##VIDEO ID:g1iCG11INO0## e e e e e e e e e good evening and welcome to the September 12th um meeting of the Indian River County Planning and Zoning commission uh we'll begin with a Pledge of Allegiance please United States Amica stands na indivisible andice all uh thank you um are there any additions or deletions to the agenda none uh our first uh item of business is the approval of two sets of meetings um the minutes for two sets of meetings the first is July 25th 2024 we have a motion to approve so move uh second seconds okay excellent um all in favor I uh the second is the August 8th 2024 um minutes uh motion to approve all in favor I excellent um tonight we have two um uh items on the agenda uh one is a non-consent item and the other is a public hearing we'll start with the non-consent consent item and that is uh T-Mobile wireless tower it is a request for a major site plan and administrative permit use uh approval for 100 foot tall wiress tower um Tower Ventures is the applicant um foresight group LLC is the agent the zoning is IG General industrial the land use designation is commercial industrial um and um uh I guess we'll for for this in the public hearing any exp parite uh Communications disclosures none uh good um and we'll uh swear in anyone who would like to talk on either one of these subjects uh please stand and get swor morning in do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth good we'll start with the staff presentation for the T-Mobile wireless tower thank you Mr chairman uh good evening members of the commission for the record and for all in attendance my name is Patrick Murphy I'm a senior planner with the planning and development service Services as the chairman stated this is for a T-Mobile wireless tower it's administrative permit use for the location the tower is located or it's going to be located at the south side of 45th Street approximately 2,000 ft east of 58th Avenue it's going to be located in the very Southeast corner of what is the 45th industrial complex which is under construction right now most of the buildings have been built and there's just a few that are being built all the storm water improvements on that site have been completed the driveway has been completed all the internal driving aisles and parking spaces so all the infrastructure for the industrial complex is completed this is going to be buried back in the very Southeast corner behind one of the buildings uh aerial uh plan just to kind of acclimate you to what the site looks like and its neighbors to the west of the site is the Ken Gregory produce distribution in an FPL substation to the east is reliable septic in in a mobile home park uh to the South is a mulching facility you can see on the map in the blue square that is where the tower facility is going to be placed and then the red circle is actually the closest residential dwelling it's about 600 ft to the Northeast this should actually reite in landscape plan it's a combo plan uh because this site is going to propose only about 950 additional square feet it has a very diminus effect on storm water and therefore it will not be required any storm water improvements that is also so why you don't see a storm water slide like you traditionally see with our projects um it's a 100t steel Tower with a 6-ft lightning rod it has a break point at 59 ft designed to in the very unlikely event of a catastrophic failure the top of the tower would come down first and then the other Tower although it's extremely extremely rare for these towers ever to really come down they're engineered extremely well and they're built very strong the tower site it will be surrounded by an 8ft tall wooden fence with the Finish side out so it has anti-climbing for it it's required to have um trees around the site to help buffer the compound they are going to be planting six red maple canopy trees 13 understory trees comprised of Sweet Bay Magnolia and dahon uh none of the uh existing trees that were canopies were going to be affected in addition to the 8ft fence the site itself already is surrounded by 6ft chain link so it's going to be is very secure it will have all the proper signage that is necessary for it uh the tower code requires based on the height of the tower two antenna minimum so that they can be collocated in the future to reduce the proliferation of towers in the county this Tower will have actually Four antennas on it moving to the recommendation uh the site plan has met all of the 97 1.44 five specific criteria just wanted to mention that that criteria deals with height setbacks uh camouflaging the the base being screen all of those items have been exhaustively reviewed and approved and staff now recommends that the PCC approve the administrative permit use for a T-Mobile Communications Tower with the conditions list in the staff report those are conditions are the applicant will be required to provide a letter in affidavit stating that if the tower was ever to not be used anymore it would have to be removed and that all Landscaping 8ot tall wooden perimeter fence and the required signage shall be in place prior to issuance of a certificate of completion for the project with that be happy to answer any questions the commission may have the applicant and their RF engineer are represented here today if you have any questions for them thank you thank you um any questions on the right Beth go ahead um the package says the facility shall be deemed abandoned if they discontinu service um does that mean that if they wanted to come back they'd have to start the process all over in terms of Permitting um for permitting they would so they'd have to reestablish the electric connections to the tower they wouldn't have to go back through the administrative permit use because the tower itself will be approved it would have been installed and the CFC issued for that so what they would need to do is get bu building permits for the electrical connection cuz if there was abandon that would have been um turned off the circuit basically removed that they so if it was a Bandon they want to start back up they just really need to go through the building division to reestablish that service they wouldn't have to come back before this process or go through site plan because all of that would have already been approved sure yep just a couple of quick questions one is the um access to the tower is that through the access off of 45th Street or yes yeah they're going to access the same driveway that used for the industrial complex and then they have a concrete driveway connection to the internal driving aisle of the complex to access the tower compound and I know we dealt with this a long time ago regarding the residential structure that was nearby in certain distance away for breakoff points and so forth does this affect the property to the south of the mulch facility if they ever wanted to do something or not uh it should not affect that whatsoever no what's distance away from their proper approximately to the to the end of the industrial complex yeah I'd say roughly it's about 200 feet okay so it's more than enough yeah thank you sure yes sir uh the only question I have and I know it has to do with height regulations but you mentioned catastrophic failure and I know 100 ft is not a lot when we're talking about aircraft but they are in the flight path of the airport my question is why there's not a regulation to have that Tower lighted so catastrophic failure airplane is is looking for a place to land at night mechanical failure to's not lighted I know that's low right but that was the only question I had so lighting of the towers is actually regulated by the FAA and any tower under 200 F feet would not be required to light the tower the did submit their site plan to the ver Beach Regional Airport and it was reviewed and was accepted they did set a maximum height of 100 ft it could not be any more than that based on where the um active runways are located and which way flights would come in and out they decided that that was the height that was the maximum they could allow but they did not require any lighting above and beyond what the FAA would have recard thank you sure okay any questions to the left I we're all answered oh we good I a brief one uh is it um the removal after abandonment is that uh boiler plate or is it unique to the uh a tower like this or what's the story over there um it's boiler PL that's right a code provision right out of the tower code for for abandonment but it only applies to Towers correct that's right okay all right thank you okay and there will be four uh antenna on this and is can they have more than four is there room for more than four they could have room for four but due to the spacing between the antenna once you get down to a certain height above the ground you're really not getting any bang for your buck on your signal transmission so they're going to take obviously the top Tower height T-Mobile will I I believe is about 95 ft above ground level and there's only be three carrier antennas that are going to be permiss underneath those uh once you get below that you're really not going to get any kind of signal strength at all and with the height of towers it's that's height is all about your signal you the higher you go the farther the signal travels so if if anything goes lower than that they're just really not going to get very far at all so it'll be a maximum of four most likely is yeah when you say they have four are the U other three already leased or I'm not aware of the other leases that uh the tower operator has other than T-Mobile okay so when you say there's four there's just uh it's designed for four correct that's right okay okay good um at this point I'll open the floor for public questions or public comment uh either one of the microphones and state your name and address good evening I'm Luke hatman I work for Tower Ventures um U I'm the senior zoning and Acquisitions manager for the company I've been working on this site with Mr Sullivan for about two years we're come to the end of the process we hope and uh it's a good site we've met the ordinance we've um uh made every change that was required and we've worked diligently with the staff and I appreciate you Patrick all the hard work he put into this and Dallas and few other people that I'm sorry I don't remember names well but I would just ask you that um if you have any questions be happy to answer them we'll be happy to comply with the abandonment uh Clause matter of fact I already have a letter ready for you guys and uh if you have any questions be happy to answer them if not I respectfully ask that you approve our uh request tonight and we' be allowed to build the Tower thank you thank you Lou uh anyone else close the floor for how tall how many wait wait wait name address Tom Sullivan 4187 West 16th Square no relation to the other Sullivan okay how tall is 100 feet in stories I was an iron worker for a while when I was a kid I worked on the First World Trade Center from 86 to 110 usually 10 fet a story correct so that's a 10-story building uh several weeks ago or maybe it was a month ago I was at a commission meeting where they were discussing the tower the um water tower that's in gford and how practical and iconic that was and that it's being used for these types of activities and that's why they they obviously didn't want to take it down but the iconic nature of it meant a lot to the community but I I didn't even know this was on the agenda this evening I talked to a planner several months ago because I go in there once in a while and he said this thing will never fly now I I just don't know how I live where I live I see planes go over my house about every 7 minutes it's the instructors flying their planes now most of the time they're at a higher altitude than 10 stories but they have young Pilots when you become a pilot you have to take a tribe course where you have to hit three airports we all remember the young girl that was killed several about a year ago I can't believe anyone would put a 10-story tower in that proximity of an airport and and I mean you can tell me the rules you can tell me the ordinances just give me the common sense of this you know there are people flying here all the time and these aren't planes that are instrument rated and a lot of the pilots aren't instrument rated and putting a 10 story structure that close to an airport a little a regional airport that has a lot of you know pleasure planes people I've I go eat at cannons on Sunday you know what people do there it's very nice they fly in okay in their little beach crafts and their little Pipers with their families you know I I I just think I don't know I I think to put something like this that has the potential for an accident and secondly when I just heard Joe fer say we're all about sunrises not highrises you know I'm starting to wonder what's happening here like are we forgetting where we are we're going to put 100 foot Tower they can go out west and put the tower and again I don't know if anyone lives in that area they say you know you go outside and you look up be you you try to find matter of fact go over the bridge to the beach I think those two spires are 12 or 12 stories am I right on that 13 I think 13 yeah take the top three stories off and that's what you're going to be looking at well the the the fact is that the airport has had a opportunity to comment on this and they didn't they don't share your concerns right right you know a lot of people don't the only thing I could do is express my concerns you know and I'm not worried about that I I mean I I didn't see I was this noticed in the paper I guess it was don't know don't know how you ended up here well don't know how doesn't it have to be noticed uh the county did follow the notice procedures and there was a sign placed out at the front of the site there for a minimum of 30 days before the hearing date okay that would be an interesting okay that's another interesting thing for me just to talk about procedural stuff uh the the sign that would be placed in front of that area would be about would you say about this big you say about that roughly okay and what street was it on 45th 45th what part of town does anyone does any it's an industrial part of town is it not I just don't think this was properly noticed okay and and and we can say procedurally it met what you all wanted to meet but if you put a sign that big on 45th Street with people driving by okay and the other side the other side of the street is industrial people aren't going to notice this the this had I think your second complaint is a complaint that you should go over with staff if if you've got major complaints about how it's how this is noticed I've been going over that with staff for about four years okay my you know now I'm trying to go over it with the commission okay I attended this meeting once again so I can pick up procedural inputs and see how this works as I said when I walked in here I was more concerned about the second item on the menu than the first okay so that was the notice now it's the notice and it's also if it were noticed would more people have my point of view that they don't want a 10-story tower in that area go ahead thank you actually I wanted to ask Susan can you can you describe what the notice requirements are yeah so I know one of them is going to be there's a mailing from a certain foot that sorry and I was just going to ask staff to see if they actually did this because solutely it's I'm sure they're well versed and knowing what they're required to do for the record Ryan Sweeney assistant Planning Development Services director so the level of notice is commensurate with the level of the request and again we have three layers if you will permitted by right which is uh can be staff level approval unless it's over a certain threshold which it comes to you all administrative permit which which is sort of our middle tier and that's what this is today this is a tower in an industrially zoned area so it's it rises to the occasion of needing planning zoning commission approval uh but that's not a special exception or a PD which is our high highest level res earnings special exceptions and PDS uh require so to answer the immediate question is just the sign posting on the property it does not involve a notice by mail to surrounding property owners and it does not involve a legal ad in the paper rezonings PDS and special exceptions involves all three posting of the sign by staff um notice by mail to all surrounding property noers within 300 feet and if it's residential including copying the HOA and a posting in a legal in the paper and that's for pnz and the board so this is our middle tier level the sign the notice requirement is the sign posting Ryan I have a follow-up question for you those are our ldrs or is that a Florida statutory uh ldrs those are our ldrs correct Just for information for okay yes different jurisdictions have higher or lower levels of of notice requirement and different size requirements and duration and all of those things thank you thank you one other thing Ryan being this is not a special exception use permit we're here to follow the letter ofrs and our own personal preferences and feelings do not matter Mr chairman I wanted to ask staff to maybe clarify hold on you'll have a chance to do that anyone else okay we'll close the floor for a comment now come back one thing if I may I didn't understand what he said what exactly is specific to this site I know he went through PDS and things that so Ryan could you tell me what the notice is specific to this site this is an administrative permit use which is a type of approval and it requires only the sign posting is the only so okay so what where we are because I thought I got a little confused there during that explanation did anyone else I heard I heard three different things three different levels what I am only concerned about is this one specific thing and I go back to the notice for this was that size sign in a neighborhood that is an industrial area and that's all that was done is that your answer is that your answer no that's actually not correct we also maintain a email list of about 30 interested parties in the gford neighborhood all of which were copied from start to finish none of which voiced any concern I'm on that list you did I receive any email are you sir with to procedurally let's stick to all right okay what's going on but I'm on that list am I not Ryan the gford interest the gford interested parties I don't believe so uh well 41st I I don't know if it extends that far not not East not east of us one there's a multitude interested all right just curious yes sir you two get together afterward and figure it out I don't mind getting together after we figure it out I like Ryan okay my my point my point here is that I just wanted to explain what the notice was because I thought for a minute there everybody thought they got not explained do you understand it yeah I did understand it after I came up and question itk anyone else commissioners Mark I know the airport signed off on this and uh someone commented that there was some proximity or Runway or uh Glide path and landing and that kind of thing do can the staff respond on that any yeah so this was reviewed by both the Vera Beach Regional Airport and the federal administr Airport Administration excuse me FAA and both of them have provided letters that they have reviewed the site plan and approved its location and its construction but is it uh does it line up with any of the the runways that the students use or I don't understand the proximity the ver Beach Regional Airport looks at all uh Runway alignments and where the structures are being proposed and they evaluated how that aligns and they approved it you want clarify that yeah um yeah Charles solvin I'm one of the owners I just want to say I am a a commercially I'm sorry an instrument rated Private Pilot I have over 500 hours I've flown in and out of the airport hundreds of times and it's not in the flight paths it's substantially off the fight pass you got fight the flight pass are for 422 which is to the not and it lines up and then used to be 11 one and now it's one two uh but yeah it doesn't and so what I was going to say to Mr Sullivan is that if you're at 100 feet it's objects in air are not your problem it's the ground because there are no Pilots the only time you're at 100 feet you're going down because with instruments today and and all that you're no chance you're going less than 500 feet unless you're on approach or like I say you're and then at that point the ground's your problem not a tower thank you Mr s the public comment is closed oh I was just going to say he he used the word that he didn't understand you said you were what type of pilot instrument rated Ty of pilot does everybody instrument rated hold on okay hold on so we have to follow the procedures all right okay but saying I'm a pilot but I'm not instrument rated thank you Mr Sullivan I com sure go ahead uh any given week I get about seven newsletters from the uh Telecom industry and I've been getting them for over 20 years and there is no I've never read an article where a plane ran into a cell tower and we're a Memphis based Corporation as FedEx is based in the Memphis airport busi airport in America after 11 o'clock at night we've built Towers all over that Runway there so we've never had a problem so thank you thank you commissioner anyone else good we'll call for a motion to approve second um second all in favor I opposed motion passes thank you uh the second um agenda item is a public hearing and it is um uh schr resoning uh and it's a schworn re uh real uh realy Corporation and Warren lern requests to rezone approximately 7.97 Acres from CG General commercial District to M Med uh Medical District um we have already uh done uh experte um uh participants have been sworn in uh staff presentation please hold on hold on Dr day we still need to ask for did you ask for exporte for this particular matter they did site visits for both of them okay I just want to make sure sorry thank you and sworn in for both of them thank you yep when we when you asked for exp parte uh I I didn't have a conflict except that I I just changed to T-Mobile but where where in the meeting would you announce a conflict I that's not a conflict though Mark no I know so yeah when when you're asked for it but I wasn't you didn't ask for conflict you only asked for X Marte so it would do you have a com go ahead it would be relatively at the same time or if you knew beforehand because you have the agenda before you would also disclose that to myself and to Lisa Miss patent over there and you would have to fill out the nice little eight beef have it filed and all that stuff so it would be if it's beforehand then it's beforehand because usually the idea is you guys get the agenda and you can at least let us know um and then when the actual agenda item comes up you still disclose um that you you know you're abstaining from your vote because of you have this um conflict of interest but yes the the T Mobile being a customer that's too far removed it's definitely not a conflict all right staff presentation please good evening board I am Cindy Thurman senior planner for long range planning and tonight as previously stated we have the Sheron realy Corporation request for rezoning from CG to meed or medical zoning District property contains 7.97 acres and is located on the east side of highway US1 south of 41st Street in a residentially mixed use area this property is currently zoned CG General commercial zoning district and is undeveloped purpose of this request is a reone the property to Medical District zoning and to develop the site with uses permit in the med District such as multiple family housing this area of the county features a blend of commercial and Warehouse properties a residential area and has undeveloped commercially zoned land all line within the urban service area a look at the zoning map shows the property location bordering on the East is likewise Meed zoning to the South is Meed and PD zoning which is the Wood Lake Commons p commercial PD solely commercial and to the West is the CG zoning which runs all the way up to the US1 Highway border and to the north across 41st Street is cln rm6 which is multiple family zoning future land use map shows it is an established commercial industrial node everything here in the red is the commercial node look at the existing CG zoning designed for General retail commercial uses with no warehousing intended to provide for development of General retail sales and selected service activities CG's owning district is not intended to provide for any heavy commercial activities such as outside commercial service uses heavy repair services or outside storage a comparison look at each existing and proport propose shows similarities and differences you can see here there's a difference in the rear stepb and the minimum open space and the development standards proposed Meed proposed Zing district is intended provide for a variety of uses which support major medical facilities uh they protect major medical facility from encroachment by land usage which may have an adverse effect on operation potential expansion of facility prohibits land uses that could cause adverse effect effect on neighboring properties because of noise vibration odor smoke traffic and other physical manifestation this allows for accessory uses in support of principal uses allowed in the med District this resoning request is consistent with the commercial industrial future land designation as it is part of an established commercial industrial future L node the commercial industrial future Lage knows designation is intended to provide for areas for the development of Industrial and Commercial uses located in areas with suitable levels of service and infrastructure for urban skill development located along major transportation routes and seated from residential areas and no future land use Amendment change is part of this request as like I said it was is already part of an established commercial node every rezoning has to be analyzed per the review criteria of chapter 90212 subsection 3 and whether or not the proposed amendment meets the criteria of items a through K item a is the request in conflict with any applicable portion of the Land Development regulations the requested me zoning designation is consistent with the subjects commercial industry landage designation and not inom ICT with the Land Development regulations Item B is consistent with the all elness of the comprehensive plan and specifically meets the criteria feature land use element objective one policies 1.17 1.18 and 1.43 item C the proposed Meed Z is consistent with coexisting commercial industrial future land use designation and no future Amendment change is being proposed par request item D is in compliance with the adopted County thoroughfare plan access for the site is from 41st Street which is an urban collector item e would this generate traffic which should decrease the level of service as adopted this request is actually reduction in trips so all roadway segments within the area of influence would operate and accept a level of service and the proposed Meed zoning item F the economic conditions have evolved in this area so there are change conditions that exist that warrant this amendment making it increasingly suitable for areas suitable for uses permitted within the Meed District item G would levels of service be decreased a more detailed concurrency review will be conducted during the development of this process here we can see we all reson are reviewed based upon the most intense use pursuant to section 9 10.07 of the Land Development regular regulations and we can see here that under the most intense under the existing CG zoning district and under the most intense proposed me District that it would be the same square footages under both classifications item h the site is vacant and densely vegetated when the developments propose a more detailed environmental analysis based on the site specific development will be conducted item I the request will facilitate a more orderly and logical pattern by aligning zoning patterns in the area particularly with the adjacent Meed Zone partial and the by commercial and residential developments supporting an overall Co cohesive land use strategy for me in this area item J the request is in harmony with the proposed and purpose and intent of the Land Development regulations item K any other matters all concurrency mandated facilities of Ade adequate capacity to accommodate Mo the most intense use under the proposed zoning District so in conclusion the Meed zoning District request is consistent with the goals objectives and policies of the county adopted comprensive plan and Land Development regulations it's compatible with the surrounding area and strategically beneficial for the community it supports the continued development of a vital medical Hub meets current and anticipated land use needs and does so in a manner that is environmentally responsible and infrastructure compatible and can be supported by staff so our recommendation tonight is that the planning zoning commission recommend that the board of County Commissioners approval of this request request to reason the subject property from CG to me and I'd be happy to answer any questions they may have thank you Sydney uh any questions on the left Mark just a quick one this appears to be um uh down zoning or pretty close to equal in terms of intensity is there any way is there a procedure for Expediting that kind of resoning or I didn't say that correctly um identifying that fact or without having to jump through all the the Hoops that that an up zoning would unfortunately by Florida statute it requires any rezoning to go before the Planning and Zoning commission as an Advisory Board and then to the board County Commissioners for their final approval I understand that I just even if it's a down Zone expedited path unfortunately Zing that's that's correct unfortunately there isn't one it just it still requires the notice the public hearings and to move forward I don't know okay well I'll shut up simp it's okay anything else on this side good anything on the right oh this is a public hearing so I'll open the public hearing for uh comment and questions good evening Rebecca girlall mbv engineering on behalf of the applicant and owner um I here tonight to thank staff for their assistance on this project um and to ask for your approval tonight as we can move ahead to the board accounting commission and I am happy to answer any questions that might come up from the public or the board all right you thank you thank you anyone else Tom suvan 4187 uh this is like ground talk day for me Ryan uh I think Ryan understands that right the the section to the um east of this land if if you can put up that first thing for me and I I really that one yeah oh yeah okay so I I'm I'm just confused I always thought that was Med right Brian I mean Ryan I always thought because the other section that has all the housing in it now that was Med that went to CL now we have CL that's going to Med is that correct no this is C Mr chair thank you uh Mr San a couple different things so this unfortunately when this when this graphic was prepared the portion a large portion of this med is actually now PD that's the um oh yes and that has since been updated so when we get to the board that'll change um and that's that's the what was approved as Harbor Bluffs is now coasta Point that's the housing that's under construction but the piece the intermediate piece the the rectangle that's roughly the same exact size yes um has been Med and is med right um I believe what you're about is perhaps the properties to the north um changed from Med to seal at one point um well I know we just keep changing that over that as all so by and large a rather large chunk of the med District was consumed by Harbor Bluff so I believe I can't speak for the applicant but now they're seeing that perhaps there's a new demand for for bed thank you okay I that was just a question I had okay very good thank you Mr Sol thank you y okay now I I have one other question I just like to ask um I sometimes I don't understand um procedurally how would I get that changed with the signs or would I have to talk to the attorney so I can tell you there's a couple different ways but that requires an amendment to the code um so you are free to petition the Commissioners yourself to see if they would change that that um well yeah I remember when I remember when uh Mr lore was first appointed commissioner and we changed the code because he knew someone that wanted to plan stuff and they had hired people and they did it that day you know and Jason and uh Dillan were very accommodative so I that would be the County Commissioners yes and County Commission yes Mr Sullivan I I believe we've answered your your question as far as your request to rezone so I'll be see you okay thank you anyone else close the public hearing any questions from uh Planning and Zoning commission members uh none I'll call for a motion motion to approve we've got motions to approve we got a second all in favor I oppose uh it passes um commissioner matters any commissioner matters thank you I had for staff um the Press had a thing about high limit at the mall and the hotel and I'm painfully familiar with the city height limit and the way it works but uh the county and the rest of the cities in the county are different uh U Is it true that the only procedure for granting uh the height limit change for a parcel would be uh three Commissioners and will it come to planning zoning yeah yes uh Mr Mr chair and Mr M yes um so what was presented to the board on Tuesday was a sort of a conceptual consensus item to if we were even going to proceed with having that conversation to be clear it's specifically to just the mall area it's about collectively 100 acres so we're not talking about anything other in the unincorporated County or the municipalities it's only that area um the the details of the actual height limit and the compatibility measures like setbacks and other things will be flushed out in an LR Amendment will be what we call a height exclusion Zone and yes that will require a to go to come to you all in a public hearing and then ultimately to the board and in order to pass it would require three out of the five board County Commissioners to to pass okay so it's not a complicated process like a like a referendum it's not it's certainly not a referendum like it would be in the city but it's not not complicated I mean it's it's an ldr text Amendment there will be a notice of public hearing there will be public hearings conducted it's not going to be done in secrecy by any means and yes it will require a recommendation by you all so you know if if say there's seven and it's you know a 52 vote against that doesn't necessarily mean it gets denied but it's an indication to the board of where you all are vice versa if it's a 524 then but the board is ultimately the decision maker thank you oh I was going to say my piece if you guys are done if there's any other commissioner matters yeah the planning the only thing I was going to say is we we have already scheduled an advertise to have the September 26 meeting as well so unfortunately this happens every year we get a lot of applications that kind of Stack up and try to make a push ideally before Thanksgiving because then we only have one meeting in November and one meeting in December so we're getting busy in the tail end of the year thank any uh notion of what October looks like October 10th also is looking like we're going to have that meeting as well uh I will you know teaser on the next agenda for the September 26 we're going to have an actual formal discussion item about potentially switching to one meeting a month starting next year um but we'll we'll talk more about that next next meeting thank you you chairman I will not be available for the October 10th I will be out of town app very good very good uh attorney matters yes just just really quick um I'm not sure if staff would be inclined just given not just from Mr Sullivan's inquiries but there seems to be a consistent inquiry about notice and notice requirements I'm not sure if on the staff report we could just kind of put what notice is required for the particular item and just say how it was actually achieved so at least that way that's covered so when that comes up it's at least already been discussed yeah well we can just include a section notice notice requirement and what method it was I'm just thinking of other boards sometimes or other staff for other issues do that that require notice they'll say hey we did notice this way so it's already taken up up front okay thank you thank so that would show up in their report yeah it'll be its own section that just says required notice and then we'll explain it'll probably be the same two sentences every time it'll either be the sign posting or the full just just just a suggestion as far as the report thank you good idea I have a question another question about notice um is there ever a time that you exceed the minimum requirements for notice well I would I would say we do every time because frankly we maintain these email these emailing lists are voluntary they're not required by code but they're probably the most effective they're the ones that the that first of all it's the people that are in the IM mediate area that are truly interested every every one of those groups is called an interested party because they are and secondly um they get it right in their email in unless they go us the junk mail which I mean trust me if we send something to an interested group and it's something they want to know about we we hear from them so okay thank you thank you thank you thank you