[Music] is may24 MRT Mr Mosley here M chrisy El here Mr Gary PTO here Mr David MC here M Francis pki here Miss Megan Edwards here okay approval of minutes January 22nd 2024 any comments or questions about that okay Mr chairman I'll make the motion to approve the meeting minutes of January 22nd 2024 we want to approve all these individually we motion do I have a second second got vote say been approved March 13th 2024 yes sir two quick comments on um under Item B the first paragraph I think it's the second sentence just a small typographical it says City to be corrected and the other correction or addition that I would like to see in reference to this is that um I would like to to show that I am not in favor of a plan of the okay with those changes unless anybody has any other ones I make the motion to go ahead and approve the meeting minutes of um March 13 2024 I have a motion second all right all in favor say I I any oppos okay by your vote you have those minutes March 25th 2024 any comments or questions on other small um typle change under um Item B within the first sentence um I think that word kind of away in the sentence isos to justly unless anybody else has any other comments um I'd like to make a motion to go ahead and approve the meeting minutes of U March 25th 2024 I'll second all right all those in favor say I any opposed by your vote you have approved those minuts all right April 10th 2024 any question Mr chairman I'd like to make a motion to go ahead and approve me minutes for April 10th 2024 make second okay all those in favor say I any opposed all right you appr those minutes April 22nd 2024 chairman I have one small change on the second page of U the meeting minutes the U within the first line of the second page it says um Mr P also stated overall he thinks it's a good project we're on April 22nd you're right I got that y that unless anybody else has any other comments I'll make the motion to approve um the meeting minutes of April 22nd 2024 all those in favor say any oppos by your actions you have approve those minutes our last one May 15th 2024 Mr chairman I make a motion to approve the meeting minutes of May 1524 all second all those in favor any oppos vote you have approved all minutes okay do we have any do we have any Vis we did not have any speaks bus da did not have any old business we figured we had enough under discussion items this meeting Mr chairman just a couple of quick questions for staff um just clarification habes we talked about the construction fing a little while ago I just happened to go by there recently and there is no constrution fing there now at all and they started moving some materials around the site some old trash that was on the site I was just curious if you could give us an update on that um an update on the fencing I know that code enforcement did reach out to them and gave them notice they had so many days to clean up their construction fencing um so what they're working out with Nikki I'm not 100% sure but I think they had to take that down because it was essentially so damaged to the point where they really couldn't fix it so they'll be putting up new construction fencing but I do know C did um reach out to them and you know site them and let them know they had so many days or they had to have a hearing um as far as the project itself we don't really have any update on the actual project at this time thank you appreciate the status of pure parking lot we we've been talking about that for a while and we were going to try to redo some papers in there and uh try to open it up in time for the opening of the beach still so the the spark notes version of that is that is going to be a big point of discussion at the June F joint workshop with city council um there are a lot of things that go into this project one of the bigest is going to be that permit that we have from D that permit is very specific on what we can and cannot do so you know one of the options originally that was recommended um internally was you know maybe we just repay it all and and open it parking um that would violate our permit and you cannot do that so that would make our permit null and void and we all know that permit took over a year to achieve uh so we did not want to do that um so we internally have kind of talked amongst other departments and basically have three options lined up um on how to move that specific section forward and that will be discussed at the June 12th meeting to get some direction from the agency of Council on how we can get that back open thank you um another item that I have is um one of the recent meetings I made a comment about sunshine Park and some of the playground equipment as well as a workout equipment being damaged and needed some repair a comment was made Believe by one of the other board members that um at least the I think the workout equipment was donated and so it's something that we can't do as part of the um uh C but you were going to check into it a little bit further is what the meeting minutes showed and I just wondered where we stood with that so I know Trevor is always on top of getting the repairs and things for playground um in fact I just went down there earlier today and they've done a lot of work to just the area in general um the workout equipment we are still trying to figure out some things on that so I apologize I do not have an update on that um I will make sure I have a better update for you at our next meeting on the workout equipment and then finally um a couple of months ago we were asked to revive provide you with our status list of priority I didn't know I had heard anything about that know was coming up in one of our it is it's um well essentially it's what went into basically creating that agenda for the joint meeting with city council um so we took the priorities of the agency and then discussions that the mayor we have mayor and counsel um and then the mayor and the chairman discussed and so those lists are what created the items for the joint Workshop that's okay thank you all right how about new business items one um do we know if the pullup chin bar on the boardwalk is the property of the CRA or the property ofse I have no idea top my head I only ask i' like to add that to our list of items to fix in downtown um our PCH list which I know is somewhere simply because it's completely red and is going to become a liability and should be considered secondly i' like to mention to everybody is I have a dead stop at 4:45 today if we extend past that I get up and walk it's not because of anything you all say it's because I literally have to go to a graduation ceremony so just wanted picture the rec thank you I just want to let everybody know that today is my last CRA board meeting and thank you very much for this great experience and I will miss you all and I know you guys are going to do good work aome any other new business staff does not have anything sir okay items for discussion hey yes so um item a is going to be the fiscal year 25 preliminary um budget review and we have our CFO Miss Ashley B with us and through what she provided and then be happy to answer any questions do you want us to ask our questions while you're doing a presentation or after um I think during is the most productive activity but I also know that can disrup disrupt your presentation so mind if we ask question that that's perfectly fine um I thought I would approach this kind of uh three topics the first topic is the going over the preliminary operating budget the second topic is the 5year CIP plan and then the third topic is the cash flows that are being um passed out right now um so if we kind of look at it in those three segments um get okay all right so the first thing I want to go over with y'all is the um the annual budget the document is a three-page document and it says um the fiscal 2025 preliminary budget discussion with the SI board I think Taylor and Heather have emailed advance of the meeting okay so um pretty much your operating budget is the same as last year in terms of the service level and the priorities um on page one it we go through the downtown Cape program um the personal services are increasing by 1.2% that's a little misleading you know overall wages are moving up by about 6% Citywide and the one the reason this is moving a little lower is we have vacancies right now and the payroll budget is a function of kind of who's there at that moment in time and what are their kind of health insurance selections is kind of driving the cost and so there's no changes to the Staffing and the service level it's just kind of a mix of who uh is projected to be there in the given year um the repair and maintenance budget is going up by 3% and that is truly kind of for the camera maintenance agreement the downtown cameras that are being installed the maintenance agreements coming online and it has an annual escalator in it for 3% um other operating expenses are going up by 28.5% and that reflects actually gasoline for the police cars we did an analysis of kind of what we had budgeted and what the actual consumption is and we were under budgeting that so that increased by $10,000 and then an additional $7,000 was added for the operating supplies for this unit and kind of to match the kind of plans and activities uh taking place and then the capital Improvement um budget if we can kind of talk about that in part two when we go through the CIP plan but these numbers reflect kind of the vehicle and equip from purchases and radios um and that's it the vehicles ATV and radios so that is the downtown Cape budget does anyone have any questions on the operating budget before we move on to page two okay all right so the second page is the downtown administrative budget question when I was looking at this can you refresh our memory what the difference between personal and professional services are because we shifting money from one to the other so personal services is staff and Professional Services is contract so so I have a couple mistakes that I apologize for let me Point them out to you on the page in the salary benefit allocation at the bottom I'm using the old title for Taylor's position and it should say CRA coordinator not program man manager so we need to update our worksheet and accounting we'll do that and then last meeting we talked about adding the construction project superintendent position and next to that we have an as saying it's a new allocation and next to the construction coord we say new position I need to flip-flop those two labels and so I apologize for that too so the U construction project superintendent that's the ad that was being proposed for the new year and in the middle of um last year we converted that construction coordinator position from a part-time position to a full-time position but we did not add any additional cost to the C the city picked up the differential portion of that and so if you look at a prior your book The allocations higher because that will have been part time um so the Staffing is moving up by 30% and that reflects the addition of the new position and then also the payroll pay plan is rising and we have increased pension costs and health insurance costs in the new year that is all kind of wrapped up in that and then the legal professional legal services going down by 10% sorry I'm sorry I wanted to get that clear about the changes that you made I'm not sure I C item that you mentioned about change in the the titles I guess so this is a worksheet that we use in accounting and it's like literally typed into it and before we hired Taylor there was a lot of discussion of kind of the right fit the right role and when the role was initially kind of conceptualized it was called a program manager and then it was converted to a coordinator so we were just using old terminology it's right in our budget b it's in my worksheet so instead of community redevelopment program manager it should be CRA coordinator and then an executive inste of Planning Development director it's the executive director right well that um Heather's title is planning and development director and she's a kind of hybrid title CRA administrator course C administrat okay and then for the construction project super is that construction project manager so we're calling it a superintendent position because it kind of slots in in our pay plan around about where our other superintendents of other divisions are kind of slotting in and so that's why Administration felt like superintendent was the appropriate title for it so I'm a little confused because we've been given a job description for a construction project manager this is different than we've been given yes because I was here last time we said we don't have the job description finalized for this position but I could bring you the job descriptions that we have already in place for the manager and the coordinator this position will have a lot of the same duties but they will be actually overseeing the manager and the coordinator um so that job description is still in development but we wanted to be able to show you something kind of in lines of what this person will be doing I'm sorry I misunderstood that then because I got the impression was sens us recently that was the uh the job description that one of our board members had asked for and so I was getting confused when I was reading one title and see something different in the in the numbers but I appr I apologize for any confusion so the professional legal services are going down by $10,000 and that just reflects the outside legal services that the agency's been using over the last several years show plenty of funds if you guys have any plan amendments that need to go through legal um the accounting and auditing and other Contract Services are the same as last year landscaping and tree triming is moving up by $85,000 and that reflects the new tree trimming agreements um and kind of the the rotation that parks and W has in place so that's additional funding for that for landscaping and tree trimming training is moving down by $3,000 based on past practice and then repair and maintenance is moving up by $18,500 again reflecting the irrigation work the any cont minor electrical work that's taking place um payer cleaning and Si Renovations are staying the same operating budget is moving down slightly um I cannot remember why that one's moving down were our post and some of our office supply stuff went down a little bit yeah andal and so that also reflects activity and then we have the capital outlay which we'll talk about in a little bit and then the incentive program The Proposal is to move it down by $200,000 and largely it's due to our cash flows in this um the capital Improvement plan we can talk about that in depth kind of collectively with that other item any questions on this one I think you might have just answered it because we just had this program now and I thought it was a shame to reduce the benefits When just not get out about it so you're saying that we'll get to the reason why you're suggesting it doesn't mean we have to follow it the suggestion so the reason we're suggesting is because we have kind of a cash flow issue um our CIP projects are coming in much higher than our estimates that we had last year and so truly to balance out our cash flows we had to look at a lot of different things about that further when we go through the CIP plan but kind of the punchline is we needed to keep an adequate number of cash at the end of the fisal year and this was a way to achieve that any other question on Administration sorry just myself I apologize I assume that the uh the Personnel numbers or Services now incl position that's that is correct about 62,939 is the new position the uh landscaping and trim tree triming later on we're going to be seeing in our agenda some Landscaping proposals for downtown does that includ those add landscap so those monies were're hopeful to tackle a lot of that this F schal year so that wouldn't necessarily be accounted for in this next fiscal year because we're trying to get as much of that done in this fiscal year as possible what we don't get done um would essentially fall under that s renovation category that's that category that the board kind of um asked for a few years back to sort of have money there for essentially miscellaneous projects that don't really fit necessarily another category landscaping and tree trimming those dollars are more for um maintaining things if like let's say our irrigation goes down again we have to do emergency repairs we have those dollars there cover that I know c1000 landsc you're saying hopefully it's covered already our goal is use it yeah to get as much of that done this c as possible we' still got a few months so we're going to on that when is the appropriate time to talk about the new positions we can talk about it whenever you all would like to well I guess I'm you know after looking at all of this kind of wondering exactly what we're trying to accomplish and I don't think I have a clear picture um there's there's a uh Redevelopment uh engineer only getting 75% of their time we could make that 100% And also increase the construction coordinator to 100% would that not take care of the need for getting another staff person on board making sure that the individuals that are allocated specifically or funded by the C specifically our so to speak C related versus mixing and matching because I'm not sure how you account for all of that as to you know the hours that one puts in 25% for City work and 75% for CRA and we also put in monies in the last major project which is the uh utility work that's being done 8th Avenue South to or excuse me 4th Avenue South there was money put in there for a uh construction manager from the design team side so I'm not sure I understand who's handling what projects and there is a need for an additional person and I'd like to get more justification for that position sure um so I I can speak to kind of the percent allocation there's a hesitancy on the part of the city to any of the construction or engineering folks 100% dedicated to the C because that's really not how the projects are formulating and executing you know we have the city tie in on almost every project now and so to say 100% of this engineer has to be to this project that means that that we have to bring another engineer to pick up the city side of it so kind of in terms of like realistic kind of pragmatic approach to doing the work um we wanted to say you know this person can handle both sides of this project um and the city engineer is overseeing the CRA work and so you know we kind of periodically do an analysis of their time to see how much they're doing on City SI projects to make sure that we are at 25% or more and historically we have been more um but with the state regulations about allocating staff to cras we wanted to be very careful that we're not kind of um um too close to the to the line I guess we want to make sure that we're always kind of approaching it conservatively and the same we brought on the uh Redevelopment engineer seven eight years ago um just because of looking at our CIP plan looking at the projects in play the majority at the time the majority of our projects were in the CRA districts and they were kind of enormous undertakings as you guys can see with you know project is a 700 project now um and so we felt certain that that 75% time was a good allocation but like I said periodically we go back and audit ourselves to make sure that we are get the C is getting at least the percent allocation listed there um as far as the construction superintendent coordinator the construction manager position that you guys have the job description for is not at all charged to the C and that person has been the pro manager for all of the downtown infrastructure projects and so we have allocated zero of that person's dollars to these projects but this person is the one that's signing off on the construction documents the one that's making sure that the contract is being executed the way in which you know it was awarded um so adding this new position we feel like you know this new superintendent will also have that responsibility and it's really more responsibility than one one person can do um so do that kind of answer the question I'm still not sure that I havefor see increasing the percentages but I don't see right now May the c one thing I would ask uh everyone to consider is kind of the concept of a single person risk if we have only one person that's doing something if anything happens to that person if they want to take a two Monon vacation we don't have anyone on staff to back that person up and so to have kind of to flesh out this kind of Construction Division having a superintendent a manager and a coordinator that allows us not to assign just one person to just one thing but to make sure that somebody else is always prepared to kind of step in and help execute the project because people do like to take vacations from what I'm hearing you know having 100% anything would basically be creating like bureaucracy bureaucracy yeah and we need to avoid that as much as possible so that creating little walls around our territories and having in into the cities um I just am looking at it and I just and I may be um a little off with this this way I'm looking at it I'm looking at it as you know the paper issue that the superintendent wants to make sure it's done properly because somebody else is already stretched them and I and this board have any help for the C is welcome in my book regardless of the percentage so if we can have anybody else looking at the stuff that's in our area to make sure that they're completed in the time frame they to because certain things were missed in the past I welcome ITC I would you I mean I you know we we definitely could have used some help during that period of time no doubt about it um I just want to make sure we're spending our dollars appropriately and we're getting the right people in the right place so that we get those things done because we've got so many projects that are like that just aren't getting done I some insurances that that's going to happen and we're going to see some Mark improvements I'm all for and just make sure I'm reading this correctly all three phases are the budget's lowering and we're adding salaries to that and still everything's going or% 9% and- 16% so that the largely because of the timing of the capital Improvement project so I don't want to Mis lead you about the personnel and operating costs it's the the the capital Improvement costs are just really kind of driving the increase and decrease year over year okay all right so we'll flip to page three3 for the South South End Redevelopment District um again the personal services are going up and that's the proposed addition of the construction project superintendent um the professional legal services are going down for the same reason of the downtown Administration just kind of looking at past um kind of activity but we still have ample dollars for any kind of legal services that the agency may need um and then the other charges are going down by 1% it's just kind of where the budget dollar kind of fell out for operating I'm sorry South Redevelopment District operating budget got and then the capital Improvement plans are going down by $250,000 and we can talk about that in just a minute so that South Budget is kind of tracking where the downtown budget is any questions on the Southend okay all right with that we can flip over to the capital outlay l um and to kind of helpfully help make things easier the front page is kind of a summary that shows the page number each project is located on and a subtotal so you can take those back into the operating pages that we went over just a minute ago um so I'm in finance I can't speak to the technical aspects of these projects and so I'm so grateful that we've got Public Works um uh parks and the police year if you have questions about any particular project item and maybe that might be kind of the best Direction so going Page by Page through the plan if you guys have questions about the pro projects in the plan largely they are all existing projects you've seen them in previous years I think we have one New Edition in the South End and that was um I think it's um the splash pad I think that's the only addition this year have any question the only question I have and just memory [Music] theud [Music] years way finding signage that you see in your CIP is just that it's going to be just the way finding signage our decorative signs we're looking to pull those out art committee since those are going to be artistic signs and they're not telling anyone which way to go they're just there to be pretty um so that's how we'll divide those up so the numbers you see there come from myself the communications manager have actually reached out to other communities in Florida who have recently done way finding signage projects and kind of gotten some estimates and who they worked with so rather than having this kind of ambiguous amount we were really able to hone in and specify and have a better idea of what we're looking at so another way of saying that is that sign hypothetically will be replaced hopefully within the next year up to 300,000 we've allocated to them I know we have had a lot of meetings upstairs on that sign so yes we hopeful to get that sign replaced thank you we talking about all the other Pages backing up the I thought we could just take questions from youall about all the page U pages instead of presenting them because like I said pretty much every project in here has been in the CIP plan I think Parks added umash pad somewhere along here in a future year actually I don't see this year it's this year you have a lot of things to keep up yeah so everything that is in the CIP plan is a program or project that existed in the plan we had to rebg some things um based on kind of when we were able to launch them in this year so some projects are being re-budget in 25 that you guys saw in 24 um but I thought we would just kind of take questions from youall if you have questions about specific projects well when you go into the U into the downtown improvement improvement plan for9 a lot of changes from last year I mean all the numbers have moving around number one numbers have gone up significantly in a couple of instances and others have moved out in the time frame as to when they going to be done so can you help us or help us understand why some of these things have happened because there's no backup or information helping us understand why that's the case instead of approaching it as a out one item ask there are a lot of items I go to um phase 3C project 3 the I'm just going to go to the total sum the total sum last year was 8, 250,000 now it's 2,250,000 the question becomes what changed it so dramatically almost I can but what I can kind of speak to immediately is on in 2029 we're bringing on the rest of that project and so when we're kind of looking at the 5year window we're now adding the fifth year onto the projects um and construction costs have gone up considerably and so we update the engineers estimates or the plan these are really planning estimates we update the planning estimates each year and we're seeing an increase like no time in history for us from the planning estimate to the to the actual bid award each time we're seeing significant increases and so we're trying in the CIP plan to kind of get closer to reality for these projects instead of having to come to you guys like we did with the Dune La overs and say okay this cost more and all the money spoking for we now have to De allocate money from our project to finish the overs so in terms of dollars throughout the whole plan the increase in dollars is the same for almost every project it seems like what what's really happened is that this is for because of all the changes occurring construction cost changes is pushing things further out in order to make the cash flow work in reference to these projects so we as a board shouldn't be surprised if we see our projects kicking out a couple of years even longer in some cases because of those uh those changes which again makes it challenging for us in the future as we start looking at other projects and what we want to do we've got to be careful because our funding is uh drying up very quickly this is the way to put it that's a fair point it's a fair point in order to have a minimum Reserve because as you're all aware we don't receive the revenues for the tip districts until December 31st each year so three we have to start with three months cash to carry us until we get that distribution from the county and I would just ask if you would I had a real problem understanding page 41 which is the talks about funding sources and when you look at the funding sources I don't follow any of those numbers they're not they're not consistent with other numbers that I've seen so maybe you could just help me understand where the are coming from changes in the uh downtown tax increment funding for 25 versus what we saw in 24 same thing with the south end and then all of a sudden it jumps from 1.9 million to 11 million in the way of funding and I'm just not sure what's causing that that change sure so the uh page 41 is a kind of a summary of the 5year plan um and I also want to call out that you know the C Overseas Fund 181 and 182 but like we talked about there City components to these projects and instead of breaking them up and saying okay here we're just going to show the CRA piece and the C CIP plan and we'll show the Public Works piece in the different plan you're seeing the comprehensive project so the third and fourth line the 317 infrastructure capital projects and 423 storm utility those are the city components of that project so you're seeing the whole cost of the project um but really you guys are just voting on the funds in line 181 and 182 and then to answer your question about like the $1.9 million and the south end for 25 and $ million for 26 if you look on page um it is page 50 and 49 and then that's why I Creed the cover page for you the 9 million in 2025 is the combination of $250 250,000 for the storm Basin 500 for the South connect connectivity quarters um $900,000 for the passive Park 250,000 for the South Beach Park infrastructure so that's the $1.9 million in 2025 and it goes up to1 million6 that's the timing of the projects that are shown on page 49 and 50 so the page 41 is intended to be a summary of all the pages that follow it in the years that the cost will um be incurred so fun when you say funding sources it's not the funds that receiving that year is funds that we already have available it could be both it could be what we have on hand at the end of the current fisal year and then it could be also re that's that answers my question I think because I didn't understand I assumed it was just funds that we were receiving for that year and that's why I was didn't understand the disparity because for you know half of the South we would typically see somewhere around 2.2 million so the 1.9 million didn't seem unusual to me but then when I look at the 11 million it just kind of kind of jumped out one comment I want to uh yeah just want to go back when we talk about the uh South End and we listed the U the projects at the South End there's one item that got taken off the list from last year and that was the splash P improvements for 250,000 it doesn't show up in this and I don't think that that's been done at this point in time working on that right now yeah that's this year that's a this year projectad they're working on it right now can I ask a question while we're talking about the south for the capital outl for that 11 million is this just an estimate for there's already allocated or is that an estimate for what we have said that1 mil is the planning estimate for that particular project they already it's it's already planed the project yeah it has a scope and a plan and since it's one year up um when we bring back the 26 budget it might be more than1 million it might still be million the passive par basically no the1 million is the infrastructure work the Public Works infrastructure projects okay okay and for the record my opinion is I would rather have you overestimate so that we have to have a meeting they have to ask for more money or from something else I will used to think that we were overestimating but the last three years uh have been eye opening just as a history lesson orind and Bo we um we didn't really like the fact that we were giving money back to the city for the South Beach area because we projected that we' running out having half million do just a few years unfortunate in my opinion if you look at that especially the increase of costs I know I'm guing I'm not sure you're been like planning on for six years now I think it's been six years we've been working on spting this million 2029 you have our estimate um million sorry at about million for that 1 million we're getting really close to that really can't do anything million type thing in that area so I'm just curious is the city's talk the staff has talked about you know after this big improvement in our maintenance is $1 million is to4 million is going to be enough for that are until we no longer have control of that area um yes so if you want to if we want to jump to the cash flows I'm happy to walk through that South End I figured we ask about because I know we had a long discussion about us giving aaction money back to the city I know we had a long discussion about is it considered an area that needs to be developed because it's at the state it's in now I know Gary had a lot of discussions about what he thinks the infrastructure is in that area we have some infrastructure stuff already works so there's a lot of things that we've worked on but we had the biggest thing I'm more concerned about is our maintenance of the parks the um infrastructure the uh you know things that we want to purchase so that we can maintain it like the exercise equipment all that kind of stuff um I just really I guess my question is has City discussed the implications of us giving that money back and it's even possible if we find that we need it is our route to do contraction so as of the 50% reduction has not been formalized in inter local agreement um but since we have been planning the reduction since 2020 um now our general fund budget receives 9 950,000 in the tip return and so that money in the general is funding all of our governmental programs um and so the city is relying upon that return to the general government and so if that money were to stay within the South Beach fund we would have to increase our M rate to raise those funds into the general fund um from a planning perspective from finance and administration we're looking at the South Redevelopment plan and pretty much everything that's in the South plan is in this 5year CIP plan there are no projects Beyond um 2029 it's just maintenance repair refurbish replace of the things that were already built um and one thing that we consider finan is equity amongst the city if we develop the South End to a level that requires maintenance beyond what the that bounded area generates in taxes will now that other part of the city is coming in and having to maintain something that we built to a higher standard than perhaps the North End of the city um so we're looking at it from a a perspective of can we can what we do in the South and can we maintain it with the dollars that are generated from the portion and where we are now yes we can um if we continue to develop and kind of elevate our standards that becomes a kind of a bigger conversation um so from finance and administration we we are planning for that 50% reduction and we're also planning to kind of request to close the South CRA when we finish the plan of what we see in these 29 projects because after that there's nothing left in the Redevelopment so basically you just answered I think my question my question which is um unless we find the board finds other things we want to update in that area it is the city's objective to take over set area as part of their own bud and it goes away as 202 that would fin request and then my question is if we replace said UMC because we didn't put it in there we have to replace not fix if we replace it is under C money when that transaction happens between City and CRA I'm assuming they get to absorb things that they didn't use their money to maintain it or will they have to replace it so the exercise stations I'm not sure exactly which ones you're referring to but the city the C did have a program to replace the stations along the walking trail so the C did put those in there and we are planning for their replacement I think some Clos like 15 to 20 year lifespan so I guess my question is really not that important now but like when it comes to that point I'm just kind of wondering if we put something in place today and in 2030 we as board are no longer using our Monies to maintain it or place it because underneath the city I'm assuming All rights and whatnot transferred to the city because they're not subject to we can't do something that we didn't Sol in the time frame we have to okay that's all I wanted to make sure so just to be clear that 50% line is because we're giving 50% back to the city of Jacksonville not Jacksonville Beach correct both we're giving when we do a return we're returning it to all the taxing authorities and that is the city of Jacksonville Beach and the City of Jacksonville so you're saying that they have already Incorporated in their budget into the future our 50% back and that we to is it back to is it Jacksonville Beach that has incorporated into the budget or jackonville beach has I don't I can't speak for the city of jacksonv their plans whatever percentage of that 50% back into yeah so the value of the taxing authorities it's roughly a third to Jackson be and two3 to Jacksonville so we lose two3 back to the city of Jacksonville well we're actually giving their own tax money back because as part of being the CRA is we're collecting our taxes and we're collecting Jacksonville's taxes so we're just their tax portion to you now so I personally think it'd be disappointing if we lose that designation and I feel like that a lot of the reason there aren't any projects in in the pipeline are because we haven't redone a plan it's a very outdated plan and it would be worth looking at updating that plan so that we can make sure we really truly feel like we're ready to close it before we close it I think it' be ideal to to to look back at it so differ that discussion to Mr and Taylor and hea to kind of go through philosophically where the board wants to go um just from a finance Point of View kind of maintaining what we build we want to make sure that we don't build that to a standard that costs more to maintain it than what that area is generating a tax revenue so that's kind of that what we're looking at from the finance perspective I understand I think though that it still it's an old outdated plan and to reassess that area would be an important so we redid that plan in 2022 sou plan so that plan was looked at we redid it we had to go through the whole process had to have two public hearings to adopt the plan um send notice to coj all the taxing authori so that plan is pretty up to date that was a lot older than that sorry no that's okay um so that one was up to date and that's kind of where the passive Park project came out of was when we were looking at that and that was Ral to tail end of doing the stuff and so that's when we were looking at the statute and incorporating that section about maintaining things that we installed because we knew putting that playground and we want to maintain it um so we're not necessarily closing that the South End by any means we're keeping it um as an operation and maintenance at this point because we do still have so much to maintain and there's just not a whole lot of new in that District that District essentially at the state level at the statutory level I mean it it did what it supposed to do um I mean it's textbook how it reel district and I would also add that that plan Amendment put in place so that we could maintain it with CRA funds on those CRA projects that funded with tax money okay got Gary first you know just perspective on this we still have9 Million worth of projects to do in the South based on the C that's quite a bit I don't know you know we're only getting 2 million in for a year whether we're truly going to be able to cover all those projects by the time we get to 2029 so the page if you guys want to jump and talk about the Southend Redevelopment this is the fiveyear cash flow that incorporates the 5ye CIP plan and if we look at the ending cash balance we have enough funds at the end of each fiscal year to manage the CIP program as together now the thing that I think we all need to keep in the back of our mind is that you know this C South is in existence until 2047 that's one with sunsets ultimately so between now and 2047 we still have some obligations down there things that we need to take a look at and really think about what needs to be done I think at some point in time we're going to Red that we've got to update that plan because to me the last plan I was really looked at is more of a utility plan not really a good Vision plan for what we want this sou to and I think for everyone's benefit in this community I think we need to go back and really take a look at that plan and see what we think is appropriate to be done and how weh that into when we ultimately or that's not the desire of the community any further then there's no reason that we need a c down there in that District anymore you know I keep hearing people say we're done down there we're done down there but in reality we're not if we're to be in existence until 2047 but if we just want to end it we can always end it and give all the money back I think it's a conversation we need to have and for all of us just to get our heads together and think about how we want to approach this and what's the best for the for the city for the residents and ultimately what we want to do thank you um generally don't have anything to say but while this consideration going on about the south and timing and the allocation and the funds I think we really need to remember that significant amount of C has been instrumental in creating in the South End don't just benefit the South End they benefit the residents of Jacksonville Beach and indeed a significant number of people from Greater Jacksonville and I haven't heard that in this dialogue we've been having so it's not just the Assets in place in the South End being appropriately balanced to the south end as opposed to other parts of the beach I think we really need to look at the fact that a lot of people don't live in the Sou and don't live Beach enjoy those amenities and take great pleasure and that should be part of when we talk about this um Harry I just want to kind of just brainstorm with you real quick because um I went to those meetings for that area um and um there was a lot of discussions about expanding the convention center that also houses Public Works and a lot of people didn't want to do that because we don't over bu for our city we had talked about bunch of things so when I'm actually sitting and thinking about all the things in that District the only thing I can think of top of my head right now is one lot that you wanted us to purchase or um that then we were told by The Authority that they didn't want to sell but they let us decorate outside the fence to the storm drain um cleaning that we did what five years ago and still feels like it's in process I mean I can't think of anything else in that are other than that lot that we haven't accomplished have all those meetings with the people who Liv in that area specifically and I always wanted to push for a bigger Community I thought well that gives the city more space to house more people and then therefore we could have bigger events are renting out to the community but everyone at the time 2022 didn't like that idea so other than that I understand what the city's saying as far as you know we've developed it we developed it now maintain I understand that that low but like I said I do worry that the cost increaseing not I'm just looking at this numbers and I'm just worried up until 2030 will we have enough to maintain that that's really my biggest thing but if you just sit down and think about area that's the only thing I can remember that we haven't tackled since then and I want to make a quick point you know the bigger case here I used to live in New York and you know I not anywhere near the city but I was paying taxes as I was something from the city and they and they don't want to create that they don't want to create animosity of the nor saying oh I my tax to make sure that isce my get I don't know if this is the appropriate time to say that since you were talking about brainstorming ideas the I've seen a lot of I live in the South Beach area so I should practice with that the traffic on Southeast Parkway between Sunshine park down towards um Marsh Landing area is increased significantly over the last several years and that that it is it's getting hard to as a pedestrian cross it um and I see between rip tide and ocean K in particular an opportunity there to slow traffic by a traffic circle some sort of roundabout right there rather I think like a light there would be terrible idea but something just that slow everybody down and and allow kids to be able to get over to suntime safer um and creating those East West connections um across the street so that's I know that's not in the plan right now I know that wasn't thought about in 2022 um but those are the kinds of things that are starting to come up as that area has become more and more popular because of the infrastructure improvements that we made so that might be something to consider in the future all right um well are if we have any other questions on the your CIP plan the Departments are here I don't know if you if you want to move on now just to cash flows or any specific questions for Department okay okay so we already kind of started talking about the Southend um cash flows um so I guess I'll ask there any other questions about the Southend cash flows before we talk about the downtown cash flows okay so the downtown cash flows I kind of antip the largest conversation so far um to to Mr P's questions earlier in the meeting kind of that we see that costs are increasing for the plan projects and we see some things shifting out and it was truly um we had to balance the cash flows so that we had adequate Reserves at the end of every fisal year so some things did get shifted around as a result um so there's two pages to this downtown one versus the South so if you flip it onto the back side this is the kind of the side I want to focus on um you know we ended 2023 with $32.9 million in cash on hand every bit of that was allocated to projects that were already awarded um and we had that discussion at the year end uh appropriation in October so when we go into 2024 um our cash flows have become a little bit more difficult to to kind of present so this is a new format this year I'm hoping it's easier than last year I'm always welcome feedback from yall um we might have $30 million of cash on hand but we have committed all of it so what I wanted to show you is in 2024 you have your original budget original project dollars and things kind of change because a budget is a plan and plans change so we are estimated that we would have $ 29.7 million at the end of 2024 but then we have this long list of projects that you all saw in the yearend appropriation and then we also had some projects um the bottom of the page that says uh fiscal year 2024 Capital Improvement projects re-budget to Future year um Lan Plaza has been moved out to Future year the way finding sting has been moved and some of it is capacity issues some of it is like we can't execute on it right now because we're waiting to do something else um and then the lighting master plan we have Reb budgeted so we took those dollars out of the budget and so we have a net cash commitments of 2 milon which leaves us $3 million for future projects which rolls into the 25 budget if you go back to page one on the top of 2025 there's your $3 million and then the revenues that we expect to receive and the budgets that we talked about earlier in the meeting um and then the 5year CIP plan uh we were very pleased to see that tax uh estimated property values for the year um you'll see a marked increase from4 2 um we had I think six or 7% increase in the downtown it was a little higher than the South and in the general government and so with the June one estimates from the property appraiser we believe that we will receive $10.4 million in revenue for the downtown tax increment District so are there any questions about the downtown cash fls all right that's all I had for yall thany um yes sir we on downtown Landscaping all right so this kind of came together for a number of different reasons um number one being um if you rode by the former um Veterans Memorial site you will notice it is roped off and they are getting started in their own construction um I know previously we had said that there was no building permit there was a whole big thing about building permits right we don't require any permit um the artist did come back to us and said you know look I get that that's not a requirement I'm not comfortable moving forward without some kind of a permitting process so myself Heather the building official Trevor um everybody has been kind of working together um to make sure the type of rebar the way they're putting this in the ground how deep they're going that everything is going to be suitable to what we would essentially require someone was building uh you know a new build basically um so rest assured it will be very thorough um so that is what led us to this point because the way we want this project to go they're going to come in and you're going to see the concrete go up so we're going to have the concrete pieces then we plan to come in and put in the ground layer which um we'll kind of show some examples on this um once we kind of get that ground foundation in after the concrete is in we'll start the landscape work after that stuff's done he will then come in and do the decorative and then we'll be able to cover it and have a big unveiling um so it's going to be kind of a three-step process to get to this point Trevor was also already working with prestige on this kind of overall visual for what we're doing in the downtown there are a couple of components to this slideshow that this area is not paying for I want to be very clear um if it's on city property like City Hall for example that's just here because they were doing this comprehensive view um but we've opted to keep it in there just to kind of show uh even though it's not very funded there's going to be consistency across the downtown um so we can kind of go through this and then Trevor is here and he'll be happy to come up and answer questions and we can kind of talk through where we're at um before you yes ma'am I went by site this weend to at it and there's no to is just water creatures right in my mind I was looking for the no there's no no PL at all okay so this is coming right into downtown kind what we working with now this is what we're calling for um again the types of vegetation are going to be easy for maintenance they're going to be things so I can actually withstand our elements here and rather than just kind of looking at um some landscape that looks like it's overgrown because kind of is we will have a Greenery but it'll be much more intentional again here you are looking at further down that same section um and again you will have some Stone features some native vegetation and then some elements so it's not just going to look like a big concrete uh Chunk in the middle Ro um it'll kind of break up all the asphalt and you can see again this is right there on that same section of beach just side so again na vegetation some Stone trying to make the area more green okay so this is what was there before what we're wanting to do is we want to keep the Palms um I will point out we're going to be doing away with those two steps because they're not necessary they're not there for any reason and they actually give us issues with ADA compliance so we're going to do away with those steps and have it be a slope so it's Ada accessible at the site um the landcaping we struggled a little bit because we wanted to have a thicker tall buffer across the back side but we wanted to do it in a way that wasn't going to call the police department any more issues and they're going to already have downtown by providing a space in between that white fencing and this vegetation for people to get in and hide um so this was a way to do that those large bushes that you see are literally against that fencing so it does not provide for an easy way to kind of create a Nook in between the back of those tall plants and then we kept it really simple with the native vegetation very minimal Landscapes and green space because the feature of this is intended to be the sculpture and then the benches that we're going to bring in and install um this is just to show you guys this is where we're at now this is what we're doing in front of City Hall again we are not paying for that this is coming out of the city budget just to remain consistent um again we're going to kind of brighten up the front of City Hall a little bit and then this is looking at Joe's and kind of towards the end towards the street end yes um isn't that one of the spots we talked about having our community put something there about the in the corners see where the left rock is the big rock isn't that one as well are we I remember talking about the roundabout I don't necessarily remember talking about these flower beds I'll be honest so if I miss that that's my fault um but there is more room than this what's shown here this is a really hard to kind of comp you know understand because it's that concept but in theory even if there was a boulder there there's still so much space there we could put a statue there still or I just make sure that we're not filling a space that we originally de get out there with his truck and a chain and just hook up the boulder and drag it away we have to I'll go help him all right and this is again Street in so not not any crazy changes but you know just not having it look necessarily overgrown um having more intentional planting things that are going to be easier for the park crew to maintain while still looking nice and these are kind of some of those planter beds um and then we're showing those Rock there Trevor correct if I'm wrong but that The Rock that's shown here is not necessarily what it would be it would be that white almost Sandy beachy look stuff so some some of the areas will be will be kind of both okay so so if you notice here in the sidewalk there's already the river storm as part of the sidewalk what we'd like to do is capture that same look into some of the Planters and some of them you know some of this landscape got to remember these are just Concepts some of these that much vegetation in them um what'll happen is these get walked through they get stepped on they get trampled so areas that hide maintenance areas will probably be more like a zeroscape more like more of the boulders more of the gravel um where it'll be we'll get our contrast through what's on the ground so we'll have an area where will be this River Stone and the way we plan on doing the Riverstone is you actually mix it with a polymer and then you pour it out and then you trial it out and it's actually still perious but yet solid um the water will still go through them the plants will still be okay but people can't kick the Rocks all over the place and then some of them like if you notice how we did down at the Ritz parking lot there will be some gravel through certain areas and then here this kind of shows some of the gravel areas some of the ones where people just hang out and they stand all day I don't care what you put in there it's going to die they they trample it they stand in it um if you want it to look like Disney World if you've been to Disney lately there's fences around nice landcap so if you want to put in these knee wall fences around everything like they do then that's a whole different story but a lot of these we we need to try and keep minimal and then you really get your contrast through the ground like like that bed we could have the Riverstone and then you kind of have some curves through it with that beachy it's called concrete screens it looks like sand I think it'll be a great look um so again this was Trevor's worked with Prestige and you know really identified these different areas really trying to get a comprehensive plan together to create a sense of cohesiveness in the downtown so it's not so kind of sporadic and random so even if you know the flower BDS are all going to have kind of different elements but there's still an intentional design behind all of them so we're not just kind of miscellaneously planting random things and random flower beds and so we just kind of wanted to bring this to you guys update like I said Trevor can answer technical questions I kind of power point but specific questions on this Trevor will be the one to answer far better than I can um and so yeah just kind of looking for comments questions I've got a u just a quick question I mean most of these trees that we see in these photos were planted probably before I moved here um what was what's the idea of these like I think like to me a queen pal was so much nicer uh and cre provides so much more shade what is there any specific reason we specific Pals every the M Palm the M Palm is is the real big Palm that we have down through all the areas and then the Cabbage pal smaller ones here um they they were kind of Trend in the 2000s all the way down P bouar they're on all the roadways they're um they're they're probably about 15 grand a piece right now and some of them just don't hold up as well to the northeaster kind of I know brought this up a but like creating like shade you know these are not the kind of trees that create a lot of shade and to a very hot experience walking around downtown it's going to be very difficult um to create shade trees in the downtown if you go into downtown because of the northeasters because of the environment if you look the only trees are growing are the ones that are on the southwest side of buildings very small specific areas if you into the residential areas where the buildings aren't as tall like if you go over to Fountain View Park you'll notice the trees grow on the west side and the second they get to the roof line the wind just cuts them off um so as far as Shades it's going to be very difficult you'll have to to mass in some palm trees you have to use lustrum trees if you can protect it with buildings around the bigger buildings and it's really crazy the micro environments you can plant a tree right here and one 15t away this one is from the building this one Smoked by the northeaster it's a very challenging environment and it will be difficult to grow Shady Trees East of thir Street Trevor just a couple quick questions you asked you answered part of my question in reference to mulch um we're going to have a variety of different Ms I thought at one time we were talking about more of a uh kind of a sand type you know so now we're talking about rocks and it looks like we're using some other types of mulch so so my goal in in the downtown is to have two Aggregates the stone which is already part of the sidewalk that goes throughout the entire downtown and the concrete screens which is the sand um some of those areas you just can't create the contrast with plants because they'll get trampled um they're going to get walked on anything near anything near the corners anything near the sidewalks those will probably be more zero stap will go will hand select well this is an area we could put some really pretty color cuz no one stands here um this is an area where it's high traffic it needs to have some rock and and something that people it just looked like in some of the areas that would look like a red mulch you know and I don't know whether that say the areas that was just through the concept if you see something that looks red that was probably the old picture right after it just got launched so if you go if you go back through there's one of these a Beach Boulevard it looks bright red right out of that's that's that's existing like one more that's existing that's what it looks like now go to the what's the M they put that was something and this one the lady when she drew it she just put pine nuggets but but we're only going to have two two Aggregates like I said these are these are very conceptual the plant pallets are pretty close um but everything that we have this will probably have a good border of the white going along it okay so so picture isn't really depicting what you ultimately want to do if um if you put in the Rocks one of the things I would recommend that you do is make sure we put down some Filter Fabric to prevent weeds from growing up through there and stuff like that if you go to the the r parking lot all the ground we put down all because I notic some weeds growing through some of the other that areas recently and that's why it just kind of came up but um that um you mentioned that you will be putting some kind of a material over the rocks to kind of tie them together and things to that extent it's a polymer that you mix with it it almost turns it into a forign place but it's something where you you throw in a in a cement mixer you mix the polymer in and you you pretty much spread it out with the TR and it otherwise you know in a hurricane those rocks are going to become projectiles they'll take off had a huge problem a number of years ago where um the gravel that's used to hold down single fly roof membranes uh took off and the insurance industry just went wild because of the damage that was caused by the the rocks that were flying so just just a point of information the cost of maintenance for all of this what is this going to be covered then once we install all of this is all of this cost going to be covered maintenance that the city does so so so basically all the entire downtown landscape beds are all maintained by Prestige Landscape they're maintaining all the beds we fertilize them in house but all the Hedge trimming all that type stuff is done through Prestige um we probably will up we'll probably add a little line item in the contract that maybe says a quarterly plant replacement or or every six month PL replacement um there's no way this is we're not going to be able to replace plants so we'll add that line in there and we'll come in and just every 6 months maybe a April they'll go in there and pull up anything that might have died or got trampled and they'll put in there but again what I'm trying to understand is where is the cost for the maintaining all this is that can be a CRA cost or is that a City cost cost C it's going to come out of our typical landscape because again we have to do things that are above and beyond what the city typically do so I would think that there's a certain level of Maintenance that the city would do and then maybe there's something above that that the C needs to do yeah we got that figured out well if if you guys like what we've done at RIT parking lot we'll uh we'll get started me any other questions or comments you know technically we don't but I'm not going to be opposed to everyone at least getting all in favor of allowing Trevor and myself to work with Trevor which makes Trevor uh to move forward this is not my expertise this is all Trevor um but yeah so if you want to do kind of an all in favor signify by say Ivor forward landc all right perfect thank you everyone thank you thank you Trevor um okay so for the last one um again he just wanted to kind of reiterate that we're still kind of working through that down Town plan we have a draft that we've all gone back and make comments on we actually have a meeting tomorrow with Jim and his team to go over our comments to that plan again uh Heather actually wrote this memo so I will kind of let her take it away um but this is just kind of a comprehensive outline if you will of what that plan is going to look like thanks Taylor um so before we went too far down the road with the downtown Plan update we just wanted to kind of present to you what our approach is because we know we've all been using that simulated Consolidated plan and I'll be honest it's confusing for us because you're bouncing all over the place so we really wanted to get in there and you know clean up any outdated information even just when the section it talks about Kate it says we have like four officers which we don't we have 11 so we want to update the data and the information we want to update all the graphics uh list all the projects that are completed stuff that's ongoing like Landscape Maintenance and then summarize all the projects we still have left to complete so the go goal is to clean it up make it easier to read um and and really reflect our current conditions downtown and where we want to go from here so uh I hope that we will have a draft to you guys by July that we can sit down and look at um and go through and make sure did you know did did we miss any projects obviously all the stuff that's in our CIP will still be in there um I know we've had several workshops to talk about any new projects we didn't have a whole lot to add to it but that can be our opportunity if there's something that we want to add that that point in time I think we've covered everything there is to cover um in the downtown as far as as far as that goes so I'm happy to answer any questions you guys have but again looking for uh a presentation of a draft to you guys in July hopefully at a workshop I just have two small questions um I can't remember but I remember our talking about extending out SI or asking to by like one block on the North side when we were doing all the Bing that ever happen and is that going to be that never happen so I'm assuming that means that in this document you guys will just like the other one outline what our zone is and our boundaries are not changing so just make I didn't know if you're going to include that that's why I wanted to see because I'm assuming anything we do anything we do is going to be approved by Council and then worked on that way so I just want to make sure that the boundary discussion the boundary changes all those numbers DET not proposing that at this time that's the only thing on this list I couldn't coms questions in the staff memo I was just a little confused it say simulated jacksonv downtown Redevelopment plan what's what's the simulated Jacksonville that's the one that was put together by Cliff Shepard that's got the color coded it's still uh valid it's obsolete it's valid with conditions that that one that's very confusing and hard to read and we don't like it and we would like a new one who's going to be doing the work on we are staff and sub group there's not a need for a um Planning Group to join and participate in no that's Jim I think we got experts enough we got experts enough we good would be helpful I know you said you were to have something for us in July it might be helpful to you know have an opportunity to get an update before some input prior to that period of time so that hope we um we're we're prepared to discuss it during the joint meeting with Council and let them know where where we're kind of going with that and kind of give them a timeline of that Plan update that's a friendly reminder to all msor thank you any other questions or comments this topic all right we're thank you everybody