##VIDEO ID:PENbW3mzrfk## okay good evening everyone this is the community preservation committee um for December 18th 2024 we have a quorum we'll start uh and just remind everyone that we are being recorded um we're not live but we are being recorded on lctv so anything that you say in your likeness will be recorded So if it's not something you want you can CH leave our first thing is news mailed in minutes um the only news I had um done a note from Marin to Hill um the planning board about the Littleton Bridge pres preservation did you get this yeah I looked it over quickly I haven't read it I have to read it it's for the Route 119 Great Road over 495 up by the point um this was addressed to the community preservation committee it says that the mot is proposing to preserve the bridge which is L1 13-30 that carries Route 119 over 495 in Littleton through a full deck replacement the total project limits extend approximately 520 ft along Route 119 including an estimated 100 ft Beyond both ends of the bridge uh the bridge was originally constructed in 1960 and has gone through at least two Rehabilitation projects most recently in 1988 design and construction standards have evolved since the bridge was originally built the latest inspection occurred on October 10th 2022 and the super and substructures were in satisfactory condition but the bridge deck and deck joints were recommended to be replaced the assessment of the different Bridge component conditions have led to the proposed project to include a full deck replacement with new bridge barrier and curbing New sidewalks on both sides and repair and repainting of existing Bridge beams there will be limited Highway work including curbs guards and pavement and sidewalk Rec construction to meet the existing conditions the current traffic lane configurations will be be maintained with compatible traffic management elements the proposed improvements will extend the life of the bridge and increase the safety for users crossing over 495 U Mass doot appreciates your perspective and welcomes your input regarding the proposed project for CPC I don't really see it's not like we're going to like a mass all it is it went to uh a number of of committees but they specifically sent it to us um so the um one of the things that is going on with that that might be part of that project is apparently the culbert that was originally built in 495 was um built is not functioning properly so the groundwater on this side of r95 is about 2 ft higher than it should be and it's 2T lower than it should be on the other side of r95 so this is the result of a new storm water new flood maps for the whole town and so that might be become part of that project but still we wouldn't ever use c i mean i that that may impact something else the more important project is an xbd down 119 over at bber Brook and starting surveying that so that's also going to be redone well we need more traffic so that's 1920's we got the name um you can give this it's the one over 495 it's Bridge l-1 13-03 um so I've read it into record but I don't think there's anything that we need to respond to yeah I mean make it SM like I said we can't we wouldn't give them any money anyway um I did send out again the uh draft minutes from October 16 I have a few I always have c um well that was a pretty important meeting yes it was so um couple comments on number two member updates um so supposedly Jeff said it's not occupied right exactly so I think we should delete that or fine yeah y all right is that is that clear myth I'm not there sorry um I I don't have a copy all right Caroline are you follow yeah I have it in take out and is occupied um on number three just above the word funding says address multiple plans such as open SP space SL Recreation I believe it only addresses Recreation should we delete open space I think it was meant the open space and Recreation plan ah yeah I yes okay maybe could we at the end and then okay and then um on the second page number 4 A1 says Linda ask if so I think I can fill that in okay Linda asked if this if this project is CPC eligible based on maintenance not being covered by CBC that's it perfect that's just about everything that I had um I was just going to add we didn't have the adjournment time and I'm actually missing as well missing missing the only comment I had was um I thought we approved or voted in the conduct but I think that was at last meeting um I'll have to watch it and see what how long it took us to um I'll get the time and send it to you oh that was October November was our record time one 59 minutes so but I don't know about the one that that yeah this one was long this one was this one was the one like 9:30 or something I'll look at it and I'll just send you please Corrections thank you okay anything else I brought paper copies if you want to look at November's but they're it's got to be drafted form it's got question marks and blank spots so why don't we take them home with us until next time it gives everybody a chance sure if you want to go hold school take the copy yeah thank you can we get a a motion to approve these as amended cored second we a motion to accept the minutes as amended by Saul second by Linda I think we're all here so we can just do all in favor iOS great thank you all right next on the agenda some projects on were there any other member updates any of them only that the Architects contract for the tennis courts and baseball fields is approved meeting Monday that is moving SCH sort not really there is a bit of a struggle with some of the contract language um next up we have the Historical Society for there are two projects I have to recuse myself so Andrew will you take over certainly I only have that's the eligibility for the that and they don't have the one okay all right so our first uh project under the Historical Society for tonight is the hot Memorial Building front door restoration Project tonight we're going to be reviewing the eligibility and funding applications for that project so Andy did you want to give the board a summary of what the S Society you want me to be um if we could actually pull a chair maybe if that would be or maybe the front room that works so the microphone can [Music] okay I think you all got a copy of this but I'll just sort of we did [Music] um we have just completed the restoration of all 54 windows in the hton memorial building expecting that they will now last many more years the Beautiful Arch double front door has been repainted many times someone described it as being held together by layers of lead paint the building is one of only three historical register sites in Littleton designed originally in 1895 as a library to be the Crown Jewel and Cultural Center in littleton's um Center geographical center and um the building is sturdy as well as stunningly beautiful inside and out we hope it will remain a town treasure forever the doors will be brought to the shop um where they will be taken down to Bear wood repaired painted and replaced in the door frames which will be similarly treated in situ a temporary door and frame will be put in place for the duration of the projects so we can have access to the building this continues the dedication the society has to the hon memorial building we have already paid for the basement waterproofing replaced and upgraded the HVAC system and contributed over $50,000 to the window restoration project um the company um uh early American Restoration who did the windows um I did get a a quote from them um $1,376 41 um a lot of that though is the uh we doing the fake door on the outside they have to make like an entry way because otherwise we have no way of getting in the building nor does anyone else um which is sort of a pain but that's how it has to be done um and uh I did I didn't get any other um estimates but I did talk to a friend of my brothers does this kind of work in Boston and um he looked it over and he and I told him what um um early American Restoration was proposing and what what it would cost and he said um if you guys if he said if you're happy with this company and happy with their work he said go with it he said because you're not going to find any price ler than this so I thought that was interesting he he didn't he didn't want it himself he didn't want um any it's a I think it will be done and I think they said about two months it would take them to do it and then it would you know be in keeping with the windows and it would be restored when you can't replace the door um it would have to be restored and putting another coat of paint on it I don't think is going to really work any questions thank you does the board have any questions for Andy sorry sort of the last piece in finishing the exterior yes all the windows are done and it will be yeah but you've also done the roof the roof was done right few years ago this slate yeah that was I think we did get a something for that we well regardless of the CPC I mean the society is rep yeah so you're taking care of the exterior of you building yes it's a very well taken care of building and you we thinkk the society as always you know for looking out for it um does anybody have any followup questions the only thing I would wonder about is if they as they start taking the the layers off if they find damage or other things um they'll repair it that's what they have done with the windows um they take the windows out and they take them back to their shop and they put them in what they call the pizza oven and it melts rather than having to sand all the um lead paint off it melts it and then if there's something that's broken they would fix it and then when they're done with it it looks like it would have when it was new right um so and the doors I guess are particularly hard uh because they're arched and um you know you can't actually it would be almost impossible to to replace them because to make something you know fit back the way yeah okay um and the other thing I have here is a um a piece of um it's it's a document it was on this weum them separately Oh I thought you talk about it out another time oh yeah no worries so what we'll do is we'll um we'll consider this project first and then we'll discuss the second project okay I I have a couple of minor comments on this sure um I think there's a couple of Corrections one is on the table where it says you know acquire create Reserve support reate I um acquire preserve and rehabilitator checked off I think acquire is not should not be checked off yeah because you're not acquiring a hisor of resource you uh reserving it and then other where this table oh whoops you're right and then the other correction is in the write up um you said the building is one of only three historical register sites the ACT it's not called the historical regist it's called The National Registry register of historic places okay sorry so that's all I have okay what are the so we have the Rose's house field bearing ground okay and this any other questions or comments for the applicants yeah what is the dollar amount request and are we considering the eligibility request in application funding in tandem so what we can do is the the amount being requested is $1,376 41 repeat that please sure it's 11, 376 in 41 CS thank you and uh we have before us an eligibility request and a funding application is that is that amount the exact amount that that was that was what they gave I I asked him about it this summer and that's the quote he gave me then so it's possible that it might be more than that but if it's a we haven't actually talked about it but in my mind if it a little more we could probably come up with a difference but I don't know I mean because I have to give you what it is now and I don't know what it is now do we have toor um do we have have to to only approve the exact amount or can we do we have any flexibility there we could bump it up a little bit if necessary at the requests of the the applicant if he wanted to amend your application perhaps a little bit but if the society would be willing to kick a little bit in if there's you know yeah I I just don't know how much it would be I mean it might be the same I don't know um but since he gave it to me in like July or something it do seem reasonable that it yeah everything goes up I don't know since we don't have a number I think we should go with what was proposed because we don't know what the new number would be I mean I didn't want to hold it up because I didn't know you know and then have to go get it and then have to come back and yeah are you comfortable with that figure tonight uh if looks it down the road in a couple of months once the work is let's say this project gets approved tonight it goes to town meeting uh the funds become available July 1 uh do you think it would potentially take more funding than the 11,376 potentially or is that well what what what if we um it still has to go to town meeting right yes yeah can we leave it at this and bump it up when we get closer to town meeting if that's the case we would have to revote the project before town meeting the whole right um which we could potentially do uh it's yeah it's it's really up to you how you want to proceed with the project if if you'd like us to approve it at that amount tonight and then perhaps see what comes up certainly do that what do you think yeah approve it at the amount it is and then I mean maybe it's going to be50 more well the advantage is go to your vendor and say you have this amount of money um and it be a negotiating from um the other thing I was going to suggest you could think about is maybe V you know adding an amount that is a contingency which is typical in all building projects um I don't know that's necessary for a project like this that's that's my head was you're going to find you know you tear something that you're going to find something I you know I I've got a feeling that it's not maybe they built in the materials they used in 1895 was so far superior than what we have now it may be perfectly sound but um I you know we have to have a starting point well and they they expect that they're going to find you know they don't expect that it's going to be perfect I think so they may maybe built into the into their estimate a little I I don't know or we could ask for more and then if it was less we could give it back the people do that any unused funds do you go back into that particular bucket so for this project it's a historic project so if there was any access it would get returned after the completion well what if we ask for 12 I a problem with that and then if it if it was yeah so we could amend your application tonight for 12 and uh and then if it ended up that was too much we just give it that that works how do people feel about uh I I I would say in general about cost of it that in my professional experience that seem je like a good price and a a new a production door would cost far far more than that so I mean I think that it's a responsible approach we need to vote on it yeah so um since the applicants have amended it we can consider everything as a whole once uh we're done discussing it and from there are there any other questions or comments uh from the board any questions or comments from the audience all right would somebody perhaps like to make a motion I can make a motion to approve the eligibility request and funding request in the amended amount of $12,000 you want to do them separately yeah let's do them separately make a motion to approve the eligibility request for the building front door project do we have a second I second it all right all those in favor any opposed all right it's unanimous all right the eligibility is settled so uh why don't we tackle the funding application now make a motion to approve the funding application with the amended amount of $12,000 we have a second so should we stipulate the bucket or okay I second the historic reserve for the record and we have a second Perfect all those in favor any opposed it's unanimous the other item I have here is a um Jonathan wcom otherwi Jonathan whitcom officers commission um it's a document that was in our well we're requesting [Music] $3,910 and it was a document found in our um in the stuff we already had and we think somebody gave it to us in 1896 1896 1896 um it's an officer's commission to Jonathan wam it appoints Jonathan to be the enen of the foot company within the town of Littleton it's approximately 13 by 16 in and it's extremely blittle and fragmented there is a picture of it in here with um in the packet you got we asked Northeast document Conservation Center any ECC for recommendations on a conservation treatment they recommended dry cleaning acus treatment humidity and wash sides with gelatin pre premen tears and fill losses with toned Japanese paper in wheat starch P nedcc also recommends Digital Imaging to create a faithful surrogate so that the original document can be stored safely with minimum handling the just a little background the wickhams have resided in and contributed to Littleton since the mid 1600s many still live among us the Wickham Homestead has been at 169 Wickam AB since 1707 Jonathan who lived 1690 to 1767 was a huge contributor to this town he was a farmer a selectman a shoe maker sealer of leather surveyor of Highways the fact that we have his almost 300 100y old rare officer commission document is pretty miraculous and and deserves a [Music] restoration [Music] um it's old you know um I don't know um I also have a a full disclosure here which is that Jonathan wh is my great great great great great grandfather but we didn't know each other I didn't even know it until we were doing this um so uh does anyone have any questions about this and there are paper copies of the application over here too if anybody wants to look at the so the the amount we we took it to um to the NCC and they appraised it they they gave the recommendations of that what we listed here to do I know but then would they do the work oh I see okay they're sort of like the only place around that does stuff like that um you know historic things that like they're well known everywhere for for their work the committee members have any other questions it really is a special document when I first saw when Susan emailed the application uh was amazed that we even have it you know 300y old's mission of such an important figure in town I did nerd out a little bit um but yeah it sounds like a great project and uh really money well spent to preserve such a important document to the town is there a after the preservation is done is how is it stored handled or where will it be our upstairs is climate control and we have other documents that we store up there like newspapers and stuff like that and um also ask them if we should frame it because we some other things that are have been framed that would be a better presentation I think it would be great if the town had the opportunity to see it perhaps after the Project's done to you know put maybe something at the Museum just saying you know CPA funded and give them an opportunity to view it because I think a lot of people would be interested in stopping by and seeing it once it's uh conserved I think it's great we have a long history but we don't have much to show for it the present day and this is you know pretty no any other questions for our applicants all right any questions or comments from the audience all right with that being said would anybody perhaps like to make a motion I'll make a motion that we approve the eligibility application for the johathan wcom officers commission reservation document do we have a second uh second it's been moved and seconded all those in favor I I I any opposed it's unanimous all right thank you and do we only have the eligibility there no funding application is that right right okay so you're going to submit that at some point yeah we didn't know whether to do it in stag so time yes yeah that's so the uh the committee's next meeting will believe to be the am I thinking is that corre third Wednesday in January third Wednesday which I believe double check my calendar here hard believe it's almost the end of December 15 the 15th so we'll be meeting next on the 15th and I believe that'll be our last meeting before the close of the war if I'm not mistaken February oh February okay perfect so um so yeah if you could have that funding application to us by then uh we can take it up at our next meeting okay good have to pass it in or do do we have to be here for it um how do the committee members feel uh unless there's a substantial change to the projects perhaps is it so awful to come no you don't have to answer that I can think of I know all of you and I like bring us cookies no I think I think we we talked about it tonight if you just sent it in we would look at it I think that's okay way to go perfect great excellent well thank you so much for coming down tonight and all right thank [Music] you so um that was added after for the historical commission okay welcome back happy good night Susan Andy was that on your mother's side or your father's side um mothers yeah you when we moved to town we didn't know that we were victims you know we just moved here you know we came for brookly and then all of a sudden my great aunt had done this huge fan chart and there we were de withes have a great nights okay so next on the agenda is the Track Association Mark ronacher is here to give us a little introduction as to what this is all about ier speaking as a private citizen um so um um the the the the track over at Russell Street was built approximately 15 years is ago um not using CPC funds they weren't eligible for that type of project at the time um the track is going to be in need of a resurfacing in the next uh couple either this year or next year um I'm not submitting the application that will be coming from the school I'm here refer resenting the track organization which has run the road race in town for the past 16 plus years uh raising money to support the track um we um I've had conversations with Carolyn and T Ryan and different people that if we uh the track to check to see if the track would be eligible for the resurfacing would be eligible for CPC funds and if so if the track organization we um can donate the money we rais to the CPC to help offset the cost and then we can take advantage of the state matches so a few years ago we donated some money that's sitting in an account with the school they have like $440,000 we donated um in the past um we may be able to donate I don't know the amount exact amount we'll be able to donate through the CPC it's probably somewhere between 20 and 40,00 but we're if if you guys have a rough determination that the project is eligible then I will work with the track organization to figure out how to get a check through the CPC for this but I wanted to come in make sure that we're all talking the same language before we issue a check and can't get um the project funded you B part for the B so just the resurfacing is $ 60,000 I think there's talk of a couple of improvements they want to make um um I don't know if they'll come in with the same project they want like a javelin throwing area and um some extra support for the pull bolt which wasn't in the original project um I have no idea what the con the cost of those are I don't know if they're coming in together or separately um but the but just at 160 the track organization PID for approximately half for the money that we raised in road races over the years so oh perfect is there kind of like a rough idea of how much the resurfacing itself would cost about 160 170 is the quote that I saw um in the past few months so there's not a lot of organizations you can that do this so um it's a lot higher than we were originally anticipating um but if you go over there you can see the the the surface is starting to crack um the track coach casy Goldenberg has been doing repairs at very or where like um you'll see like 2x4 in sections that just were pulled up and he goes and glues them back down oh wow um the area that is typically the worst is where they run the 100 meter dash where they have the starting blocks the starting blocks end up ripping up a lot of the surface they're they're switched to different kind of blocks to try and minimize some of that going forward but um there's also talk I don't know if it will be is included in this project or something else like the inside of the track doesn't have like a burm around it um in the same way so they might be doing it a little bit to help the drainage around there and help preserve it at the same time so I don't know if that's part of the cess it I haven't been involved in most of that I just help with the road race and on that side so you are here on behalf of the um C Association to determine how we feel whether this would be an eligible so if it's an if it's an eligible project when it would comes to you guys we I mean we can donate the funds to you at any point once we vote our board votes if the project is eligible then we hope that when it comes to you you at least support the amount that we donated you can determine if you want full eligibility or someone else is covering the rest but we are in a position that we can donate money to help support this and if we donate it through you rather than through the school we get the match from so our money you know even at the worst case our money grows by 10% just by going this direction so so Saul this is a competing um uh Recreation project yeah yeah I mean it's it's certainly a recreation project um it I think is seems eligible to me um I just did a quick look in the database and there are a couple of track servicing projects in there so other other towns have done but I guess I'm I guess I'm pointing out that we just gave a lot of money to you know for other things and which sort of washed out a lot of that buck and I know the bucket will so but I'm also hearing that it's not like an imminent thing that has done this year I don't know I'm not in putting the application in I will not be involved in that at all I don't know the school department plans to put it in for this year or the following year I I yeah I guess from the certainly from the restoration side I fully supportive of of funneling the money through match and and sending it back to the track that way beyond that I think you know the track is is certainly big recreational resource and if we have the funds available it seems like a Val Val project in town especially if they're kicking in a substantial portion of it I mean it's we definitely have $80,000 in the in the bucket think I think I'm know what sh we have maybe like about 450,000 in the recreation bck itself plus we have the undesignated undesignated so we certainly have thech I I don't know the current state of the track program but when my kids were there it was the Envy of other it's huge other schools and and Mark saucer used to be approached by other coaches saying like what are you doing you know it's and he says I don't know but it's been a great it's been a great thing and L father who visits from Southern California loves that track because the track that he has to be on our crappy and he compliments it so well that is the other thing too it's not just the school kids that use the track it's also used for the the seniors walk it and and anyone else do want a safe place to to walk so I was out a couple days a week over the summer and at 5:00 a.m. there were half dozen people on the track wow 5 a.m. yeah wow it's not so much this time of year I 6 and there's only two of two or three of us so we don't have a formal eligibility request but I think what he's looking for is just the you know is there yeah and is there any yeah I think it's it's a slightly novel to have a funding source come from outside of so I came up with this because you did this something similar through the light and water donation from mon property so that's how this whole idea started percolating in my mind um that it was something that we could potentially do so incom really encourages us do and I think didn't we talk about or you talk maybe it was even before I was on um I think it was the track they were going to get a lot of I mean this was years ago they were going to get some money to put through or was at the playground or you recall that M I think that was the track wasn't eligible at the time we built it at the time the track was um put in place Recreation was not an eligible CPC use it might have been for the castle and trees renovation yeah there's other examples I mean like um there's money that's been funnel through from developers to affordable housing for example too so I I have a question about the revenue in terms of but I don't have an answer for that tonight in terms of what is considered what is coming into us as Revenue it would be great to have a gift and I think it's allowed but we just need to make sure that's true um in terms of Eligibility it um can I read some from the the Coalition course uh the Coalition is a nonprofit Sports Community preservation in massachusett and we're remember and their website talks about is our project um allowable and uh a 2012 amendment to CPA broaden the law around Recreation to allow for the rehabilitation of existing outdoor recreational facilities the amendment made it clear that with respect to land for recreational use Rehabilitation could include the replacement playground equipment and other Capital improve improvements to the land or the facilities there on to make them more functional for their intended recreational use and that is precisely what is being talked about here it seems so it doesn't there's nothing can it doesn't have to be a certain ownership it doesn't have a have to have a history of Prior support being purchased or anything like that it's just reserving that Rec resour said I looked in the database too and there's other exact projects it would have been great if the track was eligible the first time around simplified so much of the household getting the track proov and I'm looking at last year's um what we we were expecting for last year this was just based on the percentages we gave Recreation a 21% from the 1% search charge and 15% of the state match funds so we were expecting about 115 to come in in Revenue so I would think it would be similar if not a little bit more just in this this time this year right so it would be recouped in one you don't see this coming in for this time I have no idea that's not we're the track organization is not putting in the application that will be coming from the school I do not know if they're planning on putting in for this year or next um I know it's coming soon I just don't know how soon they have their hands full with other things at the moment so I would say from it sounds like consensus that we would tell them to go ahead and and if they want to bring an eligibility request in with you know some more we can check that off and then when they want to bring the funding and they could bring it in in the next year I mean however they want to do it okay so I will work with the track organization that'll maybe come at your next meeting and give you a big check to do that speaking of the money you need confirm that we can accept gifts or they have to go into the town cers and then true or can we accept the direct gift yeah we can talk to the fincom um just to double check I think so we we've given a gift to the school before um so it's also possible that that money can be moved as well there's at least I mean we it was two or three years ago that we gave them a $40,000 check in there it's sitting in a track um stabilization fund for lack of better and um that could potentially be moved over as well I'm just wondering if is it but but that that I have no control or say over because we already um donated that money that would have to be this school yeah but just sitting there we can start say well we heard that money so so if this is something that the committee is okay with I can work on getting at least one if not both sets of funding coming this way and and let the school know the project will be eligible and you can tell them what year that they if you want it this year tell them to wait if you'd rather on the funding source um I don't know what their timeline is um that s's already going to be ripped up this summer so maybe they want everything done at the same time but the question is do we get the check in a big one you want a big Che have our our blessing to move ahead okay thank you very much thank you have a good night Carn do you think um there's a person that we should reach out to look into whether it's legal and most efficiently plans in terms of how the money streams I think we just talked to fincom uh Steve vudi and his team next time they have a meeting they must be going to have meetings soon they should be and I think could potentially function similar to the water department uh donation water was uh water was given to the water money was given to the water department and then they entered into anou with the CPC on how that money would be spent so I could imagine that if school has 40K sitting in a track account uh we could enter into anou with them to basically dedicate that money towards the recreation bucket for the track project and I think that would be a very easy way to just that and the worst thing that could happen is that ultimately they say no you can't get the match but right you would still have the money available for the project right we would just split it and and the one part that's a little different with theou like when you did the water one they wented final s on the project the track organization say coose to the track we're not going to say this part this piece of this as long as this reporting track related activities you guys can vote it we're okay with that thank you so who looked into that I will I will I'll Emil then start hearing from them any oh word does seem to be trickling down about CPC and the matching all of a sudden I know it I know it nobody knew about us for a long time um a historical commission Lind brought a bunch of projects with us which I do have copies of those colors or they look different oh because I could copy them on different colors these are all the funding applications Robinson Road out buildings and that's a set those those look like the eligibility because those are the ones with the yeah there this is a this is another set um if it's conven do you have the title of the project the first one we heard tonight about the doors that's um hon Memorial Building front door restoration uh so the first one is the n nug Hill out buildings okay so [Music] um yeah so I submitted an eligibility and funding for all three of these but for the nag Hill outbuildings um as you all know there's an orchard Committee in town I don't know if they're active at the moment but there has been a lot of discussion about what's going on at the orchard so the the actual structures themselves are not part of the Agricultural preservation restriction um that's been just I've discussed that with the orchard committee and I've discussed that with the uh head preservation guy at Mass historical commission so we're we're quite clear on that if any of the structures want to be preserved in the future if the town decides to do that um that that isn't decided right now but if any of those structures um want to be preserved in the future the first step is to get them into the macis database that's the state database of historic properties um two I think two of the buildings up there are already in mackas a third one we are working on right now to get into Maas that's the main house that you see on theog Hill Road um we're paying for that out of our historical commission budget for the preservation consultant to research that and write that up um and then there's three other buildings on the property and that's what this application tonight is for it would be for this historic preservation consultant to research and um write up the survey forms for these three out buildings um they are a cottage is the what is the cottage it's down you hardly see it but it's down at the lower barn and a little further down but if if you're just driving by you unless you're know where to look you don't see it so it's in that complex of barn of the lower the low the lower Barn the cottage right yeah yeah yeah it's it's where you park if you're going to walk at the conservation land the conservation it's right ACR kind of across the street oh okay yeah yeah you did it's not even in my head yeah and then this would also cover the main Barn the Big Barn um so um so that's what this application is for to make sure that all structures at that Orchard are in the macros database um we have Littleton has like over 370 structures in that macro State data base now and these should be in there and it's kind of Step One it does doesn't really prude them from doing anything right this doesn't put any restrictions right now on any of the structures it just is step one it has to be the pro the structures have to be in this database if there's any future movement towards preservation and so where did you get the amount that up I have uh I have an estimate from and consult are consulted and you is this the one you used at and you're happy with we're thrilled with everything okay good yeah she's done a great job on researching the main house that she's working on now very interesting information she's uncovered about that she she's gone back to 18 early 1800s or maybe before up until now she has all the deeds and all the all the history any other questions about just in terms of the timing given the the site may go back into more intensive use in the spring is if we're do not doing this till next fiscal year is that soon enough or are we going to be a little behind on I guess I'm M question well CU if we approve Ian if this project gets approved it's not going to be funded until July of 25 yeah that's okay okay well I think if we we if we specify that it comes from the historic Reserve we can use the money that's already sitting in the bucket it's when you're if you're proving it from the appropriation like from the the allocation for next year because sometimes with you know the 10% that you put towards any bucket can either be funds or a project but that can't go through to July 1st but if you specify it's from the reserve you can use the money that you've already collected but you have to vote it in at town meeting as coming from the Reser well so it's still yeah so not July first it would be what time it would be out of time I don't think there's I think that's all it's all on limbo right the disos of the orchard or yeah that it isn't it is well anything anything would have to go through town meeting also no the leas does not I don't think the what the leas Mr but that wouldn't affect this project this is just getting it into this database and I guess the barn is not part of the lease they're working on as what I from what I understand so who's Le who's leasing uh that's a a tree company BR [Music] field and I mean there seems to be moving ahead the SL talking finishing up before the end of the year so open to comments froms this one I am following and so my understanding subject to change the volatile situation but they believe the potential Lee has expressed an interest in the barn even though it was not originally presented in the proposed property to be leased so there may be ongoing discussion so with that I would just encourage you that make them aware that this action is taking place so that it can't be some sort of oversight with regard to the interest of getting into Maas and and potentially that would at least be the starting point which is I think what you're doing if you're just saying if we need to move quickly we' at least cross the first hurle in order to consider doing whatever we need to do so I do believe quite certain there's way to be a public hearing should the U least go forward from the Matthew and and Mark were the towns officials who negotiate with thank yeah I again I don't think any of this affects this particular project we have lots of private homes in this database so it yeah no if we if we do want to put a a preservation restriction on there the time is probably coming soon oh so you're saying yeah right so then it would be good if we could do it right after meeting if we could use the reserve for that I guess the other I just thinking about this this project we have gone it [Music] for uh affordable housing and for um conservation to have a a small an action sort of like an Enterprise fund you know to take care of things that come up right um that's something to consider things that are you know time time need to be done timely that we think are valuable to be funded through this it's a great idea is that allowed yeah it is allowed for some things I don't know if it's start is that through the CPC or yes essentially we yeah we provide I me it's the same thing as as well we've done it with affordable housing crust and they amass quite a bit of money that's outside meeting and the um Amy green wanted it was modest amount it was like $30,000 or something and not that she would even use it but she wanted it and it came up with the Webster property where they needed documentation and surveys and all this kind of thing that there kind of these exact things like to be able to do right away it's a good idea there's prent we can do it and so it's not like I'm not sure any has even used it I don't know I don't think we I don't believe so yeah but it's there as a yeah yeah we should look into that for sure and then I just requir I mean it requires some board to be responsible for it and then report back historical commission probably I mean do we have we have a [Music] conservation so so maybe you need to make a report to us about how that been used if at all we U we could probably do a report I I don't think I mean I'm not saying but probably we'd be doing yeah we should at least I mean we have Bart give us one for the Cal you know it's one of those weird things at the beginning of the year so even if you're reporting that you haven't done anything at least it's entered into the record I can certainly check with Amy tomorrow and at next meeting we can get like a report I don't think we've spent any money because there haven't been any projects after Webster in terms of surveying right potential Acquisitions but I'll give a thorough report at our next meeting yes um we're considering eligibility tonight at least yeah um I've been looking at the Coalition site again and it's just it there's a fine line to walk between what's allowed and what's not because if it's um if it's I forget what the verb is it's either Rehabilitation reservation or restoration um acquire preserve rehabilitate slash restore right one of those um they they write it may sound simple to do this but many questional project applications are submitted to cpcs if the project does not fit the definition of one of these verbs it's non relable in general a rule of thumb is that the CPA can fund projects that deal with tangible historic resources but not with historic interpretation education Etc um General surveys are not allowed General surveys studies and the like that are not con connected to a specific CPA project may not may or may not be eligible depending on the specifics of the request and the funding source used when faced with such question consult counsil um I think what what that sort of suggests to me is that this is done this is done ahead of time and we we don't know if it's we don't know what the future holds for this property um so if it's not going to be a CPA project in the future that tends to make it feel like it's less in support of a thing you know because you want you want to make sure that your CPA dollars in this category are supporting the resource itself well we have used CPA funds for surveys in the past for for Mac for getting forms into macas in fact we used quite a bit of money I think it was $20,000 um for a broader survey and yeah so there is precedence one this well it's sort of the gateway to preservation right that's right so while and this could be I mean if you wanted more ative an audit you could write this is you know this is pre this is a precedent action to uh um preservation of these outs or something right all right well I have it I have something in here inclusion in macas is also the first step of the first of several steps in potentially having a structure become eligible for possible future historic preservation status so you know the head of preservation at Mass historical commission said you got to do this first you can't get preservation for these structures and we got to do this first so I feel like it qualifies it works a town building it's kind of like a different layer to it like I suppose like if it was a private building and we were maybe putting in macis and weren't really sure if we were going to buy it down the road that's a kind of a a different story I think the pathway is to put the preservation is probably putting the preservation restriction on it at some point yeah and we're moving this is a step in the path to that and which would fall under seems like it would fall under the preservation part of Eligibility right what I picked off this preservation well the the example they gave of nonis were more like it sounded like people were applying to have interpretive guides at historic sites or something like that education but when part of a physical tangible thing as they said it's um I think it's be permissible in other town there are towns in the database that have have used them specifically to survey for Maas Maus properties all right I'm I'm happy I think I'd vote in favor of it thanks for being you sered as our own lawyer here yeah you just saved the time by the way I a question for Linda just um in the minutes I wanted to mention that you said the consultant has performed similar work for the Historical Society no she's performed similar work for 12 Robinson Road for the town for the commission right for the commission okay and and you were greatly satisfied with it very yes thank you may I make a motion to approve the eligibility request for the historic consultant survey of the three out buildings at n do Hill or Orchard second we have a motion and a second to approve the eligibility all in favor please say I I opposed nous thank you and we have the funding application as well I I provided more detail in the funding but you guys have had had it if you've had a chance to read it um I knew that we approve the application for funding for the um s preservation consultant survey of the three up buildings in God Hill ured in the amount of $3,253 Reserve oh yes from the second uh we have a motion in a second um all in favor please say I I opposed again it's unanimous great 12 Robinson Road okay um so as everyone is well aware um 12 Robinson Road has been rehabilitated um we it's almost done it's not quite done but it's almost done um we used this consultant this professional historic preservation consultant uh for that project that was the first project she's worked on for us we're having her work on these other projects before us tonight or proposing have her work on these other projects so for 12 Robinson Road there's a the application tonight is followup um work by the consultant for post Rehabilitation what that means is because this the house The Farmhouse the historic Farmhouse and barn have a preservation restriction on it in perpetuity so whoever the owner is in the future has to abide by the preservation restriction um the property is anticipated to be sold this month May maybe or next month or go on the market anyway um so we need help from this consultant we've never done this before so it was the first time we did the the rehabilitation first time we we were in historical commission was the gr is the grantor uh in the preservation restriction which means we're responsible for enforcing compliance with it um this consultant helped us immensely she helped write the preservation restriction um so we are seeking her help in going forward with a new owner how do we make sure that the new owner complies with the preservation restriction um she will talk to the new owner with us she will do a site visit to make sure that the new owner understands what they have to do she will write a template for us so um we have to conduct future annual annual or more inspections um and she will educate us as to how we make sure the preservation is continuously being adhered to so that's what this application is for so many questions um I think it's really good idea um how I don't know how it fits in you know if this goes to town meeting they'll have been sold and closed that how does it how does a buyer what what is a potential buyer and when you go in there it's clearly historically there's the original part is you know original hand grain you know hand grained um wind scotting and but um how I I I mean I don't I don't know the answers I just I mean to me it's like a sort of a complicated real estate transaction I know how does it work with you know that that will be a condo ownership of the four units how does it work with the condo documents um it's just complicated I know Sher G is doing the condo documents I don't know if she's you know thought about this at all whatever I don't know um that's why we need help from a person who's done this before she is very experienced in preservation restrictions this consultant and so um she'll get us going and if we we have questions we can ask her in the future um but it has it's a legal requirement that whoever owns owns these two structures have to comply with this preservation restriction so we need her help to help us with this legal document all this information is out in front of the sale I me you can't have it come up in front I'm scratching my head about is that I think it does though I mean the the the consti restriction has been record recorded So person who's buying this property could go read it themselves and say I'm comfortable with that and it's really it's not it may be very complicated but it's not so complicated I'm guessing as to involve the condos and stuff like that it has to do with the structure the framing the general look of a antique colonial well no they have to keep certain features they have to cure they have to keep certain exterior features and they have to keep certain interior features that are in this restriction right they can't reframe it or knock down Parts take outt or fireplaces or other things windows and stuff like that they can't take out the windows and original Windows have to remain well they're new windows but they're done to Historic well the window frames are original yeah the yeah the windows themselves are new but frames are original um I forget what I was going to say to I mean that information is out there for the buyer and know before they buy it because some people aren't going to buy it with it no it's it's a it's a place that you would be really into the historic structures if you're going to buy it not so much the barn because the barn they just recycled some post yeah that's kind of true well there are some things in there but yes but um it may involve the homeowners association you know I agree it so that's another aspect of it but you know the state recommends that you make sure that you do annual inspections um you have to make sure that whoever owns it is adhering to it so they can read through it and they could ignore it or they could try to change things or you know we have to make sure they don't do that and it kind of behooves the historical commission to keep an eye out and when the for salees sign goes up you get to the real estate agent I mean I've heard that in other times you talk to the real estate agent say hey do you know that this has a restriction on it because you're right in 50 years from now it's going to be it it it's an advantage in this case that it's a condo ownership because the condo association will have an interest in keeping everything on straight and narrow and um so that is true it really benefits the buyers too because you'll have somebody administering restriction that's very familiar with it ins and outs to protect them too from doing something that may not be allowed so it's a win-win I could take real estate and downplaying it yeah oh don't don't worry I you guys you should go in there you're not going to it's you're into you know um I mean this particular the old the house part of in fact you guys should go in there I'm really happy to hear that yeah I because I walked through it when it was for sale and had moldy ceilings and stuff and you should go look at it I'm to hear I can't wait for the open house I wish i' bought it for 200,000 I don't I I don't know if I told you guys a story about the the owners who yeah who sold it well the owners gave the town deal because they had had a long lost Aunt who died and dumped a whole bunch of money on that and so they didn't feel they had to extract every last penny out of the property and they just needed enough to set up a trust for their brother who is brain damaged from an accident anyway is there a motion um so we have the eligibility any motion that the commiss uh commission committee um approve the eligibility request for the 12 Robinson Road preservation restriction adherence Consultants second we have a a motion in a second all in favor please say I I opposed unanimous vote thank you and then funding I'll make a motion that the committee approve the funding application for the 12 Robinson Road preservation restriction adherence [Music] Consultants a second motion oh sorry let me Adit that motion to be taken from the historic Reserve in the amount of uh $1,128 thank you rob okay Andrew can you repeat that motion Absolut catching up so I'm going to make a motion that the committee approved the funding application for the 12 Robinson Road preservation restriction adherence consultant to be taken out of the historic Reserve in the amount of $1,128 [Music] then you second second seconded so we have a motion in a second all in favor please say I I opposed again unanimous thank youa we one more one more last one uh we're seeking a historic presidential consultant for follow-up consultations for 260 Foster Street for the house in Barn That's The derky Farmhouse um so the affordable housing trust owns these two structures um they contacted us about possible you know historic Rehabilitation of the house and barn and so we' been talking to them um our consultant the same consultant for 12 Robinson Road went out and did a site visit at the 260 Foster Street at the house in the barn with the affordable housing trust and Bart was there and yeah Bart was there Anna was there an architect who worked with the town previously was there um some other people were there and we walked through and you know and then and then she wrote up a um the consultant wrote up a um the results of her site visit what she thought was uh still existing historic and Architectural significantly features of the house and the barn and then I asked her to write recommendations so she wrote recommendations for what she would suggest moving forward since that time in the last couple of days um there's been further communication between me and the affortable Housing Trust they had a meeting last night which I attended part of it uh they're not sure what they want to do with the house there a couple of people on that uh Housing Trust think it would be too much work to rehabilitate the house even if it wasn't historically you know Rehabilitation they think it might be too much work to rehabilitate the house for affordable housing period um but you know the barn is still in play the house may be in play we don't know yet uh and another part of this discussion is it looks like because the house and the barn were purchased by the town with CPC funds they have to have a histor pres was portable housing restriction I think did the Tom bi no it was given to so it was bought um by the town with like $1 in affable with housing $1 CPA yeah oh so it came out of the trust CPA I see what they holding so it was it was a um it was a result of the subdivision of dery farm and that the developer was more than happy get it off this PL was $1 from CPC and it was from the it must be from their bucket the money well I don't know if this would apply if it's $1 I don't know if they CPA money CPA money yeah maybe if it's interesting right so that's something that we're kind of looking into to seeing if that really is required in any case I think the historical commission would be involved with the barn and depending on what they do with the house maybe the house so we're looking again for for a historic preservation consultant to continue talking to the all the the affordable housing trust whatever Town boards um an architect we have suggested that they use a what's called a preservation architect go assess the house um not just any architect who has no experience in historic preservation um and then um what's not in here is we would have this historic preservation some also con consult with the structural engineer that they will almost definitely need to have go through the house um and she would then help guide you know preserving historic elements of the barn and maybe the house as this project goes forward and we have told them that we would the historical commission would be willing to donate a portion of our CPC funds um in the future towards rehab of the barn and maybe the house um so I feel like we really need this this preservation um historic preservation consultant to work with the architect the structural engineer the portal Housing Trust and us as to what should be preserved with flexibility knowing it's an affordable housing project um that's you know we understand that they need flexibility to do that so that's what this request is for I think it's really uh great that you were leaped in to this uh the portable Housing Trust is sort of at Sea with what to do with the project I I mean I would hate to see that house being torn down just because of ignorance or without any profession Prof assessment I don't know how much assessment you're going to get for this amount of money uh but to at least interpose and barl said that the consultant said oh yeah there's the house definitely has elements that are you know historic often you go into places like that that have been you know renovated over the years and you know usually just surfaces and you really see you know being that and um so anyway I'm definitely for this and I would encourage everyone to look on the the community preservation Coalition website they have under um success stories um some H housing success stories there's one in Sunderland Sanderson place and it's the same kind of thing it was a house that when you look at it it looks small but I think they put in two or three units and it's beautiful and they use I think there were like four Partners to the project and one was the affordable housing trust so there are ways to do it it may be new to Littleton not the kind of thing we've ever done but there are certainly examples out there of how to do this but they're actually it's quite interesting I was kind of looking through them the other day I mean one one of the things that may happen is that they bring on I mean they probably should theying on development who then would need to be governed by this kind of work so yeah and a lot of them that's what they do it's a it's a development yeah place that and to get affordable housing you have to have some input that is usually land or structure or whatever so was saying possible between the house and the two bedroom or whatever so it's too bad he's not here I mean if you know this is such a modest amount I if it was a large amount I'd say yeah let's wait until we can attend a meeting but I think this is just to keep it going we need her to our input to keep it going any questions or make motion I'll make a motion that uh the committee approved the eligibility uh request for the uh historic preservation consultant to perform follow-up consultations for 260 Foster Street The derky Farmhouse and [Music] barn motion a second all seconds all in favor of the motion is right please say I I oppos on this again all right here thank you Linda for bringing us thank you everybody are we doing the fun sorry 275 correct right that's correct I'll make a motion that the commission commission I keep saying commission concom that influence on me the commission uh uh motion that the committee approved the funding application for the historic preservation consultant uh to perform followup consultations for 26 Foster Street The derky Farmhouse and barn out of the from the historic preservation Reserve in the amounts of $1,275 paste totally close to the1 um we have um a motion in a second everyone in favor please say I I opposed again unanimous all right um projects in the pipeline I haven't heard um so I'll have three applications at our next meeting one will be for um an invasive plant control project at the Frog Pont next to Long Lake it'll essentially evolve um involve creating an inventory SL assessment of the uh the site um as well as like a first phase of invasive plant control um a second application will be uh to replace the walkway going through the Frog Pond which is like a mess right now people now how does that tie in with what the the highway department is doing to the frog pond so the highway department will be performing uh dredging of the uh the Frog Pond and they'll be doing a little bit of site work with trees to get access so this I'm hoping will be in the same permit package that goes before conom an noi Noti D filed so if we can get all of this work into that one filing and then have the the the money to back up the actual projects um would be great but in terms of phases the dredging would probably take place first um and the other two projects like the walkway I wouldn't want to put that in until the dredging is done so no Machinery destroys it but the invasive plan control assessment in an inventory could probably be done around the same time um and then um work could be done shortly after too so so those two applications will be coming forward I've already gotten them written I'm just kind of gathering pictures and uh cost estimates right now but one will be um more of a recreational side projects um so I'll probably float that over to Alicia and Tim uh once that's written up that's a pun um and then uh the invasive part will be an Open Space Project and then uh the third project that'll be meeting which will be circulating to Linda shortly is the historic gravestone preservation project um another phase of that let W so won or the old a wlon oh okay so uh there'll be three projects next time around for a January meeting and a lot of picture taking and cost estimate Gathering ahead of me here too bad they could have dredged it this summer yeah easy water so it'll be good I mean the uh I know long like no neighborhood association's been really dying to get this done for a while and you walk through there now and there are literally just so many hazards somebody's going to break their leg walking through there so I think it'd be a great project uh in brost to fund and I'll be getting it to you soon well it seems same for all the work that they did to put it together and then just let it it's been over 20 [Music] years so oh was it but who did it was it the water department yeah yeah yeah all those whales that they put down the water saw is there anything coming up for you that quiet yeah no I we enough on our plate between the the tennis courts the fields and then [Music] the department is moving over the 36 gam building probably next summer so how was that coming out I mean I see it's been painted but I don't know what's going on insid yeah I mean I think it's you know they're most of the work is done the the um they're waiting on hbac units that or back order couple of things that they need to get done so um as far as I have not been inside since early in the project it's moving along in their their meeting regularly yeah we have there um public comment Mr do you have anything further um I don't really I haven't heard from the fincom I'm assuming pretty soon we'll start getting some messages from them for next year's um budget they did ask about um our select board actually put something out to all all committees about presenting you know most you know what we've been working on but I kind of feel like the budget will be kind of our it's all going to melt you're not going to have enough time to you know put something together but we're where we're very reactive we react to people's budgets so um they kind of know what we're doing so I I kind of just I think part of that was they wanted the various communes and boards to talk to one another more so that we don't get to town meeting where one board is not supporting another board whatever well the way it was worded was that they invited boards to come before them the select board so they can help the boards accomplish what they accomplish their goals the way this work as long as they agree with discuss the goal but we're a little different don't propose projects we facilitate them we don't propose them no and I in steni from the beginning has wanted like a 5-year plan from us and we can't do that because we don't know what's coming before us right all right and it's projects that come up that that's why that's why we have CPA so so I suspect at some point we'll be getting something from especially if we talk to them about these projects so we'll be bu SE Super Saturday morning presentation that reminds me uh this Paul I took a course with uh the Massachusetts land trust Coalition through UMass and it was uh workshopy all about different mechanisms and strategies for land preservation and it culminated in a week and retreat in Plymouth and I met some really cool people through it including uh the somebody who did a lot of CPA work in Plymouth which is a huge town by the way it's really remarkable really unique town and they have thousands of Acres that they've preserved and stuff like that anyway um uh he he had really incredible proactive uh strategies for finding um and negotiating with land owners and stuff like that including um and I want to talk more with him about it um the is completed and I I have all these people that I'm thinking I want to stay in touch with and he's one of them his name is Peter something and one of the things that he said he did was that um they would have executive session for the uh Community preservation committee so that they could actually reach out to landowners and begin overtures and in in a proactive way that would be way ahead of real estate and way had of in some cases the land owner's intent to like move on things and and start the Ed basically start the education process really early and get them um sort of uh wedded to the idea of of making a deal with the town to purchase their land so um I really liked his ideas and and admired what they had done in the town so um I'll I'll let you know what especially on the heels of the Webster property because that's basically what what ly and Gretchen wanted to do is preserve their legacy right right and then yeah I I think there's a story there or intersection points too because um they were they've been over backwards to be patient with with all the messiness that followed from different angles but if they had a through line and a partner in um right from the beginning it might have differently it might go well I know when the plan board was talking about the um it's just G out of my head it's this technique of banking land and this and that and and to speak to us and we sort of looked her and said well are there like because you get the feeling that everything's been developed and every we said is there anything that you know is worth really you know going after said oh my yes unequivocably unequivocally and I don't know what prop there were but um any well one one of the uh teachers of the course was um with the subre valley trustees and they've been a good partner with us um and the and the Harvard coner Harvard conservation trust or whatever um the Smith property for example is a real uh Su success story there in terms of Partnerships and stuff and we didn't we we didn't barely raised a finger to make that happen we had so much help from sober Val trustees to get that going I I don't mean just barely LIF to the Picker it's it's that um it was it was brought to us is sort of a whole complete package you know the leg work was already done I guess yeah anyway so that's another person group and if we don't have ideas they they'll tell us what's on in their little F but your idea from your sub from your Plymouth connection is you got to get the idea in the person's families got to get it in front of them they have to to sell to real estate yeah but it's a long process real estate is a lot faster outcome right and he also he also had stuff I I forget what it was right now in my in my memory but he had he said they used um their uh administrative funds for all sorts of stuff that helped smooth the process and move things along oh that's what it was they would pay they tell the land owners don't worry about um you know chapter 31 payback we got you covers or something like that you know stuff that would be totally gamechanging to a nervous landowner talking to their siblings you know oh what are we going to do about the tax or whatever and and he said you know there's so many things you can do to just make make worry go away for the [Music] land yeah think about thank you for the report and and again just one of the last things here is to we have still have to think about our budgets for the next year and what you know if we need to you know load something into like Recreation for getting more Recreation projects rather than be you know we try to be very evenhanded but we may not be able to do that so we may have to think about it a little bit a little bit more but that'll be coming up next year anything final before we do our our next future meeting will be January 15th that's the third Wednesday all goes well 15 before we have a motion motion to Second a second all in favor oppos thank you all right thank you everyone