##VIDEO ID:60BRcqDu_PQ## there's a ton of people in the Park good evening it is 605 p.m. on Wednesday January 29th 2025 I am Brian Leon the school committee chair and I am calling the special meeting of the school committee to order uh today is our Workshop uh the first item on the agenda though is the Pledge of Allegiance if you could please rise I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all for all thank you all right the next item on the agenda is public comment I'll open it up to public comment from the public seeing none I'll open up to public comment from the committee all right seeing none uh next of the agenda is old business we do have an action item uh the screening committee membership uh we had put this on from our last meeting to vote on the membership um just to give a little bit of background about this too uh there was two memos that went out or different posts and uh advertisements about the the screening committee and one of those uh memos that went out had an incorrect date of a deadline to submit your application by January 31st so my recommendation would be that we table this screening committee membership vote to Saturday the 1st um and I had already post that meeting so that is uh available for us to vote but I'll open up to discussion did you email applicants and tell them that we would be voting on Saturday I did I uh I did not forward that memo to you that you know to you guys but I did uh email all the people who had submitted so far I reminded them of the correct dates and I reminded uh uh I I let them know that we were likely to vote on uh Saturday because of the conflict I'll move to table appointment of the screening committee I'll second any discussion all in favor say I I opposed motion passes unanimously thank you all right so next up is the workshop and this is the majority of our time here and then we'll finish off with public comment so in your folders you will see I'm just going to kind of intro this and then we can kind of get into it but in the folder um I listed some Workshop topics to cover uh and it's really just I kind of put it as like an agenda to serve as a rough outline to guide us through our Workshop discussion and it's intended to help structure the conversation but we can adjust it and revise it as needed during the meeting to ensure all the key topics and concerns are addressed we can also take it out of order it's not really an agenda it's more of just a list of stuff to hit but if I missed anything definitely don't hesitate to to jump in um and I think one of the things that we really wanted to talk about too was the superintendent characteristics so that is also in the folder and it was kind of the first item that we probably could talk about um I did make so I received all of our ideas and characteristics and then I tried to consolidate them and I first started with a really short version and I was like oh maybe it's too short so then I did a long version and I'm not sure if we should go long or short and then also we have to decide what we want to do with that and where we want to go with it so I will open up discussion from there I think maybe start with the characteristics but we can obviously Bounce Around can I ask an awkward question yes definitely are you running for re-election I have not decided yet because if you're not the two people we have on the superintendent search committee aren't going to be here for the new superintendent and I was thinking that when I was going through or if I lose in the election as well that had not occurred to me I got faith in you but um if you're not going to run again it had occurred to me that um when I was talking about communication and um the relationship that we're hoping to Foster with a superintendent because I think that's something we we want to look for is how we work together with a superintendent um you're you're not running for a reelection so you're out of here before the superintendent ever would take take place if you don't run for re-election you're never going to see the new superintendent um they might meet yeah I got K school yeah but it's so kind of a weird situation so I I this occurred to me when we appointed them and I think it's there's two aspects of this and and of the time here because I got to split in an hour but number one is they both made themselves available to do this that's first and foremost because we got a lot of other things going on right now secondly we do the job while we're in the seat and the job right now is to find a new superintendent and we're all in office right now might not be tomorrow day after tomorrow but today we're in the SE our job is to find the superintendent and they are operating as a subcommittee on our behalf so in as much as they do their job while they're still in office which I think they will the timeline is is appropriate then identify a slate of finalists and bring them to the school committee for a decision to be made which will include people whose term expires after this you know the 4th of May or whatever it is that that our terms expire end of May so I I I had the same thought it occurred to me like oh we don't have a you know but but I don't I I honestly don't our job is to do the job while we're here and and there's five members of the committee right now and our job is to go find a new superintendent so because the working relationship that we're going to build with a superintendent for the next few years is really important to me too that we find someone who's going to communicate well with us as a board so that's that's really important to me but as long as you guys like understand that and oh actually no you do cuz you you've done this before I think it's I also just think it's just not me and Carol making decisions right it is the SCH still making that vote after the screen committee everybody makes that vot and everyone has an opportunity to talk to the superintendent I think I have a very good working relationship with the current superintendent I was not on the screening committee um I was not either so yeah I mean it's kind of the nature Beast I I think that's just how how this but I understand the concern and I think that it's a reasonable thing to bring up and it would be a reasonable thing as we talk about characteristics yeah I wanted to bring it up and keep it in our mind but it's I'm not saying I want to make changes yeah and I think that's the debates we have we're going to continue to have this on our agenda and as things come up concerns come up we address them I'd like to just yeah keep that in Mindy because I think there's you see it in other school systems where School committees change Dynamics and maybe they don't get along with superintendent superintendent may leave or school committee members may leave too yeah but I'd like to focus on getting along I think it works best when we can have a superintendent back and communicate well yes you want definitely a good strong relationship yeah I think that's an really important one that I'm looking for these are three by the way this list you mean for yeah so I don't know if anybody wants to start on say the short version or long version or anything I I have to say is I sheepishly sent my information to you quite late and um it this morning too yes yes and I'm thinking I had a good afternoon it was mid oh my goodness he had so much to put together I felt so bad so my apologies yeah um I think I think to I don't know I personally I would hit the short version and then if you wanted to look at the longer version I think I'm looking I must be looking at the long version right now but the long version short version really just bullets bullet points of the see and that's the way I think y fair enough and how much are people going to read and my other thought was we give this to the screening committee so they have a sense of what we're looking for but we can give them either or both yeah I I think people tend to have an easier time looking at bulleted lists than were there things that we all definitely hit on were there like reoccurring themes I think there were all reallying things just people got into more specifics about those key like top seven say I think not everybody went for resetting expectations for the superintendent role the seven I did so but it's the leadership it's the community HR that I think are I would like to discuss um the first is are these in order of priority they are Nots okay um should we but we could well I think that might be worth the discussion because I good idea in my view in a different time I might put educational leaders in commun in in curriculum expertise at the top but I think that that has been the focus for a number of years now we've made significant Pro progress on that lever and we have in my opinion lagged in others and and you know it it may be that we need somebody with strengths that are greater in other areas such as the leadership management uh Community engagement uh topic the other thing that I wanted to just raise because I I do think it's worth just kind of fleshing out a little bit is is strategic rather than purely operational which was the first sub bullet or the first bullet under number seven um so here here's the challenge I I agree that we need a strategic minded person because if we don't have a Northstar move to we are going to get lost on the other hand a lot of the time that we have spent you know what what I think Tony would call was of time over the course of the last couple of years has been due to operational problems that could have been avoided had we had a closer eye on operational issues and and a closer analytics in some cases on operational functions and and I think that that is an area that um needs attention right ranging and then some of these overlap right facilities is a good example but I mean we we had an athletic advisory committee meeting night before last and you know there are clearly things happening in the Athletics program that aren't bad but we don't have a close handle on them you know we don't really know and and are a we are not able to offer today a degree of detail in terms of what we're spending in some areas and where the efficiencies that we could potentially gain by doing things a a little bit more differently or creative because nobody is really kind of pushing the operational levers um and and demanding that of our leaders and and I I think that that starts at the top right that that really requires somebody who wants to kind of unpack the operations so unfortunately I'm not sure that that jives with strategic first right and I I don't I'm not really sure what to do with that so I want to say something something response to what say uh the first thing is I do think that we have spent a lot of time on operational stuff I disagree with the cause that you outlined I think that fundamentally our problem is we don't have enough money right we don't have enough money to hire people we can't pay enough to to attract good people and so you know like the we had like 15 updates on the elevator last year it was just because we just don't have that money so that that's one thing the second thing I would want to say is I think that often times when I get grouchy which I shouldn't get grouchy I'm not grouchy to anybody by the way I'm just grouchy that we're spending time when I get grouchy it's because I think that the school committee is operating in a role that is different than what is outlined in the charter and what our role is like we are a supervisory oversight committee we are not a legislative body and so I think that sometimes we take up issues that we don't properly have the tools to do like we are setting curriculum and overseeing the superintendent she is making the operational decisions and so like we can know like how much things cost and we can know how much we're spending on certain things and I think we should but I think that there are some day-to-day operations that we are asking her to do that are not appropriate for us to be involved in and I understand that people have a different view of it but like if you look at what our legal definition is like how how our charge is written we are not designed to like take grievances from parents and obviously we can do that and we should do that to some extent but I feel like we end up chasing our tails on things because we know we don't have enough money to hire these people we have these complaints and we get involved at like the minutia level and it doesn't do us any good the last thing that I will say is I sent your mind during school committee meeting last week yes um I think that the two things that happened in the past week have radically changed all of my requirements for a superintendent the first thing that I would say is the uh stop then start then stop again on the federal funding has created a really serious problem for educational institutions across the United States and so that was not something I had contemplated I did not believe that somebody who who was operating in good faith would do what what the president did and I think that that had a direct or could have a direct impact on us if they get themselves together and actually Implement that and so having essentially a wartime conary to bother borrow from The Godfather I want somebody who is capable of dealing with these bigger issues when you add on that the fact that they have now said that they will do raids and seizures inside the schools I think that we need somebody that can say you know like here's our line if you look at the advice that the the Massachusetts Attorney General put forth and our obligations under fura we need somebody who is willing to tow the line because we are in a different environment than we were a week ago the things that I thought were unconscionable that would never happen that we would never have to worry about have happened and then they got messed up and then you know but I I think that we can't have somebody if if all all our super tended is is worried about is like you know the curriculum and the budget that would be great but I think that we are in we're in for a rough road ahead for at least the next four years my hope is the next two years but I think it's going to get much worse before it gets better if you add on top of that the way in which they are planning on changing title 9 I think that what like our concerns about what we need is important but I think we're going to soon be confronted with things that are just much bigger than we have any ability to deal with and so having somebody who has a steady hand and understands what they need to do in terms of our legal obligations will be more important than a lot of the stuff that we really I mean like the buessing thing right but like if we have a if we have a student that's you know subject to an ice interrogation in the principal's office that's going to be that will change everybody's dynamic in the entire Community every every single person all of the parents all of the kids every single person and I think that we need to be prepared for that CU you know I just don't think that there's enough I don't think that there's enough we can do to be I I don't think we can be overprepared it it's going to get bad it's going to get really bad so leaving the second half of what you said alone uh because I I don't disagree with you but I think that you know relative to the drafts that we've seen I think a lot of that is kind of covered under leadership right we need this is not this is not curriculum and instruction leadership this is being able to unpack a situation a lot of factors presenting that information to the community and the school committee making decisions sometimes in absence of guidance and defending those positions and leading the organization forward right like that's leadership I think that that you just described it's never a bad idea to tell people to invoke their rights to be quiet yep um the I think that the first part of what you talked about I I I think we just disagree I I think that we have spent a lot of time on things that are operational gaps and sometimes operational gaps are not money the the elevator situation was money it was money but it was actually a budgeting this is really what it was right like if a if if a an earlier facilities director had identified that issue in advance which should have been identified and budgeted for it we wouldn't have that problem and we needed to know that it was breaking constantly and we need to know in advance and we need it need to be communicated none of that occur so I so it is a money issue but it's also an operational issue and I I think that there are just a lot a lot a lot of examples of where we need to do better in that area and and again it's not I'm not criticizing anybody individually we we've had a lot of challenges with turnover and and you know different core competencies and all that jazz but we are we are in a position where I I think that operational gaps and inefficiencies could addressing them could lead to better fiscal management um and and secondly we could find ourselves in situations where we are reacting more because there are more and more gaps right and and I I just I don't I don't want be in reactive mode I think ultimately we we have the sure the same goal but I I I just look at it a little bit differently if we're going to leave in resetting expectations for superintendent role I think we also we need to have a better balance for the superintendent as far as what we are expecting him or her I agree I guess my thought on putting this too is that like we need to as a new superintendent they should be setting the expectations of what they want in that role Rel like each I feel like each superintendent is probably going to have their own relationship with us but I'm not sure we need that on here I think we need to tell them because yes we we will and maybe that's a post thing but I'm not sure we need it on here for the search committee I think it might be something for the school committee to do Post hiring well so here here's my thought I don't know how it works in Massachusetts I only practice in New Hampshire but I can tell you that Kate is Kate was doing significantly more meetings than anybody else I have ever met as at a superintended she was doing way too much stuff and I think that if we are going to put a something out and there is you know a person that does their due diligence even if they don't contact Kate they just look at like Town meetings and stuff they're going to be like I am never taking this job and so I think we need to tell people we do not expect you to do things that are I mean but I think that could be in an interview that could be in the mightly I think it's Anthony I how you show that in a application I mean this is just the school committee asking showing what their characteristics what they're looking for so I don't know I kind of agree that maybe it's not the right time for that I I I kind of agree with Tony that if somebody were to look at I mean it's easy enough to to check YouTube and and Google Kate she's on a million meetings all the time at everything um I don't know what how you would put into this how that would you know if it would come out in interviews or but they're at school committee meetings but and saying we're going to change I don't think I'm enough to say we're going to change I don't um can we rank these and then see I just go back to something Tony said sure I I think under number six strategic decision making and Visionary leadership I'm not sure that's where it would go but understanding anticipating and reacting to changing state and federal policies I I really do think that there's a chance we won't get funding because there is a chance a lot of this fun maybe after meeting deadlines anding legal requ I agree that that should be in here somewhere and I'm not not to be like a you know the sky is falling but if it does we need to have somebody watching that bit of the sky are falling on your head they already triying to pull this guy down well it's not just so what you just said Carol can you be understanding I said understanding anticipating I I don't know if that's a good word and reacting which I'd rather be Pro proactive but sometimes you have to react reacting to changing state and federal policies so what I'm reminded of and I don't know exactly how to phrase this but I'm reminded what Tony said about being a wartime consiliary right I was in the Army we did sand table drills all the time right a sand table drill is okay you're moving your you you're moving your team here okay you know enemy fire comes from over here how do you react right and you you literally it's a table exercise yeah yeah it's a it's a it's a it's an exercise to kind of work through scenarios of what you would do given and I think that I think that that is something that actually would benefit us if we could do it in a way that um is thoughtful and relatively transparent you know like there's a time and a place to a to to reveal your thinking but but I think that there's a I think that we do need somebody who can think through that right like we need somebody I was involved in an email conversation with with Brian yesterday right like in my view when what happened on Monday happened we needed a statement immediately saying this is how much money we get from the federal government right just TR being transparent right like this is it why so so when people want to know they can find the information right like it just what's at risk right I didn't anticipate it I don't think anybody else at this table anticipated that we would need to do that but we do need somebody who can kind of think through the okay should I do this should I not do it and why and and communicate that okay right and and I I I I think that we do need somebody who has that level of um uh agility I guess is the word I'm looking for right um and it's not I mean this is a hard job the other point though that I I think we should discuss and kind of come to some level of expectation amongst us is I agree with with what you said about just like ways of working and volume and capacity and those kinds of things I think that those are real issues um I but I'm somebody who works in Tech and I I change companies every three or years and change jobs probably every year on average right so I am constantly working with new teams new bosses different projects those kinds of things and it's very important that every time that a change occurs that you're as transparent and open and communicative as you possibly can be about what the expectations are of the individual what they are capable of delivering relative to those expectations and constantly adjusting and I think that this is a public job so it's a little bit harder to do that than me just sitting in my boss's office as I did this morning but but we have to find a mechanism to do that to some degree right and and one of the reasons why I think that you know Kate took so many meetings and worked so darn hard and and and you know was on the verge in my view of we we would we would have and could have burned her out um I think we did we did um let's be honest um is is number one hiring and retaining people right it's a leadership thing and holding them accountable right and and sometimes that's a money issue making sure that they're well compensated they're not going anywhere they're happy like we we ran into significant gaps last year and as a result of that she had to overcompensate um because couldn't rely on some of the people that she had and some of the other people were gone and and I think that that is you know so some of this is looking to the characteristics of the of the candidate but it's also communicating expectations and and recalibrating as needed What If instead of saying something like we're we're expecting you to reset expectations we would just say something in the post about understanding the importance of work life balance I think that that's like a Cod so I think you're you're kind of connecting back to like a job posting now where I feel like this is different this is just characteristics of what the school committee is looking for okay versus may maybe maybe the external is an external job posting just don't think we need it on there which I I think we need to talk about it and hear it and keep it in mind the workshop I don't think May June that's why we're yeah we definitely need a ways of working we put that in a different with whoever we hire and it's important we keep it in mind I think that makes sense but I don't think we need it to tell the search committee but it is important and I'm glad it got noted so are we good with uh deleting seven well move it somewhere else but not don't delete it cuz I think it's important I'll save it as a different file so can we rank these yes we can Rank and then do we want to add Carol's line under absolutely yeah because I if somebody has better language go let me pop pop it in there and I'll uh I'll write it and then we can skip all if I have understanding anticipating and reacting to changing state and federal policies okay and I don't think I can play with the live version but I will save this separate version upload later that's that's looks good to me understanding anticipating and reacting to changing state and federal policies probably not Friday IID it's not exactly how I think of it but I probably add like four sentences get but it's not even just state and federal policies right it's like um it's changing conditions conditions yeah the tech people should be there how about CH uh reacting to changing conditions including state and federal Poli feral policies I would want that in local state and federal policies local you yeah local state and federal policies cuz you deal with the local uh powers that be yeah okay okay all right I'm happy all right so do we want to prioritize now we can put it in order and maybe we can put a title uh in title superintendent characteristics and qualifications in order in order of priority in order of this it's a hard one I definitely think I can't remember what I prioritized I feel like I didn't prioritize look at your first line yeah I feel like I kind of I think I would reverse one and two I was going to say I feel like we're good with curriculum we have a curriculum yeah but the educational I want the educational background classroom experience and the ability to get yeah but if that's under number two that's still there how I the deal one and two if you switch one at least to start that's a good start oh I started off with the budget yeah I mean we can move the budget as well I'm just saying let's start with one and two so want to Dr vernham strength that um I really valued was her ability to hold not the whole budget in her head but the levels of the budget she always had a pretty good handle on what was going on at the levels and um sometimes things could change and you could see in her mind her moving her moving things were like Marbles and it's like a Ru Goldberg machine can I just than I just want to say this I I don't have a problem with moving it down to to number two but I think that having a focus I want this next person to be a datadriven curriculum focused person because that is the only proven way to increase student achievement but do we have that underneath the superintendent currently I feel like we have the Staffing there we already have but I still want them like this is like I don't know if if you're like a baseball team and your general manager is like ah do what you want I want Billy Bean I want that person who is rigorous I don't scientific and focused on results but that's what we do that's the goal of the school Comm think I want the leader and then they have their hires hes that do the work like the finance I feel problem with Billy Bean to to to draw from that analogy is they never want anything and they they they can't draw a crowd so you know I mean they're do yeah but I mean you know they're working the numbers but you still have to lead you know I want someone who can also focus on qualitative data and balance the needs of the student along with the needs of getting the data I don't want someone whose only obsession is the data I want someone who can balance the needs of the student too oh absolutely and I think it's important to state that because I think sometimes with the superintendent role or people who are have been an admin a long time I think some of those people are very data driven and I want someone who can also know that these are children in our schools and that the data is not always the most important thing I say not you're touching on number two here too maybe it's not about prioritizing them maybe they're all really important they all important priori I didn't think it prioriti I really think might too much and and maybe that's the you know to do I tell you like in my mind right I I completely understand where you're at Tony that's not where the priority is in my head right now and I just think because we've overcorrected in that not overcorrected but we've super corrected in that area and we're lagging in others we also haven't done listening sessions with the teachers we don't know what the staff want we don't know if there are but I think each each individual on this committee and also on the screening committee are all going to have their own priorities and you can and I think sharing priorities that's good then you can get that feedback take it in and then decide what you want to do well the screening committee like kind of ask need to ask them to look for certain things yeah and I think that's and that's I think this is a pretty good list where this going to be used is there anything else we want to give them and it sounds like we're doing the short list short version keep it simple they can I just think it's easier for to have the short they'll have their own priorities all right is there anything else you want to hit I appreciate the effort no I think this was I felt bad taking away so much stuff so it's like all right give you know Brian I I I kind of threw this on you in public comment a week ago and here we are you know like I mean this is I was almost going to say this is commendable this is really good I and I sincerely appreciate you taking the time to do this and get us together and kind of can can I just point out one thing under number five yeah absolutely the word inclusive may be something that puts a tar on our back again for federal funding and so I think I'm happy to put a Target on my back if it means standing up for the right cause I do not care right however I want to make that a conscious decision right we expose ourselves like if you look at the federal the language of the fre the freeze it specifically targeted this word okay and so should we take it outus inclusive no what word can we use instead I don't know that's what I I again I don't know what the word should be I just want to make sure that we are making a a conscious decision if we want to put it in and leave it in and tell them bring it on fine well I don't so I think we bring it on what are what are we signing up for here I mean this is a this is this is just the federal government is not going to isn't policy this is yeah I mean I so so here's how I would think of it and and I think this is poter for a much longer conversation over a long perod of time I want educational professionals who do think about being inclusive I agree and that that is part of their thought process and to the extent to to a to a reasonable extent decision-making process yeah and and reasonable meaning considering all the factors around them right um I I particularly when we're dealing with children who may not feel included in today's day and age and all of the ramifications that that leads to I would today I would still want to overcorrect for inclusivity and and that is not a matter of policy that is a matter of preference for me um and and I'm okay with that if there's no objections we'll I'll send the revised uh short version to everyone and also we'll bring it to the screening committee okay did we want to have the longer one too or not at all sounds like you know to much focus on someone who's tldr I mean it's the more words right yeah it's just love someone who gives it to us straight but I think also again focus on this is our ideas coming in and then we're still going to have our school committee okay to decide and a lot of that kind of thing comes out in interview you give somebody paper that say I'm looking for someone who's honest and trustworthy they're going to play that game if if you if you tell them that is the expectation of time when you speak with somebody you know where their passion is when we interviewed Kate knew where her passion was you can't hide that it's who you are you know and they can head it from you again it's really a two-part process right it's just the screening committee and then they still have to go to and candidates are going a good candidate is going to do their research as our new town manager did and bring thoughts and ideas relative to what they have seen from us and that's fine and it's welcome it's absolutely welcome absolutely I agree all right so next one was I thought planning listening session would be a good idea to plan next uh so my thought was to schedule different listening sessions one for staff and one or not one but sessions for staff sessions for the public we can determine the format but I feel like it should be just my initial thought is an open format um uh identifying facilitate facilitators how to how the feedback will be documented we should discuss and then booking publicizing the sessions so my thought is each individual members could again be a facilitator if you want want to partner up that would be again okay but tripling up would be probably a bad idea so we don't have to do a public meeting locations I feel like you could do it in the school if you want to reserve a room but I think you could even do it at the coffee shop or whatever and then advertising my thought was you could have the superintendent have a blast out we could also post it on the Facebook and if we're not sure about dates and times I think we can coordinate through me once you get yours booked and I can get that out to everybody so we don't double but the same time and we just make sure that we do at least one for staff and one for the public okay what if we did this let's do one for staff and one for public and then have a backup well I'd like to do at least two for staff because so some like especially at the Middle High School they'll do in the afternoons and if they're doing after school clubs or sports or something so I was thinking a morning one and then maybe an afternoon one or an evening one because I want it to be I think I really want to listen cuz I really want to the the problem with the morning one though is the morning for the people here is it won't be me that does that it's so incredibly early as compared to what it would be cuz usually a weekend one too the coffee shop I could do something like that in the morning um did you talk to no so that was the other part too if we wanted uh to reach out to the Lea leadership too to let them know that we're doing it and try to coordinate they know when they can get wonder if Thea has a suggestion really good point you know they know how it works sit my only request would be from my perspective um between budget what we're doing here Capital planning which I'm going through right after this like I'm just worried about my availability we record these or make sure we get really good not do not we will be the not right because I I don't take notes I we take notes I wouldn't take down names I would just take down you I just want to make sure whatever whatever good ideas captured I'd like to and give it back to the committee and then me and Carol can also bring it to the screening committee so it is something that we'd want to do yeah I'll you do on for the staff if you want want to do that very much like to do one for the staff you want yeah and I can do one for the public I can do whatever whatever nobody else fit I can probably fit in something like soon exactly I think within the next 10 days so what would work best for staff like Brian if you had one at your school what would be I after school is at least an option otherwise yeah maybe a weekend something like that right right after the trick is you got to work do we want to ask them not faculty Mee yeah exactly this is why I think you got to kind of it's a coordination effort going to text ask her all right and things like that yeah cuz I'd like because she would have the idea of when they show up yeah and I and and but if you if you can coordinate it through me whatever you finalize that's fine that way at least I can know that we hit every we hit the staff we hit the public yeah and then just so we can you want to do a public one and I can do a public one I'm happy to do whatever one yeah okay whatever and I think it I want it to fit with your schedules too at the same time so we can actually get it done um the pup one you can schedule now if you want yeah well I just got to look at my calendar but I'm like yeah I'll just do it I'm thinking I'll contact the coffee shop roers or something and got a busy schedule what else father no the the set aside some time that would be a good public the legal guardian dance that is the most boring name ever it's the yeah it's Terri yeah does everybody feel comfortable being able to set one up if they're if they're able I know if you're not able that's fine but set it up it just bounce back to me the minor legal and if you want to use School space just contact Kate or helping room yeah and then what I'll do is is I'll wait when people contact you whatever ho there is I can just do whatever I don't mind I don't when we do I think it's important that whoever is facilitating it we make it clear that it's about the future yeah it's not about the past oh yeah no it's not about bashing leadership of the past it's not like about a complaining about current leadership as cathartic as that might be to do uh cuz we want to focus on the future and hopes on the future so if it ends up go in that direction just a quick reminder to people to it kind of reminds me of FOC on the future desired characteristics qualifications what are you looking for yeah like what what are you looking for what changes or what direction does this J Cruise Ship need to head in or what would you like to see or you know what is affecting your ability to do your job so I could do something on the 5th and I could do something on we have school committ I know do morning afternoon the afternoon I'm assuming they're going do in the afternoon and I could do something on the 7th I can do the seventh you really want to make teacher stay after school on Friday no no I have no desire to do that but I'm just saying like availability because the third I mean I guess I could do it on the third but I don't think anybody's going to be able to get together that that and if you just contact me too I can I can even reach out to Kate and say get this out to the public Mary get back to no any any thought of how it would what about I don't know how it works here currently I don't know how it works at your school I know I never could have done it as a teacher CU I never ate lunch I just got ready for math I mean there was no time did teachers actually have time to go to the teachers room and have lunch not in my school but on hard I didn't because you could sit in the lunchroom and say what are you thinking and just be very um yeah but do they really want casual sitting I know but they why we're going to be here if you'd like to come I'd be okay with just coming during lunch and saying come come over here yeah that's I will I'll be over here if anybody wants to come by anybody I don't know if that I don't know if people had time to do that I wouldn't have another thought here too particularly when it comes well for any of these audiences um we we ought to invite uh public written comment as well because people are may not want to either have a like I get really so real crazy social anxiety one onone with people I don't know and I do for real do yeah I'm great in meeting of multiple people but small groups not my thing are you so are you serious yeah yeah completely completely true yeah small groups not so so I like if you were sitting in the teachers room I wouldn't really feel comfortable just walking up and telling you what I think right so but but I would write it to you and say this is what I think but like if you were in a public meeting i' be a public meeting 500 people in the room doesn't bother me at all yell it's just a thing everybody different I think that's awesome okay so for whatever that's worth no I like that now if I know you it's a whole other thing okay no different ways of let different ways of communicating I just think we should could be anxiety of doing that no that's fantastic and letting people cuz I just we do that too I think the more Community Buy in we have on this process the better the easier we're going to make it for the superintendent when they come in if people feel like their voice was heard yes I agree especially and more willing for the public to accept it especially with the teachers it be good yeah all right anything else on the listening sessions um and when you do it like if you do the public like don't be on the stage like the auditorium or something like I'm just going to be sitting there just so you know chair don't turn this into like no exactly very relaxed we g g yeah yeah right make everyone call you Mr chairman all right next was the internal and external search options uh want to review the internal hiring process so again it's going to the screening committee they're going to be meeting on Monday they're going to review the currently there's two applicants and go through that and then they'll set up interviews and then give uh feedback to the school committee whether posted the internal hiring did you run it by our HR director for the legal language to make sure it no it was very Massachusetts state laws for hiring no it was just a a basic job posting similar to the language used in the last uh posting super same like was it the was it copy pasted from the last yeah it was a lot of taken away stuff a lot of stuff taken away okay there was no concerns I think Kate Kate looked it over Kate looked it over okay yeah okay I'm just I'm a little concerned you didn't have a lawyer look it over but uh it'll be fine famous last word don't love that attitude nothing yeah specifically for the I wouldn't do that with an external but with the internal I don't have I'm a little n we're doing this two applicants currently without a professional overseeing it because of the situation and without an HR person guiding the internal search and I would like to Advocate that we bring on masc still because I'm still not sure what the laws are regarding internal searches and I'm worried about running a foul of them um when we spoke to Glenn coocher he said you can do what you want so I we can ask them if they're plan on getting pregnant anytime soon and well no obviously not that's the LA different than a posting that's different than a posst and I think with the interview committee so I've sat on interview committees for coaches and teachers I've never done it for a superintendent but it's that idea that the questions every interview I've ever done is always the questions are already written down they've already been decided these are the questions and also on the lunberg municipal building design the questions are already pre-written you it's okay you're not straying from it this is the the list of questions um I I'm fine with the path that we're on right now I I think at the point where we decide that we're going to do a public posting I do think that we need to bring in the masc I I think that that's I think that's the p i I agree with that as well if we because I mean the reality is is that if we hire an internal candidate then this is it it be it's admittedly a more insular process M right um if we don't hire an internal candidate we have certainly given our internal candidate pool the opportunity to be seen and heard um I hope we interview all applicants for internal candidates would be I hope I would um and and um and and we are also leaving open the option to encourage an internal candidate that is not selected to remain in contention as part of an external search right so I mean in my mind like we they would be capable and in my mind that is that's the appropriate path and and at that point at that pivot point where we say okay we do want to take a look at external candidates I think then we bring in the masc and say let's I agree let's talk with them follow their recommendations we got got we will have a screening committee already assigned and we can go to work y okay um so the other part was the HR and legal considerations review procedures to ensure compliance with hiring laws and best practices discuss potential legal risks and strategic strategies to risk mitigation so I don't know if there's anything else you want to add to that did you write strategic strategies strategies for risk mitigation potential risks okay but I think yeah I think we're on the right track and like I think me and Carol feel pretty comfortable going into the screening committee that we're going to set the questions it's not going to be random that people are going to ask whatever they want no and and you have to follow and there are several people that we are hoping to put on the screening committee that have also that additional I did notice that we had a number of applicants who have done this specific process before and we had an A few applicants who've done other search yeah so I'm excited history of search I think I feel comfortable legally that we're going to be following that the right procedure excellent all right uh the next one was application review in uh initial candidate pool and voting procedures so overview of the applications received so far so we have over 20 received so far for the umen the screening committee and then two applicants for the superintendent position intern did you skip over number four or um screening committee might have I might have yeah I think we kind of jumped to the HR IED out clarify expectations and responsibilities of the screening committee so again the screening committee is really just to screen the candidates and then make recommendations whether they recommend both none one to the school committee that's the the expectation it's open-ended the screening committee can do what they want and make their recommendations of what they want that we don't we're not going to set their expectations um um did you want to talk about makeup or how is how you guys were going to bring us a slate because I'm we will we will bring a slate um as a subcommittee we're going to go through all the appli if you guys are a sub commmittee you can't talk without it being a publicly posted Mee public po just okay yep we made sure so the concern I had too is and got Direction on how to do it appropriately when do we pop that in the folder for you guys to look at is my question too because we do have a potential deadline of the 31st where people can still apply so our list could change if more people apply I wouldn't go out and recommend people start applying at this point cuz it's kind of like it should be done today suggest recommendations to you based on that would have to wait I believe till Saturday yeah for changes to our recomm changes to our rec or to come up with a list because otherwise new list you could recommend on Saturday to come with new list just bear with me here while I I I know this is medua but it is very strange you guys you guys have your subcommittee meeting tonight yes somebody lobs in an application on Friday that you guys are like oh we got to have this guy right so now you've got your recommendation and then you've got this other application so you need to show up at our meeting on Saturday morning and say are we both good yep yep or no no we need to might have a posted meeting on Saturday as another meeting you might want to do I'm just I just think it's worth it's too late to post it post a Thursday it's Wednesday and town hall is closed on Friday you can post tomorrow morning but Town Hall Clos you can post tomorrow morning okay and it's for uh for Saturday meeting as long as it's 48 hours in advance y40 okay so I will Ro yeah I I know the it it I know that face I've been down that road that's the I am absolutely right Mr chair had a question if we know of external candidates that would be qualified and interested you'd have to wait okay that's my thought because we are posting currently for for superal yeah for the superintendent yeah that would have to wait all right any other questions or concerns about the screening committee any other discussion on the screening committee um la I'm just yeah cuz Okay and again that's why we have the Saturday meeting for us to as a committee decide if we want to rearrange the thep what we did recommend you can I know but then it turns into kicking people off the subcommittee well we're not going to publish we're not going to publicly State those names until we're ready to make that motion but you will cuz you'll have a meeting tonight will you will have it's executive session it's executive session okay and Saturday morning before our meeting will also be executive session so the names will not be out totally fine we're trying to do this as discreetly as possible so people aren't follow in what MC said to do public I just wanted to make sure that we were being respectful of the people who Vol that's why we want to do this and not in the public meeting okay I was okay just wanted to make sure we're being respectful of people and like we said if we don't like the order we can change it as a committee of five we decide the screen committee we're just have a recommendation then that's fine okay I didn't realize okay I just good no this is good this is why we have a committee of five so we can make sure everything's taken care of thanks for crossing the te this is good exactly it's important to do it is important to do it right all right um I lost track sorry so I think we're at seven interview process and question screening just structured list of in questions we we didn't do six application review initial candidate pool and voting procceed so I think we talked about the the applicants so far nope overview of applications received so far yeah so I said we had 20 plus for the screening and then two for the superintendent do we expect when later so the later incomplete applications we didn't talk about that that would be for the superintendent because I think for both I think we don't have applications for for the screening letter but if somebody comes in after the 31st no but I think we accept them for the 30th 31st we will accept them up to the we'll say no on the first that's only fair it is that memo we took right away we knew and then for the superintendent if they pass the deadline we will not accept the the applicant that's my thought just one time you can't do the job and then discussion on voting for screening committee we just had that discussion when is the due date for this the internal posting when was when is the due date for the superintendent uh I would have to check but I believe it is the 31st oh boy I can double check I have it did you guys already say how big the screening committee is going to be 12 12 we have we have 2 few did you guys like come up with a makeup of so I've categorized so last time you had like it was 11 4 p.m. January 28th so we are we are closed we closed we have two applicants okay for interview process in questions screening this is something that the screening committee needs to the screening committee needs to determine the interview questions is that the screening committee will determine the inter and and then we as a committee would determine the interview questions we would ask the school committe ex inter the second the second basic screening committee passes them onto us so again they can make their recommendations but we can also disagree as a school committee disagree with their recommendations they can say like any and we say talk to them any we can still talk to both them we can they could say we like both and we could say no we don't want either of them and so and then yeah it's very open and then um yeah I think so I apologize I I'm just Cog into the time here um so I I think this is all fine in as much as the screen committee can govern itself to figure out how they're going to ensure questions are aligned and and score and score answers MH by the way I'm not one for scoring answers like I think you know take notes and chat about it afterwards come up with your slate right like I I think that there are certain things that are not um you can't with a three or six so anyway that's just my in my experience these are hard these are things that are hard to quantify um yeah maybe that's even a screening committee discussion too um do we need to do anything for timeline at this point I think we're I think we we're still okay I think we just keep doing it on the super on the school committee meetings and we'll continue as the dates as as we progress we might have to take action but we'll keep it on the agenda so we can say start an external search when we're ready for that or for want to do that thank you for yeah this great work he's done really well great work so good it's really the memo killed me I was like oh my goodness when the memo had the wrong dates different dates that's Oh I thought you me the memo about in the federal government that what I was fine with actually I was like everybody in the entire country is in the same boat as us so I'm not that wor are we going to be able to do lunch we're going to Beal but that would be everybody right one ches I but that was my I know yeah not all of it though are there any additional questions or concerns open discussion for additional items identify any overlooked areas that need further review I think we got it you did a really good job right you guys slowed us down at the beginning I was a little nervous yeah I was a little scary sorry I was late too we moved yeah it was good I app think might be a record for all five of us being here yeah actually doing real business in an hour PR good job all right wait it's only okay yeah that is a record checking my folders here um so now we know it's Kate that's holding us up we should let that would be D I thought it was P now I know it's G we you for some reason despite not being the one who's it's your meetings that you're not funny we always joke about it too it's not really you it's just all right we good all right I will open it up to public comments is there any public comments from anyone the public or the committee um I just want to say that I am really grateful that you and Carol are doing this like I don't know enough about education to know what's good and what's bad and if I had to put my faith my kids future in any two people's hands other than my family members you guys are it I do not think we could do better than you guys so I'm really grateful that it's you guys thank you thank you I would just add as uh my public comment I uh I want to thank the community too for uh stepping up with over 20 applicants to help out on the screening committee with a very diverse group of people I'm really excited and I think we're on the right path that we're we're doing it as a community we're making it change can be really hard but I think we're doing it the right way and I think uh yeah I think we're going to do some good it's not Mak sad I'm happy we we got community members without kids or with grown kids that was like that's when we get Buy in from the community is when people who don't have an immediate stake decide that they want to help that's fantastic yep that's progress yeah so all right uh if there's no other public comment I'll look for a motion to adjourn at 7:08 p.m. so moved second any discussion all those in favor say I I opposed our meeting is adjourned at 7:08 p.m. thank you