be different use mine too welcome Littleton to the select board meeting for Tuesday May 28th we'll start with the pledge of allegiance aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic stand Nation God indivisible with lice Are all uh so we have a pretty busy agenda for tonight uh starting with uh reading the mail at 635 we'll do a quick select Bard recognition then we have 640 Department updates from mapc cleaning AES Elder and Human Services uh and four things from Human Resources uh at 8:00 we'll do an appointment uh to the little Bon Housing Authority 8:15 we'll do public input and 8813 we have a bunch of Select board discussions for the host Community agreements uh doing uh border reorg reorganization stuff like Liaisons uh signing um uh contracts for 36 King Street um three contracts for 36 King Street uh the school msbc msba project for Shaker Lane fiscal year transfers uh performance evaluations The Orchard and then we'll get into goal setting Department updates and an affordable housing Grant 940 we'll do minutes and then hopefully be done by 9:45 so we'll start with mail thank you Mr chairman uh I will be quick like to start out uh we have a also have a res we have a resignation from the um position member at large in the Littleton Transportation advisory Council uh specifically as the chair of uh of that um of of of the uh of the council uh and um however he does intend to continue his membership on the bicycle pedest pedestrian advisory committee that was by uh Michael gar g Ru a r and he uh was honored to serve the Littleton in its capacity and uh but unfortunately he's been overextended and need to refocus some of his time current current vacancies on the town boards uh that are appointed by the select board we've got two uh for the Housing Trust Fund of Trustees we've got one uh we've got two citizen at large and one member for the agricultural commission we have 1 two three four five six um committee uh Lakes committee uh individuals that uh the terms are expiring they have I'm sorry that are vacancies there Conservation Commission uh three members term expiring on uh June 30th 2027 two Associates expiring on 2026 counciling aging three members terms expiring 2027 Council Council four members expiring in 2027 disability Commission uh one member with disability term expiring 2027 Economic Development Committee uh one member no expiration historical commission three members expiring 2027 the Littleton Community television advisory committee two members expiring 2027 um we have in the event that uh uh people want to receive public notifications they can go to ww. Littleton ma.org subscribe they can receive Community impacts Transportation issues public health concerns uh Public Safety activity town meeting changes town events and soon Town newsletter we also would like to gift acceptance uh alert everybody from the uh the gift of $2,000 from the Ed Walsh Foundation to the prce um as a donation to to the youth scholarship fund uh to help to pay for youth's programming for families that are not financially able to and uh we also have please participate in our survey your opinion matters on the opioid settlement funds learn about the learn about the funds the town will receive share your experience uh you can get that on the llon uh website T of bton website and uh that is it for the mail thank you so we have a recognition of Jonathan Vance and Peter M mnpi I'm not sure MP mcnp for their actions at the zva meeting on April 18th 2024 Jonathan Peter here so come on up please so we have certificates of recognition uh for both of you to say on behalf of the select board for your quick thinking and action at the April 18th zoning board of appeals meeting that resulted in the saving of a woman's life so it's a certificate of recognition from us so thank you Cong thank you very much thanks thanks so much thank you I like to hear about I don't know if it's something you guys want to talk about use the microphone joh want to talk humble as always yeah you want to get a picture yeah wi angle you're trying to say right well everything's going to be downhill from that probably basically uh Department updates uh MC presentation on the hazard M mitigation okay okay introduce us here tonight present on the the town the director of environment department at metropolitan area planning Council your Regional planning Council and here with me hello I'm Jennifer wallich I'm an emergency preparedness coordinator at the metropolitan area planning Council thanks for having us and Jennifer actually did The Omen amount of work on this draft plan it was her first one worked with me who I've done many of them but um what we have to to show you tonight is a draft plan that's put been put together over the last Almost year with the guidance of a team a local Hazard mitigation team from the town maren who was here sort of coordinated that team as did Ryan actually and it had multiple M from other Town departments Emergency Management Public Works planning Etc so we really want to thank the team we had a series of four meetings and workshops over the last N9 or 10 months uh they were all so helpful in bringing forward local knowledge and information to make this plan um more useful and more customized for the town so we do have a PowerPoint present presentation to sort of give you an overview of the plan I'll start by just giving you an overview um of what hazard mitigation means in case that is not a word just rolls off the tongue it's not always a household word um Hazard mitigation is a planning process that FMA has put in place uh Nationwide through an act that was passed in the year 2000 so 25 years ago it was a new thing back then to develop plans for communities to think ahead before a disaster happened they already had lots of plans and processes for Disaster Response and recovery and they still do but at that time it was a new measure to think about what can we do to make communities less vulnerable to the kind of Hazards we know we're having and reduce the amount of Damages that occur when these natural occurs hazards occur so the planning process was put in place with the goal of having every town and city in the whole country uh develop one of these kinds of local plans um not a mandate you didn't have to do it but they put a pretty good incentive in there to do it if a town has an approved plan it's eligible for some pretty significant FEMA funds for for project grants to actually fund projects on the ground that will actually help like drainage improvements storm water and that sort of thing generators lots of things of that sort so that's kind of the incentive and when this plan is done which it nearly is now when we submitt it into Mima and FEMA for review uh after they approve it then you will actually have the next 5 years eligibility for these these grants and there these grants are now actually bigger than they have been in the past because of the federal infrastructure dollars have been put into them so there serious money available in these brick they call them brick RS I'll talk a little bit more about that in a minute um go ahead through the yeah thank you so Hazard mitigation if you look at the um the green box on the upper left sort of the overall definition that I think Mima came up with to kind of give a the elevator pitch what do you mean Hazard mitigation reducing the impacts of natural hazards through strategies that include policies projects and programs so there's a whole sort of slew of different things that fall under that umbrella and we'll talk about what some of those are we approach Hazard mitigation plans with the questions you see in the bottom left what preventative actions are are being taken now because we recognize towns have already been dealing with these hazards for many years and you have a lot of things in place already so we want to get a baseline what's in place now when we have that we can say where are some gaps where are some areas you can improve or strengthen the programs you have or add new elements so that's when we ask the second question what additional actions can the town take to make uh yourself less vulnerable and more resilient in the future that's the basic philosophy of these plant they focused on a whole series of natural hazard the list you see on the right here so these these plans are not about um human cause like uh chemical spills or radi radi radiological uh they're not about Homeland Security terrorists there's all other plans about that kind of thing that the feds have the state has that you have parts of this is just focusing on hazards but it's focusing on all categories of natural hazards so you see in that list flooding and wind and winter geologic even things like earthquakes even things that may not be quite too likely to happen but if they could happen you at least want to be aware of them but more focus on the plan is put on those kinds of hazards that you actually experience or are more likely to experience here change on thank you so um yeah this is one of those little animated slides it's just to make the point F was trying to put this program together to try to slow down uh this cycle of disaster rebuild disaster rebuild which is something that maybe not so much in Littleton you haven't had the most severe hazards in this town you're fortunate in that but if you think about some of our Coastal communities in in particular that this really does happen uh and rather just keep seeking money into an endless cycle they want to see if they can interrupt or slow down that cycle by making the areas that are subject to these hazards more resilient and less have suffer maybe not eliminate the damages but reduce the amount of Damages that occur thank you so Hazard mitigation is a broad term that includes a number of specific types of measures this is a one way that we organize our thoughts of about what are the categories of actions in Hazard mitigation some of them are preventative actions some of them are actions to protect property that's already In Harm's Way that was built years ago before we had the regulations to say about flood planes now but we have to somehow coexist and live with the fact that some of our older development is more In Harm's Way and know other things like elevating elevating buildings elevating just the utilities within the buildings other kinds of protection measures can be put in uh looking at public education it's an important part because it's not only what the town can do it's what homeowners land owners small businesses can do for their own properties to help themselves even more uh and then looking at Natural Resources Wetlands flood planes protecting them and letting them do the job as much as we can to buffer us from some of these some of these uh hazards structural projects the second one to the last on this list are the big ticket sort of infrastructure issues that that we all identify in many cases where if you have a drainage problem it might be able to be solved by some kind of infrastructure upgrades and that's where some of those federal grants can actually help you pay for those projects if they're laid out in the plan and kind of the the the rationale for the need for them is talked about in the plan after the plan's approved you could actually pursue some of those kinds of projects through federal grants and also through some state grants and other funding sources the last measure is emergency services and the idea here is that the emergency services and the facilities they rely on fire stations police stations Public Work yards they themselves should be protected uh so that they can then continue to offer service to the rest of the town the last thing you want is for those to go off first and then you don't have the capability to help anyone else in the town so those are just a few ways of thinking about what could come under Hazard mitigation that's why I say it's not one thing it's an umbrella term lots of pieces that go into it and this plan will look at many aspects of that we also have been integrating climate change more and more into these plans in recent years uh because we we starting to see with flooding with higher R intensity rainfall events clearly these are indications of some of the signs of climate change we seeing already and all of the projections uh in from the in international to the National to the state uh studies are showing that these Trends are unfortunately going to be continuing and becoming more more hazardous so we'll take that consideration into the plan as well when we're talking about these hazards so the planning process that we go through to develop this plan as I mentioned it's really about the local team and there on the right side you see uh some of the folks not the names of the people but the names of the positions uh it so it's a really good compliment of of all the boards commissions and and employees in the town that have some aspect or the other on this and you can see it's a multifaceted plan no one Department could do it all there's a big role for public works there's a big role for Emergency Management there's roles for all all these other boards on here here as well uh so the local team met four times as I mentioned they provided really good specific information to us that we documented and put it into a format that is kind of the FEMA approved format they like to see these plans to be structured in a certain way so we take the local data we translate it I say we translate that at the FEMA or FEMA e and then make it so that it's something useful to the town but also approvable by FEA and so here is the timeline and we're on the all the way right side where the stars but almost last point in the process we have gone through all the steps you see here PR with the team meetings prior to this to develop the data develop the recommendations to the plan we had a previous public meeting a few months ago U with this board but over in the other building uh and here we are really at the last stop before having a plan that's ready to turn into Mima and FEMA and at that point it it'll be a draft plan that they will review comment on perhaps ask us for revisions and then once they're satisfied approve the plan so we're really getting into the the home stretch here so I'm going to turn it over to Jennifer to talk a little bit about just some of the highlights and we're going to concentrate a little bit more uh in this plan here actually no there's a few more I'm going to do before I turn it here what you go to the next slide here I'm going to give you she she's she's going to talk about the uh the recommendations that are that's really the heart of the plan but just leading up to the recommendations we that laying the groundwork and that what I said earlier looking at the U looking at the Baseline of what you have place already and where the HS are this is these next couple of slides are examples of the content of the plan uh a very close inventory of all the critical facilities in town and again that team with our local knowledge of the Town different members contributed into where these sites are you can see the kind of things that are on here critical Town facilities Municipal facilities infrastructure like pump stations and water towers Etc and Community facilities that you consider critical because they might need assistance more than the average person uh like you know schools uh elderly housing uh medical facilities so there's like a range of things that we call critical facilities they're not all in the same category but they're all critical for different reasons every one of those is mapped on that map I know you can't see it at this scale but in the plan you can take a look at it in more detail there's and there's an inventory like an Excel sheet they're all listed out with the attributes of those and we map then where are these located in comparison to the flood areas and some of the other hazards so which ones of them might actually be in places that you want to be aware of they they the facility could be more at risk we also M I know this map at this scale looks the same it's the same base map but what we have on this one uh are the locally identified Hazard areas and most of these are either areas that are known to flood locally not the FEMA flood planes we they're they in the map but locally local knowledge usually from Public Works telling us about you know roadways that flood few places where you have Beaver problems that create flooding etc those are all mapped out and described in the plan also we have some areas if you see the red circles uh that are potential Wildfire risk most of your some of your larger open forested areas and I think there's a few winter hazards and other things so this is like a very detailed description a very specific to Littleton where the hazards are in your community the plan as I mentioned looks there's a lot of focus on flooding because it's the most common Hazard among L but we do look at all the other hazards extreme temperatures which is becoming more more of a focus these days um drought also becoming more since we've had three of them since 2016 um wildfires I guess you haven't fortunately had any big ones here but there have been some others right around the state and whenever we get a drought that makes those areas even more vulnerable to wildfires um earthquakes well we had one in New Jersey a few weeks ago uh it was a 2.1 or something so again we don't get big ones here fortunately but we look at that uh and extreme rainfall the map on the right lower right showing at cluster and Northeastern of the US area subject to more extreme rainfall so we we we put together an inventory with the town's help of what measures uh you already have in place in the town this is that Baseline of activity and they're categorized by things that address flooding things that might address Rush fires winter hazards you can see here wind and winter or multiple hazards so that's in the plan the is just a a punch list but they're all described in the plan and then that leads us to knowing where the where the gaps are from the existing the ability to put together a list of recommended mitigation measures that's really the whole point of doing this plan and that's that I'm going to thank you Martin yeah so this list that I'm about to go over is what we were able to come up of the mitigation measures that should be um worked on in the next 5 years so I'll run through these briefly um starting with the flood hazards as Martin said that's one of the biggest um issues that we're seeing across the state and especially in Littleton so for uh the first one it was about creating uh future open space Parcels um for flood mitigation um this is a continuation as well from what was done in the previous plan this was a high priority um adding on to that open space residential development bylaws and adopting cluster by right um moving on from that concentrating development in existing areas of development again there was a lot of talk about beavers leading to floods so there was talk about also creating a beaver mitigation plan that was of high priority uh by the group and then also doing um extending Wetland buffer zones hydraulic analysis of flooding issues in the mil Pond area since I know that came up from several folks in the group as well as in the survey that we did of the town and then identifying more rain Gardens and water retention basins was set forth of a medium priority by the group and then also making the public aware of watershed subbasins and uh with signage at Water divides so for wind and extreme weather as you see installing wind resistant windows in public buildings was medium um for Wildfire it was again talking about maintaining fire access roads that was a continuation um from the last plan and then also a continuation was doing um public education on brush fire prevention for winter hazards assessing snow loads on flat building roofs was added with a medium priority and then with geologic hazards um conducting a feasibility study on how to make Town facilities earthquake resistant was added might seem uh interesting since there are not many earthquakes in the area however um for the FEMA and Mima review it is highly recommended that we do put measures in each of these categories so that's why some of these things might seem a little bit more of a stretch than others um however they're still needed to make sure that we're covering all of our bases so moving on from that um for extreme temperature hazards you see there's a medium priority for continuing to add green roofs in solar camp canopies and then a high priority of updating uh site plan requirements to eliminate heat Islands in parking lots and to increase shade which is something that's happening more and more um around this area for Drought hazards um you see to include drought tolerant Landscaping um including looking at drought resistant grass seed that was given a high priority as was continuing and enhancing that boxboro and Littleton uh water conservation project that was talked about in the last plan as well uh there's also um decided for a medium priority to include the rain barrels in um drought resistant grass seed and future projects as well for uh drought hazards and then again the public education piece this time on water consumption specifically um on lawns and then as Martin said there's a lot more um emphasis now on climate resiliency in these plans so that is why we talked um giving high priority to uh climate considerations and sustainability a priority in budgeting and capit capital investment plans and then also exploring producing a climate action plan um and a municipal sustainable action plan using the sustainability committee for that and then invasive species this was something that came up quite a bit in our four meetings um with the town really focusing on how to reduce those invasive plants for example uh garlic mustard pole was mentioned and kind of combined with the townwide weeklong cleanup effort as is done in um successfully neighboring towns that was given high priority as well and that was new to uh this iteration of the plan thank you got it so that's pretty much the the the blow by-blow of the kinds of mitigation measures the plan recommends there's a little more description in the plan for each one of them there's there's a cost estimate a range at least a high medium low there's a range of what years over the next 5 years it's recommended to think about there is identification of who in the town uh would be the lead like would it be Public Works would it be the fire department you know the different departments planning if it was a bylaw issue uh and uh there's also a section in there that just where the you saw the priorities they're all listed in there it's all done in a big Matrix a big table in the plan itself uh which we thought was a little bit too much to put on us on a powerpo slide but just even running through them item by item was a little more detail and a little more words on the slide than we normally have but this is the focus of the plan so we wanted to make sure you saw what what was in there so now that we have the draft plan put together we're at the point where we are tonight in fact launching a public comment period in this plan is available so not only the board and other other Town members but the members of the general public are welcome to take a look at the plan it's available they'll be downloaded from a special website page we set up for that you see here www map.org that's our website resource Library so not Hall excuse me didn't get that type SL Littleton hmp uh that's what you get when you use a page for a template from another project um so it's it's Littleton hmp obviously uh from that site you'll see uh a place that just click and download the plan as a PDF uh and we're saying uh please send comments if if anyone likes to read it and actually have comments they're welcome to do that we're asking if anyone can get comments To Us by June 18th uh if so so that the town can then take any comments finalize the plan and turn it in by the end of the month to MIMA so that's kind of the next immediate steps um the cover of the plan looks like that little graphic you see right there a picture of Long Lake on it from the air so we try to find a nicer interesting looking places to put on the cover of the plan uh so that's our next steps is just having this uh if you can maybe Advance one more slide I think we have just our um thank yous and our email address and um right there again download the plan again it should say Littleton obviously um and Littleton resilience at mc.org is an email address to which comments can be sent to us for for the plan uh and with that we'll see if you have any questions and just to add to what Martin said so we'll probably put that out under our latest news section so we can blast that out to people and they'll be able to work with the website that Martin highlighted um and uh with with the correct address and we'll um and you can receive comments that way as well so I think we get I I don't know what the full number is but it's it's a very high number of people that will get that blast and take a look that's good that's great yeah we want people to be aware of it cuz you know it affects the town this is the kind of plan that often kind of goes under the radar because it's not like everyone's aware not everyone but a lot of people are aware of your comprehensive plan your master plan your open space plan are more common plans for folks to be engaged with this one is a little newer on the Block compared to those and we really want to promote like folks being aware of what's in this plan and and letting us know you know does it cover the hazards that you're concerned about in your town uh we I think we have a good handle of that from the town officials that work but we're opening us to the broader town at this point to make sure we're not missing anything yeah the chair I I had a couple I wrote a few things down um so does this integrate with the FEMA Emergency Operations plan or like a separate it's pretty separate this is a what they call a pre- disaster plan it doesn't directly involve what you do when there's a disaster and you're responding that is your comprehensive emergency management plan cemp simp uh and every town and actually Jif knows a lot about those cuz she's actually written those kind of plans for many towns that's what kicks in when you actually have an emergency and you need to respond to it and then even longer term after response then recovery so think about it in in pre- during and post the disaster and this is in fact F used to use this term this is pre- disaster mitigation so so the so the with the expectation with the mitigation part of this the cost will come with the preparedness it's supposed to reduce the cost of what you're how much you're going to have to respond to cuz it will be hopefully less damage occurs uh everywhere from human life and injury to damage the property reduced hopefully with some of these measures and the cost of those responses in recovery less hopefully that's that's the whole idea and this is a FEMA sponsored it is a FEMA sponsored plan and it's run in the state by Mima so fima turns these National programs over to the state programs and that's that's our Mass emergency management to run I have a question um it's easy I think to measure the impact of you know a flood but it seems like climate change often is more Insidious and way more expensive if you look at what's happening in Mexico City or South Africa like the lack of water it's like systemic and it's terrible so I'm curious if FEMA is acknowledging that and sort of focusing more on the long-term Slow Burn problems than this is a great question and um I I don't know if I'm the best person to give a the definitive answer to that because it's a FEMA thing but my S my reading of what doing first of all they're they are beginning to recognize this if you looked at the FEMA guidelines for these plans 8 or 10 years ago the word climate wasn't even in there they didn't even like it wasn't even on the radar we began putting as MPC climate considerations into these plans and then all of a sudden about 5 years ago FEMA said oh we have new guidelines and guess what it's mandatory that you consider climate Okay well thank you we've kind of been trying to do that already so they they get that now what they're going to do with that is still exactly how what the result of that's going to be down the road is a little harder to know but I will say that that brick grant program and by the way I'm using sorry I'm using an acronym the grant program that you could have access to is called building resilient infrastructure and communities BRC that's a big grun you can get six and seven bigger grants out of that and I think that you're starting to see they will direct some of that funds to projects that are intended to mitigate climate impacts there's a little bit of a great area if we've always had flooding and you're mitigating flooding are you just mitigating historic flooding or are you mitigating future flooding well it's it's a longer gradient like we've always had flooding will happen in in the climate it's just going to make it likely happen more frequently and maybe deeper so it's like not a whole new T whole new Hazard that comes out of nowhere there are other hazards that are sort of coming out of nowhere that we haven't almost had at all before so things like some of these invasive species that we just never had that's that's a good examp invasive species is the first time primarily being in these plans now 5 years ago they weren't mentioned either so the good news is that Mima and FEMA are trying to evolve these plans it's a 5e cycle so every time they do that and we're working under the offices of a similar state level Hazard mitigation plan that the state put together and actually just they have to do a 5-year cycle too they just approved the newest one in September of last fall uh the previous one was 2018 5 years before that and each of these has ratcheted up how much climate work in fact um the state wide plan they're no longer calling it a hazard mitigation plan they're calling it The resilient Mass plan so they really are fully integrating climate into the state plan and we're trying to mirror that in what we're doing more with plans with towns and cities thank you it's on okay one quick thing one really quick question you you just talked about a five it's a is this a fiveyear updated it's a 5year update that's right so this plan will be good presuming Fe part a little bit later this year till 2029 thank you so with the brick grants um are we are we considered in a are we community of disaster resilience in in the resilience Zone will be qualified you'd be qualified you don't there's no special category as long as you have an approved plan you can app you can apply for these grants it's not like some places are more qualified than others any town that has an approved plan in in the whole country is eligible to apply now will your Grant get fund it's competitive so the more you can show how serious the hazard is and how much damage it does that's where like the actual Grant application you put together will have a better chance of actually being funded but it's not like oh we'll fund grants from these towns over here but not from those over there they'll fund a grant from any town that has an approved plan and with an approved plan does that make us aside from the brick grants that um help us with other federal or state gr it actually helps you with probably other state grants because the Massachusetts Municipal vulnerability Pro preparedness program MVP which as you know this town did the initial planning process for that there's some pretty big grants there for Action what they call Action grants for implementation projects and some of those can mirror what's what's in the federal grants or a supplement or if if you're not quite eligible for a Federal grant maybe you can get it so that's actually a very important second Revenue stream that you you can tap into now they don't require you to have a fee approved plan but it helps if you do sure it does it's competitive and du our already uh last one I have is um did lemonster have a plan before their flooding issues look L is not in our region so I can't speak to it I wondered that same thing I mean every time we have a town that has a really severe impact like the tornadoes and Springfield and mson and whatever most of those communities probably did have a plan because almost every town in the region has one of these plans and when you get an event like that that no one could have predicted at least not the severity of it it a little bit like the plan is it goes beyond what a plan could probably even help you with you got to recovery pretty quick it's you're now in the more recovery mode and then you may be thinking about okay how do we do much more resilient mitigation in the future yeah maybe that makes them more eligible now Ro for a brick Grant to do something that would make them more resilient yeah which relies more on History yeah on those lines I one of the questions I had is like you know Acton and surrounding towns had a lot of those micr bursts type you know those high intensity thunderstorms coming through how does the plan address things like that or is that just more on the recovery side it's probably a little more on the recovery because those happen so randomly uh we talk about high winds there is a category on that and you talk we saw there's actually one measure that talked about reinforcing windows in certain buildings um that's one measure that was a wind related measure you could by the way if you if you think there's another mitigation measure that should be in here that's why this is still a draft so maybe there's something else we should be doing about wind the town should be doing this is the time to do it and even after you have this plan approved it's there for 5 years you can always add to it all right you can always make an amendment to it if something comes up or someone has an idea or this a new grant program so you're not locked into this plan for 5 years you can you could actually change it you will need to change it in 5 years but before that if you see some specific part of that you want to update you can do that too so Al along this that same lines I was wondering like the sewage treatment plant wasn't mentioned in your infrastructure and it's like being built now so since it's not in it's not doesn't currently exist should it be I think that that's a good point if there's a site that you're in process of either planning or is it under construction already it's under construction that should be on the list and we can add that that's that's a good example maybe that wasn't thought about cuz it actually isn't up and operating we know that's going to be there so that and this is a plan for 5 year within the 5year period of this plan that will be there so absolutely you know another one would be the parking lot at 550 is like one of the heat Islands on the map and if if um it's going to get completely new developed like we can talk about how to reduce the heat is yep absolutely that's a very good point I think Jennifer mentioned something about like living roofs something like that there's all sorts of different that are Incorporated in there with you know water basins green roofs obviously solar panels and that sort of thing SS my other question was about like Heating and Cooling zones like you know when you know the senior center or the police station or any of these buildings we would want to use is this something that we would outline in this plan that yeah they're talked about in this plan and I don't remember if there are but if there are any needs along those lines what we find in many towns they may have a center they would use as a cooling center they haven't maybe have to use it very often but that would be their intention uh but maybe it's got like a rickety old Generator y that could be an upgrade and actually that could be a grant too or it needs new HVAC systems on the yeah so upgrades to those facilities to make them work better as cooling or heating centers uh could be something you would think about as a project for sure and we also do Mass care plans at MPC and that a lot of it is all tied in so I've been working on many of those in addition to the comprehensive emergency management plan because all of this is kind of like puzzle piec together and you're able to really do a lot if you are able to do those this plan and those do as well okay hits on a lot of those points that's probably something we should look into yeah as we're upgrading the HV just just be prepared yeah you know battery generators we yeah generators and things like that and Shaker Lane if we're going to do Shaker Lane absolutely great it's good stuff thank you thank you thank you for the thanks very much thanks the team yeah thank you to the whole team really they just did a great job thank you it's good to see light and water in there because of the whole preventative me it's like kept taking care of trees before they become a problem yeah weing L uh clean Lakes committee update we'll show them oh good thank you oh the energy mil foil little [Applause] bastard three different ponds uh one spec Long Lake and uhan on those pictures can you uh just introduce your oh certain John fome chairman clean lights committee um I represent uh Long Lake uh have for well since the Inception of the of the of the uh of the committee uh long before we were part of the town uh we have been uh busy for about 20 years uh trying to chase down invasives uh trying to keep uh waterways open um addressing uh issues that will you so on the uh in the recent annual report from last year um and I wanted to briefly go over some of those things but really uh focus on um one of the biggest problems we have right now is that's our loss of funding um two years ago the uh Commonwealth decided that the way we were receiving our money through a cell tower fund uh at uh uh on property that belongs to the water department uh was not uh was not our money to had uh it was money that needed to be used for the Enterprise uh of uh of providing clean drinking water uh to uh consumers uh of the water department uh facilities uh so we lost uh the savings we had which amounted about $400,000 and probably an annual income of about $80,000 and uh uh kind of knocked the wind out of our sales for a short time we're still recovering from that and that's why we're coming to you tonight um as I uh review the uh the annual report from last year you see that uh uh the Water Commissioners have been very generous uh in this transition time uh helping us out uh with funding uh for what was a a really uh extreme uh uh in invasive uh situation last summer uh unanticipated entirely uh we had problems with manwan that we've never had before extreme problems at spec Pond uh and uh and those have gone on to recur uh we seem to be having these are recent photos uh and this is uh this is fresh growth uh that's just below the surface and taking over again so we're very disappointed to see that happening was difficult to explain last year but as I alluded to maybe it was a climate related sort of event uh maybe uh well something we have yet to put a finger on uh we feel as though in the past we've been pretty much on top of these things uh most of our Lakes are Lake uh uh Long Lake and ins spectacle pond have usually had uh uh herbicide treatments in the past uh recently we've gone into Eco harvesting which is a machine that literally comes along plucks the uh the invasives right out of the bottom of the of the of the lake uh it's working very well for us right now there a few things can go sideways but those are in your notes uh but if it's done properly it's UNC conscientiously uh it pulls a great many of weeds out of our lakes and removes that that nutrient mass that we have a problem with when we hit it with herbicides when we hit it with herbicides we've got dead and dying plant material that goes down and forms one more layer on the bottom of our Lakes this has been going on for well for us for for 15 20 years uh but uh but the deposits we put in our legs uh are are taking a serious toll uh all of our roads storm drains go directly into our Lakes uh we get mess we get uh we get nutrient sumps uh we get things that feed the weed Invasion and it seems to be increasing uh I was hoping for for better news this year so far not so much um the uh the Water Commissioners as I said I've been very generous to see us through uh I met with uh with with Ryan and Gary uh a couple of guys from the water Commissioners uh and we talk about things uh beginning of this year uh uh this uh this calendar year uh and of course it was far too late for us to appear before this board uh Gary had explained we're already slashing three a half M million from uh from other people's budgets uh but we're coming to you now to partner uh with the water Commissioners uh to see if there's some way that we can't recruit some of the income uh that uh that we lost through the decision of the of the Commonwealth um in for this year we uh we went to CPC uh and we obtained funds to address our problems at Long Lake uh at doleful Pond uh which is down New Town Road uh and uh and also for uh for some Renovations at milpond uh those three ponds aren't really part of the purview of the water commissioners because they're more concerned with say spectacle Pond which is above an aquifer uh right there where where a well station is uh so anything that would pertain to spectacle Pond they would certainly be focused on as something was worth worthwhile uh for their for their rate payers uh to say you know these things should be should be kept after um somewhat in Lake mwan but not so much uh not at all at Long Lake do we have uh any kind of hope for water commissioner uh supplements or or funding uh mostly because we're an entirely different wed we're in the swasco Watershed drains into the conquered River uh down into into Sudbury um so uh we don't even enter into areas where uh Littleton draws water from AR first so again we come back to a funding problem know there's not a lot going on certainly as a result of uh of the town meeting earlier in the month uh I realize things are tight but uh our pockets are empty so so we come to you and hope to find some way uh that uh uh you know I C can certainly uh re uh uh reapply at uh uh at the uh the CPC um I'm not sure we exactly pertain to what they're doing the focus is not on water another concern we have of course townwide everyone's welcoming conservation land trying to reach out and create a network and it's great to surround our ponds with conservation land it's great protection it's wonderful but to skip over the concerns and the needs of those Lakes is something we need to sort of change as a town because we need to we need to focus on those too they don't sustain themselves and we beat them up repeatedly so we have uh we have that to bring as uh something we address on a constant basis uh but uh but our hands are tied uh without the funding so um short of too much else we can get into weed mitigation we can get into almost any subject you'd like but I wanted to put out there the need for for funding for partnership for the water Commissioners uh somehow and maybe it's me going to fincom maybe whatever it takes we what is the need John what is like what's the the annual spend over the last 5 years you've got you've got a copy of of our Pro budget y uh everything changed last year yeah with this crazy invasive uh we had uh we we wiped out our budget right off the bat yeah I think the water Commissioners were trying to ease us through into a transition period to explain that we're going to have to sort of uh recalibrate where the money is coming from because the thousands of dollars you had are gone uh so we look at the bottom lines uh I I think this year where are we we're at uh 100,000 for spec Bond 100,000 for spec Bond it's it's in the range of $200,000 it seems like it's in a range of 200 to $250,000 a year for a while uh there's there's spikes that come but it's just anticipated things that we need to attend to uh and projects we'd like to take on there's even projects we haven't reflected in in our budget but that's basically it and so uh I think the water Commissioners were thinking they contribute $80 to $100,000 they did about did 150,000 last year they were very generous was made up yeah if if I could John you mentioned that we had sat down to talk about you know talk about this is is um how to handle this and and I think John also pointed out that some of the aspects of when you put together with a five-year plan in front of you which is up on the screen um you know it's changed a little bit because the invasives and there is more involved with that and what that means so what you know what what John pointed out what we did this year was looking for a mix of funding from the water Commissioners who as John pointed out are more focused on uh the areas where are tied to the Watershed and water quality for drinking water quality and then the other parts of that we were looking at were uh filled in with the CPC so I think the question becomes then too um I mean we've been trying to put more and more projects on onto the CPC and and investigating the issue um you know a lot of these projects are eligible for CPC funding so um CPC funding provides a consistent you know uh place that we can go to is another resource um I I would for see this um you know for you John is something else that you can continue to go back to on a regular basis uh you know in with you know as a complimentary thing to what uh the U lwd board is is is supporting you with um you know so funding comes from many different places and and where this is an eligible cost uh I I would think that um you know we should be focusing in on that and and um where that doesn't you know really doesn't impact I can't say it doesn't impact the tax rate because we are collecting that but we're collecting it for these types of projects invasives are that and it does fall un under it so um you know I don't know you know say going out um and thinking all right we need to find a separate resource when we already have one in place is isn't really you know is necessary there may be times when CPC may may may not have adequate funding or may not be able to do everything on your list and I think that that that then um you know presents itself as a separate question but um you know I I think um for the most part and what we were able to do this year is a model you could probably follow for ensuing years they were very helpful this year yeah well questions we don't have if I could sorry uh we don't or they don't have um a subject it it's open space and preservation of the open space right right but that falls as but it falls as an eligible category and because it does fall as an eligible category it's something that we can utilize the fund for then you know those are monies that have already been raised and um you know is um is something that then doesn't need to compete against when we need to replace the replacement back ho for DPW so um so I think that it really becomes a matter of you know starting and continuing with that model and refining it and and uh U and looking ahead to continue to put those applications again in partnership with what you're doing with lwd which is going to be in that $80,000 to $100,000 range and you know we continue to sustain it and then if you identify it early enough in the process then maybe then it get brought into the capital planning process which really kicks off into the you know November December time frame so I think if beginning to think about that knowing when the schedule is and and then you know coming to us if you say hey we you know we can't cover something that we we deem to be really critical and we can look at it at that time sure sure yeah I want to get a jump on it as quickly as possible I'm glad just sort of hanging here absolutely um yeah Mark I I was just thinking so I at the end of the day um there's going to have to be a cooperation between the town CPC and the obviously the water department some some form of stabilized funding has to come from those three sources probably um otherwise we're going to be in a reactive mode the town side CPC is going to be able to help it's going to take planning on your part um what we need and have to keep putting in for that um I think between us and water um and besides the capital plan obviously when you need things um we we definitely can get you on the capital on the items list when like everybody else that would that's where I foresee this immediate problema yeah and what I'm trying to say is the first place that they should be looking for beyond the first place is lwd and the funding that they provide there for the for water sources that's that's that's one water is doing that yeah and they will continue to do that but I'm talking about um this this is something that potentially that's not going to be sustainable we need to start thinking about um how we're how we're going to fund this to some in some regard or we're going to have to beef up the fincom reserve because oh my goodness this is a horrible year of Evas and we're going we're going to need emergency money to handle that last year was a trend yeah so I I I just don't I I don't want I want to get ahead of it so I don't know if that means we we put this as part of a budget this year or we continue to to work Chase it I hate chasing things like that but to credit the to credit the the committee the committee's done a lot of that with the 5year plan you it was it's been a big adjustment right right so can I can I ask CU I don't quite understand that let's say look at the 2025 budget so does that 255 number include the contributions from the water department and CPC yes it's all combined here okay so so obvious so so the that's the total spend but it would mitigated by those other sources of funding yes okay yes thank you yeah as the uh as the the line there uh anything under uh mil Pond say Long Lake probably Lake manwan would be funded outside of the water got it okay got it so another way we could potentially do this is that the water department instead of paying for this donates the money to the CPC right and then we can get the match and then we should probably last year we were talking about whether or not we should be upping the CPC contribution from 1% to two right and what we were going to do to fund more in the CPC and we might want to look at this as something that's going to be a continual expense coming from the CPC that we know of and anticipate in the CPC budget every year and there I mean so instead of paying it out of operational cost we get the match from CPC which makes a lot of sense for the taxpayers right it does but the all all of your everything isn't covered by CPC I'm assuming that's why the the water with some of their money probably could be used for things that CPC can't be used for is that correct or is is so far is everything you've asked for been cpc's been able to manage it yeah uh we've got four different projects we're funding through CPC one's Recreation the other three are open space okay so then that Pro so we probably should kind of figure out how to get the right people from CPC Finance water I'm not sure legally we could do that because you're when you're those funds are coming out of they're raising funds from um fees so you know then to say they're not through CPC we should kind of talk to the water to get you know a fiveyear commitment on what they can fund so we know what we have to fund outside and that was part of our conversation when we all met was because they were funding some of these things over and above and they said time out we can't this isn't you know we don't have an unlimited bank here so that was when the idea of the CPC funding to help supplement what was required um and what we see you know through this 5year plan what we need to stay on top of so I mean I you know if you look at you know the FY 25 plan which I think uh you know John is is mostly mostly funded between the various sources and then you know you start bringing that down that $200,000 range I don't think any of it is um you know I don't think any of it is uh unfund or that we we couldn't necessarily meet it's just trying to under I think what John and the committee needs is some sort of sense and direction as to where that um you know how we're going to continue to move forward with which I think is something we should be meeting with CPC to kind of start setting their expectations and if if this is a recurring expense from the CPC then there may be push back I don't know from them that's like we can't we won't be able to fund anything else because this is taking a large percentage of I would suggest that we meet with you sing bule so we know we can ah of these unexpected potentially but especially in the fall um when we're meeting with other departments and we're we're getting down to the you know those final numbers on budgets if there's something we see a shortfall that you're really need something for we can put it as in part of our happy to keep you in the loop yeah that's really the main and and I also would add that you know we should get you know the numbers from what Waters Department can or contribute as early as possible right yeah yeah we can we can ask them for the 5e plan as well U Mr chair so um one question I have is is if we are saying you can keep going back to CPC and we can make a 5-year plan you can go to CPC over and over and over again at what point does that become maintenance yeah um and so and then another question I had was um so we we were talking about invasives assuming female cares about aquatic invasives um we might want to look into WEA cuz John came to my office hours on Friday and we talked about this a little bit um at what point does it make sense for us to have our own ego Harvester rather than Contracting it out every year if we could get a grant to pay for it yeah that's a big number if I recall we talked about it's over $100,000 it's a big number yeah but we're paying we're paying pay $27,000 at Long Lake yeah so paid for itself pretty quick um sorry go ahead and then just another point for us all to remember in the future is that if we were to pursue that we would want to make sure that we've got somewhere to store it once we start talking about the new DPW space how big is this thing I'm talking about it's it's this big so just if I make it to address points so the big wheel um so so in terms of the maintenance it is ongoing maintenance and and that's AOW under CPC so it's so as an expense that we can charge against it with presuming CPC is and the committee's allowable to it then that's where we can direct it again that's part of all the conversations we were having in the budget cycle is where can we put things that go to CPC so and if it keeps coming back you know then that's okay it's not it's and I think to the cpc's credit they were very openm minded and I think you know kind of came late in the cycle to them but they were you know they were very cooperative I think you know meeting with them and continuing to bring that forward is is a possibility and and as far as uh you know buying the equipment that's certainly a thought but we also then you know we need to have the Staffing and the in the training to be able to do the vehicle harvesting it may be it may be worthwhile but you know it's a lot to we you know so that's just the qu which I don't know I that's another thing to examine you know then whether or not we have know quite a number of communities have have purchased these and then they sell them back to the to the Tradesmen who who use them all the time because they just they just don't want the maintenance they don't want the hassles they don't want the headaches they don't perform on their own but uh one of the biggest problems we had with uh with applying for CPA funds was uh they're they're leaning towards Capital Improvements uh they want to point to a project where you say you know we we established that trail there or we bought that conservation land or you know we bought this Lake can't do the can't do the buy and the L thing but the recurring uh what we call it management we won't mention M maintenance it's Way Beyond maintenance uh and uh and and if it's if it's management and it's recurring then sometimes we get a little bit of flack sure and and John the only thing you know it's not you know it's not an endless well you know so that's the thing these are trade-offs that we have to make and that's why when we were talking about these and that wasn't you you guys weren't part of that cycle in the beginning but when we were talking about where we can fund you know any of these projects we always said okay where can we put things to CPC that was our first thing so if these are eligible expenses you're not necessarily wrong you know people love to buy them they that that's great and that's wonderful but you know it's it's like affordable housing we keep putting money to affordable housing but we don't critique is we're not generating you know so it's it's an allowable use and I I I fully respect where you're coming from but it also means that other things then could potentially be pushed out speaking speaking as a finance director next to me great I appreciate the push it really it really made all the difference this year there's no greater resource we I mean that's so right and I think I think to John's point we need to start thinking about public works you know it's not just potholes you know we're a Lake Community um and so our Lakes are part of our part of our responsibility for public works as well okay so can I ask why other waterways in town aren't on the list like Fort Pond and beaver Fort Pond is not does not have any public access okay uh and it's really that's our criteria you have to have Public Access as as it is most of these are our great ponds according to the state and so uh if if you have uh visitors that cut on there and you know it's it's it's something where there's a boat launch there's a beach what have you that's the major criteria and Beaver Brook uh Beaver Brook is is one of our concerns we test there uh we have uh we haven't done any kind of uh uh repairs or mitigation or anything there uh over the years but we test we uh we examine that we go back and forth on testing we tend to focus on lakes some years we focus on streams but I have a question about the Eco harvesting if if you spend you know if you spend $335,000 on Lake M mwaniki does that mean if you spent 70,000 it would be twice as good or is it 35,000 is about about as much as it you reach diminishing returns it depends on conditions okay and we've had this discussion uh if it's a big year for invasives then that 35,000 or whatever it is may not be sufficient uh it's also uh comparable funds coming from Westford uh in the case of mwan because everything split uh the town line goes right through the the water body uh so everything's compensated there uh they got especially big headache but uh but if if we can assess the amount of work that needs to be done if uh if Long Lake for example only needs $115,000 worth of work this year and we've budgeted 27 we wouldn't spend the 27 OB so there is a point where you just you you can't run the thing any longer it doesn't do any more good wouldn't wouldn't make any difference wouldn't make any how does Westford fund this excuse me do you know how Westford funds their share uh they have allocations uh yeah Dave you want to speak on that for a second hi uh Dave bar um I'm also member of the West Health lakes and ponds collaborative which is assist Organization for clean Lakes committee um Westward uh for 10 years funded uh their uh Lake management with uh CPC funding and a few years ago CPC said this looks like maintenance so this is the last year we're going to do it and then when they went to um uh a town a line item in the town budget uh they still have uh some uh CPC funding left over that they haven't spent yet that they're going to be spending in the next year or two um but um theyve moved to a light item uh in their Tom budget um this year they tried to get an override uh the base budget with without an override was only $5,000 for Lake management the override budget included 50,000 for Lake management uh the override went through to meeting but it didn't pass at the general election so they've only got $5,000 uh in the town budget uh they do have 100,000 left over from previous CPC funding so um we're working with them to see what we can do for sharing the cost for uh they have about um eight or 10 Lakes uh of which about four they they do um treatments on yeah so they've gone to the same kind of kind of thing one thing I would also mention about the you know CPC funding uh for it it does occur to me that um their funding cycle is kind of late in the overall uh budgeting process by the time they decide whether they're going to uh accept uh a request or not you you are already I think mostly have your uh budget already kind of locked down so that could be a an issue I think that's also just a matter of planning and timing with it too you know right knowing that that cycle that cycle for that year right right yeah exactly but I I would agree with you the way that the time got this year was you're right it was a little late but uh think the process generally is they don't I mean we can probably get some sense of whether they would be willing to do it or not but they don't decide until I think like February that's that's right yeah but at least from this committee and other CPC committees that I've worked with I mean it's not like it's a a form of trickery or anything like that as long as you're working with them early enough in the process you know usually they're working all working together in good faith especially as as these projects are such worthy initiatives great than do you have anything fur anything no I was just I was just thinking that the it's just going to come down to communication at least for the first few years this is a great first meeting because I think now it made everybody aware of what's going on I think we're going to end up seeing it in one way or another well you were key in bringing the whole thing together so I think going to be important okay we won't let it we won't let it get Dusty so thank you we'll keep you all up rest of what's going on appreciate it thank you all very much thank you thank you appreci your work uh director of Elder and Human Services Department request naming of the new Senior Center Liz is not here today but there are some members of the Council on Aging that we're going to present yes GNA try to spill in for her I do that but I'm GNA try so okay I'm Marge Payne chair the Council on Aging and as you all know we work very closely with Liz and and she did share with me the um letter she wrote to you people regarding the naming of the this building that's out under construction over there had to get my bearings here I think so and and then also the select board on um let's see it was on March 13th that we had our monthly meeting no May sorry I don't know where why we had March down but anyway May 13th the um select uh Council and aging board had a discussion about the naming of that building also and we um I sent a memo to your Town Administrator to you people and we agreed with Liz actually in her you know suggestion and that is that the the building should be named the center on chattic street and the COA board though specified specifically specified they would like to see a somewhere home of um Elder and Human Services the COA and Veterans agent because those are the people that are going to be in that building in the beginning I mean down the road in the future who knows but um I think the key thing is that we all realize it is more than a senior center the senior center will be and all of those rooms will be for senior activities during the hours that seniors can use them so we request according to your rules and your laws you you a rule about new build buildings and naming things so we're asking that you think about this and consider it um if you have questions for me there's a few board members present they can answer questions too but um fire away ramar is not my in my wheelhouse but I was thinking the center at Shad street but there's probably a reason why it's on Shad Street I don't know well it could be at I mean that's you know that's a small thing I think that's a pretty small change but at whatever sit here over some I'm not a I didn't get a in Grand Marina so I didn't know if it was a grammatical thing that I couldn't not to my knowledge but any I think the whole concept is that it's a center it's not yes a center it does house you know and you know every time I think about this whole thing I'm just going to deviate for a minute because it just amazes me when I reflect back to when I first became involved in 2011 and that Elden Human Services consisted of two employees and it was you know a very small operation and today I can't it's amazing the workload and the work that they produce with five employees so there's certainly the need there and it is the center of activity of many ages really so because it Services the whole town did you consider naming it the Wilson Aquatic Center so looking on Google real quick it Center on is usually the center on a subject and Center ad is usually a center at a location so it might be more appropriate to call the center at shat Street I I don't have a strong opinion one way or the other but there are also like the center on Maine and the center on you know kfax Street and so well I do have naming right so you do the Aquatic only to the Aquatic Center Mark May Mark did the um just simply the the shadic center come about it all or no I don't think I heard that come up but you know that's certainly possible out the grandma and we could do it like Ohio State University we could say the Shad you know I think it it just too it's um several documents have come out in in the course of the building construction and everything and so and the center on shadik street has been how they've been titled you know so that I think that was kind of why it came to mind for everybody's thinking but if so we would appreciate it if we I don't know how you people want to proceed or you want to wait or whatever but that is our recommendation from the Department of Elder and Human Services director as well as the Council on Aging board so absent some other strong argument I would just go with what Liz wants with both paries yes Liz and with COA Liz to COA yeah so if there's no further get out of the way see we're quick you know you got some time to catch up on here so so but anyway it's really not it doesn't require I think a lot of discussiones but um okay and I know you have to have an open hearing to further discuss naming of things according to your um the law which is we have it in here somewhere um policy 25 policy on naming Town facilities so yeah thanks very much thank you have to open it to yeah I think well I the way the polic worded this is like an introduction and then we can vote it at our next one okay yeah so so consider that just since we do have a meeting in between take it back to your board I'll I'll let know you mentioned that that's it I'm not going to uh thank you I won't be a nay vote either if it's on amongst okay Human Resources rather transfer 150,000 to the special injury Iden fund Mr chairman this is uh this really has to go with um because we still have a at this point a permanent uh fire chief so this is uh this covers the salaries for uh interim positions with the chief coming in and the existing uh in uh fire chief I believe the board voted on this last um September so this would be effective as of July 1 20124 so for the beginning of fiscal year 2025 okay any discussion where's the money coming from uh so it's from a special fund the town meeting had uh okay I'm sorry got it okay and we actually uh at the town meeting we put additional money into it got it okay ready for motion yep move that the select board vote per Mass General Law chapter 40 section 111f to transfer $150,000 from the special injury leave Indemnity fund effective as of July 1st 2024 fiscal year 2025 for the payment of expenses for providing replacement services for injured firefighters second moved by Matthew second by Karen all those in favor I I thank you next sorry guys just comp froz there classification of position Town Administrator Police Chief Fire Chief uh yes if uh Mr chairman members of the the select board it's uh this is I believe it's if you almost want to classify as housekeeping because the uh this is to actually move those three positions onto onto the area of the grid because to reflect the uh contracts that uh um negotiated exactly have negotia I believe a previous chair uh you know has maybe has more information about that yeah I I mean I think we've had discussion on this um it's just putting it where long so I I believe that the grade 24 um we we'll probably see something come out of the uh the study uh that we've paid for for this year that'll kind of ratify this a little bit more but this is getting ahead this is just simply the the grade change but then the process to get the the numbers add up to these will come next so this is more there's an and there because it's the three positions cor yeah but I I thought we were talking about not having the contract employees on the grid I thought that's what where we were working towards it that was me for sure but I think for a reference I think it helps um it helps people know kind of where where we are cuz it's right now we're still in the the ballpark in those in those grades so it makes it we can still do it I'm willing to do it the other way absolutely take care contracts but it um it does cause a little bit of confusion um having them in the in the graded system be when I say confusion also causes a little bit not going to say animosity but I think other employees see these you know every 3 years these employees get to to create have a new contract and they can get a lot more benefits and a lot of other things whereas a regular uh employee doesn't have that ability so I think when we have them on the grade on the grade structure and they see perhaps they go from here on the grade step whatever way up to here with another the next contract it it because that's what the market is is pressing on us um it's it's not the best look and where I don't know the history behind the positions being in the grade system we always have had that asterisk that they're contract employees and they don't really fall in the the compensation grid but if but if we're negotiating every 3 years then isn't it even more demoralizing to see someone jump we're going to chase it we be chasing it forever yes instead of just saying well here's your new salary yeah so I mean that's another argument for not having them graded yeah if they're a contract employee they're not on the grid like I mean without Michelle here talking I know there's there's the mun system behind this that there's a lot of work that goes into creating putting these individuals on a number that sits Within These grids otherwise they have to create a special literally a special grade for each individual that's outside the grade which is three I mean it's not an enormous amount of positions but more than three contracted employees though there's at least five right because of Finance isn't Finance uh um um a contract employee in the library no you're not no not him um is didn't we I know we had an account Alicia was Alicia was yeah I thought it was by by Statute that we had to have the town treasure Town account you can but you don't have we okay and I know the library directors yeah I I think we would we would probably just say that the contract employees aren't on the grid they very well and more than likely are always going to fall somewhere in the Grid it's just it's it's hard to stick them onto a number that sits there in the grid with the exact Cola the exact everything that increases every year with every other employee because theirs might not by contract they could negotiate something that says it's 2% this year 1% this year 2 3% that year so it that is even another reason not to put them on the grid yes that's my argument nothing you're saying is like arguing for like putting them I don't understand why I don't want to be the only one that no no but I don't understand what are the Alternatives is you areg you to put them on the grid and say this is how we treat all of our employees so this is your negotiation stance right except that they're contract employees and so the expectation I think is not that they get a cola and a and a flat 2% like the rest of the employees but that's the way the school department and all the other contracts are kind of set up right um well at the end of 3 years does the superintendent get a 2% and go up a grade the school all the school department is in a union and they get you're talking un yeah but that's yeah I feel like that's different too that I mean there that's a contracted name but it's essentially aggregating people into a grid I mean you're yes you're aggregating into a grid based on contract and every employee that's not aggregated by contract is aggregated by bylaw basic yeah so you know we we've been I'm not going to say lucky because I know a lot of work goes into this that our contracts of our different unions we historically have lined them up pretty close to the same number the same Cola in their contracts when that necessarily doesn't have to happen on any given year that could literally change and all of a sudden we have a fire contract here police here um schools here and then what do we do with the town employees we've got where are they going to fall you normally they just fall in line with everybody else so um I think we've that that's something we're going to have to look at in the future but this particular one if if you guys right now we we have positions that fall within the the the grid and we know how difficult the market is on some of these positions well we just went out and got a fire chief and what we were up against and you know and and the Town Administrator and looking at the market um I'm just looking 3 years from I think we're going to be right back where we started we be like how do we do we expand are we going to have an invisible grid that puts us out to grade 15 like you know step 15 like we had to do with the police um the police chief or something I I prefer to not have them on the grid at all and The Negotiator if it takes a little bit more work and mun I mean it is what it is we're negotiating the select board is negotiating instead of instead of negotiating them into a salary that fits in to the grid and it's just you negotia to a number the negotiation should be free and clear of the grid but it's a good guideline for where we think those positions belong in our own heads we we see the top of the GD so that I think is the that is the first thing you've said where it's like okay yeah that makes sense that's a good reason to put them in the grid but at the end of the day it's just a guideline anyway right I know so I mean so and we've been very fiscally responsible while keeping them on the grid a counterargument is Our Town Administrator police chief and fire chief all have three-year contracts still so why would we be doing this now this well taking them out you mean sure that's a fair question because this will this does put them where they they are right now but but why but why why what's the impetus to doing this now rather than waiting town at town meeting when we when all the town residents are looking at the the book so and and it says it shows them where they are and they're really not it's kind of like so wouldn't a better thing just be to vote to to take them off the grid because all together rather than reclassifying from one to another yes I think it would be better to take them off the grid entirely like I understand the the rationale for moving them but I think it's better just not to have them on the grid and and actually I think if we do this to the police chief I think it actually says in his contract what grade and step he's going to be paid for the remainder of his contract so we would have to go back and uh amend his contract oh we could put language in there unless otherwise stated but the contract already been signed have to go back and amend the and I and I have talked to the police chief about that that if something were to happen here we would potentially have to go back and look at the numbers in that grid and try to get as close to as possible to where we were that's that's what we're up against if we try to stay within in the grid that's all um but that's now the good part about the contracts is if we are having a a year where we we're really in in a budget crisis we also have the flexibility now just to well it's you're a 1% this year you know you're one this first year your next contract is 1% um or zero or or whatever it is so I guess I I mean like you say there's no reason to do this now just take no action yeah well well I I would rather see them come off the grid then because currently they they sit in those old grades they're sitting in those old grades so if we take them off the grid do we have to go back to um Matt's contract and re and rewrite it I think we just put language in there unless unless otherwise stated in but you don't because it's just a number that it's just it's circumstance he happens to be sitting on a number on the grid all them so Ryan actually I think Matt's contract actually says explicitly grade and step that's right and I did have I did work to have those removed from the new two new contracts so maybe we could take some time and look at this again Gary and figure out I'd like to talk to HR a little bit this is your recommendation well this one because I I I thought the feel was we wanted to keep them in the grid here in my brain how to do that makes sense yeah but I I believe we could very easily just take them off the grid and then when we do our our the annual Town report it has the 24 grades and then it just has these three positions at the bottom these are contract employees are these five positions are contract employees so I guess one more question Ryan is are there other besides the entries into munice would there be other follow-on problems or additional work as a result of taking these three positions Off the Grid yeah so so each you know so if you have someone already in the grid then um it's fairly straightforward as to what the next year will look like for those individual so for the three then it would have to be custom but it's not you know tremendous but that's set out in the contract in their contracts right and that would be right right so each year you'd have to when you establish a new fiscal year okay but but you know for three people it's not that's not so bad you're talking about the entire workplace it's it would be more problematic but you know certainly a doable task so we should maybe just wait and you you can I think know K we can maybe talk some more about that and figure out what and bring Kim into it I like to talk that's fine that's fine we can do that and then we'll come back sure no problem no problem um I would include the library director in there too just because they're a contract employee that's on the [Applause] grid uh okay uh 3F amend the town compensation grid schedule B2 for temporary seasonal employees by creating grades five and six this is uh uh the DPW director ask HR to expand um the temporary seasonal employee table uh because specifically he has one employee that is soon to retire uh however that individual would still like to stay on on a couple days a week to operate the the sweeper in which uh with that kind of extensive experience there was no one else within the department and this individual will take this on on a seasonal basis hence uh uh the what is before you um tonight sweeper and the uh catch Basin cleaner just says the sweet okay yeah thought and I can speak a little bit to this at the personal advisory committee meeting um it did become apparent as the members were looking at those positions that the equipment operator grade six was um it was different it it was it was aged it didn't it it didn't look like the labor position that we we had talked about what a labor versus a the equipment operator was and the grades were exactly the same and they they're not they shouldn't be because they actually one does has obviously not everybody can drive a street license or the different licenses that come with that so that's that's where this came about but that that's the number number one reason why it even came to in front of the Pac and Michelle but from that we started to look at this like where did this these old grades come from and how' they come to being so I think we're going to we'll see at next town meeting not the November one probably next uh spring um a little bit of an expanded table to give the DPW a little more flexibility um because it right now they're crammed into I think three grades when there's actually with all the new different equipment and technology that there actually licenses and requirements that probably could expand on that table a little bit that's um I'll have to recuse myself from this item as I may have a family member working as a temporary SL seasonal employee starting tomorrow so but is he the equipment operator well but it it's the temporary seasonal employe in order just to avoid any hint of it I'm just going to recuse myself so I will let you Vice M Vice chair so I just I had a couple questions on on this in general one one is it would be good just to see the job descriptions um so that we can just better differentiate what a operator is versus a labor and things like that um another general question is we have the rule that says anyone hired over a step three has to come before us but there's only four steps here so is the plan that they can hire steps one through three or is it just what I I this just one seems different just an old outdated policy again that we're going to have to work with so I mean this this is the stuff that yeah that that's something we're going to have to address Mark because you're right it wasn't designed for a four-step table right it was it was designed for a you know a 10 step table okay but um and if I thought Michelle I didn't realize she was on Leaf through today I thought she'd be here to talk she could actually talk to the PD side of it too the position description yeah I mean again it doesn't that wouldn't necessarily stop you from establishing this and voting it through but I we canly right y I mean yeah I think it's just trying to to address a staffing me y okay right yep move that the select board vote to amend the town's compensation grid schedule B2 temporary seasonal employees by creating grades five and six as shown on the proposed schedule B2 grid and move that the select board vote to establish a new position for a seasonal equipment operator on grade six on the town's compensation grid schedule B2 temporary seasonal employee EMP es second mooved by Karen seconded by Gary all those in favor I I I four and one recusal it's a lot of work on a seasonal employee two months okay vot to hire Kim as the assessing clerk lot lot of questions about this one I know yes Mr chairman um there was an opening as as you know that the I think it was April that went to uh went to a neighboring Community to become the principal assessor there uh which uh uh Kim had uh wanted to expand her uh uh her experience within the municipal uh uh operations and uh Kim wanted to uh go move over to the assessing uh to the to the as the assessing Clerk and the field Lister in the assessa office um and both Kathy and Diane uh working cooperatively and everyone is very very supportive of of of the move and and uh you know we're looking forward to it um are there any questions no no um I just my only question is when a position goes down a grade is there I don't know what happens in the handbook does anyone familiar with that oh the handbook I'm not when an employee goes down a grade I know we're moving them over a step steps but I don't know if there's anything any ramifications in the handbook I know think so generally you know there's I know there's when you go up I didn't know what there was when you went yeah no I I can't I can't speak to the town side just the federal side you don't lose money yeah well that's why we're you step out completely but if you can go down and still within you try to put them in the line okay for motion move that the select board vote to hire Kim prel as the assessing SL field Lister at grade n step five second move by Matthew second by Chuck all those in favor I I play in the room congratulations Kim good luck thank you thank you when do you start two weeks does that open up something else yes yes it does do you want to say anything or thank you all very much for supporting I really appreciate thank you for stepping up yeah thank you for all your work in the clerk's office and good luck in the assessing office so now we're looking for an assistant clerk now we have to break in a new assistant clerk okay all right okay uh appointments appoint a resident to the Housing Authority um so as I sit on the Housing Authority I can speak to this um Ben henkins is now the only applicant um um Miss samarco withdrew her application then has been sitting on the board for three years now I suppose as a tenant and uh yeah I he's great okay good enough endorsement for me no questions move that select board vote to appoint Benjamin T henkins Jr as a member of the Housing Authority for a term of three years expiring June 30th 2027 second move by Matthew second by Karen all those in favor I I thank you public input uh start with like board updates um you want to go first Gary yeah I didn't have much just to I the Memorial Day Parade obviously it's we had actually perfect weather for marching in a parade probably not the best for watching the side but um it was a great event a lot of work went into it I know a lot of departments um participated uh great community event and once again every every year it just uh goes off without a hitch and it was it was a great well attended and um I it was an honor to to march in the event so thank you Littleton I just sorry that I wasn't able to be there I was at a family wedding but um I just see the the posts on Facebook and whatnot and thank you for our legislators for showing up as well yeah thank you cew uh nothing for me today Archard group what's that anything from the new Archard group um no I think I mean we are planning on a joint meeting on Thursday with the orchard group I think we can cover pretty much everything then it's I guess it's just fair to say that so that the public knows we're I think we also have it later in the attend want talk about that then too okay um ditto everybody else on the U Memorial Day Parade it was um a pleasure to march in even if it was isn't a pleasure to watch necessarily weatherwise but um yeah it went off really well thanks to everyone who's involved uh office hours were on Friday that was mostly um focused on clean Lakes so that uh thanks to everyone who showed up for that and that's about it okay uh I so I was also in the parade I want to thank everyone for showing up I uh would like to encourage more veterans to come and either March or ride in the parade and years future years I attended a Mass Housing and economic Forum with uh Kim Driscoll online a few weeks ago uh they're talking more about housing grants and the npta communities moving on I wanted to congratulate all the middle schoolers who were in The Lucky Hudson play um I I unfortunately I wasn't able to attend but I heard there were 52 participants and the play went off without a hitch so congratulations um last week I attended a presentation in this room by from the subv valley trustees um they are developing a an online mapping system and um right now it's I got four separate um data viewers they call them where you can look at you can look at Littleton properties and uh and it helps you kind of um assess which ones should be pref for farmland or habitat I forget what all four categories are but so it's a good way of starting to you developing a rubric for how to evaluate properties um and there were some questions and comments there about how other communities were using it and um the ACT planning board is actually starting to use it for how they're doing their open space development so that they can figure out where in a parcel if they're doing an open space development the open space should be so um there's a lot of potentials for this um and stay tuned so that's all I have Mr shair um Mr chairman remember of the select board just a few few things uh uh the uh pox and wreck uh as as I have distributed uh the text PCT pictures today they started the permanent walkway should be done in a week uh they've also started the lifeguide Lifeguard c training uh and at this point right now uh weekends the beaches are open uh from the uh it I want to make the announcement that uh we have been informed that from a community compact Grant of uh $250,000 uh that was a team effort by lwd and uh submitted what on the town side so it's going to be fiber optic you know throughout the town uh one thing a couple things that we'll be able to to uh get with this is the um uh 36 King Street will be included in um uh the upgrades that need to go there for that project and also I believe there was a there was there was part of the application was uh included bringing U fiber optic to to the cemetery to over there uh but congratulations on on uh on Nancy and Dave from lwd they did a great job submitting and uh uh the I signed the contract I got notified signed the contract sent it to them and uh they sent it back to me within 20 minutes signed by this so I distributed amongst the accountant uh the CFO and the uh um uh uh Robin uh in in the uh in the finance office um we also uh one of the uh one of the concerns that was brought up uh last week with our newsletter speaking of the newsletter which will be released on Friday Friday and uh is the um uh will be the hearing and the hearing the seeing and pair the vision impaired uh being able to with PDF uh Nancy has been working with Eric maner uh for the newsletter he's the member of the Ada committee and he is uh he is of the opinion that as presented as it is being presented it is it is fine it is uh it is it is a good job it's an acceptable um everyone uh through the department heads have been are going to have been included in news and announcements so everyone all the department heads and got uh emails today to say you know with everyone is being signed up uh for them to everyone to be informed on the accounting side we have uh financial analyst uh interviews are are occurring we're looking to hopefully uh uh have someone start in that position relatively soon and the memo as I believe I informed all the board members last week uh the yearend updates for the department heads have been memo has been distributed uh the police department there is one individual in the academy and that uh that person will start uh on July 1st um uh DPW uh one of the thing another part of the update last Friday was the Foster Street bid that came in very favorably and uh looking that it looks like that that will be you'll start seeing activity in there in September in this fall uh for that project for the redoing the entire uh start redoing the entire Street uh with sidewalks everything rebuilding the the street uh they continue with the sweeping and then Mowing and I had reached out to the de to Steve uh last week I believe it was last Thursday just saying what a great job that uh um the team did with with the common uh they did a they did a fantastic job they looked it looked beautiful um the senior center in about a month there'll be a beam signing contest uh not contest uh event sorry who can reach the high Gary's really good at beam signing it's going to be competitive and uh I mean it's actually it's actually a a fun event so to to to come there when uh in uh in glou when we had a um I hate to use the uh it's not a windmill it's a uh turbine thank you thank you turbine we had a blade signing thing there too I know I know funny uh we had blade signing it was a great it was a great Community event bu of tulips around the wind milk yeah I mean we did that for this building yeah yeah you did yeah oh great okay um uh as everyone just uh spoke about the Memorial Day Parade was a was a great event fire department there are two we've got two people in the academy and there were three openings uh coming in uh that as a result of town meeting report there are three positions and there are so far there are two good candidates that are going through the interview process and that is it thank you Mark I could um I just want everybody know I'm on I'll be out of state the 5th through the 12th of June so it may not be I believe our meeting Falls probably on the 10th yes yeah I I won't be an attendance at that meeting thank you and don't forget our Carnival the 20th to the Thursday through Sunday Thursday through Sunday 20th through the 20 third okay public input uh Rob BRS 25 Juniper Road spoke with many of you at your office hours I appreciate the time that you're providing to Residents I appreciate CLC being here today and you hearing them out and the Lively discussion that there was um I I think that there's a lot of nuanced ISS issues um I think that sometimes it can be challenging to present them properly I want to I direct this to you Matthew made a comment with regard to Eco harvesting if there was more funding available could it be used well I would agree that the committee is assessing and kind of testing going from a one-year review to a 2-year review experience of it so somewhat still in the unknown category as the expl for Creative Solutions but without question there are many many more areas of the lakes that if we had equipment if we had the tools if the CLC committee and others determined that was the right stuff then the Lakes need attention that's the big headline I just was concerned with regard to the interaction that that I felt I heard that I I view it as funding is a significant problem I will tell you that I'm not a member of clean Lakes committee I'm somewhat intentional about that but I have been advocating and I will say that I have fought quite hard with regard to that five-year budget because what I found was the membership of EX officio members and real members almost self denied themselves why should we put this in because it's not going to get funded no you better put everything in that you need and I worked with others and I think that a number of the members got motivated with regard yeah we ought to put it in even if it's not going to get funded um I hope CPC funding again focusing your attention to you I hope that CPC funding can be there uh Dave bar mentioned westford's experience I will tell you earlier today I briefly talked with Amy green about this mentioned CPC funding she almost immediately dismissed ongoing CPC funding being a available saying that many communities don't allow CPC funding just because that exists in other communities in Westford does not mean it can't work here I hope it can but I will tell you as a resident it scares me I was scared going to CPC funding season knowing how late it was that you know what happens if this is denied if you don't do stuff nature is not taking you know any time off uh so it gets bad um DPW was mentioned briefly I think you know spoke of you know it's not just for Pooles I've read the last three years worth of minutes of the CLC it it really got under my skin where I read that and the water department representative on CLC presented that a contract was engaged in 22 with regard to it wasn't will it was definitive are the minutes wrong I doubt it but maybe they are but it was that engagement had been completed to assess the Wetland Park sometimes known as frog pond with regard to getting it dredged okay not done 22 not done 23 not done 24 not you know I don't think it's going to be done 25 up for maybe funding in 26 again I don't know the answers to this but I can tell you this as a new resident of two to three years now um the Wetland Park has has not been maintained the town hasn't done what needs to be done since the section 319 Grant enabled it to handle 22% of the storm water draining into Long Lake so that's another aspect with regard to DPW Staffing that I think I've spoken with you guys in vcom before with regard that need be asking what do they need to get their job done because I find Steve yanl to have just an impossible set of tasks giving his Staffing you can't seem to hire enough people to get it done um the last one or for you and I thank you for your time is that the uh water department I agree 100% with what you said try to get a 5-year perspective what they're funding I think they went above and beyond Ivan was was very clear don't expect us to do this in future years we're giving you an extra 50 60 you know to try to you know kide you over you know that sort of thing but here's another nuanced layer of that uh with regard to manow wanaki it was conditioned with with regard to the 5050 share coming from Westford Dave bar again gave you a status with regard to their you know line item and their lack of CPC funds going forward once that 100K and it'll get used up you know instantly so all of this to say very concerned as a resident feel that because it's been uh spectacle cell tower funded in the past I'm not certain that our community is knowledgeable and when I look at the orchard when I look at the other aspects big votes that come in sometimes I think the public just doesn't really understand and do get it and we're not prepared as a public to um to make the what I think are the smart choices for Littleton long term I'm concerned that the lakes are another one of those so thank you for your time thank you hi uh again I'm Dave bar I live at 49 mwan Trail I'm a excuse me member of the clean L Committee Member of the Westford Health lakes and ponds collaborative which is a sister Organization for that I'm the president of the friends of Forge Pond which is a uh General group that works to maintain the Ecology of Lake mwaniki Forge Pond and the only thing I really wanted to say was that um historically uh Forge Pond Lake Med Moni has maintained uh its um tried to control its aquatic invasives with draw Downs winter drawdowns to try to kill the plant the invasive plants around the edge of the lake uh where the water uh where where the lake bed is exposed and that has worked fairly well for the last 10 years moderately depending on the year um last year we were very surprised surprised this time of year we were getting a lot of uh heavy plant growth in the lake and it was like people that lived on the lake all their life said we've never seen it like this before uh this is more aquatic plants than than we've ever seen uh and the Hope was maybe that's uh there were some plausible reasons for it in terms of uh the weather and climate and things like that drought and warm winter and such The Hope was maybe that was a oneoff and it wasn't a new new normal I just want to say that this year already we're seeing the same thing uh in the lake uh tremendous amount of uh invasive growth and uh it looks like maybe it isn't just oneoff maybe it's something that is um something we're going to have to be dealing with more going forward um and uh it's uh something that I think is worth trying to to deal with as a community rather than just a group so thank you for your support thank thank you thanks good evening my name is Tess Degan uh berch Road I am the newly elected president of the Long Lake neighborhood Association and I'm speaking here as the president of the neighborhood association um last year for the annual meeting we invited Mr yanley um to speak to us this I was not yet president and voiced some concerns around traffic increase and speed around the neighborhood and um Mr yanley um said that he would look into it we um suggested stops on or other traffic mitigating uh things um I recently reached out to him again because there had been really no movement um one of our members uh had contact with him over throughout the year but um I asked him again and I received an email back that um the stop signage that we were looking for right on top of the hill the tree streets are very Steep and intersect with Emerson Drive uh one of the streets mine Birch Road has a stop sign none of the others do so we thought this would be a great way um to mitigate some of that risk in the traffic cuz you have to speed up the hill um he said none of the um areas that we suggested meet criteria for stop signs there's also two uh curves around Lakeshore Drive that are um not very visible to to be able to come around the speed is pretty high um and as you know uh since Co we've had much more uh delivery traffic and he said that there would be some um other uh idea on how to how to mitigate those problems I'm here to tell you that the neighborhood and the neighbors of the Lang Long Lake neighborhood association are the neighbors who live in the Watershed to Long Lake uh the neighbors are very concerned there have been many close calls and many uh uncomfortable situations we are still hopeful that um the DPW will consider um but really we would also like to know what those criteria are and uh really be um clear on that so maybe there are some things that can be done I also wanted to Pigg back on Mr R's um uh comment on the uh frog pond and Wetland Park I did mention in my email to uh Mr yanii that we are still waiting for for the uh dredging of basin one um and he did mention that there were some ideas on uh uh getting a contractor and funding for this fall or in in the process for this fall and the Long Lake neighborhood association uh this project is also very dear to our heart heart we walk around that path which which is highly uh dangerous right now it's very deteriorated all the time so we would really like to have that done also thank you so much nice to meet [Music] you uh no one else um host Community agreements I will accuse myself hello e you can be you can be the new sit there if you want to [Laughter] [Music] sit all right well thanks for meeting with me I just wanted to clarify is it just host Community agreements tonight or is it social Equity as well uh well it just listed as HCA we social Equity is tied into it okay you know so I'm sure you could talk about that um all right so when I last met with this board the model host Community agreement had just been released by the Cannabis Control Commission so this board directed me to speak with our active host Community agreement um holders and renegotiate those agreements based on the model making tweaks as applicable um to the termination provision so I worked with G7 mrm sanctuary and Community Care collectives and we have um draft agreements that were circulated to this body the agreements for the most part do follow the model they diverge in a couple areas um most notably we included what I call like a blended um a blended Community impact fee provision so for example in sanctuary it's going to be really difficult to discern whether the impact is coming from adult youth marijuana or um medical marijuana so we wanted some assurances that the um that Sanctuary wouldn't say you know we're not paying that because at the time even the odor wasn't actually adult use marijuana we were growing medical marijuana we wouldn't really know it's just odor to us so we agreed on some language that says you know no matter what they're growing whether it's adult or medical they're going to accept the CIF if applied um and then in terms of termination Provisions I made them much stronger to give this board more authority to terminate the host Community agreement so we have some samples um I've reserved your right to make edits they all know um they have also reserved their rights so I think in terms of process I'm happy to answer any questions we can make tweaks um but what I would say is if you I would if you're comfortable with the agreements I wouldn't vote tonight I would just give me that nod I'll go back to their Council I'll get them to agree firmly and then you guys can vote at your next meeting okay did anyone have any comments on the agreements I appreciate the fact you you follow pretty closely with the uh with the model agreements which um I think lines up better for us and protects us frankly so I appreciate that and um I think that the edits that you made are in line with um our wishes and um appreciate I know it's a lot of time and effort put into it definitely appreciate that there are two things that I probably should point out um in sanctuaries we added an odor provision um so you have sanctuary as you know it's cultivator Community Care Collective also has the authority to cultivate currently they have a license for retail they've filed and have a provisional license for product manufacturing but they have not filed as of two weeks ago um any license with the commission for cultivation if you want we can seek to include an odor provision in Community Care collectives agreement I'm just not sure whether they're actually going to move in that direction well could we condition it that if they if they did choose to absolutely seek to cultivate yeah I think that that make sense okay um you I after looking through the you know the hcas and um outside of an odor provision is there any other um reason for Littleton to have hcas the in your opinion I should say so I'm going to answer that from a legal perspective what the HCA provides you that you wouldn't have just under zoning is the ability to potentially collect Community impact fees um the likelihood of any Community actually collecting those impact fees in my opinion is fairly small and we have yet to see how that's going to develop with the commission they haven't given us more guidance on what enhanced need um really means we talked about that last time so if you decide to wave a host Community agreement you lose that ability um based on the model it just gives you more oversight than you would so if there's a change in management you would have the ability to have them come in and and review it um the commission's regulations now enable um establishments that are denied host Community agreements to seek relief from the commission so it's unknown at this time if you did decide not to issue a host Community agreement because of change of manage management and you don't believe the new team is should have a license whether that would be upheld in the eyes of the commission or they would just issue a waiver so we don't know that yet so I'm just ask you guys where where do you sit on the thought process of Littleton looking at littleton's impact of any of our cannabis facilities which to me have been negligible since they took away our ability to get Revenue outside of the standard 3% that we tax um which was I believe the reason why really they really pushed the HCA is because we had this whole impact fee um that we we could collect and Beyond we had s as well yeah so I'm but outside of I mean we have a we have zoning we have the voters and we have obviously the planning boards I I'm trying to figure out we we put if we put the odor part that's just into the the cultivation side anyway um where it's just like a statement it's it's on when I looked at the the reading there there's no teeth in it we can't it's still going to become a Board of Health is it is it a board of health issue is it is it something that's causing people be it's it would always end up to there whether it's in the host Community agreement or not I'm just trying to find out all of this work everything we put into these hcas and I I saw when the the town vote happened a few boards ago um why they were important made sense to me but I'm I'm really struggling now to see it just seems more like a bureaucratic thing that more paperwork that we dragging businesses through dragging everyone through we have to stay compliant every 3 years in the compliance piece to this um I I'm just trying to find the value in in continuing with hcas in Littleton and I I'm looking for help because I I just I'm not seeing it as I look through these I it just nothing came out at me and said what are we doing to me it was like what are we doing right now what what is what's the reason for these when we we have a compliance through zoning we have compliance through the Board of Health obviously and we have planning I don't see us going for any impact fees I don't see any of these businesses creating the need for us to impose an impact thee um have you seen one somewhere like one that's actually where town has gone after give me give it an example of what like where is where's the town that's gone after City of Salem right so it's just starting May 1st of this year so it's all new so we don't really know so the way that it's going to have to work is at the annual renewal you file for the prior year and then they go through the commission and the commission needs to certify that as a valid impact fee so we just don't have the information yet as to whether or not those well that's the new one what about we've had them since day one people have had no no no many communities littleon included have collected impact fees you know we talked about the Oxbridge case whether those fees were ever defensible is is another argument there lawsuits right now against Ts for this right and but there's also lawsuits against establishments arguing that the prior host Community Agreements are still valid so we don't know the courts are going to deal with it I think the other consideration for this board is if you do agree to wave your host Community fee requirement you lose any ability to make a decision in this right it becomes a race to the Finish Line almost whoever gets the next special permit from the planning board what you did before when you had three um licenses available you said okay we know we have three special sorry not licenses we know we have three special permits available they need a host Community agreement Let's do an RFP see who we think is the most qualified and then give that the hcas to those applicants you wouldn't have that ability anymore now whether or not you want that is a policy decision not a legal decision but just want to make clear to you that that's what happens if you decide to wave you also can wave for particular this the regulations say you can wave for one establishment and not another to me I I'm concerned about the arbitrary andc comp purch nature of that um but there could be defensible situations you know if you have social Equity applicant that you could see waving for that applicant but maybe not another but we wouldn't need to be really careful as we move move forward so you couldn't have HC for certain establishments based on we're using ones where all if we're trying to create a one on smell that's literally only cultivation has nothing to do with retail or anything else and so that could be that's a defense in my mind that would be a defensible reason that you really want to have more of a say in the cultivation part because of the potential impacts on the neighborhood so you you're comfortable with retail you don't feel like retail needs an HCA so you'll wave for retail but maybe for cultivation and product manufacturing you'll require hcas these are all policy decisions for this board I think just the the statement you made about um basically vetting any candidates having an RFP it gives this board some Authority um to choosing who we think would be the best operator frankly and we do have um the potential to issue another retail license and um if we just say we're not going to do hcas any longer the essentially to your point they just need to get a special permit and operate as if they were you know operating any other type of business in town well talk to me about that do you guys know how that works like the special permit is there a vetting process at all with the special permit not based on the applicant's qualities so as long as they meet the setback and have the required um plan documents okay that's fine but there isn't you know is this applicant better than this applicant is this location better than this location they have to look more within their their confines of the B what's been brought to them so I agree that the acas don't have that much teeth but it uh but it seems like if we don't have the ccas we're giving up any Authority that the slick board would have right and even if we don't have authority and if we just say we can cancel HCA it sends a message right that we wouldn't have the ability to do if we didn't have the hcas you talk about the initial vetting process no I'm saying if we to have it in place if we had an HCA in place and then we didn't like that establishment for some reason whatever or they changed ownership they changed ownership or something happened we could cancel that HCA and it might have no impact on the on the process in the long run but it helps send a message to the other boards and everyone else said like there's something there's something off here right that we would otherwise we like relinquishing our Authority and just making it someone else's problem right it's now just the Board of Health and the planning board or whoever else is involved and we're we just sit back and say sorry we're not involved so that's a fair argument like I mean I think to the extent that we can have a say and and making sure that businesses reflect our community's values we should we should exercise that say and so to me it makes sense to to continue with the HCA model and I agree that say is it's not it's not a huge impact that we have right B I mean besides the gatekeeping piece I I just if we can sit here and stomp our feet all day at somebody you know and we we'll use you know if we're talking about odor um there's no we don't have any okay we're just sitting here we're upset but so that's why I don't that's when I sit there looking at it and that as through the hcas outside the vetting which I mean that's almost a selling point to me if you're looking at it that way not that we have a ton of these that are coming into town but literally such a small amount but even was point about the management change you anytime I mean Anthony's cold fired how many how many different yeah that's that's true all right I I got off my ledge I'm I'm back on your team on this I'm sorry can he be in the room just public okay um yeah I I guess I'm leaning towards yes follow the model with the edits that you put in there and the letter that you sent about um the mutual um relas release MH I think is okay I'm okay with it okay all right I think we'll strike it for can um Community Care Collective because we never collected fees so um but other than that I think it makes sense I think it makes sense now the social going to speak to social justice yeah and so then the next part is social Equity excuse me that's okay social all right so the way I like to look at this is that there are two camps there's presumptive compliance and then other statutory requirements so you need to meet the minimum acceptable standards that the Cannabis Control Commission has for integrating individuals that have been disproportionately harmed by the World War on Drugs into the regulated market they haven't actually told us what those minimum acceptable standards are they just said if you do one of these three things you will meet them so those three things are you can adopt a bylaw to exclusively permit social Equity businesses for 3 years or until the exclusive exclusive exclusivity period has been met so you have one special permit if if you wanted to check that box in the fall you could adopt a bylaw that would hold that for 3 years um you could adopt the model bylaw that they just issued a couple days ago um which tracks the regulations but leaves a lot of questions we don't really know what a lot of this actually means yet or you could adopt a local approval process that is administered on a onetoone basis so these are presumptive compliance steps that you can take and if you take them you know you're you you're in compliance what's un is well what if you don't want to take one of those three steps it seems like there's something you can do but we don't know what that thing is yet um so I'm I'm not saying you have to take one of those three steps right now but we do need to kind of think about do we want to adopt the model bylaw do we want to have an exclusivity period or do we want to try something different and try to meet our presumptive compliance requirement and then there's the other requirements there's a transparency obligation we need to have a website that has all this information about access and how you follow the process we need to develop an equity plan um you need to come up with an HCA grading M Matrix um so basically how are you going to wait these hcas how are you going to rank them and 25% of that score so it needs to be numeric needs to be for social equity and then you need to come up with a positive Improvement plan no one knows what that means so with that one we you know we'll update you when we get more guidance but we don't know what that means um So the plan really needs to help residents um that are economic empowerment applicants um live in disproportionately impacted areas I mean we don't I don't know what that means so um the commission has been asked numerous times for guidance on that and we're hopeful that they'll issue something but in the meantime we really do need to get moving on on at least the transparency obligations getting that Municipal website up and running developing an equity plan and then coming up with a grading M Matrix so I've been helping communities do this a lot some communities do it in Open Session and other communities designate one person they just work with them come up with a draft and then bring it back to the board so I really defer to you I do think it takes a long time to negotiate and work with these in Open Session but happy to do it if that's the way you guys want to yeah so car and I would designate it as the uh haca folks P's so but if we're if there's two of us then I I assume we have to yeah so maybe what I'll do is I'll come up with a draft and um I'll share it with this board and if I feel like I need to ask questions I can check in with people um provided it's not a quorum sure so we're doing this for the one permit that we have outstanding that's correct and no so it's so it's for your community so um remember you can issue you have one retail left right but you could have another cultivator come in you could have another product manufacturer come in you could have another independent tester come in so it's for all of those so until we have so if we're required to have this in place and we have a limited number of these that we can potentially issue are we basically required to hold off on issuing more of them until we have the policy in place because otherwise we could have issued them all before the policy's in place so to my knowledge we don't have anyone asking for hcas right now we do oh we do we' got a couple of appli okay so I don't I mean I don't have an answer to that we were supposed to do this by May 1st no one's done it communities are doing it now if you don't accomplish it by May 1st of 2025 that's when the commission can start finding you so not doing it now we don't really know what that means so what I would do is I would work as quickly as you can if if you get applicants we can deal with it individually at that time as best we can trying to recognize social Equity as a component that the commission really wants to see um put front and center and try to just do the best we can but we should move forward we should get the website at least website up and running um and come up with an equity plan okay unfunded mandate awesome and what and what do we do with these ones that are coming in front of us that's yeah I mean I you kind of skirted around a little bitca we have people coming in right now we've got a couple of applications or of Interest so maybe what we can do is I guess I I defer to the board but you know within the next month we could probably get this stuff done like an equity plan and the Matrix done so that we can see those applications there's no timeline for you to act on an HCA there's no obligation but what if you get one say we have one it meets we just sit here and wait for another one to come in so we can compare them against another that's what I'm trying to get around so if you're so the some communities will look at ones as they come in and if they this is the intent the commission is envisioning and if you get over 60 on your score out of 100 you automatically get an HCA so if you're under 60 you don't if you're over 60 you do other communities are doing more what you did before where say okay we know we have a lot of interest we're going to accept applications from this date to this date and then whoever we get we're going to move forward at that time others are trying to avoid the matrix by saying saying we're going to give anyone an HCA um I we just talked about the downside of doing all that but that is something other people are are doing um so I think with people sending letters of Interest I would say let's commit within the next month to get a matrix and a social Equity policy and the website up and running and then they can submit their applications if you want to do like a we we're going to review on this date any applications we received prior to then are going to be res Reser reviewed on that date that's up to this board or if you want to do it on a rolling basis from it's a policy decision think that's kind of we we had we anticipated just having a rolling basis we really didn't have any interest for a while um and just recently we've had some folks that have are they all retail that you're seeing or are you see the Reta just the retail as far as I know mhm yeah I I I kind of I'm not sure I entirely agree that we should do it on just a rolling basis we probably should that's how we've been yeah expecting it and it really hasn't come to right but now that we have something maybe and we knowing this policy is coming in place maybe we say that know let's say the social Equity is in place you know July 1st right then we say you know we'll look at applications effective August 15th or something right to give enough time so that people know that these things are coming and it's just not the first one in the door is going to beat everyone else but there's um the intention of the state is social Equity is to give people that I can almost guarantee that the three applications that we have right now will not score highly I don't know exactly what the parameters are to be with this SC I know it's up to us but um I does if we have three people that seek an HCA and or three entities and we really feel as though entity B would be a great fit for Littleton and we like their plan and their security and everything that they present to us um I don't want this to preclude us from moving forward with NTB so which which might never come to FR we might not ever get an applicant like that that falls under that that falls under that might fall under the 25% I guess you're saying that if there's none of if there's no applications that have it that meet the get the 25% score for social I mean everyone that's okay so you don't need to have a social equ you you're not required to have a social Equity applicant yeah it's just that your policy needs to recognize that these individuals have been harmed so the score is reserved yeah okay and and remember the board can issue more hcas than special so you already have Littleton Apothecary right that's out there so like there's nothing that's precluding you if you get five applications and you think two of them are really good you could issue two and then it's just whoever gets through the permitting process and quicker it when you're scoring these is there there I assume it's only like a 0 to 100 score and are you required to take the highest score or just something in ranges or what's the the regulations don't speak to that so I think it's up yes and they are commission is supposed to issue a model grading Matrix which they haven't done yet um but I think that the I think it become if you if you have one that's 99 and one that's 98 and you choose the 98 over the 99 I think that's more defensible if challenge than if you choose the 70 versus the 90 so I think that there could be factors if they're really close that push you one way or the other but the bigger that Gap I think the harder it will be to defend or you push them both forward or you push them both forward yeah mhm right on so I think you know unfortunately a lot of the answers are we just don't know um but that's where we are yeah okay all right awesome so just want to summarize we're good with the hcas I'll reach out to the um The Operators and get them that's a lot of work I did like you said I know it's a tough read have you cont contacted anyone from the Harvest Club no so I didn't contact the Harvest club or Littleton Apothecary Littleton apothecary's provisional license was issued in October 8th of 2020 they haven't done anything since then that I could find um the Harvest clubs last entry was also uh or February 11th of 2021 So based on conversations I think maybe with you CH you had said that they were not moving forward but right um I think they sent an email and didn't didn't we I think so just so we had something from them that said we're not going to but also at any time if that changes they can obviously come back to the board um you know if they try to file hcas that are non-compliant because we're seeing this happen now what happens is you get a letter from the commission that says these are the eight provisions and go fix it with the town and so it's not like the town automatically gets fined or in trouble there's like the opportunity to work with the applicant yeah they want a different way yeah okay thanks guys thank you thank you you thank you very [Music] much welcome back so uh review discuss and assigns like for leaz on to town boards and committees so we have the list of things that everyone signed up for last year um and I just wanted to review and make sure everyone was comfortable with what they were assigned to and wanted to continue on or wanted to change if anyone wanted to change what they were responsible [Music] for I'm comfortable with where I'm [Music] signed all these are still viable I hope well I think some of these that like I'm looking at some of the ones that I'm on like I open space and Rec plan implementation committee I think that's pretty much done yeah the and I'm also on the EHS Vision subcommittee which I think is uh no longer viable Chuck you're also on the taxation committee oh yeah so that should be two of us on that was two two members yeah oh that's the other one there's the committee for exploration oh okay never mind what is the that one oh I see [Music] it the Backpage there's the liaison and there's the voting members too are you still are you okay with taking the orchard so yeah so you want to talk to that um yeah so what I told the orchard working group was that you know based on the vote we're not working on rfps much um which is sort of the value ad that I brought to the group so I'd like to focus more on hcas and some other things where I think my uh you know makes is a better fit for for the work of the group so I said I would do that but Gary you mentioned you might be interested too so one of [Applause] us I think we should make the working group always just post as joint select board meeting so because I think I'm going to try and show up even I'm not on the okay the Le on so it's up to you I mean you could be on the committee I I I plan on to now that we're going to be posting with them I I do it's just too important we you know we have to be we're going to have to be really involved in this for this foreseeable future until this is uh we get this right um so so Mark are you replacing Karen as the vote I I guess yeah we are joined Thursday and then we're going and we are joined on Thursday at 7:00 and how often is the group of meeting every other week but if we're not going for an RFP you know I think we're going to be discussing the future and the mission of that group like that's where the select board I think we need we need to have that Vision agreed so talk it might be much less fre when I mean you know let's we'll talk about that on Thursday uh we should take the the Town Administrator search committee off the list probably I don't know Jim unless you know Jim you want to speak you want to speak to that not me 7 p.m. I don't think the agricultural working group is on those back pages actually I don't think that exists either no it does not what's that the ad working group on the back yep both of those are okay that has not met for years and years okay you can delete that okay okay so I I'm okay with those change yeah taking over that um I have not been very good at keeping up with the Board of Health um but I will try to do a better job dance stand pretty open what night do they meet Wednesdays the same as the pnbc meetings and the working group and the working group and the orchard group right so I'll just follow up and tell them if they need someone to reach out yeah n PTA yeah in case anybody's interested okay okay um Litton M Community advisory committee is that done anything I mean I used to sit on that with Keith when Keith was here that Street's going in that are is well it was I still get emails from BR some from different people yeah attended a couple of those meetings just for yeah um everything was on Zoom yeah for a while there you so just leave it I kind know we're getting no that one doesn't have a that one doesn't have I mean that's a list of boards with no representation like the Housing Authority shouldn't be on that list because everyone's elected on the Housing Authority okay looks good succeed yep okay moving on [Music] I'm Sor just so if we could just make a motion updated it yeah are we ready for the motion yep move that the select board vote to reassign their committee Liaisons and representatives per the discussion at the May 28th select board meeting second move by Matthew second by uh G all those in favor I thank you okay authorize the Town Administrator to execute Amendment one for 36 King Street with lb okay for 80,000 Mr Mr chair we just take the next three really as a grouping if you think of it that way so um we uh town meeting voted to move forward with the renovations at 36 King Street the next three contracts are merely uh an execution of the agreements that we need to make that happen so uh The First Agreement is with LLB Architects to basically serve as our construction administrator um for um the duration of the project um our OPM will'll be continuing on with a Vertex uh that's item D and um item e is um the contract with classic construction we went out to bid we had two biders uh classic was our low bid we already met with them on site but uh we're just waiting uh for the vote tonight to execute that contract with them and finalize um that piece so these are all basically just follow-up pieces from uh what town meeting allowed us to do and um all within the budget per because we came to town meeting with bids in hand so um all fairly straightforward but uh does require the formal uh approval of board to move forward accordingly okay can I just read them as one motion with an and in between um if yeah we we can just go through each one if you'd like if yeah if you'd like move that theel board vote to authorize Town administrate Town Administrator James Dugen to execute amendment number one of the designer Services construction Administration contract for the 36 King Street renovation project with LLB Architects for $8,400 and move that the select board vote to authorize Town Administrator James Dugen to execute amendment number one of the owner's project Services contract for the 36 King Street renovation project with the vertex company's Inc for $133,000 $472 and move that the select board vote to authorize Town Administrator James Dugen to execute a contract with classic construction for the rehabilitation of 36 King Street for $2,180 th000 second by Matthew second if by Chuck all those in favor I I that was well that was quick uh so contract for Studio G for designer services for Shaker Lane MSB MSB EA right just if I could uh Mr chair just this is a um so we uh rece the town received two bids for designer Services um and uh per the request of the Shaker Lane um School building subcommittee technically uh that asked uh that we asked msba if we if we could uh participate in the interviews uh the subcommittee members participate in the interviews and then ultimately I think by one vote we went with um uh went with Studio G as our uh with the proposal brought before us so once that agree once we agreed to move forward with them then we had to negotiate a contract with Studio G and um what you have in your packet um there's a lot of back and forth with Studio G uh on that but uh we were able to reach an agreement with them uh for Price that's $650,000 and uh the request is to basic basically um uh authorize the Town Administrator to move forward um at the with with the msba contract for designer Services uh with Studio G so does the motion need to have the amount not necessarily no but it's it's it's $650,000 not to exceed 650 do you want do you want to put that in there or could do that if you want uh move that the select board vote to authorize Town Administrator James dougen to execute a contract with Studio G for designer services for the Shaker Lane Elementary school msba project for an amount not to exceed $650,000 second move by Matthew second and by Karen all those in favor I I uh the school year 2024 transfers okay um this is just something we we did um we we're doing now on a regular basis uh to approve of transfers uh within the operating budget as we get to the end of the fiscal year uh with the municipal modernization act in 2019 we're now allowed to do this um the um chair of the finance committee did reach out to me today and asked uh whether or not they should be voting on this as well and uh you know looking at what the the rules are fincom should be voting on it as well to give us that um that uh yeah recommendation and and vote to allow that so this is U I think last year we did this we actually may have done it um maybe like in your first meeting in July because we have up into July 15th when the fiscal year ends but we're just trying to get ahead of a few things uh like the transfer you voted on earlier and same thing here so um you know it's basically something you voted on before it's allowable and basically allows us to um fill in any holes and deficits in the budget with other um you know budget Savings in other parts of the budget so we haven't really started that process yet because we still have some time to go but um so but it just gives us that authorization are there ever any big numbers um it depends and and where you are uh you know at the end of the fiscal year um but um you know typically if we can we can cover those deficits with the you know with ex with the existing them we just take advantage of that right and whatever we don't use Co to free cash will we see a report of what was actually done I think that's what you had asked last year I think that's you know what we we and we can commit to do that again sure it just I I mean I trust our T of account and things this just feels like a really broad motion well it helps us to also know who who may be if if we need to we saw a large number that's why I asked about the large number one an apartment didn't why they why did they not use $100,000 $100,000 go over $100,000 yeah and I think Mark I think we committed to do that last year more than want to do that again sure absolutely okay move that the select board vote to authorize the town accountant to transfer any amount from a departmental or other Appropriations to any other appropriation to address any deficits within the time of putton fiscal year 2024 operating budget second move by Matthew second by Chuck all those in favor I have fun thank you uh plans for performance evaluations for the police chief and Town Administrator um so I well I talked to Gary briefly about this too I think we actually should show throw the fire chief on this list as well um the um inner Chief coffee um because I don't think he's ever had a formal review he can have something to work towards right um so we need to follow the whatever the the process we're going to do for the reviews um the police chief has submitted his evaluation to us um I I don't know if everyone has it or I have it so I have a copy of it I can we can forward it around um we need in in our first your first year our first year on the board basically everyone did a did the ranking and forwarded off to Town Council um Agate did the aggregation of all of our reviews um I'm wondering if we should just use our HR department to do the aggregation and then um a couple of us go off present the reviews and discuss the reviews with the employees so yeah it's not an extraordinarily he I just don't I want to know if she can handle it I guess would be the question I mean it's not a a heavy lift it's numbers here's everybody's number here's I mean I one of us can do the aggregation too it's not simple map that's how we the school committee for the superintendent to to everybody send it to the chair or whatever so I'm I'm willing to do it too I'm just I I think that you know when we used Town Council there were some special circumstances I think it would be fine for you to aggregate absolutely fine for you to aggregate it okay if we have to Pivot we pivot I think that's I just I just wonder if I'm just curious about the two people who go to present it to the to the employee there was a lot of debate about you know I think whether whether or not that needs to be made public that that version of the review so we need to we need to figure out what whether it does I don't think it does I think that's what it was determined but we should check so so then you would go say it's you and Gary go to James and you give him his review yeah the review is public and it has to be it can you know sometimes put it up on the on their website right in the PDF form but it's not um the actual process of it personel file is not but the no but you're but so I'm so you're guess what I'm saying is the aggregation is discussed with the employee and then the review is written after that discussion and submit it as an official record yes okay that's fine which is public which is public yeah no I okay I just want to make sure we're all on the same page on that okay so okay um so I have uh you haven't sent me your review yet I don't think so we and I'll talk to uh Chief Coffey and ask skim to do a review and then I'll send out the reviews that I get from the three reviews I get and then people people can send their scores back to me and then I'll aggregate them and if everyone's okay Gary and I will go and deliver them to the employees it's fine with me yeah no evil look I'm going to throw you under the bus and then back it up yeah so okay okay the plan uh the Nill Orchard uh discuss a joint meeting so we scheduled a joint meeting for Thursday at 7 I believe it's in 10 is it 103 yes so okay um and it's you want to talk about the meeting you guys had sure um you know I think there there was some understandable frustration with the vote um Brad Mitchell who was our chair um said that he was he was he he resigned I mean I think he basically said that he he didn't mind you know working for the town but he didn't want to feel like um he was wasting his time um and I think a lot of the people on the on that working group were frustrated um with the time we spent and um with the vote so I think that there were a couple things I think we will be looking like as a working group we we'll be looking for direction from this board we have some options in front of us as far as you know do we go after a lease do we look for another model um and then I think a larger question is what should that working group do I mean that working group's mission was to determine the highest and best use of that property and we did it and it was you know it didn't succeed and so I think um there's another member who you know said basically I don't know whether I'm going to continue on this board as well um we'll talk and she she said she would think about it and talk about it after the meeting with the select board so um interesting so I think uh so yeah I think there the two things one is um to the primary thing I think is to discuss with that working group what you know what we as a select board want do we want them do we want that group to go out and look for a new Tac do we want to say okay thank you for your service you're done you did what you said you were going to do and we don't you know you can act as consultants for us now but we don't need you to meet as a as a group anymore and the select board is going to take it over I think to some extent you know we heard from Mr Ron here who said there were a lot of people who were surprised by the vote and if you brought it back to another town meeting it might very well pass so that's another thing we can discuss at the at the Joint meeting do you have anything else Karen that iover shaking her head the whole time um no I'm trying to think the only other thing well we do we want to talk about the trees um yet or well let's talk let's talk about I think let's talk about that at the meeting on Thursday um okay so there's also we need to decide what we're going to do in the short term meaning yeah this summer right yeah um in addition to what we're going to do in the longer term meaning once we have a decide to once we have someone that's going to take over management of it so we have form or another right we have two two short-term things that we're going to do one is we need to get a bid on some repairs that need to be made immediately and we have a list and I'm going to send that to Ryan um because I think we need to send it out to bid DPW doesn't have the bandwidth to do it the other thing is that the trees need to be taken out for a couple reasons well three reasons one is they're no longer commercially viable two is they're diseased and they're affecting trees nearby and three is that many of the uses of that property which are commercially will require us to remove the trees so we also need to get start the process of getting a bid on having those trees removed um and that will accomplish two things one is it will you know it'll know what we'll know what we need to pay and if we do need to go back to town meeting we're going to have a number to say to the to the to the residents look if you want to keep this we're going to have to pay a quarter of a million dollars this year to remove the trees and this many dollars every quarter or whatever after that I you know after sitting through to meeting and and I I'm at a point of this is this is how we operate and I I mentioned before this is town government so we the people have spoken and you know we as a board might not agree with it but this is how it works so here we are um with the property which we own now we I I was just trying to look at it from what we know has worked like at chalon Orchards and trying to make it to a point where what would make that property more attractive to a leaser let's get I want to get the buyer out of my head because that's what was shut down so and at the same time while we're getting the property to that point if we don't ever get a leaser we're still making progress on the property to get it in a situation where we'd be in a better position regardless so um and if that means reducing it whatever that agriculture number is it's 50% of the property has to be Agri 50% of the APR land so around 24 Acres we remove the trees 50% of the trees yeah right I mean that to me what are the best trees there I don't know I mean I think the work group might know is it the lower field is it I don't know but we get that down to a manageable number now we have this I'm believe me shoot me down on some of this but we we've removed 50% of the trees obviously all the diseased ones are gone and then what whatever else now we've got a manageable situation where okay that's a little bit better for a liser now now they might want to come in and say well I want to replant there or but it's now they're not looking at oh I've got to because I think it's unmanageable yeah agree yeah that's right and forget the house whole separate monster just the property itself but if we can just continue to work the property into a manageable situation where at least they could say yeah okay all these trees I I've got a vision here now I could I can hay this Orchard this yeah you know blueberry this honey for I don't know but it gives a lot more as opposed to just Orchard which seems to be the the biggest hang up and I know the thought you know people that are watching taking down 50% of those trees is harsh but it's still keeping it as an orchard to some degree which is which is a I I just don't think it's manageable and that's from me spending two hours on the phone with the mayor from lemonster and the the chairwoman of of the Shalon Shalom friends of yeah the friends of Shalom and who's been farming in Orchard business for three generations so I she was telling I didn't want to hear all the things the negative she was saying sell it sell it sell it she was really don't go through this but she she's also in a community she's also in a community where they're not funding it there there's zero dollars coming from lemonster yeah so that's a lot of pressure on them to keep that Orchard and they're an aging board there's nine members and there's no new Young Blood coming in to to to fill this so they her worry is what happens you know in 10 years when we're all in our 80s aged out so that's a concern but I don't want to go there I just I said tell me the good things if we had to keep it what this is look like and she had said that the 50 you know right away that was one of the things that removed 50% that's what they did they got down to 20 acre or very manageable amount of trees and then they started to build up other things and that's a group that's keeping it um and that maybe that's something that who knows where this adds up right a friend maybe we get a friends maybe there is a friends group that becomes really engaged in this and that buys us if anything time right but you know this is I know we've all and you guys more than anybody has probably been up thinking about this and you've sat through all the the meetings um I've listened to plenty of people I know we all have our opinions but we're we're sitting here faced with the reality of a vote and the only thing I can figure is get this thing in a better situation every quarter every year to to a potential leaser keep putting it out to lease it's a better situation than it was 6 months ago now it's in a better situation than it was a year ago and now you know it's becoming more and more attractive because the land's not going anywhere right at the very end of the day unless M dark takes it and you know that's it's a it's a threat but if they see what we're doing and how we're moving this thing forward to make this um if they see what we're doing and they have somebody in place who will lease it yeah we will lose it but here's the thing here but that's a huge if the rule no no I I you know my we can't count on having this land indefinitely and not fulfilling the terms of our obligations with the state we just can't are those obligations it's a very small obligation the obligation is to farm 50% of it commercial agriculture to farm 50% of it and I just said we're cutting the orchard down to 50% so you you met that requirement well and to get to that point you know it's it's it's so you know getting rid of all the disease trees and getting rid of enough trees so that it the there's enough critical mass of land in one place that's been dumped that you can hay it those might be two totally different prospects right all the disease trees might you know there might be a clump here and a clump there I mean I don't know that's that's something that we can talk to the the rest of the orchard working group about on Thursday but um the vote on by The Orchard working group the recommendation was to remove the apple trees all of them are past their lifespan and you know that's a it's it's a bold statement and I I don't want to ever sit there and face a that group and say that's that's just not true because but I will say that Shalom had the same situation trees just growing and growing and they looked ridiculous and they were able to save an enormous amount of them so I there's a lot of young trees there I and I don't even know I'm talking the lower Field behind the house um I don't know I just to keep it I said 50% because at that point now we just pruning 50% of trees we removed the others now we only have to prune 50% of these trees and if the requirement is $500 of fruit have or agriculture have to be sold gross plus I think it's ridiculous a dollar an acre over that we can get someone to donate $11,000 a year to keep that Orchard viable with the state before so it's not taking over unless I'm missing something I looked in the mess I did I looked and it was like all right so $500 no we but that's but that's not like that's not the cost right the cost is going to be oh it's an enormous but this is what we have to present time yeah yeah yeah that you're right and I think that this is a great conversation to have with the working group it is but some direction because I don't I don't want I don't want to give any misconception to the working group that we're getting this ready for sale well no we're the working group is like what do you want us to do like yeah I I would change your tune slightly Gary and that you're getting ready for someone to manage it whether we ended up selling it or leasing it it doesn't really yeah and or whether we're selling parts of it right that's the other thing I think we should be looking at is whether we wanted to sell part of the orchard rather than the entire Orchard and we can work with mdar to change the APR so that we could do that and break the but um those are all the discussions we should be having and the Elephant that you're leaving out is the house right which we're paying money on constantly now right it's costing us you know tens of thou tens th000 insurance and we're hoping nothing else goes wrong so let's talk about the house a little bit um but actually let's go back before we move on I I do think that a conversation about what we need to do to get the thing in shape is the first thing and most important thing that we need to come out of Thursday night with because because we you know we can't do nothing we just can't so we either need to find a way to sell it or we need to start spending money um and the the first marching order should probably be well what direction do you want to go and what money do you want to spend on like for example moving the trees is a great example but I think we need to make a decision on that and and tell the working group or have this board take it over and say here's where we're going in for the next nine months or you know and here's the cost this is what well figure out the cost right because we're going to have to ask town for money it could be ridiculous this is the reality this is what the to voted to do it's going to be six figures easy and probably seven so um anyway so we can go into the house yeah like just want to make sure I want to make sure we get to there on Thursday like I said I I stood up there I mean with you and I think another Resident I I pictured that you know houses fall houses come they fall down they come up they come the land doesn't change so the house I the sole purpose of keeping house is so a farmer it would look attractive they'd have a place to stay when they farm the land and labor labor hous labor house makes sense so ret since that house is not protected by the APR I'm assuming there's potential for grant money or um CPC money to restore this house could be I mean I thought that you had to use CPC money to buy the house in order to use it to restore it but the only way you could restore the house with CPC money is if it's historical or or affordable you could do it for the farm so the historical piece could it's not designated it isn't yet we haven't that was that research with the yeah we're we're working with the historical commiss potentially add it lightning strikes and it is all of a sudden we can it gets classified as historical over this process over the next year or whatever um then other monies become available to us but I have to believe there's other money that's available in Grants to help restore that that building or and or I shouldn't say or and what is this number if it's classic construction if it's what whoever separate from the orchard don't even look at the orchard tell us what it cost to renovate when I say renovate the house what does that mean even well it means it means I mean I think gutting and redoing the interior the the the bones of it are fine okay so but but I think that's asking you know Ryan or and the town staff to do a lot of work to put together a proposal to rebuild but what's our other Choice um selling it we the town said no well Town said no to the APR land that we own that the house is not part of that the house is the house is just like Robinson Road except it's not historical the the house is under the care custody and control of the select board and it doesn't have any restrictions on the land so you would um potentially sell the house get it into a situation where you sold it to affordable housing or or how like the dery property um or we could just sell it and now you have or sell it now you have a working farm with a the money that we were thinking would more so go into that and I think the working group was very hesitant to do that with the understanding that like if we wanted to make this into a working farm the farmer needs a place to live and you know you need labor housing it's very hard very hard to find labor housing so so I think we you know that's a possibility but we should probably I would try to keep the house and the and the land connected you know and not sell the house off unless it was the last thing we did but that's just my opinion I think I'd like to see this the sticker shock number because that's what that's what people need to see yeah um here here it is um and here's the cost to maintain this as a town while we're waiting hopefully to get someone to lease it cuz now it's a much more attractive property but every year we're dumping in I don't know how much money it's a lot and it's staff resources and all the these other things um I think yeah so I don't I I think that's what we should talk about Thursday night yeah I mean I just don't know how much of the the board or the orer workp is going to be looking for I mean that's why I wanted to talk now a little bit of discussion on before we agreeing on all right it's not being sold at least in in the coming year we're not even going to talk about selling that property this is our property we're going to work on it we're going to make it attractive we're not I I wouldn't I I I I mean I haven't ruled that out I haven't ruled out going back in 6 months and asking again we did it with MBTA we lost this by three votes three votes and at least a dozen people have told me if I had known I would have been there and I would have voted and I think if it was presented as you know we can we can continue to lease this and spend this much this many million dollars over the next 5 years or we can sell it right it might also have swayed some people yeah it's not necessarily cross purposes to be getting these numbers together yeah I think preparing as Mark said preparing for a manager is the right way to go I think that's a great way to phrase it it doesn't matter in a way whether we lease or sell it we need to know how to make the property viable what cost was those yeah yeah and the leasing versus the selling are going to have different costs in in a year shortterm right shortterm not not so much shortterm because we're going to do the same removal of the trees short term because we are the manager until at least November so we have to do our management due diligence for the through at least next town meeting but then after that we can say we we're setting it up for the next manager however we did go forward and maybe you know in the next six months we start putting out another RFP to see if someone wants to lease it after we did this and say look we go to November and say we cleaned it up we put it out for lease and we still didn't find any work that's one thing that the orch working group did do immediately is we emailed the everyone who expressed interest in the RFI we emailed them back gave them an update and asked them if they would be interested in leasing so no responses we'll see what we get no we got we've gotten like I think three responses so far three responses and you know what's the kicker for us to help I mean what's we need some incentive to help them a leer get in there right I mean that's what sounds like with there's a plan or a long term to do that well I think someone who leased it is going to have a plan so let's say they say in order to be viable we need this many acres of cleared and stumped trees and then we and then we have as a town like okay well it's 25 you know two it's $200,000 a day I don't know what is $25,000 an acre like so it's a quarter of a million dollars we need to invest and then this person is willing to sign a you know 30-year lease or a 99e lease or whatever okay yeah you yeah you [Music] want Rob rounds 25 junit per Road try to be real quick um attended the ATAC working group that you're referring to so heard those things uh said I'm very very late to this game apologize for that having said that spoke with Diane Cy earlier today because I'm of the opinion that you know this past year attending numerous meetings the needs for that three and a half million just they're off the charts with regard to what funding is needed so putting in money that I'm beyond convinced that the town got this one wrong and that like Webster property like mvta might take multiple votes in order to get what I view as the vote right and I respect the people that are voting against it for all the things I heard and have heard but my understanding from Diane is that a resident has the ability to get a petition signed by 200 um voting you know voting registered registered people and you then if if I were to present that if if if because I don't want to do anything that is not directionally where you're going or where you think is the best utilization of the property I want to make that real clear if you say nope this is a bad idea you know then I stop but if it's not then Diane was very clear with me of how difficult it is to to get a special election or a special town meeting she identified you know the cost right now because the new clicker system is another 3,500 bucks per so we're up to like ,500 is her rough estimate of what that costs but I will tell you that hearing that group the other night talk about a quarter of a million which maybe the quarter million is just burn money because it just has to be done to make it viable for any seller you know anybody that Brad Mitchell mentioned recently that sort of thing but having said that the idea of spending you know six figures potentially seven figures for an indefinite period of time I everybody I speak with on both sides of the issue the people that talk to me and say you know the orchard badly managed poor blah blah blah you know all that stuff all respectful don't take disrespect by me saying blah blah blah to just try to move the the discussion forward because it's not intended there I will tell you that the two people of maybe I don't know I'm up to 30 some that spoke with regard to against the sale as soon as I said you're right maybe the petition I should be talking about is kind of that big figure number you're talking about maybe we you know the petition should be think we ought to be raising property taxes one to one and a half to 2% in order to get a viable Orchard no no no you it was just you know adamant with regard to absolutely not so a decision has to be made so I want to to share that with you with as you look to your Thursday meeting the other question that I've got is I I've looked at the agenda now will the public be given the opportunity for input I greatly appreciate you're allowing me to speak tonight just to plant the seed with regard to I understand frustrations I understand the discussion that's just taking place here but on the other hand I hope you understand what I'm saying is I've seen this town have multiple significant votes now that it takes multiple significant votes to get what I would say is somewhat of a lack of public education understanding full context what are the implications and I think that's something that should be considered as you contemplate what your next moves are both of the ad hoc working group and of Select boards thank you thanks Rob okay see you Thursday see you Thursday oh goodie uh select board retreat and goal setting session um so this is the time of year we normally do this uh I was think we are going to go to the department meeting in two weeks 13 days yeah they're all looking forward to I'm sure they are that's further on so yeah but for your um yeah um so after that we can we'll have an idea what the Departments want and I don't know um yeah so we should start figuring out when a good day or time for Retreats are so just for well and even though it is coming up but just a figure when we get to that I'll ask the question I'm sorry all right I'll ask that um uh what is the what is is it just going to be yourself is it going to be all five of you is it going to be three two for which for the department head meeting yeah I'd like to be there the date of it June 10th well you know I won't be there CU I'll be on state that's that's why we did it this way that's why you did it this way you said June June 10th 9:00 a.m. right right so it would be the morning of the one UPS I'll watch it on YouTube so I would say that anyone can make it anyone that no does that does that have to be posted right if we're of us there then it would have to be posted and open to the public right yeah we've done that's we did last time yeah and basically it was like it was almost like the a mini budget session where all the Departments just went around and said what their goals were for the upcoming year you know the swats help us to yeah understand what we're doing what can we do to help you what are your what are your goals what do you need help with yeah so but ultimately that goals should be in support of what we're doing too I mean so it's got to be kind of a synergistic so relationship all right so then we're going to just do the goals scheduling the session scheduling after that so sometime after yeah yeah the end of June probably okay or I mean while you're talking about it I mean that's that's that's the window you're at now so before anybody else's calendar fills up and me you are probably talking about the end of June you probably don't want to get into July but I we thinking Friday afternoon again last time that worked well last year we can do that so that would be either the 21st or the 28th 21st is the carnival I don't know if that plays in anything but 21st what Carnival but doesn't really play it 21st is can all go have gotten candy appol so 28th is better for me about the 28th yeah it's wi open yeah okay potential ret Retreat yeah that other week I'll be in yeah I'll be 10 you're out of 10 28 the 20 20 the 19th to the 21st but the 28 okay okay awesome that was easy what are we thinking on that like noon to 4: what we do last time speaking at the at the fire station oh boy all right yep or do you want to do it in the evening on a Friday no thank you okay you you devel I love you mean it but no you're already developing a cough just let them know you have a dentist appointment I think yeah clearly that's what the um yeah no to something we can try like 1 to 4 keep it a little shorter one might be better because I do a standing meeting at 11:30 on my C that's fine one to four all right that's good thank you and the meeting with department heads we we set the time will post at room 103 June 10th 9:00 a.m. okay perfect um one 4ish five we going to go down in three hours I think we did four or five hours last time didn't we four hours it I think it was one to four last time it went longer got a little I think it we went over but yeah I think it was only the three hours last time and Lisa can cancel office hours that day okay yeah hopefully that's when I sign up okay uh discuss and potential vote on the affordable housing trust under the OneStop Grant application so um the affordable housing trust is going to put in a One-Stop Grant application hopefully next week um yeah um we um the money will be used to well and the one stop is on a larger picture we'll be making and we'll we're going to request that the select board take uh take action on on its entirety uh the affordable housing Trust on OneStop gr Grant has three components one of which is the affordable housing uh trust component which is a a budget of approximately um $120,000 which is a they many grants to take care of some immediate um uh health and safety issues with a house such as if there's a leaking roof or a foundation issue electrical or plumbing and there'd be many grants uh for affordable um home owner for homeowners that are that are there um and those would uh the terms of that um from why I understand how it is has been discussed has been uh it is a straight Grant and I don't believe there's any uh there's no deferment there's no there's nothing um recorded on on the property that's the way I understand it uh the other two components of uh of this is a is the um for the housing um infrastructure for housing of the King Street uh Commons area 550 uh with 550 King Street of $4 million that's going to be what essentially be looking at I believe it was it' be phase two at that and that is defined under there as public infrastructure which is an eligible activity under the OneStop uh Grant application and the third one is the Littleton common revitalization robat recording Economic Development potential with the so project so that is in uh with um cooperation of the the sewer department and UMass donu Institute and that's an estimated cost of uh $60,000 um with a 10% uh local match funds required for that and that is also elal activity and uh as part of the preliminary part of the onstop application these three uh projects have been vented by the state and they are they have actually defined where they would fit in which I just expressed about each one and um um they are looking forward to receiving the application in full so the request is uh um permitting um uh permitting uh the office the town administrator's office to be able to submit on behalf of the town uh when when when the time just when we're able to by the due date okay love that free money okay do we need a motion for that or just I think that's I think it's fine as long as you know long as Jim can can do okay minutes all good for me I went over them and they seemed correct yep okay so um move that the select board vote to approve meeting minutes from The Joint select board finance committee Community preservation committee meeting on May 7th 2024 and the select board meeting on May 13th 2024 second move by Matthew second by Karen all those in favor I I motion to adjourn second all those in favor I I thank you on June 10th