no you want turn micr hello hello hello do you need me to keep going and then also check um John's mic well he can use that one but let's make sure it's fixed though hey Warren how are you pass t one tting tting e testing testing one two test test test e e way [Music] hello hello hello was it e e e e e un muted e okay e okay hello everybody I forgot to pull the gavel by me hi everybody uh if everybody could please stand for a moment of silence and salute to the flag I pledge aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all adequate notice of this meeting was provided to the Union County Hawke advertised on March 21st 2024 notification was sent to the Star Ledger and is posted on the municipal website the municipal public bulletin board and filed in the office of the municipal clerk informing the public of the time and place according to the provisions of the open public meeting Law chapter 231 pl1 1975 roll call please miss Cameron May a bloom stop here councilwoman Bodo here councilman Foley here councilman Lazaro here councilwoman ndi here councilwoman salmon here council president Carney here uh roll call of staff and professionals please John Authur borrow administrator here Sandy Brun CFO here Warren Ki auditor pres okay well thank you everybody for coming this is our annual special budget presentation uh where our finance committee will um go over some of the items in the budget and then Council might have some questions and then of course there's time for public comment questions and comments from the public uh our finance committee chair is councilman Shan Foley uh fellow committee members are councilman Mark Lazaro and councilwoman Kim samon so I want to thank you in advance for all of your hard work I know very much how long the budget process is and how hard uh you work and how much goes into it so I want to thank you I also want to thank our CFO uh Miss Sandy Bruns and Mr Ki I want to thank you as well uh you after looking over the the budget um that we have uh you know I feel pretty pretty good about where we're going here in Garwood so um but I want to turn it over at this point to uh Finance chair councilman Sean Foley thank you mayor uh Council uh public um thank you very much for attending tonight and I want to start by expressing that enclosed in your packet tonight is the detailed budget prepared for our special meeting today on Tuesday April the 9th the attached worksheets bring down each item reflecting the comprehensive effort by the committee the buau administrator CFO Sandy and our auditor I look forward to productive discussions today with the full Council this budget cycle presented some challenges with some significant non-discretionary increases in our in our expenditures some of those key areas of increase include rvsa bill with $123,000 increase which was a 16% increase from last year an increase with active and retire healthc care cost which was a $68,000 increase which was a 6.5% increase from last year our debt service was $116,000 and 800 $116,000 850 which was a 25% increase from last year additionally a general inflation rate further pressured our budget however we provi we prioritize Investments crucial for the safety and Welfare of our Town's residents including additional software for the police department as well as an additional two police vehicles on top of this year's two scheduled police vehicle Replacements we have also budgeted for new online software to both increase efficiency in our administrative office and improve access to online permanent applications and fee payments the proposed tax increase stands at approximately $172 for the average home valued at 400,000 as we began the budget process at approximately $300 per home impact I am pleased with the heartwork of our committee and what they put into making sure this budget is as streamlined and efficient as possible while also maintaining critical burough services and our always high standard of safety for our residents thank you councilman I just want to let everybody know there is a uh budget sheet um here if anybody in the audience would like it um again these are drafts things can change as you might see tonight um up until our our introduction so um I will now now I think you have a a slide yes I have a presentation to uh show tonight thank you John we can go to the next slide okay so this year our finance committee demonstrated consistent dedication to the careful review and management of our Town's budget we convened numerous times often dedicated 3 to 4 hours in the evening to ensure that every dollar allocated serves the best interest of our community our commitment to fiscal responsibility and transparency has been Paramount these extended meetings allowed us to Deep dive in the complexities of the budget ensuring that our financial planning is both strategic and effective at this time I want to send a special thanks to our CFO Sandy who whose expertise and insights were invaluable throughout this process and who did an excellent job fing in the role of ba while the role was in a transitional phase additionally I would like to extend my gratitude to councilwoman salmon and councilman Lazaro for their contributions and steadfast commitment their collaborative efforts have been crucial in shaping a budget that reflects our community's needs and aspirations together we work diligently to ensure our Town's Financial Health and to support the continued prosperity of our community next slide you can go next slide uh ah technology yeah John on the live stream going out it's just showing the laptop screen so you want me to give you a hand real quick okay you might be better off leaving it out of the share mode and just yeah showing the whole slide deck yes that that screen is showing on the stream okay you can go next slide here can just hand them my phone oh it's not working on the screen yeah this is funny okay only a reboot they they can see it at home but we can't see it okay so um that stinks unfortunately we cannot see it on here but this next slide is comparing our budget to last year's um as of last year we had 36 if I could just ask for quiet just because I know I know there's a lot everybody's coming in but just so we can hear councilman Foley thanks I lost it sorry I lost it okay that that works all El set okay so I just uh this is uh this slide right here is comparing our budget to last year's in 2023 we had 36 employees um we are down to 33 employees uh we had a retirement in the administrator's office the court administrator is now a shared service with Fanwood and there has been turnover in the police department um ex so uh we will have this available on the website after tonight so so unfortunately technology is what it is we'll have it available on the website and we have we do have many meet we do have an introduction and an adoption for the budget so there will be plenty of time even if you come up with questions after tonight so councilman fully okay and in terms of appropriation we had a net increase of $638,000 and 665 uh over two two uh over 2023 our Revenue was [Music] 428,000 es which include pensions Social Security Medicare and loap and after that is public works here you would see a pie chart which which visualizes what our uh budget breakdown looks like and once again that's with uh Public Safety being at the top our statutory expenses being second and our Public's work dollars being third okay so hopefully everyone can see that so here is a picture of a T-bone stake which I'm going to use as an analogy of the initial budget process see this Tbone stake represents all discretionary and non-discretionary spending in the budget discretionary spending is choosing where we can spend non-discretionary spending is mandatory and non-negotiable these payments include rvsa cost utility bills pensions Bond insur payments and so forth I repeat non-discretionary spending is mandatory and non-negotiable now now now let's look at the stake or should I say budget after we take into account non-discretionary spending this is what we end up with our budget after the mandatory spending we only have this much meat on the bone to work with it is here that our decisions must be wise and efficient we have to ensure that we are investing in areas that will most benefit the welfare and safety of our town while being mindful of the taxpayers pockets our responsibility has and is to scrutinize every potential investment asking not only if it's necessary but also if it's the most effective use of our limited resources let me repeat our responsibility is to scrutinize every potential investment asking not only if it's necessary but also if it is the most effective use of our limited resources we must protect the TA taxpayer's wallet while continuing the trend of having Garwood run efficiently and safely we're tasked with making tough choices prioritizing projects that promise the greatest return in terms of community well-being and safety it is a delicate balance ensuring that our town continues to thrive without placing undue Financial strain on our residents in essence we must make the most of the little meat we have uring goes as far as possible for the benefit for all thank you thank you councilman okay so at this time our whole Council up here has both the summary as well as the extended full budget which as everybody can see is certainly full um at this point I would like to turn it over to the council and see if there are any questions for the finance committee um so it just so happens that our whole finance committee is on this side so any questions I have questions good evening everybody um as you know I'm new so please bear with me I'm not you know I fully trust the committee I trust the department heads but I do have a few questions oh but I do have a few questions um I'm going to start with what was you know first jump to me um under the assessment of taxes OE there was a a reduction of over $9,000 can you can you tell us the pager on oh oh I'm actually on on this I think that it looks like it was contracts and services that was reduced okay okay okay so so the contractual Services were reassessed and the number of appeals reduced and if our CFO can explain further uh that line is requested by our um tax appeal attorney it's used for to hire an appraiser and an environmental engineer um he advised that that was the amount that he would need this year to defend the various um appeals that have been made from the commercial and Industrial properties okay so contractual Services pretty much so there weren't as many appeals is that why we're looking at a reduction I think that some of them have been settled we did settle a good amount he said yeah okay all right thank you councilwoman anything else I do um on the planning board again it's um it's a very small increase how however um it's like four 4,150 it went from 16 16,700 to 12 I'm sorry I apologize it went from 12550 to 16700 is there reason it increased so uh real quick additional ordinances are are to be drafted through the planning board uh this upcoming year okay just a a note since I'm on planning board uh along with councilwoman samon and she can tell you that there's there's been discussion on a couple of different ordinances that um our planner is going to look to try and put together that he thinks should be codified uh by the council so of course needs to get paid for that so okay this question before I ask it I want to please note that I fully support the police department say is a priority um again fully support the police department uh but the increase is pretty high can you detail the increase um we went from 12665 to 27175 so for the police department we have invested in new software um we have also invested in uh new vehicles for the police department um uh councilman Kerney I know you were the police commissioner if you can um describe and give it more detail to the public please uh sure so I'd gone over uh most of this stuff with the chief when I uh came in as commissioner in January um some of the software that you're mentioning one is a computerated dispatch system so the system that the town was operating was uh Circa like 1990 or something so uh the chief had gone out and has established uh law soft as our uh as our provider so that was a pretty significant increase in and of itself because I believe the maintenance on the old program was like less than $1,000 dollar a year uh unfortunately with the age of it it wasn't compliant with uh any of the modern requirements that have come come down for Crime reporting so uh that's lawof there's a couple other pieces that just have annual increases uh there's power DMs uh that law enforcement all over New Jersey uses for policies and procedures uh there's probably at least one provider that they're using for online training because the police training commission has imposed some new requirements on all of us in law enforcement uh for continued training uh and I think there was some some stuff in there for body cameras and upgrades on those too if if memory serves um did I miss anything Chief Next Generation that's right next NextGen 911 um yeah he can probably well yeah let's P online training a couple other components that go along with the uh the accreditation process and the next gen 91 mon um rather than the fund big payment for the nextg we're able to get it straight over five years so computer Chief included in this and maybe it's included in in what you're talking about I don't know the names of the software but we had discussed um software um where if you call 911 um they can text you and then the next day they can also text you and see how the response was that's one of the components through the um let's Okay from Power DM power engage so it's all different but you're able to get really engag with the community through this platform that integrates with the law soft system so I just wanted to point it out because I found that that was something I think will be really helpful for our residents here and I was excited about including into the budget um and then the other one that I know we spoke about was one that has to do with just the the mental health of your officers it's it's some software with that is that the KML technology no that's the nextg oh that's next there's a lot of names it's the power line it's a uh overall officer Wellness app and platform that mental well-being health is it's it's fully in on the employees and I just if you don't mind I just wanted to add um you know uh one of the things that we discussed on the finance committee in regards to the police department um was that you know we asked the chief last year when we hired him that uh we were concerned about overtime costs and our chief was able to bring down overtime costs down by $65,000 so yes that that particular line item certainly in terms of the technology that we're adding is also kind of a part of a bigger picture of the fact that like we're looking at places where you know we've made some savings and so we can justify by putting more money towards these safety procedures and making sure you know 911 calls are actually you know tracked at the location where that person is seeing that most people use cell phones rather than landline phones so um we felt very strongly that these programs were warranted um not only from a safety standpoint but also from a financial standpoint um and I also want to add that in 2022 uh seven officers used all their sick times and in 2023 uh none of no one used all their sick times and I think that's in in honor of his his his leadership yeah I agree I know we uh we had a lot of talks when you first started and there was a lot of goals and you you've definitely hit all of them so I i' appreciate that I think it does help when we go through the budget like this that when we see a large increase in our operating budget we're able to um sort of Justified to the residents by letting them know where you found savings which is obviously of import to the taxpayers so um I appreciate all that you've done with that and I do want to add during the the um our meetings he would do his due diligence he would look for other sources uh to to save money for our town he would look for multiple um companies organizations anything to save money here and he was he was he did his due diligence and I'm very happy to to report that tonight thank glad thank you chief um anybody else have any more questions on the police lines um councilwoman Bodo anything else I do um thank you councilwoman samon for asking me for the pages now I can you know cor I can correlate them now I'm on page 30 and this is for the again totally support First Responders this is with the first state organization I know it is that um there was no allotment last year but there is a $99,000 amount this year can you please detail that so this year $9,000 was given to our es EMS department and uh recognition of their outstanding service improvements and dedication to the community also I believe no requests were made last year so this decision they did request there was a decision that okay my apologies this decision reflects not only our appreciation for their commitment which has notably evolved from previous years but also our expectation for the continuation of such Excellence um and we want to continue to support and encourage the ms's department V vital work um and ensure they have the resources needed to maintain if not exceed the high standard of service the community deserves um they have really shown uh I think the ability to really take care and and and execute and do a good job and and keep our residents safe um and I thought what they presented what they expressed uh the information they G gave uh shows that um and it was evident and I think they deserved um that that uh that that money yeah um so this was actually presented to the finance committee at first um I believe the initial request was 5,000 is there any other discussion up here for a change that we jumped right back into nine um so I just it wasn't actually it was actually 11,000 says five uh so I met with um the first aid president and they have somebody else who's helping them pro bono do their accounts um and that was part of the reason I think I met with them along with councilman Foley they came to came to me and asked to me um which I was pleasantly surprised and pleased by because that was the first time that they you know the first aid Squad had asked to to meet and really go over the finances of past years and looking towards the future they presented a good plan and good accounting for the future um and so yes I asked councilman Foley to bring that back to you because I um I think it was it was a very Lo it was very logical it was well done and it did show um that they do have a plan and that they do uh to be honest I had never seen their books um you know in terms of what their finan as were before this you know and it's going into eight years so I was very pleased to be able to see the breakdown of where the money was spent um and how they intended to use it in the future um so that really got me thinking about it but the original one when they came to to me and I would have to look for the document was 11,000 um I'm not sure where the 5,000 came from it got it got put in as 5,000 this change to 9,000 actually didn't come till the second to last Finance meeting the number I the number I was given was 5,000 initially were you given by was was it paperwork or it was verbal I believe verbal who was the verbal statement made like was it given from the first a squad when we asked for everybody's budget documents no it was I can look for the um actual budget sheet and the request if you'd like I'm just curious how we got here I I would just I would say maybe it was just a I'll let me just chime in so you know it was originally 5,000 on the p and that's originally what was originally agreed upon because that's what was on the request um and then when it was made clear that that request was not necessarily going to be you know that it their insurance costs were significantly higher the fact that their communication had increased the fact that their service was getting better they had made sure that they had made some changes in their Department that um were challenging uh the department from years past that is when they came back and advocated for more money and that's when we had the discussion to add additional money you know so I think it's also important to understand context too you know so it's always first of all I think probably the public doesn't understand that that the EMS is not a burrow operated entity it's its own separate entity and so in the past we had always given them $9,000 and then last year because we asked for information from them about how they were actually allocating their money and we didn't get any communication at all we felt that we really in could in in good conscious couldn't give them money also we had a much more difficult budget last year so that's how we came to decide to do zero and then once we provided that zero and they realized that they weren't just going to get that money uh endlessly uh that they made some changes and so that those changes made us decide that they were warranted to give that money back on top of the fact that if for example our EMS did fold we would have to Outsource EMS to the county or a neighboring town and that likely would cost A1 to $200,000 for us to do so again I always look at things like from the context of the situation as well as the financial circumstances the financial circumstances would be really really challenging for us to move from if they actually did fold and were not able to keep up because we couldn't help them out a little bit with their insurance cost you know I felt like this was worthwhile since they showed Improvement so I felt like it was a calculated decision to to provide the full funding so was the um feeling coming out of the committee to provide the full 9,000 or was that a split decision the feeling coming out of committee was to provide the full 9,000 it's the process of how we got to 9,000 that didn't really wasn't very clear so they requested 5,000 now this is the first time I'm hearing about this additional meeting okay so it was just clarifying then it was just 11,000 you said so I wasn't sure now it's we're back down to 9,000 they have improved unfortunately I use them on a frequent basis um so I do support giving the funding back it's the process of how we got to the 9,000 that's unclear so there was two meetings not one I had one meeting with them one meting I have discussed it several times with councilman Foley so I'm not sure I'm I'm not sure if it if you're okay if everybody is okay with that number if it matters how we got to it or I think it matters how we got to every number in here right but whether I think we just made it clear how we got to it right I'm just curious who requested it because that's I think it's been very clear that mayor said I told provide the she had information she talked to them and then she talked to usess with them took place before any initial finance committee meetings so they met us early before we even met so if they met us early why did we put down 5,000 I don't know where I honestly don't and I'm not sure if it's going to make a difference to keep going over if we're all in agreement on the actual amount that we would like to give does anybody have any other information or questions about that my only my only question is that that is the defined need right that is a an amount that was given to them uh every year that I've served on the council and every year that I can see going back on the historical so that that is what we had always provided yeah it doesn't look like an unreasonable number to me if it's being used to defay their their insurance or whatever other operating expenses they have because they're not a municipal Department they're getting no OE from us said it was unreason I was just asking you how we got there okay anybody else I do want to add that I did visit at the EMS uh I think it was on the rodeo day to kind of do my due diligence to ensure and find out more information uh they do a lot of great programs for the town uh one in particularly how to install a car seat a baby seat correctly which is really significant CPR classes trainings and so forth it is a really important uh part of our town and really enhances our safety a collective safety so and I was really proud of what I was seeing when I went there in terms of programs and education for our town okay thank you very much is there anything else about it Council women no thank you I understand so from my understanding not being here prior you brought this to what used to be correct okay thank you okay uh any other questions councilwoman Bodo we'll keep going with you until done thank you thank you thank you I appreciate the patience um I'm moving down to streets and Roads payroll on page 38 and the amount um adopted last year was 6 36500 and we're up to 679 th000 can you detail what that entails sure um all committee members decided to give deform of the DPW arrise and right now all of our full-time employees are on the highest step as of this year our full-time staff on DPW are on the class I Class A highest step so that that complete is is due to those two I two factors you're sent okay okay can we get a cost savings from 2022 to 2023 on that line the DPW salary line was there a decrease from the year prior not to this year but to 2023 well appropriated it in 2022 was 585 and then it was reduced in 23 to 475 yeah I'm just looking I'm sorry I don't think I couldn't hear you if you're asking for the difference between the two prior years in 22 it was okay I see it here so we were at 585 to 475 and now we're up to 495 so we did see a we at 500 now it was initially 495 but it's but you have the raise for the foran 500 okay right right okay that's not in here okay any other questions councilwoman uh yes I'm moving to page 49 Department of recreation Paro there's a substantial difference um of 39,000 increase from 535 to 925 I believe that's a timing issue correct so the rise in Recreation cost is because our Recreation director was hired in September of 2023 and her salary measures her employment for the whole 2024 Year yes um that 92 isn't just the recreation director though it should be noted there's also the summer wre um employees are all in there as well uh councilman Bodo this is for the recreation line uh we also move celebrations into the recreation uh other expenses line oh those salary well I think it's a com It's a combination of there was an increase in both there was an increase in both right I I I did notice that the the other mom was moved into so o in in Recreation is due to you moved the celebrations we combine those now that the Committees are combined and we have to pay for background checks for the the the individuals who are working with children so yes that's something new that we did for basketball and if I may add we also want to the money also goes to support staff who can provide the necessary assistance for the rack director for the rack program okay anything else Council I think the last line I noticed was the senior citizen Rec OE that's uh page 51 it's a small increase it's $3500 but I just didn't know what it was I believe this is for um the program being done at kns of Columbus um and re well that was that was in there last year okay so no I think it's it's just for additional it's for additional field trips or programming so basically it's I think when the when the new uh senior director is taking over which is katata or same Recreation director um she wanted to make sure that there was a variety of different programming and so there was also the programming also cost additional money yeah whether it be bus costs whether it be the actual location of where they're going yeah so obviously there's the just the regular increase in programs but I do know that because I had the the seniors come to me there were a couple of seniors that did meet with Kya to request a couple of extra things so it's the increases on the actual programming line yes the facilities rental line is flat yes yeah I I right the Knights of Columbus um we do offset that for them and um that's the it's the same this year so the plan was for them to go back to the firhouse after Vera 2 was complete what is the status update on that uh that is something I know that I believe you've talked about in finance so um and we have talked about several times up here the seniors have asked if they could stay at the kns of Columbus because of the parking situation and because it's more um accessible for those who are handicap with Walkers um who the bus can pull up right to the door um and there's just more room for them to maneuver some of them with the Walkers and so um yes it's a decision that the council has to make whether they want to fund that $4,000 to keep the seniors um where they're enjoying their facility I personally it's up to you guys but I personally obviously am for it I I'm there with them every two weeks they enjoy the facility the Knights of Columbus are very welcoming to us they even uh the person there even comes and you know he brings them their water and helps serve them and um helps them in the kitchen and helps clean up and so it's not just the the rental he does he does help out a lot there which is he doesn't have to so um it helps just make the experience a little bit nicer but so for me it it it's something that I I do prioritize obviously I I've said that before because we have talked about this many times so I just know when we began the agreement we told the public it was going to be temporary um I'm not completely against it but I'm also watching us cut ice cream from summer rec Camp so if we're cutting from some things we should cut from other things well I don't know if you can say we're cutting ice cream the recreation programs has gone up I don't know the schedule of what CA has done I do know that you know we donated ice cream last year and people other people did donate ice cream I don't to I don't know if it's something that you can really say well we're cutting that we used to have it every Friday for the kids along with a lot of other than the seniors or should just as important I just said I didn't want to cut the seniors but the kids be just as the the recreation operating budget hasn't been cut but we saw a decrease in programming at summer Recreation last year from the year prior but that doesn't mean it's happening this year I don't know what the programming is for summer but if the if you would like to have ice cream for them then we can talk I'm sure you can talk with kti about getting ice cream I mean it's I I don't also I just want to add just something for context that I think is important you know so I understand that you know when we say things up here that we're basing it on the information that we have in front of us when we're here at that time and sometimes there are circumstances that change and to me that would be not really wise for us to not make different decisions when circumstances change so in the cases of the seniors we evaluated that the actual safety of that particular location where they were us using that was just not really appropriate and essentially this was a much better option obviously it costs money to do that and the question is is it worth it or not and we have to evaluate that so you know I think like I it doesn't matter obviously there's lots of things that we should fund or not and we can consider not funding but I think the important thing here is that it is okay to change our mind because it's the it's important for us to look at the contextual information in front of us and then make different decisions when the new information is in front of us I appreciate you saying that because I do think that that often happens up here um you can't get locked in years and years later if situations do change um as we've seen covid hit our budget very hard um and inflation hid and then so there's always things that affect and create a different context and so things are always going to change um you know not in just particular to this but I agree I mean you said that Mark you said that we moved them because they felt more comfortable and they're more safe is fire department not safe for them to have their meeting the the ability for them to walk the handicap parking situation there's not enough space for all of them they feel more comfortable with the parking lot there as is there's no steps leading up I just don't understand the variable change you know we knew the plans at verela we knew what it was going to look like when we made the statements so I I just don't get the change but speaking of how things change I also don't understand the change why our Recreation director is not running our summer Recreation program when we said that she was going to be doing that so that's also in the budget yeah additional employ woman n answered that at the last yeah that that was that was never part of the plan that was absolutely 100% part of the plan not ever part of the plan the part of the plan was that we were increasing uh adult supervision um and oversight and reining in some extraneous uh you know uh charges that were being uh made on the entire Recreation uh budget so it was really just a course correction in terms of the budget and as far as the position of the rec director that was um always the case that we we were planning on on using her for uh planning and preparation and assisting but not to be the person on the field with the with the whistle around her neck um you know that's just not her job she has a lot of other jobs that she needs to to do okay I do appreciate that but I urge you to watch last year's Finance meeting for the budget because that's not what we said and so your your um opinion is that we should not we should remove her from being over there who's her and who our rec director should not be uh helping out over at the at the summer rec no I think she we should have seen a cost savings there because we employed a full-time Recreation director said we saw no cost take away some of the other the other two adults then is what you would like to do that's what we told the public we were going to do okay I I'll be honest as a parent I'm looking for as many adults as possible there I'm sure the taxpayer doesn't feel that way uh you know what I think since the town funds half of it and half of it is from the the user itself I would imagine that look I would imagine that if we were to ask some parents they would prefer more adults there let's just be be honestly it's not that it's a you're talking about like a couple thousand dollars I think it's important to also again provide context because it's a lot of back and forth here okay so we're talking about basically this was a with conversation in finance right and so we're talking about essentially $4,000 is how much to have that Recreation director in their place but in addition what we are taking away from the recreation director is the hiring and planning and coordinating that was done prior to the actual implementation of the summer camp program that's where the cost savings is there but this person is also our senior director public relations person they're doing multiple jobs so the idea that this person is going to be on the field 100% of the time doesn't really make a whole lot of sense they have other responsibilities that they resp responsible to doing so I think again it's important to provide context and context determines how eventually you move forward so now that we have a full picture of everything sometimes we have to Pivot based on the information that we have and so also what was said in that Finance meeting was that basically this person would be in charge the direct Recreation director would be in charge she is in charge she hired all the employees she coordinated all the actual programs so it is still a savings because that person who used to be the recreation director is not being paid on an hourly basis for the hiring and supervision and the coordination so again it's important to make sure we have contexts for every conversation we have right I do realize it is $4,000 that's why during the finance meetings I tended to Let It Go but I do feel like it was disingenuous it was not transparent even though it was a pivot we should still have not sold the position to to the public that it was going to Encompass that task when it in fact was not the first year in we're not including that task I I don't think we sold a position to the public I think we explained what the position was and I think again we keep talking about this we have to sometimes pivot and re-evaluate and I am okay with where this stands right now I don't feel keep talking about it this is the first time we've ever talked about it this is a new topic so no that you you asked about this last time at the last meeting it was discussed Council woman VOD sorry just I just need to I need to make a comment because something regarding the seniors and the firehouse is just kind of bothering me um you know one of the one of the metrics that was discussed in community engagement you know uh it wasn't just the senior's preference it's that um whatever discussion was had by the council however many years ago that this had to get moved because of the construction um in 2024 we have a parking issue over there with being able to provide sufficient parking for our police staff our borrow Hall staff and for the firefighters because they have to come to the building get stuff and go out to respond to calls so to me like a a perfect storm scenario is to have a senior club meeting in there there's no parking available and now you've got 15 firefighters storming in the building trying to get out to go to a call so I don't know that the the fire department would ever be an appropriate place to host it going forward because of that situation there's just a limited parking situation and when the firehouse was used previously you had a giant open lot there where cassal used to Bay so I'm my concept of this was that eventually we would get the new public public space on North Avenue that would have sufficient parking proper Ada access everything else that it needs to and you know at that point it wasn't an expense I figured we'd be doing for the next hundred years but for right now it seems to work it's again we're and we get into this a lot every year in these in these meetings it's 2,000 here it's 3,000 there it's 4,000 here like I get it but also it's just a simple investment in a program that brings joy and is a big part of getting seniors out and about when they need to be so kind of tying it all together with the same thing as somebody who sends kids to that wreck program yeah I want the camp director there um I I know we're not supposed to use names but I'm comfortable with her she's someone I know from the school um I I don't expect I didn't expect when I voted to approve that position and the salary for it that that was the person were paying a a full-time salary was going to spend 15 to 20 hours a week running a summer camp that wasn't my thought but maybe I heard something different councilwoman do you have anything thank you I just have one last um question is on page 59 and it has to do with the tax appeals spending I believe that I know what um the increase was I know we met with the tax attorney um there's a matter that that we discussed and he felt that there may be a lot going on this year so is that based on that recommendation is that what the increase yes and I just want to confirm that uh this is a part of a uh confidential matter we discussed with that tax attorney because of the recommen and because of the recommendation he made to Mayor and Council thank you um thank you yeah thank you so much sorry it took so long thank you open it up to anybody else I do have a have a couple of questions um so I see that um and as as as a a community engagement um chairperson I I'm I'm a familiar with the historical society and I I fully support they're getting uh $300 um and I I you know absolutely don't have a problem with that I just want to suggest or plead or you know just make a request that there are are are some other organizations that are doing really good work for the town uh gpac Garwood partnership for arts and culture we do not have a budget um green team is only getting $50 they also do excellent uh work and I know that a lot of uh I know certainly my committee members on gpac are actually spending their own money to um to support our projects and activities and it would be very nice if the burrow would um make a gesture towards us in some way um you know to help us um also small business also does excellent work they're not getting um anything so not to take away from historical but um there are some other organizations that we should have in our sites uh to support I I I kind of agree I think Green Team wasn't on here obviously I think they've gotten something um they they're on there for $50 in the big budget right yeah $50 yeah they're not on the summary is that page that's page three right mayor and Council uh we're talking about no um I think green team has the green team does have their own line oh it's part you put it as part of the mayor and Council okay so but there's $50 in I see I see a line Sandy it's uh 275 on the end yeah I think she she she talking this that's why okay um yeah want to have a discussion I mean Mar at some point I was intending on asking for you know just a small amount of funding for the uh for the Small Business Association um the volunteer board members have gone out of pocket to uh to do uh posters and flyers for things like Taste of Garwood uh we've gotten everything donated by uh mostly Crossroads banners and such um it's kind of the same thing like volunteers going out of pocket I think the same thing's happening with gpac um and that that is why we provide these kind of minimal budgets under under operating expenses for the volunteer committee so I we don't it wasn't something that occurred to me until the last conversation I had about tasta Garwood with ktia about how basically she asked me who's paying for these flyers and it's probably going to be me or a board member and then dawned on me that I should have asked for a line for this last year but um I do see there's a minor reduction in Mar and Council o and on the on the top level other expenses line yeah there's a $400 reduction um so I mean there's there is a little bit of a a cut there and um I feel like we gave historical more in the past how much did um historical use last year I believe I believe there um their $300 went back into Surplus okay we we could I mean I have a suggestion I mean we could I mean I I wouldn't be opposed to making perhaps 150 sorry I think you're saying we used they spent 150 okay um maybe we make a even rounding for our volunteer groups and that way we don't really significantly increase the cost to tax payers but maybe we do $100 for each of those organizations so that way that those organizations have at least some seed money to help with the posters Andor uh other activities but it it's not a huge uh burden on the taxpayer you know give $100 to the small business $100 to Green Team $100 to historical $100 to gpack just to make it even and fair just a suggestion I'm not you know sold on that but it's just an idea what if we did 150 across the board because that 150 Time 4 is 600 and there's a $400 difference and then if you're saying 150 or you're saying to equalize all the groups then historical comes down from 300 to 150 and that is what they spent last year so it's it's basically a break even on that on that line I'm assuming that you hit the other expenses line just trying to shave that extra point I just want to um Miss Bruns you had something to say I just want to add that historical and green team both have um dedication by Riders where they have a balance in trust that they can use in addition to what you give them in the regular budget so the green team has almost 3,900 available to them um celebrations as well has 3,000 and historical has 1,00 and they also applied for a grant I believe that they're getting this year so they those organizations do have additional funding so what I'm fundamentally struggling with is gpac was created by a sitting councilwoman Green Team created by the mayor small business be created by Council McCarney we should never create something while we're up here and then look to the taxpayer to fund it it is our choice that we want to create a volunteer organization and it should be run through the trust account I think that that's at some point every committee is created by the council the historical was created I believe they got backed by mayor tadisco she create the historical committee it was created it went out and then she recreated it I believe but I mean I I mean these are volunteer organizations that are are very specific I I just don't think we should be looking to the taxpayer for funding when they they they should be self funded so you're saying to have the volunteers fund themselves if the volunteers want to start something like when we started softball do you know how much money we spent on softball is softball uh burrow organization softball is not connected to the municipality but it's within our burrow same thing as Green Team no different no the team is a municipality organization because you recognize it everybody barely organizes baseball no it's just it's that's it has to be a part of that's a private organization these are burrow committees these are B committees that you created I nobody creates anything you want volunteers and do want volunteers but I don't want our taxpayers to fund what we created are you really concerned about do you think the $100 is going to make break of it no okay well I mean like it's the princip of it I understand the principal stand and I by the way I am not I am no longer and that was the whole um actual plan I am no longer the uh president of the Green Team I act as a liaison but that was the whole plan was to create it and then move away and allow the volunteers to make it themselves when did you create the Green Team 2007 18 so they're doing just fine why why I'm just saying like change we create it and they and I think the intent is for councilwoman ndi to create it and then the volunte take it and make it themselves councilwoman ndi might not be up here in 10 years so it's it's one of that's how these committees we we start initiatives to better the town so that's the whole that it just because it comes from somebody up here I don't know that reasoning but these are you create volunteer organizations if you wanted to create a taxpayer funded organization then you should lead with that not that it's volunteer because now it's taxpayer funded as well as volunteer though as well so I if we're it's a committee from the town so at some point it was created by the town so it's to me it's the same as us bringing our stiens back you become in a position of power and then you give yourself something in return I I think that's a real stretch but that's fine that's how I look at it that's fine at some point the historical committee has was started by the council and they've been getting um some donation for years and years that you've approved so so I I do need to clarify so this is not something for myself so all of the things that we've done with gpac have been um for artists by artists of the community um so that we can all share in something uh you know in in in and around our town so that's not for me has nothing to do with me it has everything to do with Garwood residents and that the fact that we have creative people people here and um if we need to spend some money to buy Command hooks to put up art I think that um I shouldn't be asking my volunteers to spend their own money I'm buying Command hooks to put up art around town if I want to you know have an organization like this it's it's it's not for me it's for the town it's for the people who who live here and I'm just going to follow on with that the the small business now Association was was started as an Advisory Board it was a group of the business owners that approached then may to disco asking for some form of a local organization not because they were displeased with like the Chamber of Commerce or other options that are out there but there was nothing that was focused solely on Garwood so the mayor assigned this to me in my first year on Council and it kind of took off on its own and most of the stuff that you see happening has come from those volunteer board members saying this is what we want to do so you know part of our job as Council people up here is is to support things like that that better the town and put the town in a better light so to say that it's for the council member that's you know the liaison or the sponsor of it I mean yeah I'm it actually renders me speechless at the stretch look look insuring health of our town is ensuring connections ensuring uh that we are coming together as Community uh whether that's learning about the history of our town whether that's going to businesses and watching artists from our town uh show their their work whether that's uh en enhancing or or or raising awareness of our small businesses in this town the price what we get out of that far exceeds the $100 that we're giving because a town needs to have those social connections and it promotes the health and the connected tissue of Garwood I tend to lean towards being okay with the small business organization I'm struggling with funding more for the Green Team and gpac and mayor I do appreciate what you said about the volunteers but we also took away the celebrations committee and encompassed that into our Recreation director it wasn't taken away it was encompassed into the recreation committee we no longer have that volunteer base just like we no longer have a Recreation Commission so we have eliminated those groups anybody who wanted to continue with doing the celebrations and the holidays did and moved over into the recreation and again I'm sorry to interrupt mayor to May mayor mayor B okay after your after you're done I think we should make a decision on what we're doing I have to say that to say that celebrations is dead is is really disingenuous because the the the people that volunteer on the recreation committee they do all of the activities and events that are happening around town there it's a vibrant group and as far as I can tell the celebrations is is as good or better than ever so please don't say that it's dead that really is is is not not fair not fair to the volunteers on that committee okay thank you um I would like to then make see if you want to make some decisions as to what you're going what you would like to do with this I mean I think essentially what I'm just asking is can we there aren't lines for gpac or gsba um so we can't incre there's no line to increase but going to Mayor and Council May and Council uh other it's sort of a catchall that they can take it out of guess and then I mean we can certainly I'll speak to the to the finance chair offline and the CFO and I know I don't know what the procedure is for creating a budget line but that would probably make it easier for future years no no problem Miss Bruns I'm not making okay I you you did enough work this mod I don't want to make it worse um even if we just take even if we just do a coup it's gonna okay hopefully this is a quick change I would imagine I hopefully this isn't the only change because then I'm going to feel bad for Miss Bruns um but I I think what what I'm saying is there there's $300 on the historical line there's $50 on the green team line balance it out to whatever number 100 and put I guess 200 back to Mayor and Council o and E and then you know we'll councilman ndi and I are on the same committee for Community engagement anyway we'll work out what we're doing for the year I mean I'm fine with the idea of the $200 um moving to that so that essentially $100 can go to gpac $100 can go to the small business and I think with the knowledge that the green team does have $3,900 in their Rider I you know to me that doesn't seem that we need to add additional funding unless someone really strongly disagrees but um I try to be compromising with these things and so I I feel like that's fair that's my take on things anybody else agree disagree so we can give the instruction to miss Bruns councilman Foley I agree okay agree okay so so we're taking 200 out of historical and putting it into the May and Council um o and I'm not sure if you can make sublines this year or you have to wait till next year then um the Garwood arts and culture Garwood partnership for arts and culture 100 and Small Business Association correct correct okay all right councilwoman ndi anything else I just really had one more question okay um and really it's not really a question it's a it's a it's a comment and a and a wondering okay um so I see we're giving uh 50,000 to the board of education for use in local schools um how did we arrive at this amount and can you tell me more about that okay so that's correct we are allotting $50,000 to the Board of Education at this time however I would uh like to hear from councilman Kerney as he can share more info about this and just for clarification this is from the pilot agreement from vermel 1 and verela 2 yes or what we have both of those pilot agreement so uh yes thank you uh Finance chair um I propos the $50,000 transfer to the school district for 2024 uh after multiple meetings and discussions uh with the board since since I resumed the council liaison role in January uh to me this is just a show of good faith that our council is willing to work as partners in all areas of shared interest with the board moving forward um from my review of the 2024 budget I felt that 50,000 was the highest responsible number that the council could consider responsibly for this year uh that translates to and I'm sure miss Bruns will correct me if I say it wrong it's uh roughly $30 per home on the median am I close okay so you know following from that every 50,000 equals $30 of a tax raise so this this is adding a little bit of an expense on our operating side but I did feel it was important to show this this good faith uh and also just uh in in moving forward um I've had this in mind for a couple years now and I've proposed this with mayor blumenstock support uh that um will reconvene with the Board of Education uh in the last quarter of this year and our intent is going to be to work out a multi-year uh pilot transfer agreement that way both governing bodies are able to effectively budget for this in future years it doesn't have to become a a conversation point or in some cases unfortunately a controversy there's an easier way to do this and uh the lines of communication have been open this year um the mayor supported me on this immensely and I appreciate it um it doesn't mean that it it's $50,000 is forever I I kind of view that as the floor not the ceiling um and there's going to be further discussion down the road with additional development um but at some point we just have to sit down and actually have a negotiation on this because we are unable to bind a future Council to anything uh without a resolution from both governing bodies so uh I think the time to do that will be more towards the end of the year when both uh the burrow and the district have kind of spent down their budgets and we see where everything is at it'll be easier at least from our end to look at that going into a multi-year agreement what we would want to commit to so that's where I'm at with that that's kind of where the 50,000 number came from and it is matching what we funded last year okay anybody have any other comments questions about that so I was happy to see the 50,000 get added back into the school district when we first started our finance meetings there was no money allocated for the school it didn't get added until extremely late on in the budget process so I am happy to see us you know sending some money over to help fund the children yeah is your mic on did you want to say something yeah sorry I'll I'll just comment so yeah I mean I think that this is a good faith effort in hoping to renew the relationship with the bard of Ed and um you know I know that um we're hopeful also that this this good faith gesture is going to lead to working together on a variety of topics that I know that Council Kerney has talked to me about and talked to the board of ed about so I'm hoping that this is uh a step forward towards those Mutual goals of from a financial perspective and also from the perspective of the services that are provided to our town and and yeah I'll just add like this work was going on concurrently so well finance committee was doing finance committee stuff this was something that I was working on with the mayor support we've had multiple meetings and conversations with uh board members and uh you know honestly I really enjoyed the opportunity I got I was able to get to know some of the board members that I didn't really know well before and I got to know superintendent Kenny so these lines of communication are open and uh I'm hoping good things come from it um councilwoman ndi that was it on for you yeah that's all for me all right any other questions for our non-finance committee members councilwoman Botto stole most of my questions that always happens she you asked before I got a chance did a lot of resarch I read a lot of paper it's okay I I talked enough right now okay all right um councilman Foley was there anything else you needed to discuss or not this time I'm good thank you thank you everyone so there's something before we move to to some public comment um where we get I'm sure some good discussion going um I wanted to discuss something uh because I I have a feeling there's a few people here who are probably want to ask about it um and and in terms of the budgeting and that's DPW Staffing um so I wanted to give sort of a full story um and provide sort of a timeline and context um as you know online posts don't really give the full picture they don't really allow for that so um we employ six full-time uh employees down at the DPW and one permanent part-time as well as three seasonal employees um and of course we have a part-time superintendent so some weeks ago we did have a worker that needed to leave on workers comp due to an injury and then two weeks ago another worker had to leave on workers comp due to injury um so first and foremost I want to state that these were accidental injuries and not related to any sort of unsafe environment the burrow is providing or any sort of underst Staffing um obviously HIPPA laws come into play here so we cannot go further into it but I do take it very seriously um when those sort of allegations come into play even if it's just in online chatter so again that scenario couldn't be farther from the truth um but I do want to point out we still don't have any sort of timeline on when these workers will be returning any sort of concrete timeline at this point um immediately after the borrow learned that the department would now be working with four uh full-time workers we called a meeting with the DPW commissioner uh councilwoman Bodo I would say I called a meeting with the DPW commissioner councilwoman Bodo and then acting uh burrow administrator Sandy Bruns um as well as the superintendent uh and Foreman to discuss the different options that we could do at that moment we did decide that the burrow would immediately begin to the search to hire three more seasonals to fill in the temporary Gap um so notice has gone out the hiring process is starting uh and then the finance committee has also meant to discuss this um and um I know that the majority of opinions at least agreed to this path the issue of hiring full-time workers was of course to discussed um in the meeting that I was a part of and I have spoken to councilman Foley and I know it was spoken of in finance um it was decided not to move immediately to that due to several factors and one of which is of course the lack of actual concrete information on when the workers will return um we just don't have that information yet and then another reason um that hiring a full-time worker like right at this moment might not be the best for burrow um you know and our administrators agree as well as I believe several of our Council people and that this is because we are going into a negotiation with the teamsters contract this year and negotiations are likely to begin in just um a few months actually so obviously the burrow will want to negotiate to improve some things on behalf of you the taxpayer uh and I know the DPW will want to negotiate some things on their behalf as well so to hire full-time at this time could possibly cost the taxpayer hundreds of thousands of dollars spread over the next years um as anyone hired right now would be grandfathered into the current contract so when the burrow goes into these negotiations obviously we have a responsibility as a bur to make sure the employees are rightly compensated and protected uh but we also have another responsibility to the tax to the taxpayer to make sure they're protected as well uh so it it's a dual job and it's it's it's a tough one um but it's one that should be taken very seriously because it has impact for many years Beyond just the one we're in uh so now we could possibly do some things a sidebar with the Union to see if we can negotiate some things quicker it's something I have spoken to the labor attorney about just recently but that's something the labor attorney will have to look into with their representatives I would be open to it but that you know it remains to be seen with that so I understand that there is a lot of emotion tied to the DPW they are great people who work hard for Carwood and I was DPW commissioner for six years and I think my record shows just how fully I support them um which is why during that initial meeting with the superintendent and Foreman um it was clearly laid out to them that until we can hire more men uh the burrow is directing them to prioritize garbage pickup um and delay any nonimmediate or non-emergency items as much as they need to they have been directed to spread out the workload and reschedule whatever they need to um DPW employees work a set amount of hours each day and by and large the work overall M Remains the Same season to season um so until we hire more workers we as a council know that some things may need to be put off for a time um they can also spread out the timing of the hours of the seasonals uh the hours that they work during the day split them up to to manage the day differently so by doing this we know the department will have to adapt as any department does when something happens that's out of anyone's control right um and I I appreciate them adapting and I know everybody up here does too uh and I'm sure everyone here up here and out there has been in similar situations uh and I know our CFO can certainly relate uh she had to take over the role of bur administrator on top of her normal job for the past couple months and at budget season um so yes there is adapting uh for a temporary time but it is no way unsafe or overburdening when it's managed and scheduled correctly so this is really a long winded uh way of trying to explain why the decision to hire full-time is being put off at the moment in the budget what whatever else you may hear or whatever other Theory someone may post about it's just not the case this was the information that was provided to the DPW um by myself by councilwoman Bodo um and I believe by the finance committee so I understand the inclination I do um when you hear that the department is is short staffed to just jump immediately to the solution of just going out and replacing them and adding to the number of employees um because we do value them uh but I know that we always have to step back and take a look at the bigger picture uh which doesn't mean that we don't fully support the department and it doesn't mean that hiring next year might not be the right course of action it just means that the council members have to remember that their job is to you know not act off a motion immediately take in the information weigh the pros and cons and then come to a decision that they think is the responsible one for the residents that they serve um and I know that there may still be some people out here who don't agree and that is completely fine the discussion about this uh will continue as we move through the next few months and we get more concrete info and we move through negotiations and we see where we are um but again I just wanted to give the facts that and of course if our finance chair or Public Works chair wants to speak any further they may I think I was probably very long-winded I don't know if they want to but go ahead I think it's a work in progress I think we want to at this time it's a crisis situation working to adapt uh uh creating uh new new protocols or measures to ensure the safety um for the DPW and this is something I think we want to continue talking longterm uh to ensure that they have the Manpower and the support in which they need okay um anything or yeah I just like to say that um like you mentioned we met I believe within 48 Hours of of um The Accidental series and I'd like to point out that it was actually uh the suggestion of the superintendent at the foreman that would go with seasonal that even also have CDL um CDL LIC looking for seasonals that seasonal F CDL so it would yeah so they would help um at no time the they mentioned that you know they were before this like back in January it was never mentioned that they wanted to hire full times um it was mentioned that they will work with the seasonals um they agreed that at this time and again I will pull my new card again um you know they've been they've been very good at sharing information and they said they agreed that hiring someone full-time or even part-time right now so close to negotiations would be foolish for us and they agree that they will work with the seasonals um you know to cover vacations um I know that during vacation time there's also people out so they're you know they're used to um working with less people it's not the first time that two or three people are out so again it's a matter of just accommodating and prioritizing I also want to add throughout the the budget process the uh hiring two full-time employees was never brought up uh in our meetings until this these injuries did occur okay so I would like to chim in um I am proudly the only person up here that does not support this stance at all but you open up and you say that our six full-time crew our crew full is 8 and a half it was 8 and a half for a really long time it became a six-man crew in 20122 because two people resigned and we chose to not replace them because we were looking into privatizing garbage I'm very shocked to hear us say on the record that the seasonal employees was suggested by our foreman and our superintendent when I sat in a meeting with them yesterday and they said the opposite so where where does that come from I'm just curious look there there are budget documents that say that they are one of the goals is to work with the seasonals I don't I see I don't want this to become a back and forth about G talk about it though that's okay please I don't want this to become a back and forth about our employees this is about because I I don't think that's fair to them but I do we should talk about how this affects the budget overall now we were at eight employee at eight and a half yes and now we're at six and a half plus three seasonals so when they resigned those two resigned it was decided not to replace them and then add seasonals at that time I'm sure you remember what our budget was looking like and so you sit up here and and and you do always call for for cutting more things which is great you know you're look out for the taxpayer and you you know you you want to make sure we we don't spend that $4,000 well again at that time we were looking to keep the budget which was not looking very good as low as possible to help keep that impact on our to our residents as low as possible so that decision was made that decision was also backed up by our burrow administrator Kyle Harris who was a DPW superintendent for many years he had a lot of experience in this that we valued I think everybody here talked about how much we valued him when he left and how his knowledge and experience helped and at that time he made that recommendation as well so there again we have to look at the context of this to just say we're full at eight we're not full at six no we were full at eight a lot of things happened a lot of things happened financially in our in our so we added a recreation director yes so I don't understand and again I will say it's you're you and we tend to have this conversation a lot it's apples to oranges but the recreation director does end up saving us a lot of money overtime I think you know when we had Camp when we had a part-time director there was money being lost in various ways and this is now starting to save us money as she's able to make these programs more so you said there were several factors can you list them all I you listed you listed two you said that we are unsure of the return to work date with workers compy important that's pretty important but the way worker's comp works from my understanding is that they give an update and they say the next update will be in a month and we do have that information but we don't know when we have and I bit of information I want you to be careful with and everything um um it we do not know when those employees are going to beet returned it could be six weeks it could be three months it could be six months the idea to just jump and immediately go Oh my gosh we need to replace them we have to remember that that is then adding to our budget for the next however many we should have added them back to our budget in 202 disc that's a separate discussion okay that's fine so moving on the next thing was the contract negotiation yeah is that your only other reason that is my reason right I I also told you that it was a recommendation by our bur administrator at the time we Kyle doesn't work here anymore we also had actually a recommendation from Clint at the beginning of the year of a letter that was sent to Kyle about his 2024 recommendations and in that letter it says seasonal employees to to I I can show you the document that I got an email it says seasonal employees there that's what he recommends he does not recommend saying that we should replace seasonal employees with full-time employees so I just want to make sure that that it was never clear so I also and just one other thing one thing I want to mention hold on one other thing I want to mention so you talk about process you were criticizing the process of the you know the EMS situation how that came in I mean the process also sounds like the there was a recommendation that came out of the DPW committee and then suddenly it changed I mean I think it's clear the DPW had a recommendation from that committee which was to do go to seasonal instead of and that was the committee that was the DPW committee that was the committee that met and that's what they had to come out with that decision and then when they came to our finance meeting suddenly that changed and I know exactly why it changed it's because you because I'm there you convinced them oh I magic I am magic I mean let's talk about it councilwoman samon coun I don't know you absolutely are someone that has apparently gone to the DPW and have infiltrated whatever information you want okay that you think that they should get so I don't think you have really necessarily the Bros best financial interest in mind here because your focus is solely on the DPW without looking at the bigger picture focus is on the situation down there where they right now have four full-time employees and the situation has been attended to it's not being attended to if it is man how many applicants do we have for who is a manager who will manage the situ how many situation correctly Finance chair this is this has never been talked about this has never been talked matter the post why doesn't it matter it just went up when I thought you met with them within 48 hours so that would put us at Sunday the post went up when did you meet with them because the post was up on Friday 48 Hours on Sund for you to in like interrogate no I'm just trying to make this very clear for the public I have made it very clear I still want to go back to the contract so what exactly are we waiting for that you have what are you waiting for to renegotiate because you helped draft the contract as their commissioner in 2019 councilwoman salmon you and I have discussed various items of the contract that you would like to see changed that directly affects salaries so if we hire somebody right now that grandfathers them in they are at they are behold we are behold into this contract those changes that you have stated that even you want to make will not apply and that's not just for this year you have to remember that that means that this person then moves through these salaries and through these steps for the next however many years how many times have I complained about the debt service in the burrow how much debt we're in and all things like that serious question how many times you can't even count I'm sorry I'm not done point of order okay you can wait how many times have I complain about those things stop no just ask question to take the tone down please I want to make this a little bit calmer I am calm I'm completely calm just asking you a question it's turning into an interrogation it's not interrogation disc Jen I'm sorry if you can't handle a debate I'm stop it is not a debate you can tell me that you you disagree and you can give to understand what reasoning and that's you haven't you barely I asked you we're on to reason number two there were two reasons given okay so how many times have I talked about our past decisions and you've told me that I have to live with them that is right you know what I love how you tell everybody exactly what I've said that's not what I've ever said to can I change the debt can I change any of those things I will move on I don't understand why we're penalizing the DPW because you don't like the contract okay so I do not appreciate you putting out words that I have never said to you and trying to make my trying to defame my character really so Carney I want to say something well first of all I was trying to make a point of order I think you've spoken and the point of order is we're violating our own bylaws by having members speak over each other um one person talks at a time that's I'm asking for a ruling from the chair that's a point of order so I'm assuming you're good with that go ahead okay if I have the floor for a moment I just want to pose a hypothetical here because I'm listening to this this back and forth and um I just don't understand the Genesis of like there's a question I think that was uh your term councilman Sam and where did it come from in reference to the first aid Squad so examining where this question comes from is is an important part of the conversation but just I'm trying to apply that logic to another situation if we had injured police officers right now and we may for all I know have officers out on workers comp I don't I don't recall at this point but is the proper answer to that to hire more full-time police officers who uh you know whether it's a police officer or any other Public Employee there is a significant Fringe percentage that attaches to their salary for pension and benefits and the pfrs rate is obviously a little higher but it's still a consideration so the police department would not and you know knock on wood we have some here if we had that many officers out injured they would need to fill it with overtime and mandatory shifts and if it was seriously bad enough they would have to call for outside assistance hiring a new officer wouldn't solve the instant problem it would just put the taxpayers on the hook for another full-time salary and benefits I I I see a correlation there between these two things if seasonal employees for now get us through the the the Gap that of coverage that we have here and proper management of and prioritization of the resources we do have I mean that's what I would expect the police chief to do that's what I expect the DPW superintendent and for to do so the to to me the back and forth is just it's not even useful it's it's and the other thing that just really sticks out to me is I haven't sat on finance since 2022 but when I did in 2022 and we did incur those losses U of resignations that was a decision that the entire finance committee supported and I believe the council supported it I also believe you did not vote for that budget that year so I I don't even know where to go with this at this point but um what I just would like to close with is if we're going to make any sense here to the public who are not in the room with us we can't talk over each other thank you thank you anybody else I just want to say as Finance shair uh I would often express concern regarding why DPW was not was the only Department to not at the time meet with our finance committee every Department met with us and submitted a a list of budget or requests for items or Personnel needed throughout the process until these injuries nobody expressed a concern to hire two full-time staff not once not until these injuries the very last minute so there was no dialogue no longer conversations no due diligence done to really get that process and make a decision on that that would hire that staff when I did ask why we didn't get a budget request I was informed that the superintendent doesn't have the skill set to do that who who said that councilwoman Sam when did I say that you said when I asked why there is no budget request necessary you said the superintendent doesn't know how to do it and he can't do it that's not his skill set that's not what I said especially when I'm on finance and I had the document in my email but that's fine I I am curious Council MCC Carney I tend to agree with you actually so if R DPW is fully staffed at 8 and a Half Men and we're reduced by two which brings us to six we at are at a loss of 25% so would you be comfortable with our 17-man police crew taking a loss of 25% which is four men and not rehiring any full-time police officers would you be comfortable with our Police Department doing that are you trying to suggest there's a correlation between resignations and temporary leaves of absence I'm talking about the two full-time employees that resigned that we chose to not replace you compared it to the police department so like I said would you be comfortable if we lost four police police officers due to resignation and chose to not replace them you said that was Apples to Apples so I'm just correlating to you the number that they have with the number that the DPW has they are down 25% four officers is 25% of our Police Department would you be comfortable with that uh I believe the police department has had at points and times I didn't the math on four people out that would be 50% councilwoman I I'm just gonna let her go that's fine I just also want to say I I just think the argument is flawed and the reason in the argument is flawed I know you disagree is again I think it's important to remember we had a su our ba Kyle Harris who was a superintendent of Department the public of uh Department of Public Works at a previous town before he came to us that he is the person who made the recommendation for the amount of employees that we needed at that time and you know none of us on this Council are had the experience of being a superintendent of Department of Public Works none of us are foremans on the Department of Public Works this was a recommendation that Kyle Harris gave us so it's not a reduction it's basically he saw that this was an area that needed to be better managed and he came up with a solution that he felt was appropriate and for the last two years six and a half full-time employees and three seasonal has clearly worked and has been functioning and our town for the most part I think has been happy with the service so to suggest that we need to bring up back to 8 and a half is you know because of that circumstance I think is unfair and I think it's important that we in this case with Kyle Harris's recommendation at the time that's why we went that direction it's not that oh suddenly we decided to reduce it because we just wanted to reduce it he felt that this was the amount of employees that was needed to be able to fully run the operation of the DPW I understand that that's Kyle's recommendation but our current superintendent is not making that recommendation when I was chair of the DPW I went to Kyle uh our superintendent went to Kyle our foreman went to Kyle multiple times and said that they needed a full-time employee he said no that's why it never came across on any budget documents he was adamantly against adding back the full-time employees because the reality is we were keeping the door open to private tiing garbage and councilman Lazaro you know that I don't understand how we can sit here and say better management is less staff how how does that work I have watched so many Council meetings of bloomen stock advocating for8 and a half people if anything the job has increased I was in a meeting recently when they were down to four men I understand that you're saying in your speech that they can do things when they have time and if they don't get to something it's fine then how come after the two men were out on leave we had two resignations and they were down to four now they're maintaining the baseball field why did we add that to them I have told and that was a conversation where I said they did not need to do that so that that is what I'm saying this has been relayed to them but you still added it after the fact so why' you ever add it I was there I was that was there before it was not before listen it's been made very clear that they should they should be prioritizing the garbage as their number one goal and that everything else is going to be secondary until we are able to secure additional seasonal employees I think the other argument to just make sure it's clear is that I think it is financially crazy for us to without actual information about when these full-time employees are coming back to hire right away you know I already said to you in finance committee I said I may be open to a full-time employee that is not out of the realm of possibility but to do it right now makes no sense it makes no sense we are not given the information to go forward with full-time employees right now so I don't I understand you have an emot connection with the DPW and you feel very passionately about that and I do respect that but at the same time I'm making a decision that is prudent financially and what's best for the interest of the town if I may I stand by my comment that it was the superintendent and the foran who suggested that we hire seasonals and app full times I don't know why they told you I don't know when you met with them you said last night you met with them don't know why they came to the Finance meeting okay well they were there to okay but you're not by a public works you're not even in the committee you're very vested I don't know why you're so vested um you know you're so invested on the DPW um I I don't know why they would tell you that they didn't agree to that they agreed to that mayor was there Miss Burns was there they told us they will be okay with three seasonal and the option of CDL did they have an option for a full-time employee not at the time because why wouldn't they be okay wait Lenny said it would be foolish to her full times are we really by name Mr no asked he said okay Foreman excuse me councilwoman one at a time please he said it will be foolish to hire full times I highly doubt that um that's what he said and I will stand by it okay and again that's fine and Council I don't again we have to go with what was said at committee meetings so do we in the finance meeting and they said that they needed more than the seasonal that the seasonal was not working they just came in and said that we we went over the timeline of all of this we we know and we have give I have given other council members have given their reasoning for why at this moment they don't feel that's the path to go because cont Council woman and again I understand you disagree and it's a very and and I get that you can State why you disagree and then we have to vote on it as a as a council I just I have one question unrelated councilman carding you didn't answer if you would be okay with our Police Department having only 13 police officers I'm just curious yes no question I actually wanted to answer that councilwoman sammon wouldn't let me speak um no I would not be okay with the police department being reduced by 25% on a permanent basis also you're comping law enforcement and First Response Public Safety to a public works department you can't actually come on I we cannot have comments from the audience my point is that the police can't not answer a call they do have to prioritize certain things but everything that goes to them has to get handled DPW can come back and do it potentially on another day if it's not a critical function like picking up garbage or something that has a public safety impact so you also can't very easily hire seasonal police officers I mean there are things called specials but they cost a pretty big amount of money and it isn't again not not in the budget if you have a short-term Gap where there's a leave of absence for whatever reason whether it's an FMLA whether it's a workers's comp the proper response to it is not to hire more full-time employees and that would go for the police department as well they would have to fill that with overtime until if there was going to be a situation where an officer was going to be incapacitated for a long period of time then yes we might consider putting another one in the academy but that wouldn't be a decision got that got made in a couple of days and without any due diligence or any real discussion amongst the finance committee this Council or with our professionals and then just I had another point and it's it's since vaporized from from from my head unfortunately I appreciate your focus on the two men out but the focus should be on the two men that we never replaced that's your 25% they were replaced with seasonal employees they've had seasonal employees in those positions for years and all I hear about is how awesome the DPW is they haven't seasonal employees in that position for years do you know that the seasonals are rotated out every six months coun I have no idea how that works I just got I just got on to this committee and I I understand that we all advocate for our committees when we are commissioners of them right but you know this is beyond what what's necessary did we make another fire department video then because you still advocate for them all the time so if I may um look I know we're sitting here talking about hiring more staff seasonal things like that but clearly the issue here is communication and the way communication is fragmented the relationships uh how they are communicating what is being said what is not being said so the issue with the DPW what we're experiencing is is mainly due to that because like I said before these issues that we are talking about have not been brought to my attention till two weeks ago and I am more than open to work with the DPW to help them with their needs but I cannot do that if no one is talking and these fragmented relationships or whatever disorder that has happened before I've got here is not helping them and this method of of disorganization of disarray of chaos is not going to help them further and so our first need is to connect in a manner where we can communicate efficiently because it's not happening and I don't know how anything gets done within that matter I felt like we communicated pretty efficiently with with them last night so look forward to you supporting them getting a new the 11th Hour that this is something that it wasn't like we lost two people we need to hire new people we had this issue for years now we need two two employees that we've been stating we need but all of a sudden we need it now 24 hours before tonight with no information with no information about one of those people who are injured are coming back what the cost is uh for the town looking at that we're not doing our due diligence I cannot spend the taxpayers money without enough information in a crisis situation crisis situations believe or not there's a joke in my field crisis or anxiety makes you stupid you have to take a breath you have to reflect you have to look and be reflective and think about these things you cannot act with so much money at stake and make an impulsive decision for me you may know more for me I don't know that history I never heard it before but the issue is communication no one is talking no one is being direct there is too much indirect conversation conflict is not combat conflict is resolution and the way everyone is doing conflict it is with combat thank you okay we wouldn't be looking to the taxpayer to fund these positions if we didn't spend the money on a Rec director direct direct Rec director I'm gonna say this no I have to say this you so okay okay this is really quick okay now I have to I'm gonna I'm gonna allow councilman Foley to talk councilwoman I think you've said a lot tonight you have you've stated your reasons for for not agreeing with us we've stated our reasons we don't need to continue the back and forth I would really appreciate if the the everybody in the audience would remain quiet as well thank you okay so what are the Big D biggest dangers for our youth today it's not it's not physical safety it's psychological safety self harm suicide a all of these things are impacting our children at high levels like you have no idea they face unprecedent challenges with their mental health too much screen time never going outside not connecting with friends or peers or their Community these are all major factors and why these mental health crises are occurring at such a rapid rate wreck programs are a determent from mental health issues it keeps our children safe whether you think so or not this the science is there the information the facts are there to have a wreck program reduces the chances and prevents future psychological disorders such as depression anxiety and self harm by cutting this by reducing our community connections you are increasingly putting our kids at risk for what is a pandemic of mental health issues self harm and suicide and it sounds silly but this is a preventive measure for our town to reduce that to get rid of that would put our children at risk thank you we had an extremely successful Recreation program without spending $74,000 a year I urge you to please look at the statistics of the amount of kids that signed up while it was a volunteer run organization till now still a volunteer run organization with somebody councilwoman with somebody that is a director okay that provides oversight it is still a volunteer organization however when it was just a volunteer organization without oversight there were other issues that we all do up here know about and we have spoken about before so that is what pushed the conversation into hiring someone full-time not whether kids were signing up or not okay so let's move on we are going to go and open up for public comment so if there's anyone in the audience wishes to address the mayor and Council please step to the microphone and state your full name and address and please limit your comments to 5 minutes thank you hi good evening um council members I'm Jennifer gerero fortal Avenue um so I'm here to show my uh support and to advocate for the DPW I was one of those um people that posted online so yesterday um it's easier for you guys to sit down and say well our DPW can do the the work um four people can do it none of you are doing the physical work that the our DPW is doing I witnessed yesterday are the head of the DPW doing all the physical work lifting all those garbages while there was one there were two people one driving the truck and in the head of the DPW I felt enraged I was angry I was there were I had so many emotions because as a garu resident and as a former Garo celebrations uh chair which I run for five years they were exceptional every time I needed Health assistance they were always there and they're the first ones that every time there's a snow snowstorm we don't have to complain we're always praising them for all the good all the good work that they do and that's why I'm so it's so upsetting to listen to you guys argue and behave so unprofessional I mean you guys I don't understand this is we had two residents that just stood up and walked away very unprofessional you have to tonight I suggest to look at the video and look at your the the way that you treated each other and maybe you should I will suggest to all your council members to take a training on how to treat each other respectfully because it's very it it's it leaves a very sour taste of the people that are running um our town very very disappointed um but going back to what I was saying I'm here tonight to um urge council members to reconsider and reinstate those two full-time positions that we had in 2022 bring it back to the to the DPW we don't need a wreck a fulltime Rec director we were fine the re celebrations and Recreations uh committee was run by volunteers we did not and we didn't need a a a full-time paid employee a Rec director who by the way doesn't do anything all she has done is copy from all the events that I created the past five years and the reason why I Ste down Clarissa because celebrations it's over celebrations it's over you might you might argue argue with Council salmon and say that I disagree well I do agree with her because I was one of them there were many programs that I created I enhanced the program I I you with along with you know my uh former um celebrations member uh uh volunteers that we did we paid so many activities out of pocket and we were happy to do that I did that for many years without an issue without a problem and we were totally fine so maybe how about removing or reducing or hiring a seasonal part-time Rec director and and and reinstating those part uh uh full-time positions that we had back in 22 thank you thank you anybody miss hi everybody's surprised to see me right because this was my day off because I'll be here on Thursday it's Jill Paul 543rd Avenue I am pissed that I'm here right now okay so um there was one meeting regarding the Garwood first aid Squad and it was on January 10th between between the Garwood first aid squad's president Glen Castello their pro bono Redevelopment consultant anyone who attends the council meetings which is really not many of you here so it's nice to see you're here today um knows that that's me so hi I'm the pro bono consultant for the garard first aid squad for all of you that don't come to the meetings and decided to show up today hand shaking again um and so it was me it was Glenn it was the mayor and the chair of the finance committee I'm pissed about this right so I actually initiated this meeting so that Glenn could open the squad's books show the benefits to the community many of which I've outlined in Council meetings go through line by line the budget items and answer any questions including new EMT recruits if out a town member is actually um them actually being at the squad during their assigned shifts and how that's a great benefit to the community etc etc etc we actually asked for $22,000 and youall mentioning five is the reason that I left the one night that I didn't have anything to do this week and I'm pissed about it because I try to spend my time getting my Foundation off the ground so thank you for not remembering that conversation not remembering the $22,000 that we asked for for the insurance I'm pissed about that look my heart rate is 181 right now so when I have Cardiac Arrest I have a defi lator but you can let him know and you can let her know and they can help me okay so we asked for $22,000 underwrite the insurance not $11,000 not $5,000 so I literally have zero idea where the $5,000 came from but we asked for $22,000 in that meeting not 5,000 so I just wanted to clarify that and once again advocate for this much needed revenue for our all volunteer first aid Squad who relies on donations and also anybody here you're more than welcome to write a check to them so now I'm going to go back home now that it's what 8:57 and now I'm going to get my my night going so thank youall there anybody else who wishes to address the mayor and councel my name is Lou turo 98 third AV I just want to bring to your attention I'm not beating on the chief I think he's a very honorable guy you need to be start you need to start hiring police fire and first aid commensurate what vermel is bringing in here 17 police officers not enough I was uh police Lieutenant norc I was there over three decades and you're going to lose a town to crime and you're not going to get it back and it's just not enough 17 police officers and they're doing a good job I see them working and I know a few of them not all of them and I known the chief before he was chief he always been a hard worker and a smart guy but crime is on the rise and when it's gone it's not coming back and you can't talk numbers because there's a cost associated with fighting crime and it's expensive so if we all think we're going to replace an officer you need to constantly be hiring training and promoting and we're not doing that and it's going down and I see it and if you shop at a supermarket in town you just that need to be there five or six minutes and you hear arm robberies going on this wasn't happening before and it's changing right in front of us and it's not a financial issue it's a crime issue and there are grants and things we could be applying for and hiring special police officers and it's expensive if you're training them but if you hire retiring police officers from other towns which I'm one you can get them for nothing and if an officer gets hurt God forbid because it's just getting worse for them you can have three or four specials come in to cover a shift or cover until that officer is you know back to full Duty there are things we need to be doing we're not doing and we can argue and bigger with each other over things that who said what and these meetings are recorded so you can you know disprove or prove those things pretty quickly that's all I'm saying I'm not here beat up on anybody and not yelling and screaming my blood pressure is not going to go up thank you thank you is there anybody else who wishes to address the mayor and councel yes uh Frank Kelly uh 306 Willow Avenue um first I want to I've been associated with this town for over 25 years probably more than many of you guys have lived here I'm also been a resident for the last five um I want to I want to commend this Police Department that we have now and who's running it I've never seen and I've been part of associated with a couple of other police departments that I've lived with this is run by one of the finest but the point that Lieutenant just made is absolutely positive and every single one of you up there have to take this because your residence as well seriously verela is a problem there are squad cars and on a DV two squad cars have to go there at every single time leaving the town wide open wide open to being robbed and piled in other in another building right across the street shop right wherever it's scary forget four grand here 10 grand there this this police force in my opinion compared to other small towns of which I've been associated with all my life needs at least two or three more on the beat on the beat because we're losing this town and if you're here I'm here all day every day you can see my lunch truck around I see it these cops are swamped and then they got to come back and they got to write up reports for the next three hours and it's got to be signed by a supervisor and that's got to take him everybody comes off the street for that we're going to lose this town been here for 25 years and I'm invested in this town I love this town I'm here now I don't want to lose it that's where that's where the finance committee could go and take a look at and giving the chief and the police department the tools to control what's going on and it's something that we've created remember we approved verela we're approving corrugated core cardboard it's coming and it's going to get worse that's just my warning my warning and I don't don't take it from me just look at the police report incidences over the last two years compared to three or four years ago I do have some questions on the uh on the uh the interest in notes line item went up 25% year-over-year I assume that's on borrowings that we have can somebody shed some light on I know interest rates gone up and and whatnot I'm sure we have locked into we've locked in our notes our fixed rates right so um why have we increased $52,000 a year you know what uh Miss Bruns I'll have you answer all the questions after a public comment just so thank you then um there's a thing called here special emergency authorization pay down tsid 9121 for 50 Grand what is that okay okay I'll have all we'll do all the answers to all questions after public then we have a reserve for uncollected taxes that's an expense what and it shows that we just through the last years's number in there but what was last year's Actual uncollected taxes what was the actual this is a budget right what was the actual okay then we have this line called Surplus anticipated last year was a million two we took 25% off this year and made it 900,000 now that's a revenue right so why did our revenues go down $300,000 as compared to last year what's the justification $300,000 one more minute Mr shared service fees last year we had budgeted for $74,000 of Revenue it's 11 this year we lost some where in the mix $63,000 is no longer in Revenue so if you look at the reserve for uncollected taxes and we collect all those taxes and you put back the Surplus that was anticipated last year and say hey we're going to get this Surplus again this year year that covers a huge percentage of our increase if not all of our increase of taxes this year just those two line items just the reserve we collect all our taxes so we don't need that expense that's 400 and then we put back the Surplus anticipated back to what it was last year m that's 300 so 3400 Mr Kell I'm just going to ask you if you could wrap it up you've done your five minutes okay well yeah my that's my five minutes and I'll give you five minutes to answer back right thank you all right thank you well I we do it after all of public comment is over okay yes great so I will I have written it all down and I know Miss not I get to come back and say can we cover that we will we will answer everything as much as we can and if we don't have an answer if Miss Bruns can provide the answer for you we can contact you but I'm I'm thinking most of those questions I think she has it thank you Mr Kelly I don't I don't need to be contacted I think the town needs to know these are big big numers we will do our best uh to get you the answers afterwards we I don't need the answers the how's the town going to get the answers okay we'll we'll do our best here to do it okay and thank you Mr Kelly I have to ask you to sit I'm sorry we have we we have to do the five minute rule okay is there anybody body else who would like to address mayor and counsel 300 Cedar um so I thought this was great but is there a way to get page numbers could you guys keep referring to page numbers and whatever you have to somewhat align so that we can easily find what they're referring to not a today but um so I have a couple comments I'm not necessarily questions um one where was mentioned of DPW and hiring a new man I just want to say or it could be a woman there you go I like that secondly there was mention of no ice cream Fridays I just want to mention I have a 14 17 and 19 year old who are currently flourishing and never have a Friday thr that out there and then thirdly I also want to make the assumption that everybody on the council knows what the word nepotism means um and as a resident and a taxpayer and just hoping that everybody on an acting committee knows what that word means and then if they feel as though they're involved in netism that they're not actively participating in that committee thank you thank you is there anybody else who wishes to address the mayor and councel hi I'm Cheryl Kelly I live at 500 Beach Avenue um I wanted to ask if the residents could get an actual copy of a job description of how Kau you fills her day I know at my job um when they created the position for me it was a part of my company's um standard practices to then come up with an actual role of my goals and what I would be expected to fulfill so I would like to know if the residents could see that um also I know uh we just got the report from uh superintendent Kenny and there's 363 children still involved in the school system right now I wanted to know if we know a percentage of children who actually are involved in the rec committee's activities in town I know personally unfortunately my son does not um he doesn't participate in any and I actually pay out of pocket to send him to C elsewhere which I'm very happy to do um also on the workers comp insurance policy I saw there was a 133% increase in the premium I wanted to know what is the renewal date on that policy I wanted to know if the town uh received any explanation for the increase and if there were loss runs done and also if there was any plan to do remarketing and who would decide that thank you Miss bu you get part of that did you hear okay good evening mayor thank you very much he good just another question you know good good evening mayor ladies and gentlemen the Council of finance committee Warren Rey Sandy good to see all of you thank you very much for putting this together uh just some comments and maybe if I have time for questions on the finance but uh one thing Jennifer Guerrero does mention about training to be respectful uh with the council members I actually pushed this many times online and I mentioned it at Council I mean we have Sean Foley here which would be great you should actually get everybody together and talk about combative and divisiveness and why can't we all get along so I mean you know hopefully you can push for something instead of sitting there just talking about it you know but work with them in fact you know this is this is a a good reason why we need two political ideologies on the council you know for for diverse opinions for questions because if it wasn't believe me it'll be just like the county which I go to I mean they just they just vote Yes for everything and spend money like crazy but at least we have one person from the opposition party that actually asks questions gets a little too dramatic but it's worthwhile uh the uh I thank uh um councilwoman Bodo you know thank you very much for all those questions you know the last time I heard somebody ask a lot of question was Russ Graham a couple years ago before that it was really just me but anyway uh the garage fire department building maybe um councilman car doesn't know this but actually it was built back in 83 with HUD monies and that HUD money was specifically used for seniors for the use of seniors that's that's why the seniors there in the first place I I tend to agree with the council MCC Carney where's the lightning bolt but anyway about you know access with the parking spots and such you know and it's a lot better at the Nights of Columbus but keep that in mind that there was a purpose as to the HUD and the money that was spent over there the uh pilot Monies uh it's it's just I'm just ashamed that you guys for doing what you're doing with the pilot Monies to the school I mean $50,000 I'm looking at this at this budget sheet here and you got an extra $650,000 now from ver the verm 1 and two and you're still only giving $50,000 I've written letters going back to 2016 saying you should have some kind of fair and equal adjustment of the pilot Monies to the board Ed the last letter I wrote was uh 25% I don't know if you saw that but anyway 25% at first I was going for 60 but I'm saying 25 now you really should work towards that because obviously you're taking these monies and to me I guess it's a black hole or to the public you know it just kind of all disappears yeah the public employees I mean you know you're saying oh we shouldn't be talking about the public employees but the employees know full well that they can be talked about whether it's a DPW or the police I don't talk about the police because they have guns but anyway but Sandy the attorney the ba we can talk about the public can talk about the public employees it's it's part of their recognition of of working as a Public Employee so keep that in mind I mean you know you you want to you you want to hide them or or shelter them but no questions can be asked I've asked questions in the past Council Council woman shamon I mean you know I do agree she can ask questions uh the uh oh here's a question banked cap are we using any Bank cap so that's a question for stand uh let's see what else we got here yeah the job description you know there's before Kyle left I mean a lot of job descriptions were moved around among the employees I mean not only Kata but also the others um have additional responsibilities I don't think anybody sat down and actually wrote up each responsibility list for each employee I think it should be done now so at least everybody understands where each employee is and what they do uh let me see if I have do I have time uh you have one more minute one more minute yeah the it's amazing we're looking at rmel one and two now we're getting a over a million dollars over a million dollars now it seems to just be going down that black whole $50,000 to the board event you know I'm sure they're excited about that one you know councilman Carney and saying oh good faith I think I think Mark Lazar was said good faith that's not good faith it's not good faith at all they got you know in fact that one person that one student was a special ed student cost $150,000 you were uncomfortable talking about it but it needs to be talked because it was a very large expense that they incurred from the vermis yeah I just I can ask financial later on too but but I just want to mention this finance committee I mean what I heard I mean we have councilman Foley is the chair and yet I've heard all the explanations all the indepth arguments from Mark lazro councilman lazro and I said this way back why did you put councilman Foley as the chair because he really is here for one year has no experience I mean it's nice that he talked but I'll tell you councilman lazro should have been chair obviously because he did indepth explanations of a lot of facts and uh and items of the finance when it came to it your five minutes are up Mr P your five minutes are up five minutes are up thank you very much for listen okay is there anybody else who wishes to address the May Council hi John Blick 231 Hemlock Avenue uh a couple of brief things uh the the term crisis was used regarding the DPW uh it's a crisis of your own making it could have been addressed a couple of different ways I it was appalling to see the way it was addressed tonight uh there was reference to crisis Communications I know a little bit about this as well cisis Communications about authenticity accountability and ownership and that is not present tonight it's appalling to hear quotations and blame of people who aren't here it's the former administrator's fault the DPW superintendent said this the foreman said that you can agree on what they said when they said it what the context was whether you call them Foreman or Mis or by their first name it doesn't matter you shouldn't you own this those of you who are on the council last year and decided to have a reduction in permanent full-time Force you own that so own it those of you who are sitting here now will vote on this budget and have to make a determin about whether to add FTE you own it stop blaming everybody else the buck stops with you with that said I'm going to ask for something I don't see anything on here in terms of an increase for the planning board I'm going to keep a promise I made to the mayor in September at a planning board meeting when we did the master plan reexamination three years late it didn't even include the word traffic the one thing that I think all 4700 4700 people in town can agree on is circulation traffic uh foot traffic bicycle traffic vehicular traffic is a nightmare and there's one thing really that you can do to even have a chance at trying to turn the tide on this and that's to have a plan we're doing stuff we're getting grants we're you we're we're putting fingers in the Dyke we're playing whacka moole with things but there's something called a circulation element and the planning board made a recommendation to you when they adopted the plan because it was late in the game uh when this recommendation was brought up I brought it up and they made the recommendation to you I don't see it reflected in the budget so I'm hoping you tell me I'm wasting my time tonight you're going to fund the development of a circulation element for the master plan because it is the one thing that will impact the quality of life for everybody in the community for years to come it's not a Panacea it's not you flip a switch and all kinds of great things happen it's almost impossible work it's really hard but those are the things you got to do and I don't think it's gonna be expensive so I really do think that maybe you disagree mayor but the stuff I hear being talked about tonight petty petty petty but I'm telling you do a survey if you don't believe me traffic the uh threat to quality of life and the threat to uh personal and property safety is critical in this community we missed it in the master plan reexamination I I get it they were limited in funding as well this is the time and I promised I'd come back and you asked me to come back and remind you and I am here I keep my promises okay and the last thing I wanted to mention uh the discussion tonight and uh I wish we could have had this document as we had last two years earlier because some of us do read this stuff so I got to sit there with my stupid calculator and I gotta you do all my stuff here instead of being able to devote my attention uh but I wasn't able to glean anything regarding sewer fees so blissfully quiet about sories tonight uh I'm hoping that I'm not poking the bear because I'm not complaining that we're not getting hit with sories uh but can you please tell me that topic is being tabled for the time being and perhaps it will come back in the future and we can address it then thank you thank you anybody else wish to address the mayor and councel Michelle capano for for Myrtle um councilman Foley you said something in the beginning about non-discretionary spending is mandatory and non-negotiable and I couldn't disagree with that more yes there's certain things that absolutely have to be paid but you all have control of those figures to a certain extent benefits you can renegotiate rvsa fees you absolutely need to look at carefully we need to take care of our source system so those are the types of things that absolutely you have in your control so that's my statement on that I think you all should go to a team building exercise as a HR person uh what I see up here is is not good for any of us um and I think we would all agree that that money would be well spent in the budget um the two DP full-time DPW workers that just were eliminated and replaced with seasonal workers um I think there really needs to be job analysis done as to the workload I mean because I don't think the workload change if anything it's probably more than it ever was um that should be done by Clint he's a superintendent right so there needs to be some kind of analysis as to other towns what they do how many employees they work with that kind of thing facts um there's a few things that I didn't hear other people ask about so I'm going to ask about the sewer maintenance is increased by $32,500 what exactly is that going to cover and and do for our sewer system rvsa is up over 16% what are some contributing factors to that fees and permits in the revenue section is increased 26,000 what EX exactly are those fees and permits and my closing statement is that budgets reflect the priorities allocate resources to what's deemed most important so please prioritize the things that are essential to the running of our town thank you thank you is there anybody else who wishes to address the mayor and Council Stephanie willix 323rd AV my family and I are just here tonight in support of the DPW I think the issue was the two spots that were not initially hired for has nothing to do with the teamsters negotiations now or anything they should have been hired beforehand I feel that working with below like a skeleton crew almost was really just playing Russian roulette hoping that no one was going to get injured and make it a critical situation that it is now thank you is there anybody else who wishes to address the May counsil that's it we got it okay all right can I have a motion to close public comment so moved second all in favor I okay let's get started okay so um let me see if I can answer some of these questions appreciate everybody's comments um all right I'll allow for or anybody who wants to leave to leave that's just it's getting so it's a little loud okay okay thank you um first of all in terms of the first aid department Miss Paul I apologize if we got the number wrong from the initial meeting my recollection was that the 22,000 was the cost of the insurance and that um the request was for 11,000 to cover half of it if that's not the case then I apologize I can pull up the um budget materials uh later and and fix the record um but that that was just what I had recalled but um I'm glad uh that we are able to provide um some funding back again um appreciate all of the comments about our Police Department questions questions Mr Kelly okay um interest on notes is up 25% Miss Bruns want to take that one so that line I is a combination of what the interest rate is a note is only a one-year note so every time it matures it's whatever the interest rate is but in addition to that um all the bond ordinances you do in a year um are what you're borrowing so you've got a combination of a higher interest rate and just more borrowing that's driving that number number okay and that includes the the bond from the for the radios then correct not yet this is from previous year okay um special emergency pay down from Ida um I believe that was just um well miss bronze I'll let you take it I uh that was a I believe a 5-year emergency I think we're paying 28,000 on that let me just oh wait that might have been the other there after Ida we had taken out an emergency Bond and we pay it down over five years five years so I think we're close to being done right just pull that up one more uh it will be paid off in 2026 okay and reserve for uncollected taxes um I believe the question was why how much how many how much uncollected ta did we not collect there's the question last year so the reserve for uncollected taxes is a non-s spending appropriation it's uh determined by a formula it it's not something that you you have to appropriate based on that formula yeah it's it's required by state budget law you have to have it in there in other words you're anticipating what you're going to collect but you're not going to collect everything in any one year so has to be so how much is how much do you have we might need to get that for you uh that answer another time how much um uncollected taxes last year 184,000 yeah it seems like at the end of 23 we had 184,000 on in delinquent taxes in delinquent that's the word I'm looking for thank you um okay and so just to cover Mr Kelly's question you cannot remove the reserve for uncollected taxes and put it somewhere like our Surplus no it has to be there Mr Kelly I'm sorry Mr Kelly I'm sorry I'm just gonna let Miss Bruns answer but the the balance of delinquent taxes at the end of the year is different than the reserve for uncollected taxes that non-s spending budget appropriation is determined by a formula that the state sets forth that's the amount we have to appropriate okay um and the Surplus anticipated was down and that's really a choice that the is he was saying we used more last year you had more available last year you didn't generate as much Surplus and there wasn't as much to use in this budget and Miss Bruns if you could for the public sayate could you just explain how Surplus works like how do we get Surplus for the town just so it's helpful for the public there's basically two ways the two major ways to generate Surplus are unspent Appropriations and additional revenues that came in that were not anticipated so that's basically how you generate your Surplus and um in terms of the shared service they were down but I I believe that and you can tell me due to construction yeah that's construction I'm pretty sure that's construction fees yeah you can confirm that Miss BR um yeah we have a uh shared service with Cranford for the construction department and based on that shared service were entitled to a small portion of the permit fees they collect and they must there was just less permits generated in 23 versus 22 okay um Miss vakara wanted to know if she could get the page numbers for the bigger budget I it we cannot provide this for the public I mean it's literally over a 100 Pages um so that would be really difficult to do uh Miss Bruns does put together a budget we do do the budget friendly document after the budget's adopted and that goes up um and again uh we will put the slideshow up online um after tonight and we do have this document um that is right here that you can use to to look at unfortunately as things get it it's not completely adopted so we can't put the budget itself online right now so um it will have to wait um Miss Kelly the job description I you are welcome to O the job description that we have um I do want to assure you I'm here every day and Miss uh I I assure you kata's day is completely filled as she's not just our rec director but she's also ouri senior citizen director as well as our public information officer um it's it's a lot of work uh even just the the simplest things that you would think of she does uh from just the advertising and flyers to actually doing the turf rentals and um if I may I believe Mr Harris had created uh job descriptions for everybody right I think at some point last year yeah so and to to get it um and I don't the the percentage of kids in wreck from the school I we I don't even know if we could we can try and figure something out with that I don't I don't know how we would do I mean each year is a little different each year there's classes that that fill up some classes that don't um so it's really just it changes over time um like we had a skating was over a 100 kid over a 100 kids we had over a 100 signups for rec skating um the the coding didn't works so well the coding class didn't work so well the soccer is full so I mean it's it's just depends on the class itself and and um Miss lysac has been trying to figure out sort of what the residents are looking for and and trying to change certain things such as the soccer she you know found in uh the fall that fall that Friday night soccer wasn't filling up but Saturday was so we stuck with the Saturday so we're learning as we go um which is normal um I think so and in terms of the workers comp that would be some information I think that Miss Bruns would have to find the question was the the renewal date on workers comp um and the increase if you got notification of the increase and if we if we look if we look at other each year so um we're in a gif so I don't have it's not up to me to remarket it maybe perhaps and I'm I do think it was looked at not so long ago by Mr Harris I know he kind of went through everything and and took a look but that would be something if the council wants uh Mr Arthur to do we could perhaps for next year because we've already we're yeah it's already set for this year right yeah so we could um we could certainly I I'm always open to taking a look at everything to see that that's part of I Know M Mr Arthur who knows that's part of his job so um and other than that the renewal date I don't know you'd have to look up I'm assuming right we'd have to we'll have to get that to another time all right um actually um Mr KY I meant to ask you about Bank cap uh c bank and um also if you could so if you could explain the cap Bank a little bit um because it will be on the next agenda as well as the uh burrow self exam review that will be on the next agenda as well yeah sure the uh municipality is under a spending limitation it's two and a half% of your operating Appropriations and uh what the state lets you do if you want to increase the 2 and a half% you're limited to the 2 and a half percent you can't increase your Appropriations so if you want to increase it more than that you have to do by 1% you have to pass the cap Bank ordinance and it's the only way you can do then or if you don't you're limited to 2 and a half% you're under the cap as it is now uh as the budget's going to be introduced uh the 1% extra is $77,000 if you don't pass the cap Bank ordinance you lose the 77,000 you can't use it in the next two years budget so basically it's just a spending plan you're not authorizing any more Appropriations you're saying in the future years if your budget goes up more than 2 and a half% you have this Reserve or cap Bank for 77,000 to be able to use it in the next two years succeeding budget um you know it's only 77,000 you used about 24,000 in this year's cap bank that you had from the prior year so you're under the cap for this year so it's okay it's just a uh it's not authorizing any more spending this year it's a potential for next year like your pension bills and stuff went up more than 1% this year they went up substantially so now you have to have someplace to go because the two and a half% is just not going to cut it okay um you mentioned about the resolution for self- revie U the the budget law was changed a few years back uh that if you have uh you know sound financial condition the state let you review your own budget two years in a row and then the third year the state reviews it since you don't have any recommendations and you don't have any you know uh qualifications in your uh finances the state's going to let you review your own budget this year okay one you have to be eligible not everybody in the state is eligible okay if you don't have sound financial uh you know reporting requirements and then there's a certification that the CFO gives there's a list of 10 or 11 different things that you have to qualify for have you know adequate percentage of collection you're paying off your debt service you don't have any uh you know overe expenditures or anything like that in your budget and then she certifies you didn't have that so it lets the council in conjunction with the CFO review the budget in and of itself so what that means is when once the budget goes down to the state and the public hearing date is set which is May sometime that and that night you're not waiting for the state to review your budget and to give you a okay to do it you just do it yourself the resolution is passed CFO gives a certification that they met the requirements that put it this way you're just doing what the state would be doing there's six or seven steps the state looked at and then Sand's going to really do that herself and she certifies that to the uh the council and then you could just adopt your budget you don't have to wait for the state to review it okay but it's not something that's granted very easily you have to have certain conditions to meet it so it's something that's a it's kind of a feather in your C I was going to say that what you can take away from that you didn't have any recommendation so things you're doing well State recog so it's not something that's granted just very not everybody gets it thank you and does anybody have any questions for uh Mr KY about those before we move to the rest of the answers okay um Mr Patterson I I don't even know what to say in terms of of you with your comments about Council councilman Foley I I think he he did a a great job as you notice we all tend to jump in and talk about things we have a lot of EX more experience and years so sometimes as we're talking something hits us and we jump in I know I did that tonight too and councilman Carney councilman Lazaro as opposed to when you're brand new and sometimes we probably take away from councilman Foley getting to say what he wants to say um so uh I have heard nothing but good things about your work in finance so thank you councilman um Mr bartlick um in term you know what I just want to answer that nobody was placing fault on any body or trying to not own anything I'm we're owning the decision by you know voting on everything uh we I Know Myself and I think some of the other Council people um all of us includ you know all of us here we're using it for our reasoning so nobody's saying it's putting the the fault on somebody else we use what other people are the other information that other people are giving us as a part of our reasoning to make our decisions so and we were explaining why we came to those decisions so that is that in terms of the traffic plan I do this did come up and I I did want to do a traffic plan um I have discussed it with uh our planner who is um doesn't sort of see the same way about tra the traffic plan situation and so he did not ask for the funding for it I am trying to look for a grant that would help us with that um also because we do kind of this traffic plan really wouldn't be complete without working with Westfield and Cranford to be honest because that's really the circulation um coming in from both sides so um I I want to just let you know it's still on the radar even though you don't see it here it might be going a little slower than we like but it is on the radar um sore fees we actually did talk about it I think at one of the previous meetings um councilman yeah so um currently I just want to add that um someone mentioned the sewer program and the fees recently uh the sewer program uh went from 12,500 to 45,000 due to the cleaning program our former ba he recommended that 10% of our sewers be cleaned each year over 10 years uh this is the r now for sewer fees to be collected our committee has currently postponed implementation of sewer fees until 2025 to ensure that all protocols and Logistics can be set in place thank you um yeah it's something I have spoken to our CFO about at length as well and um I you won't like the answer but I think you'll you'll be seeing some discussion and ordinances uh coming up um possibly over the summer this would allow enough time for our burrow to put everything into place including software and um getting everything ready to send out so billing wouldn't happen this year so there was there's no way we could collect the fees uh as Revenue this year it's something that I think is uh the intent is to implement for next year but the increase uh Miss Capa biano asked about the sore maintenance increase that you talked about and I do think when you look at that that is part of the reasoning for adopting these store fees is that if we want to maintain we're going to need to try and offset some of these increases every year if we're going to pay for 10% of the lines to be inspected and cleaned each year um so that is that for the sore maintenance rvsa uh we we've had rvsa in and we went through that at length about why it is up um and so I'm going to refer you back to to that meeting fees and permit increase I was trying to look at exactly what we're looking at there if I don't know you can the fees and permits increase for the revenue anticipated Revenue I guess there's a lot I mean there's a lot of fee and permits listed in our anticipated revenues so I assume is that like the industrial sewer fees or is that something else Sandy well I know it's sort of like with wreck fees you calculate how much you can estimate how much you might take in for different things like summer camp and bulk pickup fees we can kind you kind of do an estimate on how many um households were using bulk pickup last year and kind of work off of that um so I don't know if those specific types of fees are what we're looking at oh oh I see the full okay the fees and permits I believe there was a new um property like the property registration fees all those new fees that okay you put that into that line yeah okay okay is that is that the 105 line Sandy uh yes 08 105 okay yeah so the answer to that question just was is that we Sandy you're saying it's the property um maintenance fees that's where that line went up the $26,000 there there's a lot of different fees lumped into that number and but primarily it's the it's those Property Maintenance fees yes it's it's your new fees that you you've implemented um and I think that was it for questions on the budget all right okay at this point we will move along uh if everybody is okay up here any further discussion okay the regular meeting of the mayor and Council will be held on Thursday April 11 2024 at 7 p.m. in council chambers information for meetings is posted on the barel website can I have a motion to adjourn so move second second all in favor hi e e e e for