good morning thank you for joining us this morning uh we had some technical difficulties but looks like we are up and running hopefully um so I'm Jenny Rowan I'm the community development director uh to my right is Andrew Morris who's our longrange planner to my left is Marcy Forbes Our Community Development engineer and then in the back we have Jay steerman he's our newest planner here um and then we have Lisa as well and I think she's running around so you'll see all of us So today we're here to talk about John's Pass Village Activity Center the zoning of uh the activity center so we have three workshops we already had our first one this is our second Workshop so what we'll do we'll have a short presentation and then we'll go through each character District by character district and we'll discuss what that is and then we'll be asking you um your input on the Heights on the setbacks and then any other standards so a little bit about local land regulations here in madir beach and just pelis County in general so we really have three plans that we look at whenever we're looking at well what what can you do with your land so with four panis that's the county they have their countywide plan and that consists of the planning countywide rules or strategies and then they have a map so you have a land use category for every single parcel here in madira Beach as well as the county and then locally we have two different plans we have the comprehensive plan where you see the future land use element and then we have a corresponding map so that also gives you a designation um your future land use and that really has the barebones of uses your intensity and then your density so density is units per acre so that's Hotel units that's also residential units per maker um and then intensity is the ratio between your lot area and U the best way to imagine it is like the air condition square footage and then on top of that uh we have the code of ordinances and that has a lot of information in there but we're really looking at the Land Development regulations um you might hear us say ldrs that's what we're talking about and within there we have our zoning districts um and then we have the corresponding zoning map so whenever you come in and see us in planning you say what can I do with my property can I build an accessory structure what are my setbacks what's my height all of that's really in the code of ordinances and your ldrs but all three of these plans have to correspond with each other so that's also very important to um keep in mind so we can't be um have larger regulations like you can have a larger building um than what the county allows we can be more restrictive we can't be less restrictive so this is what these Maps look like so we have the designation of activity center now in this area it's the John's Pass Village Activity Center so you can see here in blue this is the area that we're talking about today and we're going to be focusing on and then here on the bottom right is with our comprehensive plan our future land use element uh looks very similar to the countywide plan map where we have the activity center designation and now the last piece of this whole process is really going into the zoning categories and changing that to correspond with our comprehensive plan and then the countywide plan a little bit of history about madir beach in that area so between the 40s and 80s many of these bu buildings were built out in the past and um 83 is really the creation of what we now see is like the Modern madira beach zoning so that has what where I was saying the ldrs of code of ordinances that's where you have your zoning your use your height your setback U and many of these did not reflect what was on the ground so what was built in ' 07 and 08 the city passed some amendments to the conference the plan and ldrs that exceeded the countywide plans so what I said before we can be more restrictive than the county we can't be less so we exceeded what the county allowed we can't do that so current staff found these inconsistencies talked to Ford panel had public meetings and public hearings on how to proceed and this area the John's Pass Village area that you can see in these two maps the activity center um those were designated Activity Center because those were um we had more non-conforming buildings there that needed to be preserved um so that's why where the creation of that Activity Center um came from and so now like I said before we're now um looking to the zoning to correspond with those different land uses so why an activity center in that area it's really to protect that unique character of John's Pass Village to ensure that any new development is compatible um and sure that we are consistent with the countywide plan and it's really a proactive instead of reactive approach to planning so in the ldr is the Land Development regulations uh we're we're looking more at zoning so zoning really has a uses so we have primary accessory and special exception use special exception use that's where you have to go to the special magistrate uh for a use and then we also have setbacks Building height which is measured from design flood elevation we'll go over in just a minute and there's also special requirements so in these special requirements it may look something like oh you have to have an extra 5T of landscape buffer if you're next to residential you have to have an extra so many feet of side setback if you're this use next to residential things like that is what we see in the special requirements and I'll hand it over to Marcy so um when it comes to height you notice we reference the height is measured from DFE which is design flood elevation where that comes from is the entirety of madira beach is a special flood Hazard area so all the locations here have a base flood elevation that we extract from from a FEMA map majority of madira beach is like 10 11 12 and we basically pull that using your address from the map then madira beach has a 4 foot freeboard so that freeboard is designed to take it up a little bit even higher for your finished floor elevations Andor depending on where you're at the bottom of the lowest structural member so when you see design flood elevation that's where it comes from it's your base flood elevation plus the city's 4-footer freeboard we measure height beginning at that designed flood elevation so for instance if you have a design flood elevation of 14 ft so that means you're in a BFE of 10 we've added the 4 footer freeboard and now we you're at an elevation of 14 ft and we start to measure from there to be clear when that height is measured your zero ground is not always zero your zero is your elevation and you could be at an elevation of six and then you hit your 14 and then you measure the height from there we'll have some really good examples later to kind of drive that home um so you kind of can understand how that is so we do measure height from design flood elevation and in general that begins to be about your second story so your first story typically Falls below that and then above that for commercial they are allowed to build below provided they flood proof it so um you are allowed to use that for commercial and parking and stuff so what we've also done here is people like to talk stories so it's you know six stories five stories whatever people want but stories can vary in height so we typically don't use that to to measure how tall something can be we do like to use feet we do find that today um a story height is greater than what it used to be so that's why you have higher ceilings and stuff like that so if you can imagine a story height here would be like 11 to 14 feet on average is what we can see um and it's also what you don't see too so you have your ceiling and then from your ceiling to the top of your next floor that's where your duct work can be your lighting Plumbing whatever uh sprinklers um any of that kind of stuff so as we go through this conversation that's what we kind of consider the average story between 11 and 14t when it comes to setbacks those are the distance we measure from the property line to the outermost exterior edge of the structure at grade so all components of any building must be within that setback so whether it's a column your slab any portion of your ground floor has to be meet the setback so you can't encroach um so that's how we look at that as you go into your second story our code does allow for instance a balcony to Canal lever four feet into the setback so you do see as you get higher there are some allowances for patios and decks and stuff like that but that is still controlled with measurement of depth and stuff like that as compared to your setback and your property line all right now going back to John's P Village activity center and then the zoning so we can see on the left side is your existing zoning map um and then the proposed zoning map so this proposed zoning map really comes from the character districts which are defined in the special area plan um in the comprehensive plan of this of this area so obviously we understand that things on Boardwalk looks different very different than things on Pelican Lane uh which looks very different than things on 133rd so this whole area is broken out into six different distinct character districts so we will be going through each of these character districts um and then asking your opinion on setbacks on height um and then any additional special requirements so we'll be starting this with Boardwalk so if you can see on the screen it's really just a sliver everything that's along that board walk area the existing zoning um is C2 zoning with the setbacks are front 20 feet and that's from Boardwalk Place uh the side is 5T on one side the rear or Waterfront is none and the height is 34 ft from design flood elevation so just what that looks like on an average lot we just plucked a lot in that area put put in the setbacks and the height so this is what it could look like um just based on the current zoning code so you have 34t measured from that second floor upward to the very top peak of that roof and then 20 ft in the front and none in the rear and 5T on one side and we also grabbed a an example of current height uh so what we did is tried to find building plans of what would be the tallest building in each district so here in Boardwalk um it's near hub's Marina so we measured from the design flood elevation upward to the tallest peak of the roof is 37 ft and a half inch and just some pictures of what Boardwalk District looks like and what's unique of that characteristic so one thing that we will uh write in the zoning is definitely design guidelines so keeping that characteristic um what's important of John's Pass Village so we'll definitely have that in our zoning as well so what we'll do now is just ask you to Talk Amongst yourselves in each group talk look at your worksheets uh there's a section for setbacks there's a section for high and any special requirements and we'll give you 10 minutes I'll let you know after 9 minutes um that you have one more minute to finish up and then we'll go around the room and just have one person from each table um to speak about each one of these and then me myself Marcy and Andrew will just go along to each table see if you have any questions yes commissioner Kerr I just wanted to the DFE is that the top of the floor or below that floor that because that floor could be four foot thick so if you have a DFE and we pull it like say we pull it from the map on this on this example so their base flood elevation is 11 as plucked from the map their design flood elevation is 15 that is where the height measurement starts regardless so if they wanted to say oh you know our first floor is higher to try and get extra it doesn't matter the height always starts at design flood elevation I understand but is that is that design flood elevation is that at the bottom of that floor if the floor is two foot thick is is that DFE at the top of that floor or below the floor so if you are in coastal a or a velocity Zone your structural member the lowest structural member has to be at DFE or above so the bottom of that structural member has to be at DF or above if you're not in coastal a ORV then your finished floor has to be at DFE so it's different for those two so for this entire area though it's in that Coast away is that correct majority majority of Boardwalk what we're talking about yes for for assumptions we'll just say it's at the bottom the DFE line is before you put your floor on does not count the thickness of the floor correct so so they can build our requirement is you have to be at DF or above so however you want to construct that we will but at a minimum in this area your structural member cannot be below for example in here 15 ft the DF so yeah so let's say they wanted for whatever reason they wanted to go higher that's fine but their DFE starts we will start their Building height from that point under yeah it will be at d Fe is that answering the question I think so I I just where that line starts is it it's under the structural member correct for this location perfect exactly thanks Mar are we discussing also correct so what we're going to have you guys do is focus on height and setbacks and maybe some other criteria that you would like to mention um when you guys after you guys discuss that then we're going to come up here and go each to each table and get your feedback on what you as a group kind of hashed out for set set backs and height are so we do have we do have what's we do have what's the current rules are for that um your next question is going to be do all the buildings follow those rules and it varies so okay that's what I I was told I had that do this way so were there any examples of the setbacks currently in the boardwalk area because it looks as if currently we have to change the height restriction to 37.5 to make it legal so the setbacks are there any setbacks that have to be determined to make those legal so we do have buildings that are legally non-conforming so when we say legally non-conforming it means they were built before the current zoning code um and then our code references them that there's certain allowances that you can do with these non legally non-conforming structures so um we can go with the current setbacks um I would not encourage something less than that um because we may have a few that didn't meet that setback we have an example of the height really to show you what that height looks like um we haven't gone parcel through parcel we're in the middle of that doing that um but it's also hard because we do not have building plans of every single building in madira Beach a lot of them were built before the zoning code um goes back before a lot of our records do as well so it it's really hard to determine and give you a specific answer of this does this doesn't um what we've been doing is going through District by District looking at the property appraiser website this is a snippet of the property appraiser website it shows you kind of where the property lines are but they're not always accurate and then trying to measure from say Google Earth if we don't have the building plans which a lot of them we don't so we couldn't give you exact accurate but we can kind of guesstimate um a lot of them do meet that 5 foot on one side um but there are some that don't so it's some that do some that don't that doesn't give you the greatest answer but that's that's what we're doing yes um yeah what I was going to say is do you possibly have um something show that shows the flood zones like 10 11 you know stuff like that might be helpful for some people be able we can pull that up definitely on the screen and then you could show them plus four and it it might help I I don't know that could help yeah Marcy is getting that up right now and then just what Marcy said before grade can vary where you are as well so keep that in mind when we're talking about Jenny can you pull the uh example up for hubbert's Restaurant please of which one hubbert's restaurant that you just had up there um yes oh no yeah okay here let me oh great we were having issues with our computers and internet earlier on multiple laptop so looks like it might be frozen again okay okay we'll just have to restart it y'all can talk amongst yourselves I'll bring that back up and while this is pulling up one thing to think about I we were kind of discussing to give you guys a visual if you can imagine back when they were doing Boardwalk if you had an atg grade structure the 20 foot setback probably comes from them wanting to be able to pull a vehicle up into there so they said if okay the building's 20ft setback then we can pull in park a vehicle to our atg grade structure so we sometimes think that's where some of these setbacks came from is being able to park vehicles in there so you can kind of keep that in mind as you envision now having elevated buildings with potential parking underneath so those setbacks you know don't necessarily have to be what they were um we just don't want them any greater and we're going to go ahead and start the time now of hovers Marina do you want to bring that back up it's on PowerPoint yep okay now it's up so the example you have up there the DFE actually starts just below the window line there so basically you're saying that to rebuild they would actually have to have a higher height or they have to lower the height of their roof yes right yes because this was built with um we just got new flood maps in 2021 and then also updated the free board so freeboard used to be 2 feet now it's 4 feet so if we kept it at 34 feet and they they had to rebuild we could actually they could actually just adjust the height of their roof they could always adjust it yeah it would have to be lower though um you have a good point though that currently it doesn't meet the design flood elevation this is a coastal a I think everything on Boardwalk is Coastal a there's a part of it that touches all Boardwalk so the lowest horizontal number has to be at or above design flot elevation so you would see that and this right here would have to go up to that design FL elev the front set back is considered Boardwalk Place Boardwalk facing the street itself exactly it's a it's a little weird but yes and building and the buildings that are on the north side of Boardwalk what's considered the front of them uh it depends on the legal address okay so we don't know if that it's facing Boardwalk we're facing the other way uh like in the commercial Court the other District yeah you're talking about not in Boardwalk no well no the the ones that are across on the north side of Boardwalk you got the second set of orange buildings there mean talking about the buildings that are they're in the other District he's asking about yeah yeah it would it would be dependent on the legal address so those believe those are Boardwalk Place but if it's a new thank building yeah hi uh Jenny or Marcy uh I just want to understand the current setbacks versus current height are those the current zones yes that's in the current zone so current height is different from existing building yes so this is where they're supposed to be now and we're deciding where we think they should be yes and and right now our assignment is to fill out that first line of Boardwalk District that's correct and then we'll go District by District so make sure I the assignment you have great thank you and I'm going to start the timer I know that some of yall have already started talking um all three of us will be walking around discussing with each group and um just helping out so I'm going to start that timer uh for and I'll give you a minute notice we'll do 10 minutes C High building there all right but it's I know what are you guys thinking question this bu bu so if you want to propose p e so so real quick about the height I just wanted to point out something what we were showing earlier may not be the highest one on Boardwalk it's one of the higher ones we have plans for but so what I did is I went we went ahead and pulled up the parking garage which is directly across and that shows you that it's 55 fet above DFE so what you get from The Friendly Fisherman as it begins to transition across Hooters Bubba gumps and over to the boardwalk you probably will see like an increase in height for some of their architectural features and stuff so just want to be clear you're looking in that area from about the 37 Mark that we showed earlier to 55 from DF along the parking garage if that makes sense so you kind of have some transitioning and Architectural features that are there right we haven't talked about yeah but I think like I'm saying like the floor would be the same but that we say what now mechanical units and Architectural correct and some of the there's some caveats around the architectural features and the tops of stairs and elevators for building Heights as well so just that you guys understand that as well so what e e e e e okay you guys have about one more minute and then we're going to start asking you guys some questions e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e all right I know we went a few minutes over but um we will be gathering everybody's input on Mercy will have it up here perfect um oh and we will ask just one person from each table to speak about what you discussed um in your table we'll go through height setbacks and then any other regulations um and I'm going to give this microphone and then speak into to the microphone as well Lisa and Jay will be coming around with the microphones oh have two mics now hello okay perfect okay as we can start at this table first who wants to be the speaker I'll be get out of the way of the presentation so I'm not going to give our our our Reasons I'm just going to give you our numbers all right uh so for the proposed front set back in use we agreed on five feet uh for the proposed setback in use we propose zero feet for the proposed rear setback in use we propos zero feet for the proposed height in feet we uh maintained 37 uh feet5 in so that the existing uh the the building that is at that height can remain that height and none of the others can go any higher the only additional comments we had is that we would maintain which I think is the goal of this anyway maintain a walking friendly uh area focus on pedestrian friendly development okay and design perfect thank you all right next table in the back there who will be your spokesperson they're still confused did you have questions I have a question question on the boardwalk will they have to update the width of it to maintain more of a traffic flow on the boardwalk itself so the boardwalk is owned and maintained by the city so that's off of the property line the property line um is like where the seaw wall is so it doesn't go to the boardwalk if they expand it to update it will that affect the setback um we we wouldn't be expanding over to say if that did happen we wouldn't go into people's property um okay and did y'all want to talk about your uh opinions on the height and setbacks did they said they didn't oh you didn't okay so we're GNA go to this table okay next table okay I was put in charge of this table for talking okay so we came up with basically we were good with what the current setbacks are the 20 in the front none on the rear five on the side and what which would be one side did they change the sides so you're completely saying the same or did you alter it yes keeping the same which would be continuous structure if there's like nothing there now we're good with that okay and then the height we agree with the 34 feet and I guess the 375 would have to be non-compliant and would stay non-compliant okay perfect any other um special regulations or that you discussed or anything important in this area no okay okay you guys next okay we um on the street side we had we had a little bit of a uh back and forth between zero and 5 feet okay um the business people like the idea of zero and being able to rebuild to the road and the pedestrians like the idea of five feet being able to walk um setbacks on the side we went with zero on the rear we went with zero and the proposed height we were okay with it going up to the 37 and a half that's existing okay um and the only additional comment was no taller than that perfect same as it is now all right next table Mr Edwards uh for the boardwalk we were looking at uh keeping the front setback as is at 20 feet is that the consensus I believe okay there would not be any uh side setback would be zero okay and the rear setback stays the same as as zero we're still having a little discussion on the height and I can we have one second okay I guess the consensus is go to 37 ft 37 okay but y'all were discussing 34 or 37 that was kind of it was I can put that too um they decided 37 but there was also discussions at 34 so they weren't unanimous um any other um qualities or anything else that is just important to note in this area walkability thank you okay great and we're going to move on to the next District so it'll be very similar to what we just did except for we're going to the commercial core District so here is where we have the parking garage um and then some larger buildings um so this is existing C1 zoning so it's a different zoning District these setbacks in the front now all these are from the property line so keep that in mind um the front is none side is 10 ft on one side the rear is 25 ft and the height is 34 ft from design flood elevation and here are some examples using different size lots of what that could look like um based just on the zoning code so we have 34 generally starts at the second floor I remember what Marcy said before any commercial you can flood prooof if you're residential you cannot flood prooof that ground floor um it has the setbacks here the height and then the tallest building that we could find um which I believe is accurate is a parking garage so you can see in this picture the design flood elevation being 14 um and then above that is 55 ft and 6 and 1 12 in so 55 and 1/2 ft and then just some pictures of current buildings in that area so just like before we'll give you 10 minutes I'll give you one minute before just notifying you that you have one more minute and then we'll go around just like what we did e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e hello okay we're going to give one more minute and then we'll start discussion e e e e e e e all right we're going to start going around to all the tables um if we could start at this end Jr Lisa could you bring the microphone around to this table over here yes I don't know share this with people it came up on Saturday Okay so starting at this table who will be your spokesperson are you not ready yet yet you're hashing it out okay then we'll start this table in the back here okay have you there we go so all right our proposed um front setback is based on them keeping the current 10-ft sidewalk and we put zero okay but if you don't count the city's sidewalk because that was the dis discuss the discussion is do the sidewalks count so if the sidewalk is in place we're okay with zero um side setback current we're okay with the current um same thing with the rear and right now we're going with the are we going with the 55 we were going with the 55 on the height um only comment we had some of us was no Rooftop Bar all right next table all right there you go stilling you guys ready sure all right we want to keep the height at 34t which is currently existing and uh the side uh the rear set back at 25 and the side at 10 on one side only uh no change in setback on on contiguously on contiguous properties 10 foot on one side and that's what we have uh what was the front Again Jim the front the front was none none okay thank you all right next table are youall ready yeah lot of discussion still good ensuing but at the current uh conversation is a front set back is at 10 feet to match the rear setback 10 feet so that because some 10 and 10 because some businesses face one way some businesses Bas the other way we feel like 10 ft would give uh some symmetry uni on both sides uniformity on both sides as far as side setbacks we couldn't come up with a number but we did agree that it should accommodate pedestrian use whatever that side setback is and what um I'm just going to bring up from the last Workshop something that kept being brought up is say if your your lot is larger than half an acre or your lot is wider than 50 ft then maybe you would have a larger side setback right something like that so just throwing that out there is so height we we looked at what's coming up in two sessions is going to be the low intensity mix use at 44 feet and we thought if the if the residential mix use can go to 44 we feel like the commercial cor should at least go to 44 and that's not a unanimous decision okay yeah so 44 for low intensity or 44 for this District say that again for this this District okay to match that one to match it okay okay just want to make as far as additional comments we're going to say again maintain pedestrian uh friendly design and uh design consistent with uh what's going on already all right great maintain that we're just going to keep saying that right gotcha all right and which tables these two tables so whoever's ready are you guys ready okay so what we finally have come up with is we figure we want a 10- foot front setback and since we're giving up some of that we'll go 20 on the rear side setback a 10 foot needs to be split so 10 foot total yes okay total 10 foot total fine but it needs be split and and I would say um minimum of three three and seven all right did we get height oh and height um 34 34 okay 34 with the exception of what is existing stays you know existing any additional standards I know y'all were talking about landscaping and drainage and well it got into an issue of like um some of the people on the table here don't know what what's existing but like having a zero Frontage you know I said okay so the city's got property so you do have some sidewalks so it would be just going up to the edge of their property but what we what I don't want to see again is like sweet brunette where that's I guess is a good idea of a zero setback where the corner of 140th and golf the building is right on I would say the property line which makes it very dangerous for pulling out and one thing we discussed at the previous um previous Workshop is possibly having say the second floor have a different setback third floor different setback so or say oh you're three stories so your first floor can be zero your second and higher floors can be 10 or exactly and that's like um I guess well the the the parking garage where that first floor has um you you you've got your walk ability and then the second floor is out more and you know if that's going to the property Edge that's potentially okay but keeping your line of sight safe so you don't have a monolithic exactly next yes um one one thing I I've been doing like because of these meetings is trying to see what buildings down in John's John's Pass activity center and in other parts of the city had the board of adjustment doe a variance I know uh the building with sweep runette was one of the ones that did have that these were done um in the early 2000s way way before our time but it's just a check but I I remember seeing um that was one one of the buildings that that had had variances done um all right and our last table um we're looking at the front set back being 10 feet zero with the rear um and for S setback we're probably looking at five but if it was like a a continuous number of stores like in the traditional you could zero but I know you can't have have it both ways but if you're having some some type of other thing where you have separate buildings then you probably should have five feet from them between them okay and then for the height um we want to keep it with the current height of 34 feet DFE all right okay I think that was all the tables and okay to stick on time um we'll still do 10 minutes but I'll be very firm with it so uh the John's Pass Resort so now we're going across Gulf Boulevard and we're looking at the R3 zoning District that we see up and down Gulf Boulevard so as you can see here on the slide there's a little bit of variation between the use and how wide the lots are so single family to Triplex is 20 ft in the front multif family Hotel commercials 25 ft in the front sidey yard setbacks uh if you're single family to Triplex if you're less than 50 feet wide you're going to have 5et on both sides um if you're those single family to Triplex you're wider than 50 ft then um as well as multif family hotel and Commercial you'll have 10 ft on both sides the rear is 25 ft or if your property is along the beach you'll have the coastal con the cccl line which I'll show you in the next slide and you can build right on that line uh the height from DF is 44 ft and there is that special requirement that if hotels or multif family AB buts a residential um an additional 5 foot of setback is required so here's a cc L it's that lime green line so that only applies if your property is on the beach otherwise it's going to be that 25 ft setb so on a larger lot this might be what the building looks like we're not accounting for ISR uh we're just trying to give you an idea of the setbacks and then uh what Marcy kind of talked about in the height it can really vary on how how high your stories are um we see an average of about 11 to 14 or 10 to 14 feet for each story um we're seeing more and more um as the years go on so with 44 ft you might have three stories over parking or you might have four stories over parking just to kind of give you an idea of what that is and then here's one of the older building plans of what we could find this is Beach place so from the design flood elevation current design flood elevation it's 50 ft and 8 and 1/4 in and then uh mechanical units can exceed that height so we're really measuring from the top of that roof structure right there then an example on smaller Lots because we do have smaller Lots um some single family duplex triplexes in this area so we also want to make sure that we recognize that protect these properties so this is what these setbacks look like on a smaller lot and just some pictures of that District how we have a variation of larger condo buildings um and then smaller smaller properties as well all right I'm going to start the timer now and give you 10 minutes e um in actual e e e e e e e e e e e e e e what okay one more minute so just wrap it up and then we'll be going around e e all right and now we will start going around okay do this table want to start are you ready no are yall ready okay okay perfect [Music] okay um we're talking now about John's Pass Resort area district and we felt like we wanted to maintain the current setbacks all the way across the board uh you can ask any of my colleagues here for there reasons for that but that's what we decided with the stipulation in the additional standards that we include accommodate smaller properties to rebuild current footprint regardless of Reason which means not just just if they're destroyed in a hurricane for any reason they can rebuild in their current footprint for smaller for smaller properties right so that was something we wanted to accommodate with I don't know that I have the expertise to explain it but I don't people don't know what talking currently as I well Jenny could you explain that 50% thing that you explained so well yes it's very complicated I'll try uh so we do have a section in our code uh that addresses non-conforming properties so this is legally non-conforming so if your property if your building was built before the current zoning codes you have certain allowances of what you can do um and what we were discussing at this table is the if a non-conforming structure is damaged by fire natural elements um or forces greater to 50% of its market value it has to meet the current zoning codes so if you have it damage some damage to your home um that's over 50% you have to meet the current zoning requirements now if you have a catastrophic loss um where it's a declaration of a dis disaster say a hurricane and that declaration can come from the Board of Commissioners it can come from the County Commissioners it can come from the state or federal um levels then you have other allowances where depending on the type of property you can build back to the same setbacks some of them allow for um the same footprint some of them do not so it really depends on the type of use say for commercial even if there is a hurricane in our code you have to meet the height you have to meet the same floor area ratio whatting could decide for any reason to build back on their original footprint something to accommodate smaller smaller smaller Lots oh uh height we didn't talk about height yes did we oh I'm must have missed it maintain exist maintain existing all the way across the board existing in the code so that 44 or okay 50 so what's built there then 50 existing existing built so 50 okay perfect and we're we're still looking through building plans like I said before a lot of these buildings were built for this current zoning code um and there's some that we cannot find building plans for um and so we're in the process of seeing which ones we can find building plans for and then anything taller we're we're going to work with um our building official to get those Heights as well so all right next table okay bad we up so we would like to keep everything exactly the same although I do like commissioner tag lini's comments about the smaller structures I think that globally we're looking out for everybody with this but keep everything at its current height and setbacks as it was built or as it is in our code no as it is in the code code okay yes we always have to be specific about that so okay perfect abely we got it all right next table yes we we agree with both other tables exactly in terms of the setbacks good uh current Heights being 44 same but then also the build back back um to existing oh no no to existing code to the standards okay it has to be the 44 if it gets if it's 60 and gets demolished it's got to go back to 44 okay so we have some kind of Conformity all right got it next stable um so for setbacks we were fine with the current and um with the proposed height we basically because we were looking even above at the ones we didn't talk about the 44 feet we just thought that the 44 should be the new 50 um okay because of what you were saying about the taller um ceiling Heights and the foot needed for the foot and a half for the rebuild so we thought 50 basically is the new 44 okay 50 feet all right all right next table we're uh want to keep the existing code um as it is with 44 ft being the highest DFE okay and setbacks too setbacks all the same okay all right that is everyone we will go to the next okay so now we're jumping back across to Pelican Lane the low intensity mixed use so front this is R3 so you have the exact same zoning um so I'm not going to go through that just because I know we're running low on time um here's an example based on WE plucked one of the R3 Lots over here in Pelican and impose those setbacks that are in our code right now and then here's an example of that 44t um that's being built back there and some photos of what is on Pelican now all right I will start the timer e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e okay I know we're running our time is over but if you can stay we would love for you to stay uh we're going to go through the low intensity mixed use and we will start is this table ready do you have to go I'm sorry if you guys have your worksheets I we'd love to keep those okay perfect okay so we'll start over here we'll try and do the last few quickly and if you have to leave you can always email us come by talk to us uh we're here and um and then we do have another workshop on Saturday so of course everyone is welcome to attend that all right so we'll start they don't okay okay thank we got that worke okay so next table we would like to keep everything to current code all right next okay we've determined that since this is going to be a new code do away with obviously the R3 and and it's only going to be for this area so it's it's no need for the cccl and front set backs 20 side set backs five because I believe all those properties are 40 foot so it would be consistent with that rear setback 25 and eliminate the cccl and height 34t as opposed to 40 four all right great next table oh we went with current setbacks and current height okay last table I think the mic's coming to you uh after considerable discussion they said just go ahead and keep the existing uh ordinances okay perfect all right so now we're jumping to the traditional Village so back to C1 zoning uh which is more focused on the commercial development setbacks in this Zone front are none side 10 ft on one side rear is 25 ft and the height is 34 from DFE so here's a few examples of what that could look like and then one of the few building plans that we could find um was of this tower on the brewery near the brewery um and so from DFE that's 31 31 feet one and 3/4 inch so I'll just say 31 feet and 2 in from DFE to the very top of that all right um so the finished floor elevation so grade is around 6 feet 6 feet here and then it looks like the Bas flood elevation in this area is 10 ft and then our free board's 4 feet so starting there okay the timer is going and then we'll have one more District after this I appreciate everybody staying um who can stay and if you have to leave feel free to fill out the worksheet with any additional comments and we'll we'll definitely collect those EX to that doesn't count it's City own mod triangle about e e e e e e e e all right is everybody ready trying to move it along we have one more District after this so um can start where's the microphone um um yeah you're ready okay we we were recommend just to keep with the um okay the current uh setbacks and what's proposed yeah no changes no changes and same for height no changes okay all right next table who's ready are y ready are they ready well after considerable discussion we'd like to keep everything the way it is now with the current laws and ordinances okay so same as the previous table okay perfect we're the same way I mean especially keep keep all the numbers like like they are and especially with the idea of the tower only being 31 you know feet tall so it it everything looks good there for traditional Village all right thank you um so for the front setback we're staying with current for the side we were going with zero only so in event of hurricane it could be rebuilt the way it is we like the way it looks with all the stores touching um rear side setback current and 34 on the height all right and last table uh we're looking yeah we're looking at the uh front as no um setback the rear being 25 but um being able to can't deliv second floor out further to allow parking and maybe additional floor space for the stores okay and then IDE for the side set set backs it would be zero along the line but on the two outer stores on each Corner having a 5ot set back on that okay actually it might be 10 I guess it would depend on the visibility triangle for cars turn yes and we always keep that in account so you have to meet that visibility triangle all right great yes we like we like that one uh height the same is that right 34 34 okay keep these same all right last one transitional District we have a lot of different zoning categories in this District so anything on the beach side it's going to be the R3 and we do have one existing PD zoning which is Barefoot Beach so at PD zoning they were allowed to go higher than the regulations so you'll see that in a minute um and then on the east side we do have C3 zoning C4 zoning and then there's a little sliver that is R2 zoning um and here are the setbacks I don't want to dwell on it too long um here's examples of the C3 and C4 zoning they're very similar front yard 25 ft from the property line side depends on how wide your property is so it's either 10 10 feet is the lowest um so if you have a wider let's see wider lot then it's going to be 33% of the width and then the rear yard if you're in the C3 zoning is going to be 10 ft if you're in C4 it's 18 ft and the height uh is 34 to 44 ft and that variation in the C3 is based on use and then examples of the R3 zoning you've seen this before um just some examples of what that looks like the R2 looks similar the height is 40t so a little smaller like I said there's just one little sliver that is R2 and then another example of R3 on a larger lot and then here is Barefoot Beach I said this was done with a PD PD zoning so they were allowed to go exceed that height um when they went to the boc and got that approval so just for reference of what that looks like uh they their height is 63 Fe 7 in and then madira B across the street is also higher I believe it's higher than Barefoot Beach about the same height though and they got a variance so that was also another special exception that allowed them to get um higher than what was allowed and now in the current code we don't allow additional height through that variance process and then some pictures of what is in that transitional District so similar to John's Pass Resort District you do have larger Lots larger buildings but then you also have single family homes um and you have smaller Lots smaller smaller buildings duplexes single family so keep that in mind when you go through the setbacks and height and then we also have other so maybe there's special exceptions or um you know something special that we could write in the code to really protect those single family homes all right and I will put on the timer and this is the last District e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e okay we are going to go around and talk about height setbacks and others is this table ready yeah y are ready okay where's okay um whoever your spokesperson is Mayor good morning with a transitional we'd like to leave everything the way it is with the current code that everybody's in agreement with that okay next table yall ready yeah quick quick and simple one ditto yeah we're good with all the codes and and good luck trying to get it all together thank you under one area so officially now meet current code meet current code is referred to as MC squared okay well we're we're kind of torn on that because where we're torn on the setbacks is some of those houses when because in because it's such a mixed area on the gulf lane side there are somewhere there's a house in the front and a house on the beach side all on the beach side of Gulf Lane so under current code the people who have a house and their own address separate from their neighbor right behind them could not build rebuild their house if a hurricane came so how do you account for something like that I if you have a 20 foot setback and they're currently built on the road like you know what I'm saying there's two houses to the west of Gulf Lane so if something happened there there has to be a a way to account for them not losing a home and not being able to rebuild their home so we'll have the same comment to accomodate footprint yes smaller property and existing footprint on that because someone could theoretically not be able to build their entire house um so that's that's one thing um our height we were going with 50 just for the same reason as the 44 okay because of the ceiling height um the other thing we want put in there is no Amplified music because this is a transitional and there are hotels and there are no Amplified music to be heard Beyond 50 feet of the property line no rooftop bars all right you know we want this to be maintained residential resid to be a priority over commercial buildings okay I was just going to say that is something that we can write in the zoning code the uses um and then special exception uses and things of that nature so perfect Jenny the one other thing um that I kind of brought up talk to him because some of the issues I was having is whether or not there might be able to be something it could be that we could rebu to the existing setback versus footprint quotes like with mine where we have that goof little jog yeah I mean you're talking a couple feet and it kind of screws up the building yeah and it's not this way so it's extended it's to the existing setback versus footprint okay all right last table in the last District just give [Laughter] it I I'm not sure we're we have consensus on this yet can we have one more minute please okay or you can talk about what you're going through the discussions I think for the R3 the the front rear setbacks are fine and the side setback you know so we're fine with there we're looking at the height and you know we've talked about history before um you have a lot of buildings that would not be more than 44 feet in height where you used to have parking and three floors above that and which is what like the the Mader Beach Motel is that the highest level and there's a lot of buildings so basically if you had houses you know you're looking at parking in three floors which is plenty in that area there so my recommendation and I haven't heard too much of my okay Partners here as to what they are looking at so I don't know if you have any other opinion here so I I would say not DFE but overall height from from grade would be 44 something higher yeah if you're outside the activity you can build taller if you want but that's what we're looking at there I I think that I know C3 and C4 I don't really have an opinion unless you all have anything on that I'm sorry so maybe you could say because I know you're were talking about homes maybe you could have like a use uh we we see that in I believe it's C3 or C4 oh C4 uh commercial has 34t from DFE multif family hotel is 44 so maybe you could have something like that if you're single family to Triplex you could build to a height of 30 if you're something else and it could be 40 is that is that kind of what you were talking about or just across the board so we were talking more about just the smaller houses that don't meet setbacks similar to what one of the other tables was saying that they would be able to build back to the current setbacks on the smaller lot protecting right so more tied to size of property and type of property use yeah so to require the setbacks for a 40ft wide piece property would be difficult if someone had to rebuild back a house or what have you okay so really protecting those smaller lots to build back gu is like throughout the C so with the R3 zoning district and in the C3 we do allow for 44 feet from DFE right now throughout the city um so kind of the go more restrictive than that would would mean that it would attract development away from John's Pass the only the only problem is is this is the only area where you have single family residences that are on the beach all down the beach you might have I think there's three places that have residential but this is the only place where you have single family or a duplex at most residentially you might say it's an R3 but that's why we're trying to keep that family feel to it walk behind of land to 3 so so one that area is like mostly built out so the thing is if you required a quarter acre I don't think there's a quarter acre V well I'd have to measure it down there but it would it would make sure that like on those smaller single family lots you wouldn't be able to build to 44 feet which is what your concern is someone building a very tall next to your house which you don't want so if you put it behind an acreage threshold then someone would have to buy up multiple lots to be able to build to the 44t above DFE like if we had it like a threshold to reach that would that be better to avoid having that right on top of someone's house no because if you did something like that they could still with the side setbacks be bumping right up next to a residence so if you if you had someone buy up a quarter an acre or half acre and and they want to move with a side setback of only 10 feet which is what Barefoot Beach tried to do with the plan development they were bumping right up next to Res couple residential places there and we were going to have to sue them to push them back into the center of their lot so that's that's my concern on that issue re we require additional setback based on lot size I mean we could do it based onight too like d need at least well you're saying DFE I again I'm talking about 44 at ground level so so basically you be you know maybe 30 feet above DFE well that's what I I was trying to say is you have two height standards based on lot like lot size so you would still because what would worry me if you make that more restrictive then it'll just because we allow for like someone to do like a and there's single there's houses abing some of some certain Lots but I I think if like the amount of land required if you requireed addition setback that that would reduce the issue and and maybe prohibit rooftop uses to just being utility access we're also talking about the residen on the east side of Gulf Boulevard you have those along 131st there I believe it is those those those are um three stories you have parking garage and you have two stories they're Town Homes basically yeah so I mean think about what we're talking about we're trying to go ahead and and and match up what we have there as well as on the west side for residential families okay so maybe we can write 44 from grade uh do you have that oh I mean should we just do 34 from DFE then reduce something like 30 34 from DFE yeah because it might get confusing to have a grade for one area and then and then we have protection for okay great okay and that is all that we have we'll be around if you have any additional questions or comments um and we'll be bringing all of this to our boc and Planning Commission um probably not this boc will have everything compiled but definitely the one after and um go from there thank you really appreciate everybody coming out and staying later too