##VIDEO ID:z7cQ5sLL-ZY## how the heck are you how the heck are you I'm going to do a podcast so let's get a little deeper into your story shall we who are you that becomes a Sticky Wicket you know what's your juice let's get back on you've got a lot of things what is it that you're curious about you know what you doing like let's crumble up some for you boom boom it's been a whirlwind for you what is it that supercharges you about this that's going mon coming up or is that too many stuff did I ask too many questions no not too many questions all right so I'd like to invite um Marissa Kul Crow to join me and I am not going to uh repeat her bio because it's in the program but I'm going to let her come on up and um and we can get this started Hi how are you yeah do we need to take a deep breath there you go oh yes okay yeah so um I would like for you to introduce yourself to the grou share with us who you are what you do do and maybe more importantly why you do it okay all right um good morning everyone I am Marissa and I live in Westfield Massachusetts born and bred here in western Mass grany specifically um grew up with my father and my grandfather as Avid golfers so I was I was running around the golf course as a little child and um maybe by the age of eight I was like tagging on my dad's shirt okay I want to learn um golf is very male dominated Sport AS some of you may know so even back then how many years now 39 oh wow 39 years ago I started I'm only 29 so that doesn't make oh my God but anyways 39 years ago even then um girl didn't really play they didn't have golf teams um so my dad was like okay took me under his wing um played junior golf High School tried up for the boys team had to play from their te's um probably made it you go yeah and then um I went to Springfield Technical Community College played on the men's team there a business degree and then transferred to Bryant in Rhode Island Captain the the women's team there um tried out of college working for a small business in um Springfield and I really missed golf so I like in the Summers I would work part-time at various golf courses started my first job was um I was 17 got my license my parents were like go I worked at chabe Country Club and then as I said fast forward out of college um it's like you know what I really miss golf I I need to get back there and it wasn't just playing it was just being around the atmosphere the club and I was like I think I want to take my business degree and do something with that in the golf industry um so yeah I it's been a long journey uh western Mass the golf world is very the Golf Community is very small everyone knows everyone it's like I said male dominated and I um you know I worked my way around different clubs exhausted every course in the area um I've held every position from Greenskeeper I cut grass I was an assistant made my way up the ranks to head pro general manager um it was tough it hard and it's just it it's just constantly pushing I feel like I never was where I wanted to be um so I knew that with golf teaching was my my favorite cuz I was with people and just interacting with especially women I was like you know what this is just fun I'm I'm teaching you I'm seeing you I'm giving you confidence I'm seeing you hit this golf ball and light up um so I knew that was that's somewh that's something I really wanted to focus on so then about 12 years ago like I said I exhausted every course in the area there was a job opening down in Connecticut uh not sure if you're familiar with lime and Orchards they're known for their apple pies but they have a beautiful facility down in Middlefield Connecticut it's about an hour 15 from here uh they built a facility practice facility across the street from their two 18old championship golf courses and they were looking to build their team of instructors I was like oh man I'm from Western Mass everyone knew me as a junior golfer and car carrying all these positions it's like I'm going to commute down to Connecticut where no one knows me and start all over and this was like I said 12 13 years ago and I'm like you know what this is my last shot this is kind of like what I thought all right it's teaching full-time let's do it so I went down there and I that's a whole story but um I built the largest women's program in the country which is still [Music] mindblowing amazing amazing yeah I started there and they had like a few women maybe like a hundred ladies throughout the whole year and then the last 9 10 years I had 1,500 to 2,000 ladies taking my classes every season and oh wow that's huge yeah it's we're not all year round don't forget so it's like March through October November all right wow Bower and what do you where are you where do you what's going on now um so as I prepared for this little interview yes it was kind of cool because it made me really reflect and think it's like I never really thought about know how I got here well it's interesting too I think we don't give ourselves we don't have we don't give ourselves time to pause and take a look at a lifetime of achievement right in general and so good I'm glad that would be we afforded you that that pleasure so I was at ly and Orchards for 11 years and not this past may but may of 2023 I was driving down to Connecticut 91 and I wasn't happy I was like I was tired that's the best way I could explain it and it's May I'm like okay I cannot be tired in May cuz the golf season is like Boom full swing no pun intended but it's like I can't be tired I mean and my schedule was um it's not like I'm a golf pro out there with one lady at a time all right no it's hit a ball I had built a program where they had five levels you know 101 through 501 I taught 25 classes a week oh wow and they ranged anywhere from 3 to 30 ladies in a class of course I had staff with me but I mean I started from nothing and then I just yeah that St didn't that staff didn't happen overnight no no not at all great but 25 classes a a week I mean I loved my job but I got to a point where I was like you're not doing that now no what are youing I miss it but um I was like okay I think I've hit my burnout and I was like I have an 8-year-old son who's autistic and I have all my family still around here in western Mass I'm like I I missed out on a lot because I poured myself into my job which I don't take back I don't regret I get them y but I'm like I I need to be with my family I need to spend time with my son so here I am this year I was like okay I'm I'm starting on my own independent contractor I'm going to start something over here I go again but I'm teaching at various locations um still trying to find my way um but it's cool cuz I have flexibility and nice there's pros and cons can you just really quickly share with me like the the lgp piece I'm not a golfer I'm sorry so I LPGA LG lgp sorry obviously I am not a golfer there we are that part of your life all yeah take lessons I know actually I tried that and you can talk to Susan Le Point I tried that that didn't really work out too well well you weren't taught by me but then that's true that's true I just want to ask real quick show of hands how many of you ladies have played or tried TI ball iy all right more than half oh so you're not going to make me repeat those letters again oh LPGA ladies professional Golf Association thank you um so when I was in Springfield working in an office all right this is boring I need to be outside I miss golf um I was like again working in the Summers um at various clubs and at the time I was at wilham Country Club I was working under one of the best teaching Pros in the New England area Daryl pasanella and his assistant was a female and Marie Hamilton and they convinced me to join the LPGA which is a long process you know there's an apprenticeship and um testing and yada yada but that's I started there 2001 I became an LPGA member wow congratulation yeah very nice thanks so as we dive into our our questions uh this morning um we're going to be kind of looking at leading people through change and uncertainty and I was kind of thinking about that you know my role as executive director you know I see it as my one of my primary jobs is leading people through change right as as the economy changes as as our community changes um and you know even when it's hard for me that you have to kind of put that aside and be that example right and I was kind of thinking about for instance you know we recently opened up the workhub on Union when when Marissa and I first met I don't even like it was a year and a half ago whatever it was uh we were in the process of getting ready to for construction and I don't know um so we had to clear out 1100 square ft of 60 years of first floor in basement of stuff me and so I'm there and we had made an appointment and in watchs this woman and I'm like oh God now what and Al and behold I completely forgot that we were supposed to have our meeting I was so embarrassed I mean there's stuff everywhere people running around and I'm I finally was just like I can't even there's no hiding from this and so we ended up sitting on the floor and you were so gracious and so kind and we had a lovely meeting so I appreciate you in that moment because it was ridiculous really um so anyways I just veered off of my where I was going but the M Hub on Union and and you know leading through that you know getting that Vision to the end point you know there was some really fabulous Great Moments and then there were some really hard moments right but you and I realized in those hard moments that um the my best approach would be just to be vulnerable lay myself out there and say you know basically I believe in this do you and the most astonishing thing happened and yeah they did and then more people did and now we have the space built so it was really kind of interesting right leading through that change and it can be hard but I want to talk about you and your role as a teacher and a leader and as someone who is in the eye of the public what strategies do you use to keep those around you as well as your students motivated during times of uncertainty and change yeah um well I guess isn't Co was like a change like a time where it thrown you for a huge Loop because I'm with people yeah all day long I mean the good thing was you're outdoors and people weren't working they were at home they wanted to get outside wanted fresh air they wanted to see people but keep your distance and golf was like the perfect sport it's funny we joke Co sparked the golf industry I mean product they were running out of Manufacturers like I can't make they can't make clubs to keep up with the demand um so not everybody was hanging around doing [Music] Cobra Well they wanted to get outside a few pounds um but that that was a test because it was like okay um the timing of it was like oh crap we can't go back to the course because we don't know we don't know like what what do we have to do and so they put a plan in place where as instructors we had to you know limit the number of students but we were Outdoors wearing masks we had to sanitize all the clubs and Equipment which is appar the ours but hey I mean we made work so did you have a particular strategy or did you just not even think and you just like okay I'm doing this thing like what was was there a thing or did you rely on something or just I mean management like my GM um he was like all right Marissa you this is what you have to do um let's make it work yeah so it's like okay we have to come in earlier I mean I was coming into work a couple hours early every day y yeah wearing gloves to clean all those clubs and I'm like I have eczema great huge breakout whatever yeah whatever whatever I took whenever I took yeah I mean people loved they loved the opportunity to still do something together as a group so taking lessons building Community it sounds like that's what you were doing that was straty yes yeah nice that feels good we talked about you know isolation yeah well no this was a way to avoid that yes um how do you build a team of Advocates AKA your street posy who are your street posy who who supports you who's like there who's your cheerleader it's like you know I have I have a few here today that's a great question because I feel like I didn't have a posi up until you do I know you do oh I know you do because I heard it from around well me personally I felt like I didn't have a posy until I made my like made my way down in Connecticut I'm very lucky that I had a GM for once finally that supported me because like I said I keep saying M dominated I don't know if they felt threatened or just like ah you know but down at Lyman my GM was my number one fan he saw the potential in me and he's the one that ultimately pushed me to just you know keep doing what you're doing you're you're a rock star you are a rockar no but I mean I I have some colleagues there male peers that have been so supportive of me and I still keep in touch with them um so now being on my own I feel like I'm on my own Island but I'd say that my family and close friends yep yeah um what qualities do you believe are essential for leaders during times of uncertainty I see you know it's it's different than when things are easy right oh yeah um being honest um being able to talk like just keep the communication going not being afraid to talk to people especially your posi or who people who support you [Music] um because that's like when you need like reassurance it's it's nice to bounce ideas or feelings off of people and um qualities say that again uh what qualities do you believe are essential for leaders during times of uncertainty yeah being open honest having reassurance towards your staff I um I feel like part of it is all about empathy as well absolutely a little emotional intelligence and understanding trying to be aware enough sometimes it's hard because sometimes you're so wrapped up in your own thing um to be aware enough that someone else might not be there with you right true yeah um let's see so managing conflict during change let's shift a little bit um during change um during change emotions run high and emotional intelligence is challenged speaking of emotional intelligence often during times of change and uncertainty conflict arises and often things are not related to what is happening on the surface how do you identify root causes of conflict during these times conflict um trying to draw from my own experience like with my my colleagues um I mean I was the one in charge of the program and as it grew I would have more employees under I should say under me but um there were times where more people you were responsible for what's that more people you were responsible for reporting to you yes yes and I was very protective of my program right so um making sure that everyone's on the same page because bu I feel like this program represents me um so that was hard over the years having some people come in and not follow my not that I wanted them to be me but do your you know have your own style but you still kind of got to stick to meet the standard yes yes and I mean I am so detail oriented I would have like word for word timing I know but I mean I think we're all but you're clear you're a clear Communicator yes right so that's what that is I think I think this is the only way to make sure that people followed my like they would do it my way to little control well yeah we're all control freaks right I feel like as women guilty yes and funny is me as an instructor I could tell with all these women how like I know how you are we we all all want to be perfectionists we're all don't want to um be embarrassed or I'm getting off track here yeah um so getting back to Staffing or colleagues um um especially towards the last few years it was it was hard because i' have people come in from different environments maybe from a private Country Club you know they had they were used to just doing private lessons they couldn't handle the class setting or different personalities and it's funny how like I don't realize okay I'm pretty adaptable like trying to make please everyone and where not everyone can well I think part of the thing too is is how do you remain um true to your vision right and uh empathetic at the same time and keeping people on keeping everybody on track right right but I could tell when um instructors that teaching these classes they were like you know what they they weren't happy or they I would hear from other people like I'm like why don't if you have a problem why don't you come to meh and I feel like I'm very approachable and I'm always checking in with people like okay how was class well it comes back to being you know we can't all we can't be everything to everybody as much as we want you know I I'm guilty of the same darn thing you know I want everybody to be happy I want everybody to be part of the community I want everybody to be a part of the group and it sometimes you giving yourself permission to say okay you you really don't want to be a part of the group so that's okay try to make it work we can't be we can't be everything to everybody this is what I'm trying to say right um so you mentioned burnout let's talk about managing burnout during change in uncertainty um have you how have you personally experienced so you mentioned you were feeling you were driving into work one day and you were just exhausted um were there any other signs that you were able to identify that were associated to that realization and can you identify that in others like what what are the signs that you see maybe in your team start with you questions sorry I have no caffeine um so I I'm usually know very happy and happy goodlucky having fun because I love what I do I love teaching I love being around people it's just it's not my job um so when I was like okay I'm tired certain people are getting on my nerves my my fuse was getting really short I'm like this is not me why am I why am I feeling like this why are things bothering me when they never did before right um and usually I think I had burn I had burnout every year and the sign was one student would make me cry oh no I'd have one meltdown every season and it's and I joke around with my colleagues like okay Marissa's Marissa needs a vacation because I would like end up just it was too hot it's 95° out I have I have 15 minutes between classes I'm running around trying to make people happy I have some students that are really really really needy and I I didn't eat I'm tired and then this one student whatever it just the straw that broke the camel's back I'd end up like running to the conference room and just balling my or an email from a suud well I expected this but this again start balling once a year so that was my sign where you know what I need a break isn't it interesting too when you have that realization just how darn uncomfortable it is because you realize like you said this is not who I am this is not where I live and feeling all this stuff that's so foreign but I think it goes back to feeling empathy I think I care so much about my program and my job and I care about people that I take it personally like someone complaining I'm like what did I do wrong you I'm questioning how I like what did I do wrong what did I miss I hear you I hear you I hear you loud and clear cuz it's not me no let one rotten apple I hear you you know even in my in my you know in what I do I you know i' I've I have heard that you know you take it too personal and you know what yeah I do I do take it to personal because that's who I am and I care I care about each and every one of my contingency and Beyond so um and I've put all of it all of myself into it so yeah it is personal and and you know what I'm I'm not sorry for that sorry but not sorry I agree yeah I get it though I agree I hear it so um so last May May of 2023 that was the ultimate burnout meaning okay I can't be traveling down here anymore I can't stand driving in this traffic construction an hour and a half I miss my son I miss my family and were you on 91 yeah yeah that's horrible yeah I did that and then my first part of my in my young career I was driving you know from um driving through down 91 to Harford and I'm like you know I made a decision that I can't I can't do that the energy when you come over the Massachusetts when you cross over from the Massachusetts border into Connecticut all of a sudden it's like a Vortex the energy is completely different isn't it or is it it's right right yes you can tell me that drivers I'm not going to get specific but the energy just I it's like a force field you go over the car the line at nfield and you're like who what just happened um so I'm sorry I no no so that was that was the point where I'm like I I think I need to move on and it was funny the last couple years at my at my job I was starting to not not realizing it market and um a brand like myself like branding myself kind of doing things off property I wasn't Under the linan Umbrella I was trying to make a name for myself yes with not really not not really realizing it though I'm like you know what I I because people were approaching me from whatever different organization it's the universe talking to you sister yeah yeah they're like here come come here do this like okay it was great cuz it was fresh it wasn't like okay the daily Grant 30 classes a week doing the same thing which I I loved but it was fun and exciting to travel and um you know offered different programming to other groups of women as being creative yes something fresh new so I'm like okay then I think I realized you know what maybe I can just do it on my own completely D yay yes you can you did and what what did that mean tell us what that was I have to say it was really hard really hard I mean I when I sat down with my GM and my director of golf and I waited for my director of golf to come back from Italy this is how caring I am I didn't want to ruin his trip his family trip so I was like I going to wait till he comes back and tell him so I sat down with them they had no idea they had no idea I couldn't even get the words out I just started balling and they're like oh okay what's wrong and I mean they thought I was going to talk about next year you know we start talking about goals and oh my gosh so for me to start Bing I mean it was just I cared I mean I didn't I didn't want to right but I had to you were you were showing empathy for yourself yes yeah and they understood they knew I had a family and like you know what Marissa we wish you the best well if they value if they value you they will feel that and they will want the best for you so um so how did I manage it yeah no I was going to move on I was please Mo on sorry what role does the I think we just kind of talked about that what role does your community and peer support play managing the burnout especially in leadership positions and and having that support from those folks that you were working with was a one huge giant big stop I was very fortunate that I was so close to my GM and we still keep in touch they actually invite me back to the facility for the two largest events of the year which is women's golf day and Putt for pink which is a great I mean we have 250 ladies that play and support you know breast cancer awareness month and they invite me back to be like you know nice the star of the but it's great because I with my student and they want you to sh I love that um I have a question about vulnerability um changing vulnerability can you share with me the benefits um of being open and vulnerable how you feel about that and how much how much vulnerability do you expose are you willing to be vulnerable not only in times where you've hit your limit and now you're crying in in the conference room right we've all had that um that are there in between times of vulnerability um yeah I mean I think that's why I was successful or I am successful because I'm real I'm I'm honest I care about people and if I make a mistake I own it I own up to to it it doesn't happen often but but I do but yeah I mean yeah why hide I I I wear my in your brain no yeah okay so um authenticity um how would you define authenticity in leadership authenticity being genuine um real uh authentic I am authentic um again I think that's that's why I'm successful because I do what I feel is right I I mean my job is servicing is is offering a service right like plain and simple but it's more than that I mean the thousands of women that I have taught it's just so rewarding that I've changed lives it sounds weird to say that but no it doesn't but I mean I've had done conf like presentations and I've had students be my you know they they were there to tell their story and and they told they would share how golf changed their lives be it um like I have so I think that's very it's interesting because um in another lifetime I many of you already know this but 20 years I was a massage therapist I was a sports massage therapist and um I was I worked with this one particular woman I for many years and you know a lot of what I did at that time is you know there wasn't a lot of talking right I I I worked with this woman um for many years I I knew her name I knew her history but we didn't discuss I didn't know about her life you know um but I had decided that it was time for me to move on to something else and I was going to be leaving and after our last session together I shared with her um that I was going to be leaving and she looked at me didn't and she and she said but what about me and she just started to weep and I was like oh my God I had absolutely no idea right how you affect other people I think totally yeah and I think that's part of what you do you have no idea how you're affecting these you know the impact that you're having on the folks that you're teaching or and Beyond oh my gosh I mean I I did this presentation for the LPGA at the PGA show which is like an industry yearly industry event all golf um um related people um not necessarily just professionals and I had four or five ladies share their story and of like how they started taking lessons with me and what it meant and we did a dry run via Zoom I was balling like my GM was with me and and we just I was like oh my God I know right goodness like but that's just made me feel that much better like okay I'm doing what I was meant to do like absolutely and I don't even realize it though just being myself being authentic caring giving women the confidence that no I believe that every woman can take up Golf and it just it's not just being good but developing creating relationships you know I think especially you professionals Go I mean you learn a lot about people on the golf course and then you learn a lot about yourself um but there's just so many benefits right yeah um how do you maintain your core values and principles during times of change how do you maintain it's sort of related to authenticity how do you maintain your core values and principles during times of change right it can get confusing you can be bombarded with a lot of noise during change you know and you we all are Guided by our core values they're different for all of us and how do you maintain that you do [Music] thyself yes and um it's it's hard uh like I said now that I'm on my own I feel like I don't have that support or I'm not surrounded by my colleagues but I mean like you said just believing I just had a meeting with one of my mentors and he said something that really resonated because I you know I use him as a soundboard and he's like I said I feel like I'm starting all over and I you know it's scary change obviously but I I know deep down this is what I want I'm I'm spending more time with my family um it's it's all good but it's scary I went from going 100 miles an hour to like okay I'm a turtle right now and I really want to speed up um but he said Marissa don't let the last 10 years um that don't let that all disappear that's that's what does that mean what do you mean like don't I feel like okay you're not he's like you're not starting over don't building upon yes it looks different but don't disregard or don't disregard everything you've done so far up to this point which is like okay all right that feels different yeah yeah he's like you're still you're still the a national award winner not many people can say that like you're one of the best in the country don't forget that I'm like own it okay own it all right okay I mean I I'm not I don't you know I'm humble I just I forget but yes be confident like what's that we can be humble and own it at the same time yeah yeah you wear it well um I'm wondering about we're shifting a little bit about the topic of commitment and what are your thoughts on commitment it seems like a very general question well around around leadership um in your role in the community um you know being committed to we've talked about burnout being vulnerable being um empathetic um being committed to your passion what does that mean to you being committed to your passion it's who I am it's like defines who I am mhm um and I guess it it's made me realize thinking about certain people that I've passed that cross it's like okay not everyone is committed no no they are not you know he's just like oh you would think otherwise but [Music] um I think we also have to be clear as to what that passion is right you can't be committed to something that you don't know what it is right true so you're very well- defined you have that well defined for yourself so it seems easy and I think just looking back at how I was raised I mean going way back my parents were very strict um but they developed a work ethic so I've always had that like my whole career I worked hard because that's just who I was and what I was taught yeah and um perseverance uh I mean it such it was a long journey it was a bumpy road but um being committed to okay believing I love golf I want I love being around people I want to help people I have a question yes about commitment what is it at this point because I'm going to open it up to questions here in a second but what is it about you know the talk about commitment and and what are you trying to build now trying to build I know that's General so you can kind of pick a direction you know what I mean like yeah I mean I love what did down in Connecticut I feel like I I want to do that here locally and I mean again people have told mea yes you do it here and here but it's bigger than that mhm you're you're actually reaching people across the country more than you realize so building a community you know a woman that's yeah that's my y all right so thank you let's he it for Marissa [Music]