##VIDEO ID:HnZrpW5BDeU## by way no it won't be official for a few days [Music] but all right I'm gonna call this meeting to order this is the Fair Haven shade tree commission meeting of February November 6 2024 shine law notice this is the regular meeting of the shade tree Commission of the bur of Fair Haven with the provisions of the open public meeting ACT public meetings may be held in person or by means of communication equipment to include streaming services and other online meeting platform this meeting is being held in person and through the zoom meeting platform being broadcast from burrow Hall 748 River Road Fair Haven New Jersey public participation for this meeting on November 6 2024 is available by call and phone call and phone number or through Zoom members of the public will be on mute until it is time for questions or comments which will be announc ounc at that time the public has the opportunity to question or comment by phone or through Zoom by the raiseed hand button and will be called on at the appropriate time notice of this meeting was sent to the ADB Park Press the Two River times in the Star Ledger on January 26 20124 posted on the burough website the bulleon board and the municipal building and has remained continuously posted as required under the statute with adequate notice having been given the shade tree commission secretary is directed to include the statement in the minute of this meeting all right we call Chris Larson here Mike D'Angelo here Le beani here Peter deatti Mike Hoy that's Chris mck K mg Kevin McGovern absent Jill Sullivan not here Bonnie tvia here also president councilman olon and B secretary and I'm here too all right please rise and join me for the Pledge of Allegiance Pledge of Allegiance flag the United United States America everybody look at the prior meeting minutes questions comments there motion to approve minutes second minutes approved all right move right into project updates the NJ UCF tree inventory brand um yeah so since last meeting we've had one training session with Arbor Pro um where they just started going over the basics of the navigation of the system that um they recorded all the data in um we're due to have a second level training the week of the 19th um just uh based on schedules um and then at that point um we should be in a position to um get the finalized report and close out the grant which um again the goal is to still have that done before the end of the year great yeah is it easy to understand is it complicated no it's very user friendly okay okay perfect uh the community Forest Management program so far we have uh one quote from our license tree expert of $8,900 um we're waiting for or Pro yes um I spoke with them this week and um I asked them if they like to put in a proposal um given the fact that they are familiar with Fair Haven at this time after doing the inventory and they are interested um and I would expect to see that you know I would say within I would I would hope this week okay um they yeah so they understand that we are interested in applying for a grant what that Grant would be valued at um and that they would be you know that we already have one there so great can I say that when I was at the sh Federation conference I ran it to Bill Brash who is in freeold and he is the one who did our original yeah um and he I I said would you be interested in you know getting on this um and sure um and Seager was standing there and they said oh yeah he's our license tree expert he's wonderful um so I just thought it might be good to get a c from him I have this information if you want to I was kind of the the um Grant is for 5,000 right correct yeah this is this is this quote is for the the plan itself and then there is yeah $5,000 we also did reach out to Sher to give us a quote on writing and handling the grant as well okay um we haven't heard back from from that piece yet okay whether or not it would be worth it we'll see obviously it's couple thousand bucks $5,000 R do you want me to give you the information for Bill yeah free to ask right yeah I mean I did mention that the current um plan um was written 10 years ago and was red because of Co so um you know it's basic I think I feel like at this point basically starting from scratch yeah but um you know so yeah well but Bill brashard obviously be familiar with our original goals more quotes are better I think yeah um all right so we're gonna move on to the Green Team and Natural Area update Bonnie um so the Natural Area is having a volunteer weekend in the Natural Area coming up it was in the burough Buzz it's today Saturday and Sunday 16 17 10 to 1 um so we would love to have people come it's a great workout in the woods it's always fun um and uh they're looking for volunteers um the Green Team um we had a lot of the green team members and other members of the um public help with the New ciner Garden expansion that was the EA project that went very well it's if you haven't walked down trail go see it because it's really great it's double the size and all that and the green team will be renewing our certification coming up which is a big deal and it would be great if we had the inventory done and we could use some of that to get a bunch of tree points it's done inventory is done we have access to all the okay but there's lots of like reporting and um tracking that for what part um just for hazardous trees like the way we Christy I tried to get us to get points for that we specifically to add that field on for trees because of the sustainable Jersey oh good requirement so they added that field for us yeah we have we have a count of the 2,636 trees like they're yeah okay how many trees 2636 that does not include um the Natural Area that's you know um Street trees and park trees and bur property like you know for example like bur Hall so you guys you want you have to I can share the all the actions there are a bunch of tree related actions um that there was a tree ordinance but I think we had qualified for that but I wonder if it's been changed because of the SW CH with that all the actions I think there were like 40 points which is a lot for I'm sorry I think Kevin mg might be on here there's a Kevin can we just Kevin McGovern if that's you on the zoom can you use the raise hand feature so we know that you're here and I can bring you over there you go right just want to make sure all right Bonnie you're still up so tree Federation conference and Shore shade tree meeting yeah so I went to the shore shade tree committee meeting down in Masson um at their B Hall their um the chair of their shade tree runs this decided to organize it because he felt like everybody was struggling with the same problems and wouldn't be get great to get together and just talk it through and it really was interesting because everybody has the same problems I mean it's just and it's nice to know that everybody does that we're not unique and um to talk through them um it was mostly uh you know town south of the seagar Spring Lake Belmar Point Pleasant Radley Beach um and Masson but Atlantic Highlands was there and they would love more towns to join in um they the next meeting will be Wednesday February 19th at 6 CL and Brian invites anyone and everyone who loves trees so that's his message um the shade tree Federation conference was great um it was two days I went the second day um next year will be their 100th anniversary so I think it would be super special so I would encourage anybody that wants to go I mean it's just they have great speakers um they you know they talk about the tree ordinance they talked about tracking inventory um they had um the chair of haddenfield um they're talking about the inventory he's very he's our I was say if he ever had a question he would probably be really happy he the resource um that you can use to talk to him um they talked about they someone talking about sidewalks and trimming roots and the proper way to do it and how you really should accommodate the trees and there's all these ways to do it and not you know cut through the trees and you can shave sidewalk instead of the roots and um so it just it's it's um it's really a worthwhile um meeting I think I mean I know it's expensive and I don't know how many people can go but was Sher there by chance Sher was there um Thursday and I was there Friday so I missed her but I did talk to F they always there um and I just talk to a lot of the people from the shore so it's it's really I mean it's a great community that we're in so I feel very privileged to be a part of it um they did you know talk about the ordinance and same thing lots of you know um back and forth I guess the one big thing so at this conference there's a lot of um tree people the you know the from the tree and they were not included in this and so there's a little bit of like why did we not get included I don't know so um they they just weren't included in the discussion on what language went into that yeah and they're under the DP now so was kind of interesting um one of the things that they recommended the tree escro fund um they suggested that um that should just be used mostly for planting and maybe maintenance like poning um don't these up for removals as much because it's take up everything and it's really for planting um they really stress pruning as you know you've got to keep on top of your trees and which I don't think we do really well and probably should focus on that um they but anyway I just you know I can't say enough about stuff you learn um and it's it's a very Val resource and as I said next year should be a very good one years good thank you earlier in your comment though you said we're not unique that speci not everybody has the same you know don't tell me what to do um how do we control it I mean a lot of the shore towns really lost trees to development so they're even m one Brian melon basically said we've given up on trying to control it we're just going to plant as many trees as possible anybody that ask for a tree we give them a tree for free you said we just want to get trees in the ground um so that's their main focus yeah they plant Tre Street trees for free right yeah yeah yeah so it's really yeah you want to tree in front of your house you ask for them you get it we should think that right thank you Bonnie uh community outreach may have be gone uh yes we have 201 followers on our Instagram page over the were we at 199 198 for the past six months you made it over 200 y'all um and uh we should be in we should have an article in be Haven living this month I don't know if anyone got theirs yet I just got it but I didn't look at I didn't get it we're in there oh um and they were able to add some uh hopefully I haven't seen it but I didn't see what they finally put in but I asked him to include some treat maintenance uh graphic like uh IV removal trimming whatever we had on that door hanger um he said that whatever their art Department would probably like bust with it but um that they were going to include that uh and uh basically just kind of went over what our goals are as a commission that we've been working on a new ordinance um really just the just trying to get education out there for the um for how to maintain your trees and um trying to encourage an understanding and love for the canopy did you say community living or Fair Haven Fair Haven living Fair Haven living okay that's what I thought yeah um I did didn't come to you today good talking the cover we should for AR de be a cop yeah instead of a family Tre on the c um good luck with that I'll give you a number you can you can see you can talk um uh I would love I was thinking about can you get like high schoolers that want to help with that are good with social media that may want volunteer hours is that something we can do um yeah do or do they have to be like a part of the commission I mean we use the Key Club for the door hangers yeah that's that's but that's like an isolated project yeah I mean that's like a controlled um communication I don't know I mean I don't know if you could like have them make graphics for you and then you post because then you could approve them but I would not hand it over I wouldn't hand it over I mean even if uh sometimes it's just about being engaged and that takes time to grow your engagement sure um and you know it's about bandwidth and also I mean making Graphics takes me a long time it does a long time um uh I guess I I think any help would be helpful okay um but I understand are they are they skilled enough to make the graits do you know I don't have any kids in high school I don't know um yes they pretty sad yeah yeah okay I would imagine that you would have to be the engagement person like you would have to respond to it right you'd want to control that I'd want to control that that's fair okay um I'll reach out to is it the same is it the same person that was running it when we did the door hangers um probably probably I mean uh this is um jery still running Key Club I don't know if he's still he's still there he's doing Key Club yeah we can ask yeah if it's just bandwidth you might want to try some of the AI stuff because you can say make me a graphic with Dolly make me a graphic of a person planning a tree or a family planning a tree just describe it it'll make it okay I've been doing some AI but not for graphics that's um thanks I mean there's a graphic design class at rfh that's a good idea so I mean that would be I don't know who the teacher if that is next semester I at the teacher I met on back to school night I just can't remember um I think that's all I have for community outreach right now okay great thank you there thank you invasive species Brands Kevin want anything add on this sorry um so the guy Brian McDonald that I reached out to at the uh Community forestry got back to me and he told me to pursue um a couple of potential places one of which was the NJ um sorry bear with me um nrcs office and then there's these invasive species strike teams but as far as I know there's some grants with nrcs but I'm not sure if they're going to be the right fit and I know Seager and and Hopewell Valley have these invasive species strike teams that are funded by like corporations and and those types of donations so I have to do more digging he F he he took him a while to get back to me so maybe uh put me on the agenda for next month to provide an update because I'm I still haven't heard back from some of these organizations sure we do thanks all right Peter hey all yes not too much to report here we have um the annual budget which is on our agenda um just the community forestry management plan was already covered um last time we added in January putting a notice out about the resident tree buying program so that's a little ways out um and the other notable thing we talked about last time was just having a quarterly budget report uh but we're obviously not that wouldn't be for this meeting so uh that's all I have to report yeah sounds good does anybody have anything you think to think of in the not so distant future we haven't put on there already we went with that last meeting so I think it was pretty exensive I can't think all right good thank you Peter thank you all right bring this to the budget um so here we are at that special time of year where we uh got to get our money together last year or this year I should say 2024 our budget appropriation was1 19,250 of which as of the end of October we had used $4,395 uh this year we are again going to be held to a 2% increase that gives us a additional $385 and we're going to be coming after all of it um so I pr this our budget potential budget of $1 19,6 um of which next year as we talked about before our community forestry management plan has to be updated and again our quote so far is for $8,900 there is a potential Grant available for $5,000 but we have to figure out how to go about writing that Grant and hopefully getting it it's not guaranteed that we would get $55,000 um and we will also be faced with a um $3,000 software up date subscription now I know we had the one year included with the initial I'm assuming that went on that was effective once the inventory was done or was it I think it's going to be effective once the training's done so we'll be due to pay for that in November of next year next year okay all right so we'll have a another $3,000 um uh to hit our budget uh if you subtract those items it leaves us $7,700 to pay for our license tree expert so I guess there's going to be um I don't know some big bing and maybe stealing and I was talking about I wasn't listening yeah um so I was gonna hope to get together with you and talk offline see what that's good yeah wait the $7,700 for the licens to expert cor is that in our budget or so that that's basically what we're left with after those two expenses um the $8,900 is going to be one time charge it's not something that we have to budget for year after year um the software we will have the budget for going forward uh every year uh currently our budget for our license tree expert was $10,000 as of the end of October um we spent roughly $7,800 so by the end of this year you know we'll probably be under the $10,000 but pretty close I would imagine um so I that's a conversation I think we there is um on the software if you buy multiple years there is a discount so um that's worth considering yep I it was uh was it 5% for three years or 10% for three years here see read well we're in right right I it's not like we're coming out so yeah you should always look for the best discount sure 10% if you sign up for three years so that's 7500 right now um 20% for five years that' be $1,000 currently numbers were from the beginning of the year pay up front or is it just that we sign up pay that up front the fingers I would think so to get the discount that's why they want their money um Chris what exactly was the 19250 spent on do you have a breakdown with that yeah so uh well 19,250 was our overall budget 14, 395 is what we spent out of that uh 7,800 for a licens tree expert uh 250 in training conferences and I think we got off fairly easy this year because we there were quite a few um free classes online available that we were able to pick up a few credits and uh uh we were way ahead of our our needed credits but as you know next year starts at zero so we'll be back at it again um the uh tree planting and removal uh was $6,000 called $6,100 our Christmas tree our Fernbrook purchases and that's it Go Qui was budget is for the town rrice uh for the town and as for maintenance and for what do we what do we put I don't think that that line item I don't think it's broken out that way I think it falls I I can take a look but I think it falls into you know DPW they don't say you know trees snow removal it's at least the budget that I see maybe there's maybe there's another layer another level yeah I me wouldn't it be I don't know couldn't it be estimated I I have it it's um there's a line item called buildings and grounds tree removal that's all the work that DPW does and also work that they cannot do with their own equipment they have to hire an outside contractor um this year was $155,000 that's the budget that was budget but we just got something you said us for eight that was the marter they've exceeded so far yes so then what happens I don't know I'm not in finance so that's tree removal but what about tree maintenance both that's a build it's called buildings and grounds so grow and it does so I would you be just curious how much of that was spent on tree removal and if any and well this $88,000 just came through for Frontier at mcarter is for pruning right not it's just forting yeah I you all the but I just wonder I'm just curious how much we spend on taking care of our trees versus just reacting to having to take dangerous trees down like I feel like the pruning should be a focus going forward as a maintenance item to prevent us having to take treat I ask I don't know if they have that information if they do I'll find out I guess I mean do we have any input in that does anybody else feel strongly that we should be well I think like that's one of the like I know we've talked about this but like now that we have the inventory and there's an assessment of the you know recommended maintenance like if you look through it like there's some of them that identify trees that should be removed some of them that just need routine pruning and stuff like that and you know so you could build your maintenance you know schedule around hopefully you know obviously taking care of the ones that are dangerous first and then moving on to you know the routine thing where I think it probably because we haven't been looking at looking at it holistically it might take us a moment to like get to this get to the point where you know the the forward Focus would be pring because we can you know I think I think I think when we look at this you know and we see and maybe that's something important to look at as we're is not for our budget but for the um BW budget like how many of those trees were identified as Priority One removals um I would think you know I mean yeah I mean that's part of the training that they showed the DPW and say this is like what yeah they're involved in this I knew yeah yeah so I mean so I would I would think you know we would hope to get to a point where that budget would be more of a maintenance budget as opposed to a reactionary like you know removal budget the DPW will be asking for the funds needed to remove the more priority I don't know what they're going to ask for I'm just saying like this the information is more readily available at this point I guess it's available I just want to make sure it's being used properly like I mean I mean they're fully engaged in this training so yeah yeah we're just I mean I completely agree we're just something PR of this right so we're gonna have a lot of information right front so we have to be able to be a little parsimonious as we as we go go forward it's good like it's good like it's it's definitely a huge step forward in in how we're going to maintain our Treads and prioritize all right moving on uh tree removal permit data so I see [Music] 11 since our last meeting again yep I would say almost all of them are disease dying or failing right yeah be also interest to see what was removed since this information the survey was couple months ago and then want to see what was remot s yeah and that would only be relevant if it was a tree yeah yes but that's a good point like if it is that it needs to be updated yeah does this include bres no this is we we track public Nick does because we have to put it into the annual accreditation reps that I doing for Arbor um City USA and then J UCF it's all broken out any comments question public what we looking at kind of how many trees REM what did you say uh looks like 11 since our last meeting they were appi they were at least applied for these are were these definitely already removed or they just in the works these were applied for it's like 11 these are these are permits granted I don't know if they scheduled the work or it's up to the homeowner okay all right these are the permits that have been granted so looks like 11 trees were applied for for for removal for one reason or another most of them again as mik said dead dying disease failing um it looks like about the same number in September August was busy [Music] looks like about 11 11 trees a month over the last 3 months all been then we when if it's not required for replacement but encouraged who's encouraging these are all sher's comments when she signs off on the permit if it's not required for the ordinance she still says but encouraged that not required lot all of them move on to the 2025 shade Tre meeting dates um this is just our yearly calendar everybody agreed to be D same calendar first Wednesday of every or what that what it is first official yeah 730 hbd yep and then July is our typical typical recess yes yeah yes you do one when I first joined we only met once every other month long um but uh make a motion to uh or ask for a motion to approve the calendar once uh stick in the same format I move to approve the 2025 shry commission second approve all right looks like that's it [Laughter] uh Council and tree ordinance update councilman Olen yes so I think we're on the one yard line um I think back to after I won my election the first conversation I had with the mayor is he said uh I want your number one priority to be to get a tree ordinance pass out of compliance um storm water rules uh we're losing trees and we're not replacing them and it's been languishing for years um and I was ni even up to think that it would be a couple of months and here we are in November um there's probably 50 people's finger fingerprints on it um the north star of the ordinance has been the compromise that I think this group um came to over several months several meetings um we introduced it it was workshopped there were a few amendments I do think that the Amendments stay true to the the um Spirit of what you all agreed on um it was introduced uh and I anticipate I told you at the beginning that I wouldn't introduce something if I didn't think it would pass I do think I have votes um I would say that it is unfinished business as we talked about there are some topics that we put a pin in like the Heritage trees um as soon as this group can come to an agreement on how to define them how to deal with them I do have the mayor's word that we can introduce that for workshopping um so we're close is that predicated on what we decide about parage trees or do we to move forward no so we'll move forward as it is we're out of compliance and I'll be honest I want to get the cash register flowing I want funds coming into the escrow the tree fund start doing the plantings to do the maintenance um it's been too long too many years let's let's get the money flowing and then continue to work on herit or maybe there's some things that that you all think are great but after we've tried it for a few months you think that it's it needs to be changed or amended or things we didn't think of um I think everybody's in agreement that we want to make sure that the developers you know it's as um I guess as punitive as possible while staying within the boundaries of legality um so that's the stuff that's on my mind um so that's where we yeah did Andrew had brought that up about the penalties and whether we bumped up against a maximum did you ever get that did not because that's big that's really big because if we what is our town maximum because they could take down all these trees get this huge penalty but we can't impose that like needs to be I would say before this passes that needs to be absolutely crystal clear how we get the penalty pie and if in fact we're not going to get them because it's something in the bur bylaws I don't even know where that would be but Andrew S said something about it I'm sorry but I there was there was something to the effect that there might be a maximum threshold that we could that we might be violating if for our powers just as a as a burrow r large not not specific trees are the penalty it's the the bees if you take out you know a bunch of great big trees and there's a huge V attached thousands of dollars and it's higher than what we are allowed to charge as a burrow for a fee which I don't understand where that falls where that is in our I'll ask you um I know then that means we don't get it well I don't know if that's the case but all okay but will you ask and then get it in make the language in here so it's not a problem you'll ask me to put that in the in the ordinance well I think it's what what you put what in the ordinance well clarify I mean if if in fact this is language with free schedules that we will never get because of I mean whether we change our maximum level fees we can get in the burrow for whatever for a penalty how do we how do we adjust that so we can get all this money is it we modify um well so we had two lawyers look at it uh the overall ordinance um and they never came back with that so maybe he looked at it he did he no he said in the meeting but um he's looked he and uh Christine have looked at it since so I'll I'll double check um and and get back okay I mean that obviously the intent is not to have a fee in there um that people don't have to pay that would want to change that right okay um am iow to say one other the chair chair no no chair absolutely um so I attended a lot of the council meetings um listened to a lot of um feedback um from various constituents and seemed to me that the one one of the concerns a lot of people expressed was the uh significant specimen tree is I know they were called Heritage but in our existing ordinance they are significant specimen trees and they are protected and it's based on a kind of cumbersome the 60% largest similar tree listed in either the mama County largest tree or the New Jersey B tree hunt which means that has to be updated I mean it's a little bit cumbersome but I'm just wondering I think this was important enough to enough people it's not that hard to just take the lines that are drawn through in our existing ordinance and put it back in and maybe what we do is specify we all talk about the Buttonwood trees as something that should be protected um the big tree hunt trees should be protected um there might be other trees that we can name and maybe we make it a list of these trees um maybe there's something that's right next to a stream that's particularly valuable to soaking up storm water you know there there could be a list of trees I mean the significance specimen trees the language in our current ordinance is it's presumed the significant specimen trees should only be removed in the most compelling and extraordinary circumstances removal would be permitted only if approved by the governing body we could substitute the shade tree if you don't want to hear these anymore um the loss of lot yield building area or profitability of development shall be deemed neither compelling nor extraordinary why can we not just take a few lines out keep a definition of a specimen tree that will protect some Street trees which was also um a concern right the button with trees um it just doesn't seem that difficult to keep language some of the existing language that was in there for a long time um I just feel like residents were worried about this this was something that was expressed over and over again and why shouldn't we be sensitive I think I don't think there's anybody on this committee that doesn't want to say specimen treat you know wouldn't want that language in there I we all agree and I and I think Brian said before and we've said again we're we're definitely going to address this the me when we sure and I mean if we can come up with [Music] a we weren we weren't planning to rehash this at this meeting but I mean we can we can definitely do that in fact that will be one of our proposed new agenda items for our next meeting and absolutely I don't know why we we is just passes yes so I remember I remember this debate very clearly okay we talked about it in two subsequent meetings Heritage treeses everyone's in agreement that we want to have it in there but there's not agreement about how to define them and then once you define them what to do with them Michael was sitting in that chair I was right there and he said it sounds like this is something that maybe we should put a pin in because it might take months to sort of button this down and in the meantime trees are coming down we're not collecting cash do you remember that yes um and so we decided as a group to put a pin in it and say let's table it let's not make perfect the enemy the good get this passed get in compliance get the cash coming in and we will address it I think that our current ordinance is actually in compliance Bill Brooks told me that I don't know what about it is not in compliance actually it's not it does comply with M4 storm water it has language in it it protects trees I mean doesn't apply to burrow that's one the storm water requirements require all the tree or free removal ordinance to apply to all trees including burrow property our existing Ordinance do not so that's one example and there's probably others protecting bur trees that there has to be a process yeah the process has to apply to the burrow as well well I mean in this there is there was a process because gave it the code enforcement officer a list of of you know very reasonable which one of the public pointed out very reasonable circumstances where exceptions could be made um which I also as soon as the shade tree commission can get to an agreement on maybe we could agree I mean what a Heritage tree is well I think hold on I'm not interrupting you as soon as the shatri commission can agree on what what a Heritage tree is how we Define them and then what to do with them once we Define them I will bring it right away to the mayor what I mean is there is it really that difficult to put the um specimen tree language the significant specimen tree language there's a definition in the existing ordinance there's a paragraph protecting it and saying that those trees will if you need if you want to remove them and you need to come before councel I mean there there is simple language in there it is the 60% of the momth county but that's what we used for a very long time I mean there's nothing wrong with that um it I mean I would say that you might we might want to add some special trees in there it just doesn't I I just don't think it's that hard to but you're even even what you're talking about here you're saying we could add some trees here again it's a slippery slope and we're so close to getting this thing p and we agreed here that we would send it to Town Council um I think this would delay things further we've been with this ordinance for I don't know how many years before I was even here and I've been here since 2014 and chrisy what's what's in our escro fund right now for the tree uh escro fund what's what's it the sh tree trust is about 5300 we I I feel like you know we've been going over this for years and we can and I I I promis and we said as a group that we con constantly look at this review it and see if we can agree on the Heritage tree is list against is it possible to propose to council that we're on the agenda every quarter to kind of check on the ordinance and see like take the Pulse of like what's been going on what we're seeing what we're hearing with the community I I I like that idea I don't know if the council's the right place for it I think there we should have a process where we're getting like this kind of report and discussions with the administration about how it's working like I said there might be things that we think are are fine but there's a loophole that we didn't think of that we would need to close for example so I think we're going to be getting feedback um I don't know if it comes to the council though so we do we have to just help me understand so if it if you want to make a change like if we discover there's an issue yeah and we need to make a change because you know trees are coming down that we didn't expect or what have you um how how do we make the change at the next Council Commission meeting and then propose that change to you to bring to council yes and then do we would they be able to like vote on that at that meeting so that's that's a good question so if we make a material change now it starts the process over it's basically a three meeting process has to be Workshop introduced and then vote uh you can make Dom Minimus changes but a non-d Minimus change s starts the clock over again and so something like adding Heritage starts the clock over and it's it's three meetings but um I I would say not use the word heritage I would use the significant specimen and and I guess my only thing we put the pin in on it because we can agree then it went it never really went to public input and then the public got to speak and they were the ones saying well wait a minute we like that part of it so having the specimen trees protected done a lot of input from the public at a council meting input from the public yes one person um uh told me suggested the idea of notifying neighbors right that was that was just from a public person I was talking to as many people as I could and not everybody's input got in again I tried to stay true to the compromise that I thought you the spirit of this group so I'll I'll I'll sort of bear something that U if I were able to write the ordinance just on my own I think I would make the penalties lower not because I don't think developers should be paying I'm fine with that it's just that I heard a lot of people when I was knocking on door saying I can't afford to live in town anymore but I did not even though that's my personal preference I wanted to stay true to the compromise that you guys agreed to and so I left them as is that's that's that was the filter that I used for the input that I included trying to stay as best efforts to stay true to the compromise of the Sher commission and if you remember from our meetings it wasn't just you know we didn't want to discuss it it was a multifactorial issue um you know we also touched on reparan rights and people's personal property and things of that nature uh how it affects their house um the safety of it there were a lot of issues involved which we couldn't get past and obviously we wanted to get this you know to council because like it has like I've said it has been lingering uh you know I've had emails with Chris rodrigus when he was sitting in this chair since 2017 to try to get get a better ordinance in town so the work's not done I guess I just want to make sure that and we said we said we would discuss it I mean discussing and getting back on the agenda agenda for actual action well that's that's that's our job right I mean that's we we'll have it on the agenda every every I meant the council agenda that's our am iow talk well I think we didn't get to public participation yet but we can make an exception perhaps so yes um Ryan's analogy that they started with that I feel like we're on the one yard line well after you go into the touchdown what do you do you kick off you keep playing so that's the analogy that I'll roll with is that it's you know you're just coming the Heritage right now from being up when I'm sitting up there I've heard a few more issues than that I've heard discussions on the five tree mechanism that initiates the report um I've heard Mr Parkins talking about what's on the approved list of trees and you know how that should look um obviously we're sitting here discussing you know certain protections for Heritage and speciment trees uh so you know in my opinion I think we have enough feedback already to start the conversation for what phase two of this ordinance looks like and I'll say it again um as soon as you know sheet Tre and everyone can get together on sort of a uh compromise of how they think that that should look I'll put it on workshop at the next meeting you have my word come say that again say it again as as soon as soon as we get it did that make sense there I no I lost as soon as soon as there's a compromise as to how that language should sound as far as the protections and all the other things that we've talked about and they want to make a recom shade tree wants to make a recommendation to the governing body as to how we can improve the assuming this ordinance passes how we can improve the existing ordinance I willmed workshop at at the next council meeting now I can't promise you when it's Workshop that four members of the governing body are going to agree exactly with what the recommendations are but based on what we've seen in the past I would think that um some semblance of those recommendations would end up making their way into the and so then you go back to am I allowed to speak I think well but yeah before we because I can I kind of feel like the uh the dam might be breaking open this is an important part of the whole discussion of course let's let's follow the yeah let's stick at the agenda and I know I I have a feeling there's some public participation coming this way um but that's all I had to say there we go um propose new agenda items I feel like heritage stre heritage can we just make it significant what yeah Bonnie that's what I mean when I say heritage treat it's just it's in the existing ordinance it's all there the language is there specimen it's EAS to say well there's there's two Bonnie right there's significant specimen trees and specimen trees I think we should address both yes yeah okay you guys have a lot of work to do and again this is one of the reasons like Mike said we I mean we we had the conversation and it went into once he you start dipping your tone to those private property issues I mean it becomes a real sticky issue but moving on we will definitely it'll be on next month's agenda if we have to strike a handful of any other updates just because we want to this conversation is not a f minute conversation it's it I mean it really took up the bulk of I mean we had two meetings all we did was talk about the agenda we cleared the agenda that's all that was on was the ordinance those meetings were over two hours long just on the ordinance and this issue took up the bulk of that conversation so I'm I'm more than happy to get this on the agenda for next uh at the next meeting and have a lengthy healthy discussion about it so we can move something forward can we had tree ordinance discussion on as a running agenda just in case anybody has oh yeah absolutely not just right other things that Brian wrote down that we we hadn't put a pin into because we mean you might have an instance you want to discuss something happen oh yeah it's not going to be you know it's not going to be specific we can just orn Heritage trees we call it what we call appendix a on the agenda or uh I would just say um sort of tree ordinance review like how is it working what needs to change what you know what needs to be added that appendix a part of the ordinance it's something you guys own no no no but the way it is as Bill Perkins pointed out right now it is part of the ordinance this was just exed out this it's attached here no it's just attached it's independent I know but it does say shrubs can I think we should just is that the Minimus just a lob off small trees and shrubs that has nothing to do with what the council passes you guys can do you can change that right now if you want that's not part of the ordinance the this is is this anywhere on the shade tree the sh the ordinance refers to it that's it where did this even come from is this on our website yes yeah click the link and it'll bring you to the record you guys own that document you own that document okay you can you can do whatever you want to and it does you know you scroll down far enough it starts getting into it does talk about I'd really like to dedicate a whole meeting to this we're going to reopen this but it does get into shrubs and rendr and things like that on that on this list but I believe also the ordinance speaks to a specific size of replacement in each so obviously that would cut out using shrubs yeah you wouldn't be able to use a shrub to replace as a replac um all right so we'll get this on the uh the agenda tree ordinance review Open Season B well I mean look I don't I don't needan to be difficult you know I want this to pass I want us to get fees I just I think that I wasn't particularly happy with the process that you there was I thought we having another Workshop really not our process okay well I mean you can make fun I'm just trying to do my job I think this is the most important thing that we do and we should be really proud of this when we said and done and um you have people yeah we're on your side but we just also need to figure out a way to get something across the finish off because another few months passes by and you know 15 20 trees a month come down again and nothing coming along with nothing helping us plant trees plant trees we could probably look at this and not all these would qualify as um you know on the fee schedule because they were dead or you dying but if we just even um counted the removals we would have a lot more money to plant trees this year that's that's that's how I got in BO and you mentioned Pride I me I think we' be proud to bring this up every meeting and then you look at it critically and then make our recommendations to Brian then you can take it to council so like I said it's it's a dynamic process that we're not just going to forget we won we promised and again said before we'll get to a point where we'll be talking about how many trees we planted want us thr them we want everybody Happ we want everyone to feel like they you know had input as best as possible again best effort um and it's not it's not in stone this would be $50,000 worth of trees if we had this at the beginning of the year 15,000 it's a lot of trees that's a lot of trees plant well projects lot of project didn't plant trees if they didn't plant their own trees correct yeah right only if they decid not sorry but that would be good too yes we can agree yeah and trees planting of new the requirement to plant new trees is more burdensome for more restrictive or whatever they have to do more planning than the existing ordinance it's a higher burden I I didn't say that very well but there'll be more trees in the ground versus the existing or it's a higher bar higher limb okay and you promise you'll get the speed thing worked out that'll be in I will ask because that really can't go without that he didn't bring it up again so I'll ask him that should not be I mean I don't know just clarifying we're not changing we're clarifying that that does not violate some other code in the B yeah I don't want that I want it to be what it says there's too much work that went into it any other proposed new agenda items I have one um I was talking to somebody in town who's an environmental scientist apparently she does uh research on air quality and Fair Haven has really bad air quality I was completely unaware um I was hoping to maybe have her talk to us or the environmental commission just to kind of let the community know um because trees do act as barriers to this um to the to apparently the inner city air comes down this way unchecked over the ocean um and the trees are really our our only barrier uh I had no idea it affects our cancer rates it's it's it's important it's really important that we know I had no idea um so I would like to you know hopefully she could speak to us or the environmental commission and if we could you know have some data that we could share even if we put it with the tree planting and the tree removal permit so that people are really mind about whether or not they should take down their tree sure it's a good idea I would love to speak her you think she would come to our meeting uh I think she's uh willing to she's been a little busy but I uh will ask I will ask I didn't know if it would made more sense for the environmental commission or for us but uh she's willing to come talk to us yeah I mean if you want we're bringing it here we can invite invite the environment okay yeah all right cool um so if you want to follow up weren't thinking next meeting probably little short notice for her but I can ask if we I can ask well if we are going to um do a tree ordinance review I think that's be a ly conversation I do I mean yeah every so I mean I'm not opposed to it but I think maybe you know a January February meeting maybe might be a little better okay but if you want to follow up with her and then we'll we can put it on we'll put it on the agenda you can give us an update and see what she says datable sounds good all right anything else anything else anything moving on to public participation Christie do we have any public particip like to you want to do the online first yeah okay if you have a question or comment online please use the raise hand feature and I will bring you over Robin you're going off there she go ahead um good evening Robin 99935 River Road and I'd like to um uh refer to the comment Rel uh talked about earlier on mentioning the prevention uh preventative care of our Fair Haven trees uh the New Jersey far all of you knowing that it hasn't rained in uh over six weeks here in Fair Haven the New Jersey Forest Service reported two weeks ago a friend of mine Who's involved with um friends of the Drew forest in Mars County where a fire broke out in a 53 acre preserve there and it was reported by the fire service that because of a major volunteer effort in the spring where they removed dry invasive vines that it kept the fire at Bay and it only destroyed two of the 53 Acres this leads this is a great segue for me because I'm a messenger from um The Fair Haven natural Fields committee that is having a volunteer like Bonnie said the a volunteer um two days it's going to be 10 to 1 I would love to meet all of the shade tree commission um members I would love to see all of you out there there will be Refreshments uh there will be uh lunch there will be time to uh congregate and get to know one another and I would love to get to know you on the um on the shade shade tree Commission I also wanted to know I'm just curious to know how much of the the how many members of the shade tree commission are educated on the ms4 permit storm water management that is being handed down by the state because that really that education should be mentioned to the public when I mention about a street a shade tree ordinance to friends of mine and neighbors of mine it's really about um you know having these rooted uh you know um trees that are native and really provide uh uh preventive erosion that is the goal here and that is what you know the state is really trying to mandate I also am really um in favor of the air quality um report and I would be really happy to advertise a zoom uh to the public in January or February I recently um planted uh uh a method in I was involved in with a group in Elizabeth I had never been to Elizabeth I have a Philadelphia view of New Jersey thinking that it is Elizabeth and um when I went there I was expecting uh you know to see poor air quality and they are doing massive um tree plantings there it's the Japanese miuk method that plants 350 trees saplings in a small area that really affects the air quality in a positive way um they also are doing there's also methods of air pruning boxes that really all of us can gather in our backyards and do sapling um plantings with our kids with our grandkids uh with our neighbors and really share these little saplings so that we don't have to incur this 15,000 do expense or whatever you're talking about with tree plantings we can start them young and we can start them anywhere thank you thank you robt thank you anyone else online no other comments online okay open it up to the people in front of us here Mar I just think on the specimen tree it's very simple just name the trees Josh says a living and breathing document don't Define what the trees are list them say list all the trees on button wood and then have an address just get 25 trees as specimen trees get the thing started and just roll I think that's minim is that the minim I I don't know that's a that's a Loy question I don't know Mar you saying just it's not the minimist but if you if you came to a quick decision after the ordinance has pass on something like that I wouldn't have to wait for all four things at once I mean I would Workshop it and we' introduce it and move towards it immediately it's not at the minim change 100% don't have ask attorneys to that is not and one of the things that came up in in a conversation just like that Mark was you know who are we to say all right listen we're going to take trees on your property and we're going to say these are you know special trees that can't be touched or or fall under some kind of special just do 10 just start small get I'm I'm with ran I'm with J get it started but get some of these little things easy those are small HDs but if you have to Define what a specimen tree is oh my God yeah no I love your input on it CU you mentioned the but but those are burrow trees so are we talking about people's property trees or are we talking about burrow trees or both I believe you're talking about property trees there's there's the eight from the big tree hunt there's a handful more and then Josh is talking about you can adjust it later I mean are those but with trees protected no the burrow ones or the the ones on people's it's I don't think they're protected now can't move a burrow tree yes you can Bur are you sure in this ordinance it protects our burrow trees this is just bur decides what happens bur trees yeah but you define them as a specimen tree then you know then however you resolve I can't just still cut down a bur tree or do anything I can't it I can't water it I can't I guess I water it but yeah it's not my property I'm not sure that they feel like they're totally protected in this where well I mean it's we took out the definition of bur tree if street treeses but I thought it was if it's over [Music] um you can get a permit to to remove it you can get a permit to remove a street treat we don't have a burrow tree def find in here anymore but because the ordinance applies to all trees including burrow trees so the burrow if it owns a tree it has to apply it has to abide by the ordinance as part of the ms4 as person it says in here a burrow tree like I assume that if a person wants to remove the burrow tree in front of their property they just need to get a permit if it's a burrow tree I don't think we could take down bur I think you can I think that's what that's what's in here you know bur would have the burrow has to adhere to these guidelines right they have to well it's not the burrow taking it down if if someone on Buttonwood says I don't want that tree anymore I'm afraid of it it's going to fall my house does our new ordinance protect that person that train so I can't answer specifically I can answer right now I know that obviously I live um the issue years ago was when we came to the burrow they had to trim the trees because we didn't own the trees the burrow own the trees um it's in the burrow right of away obviously the tree is um I'd really like to focus on what Mark said because it lit a bold for me rather than sit there and Define the exact calculation of which tree PA as a specimen tree it's pretty obvious that we're going to want to you know you had mentioned Bonnie I think I think it was human me they want to protect the big hun trees um obviously this the sycamores bwood are important part of um the heritage of this town and I'm sure I'm sure few others that qualify in that neighborhood better better than sitting there and trying to define the calculation I would kind of agree he just specifies the very specific trees but I want to be clear that's still more than a dominous change so I would still put that on your next meeting for discussion if you could Define What specifically those trees are and get that to the council I would think if it's reasonable that the council's going to support it okay I just want to clarify under tree replacement requirements it says any person who removes one or more Street trees which is the new definition in here we don't have BR tree anymore with a DB of 2.5 or more unless exempt under all those exemptions um which is basically yeah has a tree yeah so um shall be sub to the requirements of the tree replacement requirements so yes yes you can remove a borrow tree you so the definition of a person includes the burrow this is a person this is the resident yeah B why would we issue why would the permit get issued if they don't own the tree yeah you can't you can't cut down other people's treats well then why does it say they want to cut down a street tra I think I think there's a Mis a disconnect well I think it's not clear then I mean I don't you're the only one coming to that conclusion well that doesn't mean it's not a correct conclusion it doesn't we don't find BR tree anymore right we only Define a bro tree as a street tree is that the same thing all trees are treated the same I mean why do we have Street Tree in here I shouldn't say all trees regardless of ownership all trees are treated the same resident the burrow has to has to treat has to abide by the ordinance regardless of who individual or the bur okay there might be an exception for the state if I remember correctly I really am confused about this and I think it's not an unimportant thing that I'm sure we can bring it to the attention of soul and see what his interpretation isn't it right well I'm quite certain that an individual resident cannot cut down burrow property tree and a street tree is a bur property tree is that the new definition for a bur tree Street tree so I know there's a difference between if the burrow has the right away but the resident can own a tree but then there's some trees that the burrow owns like the the button okay but again I just think there's no definition BR tree I don't you so this question was specifically asked at the meeting because you talked about the attorney has trees planted in the burrow right those become Street trees in burrow right away the way that W trees right now this new W anyone could cut down 2 and half in caliber Street tree and they just have to replace it as long as as long as they have the tree no that doesn't that is not what it says in here ran it doesn't say that it says it doesn't say if you own it or not we even def Street tree and we give a specific definition I'm just saying this this if you can tell me that those buttonwoods are protected and they not protected andic yeah concern my answer to that truthfully is we're heading into the winter I don't need a lot of people pick lot of trees down over with me bear with me we have a path forward here to Define which trees we want to put into the next version of the ordinance there's no one on BND drive that's rushing to cut down a sore tree what makes the entire Street Beau there's no one that's going to want to do you somebody your next door neighbor sells it to a person from New York who hates trees hates leaves they're not going to move you have time now they don't want to leave in their property I mean if we can come to an agreement here two months from now we will put those protections that we're for those specific trees into the order how many is how many trees are Street trees people all right so that was the first point on the um specimen trees second point was and you guys touched on before can you get some sort of agreement poly might be too much but annually in front of the council to address the ordinance just to touch on it to see we just discussed that yeah that's good idea sure and then the last one was oh the shade Tre fun about the uses not to be used to REM move trees like it's going to go into this fond only to plant trees it's planted it's plant and mainten maintenance yeah and can maintenance not be removal that's all I mean that wouldn't be my definition I don't know that it that's dominous it's all it's all dominous my brain is Mark I personally person feel that you know planting and and maintenance would be what we would use theun for I don't think anybody here would want to they use the fund to I remal is removal that's kind of the question like do we need a definition of what maintenance is and I would say a plain English definition of Maintenance yes Drive first of all you now 202 followers oh that nice nice um I don't have much but I really what I want to start with is saying thank you because obviously this become a Hot Topic around town and just happen to coincide around a time of year when there's a lot more emotions going on so I know how much work you all put into this from all different angles um it doesn't you know uh go beyond my thinking of um how much time you spent on it time away from your families um you're volunteering on behalf B and so I want to thank the whole trade tree commission uh for all the work that you put into it as well as obviously councilman Olson um I did I did want to throw out here only because I don't know if you got an email um we do have some Quorum issues tonight where we can't all be here um so we did get some notes from councilwoman de melli okay did you get the email if not I'll just read it real quick so it's not so it's on record from her um so her thoughts was removing the approved list the actual grid and just keeping the link these are just ideas she has for future um ordinances uh 148.5 Define what appropriate fee assessment is is it legally compliant not to specifying the ordinance what is the what is the max dollar amount that they could possibly spend or max number of trees they would have to plant it seems that more burden will be on homeowner taking down one tree than a developer taking down numerous trees obviously for anyone listening um we can't make a separate ordinance for developers than we can for residents so we got to try and split the split the hair there but that was her thought on that um lowering the number to qualifies as large scale removal which I think I I mention that's a topic I heard from a bunch of people during these meetings um Street trees these need to have some parameters as as written any tree of button will can be taken down that's for thoughts there and then consideration for adding some protection I've attached a sample of what is in the Little Silver New ordinance um this could help address unintended consequences so if you don't have that email I'll get it to you tomorrow want to save record she so thank you again to everyone for your hard work on us thank you may appreciate who's next yes from you thank you very much for I know this is a volunteer addiction and no one needs I do I do have some comments so I disagree that appendix a is not part of the ordinance appendices are part of the ordinance they're mentioned numerous times in the ordinance so I don't know why or how they could not be part of the ordinance being that as it also as it made the Sha Tre commission is on their website list recommended tree list and then they have recommended trees for planting in Fair Haven and again we list I have five Strokes sure right if aous change or if it's something that you guys can vote on right now don't know why we would have rends on a on a tree we're saying recommended trees that's that's your own wording on your website near the St Tre commission so I don't know why we would have Ro dendrum M morals spice bush witer blueberry as trees to be planted so that was that was the list I we came up long before this ordinance has gotten to the point where it is now and again to my understanding and I I I guess I could be wrong because there's a lot going on in this ordinance now but if someone cuts down an X size tree they're required to replace it with a specific size tree for the ordinance those sizes would automatically disqualify Ro dendrons and everything like that that list was compiled as a reference early on for people to just go to and I totally appreciate that I'm just saying as a body if it's that easy to change I don't think there needs to be a big discussion I think we should eliminate shrubs from something we as a body are saying our trees whatl what if we put on a pen day a proof list of replacement shade trees and because then then it's the big trees then it just is this part of great thing because that's would be the second part of my discussion my comment is cut down a 150 old oak tree and replace it with a dogwood tree that's not really tree for tree replacement the dog's life expectancy is 30 years maybe maybe a little bit longer 150 year old 500y old Tre you can have I mean so that's a deeper conversation I'm just would like at the very least this is unnecessary verbage that can create confusion I don't think we need you guys are the Shad think we also need to put it says that I mean this is called the approved list and it says the fair sh commission has provided this list of recommended we need to say approved shade trees right it has to be consistent one place is approved one going to be well the clarification was in the newest version was supposed to be recommended and recommended there's still one says approved and one says recommended there's a difference the two just make it the shave like recommend shave trees and then that does not include right the small or I woulde apples and ands and it also doesn't include the Evergreens but I don't know if you should replace a well to your point about a red dendrum being a shrug right ever greens are typically not me measured by calber so ever grain are measured by TI so you have a 10 to 12 foot Spruce okay so you wouldn't necessarily have a t a 2 and a half inch caliber Spruce you measure it by height so have the ordinances written in caliper and I would maybe do to that point I would and if it's a recommended list I could still plant white line if I wanted to you're saying is your list of recommendations that doesn't preclude you from if you if you have an approved list this is this be all end approved means these are the only ones that you can plan recommended is your recommendation so I thought it said recommended it says reced but isn't this approv like we're re are we recommending them or is this what we approved for them to plan think we should recommend yeah as a landscape architect yes you recommend many other absolutely I my second comment is we talked about the the number of trees replaced and whatever else are those 11 trees according to this new ordinance dead disease dying trees require no replacement so you only get your $75 yeah that was that was the removals that I was counting okay okay so I still think there can be I know the council is concerned about moving this forward and not having litigation or or somebody challenging it but I still think you can end up with challenges because somebody instead of paying $4,000 to remove a 20 30in caliber tree they're going to say that the tree is dead diseased or dying and they W have to pay anything to take down the TR the only person the only person that can make that determination is sharing correct pay her $75 and she's not going to say as has been the case in the past where she's not going to say tell you that she it's not going to be able to guarantee that the tree is not going to fold right which is what the council was saying was an issue for them which is why they weren't allowed to deny any permits ultimately when they came to the council was because you couldn't guarantee if you were worried about the tree falling on your house on your swing set same conditions iist the same can I answer that one yeah the difference there is we wouldn't be deny the permit it's just how much you would pay in that situation so a D Tree in the situation you brought up then it would obviously be a lesser fond if she determines that it's not a de or ding tree and she says no it's not a de or ding tree but here's your permit you owe $4,000 or whatever whatever the number is that's up to the resident at that point whether they want to take the treatment they can I'm saying they cannot have their choice to take the tree down because it's dead or dying they have their choice to take tree down because they want to pay the B mark my words somebody will choose to litigate because they're not going to want to spend $44,000 and they'll get a lawyer to come and and then you'll be in the same situation that's spend more than $4,000 but in any I don't think anybody's necessarily going to do it for 4,000 I'm saying if there a number of trees that can still happen I'm just bringing out thanks some this is just um I'm sorry I just like jump out of my house to come and I usually show up um and dress so just a couple clarification friends I have listened to this topic for seven years I've listened to the shade tree I've listened to four years of this conversation from my kitchen you all on Zoom when so some of it is just clarification and everyone has very valid points one piece of clarification tonight Bonnie you just brought some thinking here is you mentioned something about they weren't included is that um you went to a conference or something you referenced they weren't included is it someone that should have been included on the ordinance that you're talking about I earlier tonight shade the Foresters the actual Foresters and are you referencing that they weren't included in this I just was saying no no no no this has nothing to do with this I was just saying that I was reporting back what that was told to us there and you know and Bill said the same thing that they didn't ask okay great so I was just wondering if you had any takeaways that should have been included because I know that Mike D'Angelo has worked very diligently on years that was nothing that was just kind of for the record we all have it's not just I know but I listen I heard from the kitchen upstairs so all right thank you I wanted to make sure about that um you answered my one question about the budget and then the other point is there's an 8020 rule right as we work and again this is four years that this is going on and it sounds like that there's no stop gaps kind of in place I'm paraphrasing from everything that I've heard that if you just get this to where it needs to go and then you have all the other stock that is going to just jump in and either add the definitions that's needed or something I'm just asking somehow you get this to the council because it's four years going on and it's it's just from myself listening to it for you all I'm feeling frustration for you all youve worked so hard you all have such passion which I can appreciate it but no one has ill intent in this town no one has ill intent on this this ordinance if you can just get it to where you need to get it over the fish Finish Line let's please do it as much as you can so that's just for the record if people don't know the history of this shade tree started seven years with Chris Rodriguez a number of members have stayed on for seven years and this has been going on for four years and I B apologize I don't know how long you've been on the shade Tre I think a few years now at least Co I remember remember so some of this conversation I'm kind of bewildered that it hasn't been done it hasn't concluded it hasn't been able to move forward I just sit back in in a little bit of Amazement I just I move a little bit faster just in in my own type of work sorry about that so that's my point my last one in regards to the bad air quality is Leah if you don't mind someone mentioned to you that lives in town that we have bad air quality in Fair Haven or is it how did that come about uh I spoke to an environmental scientist that lives in town and all she does is air quality and data like that's her job okay and she she told me that that is unfortunately the fact here okay so what I find concerning about that is if I was a scientist that lived in town and I had that data that is it something I heard the word cancer or air quality is that something that should have been you know he brought a little bit faster or or something like that or is this a hey we should look into this is nothing urgent but I'm sitting back here and we have bad air quality in cancer and it seem it's probably been a problem for a very long time of course um and you know I certainly didn't know about it imagine most of us didn't right um we assumed though we moved out or you know W out in the city we've got fresh air now um but uh you know I think that it's important for people to know how to protect the best way seriously to protect us is to have trees I think we should speak with her absolutely if I was I just thought it' be something that would be not on your part anyone that had that kind of information I would think that would have been brought just it sounds like it was a passing conversation versus hey let me get on the phone to the mayor who I call all the time and text all the time saying you know found this out you know it just sounds like it sounds like there's more urgencies urgency to it you're seeking more urgency is what you're saying that's for me if I had someone living in town or if if I was someone living in town and said wow there's really kind of bad air quality in this town if could cause cancer I better call the mayor maybe she doesn't have that maybe it's not that level of severity and also maybe it's train not just to our town but to the area because because Le mentioned it because the air quality coming down the water line exactly so it's something that that we should you know probe and it's worth discussing yeah it just it just made me to pause a minute to say okay right anyway I'm I guess a wife sitting home listening to these conversations for seven years and four years saying let's move forward here and things and you are doing some great work but there's the 8020 rule in life and it sounds like you have to stop stop stop gaps to fix what needs to be or added so and I do thank you for your thank you thank you very much appreciate [Music] it Hi how are you good how are you great thanks um who are you H Flanigan 223 thst um and I voluntarily um as put my big tree um on your specimen report I think it's fantastic um and I have the third largest Elm in Mammoth County um but I think those are really important things um to consider the Salem Oak Bonwood the cherries along Fair Haven Road these are all um super important to the the fabric of our town and I do believe I don't know if this is true but the reason why third street is called Third Street was there was because there was three big trees and two of which were in the middle of the road at some point I don't know some these old you know there Tre okay Lan well anyway I I love our Tre I think that that is a very special thing to protect for but you know Robin brought up the idea of the ms4 too and just the importance of people don't know what other added values treeses have right and in terms of that and I think we need to do look at the whole picture and I say this you know would love to collaborate more the tree and the environmental Commission because there's so much overlap um and these discussions are super important to have a better understanding of each tree is a different case and has its own story and plays its own role in wherever that is located and I think Leah I I totally would love to hear from your friend about air quality um you know that is something that um I know even an environmental commission we've talked about some of the these parameters right you look outside you see the fresh air and you think we have good air quality but it's the stuff that you can't see or smell um and and you wonder how that's impacting our our asthma rats or you know whether it is cancer or not I don't know but other things these hidden dangers right and I think it's important for all of us to know that in addition there's a heat map and I was wondering if the Shad Tre commission has seen the heat map of Fair Haven um I did send it to you Christie but I do think that is super important when we're considering trees and tree removal too there are parts of our town that are red because of heat um obviously by acne downtown community center nollwood Sportsman's field obviously but we can do a better job and I think having all those ms4 air quality heat map every tree has its own you know that needs to be looked at separate individually um will just help us make better decisions too and I'm happy to share that heat map as well um as a resource yeah we we looked at this maybe like six or seven months ago we looked at the yeah and I think we all requireed to do the MS ms4 training for storm was that a year ago we all I think we all had I I know you we did too but I'm you know I think a lot of times residents perhaps don't know that you know it's it's education and speaking on behalf of the Green Team and and the environment commission we'd love to partner and just um I know we do a lot of work with the schools too but just to kind of bring that big picture and understanding of what a tree and especially a native tree um does to our ecosystem environment and everything else that we love about fa thank you thank you thanks for coming no your SP I Mar and I just think this is Suzanne Bonnie J your memory now tell my memory me what a cool idea you volunteer your tree into the specimen tree program what a cool town if people said started endorsing trees and Josh came out and said here's the two trees on Buttonwood I want these on that list I got three three right there we're up to four in the back row got like what a great idea the other one is fil that website Bonnie and I did that as like a goof for I forgot wasn't a goof well it was recommended it was we were taking like it yeah so if you would like to help me improve that I'm why I'm just saying that shrubs need to come up treats that's my but you might have some insight on shade treats change on right under the append I have a note to talk to you about that you own that you change that whatever you want that's not well I mean we can make a choice here we could be here to 11:00 be hasing this thing or we can use next meeting in its entirety to Wily iron out so okay just this is going there's nothing we can do at this point it's going we'll steam ahead to the council it's going to get approved but I just think it's if that is a the Minimus change just to make sure that the language it says approved one place recommended another place um if you just add shade tree and Evergreen when the meeting's over show it me I I don't have any Cur I have a two rums we have two Rend I think they're 30 ft they're amazing take care of them really really they're really big but you sit under the shade all right any more public participants comments anyone out there no one's out there right went through no all right get a motion to adour this meeting please please all right everybody thank you all foring than you thanks everyone