back all right calling our Workshop to order this morning good to see everyone this morning oh not yeah pre commission work uh good to see everyone this morning uh had a very extensive conversation last night um so uh the people's Point people do come out when it's an interesting topic uh which has been typical that if we have an interesting topic then there's a large crowd that comes out when it's regular City business and uh usually they we get our standard standard group so I but it was good to see the community come out last night with their pros and cons to express their concerns likes and dislikes you know etc for um the potential development of Marina Island and to also you know just have a good Q&A with uh the designer and the developer um for Marina Island so that was uh that was good so um so thank you all for being here for that last night and um and being able to ask you know the the needed questions that needed to be answer that we could we could jump into that um before getting into our standard agenda for commission meeting look at our CRA agenda um of course public commentary uh we get the director's report and really new businesses uh discussion and possible approval to select the lowest qualified bidder BCL contractors for the sidewalk project for 270 um any questions for Mr Yan about that so I noticed that uh that it went over I think it was higher than what we budgeted for that is cor corre and so how much more did it go over than what we budgeted for $90,000 we have 185 budgeted $85,000 okay so I guess my question oh yeah it does say here it was budget for 185 so I guess my question is it is it worth the risk to put it back out to bid oh God no or you think it'd be more expensive yes okay only one ask on that I think typically what I've seen um and of course they have more historical knowledge of it anytime I've seen us put a project out to rebid the price goes up and our scope goes down yeah that's that that's what I've seen is any you know cuz in part I mean you're looking at another 3 to 6 months of actually getting that project back um and so whatever's happening in the you know in the industry or the economy also you know could affect that as well yeah I don't see prices going down so yeah so you know every time we put out something to rebid um you know prices go up and uh and we usually have to scale back to fit within that scope of that of that price so um we usually never get what we want not that we haven't rebid it or not that we shouldn't Reb it but to think that it's going to be less the only thing that's less is going to be the amount of work that we get done yeah for that particular project has been the trend that I've seen so do we know what that's if we're going to have to cut anything from the C from what Mr jeni told us we had like plenty of money we needed to spend so oh yeah that's what I remember the last time we met about the budget like well I need some sidewalks by my house no that's that's a ho kind of thing so you c yeah there you go well we just need to change the CRA then Mr Jen if you respond to the to that yes yes um so we have um several $1,000 in the current budget allocated for Salk projects so um some of the projects there are currently we're we're getting some engineering plans done um and we also have some um some money set aside to to actually do the construction on those sidewalks where we're doing the engineering right now my recommendation would be to go ahead and get this project done and use the funds that we have allocated for sidewalks on this project and then at at some point I just need to shopen my pencil and and see how much money is left in the in the sidewalk budget and how much how much work is left and and how how can we maneu how many projects can we get completed um without changing the overall budget so we might just have to descope a little bit correct or mid year I I may come back and say here this is the remaining work that that we have that I have on my list in in regards to sidewalk projects and if you want to complete all of this this year I need two3 $400,000 more are you willing to to increase the budget so that we can get this repeted or do you want to wait until next year okay those are the two options that I can see okay thank you all right any other questions on the CRA no yes sir all right that's going to be at 8:00 on be 8 or 8:30 on Tuesday no 10 it says 10: a.m. do you want us to put it before we can we can do that all right so we're going to have commission at 9 9 and then do this at 10 yes sir okay all right now if we don't finish commission at 9: at 10: then we just push this back then yes okay all right and then all right on to our regular agenda looking at our consent agenda have approval for regular meting minutes approval of the residential and Senate program application for 902 Lan Avenue and approval of proposed changes to previously approved amendment number one agreement um any questions about those I had a question about the warrant list all right what's quill and Powell they are the ones that did our gy oh okay and I guess in in that regard in that line of questioning um how much longer do we foresee I guess still paying for projects down the road or completed projects I should say it's just hard hard to say the next year two years I would probably say the next two years okay because we still have money in the FEMA budget and as you guys know it's not easy getting money from FEMA in terms of the money's there but you definitely have to jump through Loops to get it and so really a lot of the hold up of our projects is is waiting for their funding where waiting for them to say yes you can go on and and start this project and then getting the reimbursements so I'm really hoping that within the next two years we have wrapped up everything tetr is gone and we're finished okay we recently got reimbursements from FEMA in that email that was sent out it referenced some money FEMA from your email no it's anytime that there's money allocated from the 101 account which is our um storm recovery account you'll say something like you know this amount of money was taken out of the storm recovery account or this amount of money is um for the rebuild the FEMA projects I I I know what you're referring to okay yeah so I'm not crazy no no it just he just he's telling you this amount of money is not coming out of the general fund but out of the restoration account okay so for number 10 that's none of that's coming out of the city budget that's just extra grant money right oh that's a grant yes okay yes sorry he was saying number 10 I had to look look number number 10 yeah okay number 10 this is about the um the vulnerability assess study uh if you recall we had an amendment done um a couple of months ago where they increased um the the grant amount from 165 to 235 or 175 to 235 all that was done and then a few months later D comes back and says oh by the way Lin Haven um the amendment that you just approve we want to add another document to it just so this is really a I would call it a housekeeping item uh it's it's a document that they call it tetman J um that the the the vendor that they're hiring um has to certify that they don't hire any illegal employees okay so if you add a document like this to an amendment I have to take it back to the city Commission because it's a substantial change to the amendment it's not just a you know an error in in a date or in a number with so and that's a reason why we had to take it put it back on the agenda so it's all being the all the extra money is being paid by grant money correct correct yes cool because DP is adding some additional requirements that's correct yes DP added a form to the amendment and they thought we could just sign off on it and but we can't we have to get the approval from the city commissioner office how nice of them okay all right uh Mr jeny wrot for number 11 number 12 uh any questions about number 11 and number 12 yeah can I'm just trying to understand is that just moving funds around it sounds like this Ben to yes oh yes that's correct um so items number 11 and 12 are uh in regards to the um the improvements on Florida and Ohio Avenue we did received a grant from the Department of Commerce uh under the cdbt hrp hometown revitalization program um some $4.3 million to make these improvements some two and a half years ago when we submitted the application we had to give them a cost estimate saying it will cost x amount of dollars for the administration of the brand it will we will spend x amount of dollars for the design and the permitting of this project and we will spend x amount of dollars for the construction so we identified the U the main consultant Florida Architects that will do all the plans the the engineering for us on this project they reached out to their sub contractors in terms of cost estimate H how much the design will cost for this project originally when we submitted the application um to the Department of Commerce the Grant application we estimated um soft cost to be $75,000 when Florida and so Florida Architects came back and said here our cost estimate is $375,000 so we asked to change the the the grant allocations under these these three different items so that we can cover the cost for the design and Engineering of this project so that's not costing the city any money not costing the city any money we're just shifting money essentially from the construction budget to the design budget okay because we need to get the design done first before we can even think about construction okay that's what I thought thank you yes and what is the project it's um the it's the we call it the Florida and Ohio Avenue improvements M and that those are improvements to the the streetcape and also the the street lighting um along around Roberts Hall um and then also here on Ohio Avenue right in front of us okay thank you all right any other questions about number 11 and number 12 no yes sir all right uh any other questions or concerns that we need to express before Journey for today uh I do last night the designer was represented by the lady and then the developer was Andy and his associates okay now the designer developed also Seaside and Alice Beach andary and rosemary but who was the developer I mean that plays a big part you know I think the designer can present all this lovely stuff but it's the developer and the builders that really follow through and the staff will probably know more I think Andy was one of the developers of Seaside he was he one of the developers of Seaside I think so um so what what has Andy developed or what has that group developed um land um I think Andy had years ago something to do with what that development7 L Lake M do that and some things in other I think his address is seide I looked him up a few years ago I think surf Surf Side yeah that's what it is yeah okay I was just I was just curious and if you don't mind if I add to that I I'll be honest with you I I wasn't happy last night I don't know anybody can pick up on that but oh really yeah I didn't notice did you tell noce I mean it's pretty normal so well I I think the thing that that kind of upset me was like you know two years ago when they came presented it I I expressed my concern with with the industrial park they had two different plans and I like that they had two different plans so that we can kind of pick and choose and they just totally disregarded it and they said that the question came up as far as have they started talking with the business owners there and they said yes and I know I've talked to the business owners there and they're not in favor of this at all correct so I was like well okay so I brought it up the business owners aren't happy about it and I I brought it up about you know Chris hin had bought that one property and I wanted to discuss it with him and they said they would get back with me and give me the history on it and that and they never did and so I just feel like they kind of disregarded that whole thing and just decide to do their own thing on that part now with the Chris hin part I don't know if he didn't get back with you because we weren't supposed to have any contact with the developer I think which well they said they were going to give me the history on it okay cuz I wanted the history of cuz he he bought it in 2005 from the airport Authority normally when you buy from the airport Authority they want you to do something with it with a certain amount of time right and I'm like heck that's what 18 19 years ago yeah so yeah so that's kind of how I felt about it you know I think one of the things is we're in the beginning stages of this planning and development there are going to be lots of meetings there are going to be lots of disagreements um and concessions um and so we're early in on it I know that Ben and I both keep in contact with the owners um industrial part at some point there will be a meeting with the with the owners and Marina Island um and so I think it's a process and we are always going to work for the good of our city and of our residents and I think you with that in mind it'll I feel like it'll all work out and for their good then the vendors there all right any other questions concern I'm not opposed to the project the marina Island project it was just my concern was she would displayed such a flowy and beautiful presentation when the developer actually has not had experience of developing Rosemary in Alice Beach and that's a ton of money yeah yeah but she was doing job yeah she so she works for dpz that's dpz are the company who did the design for Rosemary Seaside um and Alice uh dpz are a very expensive very uh they're they're the best in America and um and you know the owner or the the owner teaches at the University of Miami Andre dwani he's got he's known worldwide so um the fact that they went to dpz and paid them the money to develop a master plan is huge and it I can hardly believe that Lin Haven whether it happens or not has has got this far has this kind of opportunity how however when it comes to the developers um Andy is not the one who's going to get out there and build it Andy is the one who brings in the investors and the investors are the ones who will develop it so there's the plan but then the actual building of it it's kind of been coordinated by Andy Chris has a lot of the property Chris owns the property Chris has owned the property before Andy ever had anything to do with it it's Chris's dream um he has the money his family has money but he doesn't have enough money to actually build his dream and so they are getting investors in who have experience in building in gosh California New York Miami Israel you know other Big C Tel Aviv big cities who do have experience of building those kinds of things because Andy and Chris certainly don't and Chris's last name is what hi n e okay that was when you heard Mr Walker referring to Blue something blue blue water blue Waters that was that's Chris H's company okay so that's why he was making a historical reference to that company correct okay and when M um Walker spoke she referred to some other land she said that there was only two land areas that could be developed in Lin Haven what was she do you remember her saying that about some 950 or something what was 950 I didn't understand that either we up north south yeah she might have been referring to mil Bou because that used to be 950 Acres um but the concern um when she was bringing up those Town Homes um that they had brought to the commission a few years ago they had bought up a couple of parcels a few Parcels uh not on the islands that are before you go onto the islands on the leftand side and um they wanted back then their plans have kind of had they've changed I think you know as the situation and the investors have changed um but initially they were thinking that maybe a good idea to get thing and I think it was the investors at that time who wanted this was to to be able to build some uh town homes on that piece of land but it had a low density residential land use and so en to be able to do that they had to change the land use so what they actually brought to the commission was a future land use map Amendment asking to change the land use there from leny residential to mixed juuse I think it was they asked for um and that didn't at the first uh reading of the ordinance um they voted against it um and so you know obviously they have to change the L use to be able to do something like that and so it just fell flat in the water it didn't even get to development order stage thank you okay I know I have another question sorry we're here I have a big cup of hot chocolate so I'm okay oh she she got me some Coffey so look out sorry on the for last night we didn't stay long enough so no 8:30 wasn't long enough no okay the um it was a good meeting the section about conducting the meeting okay um do you think it's strong enough I mean went from not allowing I mean in our discussion not allowing people from out of the city to speak to essentially we made no changes essentially we that's kind of what I'm saying right so are we going to be happy with that I know it says no disruptive behavior uh but doesn't Roberts Rules of Order say something about you can't make um um something about negative remarks about derogatory remarks and yeah and I was just wondering if we might need to include that or just throwing it out there get a little be a little bit stronger Kevin's on the line yeah and and I talked to the mayor about it after the last meeting and I'm going to basically redo the the ordinance and incorporate the stuff we talked about at the workshops oh okay so yeah I think there was you know maybe some language about not having like commercial speech you we don't want people up there selling stuff we'll kind of just just update it some work that ordinance s back to yall I can tell you that I don't know if you guys remember you probably I don't think you were on here either one of you on here yet but we had extensive discussion on this at a pre-commission meeting about this and uh you know I I I did quite a bit of research on that and and the part about disruptive behavior and things you can't do and making noise and all that that that is almost word for word from a Supreme Court case that I read and uh yeah it's it's it's pretty close so they saying that's allowed basically yeah I would say of course we have been doing it since you all have come on whenever we all came in U of course commissioner per was already here whenever commissioner work and I came on a couple of years ago we made some adaptations to our agenda and then we reiterated you know these rules reiterated that uh that hey no disruptive behavior and such and then we actually printed them out it was like a cover sheet for the agenda saying these are the rules for the meeting um in sense because basically everyone is adapted to that that's why we basically once you all came we stopped printing out that cover sheet with the rules on it because basically everyone had had became acclimated to these are the rules that we're not going to allow disruptive behavior like for example last night we heard you heard the guy say hey I can't here hey no we're not going to do that just cuz I don't want it to be where we just start having audience responses you know when there's disagreement or something like that although what he said wasn't wrong I don't want that to even started yet you know um yeah you know we got 50 people in here 100 people so I don't want a popcorn effect happening right um because for example like you was seeing the Facebook page if that if those individuals were here with those have been statements that were outv you know while they're here so uh and it was a big agreement on on on the manner in which we do the quum you know it's like before yall came on there was dis there was people were upset that we were censoring when you even had the public commentary or not censoring when we moved to public commentary people were saying we were violating our freedom of speech for that um because hey public commentary is here we're going to respond here so essentially no matter what we do or what we change there's going to be a complaint so if we start instituting the um signing sheet there's going to be a complaint so I mean there like no matter what we do um cuz we haven't restricted anyone's freedom of speech we haven't restricted anyone from speaking or doing any of that we just moved public commentary up so that there could be some response to people's questions because what I noticed when I first start when I was coming to the meetings is that the public commentary was after the reports however there was no response from the commission um because I guess you know at that time uh mayor protim Russell didn't want a bantering of back and forth possibly cuz things were still I mean people still asking questions about Federal cases and all that kind of stuff so there just wasn't a response you know back and forth so I said okay let's move public commentary up to genda item number three so that as people ask their questions then as we give our reports as you hear city manager and sometimes myself and and maybe she'll ask another staff member to actually be able to give a response to whatever questions you're asking um at that time but there was a big stink about moving it to number three saying that we're violating their freedom of speech and so for two or three months that's what we heard every meeting was you're violating our freedom of speech viting my freedom of speech you're telling us we can't no your public commentary is here we're not we had that's the only thing we changed it was literally moving public commentary to number three because we did see the and city manager Kevin and I went through that actual ordinance and at that time I opted not to reinforce some of the things that we could already do per our own ordinance like the sign and sheet and such because I didn't want people to feel like at that time we were restricting you know what they're trying to do uh because hey what we saw with the signing sheet was everything was done a day prior to okay so if we telling you got to turn it in by Monday 5:00 you don't do it you show up with a genuine concern and that we don't allow you to speak then hey have you taken off your job have you done something to come out and you can't speak at the time I'm not opposing the signning sheet just give you some background on why certain things we didn't reinforce um initially in some of the response and feedb that we got from it uh but we did certainly draw out the disruptive behavior and and such um so that people could um could see and know that okay hey we do have rules you know and these and these are the rules but Kevin and I did we um as I mentioned you know picked up the notes from uh from our previous meetings um from from Sicilia and so basically trying to hear the consensus of everyone um and then sort of updating that and then bringing that back for further discussion not bringing it back to hey we're going to vote on this today but hey we've updated it put maybe a little stronger language unit and then hey here's some consensus there um among us to see if if now that we see that it's revised are there some other things that we might want to adapt or that we might you know want to uh want to change CU him and I even discuss say for example like last night's meeting of course it was a workshop um but there's also something you know want the Institute a r to saying okay hey you can CU some of the rules we can do we don't have to necessarily put on paper but if we put it on paper will it justify so if we have a room of 200 people um um per Chairman's rules you can actually change it from three minutes to two minutes um but is that something that we actually want to put on paper not that I'm just readying to change two minutes but again we have a room of 200 people that want to speak about this par a particular issue do we want to adjust the time from three minutes or two minutes I don't have to have that on paper to take Liberty to do that but it's those kind of things that say do we want to put that on paper um to know that hey it is in our rules not just necessarily for me but for the future uh chairperson of the meetings to to be able to do those kind of things so those some of the other things um for us to you know to review um and consider not necessarily just that particular point but other points um that go to going into the meeting because my biggest concern with the meeting is the coral you know is making sure that we do have the Quorum that the meeting is orderly um because I will tell you it was embarrassing running from mayor and then becoming mayor and people literally laughing about our meetings yeah you know I'm going around getting money and campaigning people were literally tuning in to laugh about our meting like that was their you know their joke hey we'll get popcorn for lin Haven meeting right I mean so that that so for me one of the things was okay no we're not going to we're not going to continue to have that we're going to be a very you know we're going to have a very decord meeting um not that we stop people from speaking but we're going to be very orderly and and streamline how we run our meetings and now people tune in and appreciate that um because now it isn't and I don't I'm not saying what the meetings were before I'm just saying that's that was the feedback and the response that I was getting from you know individuals you know in the in the community um citizens and Beyond about how our meetings were conducted over the past few years so that's one of the things that we didn't want L Haven to continue to be a laughing stock about that um and and having some you know some other cities are helping us you know get that off of us so you know hey but um but you know didn't want to be the laughing talk about that so so that's the the primary purpose of how we structure the meeting is that we might have the quum in order and even last night before we have a workshop I meet with city manager City attorney we talk about how we going to organize this Workshop so it just doesn't happen so last night that's why when we open up the meeting even if we don't have an agenda hey this is how this Workshop is going to go this is how it's going to flow that way everybody knows and there's order and direction to what we're doing um and for the most part people comply with with that um and fall in line with it and then I think because of the order and structure last night's meeting went very well although we said hey typically and and what happens is we reinstitute new rules that are different than what people have done before then there's a little push back but they comply typically in workshops there may there may not have been uh a monitoring on time typically but we have 50 people here yeah so we can't just let 50 people talk well I mean we could but do we want to as chairman no we don't need to let 50 people talk for 10 minutes at a time right let's let's have some restriction because they're still going to be here after the meeting which they did so city manager I still stay it's 8:30 last night um allowing citizens to engage with the developers and such to have whatever conversation stuff they wanted to have and the meeting ended at 7:15 so there was still another hour and 15 minutes that we did stay post so that people could engage and talk and and Etc so certainly it's not trying to restrict what people do or they're free fre but it is actually trying to maintain the chorum in order um because as I mentioned you go to other like I went to the capit a couple of weeks ago you're not going in there with um and disrupting anything you know like cell phones have to be on silent cell phones have to be off um there is no I'm sitting there and they're talking about our agenda item for um for the budget I couldn't get up and say hey let me come up and say something about that and I mean you've been to some of those committee meetings as well you just don't get up and say hey let me come up and talk about that so at times it does bother me not to an extent that I'm concerned about it that when people say we're violating their freedom of speech because it is very restrictive in other government settings so it isn't this freedom of speech that you're going to go say what you want to say in other areas and other places especially as you go higher up in the U the order of government it's certainly not that so just want to give you a little background of what has happened over the past over the past two years but now you don't hear people come up and complain about public commentary being number three but for the first three months 6 months six months that was a complaint you're violating our freedom of speech I mean and they would go get you know supreme court issues and all that stuff and and all of that I think uh well multiple things I had on my mind I'm trying to remember all of them but um the big thing is people is it's a limited public forum you can't just go up there and say anything so if you go up there and start saying anything that has nothing to do with City business you can't can't do do that you know and uh so there's three things that's required date time and Manner and whatever we do it has to be neutral it has to be you know fair and the same to everyone you know you can't just favor one side and not the other you know and so is it restrictive it is restrictive and I think when people hear that they're like oh you're violating their First Amendment right it's like it's a limited public forum and uh I think a lot of people don't know what the actual first amendment is yeah they just assume it means you can do whatever you want and it's not true right but even in unlimited forums I wouldn't be unlimited wherever like if you go out here in public you can do almost anything but there are still restrictions you you can't do and get arrested for you know right and you know of course we want people to speak I think that's the big important message we need to send out we want you to speak but we want it to be orderly and and and that and be respectful and all that so I I didn't like it when one of the individuals stood up there and pointed and said you're a liar yeah yeah you know let's yeah yeah we got that for a few years I I'd like for Ricky to just slap some handcuffs on them yeah hum yeah excuse me the chief and and that is the challenging part the the line that we tell to okay so for example um we had someone come up cuz I've asked and said hey let's not talk about the federal court case doing our commission meetings number one that has nothing to do with us two any responses from us is taking on record right and so that's why we haven't talked about those things because whatever you say about it publicly now these attorneys go back and get that stuff and then they can go and you know and utilize that so um so an individual came up start making again comments towards you know city manager about these things stop that individual from speaking I told P we not doing that individual claim I was violating their their rights did a called to order uh Chief Ry removed that individual I got an Ethics commission uh violation for that I read it yeah so they they went to the ethics commit so I've been you know in the ethics commission for enforcing our limited you know comments you know enforcing the rules that we've set in place uh so saying that to say that yeah people aren't going to be happy uh and don't understand that hey these are the things that we're setting in place that when you violate these things and this is how we're going to enforce this um the ethics commission basically said that no he didn't violate any he didn't violate your freedom of speech didn't use his position as abusive power and all that kind of stuff but it was just a you know like really um so so that those are the things that do happen behind behind the scenes right so um so then when I go to tallah and see hey you're you're that guy from L Haven yeah that's me but actually the aex commission's job not whether to determine whether you violated someone's First Amendment rights it's whether you gained something if you did that yeah and that was the and that's what ethics commission basically said that my what my actions did not give me any gain by stopping that person from from speaking but just saying that hey that's that's the extent that people will go in things that they will do um just for us trying to maintain the corro and for telling someone hey stop the slander stop addressing these particular issues during our our commission meetings that you know that's how people feel and I didn't like it when that lady was questioning us have you read no have you have you talked to anybody about this or that and and she went down you know yeah and it then she got to me and I was going to say it was none of her well I didn't have to say that cuz you stopped her right cuz all comments supposed to be directed towards the chair so okay ideally no one is supposed to come up and ask any one of youall an individual question corre because that's part of the coral you know and and I know sometimes um commissioner perno is not always happy with me in the past that when people do engage like that that I don't want the commission you know talking back and forth but that's an example of it where it can get into if someone would to said well yeah I did or no I didn't it does get into bantering you know back and forth and it's a natural response that if somebody ask you something that you do want to say something but that's an example of you know the decorum that we're trying to maintain that no hey please keep your your comments directed towards the chair or and I don't mind if individually people want to come up and question me and ask me my opinion of something but here we're a group right there's five of us we're really not a person you know we're a commission and so so you know those are just some of the examples of why we do have the rules that we have and you know the order that we try to maintain because 100 meetings may be fine right you know and then you might have two or three where there is an explosive situation of such um with this latest sentencing that happened on yesterday I don't know all the details of it other than what you know WMBB posted um someone may and I'm not talking about any specific person there may be someone come and ask when City going to get their $225,000 or whatever that is right so you know but it's a question that okay hey keep it here and then follow the city manager about that or that that's not necessarily a question so some of those things do spark spark other things um you know at the at the same time so uh but yeah if there are other things that you want to suggest for the the public commentary section just let us know um in said uh in said attorney and I are working on updating that to bring that back to you for further discussion not okay we're voted on this day but for further discussion then if we you know feel satisfied with it um to see how much more teeth do we need to put in it to allow flexibility it's not that just because it's in it that you can that you're going to do these things for example we have the signning sheet you know not that you have to necessarily do these things but it does give you the ability to do those things if you want to I guess one question is with the signin um with the signin sheet I think there was a consensus for all you know for us okay hey let's start doing that um but then there's so many ways to do that right so then that's something you know um you know for us to consider as well and I'll get the city manager on that um look at some of the the different options because I've gone to different places that have done it yeah School Board does it different than the City of Panama City does it than some of the other places do it so it's not just a standard procedure you know on how it's how it's done some have individual sheets some just have you know just a log record um that's then turned in with you know the different topics or whatever um but then at the end there's still opportunity for those who did not sign in to to be able to speak but ideally what happens is if you didn't sign in then you're at you know you're basically at the end and when you think of the signning sheet essentially how it would work is what you saw when we went to the um delegation meeting um um oh yeah that was essentially how the sign in sheet works right we had to sign in previously to the delegation meeting and I said people got sign in previous but basically you sign in hey these are the things you're going to discuss so they already knew what we're going to talk about when we got up there so they weren't like surprised that I came up there and ask for millions and millions and millions of dollars because they already knew that you're going to come up here and ask for millions and millions and millions of dollars um so we tell them hey this is what we like to do this is who's speaking this is is our topic that we like to address and then we're obviously we're called up you know in that in that manner that same you know in that orderly manner so it sort of will work in that similar fashion I know that's the meeting that the majority of us have been to to see how that works um and so basically if you got there late you know there might have been some commentary you know maybe an opportunity at the end but those who had already signed in and filled out were the first ones that were able to you know to be called up because you did already sign in and for those who got to the meeting late that didn't sign in an opportunity still could be given however do note that because it is public commentary if it's an extensive meeting we do reserve the right to say okay hey we just going to move on to you know we're going to finish the sign in sheets and we're going to move on to you know this period here like last night um yes it was open for it was a workshop but there was a time where we said okay hey this is our last person right and now we're moving on to to concluding the meeting um because there is no hey everybody has to speak there's no rule that says that we have to have this prolonged period of time because we can reinforce our own time constraints as well I think 2 hours and 15 minutes was good um you know for a workshop so um I I sounds like we're in agreeance as far as having people sign in but like up at the Florida House and Senate you know one of the things I notic is they have those cards that you fill out right and uh I don't know just a suggestion that might be a good way to go some people might have it pre fill out to hand to somebody be ready to go and like I said before I I think it's good so like if you look at something you're like well that's on the agenda and then you can tell the person you'll have an opportunity to speak at that time because I think that's one of the things that I struggle with is there times people are talking there in public commentary and stuff that they they could talk when we got to that agenda item we had one lady come to the CRA meeting about a about a public commentary I don't know if y'all picked up on that but the last meeting we had it it was actually she came up and spoke doing the CRA time but it was actually a commission I think she thought it was a regular commission right you know and so I didn't stop her so like when people talk about I didn't say hey no this is the wrong meeting like okay I understand you got the meting confused let's hear it and uh and then you know that was good so I think what we can do is take the month of February to announce what we're going to do um and then start instituting the signing sheet in March I don't want us to come Tuesday with a signing sheet ORS or however do that um and so once we determine I would say once we determine how we're going to do it um look at the different options you know taking in your recommendation are there any other recommendations so we we see the card option as a recommendation um any other recommendations for sign in I think the sign in should not or it should be you know like available up till like 10 15 minutes before the meeting okay rather than day before just in case someone something comes up you know because our agenda comes out on Thursday so some people might not read it till Monday okay or something well at the school board meeting and you can come up any time for you know the secretary is sitting over on the side and people come up all during the meeting and yeah not do that yeah as long as you're it's as long as you're during the public during theary SE I think you know I've done this I think we did in cway we don't do it right now but several years ago you know like a card or a little slip of paper and it just your name and you know what agenda item or you know just general public commentary I you just have that and way the mayor would know okay this one's talking about number eight this one's talking about number six this one's here for public commentary and they just put them in order but you as long as you're there in time while the meeting's going on you can bu up a s of paper slide it to I say down well one good thing about if they sign in you know you'll notice that some people when they come up my my name and I live it either my hearing is going bad or they Mumble and I don't I I like to write down because if there's an issue that I feel I need to respond back individually to that person you know I like to have their name and where they live and I make a notation of what the issue is um it would be a good record for us to get back right to this individual if we needed to follow up with an item or an answer or no I totally agree yeah totally agree and I think it's nice if you say uh like Mrs Smith you know would you and you you're actually addressing them Mr Smith it's time for your public comment or what however you want to say it it it certainly makes it easier for me cuz last night was hey M Parker versus hey got the blue head on right there yeah yeah you and the oh here come on up not you but him not him but her yeah so so no um so you know but I I I suggest that you know we take the month of February just to let people know that's what we want to start doing and then in March we'll start doing that so you know people can be aware of it um that this is what we're going to start doing uh and it's already in our rules so it's not anything that we have to right wait until we get an ordinance approved to do and we can still be working you know working on that that ordinance as well so we have two meetings in February that uh we'll bring the ordinance back the second meeting in February because first meeting is coming up Tuesday we'll bring about the second meeting in February again still hearing all of this updating that and just continue to work on that and and move forward so um and this is s of the pace of the be as we go through the different ordinances and codes is have to bring it discuss it look at it see the attorney needs to make some adjustments to it we discuss a little more and then you know know move forward from there um now some things can just be by resolution um everything doesn't have to be by ordinance I think uh Kevin did we say we're going to do this by resolution um this uh well I think one of the things we talked about is you obviously it's an ordinance now so to change it we'll do an ordinance but we can in that ordinance you know put it where if we want to make future changes to you know the order of the agenda or the decorum or whatever that we could do do that by resolution moving forward got it okay anytime you know you get another mayor or whatever that they're like well I want change the Go the whole ordinance process so they can just do a resolution and change it I think I think that's what the beach did I remember you know we talked about they they did that period of time during the previous administration where they they didn't let you know non-citizens talk for a short period of time they have it by resolution so the new mayor got in there they passed a resolution say hey this is our you know this is how we're going to you know conduct our our meetings and it's just easier to you to change obviously by resolution CU that just can happen at one meeting right you know publicly notice it and all that so I think it'd be good give give you you the commission flexibility you know moving forward okay but for now it have to be morees got it so all right sounds good um anything else about uh about that item I think I've asked enough question no it's good good conversation anything from you about the city manager no sir all right all right well thank you all for coming out this morning um hopefully you all have a a great rest of your weekend and I'll see you all on Tuesday morning 9:00 a.m. m