##VIDEO ID:9DjcifqvNy4## good evening everyone thank you for joining us today uh this is the zoning board meeting of adjustment for the board for the city of Jersey City in accordance with the open public act meet meeting act be advised that the following items will be heard at a regular board meeting at the Jersey City Zoning Board okay so no new matter involving an applicant will be started after 10: p.m. at 9:00 p.m. the board chair will decide an advice applicant whether they will be heard if an applicant cannot be heard because of the lateness of the hour the matter will be carried over to the next regular schedule meeting with preservation of notice with that can you please join me in the uh salute to the flag I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all Francisco do we have any uh Sunshine announcement yes in accordance with the open public meeting act notice has been given to the Jersey journal the Jersey City Reporter elito and posted with the city clerk on Tuesday December 10th 2024 uh we have the uh we have notices to be marked this would be B1 for the record thank you Francisco may we have a roll call yes so I see commissioner Burns here commissioner zi here commissioner shadid yes commissioner Bole here commissioner uh Baron here and vice chuya here we have a total of six Commissioners tonight can we swear in the staffy com yes Francisco do we have any correspondents or any adjournments yes in new business item number 14 this is case z223 D 0019 the address is 137 Delaware AV they've requested to carry to the January 9th meeting with preservation of notice item number 15 this is case z22 078 the address is40 Glenwood Avenue they have they've carried to the January 9th meeting with preservation of not notice and lastly uh item number 17 this is case z 2024 31 the address is uh uh 2800 JFK Boulevard they have also requested to carry to the January 9th meeting with preservation of notice and all other items on the agenda will be moving forward tonight thank you okay so we're going to start with new business with the first case we'll hear is Z 2024 d27 um what that's 198 Freeman Avenue Janelle pain one you gotta be storing in okay can you hear me now okay better okay I'll say that again Vincent ver the firm is ver and ver on Kennedy Boulevard here in Jersey City and I have the pleasure tonight to represent uh Janelle Payne with regard to this application involving 198 Freeman Avenue I'll be calling one witness tonight Mr Allen Feld is the architect who will describe the project it's a c variance uh short synopsis of what the project actually is it's an existing um non-conforming lot with a a two family home on it there's a three-bedroom apartment on the first floor there's a rear yard setback uh technical violation and the uh request is to be able to build out over the first floor to just basically square up the building and make the second floor reflective of the first floor and that's pretty much the sum total of the application so with that I'll um ask Mr Fel to come up and if you'd like to see the schematics I'll have my paralal uh plug in the computer yes please thank you yeah do youwe that the ttim testimony you will provide this evening will be the truth I do your full name is alen Feld correct so Mr veteran uh Mr Felder has been here numerous times so we accept his expertise ask you for that yes uh are your licenses still thank you very much thank you great wait those of us are technically challenged join the club Jesus it's this one that you want to that's perfect you know what I'm saying it's just it doesn't move can you hear me yeah it was muted um as as you can see from this first page um on the site plan drawing um this lot is uh 60 ft Deep by 25 ft wide and that's typical of these uh adjacent Lots uh to the corner and this property has an existing uh building on it already um the first floor extends uh to the rear and in the front is a twostory section so the purpose of this application is to build over the existing one-story section to build a two-story section uh to match uh what's on the ground floor uh right now it's a two family um house we go to the next page it's two families uh one family on the first floor a second family on the second floor now the first store the first floor is a three-bedroom uh unit and this uh new addition would create two bedrooms to uh complement the first floor which would make it also a three-bedroom uh unit um and expanding the living room dining room which currently is very undersized um uh there there is no uh expansion further than the existing one-story section and if we go to the next page the the new addition would blend in with the existing structure and uh from the outside it would look like it was a continuous uh addition um there would be no um uh sense that this was an addition when the project is completed there's no just just by way of foundation there's you would agree that there's no increase in the amount of non-compliance that's correct and the footprint isn't being changed that's correct and all that we're doing is by adding this it would bring into to a degree of uniformity that's correct and the property itself is burdened by the size of the lot extent and there's no change in that that is correct and there's going to be no increase in the um in the deficiency with regard to the setback that is correct that's all I have are there any public comments on on the matter in on hand okay do we have any comments from the board members I just have one question I just want to understand I mean I so the thing so the first floor goes all the way out and the second floor goes all the way out so what's up there right now just the roof it's vacant space yes good okay thank you any more questions not for me friend staff yes okay so I will be very brief as was mentioned by the attorney the lot is undersized um per our rear yard setback requirements lots that are, s ft or less um do need to provide a minimum rear yard setback of 25% of the total of the lot depth in this case the applicant um would have been required to provide 15 ft however they are providing the existing 8 and 1/2 ft um the rear yard minimum is in direct correlation to the hardship of the undersized lot the structure is non-conforming pre-existing and complies with the front yard setback requirements um of meeting the predominant setback um meeting the current yard requirement or setback requirement would be impossible for the application um the applicant will not touch the current re space and instead the scope of the work is is to expand the second floor to create the same layout that the current um owner has on the first floor staff does not see any detriment to the Zone plan and ordinance it is reasonable and needed as it will allow the applicant to expand the current living quarters with without taking away the yard space they currently have it is the opinion of the staff that this application can be granted as a class one uh hardship variance staff does recommend approval with conditions however um staff would like to make um a correction to the conditions as uh number four the condition number four is in error and does not apply to this application okay thank you you have a question no okay may I have a motion I'll make a motion to adopt may I have a second approv second okay on a motion to approve with conditions commissioner Baron approve commissioner Bole approve commissioner shadid yes commissioner Burns yes commissioner Zuki yes and vice CH you yes motion carries all in favor thank you so much thank you very much and I appreciate you taking this time thank you thank you okay so our next case on the agenda is um Z 2024 00 07 and that is 659 Jersey Avenue attorney Steven Joseph hello everybody good evening Stephen Joseph for the applicant uh I do have notices here this is a notice case Vinnie is somewhere around no Vinnie okay all right wonderful there he is all right um 659 Jersey Avenue this is mid block between 8th and 7th in the historic district the applicants proposing to construct a 69.50 foot Edition that's uh is not a mistake it is less than 100 square foot Edition in the historic district um it's a four-story single family house so this requires historic approval which we've already been before HBC they've issued a certificate of appropriateness um with conditions and we need approval from this board not for site plan approval but just for two c variances it's a rear yard setback and the rear yard encroachment of the uh staircase off of the rear yard deck we have two experts this evening we'll bring up our architect first um get the computer plugged in this is just a number situation nobody would ever the difference assist sorry work we go all right let's uh let's get your sworn in do you swear that the testimony provide this evening will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes I do the name Ali kesi your name q r e s h i first name is Ali a l i uh Ali you're licensed in the state of New Jersey it's in your license is in good standing yes it is and I'll just know for the board that Oli has been previously qualified before the historic preservation commission yes I was um you walk us through the plans sure so uh basically we're just adding a small um 15 ft wide by 4 and 1/2 ft deep addition to an existing in kitchen and also a stair which is going towards the backyard um this triggers uh this uh lot and the house both are non-conforming um the the lot is supposed uh 100 ft is required and we are at 75 ft so that poses a hardship on any kind of a expansion we do so it's a very small little um addition to make the kitchen um very desirable even though it's a small addition but it will make a big difference to the to the kitchen bad um the variances we we are required are two uh one is actually the planner will go a little bit more on the variances um we can just uh show the floor plan so this addition is on the first floor which is a big open room and towards the end of the room is the kitchen and this um addition sticks out from the kitchen and there's uh nothing under uh there's no covered space under that addition so it's going to be open at the bottom of this uh um addition so you want to go up a little bit so it's going to look something like this um in addition to this U small expansion we going to put a Terrace on the existing roof of the kitchen so the roof already exists so we put um special behavor to make it uh usable and also a guard rail around it and to get to this uh Terrace uh there is an egress window already in place do you want to show other drawings why is it already place so on the left is the existing uh rear elevation of the house and on the right is the proposed one which shows the terce on top of the existing kitchen roof and the addition uh proposed addition and the stair yeah that's uh pretty much it do we have any questions for uh the architect all right we have a a planner just for some very brief testimony on the variances all right wait thank you all right let's bring uh Kristen up do youuuu I do Kristen Russell are us SS Kristen your license is current good standing this evening yes thank you um good evening everybody I'm here to tonight just to go over two um variances and one design waiver associated with this application um the first one is a rear yard setb variance The Zone requires 30 ft and with the addition that is being proposed this evening we will have a 17.25 rear foot rear yard setback um similarly the zoning allows a rear yard encroachment of the stairs of 4T um and we are encroaching 13 ft into that rear yard um these are seat bulk variances they can be um considered C1 or C2 C1 um is the variance that we talk about when they're um is a hardship and C2 is when there's a better zoning alternative um so I'm going to present some um arguments that would apply to both or either um as I think they both apply to this case um the variances being requested this evening do Advance purposes of the municipal land use law including um um promoting that public health safety and Welfare providing adequate light air and open space um ensuring that the development of municipalities does not conflict with the development of neighboring municipalities um promoting a desirable visual environment um and promoting the conservation of historic sites and districts which is important since this is in a historic district that's okay um I'll point out that the um projected the proposed projection of the kitchen expansion is 4.5 ft and the Neighbors on the uh leftand side have a similar projection in fact it's a bit um f IT projects a bit further once you take into account the bay window that they have and so we're going to be meeting that projection not extending Beyond it that's okay we also have um a setback um between our house and theirs to give them a bit more space um between our proposed um expansion and their existing home um on the right hand side if you're looking at the house um we will be projecting beyond the rear wall of that building uh however an existing um shed on that side of the house will be removed and stairs will be added in the stairs are similar to stairs that are um already existing on that block um a few doors down as well so none of this is out of character with the neighborhood um the hzone does have a purpose of recognizing the special significance of the neighborhoods because of their varied and well preserved historic character they reflect Jersey City's past and its unique geographic location um so an important characteristic um the historic characteristic of this parcel is being preserved here the property owner wishes to stay in their house wishes to improve their home and um as was um mentioned by the attorney at the beginning of this presentation the historic preservation commission um gave their blessing to this project nothing will be visible from the front yard um and it improves the the existing historic structure um the ex the master plan R Jersey City 2021 includes um the goal of prioritizing the needs and ideas of current residents which is exactly what we're doing here we have a current resident in this historic home and they have these needs to have um an improved kitchen um that that we're trying to accommodate through this addition um also there is one design waiver that I want to mention this doesn't rise to the level of a variance but there is a um requirement in the code that the rear Terraces as you may recall the architect mentioned that the um roof area basically of the proposed addition is going to have a little bit of outdoor space on it um the uh zoning code has a requirement that roof decks and Terraces shall not be visible from the street okay fine we check that um and shall be set back a minimum of 10 ft from any front facade not a problem because we're not in the front um and also that it goes on to say that The Terraces shall provide privacy screening that measures 6 feet high um I suspect that this had something to do with the adjacency of Neighbors when we're talking about like a multif family or um rear Decks that may be immediately adjacent to each other but that's not the case here they don't want to close themselves in and it's really not um immediately adjacent to the neighbors so they're asking for a waiver to not provide that 6- foot privacy fence um so those are the a quick summary of the two variances and the one design waiver um I think they are justifiable um by either a C1 or a C2 variant there is no um detriment to the neighborhood the they are actually aligning with the neighbor to the left and the neighbor to the right will actually see I believe improved conditions with the removal of that shed and the um more open stairwell that's proposed there um neighbors to the rear will not be impacted in fact a building I should have mentioned a building to the rear has um no windows whatsoever so it's really just a blank wall so nobody using that building will even know about this um and again it really does just improve um the conditions of the home for the for the homeowner and um we um humbly ask for your approval that uh that does conclude our direct testimony thank you so much um is there any public comments on this on on this um on 659 Jersey Avenue do we have any questions among the board members yeah uh I'm sorry just a quick question the picture you just had up sorry actually the there was a picture the second and third picture had the uh I'm assuming the building right next to it and I just wanted this will ask sorry there we go the second picture and the third one where that window is in the side is that the building next to it that's protruding out so is that window going to be covered the neighbor's window going to be covered no okay so that window will not be covered we're going to be extending the same distance as that projection that you can see however we're going to be pulled over if you're looking at the picture to the right so there will be um several feet between our building and that window I just want cool okay any more questions no Francisco staff um staff agree to applicants professionals testimony uh I would just ask the applicants to agree to the conditions in the St report as well as the memo issued by HPC staff yes the applicant agrees to all conditions um in both reports uh with st St for approval okay thank you so may I have a motion uh to approve a motion to approve second second on a motion to approve with conditions commissioner Baron approve commissioner Bole approve commissioner shadid yes commissioner Burns yes commissioner zi yes and vice chair aruu yes motion carries all in favor thank you thank you okay so we're going to go back to um case z21 093 uh Mr Benjamin wine good evening Madam chair members of the board Benjamin wi of prime toell and melli on behalf of the applicant 225 Dwight Street Holdings LLC I'll be brief this is a little bit of an unusual one but uh we're here actually seeking to formally abandon an approval that was obtained back in January of 20123 with apologies to Mr Harrington as uh he got that approval uh so my client was uh ultimately purchased the property um that approval back in January of 23 included an Adaptive reuse component of an existing church if if you're remember um a facade element uh ultimately actually prior to my client purchasing the property the prior owner demolished the entire church on the property um and uh and then sold the CL sold the property to my client my client ultimately uh the good thing is they did not want to go forward with that approval and have their own plans which were actually before the planning board next month for uh however in the interim the tax assessor basically said I'm sorry too bad we are uh we're assessing your taxes based on an approval that despite the fact that it couldn't be built I had very good conversations with Mr Black uh Cameron black over the course of a few months and he acknowledged that it is it is abandoned because you can't uh adaptively reuse a building that's no longer there um but again the tax assessor insisting that uh we actually come back to this board and seek a formal abandonment on the record of that prior approval that's really the application in a nutshell and and I also would respectfully request as well and I with appreciation to Mr Black he did authorize the resolution to be available and for me to have drafted it in advance of this meeting again so the prior to the close of 2024 uh we could submit a signed resolution to the tax assessor so that for the 2025 year going forward Um this can be taken formally off the books okay thank you board members have any questions binnie what do we do no that's what you that's it staff hasn't I mean that's what the assessor wants in order to remove it okay that's corre Francisco all right on a motion to approve the withdrawal all right are we doing that I can I have a motion to approve the withdraw I'll make a motion to approve the withdrawal second all right commissioner Baron approve commissioner Bole approve commissioner shadid yes commissioner Burns yes commissioner zi yes and vice chuya yes there's our first withdrawal that thank you and uh just for posterity would you would you prefer to do the resolution now or with your resolutions later this evening as a formal vote I I do have a copy with me yes do you need it I'll send it to you tomorrow we'll do it when we do the rest of the resolutions this evening okay perfect okay take care all right thank you thank you everybody okay so we're back to um case z22 021 and that is 443 447 Jersey Avenue Mr stenose again stepen Joseph here for the applicant uh just for we're going to call this 445 Jersey um I this is a notice case and I do have the notices here yeah so Iris so the record is clear we could say that we have reviewed the notices and they comply and we're putting them on as A1 yes all right 445 Jersey Avenue this is located on Jersey AV between brigh Street and York street it's in the historic district the applicants proposing to renovate restore add to an adaptively reuse an existing house of worship as a 10-unit dwelling um in order to accomplish this the applicant requires HPC approval which we've already obtained a certificate of appropriateness from HPC and approval from this board for preliminary and final major site plan with d variances for use and height as well as C variances for rear yard setback building coverage lock coverage and parking whole bunch of variances here um as we walk through the plans you'll you'll see why this is a very old church and reusing it as a a as a dwelling it poses a lot of problem problems um if the board also recalls there there was another project 90 Bright Street which is to the rear of this that this board had also approved there's an easement running through that property as well which um we'll touch on briefly but let's get the Architects sworn in and walk through the plans okay yes I do name please it's William wenman last name spelled w c k e n m a nn thank you um will your license is current a good standing this evening yes okay thank you very much um uh so um as Steve mentioned um project is uh 445 Jersey Avenue it's located on the West Side um of Jersey Avenue and it encompasses um both uh the existing church as well as the adjacent building which we're referring to as the the vestri building um both of these buildings what what's unique about about this church is that it's it's a midblock building um and it has almost 100% lot coverage currently so it was quite a challenge to try to fit in um Apartments into a building that that has 100% lot coverage and is built right up against a number of the adjoining uh buildings um I'm going to um quickly go over the uh existing conditions so um the building consists of of the church which is which is this section here um again it's it's built all the way to the rear lot line um as well as the side lot lines um and butts up against the neighbor on on both sides um the the vest building is sort of a sort of a a a mashup um there are three distinct sections to the building uh there's there's a three-story masonry building uh that fronts onto Jersey Avenue there's also a two-story masonry building um on the rear lot line and then there's a a framed infill section uh that runs between uh both of the masonry buildings um what we are proposing is um a removal of the rear 15 or so feet of the of the existing church building and that will allow um for uh light and air into into the units um the rear facing units which would otherwise not be permitted um we are also removing this the back section the two-story masonry building as as well as the um framed section in the middle um the the three-story section that fronts on Jersey Avenue will be preserved and uh repurposed um another interesting feature is that we will be maintaining a portion of the rear wall of the church um this is actually a great suggestion that that came uh from from HPC um and that'll that'll sort reflect the um the history of what was there it also serve as a privacy fence uh along the the rear property line um we are putting uh three floors within the church and due to the the way that the roof lines work there's a significant amount of volume within the roof itself uh so we are proposing two Dormers to be constructed uh on the existing roof and those will be set back far enough which which I'll show you on a in a subsequent slide for they're set back far enough to where they won't be visible from from the public right away um we are proposing a four-story addition uh for the vestri building um and they're what we're doing is uh carving out a a small courtyard in the middle of the building which will serve as the the main entrance to to both this this portion of of the building as well as the as the church itself um as per um all of our applications um we we're proposing uh new Landscaping in the front yard as well as uh new curb and sidewalk as well as the maintaining of of the existing Street trees I'll just skip through the uh standard um details uh um uh I I won't spend too much time on this but I I'll just reference these um these are the existing floor plans so you can get a sense of of what the existing conditions are um I'll I'll touch on the um proposed floor plans uh shortly uh this is the this is the main level of the church here uh open Sanctuary um and then um this is the the vestri building here with a series of uh offices um uh and a and a a church Hall in the in the center so uh the church has a partial seller which we are proposing to um clear out and utilize for uh utility space refu bike storage as well as some um resident resident storage and uh uh amenity space um this is the the the first first floor plan we're proposing six units within the um existing church building and then four units for the Vester um the V units will be uh four duplex units uh and the church has a mix of of of unit types um as I mentioned you can see here this is the Central Central Courtyard um we are carving a um access um utilizing the existing uh entrance from the the vest building here um residents will will come in at this location and then enter either the the main sanctu main sanctuary of the church here or the the vest building um on this side um the existing doors to the church uh will remain we're going to be replacing them with um historic uh wood doors to match the historic tax photographs uh but all the windows and um doors on the on the front of the church will will be remaining um and that includes the existing stained glass windows um the the church is divided front and back so we have um a uh a two-bedroom unit in the front here and then we have um two duplex units in the rear which are also two two bedrooms these are the the the living uh the lower level which is the living room and the kitchens um the uh Vester building here is the same s similar configuration um when you enter uh this unit in the rear has the living living space and kitchen on the lower level um the same is true for the the front facing unit moving up the building um on the second floor the configuration is is similar we have a a unit a two-bedroom unit um in the front of the church and then we have the upper level of both of those uh duplex units um and then the same thing in the vest building we have the upper level of the rear duplex and the upper level of the front duplex uh the third floor is um a little bit different um but again similar conf configuration we have one unit towards the front um and what we're doing with with these units um both the the front facing and the and the rear facing unit is we're maintaining this the existing decorative uh arches um uh and uh the front unit will also have access to a loft in the upper level of the the steeple um the third floor of the V building uh is again two two units uh the lower level uh for each of the the duplex Apartments um and then here we have the fourth floor which is the which is only in the vestri building um which is the the upper level of both of those duplex Apartments um I mentioned that the the Dormers were set back so that they won't be visible from the public right away the same is true for the fourth floor Edition um that we're proposing uh on this building it's set back uh to not be visible uh from the street um and we are providing a green roof in those um in that roof area um uh roof plan is pretty straightforward um uh the only thing to note is that this this uh rear-facing duplex unit will have a uh an occupied roof deck um moving on to the uh Jersey Avenue elevation um this will look uh almost exactly like it does um currently um all the stained glass windows uh will remain we're providing thermal windows on the interior of of all these uh existing Windows um we will also be replacing um all of the doors at the um at the the church um and these are designed to match the the tax assessor's photograph um we are also uh replacing the windows at the best building as well as um uh providing an enlarged entry here um for the building the the rear of both buildings um we it has a a more contemporary feel so um since we are doing a major intervention at the rear of the church uh by removing the the the rear 15 ft um we're accentuating that section cut um uh by um providing aluminum panels that frames the the profile of the rear Church wall um and we are also providing uh large amounts of glass um to further accentuate that design uh that is also carried over onto the addition to the vest building although it is a little bit more simple um with a More rectilinear Design here um and uh just to note the the ground floor units will have access to the the newly created uh rear yard um the side elevations are are fairly simple uh we're providing new windows in the existing uh church church Windows um and then we are um providing um similar Windows uh that are proportional uh and aligned with uh the windows on the lower floors you can also see here we're proposing a new um storefront entrance um into the church and that design is carried around to the to the opposite side as well um and you can see here this this hatched area represents where the the building abuts the um the uh the neighboring building uh to the north here we have our our sight line diagrams um showing the relationship of the um additions to to the street uh pretty straightforward we have one on both sides um both over the vest building as well as the um um the main Church a portion of uh of the building is visible um through the rear yards on uh York Street so um this is a diagram uh indicating um what exactly will be visible as you um move up and down York Street so you you can see it's a it's a relatively narrow sliver um but it is it it will be visible um finally we have our uh material material boards um and our standard uh window details here um and then I'll I'll conclude my presentation with a few renderings so this is a a rendering of the of the the main facade um showing the the proposed improvements also have another view here as well as one straight on um and then finally um a view of the the rear of the building that's beautiful um great thank you thank you will we'll bring up uh our planner s Bellamy now get him sworn in it's gorgeous okay in the front yes I do Samuel Bellamy last name b e l l a Sam your license is current good standing y my license has a professional planner in good standing good to see you thank you good to see everyone all right so um as Mr Joseph mentioned we are here for D1 use variance approval tonight as well as D6 height variance approval and some bulk variances related to minimum number of parking spaces um as well as some existing non-conforming conditions uh with respect to the building coverage lock coverage and rear yard setback so as this board's aware um D1 use Varan is can be granted for special reasons and that a site is particularly well suited for the use and that the um purposes of planning are Advanced um in this case we're in located in the historic district which does permit townhouse uses which is a specified type of residential use um permitted in the zone that's defined by the Land Development ordinance um by definition what we're proposing is a multif family building in that it doesn't meet the exact definition of a a typical townhouse um as it's defined um so in this case it's a very technical variance that we're asking for and that residential is permitted it's just the type of residential that we're asking for um I think that the reason why townhouse is the specified use permitted in the historic district is really that's the character of the of the neighborhoods and the type of uses that you see so um in trying to keep with that um development pattern that that's the permitted use um obviously with the historic structure that we can't demolish we're kind of stuck with with what's there and um I think the architect did a great job of creating a a layout and adding additions and rehabbing the building in a way that could accommodate uh a residential use within the existing structure that's that's there today um the site is also um substantially larger than the typical lot in the uh historic district where a little over 7 500 ft where a townhouse Lots at 1,800 ft so between both the existing condition the the really technical nature of the residential use and the substantial lot size here that allows for appropriate unit layouts within the building and and mix of units um I think the site is particularly well suited I'll also mention that we are within the permitted density in the uh in the historic district albeit that's a density related to town townhouse uses of 75 units per acre um the 10 units we're proposing here is at about 56 units per acre so we're we're within what what is contemplated um for the density on this property um with respect to the D6 height variants um with the fourth addition that we're proposing on the on the vestri building um it increases the building height to 45 ft Point 45.2 ft um the maximum permitted height in the zone is 40 feet um the four story is permitted with the the maximum four stories it's just the the building height and feet that we're asking for here um again this is a an addition to an existing structure the lower third three floors do have greater floor to ceiling Heights and and typical floor to floor Heights than what's contemplated in the zone um we're proposing 11t floor to floor on the four story which is consistent with the other floors um but just given that extra height and extra height between each floor um where over what's permitted in the zone um the building itself is consistent with the uh Ro Ro peak of the church building um and the the building directly to the south of us it's a school it's on the corner the property has 100% law coverage um so really with the proposed addition increased height we're not having any substantial detriment on um on uh open space adjacent to the property um so with that I I think this project does promote um several of the purposes of the municipal land use law I think it is an appropriate use and development of the site again as a residential use that we're proposing consistent with purpose a um the density as I mentioned is within what's permitted in the zone um consistent with purpose e um we are um securing safety from fire flood and other um disasters we bringing the impervious coverage down on this property as well as bringing the building at the full compliance with the current fire and building codes um the uh the Adaptive reuse nature of the property um does do conserve um historic sites and districts and that's consistent with purpose J then overall I think this project does promote a desirable land use law uh desirable uh visual environment um cons consistent with purpose I of the municipal land use law um moving into the bulk variances that we're requesting tonight um the first is for uh minimum parking there's a requirement of half a space per unit um for buildings starting at 10 units or over so um 10 uh less than 10 units it's actually prohibited 10 units and over you have a parking requirement um given the uh current conditions on the property the the church and and V building that can't be demolished it's really not feasible to provide parking on the site without um obviously substantial uh demolition that would would have otherwise been required I think this the location of the site itself in downtown Jersey City um with access to the path to the um to the light rail to the ferry um there's there's mult means of uh public transportation that can be accessed um also has access to parks and and Retail corridors so I think the site um I think uh the the variance for the the parking um can be granted by this board and and the the requirement itself would be five uh five spaces here um as I mentioned there's existing non-conforming conditions in this case we're actually improving all those existing non-conforming conditions we're reducing the building coverage from 96 6.4% to 80.9% that's where 60% is permitted um we're reducing the imperious law coverage from 100% to 86.2% that's where 80% is permitted and we're also uh increasing the rear yard setback from the existing 42 feet to 12.17 Ft so all those are improvements I think our overall benefits to the the project that we're proposing um as as will mentioned we're also adding green Roofing here which would help towards uh maging storm water runoff as well as front yard landscaping sidewalks and uh increased tree pits so I think overall the benefits here would outweigh the detriment as I said the the property can accommodate the increased height and the site is particularly well suited for the uh multif family use that we're proposing um wrapping it up with the negative criteria I don't see any substantial detriment to the G uh to the public good or general welfare I think overall the adaptive reuse uh the project does maintain the historically significant uh building and and really bring this property back to an active use um as I mentioned I think all those improvements to the existing non-conforming conditions uh do have benefits and then uh finally I don't see a substantial impairment to the anten and purpose of the Zone plan or zoning ordinance I think this Project's directly in line with what the purpose of the historic district is by adaptively reusing a historic structure um we're also consistent with several of the goals of the uh the recent historic preservation element of the master plan as well as the land use element of the master plan uh with that I'll conclude that I think this project meets both the positive and negative criteria I think that wraps up my direct testimony but I'd be happy to answer any questions the board might have those are all of our Witnesses this evening um architect and planner that does conclude our direct testimony are there any members of the public I'm sorry are there any members of the public that would like to address this issue okay any comments from the board members I just have one question because I must have missed this in the beginning where on Jersey is this uh it's mid block between York and bright okay the other side okay okay so when when when you struct this are you keeping the the uh uh cross on the top or are you going to remove that uh will can should testify about that yeah the the cross will remain that's sacr as well as I'm sorry I didn't hear you the cross will remain all all everything that's there on the building currently will remain including the stained glass right well yeah including the stained glass what church was this um just out of curiosity think it was a uh like epic what is that the uh episcan like Baptist or yeah just curious do you know when this uh building was actually uh was constructed I don't think it was Catholic though um I I don't know the exact date church Baptist Church it was a Baptist Church I I'm just trying to see where it okay thank you yeah okay okay and with that um no public there was no public comments no and nothing from the board right no other questions do you have a question no no okay staff okay so staff does agree with Mr Bellamy's testimony um staff would like to just point out uh few items um the applicant sought and received approval from the HPC at its October 21st 2024 meeting under the application h-23 d 0188 overall staff does agree um staff does recommend approval with conditions outline in my report okay and that's so uh the the applicant does accept the conditions in the the staff report also in the certificate of appri from HPC um there were two HPC meetings on this if the board is more curious about the history of the project um that is all available on on YouTube now so okay um oh so can I have a motion motion to approve approve second second on a motion to approve with conditions commissioner Baron approve commissioner Bole approve commissioner shadid yes commissioner Burns yes commissioner zi yes and vice chair aduo yes motion carries all in favor okay thank you all have a good evening Iris do you need a break Iris yeah I think so okay we're going to take a break maybe minutes 5 minutes 5 minutes or 10 minutes break can we call the meeting to order please okay so we're start so we're going back to Old business which is case z20 043 2011 New York Avenue and the attorney is Mr Charles Harington uh so I give you the floor Mr Harington okay thank you uh yeah for the record Charles Harrington of conell Foley um I represent the applicant um my understanding tonight is that uh the uh obor's uh council is going to continue with her case she has some fact witnesses to to present to the board uh I and and that's my understanding that's the extent of tonight I I don't have anything you know further to present and I want to reserve cross examination until their their full case is in yes thank you very much um Francisco called me yesterday and said you know you've got an agenda with a lot of other people who need to get heard can we maybe cut things up move some things to January and I said definitely my planner and then as we talked about it like I'm going to get all my Witnesses in January we may have a special date we may not we'll we'll deal with that then and what I'm going to do is get as many of my residents as I can I had to excuse one person I mentioned to to to Mr leagle why as many of my residents as I can that Mr leaga has said they would normally be members of the public giving testimony but because they live in a building whose HOA um is an interested party in this hearing um and because the HOA has to be represented and is represented I will put them on um as Witnesses but I'm really mostly just going to swear them in and say you know what do you have to say I have little outlines that they gave me of their Tes but they're fact Witnesses the last of them would be um Gabriel Fu he is the president of the HOA he's a resident of the saffron um I think since 2010 um and he's also vice president of the harus Cove Association so he has a little bit larger sphere um and I am planning to put him on last I don't think I'll take more than an hour um Mr Fu does have a PowerPoint presentation that I'll work through with him but it's relatively short the the others I think you know a few minutes each I think will be fine I don't want a 3 minute cut off because they are witnesses and that takes a little longer for them but it's relatively short I was talking to Francisco who said we might depending on all everything else on your agenda there are some members of the public here who have been coming up to me and saying can I talk tonight I said who are you I don't you know um I said Francisco said you might choose to say just like you did in October and in November on this application if they want to make comments now rather than wait for the end and if you have time you can hear them and if not we're definitely going to be seeing each other in January so that's that's what we have okay thank you yes and again one one person's baby is sick one person I had to get up but we're going to get as many as we can on on and done tonight and so if they're ready I think Radu and Elaine I don't know if you both want to speak or just one of you can handle the okay hello hi so um could you tell them your name and your residence and I think um you'll get sworn in by you m sir uh do you swear at the testimony you will provide this evening will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth I do state your full name please my name is Radu that's R A du manesco that's m a n o l s cuu I live at the saffron 27 New York Avenue Apartment 515 515 okay thank you okay so I'm going to say you had three points that are based on your own sense Impressions living at the saff front this is not expert testimony you're not an expert but you're here to make comments about how what you've seen in the application and what you've heard might affect you guys it's three comments you're welcome to just say them all or if it makes you feel more comfortable now that you're at the stand I can guide you through them but if you're perfectly comfortable just go ahead and we'll be on and off and on to the next yeah so um the applicant um steam has mentioned how the building's height will be a beacon visible from a great distance uh that's just another way of saying how out of character the building would be for the neighborhood uh the second point is the shadow analysis provided by uh the applicant um shows additional shadows in the morning in Winter that's exactly when people are at home and in the days that are shortest so the impact of those Shadows is greatest and the third Point refers to the removal of the distinction between the uh uh the road surface and the sidewalk on Maxwell alley Maxwell alley is also used by Domino's Pizza um delivery vehicles which often speed on that street so uh pedestrians will be at higher risk if you remove the distinction between the the the road surface and the sidewalk okay that's what I got and that's and you're talking about the question about the Ballers and if they raise the pavement will there be balls just to tie that into the vehicles are are raising they're they're fast and so if there's a sidewalk then they can't go there if there's no difference between the road and the sidewalk then you know the there's there's a danger of collisions okay thank you very much and so the next one I think I have is are you guys ready go no hatel Patel hi good evening trth yes I do state your full name please uh he Patel h e t a l last name p a t e l and I'm going to say you had worked again not an expert not accustomed to testifying you had written written your comment out and I said that I would certainly say do you have a comment and you would say yes it is and you can comment and if you're not clear I will help ask a question but I think it's quite clear and I would say just go ahead if the if the board will indulge me with that okay great I could just ask if she could identify what number 409 right next to it will be this hotel so um the reason why I wanted oh sorry here we go um I decided to move to Jersey City about 5 years ago before I purchased at the saffron I rented for a year in Newport I thought that the high-rise experience being able to see Manhattan would be phenomenal and I hated it like I absolutely hated it it just was not what I wanted for myself it wasn't the experience that I want wanted I didn't like the Shadows I didn't like the tall buildings um and so when I decided to purchase I focused my search in the the historic district and I absolutely fell in love with the neighborhood I decided to purchase there and I like it so much that I want to buy another place in Jersey City sell the one that I have and buy something a little bit bigger so that it could be a little bit more permanent for me but the problem is if why would I want to invest my money in Jersey City if the next unit that I buy the next condo that I buy some developer can just come along and say hey you know what zoning ordinances is they're just optional I'm going to go get variances and they're going to build up something right next to me like is that what it's going to be like in Jersey City is that we invest our hard-earned money we put all of our life savings sometimes into these homes and then somebody just comes along and says you know what I like to build something higher next to you and that's fine your property value that's going to get cut by $100,000 means nothing to me because I want to build a a hotel that by the way again does not belong in this neighborhood it is taller it is longer it is wider it is deeper than anything else that needs to be there and I just don't understand why we're having this conversation okay thank okay thanks and so the next one unless Franny Gordon and Kevin youu are here they had warned me that they might not be able to be um we have Gabriel fu let's plug in okay doy I swear your Gabriel FAU G a b r i e l last name fa you f like Frank E L I U 27 Newark Avenue Apartment 414 thank you okay thank you so Mr Fu as with the other uh Witnesses you know you're here I know you've put an enormous amount of thought and work into this you are here as a fact witness to talk about what you have seen and heard and help the board understand your experiences as a res president of the saffron the I think elected and reelected since 2015 I believe put that on the record please mine isn't testimony um board president of the homeowners association of the saffron and of Vice President of the harus Cove neighborhood association took me a long time to learn to pronounce it harus um and so with that if you want to start in I understand you have a PowerPoint that some of these slides are just basically reminding people of what we've seen before and talking a little bit about how that infuenced you most of them were photographs you took yourself and you will explain them as you go through that's correct okay thanks and I may stop you if again if I think there's something that's not quite clear I will stop you otherwise I will try not to say anything and just did you did you want to cover these slides okay then you don't want to cover these no no no we can I absolutely go right back to your beginning okay since he wants to hear from you there you go okay thank you guys for hearing me um again my name is Gabby fell you can call me Gabby if if I see you again after this um I've been living at the saffron since 2010 and I've been a proud proud resident there um and I'm also vice president of the harsi Cove neighborhood association I've been elected uh as their vice president in 2021 and I just was uh reelected for another term and I've been uh serving as president of the saffron HOA condo board since 2015 that's coming up now on in 10 years like you on the board um I I need one second I'm sorry I see I'm not getting presentation mode on this you'll have to excuse me you can read the slide because the record's not going to show the words sit we're on the slid so if you're a little bit wondering what to do reading the slides sometimes get you I have um some notes that are not reading the slides of course yes we can do that do you want to print it out and get it to you and the and the board members of the exhibit I think that's a good idea I think we should yeah we'll submit it between now and the next meeting with a copy for oh sorry so continuing on my apologies I wanted to say that uh I I I serve on the boards and I take my positions volunteering on these boards very seriously and as I know you do um I have a moral obligation that was empowered to me by residents that I represent at The harus Cove Association and I also have um a fiduciary responsibility as president and board member of the saffron HOA protecting the 76 owners who live there so just to reiterate about this neighborhood commercial this is a neighborhood commercial zone right neighborhood being the key word any commercial uses are for serving the neighborhood it's not the other way around it's not a commercial neighborhood zone right Comm commercial zones without the neighborhood um that's where commercial uses predominate and draw customers from other areas that's not what we're talking about here right it's a commerci it's a neighborhood commercial Zone and I just want to interrupt you for a second say naturally the planner will be talking about that this is Mr Fu's lay interpretation of the zoning neighborhood commercial but we'll be putting on Expert testimony from the plan okay no problem and before I get started and show showing you some some more uh information about where we live I I also want to stop by saying that um I Am pro development I I appreciate development when it's done correctly and is sustainable um I've seen living in jur for as long as I have how beneficial development has been to our city it has raised our profile our value it's it's a place where people want to come put down on their Roots okay so I'm not coming at this against development I'm actually Pro development but development needs to be mindful and careful and must take an you know a sustainable approach to preserve the Integrity of our master plan and maintain the delicate balance of our Urban Fabric and I really feel that Jersey City now has really crossed this this threshold where it used to be more of a city in need of development to bring to bring us all up we've crossed that now we're we're at the point where we're more of a destination or a city where developers are looking for to develop so we're at the other side of it now what you're going to see further on in this are key topics the values now I'm talking about the saffron and the HOA that I have fiduciary responsibility to represent which include our rooftop views I want to explain more about what you've seen and heard about our Courtyard light and some of the noise issues the traffic with congestion Street Park and air pollution that we would be uh getting worse if this development were to go up the various noise impacts the fit the fit of this structure not only towering well beyond what is missible in the zone but if you think about it it's getting super wide as well in a limited space particularly the Maxwell Street the sidewalks and then I to touch upon permanence and precedence light now you've seen this here slide before where are I don't know that they can you can can you see the slides on your screens so you can read what he's talking okay great so this was presented by our expert witness our architect vicant and this gives you a sense of what our Courtyard looks like and how light reflects through this Courtyard now this is a a picture not a rendering that I took this is direct sunlight hitting one side of our Courtyard where by the way half of our residents live in the courtyard now the light here was engineered and purposefully reflects off of the walls through the glass off the glass I should say and off the light colored um facade which is not only colored but it has a glossy cover on it so it is emitting a pyramid effect of light and it lights up the entire Courtyard and that light enters all of the units this is hard to explain without seeing it in person I'm doing my best to show you here in a in an image now this is a visual represent representation of that pyramid effect the lights bouncing all around and it floods the units with light here's an example of a unit this happens to be my unit you can see the light on the left side of this image that is sunlight bouncing directly into my unit here's another out of that and you can see directly at the top part of that window which is our balcony the direct light hitting the saffron on the North side and bouncing into our unit you can see the sun's before before you move on because I had a little hard time understanding this maybe next show is no leave it on this one in the the top of the I can't remember the word for those but those windows at the top of the door to the balcony you're looking at I understand from Gabby and I want you to repeat it for the record you're looking at direct sunlight on that white paint just below it it's looking gray and that's the creeping Shadow so that's the difference and you see how the light in his apartment is coming in through the upper part of the window where it's opposite the full sunlight on the opposite wall have I explain that correctly yes yes okay another example of that you can see that what she just described the light bouncing directly in so our Apartments have the benefit of sunlight this is not like living in a basement apartment which it would become very similar to that without the reflective light that we're enjoying I don't know if anyone here lives in a basement apartment I certainly don't and there's reasons why we don't I don't I don't think I need to explain those Maxwell alley now you've heard some testimony about the flattening of the the alley I just wanted to give you a sense of the width of this alley it's pretty narrow it's actually temp .75 ft wide here is an image of a moving truck on a random day moving in and out out of our building there's not enough space for a pedestrian on the sidewalk to pass by nor is there enough space for maybe another truck to pass by a vehicle can maybe squeeze by it's very narrow here is what the city garbage removal truck does once in a while they come up the opposite side of Maxwell against traffic I'm trying to pull into my garage here this is me making a left on Jersey trying to enter Maxwell I can't get around this truck and so it's extremely narrow and this truck does not have to back in or out now the proposal that I've heard from this development plan is that trucks will need to be backing in and out in this dangerous corner and they barely have enough room to getting up and down the street collecting garbage I don't see how that's going to be feasible but that's what this development is proposing that they try and and do views we have an amenity at our HOA that all the members that all the res that live their benefit and enjoy from and here and and that's our shared rooftop here's an image of our shared rooftop and our beautiful downtown Jersey City skyline views and I just apologize this is looking East towards the Hudson towards the Hudson correct now you've seen the testimony prior testimony from our our architect vicant explaining how on the left is our current View and and on the right is what the view might look like should this development be and I got to ask you a couple things where did you get the image from the right from that was taken from our expert witness Architects plan I mean presentation that came from the the developers application it is it is the developers photograph the image on the right with the colorful mural I'll say um can you help the board members Orient themselves as to the proportions in these picture which I understand as Layman you have done to be as close as possible can you draw their attention to the buildings over on the left hand of both pictures where you have building Gap skinny building fat building can you without being able to touch the screen um indicate that so that they understand that these pictures while at slightly different angles are very similar in terms of the scale of the buildings in the distance sure on the left side of the of both images you will see the back in the skyline towards the back of the image you will see several buildings there is a tall building with kind of a little bit of a gap and then another equivalently tall a little skinnier building and then to the right of that a larger building so we aligned using those anchors to place the develop or the develop placed his renderings on top of that to to to Anchor those angles does anybody on the board have any question about that I want to make sure it's really clear okay thanks yeah I'm just trying to make it seem as Apples to Apples as I can with my uh with my Photoshop skills which are lacking as are my presentation skills here with this PowerPoint now moving on to a closer image of the proposed development and using again those same anchor points this in red this red outline that we've put here with a little bit of color fade in the center is meant to illustrate the dimensions of the building and how it would be viewed from our rooftop and we're going to superimpose this on our current views on the next slides and you'll see the amount of of blockage or lack of skyline that we're going to see so I just wanted to make sure that you were clearly seeing that this is the space up to the top of that Skyline left and right which would be blocked from our view and here for B for further illustration is our current view on the top left and on the bottom right would be the proposed view that would be left should this be should this be built and I have a question for you this red square is a little bit schematic there would actually be a bite taken out in the upper right corner is that not correct if that red square were precisely following the line of the proposed building there'd be a little bite taken out of it up there but as you can see there's no view behind it but I just want you to confirm that this is a schematic confirmed okay same view at night this is our our nighttime view pretty dramatic pretty beautiful and yet again the similar blockage now you may have heard from our uh previous testimony our um real estate experts when they're showing these apartments for for rental or for purchase you go into you enter the unit is it the size they like whatever sure let let's look at the amenities you you the first first thing they see is this View and they they ask where do we sign how soon can we move in permanence the sense of permanence what I mean to say here is that businesses are transient businesses open businesses close businesses transform right we're sure that the developer is going to follow their current claims of recording studios and art galleries and all that but these spaces can easily be repurpose for other self-serving needs who knows if they're going to stay that way business would probably dictate that they're going to change in five or 10 years anyhow so what isn't going to change is the permanence of this structure it will forever or for our lifetime at least Mar our downtime our down Town plan and our Skyline and our our our uh Urban fabric noise yeah I mean this is kind of funny but when you think about the amount of noise that's will be emanating from not just Maxwell and the street and the traffic and the parking the trucks backing in and out with their beeps the deliveries add to that all the events this is not just a hotel mind you this is very clearly going to be a beacon event space in downtown that rooftop which will be open air partially will be blasting sound and noise during every event we're literally right next door to this and at that height that that sounds going to be emanating for blocks and blocks and blocks to our neighborhood um the point on noise with these events can't be lost in that I understand the board here doesn't make decisions on noise ordinances we have laws for that the city covers that right but realistically what beop is going to be parking his car his unit outside of the hotel walking through the lobby getting into an elevator going to the top when there's this wedding occurring and people are having a good time he's going to what he's going to go there and he's going to unplug the DJ at 10 o'clock when the noise needs to be no it it's not realistically going to happen it can't and so to say that these these these impacts won't be detrimental to us and to say that we have laws and we have ordinances yeah that's great and fine but in a practical sense unlikely that's going to happen precedence we we we've heard the planner he was attempting to claim that this D1 variance and the exceptions to the zoning plan don't set a precedent for future out of scope projects like this one yet at the same time attempting to say that some eight-story structure in a permitted Zone just a few blocks away somehow means that it's okay which one is it right AB absolutely sets of Precedence that's going to be used by every developer after this one and so on should this one be approved value loss now this speaks to again the fiduciary responsibility I have to the 76 owners of the saffron our expert witness our appraiser has estimated a 10% reduction in value based on the factors that this hotel and event space would impose on our property values that's boils down to $6 million in valuation loss for the building and approximately $882,000 per unit so everyone is going to be feeling this negatively should this be built now I have uh as part of the harus co Association hearing a lot from not only neighbors but also um people in our in our area but who are um activists and Community known Community entities such as Sam pessin I know that you may be familiar with Sam tried to read his statement here before but he has told me that while he's personally knows the developers that are trying to put this together he's friends with them and speak to what Mr pess he can't speak to what Mr pesson thinks but he can say what Mr pesson told him it's not being offered for the truth that that's what Mr pesson thinks it's his sense impression of what Mr pesson said to him and I respectfully submit that is not here say because Mr pant's elderly and sick and can't be here and this board has said and this board has said that his letter won't be accepted I have an eyewitness to what he said and he wanted very much to put on what Mr pesson was hoping that Gabby would be able to convey again not for the truth I don't know what Mr pesson thinks but but Gabby's truthful and he heard him say I know Mr Mr goes to many many meetings I don't know if he's not doing well today but take it what it is it's not Mr P yes correct it's what Mr pesson has conveyed to me personally well he is familiar with the developer and knows and respects them he knows they operate restaurants that are are are just fine that he treats his staff very well well and that's all well and good but he feels that this is wrong for the community wrong for the area and he feels that that this is a mistake on behalf of the developer and he absolutely agrees with the rest of the community boards who all have said the same thing that they're not feeling that this development is right or fits in the scheme where we live and does not promote any benefit to the neighbors that live there and by the neighbors that live there do you mean I had talked about your three spheres the actual saffron residence including yourself the saffron residence do you have responsibility for and the larger neighborhood of which you're an elected I don't know if it's official but all three well I'm saying all three yes all three yes yes so the desires of a single entity or business really doesn't Trump those of the entire Community or a large portion of them you're hearing testimony not only from the assembled group of experts that you've heard from already but a large segment of the constituents and residents that you serve and I serve we had I don't know how many dozens here over the last several meetings Francisco do you need um no these are the actual I there's some that can't make it including Sam but that we have 300 uh 333 Community residents who cannot all be here at at these meetings and they wanted to uh commit their rejection of this proposal in writing and we we want right and and I just I just wanted to to ask Gabby for a couple couple of of question he's authorizing this Gabby I just want you to that's fine if he's welcome to he's welcome to just if you would give me the courtesy Mr L please to ask a question of my witness Gabby did you man a table at the street fair whatever it was I did did you see people lining up to sign your petition they did what did you say do you know who those people are no do you know that they are who they claimed to be when they signed your petition no but you saw them and you talked to them and you heard their concerns yes thank you I would like to to mark this as an exhibit I'm going to hand them over to Francisco accept that all right I'm offering it I'm offering it I understand you're not going to accept it Gabby has offered the the 300 signatures he's testified as to how he got them would you like to testify as to again sense Impressions I'm sorry I'm sorry I just want to make sure you are preventing Mr felu from giving the board the best benefit of his sense impressions as to what people said to him whether it's true or not I don't know if they hate the building but he heard them say you are preventing and you're preventing me from marking these signed papers that he collected and he has authenticated as an Evidence you're you're preventing me for doing that okay Chuck you okay with that you want me to you want me to have that point in my appeal or you want them to take this and then you then I don't have a point you in your because we don't accept those for the reason she just asked these questions he doesn't know who signed it you what their names we don't we don't we don't know what the petition said just it says that's why that's whys don't accept absolutely I'm happy to yes we are moving on to just remind or or reiterate that this site is just ill suited for the use proposed oh Gabby can you just remind me for the record I don't know if you said it how many signatures do you have have 333 okay good thank you great thank you3 that's fine he's welcome too neither one will be AC okay I I I I'm almost finished Vinnie thank you Vincent excuse me Mr leak Mr leaki okay um just to wrap this up the site is ill suited for the use proposed this has real neighborhood impacts and it does real harm to the Zone scheme and I will conclude with the law the laws Clearly say this is not okay thank you thank you very much thanks and I'll have my experts next time and a couple of residents as I said who maybe didn't make it this time thank you very much for support right so I I didn't expect that we'd be done that early tonight um but uh as far as housekeeping uh you know for going forward maybe you know Mr stom can advise us how many which Witnesses she expects at the next meeting so we could all um you know plan accordingly uh there is um you I ask it this be carried to to January 9th uh uh we have had some discussions with planning and I've had it with with Ann about possibly you know having a uh discussing a special meeting so we can just focus on this and see whether or not it we can finish at the next meeting or if it carries us over into the following meeting because uh there are you know there her her presentation needs to be complete then we have cross- examination then we have we also have uh um you know the public um so just maybe just housek geming she's I'm behind you I'm looming over you like Donald Trump um so there are some members of the public here i' mentioned in Francisco I don't know if the board wants to hear them now or have them in January you took some on October some in November they've been asking me and I said it would be up to you they can come back um I also just wanted for the record back I'm sorry okay just to say I'm sorry Mr Harrington was surprised I called him this morning to tell him about a series of phone calls I'd have with Francisco that I think somewhat included him but it's a game of telephone as to how crowded the board's agenda was and so we basically move the bulk of our case J he doesn't look that surprised to me okay I'm glad to see okay yeah if you have any Witnesses then then they are then we're going to have to do the three minute Ru for them if Public public speaking minutes I'm just saying maybe some of them here I don't even know they three minutes but okay just and the question was how many witnesses do you have next time oh and I told Chuck that this morning and I've told Francisco can you tell her for us sure um I'm gonna have a planner I'm gonna have a traffic guy I'm gonna bring back Joe minichi senior and his son Jo minichi Jr because they work as a team Junior couldn't come so senior came but has the credential and senior's so old before they and they are whom they are what those are the appraisers appraisers I'm not going to have Jason Hunter unless Chuck wants me to bring him back because I think Chuck was done cross-examining him I am gonna have Vic crant dalvie the young architect because he did not get cross-examined I will be back um the people who spoke tonight principle Gabby um and the other two to if Chuck has or the public have any cross-examination for them and it's possible that there might be another couple of quick resident w Witnesses who couldn't come tonight um because we were we pretty well knew with anybody on the agenda we weren't going to get through everything tonight but Francisco asked me if we could maybe make it even Slimmer so everybody those other people could get H sounds like about seven Witnesses I think it's going to be I think we really need a special hearing on this because I think just like he took all four hours because it's a big complicated case and still didn't get through his not his fault he did a beautiful job with it I have a lot of a lot of witnesses too and I'm just I'm worried it's going to need a special hearing or need two hearings we can discuss that off the Record okay thank you very much okay now we're are is there somebody you wish to speak this young lady uh is interested in speaking but you are you you have to have the three minute rule okay three minutes so I'll talk as as fast as I can Ellen quinnn truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth I do thank you andate your full name for me Ellen Quinn quu i n n your address please uh 250 First Street thank you thank you um I live and work in Jersey City I'm a college professor in Jersey City and I drive through the intersection of Jersey Avenue and Newark Avenue good luck on my way to work and on my way home from work it's a very busy intersection so um one of the concerns I had about the proposal was the scale of the proposal which everyone uh who spoke this evening has had something to say about seems in an inappropriate scale but in relationship to the traffic uh along Jersey Avenue and Newark Avenue so the traffic pattern has changed quite a bit there are um bottlenecks all through downtown Jersey City now that if you live downtown you're actually dealing with that quite often so I decided to do a traffic study of pedestrians all right I'm not a traffic engineer but I did have a notebook and I can count so I went out for 4 hours in that intersection at varied times I have the report I want to give the report to you uh with all of the uh counting all the uh pedestrians I counted um so what I counted I counted pedestrians on foot on bike including electric bikes not motorcycles uh pedestrians in carriages the little ones and on scooters okay I did not count trucks cars s motorcycles emergency vehicles or pets okay I was out on the intersection on Wednesday December 4th at 2:30 I'm sorry only yes I don't know what you're I'm counting I know you're coun I'm counting so I don't think think it takes uh an engineering degree are you interested or no can minute thank you thank you so uh Wednesday December 4th at 2:30 um from 2:30 to 3:30 552 pedestrians in that intersection uh School out lots of lots of you know 11y olds and 13y olds there's a bus uh a bus stop for the number 80 the number 82 and the number 86 so kids are coming from a couple of Fairly large schools to get to that bus stop that explains I think the number the high volume okay same day uh now from 5:30 to 6:30 Rush Hour 781 pest pedestrians Saturday December 7th starting at 1:35 and going to 2:35 p.m. 602 pedestrians and then December 10th Tuesday Morning Rush Hour 8:15 to 9:15 there were 783 pedestrians okay a lot of people a lot of people thank you can I I'll accept you can't accept this it's an it's an annotated report we we' all due respect it's it's not an expert report it's it's her testimony C report well it's a Citizens uh observations yes she T would she testify too okay thank you thank you thank you other there any more um speakers no more public comment no more okay okay so we're closing what unfortunately we we don't know should we continue with our agenda no well there's nothing to continue right now with the public here but we don't know the date we're carrying this to do we the next public here who how are we going to notify them the next meeting would be January 9th but so as of now we we're going to carry this to January 9 so this way if there's anybody in the public who who is not part of either side they you'll know to come on January 9th or look on January 9th agenda and you'll see when the new dat if there's a special dat or there's a special meeting as well right because a lot of coordination is going to have to happen with the board members with with with my team with Ann's team yes I don't think January 9th isn't working for us but so I don't know if we'll go to February or work out a special no announce it on the nth and that way wait wait wait for the moment this case is has a date certain of January 9th yes period end of story on January 9th on a calendar it'll say whether it's going to be heard that night or it's carried to a different day yes so anybody here in the public knows to look at January 9th to find out if that's the date or there's a new date yes exact thanks okay so do we have adjournment do we Okay so for the moment then this this matter is a journ and then we have other business to discuss okay all right so we have any we have resolutions CLE we have three resolutions and I need to talk to Tanya for one other thing here about reorganization okay I think January we also have the reorganization me I think I'm his mic on I couldn't hear him oh let me turn at still science it's Purp here we go turn on the mic say your mic on okay so the first resolution to memorialize I need a drink the case was Z 2024 D15 88-89 bright SP LLC the address was 90 Bright brigh Street it was an application for minor sight plan approval with c and d variances it was heard on September 26th present that evening where chairman Cole Vice chair oroo commissioner shadid Patel Baron Burns and Bole that past hold on three six that pass seven in favor none opposed all in favor of memorializing that hi the next case was z22 d87 KSS Investments LLC the address is 30-32 Central Avenue that was an application for minor preliminary and final major site plan approval with d variances that was heard October 10th presid on October 10th were Vice chair aroyo Commissioners Burns Allan shadid and boil and that passed five in favor none opposed all in favor of memorializing that and the last case was heard this evening that's z21 d93 that was the uh uh the 225 Dwight Street Holdings LLC that was the withdrawal of their approvals that he needed for the tax assessor so we all know who voted for that six in favor none of f all in favor of memorializing I and that leaves one more order of business which is the annual uh reorganization so in light of the the the the tardiness of the evening I had a try do we have to just go over the r one second now we're reorganizing so in the in the interest of expediency I would I'll ask the board but should we just continue the way we are with uh yes Catherine as as the chair Sonia as the vice chair you're fine with that yeah okay now we have to do make one major change and why are we making that change Francisco why are we doing this everything was flowing along fine my let me guess hope you're making more money what where are you going don't leave us unless you're make before I should I pause this is this a closed session or is this going to be on YouTube well this oh it's be you I'm sorry we're on uh oh pause that I'll just chairperson and Sonia aroyo to remain as excuse me arujo as Vice chair is that all in favor of that I I I and unfortunately since Francisco is leaving we need a new board secretary and that board secretary will be Eric Eric Eric Beasley is it ER Beasley Beasley Eric Beasley I'm going to remember that we have all in favor of that I I I so here we go thank you so that I I don't think we want to discuss anything else this evening is that it motion to ajour Merry Christmas everyone merry Christmas happy New Year and I'll see you next year toour motion to adjourn oh second second okay