##VIDEO ID:91ejAswVUjg## this is a public hearing on proposed regulations uh that will change the local tobacco sales regulations we have Lawrence I want to clarify what this of these proposed changes will do and what they won't do for example there's nothing to do with smoking tonight you're not proposing changes to smoking regulations you're not trying to prohibit smoking you already have a regulation that com of smoking in the city tonight it's all about the tobacco sales regulation that already regulates a lot of stuff but we have to bring it to the level of the state regulation so most of the changes that you see in that summary on on the table deck if you signed in to speak even if you didn't you can just get a copy of the summary of the proposed changes on that table as well as the actual proposed changes we're making so when you look at those Chang most of those changes this just to bring the local regulation up to part with the state regulation most of the stuff that we are going to propose change it's already been changed at the state law so it's not like the board has an option well I'm not going to adopt this proposed uh change here because I don't like it if it is a state law already we're already enforcing it so the reason why we are ating the local regulation it is so the board doesn't have a regulation that violates state law on the boooks that's the main reason there are other changes that we're proposing those are minor changes are mostly to facilitate to clarify things facilita enforcement make sure everybody's on the same page um are there any burning questions before we start because I want to make sure that you know everybody understand what we're here for so it's not a regular Board of Health meting this is a public hearing solely on these proposed changes if you want to see what they are they're available at the table right there and if you want to address the Board of Health about these issues only about these issues you can't talk about anything else if you want to address the board about these issues you have to sign in to speak once you sign in to speak we got the list we're going to call that list so we can go through the microphone on that side and address the board make sense as for the board I just want to say the following there's a packet in front of you I have a similar packet in front of me so let's go in the packet for your uh reference the first one up one is just like about the healing rules you may want to decide how long you want each person to speak I recommend a two-minute uh length of time for each speaker you're going to keep track of time here on this table uh as people speak you're going to get a 30 second warning warning and then you have to wrap up your arguments and then there's going to be another uh warning that's going to say your time is up okay so look War so there's are rules of uh suggested rules for the for running this meeting like I said the recommend to minute preparation and also you have in your backet a sheet of paper that's a uh summary of what we proposing on the left hand side there's a column that says issue so this is what we addressing and then the next column is state law this this is what the state law says about the topic whether it's already regulated or not regulated if it's not regulated by state law it will say under that column on the third column it says current Boh of B Health regulations this is the current regulation this is what we have in the books right now and then this is the final column is proposed B of Health regulations these are the changes I am proposing so it's a two-sided uh summary so make sure that you see the other side as well right after it we have the actual proposed changes these changes they come with a bit of a rationale as to why we we I'm I'm proposing to changes this is based on my work for all these years I've been doing Tobacco Control since 1999 work in different re regions and this is what what this is a result of my going to store is educating people about the local regulations and trying to uh help people understand what what's expected of them as far as the regulations are concerned so these are the proposed regulations says draft one because this is the only draft that was provided to this board I provided this draft to the board I think three or four times throughout maybe a year or so and the last time it was presented to the board was on May 28th this year at which time the board approved it to be submitted to the law department for review it was reviewed by the law department the city attorney um said the proposed uh uh regulation is fine didn't see anything wrong with it so that's why we here tonight the next piece of Pap is uh the it's called track changes at the top this is the local regulation With The Changes already included but this side they track you can see where they changed they're underlying it's easy to see it's easy to follow what you will see is that you'll see that it it doesn't look like we have a lot of changes just by looking at the body of this track changes uh regulation next sheet of paper is suggested motions the board will make motions uh hoping um later tonight and uh so this will make you know the job easier somebody has to make a motion somebody has to Second it and then you take a vote um so you know what we've done as far as has providing notice to the public there was a letter that was mailed out on November 21st to all retailers in lawence the letter uh itemized the changes that we are proposing uh at the top of the letter we urge people to translate that into Spanish I can't translate into Spanish and when we have proposed uh I have and we have when we have proposed regulations and language of regulations strings in them a comma could change the whole thing so I don't mess with that so a letter was sent urging them to translate the letter and uh the letter contain also the date and time of this hearing in addition to that we post to leave a notice on November 27th and on December 2nd on the Eagle Tribune so we have copies of those here they would would like to see I think there a copy of that in the backet as well and that is pretty much it if there are any questions from um you know the fds or even the board I'll be glad to answer before we start okay why don't we begin I call the meeting to order this is the Lawrence uh Board of Health we're having a public hearing tonight about the changes to the tobacco product regulations uh as Caesar said we're trying to bring our regulations um up to being consistent with the state Reg regulations and clarifying the definition of some of the things that are um unclear um I'd like to reiterate The Rules tonight any person wishing to make a comment tonight can sign in over here and each person will have two minutes to speak before the board before addressing the board you must read this um you must have read the summary of the proposals copies of it is available right over here when addressing the board you must first identify Yourself by name your address and any professional affiliation that you might have that impacts your comments meaning whether I'm a business owner um whatnot um identify which proposal and what section you wish to comment on please limit your comments to 2 minutes so that other members of the audience will have a chance to speak you will receive a 30 minute warning before your 2 minutes expires and the bell will ring indicating your time please be considerate of those persons speaking whether you agree or disagree refrain from commenting out of turn any person showing unruly Behavior or verbal disrespect to those speaking will be asked to leave the premises the hearing will adjourn approximately one hour now i' just like to reiterate um what Caesar has said there's no major changes happening in Lawrence what we're trying to do is make our regulations exceptionally clear and be consistent with the state regulations we're not making anything illegal that isn't already illegal but we are clarifying the definition of certain things and we'll be happy to reiterate and explain what those are so if you if you think that the board is suddenly making all the products you sell illegal we are not what is illegal is going to continue to be illegal and not making new things illegal is that correct that is partly correct let me give you an example the sell of a pack of cigars containing fewer than four cigars they say a two pack of cigars we three pack of cigars that the sell of these products have been illegal in the city uh and many spell is across the state since 2014 here since 2014 but those products continue to appear in the source so this proposed regulations in addition to reiterating that it's is also saying that the mere presence of these products now in the stor is just like we have in the state regulation State regulation says you can't sell flavor tobacco but if the tobacco if the tobacco is there even though you haven't sold it it's still a violation we're doing the same thing to be consistent with the state regulation we're saying that the presence of illegal products in the store is by itself AOL does anybody has anybody signed up on the list to speak nobody has signed up to speak anybody have any comments we'll take you at random anybody can ask a question doesn't have to be a com one we have intereted in Spanish um I believe uh most of you here in regards to the issue of the blood WRA uh that that of the BR um so I think some of you are here to speak in regards to that so please feel free you made it all the way here uh let me hear your opinion you are the seller you are the small business of Lawrence so it's very important to hear your voice so please uh give me your opinion before you address the board and that specifically here let me just clarify what this proposed resulation would do for blunt reps the sell of blunt reps is already prohibited in C since 2014 it's not nothing new uh and the state uh regulation prohibits the sell of tobacco flavor enhancers and like for example are you familiar with Natty wraps Natty wraps Natty wraps are a tobacco flavor hands already prohibited under the state law we're just clarifying the local regulations to make it clear that people understand that so if you have something that's made out of out of marijuana for example uh or um a similar product like a wrap like that and then it has a flavor it's it is a tobacco flavor the answer according to the state regulation we clarify that in the propos you want to go to the microphone probably want to sign in to speak because we have a record of who spoke I to you can speak loudly so my first of all my name is I'm coming from Supermarket so my question tonight that way he can listen to you better um my name is maren Gomez I'm calling I'm coming from Gomez superet so my question tonight it would be so technically you adopting the sa law to La technically so basically what I'm seeing from one side to another side because one thing that I see it's the alarms the fee were you know um 100 now we going to go technically for one mistake that we made it instead of paying 100 we're going to be paying 1,000 you're already paying a th000 I mean there's no yeah my question would be why La is 100 but and that's why we having this hearing the regulations is outdated the state law was passed in 2019 saying that A F of $11,000 for first offense $2,000 for second offense and $5,000 for the third offenses while the local regulation still reads 100 to 100 300 it's outdated so we can't enforce 100 to 100 here because we violate state law we have to bring it out to the state so technically all the so all the regulations going to be aded the state La regardless we can do more than the state law but we canot do we cannot do less and then after you guys you know complete all the process we're going to be receiving what I know I know it's there already but more clear to us because sometimes it's to be confusing because when you go to Boston to buy or order cigarettes they technically sometimes they say things to you but you know they said well because one thing Massachusetts another and sometimes we get confused right well I thank you for the questioning it's likeif right if the board adops the regulation tonight uh there's going to be a letter that's going to be mailed out to every retailer clarifying what has been changed however we won't be able to do much more than what you saw in the first letter uh providing notice about this here however you're going to do visits and you're going to take those visits an opportunity to ask ask questions about things that you don't understand about the new regulation we're going to review the new changes with every retail store so we're not going to go and I'm guessing the board is in a big and effective date that's maybe two months in the future or maybe 3 months but so there some time for us to go to the stores educate everybody give you a chance to ask questions in case you're confused about something but one thing we cannot do we cannot provide you with a list of legal products we can't do that because the tobacco industry comes up with new products pretty much every day every time I go into a retail store there's new products there so when you order a product from Boston from anywhere you have to do your research make sure you're absolutely certain that the products you buying you're legal Cate of role not legal not Cate of lawence not legal in the state legal in lawence because some products can be sold at different cities but they can't be sold you wants there'll be my phone number and letter and when I go to a visits you know you can also uh have my phone number you can ask me questions and that's how you can implement it anybody else hello how you doing Sten Gil Vice chair of the Board of Health uh 8 boy Street um the only issue I had I came up to express my opinion to come up the board um one of the issues I have the proposed language of blood wraps I believe it's going to uh how it reads now any pro or how it's read in the future any product made holy part of tobacco manufacturer or package with loose or removable leaves or sections of leaves or a hollow Tu may be C may be used to consume to Consumers to R or contain loose tobacco or other fillers I do not agree with the proposal I feel that it's going to take a few stuff up the Shelf I believe that falls into the category of uh Backwoods and blood wraps I know that is uh a a definition that's Loosely used but as I understand my community takes about 30 or 40% of the pacco sales and I feel that uh the small business will be hurt by taking out that product thank you very much just a point of clarification so I'm going to address what uh member board member Stevenville has spoken about we already have a definition of a Brun W the reason why we proposed to change is because it's a backl the companies they are tricking uril they'll write something for example this is a pack of cigar you open that cigar it's a fake cigar it's it's a it's a leaf of tobacco roll off to look like a cigar I give you an example of a company that does that but I'm not singling out one company other companies do it as well that's why we have this proposed change it's a problem the company frto they have a product called cigar one cigar it's a big thick cigar you open it up it's not a real cigar it's just a Leal tobacco R up to look at that is a blunt W that's a Le in the you see so another reason why we modify the the the the uh the uh the changes to uh how we Define these things is because Natty wraps they're made out of U um it's not Wonder necessarily it's what is it is it uh is one of those it's related to the my plant and because it was flavored you know some people across the state were a little unsure as to whether if that product was flavored you know it was a lethal product because it's it's made out of H plant H so uh the the understanding from the state Department the message Department of Public Health is that that is a flavor product and it's covered under regulation so we clarify the under the local definition so blood wraps uh just a recap it's a problem that's why we're proposing the changes and fronto is not the only company that does this when you open some of these products you open it up you can pull squares out of a what appears to be a cigar you put a pull a square easily several squares they can roll off now one other things and that's why it was prohibited to sell to begin with and that's why we proposing the change because the current language doesn't doesn't um allows for the company to exploit this loophole can I have can I hear from some of the retailers about what you sell most sign come on hello everybody my name is first like to about I believe thisa company established mass in 2015 I know you said 2014 guys like this no we we did not pass on local regulation because of one company with best regulation because there was a problem okay I have another question about the same product it's a Lea so there's not like nothing no tobacco no any flavor inside this Le so why you guys trying to not sell this the mark well it's already changed what we're proposing is a a redefining clarifying the definition so if if you think it's it's going to regulate it's already regulated for many years what we're proposing tonight is not to implement something new is to clarify the definition so companies cannot exploit it to push these products that are already ilal in the city one more thing is so to answer his his question regarding to the moreing item in our store so we we like as a smoke shop not like a grocery store as as the others we depends a lot on like plants and cigars and the paper so that's going to really affect our business well I can address that because I know your St very well uh you you're a tobacconist you call you a smoke shop but technically it's a tobacconist or a big shop right yes and you have a uh human door filled with cigars those cigars are fine now when you go to companies that are actually exploring a little po in the current definition to push those illegal products yeah that's a different story and you would have a lot of those I go to your store to check it you don't have a lot of these products you have game cigars that cheap cigars you have maybe Dutch Masters but I don't recall right this minute they have a ton of paral products there so this won't affect how you do business you still have your cigars you still be able to sell your cigars the expensive ones are in humor and also the the chicker ones that you have behind the comp thank you good evening good evening um I'm Corey Palmer I I work on behalf of crand farms I managed that location over this past summer um I just wanted to go over about what the sales what we do over there and what that that impact does um as far as Backwoods goes the um with the with the games um well by the way that way is illegal and and games are as well sure sure but I'm just telling I'm just saying like what what it does for our business currently yeah so I do when I do the checkin because I do all the receiving I do about about 10 to 15 cases of backwards each week that we get receiving for that as well as with game and not only that um when people buy that product they buy milk they buy they buy uh all all the other the hot foods groceries when they when they buy those products as well so I'm that that could impact our our business if that if those were taken away and I do have a question is is like is the Zin considered like a a tobacco enhan flavor no but zen zen was well some Zen products are still legal to be sold they're all legal to be sold here in the city by the way right now right but there's a growing concern across to State about some of these products Zen products like would Zen chill be considered an enhancer no okay not at this time okay but there's other there's other concerns about some of the Zen products okay a Zen a Zen product for the board say you know it's a dissolvable or it's a it's a pouch you put in your mouth uh it's not it contains nicotine but it doesn't contain tobacco yeah but some of these are are suspected to be flid that's all okay that's all and just re I mean you can still sell your your games and your Backwoods so long as those products are they don't have those SS that I described okay and not many of them do okay thank you what is game and what is back all right so game is a a a brand name of cigars cheap cigars you can buy a pack of Contin four cigars for $531 $6 it's very cheap those are legal um can't they just unroll them and use them as they can't because they're properly people do not these products they will do the ones exped by I think knowledgeable about this subject what I'm saying is if you take a game cigar you try to unroll it and if you take a front one cigar in Rolling it's a completely different story one you just go like this the other one you have to work at right you want to you want to sign in come in sign and speak I just need a clity you come sign and then he he already can you go to the microphone yeah good evening everyone just a quick Clarity I need from you here on the backwards under the new definition of the blunt rap will that wood be taken off on the shell yes or no you have to open it up to see no I'm just asking you like I don't know I don't know because there's too many products there's too many products back a big share like all the retailers know that we said a lot and I would like to comment based on just for the qu toing we are defining the whole definition for the entire no I just use that as an example as I said in the beginning we're not going to see well one company but I have to give you an example that is an examp that most people know that company but any any any cigar that will fit the definition will be prohib from being sold only those are actually the companies are exploiting that FLW how would as a retailer we would know that whe that would falls under that category or not can't tell you you have to research it you have to open it up we can do it this way I go to your store okay I you open the pack if it's a good product I purchase it if it's not you got to find I mean you got to have if you don't do your research beforehand that's where we're going to be so you have to research before you order the product and some of these products the problem is you can have a product that's legal today it's illegal tomorrow let me give you an example how many of you are familiar with uh what is it uh the brand name game for cigars but green who remembers green green used to be non-flavored one day it became a flavor product he has to be taking off the shelves so the companies will do that all the time it's a it's a fight that it's it's it's Unown that is why I cannot tell you I cannot provide you a list of legal products because those products change from from one day to the next and I cannot tell you whether this particular company all the product line you know would would pass mustard some some backwards product products may not pass you know the definition they still a buun rep we're just making it clear they still a g rep if it didn't pass it but most most Backwoods problems are fine they be fine okay thank you anybody else I just I just have a question are um ra papers would be considered WS because paper raw papers consider if it is if it is regular paper it's not a bun ra I have a question are blunt wraps legal legally sold in surrounding communi blood wraps cannot be sold in the city surrounding Community yes I know the can't you can't you can't sell that either but most I don't know which companes actually has that particular provision but a lot of the municipalities across the state do have similar Provisions for blunt wraps by the way let me just I'm sorry before I interrupt you let me just say this I don't create these definitions they are created by the state by a collegial uh coming of the minds you know uh all the Tobacco Control programs across the state we come across similar prod problems we come together and then we deter hey this is a problem not only here in L not only here in Lawrence but also all these other places and then we start to create language and we create language that that is checked by other attorneys to make sure that we don't bring something here off the cff to the board so I did not create that definition the new improve the definition it's a definition that's being that's being submitted by the M Department of Public Health as a as a uh model regulation so when you go to look at the model regulation if the city doesn't have any tobacco regulations if they want to implement a tobacco regulation we have a model regulation and that model regulation we have this new definition for blood RS uh my question blood r aren't illegal in the state it's not correct not illegal in the state okay so I think my opinion this is not my opinion um I mean obviously there's still a lot of questions a lot more question than answers and we don't want our retailers to be so confused when they buy their products that they feel they're at risk for stiff violations and suspensions I don't think it's fair to say you have to do your research and but it seems like the the landscape is incredibly confusing about you buy a product you think is legal and it turns out to be illegal I'm a little uncomfortable with the fact that our blunt WRA Municipal local law is different than the state law let me just say my goal and my my most important focus and chairman of the board of health is to prevent the sale of tobacco to miners that's really what I see as our mission and that's why we have been applauding the state laws for stiff fins and suspensions for people that don't ask for ID and sell to Miners and we're going to continue to be very strict with no compromise if your staff employees sell tobacco products to miners that's under the age of 21 in the state of Massachusetts with no ID you can be assured that we're going to follow through on that I also am very uncomfortable with flavor tobacco products flavor tobacco products should be illegal in the state because they basically cater to young people they are they cater to minors they cater to young people so the presence of flavored tobacco products in your establishment is illegal and you will also be fine I think that what I'm sensing from the board but I won't speak for everybody is that the the the the blunt WRA thing has created a lot of uh confusion and you know now that the sale of cannabis is legal in the state and a lot of young people do roll their cannabis in tobacco Lea it's pretty much the most common way these days and young people I feel like the local law might be a little anti equ and I think Steven would agree I don't want to see you know my front yard littered with blunt wraps like they were before we made them illegal and I don't know what the ultimate solution is the law as it stand is you can't sell blunt WS but redefining and making more confusion I think it it's creating more questions than answers and I don't really feel that comfortable with with that part of the the uh proposed changes they address that briefly um the intent of the changing the definition of blunt WS was not to make it more confusing that is not what is confusing what is confusing is the industry when I say to people when they come because I issue the per myself and L I cover those two cities is that selling sub is is a dangerous inprise because the industry changes the rules almost daily so it's Tobacco Control programs like this one here that actually try to level the play field and try to protect the public from the exploitation from these companies so the cell of work wraps is already illegal in most cities in the state of masses the changing of the definition is to make it clear if you can easily pull a square of if you open up a pack of cigar a single cigar you can easily pull know you can see those are squares listen we have the current local Board of Health regulations which I'm going to read and we have the proposed regulations and they don't seem any different one from the other any tobacco product manufactured as a package or package as a wrap or as a hollow tube made wholly or inart from tobacco that is designed or intended to be filled by the consumer with loose tobacco or other fillers the proposed regulations any product made fly or in part from tobacco which is basically the same thing or package with loose or removable leaves or sections of leaf what is different between a tobacco product manufactured as a rat or Hollow tube and one that is manufactured packaged with removable sections of a leaf to be used for the same purpose the difference is on this on the fake cigar those removable leaves are just like you can easily pull in all all right so that's how the industry has adopted to us FAS roll up instead of you Tak five minutes it'll take you two you see what I'm saying so it's a blood left disguise as a cigar and that's why a proposing this change as as as you said it correctly we we're not changing too much of the definition we're just including that to make it easier for you to identify if you can easily pull something like a square of paper well it is a big leaf of tobacco clearly is it is it so when you find those in these establishments what when you find those in what you say I educate about it I educate them about can't yeah this is well yeah this is a this is a a blunt R to sell these prod has been I don't find them generally for me to find a store for something like this the person will have to be worn once twice and then you still do it deliberately and some stores you have actually some of those those uh uh deliberate violations but those are rare usually what you see before you Dr Dr gor and he are people that sold tobacco to miners or so flavor tobacco to Min well that's what that's what we're here to prevent right I I really personally don't care as long as they're not flavored and they're not being sold to kids going to buy them go to and you you can get flavor toac product not flavored not legally I mean I've which one also guy you have a customer come and buy a BL whatever but they might buy milk they might buy cereal they might buy something else they might buy some so if we can't sell a blood we're not most likely not going to sell the mil we're not going to sell the Munch so it's to hurt I would like to see all blood RS that are legal that not flavored uh to be able to be sold um I feel it's going to hurt our small businesses if we take if we start eliminating those products they're already limited it's a question of unlimiting exactly that's not what we here for so this been a status quo for many years Years A lot of them sounds like probably illegal in state St in the state I know but they're sing them you can sell it I'm pretty sure I've seen it over the well the flavor toac product they Le all things I mean at least the blunt WS I haven't seen too much of the defin yeah no I totally understand would Backwoods be considered a cigar that you can easily take the leaves out of he asked the question or somebody else did that behind you okay uh my answer was I don't know because they have different lines of products so we have to you have to so could could someone just come in and make a judgment if this was an acted and say hey these can be easy taken out only if you open it up I'm I'm just trying to understand what exactly specifically would be considered to easily take leaves out of the the cigar on the on a real cigar you cannot easily unroll it you have to work at it on a fake cigar that has BL wraps attached to that sometimes it's just one big to back roll up sometimes just as Square as it can easily pull I mean someone could cut I'm sorry like someone could just take a razor on a on a I'm just throwing this out there someone could just take a razor and just cut a piece of the paper on the tobacco and still easily take the leaves out and still rewrap it I'm I'm just saying like they it I don't think it would make much of a difference the difference is we' be we've been making possible for cigar companies to sell cigars you to sell cigars because that argument I think it's a fall one you can just you can just cut you can just cut any wheel cigar right and then you could re ret tape it back together is what they could do right so my stance Dr W is that this is a stronger regulation it's a clearer regulation and as far as clity is concerned I think on this particular issue the blood WS that's already been the regulation in the 2014 is just make it clearer it helps you well how do I know this is a fake cigar if you can easily pull a square of of tobacco out of it that's a fake cigar that's it have you sign the speak I'm sorry I haven't I sorry I just if you decide if this board decides for example to make it legal to S reps this what would be going against what everybody else is doing for most Boards of Health in this state is doing that the work uh I wouldn't present this here if this was something that's come out just my mind some else speak yeah so my question maybe sorry apparently I'm the last one right um I think my question goes towards the clarification of you said that blun draft is in violation if it's beyond four packs or under four packs no one clarification no be confused we talk about two different things a pack of cigars in the SE of lawence you can have a four pack five pack sixpack 20 pack it's fine you cannot sell a pack that contains two or three cigars and you can you can't sell single cigars I mean this this what is a blood wrap is something different than a cigar it's it could be a blood wrap just like a WAP or it could be a cigar disguised I mean a blunt rep disguised as a cigar and that's what we're trying to so so I think I'm going to go with the Gan with the com right there backwards is a cigar it's not a blood some of these products are cigars some are real cigars if you open it up listen I'll make you a deal just for them if I go to your store if you say no this is a legal cigar I say okay open it up if it is illegal cigar then I buy it if it's not you pay a fine would you take it yeah sure sure so we have a deal but who defines if it's IL legal right it seems arbitrary the it's not arit the reason why we have this qualification Dr B is so it's not as arbitrary or at least doesn't appear to be arbitrary if people can pull easily pull a square I could demonstrate if I had one year it's not something that's difficult to determine if if it is a fix cigar you can't see it just by opening it up a real cigar you have to work at it so what they're saying is like well it's almost confusing it's not confusing when you open a figar you all know what a figar look like you know these products exist you SM because you know and the only reason I use that that name of that company is because it's a company everybody knows and they push they push these products everywhere and I'm trying to come back that so second point to that so I understand finding blunts ass is blunt similar to sorry I need a blunt wrap is just a leaf of tobacco like a real Leaf of tobacco rolled up it doesn't have to be rolled up it can be just like squished like like fral products they have like one that's called a leaf right that's a BLT wrap but it could also be like brown paper that in a fabric of that brown paper has toac those are hard to find and it's hard to determine so if if a company makes a a a a product it's like like it look like brown paper I won't be able to determine whether it has tobacco in it or not but if you can pull a leaf up to back that easily from a fake cigar that's a clear blood ramp and that's why we are modifying the definition so at at each one of you can easily determine it's not going to be me determining you can determine we've been selling Cigars Cigars for 10 years 15 years you can those are those are fine we CL we are clarifying or I'm classifying cigars backward what I want to make clear is that this is not something that I put you on on the on the T as a Target the companies are the target so if I go to your store and I find a product that I suspect is a grunt ramp when you open it up I confirm that's a blunt WP I'll let you know that's a blunt WP you maybe didn't know so you're not going to get a find because of that but if I go that three times same products and you're still selling it's because you're deliberately doing it at that point you might get a f so this is not it's just to get these products out of the stores not to penalize you it's not the purpose sorry I'm still on the spotlight but other question I have is we sorry we sell raw papers these are used for redraft blunt drafts where does that fall into place if they are regular paper you can sell it if they have flavored they're illegal if it is H if it is H unflavored you can sell it as much as you want organic h no problem so we don't see raw papers being banned because of this Rolling Papers a regular rolling paper is legal for you to sell you have to ask for IDE according to the state Pap is not a refers to a that has toac whatever no when people say let's smoke a blunt they're that has to not like I'm rolling a raw paper when you say you're going to smoke a joint you still have to roll it you can roll it in a paper and that's not can't how it doesn't make any sense roll the reason why we we Chang is we make it clear for you to determine by yourself what a BL R is I have reir discuss I'm not we need to we're going to I think it's I mean we're going to start making motions without the language on everything except for BL okay so we're going to work on this to to continue to answer questions and and I promise we'll come back to this um but I'm sorry Caesar we're going to we're going to have to put the blood WRA redefinition on the back burner that's fine so you can continue nothing is changing regarding your wraps what's illegal now is still illegal but we Caesar I think he's a fair man and when he comes in you can ask questions if you pull something out and say is this legal or illegal you should ask questions because over the next four to six months you will learn if you're buying a product that's illegal he'll tell you it's illegal he's not going to find it he he will educate that's what we're here to do if in six months we revisit this and say this is crazy these all these products that that we really need that we sell a lot of are supposedly illegal but if you find that the products that you sell predominantly are cigars and four packs that are legal for no less than $5 then we're good but we're not going to change anything regarding blockouts okay the what's what stands in the regulations now will continue to stand and it'll allow us time you allow you time to ask Cesar question questions about products that you think you want to stop that you have questions about and don't fear asking the question or asking his advice because he will tell you what he thinks is legal and what's not legal he's not say oh I got you that's illegal this is a period sometimes do this is a period going to be a little lenient and it's going to be a process of education and for not only you to learn but for us to learn as well yes sorry it's me again um can we if we do decide this maybe it might be best to give us a list of products that impossible it would be it would be lovely if we could but every day they're new products so it's like by the way the state has tried that the mass Association of Health fors created a list years ago I remember this Dr it was a list of faor products that were flavored or not flavor it was a list to help people retailers they couldn't keep up with the list because I can understand when you go to Chelsea you go to Cash and Carry it's mind bogling and and they might not be able to give you the right information so let's let's let everybody relax a little bit about the BL we we'll do a six Monon period of education and we'll see where we stand is that cool I I think any more discussion because if not we're going to start making motions make okay so we're going to jump to pass the we're going to jump to Cigar CS regulated we have the current language do we have to read it no we can just the way no you can just read the motion the way it is the only thing you're going to change about the motion is about the blood WS where's where's the no no we're not talking about Bloods right right so when you make a motion to adopt the regulation you can exclude blood wraps okay but are we making a motion to have to read each single one no we just make reference to it that's a simple motion for you guys why don't you make a motion you're willing to um make a motion to I moveed to adopt to propose the amendment to the regulations of Lawrence Board of Health restricting the sale of tobacco products as contained in draft one minus the WRA blood WRA which are approved by the board for submission to the Lawrence to to the LA City attorney on May 28 2024 so the motion is to set the effect date of proposed hold on that's separate motion so you have to somebody have to second that motion all in favor I I okay so the new regulation is fast now we have to have a passus the blunt okay we're all good with that okay next the effective date I move I move to set the effective date of the adoption of the amendment of the regulation of lawren Board of Health restricting the sale of tobacco production to product products to what was the DAT you can pick a date uh January 1st 2025 second Mo all in favor I I okay the motion both motions carry minus the redefin and please we we urge you to use him as a resource you have his phone number you have his home address no no no so the letter that you received has my phone number please use it it's better to call ahead than wait for me to come to an inspection but I try to be fair most people here know me who he years I can point to one here that I know Muhammad I'm not a youngho kind of guy that goes and find people left and right uh I want educate you first and then if you decide that you're not going to follow it that's a different story but no we're not here just to penalize people we're here to educate you and to to Counterattack the the exploitation by the toac industry Dr B I don't have a clean copy minus the blunt wraps for you to sign tonight so I'll have to revise it and then I'll contact you guys signature I appreciate your assistance thank you all for coming tonight thank you very much all of you could I have motion to Jour please all right well have a good night everybody