##VIDEO ID:MMmPQrBG8uk## e e e e e e e e e e s we'll call the city commission meeting to order it's Monday September the 23rd the time is 5:30 p.m. if you'd please rise for the invocation in the pledge Heavenly Father we ask that you watch over this group tonight that you give us the strength and wisdom to make good decisions for the city of lebur we do this in your name amen United States of America the stands one nation God indivisible liy and justice for all tonight we have uh no proclamations and no presentations so at this time we'll move on to item four which is public comments this section is reserved for members of the public to bring up matters of concern or opportunities for praise issues brought up will not be discussed in detail at this meeting issues will either be referred to the proper staff or will be scheduled for consideration at a future city commission meeting uh comments are limited to three minutes and would you please give your name uh and your address when you come up to the mic any public comment hello my name is Caroline V di I'm at 120 palur um first off I'm mad at myself for not catching this and I usually keep one foot in the door as far as looking at the agendas but second of off um all these went out today I got within three hours of posting on Facebook my friends I don't I couldn't tell you how many people got these in the mail today and what is disturbing about it is that um well first off it comes from Maryland says Police Department Processing Center Maryland I almost threw it away I thought it was junk then we open it and then it says city of police department speed enforcement program um if this was a real ticket um I need to mail this to uh P box in Atlanta Georgia where the city of leeburg police department speed enforcement program is located then if I need to request that I wasn't speeding say I have a a pretty decent camera in my car that's tracking by speeding or seeing how fast I was going it says I have to uh do a hearing request for and uh mail it to the city of lesburg now it's great that we're having this because I just looked up uh I use Google which I don't normally use and and because we all know Google likes to show you what information it wants to show you but just within one minute of Googling I found this out of Winchester where this same company that we hired to do these uh speed light speed camera lights uh had just been thrown out of Winchester because of uh the obviously problems with the the speeding whether it's you're speeding or not speeding how they processed it through the mail and the worst part was the law firm at the time said that the the company Altima was in charge of whether or not you got to uh reject your ticket or get your day in court and they were the gatekeeper in charge of whether or not you get your day in court um and then uh interesting enough when the attorneys went to get the financial records the city of Winchester received $155,000 and the company ultimate kept $69,000 now you know I do my homework so I went and pulled the new law in the State of Florida and I know how they got it through the company lobbied the State of Florida to pass the law and then in if you read in here it breaks down how much money is going to which department uh the State of Florida gets money every time we write a ticket uh this company gets money all these different entities get money so now we know what the driving force was was money but I cannot believe that I would ever think that any of you would have ever gone for this and not questioned where does it start where does it stop has anybody gone through Main Street and seeing how ridiculously confusing that one is uh as far as where it stops where it's and then my question is I know I'm over three minutes but my final question is is it radar is it from point A to point B and if it's from point A to point B where does point a start where does point B start because the striping says school then before the striping you have the sign posted legally now that says that you're videotaping us uh in let's say using the Main Street location but then you have the sign posted of the school times and now I found out from Allan today that it's not just 30 minutes before school time and 30 minutes after school time those cameras are running 30 minutes before school time through the entire day of school till 30 minutes after school time and if you go through their speeding you are going to get a ticket warnings went out today my issue is this is is a month month ago this is a month ago so if I want my day in court and I want to protect myself and try to defend myself a lot of those cameras dump that information before a month if you have any cameras that run it dumps information before then so now I'm going to have to go out and figure out what camera can I hold a lot of information on so that I can protect myself when I go through my own city the city that I love now has cameras up everywhere I don't speed through school school zones I've never sped through a school zone I'm not that person we've got problems in our neighborhood Peterson about speeding and all we have to do is shame those who are speeding because I know exactly who they are and I'm just I'm tired of this monitoring and all of this and and my question is where was all of that information was that information share with you point A to point B is it radar how is that done that's the information I want to know and obviously this this is just the beginning because everybody's going to get tickets now because These Warnings were a month ago and you guys have been doing tickets what since the 16th of September and somebody's gotten one on this board I'm sure I I don't deem myself a speeder either yeah so we've got issues any other public comment all right we Mo move on to the item five the consent agenda routine items are placed on the consent agenda to expedite the meeting if the commissioner staff wishes to discuss any item the procedure is as follows one pull the item or items from the consent agenda two vote on remaining items with one roll call vote three discuss each pulled item and vote by roll call are there any items anyone would like to pull so I'm I want to pull 5 C1 and four any other items motion to I'll make a motion to approve all remaining items yeah second roll call commiss canel yes commission rean yes commission Peterson yes mayor bur yes someone please introduce uh five C1 I'll introduce 5 C1 to be read by title only resolution of the city Commission of the city of leasburg Florida approving an amendment to the lease agreement with kid Central Inc to modify the scope of services to be provided by Kid Central Inc at the lebur resource center authorizing the mayor and city clerk to execute the amendment and providing an effective date approval second thank you guys for uh introducing that uh I had a little bit of concerns with this um this on the surface looks like uh we are now approving kids Central to uh run a healthy healthy kids is that Healthy Start Healthy Start program correct uh and my concern was we have an agreement already scope of Services of what kids Central is supposed to be doing in that building there are eight items on that the Dum in the uh you know in the packet and what's going to happen to those things what you know have right so some of the some of the prog some of the programs that uh K Central did or does less of uh include some of the high school diploma stuff the geds preparation preparing resumés those type of services um some of those we've picked up in the housing department so we'll continue to do that not through kids Central so we feel pretty confident that the the resource center will still have those uses okay kids Central is moving more into that Family Health stuff versus some of the uh education yeah uh career oriented things which we're going to pick up on staff well yeah I just don't want them to go away because some of this stuff you know money management GED preparation uh job placement um you know all these things things were geared more towards let's say the upper teenage young adult getting in you know and it looks like we're making a whole change to infants nursing babies you know that's where the program is going to move to so I just didn't want I wanted everybody to be aware that we don't have a contract for these things now because this this new agenda will replace the old agenda and therefore we have no one doing these life skills training you know except us yes and we're picking it up and everybody's given that and that's my only comment on that so uh we have a motion on the table uh do we have any other anybody have any other comments with regard to it I appreciate the clarification I read it is they were expanding Services I did not realize they were replacing Services it's read to me that they're replacing those services that this would be the new yes sir my understanding is replacement of Prior services with the scope that was attached to the amendment so that's no GED program at the resource center if we could have yeah this is hello my name is Kiera mcnight I am the new um Housing and Redevelopment manager at the city of leeburg at the resource center I was formerly a kid Central employee that did those Services right but the city picked me up so those services will still be ran through me with the city uh the GED program is still going on with um Lake Tech we are partnered with them they are there Tuesdays and Thursdays so that is still going on um I still uh help the residents if they come in for any employment Assistance or any U resume assistance and whatever I cannot do we are partnered with ciss source so we uh redirect them there so any services that was uh given by kids Central because I am a former employee I have experience in it I do assist the residents in that or redirect them to where they can get the needed services so you feel like we are still going to be able to provide we are still providing with has I just didn't want these to go away because I things we they've been gone since June and since I've been employed with the city I've been picking up those tasks okay any other questions roll call commissioner Ean yes commissioner Peterson yes commissioner conell yes mayor bu yes uh would somebody please introduce uh 5c4 hasby by title only resolution of the city Commission of the city of lebur Florida approving the sale of city-owned property located at 305 South 6 Street and providing an effective date for approval okay yes and I I pulled this also um more or less to uh get Al to to kind of give us an overview of actually this isn't a real big sale I think it's $50,000 uh uh it's relatively small but but it ties into something a little bigger and I wanted so the the concept that we've talked about a little bit has been bringing in more mixed use uses to the downtown I I would say too I would mark it back it go as far as back as the downtown Town Master Plan report that we did believe in 2018 is um so the the concept bringing the more people we can bring downtown than that then you know the benefits are the the Commerce and the folks liveing downtown helps heal healthy downtown um we have um entertained the concept of a of a high density use over at the old Lee School site we're still in the process of doing that um and then we were approached uh by Frost andberg represented by Brett Jones who's here um and I'll I'll turn it over to Brett here in a second he has a presentation for you but essentially the the concept is to bring in more mixed use higher density type of things and you'll note in the contract there's some Planning and Zoning contingencies uh because of the need to get to that highest uh density type uh zoning requirements that would would necessitate that um so this kind of strategically placed on the agenda for two reasons one because we got the offer from frosten BG and then the second as we Endeavor to work with the Lee school we do see that we're going to need to expand the central business district so we wanted to see where you all wanted to go with this concept because if we expand the central business district to the north then we would also expand it to the South um so more on that to to come but I let me introduce Brett Jones who who represents Frostburg um the style and I I'll I'll leave it to him but essentially they're they're looking to incorporate a number of lots um this facility for us I would say is now open um I I I would say it's not a need in our inventory um you know depending on where you you all want to go uh we're in the process of playing some musical chairs if you will um so this property is specifically about u a third of an acre 3 acres um just to the west side of 6 Street just south of the trail and the trail is the Southern edge of the CBD Central business district um this is currently in use with the gas department in fiscal year 25 we contemplate moving the gas department to Griffin Road uh for larger facilities um and then on the east side of six in the current facility we've talked about moving the events division into that facility uh so this is like I said about a third of an acre site which right now it houses a a shed with which which houses equipment and wellth and those type of things so once the gas department has been relocated I think that the use of this is open so with that let me introduce Brett to y'all and and Brett's going to give you um some renderings and some pictures and some concepts of what would go along with this should you approve the sale Brett Jones 700 alond Street thanks Al I uh didn't bring all those fancy pictures because I didn't I thought I'd save that for like a planning hearing or a site planning or something like that but but I can talk through through it and you have to use your imagination so uh on this project it's to acquire this piece of property to aggregate it with the parcels around there and you know there's vacant fields on both six and a vacant field on sth and the purpose of this is to have a trail oriented development you have this amazing asset run through downtown you have several Trails by the way um and in in other cities would would metaphorically kill for for that uh and you have these utility type uses on it so what we realized when I was looking at that property is if we could aggregate that block block along the trail and actually Orient the units to the trail so there's no cars parked on the trail the front doors Orient the trail and the purpose of this is to enhance walkability and liveability and really attract a different uh demographic demographic to our downtown urban areas it's funny to call them Urban living in Lake County but these towns these Main Street usas that we have which in my opinion lebur you could fight with usus over this but probably is the best Main Street in Lake County and I live in Claremont grew up there um and clar's trying really hard but they're it's not organic I'll say it that way but that's another story uh you have that trail that is just two blocks parallel to your main street so if you can if you can build residential units there that front on that trail you're going to get people that come to work for me right out of law school so like your 25y olds that are brand new baby lawyers your nurses that are working down the street at the hospital and a different type of uh I would just say demographic to fill this uh Missing middle housing piece and that's what it would be it'd be some form of attached housing and I'd work with your planning staff to make sure it it it maaps the character and nature of the city but those people except for you are probably your kids's age right and they want to have this ability to walk to go downtown to get a hamburger a Coke or a beer if they drink beer or or do this Main Street USA experience uh not necessarily live in a big city so that is the goal of the project and aggregating this piece in actually is what makes it possible versus if you if you're familiar with the piece right now there's like a five or six car garage that she use as elet for utility purposes so we hired Jeffrey maen Jeffrey M is a world famous architect and urban designer he is the town architect for celebration he also designed Baldwin Park uh he also designed for taba stock the neighborhood called Albany in the Bahamas um and he's a friend of mine so I asked him to do it so he helped design this project which is why Al thought I was going to show you a lot of pretty pictures cuz we've done that I just didn't think that uh a cont scenario and that's my error Al you probably told me to do it uh but that's it that's that's the pitch there's no magic to it it's just a good faith effort to come and bring a type of residential use structure and really built style that is missing in leberg right now but historically our forefathers and for mothers probably would have done something like this if they were in our shoes today any questions I I have a couple but not not for him okay um Al did we get an appraisal on this we did not why not I I don't have a good reason for you commissioner I don't was that required what was the questional appraisal uh no we don't have an appraisal I think 250,000 is the threshold requ so it well it wasn't a requirement we didn't trying to process it simultaneously um but I but I will tell you I don't think 50,000 is market value I think the the the value comes into investing back in the town town so that's an option for you all so if you want to read up frosten BG and try to get some more money out of them this evening I certainly recommend that um but the reason so we just kind of use the swag method on this one the swag method is correct okay what's the swag method would you mind educating me I like I like old sayings acronyms stuff we all get that's what I thought it was okay so I did to answer your question if I did an appraisal like an oldfashioned real estate guy appraisal so you look to the parcel immediately to the South which is because of proximity the best comp and it was it's like a two and a halfy old appraisal uh strike that not appraisal valuation which is public record uh it came to no me to like $133,000 per acre when you do that per acreage so I multiply it by the three something Acres that this is and it came to $3,437 67 and uh we're going to have to wreck the building so there's a cost of that that's probably going to be about $30,000 as long as I don't have to jump through too many Hoops of the city and I don't know about any remediation I presume there'll be some remediation I'm crossing my fingers that there's not so when I went there uh fund or funding source for rostenberg said well now it's only worth this I'm like yeah but you got to make it a good enough number for the city I even have interest with it so Al doesn't throw me out of his office when I ask him for it okay Dan I have a couple questions for you if you got getting up there just to clarify the um the appraisal requirement is for purchase of property not for sale of property as well so okay I think it'd be handy to know what something's worth before we sell it sure yes sir um Dan um over the years it's been extremely important by some of the Commissioners to address Downtown parking this is not that far off of Main Street um Dan how many um how many parking spots would you plus or minus think you get on this low up I'm going to guess commissioner somewhere between 35 and 50 depending on design okay and how far off of Main Street would you say this is 700 little over 700 ft okay so done about 700 ft off of Main Street for 35 to 50 parking spaces and I know it's been brought up by commission coming up to spend a Fortune of money 1.6 million on a study and addressing Downtown parking well for $50,000 if parking downtown is a major issue for this commission I I think this is something we really need to consider to add 35 to 50 parking spaces versus selling a piece of property for $50,000 versus the 1.6 million we're talking about spending coming up to address Downtown parking I I'd be happy to talk about that as an academic I'm not on the council uh if you'll hear me if you want to hear it so the purpose of having a great downtown is walkability and you already have the bones for it this is like I said probably the best place in the county for that and what this Ventures to do is create people that will live down here so they can walk to your downtown and utilize all the Commerce that you have a main street and you know one block off kind of either side then all the subblocks so that critical mass right there you actually don't have people needing to drive here to actually get to Main Street and use the use the facility so that's part one the other part is there'll be on street parking created from this as well which will exceed the amounts that are required in the unit Cals for under your code so the on street parking will have an ancillary benefit to non-residents that live there that want to come utilize it downtown like me I don't live around here I live in clont on stra parking on six yeah okay how many SP you talking about uh you'd have to do the Cals but so if you think about it when you sell a piece of property in the private sector they can go ahead and make parking so the road is whatever the requirement that your city requires the road I can then take my property lamps right here and create some diagonal or some 90 degree or some parallel parking inside as long as I still meet the sidewalk requirements that's a very common thing to do in walkable neighborhood type development if we're thinking Suburban style so sprawl style which is what we all grew up in which is possibly what you're thinking yeah it it it's not possible so what I'm proposing here is a different T style a very old fashion style of pre-World War II style of development where we actually build these Urban centers in a grid pattern and don't build huge parking lots and figure out how to actually make the parking work on the actual property that they serve so I really can't I time visualizing how you're going to get on street parking on six Street but um is back to my point is I mean I understand residential development downtown but you you have the old Lee adult site um that's already been approved that's going to be a tremendous amount of downtown residential already I said and I know there's I'm just it has not been approved yet yeah Lee has not been approved yet well it's it it has an a sense um I'm optimistic I'm optimistically will approve it it's approved as a p right yeah no no we we've not agreed on density it's approved as a pu just for just for just for clarity purpose it's been approved as a PUD which is Town Homes at 63 units okay okay correct okay the concept been on the table the concept that's currently on the table is to convert it into apartment complexes which would need significantly more um Planning and Zoning review so it's on the table as that P all indication is that the developer wants to go a different direction okay so that different direction is going to prove I was trying to help the Pud is approved for residential so but I know it's for years it's been addressed for the Downtown parking issues concerns whatever with some of the Commissioners I think this is a great opportunity to add 35 to 50 parking spaces downtown a block away off of Main Street and I I I just think for the $50,000 you're going to give this property away without even knowing if that's even a good fair market value I I I just don't think it's a good deal so um obviously I support the Lee adult site and the site for apartments um I you I'll start with the you touched on the other parking uh that's been talked about for 2025 years I'm excited this commission finally approved the money um and that will include knocking down the old Center for the Arts partnership building uh re-engineering the whole thing there yes it's it's a lot of money but when you look big picture it's very it's it's a good it's good Forward Thinking for downtown because we have we do have parking downtown it's not all in the best location uh this is a premium location um when I looked at this site here I did call Al today um I I'm a commercial realtor so I looked at the values it's it's it's the bottom of the range in my opinion but it's it's in the range I'm okay with that I did talk to Al about you know do we keep it for part parking or any other needs and we talked about that at length um Al said we don't have any other needs for it um but I did scratch my head on on using it for a parking lot um but the yeah but I also believe we need this kind of housing downtown it all goes together so I think with the other large parking lot which will be hundreds of spaces um and then bringing this in is a good deal so but I I understand respect your comments I just don't I just don't know we need to spend a million something dollars to address downtown parking coming up when you got a piece of property sitting there that could EAS house 35 to 50 and that's what we have right now we have a lot of scattered parking and this would be a good example we have lots like this that're off the beaten path um I would I lived in a bigger city so I've walked six blocks to work um you know this is probably a block block and a half but right or wrong people in lburg that come downtown want to park closer we're trying to make it more convenient for them I don't I think this is a better use uh and I struggle with it today but I think putting residential here is a good use I do understand your comments on parking but I'm optimistic that the big parking project will fix that problem and now we need to focus on residential but uh we we've had many consultant come here and say you have parking but it's scattered all over downtown um in different places of course that includes the the uh the the multi-level parking garage which is a little off you know a little further east of course it's coming into its own now as well but uh but yeah I will support it um but I did I did did go through that exercise today you know evaluating is it you know should we hold it for parking um you know Etc but uh but I want this residential housing downtown I think it all goes together well I'm just thinking that you know versus spending that kind of money and I don't know you'd even get 35 or 50 parking spaces out of the the 1.6 million here you can get the parking spaces and say the city can save a tremendous amount of money and the difference in opinion there is we're trying to make it more convenient the parking we're talking about now will be right up against uh Magnolia uh right in the thick of uh everything um and this lot is a little bit set back it's a great lot for residential and uh and the fact it's on the trail oh was big I do support this I think having residential on our Trails is huge I'm a huge Trail supporter and if I think you have half of downtown businesses here in the audience tonight and I think they will all argue that we do have a parking problem and the plan that we are presenting is going is something that they all are in favor of um so I would do support this as well so does this property that we're talking about uh is it butt up to other properties that would include more residential development yes if you think about this property being on six if you're on the trail and you walk all the way to 9th it would be that entire contiguous block and then all the way south until you start hitting houses on one there's a house on one side and there's the apartment a little bit further so it would be all of that so it create it completes the critical mass calculation yeah and you know the reality of the parking issue if you if you get your little Google phone and you look at where our parking garage is compared to downtown and then you look at this compared to downtown this is further away well it is but I mean where else you going to but where else you going to put parking downtown tearing buildings down I didn't I didn't say I wouldn't do that so you know I mean you're going to have to have you're going to have to have parking there's discussion about parking yes and I'm just like I said I'm just trying to save the city $1.6 million on spending to at the the study to maybe add an additional 12 parking spaces downtown that's not accurate that's not an accurate statement to say 12 parking spaces that's okay well how many Mike I mean I've asked this question for 6 months on how many parking spaces we're going to get out of 1.6 million and I can't get an answer from nobody well I can guarantee there more than 12 um well how can you guarantee have you seen anything well I've seen nothing we're talking about knocking down the building I believe there's we're talking about collapsing uh Fifth Street because we don't need it now look I I and we got we're picking up the some of the land from the gas plant uh re-engineering it all I mean I would like to think we're going to pick up a 100 more but I'm not a site engineer well this piece of property is right not too far from this you're talking about adding spaces there well this space is not that far away this site will not solve our parking problem too far out so look I think I think the commission and I don't want to support or not support one concept over another but I think what's important to point out is that these are corresponding and different concepts one concept is we have to address parking that that concept concerns taking away non-conformity taking away parking let me say that again because there's the business owners in the audience okay taking away away non-conforming parking on Main Street so there's a deficit and then going back to the multiple sites of of I'm going to give you the all key numbers and you can look them up 1344 379 1344 361 13 46525 um and 17 5984 and working potentially with life Stream So in those blocks of area basically what I've described is everything from the trail to the north to main to Magnolia and then over towards thir working around the so that whole area is the the area where we're trying to pick up parking as well as take away non-conforming parking in in in on the Main Street and commissioner canel you have asked multiple times what's the number we're going to pick up and the answer has been we don't know we don't know because we haven't put a significant amount of money at it we did the only amount of money that we have spent down this road is 7500 bucks to do the initial study which says we needed to focus on that 500 foot radius get as much parking as close as possible what I think now becomes different about do you want to use different doesn't mean better different means different um about this parcel is that its location while it's in that ring it does go on the other side and we spoke about this on the phone so I'll share our conversation okay so the difference is that this parcel is across the trail and is surrounded by frosten BG property then the parcel where we were going to contemplate demolition which is the gas building that will not be demolished that's that that would be the concept of where the events division goes so stringing the extra number of parking and I don't dispute the number somewhere between 30 and 50 parking spots depending on how it's designed you know yeah you'll pick stuff up but it's going to be outside of that area that we're trying to include in the partnership building for lack of better explanation so you have kind of you want your cake and you want to eat it too in this regard right we want to get as much business and commerce as we can and we want to make it parking friendly as we can I do not think that if you sell this parcel that you're going to hurt your parking objective I think you enhance the multi-use of downtown if you opt not to then it does become an opportunity for additional parking but I don't I don't think parking goes into the equation I think what goes into the equation is I would capitulate I think the sale number is a little below value but then again we've had this conversation a hundred times in in the last year is is as a as a as a public entity we don't always make decisions that's based on money I know that sounds horrible but it's the truth not all the time are we looking to make a buck we're looking to provide a service we're looking to provide Concepts which improves community and if that means you're slightly not the best sale but you're promoting your concept which is to bring people downtown mix it with some of the other projects we have then we're doing our mission I would say that this is a reasonable offer for a concept that will yield us back in performance and bringing people to downtown to getting into our mix use Concepts that we've been honestly I think I would say struggling to do for the last five years so this is an opportunity to start cracking that nut any other comments from the commission so we have a motion yeah we'll take some public comment on this actually uh is anybody here would like to offer public comment on it I'm here I'll comment again longtime resident of leeburg and yes I've been we've been talking about like you said Mike we've been talking about parking forever but how many of you go to Mount Dora I mean I've had to park five blocks away but that didn't stop me from going to a store a restaurant or anything because there's stuff down there I want and I and I hate if that offends anybody that has shop downtown I like coming downtown to eat but is malora dressing their parking issue because it doesn't seem like it to me the last weekend I went I couldn't find a space for almost 30 minutes it did not stop me from finding a space and going to where I wanted to go I mean that's the harsh truth of it so we're dancing around and spending money on parking spaces and I'm concerned that's not what's going to bring people downtown any other public comment James H good 501 South fist Street um as a business owner downtown um there's Consumer Reports what what Al mentioned was the the conversion rate from somebody that comes into an area for the first time which is what we have right we have a perception of lesburg as kind of being an old town that for a long time I'm I've grow up here didn't have the best things downtown that's changing um if you spent some time downtown you'll realize like you said you like to come down and eat I think the restaurant sector is doing a great job of creating new and exciting things to get people down there so we've got to convert those firsttime people into a convenient way that they want to come back uh I'm talking about the villages the villagers we we see I would probably say 15 or 20% of our consumers are villagers that complain about the parking because in the Villages they make it a precedent to make sure that they can can do that and and to speak to Outdoors issue is that majority of their downtown is either Parks or is already developed they don't have empty gas departments in their downtown area to my knowledge so um I think this is a great sale to bring some residential there I fully support the commission's choice to to do the other uh parking with the the partnership uh with the partnership building is and I think it uh solves a lot of issues um for us business uh us businesses that are downtown any other public comment La Blue Line Sports were 7112 West Main Street thank you parking is a number one issue to get people down here you guys are doing a fantastic job that parking lot is not going to affect it we can't even give them to walk one block right now so constant signage uniform signage rather as the company told us last year that needs to be done that was their recommendation uniform signage till we get to the thing I have full confidence that we'll get there we all want the same thing but parking is a major issue thank you any other public comment roll call commission Peterson yes commission canel no commission rean yes mayor B yes this time we'll move on to public hearings item six uh before we introduce uh 6A I'm GNA let Al talk a little bit about the uh the millage and budget adoption you didn't know do no I didn't look I'll talk as much or as little there's a presentation again if you'd like I'll give it so I'll give it just a super recap um the the high items in the general fund I think is the addition to uh a significant increase in public safety by increasing the police department by 12 positions adding additional fire uh fighter Personnel so that they can change hours um not and that takes a sign significant stress load off of them so they can uh respond better and more to um to calls not that they aren't currently uh it's a just a higher level of service I think also in the general fund uh the reduction of the transfer which represents 6% of current um current electric customers in city limits is a significant change and also starts putting us in a position to where uh extremely concerned that State Legislature may lead us uh even though it is an unwan thing leadership um and the utility funds we we Endeavor to do uh uh continue to provide the same Quality Service um there is a CPI uh increase on the utilities except for electric uh we will move into fiscal year 25 with the same electric base rate also with the noted power cment change that we've uh discussed and the uh electric Advisory Board discussed useum uh last Monday um with that said we did note the inflation the growth factors on the electric fund it's uh inflation as well as uh some of the expansions we've done to accommodate development have put a bit of a stress on the electric fund so we will be watching that closely um as one that we may need to adjust uh a base rate uh midc course of the year and we'll report according to you accordingly on that um as well another rate that we will keep an eye on is the building department rate we have done I think a super great job to reduce our building fees to where they're the lowest in the region um we did that as an attempt to bring back some of our Surplus and funback uh lowering of the Surplus through the rates um so that one is I think really a Time matter of when we may need to get back up to a fuller uh building rate but that's going to be based on uh the um the number of permits and the activity in the department um I think we can saave that off so at this time we're we're kind of balancing Personnel um openings which we're trying to delay hiring to see where we are and measuring level of service versus the need for rate increase but we'll keep a beat on that um and then in the capital project funds we've also uh I think put together a a big slate of things to do that include the parking conversation completing Susan Street uh finishing up the sewer plant and managing growth so in a quick microscope that would be the fiscal year 25 budget it does maintain the millage rate um and it also maintains the the uh the um fire assessment fee at 165 per residential unit thank you sir do we need a motion to introduce 6 um no sir you just turn over BR turn it over to Brandy that's you ready name of taxing Authority the city of leeburg Florida the current year roll back rate of 32327 the proposed millage rate of 34752 is 7.50% higher than the current year roll back rate the millage rate to be levied 3.47 52 Ms per 1,000 on July 8th the commission approved the tentative millage rate of 34752 Ms per 1000 this is the same rate as the prior fiscal year whereas the proposed budget was developed using 3.47 52 Ms per 1000 and the tenative millage rate was approved at the September 12th meeting therefore the tenative millage rate of 34752 Ms per 1000 represents a 7.50% increase from the current year roll back rate which is attributable to additional expenses and is a tax increase under t uh trim guidelines number [Music] three do we have any public [Music] comment uh James OB good I sat through I think all everyone but the first one and uh it was highly educational I would just public want to say thank you for the the professionalism the commission and Al and his staff that put together all the reports all that stuff it was eye opening to me to hear all the numbers and all those things so I would recommend that uh more citizens I don't I don't know if there was any other citizens in the room there was not very many people in those meetings um but I would uh just encourage us as Citizens and business owners to come and be a part of that planning in those meetings um and and have our opinions heard and and said and and just be educated on what cuz a lot of these things that they're talking about tonight I know a lot more about them because of those meetings that I went to um and I can and can can assure you guys these guys are doing a great job um and are very professional and very thorough in their presentation so thank you guys for doing that thank you Brandy would you like what's that you're on the resolution yeah so we're on item four the resolution motion do we need that introdu I'll introduce 684 to be read by title only resolution of the city Commission of the city of leeburg Florida finally adopting 3.47 52 Mills as the fiscal year 20242 millage rate for the city of leeburg Florida representing the current year proposed aggregate millage rate of 3.47 52 which is 7.50 % more than the current year roll back rate and providing an effective date second any other discussion on that so do we need a [Music] v call commissioner canel yes commission rean yes commiss Peterson yes mayor bur yes I just so so now we have an opportunity for public to comment on what we just did if there's anyone from the public who would like to do that and there's not so the resolution uh introd I'll intr we'll move into the budget next we need to introduce it I'll introduce 6 A6 to be read by title only you resolution of the city Commission of the city of leeburg Florida adopting the fiscal year 2024-25 budget for the city of lebur Florida and providing an effective date for approval second roll call I have a couple things it was on notice the 11th hour but um it brought it caught my attention at the last meeting and city manager said to bring it up at this meeting so we're sitting on $491,000 in the CRA fund and the resource center owes the electric fund 750,000 on a note and we know the electric fund could use that money do we want to see about transferring that $491,000 towards the note to help pay it off and help our electric fund have a little extra wiggle room maybe half of it I wouldn't want to move at all I mean we talked about I thought we were rainy day on the 400 for a I thought you told me we weren't allocating rainy day in it okay rainy day in it yeah I respect what you're trying to do yeah no that actually so uh commissioner reesman brought this up to me actually first reading and and my response was if I had thought about it when we had the discussions useum with the Carver Heights CRA board I would have brought it up as an option um you guys went through several discussions on that uh and at the end of the day we increased the funding for the home program to 600 Grand and your year number 490 and rainy day fund or allocated those are in in you know in my mind the same same thing um so I do think that that is open for discussion um it might be you know something you want to discuss with the CRA board um I think it is important to kind of put on the table because that was an option I don't think we talked a lot about no we didn't but it's coming back to me now I mean we that money was it's unallocated but I think with the Susan Street project on the table is why it's sitting there like it is I think yeah yeah so and that just came back to me I we kind of kept it on on the rainy day fund or on allocated because if we needed to go back to the well depending on where the Susan Street project were we would have that so I look I will say this um I probably think it's a reasonable uh consideration um I don't know if I would say it would give the electric fund wiggle room but it's certainly cash they need um so I I think it's something you probably should Mark I probably would want to includ commissioner Barry and the other Commissioners so we're okay with holding off to the next meeting making that decision I I think you probably would want to but I think it's you brought it up we can amend the budget during the budet moving forward um something to think about then I think it's a good one to put on the table Yeah and the second thing I wanted to bring up is I know we discussed this and we kind of just said we'll leave with what we have but um I think it's a totally different software than what we are currently using and I get calls all the time I'm sure you guys do and our residents don't know where to go or how to do it and I still would like to see if you guys would consider the C click fix option that the option for our residents to report things that they see around our city things like that that's an easy fix it was I the presentation was about 15 grand to to have the it was text gov and C click fix little bit different programs with application the the C click fix I think was a little bit easier communication for the public um to point out like was that what Sonia came in that is what she talked about I think the commission was a little bit hesitant to do that commissioner reesman talked to me about it afterwards I asked him to bring it up again too so I do think it has some benefit the 15,000 bucks isn't isn't a game Cher so um it would be appropriate if you wanted to add that into an expense for next year to say so now we can we can adjust the Budget moving forward with that if if that's real I want to go comments we did debate it some um I think some neighboring cities were using it eustus and tar both use it and I think I thought we agreed you know let's kind of see what they think about it they've been using it for a few years I think what the discussion was is let's see how text my G goes are two totally different applications so that's why I wanted to bring up and what what is the exact difference see click fix lets residents take a picture of something they see whether it be a Popple on the road or a tree that needs to be trimmed or a fence that needs to be T something that we can fix and it geocat it and it sends it to our database and then we can sort it out and send it to the appropriate Department to address it um it opens the line of communications for our resents I'm I'm open-minded I I just worry it might turn into a complaint line and um I'm I'm trying to my phone would quit ringing a lot more quit ringing as much so I guess I should be supportive Sonia came in and gave the presentation and I just didn't come away from that presentation with a uh a good idea of of which way to go I I it was a little I wouldn't say confusing but I would say confusing you know I'm not sure that I am in favor or opposed because I don't have enough information again we can amend the budget we can deal with that you know over the course of the next fiscal year it's not that much money but I would like to know more about it as well yeah get presentation just on Bas okay I think that was it all right uh so someone introduce 6 A7 yeah we okay roll call on 686 commission reesman yes commissioner Peterson yes commissioner conel yes mayor B yes so now would you introduce 6 A7 yep the adopted millage rate represents the current year proposed aggregate millage rate of 34752 Mills per 1,000 thank you thank you Brandy okay move on to item 6B which is second reading of ordinances can someone please introduce 6b1 I'll introduce 6b1 to be read by title only an ordinance of the city of lebur Florida vacating and aband abandoning a portion of the improved rideway of 13th Street located between Center Street and West Main Street in leeburg Lake County Florida providing for conditions providing for severability and providing for an effective date approval second discussion we've already got do we need Dan to get up and and I mean this is not a yeah no so this is the the the ordinance that contemplates the closure of um 13th Street from Maine to Center um so to recap uh the concept was to um close that street because as the First Baptist Church Endeavors to buy the melon patch they will have owned all but about a 30 foot strip on 13th Street um I'll explain that in a moment um so with with the with the uh FBC just so I can be brief with the FBC now owning you know about 99.9 % of both sides of 13th Street uh they they approached us uh with the concept of owning that right of way keeping our utilities intact but to close it to have so that they have more of a more of a c a campus atmosphere for uh the prisioners and church and and for the school students as as they go to uh school there um really as a safety concern as an aesthetic concern and being that the FBC is a pretty big part of that region of downtown uh the concept makes some sense uh we had uh Mr P Andy and I'll ask you in a second uh he he uh made some comments in opposition to the closure uh the big the biggest comment that that caused the staff review of the the of the project was he had thought that 13th Street was closed it we did a double check and a triple check on that and it is indeed not closed so what we presented to you was proper and accurate um since the meeting there was a lot of discussion at first reading um and I have had opportunity to talk to Mr Eris from FBC um and there seems to be some Accord to instead of closing the street from Maine to Center we agree at this time to close it from Maine to line I think um mayor you spoke about that and part of your comments um my correspondence with the First Baptist Church as well is open to that and Andy if you would read Mr PK's letter as he requested dear Commissioners on September 9th 2024 the first reading of vacating and abandoning a portion of the improved rideway of 13th Street located between Center Street and West Main Street in lburg Lake County Florida was officially recorded I previously stated in that meeting of being against the closure of 13th Street from Center Street to Main Street my two reasons behind this opposition one at present the First Baptist Church excuse me does not own both sides of the road on 13th Street two closing the road from Center Street to line Street will not alleviate the traffic problems already in existent with First Academy for the record I'm not against the closing of 13th Street from Line Street to Main Street since I'll not be in attendance this evening I'd appreciate a public reading of my written Communication in Li of my absence William El pul thank you so with that I think we've teed up the the item for you um before you is uh whatever public comment you want yeah Mr Aris is here if you would like to hear from him um whatever public and then that would be thetion of our report I think uh I think we can do that I certainly want to have public comment on this so my my position on it would be I would welcome the closing of uh 13th from line to Maine but I am opposed to closing from Center to Main and I my concern is that we would be doing that based on the First Baptist Church's ownership of both sides of the road but when you start looking on the north side of Center Street you have a private owner who owns both sides of the road so are we going to then afford him the same same thing and if we do that then what happens to the light at Center Street 27 it's a road to nowhere right so the only thing I would just offer now before you take public hearing or public hearing or public comment is you may want there is a motion on the floor to approve the ordinance as is so you someone may want to make a motion to amend the closure so all part all parties are okay with line to well let's let's have public comment okay just don't forget to we're going if we want it change do you have any comment no I was just gonna add I fully support line to man I'm I struggled with uh the residential houses uh east of 13th and I think we agreed to to do po uh signs more posting in the neighborhood I don't I would like to know if some of those people are here U okay okay so I'll wait but I you want to go on the record there so at this point we would like to hear public comment uh art maybe if you'd like to come up first and sure um yeah Alan and I talked and understood what everybody had to say and we we understand that we think that's a reasonable thing going from from Li Street to Main Street U my only caveat is that um one of the things brought up Mr pul brought up last time is that we said that we're going to do all this stuff downtown I just want to give a little bit of color to that we had we're not neglecting the downtown but we had a couple opportunities came up that we had to do number one we were doing an 8 million development in The Villages that we had to continue doing and then we had the opportunity to buy the 40 acres by winda and so both of those kind of pul made us pull back on downtown we're still planning on doing everything everything we're still good because originally when the thing came up about melon patch and we said well that's going to create more problem we got more kids coming through there uh we'll still go forward with the acquisition of melon patch don't have a problem with that M only caveat is we're we're fine with line Street to Main Street but at some future date uh Mr P is right we made plans and we did not do the downtown that we said we were going to do he's correct about that however if we get to a point in the future where uh we own additional property there or we have a lot of kids going back and forth right now the concentration of kids is at area Line Street to Main Street there's hundreds of kids going back and forth that solves a major problem I'm just saying at some point in the future that if we really do more development then we would come back to a future city commission and say hey we need to look at that um I shared with Al when we did the kind of went around looked at all the traffic the only and there is a business would be impacted is Mr P's business but he would still have full access right off of Center Street and there's always Perkins there there's no residential impacted by that it's just the the business there but I don't want to do anything to obviously harm Mr PK's business but I would just say right now this is a good solution for right now but if we continue to grow as a church and if we continue to acquire property and if we build buildings or fields on there we may have to revisit in future it's my only caveat that I have any questions for okay is there any other public comment regarding this please come on my name is Linda Workman um my husband and I bought our house on heren Street in 1996 um we've seen a lot good and bad um we're dealing with a lot right now just on our block of herning street that we are not getting any results and of course we have the Lee adult which that's a whole another story um we as a neighborhood a lot of the people have moved we've had some that have passed away did not agree with when first Baptists wanted to close High Street we we didn't um they built the wall during that time we did hear that line Street was going to be somewhere and it's funny that you said that Mr SS that um about bringing it up later if you only do the line now then come back to do Center So High Street was closed quite a few years ago in the wall and we had heard then that line Street was in the planning I think it's ridiculous I absolutely think it's ridiculous so I go that way to work for 15 years so I have to go a different way because you're blocking I consider call me out on it that's a business I live in my neighborhood we've got elderly people we've got people that go so I have to change my routine if the school was going to be that big maybe it should have been considered you can't be that big or maybe you do need to move it somewhere else that is a small area I mean what are we going to where's it going to end and I'm really upset that some of my neighbors are not here again I've got two that are sick and I got one out of town and Kelly bless her heart who was moving and I really she sent a letter and if you all got it from our street look I don't even know how to pronounce her last name she sent one she's come all the meeting she's been very vocal about Lee but um yeah they sold their house they're getting out of the neighborhood again where does this end are you objecting to the line to main or you just expressing concern over north of BL in general closing all of it I am okay I just wasn't clear because like closing line like I said I live on hearnen so I would be going when I I'm sorry I'm a Publix girl I just moveed my 87y old dad with me I'm at Publix every other freaking day I'm over it I go hearnden I make a right on 12th I make a left on line so now I got to change my route I go to work I work in park I don't think this changes your rout that's why I'm confused that's the CL the closure will be at the South End of Line Street you will still be able to drive on line and take a proed North on 13th to Center where are they closing it then from that from that intersection of line and 13th to Main Street to the South just that portion so you cannot drive in front of the school in front of Drive in front of the church anymore they're trying to create a campus environment that's safer but no you're not impacted that's why I was confused know I drive home that day and a lot of times it is it's three ways of congestion yeah it's north south on 13 Street there will be no no more traffic on 13th to to Main Street so what would be put there a wall how do you close that we're not closing it that how do you stop traffic from going in front of the church then oh I don't think they're trying to I'll let art speak to that I don't think they're trying to stop it I think they're just trying to divert it another way I mean what do you put to keep the road will be gone oh I mean that's what okay is that okay I didn't no I think that so I didn't know that but your route to public is not impacted I just EXC your route to public from your house which was your example is not changing or being impacted just FYI did not know that all I know is when I rolled up there Thursday coming home from work I was shocked when I saw the sign that the meeting was tonight and it said Line Street and then when I went home and got online it said Center Street yeah originally in the the notice it is Center Street can you that was the original and we respect your comments and that's why we're not voting on lines of center tonight we're putting that off for some other day so line will not even be a road I mean I'm sorry 13th in front of their I let art into that I they're they're creating a campus environment is what I know which I understand yeah the effect would be to close the Public's roadway over that what First Baptist ends up doing with that would be up to them it would be their choice it would essentially revert to private property at that point so they could put up a barrier and block people from using it or do whatever they wanted to because it would become their private property essentially at that point I appreciate the information I do but again the way I feel about it I don't I just wor is it going to end you know I just don't feel it is and we've already been done wrong with Lee and everything else that's G on and I dare ask but I'll doe respect what is the pro what's your concern with Lee adult just what's going on with it I'm disgusted got to that point okay no there's been a lot of controversy on that most people are happy we knocked it down but okay okay thank you thank you um we don't know yet far we're going to do we're going to bring in somebody to help us advise with that we still have to get kids in there for preschool we still have to get kids in for adult uh we may put ballards we may put a thing but I think we're going to you know we may do some traffic but part of the thing is we had to wait to see what happened with melon patch because we may be able to do some cutting across there too um Al one thing though that I've noticed here remember we also talked about High Street because Mrs Workman brought up High Street we've already closed that one yeah and I know I'm not by a microphone but just so everybody kind of has a visual image of of what we're doing here um so this is us27 AKA 14th Street this is the Baptist Church property they essentially own everything from us27 to 13th Street from Maine to Center they have under contract now the melon patch and I think they're looking to buy the synagogue which would be the southwest corner of Center and 13th Street we're we're not in active discussions I mean we're we have a really good relationship with best Shalom when the October 7th thing happened I contacted her said hey we're here to help you with safety and everything but they they are interested at some point I think so other than the melon patch for now you scheduled the cloes the FPC is scheduled clothes on melon patch uh in December right so pretty much everything from the north side of melon patch and this parcel vertically challenged right that parcel all the way down both sides of the street FBC so the initial concept was to close all of line Street or I'm sorry all of 13th Street right the discussion was that would be a problem because of the neighborhood in this area who transverses 12th and Line Street and primarily the traffic pattern is to the north so like the the speak the earlier speaker said and the the route is go from this neighborhood to get the Publix's you know most folks go up overline up 13th over Center and then on the 27 and then into Plaza so that path doesn't change the the compromise that was discussed is the south side of line and 13th this dis closure leaving this open to the public in time past the First Baptist Church talked about different ways to close that removable ballards um those concepts are still kind of up in the air as far as how they would physically do that you know I my I imagine that this probably still would remain a street uh they probably do decorative things to it tabletops speed reduction stuff uh because their concept would be uh parsonage use or not parsonage use but the the church use and the school use and then they would probably do some type of physical closure as far as Ballard that would get added and removed based on when they wanted through traffic through that area so that planed to be determined at a later date so that that's the concept and what the what as a as you all under discussed tonight is there seems to be some agreement to close it southside of line Southside to Maine High Street came up um High Street is is probably is something where we need to go back and probably clean up um because it's Frank it's a mess yeah it is not closed but there's a section of it that's probably still used by the public abut that's still us so the way the the the looks like the the the maps read is this section of high street from us 27 to the old railroad Corridor that's the cities from railroad Corridor to the railroad Corridor that's First Baptist Church and then from the east side of the railroad Corridor back to 13th Street that becomes the city again at this time I would say there's really no practical use of High Street for the city it it doesn't serve really any kind of cut through it goes through a portion of of the the First Baptist Church's property so this ultimately does we probably need to come back and formally close that except for any you know and protect whatever utilities we have and frankly I don't know if we have any in that area so that's that's the High Street conversation and we'll need to come back and clean that up we as we dug into the closure of 13th Street is when we determine the issues with line or high so high is not closed to the public 100% of it but that Center portion is or that Center portion is still a street that's go so it's a street that goes through private property and that's not a good thing so but these but these things happen so it's it's you know it it's something we need to clean up right now how does that work with emergency vehicles do you have ballards blocking the ACC ACC to the roads that's going to be an issue that the First Baptist Church is going to have to work out as they designed that plan you know I don't think it's reasonable to ask First Responders to get out and pull up ballards out of the road to drive down there no I wouldn't think so either commissioner but that's again something that the that's going to need to go into the plan of the First Baptist Church would we have a say in that or would our police and fire department have a say in that yeah ultimately they would because whatever type of Road improvements that they do are going to have to come back through the city for permitting and then that would kick it into the DRC yeah the DRC would be reviewing that development Review Committee so that's a committee that's that's set up by the city that when we get site plans or certain applications for development we review it and that would certainly be a comment of hey you need to make a me for emergency Ingress ESS I believe fire is on the DRC so me simple answer is yes the city would have a say so and how that got developed any other public comment on this any other comments from the Commissioners we actually need I was G to make a motion to amend um1 or 6 B1 yes uh basically to uh for the closure would be from Line Street to Main Street second any other discussion on that roll call commissioner Peterson yes commissioner conel yes commissioner rean yes mayor B yes someone please introduce 6b2 we vote on the original on the original oh we got it yeah got okay so now we have an amended motion uh that's already introduced it's already introduced an amended to close so this vote is to close 13th Street from Maine to the South Side Of The Line right away correct [Music] R amending to am the motion yeah commissioner canel yes commissioner rean yes commission Peterson yes mayor bur yes sorry about that guys okay I'll introduce let's move on to 6b2 I'll introduce 6b2 to be read by title only an ordinance of the city of lebur Florida amending the city code of ordinances by amending chapter 5 Section 5-6 consumption of and open containers prohibited on public property exceptions amending section 5- 6.2 consumption of or possession of alcohol in open containers near store selling alcoholic beverages amending chapter 18 Street sidewalks and other public places providing for severability providing for conflicts Prof proving for inclusion in the Cod of ordinances and providing an effective date for approval okay okay discussion on this it so obviously this is the also known as the entertainment Zone there's a there's a map of it in the in the packet which is exstensively Magnolia to Meadow orange to Canal I believe with a little extension down to cover John soo's place there with the name of it escapes me um that that that that that's the the district um this would allow open containers in that District the only other modification that's in the plan since first reading is that this now Sun there is no Sunset so approving this means that that is the Entertainment District open container in that box uh for perpetuity or until the ordinance is modified yeah when we approved this at first we had a sunset on it so we had to look at it every year uh the commission basically at the last meeting was overall in favor of getting rid of that provision so I will flatly go along with the commissions it can be terminated by the city commission at any time so do we have any public comment on this excuse me any other commission comment roll call commissioner reesman yes commissioner Peterson yes commissioner canel yes mayor B yes okay we're going to move on to some reading of first ordinances but before we do that we're going to ask Grant to swear in anyone who's going to offer testimony yes sir thank you Mr Mayor if anybody here uh tonight is present wishing to speak on item 6 C3 or 6 C5 that would be the Lake brigh brigh Hurst uh resoning or the Blue Ridge storage resoning uh if you would please stay in raise your right hand so you could be sworn in right do you swear or affirm that all testimony you'll give tonight will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth all right thank you all Mr Mayor thank you very much so uh would someone please introduce 6 C12 and 3 I'll ENT to 6 C12 and 3 we by title only excuse me thank you 6 C1 an ordinance of the city of lebur Florida annexing certain real property consisting of approximately 28.5 plus minus Acres being generally located east of County Road 33 and south of Lake brigh Street and West of County Road 33 and south of Desert Lane lying in section three Township 21 South Range 24 East Lake County Florida provided that said property so Annex shall be liable for its proportionate share of the existing and future indebtedness of said City providing that such Annex property shall be subject to all the laws and ordinances of said city as if all such territory had been a part of the city of leeburg at the time of Passage and approval of said laws and ordinances providing that such annexed territory shall be placed in City commission District 3 and providing an effective date 6 C2 an ordinance amending the future land use map of the comprehensive plan of the city of leeburg changing the future land use map designation of certain property containing 208 5 plus minus Acres from Lake County Rural to City of elburg estate residential for property Journey located east of County Road 33 and south of Lake brigh Street West of County Road 33 and south of Desert Lane lying in section three Township 21 South Range 24 East Lake County Florida and providing an effective date 6 C3 an ordinance of the city of lebur Florida changing the zoning of approximately 28.5 plus minus Acres from Lake County a agriculture to City elburg PUD planned unit development for property Jor located east of County Road 33 and south of Lake brigh Street West of County Road 33 and south of Desert Lane as legally described in section three Township 21 South Range 24 East Lake County Florida and providing an effective date thank you uh would you come up thank you Mr Mayor Dan Miller Planning and Zoning um this evening this is an annexation large scale comp plan and rezoning on 208 plus or minus Acres on South County Road 33 um this would this is for the P purpose of allowing future development of new neighborhoods which would consist of 518 single family lots detached single family lots um on 28 .5 Acres property's generally located on the east and west sides of County Road 33 and north of Bridges Road on the far south side of leeburg the large scale comp plan request is to change future land use designation from Lake County Rural to City of leeburg estate and the rezoning is a request to amend the current zoning from Lake County a agriculture to City of leeburg PUD plan unit development under the Pud requ requirements The Proposal will consist of again 518 detached single family lots for a density of 2.48 gross units per acre there are no other uses permitted in this proposal lot sizes would be 50 and 60 foot widths with 67200 square fet of lot sizes respectively the house sizes are, 16700 Square ft under roof for each respective lot size there would be a minimum two-car garage two floor maximum height we do have design and Architectural standards called out in the Pud there is 35% open space that is required as well as two trees in each yard and uh dark sky lighting which we use in all these puds there's a Prohibition on the use of be of St Augustine grass course Bea and Bermuda are permitted there's a 25 foot landscape buffer required along the entirety of the property boundaries and a fence required along County Road 30 three Frontage that can be a either a split rail or an opaque fence and there is fencing required in the remaining areas of the development as well site access is shown on the site plan along County Road 33 that would have the applicable Excel and Dell Lanes as required by Lake County those access points do have to be Boulevard roadways which have landscape median of at least 8 ft in width and enough Lane main area to allow emergency vehicles to maneuver there is 103,000 square ft of recreational requirements which is about 2.4 Acres that's split on each side of 33 because these are essentially two separate neighborhoods um and there's a requirement for establishment of trails around the larger Retention Ponds which is also seen on the site plan uh finally there is a phasing or expiration clause which allows substantial commencement within four years or an automatic reversion to the re1 zoning District which is one unit one acre per unit I should say of course all this development if it is approved and moves eventually moves forward will have to be on city of leeburg water and wastewater so there's no Wells re septics included here at the Planning Commission meeting you will note in your agenda memo staff recommended approval however the Planning Commission recommended disapproval by a vote of 6 to1 there reasons for that recommendation for disapproval had to do with traffic housing density total number of housing units a need for uh what they felt like is need for a solid wall separating some of the nearby animal and farming operations um finally Mr Ben Hanover Mr Ben Snyder of Handover homes and Mr Andrew Macau of GI engineering are here to answer any further questions and our second reading is proposed for November 12th we have to send this right yes sir this is a large scale so it does have to go to we're not exactly sure when that'll be correct Dan I have a couple questions yes sir no go ahead um how many units is this 518 is the request 518 and you say the P andz Board disapproved that is correct and if you'll note in the agenda memo the reasons we're there but yes under the uh current zoning they have in the county what's the dens what would be the density on that generally it's um under agriculture to in the county it's something like one to five yes and how many how many acres we talking about uh 208 208 okay okay thank you sir yes sir one question I had Dan when when viewing the uh the site itself yes sir there is a uh Lake what is it Lake Thomas Road uh you know it's if you can see it it's right at the South End of the property uh yes sir okay so um that is according to the pnz minutes it's not a County Road it's what is it uh because when you look at the map it it looks like a pretty sub like somebody takes a grer to it anyway or something off the top of my head I don't remember if it's a County Road or a private road we can do the research and find out I do not remember someone who lives on it may may know for sure I I honestly don't remember Mr Mayor because I I you know in looking at it what is the access to the property to the West if it's not that road is there on the site plan there were access points here on the North and here and then I want to say another one down in this area it may actually be Lake Thomas Road because if they purchased the entire property they would be able to make that road into an entrance point right but is there an easement for the guy behind it is what I'm asking if there is not we will ensure that there is because you cannot take away someone's access so that's certainly would be on our mind um we're not going to allow a situation it would be illegal but we won't allow a situation where someone loses their other access except that when you look at the development picture of the Pud it does not account for that road at all we can fix that uh if it's necessary we we can fix that easily yeah yeah there would probably be an existing easement governing that that we could take a look at and see what it says but certainly you know make sure that the folks off to the West have have ability to get to a public road I think obviously is important so does anyone have any other questions for Dan on this this item I'm gonna assume Ben can probably he can probably answer your question up also Ben SN H Land Company 605 conal Avenue happy to answer any questions well I was just going off their comment know I'm talking about yes so what's the deal that the deal on that is uh Mr huitt built it personally as a road to get back to his CND D landfill we've met with him our plan is to have that part of the community wait to develop until he's finished filling up his CND landfill and then reorient his access but we will absolutely continue to provide access in perpetuity to his through our neighborhood whenever that uh Southside does develop uh so that he can access monitor you know whatever that property back there so it is a landfill that it's AC and D you know the construction to bre trees blocks stuff like that right yes sir but that's that's the situation I met with Mr H we being and good neighbors communicating and have a plan for it anyone have any other questions for Ben thank you sir yes sir uh public comment on this do we have any public comment please [Music] some pictures to pass out over here [Music] okay hi my name is William B Robertson I live at 23404 County Road 33 um I don't have a pointer to uh be able to show you where you have boat thank thank you very justess button on side okay um our property is right right here this whole area this area right here and we have a DED access our uh our driveway is this goes right here out to 33 um this property uh line that runs along along the entire south of phase three which is this is phase three of the proposed property right here it is uh 2,161 ft from here back here our driveway comes in and our property line like I said runs from 33 back to the USDA CIT Testing Lab back and behind here um we uh uh U are not real happy about this going here like it is right now I'm retired city of Orlando firefighter paramedic and have been around uh fires my entire career and with the density they're looking to uh that they're proposing to build here they're as close to zero lot line as you can get without being actually uh having no no lot line or no space on on on one side like zero lot line is and uh they're frame Built construction vinyl sighting uh one house catches on fire city lburg is going to be in a in a in a in a configuration is what it's going to end up being in that respect so that concerns me for for uh for the city of lburg and all the people who live there with the density they're talking about uh with 518 on on on that small of an area there but um um I'd like to tell you that uh we have 33 Acres where we are there we've lived there for 36 years um it was a dead Orange Grove many years ago when we first bought it I spent eight days out there on a front end loader um turn orange trees and and and uh and of course we built our home and everything out there in that respect and have Liv there since then um uh but as I say we want responsible development um we're in favor of development uh in that respect it wouldn't hurt a thing uh Neighbors in the area are concerned about it also because it's going to change things for us greatly if you look at at uh the first page here and and what I passed out to you that's our interest way going into our property um over on the left side of of our gate going in is the property in question that you can see there and U in our house is the driveway goes up about 900 ft and our house is up on the hill U on page number two that's a picture along that driveway and you can look along on the right side of the fence which is that's that border that border fence that runs directly back uh 2,161 ft that's the property in question where they're looking at at at building all these places of course we drive in and out and with a 25t buffer will probably be the way that they're talking about having it right now with just a split rail or uh maybe a poly fence or something like that we'll be looking in uh to uh ladies washing our dishes in the backs of all these houses along our driveway and that sort of thing in that respect um and we feel like it's going to greatly uh diminish the value of our property uh as we're uh we're raise cattle U we have cattle out there and that that sort of thing and uh and uh it's going to affect us um as far as possibly people coming over jumping over fences and things like that and uh or or their animals getting over we have problems with dogs every now and then getting over after our cattle and that sort of thing and uh not real not real happy with that uh plus a cattle operation is a dangerous operation people coming over there or kids coming over there or something along those lines uh there's a 7,000 volt electric fence going all around our property uh uh all around the fence lines and that sort of thing dangerous to to a lot of people some people with heart problems can be deadly um so um this is something that's come in all of a sudden that's uh we feel like is an invasion in our area there uh the way that it's being built without any consideration of the way properties around there uh uh are are uh are are being U being lived on now this uh page one is the entrance way going into our property page uh page two as you can see there is our driveway I just told you uh um page three is our home it's a uh it's a 4800 foot home with 832 square foot garage is a little over 55600 foot home up on the hill there um uh over uh on uh County of 33 if you drive down toward the city of of mascot there's a neighborhood down there that that is pretty much like what they're talking about building with the exception of one thing if it has an actual concrete wall all the way around the perimeter of the property it's called rer Trails on page four you can look at that and see right and rer trails if you turn to the next page go inside and you look at the density of of these places there that are just I mean they're they're 10 ft apart the houses are and uh and uh the next page is going to also show the density from a different angle in the same neighborhood there how close these places are together and it it simply doesn't fit our area and it's going to change things for us and for many of the other people who live around there in an unfavorable manner we feel like um we uh spoke with an attorney uh and she told us that we need to demand that they put a if they're going to go ahead and and do this that y'all are going to pass this even though Planning and Zoning turn it down 6 to one turn it down if y'all decide to go ahead and pass this and let this happen here we're going to have all these places right there uh right next to us that we're going to have to be looking at or be exposed to along with the other people who are here tonight that would probably like to speak also and what we need to have if they're going to do this is a solid concrete wall much like the villages has I know that uh we talked about that in the planning zoning meeting and their spokesperson said that people consider to be a concrete block wall like living in a prison well the most uh popular homes in The Villages are veronda homes which have concrete around them concrete block walls around them and they really like that because it's safe for their pets and all that sort of thing like that so U hard hard to imagine prison but um at any rate um uh like I said we're concerned about liability liability as far as that goes too uh we have a very dangerous Bo that uh he's find when he's inside of his uh electric fence but if somebody decides to come over and decide to do any cow tipping or anything like that they're going to be in big trouble um okay let's see here um um I believe that's probably about all that I've got uh for you um possibly my wife or my son might like to come up and say a few other things but um uh but please uh out of respect for Planning and Zoning they surely didn't like it uh they said that they regret a lot of the smaller properties that uh that they have approved with these 50 and 60 foot lots and uh and for a place like this out here uh if it were larger Lots uh and and maybe one acre lot per home or something along those lines or maybe a little more like the ranches has up off of 565 uh they' be million doll homes uh but if that's the case so be it uh instead of these other homes that don't really fit the area at all thank you thank you sir other public comment good evening my name is Tyler Robertson I'm the son of uh parents right over here my father who just spoke I grew up at 23404 County Road 33 um I grew up in leeburg went to leberg high school um lived in Lake County most of my life but just recently moved to sunber County if you'll let me speak um about this issue um basically my father laid out most of the arguments here as to what the issues are with this development and primary concern here is that with the development going in and there not being u a mandate or requirement to the for the developer to have to put in a continuous a continuous wall from floor all the way up to at least 6 feet as opposed to some split rail that what they're currently being or what they're proposing that they would do that this would go about the development in a way that um develops it in not not very responsible way because responsible development needs to be development that goes about it in a way that uh doesn't impinge upon or infringe upon um the surrounding property owners and cause them to incur property devaluation or expose them to liability or risk and of course like my father said you know somebody who can easily go right through a split rail fence you know as opposed to a concrete uh barrier wall um they can come into contact with cattle um come into contact with other livestock not just on my parents property but the and um basically you know that's part of owning property in a home is that somebody who could if they even make their way to your property and they get injured somehow uh then the possibility of them suing your homeowners insurance um becomes something that is now opened up to get them um compensated essentially so I just think that um the Planning and Zoning Board has already disagreed with this uh the way it is and uh we're not against development uh we would just like to see development gone about in a way that ensures that there's responsibility there's responsible development that happens I'm a firefighter paramedic for Lando fire department like my father I was a firefighter or he was a firefighter and um you know I I used to work for The Village's fire department and so I know what responsible development looks like working in living or working in The Villages and I work down in Lake noo Tavis dos Tavis dos development down there building Lake Dona so I've seen these two different developers go about development in responsible ways and both of those areas have continuous walls from floor all the way up 5 six fet tall walls and um something that the developer uh said at the planning zoning meeting was that well we wouldn't want to do something like that because doing that putting up a wall like that makes people feel like they're in prison like my father said in the Villages most popular home being sold people look for is one that has that so it's kind of a little bit disingenuous something else here um that I see as a red flag is that um Builder representative was at the plenty and Zoning meeting and when asked about um you know basically uh how much the homes like a range of what the homes these homes that are going in are going to go for they expected and the representative from the Builder said that basically they didn't know now obviously anyone who's dealing with the development of this size you know building 518 homes on a parcel this big is going to go about it in is going to first thing they're going to do is find out if it's going to be profitable they're going to find out if the investment and development is going to be feasible to invest this much money how much money they're going to get out of the whole project so the fact that they're not being forthright or forthcoming with oh well well here's our expected range of what the homes are going to go for and so basically that to me shows that there may be some lack of forthrightness um essentially to try to get it pasted and uh so these are concerns and um essentially that's all I have to say thank you very much thank you sir you come back up or I have a question for for Ben whenever you get a chance we'll go ahead and have my name is Gerald Robinson I live at 3520 Desert Lane if you look on the map there where it says Desert Lane the end is at the North West corner of my property I own that corner piece bordering actually two sides of this development like the other gentleman said we're not opposed to development like I told my wife development's going to come what we're opposed to is the density of the development they're putting uh come out to 4.25 homes per acre I believe what was revealed in the uh Planning and Zoning meeting uh that's too dense if you look at all of the properties surrounding that you see a lot of open place no trees that kind of stuff I've been in uh a field that deals with construction for 40 years and as that property on the west side of 33 gets developed all those big oak oak trees will probably be um bulldozed down very much like uh the lake denim Estates it was a nice treed property you can go in there now and it's the little planted ones to to get it uh approved for a CER ific of occupancy I've lived out there for 33 years now and when they do their environmental study they're going to dig up a couple gopher turtles yep we relocated we're done well there's a lot more animals out there than than it's realized I've seen Bobcats um indigo snakes um other Wildlife well as soon as that starts getting developed you know they're going to be pushed somewhere else um as we said earlier it's you know a lot of times it's not about the dollar it's about the community well we're a community out there also and we should have some input on what our community is going to look like um with that many homes going in in that area and that concentration of people figure there's two people in each home at a minimum there may be some singles but anyway um you're plopping in a thousand people in that area right behind our houses um you can pretty much see the statistics is going to show that crime's going to go up noise is going to go up traffic is going to go way up I had to change my work hours when I was working in order to get to work on time I sat at my driveway on Desert Lane and counted 18 Rock trucks before I could get out on 33 and then of course the economic boom dropped off and it slowed down but now it's because of the villages and construction down on South 33 tracking traffic is horrible again um I ride a motorcycle but not as much as I'd like to because because of the traffic growing in that area um with the develop is going to come a lot of things that's going to affect us and there's a bus stop right at Desert Lane that's going to be on top of a blind Hill with three entrances and you know it's that's part of our community too you know we don't want to have school buses hit by cars because people's not paying attention that kind of stuff and uh I think that the density that they're suggesting is going to have have a negative effect on all of the houses around there thank you sir come on up Sir have you got a PO still should be anybody I I see it oh I'm James Rebels um I live on 3430 Desert Lane and let me see see right there and this fence line here joins my fence I own this 5 acres and I own this 5 Acres I got about a little over 10 slum acres in there okay right here when this gentleman was talking about Desert Lane right here about 6 700 ft back this way this is 33 okay it's a blind Hill and like he said traffic comes over that Hill 55 60 and 70 mph there's a school bus last week I noticed that had pulled over on the grass right there and was talking to a lady that um her little grandchild I would assume and he was pointing back down here at this road here and I assumed he was trying to tell her she needs to take her child down there what I'm thinking I might be wrong I'm only speculating okay now y'all was talking about these roads earlier hear who maintains these roads okay well Desert Lane right here this road here is maintained by the people who lives on it it's Ingress and egress okay most of these roads back in here are Royal Roads just Royal back in there I might be saying it wrong okay and so what it is here my family's got a little history here the USDA over here here um ever since I was a kid I was told my family owned it that's the US agricultural research on Bridges Road so my family has a history my grandfather was born in 1913 so we've been there what1 years from there back to okah in this area in here back towards h a little bit okay okay right here in 33 my grandfather told me a story when he was a little boy right here is a low in the road okay he told me that um when he was a little boy they went to school in okah humka down there and there's historical School in Noah there's actually another one okay and he said that yeah he said the school bus would stop pick up the kids but the big kids couldn't ride on the school bus because the mule and wagon couldn't tote the loading only small kids rode on so right here in the middle of 33 right here he had stood somewhere along in here cuz there's a marshall this side and it the Old Creek runs back on the back side in here okay he said he stood in the middle of the road right there and no wagon ruts and catching fish okay right here where Desert Lane is this area has got a um a history for sink holes okay right here is a sinkhole right where I'm pointing and it's a big sinkhole big enough to put a house in a swaller it's big down here on the edge of the lake down here back in the '90s I seen another one fall in right there probably about as about as big as a hood of a truck and and I couldn't see the bottom of it because like I said my family's been here a long time and I know this area this area in here from an aerial view where they talk about it is right here it's like a micro environment this environment right here since I lived here there's I countless go for tortoises I've seen gopher tortoises as big as a quar in their shells has got a yellowish tent on it okay so I live here so I know they're all in here I've seen flying squirrels fox squirrels and all these are federally protected most of them I've seen two species of bobcats wild turkeys and wild hogs in my back fish line right there what it is over here since this ain't developed I've soon is some kind of breeding ground from an aerial view all this land around it is sparse if you notice this is heavily wooded us being old arms Grove at one time a grapefruit block okay right here this road to the Landfield is where y'all were talking this is asphalt it's a narrow asphalt road hu Landfield back in here and this is a construction Landfield CL three I would say okay I was told here by a guy cuz I'm into Roofing construction that hu is going to reopen that landfill okay now since you got 200 plus acres here with 518 homes you're talking better than a th000 plus people condensed on 200 Acres at 10 fet apart I'd say I don't know the right numbers okay now these trucks right here are going to be traveling this road right through the bottom heart of this thing and there going to be a lot of children in here okay what will happen here is that when they open this landfill back up and they run through here there's going to be children playing what's going to happen some of these children could get out that little road and they're going to be killed now we're in this meeting I'm talking about it so what would probably happen they go well um about the meeting I and I would say if I'm ever asked I said listen I stood up on this Podium and I expressed that point okay for sake of the kids now back to the houses back to the sinkhole right here since the ground is unstable no one knows when or how sinko will ever fall in you just don't know it happened in the villages in one section now okay you put houses that close together with that magnitude of weight on the earth when it already shows history of sinkhole you're asking for a problem you're asking for people to be slaughtered up like that man did suck through the floor of that house that concrete floor it's all over news and the relative was trying to save him hear him screaming they could never get him out and they fenced it in and over in our Landa somewhere I'd say okay this is a deadly area deadly okay because it's showing signs of it now sir I'm not against building it's been well over three minutes and out of respect for everyone's time if we could close and finish up okay then thank you I mean I could tell you more all right thank you okay I'm going to be I'm going to be quick because my husband and son has are are spoken I am Karen Robertson and my address is 2344 C 33 grelin Florida um the only three things I want to say is our attorney advises it's unfair to have this liability pushed on to us because we want to see a real estate attorney to get advice you know because this is this is where where our wealth is this is all that we own that's our wealth um one thing I'm concerned about is we have a six 6 6ot driveway um coming in and we have to look at the backs of all these houses that are 50 and and on our side it's only 50 ft they have some there 60 that's on the other side 50 50 50 50 50 as we're driving in and driving out the other thing is um the Builder representative at the plan Zing meeting he mentioned he didn't know what price they're going to be well I talked to Dan Miller prior to that he said the low 300s so I'm assum ass uming 325 so you take 325,000 time 518 homes is 168 million $350,000 I think they can afford a while thank you any other public comment come back question with regards to the wall have is there any thought process of building a wall uh our neighborhood hoods generally don't have walls around them we've never been requested to have a wall the landscape buffer a requirement of the city it's been well received within the city and our developments and others so we don't see any need to incorporate a wall at this time good any other questions I I guess I'm speaking to the residents who spoke and been uh I'm not crazy about walls uh if I was there I would want a landscape buffer I don't know if there's fol I don't know what these folks think I don't want to speak on their behalf but is there to make them happy with some a slightly wider buffer or heavy landscaping I mean it's already heavy landscaping I mean it's I'm I'm trying to block their view entirely with landscaping that's my view if is is there a way to block it with Landscaping versus a wall and and make them happy it's just an idea um I'm not asking you to commit tonight and we have another reading on it I don't know if you could talk with them and see if you can find some compromise any other questions I have just a few things I just want to rec cap not not for you D I want to recap um based on the present zoning the county this piece of property would only be allowed to have 43 units they're asking for 518 I mean talking about a tremendous amount of difference between what the county would allow and what they're asking us 43 to 518 again going back onto a two-lane road being funneled down to probably the worst intersection in leeburg at 3348 and 470 and we're adding we would be adding another 518 units to that intersection craziness to make matters worth it butts up to a landfill and our plane and Zoning said they voted against it 6 to1 now I know we're not voting tonight but I would like for everybody to take these facts in consideration when this does come back up up 43 to 518 landfills two lane roads terrible intersections P andz there their recommendation thank you any other comments all right motion to transmit this to the state for review second we need a roll call roll call commissioner Peterson yes commissioner canel to transmit no you don't want to transmit it to no I don't want to I to stop right down okay commissioner Ean yes mayor B yes all right someone please introduce uh item 6 c45 and six I'll introduce 6 c45 and six to be read by title only 6 C4 an ordinance of the city of leeburg Florida annexing certain real property consisting of approximately 10.02 plus minus Acres being generally located west of US Highway 27 and north of El Presidente Boulevard lying in section 25 Township 20 South Range 24 East Lake County Florida provided that set property so anex shall be liable for its proportionate share of the existing and future indebtedness of s City provided that such annexed property shall be subject to all laws and ordinances of said city as if all such territory had been a part of the city of leeburg at the time of Passage and approval of said laws and ordinances providing that such Annex territory shall be placed in City commission District 3 and providing an effective date 6 C5 an ordinance amending the future land use map of the comprehensive plan of the city of lebur changing the future land use map designation of certain property containing 10.02 plus minus Acres from Lake County Urban low density to City leeburg General commercial for property gener located west of US Highway 27 and north of El Presidente Boulevard lying in section 25 Town tip 20 South Range 24 East Lake County Florida and providing an effective date 6 C6 an ordinance of the City leeburg Florida changing the zoning on approximately 10.02 plus minus Acres from Lake County PUD plan unit development to leeburg PUD planed unit development to allow a self-service storage facility for property generally located west of US Highway 27 and north of el presidenti Boulevard lying in section 25 Township 20 South Range 24 East Lake County Florida and providing an effective date Dan would you please come up and give us a synopsis thank you thank you Mr Mayor this is a proposal for an annexation comp plan and resoning for a much smaller project 10.02 Acres generally located on the west side of us27 south of town just north of El Presidente Boulevard which is near the Spanish village neighborhood if you're going south on 27 it's on the right um there's El Presidente and then the the uh Plantation sub division down there as well in that general direction um this request would allow for many warehouse and storage uses um the the small scale comp plan request is a change of future land use designation from County Urban low to City of leeburg General commercial and on the rezoning to change that zoning from County PUD to City uh Spud which is small plan unit development under the requirements of the Pud it's uh indoor self storage and outdoor self storage and then it allows one apartment for uh a manager security type development uh this it in any time well this is going to be under the Pud requirements um where it's not governed by the Pud we' simply use the C3 Highway commercial standards for the property we did require dark sky lighting there are large setbacks 50 on the front and rear 20 on the sides do have plenty of open space requirements 35% % landscape buffer and a and a fence a nonopaque fence is required which there's fencing up on the property what we're trying to say is the existing fenes fencing is fine three floor maximum height there are architectural standards required uh site access would be along us27 and Lake County did not indicate any specific Road improvements would be necessary uh again it would be on City Water and Wastewater it's 10 acres and attorney JB Bickel is is here to represent the project if you have any further questions uh one question I did have Dan yes sir how much concrete parking lot you know of the 10 acres how much of it is going to be uh you know the development two and a half of it you is right right in this Southeastern area a large portion of this property on the west is Wetlands so it creates a natural buffer going back here and some buffering to the South as well the property line ends right down here so really the the only true developable area is right along the the the US 27 roadway as to specific acreage of the 10 it's only a couple it's not that much I don't know the exact numbers I can look that up and calculation the rest of it is Sir because it is wet sir the this this entire tree just almost the entire treed area is wet right so we'll hear from the petitioner JB bam 17032 Johns Lake jve wi Garden um we don't have a lot to add unless the commission's got questions um the the building is about an acre and we've got about 25 ft around for uh parking and access so you're talking about 1.4 acres I don't know the number off the top of my head and we certainly get that back to you if you want want it but um as Dan said the majority of it is Wetlands we've only got a portion of the Upland property and that's offset by the power line easements that we can't use on the Northern side um we expect the building cost we haven't had estimates yet we expect the building cost to be somewh between $40 and $70 a square foot which puts you somewhere in the $5 to $9 million range um anticipated employee count is somewhere between three and five depending on maintenance and those kind of things requirements as we move forward but answer any questions you might have my my only concern uh looking at it was how much Wetland uh is there any mitigation that you're going to have to we're not we're not impacting the wetlands at all okay and we've got we've got the only thing we've got that's even potentially close to that is the drainage ponds and they aren't even in the wetlands we're back from the wetlands barrier because we have a w setback to De feat any other questions for the petitioner any public comment on this all right so we have a second reading October 28th that'll be October 28th All right so let's move on to 6 C7 I'll introduce 6 C7 to be read by title only an ordinance of the City leeburg Florida creating section 2-8 of the city's code of ordinances entitled control of access to city-owned controlled and leased property establish in a process to designate facilities as public forums limited public forums or non-public forums establishing trespass notice for public property providing for severability providing for conflicts providing for codification and providing for an effective date we have a second reading on this uh 10:14 it'll be 1014 are there any questions anyone wants to bring up with us comments I think there was some public comments that said they wanted to speak when they talked to me so I don't know if any public people want to speak regarding that was going to be on item eight or item seven I let I mean we can ask is there any public comment on this [Music] item I guess I get to be the first of many hopefully uh Dena Simpson Renew Day Spa 214 West Main Street I want to thank you for allowing us to be able to speak in regards to this um first of all I get the fact that there's a timer up there and you know that this is not the first time that I've had to speak in regards to things going on in the city I think the timer should be set for everybody and and myself included even this time um we've owned the business for seven years and since the day that we've opened the business we've had problems with homeless on our front porch I've originally when it was Jay Scott's building there was a big barrier in the front there and it was strongly suggested for us to turn around and take that down I regret the fact that I've taken that down now to be honest with you because it helped protect the front of that building and protect property um I can tell you a story will not go very long however a couple years ago I pulled up to my business at about 7:30 in the morning and found a homeless man in the back who was half clothed and at that time I did not feel safe and I called the police um and I went into my business and locked myself into my business I asked the police to not tell the homeless person as to who it was who called the police on them two police officers showed up one to the front of my business one to the back to deal with him and they proceeded to radio back and forth with one another which I'm sure that they knew that they had to do um only to find out that the man the homeless man had a um hand written no giving him permission to be there when there had been a no trespass on the buildings on that entire block for well over three or four years um he was warned um and needed to get clothes on and I was concerned with staff members as well as myself as well as Beacon students who were walking up the street going to school as to what was this man's intentions as to why he was half clothed he was only clothed from the waist up um I did not feel safe at that time I went for my concealed weapons and I've continued to keep my concealed weapons and go target shoot and all that for my own safety thank goodness knock on would I have not had to use that nor do I want to turn around and use that approximately 6 months later after that incident I had a problem getting into my back door of my business didn't quite understand as to why I was having a problem because the property owner had not done anything to my lock only to find out through after hiring a locksmith that my back door was um super glued my lock was super glued and uh after putting up cameras at my cost and a light at my cost which within 24 and 48 Hours both nights those lights and cameras were both ripped down that same gentleman was found um at the time Travis Whitley had found him in the um Town Square with my camera and had tried to ditch his backpack along with drugs BL La he was arrested and went to court I was notified less than 24 hours before his court date and was in informed that I did not have to nor did I they want me to go to his court date he was released and he is now continually to walk the streets and I've continually have had problems at my business I have had an order of protection against this man for my business as well as my family my daughter when she worked at the city pool could not walk to the pool nor ride ride her bike to the pool because he knew who she was who she was linked to and the business she was linked to and would constantly harass just say rude comments whatever he could possibly turn around and do this is not something that is unheard of downtown um my husband will get up and speak as well but this man is still downtown I still continue to carry I don't know if he's the one who's still continually vandalizing my property but we have had multiple people multiple times vandalize our property they've defecated on my front porch I've had homeless men during the day during business pass out on my front porch this should not be a problem that a business owner has to have it's hard enough to make money and to get that staff to come in and want to turn around and make money for you and have those clients those same clients that come to the Villages guess what they go to my Villages property now because they don't want to turn around and they don't want to deal with that nonsense thank you very much thank you good evening Tim Simpson R New Day Spa oops I knocked that out sorry about that um you know just to piggy back on what my wife said I mean clearly you know we have a problem you know um we continually talk to our staff about we're in a problem solving business and I applaud you guys for looking at this and trying to find an answer and I will admit I'm sure I don't know all the details legally at um the local level up to state level however However the fact is we have a problem former Chief Hicks Chief iosi they've been very instrumental in helping us navigate some of these Muddy Waters um but it continues to be a problem you know on March 17th March 25th 17 we opened up and it's been a pleasant experience being here however in those seven and a half years as my wife said I've had a woman urinate on my front porch I've had a chair stolen I've had three cameras stolen to the point now that I have to look for a more secure solution that is going to cost me upwards of $1,500 and I'm sure the city is not going to give me money to do this I mean it's very frustrating that I can't go buy $80 camera that's a blank camera look out on my phone that I've had three of them stolen from my front porch um it continues to be a problem um I think we really need to look at it some of these people continue to vandalize the street I get it homelessness is a problem however I will say my daughter formerly lived in Del re Beach we go on Atlantic Avenue and I don't know if it's a fact you buy a $50 hamburger there is not a major homeless issue on Atlantic Avenue which is their Main Street down there they find a way to get it done and I think we need to continue to work and try and find a solution to this problem I think some of these people need to be expelled from the city I get live streamers here I get a lot of the people being Baker acted are dumped here but I will say one of our famous famous ladies that walks up and down the street speaks at very high volumes most people know who I'm speaking about she continues to live here she's been shipped out she's been shipped back you know I mean heck I feel like I'm might as well live at the Mexican border at this point I mean you know it's not much different so I would love to hear from the city what we can do about this problem and what the cops can do I mean chief fix you know I mean personally answered a lot of my calls when we had an issue I don't know why we can't have a polican patrol the streets on a timely manner if they're doing in other neighborhoods why are you neglecting downtown and having a police officer come downtown and periodically Patrol the streets to the point that I would have to look at my camera it would Buzz I would have to call the city for my non- trespassing order and say can you please go look at the person on my front step who most likely was gone by the time they got there just a waste of time on our part the uh police officer part and I don't know why we can't have someone that just continually patrols the area up and down you know we hear all these developers wanting to do great things for the city if we don't have businesses that can't survive and thrive you know it doesn't matter what they want to do because they're not going to come down appreciate your time thank you hi my name is Penny castano I live at uh 2225 angel fish Loop in leeburg I'm new to the area you're trying to get new businesses and people to come in and you're worried about parking people don't want to come here if they're being approached by homeless people all over town you want to bring people in here while there's people sitting in the Parks taking up time it smells like urine in the parking lots we do have I'm from the Philadelphia area and I see exactly what's going to happen from where I lived before you're not addressing the people they may have mental health issues let's get them help and get them where they need to be rather than being sleeping in our streets I don't want to go and go to Blue Island or go to the day baseball and walk by it and smell urine that's not an appealing sight how about you put the money towards uh power washing the the where the Hopeless people are because you're trying to get rid of them but the smell and everything still lingers there so get them help rather than no offense worrying about the parking and getting back to the the little the area that's for sale why wouldn't you offer that to be in college for their students as a as a Housing Development that my opinion I'm sorry that's just my opinion I appreciate your time thank you thank you good afternoon Felicia Stewart with hope to Restoration so I'm here definitely to talk about the homeless situation I know there is a time actually from the Groveland area so the South Lake area and actually a part of the pnz just came off after four years so I appreciate everything that you guys are doing I do want to say I totally understand what all of these business owners is saying I personally you're looking at someone who is a former homeless individual 20 some years ago I moved to Orlando Florida being homeless leaving a domestic violent relationship I was shot stabbed and left for dead in North Carolina I moved down to Orlando Florida and I was homeless I was a working parent and I had a car but I was stereotyped so every time I walked into a facility or every time I went somewhere it was like oh that Homeless lady she must be on drugs or she must be an alcoholic and so some times homelessness do get a bad name I wrote a book called homelessness Through The Eyes I called a homeless genius looking at homeless in a different way that Homeless genius was my father who died on the Streets of Philadelphia as a absolute genius and as a running running for mayor in two different states I'm coming to you to find out what can we do as a city as the city of leeburg my business is at 2501 West Main Street sweet 106 it's called hope to Restoration give me people the hope to be restored and trying to restore them back into acclimated back into society and giving the right everybody does not want to be homeless there are some people out here that don't want to be on drugs there are some people out here that are not on drugs I wasn't but when you walked into a facil in you say I'm homeless with my four children 26 years ago which all of my children are grown and gone and successful and thank God I am successful as well when you walk into a facility and you say homelessness there's a stereotype so I am coming to you asking I went to the or the the I am a dog lover a animal lover all of that but a couple of years ago when I was my organization was in tarious we spent from what I was told $7.4 million on an animal shelter but yet we do not have any shelter no transitional facilities anything to transition these people into to actually help them to restore and get back up on their feet what are we doing to try to help them instead of criticizing instead of saying they're urinated they throwing up we've put them in live stream they're getting out they're doing this what are we doing to take the steps to try to help them get back up on their feet those who want help I have a statistic and I have a plan that I have been working on and right now my statistics of success is 32% you can look on my page you go my website all of that hope to Restoration and it shows that they are actually becoming successful I had a gentleman walk in my office didn't even know how to tie a tie he now is a homeowner he now has a car he now has two jobs so what are we doing are we just standing back saying get away from my property not in my backyard not on my front porch or are we actually getting together with organizations trying to find some type of success rate or trying to find some type of building to put them into and organizations like myself who I don't have the funding to do it we can't get the grant funding to do it or anything like that but would love to have a facility to help walk these people to the point of restoration again Felicia St hope to Restoration if you guys would like to talk to me I would love to talk to you about the problem thank you any other public comment uh James Hopkin I'll keep it short sweet and fix this microphone hopefully um what she's talking about is exactly I think and I've had actually a meeting with Chief AI Rob Hicks and uh city manager Al Min Al Menor just a week ago about the a specific issue and what she's talking about is exactly right there there are the ones and the people that are homeless that want to get help and and I think that through private entity and through some state funded things live stream being one of them um the First Baptist Church being has a large um that the Salvation Army there's a lot of opportunities for people that don't want to be homeless um to get off the street what what I think a lot of the business owners are concerned with are the Perpetual people that have been here for that the street in downtown lebur is their home um we deal with some of the same people that that Dena and Tim were talking about um we've had a purse stolen from one of our servers we've had uh our second week of being open we had a homeless guy come in sit down refuse to leave uh I was actually at Jag calling the PA announcement and I get a call from my wife says hey I I I think you're going to have to come over here because I can't get this guy to leave our restaurant by the time I get there we had a line out the door second week open and he's spitting on people as he leaves he's a known perpetual downtown person that has been trespassed from just about everywhere downtown we have a trespass order that I think part of the solution um is for us as business owners to come when these things come up in these forms continue to to to keep this at the Forefront of the commission's mind um there's a lot of legalities that go into this and there's a lot of things I know that's part of what you guys are going to get to the next uh here um is putting some some order to what the state and what the governor has allowed you guys to do and I appreciate and commend and and would ask that you guys would approve that that next uh ordinance uh I know it's first reading or second reading so I I would appre appreciate that it would that that would be taken consideration and be passed uh as quickly as possible so that come October 1 um we can give the police as much of their ability that they can do within the law to um enforce um what they can in our downtown area and uh I thank you guys thank you [Music] la8 Ward 712 West Main Street most of the time I come before you guys or I come with some kind of solution because that's how it was raised my solution to this once we read through this I know there's a way to get there we need officers downtown so getting the funding to keep them downtown move them along it will fit and fix quite a bit whether it's the parking which I know everybody gets say but I hear it every day and the homeless I've worked twist some of the ones that are on my end and I just look I know the game I've been there move it along you know someplace else not having someplace else to take them I understand that so it is a little bit of a conundrum but my solution is to get us law enforcement downtown let's find the funding and get them downtown because that's a simple when they're there there we don't have the problems activity breeds activity and having support but the police department is I think the solution thank you any other public comment any question roll call actually this the first reading yeah so when was when are we having October 14th October 14th will be the second reading okay so would someone please introduce 6 C8 I'll introduce 6 C8 to be by title only an ordinance of the city of leeburg Florida amending chapter 15 article one General offenses to create section 15-7 entitled public camping or sleeping prohibiting unauthorized camping at any time within the city providing for severability providing for conflicts providing for codification and providing for an effective date so uh I guess I'll kick this off a little bit um we uh the State of Florida has a new law and I don't know if everybody's aware that goes into effect October the 1st uh you can find it uh in the Florida Statutes it's Florida statute 125 uh. 0231 and it regards public camping uh and basically addresses the homeless issue um I would ask Grant so I don't mess it up uh if you could give us just a quick synopsis of what what that statute uh says that we must do yes sir my microphone on here yes sir um so basically what what this law does is it prohibits a city or a County from allowing any person to regularly engage in public camping or public sleeping um and so that would cover private property including uh sidewalks and parks and all of that um but basically if somebody is regularly engaging in public camping or public sleeping as the ordinance defines it which is pretty vague as far as um you know if somebody's asleep on a par bench at 3: in the morning and it would seem that they're sleeping in public whether they're regularly sleeping in public you know is a little bit uh unclear uh so there's some questions I guess as far as some of the mechanics but the general the general theme is cities and counties cannot allow public camping or public sleeping to happen um the only way that they could allow that to happen would be if a county establishes a public Campground site essentially uh if it's in a municipality it would be a joint operation between the city the city would have to approve it um but the county could set up one of these campsites they would have to get it approved by DCF so they would have to apply to Department of Children and Families with the state get a certification from them um that there were not enough beds in the county and then they could set up one of these campsites uh somewhere in town they would have to set up patrols and some facilities and structures in there so it' be somewhat expensive um to set that type of thing up uh so uh the the long and short is cities and counties will not be allowed to permit public camping or public sleeping to occur anymore and um if that does occur then the city could be sued so that's essentially the mechanism that's in place so the state did not exactly Outlaw public camping or public sleeping they just sort of outlawed the cities and counties from allowing it to happen and have subjected the cities and counties to civil lawsuit if it does happen so what what we have here is essentially an ordinance that mirrors what the state statute is in terms of prohibiting public camping and public sleeping what we had just gone over in the prior ordinance was a public facilities and trespassing ordinance so this would essentially set up a process for law enforcement to address the situation and ensure that the city is compliant with state law and um so this will give law enforcement some tools to use um because currently there's not anything on the books in the city that addresses this issue there is in the county but not in the city um so this will set up sort of a Prohibition on that type of activity in the city and give law enforcement some tools rules to uh ensure that that code is followed once it's in place dur regularly regularly that's all we got exact word that's all we got if please don't speak from the a you know come to the the rule says regularly so that is defined as uh somewhere along sometimes yeah you know it's a very vague interpretation I think it's you know there's some some discretion there that's probably given to law enforcement to an extent to determine what would regularly be in their eyes you know what would a judge say regularly is we don't know the answers to what that means at this point um it'll all be fleshed out down the road you know somebody is uh trespassed and arrested after two times of sleeping on a bench and they challenge it and a Court decides that that was regularly then you know that that's what it is now um but we don't really know what that means um without further definition or interpretation from the courts on what that what that duration means and what the what the the ruling ALS o says is that uh you know first you've got to fill up your homeless beds that are available in your county so take a guess at how many homeless beds we have in Lake County zero that's none so we cannot ship them to a facility that accepts homeless you know there's no beds available so if a campground can be established the campground number one cannot be con uh contiguous with a piece of property that is used for residential purposes or that is been zoned for residential purposes uh it also uh says uh that um the piece of property that you're making into a camp cannot decrease the property value of anybody's property that it may be around so functionally in a city like ours there is no property for us to establish that camp there is nothing that meets that criteria so it's it's for us and for just about everybody it's kind of an impossibility so you know having the camp and even if you set up the camp then you've got to provide Mental Health Services uh you have to have clean restrooms you have to make sure that people are safe so you're going to have to you know the list goes on and on that makes it very difficult for us to meet the needs that are out there with the way the law is written we've got to enforce the law and the the law says we cannot allow people to regularly camp in public property and that's what we are trying to address can I ask a question about camping so there are two sets of two groups of religious people who sit in the same seats in the same place every day all day long my question is that is that also considered camping no they sit in but they sit in the same place in in the park and they sit on the Park Bench so they're there all day long taking up that space so that's okay I would I'm not that's my question like when you say Camp you're not being specific we're talking about sleeping the the actual law includes things like tents uh cardboard that was my question like when we say camping because I don't always feel comfortable with the individuals being in that spot all the time I understand but camping is as defined in this statute well was that was my question is uh it includes tents sleeping apparels uh sleeping bags anything that would indicate to an officer that the person is intent on sleeping there that night okay that's exactly right if you look at in in the agenda package in the ordinance that's in the package it has a definition of public camping and sleeping in the ordinance that was pulled from the statute so if you look at that and it it talks just as the mayor was saying talks about kind of evidence by sleeping bags or tents or materials that would sort of indicate more of a permanent yes ma'am Jimmy made me get up um Grant I know we've had the legal e side of this and not to put Captain Joe on a spot but is there something that you can help us as business owners with trying help this problem in the short medium and long term because I don't know what to do at this point I mean beside calling these guys and saying oh I've got no trespass order and I've heard you read it both of you guys I get it you know I got a little legal background but I mean what can we do as business owners to work with you and your team so that we can try and get this problem solved come on [Music] up well certainly anytime that there's criminal activity call us and I I think we've you know been pretty responsive to those issues as they've occurred in the downtown area and elsewhere within the City I would say this isn't a problem unique to downtown but obviously with the businesses that are downtown it gets recognized more prevalently um certainly we'll respond to that we can do trespass authorization letters which you're already aware of um again I think it's being described you know that there still isn't a lot that's going to change as a result of this this statute that's coming down I mean that's just the fact of the matter they are abundant resources for people uh and in bad shape and uh you know we tend to get a disproportionate amount of people in this town as a result of that we will continue to provide the same level of service that we are allowed to by law constitutionally uh to keep us from lawsuits with the ACLU and other um entities that um you know watch out for for people that might be uh harshly treated by law enforcement and a community so that's what we'll do thank you Jee any other the public comment my last and and Mr Mayor I I just want to make sure is it safe to say that you're saying that in the city of leeburg or basically in Lake County I guess that this problem is not a solvable problem Oh I no I'm not saying that it's not solvable what I'm saying is the way this law is written if you read the law the law says that the county can establish a camp because we don't have the beds the B beds don't exist okay so the county can establish a camp or the county and a city together can establish a camp that camp would have to look much like a state park you would have to provide showers and you know for I mean not exactly but in too it's got to be patrolled and right and all that you have to offer the mental health services and there's some other type of services uh has to be fenced yeah it's you know it's a lot there's a lot to it it has to be regulated by uh the Department of Children and Families okay so it has to meet all that criteria it's right you know read it because I you know I've read it many times but I maybe you know not exactly right on it so in our case the way the law is written is that we can be held responsible for not yes sir not doing that yes sir and you know I don't you know this is not a personal you know it's our job to follow the law and this is the law that starts October 1st so we are establishing how the city of bburg is going to follow the law and by no means I'm a business owner outside of the nonprofit you know uh organization as well but just trying to get a solution to the problem and again you know we have so many buildings that are being purchased for other things again like I say don't want the Humane Society to come after me because I am a dog lover you know animal lover but however I notice so many abandoned hotels on 27 and 441 you know and things of that nature in which you know if again govern properly you know and I'm I'm I'm going to try to go after them of course you know private Private Industry can do that okay us We cannot put that camp by a residential Community We cannot put that camp in an area where a residential Community is even planned got we you know we are limited such that the property that is the city of leeburg proper there there's not places that meet the criteria for us to even address having a camp absolutely to do that absolutely and understandable I just you we want to I want to respect of course like I say a business owner you want to respect the business owners because there are some you know rid some people out there that are not so nice and doing crazy things and should be trespassed and should not be you know making their business you know come down but however there are some that are wanting help that are sleeping in cars with their children and sleeping you know things like of that nature so if the car is properly registered the car is an exception um if you are in a vehicle it's properly registered and mared in in an appropriate proper SP spot then you can still sleep in a car you sleep in your car okay this does not address that but again taking this getting something done about this is DCF and Mid Florida Homeless Coalition and things that's right DCF is the certifying agency and I went and met with them with Mid Florida Homeless Coalition and Kirby Smith and all of them you know so I you know I definitely want to take the proper chains because I definitely believe that this problem can be solved thank you guys so much for you talk any other public comment uh question does sump County have any open beds or any homeless facilities couldn't tell you don't know okay so my next comment maybe is um I have two businesses in The Villages and when we have a problem with homeless in The Villages which we do because one of them I'm right on the border I'm considered Wildwood to be honest with you um sumra County Sheriff's Department comes out and they take care of it I will tell you it's been one person in the last four years and that one person was probably about two months ago so um for those of us who frequent the villages we don't see homeless downtown in sumra landing or Brownwood or anything do we thank you very much okay I'm not sure what the the law is in sumra County regarding that but I know what it is here so uh any other comments no okay so this was a first reading we'll have a second reading October 14th October 14th on this please uh feel free to look at the Florida Statutes 125.0 231 and that explains it uh very well uh non- routine items we have none informational reports does anybody have any question on any of the reports not tonight City attorney items no reports this evening thank you city manager items yes sir roll call commissioner Peterson nothing tonight commissioner conell no commissioner rean one thing and I'll be quick I want to thank um there's my note I want to thank the lebur police department the lebur Blue Foundation Sergeant Walsh for a successful second annual lebur Blue Foundation 5K presided by Sun Air Aviation and thank you to commissioner Peterson for coming out um it was a successful event we had a lot of Runners and we're excited to announce what we're going to be doing next year here we have some tricks up our sleeves so and that with that all nothing else right mayor bu nothing tonight motion to adjourn we're gone thank you e e e e