##VIDEO ID:KJUEf0ErHQY## [Music] Township of Howell zoning Board of adjustment Monday October 7th 2024 I hereby declare this meeting of the how Township zoning board to be open adequate notice having been given pursuant to the New Jersey open public meeting act in the following manner first on December 11th 2023 a copy of said notice was mailed to the Asbury Park press and the Star Ledger second on December 11th 2023 a copy of said notice was hand delivered to the clerk of the township of Howell third on December 11th 2023 said notice was posted in the office of the zoning board and another the bulletin board in the Howell Township Municipal Building 4567 Route 9 Howell Township New Jersey in accordance with the fire prevention code and for your safety please be advised this facility is designed with two Emergen exits at the front and the rear of the meeting room furthermore smoking is not permitted in the municipal building please take note that this meeting is being videotaped for possible future broadcasts on how Township TV 77 this meeting is a Judicial proceeding any questions or comments must be limited to the issues of what the board May legally consider in reaching a decision and the deorum appropriate to what must be maintained at all times thank you thanks could we have a roll call please Mr burillo here Mr caner is excused tonight Mr Hughes here Mr merens here Mr Rosco here Mr Stant is excused tonight Mr Ryan pres miss scotson here and chairman say is excused tonight you have a quorum okay sounds good uh can we all rise for the Pledge of Allegiance I pledge alance to the flag the United States of America and to the repu for it stands one nation God indivisible andice for all okay Andy I guess you can swear on our professionals you swear the testimony I do I do car conliff Jen for beam professional okay thanks Andy uh first order of business approval of minutes the first one is regular meeting July 22nd 2024 eligible voters Billo caner Hughes Mertens Ryan scotson and seya can I have a motion motion to approve second we have a second roll call Mr burillo yes Mr Hughes yes Mr Martin yes Mr Ryan yes and Miss scotson yes minutes approved okay the next one is for regular meeting August 12th 2024 eligible voters burillo Hughes merens Ryan scotson and seya to have a motion motion to approve second roll call Mr burillo yes Mr Hughes yes Mr Mertens yes Mr Ryan yes and Miss godson yes yes minutes approved okay the last regular meeting minutes to approve is August 26 2024 ELO voters burillo caner Hughes Mertens Ryan scotson and seya do I have a motion motion to approve second roll call Mr burilla yes Mr Hughes yes Mr Mertens yes Mr Ryan yes and Miss scotson yes minutes approved okay next order business any vouchers no vouchers tonight okay correspondence no correspondence for tonight okay resolutions case number ba 248 modern classic Auto Sales LLC resolution granting use variance and Amendment site plan eligible eligible voters is burillo kenter Hughes Mertens Ryan scotson and seya do I have a motion motion a second okay roll call Mr burillo yes Mr Hughes yes Mr merens yes Mr Ryan Yes okay andson yes sorry [Laughter] resolution okay case number ba 23-h 10 F royalty 19 LLC C resolution granting major site plan approval eligible voters burillo ker Hughes Mertens Ryan scottson and seya do I have a motion motion to approve we have a motion I'll second it roll call Mr Bara yes Mr Hughes yes Mr Mertens yes Mr Ryan yes Miss scotson yes resolution approved okay I think we're ready to start Mr Pate are you ready I want to make sure that put it on record Mr Pate how are you I haven't seen you in a while anyway um nice to see you thank you yeah anyway we are told that you would like to switch the um cases tonight with your permission Mr chair I I would the you this is a six member board this evening um the 1805 application is one that I am comfortable proceeding with the six member board the peeker brw application perhaps later in the evening we can have a discussion okay we may be able to begin it but I wouldn't want to take it to a vote with six members so with your permission I'd ask if we could begin by presenting 1805 to you yeah no I have no problem with that everybody else is okay okay okay okay um what I'll do is I'm going to read the uh the case that we're going to have first which is case b which is case number ba 2471 1805 5 us9 LLC this is for a use variance and major site plan description application of 1805 us9 is applicant and owner is Seeking a use variants and preliminary in major site plan approval for improvements to existing building Fades storm water management system onsight circulation lighting and sign improvements on 18805 Route 9 block 144 um and that's lot 7301 expiration is November 27th 2024 okay thank you Mr chair members of the board board professionals and public good evening Kenneth Pape on behalf of your applicant 1805 route US Highway 9 LLC this is an application to renovate an existing Center you're going to hear from me and from all the professionals certain comments that I think are very Salient there are existing buildings there's no new buildings proposed there existing buildings are not expanded we are asking for permission to maintain the existing buildings there are existing uses we're not asking for any changes in the uses we are be for you to renovate the property you're going to hear a new architectural facade for the building you're going to hear storm water improvements for the building you're going to hear circulation improvements for the entire site lighting Landscaping removal of encroachments on neighbors property it's 100% a clean up the site without any ask for additional building size or uses we're before you because historically the multiple uses that on the are on the property I think the last one was introduction of a monopole some 20 years ago vested jurisdiction with this board so we stay with you but you'll hear that although Christine cfone our planner will take us through plannner proofs you'll hear that we're not asking to expand the uses change the uses or expand the building before we begin this is an application that was on the agenda in August and was carried to this evening if we just confirmed that the board took jurisdiction and we are the board has jurisdiction for us to proceed this evening the board is jurisdiction Mr P thank you the applicant the application will be presented to the board through four professional Witnesses Lewis ugar is alongside me he is the engineer who designed this facility who did created all the modifications that we offer to the board Steve rasi is the architect who has worked to change the facade of to do a new facade on the building Jay Troutman is a professional engineer with mcdonut and Ray he is John Ray and Scott kennel's partner he'll present the traffic and Christine Kone is our professional planner with your permission Mr chair we're ready to begin introducing Mr okay you don't have the applicant doesn't need to testify or anything I don't the applicant is here I'm very pleased sitting in the second row is the applicant he's available if we did want to if you wanted to hear from him and he this is going to be an owner occupied building it's his intention to use the warehouse for his business okay that's fine we'll we'll get everybody sworn in first and then we'll go from there very fine so swearing all four professionals yes do you swear the te do you swear the testimony you give will be the truth all truth but the yourself you got do please state your name for the record starting with Mr Z zner leis zner Zu GN e r Christine c f o n e Steve RI r a d j TR t r o u t m your professional the professionals are sworn Mr chair okay thank you Andy thank you I'll ask that before Mr zner begins his testimony that he share with you his professional and educational background for the record okay thanks good evening again leis zner and I am a licensed professional engineer in the state of New Jersey I am a graduate of Virginia Tech with a degree in civil engineering I've been practicing for around 25 years in the field uh and hopefully as you may recall I have testified before this board as well as many others we accept your quantifications thank you thank you Mr Z before you begin with your substant a presentation would you identify what exhibits you would like the board to have available uh there three exhibits which I hope to use some rather quickly but there's one labeled overall aerial exhibit which will give us a quick view of where we are I'm sure you may know already excellent uh an aerial exhibit where we can see the existing property and then of course the site rendering which is a colorized version of the plan showing landscaping and other features and are you comfortable that the exhibit that's before the board is the one that we should use to begin this one is is the overall aial exhibit and this is the one to begin with think a brief description of the property's location its size and its Zone then we can go into some of the substance and this is a24 for the record uh so this aerial exhibit you can see in a white outline the shape of our property you can see the two main roads going up and down down on this plan is Route 9 and then of course West Farm Road it's a property located at that intersection and as you may know there's a Jug Handle at that intersection which our property wraps around it's a little bit of reference across the street is the Home Depot I'm sure you're all familiar with the area the existing site here uh we are in the highway development H1 Zone and that property you see in white outlined is 5.35 Acres existing property then maybe if we could switch to the aerial exhibit that's a23 thank you so again this is pretty much the same thing we've now zoomed in you can see the two same roads Route 9 and West Farms uh a little bit here to see is again it wraps around The Jug Handle and what I'd like to refer to is the actual root N9 Frontage is around 350 ft that's not a specific dimension in the property other than visually you can see that's our real Frontage since The Jug Handle doesn't help us in terms of Frontage uh you can see also that there's significant Woods in and along that Jug Handle which obscure or Shield the property visually those are there now I think also what you can see in this picture and as we go through the presentation all the buildings are presently there this is a developed site uh way I would describe it is this is not a bad site U it's a site that's just in need of some attention and an update so what you'll see there you'll see in the rendering just cleaned up so before you move on what do you mean by The Jug Handle doesn't help us with Frontage that's Frontage uh I meant uh euphemistically right we don't have access we're not going to take access access point of view right okay I just didn't understand what you were talking about with that yep absolutely ready for the third exhibit I'm ready to go to the third one okay s rendering or the site rendering right there sure a21 perhaps a description of existing conditions on site existing uses on site sure so now you can see again we're in a colorized version but these uh in a light gray color these are the existing unchanged buildings those are the the buildings that exist a little bit about those buildings there's a number of uses there also not changing but to describe them uh furthest left there's a narrow section of the building this is a 4 Bay Car Wash then immediately to the right of that this is a one-story retail space and these buildings are all connected but they're separate uses and then forming sort of an upside down L and that piece uh is a commercial space in the building building and then the separate building to the right that's also commercial uh similar to like a flex Style Space is the way that's used uh and then in between those two buildings fenced in is a monopole cell tower this is an elisee area which we don't actually have control of but was previously approved okay uh you know when again I talked about this before when we start on a site like this we sort of like to have an objective or where we're going here are very simple same buildings but let's clean up the site and make some specific improvements so of course landscaping and lighting improvements I'll talk about uh those are updated throughout the site we introduce uh storm water facilities into this site and you can see those on the top left uh in a little bit of a darker green and then in the bottom right hand portion of the site these didn't exist previously uh probably most significantly we took some steps to improv circulation uh and previously the road that goes along the top was circulation to the back of the right building but it was deadend circulation it ended at a called a sack or a tight turnaround uh this now has circulation completely around the building and this is not just helpful to truck traffic it actually is a big safety Improvement for the site to provide for that total circulation and was something we discussed with with the fire CH there is some element here in the site where we add and better Define parking throughout the site was a little bit unclear where Vehicles parked in the past we make it clear through striping and do add a few defined spaces uh I would also note we respect the environmental constraints here there's an Loi in progress there a small isolated pocket of wetlands towards Route n which we do not touch and then the the trees and the screening I talked about along a um Jug Handle we make every effort to preserve that so we still have that screening from visibility before you proceed if it it would appear that there's aesthetic improvements it appears that there's Environmental Protection improvements and that there's safety improvements all that are being added to the site through your design that is correct if you would continue certainly to run through a few of the specific um in terms of the plan here the grading on this site generally runs from the front to the back towards Route 9 obviously there's not a change to that the drainage we are constructing these two basins they are both small scale infiltration basins I showed you where they were uh they discharge to an existing Channel and into the the wetlands are there any on there now this is no no okay so you're actually okay and to give the board additional Clarity on it so uh the project actually isn't a major development so there's no requirement for them to provide stormw management we did have a TRC meeting I think uh or Conant plan meeting before this application was filed and said you know uh anything that can be added would be a benefit for the application and the applicant has proposed that they they're not required to but it's something that's definitely a positive okay that's good to know that thank you thank you thank you we talked a little bit but of course s uh circulation where we created this Loop and eliminated the the dead end um one of the things we were able to do is uh provide for that truck circulation around the back there is one section of one-way traffic as you come around the building near the Basin but it is wide enough to satisfy emergency access needs um there's a little bit in terms of Road uh dimensions and widening which your engineers asked for which we're going to accommodate there were few comments from the fire chief which we're going to make sure we address all of those uh in terms of the parking for the site uh it does require relief uh but we are actually adding spaces to the site there'll be more defined spaces um there'll be 63 parking spaces this includes six new spaces on the site uh there will be two EV spaces on the site which didn't exist before uh we will also stripe and identify three handicap spaces and how many spes requ I know that Mone is ready on that one but I don't remember I have it spes it's I knew it was about 100 spaces in total I know that we need bance Rel we added six but we still need variance relief okay yeah uh we believe that uh there's adequate stacking spaces for the uh Car Wash you can see we restriped the parking area behind the car wash to create actual path in there with stacking spaces Car Wash loads from the back and they come out towards the front we created in an area that was previously the very bottom right hand side the turnaround behind the old building and because there was excess uh existing pavement there we uh and it was a a useful use in this plan to create some oversized spaces so some of the larger trucks that might U come into commercial facility they would have oversized parking spaces there thought that was appropriate use of that location and that's in the southwest corner I believe that is correct I would also note you can see to the left of the L-shaped building sort of a dotted light colored area and some striping there was a truck loading space to that building at that location it was in core condition this plan rebuilds it and creates two loading spaces into that building and provides uh sufficient space for a truck to come in and then back down into those spaces I would note that there are this come up on other applications parking spaces that come right up to the retail building the section of building facing towards Route 9 and we are proposing to add ballards along that retail building for those parking spaces I have a couple of working I know sh isn't here this evening I happened to have a early morning meeting with Sharie in another town and she shared with me that she wouldn't be able to make it we've been working with Sherie on the Landscaping plan for a number of months um Lewis and members of his firm have been working with her um I'm comfortable advising you that we are in full agreement with the few recommendations that she's made that we have not yet added to the plan and a notable one was that we add um we have area between the two buildings and we would add a picnic table seating area between those buildings for employees she had asked that we have that as an element yeah easy to say Yes um and then she also had some specific requests with Landscaping that she wanted us to address also there was a discussion as to whether or not we would be needing we would have uh a need to put funds into the tree replacement fund and if you could speak to that it's my my understanding that Sherry has advised us that we have more going in than we taking out and we won't need to make any yeah that's good to hear that usually the other way around there was a Woodlands management plan to as the board should be aware I think that we would never come before you without three stops in town before we spent time with Sherie to make certain that we had her uh concurrence we went to the environmental commission we actually went to them on two separate occasions B our understanding they have no further outstanding requests and we met with actually we met with two Fire Chiefs we started long enough ago that there was um Chief Lewis and we've been met with Chief BR now who specifically reviewed the plan that you see here and who advised us that he was satis that it was satisfactory to him so Mr Mertens what I would suggest with regard to Sher since she's not here is that like Charlie and I are not privy these conversations that she's having with the applicant like you know and that if the board were to act in the affirmative it'd be conditioned upon her sign off on this issue because AG we don't have anything from her I mean I'm not surprised considering it's a developed site but at the end of the day no I I totally agree with without her being here to agree we need something in the resolution that would require that so Mr P I guess appropriate and we're full agreement okay good the this property is currently on a septic system this property is not going to remain on a septic system in addition to the other improvements that are offered the applicant is going to remove the septic system and tie it into the sanitary sewer system that is correct that we will be able to connect to sanitary sewer we filed applications for preliminary Water and Sewer with the how Township municipal utility department and those are pening there's a as Mr Zer indicated few minutes ago the wetlands on the property were delineated and it's actually December 2023 we filed the application with the D requesting confirmation of the wetlands it's not hard to figure out where they are they're in the trees up in the front of the property but we're doing a wetland delineation and we'll will put a conservation eement over the wetlands and any buffers that are associated with them is there anything further from your perspective that should be placed before the board uh the only thing I can uh think to say is that of course we'd continue to work with the professionals and make sure we satisfy any of their open concerns we have the staff reports and to the extent that there are any staff comments that have not yet been addressed we can and will address it if you could confirm that yes is someone G to talk about signage I was going to do the signage with uh Steve mrti has designed yeah okay I was sign okay then there variance relief for signage to and that would be through the plan okay but yes we will be discussing signage Charlie any comments questions yes Mr chair so uh Mr zner you've reviewed my uh latest uh report and you are confident you can address all the outstanding stormw comments that are in there I am yes okay um couple notes I know Jen alluded to that there's a variance required for the parking the requirement is 105 spaces I think they have two spaces so with the credit it's 103 and they're proposing 63 spaces so you know we'll need to hear obviously justification for that relief um uh I know there is right now you talked about how the site is providing now 360° circulation around the entirety of all the buildings um previously there was a like a cue saac dead end at the southwest corner and it looked like from aial that that was kind of just being utilized as a makeshift parking area that that's now defined parking and then we're going to have striped fire Lanes throughout the site so there's not going to be parking kind of how it was before that's correct to maintain the the access and circulation around the building and provide a specific spot for any oversized Vehicles so and the the one recommendation I would have for the board and it's not something atypical for us uh to require the applicant to accept title 39 jurisdiction on this site especially since they're deficient with parking that just allows the town the ability to go in and enforce traffic tickets if people are parking all over fire lanes and things like that I think that's something I agree um the so we talked about the septic is going to be abandoned it's going to hook up to the public sewer in route n you're also proposing new water to Route N9 as well Mr zner correct that is correct is there any anticipation for like a hot box enclosure in the front yard area or um any kind of uh tanks for fire suppression purposes or anything like that uh so I don't expect either to be necessary I have U completed the approval for the connection there'd be no need for any type of tank or fire suppression system uh and I don't think the length is going to require us to have a hot box but I will have to get through permitting with the okay so what I would just present to the board is it's not a typical for applications on Route 9 for the water company to require like a hot boox enclosure it's giant Silver Box in the front yard area um I would say if the board does not take issue with the use in the application we like proactively Grant that relief on the condition that they provide um adequate screening subject to the review and approve of LT so they don't have to come back to the board for you know accessory structure in the front yard um that's usually mandated by the water company and it's a certain you know it has to be within a certain distance of the RightWay um the your traffic engineer going to talk about circulation and the types of vehicles and maximum size and all that I think we'll ask that he come up next and yes okay um the car wash that's there does that have its own recirculation system where any effluent is captured and recirculated or does that freely run into the parking area in the stone War systems on the site there is a below the car wash there is a large open tank that no one has really been able to figure out what's going on so the answer is we we propos to abandon that and tie it into the sanitary sewer system okay so any any effluence going to be captured and tie in the septic sewer not running into the storw basins correct okay sanitary u i in a waiver for lighting yeah so they do need a waiver for lighting I think in seeding the ma uh minimum intensity that's not something that's atypical for this board to Grant I would just ask that everything be downward facing houseside Shields and then maximum color temperature of 3,000 Kelvin is that acceptable unless I know Sherry has allowed 4,000 kelv I would say that's the maximum that we would go you have any issue with that either one as you direct 3,000 or 4,000 works just the color all right I don't have anything more for Mr zner at this time Jennifer any comment answer questions I'm assuming that um Mr adasi is going to talk who's going to talk about the streetscape design waivers with respect to like site Furnishings private walkways sidewalk Etc the um Street Furniture we were offered to place the street Furniture between the two buildings I put that on the record and then the balls across the front of the building the I can do the sidewalk there is no sidewalk in the area we can add sidewalk if so directed we would respectfully ask that you yeah I think that's going to I I I mean respectfully yeah you should put sidewalk on Route n every single applicant that have has come in on Route N9 has put sidewalk New Jersey Transit runs up and down Route 9 there's people walking on the regular up and down there's no justification for not putting the sidewalk on Route n on The Jug Handle I totally understand that that makes no sense yeah um but at the end of the day I also feel that we asked oh we the town asked an applicant for a major affordable housing application further down West Farms Road not that far to put sidewalk on West Farms Road so honestly The Jug Handle I understand but whatever Frontage you have on West Farms and Route N I recommend you should put cbon sidewalk yeah I think we're all absolutely concurred how does that work out are like are you going to have any operational testimony or are you just saying the operations will remain as is we we can describe what's there um but there's the all the operations that are there have who's we who's going to describe the operation you or you comfortable doing it I'll lead you I'll take you through it but West's Road fronted do we have West I'm not sure it like it it kind of cuts off but it looks like I wouldn't really think there's a location for us to do sidewalk on West Farms I don't think we have Frontage out there but well I mean your plans are not showing all of it all the way to the end of the property line so I'm looking at the plan it it kind of cuts off halfway like you at least have it on the hand we do have it on the jug hand but so you know your plans kind of if it's on The Jug Handle I don't take any exception to them contributing to the fund for that stretch of sidewalk because technically that's still a public right of way and they would have to provide it I don't think I would recommend people walking along that drug handle it doesn't really serve a purpose but if you guys feel that you want it that's perfectly with within your rights to ask for it I do think route n we've been very consistent about getting sidewalk on Route n how far is the nearest residentials from this on West Farms going east not far not far okay how does the board feel about that as far as I think yeah I know we're all agreeable I'm talking we're talking about the r CH handle as far as it doesn't look like there's any existing sidewalks going towards Route 9 from the first residential there Isn't So Right Now westro does not have a full shoulder it doesn't have sidewalk at all yeah I I think in this situation I don't see a reason for it I'm more concerned about route nine done and I think that's our consensus as you direct as far as the uses as Mr zoder described the front building as a retail building currently there's only one active tenant that is in there it is a t-shirt printing company the balance of the property is currently um vacant some of it needs to be restored it is intended that there'll be an office element associated with the warehouse in that front building the car wash has been described the um building be that makes the back of the L is an industrial building it it's an existing industrial building our client intends to use it as a storage building for his business the building that is to the right has an interesting collection of tenants there's a recording studio there's a party Distribution Company they U they have party favors and chairs and tables and Tents there's a gentleman who um repairs cars and and adds tire and does Tire Service I think that's that and there's a vacant space um all those are all existing but they're all existing and they have current leases with they all have leases and I've been to the site with Mr Matt Howard a number of times um before our clients purchased the property to make certain that all of those uses were properly seed so the question that I have then is when I'm looking at your site plan it says commercial building commercial building commercial building but you're saying it's industrial and warehousing so I'm I listen I get it's existing but like I'm just questioning I didn't label your plans you said commercial commercial commercial warehouse is not commercial is industrial so where is the industrial use the back of the L is a storage building it was it always has been and and it proposed to remain a storage building so then I would request that the plans be revised to be reflective of actually what's there you got it we'll lab it as storage and storage building is will be connected to its an office element the office element will be in the front building okay uh board members any questions question for this professional for I have one what M Jennifer does it require a trash enclosure on this property they definitely require a trash enclosure we have two uh proposed trash enclosure closures that will be masonry enclosed but are they on this plan or they they they are on the plan okay I yeah because I can see one of them back in the corner yeah they so there's one that will be um you can see it obviously angled on the top as you circle behind the buildings there'll be another one sort of inside the L of the buildings and the septic system Mr zner that's being taken out where is that located currently the current septic system is between the buildings in the light green area in the light green area okay thank you okay Mr Pete I your professionals will be around because I I would think it'd be better to move along and we can have public comments for each of your professionals at the conclusion of the testimony is that good with everybody okay I do have a question before Mr zner uh leaves Mr P uh can you clarify on the back end of the building on the right if there's a current tenant there uh I'm showing an open application for a CCO for a Furniture Company uh that's never been closed out I believe there were violations regarding that furniture company prior to the sale of the property DMV Furniture to be more specific gone gone gone so that means you have one two three four five different tenants with a proposed possible office uh component that's going to go in the L shape portion plus a vacant portion of the second building to the far right with only two in uh garbage enclosures um I'll be quite honest with you uh I've been on this property several times issued several violations for property maintenance issues as the tenants and the facilities uh that are there are not sufficient for the amount of garbage that's produced uh is there any way that we can get more garbage enclosures squeezed in somewhere because it sounds like you're going to be uh the the uh the owner is going to be expanding at some point and if you can't keep up with it now with additional tenants yeah so the simple answer is yes I can find a another location I also don't believe at um I know the exact pickup schedule at the moment so there could also be adjustments to the frequency of pickup but I would prefer more enclosures as that hardly ever seems to remedy as landlords place the responsibility on tenants tenants complain that the landlords don't take care of it and that open space and the back of the property that's cleared that's been the space where garbage has been dumped and dumps have been placed in the past uh littering the woods behind the area so um I'm not confident and not to say anything about this current owner but in the past this has been an issue on this property I uh can Envision a third uh location towards the southwest corner of the property where I could uh find space for a third trash en closure thank you comments of of John are are understood our client purchased this property during this past year um and has is our client is the one that's coming before you and asking for permission to do all of these Renovations okay well I think the third enclosure should be stipulated so stipulated southwest corner there'll be a third masonry enclosure okay uh Mr barell yeah um the the building on the right is is that considered warehouse warehouse space it's you there is a tire store there is a party store there is a studio a broad um recording studio I think those are the the tenants that are in there now the storage is in the L shape building the storage is in the L-shaped building the back of the L is the storage building we we we're not classifying this as warehousing not that building well that's kind of what I asked because the plans just say commercial and warehousing is I was just reading off your report and it said the existing building consists of 7,316 square feet of warehousing well that because we went through all the documentation but what you're seeing here is it's label as commercial but it's basically the back half of that or a good chunk of that L-shaped building is where the storage would be and I think Mr P and I don't mean to speak for you indicated that it's storage that's the kind of quote unquote warehousing that we're talking about is storage not fulfillment distribution high volume traffic Etc correct that's correct so will we have something in the uh if the application is approved in the resolution that n these buildings cannot cannot be used as Warehouse warehousing that building is existing to be used as it so that's it is like it's an existing condition I would say we could recommend that there be no expansion of that area on this site is that fair Mr P there's no expansion proposed none intended what you see is what we like to work with I guess so I mean I guess my my point was if tenants move out will can we put a restriction on that none of the space will be used as a flex Warehouse that Andy I mean I guess that's your we would continue to use it for these small business oper operations how varied can you be with a party store yeah I mean that doesn't sound like warehousing a party store um music studio you know I'm just saying if if if hands were to change and to be different tenants should the resolution say something to the effect that it's not to be used for Flex warehousing so Mr Pape you're comfortable with like a reference in a resolution to the existing tenants and then the they would be of a similar type in use something ex I think we want to put enough language in that John and Matt don't have trouble interpreting applications from tenants but we can we can yes similar uses it's not intended to be that that building is not intended to be an industrial building so I think it would be beneficial for that use to maybe hear from the applicant on how they currently operate from and how they intend to operate from that commercial use I just to give the board some context right it's 8300 square feet so we're not talking about like 75,000 square feet of flex Warehouse so it's it's a smaller space But nevertheless they are improving the loading dock and they do have a circulation for a WB 62 so maybe what kind of storage operations they're they they operate out that might be helpful just to give the board some some clarity um and how frequent a WB 62 may actually be coming in out of this site here there I can't imagine that there's it's a small space I can't imagine that there's a lot of turnover and they're storing a lot of goods in in such a small space so maybe maybe that might help kind of going forward for like changes of use or change of tenant to get that on the record um two other comments that I just want to make before we move on is um with the party and then also with the tire use there's I just will the applicant agree to a condition no outso outside storage of like um used tires or anything like that and then also with the party use no outside storage of any equipment or materials yes okay those are reasonable requests okay and then the last question is from Mr zner is um looking at Aerials uh the payment condition is in not the greatest shape and there is a significant amount of like trench work with the storm water and then also with the utilities with the app going to be amenable to like resurfacing the part lot so I I think if it's possible I know there's some areas that are getting redone in different ways if we could maybe walk the site together and identify what areas um might be sufficient and in good condition and what areas are not I'll make it I mean I'd say no like you're here for use variance the parking lot is not in the greatest condition they should resurface the parking lot period like we're not going to patch this up patching never works so you're here asking for us for Relief I don't think resurfacing the parking lot is that heavy of a lift and so I would say no you should resurface the parking lot we had discussed it previously I thought that we had agreed that we would walk the entire site most of it needs to be restored but there are sections towards the rear that I think are in good shape will defer to you but we would I think that the front parking lots the front driveways the the circulation behind the building behind the retail building all of that must be redone but as we work around the back the surfaces are not in bad shape and I ask that we take a look at them with with Charlie well who's going to be I would respectfully disagree with that as a condition of approval I would recommend that the parking lot be resurfaced in its entirety period like we're not going to nickel and dime this that you like enough is enough this site and I understand your client recently purchased it so this has nothing to do with your client but this site is in deplorable condition and it needs to be upgraded which I understand that's why you're here and I'm happy that you're here but we're not going to reface the entire Center and then Patchwork the parking lot like no so my recommendation to the board it's up to you guys is that the board be the the parking lot be resurfaced in its entirety and we're not going to walk it and Patchwork it like that's ridiculous board members I agre agreed yeah Mr P I think that's where we're at and I concur with our planner Mr chair I do have one more question for Mr P um you said your client is going to be using the storage area for his um for his storage uses um the C currently is there a restriction on like hazardous materials or stuff like that I was because there was a question from Charlie wanting to know how our client uses that building or intends to use that building I was going to ask for a two-minute recess just so I could speak to him before I bring him up here so he doesn't so and I'll have him describe his business I think you'll find his business to be benign and and a nice business to introduce him to that building okay okay okay so you'd like to have two minutes two two to three we'll make it five we'll take a five minute break Eileen the board will now take a 5 minute break and reconvene at 7:55 p.m. thank you yeah yeah Mr P are you we're ready okay ien we're back the meeting will now reconvene Mr chairman just for clarification things we've discussed already the applicants application is amended to incorporate the recommendations of a title 39 designation on the property a resurfacing of the asphalt surfaces on site and the installation of sidewalk along Highway 9 all as requested I do Mr Yakov Jacobs is here he is one of the principles and he is the gentleman who intends to use that industrial portion of the property for his business with your permission I'll ask Mr zner to take a back seat and bring Mr Jacobs up here and we'll have him sworn and then he'll describe his business and what he would like to do there okay that'd be great thanks thank you okay we need you to be sworn in first Andy Andy airm do you affirm that test give will be the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth iirm state your name for the record Jacobs j a o BS the witness is sworn Mr okay thank you Mr good evening hi Mr Jacobs you're one of the principles of the company that purchased this property yes and it's your you've shared with me it's your intention to use the storage building for your business yes and if you could describe to the board the products that you intend to store in that building yes so we are we wholesale Electronics vitamins and supplements um and we plan on storing it there it's all wholesale so it's we get stuff in Big Lots um and we ship them out in in on pallets and the number of trucks that would come to the site on a daily basis you shared with us that you own two trucks your company owns two trucks it would be only your trucks that come to the site basically besides for UPS FedEx and then once a week approx approximately we'll have a shipment going out it could be any we're not in control of what the truck what type of truck that would be and then once in a while a truck would come from a third party you know doing a delivery not UPS or FedEx and you had indicated that you anticipated you're gonna have to go back because that was not clear at all I'm G to I'm going to go through it you own two trucks two truck movements a day takes place every day from your Warehouse pretty much yeah and once a week you have a third- party delivery and that could be a tractor trailer yeah so one tractor trailer trip a week two trucks every single day pretty much what kind of truck we have a van a cargo van and a uh 24 foot truck and you're not looking to rent out this space this is space that you intend to use for your business as you've just described it to the board yes that is the in ended use of the storage build okay Jennifer I mean so what time does this tractor trailer arrive and so you have two trucks let me just go back so you have two trucks you're not getting deliveries in your two trucks right that's more shipping out no so we have another Warehouse in Delaware where we transfer daily from Delaware to Jersey and Jersey to Delaware that we do oursel so that's what we use our trucks for we use either use the van or the truck that we usually do every single day Monday through Thursday and then we get deliveries from other companies which could be most times it's 24ot truck but it could be a track trailer very very rarely and how many and that's a once per week uh it could be twice a week four times a month okay so it initially it said one time per week but now you're saying could be twice a week like I'm not trying to trick you up I'm just trying to understand how the site is actually work it's very rear if it listen if it comes more than one time per week you say it comes more than one time per week because what will happen is you're going to get conditions associated with this approval and if someone sees the truck showing up more than once a week you're going to get in trouble so just be honest with how many times it shows up and we can ascertain how this functions could it be twice a week yeah it could be four times a week but it's not four it's not every day of the month meaning it's max four or five times a month that will get a delivery or a truck coming out so well is it four to five per week or four to five per month per month because we never you just said four times per week like that's what I was yeah exactly no but he said could be one time a week could be two times a week could be four times a week did I is that what he just said so there in lies the concern we need to understand as does your professional team the impact the potential impact Associated I'm not saying it's a negative impact but they need to understand what they need to testify to in terms of the tractor trailer activity on the site so if it's four times a week maximum then you should say that because it will become a condition if it's five times a week you should say that but if you say one you're going to be limited to one so if you would like to share with the board what your the the limits that so currently you're you're experiencing four or five a month month but you'd like limits that are greater than that so you could grow right what would be a number that you'd be comfortable growing to on a monthly basis tractor trailer movements I would like to have it every day so can I understand when you're saying saying growing this is an existing business in this existing space so growing how like you can you basically said to us we're just spiffing up the site the uses are going to remain as is so like when then you said what do we wanted to grow to like the warehouse portion of this application is not permitted so we need to understand are you anticipating this use growing at this location or staying as is with its current operation and and just improving the site around it or are you anticipating this use to grow because there are impacts associated with that growth that we need to evaluate in a variance application the area of the site that has this building is the only area where Mr Jacob's business will be conducted there's no request to expand that but it is a a vibrant business that Mr Jacobs owns and growth could occur in his business he could have more activity than he has now and I just asked him what is the maximum number of move track truck movements that he anticipates could take place and you indicated one per day one tractor trailer per day that's the most it could be but so to be on the safe side that is the request okay but there's no expansion of the business business portion of the building it's what you see is no there's no expansion of the square footage but if you ask for the business to grow that's an expansion of the business correct I don't know that that everybody who goes into business hopes that the business becomes more vibrant in this growth I think what she's saying though is within that confines of the building you're limited to your growth so if you're going to expand beyond what that building is enabl to do absolutely not we will not grow beyond the building we will not that portion of the building we will not grow be beyond that portion of the building well how about if you end the leases for that other building will you will your client want to use that space if the music guy would have move would he use that space to make for storage earlier you asked what that building would be we agreed that that building would be the uses that are there or similar uses we carefully describ it so that your zoning officers could enforce it okay if You' confirm that you have no intentions and you're not asking this board to move your business into any other part of the site no we want to keep that as ten just renting them out okay okay Mr chair so and you know this might be also for the applicants traffic engineer so I'm a little concerned with tractor trailers once a day uh they have a circulation plan that they provided and the WB 62s exiting the site driveway have to make a significant like swooping movement almost like to the center divider you know if we're talking about once or twice a week and they're coordinating when those deliveries happen and it's like off Rush Hour Peak or like later in the evenings then you know maybe it's less impactful to Route n but like once a day that's kind of a lot so maybe we'll yeah and also I need on the traffic uh engineer because I'm looking at the back of this building and that's going to be uh like a jack knife getting into that spot with a tractor trailer I mean is that sufficient amount of space there's a turning template that has been prepared that'll be presented to you when okay up is there anything further of Mr Jacobs professionals board members I have a question so uh not to beat a dead horse uh so the testimony was that uh there was going to be no expansion I'm showing in my system uh an application for the demolition of interior walls uh would your client be able to expand on what interior walls that application by the way just for the record has failed plan revieww um I don't have access to the actual plan so can you elaborate on what walls are being uh torn down and for what reason it's going to be used for office space and kitchen kitchen bathrooms just regular office space for the sales team I'm sorry I can't I can't hear you he said office space and a kitchen room for his sales team would be part of the building for which operation for his his business operation so you're adding to that business then no we indicated that the in the front building there is the retail building there's one portion of that that is going to be renovated for the office associated with this Warehouse kind of right there right in the front front building front building right there the corner the part that's falling that it's rotting and falling in right now that would be renovated it is you can see that it is attached to the warehouse and it would be the office area for Mr Jacob's business okay but that's where the work that John's talking about taking place in that spot or is it in the other part Mr Jacobs is there any other demolition that you've made application for I don't think so maybe you don't think so there might be some junk in the warehouse but said again there might be some junk in the warehouse that is being taken down so that this is the retail space we're talking about that faces route n front route N I can't spin the uh just you know I can't spinning enough because the trees get in way so so that you can see no it was but I believe it's this is the area that we're speaking about right where the pointer is and is that one of the retail spaces yes the retail is not a we the storage part that's retail and any everything along the storage the storage is going to be office and what is there right now in the retail space there's a uh t-shirt print shop and the portion that we're talking about right now is just wasn't office and it's just rotting and falling into the ground right so right now it's it's already divided into one two was it four four retail spaces it's one retail space and then the rest is just vacant falling apart it was offices it looks like it was offices before so you're going to be taking some of that retail space and making it office space the retail is going to stay where the retail ends is there's a wall like where the storage starts straight that straight line that line from there and on is basically office space right now it's empty it's dilapidated it's rotting it's caving in but it was office space now is the architect going to just show us the outside appearance or will he have any kind of design on what's going inside the building with his plans he's got the Flor he does have Flor okay now will that show what we're talk discussing right now I think so okay well the pl that I have don't show the walls coming down oh that's I don't know what that is when Mr rasi is up we'll show you the layout that is proposed for that space and just to clarify the products that are being stored again are supplements and electronics yeah small electronics like apple watches iPads MacBooks and uh supplements vitamins are they being repackaged in any which way or form or are they being shipped out in the same manner that they are received the man of they received okay and there if you could confirm strictly wholesale just no fulfillment we don't do any fulfillment we do everything wholesale comes in on pallets and goes out on pallets but wait a minute okay you said this was storage now it's distribution like honestly I feel like we're just changing the narrative as we go through this application you I have it written down you said Storage storage is what you do when you have a product that comes in and goes out it doesn't sit there forever it sits there for a long period of Time how long does the material sit in the in the place it's not fulfillment it is it is wholesale distribution storage and distribution how long is a product in your building a week that's not storage can that's distribution and I feel like we probably need to like pause what we're dealing with here because I don't think that how this was presented to us this was storage I have it written down five times storage Storage storage it's going to remain as storage that's not storage that's distribution it comes in you repackage it you send it out that's distribution like I I I feel like we're changing the narrative as we move through the applic I mean I don't I that's just my perception intention what is your per age yeah I don't think it's your intention but it's coming across that way to to all of us and our planner is making a valid point about it because it does change a little bit as it's being presented and it's kind of like on as Jennifer says on the fly right now so it might behoove everyone to take a step back give them an opportunity to give us a very clear St of operations I don't necessarily think the Board needs to understand the operations of like the retail space or the car wash but how this facility is being used and how you anticipate if there's growth involved it be used in the future I think that's like very critical to the board acting on the application so that's my recommendation but it's their application they can choose to handle it how they see it but that would be my recommendation because I feel like we're kind of shooting from the hip and I don't want to put you guys in that position I agree so Mr P what do you want to do do you want to take a break and we can if the chair would so allow yes I would like to take a a break okay we'll take another five minute uh break e the board will now take a fem minute break and reconvene at 817 p.m. the meeting will now Recon Mr chair board members with regard to the application of M pecker and braw I'd ask if first if your attorney could confirm our notices and the are proper and in order and then I've conferred with our clients you're a six-member board this evening if we would uh prefer to approach the board when all seven member when there's a seven member board which is the applicants prerogative we would ask that and I'm advised that you have December 16th wide open I would ask that you put us on your December 16th agenda and of course we'll place on the record an extension of time to extent the board requires it okay where are we with the extension of time again on that right now it expires December 31st so you're okay for now okay any additional extensions requested by the board will be granted okay thank you okay to put this on record um excuse me okay I didn't hear that he he say it's been going on for a long time he wants to proceed the applicant has requested to carry so yeah no they're we're going to carry it's their application so that our application so okay so anybody here for case Mr first if M if we could have Mr Bayer confirm that the notices yeah the board is jurisdiction okay thank you sir okay case number ba 22-11 Aaron peer and Yanda Brun this application will be carried and that was to December 16 with no further notice and I guess thank you okay I thank you thank you very much for your Indulgence this evening good night good night so I guess may be some baseball for us tonight question yeah iene uh when's the next meeting because we're skipping next week right or it's October 28th is the next meeting we have to wear costumes yes thank you for wearing one tonight this guy's like a comedian Mr CH make a motion to