thank you Paula am I on there yes okay does anyone have a flag Dave Hold on Bill Berner typically has a flag I'm in the office tonight ah okay I had a flag in this room before um I think Mike Mack just went to get one okay there we go Mike would you like to start Us in the Pledge of Allegiance please a pledge of allegiance to the flag to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God under God indivisible with liberty and justice for allice thank you so much okay I'm going to head into a roll call vote um do I do that before I do the public meeting announcement yep yep okay all right well first let me you want me just to read the beginning of this certainly in accordance with the requirements of the open meeting law please be advised that this meeting will be recorded and can be found on the lunenberg access you YouTube channel this meeting is being conducted remotely the following information is provided from members of the public that would like to participate in the meeting remotely from a computer please use the link on the agenda to join or from a telephone dial the tollfree number 888 475 4499 and enter webinar ID 8871 1176 81305 if you've not registered with zoom you will be asked your name and email address no participant ID is needed just press pound when asked telephone users may dial star9 to request to speak after joining the meeting computer and app users may use the raised hand feature to request to speak thank you Paula appreciate that let start a roll call V with the Commissioners Mike Mackin hi here Mike n hi Dave McDonald here and I for myself um and then the um the office business manager Paula here Jane rley here Bill Bernard I'm here thank you very much um thank you everybody um I would like to start the meeting um with a public comment if there is any public available I do not see any do you Paula no I don't okay is there any public comment from Commissioners or staff just a reminder that uh town meeting is May the 4th 9:00 a.m. apparently it's going to be busy if so people might consider arriving early um and uh you know in in Massachusetts meeting is our U legislative portion of our government so each one of us is a member of our own legislature it's important that we show up thank you very much Mike any comment there Mr chair I just want to emphasize what Mike just said it's very important more than ever that everyone try to attend this this year's town meeting the future of lunenberg kind of decides uh you guys decide the future of lunenberg there's a lot going on so if you go and you're not happy with the vote then shame on you so I recommend highly if you're one of those warrants that have a uh represents you at home I suggest you come to town beinge and vote so thank you Mike for bringing that up yes thank you both I would like to say that um our software billing issues are just in a deplorable situation and I would like to I would like to say that I believe it would be very important if our select board and town manager could start to focus on the situation um it's going to affect it's starting to not just starting it's been a problem for long term now um and it's um it could literally affect the business of the sub Department from being able to continue at all if it gets any worse and our staff uh working as hard as they do is completely and totally overwhelmed by the situation and it's only going to get worse so thank you um and then I think we should work on to do we have any announcements H do you know of any announcements needed to be made no okay um I would like to start by asking um the Commissioners present if they've had a chance to review the minutes from 22724 um before the meeting this evening I know that's going back a bit once everyone had a chance Mr chair so Mr chair I saw him and I put a motion to accept the minutes I'll take that motion do we have a second second all right U for the vote we'll start with Dave McDonald Mark n i Mark Mackin hi and I for myself and Amendments have been accepted for 22724 and then we have our recent minutes um 4924 and if everyone's had a chance to review that do we have a motion to accept those make a motion to accept and could I have a second please I'll second that thank you Mike um and we'll start the vote with Mike n hi Mike Macklin hi Dave McDonald I wasn't at the meeting my bad thank you and my I for myself can we accept that Paula with only three of us yes yes yes okay well thank you all um moving along we're going to move to the Engineering Services um the review various task orders the dis um have discussion about it um I know that we've had is there something we can put up on the screen Paul um well I can certainly put it up on the screen um I just kind of want to give an overview so we had asked right Pierce for a number of different task orders and the the most critical one or most um immediate one is the review of the um review of the um electricity for pumps uh for the pump stations located at Dana Street lemonster Road and mass one um and this is in um preparation for submitting an application for a grant bill and I were both very surprised at the amount um basically we need them to calculate the potential energy savings um and the task order came in at $7,200 um which we thought was high I will say that money is tight right now with this budget um and I really wanted to bring it before you guys to see we have talked to um CTE John and I talked to CTE this morning Wade um from CTE and he indicated that it will be a savings but he couldn't specify how much um in order to be eligible we want to see according to the green community's task force a significant um decrease in energy use um so you know do we do we spend the $7,200 in the hopes to get the grant do we delay until a later date so I'm really looking for guidance from you and Bill if you want to chime in please yeah so the they sent us two cost estimates the first one was even higher than that and I tried to um reduce the scope of work and it still came in I thought way too high I think they had way too many hours for what needed to be done but maybe they're busy and this you know for that price they'll do it otherwise when something comes in that eye to me it says they don't want to do it so we're really just want to tell you we're really under the gun for the um to get this in um I was working on it today and I put together all the expenses that we've spent on on electricity as well as all the kilowatt hours that we've utilized at each station those three stations um we spend about $25,000 a year in electricity at these three stations um so you know the question is do we spend the $7,200 in the hopes that were eligible but the deadline to get this to um our representatives from the grant program is May 10th um so so I know that that bill reached out to mat Keefe um from mtil and he was going to potentially look at um trying to work with someone to get the cost sa to the electric savings um I did put together all the run times from every station all of the um specs for the existing equipment as well as the old equipment but honestly the energy calculations are Beyond me and Bill looked at it as did John and none of us are really qualified to put it together Mr chair if I could one is I I would oppose signing that that's way too high I would concentrate though maybe Cen John denapoli he can give you all the numbers Paulo he can tell you where the money's going uh but I would rely on that green task force committee that's what they're supposed to be doing my opinion but I wouldn't spend $7,200 I mean we know the electric bills are High um but what I would do I would go the other way that's me so I'll say we did we did reach out to the community's task force and they have really recommended that we get the information from right here honestly I don't know that any of them are are able to do it bill I don't know if you your thoughts yeah they've pretty much tasked us to do it um there are other companies out there that could do it Paul I didn't even tell you I I forgot to say you um I reached out to rise engineering which was one of the Consultants that um the woman from the state that administers the grant sold us to reach out to and they haven't gotten back to me yet but um unel that the guy Matt kef is works for unitel that's his thing and he said he was goingon to reach out to another company see if they can do it we haven't heard back from him either my my experience with John an appol he's an excellent guy he represents the community well uh if you tell him you have a situation and Paula you know John appol yeah I do yeah I mean he he helped us a lot with the DPW Renovations and again he would do anything he can to help the town of lunenberg so I'd recommend going that route I would never ever pay that much money to our uh uh what's who we talk about right Pier that that's just I think uh bills got a right they're just too busy and I would say screw that but let's do it the right way and talk with the experts from the electrical services I can reach out to John tomorrow he would also I don't know what you did as far as records Paula but don't waste your time call John he'll give you a report broken down for what you need um and and again that's what they do at unito know their prices are high but their customer service is very good no I can definitely reach out to him tomorrow I can get his contact information from that D can s it to you okay great we did start with John denapoli and he put us to um the Matt o'keef so we did start with John well let's continue going on with them I mean I wouldn't stop I would be a pest but that's me that's what that's what I'm know for be a pest keep on going but talk to The Experts and uh our Engineers on Experts when it comes to this even solo companies can probably help us too Bill just so you know you it would be a shame to spend $7,000 to save two I I wouldn't even consider I would vote no on that right away yeah I think um what did the rest of the Commissioners think it sounds like a a good place to start I I think that this in particular I mean you know I don't know what the odds are but I mean if if this were to come true that that's for us definitely you know getting the pumps I'd say it's would to me would be a no-brainer that you know I mean most those pumps are you know 20 years back now I mean for the most and it's that technology 20 years fast forward you know you just you would just automatically assume they going to be more efficient and you know so I would at you know I know the other price is kind of high for a gamble but um you know whatever we can do by May 10th I think it's well worth in this and this i' I've seen a couple of the other proposals here and I don't agree with them but this particular one you know hopefully we can get it to move forward what whatever information we get for May 10th so so thank you sorry sorry I'm late um SOC John right you can keep you can keep running the meeting that'd be fine no no that's all right I'm handing over the range right here to you we in okay you're probably sure where we are at this point you're aware of where we are yeah I I assume we're talking about the 72 $7,200 from right Pierce to uh look at the efficiency of the pumps correct okay thank you sir it's all yours okay um so it sounds like uh Mike null you're you're in favor of that is that what I was hearing I'm not in favor of spending the money there I'm in favor of moving forward for the for the grant um but one thought that just came to mind um couldn't we reach out to whoever's supplying the pumps and ask you know how much more efficient they are and right there would give us a calculation Paula talked to uh Chad um his last I don't know his last name but W and Flair yeah W and Flair yeah from CTE this morning and um hopefully he's going to get that information for us so I I guess that's a starting point sure yeah it's just a tight deadline I mean basically you got 10 more days yeah okay um see where where where are you guys on all of the other ones just we just got to this one John okay so so the directive is if I understand correctly is to contact John denapoli keep working with c and hopefully we can get someone to get us the information and get the information in by the May 10th deadline but not to go forward with the right Pierce proposal is that and if we're not able to get the information you understand that we won't be putting in an application I just want to make that clear you know the other thing you can do Paul is talk to the pump people and ask them what their opinion are I they're the experts when it comes to the pumps so the pumps aren't the biggest part of it according to Matt o'keef the biggest part is the vfds and when we talked to CH uh to Wade this morning he said there will be more efficiency from the pumps obviously because they're they're newer they have better technology they they are more energy efficient but we're not going to see a big difference with the V fds because we are replacing older equipment but it's not necessarily going to change the amount of energy you know that the works of the vfd John if you want to expand you were you were on the call I think that pretty much covered it from Chad's opinion um he doesn't see much savings which is you know not I guess that puts Matt in chat at odds but um certainly there would be efficiencies from pumps and that's are you talking about Matt Corbin or Matt O'Keefe oh but you know what I'm confusing two Matts because Matt o'keef is concerned that we may not see enough of a savings he's mentioned that at the last green communities meeting right okay um well let's let's hope let's hope the Chad will get us something in the next couple of days and that it'll be enough that we can go go forward right I mean again that's that's what I'm hearing right okay um now in all those other quotes from right Pierce they all seem little on the high side right very high expect the manho one fled me it it honestly that's like you know but 30 man hoses I me we probably get quotes I mean that's that's a big chunk of of it out of there that that one really shocked me you know you know I I don't want to be the one who bring this up but I will uh Bill chapter 90 money chapter 90 money I looked into it I I think you might want to look into it our sewer covers covered by chapter 90 money as S as uh storm water covers because it's Road Rep Road repairs out of our control right so raising if you're Paving a road and you're you know just raising the cover or raising the structure or replacing it the the framing cover then you could use chapter 90 funding um we're doing more than just frames and covers we're would you know rehab in the interior of the structures too so I don't believe chapter 90 might could be used for that could you check on that because what I looked at it kind of does because it becomes a hazard to the road which falls under chapter 90 now I'm not a chin chin I'm not a chapter 90 money guy but from what I researched so far it is covered by chapter 90 but again I rather have that come from you and not me so I I would suggest Mr chair let's wait until John research that a little bit before we go out and blowing all kinds of money if it's already covered under a a chapter 90 as well as sewer as well as storm water drains uh bill that's covered under chapter 90 if I'm not mistaken what I found out yeah storm water definitely yes so anything that's road yeah anything that's in the road is is covered can I can share my screen I've gone through I've started I've got a draft over an ifb um that I did and that I sent to Bill and we've been working on the bid sheet how we bid it so what I did is I went through every manhole what right Pierce proposed and basically assumed the work that needed to be done um if I could share my screen and just show you the what we came what I came up with please do so this is basically can you guys see it can you blow up a little bit try so we're looking at so what I tried to do is the work that's associated with each manhole how many of each we have to do so you can see that there's 18 manholes that we do have to remove the frame and cover and surrounding material and then put a new watertight cover on and repave to grade so that does involve roadway work um removal of roots and or organic material basically Roots have infiltrated into the manhole and that's four of those repair repair and replace steps there's six of those um five need brick and morar 19 have holes in them um 19 have cracks so that they have to be injected with chemical grout um and then eight of them need a full liner three need chimney seals and nine need polymer coating those are on our 24 in me holes and then you can see it's basically the same thing but it just separates 24 inch from 32 inch so that's the kind of work we're talking about for the manhole repairs Mr chair what I found out was and Paula go back up to the beginning yeah we own the pipes so if you take a look at the remover of roots and organic that that would be us um as far as the manholes themselves again bill you can check but I'm finding out the phone calls I made was that chapter 9 money covers the safety of the roads including storm water or storm basins and Sewer covers and again I may be wrong but that's what they told me when I called Boston well looking at these items I think item one probably chapter 90 but the remainder of the items I don't believe so I and I agree I agree with that if it's our pipes that's a problem then we fix those uh but constant Road repair wear and tear on the uh covers um and again from what I was explained was that would be a road hazard safety thing issue which is what chapter 90 is about anything else interior as far as the system would be ours so it would be 2121 that potentially could be chapter 90 is what I'm seeing yeah I mean it it depends on how you read it I think our DPW director should call and clarify I'm just saying what they told me I don't know I'm not a DPW director so I'm just saying is that chapter 90 goes for everything I mean um but it doesn't Common Sense tells us that we own the pipes in the ground and Bill let me know if I'm Mis Miss saying it but I mean that that's all us we know that yeah well again I I I think the first item which probably could be covered there you know repairing the rest of the manal probably not I will check with the uh the state aid engineer tomorrow I can give you the contact person I talked to she was very nice to me um I don't have it here with me it's that's my office but but I did I did tell her that I was with the uh sewer Sewer Commission in my town okay well tell me the name go ahead send me the name Dave yeah I'll do it tomorrow when I get to the office okay okay yeah I mean any dollar we can get from chapter 90 is you know a little more we can stretch the aror money so that'd be great so where are we with the with the um form in an effort to try to avoid having them go out and do the inspections on the manholes that's what I put together based on the previous information and and visual observations by some of our DPW staff how Mr chair I I would wait until we get a report back from Bill if it's a go or noo and then go from there but if it's chapter 90 money and if it's what I think her name was Emily but if whoever uh the girl I talk to uh I I would wait and see and if if they repair the covers that's one thing and then we go from there but all your stuff is correct it's got to be fixed from covers down to what you have correct it's just a matter of who pays for the uh sewer manhos right but I think one of Paul is I think that's great Dave and if we can get chapter 90 money that's great um correct me if I'm wrong Paul one of the concerns is that you know this L list is based off of what was it 2016 information or in some cases 20123 uh 22 23 in some cases 2016 okay so what when this goes out to bid and we actually start doing work on the manholes some of those manholes could um take a lot more work because they certainly haven't gotten any better and chances are each one of them's gotten a little worse um and then if this goes out to bid for those num those numbers um and it ends up cost it could end up costing us more than the 100,000 right Paul bill um but we we did you know buffer the budget with extra Capital um in in part my in my mind I was thinking you might be able to use some of that for manholes too so let's wait and see what bill can find out about the N chapter 90 money and then go from there okay well I mean once you get the definite definition of what you guys are doing then you do your RFP based upon that so you should save money I mean it's going to take money from the chapter 90 but the project is the project no matter which way to do it I mean but I wouldn't submit out a RFP until we know what the exact actual scope is well that's the bid from from right Pierce that's the question is this would be 25% of the 100,000 do we want to do that or do do we want to take the risk of defining our own scope or do we spend 25% of the money on engineering I I again I would take a look at what bill says let him come back and say this is what chapter money will pay and then from there we can come up with a new scope of work and I I would try to and Bill you should know this being a do engineer we I don't know if we really need an engineer to tell us that a brick is falling out or whatever whatever company you hire can do the inspection for you I mean following the scope of work we could do like a checklist like what is needed in manhole number one brick you know what you have there Paula let them come back to us and tell us what they need that's how you do a proposal it's so we have that right we have reports from previous years the question is uh you know should we inspect them again because the inspections are old and then the other question is um put in specs together well I I would talk about having the contractor themselves say listen this is what needs to be done we want you to survey each sewer cover or each sewer and tell us what work needs to be repaired following our list of responsibility they may say you don't need bricks they may say you don't need this they may say you need more bricks but have the company doing the repair give you kind of a proposal for each one and then go from there so you are you saying you want that to be part of the scope of the job of the work yes yes that would be part of the scope to inspect each manho and give us a price to repair each mle one through 20 minus what chapter 90 would cover that's yes I have to say that I have to say there's some uh there's a lot of wisdom there it's not a contractor I can tell you that's part for the course typically that you go and you look at the work that needs to be done give specific repair needs listed uh expected costs before the job starts it really wouldn't be unexpected to be part of the scope not at all it's the way to go and it'll be chances are it'll be more accurate than what we'd get from right Pierce they don't do the work they always know quite what they're looking at can you talk can you talk about procurement from a town standpoint how we could go about doing that yeah so I I don't know what how we put out a bid proposal for for doing it that way it's it's really nothing different on the bid proposal you would say um manhole number one you have that list that Paula has as far as what needs to be fixed see we're gonna we're gonna you won't you won't be able to give a financial number at first until you get the estimate from that company you think an engineer is going to go down each manle and look at it and inspect it that it doesn't work in real world today well how how do we get bids for that even if you hire a company who you used in the past that we've had and ask them could you give us an estimate of what needs to be repaired you'll pay them far less to give you an estimate then you will for an engineer to come and do it right so that I agree with um so you ask a contractor give me a number for you to inspect in fact we're doing it now for other companies give me a a price to inspect man holes for repairs and and that's it it would be less than the engineer and a good example would be with Brett I mean you could have an engineer say you know you want you to build a wall but he forgets to put in the foundation or he doesn't realize that the soyo is not suitable for it Brett comes on the the scene and he finds out that there's a big change order coming up because he has his eyes on it it's it's common sense in our business and what we do but municipality I'm not an expert in but it makes common sense to hire the company even that we use now who repaired all the man hos on massav and Paulo you like that company I would think right yeah I think they did a great job the question that I have is if we were to contact them and ask I think it's a great idea here and actually in my original draft I recommended that I basically put a disclaimer that this is based on on previous inspections um but Bill wanted to kind of quantify the numbers so that's what I attempted to do but I think maybe it's two separate projects I think maybe it's inspections to get an idea of what has to be done and then a bid to go out to do the work because we because it's over $50,000 we have to do a formal bid but one question I have is say the company goes out and does the inspections are they are they prevented from doing a bid because I wouldn't want that to happen because we're I would think they would be because they' have inside information that that would exclude them from bidding on that inside information is going to be released when it goes out to bid bill it's not they're not holding anything that's going to be the scope of work it's not inside information it's inside information that they the only ones who bet on it but you're going to take you're going to pay them separately to do a report on the manhold because that's what they do they do the report it's done then you take that and you bring that out the bid and they understand that they may have the desire to get the job because they work in lunenberg but you know what everything should be going out to bid in today's world including right pairs I love right paars but if and you know as I do if they're busy they're gonna throw a number at it and you know they're GNA say ah you know what lunberg needs to do it no they don't we got we got to start looking at this as a business and again again what I would do is hire the company ask ask our procurement officer and just say we want to hire the manhole company to give us an estimate for repairs the same thing with the buildings what happens there build when a building when a roof goes off do you hire the roof of the good or do you hire an engineer they give you an estimate so so this this whole process makes me nervous it's a question for the inspector General's office I I don't think it is I think we're over complicating it but ask uh ask your procurement officer yeah and I think that's what they would do is call the inspector General's office bidding then they're wasting our money if that's what they want to do at Town Hall listen I got one more meeting with the sewer and if I didn't I would still be saying the same thing you always got to do it the right way and by going Engineers to fix problems is not the right way but that's my opinion so I'll let that go all right Bill Bill can you talk to Heather um and see if she knows or if not Heather you know is this something we would have to ask Adam about yeah I think I could talk to H Julie tomorrow and um I'm sure she's gonna call the inspector General's office to get their opinion on on this process yeah to me it just makes me nervous you know something red flags are going off my head so okay all right well um Bill why don't you do that and um we'll have to talk about it at our next meeting okay sure all right what else did we have in those see do we do we Paula do we need to talk about any of the other right Pierce proposals tonight no I don't think so because they're basically the same different Scopes but the same projects and we've just made decisions on those so I think we're good okay okay um next item is the Q4 Bill insert you want to describe that Paula uh I had emailed it out to everybody um I just want to make sure the wording is okay I do want to point out that at our last meeting we talked about the um basically increasing the minimum charge based on the amount that we're increasing for the flow minimum charge is based on 842 gallons um I did the calculation again we thought it at the meeting I think we did some quick math and we thought it was 126 but it's not it's 133 so the amount for the minimum charge would would based on 842 gallons would be 133 rather than 126 but I did send out the wording I just want want to make sure it's okay before it goes out yeah than to me anyone have any thoughts on that all S I thought the wording was great straight forward thank you Paula okay yeah I I was fine with the wording also um anyone else have any thoughts on that no I was pleased to see the um The Ledger article that was that was a good good piece of work yeah they they made it sound like it was uncooperative anyway uh yeah that that was good I I think it's a starting point for trying to educate our users um all right so on the bill insert do we need to vote on that no I think if the consensus is it's okay I yeah I think it's okay all right um the draft turnover procedure did everyone have a chance to read that I thought it was a little uh cumbersome to have to ultimately potentially have uh the sewer department have to drive over to the town hall every day um I did talk to Bill briefly about it he thinks that's going to be rewarded and probably worded as once a week versus every day um because for Paul or to Camille to put down what they're doing and go over to the town hall it's it's at least a half hour to get over there and come back and restart what they're doing so um hopefully um that will get changed so it's not quite so strict John I missed that one um in the reports what what's what's that in regards to like basically if a check comes into into our office okay or you know someone pays for something is the proposed procedure is it it it identifies that you know they have to be locked if they have to go to town hall daily there has to be a specific form to go with them one of the things that I had an issue with is they also want us to keep a carbon receipt book I have a database that keeps track of all the receipts and generates the receipts yeah um so I I'm hoping that that will suffice um and currently how do we how do we do it currently how have we done it currently um we do do a turnover form um for the you know drain layers or sewer permits or things like that we don't for bill payments and I did talk to the tax collector Treasurer today we don't have to do a turnover for bill payments which is good um but my biggest concern was the procedure to go over to the town hall because the procedure requires daily turnovers and that you have to stay in wait while you balance with the treasurer and my concern was as a one person operation that does seem like a lot of time lot time actually but if they change it to once a week I don't think it's a big deal considering when the times if you can you know take a picture of a check and deposit it you think there'd be easier ways okay hopefully that will change um the next item is a waiver of interest uh for three accounts these are all related to um so they were they all the car wash Paul I didn't actually print those out you're Paula you're muted you're two two of the car wash and one is the office okay now if I remember correctly they felt that they shouldn't have to pay the interest because they don't recall receiving the bills that's correct there are there were numerous people that did not receive their bill I can't explain why um Camille and I ran them through the post meter like we always do and brought them to the uh post office I did map out the areas and it does look like there's specific pockets of town that didn't get their bills um but anyone who came in with a pass du notice was asked to pay the interest um that was on the bill however anything since the that went out um was not we didn't continue acre interest until they came in so basically it was what was on the past two notice was collected the reason we did the past two notice rather than the delinquency is because um delinquency demands do not work in munis still um so we did this instead of doing a demand process so the $10 fee was not assessed on anyone um but everyone else was asked to pay the interest um and um this property owner came in and has was very upset um and basically refused to pay the interest um and because it's over $15 the treasurer cannot wave the interest without a vote of the commission and the signatures of the commission so if the commission approves the waiver request I would put together a document and send it out via docy sign for you guys to sign to wave the $74.75 in interest if if back can say I I I find it hard to believe that you know I don't think there's a history with this customer I think they they've probably been a a prompt pay payer and this is something you know I probably get to do with with all of it going on and I I myself I'd be in favor of doing the waiver because they you know I I I I'm assuming there'd be a prompt pay I don't know that as a fact but I'm assuming they would be and this is just a circumstance of every that's been going on with us I don't disagree but I just want to say that if we do this waiver we can expect to do it for the rest of the people who didn't receive their bill I think and that's going to require hours and hours of work M Mr chair I recommend we give those people to refund this town the the Billing System been screwed up since January this is the town's fault so I I I'm I'm going to vote to give back anybody who wants their refund because of the billing that's my opinion this this has gone on long enough U and again I would vote to if they come in for a $10 fee or whatever it is I would give them their money back because it's to me it's the town's problem not ours I I don't think we should we should just like automatically go through everyone I think people that come forward and make it you know and bring it to our attention I I think we really should you know do something about it that's my opinion I don't think we should argue if anybody who wants to dispute Bill come in I I would say give it to him but again that's me I mean I'd like to see at some point honestly as some form of Retribution or something to munist for all this they're the ones at the heart of all this yeah I I don't I don't I don't disagree with that at all but let's let's uh and I could go on all night just about that you know you know J when when you say it's a talent's fault you know the the problem is it's not the town that's going to have to deal with this it's Paula that's gonna have to deal with it um you know what then assign it to our assistant uh uh person in the office but it's it's coming to a point where I would be embarrassed to get a bill that's late and then ask to be paid pay the late fees that doesn't make business sense to me and I agree Mike I'm not go to everybody anyone who was in that cycle where the bill got late and were asking for their interest fee I I wouldn't pay it I I I don't think it's going to be an option for Paula to have to go back and make the adjustments I'm not saying all the adjustments anyone who just went in this billing cycle who was in that little window wherever it is but again that's what I would say you got other members why don't you ask them my one question my one question would be sorry um I'm I could be wrong but I believe this is the only Bill that's been contested as far as interests that not nobody else has come forward so I I don't think by doing this we're going to see like a mass thing of all of a sudden you know everybody's showing up I I'm not saying we won't get one or two but but I that's just my opinion that's all yeah I'm I I'm kind of with Mike on this which is like let's deal with the problem in front of us not the problem behind that one um the problem in front of us is that the there's a legitimate claim for you know somebody's said you know my bill didn't come um and we have a process to approve the waiver and I I'd support it for this for this project we can deal down the road if this becomes problematic bill yeah so I I don't think this was a munice issue this was a post office issue there was I don't know the number of 40ish people that didn't receive their mail um some of the people that came in you know lived in the same area and they and Paulo was asking them do you does this happen often and they said yeah it doges um and those 40 people I called or came in I'm sure all of them said can you wave the feed so I think if you you know wave this one here you gotta you gotta wave the other 40 people that called retroactively yeah let me make this clear I'm not saying go back and credit everybody anybody who comes in now during that period where their taxes those came in late I would grant them the waiver not go back just what we did what Paula just said Paula Define what you said first the they weren't the demands did not go out however instead of Demands I sent late notices to people just to let them know that we never received their payment there was other than interest there was no other fee Associated I did have a number of people who wanted to have the interest removed and I responded after explaining that we couldn't do that they they paid it typically it was a very small amount and they paid it um as Bill said this was not a munus pro the the not being able to send demands is a munice problem but they would have if demands had gone out through munice they would have received the bill the interest plus a $10 fee um so fortunately they didn't get that $10 fee but this is a post office problem um I am moving forward I talked to the treasurer and I'll be doing a bulk mailing and the post office will certify the number of bills that I sent um typically it's in the 900 range um but I'll be doing that moving forward and then if someone doesn't get their bill my concern is we can't someone says they don't get their bill what events do we have that they didn't get their bill because they didn't come back um are we going to wave it all the time or just this particular instance I would say how long are we gonna have this problem that's a post office problem Dave I can't tell you how long it's going to occur it's a post office problem so what was the problem at the post office people didn't get their mail we sent them what was the problem at the post office why didn't they get out they they you have they have a right to da you're asking pretty much a rhetorical question for which Paula doesn't have an answer M Mr chair I'm not doing that I'm saying is that if our bills didn't get out just like the tax bills why why would the post office late I don't think that's an unreasonable question to ask I can't answer that I can tell you that I handed them over the counter what happened after that I don't know no but but I'm saying is why can't we ask what happened Dave we can ask but let let's stay focused on this particular customer at this point I think we probably had enough discussion um do someone want to make a um a motion as to whether or not these should uh be waved or not I I I would like let me think about this as I do it I would I would like to make a motion to take care of the interest at hand the current bill that we have and that from this point forward if anybody in that same group were to come forward and ask you know with the same issue that we take care of them is that can I ask can I ask one question go ahead sure if if someone has been delinquent for several bills are we waving all of the interest or are we not waving interest there are some clients that have not paid for two or three Bill Cycles so so no to me that does not qualify it would be you know this this particular customer I believe is is always been prompt and that's correct and and so therefore you know they have to me they have a legitimacy to it um so guess how do we word it that so I guess to let's let's start this again I make a I'll make a motion to take care of the the customer at hand with the interest and anybody who has been current up until this last billing comes forward with interest I I say we also take care of them is that more reasonable yes thank you for the clarification yeah only only if some comes forward now you're not talking about retroactive no no forward let let's say let's say let's put a time frame on anybody that comes forward in the next seven days okay we will and it has been current we will we will take care of that interest Mr chair as I said a minute ago we take care of the people who had this problem if if uh the Water uh cow wash had the problem what whoever people were in that period they get a waiver that's the way I I just say go back to the beginning this is getting to a point where it's a joke I would just say fix the people was it a mail po a mail problem I still don't know but just fix the problem that the car wash is in how many people would that be Paul I have no idea but Dave but what I guess maybe it's maybe it's my hearing I don't know but I'm not sure if you're saying as Mike is you know this customer and anyone one that comes forward from this point forward okay I I that's clear I understand that Dave are you talking about if someone came in and said they didn't want to pay the interest and they were told they had to do you do you want that fixed what was the circumstances for the car wash they came in and B was lost in the mail sorry was that Mike their bill was lost in the mail okay so all the people's bills that were lost in the mail should get a away that's what I'm saying I don't know how to do that quite frankly some people called some people did not you're talking about months of work to try to go back and try Paula Paula Paula if they call you if it's in the last billing cycle that's it it doesn't go you have to go back to that if the post office lost our mail then they should get away if they get their bill late the same thing we're doing with one you can't do it for one or not the other well I think that's what Mike's motion is but not to necessarily look it's just people that are coming forward to ask for the interest to be waved and that and I would do that without coming to the board that's that's would be your decision to make and that's fine but if it's over $15 the board will have to sign it and I can send that out via docy sign my issue is to try to go backwards I don't want to go backwards if you want to go forward forwards that we can do of course you're going to go forward I I think you're kind of blowing this up a little bit take the take the problem that we have right now and that's the late billing because of the mail those people would get a credit it's as easy as that I don't know why you're thinking you're going back and making all this work it's not it's not as easy wait a minute it's not as easy as that I don't I don't have a list of everybody who got their bill late I have I don't have a crystal ball to know whether people got their bill or not thought I thought you said that you had a certain area that you know for a fact that was late is that not true I said that I put together a map of the people that called but I don't have any idea of if there were other areas and people just paid it I I don't know I people don't come to my office to pay bills they go to the treasurer's office I can't I sent I brought many boxes of mail to the post office I handed it to the person behind the counter they took it unfortunately for whatever reason some people didn't ever get the delivery I I don't know who didn't I don't know who did like I said I think I made myself clear so I'm done with I mean I mean if if I can just interject I I think that's why this motion because we really don't have an answer to to you know we know the interest but we don't know whether it's a it's a situation where we didn't get it or they did get it so by putting it in this structure of saying take care of the one at hand and giving a 7-Day notice that for the next seven days you know business days however we want to word it that we will anybody that reaches out to us from that point forward we'll we'll take care of and I I I just have a feeling it's going to be a small small number not a big number and I think it's the right thing to do I mean if someone comes to you with a $300 interest fee I would say well you got to pay that we're talking this last cycle is that correct Paula they have to be current in my opinion they've have to have been current in the past and they come to us and obviously at that point you know that you know they've always been a prompt payer there's there's not an issue they just had this get caught up in this one and it's given the opportunity all right so we have a motion second there we go any further discussion I guess the only thing I'd like to see cleared up is Mike you said uh seven days whether they're business days or not we just need to be specific about that then then seven days seven days from you know to from now till till next Tuesday whatever that date might be if if they if reach out I would ask that you I would ask that you extend that time I was going to tell you this at the end of the meeting but I'm going out for surgery on Friday so I will not be in the office for two weeks okay does does our assistant know what's going on yourist she does not know how to do this IM mun she would have they would have to wait until I got back well well that's that's perfectly fine to deal with that but I think I think that we I'm not expecting the phone to all of a sudden start ringing the hook tomorrow I guess is what I'm saying so if they could just make notations of it and let them know you know it might take a couple weeks for it to take effect that's all or three weeks or it'll show up in your next month's billing however we do it but just to keep it so don't start getting too out and then then then when you when you you recover or your back follow then then we could deal with it like I said I'm not personally I'm not expecting you know I I guess I'd be surprised if there's over four or five I think I think a lot of them are talking a small interest charge and that's it so okay so again we we have this motion on the table yeah and I believe it was clarified to be um for those that come in within the next seven days right and have been Cent okay right so is everyone clear on that any further discussion see none I'll take a roll call vote here Mike Mackin hi Mike hi Bill sorry Bill um BR Ramon hi Dave McDonald sustain is that an ie no abstain obain okay and actually it's a no for me so a majority of eyes so it passes okay you got all this okay um visits maner report I don't really have a sewer system update um other than we had another major clog at lemonster Road um but I didn't receive Robert's um Regular report so when I get that I will send it out and that just so you all know that's clog number 21 SE since September 22 22 okay 22 um go ahead Paula budget status I don't have a lot to say other than um our receipts are down um and you know hopefully we will get out more um I do want to talk about um the vote that just occurred I had planned on sending out bills tomorrow however if we're going to allow people seven days to come forward bills will have to wait until I come back because I don't want to send a bill that I'm now going to have to uh change so I will it will have they will have to wait okay everyone understand that okay go ahead Paula um town meeting articles uh I will not be able to attend town meeting as because of my surgery um so someone will need to be present to read the articles you're you're off going right yes I won't be going mik you you usually go right I'm sorry I couldn't hear you I was muted actually I have a commitment Saturday so okay uh Dave are you gonna be there yeah but I won't be reading the SE article yeah okay I I plan to be there also so I wave to yeah okay Paul um um on the town meeting articles I sent out a draft presentation um Heather had asked for three slides relative to the the sewer budget um I work with John to put together something which I mailed out this afternoon um I don't know if there's any concerns about that or any requests or changes prior to it being sent to Heather Mr chair do we know what's in the consent Paul do you know what's in the consent agreement the opab and uh the opab will be in the consent calendar but but not the motion for our sewer budget do you have the presentation you're putting up at the town meeting available to we can see yeah I sent it out I sent it out today but I can put it up Mr chair do you want to review that or just look at it Paul if you could put up we can take a quick look at it I mean two two slides are you know one one is revenue one's expenses the other one is just some wording around it hold on I'm just getting it sure doesn't does not mention the 16% increase it mentions a $12.3 per month increase yes I like that by the way I like that wording know why I can't get out this okay I'm sharing okay there you see the three um I talked to Paula today about the possibility of putting a picture of a clogged pump um I do like that also what's that I I like that also the picture yeah it goes a thousand yeah it's nice disgusting gets a point across yeah though what what we see there hanging from the pump is uh disposables anyway we should have a pretty good audience so it' be you know another good way to get the information out you ready to move to the next one sure yeah go ahead this just outlines the revenues the next one is just the expenditures and that's it yeah questions regarding that or any suggestions none okay go ahead and send that to Heather Paula okay uh possible grant funding we already talked about yeah demands I will not be sending they are still not working and given the vote that just took heard I don't think it's appropriate to send demands because I don't know who PE what people didn't receive their bills um and they don't work as of right now um as of today um the Q4 billing I like I said I had planned to do tomorrow but I will hold off until I come back um I'm just concerned that if we wait on the billing that it will push our revenues out um we need to have our re revenues in before May 30th and we have to give 30 days for payment so you'll be gone at least two weeks right so it's um I'm hoping that I can come back before two weeks but potentially the doctor said two weeks I I know what you're hoping Pap but yeah um okay so we'll be right at the end of the fiscal year yep and the last item she has here is munice issues um you know you you've all heard about the munice issues but I I honestly don't think you can appreciate the the day in and day out issues that Paula is having with Unice it it has become uh overwhelming and extremely timec consuming and um I just I don't understand how a product like this could have been released John if you want to just let them know that you are requesting a meeting with the Selectmen and you'll be going over this issue as well as the the Public Presentation right I'm probably foolish here Paul but I'm hoping it will be resolved by that frankly whether it's frankly whether it's resolved or not we the sewer Enterprise fund has lost Revenue because of oh absolutely I I'm not I didn't mean to imply that um it shouldn't be done if it's resolved no it you know the last time we talked about how many hours it was over 500 hours and it's been a while so you know I know it's a lot more that you've had to dedicate to this so um not not to slow us down but just to give just so from my understanding how was the that uh system adopted by the town was it that was a a publicly bid product or was it something enforced on us by the state we had we had munus um prior and we had a version 11 and because um they were no longer going to support it they we were we were required to upgrade um and so that occurred um and it's been a disaster ever since uh the upgrade has been a nightmare the tax billing was a nightmare um our sewer bills you know have been extremely difficult um and we were not able to send demands in Q2 and we will not be able to send demands in Q3 which is probably a loss of about $8,000 um for the sewer Enterprise fund and I don't see an end in sight right now and and so I imagine that the the town end is also facing the same kind of difficulties when they're when they're dealing through the system they were um I know the tax Billings were extremely difficult I know that the town accountant is very frustrated with several issues I know there have been issues with the pay stubs um but I I really can't give an overview of other departments it's really what I deal with sure I'm just saying it's not not isolated to us no thank you okay um all business um so so I left I left had to well I dropped out of the meeting towards the end of the reboot discussion and um I but I did watch the meeting and seemed like the general consensus was that the $2,000 would go uh be a good start and that we would uh visit the issue at the end of April and here we are at the end of April and they did come in with the $22,000 but that's that's it um they're still way behind in their agreement and they haven't provided Paula unless unless you spoke to them today Paula they haven't I did not okay and Paula has sent them a couple additional emails so we're really back at the same situation uh they're way behind um they're going to be on the select board's agenda on May 21st and the select board is looking for us to offer our opinion about whether their liquid license should be renewed or not so that's where we are I just like to say I think that I mean that last meeting they know that they know what our recommendation is going to be I you know our recommend it's it's in their best interest to deal with this if not our recommendation has to be do not renew the license it just we have no choice so and but they but we made that very very clear and we've been working with them the whole way so that's my opinion okay Mr chair question for you is there a uh interest charge if they miss a payment was that in the contract Paula no no so what's the deadline for them to pay in full in the contract they were supposed to be paid in full by the end of May what's the date um I'd have to look I think it was I think it was the 28th I think I I think it was May 28th as well so as far as I'm concern Mr chair the 28th comes they didn't pay in F per the agreement then we go to select board and say pull the license it's really that easy they're meaning just an FYI we can ask them to move it but their meeting with the selectman is on May 21st so our deadline to be caught off is after the select board meeting that makes no sense when we set up the contract when we set up the contract we weren't aware of the selectman's deadline go ahead Mike go ahead Mike the hearing date is there a time frame for the hearing date that they have to I'm sorry Mike I'm sorry I can't hear I didn't hear what you asked Mike okay Paul um is the uh border of selectman acting has the uh licensing uh agent required to do it on a particular date within a particular time frame or is it possible to have a meeting moved um I I don't know that I know that um Heather Heather had sent us a copy of the letter that went out to them saying they would the select board would revisit around May 21st I can I can check with her tomorrow and see if they can move it to the first meeting in June that would make the most sense because then you know it's very clear whether they're they're in or they're out I mean technically right now they're in breach of contract but I but we don't have any kind of a clause to penalize them if they're not paying but we did say to him I'm not mistaken Paula that they got to be paid in for all tback fees by the 28th of May is that correct yes but I also I'm going to just see if I can pull it up real quick on one second no um Mr chair I don't think that will stop the the select board from voting on the 23rd saying that they're going to pull their license if it's not paid by the 28th but that's something you guys can ask um Town manager that's true as well and they've done that already this past year with some other businesses wave the deadline makes sense we this is cutting it very very close we do have one more meeting I believe um I'm curious why they aren't on this meeting with us right now I am too were they invited they they were made aware of the meeting and that they were on the agenda okay I would just like to say I think they're very very aware of the circumstances I I I I know they know it's not going to go away I guarantee they they know everything coming so whatever their move is going to be it's going to be but you know we just have to go forward with how this is going to go simple and easy in my opinion anyways so I just looked I just looked at the agreement and Dave is right there isn't anything um as far as um penalties if they don't comply other than that they have to pay um by the 28th it it did require the payment $600 weekly which they have not adhered to um but other than that uh daav is right but I I think the big penalty here is that license correct that's big yeah but uh Mike Mack did bring up a good point can you know can can the select board move this meeting out or is there a particular time frame when this hearing has to happen so um Paula can you check with the town manager yes I can I I will do that tomorrow okay I might say I don't see any harm doing at the 21st because the end results are the same the the Selectmen I believe are going to say the exact thing we're saying right now that if that's not paid by the 28th that's it that's the deadline the deadline's deadline f as well yeah the deadline's a deadline whatever whatever works out Pastor if anything if anything my honest opinion I'm not sure the exact date in June that is but it would buy more time and this would give them time to react on the on the day that we said so if I understand you correctly you're saying that we should recommend to the select or to revoke their license on the 21st if they haven't paid not if nothing yes then they and they know that we made that very clear that if it's wasn't paid in full that this was the results and they knew it they understood they we weren't you know we weren't vindictive or anything they they were very understanding on it and they know exactly you know Unfortunately they have other stuff going on that that that they have to deal with so I in my opinion this can't change if we leave the meetings the same I thought what we were recommending as an alternative for the for the uh select board is that if they had not paid in full by the 28th their license would be revoked that on the 28th correct okay we're we're in agreement right yeah yeah and there's no reason why you know meeting on the 21st they just can't you know and with them there which you know hopefully they would be there um it can be made clear at that point that yes this is it and they know they their business their business people they understand understand how what's happening yeah they if they wanted to keep their license they should have been I mean if that was my business and I wanted to keep it going I would be knocking on the owner's door in person saying listen we you know you need to talk to the Sewer Commission you need to you know this is what our lease says this is the situation this is our debate was late it has to be addressed and they didn't do that $66,000 all right um so do we need to take a vote on this tonight or are we just I don't think so I would say not okay taking any action right you sure about that Mr chair because Paul was going away I mean I I would take a vote on it well we'll we'll know if they pay cill I mean as far as the uh the action we're going to take not if they pay or not well I I need to get something to Heather before the 21st so based on what I'm hearing is to reiterate the terms of the agreement that the payment would had the account had to be paid in full by May 28th and the commission would would request that in the event that the account is not clear that they um revoke this the lior license right that's I think that's what I'm hearing correct that was my understanding as of the I expect I'll probably be going to the hearing on the 21st so any other discussion on this none okay any public comment none okay um well we have the town meeting coming up on the 4th we have a meeting on the 14th a regular meeting on the 28th and one on June 11th Mr chair it's unlikely that I will be at the meeting on the 14th right don't take this the wrong way Paula but I I I hope you're not okay oh thank you um you have to take care of yourself all right so I I guess that leads uh anyone wants to make a uh motion to adjourn I I would just like I would just like to comment first um I would just like to say Paula uh best of luck thank you thank you I would have I would like to add to that comment and say it I hope everything goes very well and that you recover incredibly quickly thank you take care that goes for all of us Paul up Paula how long you out for um I believe two weeks you need chicken Sou let us know we'll bring chicken soup too okay thanks Dave I'll bring alcohol see there's a I will probably be able to use them you're not staying in the hospital are you you're gonna be home no I'm gonna be home so why can't you do this stuff from your house because I won't be able to talk because I will not be able to talk and I'm going to be in a lot of pain yeah our love is with you so thank you um I mentioned that I I knew someone who had that do the surgeon that you have and um they were as you very very very pleased with him yeah he's he's a great doctor I just I just wanted to remember to tell you that well thank you okay uh Mike n you usually make the motion to close sure I will make the motion Tuesday April 30th at 8:27 to adjourn this meeting and good night lunenberg second any further discussion seeing none let's take a vote here uh Mike Mackin hi Mike n hi Dave hi and I for myself meeting is adjourned hey Mike can I give you a call Mike Mackin can I give you a call I got something else to talk to you about okay good night everybody good night good night everyone bye bye