e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e good evening and welcome to the Thursday April 25 2024 meeting of the school committee we have just returned from executive session and I would invite those here in the studio and rise for the Pledge of Allegiance I pledge aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all all right here with robot so the the um are yes so just for people here in um attendance just to be aware that this meeting is being recorded it is available then for Replay for people who are not able to watch live or who love our meeting so much they want to watch a second time so the first item on our agenda is public comment is there anybody who would like to make a public comment okay seeing none uh we can go into recognitions are there any recognitions that people would like to make oh I definitely wanted to make so we don't have Jack here today and maybe he would have talked about it but um I I'm not I'm not going to get all of them right but at least two of our high school um instrumental groups the band and the orchestra won Gold at Micah and so I actually got to go and see them the first weekend of Break um they played at the grotten Hill Concert Hall which was amazing I've never seen anything like it when we pulled up to it in the middle of nowhere it was beautiful um and they sounded fantastic so the those were the for all the gold winners in the state they all got to attend um so I know that it was their Bandon Orchestra and then um I believe one of the Jazz ensembles also won gold or silver I can't remember which one um because we got to see the Jazz Ensemble play this week at the high school so I just wanted to congratulate the musicians and certainly Mr hay and all of the the teachers in the program because the kids did phenomenal and it was just amazing to watch especially because our musical groups tend to be a lot smaller some than some of the other high schools and they still sounded phenomenal so that's awesome that's always exciting when we to see and our musical groups have done so well with Mr hay and all of our music department uh all right anybody else okay in that case we can move into the first next item on our agenda which we do not have a student council rep tonight so that brings us to the superintendent report okay thank you so this is the superintendent report for April 25th 2024 um in this report tonight you will very quickly talk about the naming of facilities we'll talk about the best high schools in Massachusetts Awards uh we'll look at some of the rankings among similar districts and I just started to do that work when I uh got those um best high school in Massachusetts rankings uh we will look at enrollment related to the Hopkins project and then I also have some great news from Micah echoing much of what Lori just said oh did I taste no that's okay we could have all the Thunder we like on um so just a reminder that we have on the table the naming of the auditorium at the high school the stage at the high school um in of Valerie Von Rosen vinga who is retiring at the end of this year um typically I will let you know if we've had any other information um on this and we've received no commentary so uh US News and World Report rankings you know that they come out with these once a year um hopkington High School this year was ranked seventh um and I think that there's a lot to celebrate here if you take a look at the list um we have two exam schools on there the John D o'briant School of Math and Science in Boston Latin and then we have three charter schools so that leaves Lexington High School at third in hopkington high school at 7th so I like to think that we were really the second ranked public high school I know they're all publicly funded um but I think that a a public school is a little bit different in that um your clientele are the people who live within your Geographic footprint so what is an exam School uh yes so you have to sort of apply to get into like a Boston Latin okay yeah okay even though it's publicly funded so that got me looking at some comparative data and what this chart will show you and it comes right off the radar radar data is we can take a look at our grade 10 mcast and the way they categorize it is how many students what percentage of students were either meeting or exceeding expectations in ela and math and then they lumped together grade 3 to8 mcast and who is meeting or exceeding expectations in ela and math um so I don't know why but I'll start over here on the right hand side and in math grades 3 to 8 78% of our students were either meeting or exceeding expectations in Lexington that number was 79 and um so that means that we were sort of second in that category among these towns and in ela we were 75% of our kids were either meeting or exceeding Lexington was 76 and Welsley was 76 and so you know in in that category where we're like sort of third there and that feels very good to be among those communities uh when we take a look at meeting and exceeding for grade 10 in math we were at 87 and we have Lexington at 92 but and uh Welsley at 89 but again we are ahead of all of those other communities and in ela we were at 88 Lexington was at 90 um whand was at 88 and again we're at the top of the Heap there so that feels really great um but maybe this is the part that um should make us also feel pretty great when we look at our per pupil expenditure and this is our IND District per pupil expenditure we're spending $15 15,682 per student if we look at the people on that list who are our sort of uh competitors uh we can see that Lexington is paying 2,352 for their students stents uh Wayland is at 21,000 I'll just Round Up Welsley is at um almost 24,000 and Weston is at 29,000 so it feels very good to um have our rankings and when we take a look at some of our subgroup enrollment that has happened over the last five years if we look at our students with disabilities and we had 476 students in 2020 we now have 600 in 2024 so there's been a 26% increase um our English Learners and you probably will remember this from our budgeting days in 2020 we had 238 we went up to 262 then 278 and now we're down to 213 so when we look at that fiveyear piece we have dropped by 11% um and our economically disadvantaged uh numbers of percentage is up 41% um so I point those out because we always say that it costs a little bit more money to educate students with disperate needs and um despite the fact that those populations a couple of those populations are growing we still have super high scores and a very reasonable per people expenditure um I like to think that with something like the English Learners it's an illustration of how physically responsible we really are when we when we budget the um economic disadvantage went up 41% it did but we have to be very careful to note that what we really mean is that we've gone from 207 students to 29 one students is that new movein or those families that may have fallen below we really no way of knowing that okay um and I think we talk about this sometimes when we're thinking about policy as well um so there's state certification and so you get from the state a list of students who would you know qualify and when you when you get that it really goes to our food services director that who and that person unless a parent gives us the authorization to do so we cannot share that information so uh we just wanted to talk a little bit about enrollment in the Hopkins project so I know people are wondering how is our enrollment tracking so this is as of today we have 335 students in grade four 354 in grade 5 and 309 in grade six if we lump together grades four and five we have 689 students and if we lump together grades five and six we have 663 and it's important to do that because as we look at Hopkins now it's a 4 five school and eventually it may become a 56 school you know that we have two different demographers one is Dr Arthur Wagman if we look at the projections that he did for the 22 23 24 school year in grade four Dr ragman said that by the end of the school year we'd have 322 kids currently we have 335 what he projected for 2425 was 324 So currently our grade four enrollment according to his projections exceed where we would be in the in June of 2025 um the same something similar happens in grade five he projected 332 by the end of this year we're at 354 and 337 at the end of next year so again our current enrollment is exceeding next year's end of school enrollment and in grade six he predicted projected 312 we're currently at 309 so we are pretty much tracking right on with grade six if we take a look at the msba we'll take a look at grades four and five together and five and six together um and we are doing that because we are using their numbers to take a look at the Hopkins school um and we had said repeatedly when we were making the decision about should we keep it a four or five school and just build a 2 three school or should we build a 234 school and make Hopkins a 56 school um in terms of enrollment that was fairly negligible because the msba was predicting 802 if it's a 45 school and 803 if it's a 56 School the differences in the way these demographers work is that Dr Wagman would project a number that he would say this is probably the actual number that you're going to see with the msba you see a whole lot of numbers in a chart over time and what they're doing is taking a 10-year average so the 10year average is what you see here with 802 and 803 so if we take a look at the number we have today where it's 689 this is the projected number for 2032 so we're about 113 students away from where we would be in 2032 which is eight years away um and for the 56 numbers we are at 663 if we subtract that from 803 we're about 140 students away from where we would be as the msba predicts it in the year 2023 can I ask you a question here um the first chart the grade five this year is at 354 if I look at the grade six projections they were 341 so if all the five grade five students move into grade six were already over next year's end of year projection yes by quite a bit without any movein or anything yes so I think it's interesting because way back when we got these original projections from Dr Wagman we anticipated sort of the bubble moving it was Kindergarten and then like we knew the early grades were going to bubble and you can see it start it's expanding into grade six now you can see that happening um I remember when we got these we thought they were high a lot of people in the community thought they were quite high and were actually clearly tracking right on if not um you know a little bit ahead a little bit ahead yeah uh if we take a look at grade eight at 3:21 Mr Bishop's senior class is at 286 so when they leave you can see the difference in numbers of students that are going to be at the high school next year 35 student difference all right typically our kindergarten grade grows a bit quite a bit between kindergarten and first grade so it looks like we would be on on track for next year to have every grade be over 300 kids I would think that's very likely yes except potentially the kindergarten but right um so just to talk about where Lori was I again I'd love to share the music Department's successes I want to thank all of the the teachers and of course Mr hay uh at the Micah Festival this year eighth grade course earned bronze eighth grade Orchestra silver and eighth grade band silver at the high school the chorus earned a bronze Orchestra symphonic band and concert band were all Golds so lots to celebrate in the music department here's a quick picture of the high school orchestra here is a very quick picture of the high school band and a fabulous picture of Mr hay I couldn't resist putting it on the slide um one Dean hansum took all of those photos for us so that was quite nice U and that's what I have if you ever get to go there like they have like actual con like other concerts there it is stunning and like I can't it was one of those places where we went into and was like where did this place pop out of you know and so it it's worthwhile checking out their schedule just to see what else they have there um most of it was for People of Our Generation and older but I would say that there are some things of [Laughter] interest the band just got a reboot right a post pandemic reboot but I think for coming out of the pandemic we had some contraction in the number of students in band right I had heard Mr hay had announced at the Winter concert that they were red dividing for two it was quite crowded at the Winter concert so I think they've now split back which is exciting it is he had emailed me to give me those numbers and say I don't know if you remember but they were at Hopkins school some of them on at on at the onset of the pandemic and that the very first thing we cancelled was a band concert at Hopkins he was like Tada so yes they're coming back to their former glory that's beautiful yeah any questions okay that moves us then into the uh school committee chair report uh payroll warrant s24 z20 has been approved warrants 24-5 6s 24-5 7s 24-58 s 24- 059 s 24-6 s and 24-0 61s have been approved warrants have been included in your folder and then on April 4th 2024 the executive session meetings from January 11th 2024 were approved and released uh are there Lia on reports that people would like to share okay none for me you the Adaptive playground is underway and citizan does an excellent job thank you um just the sustainable green uh we can talk about this next time if you want but they um are bringing forward an article to town meeting which is similar to what they brought last year on the specialized code for building um and they have a website we can talk about it next time I'm not we to go into it but they do have a website if you want to look at it it has to do with um electrification of new construction and maybe when we talk about Hopkins we can um just confirm that um anything that we do with Hopkins or with Elmwood is not actually part of the specialized code though I think we're well on the way to meeting it anyway but um something to take a look at if you're concerned about um going green all right that's great thank you all right so let's go into our old business and start with policy bdfb which is the CPAC policy I see that we do have CPAC members here in attendance I want to invite up I don't know um Abby if you want to come up as well to be part of the discussion oh yeah we got space right there yes hi so this is the fourth reading hello hi before we get into it do you guys just want to introduce yourselves um sure I forgot our little my here and I realized I forgot them we know you but I want to make sure that Folks at home I'm Jen Halliday I'm the chair of CPAC Jamie vonka I'm the vice chair of CAC Erica seel events chair excellent thank you so this is the fourth reading of this policy I know that um you guys did some work with the policy working group so I'm eager to hear about that uh Dr Kavanaugh do you want to sure yeah over highlights yes so as uh Mrs kavana just said this is our fourth reading uh we started this policy a very long time ago the first reading was on April 13th 2023 we looked at it again on April 27th and then again on May 11th and it got put on the back burner and it has been revived um so the policy itself is uh really you know just sort of a restatement of what the regulations in Massachusetts say it talks about the mission of the Hopkinton public schools and then it talks about the goals of the district to F relationships with parents and Guardians that encourage cooperation between home and school in establishing and achieving common educational goals for students and then there are the rags we did add a single sentence at that end of the first paragraph that says the CPAC the school committee and the administration will work together in accordance with procedure bdfb procedure one and so when we met with the CPAC board we did talk about uh what we had indicated a a good procedure might look like um so the first uh item on the procedures we really have not changed in the last year um we eliminated writing special education parent advisory Council many times and just changed that to the CPAC acronym um the second one we indicated that there would be time buil in for a midyear check-in and that came about as a result of the meeting that we had with CPAC and CPAC board members and we said that that meeting could occur through email could or that check-in could occur through email a zoom meeting or an in-person meeting uh on the third one we said that the we would establish a calendar every year with in a partnership between the school committee of the CPAC and the director of student services and we would make sure that the school committee invited the CPAC um to a meeting at mutually agreed upon times to share annual goals or topics and that would happen at least twice a year uh we included educational programming that and I think that that may have been a more recent ad um number four we talked about the posting of the school committee packet and we said that the school committee agenda and packet are posted 48 hours in advance of the meeting in a ordance with open meeting law and when a posted agenda contains an item of interest to the CPAC the uh chair will afford a representative of the CPAC opport of the CPAC the opportunity to ask questions and provide feedback on that item during the meeting um the fifth one is an interesting one because we talked a lot about um the communication that would happen between the school committee the director of student services and a school committee liaison and this is the language that the policy working group sort of settled on so it says that that group will meet B monthly throughout the calendar year as schedules and inclination permit and they would address Mutual concerns meeting has proven beneficial to support parent School collaboration and communication U and I think we looked at that language specifically because when we talk about procedure procedure will outline what it is that you want the administration in the district to do and that is what we want the administration in the district to do so when we talk about things of mutual concerns either party can bring something forward and that way there um this particular procedure doesn't control what the administration may want to talk about or what the school committee may want to talk about or what the CPAC may want to talk about and then the last one has been there for some time that the director of student services or a design will host a meet and greet for CPAC and the team chairs um in the fall so that's it thank you guys we have a few questions not on the policy but the procedures okay so I'll hand it over to Jamie she's got more notes than I do um so for number two we were wondering if the um because meeting calendar is referred to in multiple places um is this meeting Cal that's referring to the specifically the CPAC school committee director of student services meeting should that be specified um we're pretty sure that's what it is but we just wanted to confirm I think that I think that's I mean it's your procedure I don't know but I thought that was what they was supposed to be okay I just wanted to confirm because like there's other places where meetings are referred to so I just wanted to make sure since there's multiple kinds of meetings yes so are you asking that when we create that calendar if all of these referenced meetings would be on it is that the question I think she's asking what meeting calendar is it like the school committee meeting calendar or the you know the CPAC calendar specific there's just there's a number of meetings referred to in the document I just wanted to know if we needed to identify which meeting type this is yes I think when it says in accordance with the meeting calendar established in Partnership between the school committee CPAC and the director of student services at the start of each year all of these items so the midyear check-in the times when CPAC would be coming to school committee all of those things I think would be on that calendar okay thank you um and then another question on number two that second sentence that starts with specifically that seems to um we don't think it was the intention but the way that it could be read is an implication that the meeting calendar is limited to one email potentially as like the floor expectation so we were suggesting to strike specifically and write the word additionally instead because I think that captures the intention without the vagueness yeah that's that's fine thank you um no question I think we put that in there because one of the things that we worried about is that the last time we were all here in this space we had made commitments to the CPAC that we were going to meet at very regular intervals and that there would be check-ins with the school committee and the we feel like those things had not quite come to fruition so we just wanted to make sure that there would be a time to check in to say how is it going like are all the things that we've agreed upon as parties at this table have those things come to fruition so whether it says specifically or additionally as long as the spirit of that exists I'm totally fine with it great thank you um no questions on number three on number four um just two questions one and it's fine if this is the intention it's just a question um with the sentence added about the school Comm Med agenda and packet are posted 48 hours in advance accordance with mean law that was just to summarize um this sort of implies in reading it that CPAC is the owns the need to monitor the agenda and identify if there are items I don't think that's the actual intention I assume from the conversation that we had in the two working groups ago when we discussed it that there would be an expectation of open communication between the liaison and CPAC um just the way that that read I just wanted to conf like kind of identify the implication and make sure that wasn't the intention so I I think just and I'm looking at you guys because you guys have served in that capacity that that is the way that it my assumption has been that it there has been communication going back and forth around items like that do you want it to say specifically it's Leon's responsibility or just I mean I it doesn't so I think we can cover it in the second sentence to make it more clear um it was the implication that I was checking in on because I would think that that would be the the responsibility of Leong to make sure you guys knew that would make sense I just I don't know if that's something that I mean again that's a procedure for administration to follow and school committee to be aware of so I guess it doesn't make sense to necessarily dictate what whose job on the you know to identify a person but even just that it's cooperatively identified may my hope would be that there's that back and forth conversation and that it's not something that you're discovering when you see the agenda uh as a board that all of a sudden you're discovering something's on the agenda that there would be an effort on the part of the liaison or the the chair or somebody within um that to notify you yeah if we're having our monthly meetings anyway it should come as a surprise when something is on the agenda we should we should know about it ahead of time anyway but the liaison knows just to double check that we're in the loop there are very few things not not even CPAC related that are added 48 Hours within our agendas are usually planned a few days before that at least um in at the within 48 hours is the posting requirement and those things that are being added at the 48 hour mark are typically things that have to be added on because there's a sense of urgency so I'm trying to think of what would be an urgent thing that might happen that we wouldn't know 48 hours but there's no reason why that wouldn't be a conversation rather than finding it on the website that I think of thank you I like your statement about sort of cooperatively doing that because one of the things we did talk about in the policy meeting was that it's sometimes hard for us to know what agenda item might there are agenda items that are nebulous they just apply to all students which of course by definition would Encompass um students um with special needs so part of the partner ship for us I'm hoping is that you can keep an eye out and also be that um alert for us that hey did you think about the new building construction and the special instruction spaces and how they you know things that we are thinking about but we may miss something and I think you you might have a better idea of where the intersection points happen for that population than we do so we can try for the obvious ones and you know you can also share that responsibility um that would be great I think it would work well that way so I also wanted to ask like when we and I don't remember how this is written in the liaison rule descriptions but if there are procedures for the liaison rule descriptions where like this is a very specific need for this leason rule as opposed to like a different ason rule wouldn't have that similar requirement where there may be something in the quote unquote job description of leison to like remind that that is part of the responsibility to um to be in contact about agenda items that may be of note for that for the CPAC so I think that's something that as as a group we need to kind of put on our beginning of the like when things in May kind of discuss when we're discussing that first liaison piece to discuss what some of the specific things are we want to make sure happen so that it's not I mean I I would hope that that's happening with any like when we're discussing things with the budget that I try to reach out to Appropriations because some the Appropriations lays on to say we're going to be discussing um this this and this budget please come to the meeting that's a little bit different than CPAC because you guys have the ongoing meetings where that purposefully um raising things but I think that we should have that discussion at the beginning to reset on an annual basis so that everybody knows so that while at the five of us at this table know in six if we include the fact that you'll be here but um the in five years from now the school committee in CPAC board could have overturned and we want to make sure that that knowledge carries forward that the intent is to have those conversations and not have it be a a surprise for anybody would it be of any benefit to have like a CPAC list of EXP expectations that when you guys are picking your liaz on so you know somebody would know what what that those expectations would be before taking the position on so I think definitely like a kind of back and forth so that we have both what you guys are hoping for from us and then kind of what we're hoping for to be able to to be able to do with you I I think it would be also really um important that when a new leaone comes on board is to sit down with the CPAC board and say what what are your expectations of the leaon what do you need from this person in order to because it's so important to establish trust between the two entities and one of the ways to maintain to gain and maintain is to know expect exactly what the expectations are on on what kind of um thinking about it like if I look at an agenda I may not realize or Adam may not realize what might be of impact to you and um and I understand that you would like to have a heads up when things are when when a agenda item might be of interest to you if that makes sense I see nodding heads which means must be okay and ongoing I I I think I agree with everything you just said and I think ongoing as things evolve there may be things that we discover that we're not doing that would be helpful to be doing and that's ultimately we're here to and then we can always change the procedures too procedures are much easier to be changed right and also even just informally if you guys say we we really need this or that's something that I would hope that those conversations increase and be able to make sure that we're functioning in in the best way for all of our kids and all of our kids with special needs that's thank you have no um so in uh where were we number four I think at number four um so the second part second sentence in number four um when posted agenda items the chair will afford representative CPAC opportunity so because it would be an open discussion during a meeting um potentially with an agenda item that we were not able to specifically reach out to the membership of CPAC or even discussed among the six-person board ahead of time it would be difficult to ask or expect one member of a six-member board to represent the entire discussion and so we were wondering if instead of a representative they could just say Representatives knowing that we're not going to bring six people um but two or three especially if it's something new or something that seems important so that one person doesn't have to represent the entire board and membership yeah that's we just didn't want super specific with everything this has to out live the current board so make sure that it's yeah yeah and and I think you know certainly that I I I think specifying a number is not always going to be helpful so if we we say three and then there're only two of you or there four or whatever just pluralized pluralized representative what if it were changed to the chair will afford represent representation of the CPAC Community which eliminates the need for singular plural or okay lovely tons me okay um and then finally on number six um what what we had had in our notes that we discussed was an open forum and this says meet and greet and um I don't know if that's the same thing um it feels not quite the same thing so I we were wondering about that I don't know what I was not part of that discussion what is the so what was your question Jamie so it says host a meet and greet and so I don't know like what our drafts had had open forum and so we just weren't sure if that's quite the same thing um or if it is or if it is maybe it should just say open form since that's more clear to us but what is it you that's your expectation for that so when we initially proposed this and discussed it um in this room together uh we had discussed having it be not only the director of student services um and team chair but also building principles um and we can see that you know that there first of all didn't happen after we discussed it and um and we understand the potential exclusion of building principles um and we are wondering if potentially that with Team chairs um because there are the K to5 and 6 to 12 special education directors should those be included um but to US Open Forum sounds like there's more opportunity for actual questions and dialogue versus a meet and greet which might just be an introduction yeah so having done many of those over the years I can say I think a a functioning uh meet and greet always turns into an open form because we talk about things that come up so I'm fine with that language and you know all of our meetings have like a question and answer period as well as dialogue and followup conversations I guess I always picture and meet and greet people walking around with their cup of coffee or something and just talking to people yeah no I mean even this year we had a formal slide deck we had photos of every person with a summary so your meet and greet is a little more yeah and the intention really is to ensure that people know who the contact person is that they're building I think including the directors is a very smart idea um and my what I'm trying to get out of it as the Director is to ensure that we start the year with people knowing who to call if they have a question that's a and put a name with the face and so that's a really important foundation annually to do me greet sort of works or you want it to be more or do you want orientation or is it what is I mean I think our preference would be open for him but if we are establishing that that works for you Abby really the same yeah I mean my the locus of control I have really are the team chairs and the directors and I think um we have plenty to talk about all the time so that would be fine by me okay great can I just go back to four for a second because I was thinking and we moved on to five um would it be appropriate to say representatives of the CPAC board or do you want to leave it for any CPAC member representation is fine just um because we could designate somebody who might not be a member of the board but might be the expert in that area that could speak to whatever the issue is we were talking for example of the uh the adoptive playground right you might have somebody who is more was a child in a wheelchair must might be more know more and be able to speak a little bit more eloquently than myself yeah I agree and I think as a board we are um we are finishing our bylaws uh with a big update and our roles are also defined as like you know identifying who's coming to um interact of these meetings whether it's this meeting or the admin meeting and so it wouldn't just be a freefor all 20 people show up um we would be organizing and making a thoughtful decision about who we're sending um and you know when possible I think we try to have more than one person but representation leaves it open so that if there's only one person who can come we're not breaking our part of the bargain yeah I I I agree 100% I just in the world where none of us are in this are in these seats there's no limit to there's no by saying the border design it kind of least caps out a number that would be the board versus the whole membership so I just you know in to have actual dialogue at a school committee meeting we just there are just practical limitations I can't imagine though that a huge number of people would come well there have been T well we had six yes I mean you can't yeah sometimes they Po in but I just think I mean the reason we said one is because that's how we operate when we go to sustainable green or to Appropriations there's one of us there to listen and then say hey that could be of interest or we should follow up as a committee and get it on the agenda or there's one person we also would love to have all of us but because of open meeting law we can't so I get the the ask but I there's a practical limit if this the spirit of this is that you come up and have dialogue it is reasonable to put a practical limit on it is all I'm saying because what number do you suggest well I was saying the board or limited to the number of members of your board like a governing board or and you could designate someone else but not big board like six or I just just a suggestion because that's what we're were thinking we do want to have dialogue but we don't want to have the entire back just saying you know to have a dialogue we just can't practically do that it has to be limited to some representation is is all I think is reasonable so I guess this is an administrative polic procedure so Dr Kevin I look to you I don't know what you want to put in here but and I think also what you're getting at Amanda is the fact that this this particular portion is not talking about like if we need to have an open Forum on a particular issue that's a media issue that needs to allow for public comment and you specifically have a meeting for that issue versus a general school committee meeting where there may be an agenda item topic as you can see we have people waiting for different agenda item topics like it can't go on for hours so having it limited for those particular types of meetings versus where you're having a special Forum where you would allow for many people to talk and share their thoughts I think is the distinguishing Factor yeah that's exactly right makes sense yeah I'm comfortable with even just saying with a cap of six um because the if we capped it to the board 15 years from now maybe the CPAC board is 30 people so like yeah yeah with the intention of making this Live Well yeah that's com cing at six which policy the procedure could be adapted in 15 years right I like to think we're getting it right this time around but I things there's always room for improvement we can't predict the future oh for for example special needs parents you might think you're going to go at 5:00 p.m. and 6:30 you can't get out the door it's always good to have if you know there's two people going to show up at least one will make it right so that's that's part of the reason too that we would want to make sure that if we say we're coming that we actually are here well I think that's why like what you're what you were recommending Amanda made sense like representatives of the CPAC board but I also think it's funny what Jamie said about the board growing that big so maybe like you put representatives of the CPAC board with no more than six we can cap it at six the percentage You' grown grown at in the time that we've known you as your board has been very high what did they start with one just you okay you were the whole board the two the meetings were it it's gone very exciting did you have good meetings with you awesome yeah years ago it was bigger too but it went through its own evolution of people growing and moving out of district and so and then co co yeah all right so we're voting on the policy itself here um are there any things in Back to the policy that feel like they're not not quite right no notes okay no notes all right then I would recommend that we take action on the policy because it's been open uh and we've taken the notes from the procedure to be added in to be referenced is there I moved to approve policy BDF B CAC a second motion by Amanda a second by Susan I'm sorry we just talked about amendments or are we going to talk about that's the procedure we're talking about the it's the policy that we're voting but we wanted to the pro because the procedures attached in terms of they impact Each Other Well actually the procedure is is referenced it's just not voted as I was reading oh yep okay got it but it it makes sense to discuss them all together and to make sure that we have the intent behind it clarified for understood so the policy the only changes working in accordance with the procedure is the new language and then the rest of what we were just talking about are changes to the procedure go all right sorry don't mean to interrupt the motion that's okay so it was a motion by Amanda with a second by Susan all those in favor I we unanimous um thank you so much for coming out and for all the time can I make two quick plugs of course one one I would just like to thank the community uh best buddies is having their promt tomorrow night and we got a last minute request for decor and snacks and water and that sort of thing and we reached out to the community and within a few hours we had everything they needed so they're setting up tomorrow and I 6:00 to 8 tomorrow evening at the high school uh best buddies is having their PRS that's super exciting what time is it 6: till 8 and uh I just wanted to because we're not going to be here probably before May so I just wanted to thank Amanda for all of her work that she's done with the school committee over many years and also thank you as well for stepping in at the last minute to uh to help out with school committee so I wish you guys luck and uh thank you very much for working with us yeah thank you thank you thank you guys see you later see you later a good night all right so that then brings us into new business the uh first thing is the Hopkins lower middle school project to invite [Music] good evening thank you for having me uh Jeff Deo uh project executive from the vertex companies own as project manager with me is uh Rob Blanchard project executive from Commodore and Kate and Ricky uh the project Managers from commodor in the audience as well so we're here tonight to give you an update on the project uh we've been very busy over the past couple weeks since we had our last meeting so we're going to give you some status updates on where we are there's a couple of votes we're looking for tonight from the committee uh so the agenda we're looking to cover tonight is a vote on some of the proprietary building components uh which are things that the school has standardized throughout the district um but because of um Mass General law we have to vote that in in order to make it proprietory and so I have in your packet um the one for Hopkins Elmwood is the same I brought both tonight there's a there's one variant there as it relates to the hardware itself which I'll get into in a second and then Bob and I are going to give you an update on the project itself uh that work we've been doing over the past few weeks as well as the cost update and then I will give you an overview of the total project budget for the number that's going to go to town meeting and then also uh give you you a view of what that looks like as it gets presented to the public and lastly uh the plug for the upcoming Community Forum which is uh next Tuesday April 30th uh here graciously hosted by hcam but also available remotely to everybody at home so please tune in and then also want to remind the public that town meeting uh may go multiple nights so it's not just May 6th you need to turnout for but potentially May 7th depending on definitively May 7 definitely be S I'm an optimist but well for the bulk of this for the entirety of the meeting yeah okay so a bit on proprietory items and so uh because of Mass General law in order for you to not have an open spec which means you have a to provide a minimum of three or equals um towns and cities are allowed to determine that certain elements of the building are proprietary because they fit with the overall systems that you've uh accepted districtwide and so in order to do that you need to take periodic votes to reaffirm that Elmwood and Hopkins are the same here I'll just flip to the Elwood for a second to show the items that are both so in this case items that are standardized across the district are it systems Hardware so you want to make sure that your security systems are all in um in in unison in terms of the components that are there for the genitech video cameras for the wireless access points uh the Aruba switches which is your your um your brain of your it room as well as the Mosaic POS switches which is your cafeteria equipment in terms of uh scanning uh for student lunches and then the Vivy display manager so again back of the house stuff so that's all stuff we've worked with the shoke and his Department to determine these are the standards and we're looking to uh reaffirm that for these two upcoming projects in the case of uh the lock cores we've worked with 10 persons to determine what are the standards across the district and so this is to make sure that the keys in one building can uh work in the others with their staff so they have exterior cores uh licensed through medicar systems and then interior cores uh through sfic and so these are the votes that we've talked about a shoke and Tim with that we' be needing for both projects the difference uh on Hopkins here is at the top of the screen here and so because that's an existing building that we're adding to on that particular building uh Tim also wants to keep the um Hardware so the the door handles thems the closing devices he wants to keep the addition the same as the original building itself so he added in there the door closers through LCN exit devices through Von dupin and uh morto slocks of schle and so uh we're looking to receive votes for you tonight if you're uh be so willing any questions my only question was about the door hardware because we just voted on Tuesday with the esc2 the other ones I wait a minute yeah so thank you for explaining that yeah the uh just to clarify what that is with the um for the Elwood project the msba does not recognize ad hoc committees so they recognize elected bodies and so that's why it would have have to come before the school committee or in some cases on a Town project the select board the ones that are authorized to make those types of votes okay so we need a motion to approve the list of proprietary items as provided that's the yep yes for the Elwood and Hopkins project oh do we need to say both just if you if you reference the two schools that would be okay would be um we check the box with the msba I'll put it that way I move to approve the list of proprietary items as provided in the agenda materials for the mwood and Hopkins school projects by Elwood we mean charleswood sorry yeah we'll work it out took a while to work out of the Lexicon yeah okay so motion by Lori second second by Adam all those in favor I okay that's great thanks G turn over to Bob uh giving a just a project update from the last time that we met uh we've done several several different um projects on the over at the school recently last week April vacation we completed the uh test pit Wells we drilled about 20 Skate 22 uh test built borings so we just went down to rock uh we wanted to verify where The Rock was in relation to what the new foundation design is going to be just gives us a better idea of the subsurface conditions um so we did the uh borings uh we attended the uh Conservation Commission meeting two weeks ago uh that went really well we have a couple deliverables back on the next Conservation Commission meeting but everything seems to be going well with the Conservation Commission um just the other day we completed the um 60% reconciliation on the budget I think we're going to talk about that in just a little bit uh that went really well as well um both us and um pm and C that's the third party uh estimator are in line with each other on the budget now I think those are the highlights of the items that we just recently commed yeah I also want to reference just the planning boards we had our first planning board hearing as well this past week and so uh the permitting process is iterative so we we go before them we present we collect their feedback and then we have to resubmit as Bob alluded to so there are follow-up scheduled with both those boards um Bob and his team also in addition to the borings did additional due diligence in the building really trying to you know turn over the existing look behind the mirror if you will the existing building uh looking at some of the mechanical equipment and make sure we get the right amount of information on the bid documents and so there's a lot of that work happening recently the two estimates that we are going to talk about next are we reconciled both of the designer estimate which is uh PM andc through Perkins as well as the Commodore uh team and they've done their due diligence and then vertex as well as the commissioning agent that you authorized at your last meeting have also done a drawing review we've sent all that information back to Perkins so they can incorporate in the final documents so uh we've been very busy over the month of April and uh churning through a lot of information as we're getting ready to go out to bid uh at the end of June which is approaching the um the scanning that we did last week was the finish the balance of the uh what's called the Bim scanning or the point Cloud surate so we finished that last week and then we'll be turning that over to the design team shortly that's the 3D Bim model that they'll be creating of the existing school any questions on the last month with the work okay proceeding on um we want to talk about costs so um I'll first say that the two estimates that were completed uh before I get into the slide busily colored slide here the two estimates that were completed were done by uh both commodore's team and pmnc and those estimates are consistent with the estimates were done back in March so the good news is we dialed in the scope um this committee gave us the authorization on the value engineering exercises that you've done those have been Incorporated we've gone through another round of of estimating to really drill down on the numbers and feel about the number presented last time is in alignment with where we need to be and so that's the number that we're looking to move forward with uh the current estimate is consistent with the estimate that was done a month ago so what that means to the overall project itself I wanted to break down for the committee risks right because you're going to appropriate a number at town meeting before we have all the bids in hand and so it's important to talk about what risks are what the contingencies are within that number so you understand why we've assembled and recommended this number for you the Carlo reper reprs the the items on top kind of correspond to the contingency number below so I just wanted to uh have you follow that visually and it looks like one got kind of cut off the screen too which I can got a full screen mode there we go so the remaining risks and design and so we're at approaching 60% construction document so we have two more months of design over that time period we're going through those two parallel perming processes so the the permanent groups will add items they always do um there may be some mitigation there may be some requests that they go through so there'll be some amount of money that'll be added back to the project for that um the market will tell us what the market bears in terms of bidding conditions so we carry an escalation Factor within the overall construction estimate at the moment and then additional details and design work the the design isn't done they're finishing their drawings they're remembering to add those uh dot the eyes and cross the te's and so all that ends up with extra items and extra dollars and so what we do in green here is there a 4% design as estimating an escalation contingency and so that's because we're not totally done with the design and we've appropriated that into the design and estimating and then the escalation components itself between now and when the numbers will come back so all those items in Greening above uh reflect in that uh 4% number below now all that will get folded in the final hard bid number that we get this summer uh and that gets essentially dissolved within the construction number that you'll approve this summer the item in blue is that the uh you've chosen to hire a construction manager they're a partner in the process uh they come informed and they have the ability to access dollars within the contract and so as part of their contract you've already approved there's a 2 and a half% contingency within the GMP number so that's within the cost estimate that's already been established by Commodore and what that does it picks up things such as omissions and the drawings that weren't detailed right but we've talked about and they're generally aware of uh phasing Premium schedule changes and other things that come up along the way at the discretion of the the OPM the CM and the work group you know we'll work with them to you know spend that money in the appropriate buckets as we go forward and so that's within the construction number itself outside of the construction number is change order risk change orders are related to we're working under existing building fortunately it's a newer building so there's not a lot of Hazmat that you'd find in an older type building but as we open walls excuse me and connect the old to new there's additional costs that come up and so there's the ability to have uh change orders so that covers unforeseen conditions in the building and then more so in the site as Bob alluded to we were drilling to find where the ledge is but we're still just taking a kind of peephole into those 15 to 22 locations that Kate referenced and so it may jump up or down in between those points in time so there's additional money that may be needed and so all those yellow items uh roll up to a 7% um change order contingency and 7% is a number we carry on ad Rena projects if this was a new construction like elud it would be a lower percentage such as 5% because everything's on the paper versus is working around the existing conditions and then lastly uh the item at the bottom that's not colored is a a 6% so less than 1% for an owner soft cost contingency which is about $250,000 uh and that's to pick up any overages in FFN or technology or if there are other requests that come in for the Consultants to do additional work and so all that rolls up into your overall escalation buckets and uh and contingencies on the project where we are in the overall project with the total project budget uh 3 million has been appropriated to date um the construction number was reconfirmed and it's at 41,43 5,000 after the ve that you guys accepted and reflective of the updated numbers that that Commodore has provided the soft cost has remained essentially the same as it was presented to you a few weeks ago just shy of $8 million so the total project budget inclusive of the previously approved $3 million is 52,500 this does not include the relocation of the modulas which is earmarked at about 1.5 million that's escalating it out to when we believe that would come back to the project such as 20207 those modular are needed until the end of Elmwood until Elmwood becomes charleswood and um and so at that point we envision there'll be surplus funds left over from the Hopkins job that's then completed and surplus funds left over from uh the Elmwood project itself and so potentially at that point you may go for a town meeting vote to reallocate you know those dollars associated with that to then move the modular over um so I just wanted to be clear on that As We Lay that up I just want to highlight that because that's been a piece that's been discussed in the community is that that $1.5 million may be added on top of but the anticipation here is that that money is actually coming out of things that are allocated so it would not potentially be an additional cost that's correct I mean with both these projects you that that are being managed in the town you know you appropriate the money before at the beginning right so you got to go through design and then we've got to bid it and then you know all things being equal there'll be plenty of money left over especially in the Elmwood itself which you know had more uh capacity from a percentage standpoint because it's a much larger job so um you we envision that that there's more than enough money left in the Elwood and the Hopkins will play out the way it is Hopkins is a more lean budget you know we've been conscious uh through your direction to keep the number tight and to get just the minimal scope that's necessary in order to deliver the extra space in Hopkins so elmw as a larger project has more capacity um than the Hopkins project itself and then this is where it you know gets confusing so I tried to break it down for how I Envision this being explained to the public at town meeting and this is just a draft to present to you guys and certainly uh he for feedback on it so I broke this into kind of three bullets and so the total project budget as you saw on the prior slide is 52,500 so that's being transparent to the public it's everything we think the Hopkins project is outside of the uh modular that we discussed and so three million has already been appropriated so the remaining construction phase funds is 49,4 so that's the new dollars that essentially we're looking to move forward with from here forward of that last year $850,000 was approved for mechanical systems upgrades to Hopkins now those are rolled into the overall project the overall project goes forward that cost gets uh handled from Commodore and and moving forward the where it breaks down from there is the 48 m550 which is the number I talked to you about your last meeting which is the additional funds needed at this town meeting and that breaks into three buckets one there's an earmark for $700,000 for additional mechanical equipment upgrades for Hopkins and that's been on the books for a while we've kept that there as an as an elemental number uh should the Hopkins renovation project not move forward there's still upgrades that are necessary to the Hopkins school and so that 850 from last year and the 700,000 are are items that need to be replaced at Hopkins because they're end of life if the Hopkins project itself moves forward as we're discussing tonight both those elements would be folded into the overall number that is being presented here so it's it's all within the number but there is elements that are uh were earmarked in in separate Appropriations the article Susan correct me is it 19 for the project Hopkins project Article 19 is the Hopkins school project itself and so in that article it would comprise uh there is $1,646 th000 of reallocation of unissued but authorized debt so prior projects that were finished under budget that money's been uh you know collected up and is being put back in front of the town to be reauthorized without a new tax impact that's important to the public um that that 1.6 million is not an impact to their taxes from a projection it was already accounted for under prior projects the new debt request is 46 m204 and so that would be the new impact that would be uh affecting a tax impact on the public and then I I do want to note the very important footnote here that doesn't have a number associated with just TBD which is the IRA inflation reduction Act and the Mass Save because you're adding geothermal Wells because you're adding electric systems and I know you referenced that earlier with the green U initiative uh we are putting electric replacement equipment in the building itself you're eligible for rebates those rebates may be $ 1.3 million to $2 million so of that 4 6 million we don't believe the Talon will ever get to that number because you'll get those rebates but the reality of that is they're rebates after the fact so you you pay your bills you open the building and then you get the check back through the feds and so towns always borrow on the short-term band and then the long-term borrow and so you know that's where that money even then folds back in uh before you get to the long-term um borrowing so kind of in the band borrowing range so I know that's a lot of information uh you guys are following closely so you you'll understand it more than the public but we wanted to kind of lay this out logically and explain the kind of steps that have occurred can I ask a question of course so I have two full question one can we borrow the guy Bill from last year's presentation to explain all this because he was an awesome orator for town meeting but two the 700,000 piece I honestly feel like that's going to be the most confusing aspect for the public on this because you're we're having to vote that separately right like that's going to be a separate warrant item so the nice thing about it is wow that volume's loud I know I keep hearing myself um the 700,000 is literally the article before so okay the 700,000 will pass or not pass and then Article 19 is Hopkins so as we're speaking to it we can reference the funding that was just passed in the previous article and so if it doesn't pass do we have to do an emergency Amendment to the next warrant article to like if the 700,000 does not pass then yes the number the funding on the floor would have to change it now to clarify and and I don't get out of my depths but you're going to you're going to modify the number on the floor either way right because right now it's currently listed as 48550 um I'm checking to see whether or not they updated the one warrant the warrant that I have printed is not the correct numbers um but I don't know what draft version they're at at this point in time so where articles so article 18 is the 700,000 in HVAC and Article 19 is Hopkins okay there other elements within 18 no okay yeah it's a standalone article I mean we all know and I will admit this from prior Town meetings where I have not been on a board that most people walk into town meeting not having read the warrants so the explanation of this has to be exceptionally clear that's my biggest concern it's not actually that the town being supportive it's about them understanding what this all means agreed and I I was really wish that we were voting this project first because if I'm when not if when I am a voter why would I vote to put money in a project where I know I'm going to be replacing like mentally you're thinking why would I vote for the 700 when I I don't I know I want to vote for the school and I'm hoping it passes it's it's a bit like awkward order we might want to see if we can switch that well um the the public needs to understand that we have gone to town meeting for several years now for these mechanical Replacements it's an end of life cycle replacement through all the schools so we have a 10-year plan that shows the life of every unit within all five schools so there's a cycle and they've been spread out because if you look at the building of both Hopkins and the high school they're both built at the same time so in terms of a life cycle you would be replacing all the Mechanicals in both Hopkins and the high school at the same time not feasible for any community so we've spread those out through a number of years so if the life is 30 this one we're stretching to 31 and this one to 32 so this is a a request that has come to town meeting for several years in a row right I and I appreciate that um also the explanation for the community but if if I'm voting the school then I won't have to you know it's included you know I guess but that's not how they're doing it like they're taking it out so I think that's what you're saying Susan is that the number isn't right because you'd have to take out the 700,000 we're reducing the amount of debt that you would ask the community for because 700,000 of the work to be done in the building is part of another article way back when we very first started this project um it was not the original numbers and Jeff you can correct me if I'm wrong the original numbers were not all fully electric for within the building so because within the building we're at end of life we started trying to pull in and grab on to the new addition to pull in that green effort within the existing building so I think the important thing that we're going to have to be able to answer and it s I mean I know Jeffy already said this but like is to explain that that 700,000 regardless of what you vote for the school is a necessary expense because of the end of the life of these mechanical systems and so we're asking for this regardless of whether or not we are talking about the school and that these are the repercussions if you don't vote it and then when you get to the school element we then have to explain that we will be incorporating that work with the new school project and it's not going to add more expense to the school project because this has already been voted on separately right and so is the money for like the 700,000 come out of a different Bucket from the town like you were saying it's it reduces the debt ask but so is it because it's under a certain amount that it would come from a different it's the way they do their articles if you will so the HVAC replacement was a standalone um debt or Capital request okay Hopkins was a standalone Capital request now the 700,000 if Hopkins didn't pass was a gas one for one replacement if Hopkins passes we can tie into that addition and make it a green replacement either way that replacement within the existing building has to happen got it any other questions is that a question on the contingency Slide the um two 2 and a half% is the blue line the place where we would capture it says schedule requirements um because it is an occupied school and there's a whole lot to be managed around doing this work and having school in session I don't know I'm imagining we might end up in a like having to make some interventions that we didn't anticipate that I guess the 2 and a half% is the lowest um contingency and I could see us ta that if that the blue is the line item where we would tap something that might be as a result of scheduling and phasing and moving kids or creating recess space but you know what things that we're doing that I know are in the plan there probably a few that aren't in the plan they're going to come up and is it in the blue that we' capture it and is two and a half% enough is really the question the the Two and A half% is for misses on the job for you missed a door you missed a wall but we know it's there that's what the 2 and a half% covers okay we know it's going to be needed nobody picked it up that's what it's going to be for if it's a phasing question if there was enough in contingency we could use contingency but we also have the contingencies of the uh four I'm sorry the 7% of unforeseen conditions was that the what it was yeah 7% essentially a change so you know my version of that in B and I will always have a playful conversation on this is that the the CM contingency although he believes it's you know it's in their control it's in their control at our control as well so it's within the GMP they can move it use it but they have to get authorization from us to how they spend it down you know within certain limits um and so off hour work meaning you know premium time to have somebody come in on a Saturday to do something because it's mcast test or whatever like that you know that's traditionally how I've used that in cooperation with Bob and now as long as he's not at the low end of that 2 and a half% there's never been an issue with other CMS working that that that we use them for those types of things so you know it works uh for you guys because that's why Bob's here to deliver the overall project for you and we'll work around the specifics now if we were to holistically change phasing then that would be a complete change and Bob would come to me and say that comes out of the yellow Jeff you know you've you've not lived up to how you've described this project in terms of a schedule you've asked to make us to make major changes that should come out of the yellow the the sculpting of the schedule can come out of blue or yellow okay that's helpful so there are two buckets essentially if needed but probably it can be accommodated yes yeah it's definitely two buckets and they're very separate we'll always fight over that all right we know who is presenting this at Town meting it's not me I this is what you got right here God's speed this is just for me it's not like you've done it before it's just that there's like a core group of people in the town that are paying attention and that will walk in and like know what this all means and then you have the other 300 people if we're lucky I guess to get that there 600 at the last one I know um and it's not it's not the fault of those people it's just you know it's busy and trying to keep up with everything that's happening is a lot but I'm just worried about the complication of it all and explaining because it's very different than a new school project and we haven't done a like hybrid like this in a long time that I'm aware of so it's I just think that part of it is going to make it almost like seems like that might have to actually present with what is going to occur that if if people haven't been paying attention that they're going to take Hopkins and add on to it and when it's oh yeah I mean that's all part of it anyway but but yeah you probably have to get very like detailed to the point where people that have been at all of your public forums will be like yeah we already talked about all this so but okay okay I mean however I can be of assistance I'd be happy too but it's it's uh it's a little bit daunting I think all right yeah well we may get a bite of the Apple at ehhop give us a chance to show it once oh that's true that's true and hoping for good uh engagement on the 30th for on the 30th yeah is there somebody who would like to make a motion or did anybody have a question I want to count anybody off just one more question on the 700,000 that will be if the St the other article 18 is would be a um not a Green Solution it would just be replacing in kind basically what we already have in the building the 700 could be either or so the 700 right now the target is to tie in and be 100% green I mean if we don't if this doesn't pass if this doesn't pass we have no option other than to do gas one for one correct so but if it passes the other the added benefit is that we can extend our green profile correct I'm not entirely sure what the motion is Nancy so we might need some help there so the motion is to to accept the design development submission and funding ask so to to be clear just L's point just so you have the right number you know the the construction phase number is 49,4 so that's the that's the budget that it would take to finish the overall project now it breaks down to these various funding sources and so I'm not I don't want to advise you on how to take your vote but the the $3 million is already appropriated 49.4 million is what it takes to finish the overall project uh and then there's all the fund confusion we just talked about and how we fund that how you're paying for it doesn't matter it's just what you're asking for I think you guys should authorize the 494 because that's the total budget that you're asking this team to deliver for you and then how it gets funded as it you know shakes out the way it shakes out that we don't have to vote the number that goes on the warrant I mean know there's a number there right now but it tell me the number that goes to vote we don't have to have voted that number so you will vote the total construction um um budget the 49400 uh as Jeff said keep in mind that any time we ask for a capital project it's up to the town as to how they put it through as funding whether it's a pay as you go whether it's debt um in this case I had put forward all the um projects that are closing you know with a with a balance in the appropriation so we're it's their choice to you know reallocate that thatb so all those little nuances really come dictated from the town so as long as you vote the total project budget the town determines the actual funding of it and I have does that make sense it makes sense it's the 494 is a much bigger number than 462 and so I think in terms of the in the we know that we're going to get to 485 because the 850 is already there so I think it it's hard again another Nuance for the community to understand that we are saying it's going to be for United four but because of many factors you know including the conservative management of the funds that we do and the way we've been able to manage our building projects money that the schools had asked for in the past is it's not that it's school money it's all Town money and taxpayer money but money that we've asked for will can offset this cost and I I think there's a it's not always visible to the community that the school is is managing the funds so tightly and managing these projects to a positive favorable outcome so you know somehow I just want to make sure we get that across when when we're doing the um presentation or the forums that you know this is the 850 is there like I feel like it's school it was allocated to a school project and we are reallocating it to a school we would like to reallocate it to a school project I wish we could have more say in that but apparently we can't but making it clear that it is already there well the 850 you voted last year is um hfac replacements for Hopkins yeah we just didn't move on it because we were in this process so it didn't make sense to move forward and start plopping in so I'd like to ask for the 494 minus 850 because we have you know do we have to ask for the 494 if we're because we've already allocated 850 yeah I think her point is like so you would rather vote the 48550 I would just that because I think like and I hear what you're saying is that really the total project budget is 524 W or 524 we're asking for that 3 million's already been appropriated so if we've already appropriated the 850 why can't we ask for right and that's fine as well you can do it that way I'd rather do the 48550 like to make a motion on to that effect like to move that we accept the design development submission and funding ask of 48 m550 th000 thank you motion by Adam is there a second on that I'll second second by Susan all those in favor I any opposed thank you guys for coming out a slide more for those viewers at home but uh stay tuned April 30th here at ham 6 PM also available remote for everybody to participate and then the two dates for town meeting and then uh just a reminder everybody watching at home um hcam graciously hosts all these prior presentations as well as your meetings and then the project website and then uh we have a link to the project website too where all those things are also posted and so this uh slideshow will go up on the website today and and get more hits on that thank you for your time St thank you thanks everybody right have a good night suan Susan do you know how many articles there are on the total 56 feels like a three nighter yeah that's two nighter well there's a special town meeting Tuesday 52 special town meeting oh yeah that doesn't no it's more than that it's like I think there four on the special is it only four I think it's only four so 56 it's stuff that didn't make the deadlines they called for special town meeting within the town meeting so when they open it for one thing it it's open for I really wish that they brought food trucks to the town meeting that would be very fun you're not allowed to have food in the cafeteria nor or in the a nor are you allowed water just happy this year it doesn't fall on my birthday because it's happened many times all right so we're going to move into the superintendent end of cycle Summit of report um in terms of our piece of this I did people you want to do AB question ask did I oh yeah we have ABY do we have her first or yes do you this yeah pair professional request at 8:15 no I do not I have that's interesting that you don't have that are you on the revised no I apparently I that's why when we were talking about things that pop onto the agenda at the very last minute the very last minute yes this is a perfect example think we're on to the PA professional B request for element school the only wrong welcome I apologize that's okay good evening I thought you were just interested in everything um she's couldn't you tell she was just fascinated I know she mesmerized she walked us from home uh so I'll be brief I know you have a a big agenda tonight um so I have shared a memo to you uh detailing a specific ask of an increase of a PA of professional category B located at the Elmwood Elementary School for the remainder of this year and to continue into next year I'd be happy to answer any specific questions you might have but broadly speaking this request comes from the principal and um Folks at Elmwood and it's related to three really interesting drivers that I just wanted to highlight for you tonight and then um I'm available if you have any questions so if you look at the year-over-year growth in Elmwood since September there have been nine students who um moved into the district since the um school year started with IEPs from other communities and that's an important feature to understand because um many times the structures in other communities don't match Hopkinson given some of the uniqueness here additionally um six six more students who were not categorized as movements have been found eligible for special education year-over-year which is a net growth um and that's an important Dynamic that we see postco specifically for students in second and third grade and finally um we seem to just be emerging into a pattern where we have more students um who are coming up early with IEPs and that's that's an important positive development and we see that also as a echo of the dyslexia uh regulation which asked for earlier screening and finding so those three things kind of come together and what you get is that at this moment at Elmwood it's the only location we have where our numbers are actually higher at this time of the year than they were a year ago um and I think that's really important we can also look into the future by checking out what's happening today at Marathon and we can see that this trend is consistent so we know that it will carry through till next year so uh with that we're requesting an addition of a 1.0 paraprofessional B and Susan and I have had um creative conversations about how to manage that increase and we feel comfortable that we are able to do that other questions just a couple questions the um thank you for that the memo and that context the um earlier Intervention which I think I'm not a par professional or a special education professional but I would think that would benefit everybody getting it to the kids earlier in their career do you anticipate needs sort of easing in the upper grades at some point where we could reallocate potentially some um maybe grade four five pair of professional down to to the grade four will move eventually anyway but do what do you see Upstream I think that my perspective is that growth true growth is growth right and so as the net number is increasing you're seeing growth in ways that aren't realloc as the response um and I you know am very thoughtful about any request to increase midyear and I think that what I would say is this is reflective of true growth in the denom Ator of the fraction as well as the needs and that that is a trend I think will continue um from what I've observed you know in the community okay thank you and the only other question I had was um I'm not familiar with this so just if you could help me understand when we have a move in with an IEP as you mentioned structured to the descending district and and we have a a co- teing model we have a different kind of a philosophy maybe or structure of how we deliver do the APS uh at some point in that year get re-evaluated and um are you seeing you know more how is that how does that work sure so uh one of the reasons we're coming to you in April is because month after month all of that process has been happening right but people move in um across the year and those processes take often quite a while it's important to know that parents um maintain the right to all of the exact services that are articulated in the way they're articulated on the sending IEP is that the state Point mhm and and what we would argue is it's a tough way to start out trust building with people to be like oh let me let's restructure that for you right so what we really try to do and this is the common practice is you match it to the best ability you have so you can honestly say you know we've done our best job to do that and then let's get to know you over 2 three four five months and let's see how your your student has adjusted to a new school system and then we meet again and then we revise and we issue what we would call a local localized IEP but people still maintain a right to that previous document written by people who knew their child very well and you can also argue that when you move sometimes the last thing you want to do is change your child's core special education services so it's there's many good reasons why people would hold on um and we want to work collaboratively to let people make those changes when they feel ready so it isn't always easy and it isn't always consistent either it's helpful just to understand that you know here we are almost in May and understanding that I can see where um you can get into the air and the need can emerge and um I I would assume many thanks to the PA professionals who' probably been working really hard to address this growth so um thank you for that of course and I did want to thank everybody at Elwood who does a lovely lovely job of adjusting flexibly and kindly and professionally all the way through and when they start signaling that it's time to make an adjustment I take that very seriously couple things one is I am excited to hear that the intervention's starting earlier and that the dyslexia screening seems to be having a a positive impact on kids lives question I have is I know you had referenced the funding source having been identified so more for Susan is I'm assuming the funding for this year is not it's a much smaller amount because it's only for a couple of months what is the funding source for next year uh we're going to look to use the um idea 240 Grant okay makes sense yeah it's an appropriate use that's great all right any other questions regarding this also want to say I I know that you work hard to get your the the budget is far in advance as you can but I also do appreciate when you bring things back mid year that need to be addressed in the moment so thank you and I think it's it's a true um example of kind of the transparency and the iteratives of the special education budget um and hopefully the memo is helpful to give you some context thank you is there a chance that you'll be able to hire someone this late in the year well we're terrific so we're going to try very hard right like it's a great place to work it's a lovely building with great kids kids and staff and so we'll do our best and sometimes people are in flux this time of year they might have just graduated they might have just gotten their license so we might we might be lucky yeah all right is there somebody who would like to make a motion move to approve additional B par professional for Elwood school for the remainder of the 2023 2024 school year and fiscal year 25 motion by Amanda is there a second by Adam all those in favor I unanimous and approve thank you very much for thank you for your support thank you for waiting so patiently all right so that then moves us into the superintendent end of cycle uh report in terms of um the form that we use and I just for people that might want to keep this in mind as she's going through the presentation Georgette did send that out I appreciate your prompt make sure that that I did not I I just was confused as to whether we were doing that for today and then I thought I was behind no you're not behind so just in terms of process I think it's good to have that just to be able to consider as she's going through the presentation because it does impact how the form is filled out I mean it kind of helps make sense of the the goals in the indicators piece we're not filling it out um tonight but between now and the next meeting everybody in individually we'll put together like both ratings and then comments and then we'll discuss it here at the table in the super awkward like talking about Dr Kavanaugh in the third person kind of way uh and then at the following meeting we will have a we actually put it together in one document uh and figure out where the ratings and things are next week so that it should be a smooth meeting for the final one and then we'll vote it um at that point in one document but all of our work that we do individually also becomes part of the public record but the one evaluation that is the evaluation is the one that the five of us will vote on so so we have the like kind of group meeting special meeting about it on the second and then the final meeting on it is the 16th I believe that's the right date okay yeah yes because the following week is town meeting but for for next Thursday we want to come with our own point of view on all the ratings with comments possible and typically what we've done in the past is that then people can have the after we've had the conversation if you want to give thought to some of the conversation just to get them to me by the end of the weekend so that I can then merge into one cohesive document and we can then get it back out for people to consider before we bring it to the meeting although we will have an extra week I guess because of the town meeting okay we can discuss timeline all right okay um so you'll be looking at two documents tonight one of them covers my goals the other one will cover all of the indicators that we had selected uh way back at the end of the summer for me to work on during this year so this will take some time um I have shared both of these documents with you and you don't have to open them up now if it's easier for you to do that then then you can certainly follow along that way um it will be very difficult to read them on that screen because a lot of the print is super small but between now and the next time we're together together you'll see in those documents there are loads of clickable links I won't click on them all tonight uh but you will have a chance to kind of go through and look at all the supporting documents if in that process as you're doing that from one week to the next you think hm I wonder about and you have a question about a document or there's something that you said do you have evidence for or could you help me better understand I absolutely available to do that so this is just um a compilation of some of those things and some of the things that you see are going to be nothing more than just one example of and there may be many many more um contained electronically somewhere in the world so my first goal for the 2223 school year uh was back in the 2022 23 school year um I started out with a math student growth and achievement goal and you just saw all of that come to fruition just recently when we talked about how we were going to schedule the math kids at at the middle school specific specifically in grade six um but way back in the summer when I was looking at this I said after one year of work on math we are not done and so we need another year to continue to work on this to mine the data to think about the way teaching and learning is happening in those classrooms um hence this goal so I did put together a math instructional team there are loads of people who are on that all of the directors some building principles the assistant superintendent for curriculum and instruction uh secondary leadership team members Abby hansam was there uh the new uh 6 to2 director was there and you'll be able to click through some of these things but uh we went to the Hopkins school and we did some observation of instruction in grade five to see how things were differentiated uh we did case study research with four students we reviewed a lot of the mcast data especially in relation to our sh groups uh we did item analysis work we um prepped a grade six Math survey that went out to teachers to families and to kids and oops hold on we uh have done obviously all of the Star M and uh mcast data stuff and all of that has been analyzed from K to 5 and 9 to 12 if you click on this link here you'll be able to see the 9 to 12 um analysis of the mcast data but we do have that for all grades um this there will be some places where you don't get to see data because it has student names in it and would obviously violate um student privacy uh we continue to monitor all of our K to5 guaranteed and viable curriculum to make sure that um it's effective in meeting all of the kids needs that was something that we started with and I think that you saw by the time we came to the end that we realized there was a subgroup of kids whose needs were not being met as fully as they might be uh Shelley Moran our K to5 person now has number Corner in all of our our K to2 classrooms we have Beast Academy in grades 2 to five and that's an enrichment product um so kids who are really jazzed about math can engage in that um I'll will show you a couple of things that just might be of interest to you so she has put together what she's calling a curriculum container if it happens to be green it's something that is non-negotiable it happens at every grade level if it's pink it's something that's an enrichment and you can see the grade levels at which those things are happening um the other thing that I thought was kind of neat that she has done here is she is looking at the impact of something like number corner so we started doing that work here in 222 23 and you can see the fall to winter SGP score for our grade 1 students um was a 57 we like it to be above the 50th percentile when those first graders moved to second grade so the work is continuing I think that the the Foundation that we're putting together in that math is really helpful because these same students had a 67 SGP and this year in 23 24 when our kids went um our grade one kids went from fall to winter you can see that they all hit a 65 so what we're hoping is that these things that used to be 55 58 56 57 will start to look like this because of the work that we're doing with number corner and that will be interesting to follow through um and then then finally There's the link here for the presentation that I made to the committee uh about the changes in math instruction is just a picture of our kids doing number corner so the second goal because of the 2023 May mcast data hadn't yet been released I wanted to continue to disaggregate the data by subgroups in ela as well um and specifically I wanted to take a look at our writing curriculum instruction and assessment most notably at the secondary levels but we've also o been looking at at K 5 uh so one of the things that we are seeing when we take a look at those subgroups is that our special education students in ela we have not seen that bounce back from the pandemic and we really feel like we need to do that and we are wondering if some of that has to do with first of all our writing instruction we very frequently use writing in what I would call the service of reading which means that um kids are not just writing but they are writing about things that they have read things that they have seen anything that we would consider to be text and so they are mining those text to take information out and then to start making meaning of that information when we've done some of our mcast deep Dives what we see too is even if it says that it's a reading standard if it says analyze our kids don't Fair as well as if it's a language standard or if it's just a basic reading comprehension so it's drawing inferences and making meaning in in the reading and then writing about those things that we think are places where we could um grow our repertoire to that end down here in number six I now have an Ela group we started meeting just yesterday for the first time but we're going to do the same thing the math people did just do that really big data dive and we're able to also look at student work because anything kids write on those mcast tests or any of the in-class writing that they do we have access to all of those student writing samples uh much of this is stuff that you saw when I had presented to you in January um I've been meeting with the high school smls um middle school plc's and content areas um Jeff has been doing that work um and we've done all kinds of presentations especially on disciplinary literacy here you'll be able to see one a very recent um presentation to the Middle School faculty on disciplinary literacy and you know disciplinary literacy lives in both the high school and middle school school Improvement plans my third goal U was a student achievement goal and it was focused on co- teing models as they applied to the middle school this came about after the release of the Athena report um our Nicole Murray has done something very interesting here she's got a math learning Matrix and an Ela language-based Matrix uh what I really like about this is last year you'll remember that I was doing a lot of work in cohorting kids and putting them into classrooms so that we would be able to maximize targeted instruction because kids of very like learning profiles lived together Under One Roof so now that we have this Matrix it seems like it's a very easy thing for our people to um internalize at the middle school level for example and they are able to take a look at this and think about where a kid lives in terms of um language based skills so I'm thrilled to have that in ela and I'm also thrilled to have that in math um so Nicole has taken over a lot of that work she does that work with Beth Callan who's the K to5 person because Beth obviously knows those Learners quite well and naturally we have the Middle School um guidance faculty and Middle School administration working on that uh when we talk about those classrooms in the co- teaching model um it is a very slowo I know that you knowe that at the end of last school year we brought in someone who did a really nice presentation for us on co- teing and how to streamline that process in here I've added something that is um an indicator of what are those six co- teing models because we talk about them all the time I'm not sure the committee members always know what they are uh so when you take a look at those you'll be able to see that when I say we're still using a lot of one teach one drift that's one of those models where you have a teacher at front who's delivering the information and somebody else kind of walks around and just coaches a kid up sort of in real time we see that predominantly and we want to start seeing a balance of of all of those uh pieces so um still this is is something that I will be working on um with Nicole Murray and with um Abby as well um we now have a provider who will work on differentiation as it applies to math uh so that person uh is a a person who has a PHD in this particular topic from WPI and so she does this work with a lot of school districts so she'll be coming in uh over the course of the entire year just sort of in a spiraling kind of fashion to keep working and observing and working and observing and Nicole will obviously be doing the co- teing piece of that um we've done a lot of ela a lot of math walkthroughs um we these once monthly math uh Ela and math walkthroughs have happened on these dates and um what occurs on a math walkthrough oh that's super interesting so we just go into maybe four different classrooms that are predetermined and they are typically coot classrooms and we just observe what the instruction looks like and there are typically four or five of us who will go in to each one of those rooms I know it's got to be not much pressure or anything no it's interesting for the kids too because I'm sure they're thinking why are all those people here yeah and then afterward we just do a debrief of some of the things that we saw and really to our teachers credit we do see a lot of strength in teaching it is nice to see that uh so placement this year will also help happen I think I've already said this with help from the grade five teachers and um a lot of our kids growth and achievement it it's living in spreadsheets and you got to see I think some of the more aggregated stuff when we were looking at the math but if you were also able to see the ones where you actually break down like names and kids um it it's very interesting data all right so this is the goal that is also a carryover um this is kind of that that weaving of the Dei and the social justice and the seal and all of that stuff coming together I know that when I've spoken about it before we we' got people who are working in different buckets special education social emotional learning um diversity equity and inclusion and now it's it's sort of this way of not looking at those things in isolation and all of those things live in our school Improvement plans um but you can kind of see some of the things that we've done through the course of the year we took the findings from black Print and we looked at um having Matthew Rodriguez and Karen White both come in and talk with faculty talk with the administrative team um we had spent some time with our sick religious leaders in the development of the kpan policy this is actually pretty great I have to just stop and tell you this so today I was in the grade six classroom at the middle school and a kid came out and he said hey you're that lady I've seen you on TV and I said oh do you watch school committee meetings he said only for the kpon policy well that was great yeah I thought that was really nice um and anyway we have lots of plans in place to continue to grow our CPAC and lpac relationships um there have been some superintendent reports where we've talked about those things I want to have a little shout out to Jen suker this is the first year that she has ever done this but she put together um a a day for anybody who is an elac parent to come to hopkington high school for a few hours you could drop in there were all kinds of booths set up like what does it mean when your child takes an mcast test you know how does your kid actually like buy lunch in in the cafeteria and what does that mean that lunch is free and I mean there were people from every walk of the hopkington public schools lives there to meet with parents and the turnout I had first wondered would there be about three people who came to this the turnout was amazing it was steady all day for the time they were there yes and they got to you know really have time I think with with different groups of people who could help them with things they really struggle to understand what what do you call that in this list is that listed on here um we where is she she's in here somewhere if she's oh I know why she's not here cuz I had to use two pages on this one yeah here's her educational Workshop I thought it was just my eyes I no sorry that that was her flyer that she had sent out so it was on February 16th 9 to 11 in the high school library and the turnout was super all right yeah there were so many things to this one I had to go on to another slide um let's see where it is uh there is currently a DI Dei team at Marathon that's brand spanking new I think elmwood's had one for a very long time we have not only had presentations made by um our friends at Legacy Farms they've come in to to talk with uh our high school and middle school Educators about what does it mean to be kind of this this sort of newcomer or cultural other in this community and how do you help to understand how our culture influences the ways in which kids access curriculum but we also just recently had the Chinese um Hopkins Chinese American Association come in the hcaa and they also did a presentation for us which I've shared for you here um the seal director has been working with our teachers and counselors to make sure that the HSA has been administered and in fact it has been uh we currently have an audit of seal practices going on there's a team here uh from um Ed solve and they're here taking a look at they're doing classroom walkthroughs in all five buildings they've managed to get into probably 25 classrooms in these quot a 10-minute hits and we all go in there's a group of us and you just keep putting ratings in and they'll take that qualitative data and do a little bit of research with it but they also have our vocal data they have our HSA data and they have the student responses to the climate team data so they will produce a report for us about what does seal look like and how is it thriving and where might you grow your programming is that Grant funded it was Grant funded we had not planned this when I was doing this work and then because we had another seal Grant the state contacted us and said you have an option to take another $144,000 and we said if we can do this work why wouldn't we look at you know some of our gaps and holes and see see where that went so again hats off to uh Carla Burley who's put this together and so far we've done four schools the high school is the last one tomorrow morning and it's gone swimmingly well uh we've done a lot of professional learning on culturally proficient teaching practices so when you click on this you'll be able to see that you'll also be able to see some of these things I think in the indicators um and there's a PD presentation that were made by four directors and me on November 7th which was the professional learning day we had a lot of the elementary Ela folks and we were thinking about um cultural proficiency and the cry op and how those things weave together and remember the the purpose of this is to really bring all these pieces together and see how they are working um last summer Jeff lead and one of the um folks from black Print Jen suker and I did a presentation at the mass Summer Conference um we still have our trial program going on between Yale University and the Elmwood School this is year three so it will discontinue after this this year Yale University comes in observes the teachers takes data gives them feedback um and I just want to thank the teachers for for signing on to this they have been amazing and Yale is giving us like big Kudos um restorative practices what Carla has started to do is use some of that grant money to pay teachers on off time so because we're so limited in the time that we can offer people professional learning so like even over April vacation we had a group of teachers who came in and did two days of RJ which is really amazing that we're getting all of our people trained in restorative justice practices and we're doing it in clever ways and we're not having to fund that ourselves because it's come to us through Grant um oh there's Jen's educational Workshop that we just talked about and we continue to strive to diversify our Workforce it's really hard to do that as you know um but I thought I would include for you some of the Desi data that shows 2014 to 20124 one of the problems is that when it says Staffing it means everybody in our school district so this is never going to break that down for you to say who is an administrator who is an administrative assistant who's a teacher who's a par professional who's a custodian but these are the ways in which the numbers are changing and you can see that the numbers are changing ever so slightly for example we had one person in our district who was who self-identified as African-American and now they're 8.2 four who identified as Asian now 24.5 Hispanic 2.8 went to 11 um so it really is a slow crawl to increase the diversity um but in some ways it's happening you find you're getting a more diverse population applying for jobs just a little bit not I I can't really say that it's enormously different um but and we now advertise in different places and Kim pnck and Emily Brown have been going off to job fairs yeah I was yeah so sometimes it helps to meet a person in person um and then if they've already applied to a job with us we don't take their resume because we would have it um but when they just came back they had about you know 15 additional resumés for teaching positions which was really nice so it gives us an opportunity to meet sort of candidates in the wild so to speak do they go to job FS just within Massachusetts mostly in Massachusetts yes yeah it's nice when you have kids who are just leaving College um there's not a lot of diversity coming out of teacher preparation programs um Kim had gone to um a desie sponsored professional learning opportunity and they say we are willing to admit that we don't have a lot of people who are like nonwhite candidates coming out of teacher preparation programs and a lot of times um you know people like to live near people who look like them and think like them and so you know if Hopkinson continues to diversify the way it is it's not surprising that our Asian population has grown more so than many of the other populations that you know is are on that that list one of the things I have seen in other communities that have Diversified just a little before we did you do start to have more um Asian faculty in your schools all right the fifth goal is to continue to address enrollment growth and then ultimately building Youth and expansion throughout the district um I won't spend a lot of time on this one because I think of all the goals this is the one you see all the time you see all of the presentations like you saw tonight you see me talking about the enrollment updates we take a look at um what those buildings are going to look like so for example way back in July of 2023 we had a meeting with folks from Hopkins to say my gosh what would this thing look like if you turned into a 56 school what would be the hopes and dreams or what would that look like and so some of these things will just sort of help you take a look at how this thing has evolved throughout the school year things like press releases sample presentations made it h all the way to our May 6th um annual town meeting presentation that we have pretty much sealed up right now we like to think in goal six um this came about from an indicator that I had chosen last year the focus of the goal was really to think about the Hopkinton experience and what do our offerings look like alongside the way students experience those offerings so we engaged with Dr Judy Martin um she had done this work in a previous District um where I had worked and so she has been a community iation with the class of 2023 so now that they are one year out of school she has a survey that she's going to be sending to them like what was your experience postgraduation how well did we prepare you and this is a very lengthy survey and because it's a lengthy survey and we asked them about a lot of things and if you you know it's a survey that will advance so if we say you know did you attend college when you left hopkington high school and you say yes and then we say did you change colleges there might be a whole bunch of questions that you skip to something else so it won't be the same survey for all people because the experiences are different um but because it's it's a good commitment to do this this survey it will take our our kids like maybe 15 20 minutes to go through all those a computerized survey I take it it is yes um the uh hpto has been super generous and they have purchased for us $1 50 gift cards so if you do it you have a chance of winning a $50 Amazon card and those names will be sort of chosen at random um we had the promoting good report um I had done some work with two non- col track students who were willing to be interviewed by me on uh on the way and um I was really happy to be able to talk to them a few times uh I think the one thing that I derive and you'll see this in the indicators as well one of that those people is just traveling now and another one of those people is in the workforce um but the one consistent thing that they would both tell me is that um because they knew they were not choosing that very traditional hopkington high school college track they had the identity of I feel a little bit like an outlier here like it wasn't impossible to fit into the fabric of the building but you knew that you were different for that kind of purpose um you can see the districtwide climate team um that we had and you can see the rolling agenda and the climate team when we started was really to think about assessing the morale in our schools I think we've taken it um even further than that but you got to see a little bit of those slides from the survey um and hopefully this did you share those with us um yes they're in here somewhere okay yep they are don't if they're not in here Susan they're in the indicators okay so you'll be able to go back and look at those as well I think I I shared the long one and the short one so there's one that has about 137 pie charts and then there's one that only has about seven that I shared with you last time time so you'll be able to see both um reviewing the Civics curriculum we thought that that might be really important for to see the kind of experience because what we really hope is that when our kids live they know leave they know how to be sort of good citizens and we're not sure the degree to which our kids do that we we know that they leave with a lot of knowledge and a lot of ability to navigate things but their citizenship we're not quite as sure about so um that that's something that Mr labrad has sort of uh taken the lead on is looking at at that piece um and then we went with the 360 degree assessment and the district climate work um we I sent out a request for people to participate and we had some teachers and all of the administrators who didn't really have as much option as the teachers did to participate uh we had the first meeting welcome you can see again the rolling agenda we had some loow hanging fruit so we're talking about things that we're already doing in our buildings that seem to be boosting morale we did a 360 degree survey for review for and the admin team did this so you can sort of see the results of that um the first draft I had attached to you we went back and looked at it again and we have agreed that we're going to spend some time with that when we do our admin Retreat over the summer um you did get to see the results of the survey here and oh here are the two different surveys the long one and the a short one that you would be able to see I did not do a public presentation on the data from the um 360 degree survey that was filled out by all the what's 360 degree survey interestingly desie has one and it asks you about sort of every single facet of running a public school district so there are questions about budget there are questions about climate there are questions about academics there are question about special educ all of those things land in that Sur okay all right so that's it with this these are all the goals can I ask you a goals question sure yeah in the past couple of years there have occasionally been goals that were not really achievable they were really a two-year goal they became two-year goals or they were um in the mid year we adjusted to a two-year goal yes do you feel that everything here at this point point is kind of wrapped up and next year you're going to start fresh or any of these are you asking or considering extending them that Ela goal I'm hanging on to that and even if you say I don't really want to see that again that's okay I'm still doing that that that's fascinating work to me and and I think that that is when we in the superintendent report tonight when you get to see our scores it's and we have 75% of our grade three to eight kids who are meeting or exceeding expectations on a Statewide level that's that's great um but I I have sort of hopes that we can keep all of our teachers and all of our administrators and everyone really focused on that kind of literacy learning because the research that comes out of it continues to evolve like crazy and the more we know the better we can do okay so I I have a I had a hard time with this when I had to do it before so now I'm like struggling again because I'm trying to understand how we take your goals presentation the rubric indicators and where that all fits into the actual evaluation form because I'm not entirely seeing how they match up and it's likely user error not actual anyone else's error so and like the form that we have to work with has four different sections based on like you know the community outreach your curriculum work which I I can see parts of that in each of the goals so is that what we're supposed to parse and parcel out for the those four standards you're talking about the indicators fall under the four standards so there are two goals and then well sometimes there are two goals I have a lot of goals um so those goals are there but they are separate from those four standards that you're looking at okay when you take a look at an individual goal for example so let's say we go with the math goal you would ask yourself the question based on the evidence that Dr Kavon provided to me did she exceed the standard meet the standard partially meet the standard or not meet the standard and you'd have to make sort of your own judgment about that based on all of the evidence presented in the goals document then when you look at these indicators we chose specific ones that might say how well does Dr Kavanaugh communicate with the community for example and then you'd have to make a decision about the degree to which I have met or not met that indicator I'm still confed so it but I I I mean it's not hard to see the breath of work I'm more looking at the form and saying like like if I was looking at each of your goals and evaluating on my like on the goal it's really clear but then taking it to that form is where I always am like so I apologize because I don't want to it's late and I don't want to keep us lengthy and if it's one of those things where I just need to like sit and talk to somebody individually and figure it out then I can do that but like that form itself is where I'm struggling so I want I want to be tread carefully but is do you think Georgette could put the goals and indicators just on the blank form to make it do you know what I mean to well it's funny that you say that cuz that's what I was thinking I was like if it came with that in there then I would know what we were more and I have done that in the past I just don't know that I'm going to get to it before the weekend y we can and her formatting on the document itself is better than mine is actually the bigger issue that it and I was just going to say I think and I don't know that I'm an expert on this I would say I'm not but the the indic the research on it up front well yeah this a while ago now but I think that the indicators if you look through them the superintendent has a big job with a lot of facets and the indicators are professional qualifications of a superintendent and period and then each year we sort of highlight a few that we specifically want to evaluate on all of them in some capacity are being addressed by a superintendent at all times I mean all the indicators are kind of in play when you are a superintendent but we've picked some number to say in observing the outcomes and and the work that Carol has done this year for these indicators that we're focused on because we think these in particular are very critical to the success of where our district is right now how is she doing on those those specific indicators some of those enable the goals some of them are it's just it's just a focus of indicators there's some relation but not necessarily right and I just think as someone coming in mid year it's difficult for me like I think if like they were marked which ones are the focused indicators it would just be easier to understand and and to have the goals put in what the goals yeah are so that our numbers line up when we're having the conversation if that makes sense yeah that's we always past them in ourselves like oh I had that as number three oh I had that as number yeah so I think that's okay thank you because I think that was what I was missing and that added it would make lot more it then does make it much clearer and the next meeting will'll have a lot of conversation right your form doesn't have to be like totally done next time it's just the point of discussion then you can kind of take back and we can you have a little bit of time before you send it in and then we'll try to create a a cohesive document that reads as if we all um as if it's like one voice of the committee and some people do their working copy on handwritten on paper like if you don't want to type it in but but if you can type in the comments if I'm going to merge it it makes it a much easier job the other stuff is easier to yeah type it in mean you can't read our handwriting it's not a matter of reading it's that the text gets quite lengthy and I'd have to retype it if everybody gave me handwritten copies if it's like one person with a handwritten copy or even two but if I've got five to type the whole thing over it would take me longer than copying and pasting that makesense she's really selling the chair job for you [Laughter] no okay thank you for explaining that okay so in the rubric indicators um the first one is is 1A empowers administrators to ensure all instructional staff collaborative collaboratively plan adapt as needed and Implement standard based units comprised of well structured lessons aligned to state standards and local curricula um so my rationale for choosing that one was that uh we have Hopkins that is going to hopefully at some point transition to a 56 school and if that's the case we need to take a look at how curriculum is going to be impacted so we had developed a Hopkins educational plan um the state requires that we do the same thing for an Elmwood educational plan we brought in a consultant uh to take a look at our K to8 science instruction and she's going to continue with us next year as a consultant that will be Grant funded but to make sure that we are now doing science because one of the things that the state said to us in one of our msba meetings was that if you are building that elmood school you need to be able to have your kids doing science it can't just be you know textbook science where kids are accumulating knowledge it's got to be roll up your sleeves and have a lot of authentic experience and when they changed the standards in science there were science practices as well so that needs to um certainly be grown uh I am still very much interested in and I think this is down in the um instruction area in making sure that our special education students growth scores start to rebound at growth and achievement scores really um we are looking at the mcass Civics pilot our kids took the mcast Civics test last year did remarkably well but they did remarkably well when only a few districts in the state said sure we'll give it a try so this year when they take the pilot test we will be joined by the entire rest of the state so that's going to help us to take a look at some of our social studies curriculum just adding in the Civics pieces that the state requires um we are thinking about growing our computer science work and so you can see a group of Educators that um attended a two-day professional learning on December 7th and 8th in computer science um and we have Mr Scott uh thinking about what that looks like in in his domain um the mcast ELA scores 6 to 12 disciplinary literacy I I do want to thank that high school they have embraced disciplinary literacy and I think when you look at the grade 10 scores and how so many proficient kids have moved to like the exceeding the standard category and mcast I I really believe it has a lot to do with that uh Colleen Coria who is the subject matter leader for social studies has a a company coming in to do professional development exclusive to social studies in disciplinary Literacy for all of the teachers grades 6 to 12 and our um Ela gurus a couple of them will be in the room as well so that say for example Julie Matson wants to go back to the middle school and support that literacy learning she can do that um so I will move on to instruction um The Cry op was a huge Focus for us this year you're probably tired of hearing me talk about that um but we really believe that seal and cultural proficiency have to be in place for kids to feel you know truly like they can access curriculum at the highest levels um so again summer presentation opening day cry ups and student data a full PD day consultant work um the co- teing that's happening at the middle school um specially designed instruction that's going on with Nicole Murray all the way 6 to 12 um our special education student growth scores we continue to monitor those um we actually did just get cited by desie for disproportion it because we have a great number of white students who are now being identified as students uh sld students with learning disabilities and we think it's because we're catching more of our dyslexia students early on so I mean the nice part of that is that we're solving the problem but because we have so many of them uh the state has cited us for disproportionality um so Abby Hansen one of her goals in special education is really the rebounding of those special education scores and so while I am in that work in terms of the ELA and the math uh growth and looking at that in the aggregate as well as through the subgroups um she has taken that on as well um and then finally the other thing that we did was we started looking at evaluation workshopping because we have so many new people to our admin team that we did about four or five workshops this year on how to really effectively evaluate staff so that you can help them grow and grow in the right ways um so there's just a couple of part points I had put together for those workshops that we did inhouse and it was really um Mr lead and and I doing those um this student learning data that we on Earth examin special education scores students with disability performance discrepancies as well as the dayto death he offers on growth scores of our students with IEPs um we interestingly we do actually see some good growth scores but we don't necessarily see the movement in achievement scores and we can see it in isolated when we do case study research we say okay let's take that kid and we can see some of the things that have made that child successful and a lot of times and I think I actually have one that I've embedded in there you don't see the students name but you get to see that student's trajectory when that kid first took an mcast test um his score in math was a 4 34 which is like four points above the base line that's that's 444 that's the lowest it can be and then it got to like 494 which is about six points away from being proficient and that happened over several years but we kept saying what was it that we did and it was incredible personalized attention to that particular student and you know all of the bells and whistles tutoring and all of that and it was a student who um was never on an IEP until grade seven but that student made those gains before the IEP so it was really indicative to us that that some of the things that we do that are helpful are things that now we know we can do a little more widely um with all of our kids and I know when I started this I said I wanted to make sure that 75 to 80% of um our kids are like meeting or exceeding expectations in terms of achievement that would be all of our students in the Aggregate and tonight you can see that where they are um so so that that felt really good um so our SGP scores are are looking better than those achievement scores um there are places where we are below the 50% and so we're we're thinking about that and how to get kids there we really believe that some of that might be the rigor of instruction like we have to make sure that we are all believing that kids can do it because we think that when they can do it um we get them to do it uh so here is um a PowerPoint that I had put together in 2021 we actually as an admin team Revisited this in 2024 because we are now making this sort of um doubling down on everybody is going back to that star data so we we actually get professional development embedded into the fee that we pay to Star Renaissance so they'll be coming in and we're going to retrain everyone and make sure that there are at least you know there's at least one if not two of the reports that everybody can use with super proficiency and that way there we're not asking people to do things that are you know super advanced in terms of data reading but it will help them to Target instruction for their individual students all right standed two in terms of laws ethics and policies uh what we have here are all the policies that we worked on this year these are the monthly meetings that we held with um the HDA for labor labor management um we have updates on legal uh issues that that you know I would share with um Nancy and Amanda um as those things kind of pop up uh the handling of grievances with the HTA and really we've only had a couple of stien Grievances and that happens because if you've Overlook paying someone a stien in a previous fiscal year they have to grieve it in order for us to be able to say yes now we can pay you and we say oh we know what the remedy is it's to pay you and then we pay them uh contract negotiations with the par professionals you know that's coming along um School attendance that's been a big push coming out of the state and you know we had folks come to ask about it at a meeting and I thought it was really important for them to understand sort of the legal background so I did send that out to all families in the form of a Blog um and then we are working with the town to develop the language and this is also sort of a legal piece to make sure that our relationship with the HCA now that they have a liquor license is is good I have not eded that in there yet because the town's legal council just sent it back to me at about 5:00 today I think we finally come to an agreement on what that language should look like um in terms of fiscal systems we always say it's going to be a challenging budget season um but this budget season went much more swimmingly than the last um and I mean that's another one where I feel like you get get to see all of the things that happen during budget season you hear from all the principls you hear from all the directors you see every single one of the PowerPoint presentations every time something changes just a little bit and here's the annual town meeting presentation for you uh transitioning to munice Mrs it will tell you it's it's a process it's a slog a slog I almost used that word and I said I don't know if I want but it's we'll call it slow and steady but yes it is a SLO uh let's see so a communication in past years we've really improved our Communications we think with families about student learning and performance and so this year we wanted to make sure that our Communications with L families was going to be like super top-notch and again I just can't say enough good about Jen suker she has held so many events with the elpac she did the thing at the high school um she's brought in uh tools and devices to ensure that she can text with families and they get it in their language and then it comes back to us in English she meets with individual families all the time to make sure that as they are onboarding they feel supported and if they need a translation of any document or an interpreter at a meeting we make sure that we get them there and we are hiring them from very reputable companies so that the interpretation and translation is great great um and then uh we have changed ever so slightly the way families are filling out the online registration materials because we want to make sure that they have access to that in their language and so we've had that translated into like maybe our five most predominant languages and then we work on it in other ways if if we need to for families who are outside of that um our just sort of that same chart that you saw it tonight in terms of our changes in demographics and I think that we're doing a really nice job of being able to meet our the needs of our economically disadvantaged and low-income families um Mrs Rick will talk a little bit about how um our thresholds for support are working uh or not working when we meet again on the 16th uh the El Department we supported that budgetarily we had to obviously and we thank the school committee for support on that um and just again cry up pillar number two um in terms of cultural proficiency you've probably seen a lot of these things before but we've had satch come and present three times hcaa once we actually are making changes to the physical education curriculum based on a survey that we sent to families saying what are some of the games that you would play if you were you know if you are culturally who you are and um those things will be incorporated I should have added in here that I went into Deb Pinto's classroom in PE about two weeks ago and it's unified PE the kids were making mini golf holes and they actually had Putters and indoor golf balls and they set up this maybe five or six whole golf course and we all played mini golf it was amazing you played too I sure did yeah it was great y it was it was wonderful Mr LEF played we we were all there um so we have the curriculum on it to eliminate bias and anti-racist materials we're doing that through black Print so that RFP has gone up we've hired black Print and we are in the process of collecting all that data um theal audit they have all of our data and they're doing the walkthroughs now um the case study of kids who have chosen a non- colge bound path we have that and um again Mr lebrat is doing a lot of that work now with through grant money but with a core group of middle school and high school teachers and really thinking about opening up Pathways that don't infringe upon something like ke Tech because you can't legally run those same kind of programs um Carla Chris at the high school has done a lot of work with Mass bay and bringing in like cyber security courses so you're getting kind of early college credit even while you're a high school student and uh those kinds of things are are looking very good I think in terms of continuous learning this is really where we make sure that all of the people in the admin team and you know even our our our teachers are thinking about leadership and what it means to be an instructional leader so you can look at the district Improvement plan you can look at all really does mean all we're thinking again about the subgroups and you can see some of our agendas that we've used at edman Council meetings where we talk about these are the best practices in interpretation and translation so if you have a need in your building this is how you make sure you go about it so that our families who speak another language get top Services um we looked also at our Desi targets and you'll be able to click on that too so you can see they set targets for us every year in 24 they will tell us if we have arrived at that Target or if we are kind of on the pathway to getting there that's pretty interesting um if you feel like you want to see any of these agendas like what does it look like when we have PD days BBM staff meetings plc's I'm happy to share those things with you you have access I think to a lot of mcast and starcore data in the aggregate um and then you also have the Athena special education um recommendations and then the last one is shared Vision um because our demographics are changing and our kids interest post High School in trajectories are broadening I want to make sure that everybody's getting what it is that they need so whether it is the five case studies that we did during math or the two graduated students or the research of Dr Martin um or the compi work um the Mr Bishop and his team have done a beautiful job evolving the senior project so it really gets to what a kid wants to sort of fill their how they want to fill their bucket and make sure that it's meaningful and rigorous but it doesn't necessarily have to be academic uh our kids going to ke Tech I think are at 27 this year which is nice I met with the middle school guidance Department to think about ways that we could like kind of grow our ke Tech enrollment and then obviously just our us us newss and World Report it's really nice to be able to see us doing as well as we are across a lot of demographics and you know kudos to our high school folks um and it's not just our high school folks because you don't get to be that high school without having a lot of support all the way up K to 8 because those teachers are teaching the hack out of it to make sure that our high school kids are prepared to be good high school kids so and that's it that's all of it I'm sorry it takes so long to go through that every year sorry the last one just how do we how do we know we we often say that the trajectories of kids are diversifying do we how do we know that um so some of that comes because I think Lee Graco keeps some good data and I think when we take a look at that we say you know a lot of kids used to be fouryear private um schools and now a lot of families are moving to State schools we've got kids who are going to two-year colleges and the two-year colleges have a little program where if you go and you do your two-year College you can move on to a four-year state school and the cost is very different um we when I asked her for the names and email addresses of kids who chose not to go to college she had them at the ready she could send those right to me um and I met four times this year with the whole high school guidance Department to think about that and um they are well the changes that they talk about are are interested interesting changes um some of those changes tell us that our kids are more driven than ever and we do worry a little bit about that but some of them say uh we have kids who are really trying to think about how it is that they can navigate something different within the that sort of climate of Hopkinson high school that says but everybody goes to college but not everybody really does so those numbers are just when we get the you know your graduation rates are always very high um but what they do after graduation like I think this year when uh leco gave me the names there may have been like nine kids on that list who deliberately chose not to go to college any data on students who have chosen to go to college whether they finish their degrees so Judy Martin should be able to help us at least with year one of did you stay at that school did you drop out of school all the reasons why people did was it a financial hardship that caused you to drop out of school was it because it was not what you thought it was was it because you went to a school that was a terrible fit for you know all of those in a previous District she had carried that out for five years with a given class so we really got to to follow them to the end I'm kind of hoping she would be willing to do that again um it's Pro Bona work that she does what year is year what great graduating class is year one class of 23 so right now we'll be getting their first round of data so one thought that kind of pops into my mind as just as a parent child in that graduating class is they don't all use their email that they had from the many of them use different email addresses and I actually venture to guess most how do how were they getting follow-up email for those students so it's interesting for contact we yeah we before they graduated we had them give us personal email addresses so that we have all of that um but she's kind of like a dog with a bone so if we try to email you and it bounces back we know that you're very likely Cavanaugh and then she can just go to the college and find out what the email address is there so en Cavanaugh vanderbilt. or is going to get something from her anyway and we will tell the kids like through social media channels it's coming watch for it yeah I think this is yeah this is a fascinating topic you know I think because someone goes to a community college or a public College that's still College there is it can be very C driven yes and I think the Gap year situation especially post pandemic during the pandemic um the immediate next step is often maybe a year to think about it and and get things kind of organized I don't know what that does in terms of changing the mission of the district because you know much of the intent is still there although no one should be in the district feeling alienated because they wanted to take a different path so it's it's an interesting um it's an interesting puzzle yeah so anyway yes and imagine that we have a student who wants to go into the construction industry like we wonder if there aren't ways during senior year to be able to have that person you know outworking and and testing that field and to see what it's like I mean you've got Mass labors here like it's so easy for our kids to have access to you know could you take some kind of course there in small engine repair or yeah yeah it doesn't mean they won't be reading Shakespeare though you know like exactly so there are lots of people who you know maybe pick a trade but also enjoy academics it's so it's a very interesting situation the student the who I interviewed who had chosen a trade said the one thing that that student wished was that they had been more attentive to how important math was going to be in life after Hopkins in high school there's a great message to quote there they also told me you know what if you told me that in high school I probably wouldn't have believed you so yeah so it's interesting they probably were told that yeah they probably were so all of this evidence that Dr Kavanaugh has presented is to in the service of us being able to evaluate on the goals and indicators if there's additional evidence that people feel like if you feel like there's more information you need in the process of looking at it Reach Out directly to Dr Kau I'm sure you you put so much into putting all of this together but you might be able to clarify again questions that come up between now and then the one question I did have because it it jumped out at me as you were speaking was about the disproportionality piece the if I understand it right the number of white kids on IEPs is increased and we got cited for that because it's not in line with what our overall demographics are yes so and so they're there are typically categories you know so when you know when a student is on an IEP you have like sometimes it's a primary area of disability and then a secondary and then a tertiary um so there are sort of percentages that you could almost predict like how many students would you have who are on the autism spectrum how many students would you have who are diagnosed with Down Syndrome or so for us it's the sld kids in spe in specific so specific learning disability and you know typically those are students who are uh with like reading struggles like dyslexia so I guess what and maybe it's impossible to know from this at this point in time because it's so recent but why those would be growing differently in different demographics is it a matter of um I certain you know groups of people pursuing the IEP differently or is it a matter of there being a higher rate of specific learning disabilities in different populations it could be the former and here's why when the state asked us to do a dyslexia screener screener required us to do a dyslexia screener um we had actually done that before the requirement was there but once the requirement went into the into place the state then said that you have to send a letter to any student who is flagged on that screener as a kid who's not at a reading benchmark and sometimes that happens because you are a k student or a one student who really has had like very little literacy exposure um and sometimes it happens because you know you you just have an accessed um as much curriculum as the kid sitting next to you or you haven't or you may need to be double dosed in that curriculum whereas the kid sitting next to you doesn't right so I mean some of our kids are just sort of slower readers but there are times when it does mean that you have and it's only a screener it doesn't we we can't diagnose that someone has dyslexia um but we then send those letters to all of those families and let's imagine that you know 20% of those kids who get a letter really do have a diagnosis they're yet undiagnosed with dyslexia but somebody else has just lived in a you know less literate environment and somebody else just needs to be double dosed um like when you get that letter as a parent you go oh my gosh and and so that may be accounting for the fact that there are more kids who are getting on IEPs earlier I think Abby alluded it to a little bit tonight um but I mean our goal is to get every kid to read at Benchmark so however we get them there it maybe a misinterpret what it is but my concern is not about the increase in the number of kids that are yeah on IEPs I I mean I think that's great that we're catching kids that need Services sooner but the fact that there's a disproportionality in there are there kids that are of other races and backgrounds that we're not catching for some reason that do you know what I mean that why when at the younger grades we're seeing a greater level of diversity than we are at exiting grades why is that diversity decreasing in the number of kids that are going on IEPs right so especially with sld so there may be kids from other demographics non-white students whose parents aren't asking for that kind of testing right so it's a the group of parents asking for the testing as opposed to I don't think we've done a deep enough dive yet to say have parents asked for that kind of testing and and that's how it's resulted but might I mean there's a very big difference between the schools coming to you and saying we think your child needs to be tested and then having some of that test that testing covered differently than a parent noticing some things and seeking private testing on their own and then coming back to the district and saying this is what the findings are like it it's I'm getting exactly right there correlation is not a causation so all right so I always appreciate how much goes into this in the fact that you've done this now multiple times in one year um both for the formative and now for the summative but also along the way you've updated us on a lot of this so I appreciate the depth of the information well a lot of it relies on an amazing admin team so I have to you do have a superstar team y Mr LeBron and everybody they they're all part of this okay so we'll get those pre-filled out for what goals and indicators we're actually looking at um and then we'll bring that back to have a group discussion and then people can get those to me to give me if we have two weeks between the two meetings then if we could get it like at the midpoint so that I have some time to put it together all right that moves us into the Lou and Cathy white scholarship okay um so we just need for you to authorize payment from the town treasurer for the Lu and Cathy White Memorial Scholarship and that is $500 move to authorized payment of L and Cathy White Memorial Scholarship in $500 motion by Amanda second by Adam all those in favor it is unanimous and then the Annette Joyce flow Memorial Scholarship okay um so again we need for you to authorized payment from the town treasurer for the an net Choice flow Memorial Scholarship in the amount of $500 Mo to authorize pents in theet chice floor Memorial Scholarship with the amount of 5 $500 motion by Adam there's second second by Susan all those in favor I I that is unanimous uh and that moves us into the stem scholarship okay so we have the stem scholarship um and that again we need you to authorize the town Treasurer to make the payment for the stem scholarship at this time in the amount to $5,000 I move to authorize payment of the stem scholarship in the amount of $5,000 motion by Susan is there a second on that second second by Lori all those in favor also unanimous and passes um I am aware of the time um and I also am aware that we have a lot of things for the 16th part on the what we want to do um are there things that we feel like are going to be lengthy that we could push off I think poliy I joa can wait okay let's put that off then the intent to travel I'm assuming is time pressing so we go ahead and do that okay that would be great um this request comes from marjerie biter at the high school um she would like you to approve 32 high school students and they've all qualified for the HOSA International Leadership Conference it's in Houston Texas um June 26th to the 30th and she would like for you to approve that travel it's awesome it is awesome I move to approve travel to Houston Texas to attend host up from June 26 to the 30th 2024 motion by Susan second by Adam all those in favor okay and then there's gonna see JB I think that we can if if Susan is GNA do do we have to do that now because if Susan's gonna do an update in a couple of weeks okay so do we want to put is that okay if we put that off for a couple of weeks they're only here together because we started looking at one and you couldn't look at one without looking at the other so let's jump into the elw school gift account all right and this one's very easy um we just need you to accept a donation from the hopkington Education Foundation in the amount of 8,330 to fund the Elwood library with various book series it's excellent motion on that soone is there a second second by Susan all those in favor we're hoping this hooks some readers when they get hooked on a series fabulous the you know H we are very fortunate to have so many great organizations supporting our schools the Hopkinton Education Foundation um comes through with a lot of funding for us all right any future agenda items that we want to throw out or you can also email if you think of them all right that moves us into items by consensus okay as superintendent I recommend the school committee approve the items by consensuses outline in your agenda so moved motion by Amanda second by Susan all those in favor I I okay that moves us down into adjournment is there a motion to adjourn I move the be adjourn okay motion by Susan is there a second on that second second by Amanda all those in favor I I and we are Jed at 10:14 our next meeting is the April 30th Hopkins lower Middle School Comm any Forum that is here that is on Tuesday is that a 7:00 or 6 o' start it's guing at and then compter we have the May 2nd regular meeting and special workshop on the superintendent's evaluation and then annual town meeting and then May 16th for a regular right thank you thank you everyone for hanging in there good night e