##VIDEO ID:Jke5JBfUrrw## presentation CH all right let's call this meeting to order at 7 p.m please rise for the salute to the flag I'll take I pledge allegiance United States and Justice all please join me in a moment of Silent reflection thank you sunshine law notice in accordance with the provisions of the open public meetings ACT public meetings may be held in person are by means of communication equipment to include streaming services and other online meeting platforms this meeting is being held in person and through the zoom meeting platform being broadcast from Burl Hall 748 River Road Fair Haven New Jersey public participation for this regular council meeting of August 12th 2024 is available by calling phone number through Web Conference Zoom members of the public will be on mute until it is time for questions or comments which will be announced at that time the public has the opportunity to question or comment by phone or through Zoom by the raiseed hand button and will be called on at the appropriate time noce of this meeting was included in a schedule of meetings which was adopted by resolution number 2024 13 and sent to the Asbury Park Press in the Two River times on January 4th 2024 posted on the burough website the bulletin board and the municipal building and has remained continuously posted as required under the statute with adequate notice having been given the burough clerk is directed to include this statement of this meeting Alison and I please have a roll call herei here here here wson here okay so we are going to start off every piece paper this is what it's all about right here this is a tremendous honor that I [Music] have um there was an incident day uh on rid Road and uh I'm going to read here before we uh ask everyone to come up uh Proclamation that discusses the life-saving efforts of that day it's commending the Fairman first a squad and fire department members uh that were involved in in this heroic act whereas on May 25th 20124 the Caren first aid Squad was dispatched to the intersection of Rumson Road and bua Vista Avenue Rumson New Jersey for a motorcyclist that had struck a tree with CB CPR already in progress Fairhaven Squad members quickly responded and were the first arriving ambulance on scene and quickly deployed to assist one Rumson EMS member and whereas the patient was found to be in full cardiac arrest from the traumatic accident and crew members assisted in establishing patient Airway providing CPR are and identifying immediate life threats through these actions the crew achieved return of spontaneous circulation in which the patient's heart began beating independently and whereas immediately after this achievement officers requested a metac assignment to allow the fastest transport to the trauma center extremely quick decision making determined that the most appropriate Landing Zone would be Fair Haven fields and whereas station 13 13-1 was dispatched to set up and coordinate the safe landing of the metac firefighters quickly responded to the field and removed all of the recreation equipment and walked the field removing all loose debris to ensure a fast and safe landing of the aircraft and whereas once the area was deemed safe for landing firefighters established a perimeter and remained in place so no one from the public enter entered the landing Zone whereas the aircraft was safely landed in the field awaited patient transport by Fagan's first aid transferred to the flight crew and flown out for definitive care whereas thanks to the quick action of the Rumson EMS member Fairman first aid Squad and fire department members individual survived his medical emergency and injuries and is currently recuperating now therefore be proclaimed that I mayor Josh alurn and the fan burough Council hereby commend all and Bol for their Instinct expertise dedication and professionalism during this medical emergency that resulted in such a positive outcome and congratulate them on the following recognitions first I'm going to start off with life-saving merit awards the first aid Squad starting off with Captain Brian Allison also life-saving Merit first aid Squad second Lieutenant Dan Mone life saving Merit first aid Squad Mary Moss life saving marry Gabby hinin you gave two to there we thank you and then one more life-saving Merit Alistair Jack entally I'm going to call up the names for unit citations starting off with Fire Chief Matt deantre Rich Andre Andrew Shen Vinnie feny fire police first assistant chief Matt bufano pronounce this right Raphael bugaru Ryan O'Reilly first aid engine operator Tim morisy Scott Smith and Cy Kathy grabau first um I'd like to invite everyone up here to take a picture and I really think we should give them the loudest Applause ready congratulations great job you thank you picture congratulations is 70 got compl that I we quick reaction one of that she was she in is she able to get on who else is all right we're GNA keep this uh this moving along uh next up we have an Eagle Scout project request from um Alexander oranic uh regarding a pollinat garden extension is Alexander here tonight yes it is you do perfect good evening I live on Lake Avenue I've lived here my entire life and I am now a life Scout in troop 2011 as throughout my life I spent a lot of time on the Third Street Trail whether it was sleding in the winter or doing cleanups or even helping my sister with her EOS Scout project which is planting the shade trees that are in out there I have seen it improve and I've seen it grow in like there's so many new things there that are just nice to see and I would like myout project to help improve and because of that I would like to ask for permission from the burough Council to extend the existing poll pollinator Garden to H and I'd like to do this project this fall and finish it this fall you have any questions for me and you for your time sure first of all congratulations um on the surface this sounds fantastic just a few quick questions I have when you say extended um do you mean going further away from the path where it is now back into the grassy area or is there stretch it out more so if you were looking at path it would be more to the left about like the same size that it is now like so if you're looking at it from the path the extension would be on the left side yes okay so going sort of up towards the hill okay um you you'd be using this the exact same types of uh plants and you know okay got it um what do you need what would you be asking for from the burrow if anything to make something like this happen I don't think we actually need anything from you guys because we will be fundraising ourselves by using your car wash and also calling out from the public for donations from like for like milked and plants like that so I don't believe we did okay have one question I have a question have you spoken to um members of the Natural Area yes I've SP I've spoken to Bonnie and also Mr olon about it so and they're they're in agreement with you they support you just one question Stoke love it full support um any Lessons Learned From the first pollinator Garden that we could potentially apply to this as we add on um well we're going to need to clear out the bottom and that planting actual plants instead of just seeds will speed up the process and make it an easier thing an easier like job to do cool thanks I think this is great my compliments to you on achieving this level of eag scout just be able to come forward and put a proposal we did an excellent job and look forward to watching you do your work and thank you does anyone have a motion to approve motion to approve second uh all in favor I anyone opposed congratulations you uh will you provide a report afterward once it's all said and done you can send something in so we can take a look or even let us know when the opening is and the reveal maybe you can come and and if yeah I think along the way you need signatures for me just uh Alis and the Bro clerk if you can get them to her Chris and I'll I'll get them sign whatever you think thank you you got it great job um all right next up uh Foundation of Fair Haven uh it's that what's that oh I'm sorry didn't even know she was on I knew we were trying she's not as a she's hi guys can you hear me yes hello hello from Taiwan I'm sorry that this is a bad uh bad connection the only thing I wanted to say is that um I fully support I'm so excited we're moving forward with this um I just want to mention that we don't have a water source there yet so my only concern is that maybe we could prioritize is getting a water source to Third Street Trail just so that once we plant them we're not going to they're not going to die like we can actually get water to them so that's my only comment okay thank you thank you thank you well I guess we all speak on this so it's actually is that I has been supplying the water to that area um and she helped because his sister as say she did the tree e project there and so my friend was happy to let us use her water and and since then that now two years it's two years yes so definitely I know we were speaking together about ideas on how we can maybe like we're happy to do with the trees we in water buckets at Earth and we didn't do that because we believe it we want to um grow and do well but there were some ideas um well I think this is a different discussion truthfully it's not it's not on the agenda the Water Source the I understand but that that's not on the agenda either what was on the agenda was the project that he brought up which we've all approved and if we want to discuss that during good to the burrow that's something we can discuss at that that moment I I just don't want to Veer off course here into a capital Improvement that has nothing to do with his project so we're good um you know and if you want to talk about the water s later I'm sure it's going to come up we we'll have that discussion in that time okay thank you thank you all right next up is foundation at Fair Haven it's October Fest um they are making various requests for September 28th uh I don't know if there's oh there is here should have remembered I'm I'm representing the foundation Haven about um our event on Saturday September 28th um hours are from 4: to 10 p.m we kept done this event before we took a little hiat due to co and so um CH off and now we had kind of resurrected this event and we'd like to bring it back to the fields uh it features live music Craft Beer vendors and a beer truck Prov who we've worked with a number of times in the past uh food trucks business and craft vendors um and we also invite the fair Heen businesses to participate in this event of No Charge they can come and set up their lares or sell their items whatever they'd like to do for that day um we have a number of kids activities some adult games um and we are requesting use of the property as well as uh DPW the police um and some sign approvals anybody has any questions I do have a map of I do have a map of the um s parking lot I haveone un like Fair Heaven day we use more we so first question maybe for maybe for the chief actually um with with DPW making use of the since they're not in the DPW they're making use of that parking lot for parking all their does that create any issues with this map or not we we worked closely with them on Fair day and they were able to move anything that we needed out of the way and for know Chris rich but yeah I'm sure they I don't why we as coverage we work really close with them we'll get together with them figure out what they need or don't need and we'll help them out and the foundation page for that separate so won't be out of the bur at all correct for cover correct we did it before I think it be yeah I'll coate Rich probably you know those at the site that okay and then what does adult games mean cornhle Jenga we're working with an event company to also bring in some other games not any games a chance that would require any kind of Licensing one's like a little Target game a throwing ball game a a hatchet game it's all very kind of low low inow and is that is that area fenced off where the beer T is be the beer actually the we fence the entire property because we allow people to walk around you have all this assorted beer vendors and the beer truck so on like fairen day where there's a small Corral we actually Corral the whole event this is a ticketed event so you come in you have to pay an entrance fee and you're kind of in the whole of that where all of the items are so the kids activities will be inside that Corral and all the beer will be in that zone you can see that on the map so what um I Heard two things ax throwing drinking right they're classic they're classic Sor and are the adult games drinking games or they're just games meant for the adult no it's just kind of just an added value to have something to do when you're kind of standing around having a beer okay great thank you uh one other question um and we brought this up in an engineer DPW email earlier um so for the council's um recollection last year there was a renegotiation of the DPW contract so that uh when DPW supported certain events throughout the year they were paid cash overtime instead of comp time right because we're coming up against that comp time affecting that so I think bur administrator um yeah there was a question that came up regarding comp time and would they be allowed to do it but obviously they renegotiated a contract they getting paid the overtime for it so it would affect manow oh good okay cool love it we're very excited to bring it back and the the sign requests are for some long signs scattered throughout Town um on private property um as from September 1st to October 1st as well as we'd like to use the large sign that um similar to what the farmers market uses on River Road coming into town um from again from September 1st to October 1st but we would work with the market I spoke with them earlier to coordinate their Banner being of and ours awesome three Nam yes there are three vs um based [Music] on based on the requests that she has made um is there a motion to approve motion to approve second all in favor I anyone oppose thank you all will attend prob I Amanda yes is this being coordinated with dj2 so he can Sports yes I think we've already had some preliminary conversations with DJ he aware of the dates great thank you all very much thank you thank you okay um next up is proposed traffic ordinance amendments um we would if uh if there's no issues here we would eventually introduce introduce these on September 9th this is a workshop um the chief is here if anyone has any questions and um do you have a hand yes yes that's it you can you just Nam me uh yeah all of them or just the yellow just the yellow creating a four-way stop at Kemp Avenue and Hill Prest no stopping or standing on Cambridge Avenue change times from 6:30 a.m. to 8:30 a.m. and 1:30 to 3:30 p.m. Third Street no parking at north side of Westerly curb line Cedar Avenue approximately 150 ft West and one more no parking navis EV Northerly from L intersection East 50 ft street street parest it was at Cedar Park on that corner the stop sign problem to the right side or left side to the right side the left side you go parking at area that where the baseb oh got it the cars that Park where the stop sign I think we're look at this we had 150 fet I went and looked at it I think maybe we cut that down a little bit maybe one side to 100 the other side 75 feet uh so you know if you say it's okay then I'll work with the turn but the one on Third Street would be not where the indentation is one the ones that we're discussing right now are the ones that are pilot what about the other ones the other ones AR we're not there yet right I like and um okay I have questions on other pieces of it but I'll talk off about that I'm good on the uh uh the Cambridge ones the the current times yeah times were understood we took a look the best for the yeah perfect we talked about earlier copy that so just for my own benefit this uh traffic safety meeting who's who's in that meeting what's the is it is it just burrow people or is it County State uh you talking about in the future we won't have that meeting no it says here the following ised at our recent traffic safety meeting yes it was in just internal yes so people that know the to yeah you mean pleas follow us any other questions no thanks for taking the time ke thank thank you all right um next up ebike and E scooter regulations again if um if it was enough um support here uh this could potentially be introduced on September 9th as well okay so you all should have received um the latest on that mayor y um I see that uh it's under 13 13 and under right on sidewalk that was a question I had as well 14 right 13 and under sorry I I don't really think we should allow that on well I have two separate my personal opinion on this I have two separate interpretations I AG I agree when it comes to ebikes and E E Scooters um I'm okay with young kids uh on reg bikes on the sidewalk but I'd like to hear from the chief because I haven't had the opportunity to discuss that specifically yet I might just breaking down my thought on it maybe I'm wrong um if if we can if if we're saying that they can't be on the street because of their age and that's the reason for them to be on the sidewalk my interpretation of that is maybe they're not mature enough at that age yet to be operating an electric bike in general so I'm not going to take that decision away from the parents but I also don't want to pestering on the sidewalk to get clipped by someone that maybe isn't prepared yet to ride that at a high speed we had that exact conversation we went back with Pon L we just felt that the number one concern was that right now we kids are that age to ride their bike on sure just because they're trying that's why we kind of left that in there so that because a lot of young kids that's why just by way of introduction as well um we've had multiple meetings uh with the chief with uh Earl administrator and other other officers uh to discuss this because it's obviously of the utmost importance I know mayor you've stressed this and I know the council is you know stressing that we we put something together so we've had multiple meetings to discuss this is a a living breathing ordinance that we need to make sure we get correct you know in from minute one um kids lives are you know in Jeopardy and that's what is the utmost importance to the town and I know as a you know the mayor of the council so any feedback you give we'll will continue to revise until we get this right um we we' looked at you know multiple municipalities ordinances regarding ebikes fortunately unfortunately there's not many that you know municipalities that rival uh Fair Haven um we're a small compact community that is we don't have school buses um we are a walking biking town so that's what we're looking to you know get it right in the first place so whatever constructive criticism you have you know on me so I can so we can continue to work on this I'm not even saying I'm right I think it's a very challenging discussion I'm one which one's correct we had like said we you we tried to figure out what the best age was that but we're trying keep to get on the sidewalk with the bit that we're telling e bites they should be on sidewalks um the problem is that the more you lower the age the less likely the person is to be able to control the bike I would think in in general if it's going the same speed I realize this is just anecdotal but what is the youngest person you've seen on one of these EV I me just a guess I think Young I think about six or S yeah maybe even younger yeah young those little cars those little Elric cars driving down the road does this does this ebike orament conf does it have any discussion does it conflict with regular bicycles and I don't know if that's this it's like I don't want to bring regular bicycles into the ebike and E scooter conversation I think all these definitions have to do with motorized whether it's a scooter or ebike and we also did choose to keep in scooters as well yeah in order to regulate that as well the reason the reason I raised this is is because right we we we talked considerably at this Council right the need to take action on this and have something to start and since this is focused specifically on ebikes and E Scooters I think the way we should frame this is is whether or not we're comfortable with the age of an individual on an ebike or an e scooter riding on the Salk I think that's the question up that same point if I may to is I'd rather not see any motorized bike on the sidewalk for the sake of the pedestrians this is because if if if you're allowing motorized light on there's a threshold or we just say no no use of sidewalks for motorized bikes then it's up to a family to decide look this is only allow in the street and you're not old enough to take a motorized bike into the street so it it puts the decision where I I I personally feel this is a a certain extent this is a family decision um there only so much so much we can regulate or should regulate but yeah sometimes we have to because yes to try to keep safe we we we talk I think we came with 13 we were trying to cover everybody at nobody right is that kind of what we said no we were we did a t because we try to cover everyone um sickles but but you have bikes on here that uh no on the sidewalks 14 it's for we're supposed to be 10 I thought we no 10 is the helmet that was my next question it should the sidewalk should have been 10 everyone should so so for G it says a person over 10 years of age shall not operate a ride upon a low speed electric ble or a low speed electric scooter is a passenger I yeah driver and passenger why is it even showing the person over um 43.3 g 43.3 g yeah why does it read a person over or 10 years of age shall not operate are we saying someone a 9-year-old can do whatever they want can I chime in sorry that was a that was a typo it should be 17 that's what the state statute says 17 and younger helmets are required whether you're operating or your passenger the 10 the 10 was supposed to be on the sidewalk so I will make those two changes so you mean a person under 17 not over yeah the whole the whole phrase is wrong it it should be a person under 17 years of age um another question in uh uh under motorized bicycle um a capable of a maximum speed of no more than 25 miles per hour so you have kids riding bikes that are going fter than cars on pimp Avenue or yeah but they still have to follow regulations say you can't have any 2 which is what they're made to do that's what they like that doesn't mean you can go over the few thought of B student okay um Council Nicole had a question today about four-wheel conveyance yeah I'm I'm personally I just want to say to my colleagues here on Council I don't think we should have try to capture fourwh uh Vehicles is a two wheel motorized hop you know we're trying to you can remove yeah something put in um are you thinking about 4x4s or you thinking about golf well so when it was originally drafted it was just it I believe um Police Department came up with it from another um it was atbs there another to there's there's Street rated electric vehicles like or maybe we just change the word to say ATVs I don't think we need ATVs that would be an easy I would want to have some open deliberations about that and tonight is about bikes and scooters and I think we so L yeah exactly we can remove l i some questions after we put all the regulations in you see every kid's gonna getv now I want to go back to because um you know motorized I I can honestly say this is feels really um difficult to discern but in my mind there's a slight difference between a motorized scooter when you're on your feet inches from the ground and can got off of it seems slightly different to use that on a sidewalk than a motorized ebike um so I want to rephrase that ebike not a motorized bike the motorized bikes are in the street full stop period that's it but these hybrid ebikes um it sounds like we're this draft contemplates 10 and under n and nine and under riding on the sidewalk um as it reach now it's 14 and under buta said it was a mistake nine and under or person over 10 well I guess what I wanted to open for discussion is should there be any motorized ebikes on the sidewalks at all anywhere in fairen and does one versus the other make it a little easier to enforce it's it's a tough discussion as they said do you want to do you effectively want to tell the younger kid they have to go in the street and then the kid gets hit by a car but the same token that you mentioned you ban it then it's up to the parent to make the right decision is my kid ready to actually ride the bike in the street and event is designed as a community the way you described a third of the population is 18 and under parents make those decisions all the time you know you're old enough to walk to your friend's house and now you can ride your bike to school and after that you'll be able to you can ride your bikes into Red Bank yeah but that's a personal decision based on the growth and development of your child and your family Valu so but what I'm suggesting is that sidewalks and we do make allowances for bicycles correct uh and even ma is some you know it gets a little there's points of friction but I I I want to suggest that keeping all motorized fides off the sidewalks is straightforward it's simple it puts the decision making in the home um and there's plenty of options they can ride their regular bike to school if they need to be on the sidewalk just throwing it out there so have a discussion it's not an easy I hear it yeah and and I I think it makes sense I'm just I could see both sides of it who who are we to say they can do it or can't do it right like who are we like I I see both sides of it and I don't i' rather air more ey it's it's [Music] balance I have I have a couple questions just about well kind of to that point right we're trying to keep track of age motorized sidewalks like to me that's like a lot to keep track of but I'm not in it every day when when we're talking about enforcement here right juvenile refers to what someone under the age of 16 18 oh 18 okay so a juvenile would basically get two warnings before they get a summons for a fine well it would go to the parent but yes second warning is parents yeah first war first Warning Second first Warning Second is impounding and and then and then having the it says warning and then it says then it goes to the parent then it says um there's no I read I believe I'm tracking with say no the second the second step is the right and then you get then you get the F what I'm so my question is is this going to be really hard to enforce like who got the first warning who got the second warning got keep track of it my point is that like it's officer John one day and officer you know Susie the next day but that was the um the other component that we had discussed in the meeting was actually registering all of these and that's why we had the registration component so we can track all of you so if it's the same ebike you know that the same Rider same ebike you can track you know because we're not going to attract the the juvenile's name we're going to attract the parents name and the bike the bike would have a decal correct but I'm saying how like practically speaking how are we going to do this file like any other file I guess what my point is I'm in Shaver of simplifying so my point is I think we get rid of the second one I think we go A and C and A and B and I think we got to start holding people this is a life and death issue I don't I personally don't think a second offense in an impound I think can go straight to a summons I really the only problem with going from a to c is it doesn't say that the parent get notified notifi combine my point is that like I don't think it's gonna be really hard to have three status I think the other the other thought too behind people are getting killed right so like this is a life and death issue this isn't like this isn't no offense to any other ordinance that we have but this is a serious ordinance I want I want to Echo two things that Christen say right the first is is by giving two warnings that I don't think that is deterrent enough right and commensurate enough with the what could happen with the F comply right we just had that the fire department in here and first aid and I'm not comparing a motorcycle to an ebike but the guy you know so I think having stricter uh penalty as a deterr needs to happen number one and number two I think asking to have these scooters registered and trying to manage it from that perspective I think it has to be on on on the individual perspective because you're saying here that that uh that there's a department file right shall be made in the Department's files so is there a way to see when a child right because if I hop on one bike right and that's registered to Andrew Soo and then I get yelled at and then I hop on a different bike and that's registered to Kristen right and so those are two first time offenses but for the same kid right that's I think we could we could track that in system I don't think it' be that with router bikes you know I just don't know if we can put J's names in the system so I have to take a look you can't put that to take it seriously and if we have like a couple pushy ways before they get in trouble they're not going to take it seriously I it just so I can talk about the reasoning when we were when I was drafting this ordinance when we were collectively drafting it um was that the deterrence of having their their B taken away from them and the parent having to go to the police station in order to retrieve the bicycle I think is a pretty big DET ter and I'm speaking from both legal counsel and I have a 10 and 12 year old boys that both have e bikes yeah but you're you're not every parent parents the same way let's be honest I understand that but but but I have a you know I see you know my kids friends and I see the way they operate but I think the sheer embarrassment my younger son is so happy to have received I mean he's going to have 10 pies of pizza from lbos soon from getting from wearing his helmet and and obeying the the laws by riding his bike in a proper fashion and I think these things are what kids will remember yeah and I think if they if they have their bike taken away from them and their parent has to go and retrieve the bike iar pretty big yeah I would agree in I disagree that I love the car of stick the partnered with our to to Really proper I'm not knocking this I'm just I'm just worrying about life or death my I guess my only question to balance this is I agree that a parent coming down I don't think any parent wants to come down to a police station to get a bike or do anything but for letter A if you're a kid and you get a warning and it's deemed not to reach out to the parents what are the percentage odds that that kid is telling their parent that they got that one probably so I guess from that standpoint that's that's the only part of this is I'm not I'm not thinking it's a and c I would say it would be B and C yeah I I would agree parents need to know if you if you were going to eliminate step it it wouldn't be the second step you it would be the first step because the first step is it you know the officer telling the kid you know you can't ride like that if you do I'm going to call your mom and then the kid gets home and the M's like did you have fun and he's like yeah you know well would you feel more comfortable then if we um remove the language if the warranted and that the parent was notified yeah I would feel better if the parent was notified on the first offense second offense the bike is taken away with that said I think our Police Department is perfectly capable of having a oneon-one with a kid like hey yeah you gotta see what the defense was too it's GNA matter so I can sorry so I just we are we're trying to place our mindset into a reactive manner right we're trying to understand how the behavior of the child and or apparent is going to change right based on a potential cause and effect we need to take a step back right if God forid somebody died tomorrow we wouldn't be contemplating on the severity the enforcement we would be going to The Other Extreme so the way that this ordinance in my opinion I think chrisen you agree we have to look at this we want the enforcement strict so that we're changing their behavior now before they're issued a summon and have to change their behavior so so I agree but I think I think if if the parent is notified you you got to give some leeway to the police department to recognize when a situation deems notifying and when it doesn't you know there might be a situation where someone's not following the rules but it might be unintentional then there's another situation where someone's driving down the street at 30 miles per hour doing pop of wheelies with two people on the back of their bik and that's very intentional and very dangerous so you know I I think you have to balance those two things give them the tools to do the job that they do take it seriously at the same time recognizing that we want to change behaviors I think I think if if the first time they do something the parent is notified I think that's going to change behaviors immediately yes well not par can I I totally agree with you but at a certain point it's not our job to parent kids it's not that's not our role our our role is to make reasonable ordinances for the for the buau um they they they have to have some leeway to make decisions for their family as well and I think that kind of balances those two things about owering giving you the tools you need to enforce the safety all this marinates so if you impound the scooter what happens to the child do they ride back to the police station with you you take them home you let them walk home if you would you would take it and they would walk they would walk home but what if they're from out of town what if they're 10 miles away I I I right I get it right we're doing second well what would happen now if something else happened that wasn't bike related they would handle it the same way and they at a party and they did something they shouldn't have done I agree and I have the utmost confidence that's why I think having B and C and removing a there's a tremendous amount of rules and regulations and guidelines that this gives in order for the police to be able to do something yes and so more the better I think the police do an amazing job my point is like let's simplify this we don't have to track too many too many variables yeah can Michael speak Michael hey guys um just to clarify when you say that um they're impounded they get their bike back is that what you're saying yes yes unless they don't retrieve it in a certain amount of time within 30 days Michael they have to retrieve it okay so I just can I just weigh in here um so the on the sidewalk just to go back to that what is the age of we that we allow just regular bikes on a sidewalk 13 13 under 14 under 14 under 14 so I just wonder if we should be consistent about that just because then that gets just another rule that I didn't even know it was 14 I never knew that until the last meeting we had so I just feel like adding another age just might confuse things um just a thought and then also I don't know I mean Drew makes a good point like are we only finding people in our town then or like how does that at work are we tracking everyone who everbody have toy the doesn't matter this this this is an ordinance within our town limits everyone has to being but then but then if like they're not going to have are we tracking those Outsiders as well though like the outside Community well and like how do we know if it's if it's their second offense you know like they're not we would keep track of it so even if it was at even still have their name they tracking wouldn't matter okay and then Tracy mentioned having four wheels I just want to clarify though there are like the little like Tonka truck or not Tonka trucks like the little four-wheels like if there were maybe we should put a specific speed I think we have a speed but if you add four wheels we're removing the uh four wheel means of conveyance wait say that again I'm sorry we're removing that Michael counc brought something up there's a registration requirement in here to register with the police department so if how is someone are we just expecting someone from Rumson that might ride over here no to come register their bike no we have name sorry no no no no that's totally fine sorry are we still going to require every ebike to be registered we're here to talk about I me you gota you got license yeah track ownership I I listen I think in theory right that everything we're talking about sounds great but from a practicality to ask I I just I just don't see it being practical to ask our residents to register every single ebike and scooter why is it why is it easier for a go than is for anybody I'm not I'm not I'm not I want to I want to treat it severly right because I could say I could say why do we approve tree ordinances or a tree appeal because we're afraid a limb might fall and hurt somebody right then that same logic here why wouldn't we want a stricter enforcement because got somebody can get hurt right I don't want to play apples and oranges but it comes down to the practicality of one how you're tracking it and two how you're enforcing it and when you look at 8 38% Tracy you said 18 yeah okay yeah roughly a third of our population right and how kids are interchanging the use of bikes the goal isn't to penalize the the bike the goal is to penalize the individual driving it right just as if I'm driving your car and I get pulled over I get the ticket you don't get the ticket because it's registered your name right it's the it's the person who's owning that you're saying I agree to buy by the rules yes and no if it's a speed camera in another state the person that has the vehicle gets detected totally agree we're we're not talking about speeds here right like and and the difference just to bring up on the tree ordinance is that the Tre the person that lives on the land is saying they're concerned about the tree falling on their own house sure in this situation as well we're giving the parent the choice of how they want to handle their own child and how they ride their bike totally get it I'm just saying I'm concerned about a kid getting I am too well I think that's why yeah no I get it I get it it's my my intention by the way isn't to penalize I don't feel like that's the purpose of this I I think it's our job to look to provide regulations and tools to our pity to um ensure safe mobility of everybody of the choices that are available and suitable for your individual family what's the safest way for for us to regulate not just um not just Behavior really it's it's this type of vehicle and in what Corridor which facility it's being used and in what manner so the penalties are just a piece of this in my mind um and those are really just tools honestly regulating Behavior takes time and it and whenever you do it with just penalties it usually doesn't work you need carrots and sticks which is the L story that um we heard about last time Chief told us and you know so I just wanted to throw that out there as a thought we have a rogue Network and we have a sidewalk Network and certain sections we have trails and thankfully we we're a community that provides for multimodal opportunities if everything is very close and Compact and you can access all the amenities and schools and churches and stuff lots of different ways in this town so we're just looking for ways to that se and I just wanted to throw that out there for cont to frame it a little sec I I don't think we have to Reg to keep to just keep track for violations I I don't think we really need that in there we're just trying to make it a little bit easier and just so we keep track B stolen or something but that's something that we that's exactly what the CH said like stolen it's registered and then now we have but if that's you know one of the points and I mean not you get rid of it if we take that out it's not going I know but I'm trying to Andrew to your comment right I'm trying to find practicality right then why don't why why don't we stop with stolen e bikes and not stolen bicycles right and then like we we can't do everything if we're trying to do everything we're going to do nothing well right and Tracy I understand what you're articulating and I think what you've outlined are multiple facets right to a central problem right you're talking about all these different aspects so here we're talking about the consequences specific to to not abiding by this ordinance right every single ordinance has enforcement and a consequence when you don't abide by action so what we're contemplating is is the the degree of consequence that we think makes sense based on what could possibly happen if somebody doesn't follow the right and that's why this is like a life and death yeah but it's not the only part that we're talking about as well as trying to but it's the only yeah agree but it's the only part on paper right now that the plating but we have to look at the whole picture as right say right at the it sounds like there's two possibilities here based on what we just discussed correct there's the possibility that we get rid of um a or b one or the other and just go BC or AC right the other options turn a to read um that the parent of legal Garden will be notified keep it as ABC will be notified next one impounded thirdd one summoned for a fine of 250 I'm just going to throw out there not to money the waters even more I'd like that that third one to be include b as well um so if they get B and they and their scooter is impounded um and then they get caught another time doing something they shouldn't be doing I still think their scooter could be impounded and and the fwn and the sus I think it should be a step ch that just adds more and more to the issue um because once we get to that point we obviously have someone that's not following the rules and um you know we got to address it properly I you so you know also I'm highlighting that uh because I spoke to them earlier today the B under adult operators would be mirrored to the same $250 right that we have then we have for the juvenile so unless anyone has any other thoughts on yeah you know I think of um you know any ordinance you can poke holes in it you can't make them perfect um I like that we're we're trying to think of the the holes and the weaknesses proactively but my mind goes to sort of like coaching um sometimes you coaches or sometimes kids respond well to criticism and others respond well to praise and I I like having several steps and layers that give discretion to the police officers they can read kids they know the situation they know a lot of the kids I like them having a lot of flexibility as the police you have discretion no matter what the no matter what yeah no matter it's just that you have something behind it like like the mayor said if it's a kid that maybe has helmet do have a buckle that's something you can just talk to him about or it doesn't have helmet on but you doing wheelie you're doing 35 that's a whole another thing so that's why you have some discretion there's always discretion yeah I like having a lot of layers there's always discre sort of where where they want to they already have that discretion based on the wall that you have now you have something this what this does is what this does is if they choose to exert that discretion because someone's poing or they give the finger or because they're just blly inornate then they can fall back on this and have the strongest Tools in their tool box in order to provide consequence but the discretion that talking about they already have you don't need to spell it out here well I'm saying they have discretion to dial it down but they can't necessarily dial it up right unless we provided unless we provid yeah that's that's a good way to put it yes exactly and this provides it that is a very good way to put it we have that discretion that this has something to F for the next step we're talking about what level we want that minimum to be right and is the minimum a phone you know a phone call is it whatever but I think Josh to move I think you summarized it perfectly right I think AC BC some combination in in just less steps more impact less steps and you want make it easier for you you guys do an amazing job there's like know 13 of you and 5,000 of them so like how do we this just gives you some you know something yeah to back yeah personally I I like either BC or I like changing a to say they will be notified and then keeping the other ones I advis to do that what you just said that's a good I like that they will be notified that's what you're saying right they will be notified the next one impounded will be will be notified the next one impounded and the third one um does everyone agree with me that that it should be impounded again on the third one or no sure all right and then the third one wait are you saying they'll be impounded on both of them just not on a Michael on B on B and C yeah does that seem I don't know if we need both them I don't know I'm kind of on the fence about whether they need both just have it be impounded on the third one but they have 30 days to come and retrieve it which means I I'm not looking to make it once they get to step three I you know I'm not really making trying to make it a cushy situation for them you know at that point yeah and it's all predicate on it to be tracked by per K not first scooter and if it's not there Michael once they get to third fourth fifth sixth would they never impounded them they could keep going and they get the summons every time but the bike would never get impounded I guess um can I just add something really some grammatical question or thing I think in the first line it says whereas the burrow has seen I think it's we've we H like that there have been I think it supposed to be hve instead of H that's very it's missing parking that's the only thing I thought of exactly put like where are they allowed to park them well you know or we just where they can I this I showed I thought you did I knew I saw and when we get on the police um I I love this chart as you can f my little highlight um will this be added like EES be added as a separate is on there for bikes I don't know I can I'm not sure check um I have another question on this uh and maybe there's a state law that trumps it is there any penalty for someone um manipulating these electric bikes so that they have a govern higher speed capacity than well most I think to be restricted it's monitored by phone you can you put a governor the governor is on B is 20 and then if you take the governor off it goes up to 38 milph is this no because of you're a dad of two kids with these bikes they don't have that they don't one of a good friend of one of my sons has a bike that like that and the parent has the app and it has a governor set on the app wow and if she was to remove that Governor the bike would go up to 38 miles per hour that's insane but then they're not doing anything illegal that's just a parental decision is that that's a pral decision okay so it's not like someone's illegally manipulating the bikes or but if a parent was to give their kid the app which would be foolish they they could do it on their own right well fortunately all our roads are 25 miles an hour and under I'm just going to ask that we 30 mil an hour with no protection around you going down the road just well I'm going to ask that I think insane I I have a good question let me get my phot if you don't mind that um I visit this idea of keeping motorized bikes in the roads not on the sidewalks the sidewalks are pedestrians because of the nature of Fair Haven we make a special allowance for pedal bikes not motorized bikes which I think is perfectly appropriate and fair but these motorized um bikes really and I'll just go halfway and say maybe maybe the east scooters are okay in the sidewalk we haven't spent a lot of time on that but the motorized bikes um I think we have we have streets we have some bike lanes and we certainly have shows and some and you know we're just beginning to lay down our bicycle infrastructure there's more to come and these do not belong on the sidewalk even with a little kid on them if if I had a little kid and you know I could ask you you're a dad of maybe are there other parents in here that have kids that have these ebikes well if I I probably would say a certain age yes and you have to ride in the street like regardless of what the rulle for because it's it's unsafe to drive them on the sidewalk for the sake of their pedestrians and the other side day the Rule's the rule I we can't we can't we can't pick and choose when we follow the rules not though that's what I'm saying don't putli them on the sidewalk no but you she wants to make the rule that currently in this ordinance says 14 and under can use the ebikes on the sidewalk it's supposed to be say 10 it's supposed to say 10 yeah so she wants to change that misrepresenting what you're saying she wants to change that to say no one of any age can use ebikes or potentially maybe scooters also on the side what if they're using the ebike non ebike mode and they're just pedaling it on the sidewalks so is that do they use ebikes for just pedaling that's a lot of a lot of them are just pedal assisted then that's a it's it's a pedal forgive me I do not own one of these I don't have get on one of them yeah you can Tracy you can use it full electric you can use it pedal assisted like a hybrid and you can use it pedal only so pedal only under 10 on the sidewalk is our current rule our current rule is under 14 bicycle so I just don't again from a practicality perspective if they're looking on the sidewalk and then then it gets into he said she said hey you said I said right ped like were you pedaling were you Hy mode were you not mode you know like self charge mode so why not just don't I had a friend in college I had caught he said he had cords light in his dorm room but it was bars and they made the argument was barks it's the same thing here with the pedaling you don't know what the person's doing I'm not sure what's bars oh oh oh delous well then maybe that's a reason for to be off the side one and and if we need more time on this it sounds like we probably do um I well the only thing I would say is I I think I think we need to um this one discussion seems like something that we still need to figure out and I don't mind having side conversations in the three weeks up until the next meeting you get something together that we can introduce a workable package just because I don't want to we don't to wait yeah so if that's all right with everyone on that one point I'll talk to everyone just see where the consensus is maybe we could also put a a limit say if you have a Mot assisted ebike electric ebike and you cannot go over so many miles per hour so if you had a bike you'd have to go slow on sidewalk anybody you can do something do these bikes have um uh odometer how fast can a kid ride a regular really 12 miles hour the number we use be right there's no kid four miles hour you can't miles hour let me just say if you make it 4 miles hour then you have discretion exactly correct like made it a little more you have you had the kid going 20 on the sidewalk obviously that's outrage if you have doing five that might be okay um my last question is you said that they have to follow the traffic laws right correct all right so now you have a 15-year-old kid that doesn't have a permit doesn't have a license they're driving past the speed limit are you giving them a ticket for speeding you can't because they don't have a license I'm assuming you're using in that case if it's a violation of going to letter if you're if you're violation at title 39 at any you get so so so those traffic laws from that's corre title 39 reference he doesn't get points right but like you get but they still do it over like the points over like if you're doing 3 25 13 over scale the I just mayor I don't want to gloss over I liked um the the four M hour thing from a discretion perspective with the sidewalk I think that was a happy medium because it gives the discretion and then keeps them off going too fast which discre I think discretion I think they they know about how fast someone's going talking about please I'm talking about the kid riding their bike they have a speedometer don't they on some of these bikes some of them do no I don't believe so well not the one you bought obviously one last Mr soille if your children um that have ebikes with the governor on them I'm sure because you have the app um no his friend okay the unnamed friend we know not you um do you think if you were in isues and we prohibited all motorized bikes on the sidewalk for all ages would his age kid would that family feel comfortable with his age kid he was a 10 and 12 his body would would that family feel comfortable with being in the street absolutely my son at N9 years old was riding his little thing it doesn't go as fast but he was writing the street and you know you just have to teach the kids right you have to be parents as well and you have to be active in their lives and that's what we chose to do I I app yeah but I just want to ground right that's Tracy I love the anecdote I think I think you're trying to get information but that's one resident out of 6200 people how many adults 38% are under the age 18 so that mean 62% over 18 help me how many adults we one of 4,000 adults right I just want to qualify that and yeah no fair but I what we as much we're talking about bikes and behavior and kids we also have to think about the facility what it's designed for and pedestrians and what we currently allow on the side so no I'm in agreement it's not just about the behavior of the I also say I top of my head maybe I'm wrong but I don't think we had any intin on the sidewalk but e i don't yet or R bites very F someone on there is if they're on the sidewalk they're probably trying to be safe in the first place and you know to to close the loop on this conversation I just want to make sure everyone understands we're not trying to be bicycle scrooges um I I love seeing the kids bike around the town I think we're a biking community and we just want them to do it safely that's all it's about we have back to take perfect send and we'll get done all right uh moving along thank you Chief uh order management who's taken this one CH storm water management um so at the last meeting the last governing body meeting uh we talked about the loophole between uh storm water run with uh new construction and additions um Allison sent out um a one pager of um language that was put together by a culmination of stakeholders last year across planning across zoning engineering legal Etc looked at other towns and what have you so before um having um um it be put into an ordinance format I wanted to give everybody and now to bring up the screen want to give everybody a chance uh to take a look at it obviously we would want to um coordinate withv mental R um we there was a discussion last year at the end of the year on it but I think we'd want to resurrect that wanted to you know go to planning zoning just make sure that we're coordinate with all the key stakeholders um but again it's it's limited in scope in that it closes the loophole specific to additions and storm water runoff specific to what comes off the roof which is what our current says for new construction so who drafted this for us there were eight to 10 different people that put pen to paper but ultimately an attorney has to sit down and write this up have you looked at oh this little little so purpose is to establish minimum storm water requirements specific to drainage for all newly constructed full Renovations Renovations including roof replacement and additions resulting in increase in building footprint increase in building footprint is defined where addition or renovation need one of the following conditions so two different conditions increase is greater than 5% a lot of area and then there's a second one there all rated verbatim it defines storm water management um it talks about recharge infiltration systems it talks about what those recharge systems could be from a green infrastructure perspective and how to calculate this has all been done before by D and all these different entities and bodies of how to make these calculations um and it's saying that on citro right going forward that you would have to depict this type of system needing to required and it it goes into details of all the different pieces of where the storm water of goes um so I would say if folks for the ease of time and what we have if folks want to digest what Allison sent out provides those comments back to Allison and she'll for them over to attorney so um and we can I just want to lend my support to this because um not nothing in the storm waterer ordinance is going to address the size projects and improvements that are made very on a regular basis um I would say I would like to consult with an an engineer and ATT turning on one additional piece that has to do with sight disturbance in the B1 and the B2 because while this is going to help address the flooding we we you know we have some serious stor M issues in our residential neighborhood but we also have um you know we have conditions in the business district that exacerbate that yeah um there's nowhere for the lar vks that c that they're bled or um you know which frequently they are we have aging infrastructure and when there's significant disturbance because there might not always be an addition or more move but we will have conditions that might trigger some green infrastructure opportunities so um how this seems like worthy at least of I don't know whether who which engineer was Jordan do involv Jordan was involved uh I don't remember who was on the bre right it's okay Nick was involved maybe we could just get with Nick we can see about threading that one addition and there might be something easy to grab so slow this down I think if it makes sense to throw in here we we we should right because this was I'm gonna say five and a half months of conversations right so um yeah I think if there is a site disturbance piece that we can add in and close another loophole so let's have Nick propose the language and would like and then I can incorporate okay can I waigh in for a second can you guys hear me here we are right we're back don't worry no business has been conducted we are back and we are here to talk about deer manager all right so little background just remind everybody back in may we were awarded we applied for and were awarded a communitybased deer management Grant um it's two phases of the grant the first phase is a bar Street Health survey and then after the bar Street Health survey then they determine U what to move after that whether or not they would do a control Geer hunt or not based off that survey um we were awarded it we got the letter on May 28 2024 um there were a couple uh was an email that we received back in July and when we had applied for it we had mentioned which vendor we going to be using it um we got an email back in July saying that we had the followup competitive bid process now just to give you a little background U we have a qualified purchasing agent here in here Haven so our bid threshold is 44,000 um and this is significantly lower than 44,000 um couple emails back and forth I had um trying to track down the person handles contracts with Jersey Department of Environmental Protection um they were a hard person to get a hold of they were trying to get a clarification whether or not we would need it um you put this out to bid or not um finally this morning um they got clarification um because this is a grant funded project the bid thresholds that we have um as a municipality the local contracts do not apply and they require a competitive bid process so in order to do a competitive bid process uh we would need to create an RFP now um as far as a Pary Health survey nobody here is really necessarily qualified to write an RP for what would be required um I do have the points that we need to include in there however we would probably have to hire an expert to write the RFP for us reached out to our tree expert um Sherry SPO uh to get an idea what it would cost if she would we were to contract her to write the RFP her hourly rate is about $145 she estimates it it' be no more than 6 hours so worst case scenario would be $870 for her to write the RFP so put this out the bid the question is so the question is is itth is it worth it that is that's the question I posted to Council of his Workshop is it worth it now to give you an idea on what surrounding towns are doing I reached out to all the B administrators surrounding towns of Jim Gant to Redbank Tom Rogers or Rumson Kevin Burke of little silver um all of those towns are not doing the deer the deer Grant they're not they're got involved in it they have no interest in it and they're not planning on doing it in the future so burrow so the governing bodies in those towns have decided not to pursue they they are not even pursuing it they didn't for not pursuing it and they have no interest in doing it in the future so if they if they have chosen not to do it and we chose to do it we would create a void correct that all the other here would fell in rather quickly let me let me just be um add one more thing in from what he said uh I did speak to Mayors in the surrounding towns and they do not have interest in a hunt in their towns so you know that spoken to them both on multiple occasions they are not interested as it relates to what you're saying so what would be the point of us doing it it would it would it wouldn't help us it would just have other animals come into the void that we create well the deer expert did say that they don't they don't move one k wasn't mile mile you seen them crossing over Ridge Road all the time yeah across the road but I I'm not sure that they will Spread spread out as much as we think in our heads based on that comment that she made um I'd also like to throw out there just I'm trying to provide as much information as possible for everyone to you know inform themselves to take a position on this um we did receive a memo from the environmental commission which I think all of you got you which which was in support yes of a hunt um so I wanted to mention that and obviously I believe that we've previously heard from the faen fields Natural Area else important has supported as well can I take a slight a lane shift um if there I wonder if I'm separate from the question of deer management even though I know that's the the um the idea of a Forest Health survey as a resource and guidance for Fair Haven might have I mean I would suggest it does have value for the environmental commission the natural area there bird sanctuary question that we're looking into that the resources that might come out of um a horse Health survey could provide the kind of guidance that our volunteers and our Co DPW me I'm just want to throw that out there separate from the question of deer management we got an award for a a forest Health survey that might have multiple applications so before we to closely link them they have some they might have some independ they might have some independent usefulness for for very of them so I don't know how much it would actually cost in a competitive bid price but I do know what they look like and they're helpful these studies so does that you don't have anything right now does this grant do that give you it's a forest Health survey Grant this one is yes yeah yeah yeah true the first the first phase of it before they would even consider on they would forestry Health survey and then determine whether or not we do have a deer problem here in Fair Haven what how do they constitute what considers bars that is a good question I don't have the answer for that that the expert would have to all 10% of the open Spate right is the 100 acres probably give or take right it's probably so's backyard she she's so involved in everything tonight have a friend so what is the downside to the forest so the only the only downside that that could come out of it would be if they did determine we did have a bigger problem and then then we potentially have to act on that um you know that would be the only negative that could come out of it that we would determine that there was there was there was a bigger problem that came out by bar that we might have to I I don't thought that we gave up any of our autonomy of deciding whether or not we were going to authorize a colum that that didn't was never suggested at least in the materials that I read that we would forfeit some of our authority to the D if we is author no the only they would um the only thing that we would forfeit is whether or not we had a deer problem not so they determined through the forest house survey that we did not have deer problem in the second phase of the grant not right but if they did because I mean we all pretty much know there's some deer issues going on here but even if the study did identify that doesn't obligate us to commit to col no it does not obligate us to commit um question might be if we didn't act um again what you know where where that would leave us that' be that' be good questions we have to investigate we've already been told we have a deer problem yeah right like by multiple different so it it doesn't change anything my question is though is since since by and so Christina help me out here by New Jersey public contracts law since it's under 446 we don't have don't have to go out to bid 44,000 isn't 44 it's not 44 okay all right so but so since it's 44 can we ask them to cover sh's fee of $870 they will not I have a question for the mayor you said you talk to other mayors that are not interested in doing a hunt are they managing their deer in other ways yes so they have excuse me um they have private lands that maybe are a little bit more expansive than you know fairing we have a few sites like that but they have more of them so they just have more residents they're willing to privately hunt and have the frontage or the I don't know if that's the right word from their neighbors um that enables them I think there's State rules that dictate it's like 250 yards or feet from your house to the next so that they have like you go to a town like Rumson um they obviously have tons of properties like that where they can do that on their own and they also have for space just in general um for the deer to Rome and and Fa we're a little bit more compact densely populated our homes are a little bit more on top of each other you don't have those homes um I only know of one potentially that's privately one um and doing it legally but uh Shrewsberry does this as well so so sh Shrewsberry um I also spoke to the mayor Shrewsberry they tried this a few years ago their residents were were pretty upset about it um and the feedback that I got was they there was a there was a minimal Improvement um but they felt as if the lasting Improvement wasn't worth but it sounds like they stopped too so I don't on the void issue which I think is fair separating the one mile um if the other towns are addressing they're goinging privately and we're not doing anything our problem is into them and so maybe if we do so you're saying it's smart for us to let our deer yes export um but maybe maybe a responsible neighbor if they're they're doing a call you know we should as well so that our our deer aren't there the the only other information that I've gotten since the last time we spoke also because I I tried to speak to everyone and hear everyone's position and feedback I spoke to some Hunters as well that they like to do it recreationally I'm going to point out that they did say that um you know when you hit the deer it doesn't necessarily perish need it so the Deer uh they Instinct for whatever the reasons to find water so um whether that means going to the river or going to pools or you know and and you know sometimes that involves like they'll run for a while after they get hit into the street um sometimes perishing in someone's backyard I'm not necessarily saying that you know if people are hunting Before Dawn there shouldn't be many cars on the road so you know there's but I just want to make sure that that wasn't something that came up in the last discussion and um even the hunters that I spoke to that were in support of it were kind of like people need to know it's not as perfectly as presented and just to add one thing we haven't come from rson most of the hunting on private prop property you know you hire Hunter to hun your property most of it's boat hunting because of the frontage uh we need a significantly larger property to uh to you were not to hunt by Bow most of bow hunting and the mayor is right about that um they don't die right away lot they went off and we have had issues you know in the past in my former life where we did have deer it did turn up you know several several blocks away on some this property that would have B it so that does happen so so the one of the questions is I me if not a calling freed on and what was described as by the DP um what are our options and this takes me back to looking for professional guidance because you know the DP it said sterilization doesn't work and they gave us a story about all the things that don't work and I feel like it's probably Fair research if they share the but I'd like to know what our options are because we know that it's compromising our natural resources which are as important to our community as our good neighborhoods our business district and our you know good schools we love our natural resources where we recreate so we have to take care of them um I guess this takes me back to how do we get that kind of professional guidance where do we go we don't yet have a conservation element in our master plan which you know I hope we will in time but um in the absence of that need guidance there's two inflection point that I'm hearing to you right one is do we want to spend the $800 and something dollars for share dut the RFP for the grant which would do the forestation analysis and we to Dear management so we have a decision like guidance to provide and the other piece of guidance provided is whether or not we're going to move forward with the color or whatever in Fair fields or not I think need to provide guidance to our bur staff on those two pieces what what value does the um that for health what do you call survey the forestry Health survey what is that let's say let's say the deer wasn't even part of the do we get value from that survey we might you know and there there may be information I have not seen what one of those sampler fors look like again the de and I reached you several conversations DP doesn't have that much to offer us basically we want to go for Grant we have to provide professionals to get this going for so that is what I guess what I'm saying is for $800 independent of the deer does it make sense for $800 to get this done and learn more about our Natural Area and our farest than its own and then we'll have more information whether we want to pull the lever or double click on on your management on that side that was MYRY survey up with a list of items that we need to take care of well that's just at least at least you're educated on it doesn't mean you have to no are you compelled to well that's up to the governing body I mean obviously anytime you have a report that might show deficiencies or show where we need to act you know I mean that's up to the governing body you know to make a determination say for example we form a bird sanctuary committee and we asked them to formulate recommendations they're going to need resources they're going to need analysis data at least a a catalog say no I'm just I'm giving an example of where it could beev Health Service I want to see if it comes up online it does we ask them for a copy of one that they've done for another has um a list of wow there's some firms that she knows have produced the USDA far s far service National program design fure gos collection of information from nationally standardized aerial and ground surveys remote sensing change detection tools and other sources Prov valuable insights on how far on Far conditions so so if we have if we pay $800 because I might be misunderstand for Sherry to prepare right we apply we apply for the gr we already have a gr we go to the RFP that $800 buys us this study correct well buys us an invitation for professionals we don't have to pay more money for this study it's just the the money money Sher to provide you with a template if she's gonna do it sher's gonna do it all I I for me personally I'm just I'm I'm for it I am just curious on how do they Define that right and Dick's in the woods I know right like we have 100 acres right of land Giver take is all 100 part of the is would be considered forestry or is it 58 Acres right farry and then assess with that I think all be far report Creek Bas where it comes through is an area that's very unique and different from the natural are it's different from the bird sanctuary I think they should be identified in the RFP so that the proposals address them it sounds like in the in the report as well it's going to give us very specific information about deer because if they're to tell us deer problem I think it's worth it's worth $800 it moves it moves the process along it informs us educates us so we can make a better decision and Council woman Miss selling she had her hand oh Michael what time is it we're in the morning it's like 9 in the morning here it's not bad so um I agree with every joshh with what you just said I think there's kind of no downside I know you said we might find out deficiencies but I guess we're better off knowing the deficiencies can you hear me yeah so I would rather know the deficiencies and for 800 you know as Tracy was councilwoman Cole was saying with the bird sanctuary I think that would be a good thing um and Brian uh councilman Olsson did ask so the other towns don't want to do it all because they they're able to do it on private property were there any other reasons why they just you said they had push back from other from residents that was kind of the feedback that those probably be the two biggest parts of their explanation yes okay and I agree with um councilman Cole that we I would love to know what other options there are then or kind of what I don't know what other directions we could possibly go in based on the problems that we know we have yeah that will come out of the report it would so it sounds like we know the timeline on when we'll get the report back no um obviously we'd have to advertise and get order bid then they would put the timeline after that we have to provide all that before they give us a timeline okay as far as what our competitive bidding process was um who was awarded it then they gives a timeline that as far as dispersement okay is there any overlap I'm just looking at ran is there any overlap between the shade trees that's why it's shade to I would suspect that there would be but I don't know what this is okay good question um do I to vote here I you motional I'm gonna make a motion sure all in favor I'm gonna make can I just make a comment sorry sure hi um so we just I have not looked to see if we have the funding for this for the $800 I'm correct so we then we can make a decision and then you can find out I just wanted to make you aware of that before NC if we didn't have it what would be the mechanism the the emergency appropriation like we do with the or no um I would have to I would have to do some research on a mechanism I don't for $800 to ,000 I don't know that you'd want like want to do an emergency appropriation but I can look into it real real quick Nancy hang on Mr Mar if Chris can take this away to to sync up with Nancy and see if there's $800 I I ra i' rather do that instead of getting into emergency preparations and all why don't we just say pending yeah I just wanted to share that before satisfied make a motioning the budget being satisfied so so so two things right we're going to we're going to hold a deer hunt in fairen fields and we're not do that no no hold like we're not gonna do it sorry no and you are the one shooting the please correct I'm not saying fold it I'm saying fold as in pause we are not doing the Hun Fair field and pending that bur administrator York will work with our CFO to see if there are $842 funds forward we didn't we also didn't make the decision we're not doing the can I can I just make one clarification so the before we can even discuss whether there's a hunt or not we have to have the far survey so we can't even discuss it until we have the far survey that determines if if we have a gear problem or not so so it's on pause so well not it's not even there yet right now the only thing discussion we theart pending the budget someone's made a motion spending $800 plus Dollar on the all in favor anyone opposed good okay okay next up trash and recycling contract um you want me to okay uh we we've basically gone over this in every single direction we possibly can um we've looked for assistance wherever we can um it doesn't look like we will know that we have the support we need on this um and we have to make a decision just based on the 60 days are expired um we did receive and Nancy might be I'm sure I'll have the number wrong but we did receive um some help on state health benefits that was something we did receive but then we found out state health benefits are going up I think 17% 17.2 so the help that we thought we were getting really didn't give us any help so we're at a point now we we have to make a decision um just as so you know the decision isn't going to be made tonight um we're going to because we have to prepare a resolution uh and since there was a three and a fiveyear contract and there were so many different choices for us to make um we would have had to prepare like 14 different resolutions for tonight um which didn't seem reasonable so you'll also see on tonight that um we're we're looking to set a special meeting for I think for next week um Wednesday I believe that's what it's about but what we just kind of get to a um agreement on is what direction uh we're going with with the trash contract I can tell you uh where my support would be obviously I don't vote unless there's a tie um but personally based on our financial situation um as it relates to the state of Appropriations cap and future expenditures that we to have I I would um go to bi-weekly recycling um I would not remove the second garbage day uh you know I I see bi-weekly recycling as something that could be manageable I see second garbage day as something where um your garbage is going to smell no matter what you do in the summer and I think uh to pull off both Band-Aids in in the same contract year I think is asking a little bit too much of our residents so to balance it out that's where I would be and after that three or five year I could be pushed either way I'd actually you know I think I'd probably go five year uh just because once we reset the contract we know where our Appropriations cap is and then every year we're we'd be underneath it with with the normal increase and to do that for a longer period of time I don't see this getting better um personally but maybe there will be some State Appropriations cap uh relief coming and a shorter one might be better can you fill us in on how that um or just where are we and what happened right so what what I would say is I think that there's Representatives that feel as if um there does need to be an intervention to the state Appropriations cap but if there is it's not going to be done by the time we have to make the decision okay it's a week or two from now um So based on that if we weren't to make a decision now and you didn't get that relief and you didn't get that reform we could potentially be putting ourselves in a very very difficult you know financial decision and then back us making having to make decisions for our residents and for our community are much much harder than just going to bi-weekly recite I just want to I just want to continue to State my support for your efforts and join you wherever I can be helpful and you know campaigning to remove or to make some sort of changes to the Appropriations C it's I think we got move past it I just so can I summarize you offered sure we B pickup would be four times a year correct B pickup um in I think in any of the scenarios that we have we'd be going from 10 bolt pickups to quarterly B pick which is four four times a year and and remember the it was a 233% increase per pickup right and then um you're suggesting going to five weekly recycling which is twice a month recycling yeah would that be no not necessarily twice a month recycling it's bi-weekly I'm just pointing that out because in a five-week month you could potentially have three weeks of pickups so every other week every other week right and would it be on same day for all residents um I believe we had the options and we said we thought that would be better to do we would do the the recycling would be one day for every resent and I think that we were eliminating zones right from the garbage right TR G is one day too the trash would be one day for the whole town as well except in the weeks during the summer in which you would do obviously two times okay I think that's and the the part and the business distri you're getting picked up that they're tied to the same I want to bring up one more point just so we don't lose sight of it um we still have like a three- Monon gap on our recycling center being closed and the fact that we're going to a bi-weekly schedule which is going to be a little challenging the nice thing is I think what I've been told is they think they might be able to get the recycling center open by Christmas which I know is a huge push on all the corrugated box and stuff like that that comes in but that is something we also need to um come to a solution whether it's a dumpster somewhere I know we discussed different places and there was different thoughts on what was best um I think the the the waste company said that if we did if we did tie up the box if we broke it down you tied it up and left it next to your recycling pan they would be willing to pick it up um but that that's another part of the program if we do go bi-weekly here that we do need to um I think we want to have that sort of uh figured out figured out by the 19th to the 21st when we have a special meeting so we can give direction not only to uh the vendor but also obviously to our residence and this is you know how we're moving forward so so some thought yeah sure um to my surprise I've experimented with our at home recycle and as long as I make plans for my cardboard the bi-weekly recycle works for me you know obviously it's just my SP um but I wasn't sure that would be the case so that's why I've been experimenting and holding my recycle um so I do think it's fruitful that we make sure we have a place for our residents to take board um because nobody's going to get their part board in their recycle twice uh every other week so not going to fit um but I also wanted to say that I don't really like this contract and I think for reasons out of our control we are you know we're under a lot of unusual kind of pain points and I don't want to stay in this uh for five years if we don't have to I think it would be in our best interest to um there's no real cost advantage to going with a longer contract but um if we did three years and immediately started internally talking to other municipalities considering inter local decide you know do the analysis we need to do to figure out what is the best scenario for fair even and that's a big that's a big piece of work but if we start now um you know and Nancy says hey you guys believe it or not it's been 18 months and you should start looking at you know your trash contract let's let's you know look at it it early make sure you're you're planning ahead um I think we can hopefully get in a better position three years from now but if not is it possible to do three years with the option for a one-year renewal for maybe we don't have I don't I don't think we can Nancy right yeah no I think I still say three years uh personally but I want to hear what you guys so the only the only point on that that um and I want to hear what everyone says too on the threee where you said there's no cost Dage to me I'm assuming that the state Appropriations cap doesn't change that's that's the only Advantage I was saying is you know always you know you once once we've made the changes we need to make based on our waste the waste and in its own will not take us out of cap then for five years that was my my thought if we are if we're going to start talking to everyone for three years I mean I get that approach um as long as there's other municipalities that have contracts right now that are going to end within three years of us because if they're longer than we are then we're not going to be able to necessarily sync up with them if we had those one year increments to play with uh that would help us sync up with I mean really municipality to look at right now is Middletown would defer to uh you know versus relationships um there was one I think silver if we did three or would match up with us three or five little will match up with us after three years after three um and then the three plus one plus one which is I ran the analysis assuming that was a scenario but it's not so throw that out so I think it was just a little sober in three years but I do you still have the email you he I was not that but I can probably I still have it on the other email server hey Nancy if we were in the fiveyear contract and wanted to back out you know 3 and a half years in is there mechanisms in the contract to do that I would have to read it a little more carefully off the top of my head I mean there's always something in a contract that you can get out of right there's some way with enough notice but I off the top of my head I don't know and the reason there's no one plus one is because we didn't include that in the um RF before we we're talking about the length of the contract now before we even get deep into that conversation if it needs to go deep um let me just ask is there anyone that doesn't agree with bi-weekly and wants to do less than that or more than that or are we all on the same page on that I agree with that we're good with that Michael I think we can afford to do it it's honestly it's not my favorite but I agree I don't think we can afford not to do it okay so so that side of it um yeah have now I think the conversation obviously we're on 3 to five I don't know if anyone wants to you know just make a call and what your position is and we'll see pros and cons year four is a 4 and a half% increase or 4% increase right versus years two three and five so let's see in fiveyear scenario four of the five years were below the cap there two one that was slightly overing yeah so you know you would have a natural buffer built in for those five years your expense base would be growing slower than the cap rate increase but it reduces flexibility and listen I I've obviously advocated I said probably I'd be I'd go for five I stated that but I'd say one of the reasons to go for three is if there was reform on the cap um you know it might make things a little bit easier three years from now if you wanted to just renegotiate the contract do something different there's two primary reasons why I'm comfortable three one little silver and potentially coordination there to we have a phenomenal burrow staff y um and they can make this a priority irrespective of governing body turnover which happens every year so I I'm looking at you and I have a very good relationship with their administrator so could you check that between now and next Wednesday because remember the one arm banded we s up with them all that Logistics and maybe if they have an app TI for that plan as well yes maybe they don't to know brought up we already had that conversation with us right but if if we're one armed Bandits and they're not they don't want to spend the money to become one armed Bandits that's not a cnergy they could say they want to do it but then we're stuck with garbage cans that unless we want to make a capital inferent on garbage cans that are not Bandits and capital was outside of cap I'm not saying show stop I'm just say we do with all our yeah this is what that this goes into the whole analysis like these are good questions we we should get start yesterday yes well we'll start August 22nd um because and I want flag something Nancy said um because she gives us good advice along the way um if we start a process early and we put up we put our bid out we don't like what we've gotten back if we do it with enough lead time we can repackage it and put it out again reject twice and then go to negotiations to 30 so well we have multiple reasons it sounds like three year yeah I'm I'm obviously the minority so three I think we're thinking of three years but we also want information from little silver as far as middle if it you know as far as one arm Bandon when their contracts done and then honestly any other municipality any correct because if other municipalities do it in house and we contract with them then it's an inter local out of cap Chris I think we also want to ad if we go if we're going through years which it sounds like we are I think we want to advertise to all the other administrators that this is the new date that our contract is going to be up so that they know it when they plan their contract maybe they could advertise to the same dat we good having our meeting um I think that's on later we discuss that now or no I think that's part of the consent agenda it is let's wait till the consent agenda we'll discuss that um good job everybody Michael do you have anything before and move forward all good sorry yes all good thank you all right um moving along public comment on agenda items only please observe a thre minute time limit please stand identify Yourself by clearly stting your name and address for the record is there anyone in the public yes Katie come on up and thank you for everything you do for the burrow hello everybody so I actually have been very concerned was Katie foror left can you just come closer real quick just I wearing two hats today um one hat is my 180 days a year that I'm the crossing guard and 180 days mornings I watch kids on motorized so I have some data there and number two obviously my first a had and I'm not here the punitive and the resolution to how to um the rules and all that it's not I'm not here to discuss that but I want to pick up something that Council um Barbara said and that is what I'm observing is the behaviors that these kids have when they get on these bikes parents have control I would say 8 99 10 11 when you get to your 12-year-old the peers are the ones that are influencing those kids as we all know not the parents and what I'm observing is that that impulse control which comes with being an adolescent is not there when you're at a certain speed they may be well meaning they may think they're following the rules they literally don't have what I learned in my in my Navy job my regular job situational awareness for understanding reaction times where that plays is drivers they pull out of places like the acne and you see what looks like a cheap little bike coming at you you think they literally have 30 seconds to pull out the next minute they're there right in front of you and that's the issue is that adults and kids aren't used to these quick speeds it's it's a new toy so I know we have an excellent bike safety program in the in the town I think there I don't know what the solution is but I feel there just needs to be some education something maybe there already is I don't know if parents go from hey here's your new eite have fun be safe or if there literally is but before you go out I want to spend some time with you I want to watch you practice I want to make sure you understand the implication I want you to go on the sidewalk I want to watch you go down and see what the implication is of you doing that I'm not sure that parents or anybody give kids training or do they when you get is it just a cool toy they get under the Christmas tree and then that's it and parents just say safe so I don't know what the solution is I just like to propose something to a bike safety program maybe more awareness maybe there's cool YouTube videos out there because on my first aid hat we are talking about this we are drilling for what do you do how do you remove a helmet off someone on a sidewalk pediatric emergencies so your first day squad's ready because we don't think it's a when we think it's an if so so I would just like to make yes so I'm just want to make sure that the uh training part of this is taken on and I have no comment on your resolution on how to you know get citations that Chief doesn't lags do a bike at the beginning year do they do eat bikes also or no yes yeah and they uh we had a thing for parents April April we're going do that again it was put I think on the website is is is it in the school or do they actually take them out on the street and demonstrate or it's in the school in street they're G to do AO sometime September October which is in stre Department okay but that's all the students attend that it's not like optional to parents like you could send your kid if you want to is optional this year we're trying to work with the school to see beautiful but the bike the bike safety is mandatory in the school the b r or something that this year that was done the past but it wasn't I'm just looking at the safe roster School website that has a section about education micromobility especially with the ebikes um is that the resource that the officers use to oh they use part of it we had that meeting uh last year and they took some of that information and we got for the town but they put it all together I'm sure some came yeah okay and that's good um you can probably just get more robust thank you anyone else with a public comment on agenda item told NO3 first I want to say on the trash I agree with the three-year contract I think the uh bi-weekly recyle is great two times a week for the summer and the B four ends the year is B um I also want to say just for my two cents that I support the near issue it is an issue I had lies twice I had trip with born in the backyard my small property I ended up in the hospital recently with a heart condition that they think is related to Lim's disease it's great I'm a six-year-old healthy guy but if your six-year-old gets it or your three-year-old gets it it really does concern me with kids and I know we talked about the deer don't die instantly when they're shot with an arrow and they wander away but so do the deer that's hit by a car doesn't die instantly a lot of times they Linger on the side of the road and they run away so this is just going to be a concentrated thank you but what I wanted to talk about was the consent agenda so if apparently we're doing a reord for DPW we're hiring Nick as the Director so I I guess I just wanted a little more information about this apparently reor and I just want to know if the position posted and um I know was an issue with Staffing but I'm just question my own question is if hiring at the top is addressing the issue that we have if we have an issue with worker beats would seem to be higher at the time that's that's that's a management issue that that's that your that's fine I just also wanted to know now if we have a director of DPW currently we have a director of DPW engineering director we're now going to have a direct of BPW and the director of BPW engineering or is his title going to be just director of engineering if so are we renegotiating his salary being that his workload has been cut in half a question and then are these new directors going to need assistant directors since we currently have assistant directors which is another beeping up of sta and then this all goes where do you see that on the cons 24 20 on I get that it's on it's on your agenda after ex session oh after executive session down the bottom okay so if we could just I I just love some clarification to any of those all of so you can always speak you can't speak as to any salary or whatever else but obviously we you want to address if you want to address I this is public comments so there is really a question answer session but if you'd like to address it just address why you decide to HDE on the top or why make this this is all said and I appreciate the question I think it's a fair question um I think i' prefer to go into exe executive session first before I gave a more detailed answer but we're trying to be as efficient as we can possibly be okay at the DPW that and and this and and as part of that um we looked at the entire uh facility all the workers the way that it currently is set up the way that we eventually want it to be set up and this some this is a made it two which could then be four this is a partial result of that process that's what I was say okay I just eyes wide open because then later on when we talk about state benefits and pensions absolutely comes back to roost and then everybody's surprised when the big Bill comes in in the end so and it's also why we have to make tough decisions on other things uh that affect our res can we understand yep thank you thank you is there anyone else public comment on agenda items only Alison no one currently has hand okay uh moving along to approval of minutes from July 22nd 2024 regular meeting motion to approve Alison may I please have a roll call bler just we get our can you just can we ask her real quick if has something to do with something we're going to vote on that we've already voted on you mean on the agenda yeah if she has something that could affect one of our opinions then we'll take it otherwise we'll do good to the burrow Ru can you unmute okay yes um I just have a quick question when are bicycles regulated so that they have to have a light if they ride at night are yes the new ordinance said well I don't know about I know in the ebike ordinance it says that a light has to be seen from 500 feet from the front and the back yeah well I'm I'm saying bikes in general if you ride at night like a car do you have to have light saying yes okay a personal experience I went to the end of the plan planning board meeting the other night at the building where you now sit and I got out of my car in the parking lot it was approximately 10 o'clock in the evening and I was almost hit by a bike rider who came in through the wrong way through the parking lot by behind Fair Haven Hardware if I hadn't sensed he was coming he would have hit me he had no light he was riding as if he was part of the tour def France and went out around building and out onto River Road I don't know if he was trying to avoid the red light or what but he was going 30 to 40 miles an hour and had no light on his bike and that's and that that's this ordinance we give the police the tools that if they were to see that Ruth they they would be able to intervene okay my other and yesterday I was out and I was riding down uh I think it was Third Street by the ball field and I was behind this child and I suddenly realized he was on an electric skateboard I'd never seen one before because he wasn't you know using his foot to propel himself he rode down that lane like as if he were a car he did not move he did not ride in a skate Lane in a skateboard lane or a bicycle lane just kept going on his electric skateboard so I don't know if you regulate those may we the word skateboard to that same it's the same that's a four-wheel yeah well use the word skateboard I put in there if it's a if it's a I don't mean to be I don't mean to be then you have the onewheel skateboards what's a one whe skatebo you mean a no it's not a hoverboard hoverboard is a two whe we you need for back we could address skateboards later I don't I I think we've all seen that bikes are an issue skateboards we Ruth that was a good idea I thought you were calling to I want to discuss the deer too you said that you you really don't want to do anything about them unless something else exacerbates the problem you didn't even discuss Deer Tick we didn't we didn't we didn't say that yet and um but I but I hear you about the deer tick I think Bill just made a pretty um you know remember rememberable uh statement about lime Lim's disease in the deer TS whereare okay and my fourth one my fourth one is is sort of I told you so a little while back when we went to contract pickup of garbage I said my father taught me to never give up my options when you gave up in Town Collection you gave up your options and that's part of why you find yourself in the problem you're in thank you good evening yeah uh thank you Ruth moving along motion to approve the 2022 July regular meeting minutes Alison may please have a roll call Paul yes yes yes yes yes yes uh thank you uh moving hearing and Adoption of ordinances 20241 amend ordinance number 20247 land use and development regulations comply with NJ DP storm water management rules I have a motion to open motion to open all in favor I anyone opposed does anyone up here have anything on this before no is anyone in the public have a public comment on 20 24-11 Alison do anyone on Zoom close uh sorry M we talked about two amendments that are they're not that's not embedded in the draft yet right okay the the the stor M management from earlier yeah that that won't have anything to do with this we're gonna completely separate completely separate y okay this is just correcting something I recall I just figured it would be worked into this no okay motion to close motion to close second all in favor anyone opposed do I have a motion to approve motion Alison may I please have a roll call yes St s yes yes yes yes yes thank you uh 20242 create a capital ordinance for police car purchase D motion to open motion to open second all in favor I anyone opposed anyone up here have anything on this this was just the one of letters we pulled right uh during the budget to ensure that we could be under the corporation C does this commit us to buying a new car every year anyone in the Public Public comment Allison do I have a motion to close motion to close second all in favor anyone opposed motion to approve motion to approve second Alon may please have a roll call PA yes yes yeah yes yes thank you facilities update councilman La Bara Bicentennial Hall Community Center plaque and long-term parking lot design thanks mayor keep it short and sweet let fre know if you guys have any questions um bit call update uh cdbg approved going out to bid which will be happening in the next week or so I think we're looking to close bid on 29 August you be advertised on this Friday Friday uh there'll be a pre- bid meeting on August 22nd and opening bids will be AUST 29th awesome um so that's it for big Hall one thing may I yeah please um the one thing I've been tracking and maybe you guys are too we're waiting on Scott Ferguson's GC PL for from the site visit it's been some time if we do need to go back that's fine but I don't want to lose that thread because ideally we initiate both bucket one and bucket two together spot on and even Laura's work from the gold partnership on the so maybe follow with yeah follow em with them tomorrow just one more thing to just to give you an idea of the timeline work on Vice Hall looks like they'll probably start sometime around October as a tenative date of October 1 24 uh project completion is slated for February 20 to 25 and it CLS out the project 55225 final inspection and to start refer to begin mobilization correct yes okay um Community Center plaque we uh I think we talked about this in the last meeting now you carried it we carried it oh so um where we left off was that um the the previous governing body was on board with no plaque at the PD no plaque at the ppw and at the community center we would do something of a plaque that we would agre to the content um so content of like hey established this date or a memorandum of X right right so facilities committee will come up with a couple suggestions I spoke with a couple folks on this and they said hey what are your suggestions so and Daryl Breen also has to be included in that that one was for the church Memorial Oh I thought the schools up the black school yeah that's that's all yep um and on that we met with a couple fish Chapel Representatives started talking through the long-term parking lot design um as well as the pictures and the content for the memorial more to come on that yes that's it good thank you uh we are now at the consent agenda we're talking about resolutions 20241 196 through 202 24-204 before I get into a vote I'll just ask you guys 19th to the 21st for a special meeting at 6 PM do you want to specify what do you want to do it at 6 would you rather be back on the 21st listen if I if I yeah I'm back on the 21st but if so the meeting is Gonna Be by oh maybe I can then um all right well whatever whatever more people rather than less just in case there's some what about 19 at 530 21st doesn't work 19 one one point I just want to raise mayor that the date and how much time we give oursel is critical because we shouldn't do any communication or education of the public of what happens until we sign off and officially approve it right so if we do the 19th that then gives you know Nine business days to do all the communication and everything ready we don't want to have it Go L ahead of time why can't we do it this week here I think you have there's 48 hour notice there yeah I'll be away still um and the earlier you do it the less likely I'll be able to do this because it's 5:30 in the morning but don't BAS me I'm just letting you know are you Michael are you back 19 I'm not I'm not I'm not back till like the 26th so 19 right I'll be back on the 21st but I'll be out can we do like Michael 21st honestly either is kind of the same for me I'll still be away so there's no guarantee but 5:30 in the morning would be a little bit tough that would be my only thing so later in the night would be a little easier I'll figure it out you guys just I'll figure 21st no you said that was B said 19 is better I can do 21st I can do 20 I don't I don't want to make a decision's what about the 20th calendars we do the 21st 20th conflict Alison is that why you put 19 [Music] 21st 20th 8:00 morning planning board uses zo Tuesday Morning's unless you do it at like 4 in the afternoon about 4 4 p.m. on the 21st yes yes yes yeah I again I'm I'm worried about how much time we have so I think they're earlier the better all right can we do a little earlier earlier time or date what is the what is what day of the week is Monday Monday it's next week week 11 a.m. you do 11: a.m. I could probably do 11: a.m. on 19 on do do do you think do you think that's going to be perceived as we're doing at a time people do you think we've already stated our position here and people right now we know but we also don't have any more time with the GS comp or 60 days around with that all right I just want to make it clear to the public that you know where what the position up here what it looks like it's going towards is bi-weekly Recycling and and and a three-year contract that's where it's headed so just you know um and also send special Conant contact with the agenda and a copy of the resolution we did have we did we did multiple open houses right okay 19th at what time 11 11 11 I'll do it if I can 11 you can do 11 I can do 11 you 19 11 on the record and and is it now 11 11:30 you guys with 11:30 I apologize 110 fine and can can please somebody double click and Echo what I'm saying that there should be no Communications going out prior to our approval any education guys I'm not available no one in my office will be available on Monday until 4:30 p.m. you don't got yell yeah does it matter we've already made up our we need to have an attorney 100% can't get it done this speak there's no way no yeah I think there's some other questions I think Thursday night wait hold on the problem with the planing where was at night about Tuesday at 11: a.m. Tuesday the 20th 11: a.m. I'll make whatever happen yeah that's good problem solving are you available on the 20th mister I I do it 1M on the Jes why don't we coate offline we'll got way it is is there a mechanism because I mean I know what the wording is so you can be um are you not available at all soon I won't be at these hours that are being discussed how many do we need 21st at 11 this this is for one resolution that is there a proxy function that's allowed if I no all right 21st and 11 a.m. yes 21st 11 a. yes 21st 11 ran what time is good for youone agre as can't we're not GNA make this word for everybody so we're losing the 23rd and the 30th from education second is Memorial Day weekend we have eight six days to answer resident quest questions hold on this is only going to take 10 minutes what about the 20th before the planning board meeting we said that already Tracy's no good but do we have four people that can do it 20th yes 20th 20th yes 20th 20th maybe all right but we have four no we're all in agreement we're all in agreement you guys it's okay what time on the do 5:30 to do earlier 5 sound 5:30 you're welcome can I say my one thing real quick turn soot no I know but I just want to say so everybody's on the same page right we cannot communicate why are you saying that again because when brush and leaf happened yes but we're not there we're here now nobody's going to do that I know and I just want to make sure that everybody's on the same page well we okay perfect thank you so we're talking about resolutions 2024 -196 through 202 24-204 with the amendment on 2011 showing the 20th at 5:30 p.m. via Zoom correct anyone want to separate any we're not appointed oh correct 200 we're we're pushing to the next meeting um does anyone want to separate anything else off the agenda no want to comment does 202 have a rain date for the black party the next the 28 is in there okay anybody want to talk about anything else no good any have a motion to approve motion second Al may I please have a roll call call yes yes yes yes yes thank you depart Department reports uh July 2024 do I have a motion to accept the reports as submitted with the thank you motion with the thank you second with a thank you all in favor with a thank you I without your weles Mak sense all right go to the burrow please stand and identify Yourself by clearly stating your name and address for the record please observe a time limit of three minutes anyone would go to the burrow of the public no Alison anyone on there go to the burrow no all right uh we are going to move towards executive session I believe no action will be taken there's a resolution if you guys oh after when we come back executive session no AC well there will be actually coming to you executive session we're coming back to you with the action right yes we are coming out of exective you're going to do your action if so potato Pata all right all right with that being said uh we're going to move to Executive session 9:31 p.m. motion motion second all paper thank you all right hold on one sec we're gonna open up those doors [Music] fa we are back and we are going to uh resolution 2024-25 approve Employment contract for Nicholas py director of Public Works do I have a motion to approve motion second Al please have a roll call Paul yes yes yes yes yes thank you new Gaga pick at marter Park Place in Gaga un totally by the PTA go play some Gaga do I have a motion to adjourn motion to Second all in favor I anyone oppos good night fair oh it's beautiful