[Music] all right I guess we can uh go and get started here we're just missing EJ so um this is going to be kind of short meeting so goad and get started uh so I'll call the Halifax finance committee meeting to order it is uh 6:01 p.m. today is uh Monday May 20th 2024 4 uh this meeting is uh being conducted remotely and recorded by area 58 in attendance from the Halifax finance committee is uh Cheryl Zer Burke Michael Bennett Jim Walters Frank Johnston Bill Smith and myself Todd Dary uh and absent is EJ Brian uh so first order of business on the agenda was the acceptance of the meeting uh minutes which was from uh May 8th is the latest that was circulated has every everyone had a chance to review those any open discussion questions concerns comments it look good to make yeah me too everybody good yep okay uh would somebody then like to make a motion to approve the meeting minutes from May 8th Cheryl thank you Michael uh roll call vote Jim uh yes on the meeting minutes uh Frank yes meeting minutes from 0508 2024 thank you Frank Bill yes Michael Yes Cheryl yes and I am a yes as well motion carries uh six to [Music] zero all right so the next um item on the agenda was the uh the financial impact of the Town administrative contract so um Cody I kind of mentioned to you a little bit so uh this kind of came up is part of the uh the line item transfer request that we received uh pre toown meeting uh I forget the amount off the top of my head I think it was like 300 3,800 or something like that um and so really the primary question was um you know how many you know just this or 7382 I think was the actual transfer but you know from the finance committee standpoint we weren't really aware of um uh you know the contract uh you know specifics as far as when a new contract went into place which I Now understand was March uh but so like one of the immediate questions um and I'll turn it over to if others have additional questions to ask but really the more immediate question that came up when the uh the transfer request was presented in front of us was is that 7382 that was um put forth the total true up or is there more I guess you know money um owed I guess and so just trying to understand the uh the overall Financial impact there I guess so if it could start there maybe yeah sure uh so that yeah that's the full impact for the rest of the fiscal year um so you can see you know in the contract um the the new contracts effective March 1st so excuse me the uh s new the the salary revised total salary changed effective March 1st so the the figure in the contract isn't what you know what I'll receive for the full year it's just the pro-rated amount of that which was the the transfer so um yeah from March 1st through the end of this fiscal year is what that amount was and then you know as far as the communication aspect of it I apologize for that I mean not not just for this contract but for others um you know my mindset it obviously wasn't uh the best in the you know hindsight you know my my thought process behind it was we can't do line item transfers until May we'll bring it up as soon as May comes and bring It Forward at that point obviously that was not the best method uh so you know in the future what we can do and I I believe might have mentioned this to you Todd um is you know anytime there's a contract that you unaware of or that has changed we'll bring it forward to you as soon as it's finalized unfortunately we can't do so beforehand because that would be contract negotiations which are you know typically done in executive session and it can't be public if we brought it to you it would be public but we can certainly make the process more transparent so as soon as there are any changes going forward I I we can pass it along to you so but I do apologize that that is 100% on me um so you know that is something that I have taken in and we will change in the future yeah no exactly and thank you for that Cody and really the standpoint was just from um you know if we're going to be presented with requests for transfers just we want to be able to understand the picture as to what we're you know voting on or approving uh and that kind of thing so just to have that transparency and that was really the the main point of it no it makes total sense I I completely understand where you're coming from okay all right yeah so thank you for that Cody I guess I'll open it up to the rest of the committee any additional questions on this topic or what's the contract process I'm curious and how is the finance committee engaged if at all and then the wage and Personnel committee if at all so what's what is the contract process so I'm an employee I get an offer from who Whitman to pay me 20% more so I bring it in and I say hey man you know I got an offer for something else pay up or I'm leaving so what happens at that point um well I mean I I can't go into you too much detail as it was you know um done in confidence that aspect of it but you know what I can say is with there's only so many contracted employees so you know myself um and the two chiefs and obviously the board of Selectmen have oversight over those contracts TRS um you know in this particular case there was um you know I did there was another uh opportunity that presented itself um and in executive session conversations with the board it was determined that you know I think if if we were able to come to just a a fair uh compensation that it was something you know that um both of us desired and you know we we came to a agreement and that's kind of how how this came about um is you know they're contract their contracts so they don't go through uh wage and Personnel or the finance committee because they are the the sole power per um is with Master General law the select the select board has the authority to negotiate contracts on behalf of the town over $5,000 correct that is correct correct so okay so take um this isn't my intent is not to make this about your contract Cody because it is right I I would like to know what the process is so you know if if whoever has a contract with the town and is getting paid x amount of dollars gets an offer from somewhere else do I just take it to the selectman do I say hey man you know I got this you know we you know well and then what happens at that point well I think everyone is um it's there's individual circumstances many factors that play into it the biggest one is um what are we paying adequately for any position right we just did this compensation classification study so we look at okay um are we paying are we paying in the range are we paying are we paying too much are we paying too little that's a factor that's considered um and then also you know what if if what are the implications if we were to have to bring in a new employee for ever position right we're talking just generally here um what is that cost to the town in a monetary value right are we going to have to bring in an employee at what this employee is looking to get right and then you already know this employee so there's a value to just keeping that employee and paying them fair market um or are they looking for more are they looking for Less um and then you look at you know what is the cost of loss productivity right so if we were to recruit um you know any of the contract employees they're all pretty high level um there's a loss of productivity within the department within the town you know of at least probably three to six months so there's a if you're putting a cost on it right we we look at that what what is the cost of that and then we also look at what is the cost of you know the when someone new comes in if you if there's no one internal which in many of these cases we don't have an internal candidate um how long is it going to take them to get on board right so maybe that's another three to six months of kind of loss productivity so the you know at least this is kind of what we presented what I present to the board and the board's logic is what is the best is the best value what is the best option for the town um in a monetary standpoint and also an operational standpoint keeping in mind you know we we're not looking to overpay we're not looking to underpay and is it within the compensation classification uh range that you know the wag and Personnel did adopt at uh in the fall Okay I accept that rationale so just let me just step back because maybe I'm not explaining it correctly what I'm what I'm interested in is Step One is what and then it goes from step one to step two so it's it just between the contracted person and the board of Selectmen and whatever they settle on is whatever they settle on and then everyone else basically has to just kind of accept that uh or are there other is there another process involved well if it's the Town Administrator position yeah it's directly between the Town Administrator and the board um in an executive session you know with potentially negotiating a new contract um if it were one of the Chiefs what we do is usually that runs through me and then you know I'll bring whatever proposal on their behalf to the selectman and you know you know I I will provide kind of those things that I just detailed um this is the market rate this is what this looks like and then they'll they'll make you know this is what we're willing to do this is what we're willing to offer and then bring it back um to to the Chiefs um and then right if it's something that the board is comfortable and feasible with then we put together a draft contract Council would review it and then it's on an open session meeting um for it to be voted on and at that point once it's voted on an open session the contract becomes you know public and it's all public record and what happens if the finance committee doesn't approve the transfer um well you technically there would be uh the funding wouldn't be in the account so there would be a situation uh where you try to renegotiate with the person um if the transfer weren't done for you know whatever was in the account you would um effectively not be able to pay that person for you know whatever that whatever that period of time would be okay so basically the only parties involved for contracted employees is the board of Selectmen and the contracted employee correct yeah effectively until the contract is is ratified and then it becomes public and that and that's where I mentioned it you know the better communication on our end of in transparency of getting it to you guys kind of immediately afterwards which I is where we elapsed this time yeah that's all the questions I had thanks I I have a question as well Cody um is this the same process we we're about to make a big change in the town accountant um position after Miss Sandy leaves for retirement um does it pretty much follow that same rationale that you just described or how does that work that's a little bit different Frank because that's a wage and Personnel Employee so they don't have an individual contract it you can have a contract with the town accountant that's one of the positions under Mass General law that you are allowed to contract with um and we did we have in the past we we haven't contracted you know for Sandy but I believe prior to Sandy there were contracts in place for some of the accountants so if if it were that rot it would follow that process um if it were the same as sy's it would follow follow the process of wage and Personnel where any variances from the bylaw would require approval from you know both finance committee and the selectman um you know what I can say is we were looking at a couple of candidates bringing them in um a little bit higher than step one which requires wage and Personnel approval and that was brought to the selectman initially and then you know if they had kind of given their blessing we would have brought it to you um because at that point they hadn't even selected a candidate right so there was there was it was a hypothetical um but if one body isn't going to approve it then there's no point of moving forward thank you all right any other questions on this topic from anyone no okay all right so then moving on to the next item on the agenda was uh the funding transfer request we kind of just put this as a um placeholder just to have open discussion on like any upcoming transfers I guess so Cody I know that there was um the issue with the roof and then which turned into be a little more widespread with the structural issue and such anything anything developed there I guess to uh communicate or kind of same situation I guess as of now or um so you know we re we we're meeting tomorrow uh all of us in the contractor it looks like it so um I guess rewind a little bit so on was it Thursday or Friday we got that torrential rain the um which we you know we knew it was going to happen if it wasn't taken care of the building started taking in water so we um what we did is we put like a snow and ice shield on the roof uh to protect it you know that that should buy if we had to that would buy us up to a year is what we've been told um so there is a cost to that that'll fall within the existing contract the amount that we you know the funding we have put aside for that contract and we're going to have to um kind of restart here and figure out what we're going to do we we need all new architectural drawings um so it's going to be a while probably before we come back looking for more money what we're looking to do at this point is basically terminate the contract we have in place um compensate them for all the work they've done up to this point and then Circle back around and figure out our best game plan just because the the work that needed to be done that we didn't expect is actually more than the initial contract amount so we we can't just you know move forward with it even we don't have the funding but even if we did have the funding there's procurement issues and uh we need to kind of recircle and re refigure out going to approach this okay have a question regarding that to Frank um are we going to have to pay that initial contract in full or are we Pro rating that contract based on percent of work complete under the existing contract yes that is correct so we will pay them for any work that's been complete we had a thirdparty um estimator cost estimator Fogerty they do a lot of uh Contracting uh Construction Consulting price estimating we had them um you know we we gave them all the work that had been completed all the supplies that have been purchased and said you know what is a fair value on it um and then we'll we'll pay for everything you know obviously every all the all the supplies will be ours and we'll pay them for all the work completed but um yeah so we'll we'll get out of it whenever we've whatever has been done yeah so we're not going to pay that contract out and fold in based on what the um adjuster had um recommended to the town no no definitely not nope we'll just pay him for the work that's been completed with uh you know we had a clause in our contract that we could terminate at any time you know with with notification so um we're going to exercise that that clause and no penalties for that early termination of a contract no perfect okay that works and all the work that's been performed Cody that's was really still needed work I guess there isn't anything that's like throwaway work I guess that the town's going to be built for I guess given the additional issues that we found or not really I mean the the unfortunate aspect is they you know they stri the roof so the right there which we needed to do in order to replace the roof um but so I guess the really only added cost is we had to put on that snow and ice Shield uh which is kind of a temporary measure to protect the the building until we can figure out long term because we're just we're not looking at something where we can turn this around in a month we're going to have to re rebid the whole thing and that's if we you know can have the funding in place we're going to have all new um doc design documents then if we reach over a certain threshold there's certain different procurement requirements so it's not uh an easy you know terminate this contract bring a different contractor in to do the rest of the job it's so the snow and ice was an added cost but definitely there was really no way around it yeah so the building's functional um at present now then yes yeah they like on Friday it did start taking in some water so they went right back out we authorized them to do the snow and ice shield and um that's that sealed everything up and our cont our uh architect advised us we you know if we had to that that will last us a year expose to the elements okay but Todd I wanted to Circle back up to the um transfer um request um so refresh my memory from last Monday it's a little foggy um we we all signed off on all on all uh yes yeah one two three four five oh seven transfers correct correct yeah we didn't leave anything open we signed them all off correct no there was the so this issue that we were talking about that one um you know narrowly passed with the vote four to three but um you know we still was approved by majority so everybody signed the sheet and all right so there's nothing else for us to do there yeah yeah I just couldn't couldn't quite remember there's a lot going on last Monday no yeah it was a crazy day for sure but um but yeah no everything's all set there with the transfer we wanted just to Circle back just on the topic just to clear uh some of the points and I know Jim had a couple questions so I just wanted to you know give the opportunity for folks to uh follow up and I had talked to Cody um you know sever a couple different times as well in between the meetings and stuff and um you know to work on a plan as far as you know improving the communication going forward and uh we will be having like a joint meeting with the board of Selectmen as well to discuss that a little bit further as well so uh something we can proactively work towards to uh you know collectively Collective improve so thank you yep okay all right so um so any other I guess General funding requests outside of that um item there that we're expecting at all or anything any line item transfer Sandy that you know or anything not at this time I do expect one or two to be coming through but not right now okay all right all right thank you for that all right so then moving on on the agenda was the next up is the correspondence and as may arise so um I know that there were some various like corresponden and Communications regarding the town meeting and stuff I don't know if anybody wants to share anything or if anybody has anything um any takeaways they wanted to um to mention here you can do that now like I said we are going to schedule a meeting with the Selectmen to kind of debrief the town meeting as well so um you know you can certainly hold any comments or feedback to then which is where we'll get into more depth but just if anything's uh you know anything came up I guess that anyone want to mention you know that was the opportunity go ahead Frank um I wanted to ask about plon did they approve the um if anybody knows and Cody may know this um the police officer for the uh Cil Lake Middle School yes yes they did they did approve it yes okay yeah and so that's one of the challenges that I think we need to work on for this year so you know part of our initiative and as you all know to try to not recommend it was it's our opportunity to make change right unfortunately um now that it's approved and you know as as Paul had stated um during the meeting they just go to the um you know to the to the police department right and then they fund the position at whatever cost they didn't fit which we know is $85 an hour and then we get build so I think between now and the next town meeting I guess we'll have to engage them and try to see how we can you know address that contract issue in between the town meetings right so um there are there is no oversight of the contracts which is really the the big problem with the school right so they just say we need a part-time officer and then the bill comes and they just pass it to us whatever that cost is there's no one that's questioning um you know those costs and and trying to you know reduce them and things of that nature so so it's it's definitely an area of uh Focus or should be an area of focus I guess for this committee between now and uh next year so that's you know it's the not only the um you know the resource officer but there's also also the um you know the transportation for the special needs and in areas like that that are um you know Big Ticket items I guess low low hanging fruit I think that you know some substantial um wins can be had if we can um you know work to address those uh those invoices but you know I did look up to the average cost of um you know in Massachusetts of a um school resource officer and it's about $40 an hour which you know again we're paying $85 in detail pay so we're we're paying you know over 202 Grand a year right so I think that's substantial um and and certainly a lot more than a lot of the Motions that were made on the floor to uh to reduce you know salaries of uh of key roles you know within the town hall so um so anyways that's something I think we need to really focus in on and see if we can make some Headway in the coming months uh because next year is going to be a major challenge as well um you know with the increase that we're expecting from the schools so so that's that's two key areas where I think we can get ahead and try to reduce some of those costs but um but again we need them to uh be willing to partner and work with us sir right to be forthcoming yeah yeah yeah and also Todd if I remember correctly in the meeting we had at Town Hall with the uh school committee they had mentioned that this is the last year the first student contract I believe or or is there one more year after this the First Student Bus Services that I'm not sure Frank does anybody else know I think I think there's an option year left one one option left okay one of the things big issue with the bus was that they never reass them to reallocate knowing that they had one really long bus rad one really short one they never asked them to reallocate and adjust andig things out and see if he could do it with fewer buses or you know fewer stops or whatever so it just crazy go ahead Cher and do we not ask if is there a difference in price if say they all needed a certain location rather than we stop at every house do they charge us more for stopping at every home or would they charge just less if there was a group of them at one particular stock so we don't have those stops you see what I think it's the same it's the same cost they they just charge you by the bus so whether that bus makes you know 25 stops in the morning or it makes two yeah they charge you per bus all right okay and it's only the elementary kids that get the the door to-door service the high school kids all have groups group uh high school and middle school do have group stops I haven't noticed that in my travels early in the in the morning there's a lot of stops yeah I've noticed them stopping and some of these children seem to be their high school students well they used they used to do group because there was a whole bunch of kids uh near me on Hayward street and at each end of the street was a group there'd be one group down the South End one on the North End yes I understand that for the older kids but the little ones the yeah the little ones they go door to door yeah because I had that issue with my granddaughter and Hansen and um she had to walk up the street there's no sidewalks or anything they a very busy go in a Handover and she had to walk up six houses up the street to a house that doesn't even have any kids and that's where the bus was stopping so I had chat with the bus driver he had to turn around and come right past her house because he had to go in a Handover turn around and come back so now he's doing door too with her which is perfect you know 5 years old she can't be walking up that street you know right right no absolutely I'm a big city girl and big cities don't do that they did for the kindergarten show oh because when my kids went to kindergarten in Brockton they they got picked up at the driveway yeah mine didn't mine did not no no five six of them that met at one corner and that's where the bus oh yeah because my kids are older than you are so yeah that's true that's true all right anything else from the correspondence and as may arise okay all right so next up then was H public participation there's a couple people on I don't anybody have anything you want to to raise if not I guess um one point to make here I guess too I guess in um you know various discussions with folks I guess like we you know I definitely would like to um you know emphasize to uh to folks to join right for public participation is the opportunity for folks to weigh in and stuff um definitely want to look to avoid another debacle in a town meeting so to this extent where people have comments or want to understand uh the rationale for our decisions and things of that nature then you know this is the Forum to certainly do that we do conduct this remotely which does make it extra you know convenient for people to join right whether they're uh on the way home from work or whatever situation may be uh having these meetings um conducted remotely it you know lends a um you know opportunity to uh to join at will so definitely that's something I think we should U emphasize to the public and try to see if uh we can get more public participation on here folks to weigh in and uh and to debate things a bit further as we go um certainly have our challenges cut out and for the next uh for the upcoming year as well so something we'll have to work through um so and then I guess that brings us to the next meeting planning so there's a few different things going on here so as far as like our our regular schedule so um you know I think we should go back to our reg regularly uh scheduled calendar so that was um you know the first and third Mondays of each month so that's would be June 3 and June 17th will be the next scheduled um you know meetings per that calendar that uh you know Katie had published so we can start following that again given that we're past the crunch with the budgets and all that kind of stuff so we should get back on that schedule doesn't sound like anything's pressing so the caveat here is that we may need to add an additional meeting here or there if there's like an urgent transfer request that needs to kind of be pushed through uh you know we're not at that that point now certainly doesn't sound like so I think we should be good to um start planning out the uh the meeting so June 3rd and June 17th would be the next two upcoming ones uh the other item here too is in relation to the board of Selectmen meeting that I mentioned a couple different times um so I had some conversations with the select man and with Cody as well and so we want to do a joint meeting on uh Tuesday June 11th and so I think that will be it's not finalized yet I don't think Cody right but time would be at 6 PM I guess with them so um one of the so a few of the topics that we want to cover in that session will be uh the communications as we mentioned right so how can we better you know communicate amongst all parties especially in relation to contracts and just general communication as well how can that be improved what methods uh should be used you know the emails or them joining these sessions or whatever it may be uh for somebody to communicate and um you know into partn partner with them more effectively um also the recap of the town meeting so we want to spend some time just talking about feedback and and thoughts on the town meeting meeting um so that will be this a second topic and then the third topic will be the review of that uh the financial management review that Cody had shared and we discussed we we would uh do that at some point so given that we're going to get together it's a great opportunity to kind of cover that as well in that in that session as well so it'll be those three key topics uh which will kind of hijack I guess the select's meeting there so um you know a bit but so Cody if you can just get back to us and confirm the time I guess of that and everything but that will be uh again uh Tuesday June 11th uh go ahead Cheryl you have a question I will not be available unless it's going to be on Zoom if it's in person when it'll be in person yeah yeah I won't be day that's fine we can fill you in after I guess is is anyone else have any concern um is everyone else going to be available though any other plan Vacations or anything like that I'm good no okay I'm good okay um so yeah we can fill you in lat so the meeting will be recorded Cheryl as as always right so you can always watch it after the fact as well but um you know we can fill you in as well yeah make it uh and so I guess if there's anything that you want to have covered or whatever just reach out to me let me know and I'll will make sure that it gets uh you know mentioned as well so that way your feedback is incorporated as well so okay right um so that's the second one well any questions on that so far no that sound good any other topics I guess from anyone that think we should add to the meeting or is that comprehensive yeah okay uh all right and then so the third meeting is really just for Cheryl Michael so it' be in relation to the reappointments to the finance committee so we're looking at doing that uh either May 28th or May 29th I think we're just still trying to just nail down the exact date um we have to beat that too that can be done via Zoom okay um so I do have any concerns with being available on the 28th or 29th that say 6m no no problem no to I think we're looking at the 28th um we have if we're going to do 6 PM yeah the 28th I will confirm tomorrow but I don't think the 29th at six will work we have a um zoning by review committee meeting so oh okay okay all right so we pencil in 6m on the 28th I guess that works for you Michael and Cheryl it should just be like a maybe like a five 10 minute meeting it'll be pretty quick so y I'll send out the zoom link um later this week okay okay awesome we all don't have to be on that meeting is that correct Tod correct yeah Y and Cody the 29th for that um zy bylaw yes 29th at 6 PM correct okay okay all right great so guess again so the next meeting here will be June uh 3 at 6 PM via Zoom we'll continue to do this via Zoom for now until uh that you know the state um guidance their changes but um so I guess we'll see you all then I guess brings us to the end of the agenda would somebody like to make a motion to adjourn so move second thank you Michael thank you Cheryl uh roll call vote Jim uh yes on ad Journey Frank yes to adjourn please Bill yes Michael Yes Cheryl yes and I am a yes as well meeting is adjourned at 6:35 pm [Music]