evening everyone calling to order the planning and zoning committee meeting on April 17th 2024 the time now is 7:02 p.m. I'm Daren Martin your chair for the evening uh if we can all rise for solid meditation and pledge conratulations for the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all thank you so much you may all be seated Madam clerk can have the roll call roll call um chair Martin present Vice chair Pella here member bbom present member Nickerson here member lifeo foot Ward also present for the record chrisa Village manager Joseph Geller Village attorney Janice Kobe Village clerk you have a quorum thank you so much Madam clerk we'll move on to subsection D approval of the agenda do I have a motion to approve the agenda Madam chair if I may sure um I wanted to adjust the agenda slightly I wanted to put G2 which is the launch I wanted to put that at the end so that um every all of our residents who came for their properties they don't have to wait for us to go through that discussion um we can get the Resident Properties out way that makes a tremendous amount of sense do I have a second for that motion second all right all in favor say I any oppos say nay awesome so let it reflect that item G2 has now been moved down and will take the G7 position I'm assuming let's move on to subsection e approval of minutes do I have a motion to approve the minutes from the February 6th 2024 planning and zoning committee meeting do I have a second second mam okay all in favor say I I say name all right moving on to subsection F we don't have any visitors or special presentations this evening so let's head right into the agenda we have a lengthy agenda tonight um so I'll try to get you through M chair yes go ahead Madam chair just got some uh last minute information sure the individuals that um we going to do the launch they wanted to defer it until the next Planning and Zoning meeting they couldn't make it here tonight so we just got told by the cordino group for that so if we could um I guess scratch G7 just get rid of g74 then awesome so let the record reflect that we initially moved item G2 to position G7 that's A3000 Northeast for play site plan for the launch we are actually going to defer that to the next planning and zoning committee meeting do we know when that will be Madam clerk Madam clerk is it sufficient for us to just say the next Planning and Zoning meeting or do we have um not as of yet but I'm I'm assuming it's going to be May June June okay most yeah we'll have to get back to dat okay so we will defer the new item G7 to the next planning and zoning committee meeting whenever that may be uh let's head right into the agenda with item G1 that's 205 Northeast 86 Street can I have the applicant step up to the podium on the right and can I also have our staff uh step up to the podium on all right I'll ask the I'll ask the applicant to state your name and address for the record please one second hold on one second for the attorney do we need to be in Madam CL okay great thank you so much perfect uh yes if you could go ahead and state your name and address for the record both of you please Ricardo Lima 205 Northeast 86 Street Thomas P 20586 Street thank you so much and can I have staff report on this item please yes hello yes um this is an application um from Tom Tom here this evening um he is requesting a variance for a new fo high wall and a fence combination that would be in the principal setback at the property located at 205 Northeast 86 Street their request is to locate this new wall and fence along the front property line and then along the um the side property lines to enclose the front yard the primary justification is that the wall and fence are needed as a a visual buffer to screen the home from nuisance activities occurring on this property that the applicant has listed um several incidents in letter of request and that's included in your package um the code does not allow fences in the front set back unless they're limited to 4 feet in height and made of Coral Rock and is approved through the variance process the applicant proposed that the wall be made of Coral Rock and the fence will be a continuation of the wood that um currently exists as a sidey fence the intent is again to fully enclose this front yard area the granting of the variance approval is with the general intent and purpose of the comprehensive plan and and as proposed the development is compatible with the existing residential character within the village of alal and um the requirements for the variants um were satisfied by the applicant and the granting of the variants is presented in harmony with the general intent and purpose of the code and therefore approval is recommended um with a condition that the Privacy hedge um screen um shall be maintained to I'm sorry I don't have that there's no there's no condition that concludes my thank you so much I think how I'm going to do it is to open it up for comment for members of the council then after that I'll open it up to the public so does anyone on the council have a comments about this item okay councilman like for Ward and then after that Council bbom is it appropriate for me to to ask how long you've been in the property attorney it's okay to ask how long I'm willing to tell that's my question that's the first question how long you been in your problem December 2021 so less than two and a half years did you have a problem when you moved in uh well we've had multiple incidences starting I believe July 2023 or sorry when we first moved in yes we had homeless people from Second Avenue coming soliciting at our front door this is the one that you told us way back then right correct situation and now the nuisance is they're using your yard as a pathway to the next street am I getting this no so we've had offleash dogs come to our property multiple times kill animals a cat bit my finger there's been uh people coming in looking uh to steal items as well and our property our lot the backyard is all of our yard is really in the front um so we have a unique property here in sherard Forest um where we can really only enjoy and use our front yard um for an outdoor space my questions are very real when I first moved in I live on the corner had people walking all over my dog on yard but they stopped doing it once I you know was just gent about it I guess I'm asking the questions more so it's becoming a nuance it's called trespassing in your view and it doesn't seem that they respect the fact that it is private property and I have signs posted as well so those are ignored and you think the remedy will be uh what what what's your height that you're looking for exactly what is allowed by ordinance so a variance for 4 foot I'm going to do a Coral wall you going to qual wall Coral wall yeah which is what's Allowed by varians requesting it okay otherwise you see this continuing happening continuing to happen oh yes very much so but your friends with your neighbors no we are not we've actually uh needed to uh have a restraining order um she's actually here tonight sitting as close to us as possible uh don Wellman our neighbor on the uh west side of our property we we can't we we can scream out but there will be a time for public comment and you can step up to the podium and say your name and address and and say what you would like but go ahead Mr P yeah and and the neighbor on the other side has had multiple light trespassing through our windows and onto our property all night but that's not uh necessarily relevant to just closing in the front up section of the property behind the sale at the property line and how high you want that four feet yeah okay where's four feet on your hip I don't know approximately here I'm six tall I'm just thinking about the four feet I'm 5 feet five and a half so you know why I would say that M chair that's all I have thank you so much a council member or bomb good evening um so I guess my first question is um so the reason for the variance is twofold is that right one is that there's going to be a 4ot fence essentially not splitting a property line but actually Crossing and going across the face of the property is that one reason for the variance and the other being the 25 foot setback is that right correct um the the um the wooden fence which would run um along this each side that would encroach into the 25 you're not you're not pered right any in the front yard so that would be one one side of the variance and the other is that the fact that the four foot Coral Rock um wall goes through the variance process in order to be improved okay so then in terms of final Design This is we keep using the phrase fully enclosed front yard so we're talking about vence coming along the property line on each side and then crossing the front and joining in the middle and Crea an entire boundary right yes correct so the fence that would run along the property line really isn't an issue other than the materials we want to make sure the materials are are within the code correct right um that the only type of fence that would be allowed within the front any any part of the front yard would be the Coral Rock and there's a couple other materials but I just mention corck because that's what he proposes so but that but certainly fits Within that would okay so then at what point is the wooden fence beginning and ending here I might need to defer to that yeah that's fine yeah I think I think it's around is the first front setback so that um how how big is the first 15t 20t 2 25t would be 4 foot wood and then I already have on both sides six foot wood which is the limit back at where the house so it would just the 4ot wood would connect directly to the 6ot so the wood would go up to the 25t set back line at 4T and then Coral would extend beyond that to the the front facade and then the coral would cross in the front so my question is um so is it a hardship that we're talking about in terms of the variance here what is the exact reason for approval of this variance that otherwise would not be allowed anywhere within the village what I understand is the um the activities that have been occurring that been brought out to our attention and in addition um the applicant doesn't have much of a backyard enjoying little yard that he not not able to enjoy it fully because of understood okay all right then my final comment I'll relish the microphone um so I also have so I've had my car gone through in front of my house I do feel like that was my fault I did leave it unlocked but that does tell you that there's people popping locks right trying door handles right I have neighbors across the street just the other day even uh got uh porch pirated um as well as similar footage to this in terms of usually a single male on a bicycle speaking with a backpack uh is usually the uh you know mo of people who are coming through the neighborhood transiently looking for opport looking for opportunities right so so so if we are to Grant this variance under this condition for that reason specifically then we are going to end up with a Village of Walden properties there'll be very nice beautiful properties once you get inside I'm sure but we are going you have a village completely full of walls we already have a backlog of 7 foot walls walls to the property line edges Too Tall we have a backlog of of trying to already maintain uh what exists in fact in one of these photos across the street I see a six foot hedge that runs that's why we're going through this variance process I actually I did the the Google streets and went down the street and then also walked it and uh I remember seeing that also from from looking at those uh photos as well so so I mean I don't take issue with the coral wall extending all the way up I I don't take issue with the wooden fence uh uh being extended you know to to mesh with The Back Fence it's it's that crossing the front of the property that that uh that for me I is is a present that I don't know that I'm willing to to make tonight just Crossing from the property because we have 10 ft ofil that people can en closing the enclosing the property so creating so there you'll go around the neighborhood and you'll see there's a few properties that have uh you know a metal fence right with a with an automatic gate even for entrance into the drive right uh and those are all not allowed as soon as they start to repair or make any change or alteration to any of those setups they're going to have to revert to the current Cod um we so right before the pandemic we had a huge uh effort uh Town Halls multiple surveys to establish specifically what we're trying to accomplish in the village when it comes to uh you know are we going to allow zero lots are we going to allow six foot fences are we gonna so so this has been hashed out years ago uh to a very specific degree and I and so so enclosing the property is the part that I feel like we went through Blood Sweat and Tears to to come to a conclusion that that is not what we're trying to have within the village and it's and and so um for me I I feel like we have not potentially exhausted all possibilities and what might be done in terms of mitigation and there's things within this design that I'm certainly willing to allow without any issue U it's that enclosing the property where I have paed and so thank thank you so much does anyone else from the council have a comments on this item all right Council life award I got you I got you shall I put that in the garbage I hear you before I even start I hear you I'm more concerned about bringing in all these fence enclosures thinking that it's going to solve a problem I can see the the swell line looking at your photo you did real good with that for me I'm having a problem you know the village is going to have sidewalks one day it really is Village is going to have sidewalks one day I think about stuff like that and what I'm hearing now is you got nuisances you you you did uh police reports and all that stuff right so you've got nuisances on your property you've engaged the people and asked them not to do that and they've ignored you okay so you're here today to fence it off why we have prohibited fencing things off is because we are a little village and it looks like a village we're not trying to engage uh uh property so that folks feel like they they they are their own person on Earth that's not what we're trying to do but if your neighbors are totally disrespectful and walking through your yard because it goes all the way to the back and over to the next street is that what happens do you have a fence in the back yes okay so they just decided one day yes but it's not just neighbors it's offleash dogs the same one who killed my can I bit my finger also showed up the next year in my backyard it's also as you see in my letter of intent um by right of the setbacks we have space to put a pool in the front of our house which we plan to do that also will require a safety barrier another reason why we're looking to enclose the front yard the front facade besides the 4ot RO is also going to have a pedestrian gate and a driveway gate so it's not fully enclosed people can't enter exit it is just closed to my private property the remaining 10 foot sale in front is fine when sidewalks go in that's where a possible sidewalk would go um so uh we have within our ordinances you know if you want to put a vence in the front you can do coral you have to do a variance process that's why we're here tonight to do everything legally and above board is that the conclusion of your com no not really but I think I'm I think I'm following you now I think I'm following I'm on the corner the last thing on my mind is putting a gate around my and people do come through my yard they do the dogs do try to do whatever one man almost cussed me out because I said we got a swell over there why why you want to come and let your dog poop in my yard he said CU it's ground I'm not going to argue with them but I know I don't want to pick up no poop so he says I got my stuff and then he just got mad cuz I said what I said I'm not sympathetic to you I'm concerned that the whole village is going to gate in because of some few people that just want to be rude to the owners that's only in my head right now yeah well I guess if that's the case they could go through the same process and they could be up here talking about their specific issue that's true which is the process we have so that's why we're here tonight with everything with our specific is requesting a variant so we can put let me tell you what happened in the 31 years I've been here maybe they'll start throwing the trash over your fence that's what happens maybe they should be rud to you because why they can but but but I'm just wondering is this going to align with what we projected plans for I hear you Council much I definitely hear you and I I don't think that anyone else on the council has a comment so I'm going to just Echo what uh councilman herbal just said I'm concerned about what president this says because I do think that we made a clear statement that we do not want those front yards um enclosed and in my mind uh when I think of a variance I think is this situation so unique that something has to be done right um and I'm not seeing the uniqueness I think that people routinely have incidents with their neighbors where where they have them either or maybe someone comes up to your door that you don't want to come up to your door or a dog comes onto your property that you don't want to come onto your property and if we set the precedent that this can make us um dovetail or go around what we've initially stated is Our intention for what we want the village to look like then I do think that you will have a tremendous number of people coming to us and asking for variances dogs on their property or there are people that knock on their door which is definitely a nuisance and something that I think of course um is undesirable I just don't know if it rises to that level of uniqueness for me that would trigger um the approval of a variance on this item respectfully I'd like to remind you my finger was bit my cat was killed and the dog returned after being labeled a dangerous dog also besides just the intrusion whatnot the uniqueness of our property um you know we don't have space in the back um all of y'all I don't know when uh this conversation has been that you guys are saying that it's been said that you don't want anything closed in in the front I have we've never heard that in the two years we've lived here um it was a staff recommendation was approval and in our current ordinances it allows for this no I I completely understand and I'm sure that we would probably be able to get some sort of information to you as far as when that was stated and I do understand why staff's approval in this situation um gave you I suppose a false sense of security on that issue because I too wonder why staff approved this portion of the item but I do think that there was a clearly stated intention previously I remember ITB remembers itan lifeward that we do not want the front of those yards enclosed I understand that your property is unique and I do believe something uh another property that was unique in that way and I think the person wanted a PO I think that's what we were talking about and Y all accepted that variance but it was about Recreation not about the enclosure of the front of the property uh number two I do have a question for Charlotte can have this wall in the second like wall of this yes okay so I I think that's another Al so with that I have to give up 20 ft in my front yard which I don't have elsewhere so we all have to make really tough decisions but it's not in the ordinances no no no the the fact that you're here seeking a variance means that you're trying to do something other than what is prescribed by the do we agree on that no because the code says you can have a coral fence in the front if you go through the variance process that's the language of the code but it doesn't guarantee that you the variant will be gred correct so you're but it says if you okay another Point um so this is the current variance process and what we're telling you through this variance process is that there is one Element right that goes completely counter to something that has been our stated intention but there's a workaround you can choose to do this in your secondary setback um and this is just meering a possible solution I don't know how the vote is going to go today for you um um because it's not just my decision uh just giving you an Insight on my thought process as to what triggers a variance for me um and the the issues that I have in calling this an issue that is so unique that something you could be done other than what has been the state of intention of the body so um that's my thought on it and you're welcome to say uh I would request and ask have all the people looked at my uh site map and familiar with the dimensions I of my property Council have you looked atoun okay there was a lot of information you did you did submit a very thorough application definely all your information yeah and to be honest if we we had even been aware that it's the policy or position of the council uh that you don't want the front end closed we wouldn't have spent $900 in months to get this meeting here today that's a valid that's that's a valid we were not told that no that that that is that is a valid that is a valid complaint on your end and in fact I brought it up last time because I was asking you specifically hey I want hedges too so do I need to can I combine them or do I need to do two separ and pay 900 for each I was told it needs to hand be handled separately so I said okay we're just going to go for the fence um and that's this meeting here today no I I completely understand that's a valid a valid concern and and something we need to we need to figure out as far as like what information um you guys are getting on that front end right because I I have no desire in having you spend money unnecessarily for uh for something uh but however I don't know how this is to I'm just telling you what my personal thought is so the next step in this is for me to ask uh anyone else on the council if they have a comment and then after that if they do not then I will open it up for residents to comment when they do come up to comment I would ask that you step from the podium so that they are able to access it so I think the mayor has a comment yeah really quickly M thank you um yeah this is one of those type of situations that I think is just really difficult to you all because when you look at there's not very many hous eler to that are set back this far and so since this house is set back that far you think about them not having a yard period and therefore you know whatever people usually and normally do in the back of their home they have that you know that piece of Mind in the back of their home their piece of mind would have to be in the front of their home um so with that being said and with st recommendation being approval I just think it's something that we really have to you know just kind of look at because if you were in a house that was that was set back this far would you just it's almost just having a house with no yard to enjoy any of the amenities and especially if they're trying to put a a pool in their front yard there's no way that would be possible with that openness that's right there in the front so just something to think about thank you so much for that com go ahead I do have a comment as well um yeah that that was um um my first impression actually when um the last time when we actually decided in um about the new um resolution about no fencing and all of that I remember you being here and asked that question as a matter of fact and Juan uh from Blue Seria did you know answered saying that um you could always request a variance and that was it um and that was your concern because you were going to um try to build a pool in front of the house and all of that now um one uh when I thought about the 25 ft Frontage I thought exactly about being actually the second setback which is then 45 not 25 right so it would not encroach to the next uh neighbor's uh fency or that the the frontage of the house that's pretty much the enclos the enclosement that I thought we were talking about but it's further up is all the way to the property line which is uh by the sidewalk if there were um a sidewalk over there it would be right by the sidewalk um as actually behind the two the two olive trees and there's 10 feet in front of there which is the entirety of the public right exactly and and so and there's and there is sidewalk too on our street 86 Street it stops right in the house and if that was to continue on it would not it would go interfere no no I understand I understand I'm just saying that 25 ft is actually if there were the you know if there was an existing sidewalk it'll be behind it right behind the sidewalk yeah not all the way by where the fence of the neighboring hous is on the side which it will still allow you to have your pool in the front yard if that was the case yeah I mean the property is unique and all most of those properties and the and uh the shwood for are for some reason are are all setback um our was built in 1936 so three years before Village as well so maybe that has to do with the not necessarily my was built in 1925 and it's um you know I do have a lot of Frontage but I also have a lot of backyard I do have you know people walking to my um door which is 45 over 45 ft off the sidewalk I don't feel that's an instruction or you know none of that so I think that's part of living in a a metropolitan area you know besides that we're a little village and maybe we're accustomed to have peace of mind and you know we had a bicycle stolen two weeks ago from our backyard yeah I have a moreing yes um so you don't have a you don't have a side side uh Gates next to your property uh to the backyard uh we did however uh the previous owner had installed those and those were not fermented so in our renovation process that we're undergoing we have removed those okay so no there will be none okay okay thank you that was my comment thank you vice mayor I think councilman like for board has another comment and then we'll open it up to our guests if the wall does not take the space what we're projecting as sidewalks in the future I wouldn't be opposed to this but if it's going to be right out there where someday a sidewalk is going to be that's going to be a problem that's all I'm thinking about right now I I I I I feel you though I Liv in a house without a back backyard once upon a time I feel you all you had was the front yard I'm feeling that but I'm feeling when we start doing sidewalks in this bu in this Village I wouldn't want to hear somebody say you got to take that down so you got a way to make sure the sidewalk which is which is the what you call it which is the what's it call it's not on my property right the right away it's not messing up the right away my great so so two comments on that no it's not going to be in the right way we're even open to stipulation if there's some measurement of where that sidewalk will be to be sure that we're behind that I I feel like the where we're putting it right now uh you know doesn't have that issue but we can have add that as a stipulation to ensure that it doesn't furthermore um the construction of it it's just Coral placed on Sand so it's movable if I need to move it in the future it's not concreted to the ground and movable um you know where it's just there forever so you know it's a uh 4x6 foot piece of coral that will be on the ground with the S Foundation laid by a professional um fence person who does that work thank you so much we're gonna open it up to to our guests but I do have a statement I do think well I hope that when we buy houses we do not do them blindfolded so we know that with every property there are pros and cons that exist when you purchase the property um and yard size one of those things and our needs change but doesn't necessarily mean that our codes need to change that might be that that house no longer suits you or fits your needs um but I don't think that it is or should be a driving force on what we decide we want our village to look like and we always have to be careful with every decision that we make about the precedent that it set so if uh whatever we vote tonight I want us to know that there will be tons of people uh following behind the applicant to get a sim and in no way to really stand behind not approving those as well so with that being said I will go ahead and open it up I do have go ahead just one comment response to that so again we purchased this property December 2021 I was aware I downloaded the PDF design book from the village we looked at all the ordinances we saw the what setbacks are are allowed what's Allowed by ordinance all of that inform formed our decision hey we can compromise without having a big backyard because we look at all this place we have in the front oh the first tin Fleet is actually Swale so we keep that public right but the rest of it that's our private property and the secondary setback is not an option for you putting that enclosure in the second correct because of the location of the pool it would infringe uh where the pool is located but you don't have a pool currently this is your future no but I have uh a right within the set within the setbacks um I have a right to put a pool without process of variance no that that's that's completely correct cor I'm just asking if the pool is currently there or just one that you plan on installing no and you know if I'm not able to close in my front probably will'll need to reconsider getting a pool as well right okay thank you so much with that being one last one last quick thing I just want to say um because I don't want to scare anybody out there especially um Sher Forest residents you know we do aim to eventually put sidewalks throughout eler tow it's my personal opinion that Sherwood Forest is a place that should not have sidewalks um due to the archaeological uh uh stuff that's in there due to the curves and things like that especially when you get up by um Native American burial Mount and show Force just the like the way it it just feels it shouldn't have sidewalks in my opinion so show force is one that shouldn't have sidewalks in over time thank you that is very true it's uniquely beautiful amazing site if councilman arom after you then we'll open it up to our okay so just um true but we will still have bios swells in the Force which will include you know hardack paths and things like that everything up to including ADA compliance so okay now there will be something thank thanks for noting that all right is there anyone in our audience that would like to make a comment on item G1 if so please step up to the podium and state your name and address for the record one second I think this young lady was coming up to Podium and then right after her then gentleman in the orange you awesome can you state your name and address for the record yes my name's Don Wellman um my address is 203 Northeast 86th Street I'm also a real estate broker and have sold a lot of real estate in the village for many many years I bought my house in shood Forest because of its uniqueness I could have lived anywhere I've been in my house for almost 23 years I've never I'm sorry I've never had a problem with any of my neighbors ever in 23 years we have the new neighbors that moved in they stated they bought it what two years ago our street in our neighborhood is not in harmony anymore he filed a he tried to defame me tonight in front of everybody here that I stalked him that is a lie that was fraud he filed fraud papers with the clerk of the court it was dismissed so I I I completely EMP I just want to address that and then I want to move on to the item to the subject but I have a right to defend myself for sure you do but in the context of this meeting we're going to keep our comments centralized so I think there's a big backstory but I would have never brought it up had he not brought it up first okay so now hopefully hopefully you feel like you've said enough so let's AB caliz the convers to the so I think it's important to have Harmony in the neighborhood I don't feel a fence erected in the front of the house is going to H bring any Harmony in this neighborhood I think maybe them moving but that's beside the point there aren't many houses that have fences in the front and I like that about our neighborhood it gives character it gives uh continuity it gives inviting and welcome I've lived in my house 23 years I have never but once had an incident where somebody stole a bicycle there aren't homeless people coming in my yard I live right next door to him I have no I have no new please don't call out from the audience let's not do that okay I I've never had any nuisances I've never been afraid I've lived in my house by myself my whole entire life never been married no boyfriend Sherwood Forest is a special Street and a special neighborhood and all us neighbors have always been tight I feel wreting a fence is just going to give off a tone and Vibe that's like unapproachable this is my world this is my neighborhood nobody else's and that's not why that's not what we're about here I hope so then as far as a 4 feet fence I'm not sure how that's going to prevent a lot of nuisances even if there was nuisances as far as dogs getting loose that's a common element throughout anywhere you go a dog can get loose they can run out the front door by accident they can you can not put the leash on them that just happens that's life putting pools in the front yard when you're going a house when I sell a house to somebody we go over everything and a variance is not a guarantee I know you can get hooked on Hope but it's not a guarantee So when you buy a property it's very important for you to be aware of exactly what you're buying and if you outgrow the space or you outgrow the needs there's other available properties that could afford a backyard or you can you know live on North Bay Road and they put all these high fences and none of the neighbors talk to each other and it's just a different it's a different vibe and I would hate to lose our special Vibe and you can talk to many people about our community and that's what they like about it so I really don't want to lose that and I think it'll also set the tone that everybody else is going to want a piggyback and then we're going to have all these variance request is for fence and everybody's going to have a fence in their front yard and there goes our cute quaint neighborhood thank you so much all of those things are noted uh and we'll take that under advisement thank you so much thank you for your time I appreciate it anytime gentlemen I'm sorry if I may to her point there were actually three houses that were flipped um contractors that those three houses had F uh fence in the front yard the only three houses that I knew they had him and they actually took him down it just looks more appealing and more beautiful and it it rais up the price their houses they bought for uh you know four $300,000 they sold them for 1.2 one.5 million yeah without offense right thank you so much gentleman in the orange shirt please step up to the mic and state your name and address for the thank you hi hello my name is Eric I live in uh 311 Northeast 86 Street uh and I'm uh I happen to be friends with the guys and with many people in this lovely neighborhood I love our neighborhood I love our neighbors and I'm aware that uh it's not the case for everyone I I'm aware that the guys has had like personal issues like with th and uh what I have to say is that they really care about this community they are always here I'm I'm not always here uh because I'm I actually I don't enjoy getting down to the you know like you come here and you see like how how hard it is uh to communicate uh in a healthy manner but they are here and uh they are law abiders uh you can say anything about them but they do uh uh respect guidelines in the law and they based uh like a lot of what they do on that so I I'm pretty sure that like uh I've been to the house it's not true that nothing happens because I've seen like uh by being friends with the guys uh I have cats and uh they lost the cat because of a dog attack that actually uh it didn't matter because the same dog invaded their house uh their house like a maybe a couple months later uh and the cats run and I'm very terrified of losing one of my cats because of a dog attack so they have to be leashed I don't think it's a force of nature their LW for that and uh well I do like and appreciate the guys because they care about the city and they also think that our guidelines are uh well their guidelines the variances are there because they have to be approved but uh we shouldn't have that type of control over what people do in the private uh space especially in the in the guys case because uh their house is really far built far in the back of the of the lot and they don't have a lot of space they maybe have like um like from this wall and there's a huge tree so they don't have a lot uh they don't have a lot of back space they don't have back space at all actually so uh they have not only I've seen the the videos and I'm pretty sure that they can show you uh they have had people like come to look at their stuff uh you know like to see if they could find anything and uh and they uh have the situation with the with the dog and they also like close to Northeast city2 Street and uh this area is uh graphly uh raply growing to become uh more urban especially with the new condos being built on the other side of the river and in this Village By the way uh so I also uh would like to you know like to remember like to to to mention that uh lots of houses in beautiful neighborhoods qu neighborhoods like uh Coconut Grove have uh uh Coral like fences they're not too tall they're not like a you know like they they're not uninviting they're actually very cute you know like it's a historical material it could be Coral it could be Limestone you know like it's actually pretty you you can still see the house so it's not a big deal uh to have that build over there I think it's actually good for the city uh I also don't think it's a great idea to uh like for the city to build uh what do you say a corridors or sidewalks thank you in the in elportal or in shood for because we have so many trees I do want to give you a heads up that you have 30 seconds yet and I may not have said it but everyone gets 3 minutes at the mic and I'm timing you so I I'm just G to give you a heads up that you have 30 seconds so I I really want you to get out if there's something else that of importance you said amazing things so far um but if there's anything else of importance you want to say you have 30 seconds to do so thank you I'll try to wrap it up it's just so many things to be said uh so uh it's not a good idea because we have a historical trees oak trees we have nature and lots of uh properties on shood Forest actually have lots of Hedges and not the pretty Hedges I mean ARA trees and uh you know like just the the most basic forms of Hedges everywhere there are lots of variances in shed forest and I do think we should uh strive for like a peaceful like uh relationship with our neighbors and uh I hope that uh this is a chance to reset that because I I do see the good side of guys and you can either get on the good side of people and the bad side of people and I think we should strive to be on each other's good side and that's it thank you thank you so much we appreciate your comment this evening are there any other guests that are joining us that would like to step up please step up to the podium state your name and address for the record good evening J rero 225 Northeast 86 Street um first item I want to discuss is why previously variant notifications were sent by certified letter I found out about this uh variance based on the agenda that the clerk sent out I came and I asked the front desk where was my certified letter they said no it's now published in the her first of all I do not get the paper I do not go online to get the paper and I wouldn't know unless the agenda was generated so that needs to be a fix second of all I'm the neighbor to the east side of them I'm the that they complain about excessive lights um my house is 3 feet tall I see over the fence their heades is growing that's fine and dandy I don't care I don't want to see them we're not friendly based on their complaints on my property that cost over $5,000 so you could pay your 900 for the VAR there's over 27 complains here that they file with six different neighbors so I'm going to give you the same caution that I gave this woman I I I sense I sense that there is a lot of things that are happening but we want to centralize our conversation to whether or not correct you have a thought about the fence going up and the hedges and if you could just centralize your conversation on that that would be great I stopped your time you have about a minute and a half definitely thank you the fence I'm totally against it I have not seen the designs they've not spoken to me I don't care um if it's a for a rock fence it's going to hinder the flooding that we're having now on Sherwood Forest the water from the that property it's going to come back to me so that's one issue two the Aesthetics of Sherwood Forest does not call for that property to have a coral Rock fence or wood fence or whatever and as you know it will be a precedent and they will be back in here if they get the wall today they may come back and get the hedges later or definitely they're going to come back and say get the pool as he mentioned it now okay I am totally against it we need to focus on the Aesthetics and the beauty of this community I've lived here 22 years I've never had a problem with any neighbor except this two and they could flip the finger all they want thank you for the comment I appreciate that are there any other guests who would like to step up please step up to the podium and give me your name as well as your address uh Enrique 311 Northeast 86 streets um regarding the fcing sh Force I mean I moved here because I love the way it is but I know that the city is changing and it's going to change very fast and we have the commercial buildings being built over there where was the church and we have a lot of more possible people traffic all over this area and sherd for is special everybody agrees and we don't know about Metro stations maybe not Metro but the the the the railroad they're going to build I'm pretty sure that we're going to see here is over the years you're going to have a way more intense population comeing to visit this area too right so I get the idea of living in a very open space but I think we also have to realize that this is changing Miami is changing and the whole area is going to change and it's going to become more urban I have a house that is also set in the back and at some point I I don't need to close because I have a huge Forest closed in our house it's beautiful but at some point if you want to do a pool we also going to need to ask for evation and um my my my concern here is just are ready to understand that the the neighborhood is going to have to change an adaptit toe to a new reality of Miami and a new reality Northeast Second streets because I think it's going to happen um and even though we protect the small area that we are in share with Fest the city around will change and the people and the amount of people visiting this area is going to change also over the future right so that's my only comments thank you so much that's a a good perspective to shout out uh are there any other guests who would like to comment on this item one second uh seeing none I'll go ahead and ask the applicant to step back up to the podium um and open the conversation back up to the council I also think the applicate has another comment that he would like to make I do one one second let's just sequence it um so vice mayor Madame chair yes I do have um a comment uh thank you um um to address um Mr rivero's um first um um point and it was about the uh the variance being discussed today um that he wasn't aware of it I um I remember asking the manager about the um actually for any variances any planning zoning um hearing to have a sign and I think it's in our books right it's in our we can do uh go ahead and post in front of the property um a notification that this property is going to be is going to be uh you know meeting is going to be discussed about a variance and all that or is it something that we can Implement so anybody that pass by through the neighborhood can actually see that the property is going to be you know it's going to have a is going to come before you know plan and Zoning meeting might interest it to the people around it to actually to address uh the neighbors uh Point yeah I I I I hear your point and um you know I have seen that in other municipalities we don't have that but that's something we should we should look into doing because I agree I think that would give the surrounding neighbors because you're right if you don't have the herald or if you're not checking you know the other um Publications you would know so I'll def into that that's an EXC May is actually um so it does State courtesy because that's paid by the applicant and no applicant wants to pay extra that is the point of it all so it does state that like we can have one of three and it offers it but every time what happened he's right it used to happen but then an applicant brought it up and said it says courtesy and I do not wish to pay any further than I've already paying and is it I'm sorry madam Clerk and is it something that we can have the signs and actually borrow that that um that applicant the sign and just because it's it's uh it's written and uh it's up to the it's up to the applicant for us um what satisfies it is me advertising it and the way that people came today it's because it's advertised so once I put up there's a pnz and if you're interested then that's how most of actually uh Mr pulum is one that comes because he sees it and he receives it so he knows if there's something that's part your interest that's why you come for public comment okay now so this is for our lawyer is it something that he could actually be included in part of the package or is it for you a part of not something that is not courtesy but mandatory um then the language would need to be revised and then we would have to budget for it because if the applicant does not want to pay for it the city has to actually pay for the sign okay and it would be an individual sign it's not not an erase and Pace no no no that's an individual sign it's an extra cost yes okay thanks that was a a question I had as well like what the city covering it be cost prohibitive can we look and see is what the cost would be I I don't I don't think that it would be prohibited we can actually go and do that but that would have to be something that's fiscally budgeted for okay for can the manager look into that and get back to us on how much this how much has historically just based on last year how many of these variances or signs would have been posted if we had taken over the cost like what that might have been or if there's a way that we can project that out mind you might if the person is not driving through elportal is not just if they're not driving through Sher Forest which is very unique and a lot of people don't drive through that they're not going to see that yeah but sometimes the people that's directly impact is the people that surrounding the property so for his property in particular if the sign would where it would be placed at also might not still see it but just say I'm just giving you know but yeah it's something definitely that you can look into and the and the word sure I I have no idea if this is a good idea because it depends on the numbers and the feasibility just something to look into because I do think that your neighbors have a unique interest and like what's happening we can absolutely look into variances we do Mr Mayor has a comment let me really quickly thank you very much Madam chair I just wanted to say um just make clear that you know this discussion that we're having right now that what elal does right now we're in um legal compliance all right so it's not that we're not doing something that we should be doing or that we have to do we're currently in legal compliance let me also say that um there's a lot of things that we do that we just do for Courtesy for example um I'm on every mayor organization all throughout my all throughout Florida and there's very few IP alties that email their agenda out they don't have to and so we do a lot of that for Courtesy the way we have our um our agenda where in the beginning we have a good in welfare for every agenda item we let you come up and speak at the end we have a good and Welfare go to this go to the county meetings in Mii day County they have a good and Welfare like one and if you don't know because and and so the reason why we have it like this is because when I came on as a council m that's the first thing that I passed that was my first initiative and the reason why I passed it because I said okay I said let's let's keep the first one we only had a first one I said let's keep the first one I said because you know somebody might come and and they can talk about whatever on the agenda I said but then let's allow people to speak for every agenda item because after they hear us speak they might say oh you know what I disagree with what you're saying mayor or you know what mayor have you thought about this and it might adjust the way I'm going to vote I said so let's put that in I said and then let's have another at the end but there's a lot of things that we have in eleral that is courtesy and it's not legally binding to us this is one of the things I think it's a good thing to change it my question though is is that so are we talking about just putting up signs for just variances or are we talking about putting up signs for everything that's on the agenda having to do with somebody's home because that means that every Planning and Zoning we have a lot of items that are on the agenda so are we putting up a sign for every property that this is going to be on this agenda for this Planning and Zoning because we have a lot so that cost we're going to have to really look in it might be very high because we have a lot of homes on Planning and Zoning um um uh agendas and does that mean that when the Planning and Zoning when gets moved to the regular council meeting then it has to be put up again for the regular council meeting so what let me let me just rephrase this none of that needs to be answered tonight this is just a thought and that we can look into it and figure out either how to make it work or that it doesn't work and whenever we kind of throw out these ideas definitely doesn't mean that the village is doing anything wrong it's just an effort to perfect no matter how good you are doing something when someone brings in uh an issue you think hey is there a way that I could solve something from their unique perspective so this is just like a little hey can we the needs assessment might make it obvious that it is not a good idea but just something to flush out as far as being as responsive and communicative as we can be as a legislative body uh but with that being said I'd like to table that part I'll go back to uh Mr pulum I know you had a comment and then we'll take it back to the Council on this item G1 thank you um so I just wanted to address a couple of the comments from my neighbors who you saw up here today please centralize those those comments to the Hedge thank you much um so uh the first point in terms of the aesthetic charm of the village all that sort of subjective stuff again we are paying a five times price premium to do the Coral Rock which has been decided I don't know when but historically by people in the village residence Council Etc that that does conform with the desired aesthetic charm all that sort of stuff the four feet uh limit as well um so that's my first point uh my second Point um in uh uh some fear of coming back requesting Hedges I already uh just so everyone is aware I articulated to um our Planning and Zoning staff people that because of the $900 cost variance for that that's cost prohibitive we're not going to do that so we will do natural plant clusterings or just a bush something that doesn't require a variance um so I will not be coming back requesting a variance for hedges in the front to be clear um in my third and last comment um in regard to one of my neighbors who talked about flooding um uh first of all my entire front yard is permeable also this Coral Rock Wall like I said is constructed on a foundation of sand it's not cemented to the floor is not creating any water issues in fact this neighbor who's complaining about uh this potentiality um has a huge paved driveway in the front that is not permeable and creates uh you know is experiencing water issues I would suspect that's where it's coming from thank you so much for those clarifications now I'll bring the conversation back to the council does every anyone have a motion on this item or additional comments do just one additional comment so I just want to reiterate that we went through this years ago in terms of the number of fence variances specifically that were coming in front of the council sparked 18 months of town halls surveys uh intensive work expensive work with urban planners and it was definitively established that having uh properties fenced off as a general rule within the village would over time deteriorate the property values and lessen the quality of life in the village point blank years ago years ago um I lived in the Grove rented a property we were a border property on the one side was shanty town on the other side was multi-million dollar ownership right so go to a town hall over crime watch be& and all this stuff right all the older white people in the audience wanted more police and longer jail sentences as a solution to solve the crime problem that was ravaging Coconut Grove at that time all of the younger black folks in the audience were very clear and establishing that there had been after school programs in years past that were gone there were this resource and that resource that disappeared so for me personally as I've gone through life outside of that experience it seems very obvious to me that uh if we want to get rid of petty crime we're going to take every dollar that we spend on an aircraft carrier here and we're going to match that dollar and educate somebody in this country until we do that we get our cars broken into at 3 in the morning I will say this the picture I'm looking at here has a front porch full of construction items I grew up in Topeka Kansas so I have an advantage over everybody in terms of Street smarts I'm looking at a picture of $2,500 worth of bait sitting on a front porch that's the issue in this picture that somebody's on that front porch we are not going to create a beautiful Village by Walling off the properties Coconut Grove is attempting that Coconut Grove is no longer any fun to drive through it is disgusting honestly 8 foot fences zero Lots Coconut Grove is not pretty anymore I hope not headed in that direction thank you so much for that comment uh does anyone else have a motion on this item does someone want to move something on this item councilman light board okay all right so so you move to not accept staff's recommendation on this item into deny okay okay so that's the I was second you second okay Madam clerk can call the roll roll call um member Lightfoot Ward so she's Mo she's motioning not to to accept not to accept staff to deny member life award okay member bbom yes member Nickerson no Vice chair Pella chair Martin yes motion passes 4 to one what followup is the clerk can the clerk can give you some secondary steps correct yes it's it's been Deni maybe we receive a rationale why or I think the conv Willing the conversation that occurred previously everything that was stated all of those are the reasons why so I I think I think a transcript maybe of this conversation can give you some more clarity but I think everything was stated but it has been denied so we're going to move on on to item G2 and if you have additional questions you can step to the back and talk to the clerk about next steps okay thank you so much Al righty now we're going to move on to item G2 so G2 is now 301 Northeast 89th Street for demo and new home construction new site plan can I have the applicant step up to the podium and state your name and address for the record hi my name is Joshua Roos and this is Roos hello closer to the mic please better yeah oh yeah hi my name is Joshua Rojas and this is Nest roas uh yeah address please uh 301 Northeast 89th Street okay so first I'm going to get the staff report and then after the staff report I'll come to you okay can I have staff's report on this item yes this is an applicant from Portal Development Group they are requesting a site plan approval for a new single family home at the property located at 301 Northeast 89th Street the applicant proposes to tear down or demolish the current home that's on the slot to allow for this new construction of a brand new home which is will be two stories 4,840 sare ft and the new home will have four bedrooms and six bathrooms and a two-car garage and a covered backyard Terrace the property is 7,761 ft and single family homes are permitted in the Sony district and they are not requesting any variances with the site plan approval so they meet the code the um persuant to um the procedures for site plan review the applicant does show good cause for the compliance with the land use regulations and development standards the applicant has stated um that the plans will be submitted to the County Fire and Rescue department for review and approval and that they are committed to complying with the fire department review regulations and when the full set of plans are ready to be submitted for before building permit um also to address storm water management and to ensure ongoing retention the applicant has a preliminary engineering plan for 8 in pipe system with an exfiltration trench that would be located on the site and then the final design for that storm water um system will be um again further hashed out when they get into design drawings for their their site um the in granting um the site plan as presented is in harmony with the general intent and purpose of the comprehensive plan and the um as the proposed development architecture is compatible with the existing residential architecture in the village and therefore approval is recommended for the site plan to allow for the new construction of a two-story residence and um there are two conditions that are enumerated in your staff report thank you so much uh as I've done before I'll open this up for comments from members of the council does anyone have a comment councilman bbom just one question so the only reason we're here tonight my okay okay so there we go uh so the only reason we're here tonight at all on this application is because they are demolishing 51% or more of the original structure and rebuilding it is that right correct it's it's a site plan and so outside of that there are zero other issues no setback issues no uh driveway issues no fence issues nothing no they're complying with the code very good I just have one comment for the applicants so as she talks about the flood mitigation um I will humbly ask you to take that incredibly seriously uh as we approach our new reality in terms of flooding within the village you'll find it's like lot to lot sometimes right you're going to find out is depending on what people built in their Swale Etc when we have new construction it's some of our only opportunity to move in the other direction um so I would just humbly ask you to please take that uh very seriously and uh it will benefit you with uh a selling point at some point in the future uh whenever you do go to resale and I I would just add that um through um the site plan review process um when I was reviewing this they they were very Cooperative when I requested that they they they look at this issue from the very beginning not wait until the end of you know their their whole process so so they were cooperative and produced plans for us to thank you that's good to hear any other questions for members of the council councilman light foot Ward uh this is father son deal right here yes yeah it was the way you said it that's his dad talking about we got this person you both got same name a lot alike I know I know I'm paying attention you are asking to build a million doll plus house on a lot that has a house that you're going to totally tear down regardless to his historical uh um archival history and you're going to think you're in Coconut Grove or you're trying to be make us something we're not I'm seeing a big how do you call those expensive houses I'm a MC Mansion I'm seeing a MC mansion in my head knowing where this house is I'm seeing a MC mansion in my head and I'm saying what you trying to do keep people from moving in here so you goingon to go build a p a palace y'all got to help me out man I'm I've been here I'm 31 years in this Village and it was nothing like it is today thank goodness for a good counsel which I've been on several times so tell me exactly why you want to put this kind of big building you bought the property right yes I guess that's why but you got to help me this sounds like this is going to be one of them oh wow this is a little tiny village we're not trying to change the character of this Village so that people can't afford being here including me who own my property okay we're not trying to do that so why why why you want to do that tell me why I thought I was asked that didn't think I would ask that question huh I like the mother house now you know sorry I like the house you know the second two floors you know identify yourself sorry apologize nesto roas no igc archit okay actuality I developer in different areas in in Miami no cocon Gro belmet Golden Beach porot a lot the houses you know actuality in this particular area I come in the construction one big house in belm you know four houses you know actually they increase the area for for BM the people move for this area and in the north those is particular I like the no Miami styles you know very standard you know building to house mod you know for increase the neighbor no increase the neighbor for architectural a lands big Landscaping good pH for the houses you know do this actuality the house no it's big house is one house is 4,000 AC area only you know because for I adjusted for the for the for the regulation for the for you see sub go exactly noce big Mansion know it's only two two two flooring you know for 4,000 AC area I'm not convinced but thank you for your comments I'm yeah what we what we're trying to do here is that unfortunately we don't have the architectural um book where we can actually you know tell people this is what you know this is the character of the neighborhood and that's how we're going to keep it it's just a suggestion that we have but seeing these uh big block houses are just disturbing for you know the people that that been here for many years and moved to the area just because we like the quaint little different houses and you know not these big block houses that now they're they're there's not only one or two now this will be like the sixth house that is it has the same kind of design very modern Square not appealing to this neighborhood that's what you know we're trying unfortunately we cannot regulate that only by you know based on the amount of Windows you have and all and the the the the the lot uh coverage other than that if you meet regulations so unfortunately and painfully we have no other option to approve it so um yeah any other comments for members of the council councilman ARB yeah um so the architectural guy B that we're talking about um uh there is a place for modern architecture in there this was a huge discussion that took place over about 18 months as well um uh after we had sorted out the the fence issue we we did a town hall on architectural the guide book that you're referencing right and so um the primary concerns are that there would not be uh monolithic block structures uh the IDE is that there would be some breakup of the lines uh there certainly should be enough Windows it sounds like what you're from what I saw it looks like you have an idea to put light into the house and have plenty of Windows that you know uh for accomplishing that uh which again makes it aesthetically pleasing from the street to see a house with Windows you know as opposed to just a wall uh and so um so while I I I do agree with the other counc person comment here in terms of you know we wouldn't want to see the neighborhood become a you know a strictly modern architectural neighborhood there is a place for it within there as outlined within that guide that that guideline I just wanted to give you just a little bit of background in how we had that discussion um and arrived you know at those conclusions in terms of just trying to prevent it looking like a a store as opposed to a home you know yeah thank you so much councilman herbal are there any other comments from Council Members I actually like your design so I don't want you to feel like we all hate it uh I'll open it up to the guest uh is there anyone that would like to comment on this item hearing none I'll bring it back to the council uh does anyone want to make a motion on this item uh sure councilman life award it's a box it's a beautiful box it's a box it's a box house give me a minute it's a box we're a village we our houses look like a village it's a box if it had been anything but just a box it's a box and it's not what's that word cohesive cohesive it's not cohesive to the presence of what we've tried very hard to maintain historically you build a box in here a twostory box at that and we going to have boxes all over the place and everybody's going to say what happened to el protel it's the dog they're gonna curse the counsel and my name gonna be the first one why that that that blankety blank life foot Ward I should have known that she would make things no no no I'm the one that says common sense don't change my Village there's not many look look like this don't change the state if you gave me if you gave me a thing that looked like a a home and not a an office oh I'd be all right but this is a box thank you man thank you so much uh any oh yes you did have a comment I knew there was something yeah it's just something you the applicant would like to make a com yeah it's just something very small it's like not exactly a box CU like there's there's a recess space in the first floor like it's not like meeting the the set the set back exactly like there's like a on the front facade there's like four feet recessed wall so there's an overhand on the second floor he's making a guessing a shadow so it's not exactly a box like they have like it ins and outs of a rectangle so no that's just that's my comment that's it I like that that was a good comment it's a semi box but I will say I will say that I think that there is a large amount of variance in what people find aesthetically pleasing so I stop at the point where I say hey The Village looks a certain way and one house looks this way and every other house needs to look that way I do think that Charlotte has told us that barring this requirement for them to come into and into this body and get this approval they have complied with all other requirements correct yes that's correct and I think that that is um and also I think has been they have been accommodating according to Charlotte as well so I think that that is um that is dis I think that is all I need to know on the item that they are doing what they are allowed to do and they are doing what they believe is aesthetically pleasing with property that they have purchased um so with that being said does anyone on the council have a motion for this item all right do we have a second can I oh I can second that a second Madam clerk can I have I did open it to the public then I closed it did you but I can reopen it I think I see a hand going up hold on one second so I'm going to open it back to P the public comment M Mr polium if you can step up to the podium restate your name and address I you just stand right there yes sure sure thank you Thomas pum 205 Northeast 86 Street um what I just heard uh from you Miss Martin was that because it complies with the ordinances and aesthetic is subjective sounds like you're going to recommend approving this m that was the same case with with my fence with an ordinance and the aesthetic issue so that that is my comment I understand that you're not happy with how yours turned out and and you're more than welcome to comment on item G2 but what I'm not going to do is engage in a back and forth the body that's fine that is my comment that is the this is the same rationale that I heard from you in both cases thank you so much you can have a seat there is a motion on the table I believe Madam cler could you call the RO yes I seconded it okay okay counc herb officially which item are we on here this is the G2 it's motion to approve motion to approve it g that's and accept uh okay um roll call member lifeward no member bbom yes member Nickerson no Vice chair Pella chair Martin motion passes 3 to2 thank you so much now we'll move on to the new G3 thank you no no you're welcome have a good evening uh we'll move on to the new G3 and that will be 256 Northeast 90th Street a new garage outbuilding site plan can I have the applicant step up to the podium and state your name and address for the record is that see this new numbering has really got me going here two is it 256 Northeast 90th yes yes that's correct yes is there an applicant here I don't see him I have met him personally but I I don't see him so what do we do in this in this case Madam Clark there is no applicant advertised I mean the applicant is welcome to come to speak on their behalf and introduce it but she she's already you've done the 10 days and you've revised it and you have your recommendations and you spoken to the applicant yes and you they known to be president they do they've been okay okay awesome so let's proceed with 256 Northeast 90th Street there is no applicant in attendance so we'll move along with staff's report on this yes this is an application by by Freddy Penna um he is the homeowner and he's requesting approval for um a new garage um on this property that is located at 256 Northeast 98th Street he proposes a new prefabricated detached garage to be located in the backyard the is 1,600 ft in size and does not exceed the allowed lock coverage for an out building in the rear yard and there are no variances being requested for this garage um the requirements and procedures for site plan review um persuad to this requirements and procedures for site plan review the applicant has shown good cause for compliance with the the regulations the Land Development regulations and development standards um the the granting of the site plan approval as presented is in harmony with the general intent and purpose of the comprehensive plan and the proposed development is compatible with the existing residential architecture in the village therefore approval is recommended for the site plan to allow a new detached garage to be located in the rear of property thank you so much uh like I've done before we can open it up to the council does anyone have a comment on this item yes I do have a comment um Madam chair yeah um this application C it actually came to us as a variance back in 2021 for this same shed and the same the same shed and the same reasons right the shed big larger than the it's a garage it's a garage it it was a garage it was used to store their of uh uh cars collectible cars or something like that and it was denied um okay so um I think that in my this is my understanding I wasn't you know staff at that time I believe that that may have been because um it was interpreted as an accessory unit and um in in the staff report and in staff's review um it's been explained to me that this is strictly a garage there's no it's no units whatsoever it's only for storage of cars um he he's a a large collector and he explained to me when you know doing our review that um he has a number of cars that he stores in other places right now but he really would prefer to have them in his his yard he does have a large backyard to accommodate this any other comments from the council vice mayor were you done on that one vice mayor vice mayor oh yes I'm sorry yes would your comment complete I didn't want to step on your comment would your comment complete yeah no that was my comment because I saw it I saw it um here before o again and I was like you know I remember that being in front of us but it was the variance or denial for the same purpose um and um and so even with a slap that is over 40t by 40t um and the new pool that they install in still under um the LW coverage the yes and the the out building um there's a 30% maximum of the reard and they're in compliance produ now you don't see it as an accessory unit even though it's a shed it's a it's a no it's not it's a garage this is not a it's not a four wall thing with a roof it's actually old metal preconstructed um piece of a okay that's my No you have an impeccable memory vice mayor and I know exactly what you're talking about and I remember but I don't remember as to whether or not staff's recommendation was approval the last time denial so I that's the question I have there there just seems to be it exceeds the the leaving leaving uh scooter footage of the main house right right if there's another requirement if you have an accessory unit then then we look at um that compared to the to the main structure but that doesn't apply to a garage which is just considered an out building the only regulations we're looking at is much of the rear yard it covers and they're within that because they have a very large recor so I think it's it's it's important that we denied it before um so with that being said is there anyone else on the council that has a a comments on this yes Council like for Ward this came up the new garage out building site plan I hear the positivity that you you've expressed but I'm thinking about the person moves says I got this big garage that you can turn into a a rental house one day that's what I'm thinking about right now there won't be any Plumbing or electrical well possibly electrical for lights but it's not going to be plumed or set up for a unit so is this a garage that has a door that closes for a person yes and and a g and a door for the vehicles to come in out and do we know how long been in in this address 256 Northeast 90th Street probably in 2021 or 2020 okay just a few years see see see yeah there's uh now and if you go online you can actually see ideas in how to convert uh an accessory building or a shed into a rain that's what I'm talking about and how to do the plumbing and the electrical and all of that that's right that's what I'm talking about see I have to depend on what you do as a professional but look my little brain says red flags it just says red flags and I can't sit on the council people be people vote me because I vote my conscience this is big enough for another house forget the fact that it's a garage and I can just see it 31 years I've seen everything in this Village I can just see it oh do you know they they're selling a house on 256 Northeast 90th Street and they're also telling them they got a building in the back that they can make into another house a rental that's my only concern you know it was a little um just something I want to throw in there um when I was building actually doing my deck it was a concrete deck in my backyard right and um we got the I got the contractor he did everything he and so inspector went saw the compacted and the framing and all of that and he denied it so I have to come over here and he the guy was like why it's it's an a it's an U it's just a slot of concrete so when I came here and spoke to the uh the the inspector building inspector he's like well you know he's right the contractor but you're building this right you know next to the house that's why he recommends you to do the rebars every foot and a half six inch of in whatever down so and only because right now is a slap tomorrow you'll put a roof then walls and then AC and lights and then you have an extension of the house so yes it is it's a little thank you so much for that comment I think I'll close it up to the council and open it up to our guest does anyone have a comment on item G3 hearing none I'll bring it back to the council um does anyone have a motion on this item Mo not to approve okay do you have a second I have a second all right M Park can have a roll call motion is to deny correct yes correct okay roll call member life foot Ward yes member bbom yes member Nickerson yes Vice chair Pella yes chair Martin is it sweet yes yes motion passes 5 to n thank you all righty uh so now we're going to move on to item G4 now I do have a question about this for G4 G5 I could not see the staff report on that did everyone else have that no that was missing off of the attachments let's go let's move it to the next meeting the next public your planning and zon because I didn't see didn't open okay and also there were a tremendous tremendous amount of misspellings and I'm I'm not a stickler for scribers errors but it was hard to get through that document so I don't know if in the future we can do something to remedy that there seems to be some sort of glitch where ings would turn to like an uppercase j I don't know if that was the only one that had that but it was tremendously distracting trying to consume this material so in the future with those reports if I'm not sure who in your office is completing them but if they can just read through that and make sure that those type of glaring repetitive errors are not in there that would no they're not in there um not at all not not in the word documents not yours no yes well I would suggest that you maybe just to to double check something so maybe when the clerk is sending out that email I don't know if you want to put yourself on the list or click that link and make make sure that it's appearing correctly so you can fix whatever's on your end but it was imp almost impossible it was possible but it was very annoying to read it like that yeah I understand I I think that that definitely should be um thank you so much okay and I suppose we should we take a like a two-minute break to let the clerk do these copies otherwise we can't go forward well yeah we got to see it at least right she can she can she verb this is um the board okay perfect so it should be fast enough on that yeah and and she can verbally talk through her staff report while she's making copies and then we can see perfect I just didn't know how much time she needed but uh yes so the applicant for G4 61 Northeast 86 Street can you step up to the podium and state your name and address for the record right after you state your name and address uh we will receive stash report and then we will speed read this thing give him give him I think that's cool is it the same thing that you've given us in this okay I think it's good don't TR don't trouble yourself just your name and address for my name is kolina Almeida Al Carolina Almeida I represent metria the Architects and this is my client my name is Juan cimon I'm the owner of the 61 or the street thank you so much for being here tonight can I have sta report on this item yes our applicant um here tonight Carolina Mana is requesting site plan approval for two things um a home of about 8855 ft and um there is a variance request as well for the enclosure of an existing garage that they state would be um used for storage in the future um this property is 61 Northeast 86 Street the site itself is 12,875 sare ft and the addition to the home would not exceed their allowable lot coverage the home has an existing driveway to accommodate this enclosure of the garage for parking I'm persuant to the requirements and procedures for the site plan review the applicant has shown good cause for compliance with the land use regulations and development standards of of the code and granting of the variance and site plan approval as presented is in harmony with the general intent and purpose of the comprehensive plan as the development is um architecturally compatible with the existing residential architecture style and as you can see from the photos they're um going to maintain this house as a one-story um propt um therefore approval is recommended for the variance for the garage enclosure and the site plan for the additional 855 Square F feet all right thank you for that report um does anyone on the council have a a comment about this item or feel comfortable enough to comment on this item yes you want to go ahead Council Council which side of this life award which one of these were which one was the garage I can't tell you can go right there so it was right it's right here it's right that was the garage okay is this a double garage where we the mic yeah so that the clerk can hear you I'm sorry no worries yes there is the Gage and it is for one car right yes for one car now it looks like you're going to widen it no we are keeping exactly the same measurements now I'm telling you what it looks like yeah but it's probably because of the rendering okay okay now I'm believing in you believe me so the garage was on the left side of the front front or in the back always it is it is a corner it is on a corner so there is two streets and then on the 30 on the left of the front is actually the the garage but but this room is going to be on the back that the addition will be in the back the addition the addition be in the back no no no no yes exactly this is this there is two stets right this this here will be the the you can turn it the way you need it no no you can turn the mic the way you need it okay and you pull it out if it won't do act ah I can pull it out yes I'm sorry it's my first time here yeah perfect now talk to me now Perfect all righty so this will be on the 86th Street and this is the the main entrance and this here will be the the nor exactly and this is the garage right now we are closing the entrance of the garage and converting into a storage and the addition is this here which is in the back of the house mhm okay and we are adding a p yes they have two kids small ones yes well yes sometimes but the the idea is to um Elevate the FL and anate also exactly and we're keeping the mango trees and all the vegetation there because it's so beautiful and actually the architectural inspiration was to keep to touch as as little as possible because we really love I mean they really love the neighborhood they are super happy there and we agree with it thank you any other comments from the council vice mayor council M life oh no I was just saying that it's a corner lot and it's a it's a it's a big lot and it allows them to do you know pretty much what they're um intending to do over here where's your sewer L on this on this property this where's your septic tank on this property the septic tank is here on this on on the right side of the 86 Street if facing the house from the 86 Street the septic tank is here we are not touching the septic tank I know but but we are we're going from septic to sewer I know but you will have the access there we are not I mean the extension of the the addition of the house it does not interfere with it okay thank you so much any other comments from the council so I'll close it up to the council open it up to our guest does anyone want to comment on this item all right seeing none I will bring it back to the council and ask you lovely folks if anyone has a motion all motion to approve awesome uh do we have a second second all right Madam clerk can I have the role roll call member L foot Ward yes member urbam yes member Nickerson yes Vice chair Pella yes chair Martin yes motion passes 5 To None thank you so much for joining us thank you so much all right we will move on to item G5 that is 2011 Northwest 86 Street can I have the applicant uh step up to the podium and state your name and address for the record good evening uh my name is Peter petkevich um actually my parents are the homeowners I'm appearing on their behalf 2011 Northwest 56 Street nice to have you here this evening I'll have staff's report and then we'll have a discussion thank you the applicants Mr and Mrs pwit is are requesting a variance um for a new six fo high fence Andor a hedge combination um to um in within the sidey setback at the property located at 2011 Northwest 86 Street um this request is to locate the new fence hedge along the side property line which um it would be permitted if it were 15 ft back but they would like it to be on the side property line their justification is primarily that um they would like this barrier some sort of barrier um as a buffer to screen the home from some nuisance activities that are occurring on this property and the applicant has listed several instances in their letter of request of what has been happening um near the home and this to note um that this is um located very close to the Middle School um I think it's about one house um away from from the from the middle school and the homeowners have stated that they have observed some altercations occurring in the sidey yard area and um they are not in um they haven't decided yet to um whether to do um actual fence or hedge they're still in the process of seeking quotes from contractors for make this final decision and um they are also considering um the Hedge option for um not interfering with a mature Tree in this area um so they're um they have come before you to um either have a combination or um to um have um hedges around this the site um on the property line and um I'm sorry which side of the of the house that I I didn't follow the um on the east side east side thank you the east east side east side the granting of this variance um is seen to be in um approval is in harmony with the general intent and purpose of the comprehensive plan as the proposed development is compatible with residential character the um requirements for variances were reviewed and the applicant has shown good good cause for adding some privacy barriers around this home near the middle school where there is a high volume of foot traffic and um and nuisance activity the grant SC of this variance as presented is in harmony with the en intent of the zoning code and therefore staff's recommendation is approval so I don't know if I'm the only one but I don't have the supporting documents for this one either so and I would really like to know like what is the nuisance activity yep I can so there's been a bunch of stuff um part of it has been a lot of the students after they leave school and they're making their way home um because the um in addition to the Swale the property's currently open to the street there's a lot of kids hanging out there and just you know garbage being left and things like that um there's police that come by and when they when they particularly park the cars at the the little Garden at the end of the street by the bridge it makes it a bit better but there's a lot of that um there was an incident I'm not sure if you guys saw this one up um but we shared a video of somebody um seemingly being attacked by the students from the school this was reported to police according to the video from our our security camera um and then there's in the in the document there's photos of like cars driving across the property like literally if you have the picture of the property like literally across the corner of the of the property it's like it's crazy particularly my daughter my parents granddaughter she's seven years old that she loves that oak tree that's there we want to keep it on the as part of the yard that she could play with play in I can't imagine if a car drove through there or somebody was being attacked and my daughter was was playing I mean I can't even foresee that so um that was the the rationale we I love the passion here for keeping elportal beautiful um and in character and we believe that particularly a hedge along that side will be in line with what's in the neighborhood and and kind of keep it consistent with the look and feel and the vibe of of the of the area and the village so I think I know I think I know your house it's are you proposing to put this hedge on the side that kind of aligns with Horseman like yes there's a there's a beautiful oak tree there and then the property line is just kind of to the east of that and so we'd like to just just clear the tree basically along the property line to put the the Hedge there okay and and for and I'm I'm so sorry if I'm asking a million questions that document would have been helpful kind of orienting ourselves in this conversation but the reason why uh they would need a variance is it because of the the height of the Hedge that they're proposing or the um no the location it needs to be further into their property 15 ft that would be that would be allow and what is the what is the um I suppose what is the hesitation with moving it further into your property where it's allowed so a couple things one um the other side the west side of the house has mature trees there's really not much of a yard there to really use so the primary yard that they have is on the east side of the house there is this huge oak tree that that U my parents would like to include as part of the as part of the yard to basically be able to to enjoy it okay okay uh and and Charlie because of the location that it's in um do we foresee any issues as far as um visibility um uh when it comes to cars turning that corner because I actually jog past your house a lot and that corner is um actually pretty dangerous as far as being able to see what's coming and turning uh do do we think that maybe that is something that should be considered or is that not really no I think that um all safety issues should be considered and um that um we could um maybe if you would like to propose um as a condition of approval we could before they um move forward um to um maybe to the city commission the council meeting they could provide um a diagram to show that that that wouldn't be an issue that if that would be something that could ease your mind on that okay does anyone else from oh one second the applic may I just add to that oh yeah sure um so just to be clear the the front setback is 25 feet yeah so the the proposed hedge would end 20 at the front setback so it wouldn't be any further than the front of the house basically and so there' be 25 feet between the end of the Hedge and um 86 Street and there's that um I don't know the actual name the tri the safety triangle thing it's it's posted right here we've reviewed all that and it's the Hedge would end many feet before the Stop Bar I don't know exactly how many but many feet before the Stop Bar and the calculation for the safety triangle thing only starts at the stop bar so I think we did rev that's useful to know and then you're you're planning on not doing anything with that the front portion you're just going to have that side hedge and then the Hedge is going to end at the 25 foot setback and then well on on the on the front along the east and west side of the house we're planning to put a fence but again that that's doesn't require variance that's just within the regular setback or requirement okay any other questions from the council how you doing Mr yeah thank you very much um I just wanted to say that uh I know you have other stuff going on with the driveway and stuff like that I know it's been a long night you probably can't get into that tonight but um I've been to this property in the daytime in the afternoon actually I I was at the property in the afternoon then um officer Fitzgerald came by he was at the property with me in the afternoon and so yeah it's very unique in that in the afternoon during school days his property because it has nothing there is inundated by um students walking home home because they have to walk down that street for the bridge to go to the bridge and so because there's nothing there they can Venture off into the property at all times they can throw trash on the property at all times so just not only for safety purposes um for the amount of kids that are walking down that street and walking through the property um in the afternoon like I said I've been there in the afternoon um for this but he really needs something there because it's just not safe at all um in any shape form and fashion thank you thank you so much Mr Mayor any other comments from the council Council M life for Ward and then Council herbal so if Horseman closed down would you tear down the the whatever you trying to put up I don't think so I think it would be a nice addition to the to the to the neighborhood to have more Greenery because you're you're I'm being real you're saying somebody drove across your yard let's don't talk about the children you know children are children we were all there somebody decided just drove drive across your yard and leave their Tire print because it's a big lot and where were they going just going through your I I know where you are I'm on I'm on I'm on uh 415 Norwest 88 Terrace I I know where you are and you're saying that this happens too often or this one time you don't want to have it happen again this happen at least twice and somebody mentioned that that particular area is dangerous traffic wise I totally agree if you remember there was a little wall I do at the there's a little community garden and everything and then like somebody smashed into like there's I don't know what's going on that corner but there's a lot of drivers driving all over the place basically and and so when they hit it and break it then you're going to say what you want you want to steal wall or what I'm just trying to figure out why you want to take is this your property it's my parents property this is yeah and I and I love it y'all outlive my folks so I love it okay they could be my parents thank you but I'm just concerned you've been in this property a long time yes two years why you moved in something like this so big I'm sorry why you moved in here so big I live in Miami Shores on 93rd Street and it was what we could find that's close I got it I got it real quick you said that okay this never happened before I've been in the village 31 years this never happened before so I think before we go messing up something law enforcement needs to be on the watch I know where you are like I said I'm on 88 terrce I know where you are Northwest so just that's not a remedy what it says to me is it's simply locking in the property doesn't show me a a remedy these are children but that's not a child driving that no that's not a child yeah you didn't mind the children it was This Ti Mark that kind of mess you up right well it was the combination of it and there was also this related to the I presume children from the school I mean there was a there was a video I don't know if you guys saw it or maybe you didn't see it but there's a video from from my parents security camera of two again seemingly children from the school literally chasing a man onto my parents property right in front of the camera and like starting to hit him like it would it's insane and the police were called but you know again I I one of the things that freaks me out is I think about my my seven-year-old daughter spends time with her grandar all the time it's one thing reporting it to police after it happens it's another thing something happens right if if you understand what I mean right like I I think the police are involved there the the um school police or whatever are there seems like every day but still stuff happens and I just think that I mean we think that it's not safe chair quickly after she gets after she after council person Council life award are you with your comments yeah I'm just trying to melt in what you're trying to process it yeah I'm trying to process for sure I'm I'm where they are I just look like this I'm right where they are I just look like this Mr Mayor yeah I just wanted to say um safety is an issue uh and that's something that we should really think about moving forward because you know we have upgrade our Police Department we vamped our Police Department they're better than they ever have been before but they still need we still need more police officers um I understand they're children but uh Madam manager maybe about six months ago and quas was still with us we're at the school the students and let me just say this because there's a lot of things that happened throughout the United States and let me just show you the reserve of our officers the students jumped our officer jumped our officer horse man students teamed up and jumped our officer yes jumped him he didn't pull out Maz he didn't pull out a gun jumped him he was able to get them off of him eventually not only that we had a resident horse man students and I'm saying they're students but we were saying they kids but I'm trying to let you guys know kids what what we think about aren't kids like kids today um we had a resident horse man student man of manager hit her in the head with a brick this is when they're walking home from school this is when I went to his house and I'm seeing them walking through his yard their kids the kids today you all aren't kid there's a lot of stuff that happens that we just you know don't announce that we we go through on a weekly basis you guys can come by uh uh uh Council P Pella can tell you I'm here at Village Hall probably three to five days out of the week you can find me sitting up here on the DI I'm using in council person I mean chairperson Martin's chair if not I'm in council person Herb's chair and there's things that happen week in week out so I just want to kind of say that um safety is an issue um and just kind of put that out there as far as a couple of examples of uh how things have have have changed in this day and age thank you I think I think I do have to say uh something just because I do live really close to Horus man and for sure some kids are not necessarily acting like kids and there might be a lot of reasons environmentally and socially and familiarly that that account for that but there are a lot of kids that are kids and I've jogged around horse man numerous times I have two small boys a 2-year-old and a five a three-year-old and a 5-year-old my three-year-old is turned turning four on Sunday he would be very mad if I didn't say that but yes he's he's turning he's turning four uh and we go around the school a lot and a lot of those kids are sweethearts and they are kids um and because I have little boys that look just like a lot of those kids that go to Horus man I definitely don't want to make it appear as though the kids in Horus man are by and large uh bad or violent or anything like that I'm sure that those occasions um for sure did happen and were scary and there's a lot of conversation that I can engage you guys in as to why some of the kids nowadays are not necessarily acting like kids because we're not really treating them like kids or giving them the opportunity opportunity to be kids uh in the truest sense of the word word some of them are dealing with very very very adult issues um and they have kid brains and they uh react in ways that are unpredictable and definitely um not conducive to to being treated as what they are which is kids but I live around horse man as well actually went to Horseman and I think a lot of the kids there are are kids but I do understand that uh you've had a couple of incidences that are unfortunate uh with that being said I'll let councilman lightford Ward uh make her comment this is your this is your your your parents property they've been here for two years and there was nothing wrong when they moved in right you didn't see any of this do you see anything like no that started pretty much right after I mean not the tire tracks but trespass there there's a related thing where I don't know what was going on at that house before for the previous owners but I think um individuals may have been used to the fact that there was no fence of any kind around the property and at the very beginning there was all kinds of I I don't know who these people are but all kinds of people coming on the property um we have lots of this on video there was people going around the back off C off the security camera no idea what they were doing like just it's weird so we added security cameras that seemed to um disway the the the the situation from happening um but there are sort of like more serious things like like those and and the the attack that I mentioned that continue to happen and this is only within two years so um we're hoping that that that by putting a nice hedge on the side and putting a fence on the front it'll help them sort of like be able to sleep at night I'm between a rock and a hard place cuz I'm getting there I'm between a a rock and a hard place on this I know this property 31 years I know this problem but why make this because the elderly a word or Liv living there now why make this issue right now and I'm thinking of your parents in terms of me because I live on a corner you live on a corner so I'm thinking about your parents well if your parents weren't at that house years going by you didn't have anything something happened to make this star being a par something happened walk in a I I do I again somebody mentioned I apologize I forgot who it was I do think I don't know if it's the weird end of the street or something but there is also a traffic issue there which is maybe that car was out of control I have no idea but there is something you know I don't know I don't know what the city could do to address the intersection but there is something happening there I mean there was multiple times cars driving into wall and stuff like that so um I mean I can't speak to why any of that any of that happens we're just trying to protect parents yeah and and allow them to enjoy their their space as much as they can are there any other comments from the council hear council member bbal and then vice mayor so I mean my so as you sat through the meeting tonight You' heard us reference the the fence town halls and all that from right so Corner Lots were actually the sticking point in all of that discussion because of the uniqueness of the challenges presented by corner lot its specific intersections and this one we're certainly all familiar with um I will say that my primary concern right now Beyond figuring out if we approve this variance or not is the line of sight so I know there's an existing HED on the corner great so when that becomes uh unmanaged I mean it it dwarfs the stop sign like I mean we're talking eight n feet um uh so that's helps with privacy it helps with uh you know vehicles from certain angles coming onto the property but not from down uh Second Avenue there more from 86 Street correct so so do you know how far from the property line from Second Avenue going to that oak tree how many feet is it to that oak tree do we know from the property line to the oak tree yeah three feet four feet something like that it's not very far the the Hedge from the front no from the front from 86 oh whatever the I'm talking from I'm talking from Second Avenue I'm talking from Second Avenue from basically uh okay so you're taking your the the right subtracting that out and that leaves you about three feet is what you're saying yeah okay where the property so part of the reason why we would most likely my parents would most likely do a hedge is we also want to protect the oak tree and the property line literally runs through the roots I mean it's like a few feet away but literally runs through the roots of the of the oak tree and and so probably safer for the tree to not to put you know concrete or whatever in the roots and stuff sure not thees the fence will be on the front on the South Side along but that's not part of the varas along the so I know that we've allowed some fencing on corners and other places in the village however those were lied to I don't know that we've approved any fences on Corner L I know there some put up but I certainly don't know if we appr any okay there's my question uh thank you so much vice mayor oh um thank you madam chair um no my comment was uh about um the side yard I mean and and you have it's 35 ft as the second setb is 45 they just take an extra 10 ft just to include the oak tree um in their property which the property line goes beyond that point right be um no I understand that they want to place the the um barrier that they choose on the property line the property line which is 35 ft from the second setb um where'd you get to 35 small it's um here it says 35 ft that is 35t to the center line of the road so not quite 35 but um maybe 30ish see this okay so this is the same scenario of uh where I live where my house is facing well let's say like that the back back of your house is facing Northeast Second and yours is facing 86 so the one facing on the other side somehow years ago got approv a six foot fence on the second set back it looks horrible it does it looks horrible and I'm right next to it um vice mayor could you repeat that what what looks horrible the the the the six foot fence wood fence on the second set back because it was the Corner House okay but thly is the only side they have to enjoy the side house not a front it's a side um yard and in this case it's not a 25 ft is a 35 ft um distance from the middle of the road from the center line of the RO from the center line of the RO yeah okay can I just also add so we're not going to do a wooden fence for sure the the north of the property adjacent to the next house already has a Kucha hedge so this is kind of like a continuation of it Aesthetics I beaut is in the eye of the beholder I guess but I I don't think it would look bad I think that's why we're trying to do a clusia hedge to protect the tree but also I think it'll be in line with The Greenery of the area the six feet we would like to do six feet if you guys say only four feet we'll only do four feet but that's what we talking about okay I mean that's up to you guys but um we would ask for six feet if we can all right any other comments from the council hearing none I will open it up to our guest does anyone in the audience have additional comments about this item step up to the podium is the podium and state your name and address for the Rec hi Thomas pum 205 Northeast 86 Street um so I'm going to be one who is always going to Advocate and support Property Owners doing things on their property that is not infringing on other people um that said since it uh you know a lot of the same rationale in terms of danger um of nuisance um as well well as um you know what knowing having foresight beforehand the dimensions of your property and if you're next to a school or to dangerous people or whatnot um all of that seems to ring true in this case um it's my opinion since the council um appears to have the um perspective that Hedges and fences are um isource and not in character and limiting visibility all that sort of stuff totally understand about having a like a monotonous hedge kusia AA otherwise as we know we have a bunch of those that have been done without variants illegally that are six feet tall um up around the Village um that said I understand why you know from a um aesthetic reason which hasn't been articulated today we can do natural clusterings of plants you can do a natural clustering of trees that are higher than six feet tall that's allowed without variance so if it it's feels to me if the council really doesn't want to you know see more of these monotonous Hedges um which also are not controlled by the village because the only way it gets cut down is if you know a resident by their own valtion reports it to code enforcement and then a process begins there's no proactive measuring of the hedges if everything is in compliance or not um it seems to me that this should not go forward um and that the council really should uh emphasize the natural clustering of trees other Solutions um and provide that information to the residence as part of what the vision aesthetic Vision um actually is for for this location um that's my comment thank you thank you so much for the comment are there any is anyone else one second I'll open it up in a second uh does anyone else have a comment all right let me close it up to our guest and bring it back to the council but before that I'll have the applicant uh State his comment with all due respect to Mr pman is it polium sorry I appreciate the frustration you have with your own case and and the decision that was reached by the council in respect of your own issue this is different in your case the the the wall that you're proposing was at the front of the property this is at the side of the property there's also a huge oak tree it's in the pictures it's not really reflected on the survey because it just shows like a little circle that it's all shaded it's not conducive to Growing anything very tall there because there is the canopy of the of the oak tree that's there so I appreciate that and I think we have explored both with the Corino folks and with our landscaper and with my dad's green thumb and all this it it seems like the the appropriate solution in our case because it is on the side is to have a a hedge that would protect the tree be reasonably um easy to grow and maintain um and fit within the spirit and and overall look of the of the neighborhood thank you for the comment I'll bring it back to the council does anyone have an additional comment or would like to make a motion on this item I have a just two questions um okay so without variance a six foot fence would be able to be constructed on the west side of the property extending from the garage to the prop line and then back into the backyard all along the back until we arrive at the second Frontage is that right right and that it could go around the side but it would have to be 15 feet in from the property Lan 15 feet in from the property line would not be they not on the property line 15 ft in towards the house once we arrive at the secondary Frontage okay all right um and then my only comment for the council is again line of sight specifically on this property uh needs to be uh considered seriously why because of because uh because of the intersection so because vehicles um uh are traveling from three different directions uh it becomes uh impair and then we know this street we both these streets both these I mean that is a that is exactly where I would expect to see a collision occur if the line of sight was interrupted exactly pedestrians as well Jers all the above uh Council life award do you have a comment I I don't like the six feet can you adjust that six feet is you going off the radar right now okay six feet you're going off the radar and as As Time grows on Hedges don't just grow up they grow out nobody said anything about a fence they said about so you know where I'm going with that you can modify what what you're trying to do in terms of protection of our parents then I can understand what you what you want to do but six feet high Hedges and a fence so the fence would be on the front on the on the south side which I think six feet is the allowed no yeah there would be a gate as well but I think six feet is allowed on the that's the regular High defenses right that's no it's not allowed you talking about a six foot I'm five five and a half you talking about a six foot but the issue is that it's a corner lot so we're normally on the east side where you would start your six foot fence on the edge of the house the problem is it's a secondary Frontage that's that's the issue so so as you move so let's start at your garage and move and move west okay y six feet to the neighbors to the property line correct no no issue y now moving North to that property line no issue now moving East okay along the back of the house now we hit that edge of the house on the East side this is where we're saying that without a variance that fence has to cut in towards the house make it 15 ft off the setb cor drop down to four feet then continue respecting the setback off of Second Avenue right Y and then you could move around or or what you're saying is it's it's level with the plane of the tree you're moving towards the front of the house again under no variance we're at four feet still and then you move back in towards the house at that point um so there's your yard six feet most the way around and then you got this cut in four feet and then wrapped around on the tree and then so so it goes like that so without a variance that's your understanding as well as far as what would be available is that correct yeah just to be clear what you said on the the part that we're asking for the variance it would have to be 15 feet away from the property line once yeah once it yeah yeah once you become flush with the edge of that house then that's when the fence needs to cut in towards the house on I'm talking about the the east side I'm talking about the East face yep so you're you have your six foot fence no problem moving along the back there and then as soon as you flush with the edge of the house and there's no more house that's the point where the fence without a variance would have to cut 15 feet towards the house and then drop down to four feet as it moves towards Second Avenue on the North side so on the North yeah so on the North side that so that six foot fence along the back would not be able to extend all the way to the to the setback up up on the front as as soon as you become flush with that house two things have to happen fence has to drop to four feet and a setback of 15 feet is now in effect yeah so with the back what you're describing from both sides so what you're describing along almost all of the entire back because the neighbors to the north have a metal fence on the west side but not all the way to Second Avenue I got you yeah that there's already a clua hedge I don't know I've seen that yeah yeah yeah correct okay okay um and that is and that and that is is uh obviously not ideal but is it untenable I'm sorry I don't understand the question putting the fence without any type of variance under the existing guidelines to accomplish the same goal so the yeah the two reasons I'm not sure which one is is more important one over the other but one is what we've observed is the kids coming I don't I don't mean to blame all the kids from the school but kids coming from the school seem like they have a hangout area because there's so much lawn I mean right now it's way open but because there's so much lawn if we have if if we put the fence on the west side of the sorry if we put the Hedge on the west side of the oak tree it's going to still create a huge area for kids to hang out on the other side of that of that fence particularly if then under the current rule it's only allowed to be four feet high I mean four feet is not very high you know again yeah it's not a hard barrier you could easily exactly and again my daughter playing there you know all kinds of things um so that's one reason why we want to um we want to put it on the other side of the of the tree the other reason is we want to we want to my parents would like to include the tree as part of the if we put the if we put the cluser Hedge on the west side of the tree they effectively lost the treat thank you do we have a motion on this item motion to approve M chair do we have a second that motion uh do we have another motion on the item motion to approve a 4 feet um hedge of on the east side of the property do we have a second so are you excluding the fence on the east side of the property the frontage of the property it's um it will also have to be at 4 feet um not to interrupt the view of the corner right is that what you were mentioning uh Mr Oran yes yes I mean no matter what goes there the a concern a primary concern is line of sight uh yes I did mention um if you recall that um we may be able to condition that they produce an exhibit and he did he verbally explained that that he believes that it does comply with the the line of sight requirements but like to see an exhibit just to verify and prove that it's in compliance or you could make that a condition before they move to council or you could postpone or that's what you want to move to postpone this issue so somebody needs to make the motion she moved it I'll second it all right there was a motion on the table it is to be either denied or approved the right the motion there motion failed okay hold on right hold on hold on pel made a motion was there a second there wasn't a second okay so there was no second now you go back now you're motioning to go ahead State your motion for the record item you want to table the item until the next Planning and Zoning that's so you want a motion to table the item yes until until the next Planning and Zoning commit with the conditions with conditions in other words you see where we're going right yeah so you'd like to see the diagram indicating the safety line of sight line of the line of sight because your six feet is on one end but that front side and the side is what's giving me the question mark that's that's more what's going on right now and then I know we need to have a roll call but I also want to make sure that when when you produce this exhibit Charlotte you guys are going to review it to make sure that this stuff is accurate absolutely what the yes I just want to make sure that we're not relying on ourselves with a triangle it's a pretty typical type of review that we do for planning so perfect perfect perfect perfect so so go ahead but I do need to have the roll call but go ahead you see where we're going six feet ain't working for us all over the place that's not working see where we are yep hedges for safety purposes you see where we are so we didn't we didn't do anything yet we're just saying reconsider what you're doing y because right now you you going to gel them in literally six feet in the front all right Madam clerk can I have the roll call roll call member like to postpone to table this to the next Planning and Zoning commit correct it's going to be tabled to the next panz that's the the motion member to come back with the conditions no member lifefood Ward yes member bbom yes member Nickerson no uh Vice chair pill yes chair Martin yes 4 to one motion passes thank you all right we'll move on to item G6 that's 149 Northeast 87th Street can I have the applicant step up to the podium and state your name and address for the record have the applicant for 149 noreast 87th Street hearing none I'll assume that we don't have the applicant Char do you have the staff report on this yes okay yes this is an application by Adriana AR gurin who is the owner of the property um requesting an after theact variance for a fence located in the front yard setback located at the prop the property line at the property located at 149 Northeast 87th Street their request is to remedy a code violation um for this existing fence that is on the front property line across the front of the property the statement given by the applicant for their justification is primarily that this barrier is needed um to protect the home from some criminal activity that has been occurring at the property and the applicant has listed several incidents in their letter of request the code does not allow fences on the property in the front yard unless made of certain approved materials um that we've talked about earlier today um and limited to four feet this this um fence is much higher than that and does not comply with the materials that um would be permitted um via variance um the granting of this variance approval is in harmony with the general intent and purpose of the comprehensive plan as the proposed development is compatible with existing residential character and and the um requirements of the variance were reviewed and the applicant had shown cause for um the request for this barrier due to um the the recent history of criminal activity as noted in their request and um that our staff is recommending thank you uh does anyone have a comment about this no the only comment I have is actually making a motion to remove the fence and denial do you have a second yeah I'll second oh before we do I didn't open it to our guest uh does anyone have a comment about item G6 of 149 Northeast 87th Street seeing none I'll close it to our guest I'll bring it back to the council uh vice mayor made a motion does anyone second that motion not yet there is a so there's a second but there's also a comment I'll let you have your comment everything was done and on Sunday and on Sunday so with that in mind I move to we have a motion in a second so roll call what was the motion the motion was all right I walk it that okay uh Madam CL can have a roll call on this item please sure roll call member L foot Ward yes member bbal yes member Nickerson yes Vice chair Pella yes chair Martin yes motion passes 5 to n uh thank you so much uh we are now on to subsection H which is good and Welfare this is an opportunity for anyone who would like to do so to step up to the podium you have three minutes to speak about uh what has happened in this meeting anything that has been on the agenda I see that there is one guest that would like to up could you please uh give me your name and your address thank so much yes uh Scott cobri uh 85 8525 Northeast 4th Avenue Road um I uh don't know the proper situation here because I had spent a lot of time planning um to come here and with several neighbors who actually were here earlier but uh the item that I guess last minute got took off the agenda um so it was a very important thing for many of us being the launch um and um I'm not first I guess question is when uh might that be able to be uh I think I heard it might be May or June unfortunately um if it is ending up in June I have plans to be away then so I just wanted to try to make uh an important comment about it now um I have uh so the first thing is that um I was given this by my neighbor um Hugh Gladwin um who essentially is um within 250 feet of uh this new proposed development um and as a result of that we you know of course we saw the the the plans that were supposed to be addressed at this meeting um and they are proposing an eight story uh B um that's actually seemingly bigger than eight stories um you know the actual architectural uh top of the building is quite quite higher than that um and the I think the clearest Point other than several other elements that you know I think if this were on the agenda would have been uh discussed tonight um or or happened um but uh the the biggest one is um regarding that the 250 ft that it is within um of of a residential property um uh would mean that the building would only allowed to be four stories high um and the code is uh pretty pretty clear with that and there is this um public benefits program um that was apparently used uh as a way of cista um getting beyond that requirement um and think there was some sort of um you know uh Civic or uh Green Space that was promised as a result of that I'm not sure what ended up happening with that um but um in this circumstance because this other proposed building would be within the 250 ft this public uh benefits program is not supposed to be uh something that um is is is allowed it's still supposed to not exceed stories and of course there's a lot of reasons why that is because you know we're in um you know it's there was another neighbor here earlier and a few other neighbors as well we're in Sherwood Forest um which of course has has been discussed tonight is a you know is a very um you know historic pristine single family residential neighborhood um and there the reason why I a lot of this stuff is in the code um is to protect that um and so I wanted to just address that and there's several other elements um including uh looking at the plans um and this is more from me than from my neighbor um but um just regarding the open space um the uh environmental um aspects that are actually written in the code of of environment environmentally sensitive areas is specifically on the banks of the Little River um and um the specifically with with respect to the open space requirements um and permeable surfaces Etc um from the plans that I saw it appears that there's not really any permeable surface um it's pretty much you know all um you know uh you know uh concrete um and there is some wood decking but um they're supposed to be into the code you know the natural River Bank there um and there is also thing said about um you know pedestrians uh the on the Little River uh pedestrian access and not blocking the view of the river there's like a a lot of different elements that that this plan um you know seems to sort of try to get around um and uh wanted to have the opportunity to address that uh you know as I understand this has been a long a long meeting and um just because I won't be present probably at the next one uh unfortunately I wanted to try to just use this thank you for sure and I I let you run well over the three minutes just to get those those thoughts out because you won't be here for the next meeting I think the mayor had something that he would like to say about some of those just real quick because I know it's been aone meeting um for everything you brought up I have an answer to it and a rebuttal um I think I might save a lot of those or save mostly all of those for when this item comes up so that everybody can hear this um so that everybody can hear the facts let me just say first what everybody needs to First Look up is live local act Rhonda santis put that in place the live local act that is um Zone business business Corridor anything on the live local act they don't even have to listen to anything we say about density with Ronda sanz's new law on the live local act so anything that's in a business Corridor that's Zone business which that street is Zone business 83rd Street anything that's the business Corridor industrial yes anything that's business Corridor anything Zone that's not residential if they wanted to through Ronda Sanders's Li local act they could go up to 15 24 floors if they wanted to because they're in that zone absolutely 100% because they're because they're and they're part of the rapid transit zone so so we're doing a great job by keeping them where they're at secondly I'm G stop mam CH because I'm I'm gon get too deep into it uh secondly it's it's it's shorter than cista which is eight eight stories so the cavist say eight stories this is going to be shorter than eight stories so it's not more than eight stories it's actually shorter in length in in height it's shorter than eight stories um there's so much more you mentioned uh we'll just keep it there because I know I want to I want to address all the residents who have these same concerns so I don't have to repeat everything but for everything you said I have there there's a there's a response to that public benefits program there's a response to that there's so much to it yeah yeah okay uh I will certainly look into the uh the live local act um that's def okay um so um but um I I definitely will look into that obviously and try to understand that if if that's the case that's really uh you know a shame and pretty terrible govern everybody everybody's as a matter of fact yeah as a matter of fact it's so bad that Dural because deral is pretty much all you know like a lot a large part of it is business and Industrial dado put a moratorium on new businesses and new developments period so they didn't have to adhere by the live local act interesting so yeah so just on that note though um like what you're saying is essentially none of our ordinances matter um no because Governor santis made it so they live local act it's like we're the State of Florida who are you guys and so yeah okay and a lot of people are going through it as a matter of fact it was part of the live local active I don't know if you guys saw this but a few months ago there was a whole big thing on the news about on South Beach to Clevelander did you guys hear about that and there was an argument about the Clevelander actually probably like they were trying to fight because they wanted to build so hot that's the live local act and that's because because of where clevel is in the business Corridor business district they basically can't do anything about it and so if developers wanted to come in and just put all type of um height on it they can because the uh the great people in Tallahasse made it that way sure so okay yeah I appreciate you bringing up all these all these points but uh yeah I hope you can come back um I hope we we do have it when you're here so that I can address everybody because I know a lot of times you know um there'll be you know rumors and all type of stuff and I don't want that to happen so I have for everything you mentioned I was like oh I know the answer that I know that answer that yeah for sure thank you madam chair thank you so much thank you very much we appreciate you uh Mr pum I know you had a comment step up to the podium and state your name and address for the record thank you Thomas pum 205 Northeast 86th Street um first I have a question um I was told uh by you Anders bbom at the last meeting that that there would be a codea enforcement meeting directly after this is that still taking place tonight no it's not taking place tonight that was the original plan but um council person Martin uh called me out a few months ago she was correct I do need just a little more time to work on the noise ordinance so it most likely will be in June with the next Planning and Zoning meeting okay gotcha um okay U my next uh comments um so is a actually followup on the last Planning and Zoning meeting uh about two or three months ago now um I addressed these comments uh council person Martin you told me um to you would work with me in the interim you told me to send you an email which I did more than two weeks ago um we have not discussed that you reached out to me saying that we would have a conference call two weeks before this meeting you told me last week at the workshop uh Planning and Zoning Workshop I attended uh that you had been busy personally and that I guess that was not going to take place any longer um so I'm using this form to uh bring up those comments because they are not just for council person Martin I'm glad to see the entire Council here I believe at the last uh meeting two months ago um there was some absentee as well um so I'd like to um just go into uh one of the comments has since been resolved since it has been months and months ongoing and I've been working with the administration and staff to resolve some of it three are still outstanding issues that has been occurring for um up to a year in some cases um the my my first uh comment question um has to do with um my uh the neighboring property directly next to me at 203 Northeast 86 Street they have um in their first front setback in their Swale on the property line 20 feet uh AA Palms which block the visibility of my driveway we have codes that specifically say um for line of sight reasons it can be most four feet um I reported this to code enforcement back in September 28 2023 um I was told by fit Simmons that uh the forest is legally non-conforming trees so the village can't require the property owner to conform to the new code for removal or have it cut because it harms the health of the trees he did not mention at all regarding um the the driveway line of sight issue which is my specific issue regarding this because the 20 foot Ora Palms are right there I can't see um when I'm backing out who might be Crossing there's no sidewalk there either and again my property is extremely uh deep set back um so that is uh my first issue um I would like to understand what you know next steps for resolution uh there might be with this thank you for your comments and I do want to say something so a lot of times you guys come in here and you see us on this days and um I I want to assure you that everyone up here is human right and as hum sometimes really really horrible things happen to us that make us divert our attention to other things um and to that vein I would like to um appeal to everyone in this audience to look at us as human beings so sometimes when we intend to do something something very horrible could have happened to us and we couldn't do those things yet we still find time to come back and think about your issues and I know that you're not happy about what occurred today but I want to assure you that it's not anything personal um and I see you as a human and that you're frustrated and I give you Grace and I will still look into your issues diligently um but something did happen I and my family that took my attention and quite frankly prevented me from being able to physically be here although I do take my service very seriously so I will say that and I will get back to you within a time that is reasonable and that uh my personal life uh allows me to uh the other members of the council are also more than welcome to take up some of your issues as well but for me my family will always come first and I'll make sure that I handle that before anything else so in that vein I will get back to you when I can and in your additional question I will get back to you when I can as well so that's my response I don't know if anyone else has a comment but as for me I'm ready to adjourn the meeting so I will get back to you I do have two other additional comments as well you also have a three minute time limit I'll be gracious to you and I will enjo allow you to those two comments but please try to limit it to the three minutes since I am being so accomodated yeah may I ask a followup with that too so is that specific issue of Planning and Zoning like this meeting or is that a uh Code Enforcement issue meeting yeah but for the so should I be working with council person bbom who's the chair of that rather than Planning and Zoning uh potentially yes yes potentially yeah for the issue at the line I'm looking at the I'm looking right now the line of you have our emails you can always email us this and we can come back I did per your request and you didn't tell me you had a family emergency to speak with someone else don't have to I'm sorry I I I didn't even have to tell I know but it's news for me today well that's okay but I I I don't have to tell you what it is I I didn't even have to tell you that much the only thing I can say is that I think I've always been up here and treated people with respect and I've given everybody the benefit of the doubt and realize that sometimes really horrible things happen to people and they're not able to show up like they plan to so yeah I would just like to address this is a safety issue again line of sight with my driveway so I would just like to be able to work with the council to resolve it this this is absolutely fine you can send us an email you can send the manager an email I've seen the the emails that you sent to the manager to fits to all of us please email us away um and then I'm going to turn back to your issue uh and figure out some of those items that we initially spoke about when may I look forward to that happening as soon as I can I'm not going to put a date on it because I but as soon as I can hopefully it's in a time that's agreeable to you okay well it has been an ongoing issue since September 28 2023 and I've already worked with the village that's why I brought it up two months ago I'm bringing it up again if anyone else from the council is able to work on this I would greatly appreciate it um I will reach out to you as well since you are the head of the code enforcement with the same email that I sent uh Miss Martin three months ago thank you so much um my two other comments um the other this was all part of the same uh can we yeah what is the time check how long do I have you have three minutes from now to give me your two additional because I think we all yes I think we all want to go home so we have three more minutes and you can give me your two additional and this is a concession for you I'll start the timer and let's let's go um so the second Point uh Point um is we have a county code ordinance um that's been around for decades regarding nuisance lights um that has been defined as you know something that is trespassing onto your property um into your Windows onto the facade of your property Etc I have an ongoing issue with this with my um neighbor on the other side of the property several of the lights have already been uh have come into compliance based on our current codes but our county code regarding the um the nuisance lighting um if an adjacent property declares hey it's a nuisance because it's shining into my windows all night long uh even with curtains Etc um then that qualifies for code enforcement to date that has not been enforced so that's uh the second point that I'm looking into um and that same property at 225 Northeast 86 Street has another um they they have multiple um lights that are uh they have they got permitted for them but uh not with with the ordinance in consideration with the um uh nuisance lights of it's shining in other people's houses the foot candles that sort of stuff um so there are several lights on this building that are continuously shining onto and into my property including my windows all night long and that is something uh has been reported to code enforcement since uh August 23rd 2023 as well and I've been working with uh the staff Village here they have gotten um the foot candle part of the ordinance in compliance but not this nuisance light um if it's bothering an adjacent property which is my case that is all thank you thank you so much for your comment is there anyone else for public comments at this time all right hearing none I will go ahead and move us to subsection I uh do I have a motion to adjourn second second M Oh I thought you wanted to stay here all in favor say I I any you oppos say nay all right I show the planning and zoning committee meeting for April 17th 2024 adjourned at 9:48 p.m. good night everyone and have a good one