##VIDEO ID:mPWffMNo05o## okay good evening uh welcome to the planning board meeting um I'll take a uh roll call uh Gordon Brer here Mary Foley here um Peter Morton here uh Sue filbrick here L Tenny here only is not gonna be here tonight um uh open with the sell signaling public hearing and we're gonna uh I know there may be other issues besides those that are subject to the site plan review and if if we can if if there are those that are obviously um things that are outside of the site plan and special permit we're going to push those to the after the um the hearing has been continued uh because Peter Morton has a time constraint and I want to make sure he's here for the hearing we're also not going to uh hear about the we're not going to we have a continue request to continue the hearing on the docs um tonight um so we will not be taking opening we will be only opening the hearing to continue it but not taking any comments about the um docs until our next meeting so if you're here for that you're welcome to stay but just to let people know we'll um do that at the appointed time so um I'll take a motion to open the continued public hearing forell signaling technology um a motion second think we have to do a roll call for that uh Gordon Brer Peter Morton yes filbert here La Henny yes great thank you um okay I'll turn that over now to Mark res our planner okay um so we have uh the conditions that I sent out on Friday and theni has um submitted additional divisions as um as well so the first um item what had to do with the control um what that means um and uh and whether we should the board should still have its own inspector to oversee um some of the uh sitework installation as it pertains to drainage um I did receive some emails I believe the today from uh Paul um Orlando our Building Commissioner as it relates to controlled construction and um want it's not too long at the record and then I received another email from Chuck Dam um later this afternoon as well as um it relates to inspections so just to summarize Paul I think everybody got a copy I don't know if people had a chance to uh read it it um basically confirms what the applicant had told us is that this will be under con instruction control that affidavits will be submitted through the building process um registered professionals um we'll Ure it's complies with code and they will submit reports um and part of our part of the permit review inspectors as well as the fire department will review the plans for compliance with codes and may request independent review for any unusual or unique aspects during construction they will perform periodic inspections both scheduled and unscheduled to verify that the project is progressing in accordance with the plans at the end of construction after final control construction control affidavits they will do final inspection so it's sort of a High um there is also over uh local control in addition to the construction um then there were some attachments I not um and then you want to just summarize what Chuck said sh a couple different emails here based on Paul's email this morning I'm fine with the engineering affidavit as a certification of the install we will also send our reps on site as their work progresses at certain Milestones I don't have a strong opinion either way I say get more Culver utility stuff in atwat then we would do more at oversight so these basically Ally saying on site um he's okay with the installation and there's also concom has review and then you have an npdes permit as well that you've applied for is that right Mark what do you call it oh npv yeah yeah okay uh what is that pollution elimination and discharge system something that's pollution discharge elimin can remember my environmental law from 30 years ago um so there is oversight also of that by D right okay so um okay any comments on the first proposed uh condition at least let's not try to Wordsmith it but uh do you have a copy so s are we saying this precludes us us having a separate site person no we haven't gotten there yet okay we haven't got Mark did you say you have extra copies of I do have extra copies these copies are what uh my edits of Mark's edits do you have an extra copy of this let's uh keep our discussion with I'm yeah I have that me to give Gordon this one I bring it up on the screen okay looking at the one that says PB discussion 9924 yeah oh okay that this one with the red yes the one okay so let me pull that up so we're all looking at the same thing that would be Mark is it changed from three days ago no it's the one that was put into your folder and Frid as soon as I pull it up and can give you this copy I'll make that bigger don't worry I'm looking at okay is that the one I'm supposed to be looking at yes okay okay so the cost was part of this so that we just talked about number two number two number number one on the one that was in the B no that's a p review number one right an outside inspe inspector yeah I said one or two on the draft I sent out Friday um so after discussion and getting the emails from Chuck and and uh from Paul um two will probably agree not to do number one do condition number two which is what the applicants proposed okay so we would strike um we'll strike the this this language the number number one yeah try to put this it's one or two so yeah okay like the sequence and the rest do all right so let's um so you're recommending number two this here is that correct Mark yes okay great I'm going to try to put this in the docum I bring up the next one can I ask some question yeah absolutely so um I guess my first question is for the general conditions are we lumping phase one and phase two together are there times when we need to clarify for phase one and phase two well I think yes looking approving it together they have submitted the overall site development plan for the overall thing I think the what we're looking at phasing is some of the offsite improvements for um for the intersections okay so yeah those are further down but I just wanted to clarify that this is conditions for phase one and phase two yes um so I guess with just looking up what 780 CMR 107 is um does this Encompass that it's also the final control document and the Construction Control checklist and then there's like um phased approval documents and site reviews are you I'm just wondering why we're calling out just the initial construction documents that would be a question for are we Greg to answer yeah well that's because that was an exhibit which is the preliminary but as you apply for a building permit that's what this that actual activity is called so when you apply for the actual building permit you you provide an affidavit at the beginning that says you know CES are submission plans they all meet the Massachusetts you know regulatory uh requirements and then so when they go for like phase two building permit the same process will happen again so I guess my my original question stands why wouldn't we also have the conditions that then we get the final control document along with the checklist and other items I don't understand the question so the question is this um condition number one States um out of this the mass law 780 CMR 107 it just plucks out the initial Construction Control document whereas if you look at that law it also lists out a final control document and then the Construction Control checklist that requires the site reviews and then there's phased approval documents throughout the process I only I only included the first AG to reference the process uh not the entire process okay this as to how we initiate the process yeah the whole process is under CMR 107 he just put that one exhibit we can put all the exhibits okay yeah so maybe we should add the commenced by the exe execution so it means it's begun with the initial rather than it's it doesn't show it um so CMR applies but it's but it begins with that initial I think that's what that says and that's fine and we can add one at the bottom to say do the final okay control document I just don't want to narrow Us in with just one document when there's really why Peter next to me just suggested if you want to do it that way you could put a period after 107 so that the project needs to proceed in Ordy with the regulations and leave out the exhibit and leave out the commencement of the process I was just doing that sort of for clarification but it doesn't have to be in there I the theory is that that starts a process and then you have to follow it when you know once the process starts you have to follow the rest of the steps if we could just be clearer with that because I know when I looked it up I was I was just questioning why is there just one document when there's really five so possible is to does that make S that covers then the whole process well it will be commenced by the submission of that form Peri but we could take that out right so I think you're right put a period in the sent inent and then say the the process or buildit process will be commen take that take that all out you have to follow you have to follow the statute right well why don't we we have to fix this so we will I'm sorry about my mess here I can't put it in word okay hours I think we talked about those last time are there any other changes um I just so our general zoning bylaw bylaw article 10 section 45 lists Out Construction activities and that's 8 a to 6: pm. so you'd have to go in front of the select board to change those not the planning board those are the the general by hours that relate to Earth removal no to construction activity yeah we've talked about that before but I think the um what I would suggest is that we put this in the special permit conditions and we send a letter to the select board with this as our recommendation and ask them to so this doesn't state for Earth removal am I missing something here no it's not an earth you are correct this is the the general bylaws has a construction activity section yeah and then it states that um and then the other clarification is that it's also state and federal holidays so it's not just Federal in our general bylaw um so again I it's just not under the jurisdiction of the planning board there's some State Poes when uh work will actually go on because not all state holidays are observed by everybody he yeah I mean I have no skin in that game that's just how our general bylaw reads so um if it if you want to get a waiver for that I think you have to go in front of the select okay I'll take a look at that I didn't realize it yes sir sorry I didn't remember that we had agreed to 6:30 a.m. okay hadly I don't know I would we talked about uh we talked about trying to get the construction traffic into the site part of the school traffic I remember that discussion but I don't remember resolving it with a definite time frame of 6:30 a.m. to 6:00 pm. we in the other uh uh rationale for it is that that we really have no residential neighbors we have 128 that's very busy at Bed hour and very noisy and all we're doing is moving equipment on site we're not really that can explain what happens early in the day but it's it's merely as Peter said to not conflict with school traffic and at the same time give us a jump start so one of the things we learned sorry go ahead with the high school project is that and and other project is people you know the hours of construction is you know people are arriving to your site at 6:30 even if you're starting at 7 so I think a 7 o'clock start is unreasonable and is quite a bit I know my alarm brust doesn't go off it's sort of there will be noise that travels um s's fine no again most tring to get off I mean with the high school project one of the big things we had that you won't have on this site I agree with neighbors is the queuing of big trucks before the construction started and that kind of thing but I think you won't have that that's really the the more critical aspect is is anything that's coming on and off the site they'd like to do that very early to avoid you know the school traffic and any other traffic that can have can we make that seven um yes how's the board feel about that that's a question is this is this andcompany encompassing our noise standards as well or just construction activities so we have a zoning Bop of noise right it technically does yes well if you if you do the whole DB stuff it definitely does if you to the boundaries not creating TV should we add um to this condition subject to the approval of the what selected so I just I just want to um voice my disagreement with the general statement that we don't have to think about neighbors because we do because we have already heard from many people who live close enough that they're hearing the construction apart from the blasting that we heard about during our last meeting there is interest in the rest of the construction and its ramifications on the people who live nearby you know across from 128 um so I I just I think I'm uncomfortable every time that statement is made that we don't have to worry about the neighbors that there aren't neighbor Neighbors um living right next door in the site thank you so um great um prior to the issuance of an occupancy permit for phase one um so I think we're g are we going to skip over this for right now um this is no this is the this is not Outwater app we're going to skip over anything related to Outwater app that came out you took it out yes yeah there's nothing in here about water rabbit just for the moment that doesn't mean we have forgotten about it that's when you're on at water a and I'm just reacting to hold on we're gonna kind of get through a few of these and then I'm going to take public comment on on the balance of them if if you don't mind just so we can kind of keep we will make sure you raise your hand okay um uh okay can you just explain this one please so this one is um apparently currently Mass DOT has required them as part of their permit to um 25 designed for a build out of the traffic signal at that corre so this is a condition that follows along with what Mass highway requir is they're restating that it's restating that yes because we we did talk about the intersection okay great um I'm actually going to just reverse my my comment take your comment do you have something on the um on the about yeah say could you speak up because our secretary is um online and um give us your name if you can just stand and tell us your name and address hi I'm Mary Ellen moers I live at 71 Street and I just want to make a comment about something I read in the C Cricket about two weeks ago um when you were talking about app Water app and considering some of the options one put out was to direct uh uh bicycles and pedestrians over 128 onto Mill Street and I don't think people are aware of how dangerous M Street currently is putting more people on bikes would just be a more dangerous situation so um that was not brought up in the cricket and I wanted to make sure that was out there for public rec okay great thank you um specifically are there any comments on um the hours of construction before that evaporates because that isn't important um yes go ahead um Stephanie Rogers 59 FL Street um so I do feel like the um hour should be approved and not um just recommended by what you know like your alarm clock is um and because the neighbors do feel it and it's just concerting and we never know how large it's going to be um also I'm I'm curious about this like that we're planning construction traffic around school traffic but aren't we going to have way more traffic with all the business up there so are we going to make people show up to work before 7 a. so display construction understand this the priorities here yeah yeah thank you um so the the uh condition number three is the hours of construction so I'm gathering you would prefer 7 to 6:30 a.m. start I thought it was supposed to be 8 a.m. um that is what the bylaw says this is adding a an uh this is approving an earlier started than that so you would be yeah I'm just not sure why because if the rationale is for traffic there's going to be traffic for now on that's even worse than what it's been thank you and then I think the other question is about Atwater Avenue um is something we are going to consider but not tonight we are concern we are thinking about how much additional traffic at water will have and how much construction will'll have on it and a whole uh pedestrian and bike safety is something that we are concerned about we're just not going to find the solution tonight okay um uh number five uh sorry any any other comments on house too so I have way too many copies of this and I apparently don't have the latest one um when was this items taken out of about the or why aren't we talking about the striping of at water so we are going to talk about at water but not tonight there's some other things we're waiting there's a whole bunch of other things happening about Atwater we will absolutely talk about Atwater okay but just not tonight so that's why it's out it's not that it won't be in in the future so so okay and then then the one that we were just talking about last meeting we had that the applicant shall be responsible for completion of a traffic mon monitoring study following occupancy of phase one why was that taken out um it hasn't it's still it's still in there right now see look up there were two that were combined Mark had two before he had a a four and five and they were combined now four okay out of all the ones I printed I somehow didn't get the was I don't know what it was posted but I printed what was in SharePoint all right I'll try to yeah thank you sorry I think this is here you want a hard copy that well are you using it I'm okay um number five um we uh this is not necess final draft here but um so this is basically saying that there would be a traffic monitoring study following phase one that's kind of what Mass do is going to ask for anyway right yes they're ask for that and is kind of evaluation how the intersections are working and um what the counts are and that type and then they do an intersection control evaluation which is for example like an Alternatives analysis where they'll evaluate the proposed design solution for traffic lights if it's warranted or Alternatives such as roundabout as we had discussed before and whether that's a reasonable alternative or if there is some third design that might work better so um so that's what that it IC study in ction control evaluation sort of duplicate a duplicate to the MSD requirements um okay and and so the reason why this is in here is not to tell them that they have to do it Mass do has is requiring them to do it but that we want to see those reports and evaluate them prior to any decision being so that the planning board can uh you know I think that would is kind of what you're Laura these three four five and six are related to each other and that that's sense that they're about traffic patterns and traffic um traffic design I'm just trying to get this sort of sequence of things straight and what we're asking for and what the goal of the planning board's review is so at number four we're saying before Perman of occupancy phase one so before this phase coincident to the work the um applicant can design 25% schematic uh design for traffic signal that's one thing and then we want to look at that before it gets submitted or the planning board wants to look at it before it get submitted submitted to do then number five says after occupancy phase one a traffic monitoring study is performed I think the planning board might want to um discuss with the applicant at what time the what's the right time to monitor traffic you know is that September or you know is there is there an optimal months to gauge what traffic what the traffic impact is after occupancy or you know is there a phased move in by CST employees whatever that might be so I think that's discuss consultation with consultation with the planning board in terms of before the traffic study is performed about what are the parameters and the timing and so forth and then the number six which is the inter C control evaluation I need to understand that a little more I know Mark you were just talking about that but I think I was thinking about 4 and five so how does that fit in to the traffic monitoring study and the design what's the sequence there um my understanding is that they do the and perhaps think that they do the uh traffic analysis first and then they do the um intersection control evaluation afterwards so that they know what kind of parameters they're talking about for traffic and what they would have to design for what alternatives may or may not work for that particular intersection so that's are we talking about the same intersection all the time is it always 28 the Northbound okay yeah it's going to suggest that this could be clarified that this um we could group these things by um this so that for people people who are not as inent with us we're talking here about the School Street 128 intersection and that's why Mel Street is right there at that inter yeah because it's not totally clear and F it's not explicit I think we can have a add a heading but also does the the findings of the traffic monitoring study because we only took design for the intersection to 25% which is appropriate so once you find out the impacts of the monitoring study then you want to the design of number that's number seven okay that's number seven but that prior to phase two occupancy permit um then there's the the actual new study right so I think my only comments here that we sort of make it clear that this is the intersection we're talking about the intersection area and that um the study happened in consultation with the planning board so Define some of those criteria I do have a question for the applicant um as it relates to the intersection so the mass do requirement for phase one is to do a 25% designed for a Northbound intersection um however when you do the traffic monitoring study and the intersection control evaluation does that includes both southbound and the Northbound ramps in other words the end of the day there could be some something that might be required mitigation for the southbound and um based on traffic volumes when people are leaving the site and turning so do they look at the entire North and South unfortunately we don't have TTC here with us but yeah I think that their study will evaluate you know the entire 128 intersection um but the only place where we've been instructed to do a kind of design is at the one that was getting that was the most stressed right the rest of them had you know very had plenty of uh actually the wording from the state is the proponent will mitigate the projects impacts to the Route 128 Northbound School Street intersection by installing the fully accurated traffic Sy demand based vehicle Etc so it's referring to that one but but what I'm saying is when you do the traffic study at the end of phase one once you're occupied will you evaluate the um the southbound inter section it will because what we're trying to do is evaluate the traffic the new traffic coming to Manchester in particular to the site right so what we're expecting is that there'll be a dramatic increase in the number of people turning towards Essex and then turning right on at one right but I'm saying at the end of the day it's going to reverse and there'll be a more substantial traffic turning left onto School Street and then left again onto 128 Southbound so it may not necessary it may require some sort of mitigation maybe not a full traffic play but may require something else if it's a value may not require anything that is the state jurisdiction and if if they conclude that it's it's required we're stuck with it well and sort of to Mark's point the stateus is has these same right but but the state will consider comments from the town on traffic lights or mitigation at their intersections um sometimes my experience sometimes just go it's the state's intersection whatever the state decides and other towns are more concerned and want to at least participate and comment on the process so okay so Mark if I understand it you want just want to make sure that the wording is in there that they evaluate the entire intersection nor and southbound at at the appropriate times and if it's not required to be for any mitigation you know just see what happened yeah see what happen we'll confirm that with TC okay okay so number eight refers to adding um Mark say what well it looks like on this be um to um what we have suggested um um in being consistent with the state is that in the middle of that paragraph that had initially is proposed we said the applicant will finalize design and install traffic signal infrastructure which is what the state said so so we put the word signal in because the state wanted that word but you took it out I took it out because maybe during the if if something changes during the um the evaluation process and they require some alternative to the signal then you would be required to construct that instead with respect to the alternative to the signal in the report that we filed with the application it says that according to the Tia a roundabout is not feasible because the proponent would be required to acquire property abing the intersection to construct the roundabout and it would significantly shorten the length of the Route 128 Northbound onor ramp from 720 feet to between 500 and 600 feet which is below M Do's guidelines for minimum ramp length and so they seem to take that off the table well in my discuss so I did have like I said last time I had a meeting with mass doot and that they would be amenable to looking at that and it's not a hard and fast schol that they they do make adjust you know um you know they have it says it's a guideline so um it's not so okay so we can um what I'm going to do is just note that self signaling would like to see this insert the word signal but this is um just make that as as input moment where was signal after the insult traffic signal instead of infrastructure no it it's traffic signal infrastructure okay um but we we'll so not at this point traffic signals unfortunately m is coming out super small but I'm getting for the state language okay great thank you going to keep us moving along number eight is the um Mikan from Atwater to This Town Line I I am suggesting if I may that uh that provision stay the same but at this point since we have the other offsite improvements to talk about the at water and whatever we hold did it it say constructed to Atwater Avenue instead of the Essex town line because there are issues with respect to extending it to the Essex town line both with respect to design and cost that are going to be in that basket of things that we're talking about with the with the town okay I think that's we're gonna so I'm gonna just say hold on that one oops um a question with some of that is is some of that the mass do jurisdiction then yeah that's part of that issue I think it's the width and the constructibility No but even yeah just yeah the portion the portion from the off ramp to the edge of the State Highway layout is their jurisdiction okay that's not that's not all the way to Black Earth and not all the way to that one okay this to be resolved okay thank you um sustainable features will be uh installed and comments on that one if I may um we're as you know from hours of testimony sell signaling it's all about sustainability and quite proud of that and and it's going to advertise that um we're happy to agree to put a display near the trail head and um with resp with respect to the lobby inside the building I I think it would be premature to tell us to create something in our uh so we certainly will be touting what we've done on the website for sure and in other venues and we're and we're actually anticipating fair amount of publicity about it but we I don't think we really need under these circumstances to require self- signaling to put a display inside the lobby how about uh if we were to say a display of sustainable features visible to visitors and you know some V visitors to the building I think somebody brought it up saying that they went to another building um and there was a display of sustainable features and they thought it was interesting that you know for for people who might be going to see that Sue has a comment and so that's why where that came from was from comments from I don't remember who did that I I do remember this discussion and I remember the result which was that we agreed with sell signaling that it would be a security issue but it to to because people won't really be spending time in their Lobby unless they're working that's what we did the trail Laur I remember we were talking about the bu building which has a big dashboard buity it's very cool it's a more publicly accessible building um I think the intent if it's signed at the trail head and it can have a QR code or something that links you to where your website is not can be updated you know I think that means the inent and we don't need to see what goes inside the building okay great um have questions here yeah a comment on on the sustainable features not so much on that um I just know there's some questions back here about the construction time they want to clarify is it 7 to six six days a week uh that was Gail that was Karen Bennett um so the current proposal is hours of construction shall be from 7 a.m. to 6: p.m. no blasting shall be permitted earlier than 8:00 a.m. hours of construction shall be 8: am. to 6:00 pm. on Saturdays and no work permitted on Sundays and federal holidays during construction a local state federal laws should be followed regarding and we added um to make a note to look at the whether or not the local zoning our Manchester Zoning for noise um and we added also subject to S select board approval yeah I believe that you said you read 8 to six on Saturdays when this says 8 to 8 to five I'm sorry and maybe that first sentence want say week days week days as I so s to six days week days and 8 to five on Saturdays so um just to clarify that um if when you go home and you think about this you can also send us an email we do read them um go ahead yes hi um do I have to stand up yes pleas stand your name Elizabeth Thomas 27 n Street I just want to I don't know if everybody here really understands what's happening on mil Street and Forest Street like what the pressure that's being put on all of the residents you're talking about every single time we come here it it's more and more things being taken from us and given to cell signaling technology it's more blasts it's trer blasts it's going from one blast to two blasts it's uh you know now detours are starting on Forest Street and M Street or the water and sewer work that's going to be starting it's now increasing the hours overall for construction and then also you just said for blasting now 8 a.m. right now the current permit is 10 to2 so what of my concerns is right now we've gone from one blast to two blasts I have no reason to believe we're not going to end up with five blasts six flaps per day I don't know that and the reason why I don't know that is because every single time I told something something changes after that I was told on I went for a a blast site visit which I was very thankful to be invited for that but I was I asked on that day if there would be if if it would be one blast per day for the duration and I was told yes the very next blast was that following Wednesday and it was two blasts and we've been told on camera I been told in writing that it would only be one blast that changed as for the construction hours now you want to do that and I can I live at 27 mil street so I live right on that turn I can hear the construction noise it's not horrible you know there's leaves there's other Highway noises but when you take that away when those leaves start falling with the fall and there's no longer that sound barrier and there's no traffic going down 128 you're going to hear that and that's just one more thing one more pressure point on this street I don't know I know some of you have seen the emails that all of us have been sending and it's because we're hitting our Breaking Point already and it's it's just not fair and I have nothing against sell signaling technology I think the world of that company but it is not fair that you're building this on our backs so I just wanted to say that thank you um can I just get a clarification is uh on the blasting hours are we have we come already committed to attend a two blasting schedule where did that I think that's I believe that is the requirement for the state anything within the 250 foot range from 128 that's the parameters for that particular permit which we have not obtained yet too from the state right from the state correct so sh uh I just I just want to clarify um the the um so the so as the blasting gets closer to 128 then the hours will be limited to 10 to two is that correct anything within the two there's a separate permit that's required for within a boundary of 128 and that's been applied to the mass do and that goes through you know a number of different departments so we're waiting for that once that happens that's where the Restriction between 10 and two is the only hours that blasting within that Corridor is allowed presently you're trying you're trying to have your daily bet blast middle of the day 11 one cor understanding great uh was that the one day with the two blast this week is to minimize the size of the blast that was actually directed by the fire chief uh a couple weeks ago to have smaller Blass but but M right uh but that's only on one day this week I no um it varies depending on it might be two days one week and one day so if your practice is to have blasting between 10 and two can we is uh maybe it makes sense to have the blasting hours be limited to 10 two in the per I would defer to the fire CH to see what the actual permitting is I I don't know why don't we check with fire CH on that Mark let's um add that it's blasting 10 to two can I just ask where did the 8 a.m. come from on blasting okay so it sounds like that should be yeah but they've been doing blasting in the middle of the day blasting at 8 a.m. not that's not set perspec okay I don't think the issue is when they're blasting um okay let's uh let's keep um uh um so we can all hear the benefit of your comment yes in the back again share what is stand I'll share the conversation back here I think yeah and your name again Moors saying you know 10 to two is fine and but he's deferring but you know I would hope that you know you will consider 10 to two as you know just it's worth wide to consider at 8:00 in the morning I had somebody in my house and one of the blasts occurred and they came running out and they're like did we just have an earthquake so for you people that don't live on Forest and Mill this is what we're experiencing your you're sitting in your chair it's start shaking your your windows are shaking I've had residual come down my chimney you know so just want you to know what we're dealing with thank you for that input you um raise that yes go ahead Thomas 27 M Street I just want to point out I know that week that we W move to two blast the purpose was to get to smaller blasts but actually that week we had our largest blast to date was uh Thursday the 22nd it was 325 before that the highest we had was 0.25 Mary Allen was the only one that I know of um that was home for that blast and you were pretty horrified that's the BL you're talking about right yeah yeah I had whatever comes down your chimy yeah it's mortar um so that's the problem that they had over with the high school um so you guys you guys really locked out that for some reason every single household that was closest on Middle Street my house all my neighbors none of us were home there was somebody in Maine there was somebody in New Hampshire there was someone uh marth's Vineyard there was people working literally not a single soul was home if anybody in any of those houses were home for that. 325 I guarantee you every single one of your phones would have been blowing up because if she felt it like that at her house um she doesn't even live on Mid street she lives on Forest Street then I can't even imagine what house felt like that is a massive difference between what everybody who's been complaining about2 has been feeling and I'm I'm concerned so I don't know thank you and I know the fire chief is um is monitoring that so Mary had another comment um so I I just want the residents to know I you know the fire chief and the town planner this weekly blasting schedule that went out that had the planning board's um um so-called approval we did not discuss two blast today um I as a planning board member I was very upset that it was sanctioned here that this was in coordination with the town planning board it was not um at the last meeting we talked about one blast a day not two um so hopefully the planning board does not get misrepresented again um and as we go further along along in these I did pull out the Manchester um Essex Regional High School um conditions and they had I think about six relating to blasting and Demolition and I think we can incorporate or we should incorporate a lot of them into this um and hopefully we'll help some residents with their concerns of um being notified communication level of last level of instruction so I think if we could do it for the high school we can do it for here as well so why don't you send those suggestions to Mark let's keep going through the um uh um the uh propos condition so we get through um permission I think we talked about the granting to the preses um um can we I um I may have read the attached document incorrectly but um is this going to be a permanent permission it looked like there was a a right to um suspend it in the document and if I was reading the attached legal document correctly it looked like there was a section in there that um at a future date would allow this the suspension of the easement right to happen right um could we try to make it a permanent no um we are we came up with this whole concept of providing access to the trustees and creating the trail head creating the parking lot we weren't asked to do that we did that voluntarily we need to make sure that it doesn't interfere with activities in the property uh phase two or phase three or whatever and consequently we don't anticipate uh suspending that at any point but it could become necessary if it were a permanent easement then we're sort of stuck with it and uh this is voluntary on our part and we intend to keep it in place that's only a safeguard if we have to uh pause it that's all it is and the trustees are probably fine with that um okay I just I just wanted to point that out that it's it's and that's way it's a license okay ra a question about that yeah I I also understood that it was a license but I have a think a similar question that I proceed Mary has which is you know if we get to phase two and there's a reason why that license needs to be terminated or retracted or whatever then we granted phase one based on this condition so of that trail access no longer happens and we're at phase two and it's just discretionary then how much how much teeth you know where's the balance of like I understand that this is a gesture that CST is making but at the other hand we're trying to um facilitate a sort of more Regional you know Trail Network here so is there I don't know that I have a suggestion I'm just raising it as a you know if it only lasts through phase one and then it disappears at phase two that a concern we're not planning to have it disappear after phase two we might want to change the location of it uh the property does have the benefit of an easement through the Brady property uh that would that would could connect to the trail head so there may be a reason at some point to modify it and we're just trying to maintain some flexibility right right so cell signal is very supportive the trustees yeah I I think we we share that and maybe there's a way to just build in some flexibility but to say that you know if a future trail head access changes it'll be reviewed with the planning board trustees or something like that but the intent is to maintain the trail access I don't know reasonable but just consideration for a phase to be Revisited as a in phase two should it need to be change you know maybe a suggestion that should it need to be changed in phase two or something that I just want to keep the intent the intent is to facilitate public access to the trail head maybe we put the intent if we state in order to you know it is the intent to provide right um Karen do you have a a specific comment on this issue it's back to the other question so I apologize Karen benett 28 L can I have two questions on the hours um I went through this one the Turk field were put in the construction vehicles were showing up at 2 and 3 in the morning and I was hearing be be be all night sleep so I had to contct an Harrison I had to contact the police constantly so I don't know if there's a provision for that that's one and then the second thing is a lot of these people are already talking about damage and as you know we had damage to the homes that surrounded the high school we did we brought that up last time and no one said anything so is there a recourse for the people that are having damage yes um it's possible just to finish the last clause and then go back to the traffic sorry the construction hours conversation I just didn't want to lose the yeah please do um so is there something we could say about the intent is to provide public access to the network as long as we can reserve some flexibility fine yeah okay new on language but yeah I don't think we need to worry about the specific language of it right now thank you um correct me if I'm wrong that if there is damage then it becomes between the the uh lasting company and home owners that's the and your and insurance there's a process filing through the fire department and then that gets transferred to the the blasting comp okay um going to keep moving through these here um and um at Water AB we uh construction water AB we keep kept freid of mud and dirt and debris the general housekeeping um the drainage system number 12 as um will be functional or suitable best construction best management practices um could you explain the purpose of the last sentence seems like that's a detail within a larger set of 12 yeah if that's are those depicted on the drawing okay the question why are we calling those it's really not necessary they're depicted already on the drawings so I mean to call those out above yeah I think we just talked about also that the there's a lot of belts and suspenders on okay should we um should this be for phase one and phase two it just says phase one the site infrastructure is for both phases so we can add phase two no but it's for phase one I mean the infrastructure size once it's done at end phase one it's done for phase two all the site infrastructure is happening at phase for phase one prior to phase one pH building only the drainage will all be installed okay um can I add something to the storm water that's Nate please go ahead yeah Nate derer DPW um kind of just a minor thing I would revise drainage system to storm water management system and then uh I think we should reference the town storm water bylaw uh with which sets forth you know all of the performance uh and and system um design parameters that they need to meet which I'm sure it does but I think it just provides a little more uh back stop uh for us to go back to great thank you GL somebody's paying attention um okay um this is the order conditions is um a concom thing do we need to include that again it's just another so you reference that I think more importantly from my perspective 13 references operation maintenance plan and maintenance plan so I think the point is we need to have a receive a operations and maintenance plan should be a condition right we we have but we need to receive it and that was a high school that was one of the commissions of high school yeah and those are all things that are laid out in the storm water uh bylaw like everything that they need to provide pre-construction post construction uh Construction monitoring you know it's a very detailed uh bylaw ask a question Nate yep Nate would that include the green infrastructure on the site too yep L um yeah so that that's one of the things that's actually on the fall town meeting is a revised storm water bylaw that would still govern this even though this permit this gets permited first that's what the general right yeah it was just a yeah okay so we'll remove we'll reference the general bylaws y that means we're removing number 13 I think so you recommend removing 13 I think you could consolidate them you know 12 and 13 could be Consolidated but certainly referencing the order of conditions you know doesn't hurt anything either okay why don't we uh maybe you can suggest some language yeah I have a couple questions with that one about um yeah and I I think um Nate are you referencing the ms4 storm water yeah so the storm water bylaw is a is incorporated into our ms4 as a townwide so like part of our ms4 work that we have to do we have to do uh the DPW we um will have to do site inspections um so there's a whole Litany of things that we have to do for our ms4 permit as a town um you know inspecting the sites um but part of the ms4 to come into compliance uh with the EPA is a you know a set of bylaws that you know are are very detailed and and you know govern everything for what we need to do for our storm water management for development you know whether it's uh virgin sites or if it's you know uh uh renewing sites yeah so just the reason I wanted to clarify is because in that bylaw um I think we might want to clarify that it states long-term operation and maintenance plan and then it also states that um for the first two years we get semiannual report and thereafter it's annual report from the project so I think if we clarify that in the conditions it'll well maybe what we do is just reference the specific bylaw because um then we're not don't have two two things especially if the bylaw has to be updated which we can talk about under the other business how work would need to adjust the language but I think you're right by by referencing the bylaw then by defin by definition we have referenced the the reporting and the operations maintenance yeah and then the planning board can then have a separate discussion because we've never actually done that or probably should have done it maybe with the school I don't know but we have not been getting annual report so um or semiannual so how the planning board yeah good good thought um okay this is the lighting andt lighting levels so the the key difference between what was submitted by attorney wski in my version is that his refers to um if there's light spillage that exceeds um the intensity of the levels depicted on the plans and mine is the planning board just generally has a concern with the lighting levels or intensity or light spillage and uh because I've experienced a couple of times where it's designed a certain way but it still creates an impact and even if they build it as designed there still like a unforeseen impact where some additional shielding needs to be uh added um or um and so even though it's technically correct it's created an impact and we've um you know met with the applicant and had them adjust um light directions light intensity um or added shielding to lights it doesn't happen often when you get such detailed plans but it it does sometimes occur so that's that's the key kind of the difference yeah I'm gonna speak on two two points on that one of one of which is when you have a an example is a Sports field which obviously um which you measure the foot candles of this light coming off the sports field at a distance away from the field and there's no light but yet when you look at it in the sky it's a blazing um football student whatever it is high school andot whatever you can see Ott's field from five miles out to sea and so um this as you've written this I worry that it's very unspecific and um maybe intentionally so knowing you uh no you're usually very specific um so I think I would like the remedy to be a negotiated uh conversation or some sort of uh will make every effort to or something that is also uh cooperative and collegial um because um well usually that's what happens right but guess I'd like to I think it's because get complaints from neighbor Butters right and that offers you the right that offers you the ability to require a change and that spend tens of thousands of dollars of design right that's my concern tens of thousands dollars worth of Lights to just for someone arbitrarily be able to say yeah we change them well it's usually not arbitrary it's usually for very specific well because the the plans that we submitted right were very specific with respect to the lighting at every location on the site I thought it was appropriate to say in the event there is light spillage that exceeds or intensity that exceeds the nature levels depicted on the plans and then I had added so that it it wasn't vague the planning board may require the applicant to cause the intensity of lighting to be reduced or reasonable modif ation to the lighting to be made I.E shielding the fixtures causing such spillage I had I had drafted all that in before okay yeah I think that that's a little better because it's a little more specific and it references the plans that have otherwise were subject to your whim which I'm very concerned about I've been done enough lighting projects to know so I think the intent is good but Mark so let's substitute what what number of yours is that I like Mark but he's getting very aggressive Mark I I missed that last sentence uh oops Mark glovsky vers I'm okay with this uh uh what what number his number 12 is 12 yeah this number 12 is okay okay so so I agree with the vagueness of this um I don't there's no time frame on this so in five years 10 years I mean I think we would want a time frame on it at least for you guys not for us right I don't think you want to what do you mean I don't think you want to hear from the town in five years saying you know what now we think the lights are too bright right so there's no time limit and I don't know what Authority the planning board actually has to do any type of enforcement like this um that's why it's kind of a mutually beneficial I mean I think s signaling but just kind of say we don't want to do it we don't really we're not enforcement so we have no you do have the right to enforce your positions um okay I yeah we've just never been in that spot so so I guess I would then still clarify what are we enforcing right is it um the lights any lights is it any time frame is it well they've given us a lighting plan they've given us a detailed lighting plan fixture pipes and shade so if the if the uh Shades fall off the lights or the intent that you know they're no longer there lights that are not dark sky compliant those would be obvious things and then I think the so can I ask a question here so Mark you referred to a drawing where photometrics were all defined for the entire site yeah that so your suggest interesting if if it exceeds the numbers the photometrics on those drawings EXA then we have a point to talk to exactly okay having done this in the past unfortunately I've been on the wrong side of this but uh it's he that's that's understandable but it will require us for us to go measure the photometrics on the site if we feel it's a violation so I guess my concern with I think we Mark's language actually has some broader than just the metric because like I said a football stadium you can measure the photo metric 200 yards away from it and there's very low foot candles but the St thing is still glowing when you look at it from a distance so we're trying to avoid the glow from a distance not the uh additional foot candles that you'd measure on the edge of around 128 which will be low it's the glow is the glow is the I think and that's not that's hard to measure well we're not going to you know cell signaling is a daytime operation for the most part so the the lighting probably what lights are on at night but it's going to be minimal and it needs to be objective I mean your definition of a glob my definition of a glow may be different so it it really is about beating the standards that are on that plant that's right yeah well the the other thing I could see is you know if depending on along 128 if the screening isn't sufficient and there might be a glare from certain lights out on the roadway theoretically um that could cause a problem as well so probably not but um well can I suggest in order to but I think the language here is sufficient so I I think that's fine I do Laura one all I wanted to do was to strike and add the time frame because I think with the other language it's specific and it refers to the plan but there's nothing else we have in here that expires at a certain point just want to be bling condition okay is that make sense okay I want to try to get through the rest of these um we can um let me let's go to the last two because they're a little easier I think um special permit shall lapse if the building permit from phase ones have not been issued within 24 months it may be extended for one year that make any problem that and then the applicant should prepare um a plan to train public safety personnel that was a suggestion by the thcom number 16 is not not applying to the phase two phase is that correct this because all of the site work and all of the right so this is commencing with phase one which includes all the site work right so that's the only building permit that's right covered by this three-year time frame the the speci the timing of the special permit we might want a special permit timing for phase two is there any is there any no I'm not proposing that I'm not proposing that I just you're clarifying I was just clarify that wasn't expiring and that you had to get the building permit B right within that threeyear period okay thank you all right um any other comments on 16 or 17 all right uh 15 um a performance guarantee in the sum of 250,000 to secure uh stabilization of site and prevent off-site damage in the event of the applicant Awards completion of the improvements permitted by the special permit so think uh the in here is to to make sure that uh correct me if I'm wrong Mark that the the site work is um done you that's our that's our risk right something you guys don't finish the building doesn't get built that's not our problem but the site work I believe the purpose of this is make the stabilize the site so that if it was abandoned that some of the uh improvements would be still in place so that you didn't s so we wouldn't have silt running off into the Su work right I did I did add a sentence that propos sentence on the tail of that that said the performance guarantee shall be released upon the issu occupancy permit for phase one if not previously released by The Den I think that's reasonable and I think it can also be released in Bas sometimes it's released in so release Sarah there's there's no time frames on this at all about when and if or when when things have to be completed yeah the applicant shall provide a performance guaranteed the sum of 250,000 be to secure stabilization of the site and prevent offsite drainage in event the applicant ofs completion of improvements permitted by special permit I plan but you do you want to put any constraint on that at all well I mean as far as one it should be submitted to the town yeah ask ask a general question when it starts or when it ends right yes so when Mark sentence Mark sentence would would address when it ends it's you know you get C ofo for phase one then the bond gets relased I see Marx yeah Marx is you can s issuance of building per right can do that um could we just go over how the 250,000 was calculated like how do we know it's enough too much where' that number come from I have that question um I have left it blank I wanted to make sure everyone was okay with this condition Mr glovsky had uh CS here put in that figure in consultation what it would cost to to stabiliz and stuff I think it's probably generous I would suggest we talk to Nate and Chuck and make sure because they're going to be the people who are going to go out and stabilize the it doesn't make difference so whatever they think yeah so I mean the qu the you're already doing some work but the question is you know if they need to go out and Seed it and grade it and install a number of catch basins then that's that's the concern reality is one under the ordered conditions anyway so it always has to be stable right no matter what I hate that while you're here but the the performance gu this is Mark's words the performance guarantee should be released upon issu of the occupany of OCC for phase one if not previously released under phase two so this we're saying that all the measures CED on be done under phase one so that's why we're tying everything to the certificate o one all the major plantings all the the soils will be stabilized the only thing phase two truly is is building proper additional geal potentially yeah correct so I'm searching here to find out is is there a reason to put a deadline or a date or a time frame the end of this say you don't build phase two well that's that's what we're trying to do is figure out how to get the money back we've sat we satisfied we've stabilized everything it's all green flowers everywhere we we need to know we can get the bond back and that at the latest St at the latest would be with the certific it's objective phase one of phase one there is no bond for phase two what happen this is this is purely hypothetic what about if you don't complete phase one B you take the so there's no time frame that says when that no we take the money if they go if they decide to sell to sah and I yeah um and they don't complete the building and they they walk away we try to get them to come back and finish it but in the event that they can't our risk is that there's Runa I see this the risk is there's silt and runoff running off into Sal brook or some sort of um other condition that we send we take this money we hire somebody or we send Nate screw out then Chuck screw it and that's that's what we're protected against the the building of the building is not something they elect not to build the building yeah they build I'm talking about the site essentially the state development will be complete before the building starts ENT all the infrastructure will be in place the roadway will be in place Peter just suggested that this should be proceeded by saying concurrent with the issuance of special perit we do it instead of prior to I was because you want it in place before we start building the right or two a month after or a time frame after okay thank you the uh stormw water bylaw does have a section regarding shity uh for this specific uh application um in regards to the 250,000 um I guess I think I heard people mention not sure how they came up with the number but I think you would typically you know look at their cost estimates for the site development and base it off of that and come to an agreement on what is actually applicable because you could get into a situation if you're only putting in for $250,000 the shity is only going to be on the hook for that if the cost to repair the site in the unfortunate event that they don't complete the work cost more than 250 then the town would be on the hook for that any additional funding so I think going kind of seeing what their their line items are for site development um you know might give get us more coverage yeah I understand that Nate but their landscape plan is probably more extensive than what a stabilization plan would be which would be the intent um but maybe we can Laura's got a comment this is saying secure stabilization of the site which is you know preventing erosion maybe you're seeding or something but it's not completing the storm water management improvements right is that is that what we should be bonding if yeah I think so I think it's the the whole storm water system to make sure that like someone said you know there's not silt running into sill Brook yeah um or any other adverse effects um that could potentially happen yeah so whatever the schedule of values is for the storm water management system exactly yeah and site work and site work yeah and some portion of the site work you know obviously not for the water m going in the Ring Road but right not to put Ren Road Stone water doesn't work okay um he's talking about all I think we're gonna need to continue okay but we have two um one other comment um online roll and gliden um yes hi this can you hear me talking this is Roland Glidden 54 Forest Street um I just wanted to uh kind of echo Nate's concern about this performance bond it just $250,000 seems like a drop in the bucket if this site was abandoned and you need to do mitigation to make sure that there's you know storm damage um contingencies it just it I don't know why that number isn't more like two and a half million or even a bigger number than that that's my only comment thank you um I just added notes to say let's think about that amount and okay um at this point I think Peter has had to any other comments folks well I have I have ones that I would like to add okay do you want me to send to you or do you want to discuss them send Peter is just signing so we want to continue at this point at this point we should vote to continue he's still there still here just the lower right right hand can you tell us when you're going to leave then we'll we'll do thank you okay uh Mary go ahead thank you oh um so so like I said I I referenced the um High School build because that was the I was here for that but that was the most recent big build I could think of and um so um I had a lot of conditions as I think Gordon and Sarah were on this um so I mean everything from well we don't need that one um so there was a fair amount with the with the blasting um um or explosives for there um and so I think if we could add some of these where um it's just some more communication I think that res are really looking for um getting 36 hours prior notice to convening blasting or demolition operations I know we're just dealing with blasting right now but demolition demolishing anything per se but with the other activities there which could be loud um they did go to 500 feet for the high school so something to discuss um they did have a um a bond with the fire chief um for explosives and I did want to ask because um Mass General law Title 20 chapter 148 has bonds for black te permits have is that part of this construction the permit's been issued so I would have to check again with the fire chief as to what the requirement I'm sure required that it was put up yeah the law says for for um bonds required for blasting permit so I just we have never discussed that here so um I can check wanted to lookist into that thank you um and then um they had conditions for um emergency vehicle access plans um and exits during construction that that was such a tight site if you remember was like two buildings right next to each other so I think that's um but with kind of one way in one way out for Atwater it might be um beneficial to look at um comprehensive project schedule shall be submitted to the planning board um noise level shall not exceed the boards of Health 70 DB um and then they did get get on to other things like the um [Music] uh might not be from the high school but um maybe one for irrigation I know you said you were going to irrigate for the first year um but then maybe we put in the conditions that after the first year it's just the on-site SST well provides the water um the um I didn't see from the police chief the verified site security plan with the fire alarm system plan fire alarm is going to be handled by the building code buing code okay they did I know I just from the high school I think you would reference that the planning board got that um the there was also a geothermal um and they called out the recharge system which we might want to do as well and then the storm water management removal of 80% TSS um that's in this that's in the bylaw yeah um it's also in the order condition inuse um and then again the op um operations manual and just the things that go with that operations and maintenance manual um but I can write these all up and or just send to you or what well um it seems to be the substantive ones are prohibiting irrigation after the first year that you your application or at least your your um uh so just we have to talk to the uh landscape uh architect I think you represented that the first that there would be to get the plants established there would be an irrigation um Laura here we had talked about some kind of operations and maintenance manual for the kind of ecological landscape plan which may say something about an irrigation I not on board with shutting off an irrigation system for after year we got how many hundreds of thousand dollars in do that's breier and we don't want them to die so right um very much um you know Water Management same with water management but we went through all that and the discussions the irrigation you know of the Horticulture and all that so I don't feel like that's that just came out of their documents so I was just going to say put it in the order of condition that's what it said in your documents that you were going to irrigate for the first year and then go to wellwater so I just thought that since we are as a town trying to conserve water we don't have W water part um maybe it was in the St Weston and Samson I also recall the landscape architect saying that there would be irrigation for the plant for the establishment of the plants roughly a year but I think the L let's let's take the larger question which is should we um create some sort of limit irrigation water use limit I guess whether that's from none to not an arbitrary one I would say there's a sustainable landscape you know ecological landscape plan that is submitted to the town that will have the goals in it and then um that is sufficient to my mind what does the desire for long-term irrigation on some of the property should te instead of utilizing Town water drill it well for for irrigation purposes if you recall we do have a rain capture system with a 30 that's designed for the irrigation the outer areas where the embankments are with the mature trees will be I believe she uh our landscape architect had recommended two years of of establishment and then the other irrigation which is just recaptured water would be only for the areas within the building that's the way I yes so I think because their plan is specific already and the plan this permit will reference this plan set if there's a departure from that and you decide to eliminate the rainwater capture system you're going to need to let us know because the rainwater capture is part of many things in the application which is going to be referenced in the special permit I think that's I would feel comfortable with that being the issue where it um yeah I mean I'll these up more coherently um this was all last minute um but I will write up the ones that I think Merit discussion um because there's still some outstanding things in this Weston and Samson memo um that we haven't addressed so we can address those as well so go ahead um some time ago you would ask for comments from the board members to go to Mark and I don't know if you received all those re you received some Maybe but you know if there was a period for when we submitted comments and then if there was any discussion about why some got in or why some didn't you know I think that we should maybe sort of collect our comments and have a period because I'm just concerned about things coming in late that are referencing another project um I I think it's you know it's great to go back and see what we did before particularly where blasting has been a concern um and we talked a lot about about that last night but I do think on the strongest conditions if we reference the discussions and the plans that we've already reviewed here specifically and keep it specific to the project so maybe what we can do can I make a suggestion in terms of process um that we're gonna we've made some great progress tonight on these we still have the Atwater ad and right discussion kind of is still outstanding and Market was working on that um and um I see uh Darren has his hand up we'll get to you in just a second um uh sorry Sarah it's Peter I have to go I'm terribly sorry to interrupt okay thank you Peter for joining us um tonight we need to move to here I think we can just finish out this little process process yeah not process well what you should do first is V to continue the hearing okay if you want to discuss process that's separate no more public com no more comment about right yeah good yeah so I think your comments Darren we're going to have to save if they're substantive but if they're process we'll take them after we close the hearing not close continue the hearing okay they're not substance good thank you for sitting for being here um so I take a motion to continue the public hearing to the next meeting whatever that is september3 23rd at 6:30 uh we try to get the harbor done for this close is there a process timeline to close these out um I think we want to try to do the the dock close yes we want to try to get these done want to do it at 7 I didn't mean like what hour of the day when when are we trying to soon finish okay I think we're trying to finish the talks next time okay so um how it's 7:30 Fus I move to continue the self signaling hearing to September 23rd of 73 second second second yeah I was only saying that now I'm trying to rush the deliberation but I know that we all have to plan to not miss a single meeting and so the longer these goes I just want to make sure that I don't miss a meeting that's all stating this for like know this stuff's important well aware a lot at stake that's why we're not taking the talk okay um so we're gonna put you at 7:30 is that a [Music] problem okay uh what I'll take a nap okay um so I have a motion in a second to continue the public hearing to September 23rd at 7:30 p.m. uh roll call vote Gordon hi uh Mary yes um Peter's abstaining uh Sarah is yes um yes and Laura thank you okay process my suggested uh okay Darren do you have a a suggestion about how to handle your conditions on process sure yeah I just wanted to flag that we did have a call with the applicant and with last week and we just went over and there's a few onproperty items that were highlighted still and we had received all that information so we all the onproperty comments from our peer review have been addressed so I did want to just apply that there's no open onproperty comments I know there's a separate discussion on Atwater a and how that's going to be handled but um the actual site plan and special permit our peer review is complete for the onproperty portion great thank you um and then are there conditions that are not well let me suggest a process yeah but you shouldn't really discuss okay so my suggestion is that you make these edits send them out to all of us as soon as possible like in the next couple days and then to Laura's point we all review them and think about it look through all of our documents and Darren as well and make sure that there are no omissions that we would like to suggest we have suggestions edits or suggested additions we send them to you and then you car you include all of them now don't exclude anything but with a recommendation your recommendation that my that that those be you know tabled or included and that um we get that to you before uh all of this happens like by Monday of next week so that then we have time to kind of digest it and additional comments from Mark lovsky can be and we've been included in the process because uh if we get things earlier then we can hopefully get to the Finish Line together and I'd like to have one document that shows so well we'll so we don't have two documents unclear um Laura does that make sense two two two things can we start sort of below the line we got through Le 15 or whatever and then let's not keep going over those and then additional new and the same time when you're potentially getting new comments could we um ask Mark and I think we would have only copyed Mark nobody else to look back because there was a previous time when you asked please send your comments on a drafts order conditions or special conditions and so I comments are definitely in there so uh either let us know if you need us to resend or please go back and look at those and add the list okay so do you want people to are you going to find them or do you want people to resend them to you resend me because some of those com not the gerain anymore Germain anymore okay right so or they may already be included in something else great we might just resend just to because it's faster than revisiting and then I'm gonna ask Darren also to review the special permit and to make any additional comments as well be part of that process sure thank you um anything else on cell signaling that is not part of the special permit or site plan review Pro you know anything else that's outside of that process okay thank you very much thank you thank you um okay um at this point I'll open the hearing for the read point in Morris Pier ducks and then with a motion to continue it I'll take a motion to I'll take a motion to continue the hearing scheduled for tonight uh for the uh read Park and mors Pier docks and continue it to September 23rd at 6:30 p.m. second okay thank you uh uh Laura real call vote Laura yes uh Sue yes chair votes yes Mary yes yes and I think um there we do have a draft um conditions in our packets same process if you have specific comments if you add or any edits on those they're in they're in the meeting packet what was what you we should have conditions that there are there is a draft dra conditions so again send comment to Mark so just because I am not a special permit expert yeah the conditions are what is listed in special permit and site plan approval granted to that doc contains the special and the F signaling will start to take that form as well yes approval start to take that same form same form so be help we can put it in that same form okay got it so comments to Mark and I'm gonna say can we get those comments to Mark by do people need the weekend is this for sell signaling for sell signaling and for um well first marks going to get back to us the tonight's work um I think I was editing the one in our document wa we don't need tonight back why would we wait for tonight's back before we send our comments okay send your comments we get the self signaling ones by um the end of the week and the um St the others by Monday or Tuesday of the following week that'll be good okay it's just cell signaling no no cell signaling by the end of the week and the docks the two doc ones also do not D CS d c KS okay Gail has her hand raised I'm sure putting us straight on something Gail go ahead um could you tell me who made and seconded the motion I think and Laura seconded it thank you okay um great thank you Mark um so liazon committee task force updates um Harbor Management Group Advisory Group is meeting tomorrow at 5: in room 7 or on zoom and um I have fored them the Reed Park and mors Pier plans so we should have some input on those from them before we take up the final um review of the of the docks um um the we've sort of um took a break over the summer I guess is the right way to put it and now um we're gonna there is a talk about doing a survey of people's views about the harbor and so forth so um is that your the task force or the that's the harbor management we're doing the harbor management plan that's who you going to send it to I already sent it to okay yeah um but if you want to hear their comments it's tomorrow five I will report back but um I just as a a side I went to look for them because I think it's all highly intertwined um for the meeting minutes and there hasn't been any meeting minutes posted for 2024 for that committee or task force I should say um we didn't meet for a bunch of months we actually have approved them and I have sent them to town clerk so I'll check um we're out to date in the minutes all right no I haven't looked so that way I will check um thank you yeah Laur um when they haror group meets will you also discuss the or petitions or you no probably just the general just the proposals okay I mean they're not all approved but I know I've sent them I write them right but that but they've been sent um okay but thank you for pointing that out um CPC that's uh Chris he's not here downtown Improvement any updates they also took a summer Hiatus their next meeting is next week okay uh affordable housing trust is also Chris um MBTA task force um updates I soon the MBTA task force never sleeps [Laughter] never we did have a meeting which I missed our most recent meeting but um I think Markie were there and um they went through um and made some minor r s on the uh proposal just tried to streamline based on Emily's input correct yeah Emily and I admit and we had gone to the zonian bylaw the proposed document um and we removed things that were redundant to our already extensive site plan review uh design standards that we already have that was um whole page of things that are already under that and then we moved few other item around and rewarded a few um things that were confusing so that was presented to the uh committee at the time and so that'll be forwarded to the planning board for some meeting upcoming when we have time to uh maybe after the 23rd or we may to around that time have a special meeting maybe the following week for just and the only other thing to add is um the communication uh subcommittee um has scheduled a public forum uh for Saturday September 21st from 10 to 12 on the town common it' be great to have planning board members there um it's going to be just a very short introductory presentation but then question answer comment from the public um that's the primary purpose um we'll have um the information on the districts there the maps the charts of all the specifications um but as always open to suggestions from the planning board of what would be important to in clude um so 10 to 12 Town common on Saturday the 21st what's the time again now that the time in the morning 10 to 12 is the Saturday morning it's going to be outdoors yes and if it's not Outdoors um the rain location I believe will be the Masons oh nice okay so I um I bcom um it's not on here but I just wanted to give an update they talked about the MBTA um financial analysis and I have to say I was a little confused leaving there but I think that they're they asked Mark to um inquire about other Consultants besides rkg G if if anybody else is a available they wanted to somebody to gather other towns examples of their financial analysis um I don't think they officially came up with a plan how they're going to do it or when they're going to do it but um um so I wasn't clear on that but they discussed it um you might have something more on that that Mark but I there was no outcome from that meeting of a what the scope of a financial analysis would be um and then I think it was at that meeting for another task force meeting so you would know better um the idea that we might not get this back from the state by September 30th and I know the planning board hasn't discussed it but um I guess I would like to see the board discuss or have a plan in place if we don't get it back from the state by the 30th that residents know the steps of because I've heard it mentioned that the town meeting might be postponed or cancelled um so I think I think we need to have a plan in place rather than last minute you know go to town meeting go to town meeting and then it gets cancelled because we don't have enough time to review we never got it back whatever we just need a timetable of where's our drop dead dates and what we need to do once we get it back from the state as a board Etc I have started more Mark and I met to sort of map out the meetings between now and there's not much time to your I agree and also um so I think we are expecting the some studies to come back fairly soon and um we'll see what the state if the state meets their deadline which is September end of September third I think um so you're right um the reason I was looking at my phone is that um it is possible that we are going to need to TOS toss in another meeting to your you know about planning um either a joint with task force or um to to review a you know to read through all this stuff and get through the zoning the only thing I'll say is that we are going to send the zoning if you haven't already to Town Council so we'll get that read before we hash it through that should be Council already they they did a first draft but I think we need to send the next version or you're in the process of that so that should make it and then it's also going to have the hlc review so you know we we're kind of Mak looking at it it's in its entirety rather than line by line the way we have in the past I hope um but I think we're going to probably need to have another meeting um September actually is one of Ron's favorite months because it had five Mondays and so we have one of them was Labor Day so it's really but um um he always liked those five Mondays always pointed it out um um so there's the September 30th and October 7th which is also select board I understand but there's a we have an extra week in there that we make so I think to Mary's point when things come back once we know which we should know a lot more in the next week or two about the timing and then we'll have to make decisions once we actually know what the so IID asked Emily about the timing and if eohc is keeping to their 90day and he replied it says my understanding is that you hlc is keeping to its 90day review oh good good so um okay we I did receive about three weeks ago a note from eohc saying that our application was complete oh that's good which means you know they know where it is they know where it is they have it and everything we submitted was what they needed so good okay so I think you're right we need it's time is tight and we're definitely aware of that let's see how things shape out in the next few weeks I think um so and one question with this and then it'll be a question after this topic um um an email that we got um from Lorraine aavani asked if um the town had notified eohc of Newport park being de restricted um and I just I have let people know I will follow up with their questions so that since we're on this topic have they been notified of that um are they going to be notified so no the property is on the state's list of properties that's eligible to for the program so um as we've discussed before it is 176 seven towns that are zoning hundreds of thousand Properties or more in bigger communities and there the state is not going to be going through deed property by property reading deed description so the the point is whether it's deed restricted or not the zoning that we are writing and adopting does not restrict the use of the property and that's what the state's concerned about is what is being written and adopted by the town because deed restrictions can be lifted they can be changed town meeting can do it the property owner can do it if it's a private restriction so those things um apparently the state's okay with that just imagine if they had to review every single deed of every single property that's being proposed to be Reed and it take five years to you know to go through all all the communities well and the reason I raised that is that because Town Council highlighted that in their comments um they they highlighted it as a concern and um so they highlighted it so I think it behooves the planning board to address that and I think if it's a known we should have a contingency plan on our side um rather than having to scramble at town meeting or some other scenario so I can't agree with that path but if that's what saying we did do that at the last um um task force meeting uh Richard and I had worked on how how do we adjust the model to make it work and um for the loss of the units at Newport Park and so we presented uh two Alternatives one is adding a few properties to the North End of um Pine Street and then adding a few properties at this end of Pine Street going up um the side street Benet Street and um and then making some adjustments to the densities in a few of the other existing um uh districts and making a couple Corrections for a couple little errors which added maybe four more units and so we basically showed the committee that it was possible and that um and they were um that's kind of where they left it is that's what you know we let's not go down that road with extended discussion because we may not have to but there is a plan in place um that was presented to the commit so can I oh go ahead I just um there was I wanted to just add there were no votes taken on a different plan or anything um at we discussion I watched the meeting since I wasn't there I watched it later but what I wanted to uh comment on the worry that this was flagged by Town Council I take a lot of comfort in the fact that um when we run the state's model it's included it you know nothing happens to it and we've hired this consultant who helped make the model who's worked with the state and she was adamant that we could include it and so I I rely on that um and am confident that we won't have an issue the other just one other thing is this has been brought up a number of times we actually voted to send the the the plan with Newport Park um to the state so that's I think we decided that we were going to send this as it was to the state the second thing is I also take comfort that the state has said our application is complete which means that they did not require deed restrictions for par if they wanted Parcels any list of deed restrictions it would have been part of it would have been required as part of the application and so therefore I think we stay the course and um uh and see what happens the next um I mean unless no in a couple weeks no in a couple weeks and we kind of have a contingency plan but it seems like it's a all all indications seem to be that we're moving in the right direction so could I just ask that we get out on SharePoint um those the new proposed version if need be um and that we have the latest uh models the latest spreadsheets out there so that we know we're referencing the right data um I think we have a NBTA so I'm not sure we want to put out a contingent plan at this point it's very confusing no I'm not put just for planning board members has been it has I think we should I can put out the revised language of bylaw and I think that's important to get out to everybody I have the redline version that Emily and I worked on and I think that's that's important saying that the properties that were discussed because I'd be curious what you know if Newport park has to come off what did the task force who's you know helping the planning board I think it's fair for planning board members to know well I'm not sure the task force has agreed it it was discussions um and I watched the meeting afterwards there were discussions there was no agreement on this will be our backup plan and let's present this to the planning board um so it's just way too premature and um informal I I think I think um the the question is was there an opport was is there something that's possible there are lots of things that are possible lots of things another five let's see if this if what the state comes back with they're going to meet their deadline and hopefully this issue will go away so September 23rd not the 30th is that right don't I 2 is our next meeting so we would know by our next Mee we might um I'd have to look up what the date it was officially submitted um it was June in the 20s so I don't really then we only had three meetings after that that's why I'm saying proba well was wasn't it was submitted after a select board meeting in you so it took another week or all right let's let's hold on on um and then just another issue that Nate brought up tonight that we um uh just should be aware of um I think and what I um okay the issue is recall that we move storm water from our zoning to the general bylaws so would have broader applicability and I um to to more things rather than just when you're getting a um doing a a building and um we use the state's model bylaw so apparently the federal EPA has decided that the states model bylaw is insufficient or inadequate wow and so now the EPA is breathing down the state and the or the town's neck to modify the um General bylaw again with a another model and Greg really wants to have that happen in Fall as as Nate implied so happily for us it's not a zoning matter so we do not have to hold hearings and it would be the select board that will hold them but we will have maybe even as early as the next meeting because we'll have so much the other meetings we'll get Nate and Greg be long meeting to come and just give us a overview um maybe there's something written that they can give us as an overview to go in our packets um uh the storm water but that will be um people would like to have that on them and on the town meeting warrant and because we deal with some storm water stuff we should be aware of it but it's kind of a sorry one last thing it sounds like it's a here's your bylaw adopt it are we as a planning board required to give an opinion does this fall within those things so great enough opinions on no it's just I'm not a storm water expert yet you know I think it's sounds like it's a very um prescriptive reir per town or per for the um the EPA is telling States here's the bylaws your towns need to adopt oh I just make a St so Sarah in that particular case for CST CST the references to the new that's why I wanted it to not be okay super specific um we want it to be to the general bylaw storm section storm water section because that might change with this change but then it might change sche well a month ago yeah so um so yeah that's why we want to make sure that the special permit language doesn't reference an old yeah requirements but they're yeah is already doing so much with storm water that I'm not fearful that new language by the EPA that says you know percent phosphorus removal but they're not already meeting that yeah but I think they are pushing they're going to push it to towns to comply but the easiest way to comply is with the new build by a sophisticated developer like this you know there's a lot of um burden on towns to comply yeah the the treatment of so but your existing parking lots and all that kind of stuff that now gets governed by general which is right good in terms of water quality or burn on the town but it's really not it's not going to be projects like this that are building it ground up and right are dealing with it I'm not really worried about the high school the the other two biggest projects in town are high school and Memorial School and there's best management practice storm water catchment and treatment and all that but I but we have other parking lots size sure stuff going right so along the bylaws um I think the planning board needs to discuss the Adu bylaw from the state and we're going to have to change language in our bylaws and um I think we might get in a pinch if we don't do it before the February issuance of the Adu State mandate so um if we can have that at our next meeting as well I have a lot more information I'll know a lot more about that for your next meeting so if you want I can so is there already somebody in town drafting an Adu not yet bylaw not yet okay be drafting it besides the planning board uh I would probably be the person to draft it for us but um so again we can put it on as a discussion item for the 23rd I don't not sure whether absolutely necessarily has to I'll know a lot more there's a bunch of training things coming up and other things I haven't really followed the bylaw up until now so um so by the 23rd I'll be able to advise you with whether it's something that we absolutely have to do by the by February or whether it's something that can ail till April that's going nice well if we wait we just have a period of time where we can't put our personal stamp on it of how we want it for the town so I don't know why we would wait if we're doing other laws the same meeting well the meeting is in November and so why we would wait is that we don't have a draft even yet and we know how long these things take to churn their way through draft to Fin and are there regulations yet yeah there are you send can you put those in our packet for us that be great um so you may have to yeah we'll see okay great we'll put that on the agenda for the next meeting as well I'd like to try to get those like that and decisions made on couple of those things and maybe get um good any other um things updates um any public comment okay uh approval of minutes um we have July 22nd and August 12th um I didn't see you do not have August 12th and July 22nd was put in late I apologize I didn't see you okay yeah I was doing it this weekend so I guess um unless we have a critical mass people who can uh I looked at I read July 22nd okay do you want to take a minute look should we do that next meeting look at if you want if they don't we can look at them live together if you want if they're not in the packet by today Friday then let's um push that off Gil and um make sure we do those next meeting um okay any other business I do what I do okay good I know everybody wants to go so I will it's early but um I I'd like to ask that we get correspondence back on our agenda um we used to list the correspondence that we received on the topic um and this meeting with the public hearings and stuff wasn't conducive to it but I do respond to people saying I will raise their concerns at the planning board meeting um I know residents are extremely frustrated that they have questions they send emails they ask questions I'm sorry that was repeating um and and it's dead silence so I think it's respectful to acknowledge the receipts of these and to address the questions them um we don't have to go necessarily through people's opinions if we don't want to but you know we've had I think five on blasting we've had a bunch on the um docks we've had Financial impact study um questions we've had pedestrian and cyclist access along Atwater um you know these are all topics we're discussing and we just blatantly ignore residents input and um people may read them but they don't come up in conversation at a meeting and I hope other board members would like to see that change as well and if you want to go through the questions now I'm happy to I'm I have them highlighted and underlined so at least people would think that we're paying attention or when it's relevant during the the um are these coming directly to you Mary Y no no they they're coming to the planning board email which you still have but we need that we need looking at went through this so um Gail has her hand up let me take Gail's comment and then the only emails we had for this period of time were seven emails from Lor and iani and they are in SharePoint if you are receiving other emails on subjects that I know nothing about I can't do anything if you do not forward me emails you receive okay so I I don't I haven't I didn't look at the I just get them at my town emails so the day after last meeting we had I think five emails on blasting I thought you were CCD on them I'd have to look um okay no I did not I did I have not received any emails on blasting I do have the emails on the doc because Bion sent me those but I have nothing I received no emails on blasting um I so I don't I don't know who forwards them to you I know the other planning board members received them um I don't know what the processes so do read all the emails that come in and if there are topics that are new I flagged them but I think the topics that I've seen so far are not top are topics that we have discussed so financial analysis has been discussed lasting been discussed pedestrian uh safety has been discussed um at Water Avenue um fueling at the dock which at the at the Docks has been discussed um those are the ones on the top of my head so um I think it's one of those challenges with our with our um I do think Mary is correct that we should take citizens emails seriously and read them but um I don't sure I'm not sure I agree that we have to address them all in um uh line by line or questions we you know it's hard to if everybody if every question gets answered it's a maybe Mark you advice on how to handle this so technically when people send you stuff questions and things technically really only have to respond to request for public documents people asking your opinions or what's the board going to do about this or what are you going to do about that you do not have to respond you're asking for your opinions about things you sit as as a board and make a joint opinion decision so you can choose to have individual ual conversations whether it's by email or by voice phone calls with people that's your choice you do not have to respond personally and individually to every question that comes in so um because it can be very time consuming to to do so well I put blasting in a folder and there's one two 3 four five six seven eight 9 10 11 12 emails um that I read um but I think we've had last discussions about this here and um so and the public comment is meant to be just that to inform you so that when you do hold those discussions you're aware of concerns of people whether it's a whatever the the issue is so that you know what those concerns are which is why you put it in share point so you can all read it um but to respond individually to lots of questions is not is is a little kind of going beyond the scope well the other thing is we're getting copied on the because 39 people were copied on that email we're getting the thank you and the you know accy to all of those I didn't count those but um I I think if yes you look at the letter of the law is it a planning board member requirement to address this I think it's it boils down to what kind of board do we want to be and as a board if you're saying you don't want to acknowledge these at a public meeting I don't think residents are going to wait till nine o'clock for public comment um I am more than happy to answer and I have with some of them um my opinion or send emails to town employees to try to get answers for residents um I think it just boils down to what kind of board do we want to be and I think completely ignoring it on the agenda completely ignoring it at a public meeting um is disrespectful I to me personally other people have differing views of how to handle this so I am just voicing my opinion asking if other board members agree with that or not or do they want to just business as usual and kind of ignore what's get sense to us um Gail we used to have a them on the we used to um have public um a list of correspondents on I I think Ron used to acknowledge correspondence with a A list um you had a se you had a title correspondence and when we adjusted and shortened the agenda correspondence was not included but we can add it back and but I didn't if I do not have the email and it's by the way the emails are also if the email is a single email it can be managed in the meeting packet if it is a series of emails and it is 30 pages long and believe several of the emails I have received are multiple pages long it's virtually impossible to put that in the meeting packet the meeting packet would be 200 pages long um if I don't have the email I can't I can't list the emails we never listed each email each each bit of Correspondence all we had on the agenda was correspondence um that's I mean you can go back and look at the agendas it's just not true we used to list out um the person that sent it and then at times and it fluctuated we would list out the topic so people looking at the agenda would know what residents were concerned about or writing in about I've been doing this for four years and never did that um Mary you've looked in detail at the correspondence are there any topics that like I said I've read them all but that I miss that are that we have not discussed at all I think there's topics or specifics I mean topics the topics are blasting Harbor um MBTA financial studies um I mean this is just the past couple weeks so um the question that I asked about Newport Park and eohc and the um with that one tonight in our meeting I mean a lot of these things come up in our well I just asked um because it was an email um the I get re uh the fueling station um we did not take the harbor tonight that well we discussed that at last time right I specifically addressed that so also answered that email sorry Mary go ahead I'm getting the the gist of rather than oh that's a great idea we're looking for reasons why it's not so I have said my piece and I will leave it at that it's disappointing I'll be honest with you but so I'm trying to understand your request is to list out each piece of Correspondence and the topic on our agenda yeah and like we used to and I'm happy because I went through them today the agendas um I can send people examples what we used to do and because lots of times we don't have any correspondents but when you have public two public hearings going on you're going to get an uptick in correspondence with people's comments questions and concerns and um could you would you be willing to take the C the letters that come in and make sure we save them to the SharePoint maybe make a subfolder in a meeting of correspondents so that we make sure all the correspondents gets into the meeting folder that's that's irrelevant of the point that I'm bringing up if somebody wants to take them from the email and put them in the folder fine but my point is to address them at a meeting and address residence um but I guess my point is if there's something new or a point that was that we haven't heard by all means I think you know I re I we all received an email from John Smith he raises a point we haven't considered before that that water AB should be painted pink whatever you know that that that we have I agree with you that we have an obligation to read the emails but if the question is that pedestrian safety on Outwater out is priority we're we're discussing that actively and so um go ahead Laura if I could make a suggestion seems to me that the letters that come by email are somewhat in kind to the public comments just in a different form where we listened um it's part of a larger discussion that the board is having we very much try not to have a kind of back and forth on a like basis but we do try to discuss a topic so perhaps if the and I and I also you know we're we are we are a board and we discuss as a board and we want to be careful not to be having these kind of offline discussions that right by you know that could evolve into mistakenly having a meeting by having too many people on it or by seeming to just for me I would feel uncomfortable about having discussions outside of the planning board so would not feel comfortable or would I would not feel comfortable having a kind of ongoing substance discussion for something that is put to the planning board and the planning board is all they're not running to me they're running to the board right and so um you know perhaps if there are correspondents received and we just list out sort of high level topics and then we we have those on the agenda you know blasting is one and so blast came up in the last you know badge correspondence let's talk about that for a few minutes you know is there here's a and we sort of synthesizes right so we don't right have this sort of specific you know one one back and forth going on maybe that would be a way to address so that people know that their correspondence is getting aired but it is not a you know it's not a trying to have a debate we're just trying to hear people's comments and reflect on them as a board together U the other thing I would say is that maybe this this does get captured in the meeting minutes again at a high level and so because everybody's busy and the board minutes don't always get in the packet we can spend a few minutes at the end of the board meeting if everybody hasn't read them or we want to just because we're live look at it discuss anything that needs discussing and approve the minutes so that way they get out faster as well so that if the meeting minutes if emails come in they're you know they're on the agenda at least in terms of topic and cender um and then or just you know list of tenders list of topics you don't even have to map one to the other and then at the meeting minutes we can have a place where we discussed correspondence if there was any discussion that might be a way to just kind of get it out theze it yeah synthesize it and I would suggest that Gail does not need to put the meeting the email correspondents in the meeting packet she's making a PDF I agree of the meeting material for the public so when you go you can go online and you can click on the meeting material so I don't think that needs to be the 15 blasting emails and the you know I think we can but when she gets an email she fors it to the does that when she knows there's an email happening and Blasting I my guess my assumption was that the police that the fire chief was in this he's responding to them so um he's the blasting person so did you I haven't seen his responses James he says he responds to Residents yeah he has responded um Saturday at 1:24 James MC mcney he has several of them on we all on that I must admit I'm having a challenge like Su is what we're what we're supposed to do though would you like us to respond to each one of those comments no I would for them and they should not be in the meeting packet because then you if you're just cutting and pasting you've got people's personal email addresses and stuff that of course would not happen um but it is public wait a minute it is absolutely public well I of course the content is but again we can do people's email address if they send us an email and it comes it's absolutely public I mean way we don't want publicize them and be respectful and take the emails off but besides that I my point is is that we do nothing so do we have to sit down as a board and discuss how to respond and respond no but when there's you know we have a discussion one night and the next day we get five emails I think it merits raising that in a meeting and saying we got five emails these are the topics these are the issues these are the questions these are the concerns whatever right because we're here for the public and they send us stuff and people listening in will have no idea we get correspondents or have no idea there's outstanding questions and then the people that send the emails in they feel as if it goes into a black hole and so what happens is people just tune out and you know we think oh you know nobody cares nobody's paying attention well they probably did pay attention they probably did send emails and just said forget it nobody's listening so I am trying to write that but it's very very hard process um so you know and I can respond to emails I you know that's then it becomes your opinion your personal op of course and that's what I State on it there's no issue with a quorum or anything like that but if we can't even as a board say yes we're going to address this in public then I'm not going to just um continue on on the path and ignore them what would the harm be in that Sarah if we identified if we got five emails about blasting don't mention the individual just note that the subject matter says there's issues with blasting this is how we're doing do a little better job I think I'm trying to acknowledge the emails I just what I I'm concerned about is making a pledge that we're going to you know itemize every single email I think the pledge is that is that that if there's new material if somebody is Raising something that is new I I feel very strongly and we haven't heard you know a comment that we haven't heard to me that is um or an opinion that we haven't heard I mean we have heard all of I have yet to see recently an email that says something that is and or something that's not on our agenda that um you know and we got a lot of a lot of emails so um a couple things one if we get emails that are specific to an application a question or statement about an application know um so John Smith writes about self signaling you know um I support the project but um I'm a little concerned am I going to see the lights from across the highway you know they're going to be blah blah blah and I just want to make sure you guys uh consider that that's kind of like a typical comment letter from someone who can't attend meeting um a letter like that in many towns is just read into the record at the beginning of the you know opening the next hearing of that these are this is the correspondence that we got and just read it into the record it usually takes a few seconds and and it's done and you know you may discuss it or you may go well we already talked about lighting or we're going to talk about lighting at the next meeting or whatever um a lot of the other correspondences just general correspondence and comments about what we're doing on other projects we're working on whether it's a zoning thing or um or or something like that at a policy or our own bylaws that type of stuff those are are things that should be shared in SharePoint but not necessarily placed on agendas or topics of discussion until such time I mean you now are aware of it somebody doesn't like the fact that we're writing a bylaw on a particular topic you know that but if something the board's already decided on or they think think that there's a specific concern about an element of that um you're aware of it so um but I don't think those to those items necessarily have to be on the agenda and read and Etc so those that are related to uh the special permits should be an open application that are specific to and Germain to the top we summarize them rather than reading them into the record unless you know you can lot yeah you can you're not required to it's as long as it's would you be willing to Mary to help make a list of those um that have come in for the cell signaling um and the the doc so that we can acknowledge those at the next in the next hearing read you know we read we had a you know an email from um Mar iani about uh opposing fueling on the docks we had a email from um if you could summar if you could take and summarize those um list that I think that would be very helpful so for all the emails that we receive related to the permits but sure for all the open special the special openings yeah which is the docks and the and theing start with those you can so you you don't want to acknowledge other emails just let's start with those to for the next week and try to to characterize those going forward that come in so what I'll do is I will send to um Gail examples of this year and last year of how we used to have our agendas um and so we can get back to the first topic is acknowledging receipt of correspondents and list them out correct um I think I was saying something different I was suggesting that for self signaling and for the open hearing for Reed Park and mors pier three different special permits that we have a list that you type up a list that says I Lorraine iani this date um you know uh and quick like to have a summary of the financials for self signaling and then we can say we heard had a comment that that she that Lorraine believes that the financials are important for us to review you know so we can kind of just go through them in a summary fashion and I agree with that part but also have it on the agenda so residents know if people are having concerns or not or people are writing in or not so I'd like to suggest we start with a special permits I hear what you're saying and then we can try to get back to that if if people think it's important but given that it's a large volume right now if we can at least start with a special permits if you want to do the do both that would be fine I think but let's start with the special permits if you could summarize them that would be really helpful so I guess my last question is who decided to take it off the agenda I did I was trying to shorten the meetings well the agenda just lists the correspondents so I it's unknown to me why we wouldn't want people to know that residents right in Happ what happened to that you that's the list there right there did you address each one of those we would us just you could say okay there was a public hearing notice you're right it's a courtesy unless it's related to a specific application you often end up in an extended discussion right we didn't we just have lots of projects and things that you really need to focus on you end up an extended discussion about some topic we we would discuss anything it was just listed and again it's transparency it's open government okay I think I hear you chosen not to well I think we can get better I don't think it's necessar idea right now see how work yeah I I do have to say one Mark Mark brought up a I was feeling a little soreness in my arm today and then scab it over and then Mark just pulled the r off about people being unaware someone's thinking about the glow of the light that little light Dome that's going to sit over the project I know we're going to say it doesn't exist or it won't exist and people don't need to be aware of it because it's not going to happen but it is it is no matter what we do it's going to be at some level there's going to be a light glow in the Horizon here and so I hate to have I hate to have but the reality of that and the promises we make such as when she said that that lady said she was not going to not going to be too blasted and then next day there was too blast stuff like that how do we avoid that making those Divine hard comments opinions and knowing full well that it's not going to be the case oh yeah that that I see is something we defitely need to address whether it's our perview or not they use us as the vehicle follow me you you can't make promises you can't keep so to speak so I me obviously we talk about that light that's why obviously a developed piece of property versus an undeveloped piece of property they're going to have parking lot lighting it will have but the whole idea of reviewing plans is to ensure that it's not lit up like you use carlot and that sufficient lighting for the safety of the people who utilizing the site but it doesn't create undo layer and and light pollution okay and so I think that's the the the best way you can answer a question like that as it pertains to lighting you know if you had neighbors around there you try and assure them that you know they're not going to be able to sit in their living room and read the newspaper at 11:00 at night from the lights about that that's one of the examples that uh from a McDonald's that got developed where there was unshielded lights literally you could drive over there at night and bright light was blasting against this guy's house so um I agree fully with all that I definitely agree fully with that but having been on the developer side of the equation here we did our photo metrics we had a big parking lot whatever when I was doing retail design or office planning and had big parking L like that we came up with our photometrics we came up with a shielded lights we lowered the lowered the light picture down here but in in our heart of hearts I know I know that there's going to be a light Dome over it no matter what we do here so there's there's I don't know how you I don't know how you tell the truth without appearing to betray the town it's just a oh I mean we I mean there is no answer you just have to tell them the light rendering will never work I've I've I've done this for a billion years I've had light renderers come up with things and images and some of them are handdrawn so that was a little bit of fake but but do it they you you can do it you do the photometrics but there's nothing like looking out the window across the harbor and all sudden you see a light though it just it just will happen it's like the football field yeah but look concerned that we're retreading ground that was happening during the hearing and talking about subst is I think I'm taking it as the process thing reception of our comments versus yeah Sarah I thre your hand up um I'm we're just sort of having a nice discussion here it is past n okay it is past N9 and we're gonna have a couple of late night meetings Sarah do you have a quick comment I do um I would just really like to address the whole correspondence piece in general because I've heard from many people friends I don't write letters to the planning board because I know they're not answered um boards handle course respondents differently different boards handle them differently public comment is public comment and if people are taking the time to sit in for two to three hours on a meeting and wait to the end of that meeting to possibly be allowed to speak then that's great and maybe their comment gets listened to and agreed with or not agreed with if people take the time out of their day to write an email it should definitely be acknowledged and brought brought up in the Forum of the board it was written to it's important for people's interest in the town to be on record heard acknowledged and quite honestly a lot of the times the board comes across as not very welcoming to the public and I I don't mean that as an insult it's just to common knowledge you're not flooded with 45 50 people online for a reason or having people in the room that's just the way it is people talk about it in town that the board is not very welcoming people get shut down all the time it happens on different boards but I think it's important to really realize that you're a very small minority of the Town you're a board but you're a few people who got elected not by everybody but the residents in the town need to be heard every single one of them if they have a suggestion an inquiry a concern it's important to definitely at least recognize it and bring it up you don't have to read a 45 page email that doesn't make sense but just the recognition in the topic and maybe having some time to discuss further or Point them to a direction where they can find the information online but if you don't do that it's very it's it's a very cold feeling coming from uh a public you know town government board that's all I have to say thank you thank you um I will say that I have it's always been my intent to always take if there's a hand raised we do take it I do try to limit comments sometimes to a reasonable amount of time and to try to channel them to things that we have not heard before so in also in respect for our time and that outside of public hearings uh comments are actually at the discretion of the board you do not have we don't have to take any public comment turns out by state law um so we do and it's hard to not to be welcoming and to answer everybody's questions and get out of here at a reasonable time and the we all do a lot of work behind the scenes so it's a it's a balance and I think we don't always strike it um and we're not going to please everybody all the time unfortunately but I do appreciate the fact that I know Sarah you're a regular attendee and you sit through many meetings so you're to be commended for that um any other business for tonight um with that take a motion to uh adjourn so moved I thought okay um uh all in favor all right thank you be no I me to