##VIDEO ID:-tvTyYjHbqg## tonight um is Craig schy online Robert Ash David dve David I can't see our City attorney or Other M sorry David um David as yes thank you thank you David I should probably just let you say your name and we'd be better off um so Craig David and I think that's it online right okay oh I'm [Music] sorry what from the parking license oh okay oh yeah yeah okay welli Mitch will fully introduce himself later in this conversation all right and also Ben Peters Bill Lis myself Michael Gary and Mike Roth so there's our roll call it is now time for open forum and if anyone C oh Cam sorry cam just blending in there um if anyone like to speak speak for I don't know if you can hear me Igor lensar can we put him on the big screen too Patrick just one moment we'll get you on the screen so just just one second we are about to begin open forum and with that if anyone in the room would like to speak please come up to the microphone and of course identify yourself um and if there's anyone online as well um and the way my screen view is now set I can see if you'd like to signal for um open Forum so thank you so with that is anyone here for open Forum eigor has raised his hand all right e if you would please I learned a new tool just now um M mayor members of the council eagor lensar linking in in law firm in St Cloud on behalf of borberg who's the applicant on the P application which is up for consideration again tonight uh I don't want to take a long time and I didn't know if you were going to allow comments during that part of the agenda so um I thought it would be appropriate to speak quickly now um the the application that was made was a planned unit development and in the city as you folks know the plan unit development is a conditional use and conditional uses are generally uses that that we look at and say hey these uses uh are probably okay in this district there may be um items that we need to address and conditions imposed to make sure that that is in fact the case um the property that was uh proposed for development is proposed for development uh is a block of property that was originally pled I believe in 1917 so it's it's sat uh only partially developed for the last 100 years uh as some of the the Lots around it have been as the rest of the city developed around it um when we were before the council previously I was uh in attendance at those meetings either watching or or their live uh on screen live but not uh in person um the issues that were were raised at that time a couple of them uh one was I recall many of the Neighbors being concerned about who who would be buying these homes who are these homes for would they be for vacation rentals um would they be second homes for people from the Twin Cities Etc um that issue was addressed by the applicant one in the HOA documents and in its City application specifically saying that it was not going the homes were not going to be available for vacation rentals overnight vacation rentals there was a uh rental provision uh but it was for long-term rentals and secondly uh working with the county HRA 20% of the homes would actually have been specifically set aside for purchase by people who live in the county County but also work in the county so that would have made it very difficult for someone from say the Twin Cities to buy one of those designated homes and use it as a vacation home because they would have had to show that they're permanent resident of the county and also work in the county but those are restrictions that do not apply to any of the neighboring homes to my knowledge and so uh this property was proposed to be developed in a manner that was more restrictive in terms of being available for uh persons to rent longterm as well as uh purchase um so those that issue was addressed in the application another issue that came up was the density that issue was addressed by a potential condition uh that was uh set out by the administrative staff which was to remove the accessory dwelling units from the approval the my knowledge the applicant said that they would accept that condition um the third item that uh came up was Third Street West and concerns of traffic one by removing the adus uh the density's lowered and that overall concern uh significantly altered in terms of the amount of density the second thing is is the applicant engineer when asked to look at a traffic study had had said basically the impacts are so nominal that it would not pay to do any such study but uh the applicant did propose a widening of uh third in an effort to address the city's concern um those concerns uh I believe were all addressed by the applicant tonight uh or today when I saw the uh last couple days when I saw the proposed findings for tonight A a new item that I had not heard nor seen mentioned before was proposed in those findings and that item of concern is that the developer had proposed to run utilities up the center of the property and their finding says that the concern is that this extension of public water and sewer would be inaccessible to undeveloped property surrounding the development property so I wanted to specifically address this concern one is I do not recall nor did John Peters ever recall having this concern raised by the council during any of the meetings or by staff uh secondly the utilities proposed to be extended to the property were going to be private utilities entirely paid for by the developer um so that would not be a cost born by the neighbors uh third thing is is that the reason that those utilities were proposed to go through the center of the property and likely the very reason that this property has not developed since 1917 when it was originally platted is that it is economically and geologically infeasible to on the utilities up sixth or sth sixth has a significant amount of Bedrock which would make it infeasible financially and potentially physically to run the utilities all the way up six and seventh has serious elevation concerns with regard to the feasability of extending utilities the other thing is that we never heard that the neighbors wanted sewer and water available to what is for many of them their backyards this was not something that was expressed uh in what was expressed was by many neighbors expressing a concern that they did not want to be assessed for any part of this project and any kind of extension of utilities of sixth or 7th would have been an extension would have had to been an extension by the city and that cost would have had to been BL 5050 by both the development property as well as the adjacent neighbors there was no such discussion because none of the neighbors had expressed an interest in spending that kind of money to provide SE Water Service to their backyards as to the undeveloped property north of the proposed project if one looks at the elevations that property sits roughly 20 ft higher just across the road there's another reason that that property hasn't been developed and there was never an expressed Desire by the city or that property owner to have utilities extended to that property and that property may actually if it can be served might be better served from development to the north and I just want to note that this is not a case of a proposed development on the edge of town where a developer would install private utilities thereby stopping future development outside of the city this is property that has remained undeveloped for over a hundred years that has been developed around it with utilities each block around this property it is basically encircled by utilities that were not financially feasible to run up six s and so I wanted to mention that although that's in the findings tonight it was never discussed nor part of the record and further there was never a request by the developer to provide any plans for Neighbors who would want to potentially hook up and that is something that potentially could have been possible had it had that need or Desire been expressed but it was not and I and I rais this because uh this prop prop shouldn't go undeveloped especially when there's a housing need and the city uh seems to want to try to meet that need and to develop this property it is going to require an extension of utilities and even if it's not developed as a ped that would have been able to address some of these geography and geological issues and preserve some property even if it's not developed in that manner it's going to be developed in a manner that would be permitted under your code but that is going to require the extension of City Municipal Utilities and so I urge you to look at that finding and ask yourself whether that was something that you ever actually expressed or was ever actually expressed at any of these meetings um before you go ahead and adopt those findings and uh that is all I have for tonight thank you for letting me speak thank you is there anyone else for open forum good evening Council Madame mayor Linda jurich executive director of The Cook County Chamber of Commerce I want to set the tone by saying that before I speak in public um in support or not support of a project um we pull the board of the chamber and um they unanimously voted for me to be here this evening so with that we have long identified housing as a dire need for development in Cook County in order to attract and retain workers housing is Paramount I also think Aging in place is a consideration as there is a diminished ability for current senior single family homeowners to transition from their home ownership to scenarios which require less maintenance of course with the establishment of an HRA we have made tremendous progress we've accomplished much of this with financial government and Community Partnerships that's not news to anybody in this room we've done a lot of good work I listened to the record of the August 14th city council meeting I was out of town at the time what I learned in watching the video is that there is concern about long-term Street and utility Improvement plans and housing density I also understand that the applicant worked with a civil engineer to widen the street for the entire block and agreed to pay for the improvements does the City of Grand marray have a long-term infrastructure Improvement plan are we able to simultaneously work on City Improvement plans while supporting Housing Development and working with developers that come with cash in hand this feels like a section of blocks in the city of grar that has remained relatively untouched when it comes to infrastructure improvements also of concern for our business Community is that we should be open to working with outside developers in most cases communities would welcome the outside investment from developers especially ones that have secured dollars and made commitments to improve city infrastructure the Planning Commission of the city of grar made a positive recommen recommendation for approving this project if there were concerns at the council level would it not be appropriate to discuss with the commission to gain their perspective and perhaps that already occurred I'm also concern I'm also curious about the concerns for Forest density within the city this property does not have signs posted for community members to enjoy the forest it is also Zone permanent resident which would not allow for commercial or mixed use or vacation rentals that is not the intent and the de the developer has assured that 60% of the land would remain forested I hope that the city council will choose to further consider this project and other projects by private developers as an opportunity for thoughtful growth and development for the positive forward movement in the City of Grand marray thank you thank you is there anyone else for open form all right and with that we'll move to the consent agenda yes I wanted to pull an item from the consent agenda certainly we' like to make a motion yeah I would make a motion to pull a f something parking license and move that just as a suggestion to after the liquor store marketing update okay I would also like to pull the s swc the cost sharing agreement for conversation okay and also remind you that we can get the liquor store City Hall update before we do consent agenda yeah we'd move them both after the L he's talking about hag and Miller oh oh thank you yes sorry John we'll get back to you in two seconds in fact we will do that I'm going to put a pause on this and we're going return to John yes sorry my mistake good evening everyone uh again my name is John Heen Miller with moff construction I'm the site superintendent for the city hall and mville liquor store project I'm here to give you my bi-weekly update I guess um at this time you can see uh we are setting structural steels will be continuing that into next week um we're continuing to install subd drainage system the subd drainage system in the parking lot area and on September 9th we will begin the framing of the exterior walls and continuing to prep for the parking lot underground electric and low voltage and then uh start working on the exterior concrete sidewalks uh replacing some curb and gutter and aprons into the site and that will probably end up towards the end of the month so again uh anyone's welcome to come down and stop by and say hi and if you'd like we can somewhat do it to or now we have a hard slab to walk on and you won't break an ankle on the Rocks so again um thank you for your time and I appreciate it thank you thanks great okay all right now we will return to the consent agenda for which there are two motions to remove or there is a motion to remove two items the S swcd casare agreement to uh discuss and look at along with the fight for something LLC parking license would anyone like to make a second to that motion I'll second the motion all right um any further changes edits questions all right so all in favor of approving the consent agenda with removal of swcd casare agreements and fight for something LLC parking license we have to do it in a roll call in a roll call yeah Craig think you muted Craig sorry I okay Ben I bill I I Michael hi all right with that um we will which we did not put into that uh when I complete it but we will move that for after the liquor store marketing update yeah all right very good all right next up on the agenda is the Bor borberg p and preliminary plat those are way too many P's to say without I still like the PC P all right I'm just going to get to that page all right um resolution 20 2437 would anyone like to make a motion all right I will make a motion uh for the resolution of the city council of the City of Grand maray Minnesota denying planned unit development conditional use permit for proposed bukberg grandm LLC common interest Community plat is there a second on that I'll second all right any further comments or discussion okay we will take a roll call on that Craig hi Ben no bill I I Michael N okay and now we will move on to city council resolution 2024-the plat would anyone like to make a motion on that all right I will make a motion on that would anyone like to second that so Tracy yeah did you repeat could you please repeat your motion please all right a motion for this resolution of 2024 38 that's the second resolution under this borberg PUD preliminary plat and this is for the for the preliminary plat so that's the second one on the list is it you're okay with that now Craig do you see where I'm yeah okay and your motion and a second on that I'll second all right roll call vote Craig yes Ben no bill yes yes Michael N okay all right and with that we move on to the liquor store marketing update Chris you're close to a microphone I am pretty close to a microphone yes you hear me oh yeah yeah we thought it would be nice to get a little update Summer's almost over with and um we're already looking into our future of the liquor store where it's going to be and what's going on we thought it' be great to have a little update from you and kind of see how all that's going along with the marketing piece which I you have quite a bit of material yeah um we've kind of we've picked out a logo we have a couple options for you to look at as far as people to help us do some marketing I don't know if you had a chance to look at them or not yet um you can just kind of describe generally it wasn't here we didn't ask you here for the purpose of like approving anything we just wanted to know update where you're at and see how things are going so you're going great I mean I mean and about the the marketing and how we're online and just just general update it wasn't that we wanted to say yay or n to anything I mean we have rack cards made we've got we've done a lot of things to we'll be hiring someone to do to build us a website and to do some marketing via that website and other avenues um yeah I I pretty self-explanatory I guess any questions for me about what we're trying to accomplish or what we're doing let's look at a couple of the ideas that are in one of the proposals quick so the um I mean first of all both of these proposals included uh redesigning the website doing some social media marketing that's what we want to focus on we don't think that there are other marketing tools that make sense for us right now in terms of BigTime print or anything else uh one of them uh from uh breakwell digital we received first and and uh the price is a little bit high on the on the uh social media marketing we did get a discount on the website uh and then the second one from Sweetwater design company the website price is a little bit higher but we were very familiar with her work and and have examples of local ones that we really like quite a bit and then the price on the social media uh work is a little bit cheaper so we think that's the one we we probably end up going with and so if you look at um it's page 65 on on my uh PDF but uh if that's a bear with me if that's not true for everybody else it includes the new website and social media estimate and you can see there's 12 items that she's listing okay um and so the first couple of those are just helping go through the design process for the website uh there's some uh getting photographer videographer for the website and for social media and then figuring out how to get Instagram feed integrated creating a contact form uh optimizing the website Pages doing some Google analytics for us training sessions so that we can make our own updates and then launching it with all LS and plugins one of the things that we considered but didn't include right now is using our website to sell products so that's one of the things that she has the capability of adding in the future if we want but right now we don't think we're going to go that direction and then page 66 on mine the annual website and social media fees uh you basically we're we're asking uh for assistance from her to help us create social media contact and then just get it out there so your content sorry that that's our basic marketing strategy is to rely on our website and to use social media marketing and just Target some uh probably Thunder Bay and some local areas right now and then just use that to kind of grow with as uh we keep going okay just for my understanding so it be the excuse me the 5,000 plus yes the 1,000 so the 5,000 is just the website that's one time the 1980 is an annual cost and really both of the proposals the annual cost is based on some assumptions of how much ads we're buying on social media or how how many people are looking at them uh this isn't a huge amount right now and I think you know that could potentially right change depending upon our experience with it but we're just trying to get started in this and we haven't really done this before and we're excited to get going mhm okay say been an okay summer All Things Considered um it's been a summer it's been all right yeah it's it's fine it's kind of tough to move into somebody somewhere and then just leave immediately just when you're kind of figuring out how the place works but right yeah and it's been a little hot in a building with one door and no windows but other than that pretty good adding two 15minute parking spots really helped short-term parking getting people in and out of there quicker they pay attention to that they do that's impressive the one sign that people do see yeah um so I was curious about how the THC drinks have been going there and very well any thoughts about that going forward like how's that looking I mean we'll definitely have a pretty good section in the liquor store dedicated to THC CBD beverages for sure we'll add some edibles too probably yeah you know not just drinks but some other things yeah the age demographics are pretty crazy with that stuff there people all over the board you know you see just as many 80y olds as 21y olds which I think is kind of fascinating yeah all right I also feel like people are a little more comfortable buying those things from a liquor store than from a grocery store or a gas station just and talking to customers and you like the older clientele yeah you know it's a 21 an older store so I think it's a little more appealing to go in there than get those things than than elsewhere yeah yeah that's interesting wouldn't have yeah yeah it's really stuff like that's fascinating mhm yeah and do you sell mult packs sorry I'm just curious yeah we do um at I just hadn't seen them I saw like the the thing yeah um at first everything was the most you could get it in was like a four pack I think you couldn't buy more than maybe 40 Mig okay at once and now there's some six packs and eight packs okay yep and I think there's going to be more of those within the next few weeks too yeah in that market too there's already brands that have disappeared sure like that were there and they're already gone and there's ones that have kind of taken over it's funny how quickly and I think as of now they're all pretty much Minnesota products too still they have to be which is pretty cool yeah yeah okay well and did you end up actually having to condense your inventory choices as much as you thought originally I mean were you able to keep a lot of more so I mean I had probably a you know one of the five pages long for burning it's now three pages Budweiser was 3 and A2 Pages it's now about a page and a half you know it's it's been like that with everything M just to keep beer has probably been harder than Spirits just because you can't have one case of beer sitting there you know 12 bottles of booze is a lot to sell 12 cans of beer is not that much to sell you know yeah so we've had to and we still can't get enough stuff to make it through a week I mean unless I bought just like half of what I do now in six packs and smaller format packages so there's um probably a lot of anxious uh like when can we get into the space we really need to stock what we really I mean I think customers are wanting that again mhm there's a lot of stuff that's been taken away that they just can't get right now sure yeah all all right so you and the staff feel pretty good about what you've got on tap for marketing in general and things you want to take I um absolutely good yeah I mean at the end of the day we're still the only liquor during Grand marray you know we need to let people know where we are we need to let people know what we have what our hours are that we're excited about this project but you know well you may be the only one in town but you're not the only one in County so um yeah all right anything else no our next step with the logo work is to design and hire a sign builder for the building so we're actually going to start that process right now our beer can that's right it's actually it's going to be a martini glass now we switch from beer can to martini glass can you get as much on a martini glass as you can with a full beer can you get a whole moose in one there you go well we're looking for something really showy let's hope we get that like a fish tail or something yeah we tried to get that to come with with the lease but he didn't buite it so our it's really bad all right um with that thank you Chris hey thanks Chris thank you we need a can we come back though and no we don't we're good thanks Chris can we go back to the resolutions that you just passed and I've been asked if we can just make some clarifications about what actually happened here okay so both resolutions oh are written in a way that if they are approved they deny the borberg request and so the Motions that were made seconded and then voted to approve 3-2 means that these resolutions were adopted and that the request is denied just one make sure that's clear all right then we're on to the Third Street feasibility study proposal um I thought we were going to do we got one intermediary now we're going to do the yeah but we have two we could do both at this point but let's do the parking license CU we have a guest for that okay let's do that true now we're going to get a correct name all right did Mitch join the meeting yes so that's the C share hello can you hear me sorry am I being asked yes and please just say your full name so we have that correct my name is Mitch ram ram thank you thanks all right new owner of Stone Harbor hello yeah I own a I own a company I'm from down in the cities and my wife and I are in the process of um yeah taking over the building that's currently Stone Harbor and our hope is to use it very similar to how it already is the only real change would be that the second and third floor which were like built for residential we'd love to be able to use for um like Workforce housing for ourselves and maybe some of our staff as well as uh shortterm housing so um really we're we're looking at it like not much will change except hopefully the second and third floor and so the parking is a big part of that and being able to do that it's currently used by Jack for parking um but we just want to I'm a r follower so wanted to get it in in writing and make sure we're all good there yeah appreciate that so this license agreement is virtually really similar to one that we have in place right now with East Bay Suites for the South half of the lot this is a city a platted City lot that we own Fe tied alone it's not a public RightWay and the reason that we own it is because there's a storm water pipe that goes from the parking lot to the pond behind the co-op that goes through this lot and so we don't really have a need for it other than to use for parking which is is probably how we would use it if it was just publicly owned uh but we do have a need to occasionally get in there and do some maintenance to the pipes so this uh deal that was approved for East Bay was used to help them meet our minimum parking requirements for their use and it would be the same for what we agreed to Jack but never actually signed paperwork on and what we're looking at approving tonight okay not Paving it we're not going to make any improvements to it this license agreement is similar to other RightWay license agreements where we're saying the user is responsible for whatever happens to it and that we can have it back whenever we want it uh we're not we don't have any intentions to do anything with it and it seems to be suitable right now for parking use if he wanted to make some changes to it then he'd just have to ask our permission and yeah we could talk about it the for myself the reason why I wanted to pull that from the consent agenda was just trying to understand so knowing that this is going to be coming before us at uh Planning and Zoning I was uh Curious to understand um so so they'll have parking spaces because we are because we have an agreement with them and is that I mean it seems like I guess we already have done that that is sufficient to me I was wondering if that was sufficient for them to make would that meet our parking requirement is that your question yeah uh there's no reason we we wouldn't allow it to um but I think we're not prejudging any of his request that's in front of Planning Commission so that's what Michael's talking about is there's an application in front of the Planning Commission next week for the use that Mitch talked about for the opper two floors and parking will be one of the issues that's addressed in that conversation I would guess yeah so yeah if if for some reason that you didn't approve this that would make that a very different conversation next week that's for sure and I was wondering even if I guess the question I had in my mind was like even if we do approve this you know we're making a a essentially a permanent Grant like we're granting him the ability to use that space for housing is uh an agreement of this sort sufficient to meet meet that standard yes and no yes it's sufficient in the sense that this is the legal document that we could use to Grant the permission for parking this is not permanent right and so what you're granting if you decide to move forward with his conditional use permit request isn't permanent either if it's based on conditions that he can't meet and so I think there's a way to get through that conversation y okay okay great thank you that's good to understand I wasn't aware that that that other piece was part of your consideration so that makes good sense so we don't charge a a market rate for this and that's one of the questions that the City attorney raised with me is is should we do that is there a market rate that we could attach to this because this is a commercial rental of space you could look at it that way and because we hadn't done that with either of the previous users I wasn't proposing it but since we're talking about it I'll just make sure you know what Chris brought up and is he spay they're not paying they're paying they paid a dollar okay yeah gotcha Fair got a question I have a question just one question um does this land offer Mitch adequate spaces that he requires that he needs or is that going to be talked about in Planning and Zoning yeah I think we'll address that more clearly with the Planning and Zoning commission uh I don't think that it necessarily does he still has to provide additional space Bas on his property so but we can start that out when we look at his request specifically oh yeah thank you I would like to add your well the city attorney's comment about rent to our next meeting I do this is not the time or place but I do think that uh does for for consistency I think that's a good point I'd like to see it on on our next meeting okay Captain I would make a motion to approve uh if there's well no further discussion or anything I make a motion to approve that um fight for something LLC parking license I'll second that would still now I'm going back to your comment again if we bring this up for discussion next time which of these uses does it really apply against this license or when you bring up the the the need for permanence but it seems to me that would apply to this license if there's any conversation about rental fee right it would apply to this license license not the conditional use permit yeah and if you're approving this license tonight it doesn't include a rental fee and so there won't be one we have a right to change the terms with 30 days notice I'm sure we can work something out either that or table it for next time if that's still workable rather than go back and re you know get be done oh I see what you're saying I think it' probably work better for the planning commission's conversation if they were assured but if you're not assured that we can come to a deal then that's just good to know and if we need to wait on this and have more conversation let's provide that guidance to Planning Commission that this is not a done deal and don't it tonight 28 so that's the oh because you're going to be meeting next week next week next wees yeah um and they can have a similar condition on their permit what have to slow down that conversation at all they could say one of the conditions is that he acquires uh sufficient parking spaces and this is the plan and we're still working on it so it wouldn't have to slow him down at all got it that okay I just think that's here for a minute because it's actually going to end up two conversations potentially anyways yeah all right that's okay then as well it'll go to us and it'll come back to well and then it's two properties of potential conversation if we're talking about rent we're going to talk to both of them right so that's okay then so then then I'm fine I get I'm tracking all right very good and then um s well we didn't take any action on this yet sorry um so I would like a motion for approval there's been a motion in a second second sorry we have shut the bo second there's been one all right and that was the end of our conation yeah all right so all in favor of license agreement for use license agreement between the city and fight for something Properties LLC Craig yes Ben yes Bill yes yes hi all righty all right we'll see you in a week Mitch thanks Mitch y thank you you he's still there thanks everyone appreciate it yes all right so now we'll move on to Soil and Water conservations uh cost share agreement uh around the green roof for City Hall um I was confused to see it on the consent agenda because I don't remember us having a detailed enough conversation enough to say we were doing a green roof do you did you have a chance to look through this or do you want a I just wanted just to understand you know right that that we Haven your issue is not the contract language your issue is the policy question gotcha yeah policy or actually just how this is going to work or would work I think is the question yeah well that's my well that is my question is is you know do we know what it's going to cost do we have we had that conversation and we so let me let me try to clarify all the financial part and I'll go back to where the last we talked talked about this so the last place this existed at a council conversation was the overall project budget and we decided when we bid the project out that this would be an ad alternate we wouldn't necessarily do it because at that point we didn't know what it would cost and we didn't know how we would pay for it now we know both of those things so what this agreement is doing is saying s swcd are our best local Partners ever have $150,000 of grant money that we can use to pay for a green roof and guess how much it's going to cost $150,000 we're going to make sure it does as a matter of fact we told mof when you're talking to the contractor on this we're right sizing it we have $150,000 for this and that's what we're going to use to build it okay so it's it's budget neutral to the project and it's our one and only way that we can do anything with storm water on site so the the confusion for me was the $250,000 match you know C gr Marie um I tried to clarify that in the memo but maybe I didn't have enough detail the the match that we're using the 250 is just the number picked out of thin air we're using 8.5 million it's already it's not additional it's not additional so it's not additional money we're not coming up with any funds they're paying for it and although some of my staff says really we're have to do a green roof and I get it uh we'll still have to figure out how to deal with this the seagulls and such but if we want to do anything on site storm waterwise this is our this is our chance and somebody's going to help us do it so I hope you do okay the co-op still have theirs yep they do that's I thought well I would put a motion to approve the S wcd cost sharing agreement I'll second that all right any further comments discussions all right uh roll call vote Craig yes Ben yes Bill yes yes Michael all right and with that that passes um now we are on to Third Street y feasibility study proposal my occasional cynical side says we could probably get this done a lot cheaper without involving as many parties but that wouldn't be the right way to do it and in particular because I don't think we know how we want to do this project we haven't decided whether it's financially in our interest to do this project and you haven't decide whether or not you're planning on special assessing any of the adjacent property owners for this project and to allow all those questions to just continue to exist what we need to do is hire Engineers to do a feasibility study so here is their proposal uh and not to exceed cost of uh $1,275 what do we get for that uh we get a preliminary design which is not a uh engineered design but it does tell us this is what it'll look like this is how big it is and this is what we think it'll cost we also get some what they're calling reconnaissance and consultation they're not going to do a site survey but they will just establish the existing conditions on site and and with talking with us and seeing what's going on uh then they will look for funding opportunities for us although I'm not anticipating any that we don't already know about for this uh and then they'll create a design memorandum and they'll do some project management during the process where what I'm hoping to have happen is some communication with the neighbors and some communication with the council just to make sure that we all know what's what's going on M and for those people that haven't been following this for a month with us this is Third Street between 6th Avenue and 8th Avenue I think this is our next step is there a motion needed yes okay if you want to did have a question um it's just a clarification from the last meeting um when Craig was talking about this I wasn't sure Craig is this the space you meant or did you mean even farther on Third Street did you mean just between 6th and 8th or from all the way to fifth or or farther on I just want to make sure well what are we is this a feasibility study for all of Third Street from 6 to 8 or is this from 7th to 8th 6th to 8th 6th to 8th connecting it on the east side of six Street where it's already wide right I would assume correct yeah Third Street between fifth and sixth is a 40 foot wide pavement uh it doesn't have a complete curb and gutter setup but it's it's a wide Street M and then 8th Avenue there's a curb cut for a 40ft wide pavement there's a c cut we're not talking about building a 40 foot wi pavement here I'd be really surprised if that's where this ends up but that's what the spaces on either side are right now and all I'm asking Craig is from our last meeting I wasn't I didn't catch how far you were thinking along six on Long Third Street was it just six was it as we have it here 6th through 8th is that what you were well there was a proposal to Wi at 5 ft I believe it was I'm sorry I meant are we starting at Fifth Street across or it is from 6th to 8th is that 6th 7th 8th yeah that's please help me here I'm saying this very well that's for sure the only stuff we were talking about okay just wanted to confirm what he said from the other night because I never quite got that going from six West to 8 is what I'm assuming is what we're talking about right yes okay just wanted to make sure that was what you had had from last week okay well my question at this point in time with this topic that we're talking about if going to spend $20,000 what are we spending this money on to find out what's going to cost to actually do the project or whether we're going to get money to help pay for that project or are we not going to get money to pay for the project um I wouldn't assume we're going to get any assistance to pay for the project uh what we're getting is a conversation with the neighbors and with the council about what the design should be and then a preliminary design and a preliminary cost estimate and a me mandum that explains all that that's what we're getting and it leads us down a path to where we're either going to pay out of pocket to do this or get money to do this or assess people to do this those are about only three options yeah and or I can probably in combination combination of all yeah yeah but for this 19,000 we're out of pocket to at least I understand that I'm just trying to see we're going to spend 19 what are we going to get for $119,000 and what's at l or is it a closed door that's kind of what I'm looking at how are we approaching this yeah and I think if what you mean by light at the end of the tunnel is someone going to help us pay for the construction of it I wouldn't expect it okay anything else no other than that I just really I feel strong like like it is a substandard with Road and we need to look at it and if this is the way that we do it and I'm I'm not one to say let's throw $220,000 at it and see but but in this case this is we we can't we can't afford to not do something with with third I feel very strongly about that I mean we took we spent a lot of time talking about that in our last couple meetings I think I I think I think we all can agree with that but I can also agree with how long have we talked about the gravel road behind the recycling center going down to the 7th Avenue that's been what 4 8 12 12 years now we've been talking about that and it's still a gravel road I mean let's bring a list then of all the roads that we need to study and we want to maybe lean towards putting some money into instead of we just picked one out of the thin Sky now because of a proposed uh building project and so now all of a sudden Third Street is the most important Street in Grand marray um I'm not against doing something in third street because it's it is narrow I get it but we have other issues around town too so I would like to talk about all of those other streets and try to put them in priority what we want to do what we're going to do um I don't know if anybody else thinks that way or not but um that's how I'm thinking right now absolutely we're going to spend $220,000 go ahead I agree with everything you you just said we we absolutely should be looking at at our infrastructure we should be looking at roads that are are are are substandard we should be looking at highest and best use uh who's going to be you know would most benefit from those improvements right and I think there was some Creative Solutions on how we pay for those things but it we if if we want infill and we want housing we have to support it one way or the other like we we we just we can't do nothing on these on these projects okay um can I divide this then and say that we have made a decision on Third Street to certainly pursue that we could add on top of that reviewing and yes we've had a lot of conversation including the fact is who even owns that street has been also a t i mean it's not just its condition um but a broader conversation and place that on an agenda item for the future and proceed with this I actually think going through this process talking about this two block section will help help you decide how you want to have a conversation about the next piece too cuz we're saying substandard but we don't know what that means yet and gravel doesn't mean substandard to me necessary no I agree with that so let's just wait and see how this goes and then we can start applying the standard and seeing what needs to get fixed so doing this as our test case and letting it be instructive yeah okay I see what you're saying yes we become aware that some things aren't that prescriptive yeah so that makes sense is that s okay okay well the qu the other question I've got I mean like is there is there any are they going to be looking at any sort of utility stuff in here Mike or like what like include in that I mean I think that's important as well the way their memo is written they're definitely including Utilities in the conversation I don't know if we can right understand what that means yet because there are some utilities serving the house that are already in that section RightWay um I don't know that 20,000 pays for a full-on study for extending water in sewer through two blocks where it doesn't exist in Solid Rock mhm so we can have a conversation about utilities there but I wouldn't expect this to create a plan that includes them okay got because it's not a full plan it's just a preliminary design yeah it's not for full make out all right build out with that said um I'd like a motion to accept the proposal for lhb for uh preliminary design for the Third Street reconstruction I would I would make that motion all right um a second to that a second all right any further comments or discussion all right roll call Craig yes Ben yes Bill yes yes Michael I all righty thank you we look forward to that now the 2025 budget like our actual first draft you see but what the heck does that number even mean uh it the levy that this spreadsheet is proposing is the higher of the two enclosed boxes on the Lower rightand Side $1.22 million that is um just over 10% or 15% more than last year's budg budget or last year's Levy so it's still quite a bit higher than I think we'd like to see part of our budget process is we do a three-year look ahead and so last year we had a projection about what was going to be this year's budget and we're off of it by $887,000 and that's not based on actual happenings that's just based on our budget and what we've approved so far and so there's some explanations for some of that that we know but I think there's more work we want to do still the the first pin in the ground that we made was approving the library budget and that was significantly higher than 3% uh which is the estimate we used last year to imagine what this year's budget was going to look like was significantly higher uh there are also um some other expenses in here they're a little bit higher than than we projected Ed so I think the 3% didn't pan out in terms of our expectation last year it's probably closer to 42% in terms of expense growth what's not included in here is any sort of new staff or new um uh programs or anything else so we're just talking about growth in expenses so let's look a bit of what this uh Levy is supporting the top row is a just a catchall we call it Administration But it includes everything that we can't put in some other department so it's really not accurate to think of that as just the administration otherwise we're doing great with a negative $336,000 Levy but we can't take credit for that that includes all the state funding that we get and other revenues that don't belong in somebody else's Department you can see that Planning and Zoning is not up significantly from last year because that's just a function of of uh raises and we know that next year here the at least the Union contract raise is in at 3% uh the buildings we've got an idea but I don't know how to tell you this we have we have no real idea of what our building costs are going to be in 2025 because this is mostly City Hall and so hard to predict uh I'd like to think it's going to end up being a little bit less than previous years because we going to have zero maintenance and very efficient building but uh so this could be a very conservative estimate right now and that could come down Public Safety uh we've got a number in here that is $140,000 contract for law enforcement that we're right in the middle of having a conversation about so I'd like to have some level of of faith in that number but I really don't right now um streets is up but uh that's just a function of of salaries and and typical expenses Rec parks same thing um the Rec Park revenue number at a million 590 uh will once again be a record number for US every year is a record number at the rec park this year's number isn't uh a lot higher than last year it's pretty flat and so that happens every once in a while we we don't ever go down in revenues over there which is a great business model but uh it's it's usually every year we get to look at this Revenue number and say we're being conservative we can add a little more to this if we need to I still think that's true now but not as much as in previous years uh we've got a uh YMCA contract again I think that is in the middle of a lot of different conversations but it's still there the golf is uh I just want to point this out that's $260,000 of budgeted expenses that doesn't include a fully funded Capital Improvement plan to take care of all the infrastructure at the golf course that is a get by and operate it at a level that we're still proud of operating it but that isn't enough and the revenues are I think we kind of know what we're going to get from revenues at that place there's $105,000 in public subsidy built into this budget for the golf course the uh other activities at the in our Parks departments Are all uh performing pretty well the city parks is up a little bit but not a lot the boat harbor is is uh still making money so those those are things that we know how are we going to get this number to move we're going to spend a little time talking to each department and so particularly when Dave comes to talk about the park we'll dig in in a lot more detail about what is built into this expense budget and what we think about revenues what's going on with revenues now what we think we're going to do with rates what can we really count on we're going to look at uh our building budget a little closer and see okay is it is it too big for what we've got going on next year let's try and do some estimates for what it's really going to take to operate this place uh and we're going to look at some of our additional Revenue sources one that's been on the list for a long time is the amount that our electric utility pays in support of the general fund right now we collect that in the form of a franchise fee a lot of cities use what they call payment in Le of taxes with a utility and what we know is that the percentage that ours is paying is lower than what uh would be a typical or standard or more importantly what a bond rating agency would look at as an electric utility and say is too high so we're going to talk about that number having to go up a little bit we're also going to look at what the utilities departments pay in rent uh and you know it's a little complicated this year because they're also paying a big capital chunk for the new building that they're going to be in but they need to pay a part of the operating expense as well which is what that $137,000 number includes quite a bit of um and then finally we're just going to go find toothcomb all of our departments asks and make sure that the numbers make sense to us we've done that at a kind of a high level now you're going to get a chance to have each of them in front of you in the next couple weeks and to sit down and you get to ask them some questions so let's start right now and see if you have any for me yeah I had one uh just curious about the the YMCA amount I'm forgetting how that is figured out because it obviously doesn't stay the same year to year no um and there was the the 2020 oh that must they were close but okay they didn't invoice Us in 2020 oh okay well there you go thanks thanks for that uh it's a contract we have with the county a contract that we've talked about um not being relevant to anyone's current situation right now in terms of the words in it but the spirit of it is Remains the Same which is we agreed that we would help pay for some of this outfit and this is the amount that we agreed to and there is an escalator clause in our contract that is one of the reasons why it goes up okay um right now it's the county that's telling us what this number is they send us an invoice and and we're paying it and the invoice they have complies with our contract that we have with them okay do we this is going to come up in my Council reports but um since we're looking at directly in the budget do we also contribute as a line item to the community center and all of its hings at all no okay we do not all right I didn't know if that was a way we funnel dollars through some of the other okay and the library's budget at this point is still um mostly affected obviously by potential Insurance costs we didn't see other pieces so I just want to read go over that one one more time there's nothing changing there um no not only is there nothing changing there but we thought we were being conservative with that number but it actually turns out it's accurate we need all that money to provide benefits so you do have a confirmation on the insurance costs we no still get worse but we know that we have employees that are going to use the amount that we have budgeted okay so when we have positions that we offer benefits to there's still a significant price difference for us depending upon whether they take full coverage whether they take coverage for just one person or whether they they don't take coverage because they're covered somewhere else right and that's something we don't have any control over but sure we have to be prepared for it okay well at this high level I don't have anything else any else no not this time we're aiming for your next meeting you passing a resolution approving a prelim Levy and so before your next meeting we'll have Dave in here we'll have have Ben in here to talk about fire department we'll have Lenny in here to talk about the streets department and the buildings and Kim and I will talk about the other departments the administrative and finance and other things that are included in here so you'll get a chance to look at the line item budget documents ask questions about it have a little FaceTime with your department heads and then when you do appr prove the preliminary Levy it's not the levy it's the levy that you can't exceed and so it still might be a number that you think is too high but know that we have three more months to keep working on it and then we're going to refer back to the calendar you included in the July 31st or or a July 31st that's right yep as our our scheduled calendar on that all right anything else on budget all right thank you um I you may or may not remember uh moving on to the rural Minnesota Community Safety project um this was actually back in March um I we brought this up uh at a city council meeting and for General awareness um this project um I believe it was clo I believe was the other community involved oh yeah it says that there and then um it does include Grand Portage and then here in in the city so they conducted their survey and now it is time to have a meeting to um present the results and at that time I had mentioned um some of this might be helpful in some as a reference document for future planning around topics that might apply so we could use it in that way potentially um along with the other there's another survey going out as well um or work that was done to on a different project but either way they they apply to maybe being helpful for planning and reference material so tonight I'm just simply um alerting everyone to the fact that um those results are there they are offering a um online meeting to review the results it is Thursday September seber 12th from 12: to 1:00 and Patrick you have that on the city's website now right so people can if they're interested they can get a link and um join in on that meeting and uh see the results of that survey and that was done by nor North span was Contra contracted to do that work so it it just arrived on her plate there was nothing we did actively um for this to occur so I wanted to make awareness of that I had um two other uh pieces that and now let's just I am going to share my screen there we go um and I want the entire screen all right did that did I click too F there we are biggest day all right um I believe Mike forward this to everybody so there is a inaugural state of the range address that is going to be occurring Thursday September 19th um and you can pick up the rest of the details there and hopefully you did see that forwarding of that um it's an RSVP and I would like to see at least one of us represent the city at this event um we can have more of course that would be welcomed and wonderful um is anyone at this had a chance to look enough to know if there's an opportunity they could attend or we don't have to settle anything I hadn't looked that much well Ben Bill any thoughts on this yet or you just want to take a look through still yeah I've got to take a look at my okay account um or Craig of course uh I would ask that September 6th is is the date but and I don't know what day a week that is without looking but um which I can do handily um so that's a Friday we not meeting on Wednesday the 4th but it would be nice to know by Wednesday the 4th contact do you want that to go to Patrick like or who do you want Alissa that be that'd be fine any of us frankly will work just fine let's pick somebody so it's not is that Lissa sound good I don't care all right so just let know and confirm and make sure that we have representation there for that um the other piece which has gotten already a lot of press but I'm just doing the same as well um and for also um our residents there is the SBA low interest rate disaster loan available and this is for any physical property damage uh between junee 16th through July 4th of this year due to severe storms and flooding and um have you had a chance to pop that probably not I just mentioned that today but once again we'll put the more detailed informations about that on our city Hall's website if anyone is interested or feels they would this would be applicable to them and I think we've been through them all that was it um of those pieces that I wanted to share on screen [Music] um all right I will come back to mine in a minute Craig did you have anything to report meetings no all right Ben nothing nothing Bill no just uh exchange with Arrowhead Animal Rescue we owe them a meeting dat we're going to put that on a council meeting they just wanted to know if they had passed the information LA and I assured them I did yeah all right so we have that tenative for September right and early mayor correction on the date for the i r state of the range address that's going to be Thursday September 19th I thought did I not say that no I think she was talking about the RSVP deadline which is Friday the 6th yeah yeah yeah that says referencing sorry about that thanks for paying attention got to double check yeah good um all right so animal airhood rescue anything else on that how's the building the the movement of all the moving Parts literally they didn't mention anything else about that they just wanted to follow up on okay the prev we do need to finish up that oper agreement we've said that before we need to no you you're in process of taking they have a proposed agreement which it's my understanding you are working on any edits and changes yes and then it will come to us that's where it's at we and we've talked about this before we'd like to have that completed and done before they're actually operational should just make sense so um we're working on that um let me just there we go um all right and anything else no I don't all right all right uh I had one meeting since our last uh meeting and that was with the NorthShore management board um one of the things they've been working on for some time and they had a grant um available to them to pay for this was just revising the management plan that we've been working off of for some time and that Grant timeline was coming due and there wasn't enough time to get the Plan update completely done there's been some staffing changes just a little bit of I won't say chaos but things should be straightened out and all colliding in at the same time so they're still looking at a potential extension on that Grant so that this plan review update can be completed in the mean time the other thing that needed to be done was um approving a ardc um to be continuing to provide the support for the norer management board so they do all the administrative work for that and that was a bit of discussion and that approval went through so those were the main two items at um the meeting I will say as a change of pace that meeting was held here at our community center that has not done been done as long as I've been on the board and that was kind of fun and now they're going to start rotating you always have an online option but um we were pretty much consistently trying to be in Midway at tedo or Silver Bay and now they're going to kind of roam around and have everyone host you know up and down the shore a little bit and you know if it's not a good day to drive you can still tap in and then um the county is represented represented by um Deb White so she was gracious enough to ALS it was dinner time um host food for all of our guests who and they and by the way it wasn't like just us and then a bunch of people online we had um three four other people drive the distance along with ar DC Group so it's very nice so that's my main piece to that and now um I'm going to circle back to one of the budget items um I've had several different Communications with the now tennis SL pickle ball Association they've added that on so that's good to see um and they have a few pieces they would like to purchase and improvements and I know on the past they've come for us thanks Paving and and whatnot um and I knew there's sort of a a chain to all of this so I included um Dave Mills on this and that was the confusion with where that goes through and apparently that's part of the um community center's budget and they're still coming back to us so I is would we normally just contribute to the Comm if we want if the city were to assist with this we have in the past what would be the chain we usually follow on that is where I was a little unclear gotcha so what what the council usually do is just agree to what amount they're willing to spend on whatever the project ask ish and then whoever is paying the bills will figure that out and I typically I would imagine it's the county that's going to purchase equipment but if it's the association itself then you're just deciding which part of it you want to contribute to if any right and I'm still waiting to see what the county I was told that the their budget at least for the community center's budget for the year which is understandable is complete but am I right to think that we will wait to see where the Count's at and then join in from there where's the county at James I can respond to that if you like thank you that would be helpful this should be more simple than good evening Madam mayor coun um so James Yori County Administrator my understanding is that the uh the community center's budget for the tenis courts is expended because we resurfaced um within the last year so we have zero balance in that line item so if the city wants to contribute to the purchase of I think benches and Nets is what the request was um we would welcome that CU we don't have any funds set aside to do that and then just a process so do you set aside a certain amounty for them each year or or in general that can be allocated to things like this over over time we have set aside funding for tennis court improvements skate park improvements playground improvements Etc um and so like I said with a with a resurfacing we're we're zero for this year yeah I just was like going forward how does and and it tends to be nominal amount so you know if again if the city's in a position to help cover this expense requested by the Association that would be helpful should I put it on the next agenda so everybody can look at it yes I don't know has everybody seen it no we really have we haven't because all all that's come through is a conver yeah is email conversations and I we've certainly been through about the P the um repaving and I remember all those conversations from prior years I mean a while ago um but I wanted to refresher on how we went through all of that and that was of course a lot more money and there was a request also for them to make sure they were were looking for all other sources of funding as well with this so um that's fine I think that would the usual processes Rod wabu comes to our meeting and asks us for money M he doesn't I'm going to miss that yeah no this time it's it's not and we do um Bob pranis will be joining us for that that'll be fun so um all right that that is helpful um all right that is all that I had with that we are adjourned I got one more thing I thought you were going to let Michael go too so oh no I'm good okay I'm sorry so um I probably should have put a memo in the packet but I was just so excited about this idea didn't uh as you all remember Neil is retiring at the end of the year and uh I'm happy to report that we have selected a final candidate made a job offer and he is going to be starting next week but we should probably actually hire him first so if you wouldn't mind please hire Scott Warner as water Wastewater superintendent I would make that motion second any further questions comments he'll be starting on the 4th he'll be working 3 days a week through October and then starting full-time so there'll be a nice crossover period between him and Neil where he can benefit from Neil's experience and knowledge about the system Scott is currently a Wastewater superintendent in new pra and we're really excited to have him that's great awesome I participated in the initial interview not before he actually came here so I put a little bit more in the no on that and I was really appreciated ative of his energy and um some experience coming to this and I feel there just yeah he can bring some new things to the plate so very nice yeah one more vote now that's all you got to do ah so with that um take a roll call vote Craig hi Ben hi hi hi hi there we thank you and you'll get a chance to meet him soon great yes thanks that we are adjourned