##VIDEO ID:9PHXLTEYoow## Mr Gary pay Mr David MCG here miss Francis Papi here Miss Megan here all right that we've got a corn first item approval of minutes item a Mr chair for to visitors I don't think we have any uh not unless you would speak I'm just kidding no we don't have any old business here old business Nows to excuse me um this is sort of old business but it pertains to both the items that are being considered under new business to get the federal government to pay the vast bulk of renourishment costs do on a regular basis parking is part of that access consideration reducing the net number of parking spaces will probably not be willing to parking in the restri with the all the work being done it's gone from like maybe nine spaces to maybe 18 or more I can't tell for sure they haven't finished the end of it it could be as many as 22 spaces gain second uh Street and Fourth Avenue the city council has decided to consider converting that in dep paring probably for low speed vehicles or whatever that's under consideration by staff I'm sure um even if it's just low spe parking this one of those counts is a third of a parking space in the total Town that's a big chunk ofet 25 spaces depending on how the fourth and second job is done now what do you do with the spaces I would suggest that we think forward since we're going to be redoing all the Lots how nice it would be to set a car of eight spaces out of the lot that's in front of lynches on the ocean and make a little park now we have a park Department that knows how to landcap that's easy to maintain maybe use some of the spaces um to take some of the pressure off the P3 to make it a more economically viable project and in line with that the thir is the only parking lot you can Elevate that Jack Beach owns that wouldn't screw up somebody's view is one the high sneakers you can go two stack on that partial or full it's not cheap sneakers yes to the west of sneakers you could partially or fully double stack that sucker and that would really freed up P3 it let P3 13 15 ft on the first floor to put all the stuff that shops and stores need it would give you 10 10t easy on top of that the next two levels which let you do all sort things even if you couldn't get all the car getting some of out there we give you a lot more flexibility particular on the first level um so as part of the P3 considerations maybe it's already been considered I don't know I wouldn't know but we need to think about parking really long term because the other item on here with the uh dining uh 15 18 years ago Jack Beach carved half the rways out of some of the streets to the north and turn them into parallel parking it's very few spaces actually but it reduced the withd of the rideway from 20 plus fet to 10 ft and particularly with new structures going up on some of the Vegas properties and Way Beyond My Lifetime some Redevelopment some that area the ability to pull a few of those spaces out and have a big 20 or 22t curb to private property line would give a lot more pedestrian feel and look and allow a lot more flexibility for the outdoor dining and other Outdoor Concepts and that's why I want to mention two things it's a big deal it's a really big deal long thank you um I just want to confirm um it's my understanding that all 100 of those spaces at the pier must stay that way due to the contract with um city for the um Pier so we can't actually reduce this I don't know how many spaces we have but I know the contract says we must have 100 so how many spaces are in that spot 100 in the ballpark 120 off the top of my head I be there's so many random parking lots we keep tallies on but it is in the ballpark of like somewhere between 117 and 124 and it is the contract is only 100 correct correct the contract there is room for that and we've had discussions just in the past about making some kind of Boardwalk approachable for people to send their kids up to get little teen cuts and stuff so you got my favor on that um as far as um the elevation of sneakers I was my understanding sneakers wouldn't sell or there was discussions about that with them we'd have to work with them for the P3 and that they're technically private property we'd have to buy it so we'd have to make a recommendation to purchase that property but we also did have plans in the works and should have already had a parking lot on second and fourth on North so I agree with you that parking is an infrastructure issue and if we want more people here I agree with that I know wholeheartedly as well but I think the sneakers thing you could correct me wrong you're not you're not necessarily wrong it was just determined that because that is privately own Jim was actually part of these conversations as well it would be best practices for the process for us to not be involved in that however um if and when we were in an agreement with a developer if that developer then wished to approach sneakers and sneakers was then on the same page with joining then that would be completely appropriate and then the other parking um study that during the parking study we did we also talked about um across from guess the r parking lot basically surrounding the RIT parking lot in that um apartment complex which we originally wanted to buy or there was a discusss to buy u a long time ago he's very aware yeah and um that being that being a property that um would be raised as well which I know a bigger part of the view and what not they're talking about lock ability on that street and not making an empty parking lot since we're required to keep the tier empty um so I mean I agree not blocking people's spaces but at the same time I'm kind of just um General I agree with all that I just wanted to make sure that I understood the contracts and sneakers part lot because we decided not to approach that for that reason and we didn't do anything with the red par lot either because of that I have agreement from back then Taylor do you still need to address um yes but I can wait until all the board members have gone okay um as regards the wave departments I do own them I don't feel conflict of interest in any event except event that the city would like to buy them at some point um why they didn't get sold I had three properties in the um Redevelopment area and I had them all appraised with the same apprais and I took that one to Jacksonville Beach and met with Bill man and George Forge and said if you want it I'll give it to you for the appra um how you know do you want yes are the politics in place to get it yes can we move recently quickly well you know we're the city we can't do it in two weeks but we should be able to get done in a couple of months 15 years later s months later i' sold everything else we had on the Block for 20 to 30% more than the appraisals by the same apprais and I withw my offer wants it they can always buy for a fair price and I don't mean anything over it either and that's just for the record EV that that were ever to occur I would become a nonvoting member of this board for a while but we have no great reason to keep that but the reason we withdrew it because of the way things going down two other appraisers that the city retain I'll go one in further on this one of them was told to income only I know him I've known him since we were kids those were his instructions income only the other one had comps on all the converted houses on MAR Street you remember how nasty those used to be allal at one point said okay you're all legal now so those are the other two appro and I just I just gave up I get that no but that's um and I'll just say from those discussions from when it was and all of them as well like the whole thing was like well if you guys don't want to do the parking lot on second and four which we already have approved they wanted to hold out for the RIT parking lot area because it was a bigger P3 project but that's you know like pass history but I do agree in general with what you're saying we don't want to take get parking it'll be nice to not have the pressure on the P3 because I think now that the height limits being officially at three levels and still requiring all that parking to make it difficult for any person so we can find a way and I'm 100% for parking being in infrastructure T um it is all right with you Mr chairman I would like to kind address a few things on the staff report if that's all right please do um all right so the First on there are going to be our future CR meetings I know in December we plan for it to just be a training meeting um I don't know if we want to say fortunate unfortunate but the way it has shaken out is we've actually got an applicant um I suspect we will have a fac application a very good use of fa grant program funds so we do not want to make this applicant um wait so if they get their application in in time it's sufficient that will be probably first up on the agenda next month um and then our safety grant program final documents it'll be the entire package I kind of went into a little more depth than that on here um but it will be the application the one page summary and then the required devices and brands that are compatible with our police department and then at the previous meeting know I think it was uh Gary I think referen made a really good point about maybe increasing the maximum eligibility on the amount of Grant ones so that was something we had changed and we were going to kind of Base that number off of what's reasonable within the type of equipment that they could buy um and then another thing that came up was what happens if we award these grants and then they leave and then we have this equipment so we're working with legal to kind of hash out um for a lack of better terms and repercussions if you want to call them that shouldn't it just be based on square foot I mean sare foot a bigger building is going to need more safety equipment than a smaller building potentially um it runs into one of those things that where we want to be detailed enough without being overly detailed because inevitably there will come a day when we have something that is a substantially smaller square footage but based on proximity location um where it is in relative to RPD cameras maybe this small footprint needs more safety and so I feel like there should be a base amount mhm and then to go over and above that would be square footage that way you know we have a base package and if you have a you know talking about sneakers that's a large building right and if they wanted to app that you know that amount of safety equipment isn't going to be the same as lyes sure that you know what um that's a great point and I will Circle back with our police department and legal department on that but I um I do like that approach um so then once we get through a potential facade Grant app the safety Grant finally that finally approved uh we will then do training and basically what that's going to be is just a refresher course some legislative updates because there happen um a good amount of legislative updates that I feel like are important um Communications for board members and then just our Sunshine Law stuff and our legal department is going to be here with us for that training in January right now our regular meeting date is tentatively set for our joint workshop with city council and this will be with um our newly St city council and we will about now more than just First Street so that will be first order of business will be First Street and kind of the direction there in regards to papers and Street Direction and the urban Trails project and kind of how all that ties together in the direction they would like to see us go with that uh the boardwalk this has been a really funny one so this is based off of an ordinance from 1946 that the city still follows that basically says you cannot do anything at all on Boardwalk um it's it's crazy it's it's but that's why none of our businesses can any they can't even sell an ice cream call you cannot do anything on Boardwalk um I am not mentioning names but pre no nobody since I've been here I'll throw that up there previous previous previous previous City attorneys had said that oh you couldn't touch this ordinance of the 10 foot pole you would get yourself into a reverse bir Harris decision which our current C attorney review and said that's not a thing um that doesn't make sense and that yes we absolutely can and should revisit this so that will be the second order of business at our joint meeting is to kind of disc of the options uh myself as well as Heather and administration have all kind of come up with um just kind of a menu and different ideas that we can do that allow certain uses on the boardwalk without it becoming a Dayton Beach Boardwalk situation we kind of want to find that nice middle of the road so we'll talk about that and then by that point we should have our P3 out on the street um and then there will be a couple of preference details in there that we want to talk with the council and C at the same time about because it's bus project as it's in the district but it is a city parcel so it's going to be a unique conversation but a good one list I think um and then sometime in the spring and I and I hate that it's kind of vague but at a future date um we will have essentially a workshop on the new reporting requirements because those have substantially changed and you have to have your new requirements in place by end of calendar year 25 we anticipate having those in well in advance of that um we will probably be utilizing those new standards for our upcoming annual report in theing but we will do a workshop with you guys on just what that's going to look like just again so everybody's kind of up to speed um city council has got some big things coming up on their meetings at their well tonight they will be adopting the election results officially and then seating the new city council they're also going to be talking about the Citywide signage brand standards project try saying that three times fast um that's going to be awarded to GI and that is the city kind of taking a handle on signage all across the city because it is kind of a right now a bunch of different things um we will not necessarily be jumping in on this with them but I will sit in on a lot of these and be a party to these conversations so that will what we do in the downtown won't be the same but it will be complimentary to the Citywide signage plan um the December 2nd uh pending our approval tonight the sou group contract will then go to city council um and then that will be the first reading of the extension of this sidewalk dining program um and as well as pending approval from you guys ton support December 16th that will be a big one as we will uh have C board appointments um so I encourage everyone if you're able to attend that one uh please do and that will be the second reading of the sidewalk dining program pending it passing and then that will also be the comprehensive plan reading um and then the December Council briefing these don't necessarily have anything directly to do with C but I just felt like they're very important city Rel things they're going to be talking about storm water rate that is a public works and finance discussion they're going to be talking with the police department about banning smoking on the beach that's on the council briefing uh Urban Trails update uh special events updates and then that again lovely 1946 ordinance will be discussed um something that is attached to your staff report is a letter that Public Works sent out to certain residents um around America Avenue they have an open house tomorrow night from 400 to 6 parks and W and this is to inform those directly impacted by this project um I believe this is one of those where it was a targeted approach to a certain kind of chunk of folks so I do not believe this is the Citywide open housee this is kind of that first one for those residents but nonetheless I wanted you guys to all be informed that that was occurring um and so did the Public Works director something that I am starting with the city manager I'm actually really excited about we are doing a monthly downtown review where basically we hours of the day and we do nothing but go Street by Street of downtown and we find problems and rather than me just pestering various departments and entities and organizations now the city manager is going to pester them on our behalf so I'm really excited about that um it kind of spearheaded from a couple of other issues but I'm really excited to have his support on this and I think it truly will make a difference so we're super excited uh our passive Park folks have sent all of the lighting info to Beach's energy because we need to make sure that we have the appropriate um amount of energy required on the Transformer there so we're working on that with Beach's energy for the passive Park and then weirdly enough we kind of had to pump the brakes for a minute because the state had to determine that the site wasn't a protected Wetlands we're like no of course it's not just because we say it that doesn't mean anything but they have S um in the last 10 days come back and said nope you're good it's not protected so we are perfectly fine to continue there um our P3 we like working with Jones Edmonds again those criteria that they're working on is required by State Statute and at the Joint meeting in January we'll go more in depth on where that stands and then again some of the partnership possibilities and some of the deal structures that we will get input from C and Council uh for the Peer parking lot everyone's favorite we received the electrical quote on November the 12th so that was sort of our final piece because our hardscaping quote came in we're like okay cool we got thinking second if we don't come in and put electrical L at the same time as this we are shooting ourselves in the foot that makes no sense so Vanguard got us our quote we are actually sitting down tomorrow with all the necessary department and all the contractors to kind of map out who needs to do what first when and where so I am really excited to get that going um there is a new fence uh just past the park along South Beach Parkway I kind of did a little write up on that in there um kind how that came to be um basically those homes the developers requested as a lot do from public works you know granted a use of the easements and rideways but because there are Beach's energy poles directly above that rideway uh Beach's energy said absolutely not we cannot Grant access here if we need to get to it we need to get to it so Administration decided that they would move forward because it is a city ride of way they were going to put up the Privacy events to allow some type of a buffer so I kind of put this in here because I know they're working on it now just in case anyone sees it or wonders it's kind of how that one came to be we have an urban trail survey out right now the link is here it's on our website uh it's open through the 25th we encourage everyone to go in and take it um pleasantly enough though I did talk to Communications Friday and the higher percentage of votes right now are in support um and there's a lot of positive feedback so it's actually been really beneficial for Parks I put a couple of things in here about some overnight road closures for Road striping another fun one is our lovely welcome LED sign right here at Beach Boulevard uh we officially have issued the purchase order with datonics and D Bell Signs and we are replacing design so it will be working very soon um Splash pad's closed that was getting upgraded and repair TJ Maxx is set to open in early 25 uh Sephora when I typed this had not opened but they are now open in the Whole Foods Plaza uh and then another I kind want to give a ND to our finance team uh for our FY 23 annual comprehensive financial report they received um an excellent rating from the state for our financials and that is actually I believe the 31st year in a row they have received this recognition uh Gonzalez Park is open mine is the ball field dogs are allowed in the Fe again with some rules um if you have not signed up for our city newsletter I know I talk about it every now and again our Communications manager lately has really been doing a big inititive Communications with the city I encourage you to sign up for that and then awkward because I don't like to talk about myself during staff report but I have officially taken all of the required exams and final and I'm officially a certified Florida R Development Association Redevelopment administrator so I'm Legit now um so that's been really exciting and I am happy to take any questions comments sta report that you guys may have I just have one question one quick question regards welcome sign I heard you say new design did I miss that or is it same design no if I did that was a a m that is same design process just replacement making pretty yes that being case are they also going to f the one signed by has a hole in the middle of it they already have the template it's just like a it's just um to be determined and we can chat about the reason on that one later yes okay but it's on the radar that drives me absolutely insane it's been two years now that I've been asking for this sign to be fixed kind of like ourc shirt y sorry Taylor just from my information the American Avenue drainage improvements that's not a c project no it is not it was more kind of one of those FYI here's some information just when it's anything of substantial value and it's going to be really kind of a big deal um we just like to make sure everyone's aware so nothing catches you guys Sur price um one other quick thing I guess I'd like to just comment that I I think that fence going up along South Beach Parkway is hideous okay it's a 6 fo high vinal fence that runs 100 yards along South Beach Parkway and I think it really takes away from the Aesthetics along South Beach Parkway I think we could have done a much better job than before it was just a wood fence with a couple of slats running horizontally but now it's 6 high and the way I understand it that was to appease the contractor who bought the Lots well when he bought the Lots he knew where he help against South Beach basically and uh you know take a look at it but you know 100 yards of U of just white vinyling along and we just a mural on it that may be the answer I did want to know um I did speak to the just kind of about that in general about the F because I know there were some changes in the um LBC to what's allowing for offenses and he did confirm um just as an FYI that in the new LDC right now is allowing for six foot fences along main roads in the city and I guess that was something that wasn't allow but that that is also um a new change or something yeah about two um Council meetings they made that decision yep so just fun fact maybe related to I don't know but it was just something worth mentioning to because it was something different yeah you know unfortunately there's two streets that par parallel each other they're you know South Beach and then Sunshine court and there's just kind of a sidewalk with couple of grass strips in between but just the feel of that whole street has changed dramatically final sure I'll relay that um absolutely to Administration who does the irrigation for that along the fence because the one vyl fencing is that if you are fed from a well and it starts staining almost immediately it looks terrible okay and um so as long as it's not irrigated with well water I don't know who's irrigating that area but that's what's going that would be something Trevor would know and I'm very happy to follow up with him and find out just add for you you know the information that I have from is that that strip down through there is really City properties right away and the city is handling the building of that fence and public works or not Public Works excuse me personal Recreation is actually contracted for the construction of that fence and my understanding is they fence was decided on instead of put Landscaping there because they didn't want to put irrigation all the way down along that that strip that was the feedback I any other questions for sale on staff I was just going to Echo what what Gary said I mean I can appreciate you know the the fence needed to be repaired but the cost of repairing the wood fence versus putting this big long fence on there it it's I mean we see it all the time right where developers pick these little less than ideal areas and then ask for it to be subsidized for privacy I mean I don't why didn't we just fix the fence I don't understand why we had to make it oh because purely because they wanted privacy and I can appreciate it it these are a million dollar Plus Homes and W paying for their privacy F and an ugly one at that so it's just it I get you know I understand wanting to have a good relationship with what Builder you know I understand that but um I find that disappointing really that was that was the decision um and then Echo the scene with with the what is what is it going to look like soon and now we have to maintain a fence so just wanted to i' like to shift to the marketing part of this report um these events I'm excited to see that there's some you know priv like little piano concerts and stuff the hope is to really do those on the new smaller stage in the future these kind of ideas Mak more intimate program are um my question though is I haven't seen any advertisement for any of these things not even the market anywhere and I don't know if I'm just not on the right social media but like what is the marketing strategy I mean possibly um because I know it goes out every month in the newsletter all of these I know every single Tuesday of the month there's a video that goes on our social media that mentions all of these um they're regularly posted to the social media page and they're regularly posted in the banners that swipe when you're on the website and kind of rotate on you um again credit where credits due the communications manager has made a huge push lately to really come up with some Creative Solutions on getting things out there and I know there's been a lot of positive feedback on these take two Tuesday videos they're two minute videos every Tuesday they feature a different city Department project Etc but the last maybe 45 60 seconds of this video is nothing but going over all the upcoming events and things for the next week but if you're not on social media or if you're not um liking a page or following a page you're not getting notifications of it so my question is I've got the newslet I say the newsletter has it the website has it and then they post social okay I'm just curious because I think sitting on SP would these things and I just don't until I get my report from you and then I sh them in my calendar all on the city website they're all post that calendar as well um and then a lot of these you know we do give them kind of not tricky but you know it's one thing for us to for free post them in our newsletter on our website and things but as far as like running an ad ler obviously we're not going to do that we're not the event sponsor but a lot of these event sponsors also run ads in the leader as well okay all of these are recurring events as well right so right now yeah I haven't seen the cars and whatnot as well just I just I'm happy to see that there's some in smaller things that will Shi from the big stage to the small area absolutely so I'm happy about Alison over at parks has done a really good job about brainstorming some Creative Solutions for having smaller scale events during the week um about a month ago she did a Big Yoga event I think it was like over 200 people that ended up coming it was packed um they also are doing and I didn't put it in here I don't I think the way it fell this month was kind of weird with the holidays but she's been doing these concert series on Wednesday evenings that have been pretty popular um so been doing a lot to activate that area during the week and not just you know on a Saturday thank you m so it's like the silent disco where you have headphones on is the yoga going to be a regular it was not at the time of this last one but I do believe Alison's working on making that regular thing I don't know if it'll be the same Studio but I believe it's going to become a monthly kind of reoccurring obviously I don't know that we want to be in the middle of lam in August doing yoga sure maybe I don't some but I think I think mosquito yoga but yeah she's working on um yeah so yes but she's trying to make that I think a more permanent uh thing and again those are things that our lovely Tuesday videos have been featuring as well those videos are on YouTube too I think if you're not on Facebook you can find them on the city YouTube page I'm pretty sure if I'm wrong Jacob's probably watching and is going to text me and tell me to retract that but I'm pretty sure they're also on YouTube any other questions on the staff report before we move on to new business all right new business all right first up we have got the support for continuation and expansion of our outdoor dining pilot program uh we all kind of knew this was eventually going to come to us I'll be honest that two years went like that I did not expect it to be so quick um we had nothing but positive feedback from Jackal and Waka and the last time I checked in with PD there had not been any major issues either with outdoor seating at jaal and moaka right here yeah nothing nothing out of the ordinary for you downtown anyway um but you know it hasn't caused issues Marshal has not had any issues with side triangle problems anything like that so because that idea kind of stemed from the CRA and we initially did a resolution requesting Council to make this a program and then they're the ones that voted it into an ordinance uh we just thought we would follow that same format and request that you guys approve an ordinance for the expansion um and that just I want to point out something um that I think can kind of be misleading maybe a little bit is the corridors that we reference expanding to doesn't necessarily mean that every single one of these the day this is adopted are going to now automatically start do but it just gives us the flexibility over the next several years to expand there as deemed necessary rather than having to consistently come back um and in the actual Council ordinance it will still technically be a pilot they're not quite ready to make this a permanent thing but it will not expire until December of 2029 so it will be and that was another reason we wanted to keep several corridors in there because we really don't want to have to come back again and again and again before 2029 um and the first ones referenced in the council ordinance are North and South sides of Second Avenue Third Avenue well most of them actually would be allowed basically just as it reads in this so um and we have talked to some folks who have talked about developing and redeveloping different Parcels along these corridors that would be looking to develop into mixed use type areas that would have restaurant that AB want to take advantage so just because maybe something right now listed on this list doesn't seem like it's necessary um that doesn't mean in the next you know 12 to 18 months it won't be Francis are we having any discussions about extending our grant program um for those who want to utilize this um outdoor seating to help help them utilize this whole program or we um the way it's written now can they do it without us having to amend it so no right now if we were going to do that I think because we've actually had those same conversations I think what we would like to see happen is because that first pilot program was only two years it was so short and we just weren't really sure what would happen um if this one gets approved into 2029 then I think those could be some additional conversations to expand Inc much like we kind of said okay we're going to expand incidence now to safety if this goes through both readings it could be okay now let's look at expand um but with that being said it our grant program is not currently and to my knowledge has never really been planned and intended to purchase temporary installations so I wouldn't see it purchasing tables chairs benches those kind of things maybe the hardscaping that would be more of a permanent um solution but again that would all be up for conversation quite frankly and then um okay um I was just I was just curious because um I know that we that we're not trying to do like you said not doing anything as temporary my whole thought would be we probably would need to go around the budget aspect of this too I know that we already have approved the budget um so if we do it it would be something that we would need to make an amendment to the budget and if we have how much it would be so I just wanted to know if we were even going to consider that if it gets passed yeah and it may be something that we have discussions on but it's not something maybe that's implemented until next year you're talking by the time that second reading of this ordinance comes into play and then by the time we figure out okay what corridors are they going to go to next it's going to be spring and then we start budget G in the spring and maybe it becomes a part of next this year budget well when I joined this board this was my number one issue so I will consider admission accomplish and I will entertain a motion for this resolution uh just a quick comment overall David I agree with you I'm fully in support of this the only thing I'd like to see it expand just a little bit particularly Second Avenue North Third Avenue North and 6th Avenue North be great if it Incorporated that area from First Street East to the basically the boardwalk you know why not allow those businesses also the opportunity to to have outdoor seating I think it would encourage um some Redevelopment of those um parking areas and things that we have now in fact at one time I think it was considered that we take those parking areas out and we look at just making that outdoor seating and little more intimate spaces uh for people to sit and enjoy um the uh businesses and so forth in that area so again looking at Second Avenue North Third Avenue North and then obviously 6th Avenue North just expanding that that's roughly one block I think as long as we're doing this we might as well include that also that would be my recomendation well I'm assuming once we drop the pilot monitor of this program then everyone get it it it just all depends and it depends on where that City council's had in 2029 uh also I will say I think some of the reason we kind of focused on that between first and second Corridor and this stab at it is because at the time we still didn't even know if that coordinance from 1946 result on the boardwalk side of things was even something that we would be able to amend so we said okay let's focus on this side of things once we kind of get this going and we get these commercial areas it is I believe planned to then shift it basically all the way from where this States all the way out to the boardwalk pending amending that ordinance um it's just kind of this is where at right now whenever Council had those conversations with the um planning department staff on amending this but I'm happy to pass on that feedback as well I mean I think it makes sense especially since we're looking at that ordinance already resulting you know on the boardwalk prity come back and go through all the processes to get that approval we not just put that out there and people apply and hopefully if it makes sense it gets appr manyc the the only thing I'm going to say about the endzones which isn't against what you're saying Gary is that um the places that are being proposed now are parking spaces or no parking spaces that would be Street with an Zone you have a roundabout so if you do one there we might have to redo the whole roundabout to accommodate that outdoor seting which could be a traffic flow issue which will then pull in you know safety departments then pull in some other things and additional sens to us that we may not know um right now so for us to initiate this I'm more for let's keep it in this section and then once we get those answers to how do we deal with a a roundabout area that's going to be have to redesigned um just to accommodate one of four buildings on the side of it I think we need to just hold off for that personally um and just move forward but like I said I only one voice on this board when it comes to that well just to address your concern I went down took a look at each one of those and there's plenty of space you you could do it now without it making any adjustments to the parking and so forth um there's enough wi of side to accommodate some type of outdoor sking if that was desired so it's possible now I would like to see it you know um take a step further which is to eliminate the parking era all together and make those more intimate green spaces for the city but that's fur than that so are we going to this or not does it matter yes and no um because the end today to be completely Frank whether we took this to city council or not they're still going to look at it um so we can take this as is and this part of the staff report tell them that this discussion was had and I I'll be honest I'm not super from my role perspective comfortable without the planning director here because that's more her side of things is with those parking in the end zones and kind of how that uh the regulatory side of all that would work I mean I I think it makes sense in my brain but my brain is completely differently wired than thinking about the planning side of things um um but again I kind of leave that up to you guys also I did get a text told all I would somebody would text me in this meeting part of that America Avenue that is CRA um the America Avenue project Gary I'm sorry you were asking about C related that is CRA um there's parts of America that you know how that South District it's got weird nooks and crannies so there yes there is C on America Avenue and that came from the public works director diars behind and that may not be the best diagram but the legal description um it parts of that are in the C so there's funding ultimately that needs to be approved by the C no there is not it was approved in the budget I will entertain a motion for C resolution number 20253 I'll make a motion to adopt resolution 20253 for continued support and expansion of the outdoor dining program with a footnote to council that this discussion was had and how we split at least two of us as to where to go with it all right we need a to take a roll call yes yes we do all right okay we have a sorry I had to count for a second Mr Mosley yes Mr Gary payow yes Mr David mcra absolutely M Francis pavi yes Miss Megan yes by your votes you have passed this resolution thank you everybody next item yes before um Gary though I will talk to Heather specifically about what you recommended and get a very direct and clear kind of statement on what we'll take to council just so there's no confusion and I'll going to try Emil that to you guys she'll be back in office this week um so I will make sure we clarify that because I do agree that that is a good idea but I just want to make sure we're doing it by the book and if there's something left off odds are it was left off for a reason and that reason is just not in my perview at the moment so I will find mhm Item B approve disapprove and agreement with the Southern Group for consulting services to the C yes so in your packet you guys received uh the proposal from Mr Gilmore and team um something I always really want to point out is yes you guys always see Jim's lovely face at our meetings and occasionally Molly and Caris with them sometimes but thether GR has been a just a wealth of knowledge for me and um a big help and it is far more even though the three of them are wonderful the resources and access that I have to them as a complete group is huge um a perfect example was no one from our Corner was able to from Southern Group to be at the Redevelopment conference down in Tampa uh I was there there were a couple of ladies in the buffet line one day with me that saw my name tag and they were a Southern Group and they pulled me aside and then we all got to talking about legislative updates and they were actually able to some questions I have on something I had heard in a session um and I had never met them before that day but just because they knew that Jim worked at Jack Beach and they saw that's where I was from they again were another resource for me um so they have been a big help um and again we've done a lot over the last few years but I feel like we still have a lot to get done and even though thisa has one full-time staff uh having the southern group is like a big extension for staff here and it it quite frankly takes a lot off of me uh with a lot of the development of different and so I sure J is happy to answer any questions or comments you guys have um Taylor I yes sir it's not stated in here but I presume that the Southern Group services are also available to the staff of the city of Jacks Beach just through you I mean see yes because I am a city of Jacksonville Beach emplo yes so they are a c consultant when we had with Administration with Finance Jim they're always there always with me that's my question that's the answer thank you very much um just more of a generic question um it had to do with the hours um that you think that you guys kind of pour into this board um over time I know you guys aren't like C and you're tracking it I what have you but ballark do you how do you guys come up like you just estimate how many hours you're going to give us it by a certain percentage by a certain you know level or you just say you know what this is it because we're going to like how do you come up with your number question we have contracts transp excuse fine Transportation so that's mechanically how process how we are our work and how we do that is based upon an estimate of hours that we spend and it doesn't matter if we spend 100 hours or we spend 10 hours we also have contract with and that's but generally speaking the time weend of develop robs it's about almost every week for example me Rec IDE with the city manag talk about3 project are we going to follow stat follow theel process talk issues this is just prev so we're engag out here just about every we talking all those and better than I I mean I was just kind of just playing with numbers obviously 20 hours um um is a 250 an hour kind of fit with that CLE hours week like not a lot more than that yeah and that's why I I was kind of not saying that we want you to increase the costs I'm just saying trying to figure out I I was trying to just get how you get to it and 250 is reasonable per hour and then by 20 see them actually a reduction in price to the next year because J contract expires December 11 and won be red till the first January I can't do it because yeah no I was just I was just trying to estimate service to fee to know but yeah thank you for your service I'm happy you're this me too J could you just give me a little bit of clarification um when I look at the proposal it talks about only two real Services the P3 project and then also the updating of the C plan the CRA plan C plan work is done yeah and that's done but that's a major bulk of the work that's supposed to be done under I can only tell you that on this P3 project that we're working on it is going to be a lot more than 20 hours a month and and I say that because as you know we've been working on the RFQ for a very long time and every time we think about we've got done something else comes into play and there are serious decisions that have to be made we've discussed before and talked about some of our internal discussions if you follow the state P3 statute the city has to own the parking you on parking garage and observe all the risk for that be probably developed and we've got other developers that have come to us and say we're going to build a parking garage somewhere else and we'll build your parking garage and we'll develop the retail but we want you to incentivize the parking garage and then we have to think about issues like city employees where they going to park parking garage in that parking lot you got 200 City about 200 over there there yeah there's there's been a lot of monkey renes and then okay the city employees going to pay for parking or they get parking for free these are all iterations we fight for literally every week to come to some conclusions so we can make some recommendations to you I didn't know this to recently but as you know SL properties owns uhas and they own sneakers and a little bit of their land doesn't quite encroach on where we are and what I did not know is that SL allow some yeah so then we got toow down on and try to organize this thing and bring the good news is we have a lot of developer interest in this in this par we just got to make it right way to go out You' seen for the 10 points that we put in there there's a lot more than that we want to come back and talk to you about and that's related to evaluation of and I don't disagree with anything that you're saying I was just focused on the fact that saw is the on another of the services you're providing has already been completed but let me ask Taylor this question uh we've done the downtown plan but we also do the South End plan because that's required too by State Statute is to have a plan for the South we have a plan for the South End um and the South End is it's truly and I think a lot of this is going to come up into training you know we really do have to careful with how we talk about the south end because as the state defines SL and bl and need for redevelopment districts the South End is in a really good shape it's really getting to operation and maintenance um and that's something that staff Administration everyone kind of agrees upon so well I think that there will be minor updates to that souland plan there probably won't be overhaul but I did I'm glad you uh brought something up I did want to point out to a lovely little sentence right at the end of introductory paragraph that says included but not limited to the following um I don't think since I've been here there has ever been a here where what was in Jim and the southern groups spoke that that is what we stuck to we never have I mean I'll call them even uh Caris in their office back when we were in session I would get bills and have questions and concerns and um that that little line really helps me out because truly when I have any random thing come up someone in their office is going to have an answer if they don't they can find me one um otherwise sometimes I don't know where I go we are very fortunate that we can provide yeahor weel and the we've that is abely oh my bad yes any other comments I will just say for my comments and I will repeat exactly what I said the last time we approved this this looks like a tremendous value Professional Services G this is not expensive so the value you're providing is um say exceeds yeah it's a big help for me just so we used the JTA contract it back on the quite frankly I do a lot of work a lot of work and our retainer this so I said well if you want to follow the big back rules exactly at the same rate it's JTA I got no if there are no other commentsin I will entertain a motion I'm making a motion to approve the scope of the work and fee proposal for the Southern Group beginning December 12 2024 and expiring September 30 2025 as stated I'll second that M Mr dad Ming yes Mr Gary payt yes Mr David MCG yes M Francis pki yes Miss Megan yes by your vote you have passed this resolution items for discussion think we kind of covered everything I did not ask I didn't have anything else uh CU I board you guys to tears at Old business um um and that's all I've got right now again I can't kind of drive home enough really sign up for that newsletter it's not a noxious it's not I promise I'm not going to email you every day but it has a lot of really good content and it's not just C Taylor could you tell me maybe this was discussed somewhere um what is the project that's going on on 16th Avenue South and Third Street between third and second right behind that gas station oh I think that's an office building that's just out in the district so I'm going to be really honest and I off the top of my head I should be able to but honestly if it is outside there downtown boundaries I'm like um but I'm pretty sure it's an office building it's an office yeah it named after some um consulting or I thought I do have a question may it be something you have to come back to with that so part of the downtown beautification Disney wish that we do not have an ambassador for yet um and we're on the long waiting list for a lot of things that um I saw that is somewh quoting the world of our computers do the public dumpster areas or even if it is a public dumpster are get cleaned like the one on behind Sal behind it's um on second behind the oh my gosh the shop right across the street from my building on second in that parking lot the city parking lot there's a big dumpster yeah behind the two new restaurants yes how often is that first off one is that ours um ours being city responsibility and two um if it is how often do we clean our dumpsters and if it's not what are the ordinance to get them to clean it so first the only city one that I know is 100% that UNC comfortable saying as ours is a your parking lot is um how often are they cleaning it I could not tell you right now I happy to follow up if it is ours and get an appropriate answer and if it is not and it is blighted and unsightly because code enforcement is complaint driven not sing then yeah so I would encourage file I mean in all seriousness file just go to the website file a formal code enforcement complaint and it is nikk realistically I mean she's on top of stuff like that if she gets a complaint she'll be out there this week and we have pools of Suess is nasty yeah then I highly highly highly like I I need to go on the web page so I would like I would though for us as a CR to know because we did the thing for the for the dumpsters anyway I mean what is it one if it's not ours what are the code enforcement people doing this is right behind Waka and Chu across from your office and then two if it is ours what is our maintenance schedule because I always have felt like if I ever owned a restaurant I would pay the person who cleans the restrooms four times as much as anybody else because that's a real experience of what you have of a place they have clean bathroom they have clean kitchen and therefore you can eat their food and right now I go by that dumpster and I'm like I don't want to be here it's gross okay yeah I again I'm I don't ever want to say for certain but I'm pretty certain that I don't feel like that one's will be on but quite frankly even if it is please still go file a code enforcement complaint and I when I leave here I'll pop in and give Nikki a heads up that it's coming and you know to take a look at it but code enforcement here is complaint driven so with that said we arein thank you everybody so