e e e e e e e e e call the planning zoning Commission meeting of city of Leesburg to order it is July 2024 4:30 please stand for the invocation and pledge the flag our heavenly father we ask that you be with us today as we undertake the business of the city of leeburg we pray that the decisions we make will be pleasing in your sight pray this in the most holy name amen amen Al to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation God indivisible with liy and justice for all thank you [Music] sir everybody's had an opportunity to look at the minutes there any additions Corrections or deletions if not I'll accept the motion M Mr chairman I move that we accept the minutes as as submitted I second all right all in favor say I I I all opposed thank you all right um want to swear everybody in and then if you're going to speak today uh please stand and be sworn in uh because you cannot speak unless you've been sworn in the testimony you're about to give is the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth say I do I do thank you okay Dan thank you Mr chairman I'd like to welcome everyone to the July 18 20124 city of leeburg Planning and Zoning commission meeting my name is Dan Miller planning director for the city of leeburg Staff present today includes deputy director candy Harper to my left plan and planners Max Van Allen and Melissa Mets Attorney Jennifer cotch is also present at today's meeting today's agenda and a speaker's registry is available on the table by the exit door if You' like to speak on a case if you would please sign that speaker's registry and turn into page uh the signature page to Candy who is sitting here to my left under the rules of participation the meeting will be conducted under the following process number one the chairman will announce the case and then staff will read a list of exhibits to include Maps photos and texts into the record and we'll be presenting that information on the screens two the staff will will then read a recommendation and background into the record and the applicant will have the opportunity to speak about the request the chairman will then allow time for public comment and the applicant will have some time for rebuttal the chairman will close the case to the public the commission will discuss the case a vote will be taken and then the commission will move on to the next case the Planning Commission is a citizen board which is appointed by the city commission they are charged with two major responsib abilities the first is to make a final decisions on cases such as variances and conditional uses and the second is to make recommendations for cases that will be heard by the city commission for all cases that would be heard by the city commission there will be tenative dates on the agenda listed in bold that you will see on the agenda that you would have picked up today um finally on behalf of the planning staff and the leeburg Planning Commission we like thank you for your participation in today's public hearing process Mr chairman thank you very much under new business uh case number one public hearing case number lscp 2439 Silver Springs large scale comprehensive planned Amendment it has been requested that the um that we withdraw this case um there's no discussion I'll accept the motion to withdraw Mr chair I make a motion to withdraw lscp 24-39 thank you is there a second I'll second it all right I'm assuming no discussion Mr chairman if I may yes just to give some quick background the the applicant has asked to withdraw these cases they intend to potentially potentially bring them back either later this year or sometime next year they wanted some more time to work on their designs and meet with the the folks that live out in that area okay all right all in favor say I I I all opposed thank you very much roll call I don't think you really need a roll call for this okay it's not controversial or you thought about that um public C case number PUD 2440 silver spins planned unit development can't speak today uh same thing it's part of the same case they're asking to withdraw the application for now um do I have a motion to approve yes Mr chair I'd like to make a motion to withdraw public hearing case number 24-40 thank you second all right any discussion all in favor say I I all oppos thank you thank you okay number three public hearing case number PUD 24123 First Academy Athletic Field minor modifications plan unit development thank you Mr chairman by way of background this is an overall proposal that has a general location of subject property being east of Highway 27 and south of wi song Oak Drive on the east side of the property which is now owned by First Baptist Church this is a request for a what's known as a minor modification on an existing plan unit development zoning which was which is currently under PUD ordinance number 11- 78 which was approved in 2011 um it was under the South Point Baptist Fellowship at that time under this existing approved PUD there were 39 Acres that were zoned to allow a church private school Assisted Living daycare fitness center a number of items including unenclosed recreational areas such as athlet IC Fields Miss Max Van Allen planner with the office will present the maps and photo exhibits that include aerial zoning future land use surrounding land use Wetlands flood zones and Zoning Maps thank you Mr Miller the image shown on the screen is the extended aerial showing the subject property generally located north of Plantation Boulevard and east of us27 the aerial map shows the subject property is directly south of winsong Oak Drive and east of us27 the existing zoning is PUD planned unit development and the property is surrounded by PUD to the north east south and west the surrounding Lake County zoning includes a agriculture to the west and south R3 medium density District to the West rmrp mobile home rental Park District to the Northwest and South the proposed zoning is PUD planned unit development as a minor modification the existing future land use is institutional there is no change proposed at this time it is surrounded by neighborhood mixed use future land youths to the South and East Estate residential to the north and General commercial to the West the surrounding Lake County future land use includes Urban low density to the west and north and Rural transition to the South surrounding land uses include residential to the north and west non- agricultural acreage to the east and south and vacant commercial to the West there is some flood zone present on the eastern boundary of the property as shown here there are also Wetlands present in the same area along the eastern boundary the subject property is south of the 27441 CRA and the subject property is located within commission District 3 signs were posted on July 5th the top image is showing a closeup of the sign on the property from US Highway 27 the bottom image is looking North along US Highway 27 the top image is looking East into the property from US Highway 27 and the bottom image is looking South along US 27 finally looking west across US Highway 27 that's all I have thank you thank you Max with that we move to the departmental review summary project was sent out to All City departments plus the Lake County government and School Board um under City Department respon said we did not receive any substantial comments from any of the departments in doing so this generally indicates that the Departments Water waste water police fire gas Library Etc are saying they have the capacity available to serve the change requested by The Proposal the school board Lake County School Board had no comments Lake County Public Works had no comments under public responses uh per Florida statute and city of leeburg code of ordinances staff legally advertised the project posted the signs and sent out letters to the surrounding Property Owners we received two responses in the positive and six written responses in the negative the negative responses generally we're talking about noise light produ light pollution and privacy um in review of the request this is a request to revise an existing approved PUD which has been in place since 2011 the specific request today is to change the location of the athletic fields on the existing approved plan basically they want to turn the proposed field um could we try the the aerial there we go perfect um looking at this this development this proposal was originally approved in 2011 but the football field was restricted to being on the south side of the property okay and we wrote that in the original PUD the owners of the property First Baptist Church came in to see us and wanted to make a change in the way the fields are laid out obviously staff's first concern was that we're going to be skeptical because this is a little closer to here than it would be over here right and this is residential and this will eventually we anticipate being commercial anyway um so we had some concerns about that same concerns that were brought up by the folks in wi song in their responses is there going to be a noise problem is be um um lighting problems those types of issues that's 2011 when this was approved um we then met with the applicants and their lighting engineer experts and the in looking at it staff has come to the conclusion that there is newer lighting technology that was not available in 2011 that's one issue the other issue is that what we think if the field is running parallel to this South Line the lights on this side are going to direct back this way and the lights on the North side are going to direct back south if you turn it use the new lighting technology and the dark sky lighting requirements that we've put in here we feel the lights will come down this way and this way and be less offensive up here that doesn't seem to make sense sense until you look at the lights the direction of the lights and the requirements in the Pud so that's the conclusion that staff came to so what we're saying is after meeting with the applicants we came to the conclusion that using the light technology that wasn't available in 2011 and requiring the dark sky lighting requirements that you're all familiar with in the subdivisions that all go through and um we feel like it's not a negative change now I can't guarantee it but that's what we feel based on our conversations with their lighting experts the football field lights are generally going to be constructed along the each sideline as you all as everyone knows football soccer any kind of field sport the light are run down the sideline that was our concern was we don't want the light just as the residents don't we don't want the light glaring up this way and it we think it's better off to come on an East West Point of View um so it would be in an East West Direction instead of a North South so the question before the commission today is not will a field be built because it's already approved under the current PUD but is the commission willing to say it needs to stay in this direction going east west or should should these end zones line up north south it's a hard question to answer staff believes it's this way it's the commission's decision north south staff believes it should go this way because we think it will actually reduce the amount of lighting plus with the with the changes we made in the Pud regarding dark skylighting requirements um we think that it's a better option now can I ask a question the old uh site plan where the two ball fields at the North End the two I do not remember let's see I'm assuming it's a ball field at the top looks like two yeah yeah those are it's a baseball and a softball I believe okay look at the old on and are they Night play or day play they were always Night play day and night um that one is old I believe they were simply flipped yeah if if I remember everything correctly I don't think we've got a picture of that specifically but it was basically just flipped and what we wanted to see was because we were quite skeptical when they came in originally and after meeting with them we felt like it was probably going to be less light doesn't seem that way when you first think about it because you're moving a little closer but it's the angle of the light light coming in that we think is better putting yourself in the shoes of a person who lives there as much as you can um that's what staff believes um from a planning perspective so we did amend the ordinance in as far as we left the land use is the same nothing changes on that we did add architectural standards to the ordinance that were not there were not available in 2011 that's the dark sky lighting principle so that when you're selecting lighting the light has achieved the overall effect of containing and shielding excessive light pollution from adjacent properties and we added an exhibit e which shows and can we go to exhibit e and the Pud please Melissa that shows the type of lighting shading or shielding that goes for the field and and what was interesting is there been a great number there's been quite a bit of um the advancement of LED and things like that that were not really truly available in 2011 um then we added the requirement of a 25 ft landscape buffer with plantings plus a 6 foot fence and if we could go back to the thank you so one more back yeah so on the actual here we go thank you along along here wi song Oak there's a requirement for a six foot uh fence solid fence PVC to go all the way down this buffer to provide where people can't trespass back and forth so we've tried to address the lighting tried to increase the landscape buffer and require a physical buffer in addition to the 25t spatial buffer and then limited the hours of operation which is you know up to um up to this board to set saying no later than 11 on Friday and Saturday no later than 10 Sunday through Thursday that's just a starting point it's whatever the board wishes for we've amended some other language in terms of landscape islands for parking Wetlands um legal description dark sky lighting so we've just brought the Pud up to standards of what we would do on any other PUD today so with that um Mr chairman is there going to be see where the wet Wetlands start yes sir and the fence stops you got one lot sitting out there with no protection this one yeah yeah if that's if that's Wetlands I don't know that we could legally even fence it but can you do uh any kind of U vegetation or or fence that West line I mean east line pick that think about talking about right there where the yellow dotted line was yeah back back where that last one was right it was right right running up and down here yeah um there's there's no specific reason why we couldn't do that if you felt that was [Music] needed yeah I was just look it stuck out to me that you got one lot out there left out in the cold right and it's it's it's because of the weapons that we can't enro on the we but we could require some fencing to come down North to South as a corner angle that would give that lot some buffer we're happy to do that something to ponder while we continue okay so um under the recommendation for First Academy Athletic Field minor modification of existing PUD under PUD 24-23 Planning and Zoning departments recommending approval of the request for the following reasons one the proposed request for a minor modification of the existing PUD zoning is compatible with the current surrounding zoning districts including Lake County a rmrp R3 and C of leberg PUD and C2 and P and number two the proposed minor modification of the existing PUD is compatible with the existing future land use designation of institutional remember it's a church use and then three the proposed request does not appear to create a detriment to surrounding properties as conditioned in the modified PUD agreement and that's what we just went over was the changes to the Pud therefore the action requested is one vote to approve staff's recommendation to modify the existing PUD planned unit development agreement as conditioned um this would be because it is a minor modification it would be a final decision by the Planning Commission it would not go on to City commission so that's staff's presentation and thank you Mr chairman okay any other questions of Staff yes uh can the fence be increased in height 6 feet yes sir let's say 10 or 12 feet with uh we could probably go to eight 10 or 12 would be eight all right let's say 8 ft MH and can we ask for landscaping move the fence couple of feet onto the property and the landscape the residence aside of the fence we we can certainly do any of that uh commissioner Kaplan um normally what we would do in this case what we're recommending is that you put the fence directly on the line so there's no confusion about whose property it is because sometimes it's real easy to think I own a piece of property that's in someone else's because the fence is not there and the other issue is maintenance so what we staff would recommend is if you want to increase the fence height to eight feet and we still have the landscape buffer which is a visual on this on the church side right and so you would have a a a good siiz fence the uh 25t planted buffer and where if if there's areas there that are completely treed we don't want them to cut those trees we want to leave that but there is there are specific requirements for planting buffer will be a screen planting buffer is considered a screen basically it limits vision in from the residential side yes that's the design Mr M yes go ahead chairman uh I wanted to just add that specifically in the landscape buffer language it is written to include the phrasing that it's the vegetation will be installed with the intent to block any noise or light seepage so we're hoping with the opaque fencing requirement certainly uh at an increased height if the commission wishes and also the vegetation and the distance as Mr Miller mentioned those three items will hopefully help mitigate any nuisance to adjoining properties who will make the uh the approval who will approve the Landscaping at the time of completion of the city do that my department Diane from my department is a an arborist and um handles the land landscape plans I have a question if you Dan yes sir uh you know you've also got football soccer field yes okay then you have tennis courts also then you going to have softball fields and baseball fields so you got more light than just what's on the soccer football field potentially that is correct so you know it's not just are they going light the softball field I would have to let Mr Don bsaw with the First Baptist Church the the academy answer those questions specifically I would assume that the answer if you're going to light one you need to light them all um so but that's been the case and the approved case since 2011 in there as laid out now but as it's laid out now there's no protection on how that lighting goes up why don't we ask the staff of anything in particular that they're involved in and then let the applicant come up and they may answer a lot of these questions sure sure I have one more question to you Dan yes sir did you said that zoning uh to the property of the South is possibly going to be commercial development that's the um Whispering Hills entrance to Whispering Hills development and we anticipate that there will be within that large development that's going to be one of of the main access points so we're going to require at some point whether this project is approved or not when it's developed we're probably going to need to require an access north south access between the church and the Whispering Hills as well so you can come in the Whispering Hills development either go to Whispering Hills or go to the church as well that's dependent on do because us27 is a DOT road but we would anticipate wanting that north south cut between the two properties just to clarify the only thing we're really deciding on is the orientation and location these fields correct that's correct so they already have permission or authority to to develop this yeah um and our concern is that maybe we can Implement like she said would be to have that landscape buffer it may not is that included in the original in the existing it's it's I don't believe it's in the original current PUD as it sits today right okay so we could and so what we did was add the fence and the plantings I think there's a 25 foot buffer in there but it doesn't have as it's not as um puffed up buffed up with the plantings and fence right okay thank you I got the KN behind you so okay question right here too oh yes um Miss uh um Dan um I'm concerned about the noise yes sir part of it so if that going to be enough with the fencing and the buffer is that going to be enough sound barrier the that depends on how big a how big the crowds are and I don't have any way to control that I do know that the the school the building's currently used as a church there would potentially it would be used for First Baptist Church athletic facilities Mr birdal can answer those more accurately um and noise depends on how many how big the stadium and how full it is and on a property of this size you're not looking at much you're not looking at a big Stadium um but as to how many what the capacity would be that I don't know because the size is going to be limited to the the size of the stands and things in some ways could be limited by the amount of parking that's available and um not much and so there's a number and it's a small school and I don't think I don't know that First Baptist has any plans to ever go to a thousand students whatever I forget what the number Mr birdall knows but it's it's a small school so it's not um it's not something like you're going to have a high school football game with thousands of people there it's why don't we go ahead and move to the applicant some of these like I said some of these might be answered thank you sir okay uh Mr Bol sir please state your name and your address please Don bdol 1533 Normandy way lesburg Florida I'm here to answer any of your questions but answer some of the ones that have been thrown out there if that's okay sorry I've never been to one of these that's okay say whatever you want I love I'm a teacher my wife and I spend every summer hiking I don't want to tear down anything we don't have to tear down but I can't promise anything because I don't know how long I'll be there I've been there for 23 years I'm getting getting ready to go on my 24th year right now we use City Fields for football games we average around 300 people at a football game to answer that question another thing that was not mentioned is another purpose for rotating the stadium is the home fans crowd would be shouting this way the main stadium towards the church not towards the subdivision trying to keep the noise again in that area the other thing that was mentioned is Stadium this is not a stadium we're not a we have 160 kids in our high school 520 kids K through 12 um we are not looking to build we don't have the resources to build an expansive thing this is um the the pictures you're seeing here are literally picked up from other places and put on here because the dimensions were accurate um but we want to leave a buffer around we've we've played our games since 2006 at Sleepy Hollow uh we use the fields there we start our games 30 minutes before most other high schools start to try to be off the fields well before 10 p.m. I can't make that promise because if you ever been to a football game in the state of Florida you got weather and sometimes it pushes it back um the only thing that typically goes on at night would be baseball football and softball everything else goes on it a day practices go on during the day um most of our practices End by 600 p.m. most people are getting home from work shortly around that time um the football games we host five to six football games a year our baseball and softball games we start at 6 PM because we try to get everybody out of there we use Pat Thomas right now for our home fields for baseball and again Sleepy Hollow for softball um we are constantly at a problem with resources for Fields this is why we're trying to make this move to do this the other reason for moving the field to a north south uh angle if you've ever played football or played any ball field East West the sun's right in one team's face at 7:00 till about 8:30 at night during that time of year it's a horrible situation for the kids playing um the other thing as far as the lighting the technology and lighting and I'm sorry that Jeremy Collins is not here to answer these question questions but he installs these fields um and works with the development of these in developments and they do not spread they they they are the LED closed lighting is so focused on where the city tells us we need to put them to light up the field and the field alone we've had I'm sorry I don't have them with me um but there was pictures of houses that were 20 feet away and you can barely make out the house from some of the these fields that have built and we're trying to keep it as far to the south side of the property is possible um and the other reason for this is if we go east uh completely East West with the fields across we end up having to build multiple buildings to house the kids for locker rooms and things like that where if we turn it north south and turn the fields we build one building which takes up less ground space less messing up the the natural flow of the water all those things because it's one place for everything to be any questions any questions can the softball field be oriented the same way as the baseball field for lighting the lighting isn't impacting the residents as far as you mean turned turn it turn it so that the diamond faces the same way as the baseball field that way there's no lighting directly towards the red residents cuz right now the left field line will be uh excuse me the right field lights would be lighted T towards the building towards the houses I don't see why it [Music] couldn't see here say turn the left field line yeah turn same orientation As baseball right yeah I don't I don't see why that would be a problem it still wouldn't it wouldn't take us out of that range of be able to use that area for the same same space is just do the lights would not be shining to yeah we want to impact the neighborhood as little as possible we're not we don't I live in lebur and we we always try to work with everybody I'm going to and the other thing is as long as I have anything to do with this we're not tearing down trees we don't have to tear down along that line that's already there we want to leave as much there as possible I'm a cross country coach I love a place for the kids to run where they don't have to run out in the hot sun a little shade um okay any other questions thank you thank you okay is there anybody else to speak for the project anybody like to speak against the project I would like to okay um come up state your name and address before you get started uh you're going to be on a 3-minute timer and um if anybody else follows up with him uh please don't repeat the same thing try to bring new evidence gotcha my name is Mike Owens 5718 Wind Song Oak Drive the the end house that somebody was pointing out uh just a couple of things one I wish he had come to us come to the h away and talk to us about it we could have worked out something we know we can't stop it we know it's it's an improvement or just a modification what we would like as an association we've got 21 homes on that one side a narrow Street and then 21 homes on the other side so the noise is going to be a problem one of the things we would like is no play after 9:00 at night I think that's acceptable should be acceptable another thing is no Road should go along that perimeter on the North side the last thing or second last thing we want a 50ft buffer then you can put your fence because the homes on that side some of them have are very close to the back end of the property so if you put an eight8 or 10 foot vinyl fence that's what they're looking at it's it's these are homes that have been there since 2006 with Forest behind them and you're going to change it to this that's a drastic IC change the last thing we would like you folks to take a look at the entrance and exit because it's a it's a subdivision property that they're exiting and entry on we know it's the same as the church but church is one day a week it's on Sunday morning now we're talking about games whatever nights so we've got some concerns there we'd really like you folks take a look at it maybe we could step back and they could approach the HOA for that subdivision and we can work something out that's what we would really like that's the way it should have been handled thank you for your time thank you very much there we go anybody else uh like to speak against okay do you have any uh comments to the no I I missed this I mean you don't have to but if you want to um you have the opportunity to rebuttal I would like to apologize because I'd never even thought about approaching HOA that's my first time ever doing something like this again we always try to work if you know if you know First Baptist Church if anybody knows the history of First Baptist Church a lot of okay we try to work we with the communi art a has helped me with the project unfortunately uh Steven Roth who recently passed helped me with the project trying trying to make this a thing and one thing I forgot to mention earlier we'd have no problem turning the fence to keep anything from affecting the back of the property um I I can't say 9:00 works because it's just a matter of travel for kids with schools and it's a matter of when other schools can get there to play games but we try to always work within the city requirements and limits to not cause problems with the neighbors um and I to my knowledge I've never received calls from Sleepy Hollow area area other than poor decision by some kids from time to time and half the time they're not even our kids um but we don't have any issues with them with our games at night we've not had any issues when we've had to go on with Rand delay again we take all those things into consideration we've killed our sound system at games and stopped using our sound system because we hit the 11:00 cut off and the game went to 11:30 because we had two thou uh 2our lighting delay um I don't know if we put a 50-ft buffer if we can fit the stuff there that's the that's the other issue if we can do it I will do it I will move the fields as long as I have anything to do it as far to the South out property as possible that's what we still want to do it's just a matter of that orientation of that field but the other thing is city of leberg is growing and growing fast and we have that we have two months where our baseball and softball teams have to practice in the city of Lady Lake I've only been in this town for 23 years I love leberg I love bragging about lesburg I try to bring tournaments in here and stuff like that during the daytime to Showcase what lebur has to offer we need more playing space for kids we need more places for kids to spread out and do things this would be privately run by us this will not be people coming and going all hours of the night and day this is for our use would we work with the city to rent it out if they need it for something if the church allowed it to base on their insurance needs so any other questions or any all right any other questions before we close than thank you all right we're going to close to the public and uh for discussion and render decision any discussion on it before we we have one thing um the 100 foot typical landscape detail that you guys have calls for two canopy trees and two ornamental with uh 7 foot height on the ornamental tree if you're going to put an 8ft fence 7ot ornamental tree doesn't offer any privacy to the homeowners so if there is a proposed 8ft fence I would think that two ornamental trees with a 25 ft span is only half of the 100 foot linear buffer that's proposed that we either increase the number of uh canopy trees in that buffer or redesign it so that way they have a good screen and not 11 ft 11 ft 7 ft 7t as proposed on here I think it makes sense right I mean I understand you're going to leave as many trees as you can obviously there may be you may run into issues where you have to remove something and you end up with one home has 50 feet of nothing um okay yeah what what we do is lay it out flat and at 100 foot intervals they have to lay in all those landscape the number of trees is designed that way because when the particularly for the canopy trees when they become mature they're going to take up enough space and we don't want them to um be too many canopy trees in there that there's so much shade that nothing else will grow and that kills off the sound effect but I get what you're saying if we can increase the number of understory trees which or or something like that the canopy trees are kind of critical because they're so large and they grow out like this that we we don't want those canopies to override the smaller trees and the smaller shrubs right now you have the two canopies next to each other and then you have two ornamentals over here right and the actual the actual way that would work I I see what you're saying commissioner yeah so there's just a it's going to create it can be mixed up within that it doesn't have to be exactly canopy canopy ornamental ornamental it could be canopy then two ornamentals or one that's up to the designer this was a sample but I'm glad you pointed that out cuz I never thought of that before um but but it's designed so that the landscape person the landscape architect would have to um bring in the trees and normally they'll set one closer to the boundary and then ornamental and then another and they're back and forth in a sort of triangular fashion and I'm sure you've seen those but we I'm I really appreciate you bringing that up because we didn't mean for it to be exactly 1 2 3 4 five like this is as long as those five are in that 100 foot area okay then and then you have the appropriate say it's lustrum or uh whatever Shrubbery down there that's that's the intent but if you want to increase those plantings that's certainly something you can do we just want to be careful about increasing the canopy trees because at maturity or close to maturity that's when it's going to shade everything and kill everything else yeah know I mean there's well way more educated people who decide what the the amount of tree commend that you get with the architect and uh make sure that's taken care increase that visual screen as much as possible right okay any other comments suggestions I got a question just clarification the so the main entrance to this property is the same entrance that uh Windsong residents use off of Highway 27 is that correct see it looks like there's a when water retention area in 2011 when this when the church and everything back in the days when this was being built we were trying to get an entrance here for the church and do would not allow it and required it to come up here because that was in this second entrance was in the original PUD they'll they'll go back to do and ask for this again I I can't control and this will help if do will allow it here but I can't control of dot will do that so that will help some in and in addition when the property down here is eventually developed under the Whispering Hills name uh we'll be looking for an access point either here most likely up here right so to take some pressure basically we're aware of this and we want to take that pressure off of it if dot will allow this and we can require an access point here and Whispering Hills will have one on 27 that will help as well well problem is we have to put up with it for a while before those things come in yeah and reality that many entrances in that distance probably is Not Practical or advisable it it depends on and as the speed comes down and the development comes up all the traffic that's on 27 and people come in going probably the fewer entrances the better yes sir but it doesn't hurt to try and see what they say well there'll be apparently be one to the South where this new yes sir Windsong entry would be yes sir that's correct but you could maybe allow or ask them when that time comes maybe to bring a allow an access to the south side of this property to prevent overload onto the wind so that's a part of the comprehensive plan that requires us to have inter inter what's the word candy interconnectivity right between the between the two developments so that will come along for sure in the future we just don't know the timing until that development proposal comes through gotta any other questions all right we'll close and render decision there's a um motion yes sir I'd like to make a motion to approve public hearing case number 24-1 123 okay is there a second with with the amendment and the changes second now those changes include that that corner down there by that last slot that I talked about if I understood it correctly there would be some gentl house yeah there would be some additional where's my pointer additional fencing down here as far as we can go to help the gentleman that lives here as far as we can go to the wetlands and then a little bit down here to cover try to help a little bit there I that's going to be something we have to work out over time okay yeah then um let's see we had the fencing and then did you want to do something on the height of the fencing is 6 feet do you want to go to eight I wouldn't recommend going over eight yeah over eight eight and looks like a driving the the 8 foot would that be on the property line yeah on the property line yeah cuz it just becomes a maintenance issue you don't want them in their backyard yeah okay so and we're keeping the 25 foot width yes okay okay so fencing on the northeast 8 foot fence on the Northern property against any property developed residential yes okay so that would include all here yep add a little bit of fencing here to help up here okay yes I know it's in the Middle where we're not in discussion anymore but I know the 8ot fence uh if you live in one of those houses and this the rear setback is 15 ft or so I'm not sure what it is how far is your property line behind those houses on winda think it's 18 or 20 I think so it to me is set forward a little bit more than some I have from my back of my lenai to the property line without the easements is about 20 ft okay I guess what I'm what I'm put in my mind on if I was living in one of those houses would I want to have an eight foot fence and have no visibility or what I would rather have a six- foot fence with still no visibility but maybe I'm not sure not so demanding not so why would you put Landscaping behind the fence this this this we're we're out of order here speaking oh no sorry because it doesn't make sense I'm out of excuse me most there's your answer most are all two story houses on that so this is way out of order guys I'm sorry I don't want issues down the road so we got to follow Robert's Rules go ahead State your case to them though about the the because I know what you're saying I I wouldn't want it either but we in the middle well I mean the discussion we're in discussion for the motion are we so it's okay for it talk about it I thought there was a motion is there it we're in discussion okay we're in discuss we can talk okay I'm just trying to visualize if I had uh a backyard and I only had 18 ft or so would I'd rather see a blank white six- foot fence or 8 foot I'm not sure what the answer would be on that and what it do any good soundwise really to have 8 [Music] feet you would have more visibility of tree canopy if you had a 6-ft fence with the requirement for landsc escaping behind there I'm leaning I'm leaning towards what you're saying I agree you I have a point I'd like to talk about to okay let me finish what I was saying first um so I would suggest if you if you want the six-foot fence vote down the the motion correct and then we'll redo the motion and put it at six so I just want to get that thought out while we're talking about it a better sound barrier excuse me we got I'm sorry the fact that the fence has to be on the property line if you don't want people from the the church having to come to every house and maintain what's on the other side of the fence so uh I mean that's a no-brainer in my opinion maintenance wise uh the fence has to be on the property line I don't think that's been an issue but the thing no he should be what what the most important uh the sound barrier of looking out to see whatever you can see and I think the sound barrier is more important so I think the 8 foot fence is good okay okay okay yeah there is a different engineering aspect to an 8ft fence over a 6ot fence yeah so an 8ft fence requires a much more substantial system of reinforcement than a 6ot vence does for wind load so it's not going to be the the exact same fence it could have the distance between uh posts could be different [Music] theair but anyways it would just he didn't like that idea I know right my my point is is you might you might end up with a much larger picket size a much larger looking fence a much it might be less aesthetically pleasing at 8 ft other than the the sound and or visual screen that you would gain from that's all it requires a different set of engineering um to when you get a permit that is true but more dominating okay any other comments okay so if you want the OT fence you vote for this if you approve everything else if you want a six foot fence vote it down and then someone needs to make another motion everybody understand okay roll call roll call I'm sorry do we have a second yes we did have a second you second yeah I second yeah thank yeah we couldn't go into discussion about it trust me I got rert R down you um commissioner no chairman Senate no commissioner Sanders yes commissioner Marshall no Commission aaman no Mr B socks no because of the fence Mr C yes you said your all right so is there a motion to uh well I'm not going to tell you what to make a motion for yeah I'd like to make a motion to approve the U PUD 24-1 two3 minor modif a uh with the requirement of a 6 high uh solid typ PVC fence on the proper line of the adjacent North Boundary with the other item with the other items that the fencing along the Wetland and the 25 foot buer WID yes okay thank you I'll second that Mr chairman it's been seconded any discussion roll call um I'm going to mix it up okay may I ask a question before we continue okay that's we had discussion before you're looking for an approval and and and to say no yes or no to one or the other is kind of confusing I can approve either way is it is that a legitimate what I said my statement was I'm not going to tell you what to vote for or I'm not going to tell you what to make the motion for so he made his own motion so that's what the motion is now I didn't guide him one way or the other I just tried to make it clear earlier that if you want didn't want the 8ft fence you had to vote down the I want everybody to understand it up here you know whatever so I didn't I didn't guide it at all I made made sure that go back in the minutes and read that basically what I'm saying is that I I I might want to be an approval approve the overall project rather than you know be a negative you're asking you're asking for you're asking your votes either a yes or no on this okay we still can we still would to be a to approve the overall project the votes been called for there will be another right okay right okay just want to make that yeah I want to understand that as well got it yes sir roll call thank you sir um commissioner kapan no M Bar yes Comm aan yes commiss Marshall yes Mr Sanders yes chairman Senate yes commissioner Kelly yes thank you very much okay uh case number four it's public hearing case PUD 24126 Shore Acres Landing plan unit development they have asked to postpone this to September 19th if that is um okay with everybody I'll accept the motion so move Mr chairman I have a second second any discussion on that all in favor say I I I'll oppos thank you very much is there anything else to be brought up before the commission uh Mr chairman I do have one item um the terms I've got three Commissioners whose terms will be expiring uh Mr Bowersox and Mr Marshall's terms expire September 30 Mr Sanders term expires December 31 so we're respectfully asking you to uh if if you would like we will send you a new application to fill out so that you know you staff you know staff loves you we want you to stay okay um and we don't give we don't staff doesn't give staff doesn't get the opportunity to uh thank you enough for what you do and how hard it can be sometimes even on what appear be small issues uh but we we appreciate all of you and would love for you to stay the unfortunate part of this is Staff has no influence on how the commission votes and chooses to who they choose to keep and who they don't choose to keep um and that's happened to some of you before where you know you've been taken off and brought back on and gladly but if you would please um we will email you the applications um this coming week and if you can get those back to us if you'd like if not just let let us know that you want to expire but um we have Mr Bowersox and Mr Marshall for September 30 this is be these are the three-year terms and then Mr Sanders is December 31 so trying to be a little more proactive this year and not rushing but as you know staff love to see all of you stay so do the rest of the com commission have have a recommendation on these renewals such as Mr Bowers sucks I'm not so so sure about well I would I would I would write a letter to City Hall second I can't lose my chap yeah oh somebody got to pray for you guys I just go know the procedure I just was asking I have a I do have a technical question um of a meaning to ask I know the planning of zoning uh brought this ordinance to the city commission years ago because I was on it back then is those temporary signs you see all over the place the feather Flags or other huh when you say temporary signs well you know little signs you see you know you know come here you know sign cuz the city's got some on the front of their own property for Ski Beach which bothers me a lot and then also there's some political signs that they they have we're hiring which I think you know takes away from that it's a political sign and it's a work sign technically speaking what does it say well it's it's one of the candidates running for office and it says hiring and it has a phone number but they're but they're using their political signs to to put them and they're putting I've seen them around I got a picture one right here let me see that picture there's one right by minute made by minute made 441 I've seen that but that's that technically that's against the law against the ordinance but definitely the the city needs to follow their own rules I mean that where the where City along in front of the community building what does it say Ski Beach advertising there's like three or four of them up there I don't know if they're still there but the restaurant Beach Ski Beach the restaurant still there if the way the way right but but they're against the rules and they're on your property so the the way they need to be removed the way staff has always handled it is if it's um if you have a gas station and you're putting out a snip sign for a period of time that's advertising items sold on your property right that's we're we're we're good you can't put 7-Eleven or whatever gas station all the way across town from 7even right it's it's a bubo rule and and in the case of um Ski Beach I don't know specifically I can conjecture that because it's on city property and they're advertising for the business that exists there even though it's not already got a response to that I know but let me see the lease and see what legal says yeah I mean but does Ski Beach have rights to the city to the uh Community Building no so I see that as a separate none of them can be at regardless of City I just think that I mean I I hate those things because they look sloppy no the the reality is code enforcement's the one who goes by and Yanks them right and there's 85 billion of them right but these are very obvious I'm going to eat there when I leave here so I will put it on my list of things to take care of he bring that up but I just hate those things I see them on my properties that I rent and I I make attendants take them down you whoever put it up well will be in touch with code enforcement and while we're on the subject I would like to uh welcome our new Deputy city manager Mr Robert hickler the Planning Commission thank you for coming sir TR to make Emer money I I've been wanting to bring that up for weeks and so that's it good but I love don't get wrong I love ski beans I go there all the time all right um anything else see you all right see you all right see you lat