##VIDEO ID:pm84ca10Xd4## okay it's resolved you can start okay Nancy yes we all set to go can you guys here okay that's okay let's go ahead all right so let's just say again welcome to today's Cemetary commission meeting on Thursday November 24th 2024 in accordance with the requirement of the open meeting law please be advised that this meeting is being recorded and broadcast live over the lunenberg public access channel on Facebook live on the public access Facebook page and will be uploaded to the lunenberg access you the agenda lists all the topics which may be discussed at the meeting and those responsible anticipated by the chair votes may be taken as a result of these discussions not all items listed may be in fact be disc and other other items uh not listed may also be brought up for discussion uh to the extent permitted by the open meeting Law Public participation is encouraged and public comments may be welcomed during the committee members discussions and the discretion of the chair please note during public comment that you have 3 minutes to give you public comment thank you com no you're cutting out okay is there any public comment by the public [Music] sure did you want to talk sir did you want to make a comment anything no okay I'll set ncy okay all right so we're going to jump right in um I know Carter has another meeting he has to get off to and thank you Carter we appreciate you taking time out of your busy schedule to sit with us today uh my apologies again that I'm not there but I am here um if anyone has any questions and like I said I will continue with with trying to do things on Zoom for as long as I have to be here in Maine um Carter let's Jump Right In and let's talk talk about this enement domain uh issue and and project that we're looking into and that the town Could you um can I pass that over to you and you explain to us how we would like to move forward with that so my understanding is a bit limited based upon my conversation with some folks and with Town Council it's my understanding that there is a uh Cemetery that has been located and that the historical commission has urged uh the town and its Cemetary commission to take ownership and responsibility for that plot is that accurate okay um I think that how this needs to be done has been fairly well laid out in a memorandum from Council I don't know if that's been shared with the cemetery Commissioners uh and with um Mr Bernard if not I will make sure that that gets forwarded uh this found Cemetery for lack of a better term is on private land you must either obtain an easement to maintain it in perpetuity or you must uh obtain uh actual title to it that easement uh could be voluntarily granted uh or it could be acquired by eminent domain uh the determination as to whether it would be voluntarily granted would be up first to the property owner themselves and subsequently because there is a mortgage on the property you would have to obtain the approval of the mortgaging entity uh they want to make sure that the property once encumbered by by this uh easement uh still has sufficient value to protect their underlying mortgage so if you own a property and own the bank $500,000 let us say and the properties's uh worth U $625,000 they're at 80% loan to equity and they're happy now let's say you give me an easement uh to go through your property to get to a backlog or something else and the property all of a sudden only becomes worth $500,000 because of the encumbrance upon the land the bank is going to say wait a minute I just went from having a property a mortgage that was worth 80 only 80% so I can go into foreclosure if I have to and feel very comfortable in getting the land back um and then they'll say but wait a minute now all of a sudden I'm at 100% I'm perfectly Steven that's risk I don't want the risk so no you cannot give that easement away in this instance you have to take it by eminent domain there's a process that has to be gone through there is uh correctly identifying the very specific lens you want the proposal for the survey that uh Mr Bernard has obtained um then select board Cemetery commissioner town meeting town meeting has to approve that action but I do have to ask one question before we get into all of the mechanics and spending uh dollars on this has this Cemetery commission voted they wish to accept this responsibility and have they had that discussion with the select board to determine it wishes to accept that responsibility and is willing to put forth the warrant article to carry this out once that determination is made now we can get deeper into the mechanics of it uh the other thing I would suggest is that we try to get that done um if you have not already done that um have we done that step no no that's that's been my that's been my point all along with Cemetery commission chair is that this again um has to go exactly what you just said Carter um it has to methodically go through the process and I felt like we hadn't and the cemetery commission was I did not want us liable until we know what is going on and what the best and understanding that it by a town by a select the manager that we're going forward in this so so Char I don't want to say Char voted nothing okay so I I shouldn't use the the term charging ahead but proceeding ahead I do think it would be worthwhile uh for uh the cemetery commission to take a formal vote I believe the historical commission has taken a formal vote is that correct Mr McGrath okay so we uh get those formal votes we put them in a memo uh and we have a representative of the historical commission and the cemetery commission meet with the select board and would Target December 3rd for that and let me tell you why I Target December 3rd you want money the select board has money it's a term I wish I'd never heard of but it's called arpa there's still some money on the table and the select board might be willing to entertain a request for you to proceed with the needed survey to be paid for out of arpa so a meeting on December 3 uh could help determine whether or not the select board would be supportive of going forward whether or not it would be supportive of placing that warrant on the article and perhaps get you uh the relatively few dollars to undertake the work that's needed saving uh whether it comes out of the operating budget or trust funds saving those local dollars uh that is my recommendation to you happy to answer any questions but I do think it moves the ball forward the December 3rd meeting you're talking about the selecting yes sir not okay yes sir and I would need that packet of material because of the way Thanksgiving falls um I would actually need uh your vote by next um well today if we have it I would need the minutes quickly even though they might be draft uh and then um when I prepare the agenda on um I actually forget which day I'm here next week Tuesday and Wednesday uh we could get that on their December 3rd agenda could could I interject quickly though um I had looked I was reviewing the Mass general laws around cemeteries and in chapter 114 there's a section 18 and it says care of neglected burial places within Town limits and it says any Town having within its limits an abandoned or neglected burial burying ground may take charge of the same and keep in good order and may appropriate money therefore but no property right shall be violated and no body shall be and no body shall be disent returned no fence tomb monument or other structure shall be removed or destroyed but the same may be repaired or restored so I'm thinking that um you know somebody of course came this this this uh this has come up many times over the years of finding burial grounds on private property and the Mass state legislator has dealt with this that that has said the cemetery commission can go in and um you know improve on that um but they're not to take property um so my thought is that um we don't need to acquire this property we can have a conversation with the owner um perhaps the survey is necessary to establish the exact bounds of the the cemetery portion um if the owner does not carry a mortgage and owns it outright and and would like to see the transfer of that partial that to the town that that's fine but I I don't think per this law I'd like the town attorney to go back and look at this to and and and so um we may we we according to what I'm reading we we have the right to go in of course i' I'd be cordial with the property owner and say you know here's here's what we're looking to do um is there a mortgage out there is so the comperative phrases here are two the first is that you may do it you have yet to take a vote to do it second to care for this found Cemetery my understanding is you have yet to take a vote a formal vote on undertaking that action the second important set of words is no property rights may be extinguished so therefore this property owner could let you on there and the next property owner might not let you on there so if indeed you wish to take care of this cemetery and you wish to do it for lack of a better term in perpetuity you need formal authorization that is longterm to be on that property and that is by virtue of a right of access and an easement over the property to be maintained so the property owner must grant that with the sign off of the uh of any lenders they have let me just say it that's been a little bit I think since Adam took a look at that um or you must acquire it uh in fee through property eminent domain or it could even be uh in fee with the permission of the bank there's several different mechanisms to get it done but but it all starts with does this Cemetery commissioner wish to take care of this cemetery and is it prepared to go through an on again off again permission of the property owner where does the title company get involved with this title company would not get involved in this until the next owner goes to purchase the property and a title exam mination is done to protect the interests of the lender remember title searches do not protect the buyer's interests they protect the lender's interests if the buyer wants title insurance to protect its own interests they have to buy a separate policy now I have to always put the Proviso of um unless they recently amended the law that is my understanding thank well I'd like to break it down into two things then is um do we wish to um take charge uh for maintenance and then the second would be how to pursue the property what your what's your long-term vision is of responsibility my reading of this is we we we have Perpetual rights to enter the Cemetary portion of that property if we choose to take charge of it um subject to no property rights may be extinguished right to me which which the property rights is is is their deed to the property not you might be right but we do need to start with does the cemetery commission I I think the way to break it down is exactly the way that you've laid it out step one does this Cemetery commission wish to take responsibility for this found Cemetery that's a vote it's clean it's neat I like the way you've done that the second question becomes for what long term and are you willing to endure the possibility that the next property owner says no or that this property owner says no we can work that out through legal but knowing what your intent is would let us move forward so we need to vote on this before we even know if the town is interested in taking it I suspect that um the select board would be unwilling to act uh without knowing the desires and intent of the cemetery commissioner I suspect they would want your advice uh on this and what your position is okay I've not always been perfect at reading the cours go ahead NY let me let me um step back for a minute so Mr um uh Bernard what is your take on maintenance keeping this grass done if we go forward and vote this to go forward with this and give it the vote needed to accept this responsibility and how big of an area is this is it a quarter an acre is it less and yeah yeah so it's a small area uh there's a bunch of trees grass may not grow there um we'd have to decide on a design are we going to put a fence put shrubs are we going to put the monument back um it's all to be discussed okay so all you need is again Carter what I'm hearing you say is if we wish to go forward in this whole piece all you need is for us to vote on this today to say yay or nay is that my understanding and then we work out the next detail step two I would suggest a two-part vote the first is whether or not you wish to go forward at all the second is whether or not uh you wish to go forward uh in perpetuity um and we would then get this in front of the select board uh to hear their thoughts uh and um hear the advice of this commission and of the historical commission I think truly that is the best way forward um oh and of course to ask for the money to do the survey all right so uh Dave and uh Michael are you I I think I would like format a motion that um in accordance with um in accordance with Mass General law uh well I guess it's um chapter 114 section 18 we would like to take charge of the family cemetery plot located on West Street terrorist is that sufficient and then um that's part one yeah I think that's sufficient okay okay I'll make a motion that um in accordance with um Mass General law what was that again um in accordance with Mass General Law chapter 114 section 18 uh the lunenberg cemetery commission would like to take charge of the family cemetery plot located at um what is this 34 34 West Street Terrace I second on the motion all in favor all I for clarification anly uh if I may ask a question Madam chair yes uh for clarification will the minute show that this is forever more this is not that the timeline is you wish to take charge of it forever more yes yeah yes yeah okay as long as that's in the minute for clarification make sure it's in the minute okay thank you um I will uh prepare a memorandum as soon as I can get even just the draft minutes um I will prepare a memorandum uh using the minutes of the historical commission I I think I lo ated them um if not Mr McGrath can point me in the right direction uh using the minutes from this and that will be before the select board on uh December 3 subject to the chairman does sign off on all the agendas um and I would ask that a representative of the historical commission Mr McGrath uh and the cemetery commission be present that evening okay could I ask um um can I oh has the um property owner been contacted and um are they uh in support of this and um you know working that plot to you know improve it Bill do you know answer to so we've talked to him he sent me a couple of emails um I think he's open to the to us going in there but he wants his property protected he doesn't want to lose value so I will invite that property owner to be present on December 3 um and I think that uh you know the select Board of course would be very respectful of a property owner's concerns uh but what I'm looking for on December 3 is a sense of direction uh uh you know um President Jefferson sent Lewis and Clark to a specific location how they got there he really wasn't quite so concerned with on that day-to-day basis uh and with this vote here the vote of the historical commission and subsequently um an indication of interest from the select board we have our destination and then we can start to work out about how we get through that in a way that respects everyone's concerns uh from um the care the history the maintenance and the legalities I I think that can all be worked out uh hopefully how far back are we going with the I mean how many people are there is it the Revolutionary War are we going to be putting a monument eventually there like we have at the North and South um are we going to be putting a a gate around it um you know I'm just wondering how much it's going to get involved even though we're taking it over how much more are we going to do to it right that's all future discussion there's six Graves that we know of six only so it's do we want a fence do we want a hedge do we want whatever so it's like fish Street okay yeah a smaller area than fish Street yeah is it okay yeah did we use GPR to identify we did okay right we have that report okay so for the Public's uh information uh I'm told uh by Mr Bernard that she used GPR ground penetrating radar uh to loop around the area to try to make sure that uh any bodies that were there were fully encompassed within the area we're talking about um and that there is a report on that uh have we put that online yet we have not we we can put that online uh so that people can follow this uh as it develops um particularly if it should move forward to a vote at the annual town meeting uh the more we information we can provide the general public um and get them understanding of what this is all about I think the easier time the vote uh at town meeting would face good okay is there anything else we might do on that uh issue Madam chair so I just wanted to ask one question that you brought up when this goes to a town vote and what if we go all this work harder and all and the vot comes back that they don't want to follow through with this that's it at that point in time that is it at this point in time subject to revisitation at any point in time by any subsequent Cemetery border of Selectmen in town meeting of course but yes uh unless there's a different workaround in the state I come from no means no if there's a no at the annual town meeting that is it for 12 months period end of story here in Massachusetts we can be much braver we can face every decision over and over again so that to the next town meeting is in what April May time frame correct uh May so we would be looking um for Warrant articles I suspect um it'll be very very late on my my tenure with you here uh we'd probably be start to prepare warrant articles uh in um mid to late January okay my thought is though um right now we have access to it we've just voted to do that um it would be good to go the formal channels to to get uh ownership of that go to town meeting to get funds um but the other uh Avenue might be um use of um you know uh what what what specifically can we use the sale a lots F Well s sale a lots we have to go to town mating but um um the um Perpetual care funds um or a gift fund we have gift fund could we ask residents here's a plot do you want to donate some money so this is all Downstream so um but we we we could could do other avenues if if the intent is just a small um clean up and uh Improvement you know I'm reminded of um conversations with my former wife when I would ask her if she wanted to go on vacation and she'd say where when what are we going to do and I said no let's start with do you want to go on vacation if the answer is yes I'll start to work out the logistics okay if the answer is no I'm not going to worry about anything else and so we would go through this sort of incrementally step by step and I think that you've identified and voted on the first step which we'll now get in front of the select board uh for the second step for their indication of willingness and interest um and then with Mr Bernard for the time I'm with you uh with Council I think we can move forward um you might not get much farther than simply getting appraisal money at this annual town meeting there is depending upon the U The Stance of the property owner and and uh any lender that might be in place uh you may not be able to get from point A to Point Z all in one you know Superman giant leap here um so let's let's determine if we want to go on vacation before we worry about anything else do you know the location that we're talking about yes you've been there yeah within within 50 ft Nancy have you been there West Street I have not no okay no again because this was never pulled through concerned because of the open meeting law but we're voting on this if we should be able to at least go see what this is all about you know we already took a vote which is fine but only one member knows the area um I do need to notify the property owner tomorrow of this vote I can't have them finding out if if you wish to forgo the vote so that you can visit it we can rearrange that differently um we have to I think we're Mak Dave I think we're making this too complicated I'm trying to help uh we're trying to help the town take that first step let's take the first step okay I'm sure again we you know again we've got to trust what they've already seen um this has been going on for a while my understanding is and again we weren't brought into it again we are now so let's take the first step let's take the leap of faith with Carter with the organization of going stepping forward in this and doing that first step then we can go and address everything else because like Carter said if the property owner if anything happens at the Town piece we are not going forward if the town votes no that's fine that's fine as long as before we take any more votes at least we see what we're talking about that's fine okay I'm I'm sure that Mr Bernard can um obtain that permission and steer you to that location okay yeah and Dave how about we do this how about Mr Bernard does exactly what Carter just asked maybe Mike unless you don't feel comfortable let um Dave go there I won't be there so I can't so I will trust Dave's judgment to go in look at it with Mr Bernard does that sound like a good plan does that make everybody okay with that sure go oneon-one and there is no violation of the meeting well okay right is that okay Mr Bernard yeah that works for me I I can reach out to the homeowner and get us permission to walk out there MH great and Bill will you advise him of this vote I will do that too thank you sir that's oh that's where the grades are let's go to the next piece okay yeah and about 20 ft uh-oh did she cut out what happened well she cut out yeah K should they also vote on the requests for Opa money um I I don't see where that would hurt I don't think it's necessary but I don't think that would hurt at all mhm we lost let's say a 5,000 Bill what happened it said that you ended the meeting it said the host ended meeting yeah it didn't we didn't how do we get back on you got to start okay let's hi there yeah I know I got so the next step is talk about the fish Street just keep me on your cell phone okay and talk about the fish Street project have look at Carter and Carter will talk about you're on spooker oh okay delay okay so Carter let's go in that next piece which let's talk about the uh fish Street project it's not on the agenda Carter um okay you're all set I I guess my only concern is are we taking this up under Cemetery Capital funding projects cuz I'm not seeing fish Street project on the agenda right because the Fifth Street was on what I stated is that it was underneath um the hang on one second I don't know the meeting ID it's under the re uh hang on I'm looking discuss open items and upcoming projects that's where I put that under I just again just put a big blanket over upcoming projects okay um are you okay with that I always leave this to the discretion of the committee since I'm not the one who gets the open meeting law complaint okay uh if the Dave are you okay with talking about the fist street we have Mr McGrath there I know there was some concerns with it I want to try to move this forward whatever way we're moving if this needs to be delayed then um and that's why I put it under the upcoming project we're all yep we're all set with that yep okay uh so I I don't have a a good set of brains on this one perhaps if someone could explain to me the issues uh here briefly uh between Bill and myself we can provide some guidance okay so the issues at hand it was my understanding under again the state law and getting bid information we were asked to give x amount of doar for the supplies but I don't know that it was put out to a bid I don't know from Mr McGrath again where the plan is of what this is going to look like the cemetery commission is in the dark on this one because it was brought to the DPW which is fine but we need to intertwine with it so if we haven't been told what it looks like what it's going to again we've been told but we haven't seen the actual project plan um um so that is my concern is making sure we dot our eyes and cross our teas that we don't get into trouble for doing something um incorrectly as far as what the violation of the state law allows us to do so okay my understanding this is the construction of a stone wall is that correct it's the that's my my correct but is Mr McGrath right there that can answer the he he's coming up to the mic and then we're we're going to get you back on Zoom shortly [Music] okay thank you that's okay [Music] try hello no not that microphone is actually more for compac than it is for broadcasting into the room so if Mr McGrath can just speak up I think we'll all be fine BR McGrath 22 chring L chairman of the lunberg historical commission uh Madam chair if I might uh may I uh take a few comments on the Lich Cemetery before I be in with fish Street which cemetery uh West Street terce West oh okay do you hear him N I heard something about he wants to make a comment about West Street yes yeah we're going to join [Music] uh L cemetery on West Street Terrace um there a 19th century Cemetery there prominent citizens that were interred there uh it was desecrated by a developer in 1953 the gravestones were removed and turned upside down and used as a side for his house in the development the historical commission uh along with the Historical Society progress has a detailed plan for restoration and a memorial B and that was in play uh at the time that Mr Bernard found the actual grave [Music] site on to uh good Cemetery provided a sketch uh with the West wall of that will appear with the gravestones behind there's a uh plot plan shows the existing walls which would be restored and two new walls that are missing that would Encompass the entire cemetery plot and detect uh new gate an iron gate U with two granic pillars would be uh allow access on the west side the graves would be a little bit behind that and the graves all face West restoration and scope of work we would restore the existing east and south Stone perimeter walls we would build two new walls on the north and west sides to completely enclose the cemetery plot new walls will match the existing in style and stone size so it all look like an original wall uh we would provide a uh 6t wide entry in the west wall with granet post and a rod iron gate locking key we would provide a new mble gravestone and base for the desecrated original Levi Goodridge Stone we would clean and repair and reset existing Stones as needed all work would be documented for the record and uh we would hope to have a historical plaque on site describing with what who's buried there and what the cemeter is about um we're trying to get you our feeling education having historical and educating uh the public uh is the best way to preserve and keep these cemeteries from being vandalized and questions yes let me try something uh may I Madam chair any questions yeah no no uh questions I'm very familiar I went diagonally across the street so this this looks like a very nice enhanc [Music] Mass General La chapter 30b and 149 m control of procurement of material and construction projects on public property not every project um done on public property is necessarily uh considered construction under the law for instance uh you've been able as a town uh to work out in Arrangement uh with The Advocates of uh skating skate boarding uh to construct uh the new skate park at Marshall Park without it being deemed public construction and not following under any of these rules uh but I would need to understand how this work is being paid for in order to give you proper advice the historical commission would be um providing volunteer help under my supervision uh for the construction of the stone walls and the gate and the restoration of the gravestones um uh what we would be looking for from the uh commission would be the the uh Cemetery commission would be um the uh cost of the stone and the uh and the Iron Gate and in a historic plaque and what is the What is the total cost on that I provided that to the commission previously I don't have that on hand do do you recall B park it all sir I don't I don't remember I remember us talking about it I remember you talking with Bill uh Tyler regarding it but I don't have anything on paper to say exactly what the cost is that's what the cemetery commission needs I need that spelled out how much it is for the stone the Iron Gate and whatever and the plaque I can get that with with that in hand I could give the commissioner's um advice as to how to comply uh with whichever one of the statutes would apply but I would need a you know at least a ballpark of of what we're talking about uh and you say the volunteers would be sponsored by the historic commission itself yes okay commission or Society commission commission okay uh with that material list material estimate um would there be any other work involved from the public side a bill do you have to dig a trench to set a sandbed or do anything to yes yes so DPW would do that okay so once I get that estimate um I can work with Bill I'll work with Julie our chief procurement officer and I can have a response for you um I am if I'm understanding correctly you're looking at the possibility uh of a meeting um perhaps December 19 Jan we're going to be meeting again in January okay okay because it's close it's too close to the holidays sure uh so I can certainly have a advice for you in writing by that time provided I can get this other information let's say within 3 weeks 2 weeks something like that is that doable Mr McGrath yes that is that satisfactory to the about the stone getting the Stone from has to be from a company that's already lined up with the town right not not necessarily it depends upon pricing that's that's why I need to understand the material breakdown so um if we are procuring items and we're not so let me start with you can't just split things up to get around the procurement law so you couldn't buy half the Stone from one company and half the Stone from another company to get to try to skate through the limits so let me just let me just use some numbers here for a minute let us say that the stone is um I think it I'm trying to remember I think it was $5,000 for the stone ises that sound familiar don't have that in mind well let's just I think that's what you told me before but that was just the stone not the gate not anything else right so let let's just say for argument sake the stone is 5,000 and the brass plaque is 2,000 that might be low and the gate is 3,000 so now we have 5 6 7 $10,000 we can purchase I don't think those three items would be considered together and you can purchase up to $110,000 and I can't remember if it's $9,999 or 10,000 whe anyways um by using best business practice that is defined uh not in the statute actually but by most communities as doing business with a vendor who perhaps you've had some experience with is known to provide a quality product at a reasonable price so you can just simply go do that now let's say that collectively you have to group them together and it becomes 12,500 at that point we do have to write up a bit of a a scope of work and we email it uh you know 20 years ago I would have said facts but today we email it um and we await responses you don't have to get three responses but you do have to seek three proposals um and then we get those in and you sign off on them so once we know the material list that's needed I would want to talk with Bill about what his labor is going to be involved we'll put that together from the procurement side uh and then there's kind of a three-point test uh that the state applies to is it a public public construction project or not and you'll have to bear with me I honestly don't remember what those are right this minute but it has to do is it on public land is it being done directly by the public entity and there's there's some couple of tests they apply uh we can get that answer to you uh for your meeting in January okay because then we're going to have to vote if it's over some you know if it's 12,000 do we have in the budget to to do the 12,000 so well on once you know the number and once we know the number we can look at how it gets done that might actually impact the number right uh because there are different rules it is Massachusetts uh as to how things get done and then yes you'd have to look at your existing budget uh Andor uh seek funding within your operating budget in fiscal 26 or uh what I refer to if I should be with you uh capital and special items so onetime items that aren't necessarily Capital but let's say you need $10,000 for a survey we don't want to necessarily put that in the operating budget because you're only going to need it once so we would put that in with uh those items um but it all starts from knowing what items we're purchasing how we're doing the job and what the estimated clost is you talked about subing go ahead one point I want to bring up is and Mr McGrath maybe you can answer this are we going with Lunenburg rocks because the town of lunenberg was built on certain levels of what those uh rocks look like and I want to make sure or at least bring to the board to make it to the vote is that we are using the assisting uh look and feel of the town of lunenberg as we all know rocks can quite look differently what is your thought on that Mr McGrath what was your intent with that as on the Rock selection I'm not aware of any uh lunenberg Rock that's available for this um and the uh I found stone that matches pretty well um at a reasonable cost um that we could use for this Pro project it would look my intent would be for it to look pretty much the same as as what's there okay uh may I Madam chair yeah so as I'm looking at the Goodrich Cemetery restoration scope of work what I'm hearing is that in the uh second Dash in the fourth line uh that the chair would be concerned um I'm not trying to speak for the other members but what I'm hearing is that the a chair would be concerned that the new walls will match the existing in style look and stone size correct would that be agreeable that short notication Mr McGrath yes perfect I had one idea on on Rock uh Supply um and that's um and and look at the parks commission's posting on Facebook of the old um rock domes and all I don't know what they call it that that that the they built back in the 1920s and and I looked and I thought I found them and it looks like in the expansion of the baseball field a lot of that was just pushed into an embankment and I'm wondering if there's any um economy to recovering Stone from that and and using it in projects this project and even throughout lunenberg to kind of um recycle what what what people had done 100 years ago uh and uh there there seems to be a lot of stone there and I I'm I'm wondering if um of course the Parks Commission may not uh take my stance but there seems to be a lot of rock in Marshall Park uh from these Stone projects that are are fairly obscure now are just in in rubble or collapsed and and could we go in and uh and retrieve that material don't we have to be careful that that's a historical uh piece of it or not because my understanding is some of those rocks were actually when the ball field were put together if I understood it correctly part of those were buried yeah yeah there there's uh there's like um an embankment of uh those rocks there uh and I know there was concerned that uh this 100y old effort or effort that was done 100 years old how could you preserve that and I'm just wondering if uh and Nancy's comment about using lunenberg Rock seems to we we have a lot of rock in lunenberg you know do do people have Rock available or uh you know and on Town property I might suggest that once you know the the method that you have to proceed um any appropriate means of of reducing costs and uh using elements um available readily available would be welcome by whoever's paying for the project right um and it is uh you know recycle is not first first there's reduce then there's reuse so you know you'd be right in line with the model of re reduce use recycle um you obviously you would need to consult with the Parks Commission the property owner the historic commission and once receiving those appropriate sign offs I'm sure that uh Mr Bernard could uh work with volunteers might take a little overtime on a Saturday perhaps uh to um recover and um transite those materials to the site that you're working on um one one thing to consider there's quite a few tons of stone in there so unless you have a pile of stone that you can scoop up and dump in a truck um it would not be more efficient to uh to gather Stone then it would be to buy a stone and have it delivered yeah yeah I I was thinking you would want to palletize it move Marshall Park there's a nice asphalt area back in the woods that used to be like the entrance to the to the track that they used to have you could palletize it move it and then and then once you had what you needed for your project come in and move it to your project site but they they have a nice big asol area that could be a it would definitely be nice to have original Stone to the area Mr McGrath do we know exactly how many pounds or however you figure this out is being a Mason uh masonary is how much this is how much rock you need I guess that's my question do we know that that I don't have that information with me I do have that information okay because I think that's going to tell us Michael if they've got enough over there or we can if we can work that out what's your thought what is your thoughts you and Dave I I I think the next step would be to to have a discussion with the Parks Commission to see if they're even amiable to it okay yep okay um I I would respectfully suggest that the intermediate step of how we can undertake the project consistent with statute would really be the The Next Step so we need to get the pricing first and then right and we can have for you in um in January uh and then uh based upon what that tells us you could have a a meeting with um The Parks Commission the historical commission um February March um and be ready to move forward uh after a month season does that go in what you're thinking of Mr McGrath can you move the date out like I said we start it later than than I know you would like but it it we have to go through this process yes that would be fine with me okay that would be wonderful because we definitely appreciate your help in this and you know you're offering as a volunteer uh to help us with this project that's wonderful and kudos to you and all volunteers that you know we all try our best to help uh with volunte aring in the town and giving back so we thank you so much you're welcome make sure that makes um my apologies but I have a a 10:00 conference call I need to be on so I'm going to have to excuse myself okay did we U just Carter we did everything that we said we were going to do with you today correct um my understanding is that I've uh been here for the two items that uh my assistance might be useful on and that the balance of Mr Bernard will be more than capable of handing okay perfect thank you and thank you for um being at this meeting in the minutes have a word look to the new walls okay so let's go um let's get one item done um as far as let's approve the minutes from the January 25th time frame so we can get that off our plate and then we'll get uh the DPW director to uh go through some updates and some discussions does that sound like a plan are you hearing her yeah she wants to do minutes okay has everybody read the minutes have you looked at the minutes yes I wrote them I hav looked at them today but hold on a second answer okay [Music] I briefly looked over it let me just quickly look over it again okay thank you I make a motion we accept amendments from July 25th 2025 for I second all in favor hi I I motion to approve unanimously okay Mr Bernard do you want to um take up what you would like to discuss I know you had sent uh a note to everyone uh this morning is that what you'd like to go over first yes okay all right so since the last meeting in July we've had nine full burials 11 cremations um we've been mowing grass all summer um before the major holidays Labor Day Columbus Day Veterans Day we had all the grass mowed you know a day or two before I give you a summary of the um total hours and average hours of how much time we spent uh Mowing and trimming um I guess the gist of it is the North Cemetery was cut seven times this year the South was cut four times this year and um fish treat was cut six times this year um take away from that is South was only cut four times but because of the drought the grass just wasn't growing over there um North continued to grow so we concentrated more over there um so mowing was completed mostly by the full-time Cemetary superintendent and we had part-time seasonal laborers um we had four this year kind of scattered over time um the first two overlap by only I think it was two days and then they had to leave and then we hired two more who who have been working together but they were just hired about a month ago um so they did a bunch of trimming but they've their efforts are now turn to Leaf cleanup so been doing a lot of leaf cleanup lately we've been blowing it all into piles um then Lake View Landscaping will come in they have a a new uh vacuum and um truck that could suck up all the leaves so we put it in piles they come in suck them all up and they and they leave so that's been working out pretty good um me and noticed over in the South Cemetery we ground down 10 old tree stumps um we still need to clean those up we've cleaned up a few of them um you know cleaned up all the the the ground up wood and then L and Seed over it there's still a few more to go so we'll be working on that um I guess that's it for updates so I just have one quick question what is the cost costing us or you or however this is being looked at for the late view uh with the vacum I think that's a great idea I'm just asking is there what's the cost like for that I haven't seen an invoice yet but because we're doing all the the blowing at the piles they're just coming in for an hour or two so the the cost won't be that much okay is that falling on you or is that or are you asking us to pay for that that's what I'm asking nope that's a operational budget that's my budget MH okay m i I got a question regarding the leaf blowing cuz I went over there last weekend M all the cemeteries and I I see what they're doing they're putting the like a South Cemetery they blow it against a stone wall mhm but I guess my question is I didn't know that you're going to have they you come in and pick it up but when are they're coming because all that stuff is being blown back out to the it's mostly new leaves you seeing they just keep coming it's almost done now right um we blow him and then um the superintendent calls Lake bu it says you know can you come in the next day or two and he does so it's been working out pretty good okay so the stuff that's in the new section we're proposing that's going to be picked up also because that's going to be blown that it's going to come right back into the cemetery right we actually had um Department of Corrections crew in for two days and they concentrated on acorns there was I'm sure you notice Acorn explosion this year I guess we'll call it and so they were concentrating on that and they were going to try to get into the the new expansion area get the acorns there cuz there's millions of them but the leaves are in the new area yeah they're all piled up and I'm concerned that they're going to get blown back which makes more work for you guys to pick it up again so right is Lake you being called in this week you think or next week or because if next week you guys are going to be well luckily there's a stone wall they had to stop most of them from blowing over but yeah that's that's the last area we're concentrating on so try to get the main parts of the cemetery first and then use that would be the last area okay so my understanding is that and you get them all in the in the piles and then are they brought in you know like do you call them and they come in within 2 days is that how that normally works Mr Bernard yes that's correct okay um how about the um we allocated funds for trimming the shrubs at South Cemetery they look good but I I don't know if they've been trimmed or not they the front they were the front shrubs the front's being done by Lake F and that's been we've already done it okay yeah no they look good so I I just just yeah link you is going to take care of the shrubs in South Cemetery from now on and then the um because what happened in North Cemetery yeah no I'm just wondering we allocated to do that and it's been completed okay yes yes that um they came in a few months ago they gave me their time frame when it should be done I think we were um pretty much on time on that and they came in and then we voted on it and then we um they've already been paid okay and then the um lights flag pole lights so I was triy to get the electricity in there to do it and um he was busy he didn't get in there and then a while I don't know a month or so ago I was told to stop all projects so that it's on hold now who that was told by the interim Town manager who was I believe told by the cemetery commission no that was to do yes there was we were discussing the the uh fish street so I may and yes I believe that the interm had said stop all projects but I guess we didn't realize that that was stopping that I didn't realize uh that piece of it so uh I'll have to ask Carter if that can be if we can open that up to get that can he finalize it now if we say if the town manager says okay to that are you asking if the electrician can can get in there now yeah he should be able to if you give me the the goahead I'll I'll contact him and get him in there all again I don't think it was us per se I need to understand that conversation that Carter and I had and make sure again that I'm not stepping on his toes uh because there may been another reason that that he said that um so I just want to clarify that with the town manager I will take that on myself to clarify and I will send a note out how does that sound that works for me and the now does that also mean with a skirt too that's in South Cemetery I think Michael you probably going to bring that up right well that was my just my last question how's that progressing the con skirt at the South Cemetery with the Ben I see benches there I see some piles of yep we were uh ready to go we're actually day away and I was told by the interim Town manager to stop our project so it was put on okay MH all right I will get clarification on that one too okay and get and uh send out a note I'll send out a note as soon as we get off those meeting and then maybe we can get clarification either today or tomorrow how does that sound that works for me okay is that okay with both you and Dave uh Dave and Michael on that that that's fine with me yeah yeah I I was expecting it to be going ahead yeah yeah okay if I can bring up one more topic while um uh dpw's here is um and I know the commission hasn't talked about it yet but um the North Cemetery all the um shrubs or no they're not called the the trees that were cut and now we got stubs that are just there I'd like to have some sort of a plan to get those out um for the next year but just something we can talk about at another meeting but I just wanted to bring it up so that uh doesn't look the way it is and it's going to have to come out eventually if we put if we talk about a stone wall again but let's just start the process anyways it just doesn't look good so just I wanted to bring it up as a topic for a next meeting just so you know that we need to discuss it okay uh I think my main concern and this is my own personal opinion as Cemetery commission chair is is um in the winter as far as with those roads if those roads get icy and you don't have the protection not that it's going to totally stop a car but if we take those trees out those roots and stuff now I yes you're right it does look it doesn't look okay in there I get it but we're trying to protect the cemetery as best we can with the situation that we were left with so with that being said I think the protection are kind of those roots does anyone else have any comments on that yeah I think I um like Dave mentioned um coordinate um with the installation of the wall what goes with aesthetically removing some of those and you know match the wall to the removal of the shrubs and there you have your barrier again yeah we need the barrier it's just that we tried the wall then we might have to try it again I don't know if it's going to be a wall or if it's going to be is there going to be trees again or or what but I mean we tried it and we can always try it again another year but no matter what we put in those dubs have to come out yeah I agree so we need to discuss and if it's the DPW that takes it out uh or because you're taking out other stuff now right um weren't you working on I thought I read some place you were working on taking some stumps out right in the South Cemetery there was trees removed here and there about 10 trees and we ground down those stumps ground them down you didn't take them out okay um but do you have the the machine and the power to to take out stops because if we put a stone wall in or if we put trees in those stumps can't stay there they got to come out eventually they will yes okay so you have the machine or the M Power okay yes good Mr Bernard can I ask what trees were taken out in South Cemetery are we talking big trees or we just talking the existing and you were just getting the stumps out of there it was existing stumps trees that were cut some some of them years ago so that's what I thought okay mhm I just wanted to clarify that okay yeah we didn't cut anything new okay um now I also noticed on that I know it's a topic uh the rain maker professional license uh we have to vote on that today um I have promised rain maker where they have given us uh some time to uh be into rain maker and that I make a motion that we evote that we uh go forward in getting the license for the Cemetary commission does anybody have any thoughts on that um yes where where is the um is is this on a central server and you um access into it um I'm I'm just wondering um once you get the license uh do where is it going to be loaded or is it just it's in it's in the cloud the it's in the cloud oh okay so you go on through the cloud and and so you just need to pay this so they toggle uh an extra license correct and you're good yeah correct um the we have the the under the DPW license of it which the cemetery commission has always paid for is has put that through uh when we first uh did the upgrade we were asked to and we still hold that and I suggest that we continue to hold it that uh the DPW will have their license we'll have ours they intertwine um the DPW it has the burial search the public burial search that that sits on that area so that the public can go in and see if they you know want to go see where their loved ones are if you know again they're wherever they sit or wherever they're from um and then we have an annual maintenance of it um so and ours is going to be a one-time setup uh which the cost will will pay at once and then um then you will have the normal fee of uh the pr rated right now is $225 uh which is the additional license it's usually $300 but they prated it because we didn't use it you know all year so on and so forth so I think the total uh amount was1 1825 uh so $1,825 and again this is uh this will be on our side with our license we're going to be able to pinpoint if um uh someone is uh deceased and in a plot we can just go okay then I make a motion that we accept these two licenses and pay rain maker a total of $1,825 uh I'll second it Madam chair before you vote may I speak I'm sure sure okay so the the license you're asking for is that to see the the backend stuff the death certificates and whatnot yes okay so this has been brought up in multiple commission meetings you've been told multiple times that that's part of operations which is on the DPW you've been told by the prior Town manager that you are not to have access to that so why now are we here again you're trying to get access to it Mr Mr Bernard I'm going to bring this up again once is that you have stated under your personal piece I will discuss this again we are going to vote on this because of the fact that rain maker has given us the opportunity with this we've had this and we've told you going forward that we are going forward for with this no one like I said the town manager that was here before is no longer here in the town we I I listen to Carter if this needs to be told by Carter that's fine but I'm we are going forward with voting on this today well I can't stop you from voting but I will speak with the interim Town manager about it and I will be speaking with him also and if that means to be a three-way conversation because again we are the ones that started this process before you ever came to this town Mr Bernard and we are the ones that put all of this together and now all of a sudden you've decided or whoever has decided DPW that we're no longer to be able to see things that we've always seen so I'm not sure where this is coming from but again we're going to vote on this that we are getting the license to keep this going forward and we are the ones that pay for it and will continue to do so okay it's my understanding you never had the license to see the backend stuff excuse me that's not true okay so um would someone like to make a motion to vote we already voted you already motion sorry my we made the motion but we haven't approved could could we modify the motion to uh approve the funds but um have the procurement contingent on um the discussion with the town manager well I wouldn't put that in there because I disagree when she discusses it with them if he whichever way it's either we're either going to go through with it or not if he says no Then you know he says yes leave him as the stop Gap that he has the authority to say wait a second you yeah um for death certificates and all I don't I don't having access to people's birth certificates or social security numbers is that is that what I personally just think we I think we need to see be able to see who's buried where and DPW does the maintenance of the cemeteries and and he's responsible to to plot the people into rain maker okay but if we want to be able to see instead of asking you know a question if we want to be able to go in and say is this plot filled is there is there a person buried in this plot or is it vacant we as a commission should be able to do that without you can now anybody can right it's un enough website anybody could see that so we why do you need another license you can already see that so I can which which website like like if I go to the go to the the town's website go to cemetery commission right there's a couple links and one for North one for South okay there's map North Cemetery map South that's it oh well yeah I've looked at that yeah you can click on any plot it'll tell you the name of the person there oh okay okay so we made a motion already but it but it's it's just a location we're not we can't print the report on how many burials by month or I'm not familiar with the nether can we yes we can under that license yes we can and that's the piece again the semi just so Mike you know and Dave I know you know is we have the cemetery commission has always driven this forward has always had this ability so with that being said behind the scenes before you ever came Mr Bernard I was looking at things also with Mr Tyler which was the cemetery commission chair so there is nothing that we've done any different than we've always done so therefore that's why I'm bringing this forward that we will have our own license there should not be a problem and you really shouldn't be on that piece of it so that's why I made the motion to go forward to pay Ray maker for the license they have allowed owed us to have free of charge for some time to look at everything and I want this legal with a license and that's why I'm bringing this forward okay I I've been on the board for four years now and with the previous chairperson Bill Tyler um we always had access to it okay and we paid for it so I'm it's nothing against you guys having it it's just that we should be able to have one also so I'm making the motion that we go through with it and that we have the licenses totaling [Music] $1,825 okay I'll second the motion all in favor all I I voted anonymously okay next Mr Bernard is there anything else you would like to bring out on that subject other than no I'm just going to talk to the interim Town manager and make sure he's okay with it no yep and I will be doing the same have to be on 10 yeah okay is there anything else um that we need to discuss today Mike and Dave or Bill Mr Bernard you do have other agenda items I propos Madame chairman that we um because we're going to be losing one of our members very shortly in a couple of minutes that we postpone to the next meeting whatever else uh what we have on the agenda agenda unless you see something that's urgent mik no no I I thought we covered the anything you feel urgent Madam chairman no but Mr Bernard is there something that you feel is urgent NOP nothing urgent on my end okay okay so we'll move the other items uh to the next meeting to the next meeting which is going to hold on one second um tentatively set for the fourth week could be uh January 23rd all right is that date good for everyone January 23rd yeah I think so I'll probably zoom in you're going to be out of town yeah I'll probably I'm I'm going to be out of town but I'll uh what about the week before I'll be out for the whole month of January oh okay all right we'll tentatively put that in and we'll make sure is that fine with you Mr Bernard yep I'll put it on my schedule perfect no now this December 3rd meeting is that going to be a joint meeting at the select board or is that um is that just invite can you check on that Madam chairman because um yes I will if we if we go there might be against the open meeting law no we may have to do a uh two-part to that so we may have to rejoin with uh the uh select board okay if you have a quorum you should have it posted yeah yeah I understand that's why I said we'll have to work along with the select board and far as doing one with them and I will find that out to make sure that we do that legally thank you okay would someone like to uh make a motion to adjourn I'll make a motion to adjourn I second all in favor I hi I all right thank you thank you very much yep have a good one