the notice requirements provided for in the open public meeting Zack tman satisfied notice of this meeting was properly given by transmission to the Asbury Park Press the Middletown sun and the two of her times and by posting at the Middletown Township Municipal Building and filing with the Township Clerk on January 5th 2023 comman Clark here commit woman cratz here minman set brino here Deputy Mayor hell here mayor Perry here please rise for the pledge of Allegiance I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all at this time I'd like to ask for a moment of silence to honor the troops serving worldwide defending our constitutions freedoms and way of life thank you Heidi real quick I'm just going to ask everybody to stand uh just for a brief moment of silence yesterday uh first lady former first lady rosn Carter died at 96 years old um obviously um not not too many people in this world know know what it's like to uh be the spouse of a of a president and obviously she did it with Grace so I think it's it's fitting to just stand and honor her life for for just a moment thank you our first item on tonight's agenda we have a presentation recognizing the Middletown High School South girls cross country team for winning the 2023 njsi AA group three state championship at this time I'd like to invo invite the team and coach Bill Clifton to please join mayor Perry at the front of the room you want to go so we anchor each other since we have the Navy suits on no I want to be by first of all let's give it up for our state champion so it it's really impressive to be here once again uh for yet another state championship in in this building I feel like we are on such a hot streak in Middletown I don't know what it is ever since we moved in this building I I feel like I stand up here every meeting for another state championship which listen keep them coming I love it um but just uh what was it last weekend or two weekends ago now yes two weekends ago and and and I I just want to start off with the coach real quick because uh we were at the uh I I I get the text message from uh where's Dave Merc 30 I get go state champ so I'm like wow this is this is all right let's do this thing you know and then I get the text hey the fire engines are meeting them at 114 Chief morisy and chief Kelly back there bring bringing them in bringing them in for a victory but the thing I want to point out the most is the Persistence of a team and the dedication of a team because from the stories that I heard from parents the stories that I heard from the coach was that there was a there was a second there there was a second there that it might not it didn't feel like the victory that it was going to be that it was a little bit it might not have been the perfect overwhelming Victory but you know what it doesn't matter whether you win the Super Bowl by a point or 20 it doesn't matter whether you win in four games in the world series or seven state champions are still state champions and every one of you deserves a big round of applause the question I asked the coach was I said well is this is this your first one and he said no it's my third right yes but he goes this one's the sweetest this one is the sweetest for sure and I you know I'm going to let the coach say a few words in a second I I don't think I told you that but I'm I'm ready but the the the the what encompasses a team what makes a team is people who can rely on one another that's the beauty of it that's the beauty of of working with good people being on on great teams is that somebody can have a bad day and somebody else is there to pick them up because that's the perfect definition of a team so I want to congratulate you you're representing Middletown representing Middletown South and I hope that you have nothing but success and bring that Championship right back to Middletown South again next year uh before before we take pictures coach let you say a couple words about your team basically that we're very honored to be here you know I'm grateful to the Town Council and the people who are here tonight that came just to see us a cross country is a sport that does not get a lot of it attention you could be a state champion it could just be slipped right underneath the the the rug so for the town to have made such a big deal for the fire department to have come after we won that state championship and to be here just recognize it's very very special to them and it will last for the rest of their lives and we're very proud to say that we are state champions in front of our own you know towns people and that we could say here we are we're the state champs and middle Middletown did it right okay this is a well-deserved win you on behalf of the township committee we're we're honored to present you with the those certificates and uh again we wish nothing but success but now the pressure's on I want that Championship again next year all right so congratulations let's give it up to each uh you want me on the other side okay everyone ready they're never ready one two three congratulations don't stop don't stop smiling until all the camera all right congratulations thank all right let's give it up hey Middletown South Cross Country the deputy mayor very smartly just said I think I should go out to the parking lot and race them now I will put up big money to see that happen and I know that Merkin tante is with me on that one congratulations Rick never learns he never learns all right Heidi our next item on tonight's agenda we have the approval of minutes for October 16 2023 regular meeting and the November 8th 2023 special meeting motion to approve second committee man Clark yes committee woman Katz yes committee sen brino yes Deputy Mayor hell yes mayor Perry yes motion carries to approve minutes our next item on tonight's agenda we have a public hearing on proposed ordinances our first ordinance 2023-the Centra South Redevelopment plan for Block 11 31 Lots 30 31 and 32 within the exit 109 Redevelopment plan area any member of the public wish to make a public comment may do so I'll call on you one at a time just come up to the I'm going to go to you first um just come up to the microphone and uh state your name and address uh for the record please thank you mayor and Council Dr Laura Smith steens I'm at 20 for Riveredge Road in titon Falls I'm here tonight representing save our swimming River or SOS we are a concerned group of residents from titf Falls Lincroft greater Middletown and Beyond fighting to minimize development and preserve the swimming River I'm here to publicly voice publicly voice our concerns over the Redevelopment of the River Center office complex located at 331 Newman Springs Road otherwise known as block 1131 Lots 30-32 we disagree that this area is truly in need of Redevelopment the only criteria met was for low occupancy but that was during the two years during the peak of covid when a vast majority of Office Buildings not only throughout the us but the world were vacant in fact I drove through last week and according to the sign it seems only one office is currently vacant and the parking lots are quite full we are requesting that the parcels in question be re-evaluated for this designation furthermore the proposed plans offer for very little to update these Office Buildings which were the focus for the need of the deel of the Redevelopment but rather focus on squeezing in a large apartment complex between the steep slope adjacent to the swimming River and the Garden State Parkway the Asbury Park Press article from last week touts a recently renovated amenity building that houses a fitness center Cafe conferencing Center and tenant Lounge which sounds lovely but it's slated to be torn down for this housing complex we are concerned about the omission of an environment impact discussion on this project when Middletown went to Great Lengths as stewards of the land by Slo ketering with two sets of nesting bald eagles just across the river as well as Ospreys and other threatened and endangered species it is imperative we identify and protect these animals further the river itself and the swimming River Natural Area which is just across the river deserve protection as such we are formerly requesting an environmental impact study be performed we are concerned that the current infrastructure and services are not equ equipped to manage the decreased quality of surface water runoff into the river it is my understanding that the storm water drainage need not be updated for a Redevelopment as well as the increased demands on drinking water sewage energy vehicular traffic and schools to name a few we are formally requesting updated studies and confirmation from the respective utilities that this Redevelopment can be adequately supported without decreasing services to the existing Community we are concerned about the development of a walking path Ong the river one that would only serve to make the apartments and Business Park more appealing to those residents and employees increase litter animal waste and food foot traffic will serve to degrade the natural environment creating more pollution and deterring wild animals from using the land finally we are very concerned that there has been such a lack of transparency surrounding this project from its Inception Titanfall's residents especially have been kept in the dark these are residents within 200 ft of the project who were notified over a year after the land had already been redesignated and just as the master plan had been updated giving them no opportunity to be part of this decision-making process last month for the October 16th meeting I personally checked the agenda that morning and this project was not scheduled for a first reading shortly before the meeting it was added so very few of any residents or concerned community members could have the opportunity to attend then the special planning board meeting last week I didn't see it posted before there was suddenly an agenda why did the River Center plan disappear from the planning board Redevelopment page and why was the proposed plan attached to the agenda taken down and updated with a change of document date with without a change of document date the day of the special meeting it is the responsibility of the governing body to be open and clear about the proposed projects in town and the process for approvals since we can't go back in time we are requesting that the agendas for Town meetings be finalized at least 24 hours in advance and we the residents of River Edge Road in tinon Falls and Parkway Place in Middletown who are immediately adjacent would especially like to be notified of any project developments relating to this par these Parcels further I would like to ask of you if you could please outline the process for us for the remainder of the approval process for this project where does this go next and which feature of the plan will be evaluated thank you very much I I have one I'm sorry I have one more par yeah go ahead and then and then we'll get there um in closing I would just like to stress that this Office Park is not in need of Redevelopment and the proposed development does not belong here I look forward to receiving the studies and reports requested tonight on behalf of sa Swimming River and thank you so if you could please walk me through the process thank you Brian you want to you want to handle uh the process by which that'll occur oh sorry sorry the um the investigation study process was completed in early 2022 um at that time there was a determination of there being substantial vacancies in the buildings keep in mind that the Redevelopment investigation study covers the entire Redevelopment area not just the buildings on the South Side the Redevelopment area consists of everything on over by Schultz Lane where the vet hospital is being redeveloped right now right behind the Lifetime Fitness which was a separate Redevelopment project as well um and then and then also the south side of Newman Springs Road which is where you're referring to and which this specific Redevelopment plan governs so the Redevelopment plan is specific to a certain there are different plans for different areas within the global Redevelopment area um and um but that is a criteria under the Redevelopment law which was put into place that is a valid criteria there were significant tenants such as jcpnl which left for Bell's Works uh Maser Consulting now cers which left for Bell works and other tenants which vacated all those buildings actually prior start that process started prior to covid so it wasn't actually the result of covid the um um so those those that you know those those happened over a year and a half ago the the uh and Redevelopment plans were adopted for cross the street over a year and a half ago under the Redevelopment law there's no notices even if you were within two 200 ft um only the property owners themselves get notice for the investigation study and then for the Redevelopment plan it's just ordinance notice as well so there are no 200 foot notices under the Redevelopment law um I don't think that I don't even know there would be at site at so next in the process if the Redevelopment plan is adopted tonight there'll have to be a Redevelopment agreement entered as well and then after that they can make an application for site plan approval to the planning board so the application for site plan approval to the planning board that's where specific issues would be that that would require a 200 foot notice so anybody within 200 feet of the property would get a 200 foot notice of the site plan application before the planning board and that's also where more specific issues would be addressed such as storm water runoff and those calculations and anything of that specific of a nature um the Redevelopment plan itself establishes the Zoning for the site um but doesn't deal with traffic considerations per sees and deal with all the the storm order runoff and more specific issues that would all be part of the site plan application process which there would be a 200 foot notice of so you did mention the zoning there will it be rezoned or does this designation negate the need to rezone the Redevelopment plan is what rezones the site that establishes the Zoning for the site um so this is the zoning stage of the process so there has to still be site plan applications before anybody could you know develop anything on this it so and then before that there has to be a Redevelopment agreement entered between the municipality and the redeveloper but that can't take place until plan is adopted and then that sets forth any other specific requirements that the township is imposing that the Redevelopment law allows um so that I think I think that answers most of your questions yeah and some of those items that you mentioned you know we there there are certain ones that we've already requested right uh economic imp tax study uh traffic study those are all things that environmental en that one I was holding till last because you know I think that number one they're the ones that are going to have to get D approval right on on on everything that they're doing um we we don't supersede obviously DP and and the other part is the the planning board can also set forth in in their resolution if there was if there was a request by the public to have place conservation use men you know those those are all things that can be done along certain areas of of that project so I know you mentioned that you were um opposed to like the walkway for example right and um you know that that's a perfectly legitimate you know thing to to be opposed to obviously but what can happen at the planning board level that the township committee does not have the authority to do is set any type of conservation easements as a part of the resolution that would that would come with any type of an approval for um that site plan approval so that would be something that you can request at the planning board meeting and that okay you know the the members of the planning board I have one designate on on the planning board that that I can communicate with um but it it's it's one of those things that that that request and those items that Mr Nelson mentioned would all be at the site plan um meeting with within the plan board itself and then I have one further question um Newman Springs Road is a County Road from my understanding so then where does the county come in to the approvals process they just just like any other project on on a municipal on a uh within Middletown or any other municipality it will have to go before the County planning board okay and that is after our the Middletown planning board that will take place yeah go ahead T it usually happens during the the riew process so they kind of can run simultaneously okay um it's usually towards the end of the process and they go to the County planning board for review of impacts on County Roads and impacts on County Drainage Systems that's the limited scope of the County Planning wood review okay um and then residents within 200 feet would not be notified of County meetings we would have to just keep an eye on that agenda yeah if you stay in touch with the planning department they can let you know when the County planning board meetings are scheduled for okay thank you thank you very much any other member of the public wishing to make a public comment I I'll come to you next sir oh no no no you're you're already up here right uh Doug tomchuk I'm a resident of Parkway Place adjacent to block 11 1131 uh so we're right in the neighborhood here um but I'm really disappointed to be here tonight um um I think the township committee is likely going to approve this I just sat in the planning board meeting where they wouldn't even listen to a comment it was not a public meeting I guess but they we didn't have a forum to discuss anything with them um I clearly you just just so you know sir and I'm GNA let you finish but that that is a master plan review so you they they are simply taking and saying that the the Redevelopment plan complies with the m the town confence master plan so I I do recognize that there were all sorts of errors in that plan if you rebed it and uh you know I tried to make that available to the uh planning board beforehand and they nothing was changed of that they changed the cover put a pretty picture with cherry blossoms on the front uh so anyhow I stand Here against such an approval um little bit of uh for a second here let me you know say from my perspective what has happened is basically de veler has come in and buys the properties in June 2021 and promptly starts negotiating with the township that let them add multi-story residential housing to the property maybe it was before they bought it I don't know that okay the ability to change the use on the property under Redevelopment laws is all based on the premise of low occupancy however the Township's own report in March 2022 estimated that these three buildings had a 75% occupancy rate pretty good for 2021 uh data and we actually see in yesterday's Asbury Park Prest that there are many new leases for these buildings but most but of all that it's basically irrelevant because the township already passed the Redevelopment plan so you know we don't even get to argue that point anymore so we we missed the boat there uh the notification on that was was there I guess if we knew to read it you know all the notices but uh residents did not know about that process so today we get to change this zoning but ironically the r development plan we discussed tonight you you keeps all this underutilized office space except for the one smaller recently remodeled building that is in the way of the apartment building so that's the only one that gets knocked down we keep all those other office spaces that are underutilized but the reason for the Redevelopment so I have several requests and I realize some of these may be for the planning board issues but I want to include them now for the record please don't put AET a path along the river to our backyards such a path will not be maintained it will be used for new residents to walk the dogs but given the natural aspects of it they'll probably leave their waste behind uh PE culfor contamination is a big problem for many MTH County streams uh and the cliff along the river will be an attractive nuisance and potentially dangerous to kids two traffic I should say this about five times traffic we need traffic studies to take into account the at traffic from the lifetime gym as well as these so we can't really do that study until the gym is operational and has some occupancy there uh to understand what the flow is going to be out of there uh and which direction it's going to go as we discussed uh on the telephone mayor Perry that uh you know I there's an assumption that everybody's going to be going to the parkway but I'm not sure if the Fair Haven and uh R Rumson residents aren't going to be joining this gym so um potential increased occupancy rates in the the buildings as well as the residents and anything else that is added to this project will also be you know add to the traffic so if built can we get a light that will allow Parkway Place cars to trigger signal like what used to be at the Bell core not on all the time but to trigger something so we can make a turn out of our street because it's it's dangerous now a traffic light up um Parkway Place you said that was that's a suggestion okay I I I just wanted to make sure I understand yeah I'm trying to find something that could could you know make it manageable to get in and out and uh can we make the road that connects the extended state America lot with the River Center Parking uh there's a a small access road for so that Extended Stay people can make a left out of their property um and uh make that one way so it can only be exiting extended stay and not for a side route out of the uh River Center Plaza the River Center Parking excuse me um and especially if a drive-through restaurant is put next door um please no Starbucks no drive-thru restaurant right in that uh adjacent parking lot to the Extended State America the addition of a Starbucks or fast food joint right next to Extended State America that changes the whole neighborhood and the traffic patterns will really be detrimental to all the residents on our street um I I don't see the need for that there there's plenty of other places to go uh I just don't understand that you know why that's in this Redevelopment plan um several uh parts of the proposed apartment building that extend to the embankment along Swimming River should be eliminated it's too big for the area and too close to the natural resource something that this committee has said it valued at other potential development locations this is an ecologically higher value area considering potential impacts to the swimming River okay and then one thing that the board should address um this board I think that I think all the other ones were kind of planning issues so please discuss the tax exemption process and what revenues the town would generate from taxes versus the anal service charges it seems that we would actually be subsidizing the developer to build these apartments I'm against the apartments and what has always been a business park Business Park zoning I'm really against subsidizing a developer to build Apartments there so the town gets so little in return for this please reject this proposal I'm I did say that yeah she she he did um I'm not sure I I'm I'm understanding the the subsidy you're you're referring to um the LA the last item that you said yes you normally signed a contract with uh Redevelopment properties yeah that that's just that's just for the vet hospital though that's just for the vet hosit just for the for what what we're what we referred to as the north okay that we we're unable to negotiate any type of what you're referring to as a pilot with with some with someone without a Redevelopment plan um the you you can't negotiate that without a plan there's no so once you approve tonight you can start negotiating you can okay does does the board plan to negotiate such a plan with this developer and and give a tax exemption there's no there's no tax exemption sir the the pilots are not tax you're not tax exempt okay well it yeah you don't pay the property tax and there's you do you absolutely pay you still pay property taxes the vet the the the the the Red Bank vet will still is absolutely paying property taxes I thought they I think to the tune of like $200,000 I thought they just pay the annual service9 $191,000 per year be about about 200,000 a year that's what that it's not that's not an exemption they're still paying that it's it's a go ahead yeah I mean it's the word exempt means that it comes off of the regular roles but they're still paying and they're paying more than what they were paying before actually so it depends all of those have to be determined right now this property is not eligible for tax exemption tax abatement pilot whatever you want to refer to it as after a Redevelopment plan that can be negotiated after a Redevelopment agreement has entered that can be negotiated one important factor here that I think has been absent from the discussion so far this evening is that this is part of the Township's affordable housing plan there were plans to actually build significantly more units there than what are presented and allowed for in this plan plan um there could have been a thousand units there actually um and that's something that the committee did not want to see there um the Township's actually in the midst of two Builders remedy cases right now on properties that are not developed um that the township is trying to prevent the development of right now um and and this particular development is being completely constructed on atw's now existing buildings and asphalt um so and and not exceeding under the Redevelopment plan any of the existing Heights for the buildings that are there now too so so there are often when there are affordable housing components to these projects which there is here there are often tax abatement agreements Financial agreements that are negotiated to help subsidize that affordable housing which the township is constitutionally required to do so it is a unique site and that's given that circumstance still paying but they're still paying there's no well only nonpr only nonprofits or and I guess I should say technically approved Farms Farmland assessments receive reductions in property taxes uh where where they're they're they don't have to pay property taxes okay let me just say that the whole process there and you know the exemption you know uh res the uh ordinance uh 3376 that was passed this July uh for the vet and everything you know it's like reading that trying to interpret it uh as a Layman is difficult to do so uh I'm trying to to to catch up with it I mean the the law you know seems to say that you can have these annual service charges that don't exempt from all taxes but you know you know take steps about what the payments that would be made and I just wanted to you know ensure that my statement is made that this isn't going to be negotiated with this developer for building more building apartments in an area that you know has been a business park you know traditionally and and shouldn't need that and they'll still have all those same business buildings there you know so why do they need to to do this why does that incentive from the town for now if you're saying that incentive is for the uh lowcost housing uh we're getting 34 units out of this how many does the state request right now 700 I think you said mayor Perry 700 I don't know how many our Our obligation for just the third round is approximately 1,026 units okay we have a significant number of credits towards that already but we still have to plan at these other sites which is why this is one of a number of sites that are in our affordable housing PL such as we development project at bford this site um so so we have to have sites to satisfy that obligation and the this the township has been attempting to direct that development at sites that are already developed rather than at sites which are in the woods such as the site that they're looking to develop just up the road at Exit uh 114 which is completely wooded um by behind slone kering you don't know much about environmental matters sir I have to say if you think that that's the Environmental sensitive spot uh let me just say that the Waterway is much more environmentally sensitive okay well wooded area is still environmentally sensitive there's there's plenty of actually where the tri so the the tributaries that feed into the swimming River actually begin at that site so I might know a little bit more about it in fact we have environmental Consultants that we're paying thousands and thousands of dollars for to review those issues for us right now to address this because it actually feeds that site actually feeds directly into the swimming River so um you know we can be queued and make personal taxs but I'm just stating the facts okay well I work in the environmental field too so I I have some idea of some of these things and and uh recognize that development in the upper portions of watershed migratory fish species um which I did comment on to the New Jersey G when in their in the the uh coastal zone management process so I I think that there are factors there uh the upper water set and that and that is fully on D like yes D's permitting is that that's that's this redevelopers issue that that's that's I'm just trying to go back to Mr Nelson's comment though uh about uh the lowcost housing and we get 34 units out of this why was it decided that it was one in 10 isn't that couldn't it be as low as one and four uh for uh if if we're trying to actually address the lowcost housing situation uh or are we trying to you know I'm not sure where we're trying to go with that you know why why is why is that number set um those numbers I mean typically it's actually more the problem is that when you have more if it's one and four a 20% set aside then you need more market rate housing units to subsidize the affordable housing unit for every for every one affordable unit you need four market rate units to pay for that but this one has nine market rate units for every sub you know lowcost unit no for for every for every one market it's 10% of the total total number of units so if if we wanted to increase that number that increase that percentage then that means that they have to increase the number of Market rates that they have to build this Township committee negotiated the number of units down from a thousand to where we are today I think you're looking at that the wrong way I'm not sure but uh if they have they have one in 10 right now 10% of them are lowcost units correct so we get 34 units out of this right so credits so they're designed to be supportive units so there's there's there's units and credits aren't exactly the same always so okay if you have a rental unit that's for Supportive Housing which these are designed to be then you can get bonus what are known as bonus credits so each of these units is designed to achieve three credits per unit um if it's just a regular affordable rental unit that's not a Supportive Housing unit then you may be able to get a just a standard double credit um and then if it's neither of those if it's a for sale unit you can just get a single credit um and so so it's designed to as the mayor is saying it's designed to minimize the number of units overall at the site because if you you know if you add more units with fewer you know to achieve High more credits you're going to need more market rate units to help subsidize those affordable units because they're not collecting the same rent on them as they collect on the market units it's really an economics issu so we're worried about the developer there basically the township it's trying to look at the impact no I think I I think what you're advocating for right now is more units well no just trying to say it's just I'm just saying math is is black and white I don't I don't see that you could still keep it 340 units and and get more you know lower cost units if you wanted to uh you're you're laughing at me for every for every unit that you're adding for every affordable unit that you're adding you're adding four more affordables you're adding four more Market rates but we're we're at 1 to nine right now if if they f yes I I I I'm not sure if you're advocating for more units or or confused I would like very much not to have any units but uh right now there let's just take you know there's 340 units right now and 306 of those will be market rate yeah so if you're really trying to get lowcost units you would tell them no that's not enough we should have you know 60 low cost units and still has 340 units 280 Market rates and still gives you your one to 1 to four ratio four to one ratio I mean you you can ask for anything but that doesn't mean that it's G to work so so you let them walk that's well no then they file build they have then they have a thousand units with 200 units so you can pick that's Happ yeah I mean you honestly get to take your pet we you can either come to an to come to some type of reasonable percentage where the where the redeveloper is saying we will do X or you say you know what you're not coming we can't come to terms so we're going to file Builder's remedy suit against you you're going to go to court you're you're GNA potentially lose and then they get to build as many units as they want and you know what maybe the redeveloper set the redeveloper says you know what we'll knock down all the UN all the buildings and we'll just build housing right on there that's the risk you run and that's the risk we run every single day so at the end of the day you you can you I mean I want to be respectful to your opinion and I respect everything that you're saying but you I don't want a thousand units there either and I don't think you so the I want to say it's a flip of the coin but the flip of the coin is better odds than we had if we just said no thank you okay it's it and it's already in our housing plan it is in our our housing plan to say that th this we have designated this area to potentially include housing so I am not willing to run the risk to say that this individual is going to now keep those Office Buildings there and just say it's more profitable for us right now with the rents that they're getting in Redbank for the rents that they're getting in in other areas local to us to say you know what we'll just knock down the office space and we'll just be done with it and we'll just bu build housing there and there is zero once that Court once we go into that zero that the township can do to prevent that Builder remedy suit from coming it's not fun and and if you think any of us up here think that this is like fun it it stresses me out to the point where I don't want to tell you how much hair I've lost but you know I I I sit here and and I fully respect your opinion I really do but but I also we have been working to Prov vent as much housing on this site as possible and unless we are willing to to have that low odds victory of a court settlement in a builder's remedy case on this site in particular I I'm I'm not going to be the one that sits up here and says that a thousand units is good there I'm just not right okay thank you for for your time there I think uh there were some the comment about the four to one just was very confusing to me that that's like that that is just the that's normally the ratio of how much a a developer will have to do in order to build one unit right and and here it's it's nine to one and that's great so I'm glad that that that's the direction you're going uh as far as keeping the number of units down but uh you know I I think that if you know all I was trying to do is point out that there is the option of having less of the market rate ones which then I guess raises the the potential I don't want to rehash what I got you I appreciate your comments sir okay well thank you very much I want to let other people have an opportunity absolutely thank you um yes sir he had his hand raised before so that's okay I don't mind going in a different order uh my name is Gordon Brown I live at 228 River Edge Road tenton Falls um so thank you for allowing us to speak I appreciate it first of all Happy Thanksgiving everybody things perspective here okay so I just want to briefly say that I I agree with and fully support the statements that my neighbor Laura Smith said just a few minutes ago um just to I guess summarize things a little bit you know those particularly those of us in the in our community that have um that are adjacent to the river and look across at this building this land that we're talking about have concerns about you know building Heights light spillage traffic um um possible adverse effects on what really is a pristine River back behind our houses um and the safety of the kids that might go there so I mean I personally think that your objectives of trying to get affordable housing into this area are quite Noble and I think that there's a lot of Merit to this site it kind of makes sense to me there are a lot of good reasons that that's probably a good place to try to put some of those sight some some of that housing um but at the end of the day uh all we're asking for I think I think maybe others would disagree but all I think we're asking for is that you be good neighbors in the way you go about doing it you know try to try to think about the impacts on the surrounding areas Parkwood Place sent and falls and Norther an end etc etc and reflect that in your conversations with uh your colleagues on the planning board I understand that the details are going to be in the planning board and thank you for the description of the process that helps I think all of us a lot because it's a very convoluted thing right it is um so U you know I think that's it just uh we appreciate you're taking the time to listen to our concerns we'll we would appreciate it if you could try to make sure that the planning board gives us adequate notice of future meetings so we can try to be there and present our case to them as well yeah I believe you have for for site plane it's it's you will be notified um for a site plan approv you're within 200 feet within 200 feet of the property yeah with the with the width of the river at that point that actually turns out to be a relatively small number of us but but yeah that's okay at least one will get it right yeah well that's that's especially if it's that we're we're I'm sure we'll travel fast anyway and last but not least congratulations on your state champs that was great thank you I appreciate it thank thank you very much sir appreciate your comments yes sir your name and address yeah sure no problem uh my name is Mitch Colberg uh 21 Cedar Place Tinton Falls uh I'll be really quick I really just want to follow up on something you guys were doing the whole math thing with the affordable housing before yes uh you said that certain units you know get three credits and some get two so I just want to make sure um the 34 credits number of actual units where somebody might live sounds like it's less than that sounds like it's closer to 10 or 11 based on the credits I was go ahead so so this is 3 340 units right right so 10% is 34 so even if they were straight 34 rental units you'd get um 68 credits right but I so um there are other types of units though that sometimes are put into these Supportive Housing units maybe a special needs population takes a unit you get extra credit for those so we don't know that might happen we can't okay all right so you don't really know you don't have that number it's 34 credits but okay depending minimum 34 units with 68 credits right if they're rentals so I was going I was just about to leave uh um you said at the minimum there'll be 34 units and just and by the way I'm not going to argue One Way Or that just trying to get trying to get it clear um is it a minimum of 34 credits or 34 units right so so if they built 34 uh accessible units they'd get 90 something CR so 340 units so at at minimum at the one credit to one unit ratio we get 34 credits depending on what is decided whether it's Supportive Housing and and any of the other legal ease that comes along with the rules or I really should say lack of rules uh and lack of clarity when it comes to COA and affordable housing um that that number will change I'm sure because there will be maybe some variation of of rentals to whatever so it's so it's minimum of 34 units and you could have up to let's say 96 credits or something it's not a maximum of 34 credits realistic you're not not no I'm not saying I'm just saying in other words it's not I was I was concerned that it was you were maxing out at 34 credits which means it might only be 10 units times three okay good enough thank you very much thank you any other member yes hello my name I'm good thank you my name is Esther Nelson I'm a resident of Parkway Place in linro Middletown and I want to say thank you for answering our questions I really appreciate that you're taking the time to also answer not I didn't realize that would be the part of the process I thought we only had to to read um or make a statement um so I I wanted to so I did go to the township planning meeting last week and that was what they said was a review of the proposed plan for conformance to the Middletown master plan the consultant who presented addressed the requirements for the 2004 and the 2016 Middletown Township master plan but he didn't mention any consideration for conformance to a newer version of the plan or the proposed master plan which I think it's being revised if I'm it it is we're we're in the we're in the first stages we just actually awarded um it's it's normally the master plan is normally done every 10 years 8 to 10 years um a full comprehensive um effort of the master plan is is normally done in that time frame but there's variations that you do you know depending on the climate you know of what you see on the on the horizon in terms of amending your master plan but we just recently uh awarded the contract uh to uh an engineer engineering firm to help us um with the next master plan that we're doing so we're working under the current master plan because we are in the infant stages of of our next master plan okay that helps thank I'm trying to understand um I wanted to acknowledge um that it was said I think Laura mentioned um so this Redevelopment plan will then be folded into well I'm sorry I jumped um this Redevelopment plan will only only will only dictate zoning over these locks block 1131 Lots 30 31 and 32 it does not it does not carry over into any other um Parcels within the municipality or boundaries of the township of Middletown and is there any possibility that because it's already been I'm trying to understand so the area of Redevelopment was exit 109 but there were three separate Redevelopment plans one was the lifetime one was the area on Schultz Road yeah on the North side and then this on the south side but it was determined that all three needed to be redeveloped no no this one is still being determined that's understand yeah yeah two of the three Lifetime Fitness was not did not have a Redevelopment plan oh that was not no um it it we had Redevelopment investigation into it yeah but it didn't achieve the same criteria that the that the these two North and South Parcels that that we've been referring to it didn't hit those um those uh criteria to be eligible so the the criteria that triggered these two were the occupancy rates of the buildings correct correct so and and they were looked at so I so I'm surprised because I I thought that the the lifetime would have met that so so were we the law Chang yeah it did the law changed from the time that was the life time was the first of the three areas to be investigated the law actually changed subsequent that actually started a lot long everybody sees it getting built now that started years before the you know physical construction everybody sees now so and that was subject to couple years of litigation as well that we won thank you I wanted to just acknowledge what Laura had said about the version of the document changing online it did change that day Debbie of the planning board uh office did actually let me know but the only thing that was the parent that changed was the cover page changed the photograph but why it changed and and that it's not referenced the date I think the township could do better on document Version Control and notifying people if there's different versions of a document we're referring to and approving or voting on or reviewing because what else might have changed besides the photo on the front um I I think that the traffic problems on Newman spring roads are very significant I I really think that adding additional units 340 at approximately multi capacity you know I don't know how many people will live in that so the number of cars that will be turning in and out will will add to the congestion and I I I really look forward to trying to be proactive about adding to the congestion to 520 [Music] um our street it's very hard to turn out particularly during rush hour and either left or right and if there's any way that we can address that situation I don't know uh traffic light is not likely I mean that's an idea but I mean I don't know if there's another way that we could figure out how to help control the flow as as more people commute to the the new vet hospital and and and the lifetime traffic I I don't see how that will help um I feel like we get forgotten sometimes are part of the township people think we're titin Falls but we are middl Town um titin Falls touches a lot of other towns and I think some people in tenton Falls think that they're a part of other towns too right no that's true no other Town touches Middletown and also Ocean Township or wall yeah I have to admit I'm not an expert on the geography um but I think it was Doug that mentioned the tra traffic light on Parkway Place yeah yes yeah I got I got it down yeah I mean they added as part of the parkway extension another traffic light so just going from like our house westbound on 520 we have five lights I lived on Davis Lan long half a mile it's a little yeah I don't know if that's the answer as all I'm saying at um um and the uh the drive-thru restaurant would also really add traffic flow I I don't I the the Access Lane that was referred to from from the extend the America to the River Center was only added because as part of the planning process then there was a requirement that people staying at the hotel should be able to go left out of the hotel they could not make that left so that to resolve that issue they added the access road so now if we add 340 units to addition and people are going to be using that we have to be mindful of that flow uh I don't understand we're keeping all the buildings so the Redevelopment in that area is just adding is that correct it's just eliminating the one small building what the uh that is open for business if people didn't know they're open for breakfast and lunch Monday through Friday just thought I time being I guess well for it's really pretty nice actually yeah it's I I think it yeah so it would eliminate the I think it's 20,000 square feet of of that building okay and and and is it possible and five you said that I heard that the the footprint couldn't be taller than the existing structures the tallest building there is 3 feet not five and I think in the plan the proposed height was five feet five stories that's two stories higher no those bildings are four stories so it's still higher yeah so the parking wouldn't be counted as a story is that why or is it an actual footage is is there a reason that they changed the plan from two buildings to one longer building we reduced the number of units almost well by more than half and in in the in the document that the the planning meeting the Redevelopment plan listed 390 units and now it says 340 units so that's not that was a way to reduce the to to reduce the number of units was to go down to one building so there' be less uh site disturbance uh so that that was the change but that's not half that's 50 we started we started off at 900 on that property with with all the Office Buildings remaining correct and now we sit here at 340 you know everyone should remember one thing about all this that we're talking about with affordable housing requirements in 13 months it starts all over get a new obligation from from well from the Supreme from the court basically uh we get a new obligation number so this is a never-ending process so if that bothers people call your legislator today and we could tell you a great we could tell you a great story about when people opposed the project that delayed it in the covid that is now where we had an affordable housing settlement and then they delayed the project killed the project project and then now we have a proposal for a thousand more units right across the street where the clown is so which was supposed to be 300,000 square feet of commercial development but because of a lawsuit that was filed that delayed that for two years then brought it into covid and killed that project we now have a proposal and a lawsuit to build a thousand units there so I always tell people be careful what you wish for when you oppose something because then the the result we had another project like that too where the um um was it the Century 21 there was a proposal to have a Century 21 store in Route 35 which by the way I had to look up what that was I'm not gonna lie I never heard the neighborhood upos and then we had a a you know Builder come in with affordable housing project that you know forced the Township's hand through the courts to build I forget how many hundreds of units there are now too so it's a very dangerous game to play um get yeah anyway what what I hope everybody understands is is that no one like you know no one is cheering what what we are trying to do is minimize the impact in in throughout the town right um and and that's why we have to be reasonable and good stewards to show the Supreme Court and and the courts that we appearer before that we are not just sitting here saying no and you know unfortunately in in areas you're going to have to understand that you're going to have to create credits and and and go through this process um and it's of my opinion that I would rather do that in areas that are already developed you know I I'm not opposed to Redevelopment I'm opposed to development because when it the and the difference is is critical is that there's only so many acres of undisturbed land left in Middletown um and when we went in 2018 before I was the mayor um and into 2019 we were negotiating with with fair share to try and create areas that were already developed and and say hey let's make this mixed use Let's do let's do this here and they said no no want that I don't want that it it it bothers me to my core that we are in the position because the legislature won't get off get off their butts and find a solution to this problem because it is a big problem I've talked to deinos scanland I've talked to Senator gopal I've talked to Senator Singleton I've talked to the governor about this you know Republicans Democrats are are equally at fault on this because nobody wants to get this done and it's about time that Trenton finally does something that the people of the state need and that is a real reform when it comes to housing quotas because they are destroying every single day that goes by but no one does anything about this you're destroying another acre of land you're you're destroying another environmentally sensitive area you're you're going to destroy them and we I wouldn't fight two Builder remedy suits at the same time if I didn't feel like Middletown was worth fighting for like Mammoth County wasn't worth fighting for but I'm gonna I'm G to get my head kicked in in court and poor Brian is going to have to be the one that takes it if we don't at least show that we're willing to put housing somewhere where should that be it should be in places that are already partially were developed commercially it should not be on places that have zero development on them no one is asking for that and this I don't listen I I think everything that you that you folks have asked for is is completely reasonable and I hope that you show up to the planning board meeting I hope that you ask for all the things that are necessary from the planning perspective but I just want you to understand that the position that we're in I'm willing to fight every single day I will fight for this town every single day for the betterment of for the betterment of this town but there's forces that are above us that we have said no no no no no constantly to but we need we truly need comprehensive reform when it comes to housing quotas before any of all the things that you are saying are exactly the things that I have said exactly the things that I have gone into Senate offices that I have talked to the governor about I have done all these things and and I don't blame you for having the position that you do but the having the full picture is a lot easier than not knowing any of the things that I just told you and and I just want I'm I'm being straight up with everybody that's here they are going to build a thousand units on that on that parcel they're going to squeeze every single housing structure they can onto that onto that with regardless of of Building height regardless of your environmental concerns regardless of traffic flow we will lose that case because they will say that Middletown hates to build affordable housing which is so beyond the truth it's not even funny anymore because I've read it I've seen it I've heard it people have said the same thing to me I've seen opinion pieces out there but they couldn't be farther from the truth I voted for redevelopment plans that included affordable housing in them but we are we are in a catch 22 but that catch 22 only kills Middletown in the end and and for those of you that are ttin and Falls residents it's only going to kill you too because ttin and Falls is going to have to do the same thing and Middletown is going to is going to have to be forced to build on areas that are right up against your border that are right up against hell's border that are right up against haslett's border that are right up against Atlantic Highland's border fix this problem we're trying to do the best we can by preventing a th000 units from going here a th000 units from going on Village 35 500 units from going on at exit 114 and I'm sorry and you're going to you can say what what all that you'd like to but I hope everybody knows that I have been screaming about this issue since 2019 and I'm only one person and I'm just a country mayor I'm just a country mayor but this is something that that I I think is personal because I I think they're trying to I think they're trying to to beat down bu bucolic places like Middletown I think they're trying to I think they're trying to beat us and and I think it it is it is beyond fair at this point so I will stop pontificating and standing on my soap box here thank you for but I hope you all send a a clip of that to your your respective legislator thank thank you for sharing I appreciate that I'm just curious I I can't speak to all Middletown I really mostly know more about lro but with four ponds how many affordable housing units are in four ponds I I'm I'm so glad glad you brought that up you're GNA say and you're say but and what about the other Bome Hollow I mean I know people are asking both perfect example both perfect example you know why no affordable was done there because the state had no rules when the we had an approved housing plan and then the state went I'm out like a blackjack dealer when it came to affordable housing I'm done no one had any rules anymore so then you have municipalities 500 65 municipalities that don't know what they're doing you have 565 municipalities waiting for the Supreme Court to make a decision on something that we have no clue what you're doing so what do we do we have we make settlement agreements with them oh okay well you're you want to build there's no rules from the state there's no rules from from COA COA was abolished basically and now it's it was just up to nine Supreme Court Justices that if you were walking down the street you'd have no idea idea that you just walk past the Supreme Court Justice they're not answerable to anybody and they're making these decisions so why why was that why did that happen because at that point in time COA had been abolished and and and eliminated basically and it was thrown to the courts and the courts hadn't put out the rules but time still keeps going on people still keep working you didn't stop working because COA didn't COA didn't exist anymore it's like when the federal government shuts down like you know people done that well most people will go back to work right but but again it it's this the state always thinks that it can just I got an idea you know and and then all of a sudden like they think that all municipalities stop doing what they're doing because the state just said ah we're done with that those those were both specifically sites that were bam Hollow especially tried to intervene into our housing plan in 2009 and tried to stop us from securing approval of our housing plan at that time because they wanted to build 1,400 units at BAM Hollow then we got our housing plan approved by COA but then the courts threw that plan out um and then and then we were able to come to a settlement which preserved 100 acres of open space that the township now owns there and built the houses that are there which is far or less about what 190 houses single family homes there now in 100 acres of open space that the township owns now rather than 1,400 tow houses that they were planning to build there and that they were suing the township over to build there that that site was actually the subject of litigation going back to the early 1980s believe it or not and that went until 209 a or 2013 I think after our housing we beat them in court we beat them in Administrative Hearings before COA and then we you know we finally got to a point where they realized that you know then the co rules got thrown out the plan got thrown out then that's the only thing that really permitted us to come to a settlement there um because they weren't going to wait another five or 10 years for the Supreme Court to decide actually wasn't even until really 2015 um so you know six years after that um and so and then same thing with four ponds four ponds was actually supposed to have almost twice as many units as there are there there are there now they were in our a lot of people in lft and so that that was what ended up there are also the result of a Le eventual legal settlement in 2013 and I would note that all of these settlements are now being you know that they're trying to use against the township too in court right now so um so the Township's efforts to you know limit you know and and and have more reasonable development um you know it's it's it's a NeverEnding fight that the mayor touched upon soe you know one thing to I think everyone should be aware of is just because we we we've talked about two sites bam Hollow and cor ponds that don't have affordable housing units but we do have dozens of projects around town that do have affordable housing s we have many many many projects and every time we dealt with one of those projects their neighborhood would be here you weren't at any of those meetings concerned about those units but they weren't they're not here tonight because it's not in their neighborhood that's just the reality of it so we we've we I could take any one of you for an entire day and show you all of the affordable housing projects we have around town but far more than most municipalities in New Jersey have done and so um it's not like we haven't um taken on our fair share we haven't built many many units we have but the issue now is it's piling on at this point and we we've kind of taken the mission we're still going to BU build units but we want to do it at at our Pace we want to do it where where it makes sense not every Farm every undeveloped tra of land in town be reasoned for housing we want to try to redevelop or revelop properties that's our approach to doing it and and that's the plan going forward and I I want to be clear we're not necess we're not sitting here only talking about affordable housing I mean that came up as a requirement and that's what's motivating the town to reone part of this property so that they could put the units the people are opposed to adding apartment building not specifically affordable to understand so I I I think that's important to to say 100% I I I not one person has have I felt is saying that at all you know it it's but completely understand your point and I was curious is it if it's I know it's not proposed at the plan yet but how many apartment how many bedrooms and what size apartments are we expecting here is it like three bedroom units one-bedroom units do we know the distribution if there's any idea that'll that'll be more of a um decision made at the planning board level because it affects the number of parking spaces so but with with affordable units there is some requirements uh that you have to do a certain percentage of one two and three bedroom units that would be only part of the 34 not to the rest of them so to be mindful that that there will be need for busing for schools to go to that property every single project in town that has affordable housing in it gets less okay I know that just to mention I know because my daughter took the bus Parkway Place and um there was an issue in in the hotel at one point there was a student going to linro Elementary that was living at the hotel and that was an issue and in order to curb the what what currently sits as a as an overcrowded School of linro Elementary um the board of education has stated that these students any students generated out of this um um complex would go to River Plaza elementary school so what about current students of Parkway Place no no no this is only for this River Center building that wouldn't impact anybody else so the Zoning for the schools there's one neighborhood would be separate from I mean that's new yeah it's just it's just to prevent linro which we know has a has a current you know abundance of students to go to a school that currently is completely underpopulated um to try and prevent that from exacerbating the problem because again that'll flip in a generation just what we're what we're seeing right now is the south side has has much more students than the North side was but a generation ago it was the reversed and now you have all your empty nesters on the North side or or a higher percentage of them on the North side and eventually that will flip too Sandy didn't really help with that you know it it it kind of stopped that really from going on because people were buying up those those houses and demolishing them and and and rebuilding but in in an effort to prevent any more students from going there to linkt while this while this overpopulation exists these students would be sent to River Plaza which can easily um absorb any students that go there yeah yeah who knows that's very good point what will happen in 10 years from now could be totally different again I wanted to story of our Liv it's everybody's life yeah I wanted to just acknowledge the environmental issues that were previously stated and I I um if it's possible to reduce the footprint I know that you're saying that it's already been reduced I don't I haven't seen the actual drawings except for what's in that plan it seems like a pretty big area um so if there's any way to reduce the footprint that would be helpful and um that's thank you very much and thanks for Roslin Carter too I'm a fan I named my first daughter Reagan I tried to name my son Carter just for the sake of having Reagan Carter I didn't win I didn't win that battle but all right any other member of the public wish should yeah Melanie come on down twice in one day what do I owe this honor Melanie eler green tree terrace and Loft um I think I can solve your height issue because that's offensive to a lot of people the height of the building being five stories four well Ruckers recently did a study and they've advertised this pretty heavily in the last few months about the number of parking spaces that are given to these kinds of housing uh developments is way too high that the state makes that requirement I think they want like 1.33 units uh parking per bedroom or something I know we talking about the rers yeah because they're saying it should be 1.01 spaces a 25% less than what's been mandated by the state and they're really making inroads and trying to get that message received by legislator big part of our Master plane that's come is that what you're going to say to him no okay well I'm going to say it anyway big part of master plan coming up you drive down Road 35 all right drive down Road 35 the number of parking spaces that are empty in these strips it's ridiculous it's ridiculous it is obscene because at that time it was like well we have to have so many parking spaces for for this place there was never a need for that and when you go to the to the uh what shopping center Stop and Shop shopping center 135 5 there is the whole back of the Stop and Shop shopping center is all parking what for what because everyone thought oh well the employees will park in the back and everyone else will park in the front yeah that never happened that never pans out so a big part of our master plan is re-evaluating the percentage of parking spaces we require based on the square footage of any proposed building that is occurring so I'll let Merk and tante tell you what he was apparently going to say um but but a big part of our of our master plan uh reevaluation will be reducing what Middletown currently requires in terms of parking per square foot yeah what I was going to say is I know the study you're talking about you know we've been talking about it for a few years now and um one of it reveals two things that we've known all along and the state doesn't get it um that most of these projects generate far fewer um cars than uh people think than the state thinks and they also generate far fewer school children um usually the concern about projects like this is oh my God we're gonna have more kids in the school system it's going to you know devastate our tax-wise first of all Middletown school district has lost thousands of students compared to what it used to have so it could probably use a few more students but that being said these projects generate a much smaller number of of school children school age children than people think people think if you build an paring Department you're gonna have two children the reality is it takes about six units to generate one child and we've surveyed every multif family H housing development in the township and we do it every few years just to make sure the numbers are current and that number has stayed pretty steady for 20 years now so uh they don't have the the type of impacts that people think and yes I do think you could do less parking the only thing is the state has a a state regulation called the residential site Improvement standards you you're required to follow so they gets to be a bit of a debate at the planning board level as to whether or not you can reduce below what the state requires for parking because again towns don't dictate residential parking requirements anymore the state took that away 15 years ago um and so we have to abide by that generally do you see momentum towards a change that it could perhaps coincide with when I do think it's changing the other thing that's going to change is the mayor was talking about is commercial parkings Lots right I mean when when all those standards were're creating there was no such thing as online shopping there was no such thing as packages from Amazon so far fewer people are going to stores anymore and so the parking standards should be reduced accordingly because we have C Asphalt in all these shopping centers you can go byy any of them and they're at best they're half buil so that that needs to change too and I'd like to take some of those shopping centers and retrofit them and reduce the amount of pavement parking we have in replace it with open space okay um because if you could get less parking then the building could be lower I don't know if that much l cut that top floor off maybe okay um the other thing so just I just took a look with Brian whose computer just died but I think that there's only a 10 foot difference between the existing buildings and that's because of the floor plates now I can sit here and pretend like I understand what a FL plate commercial floors each commercial floor is much higher than a residential floor oh okay so the Delta between the existing buildings and and this proposed building would be 10 feet okay um what about the D applica application um is that something that just the planning board keeps a breast of or does the township committee get informed because I'm wondering what if the D comes out because I don't even think they've been out to the site and what if they don't approve then what happens like what happens to this application that's on them that's all on the planning board it's a condition of approval they they can't do this without the EP approval everything moves along through the planning board through the County planning board and then like why is there no urgency for the D to come out right now the D won't now they kind of they kind of run all concurrently yeah it's all concurrent okay because I had thought that they were going to come out initially just to do the wetlands delineation and I don't know if that was they may they may come out to do that but that's a whole different ball game than the other type of Permitting that they like Waterfront development permits and things like that so the delineation in itself can't alter what goes to the planning board perhaps or it can in some cases in this case it won't because you have such a steep bank that the wetlands really aren't going to extend beyond above the bank above above the top of the bank in this case in some properties it can be very extensive and affect the development all right that's all I had thank you so much Melanie uh this young man I think did you have a question sir on step for um hello how are you I'm good thanks uh my name's Zachary Benner of of 129 glenw Drive I just a I would like to like present a question that I don't think I like heard before it's like how are the the buildings that are already in what you're calling South lot like how Stu close to the mic a little bit um the buildings that are like already in the what you're calling the South lot like those big Office Buildings you said that they're mostly like they have like a low occupation so like how I'm just wondering for like the building project how are those going to be used like are they going to be knocked down or are they going to convert them into housing no th those buildings will remain commercial oh okay yeah the the except for the the 20,000 foot auxiliary building that's there that building will go but the other the other three buildings will remain where they where they currently are okay all right yeah just have that question thank you I'm glad you step forward I love when young people come up to the microphone any other member of the public wishing to make a public comment all right I want to thank all of you very much this has been a great dialogue I want to thank you very much um with that um move to close the public portion and approve second yes many woman crats yes mman Senate bro yes Deputy Mayor hell yes mayor Perry yes motion carries to pass this ordinance on on second and final reading our next ordinance on tonight's agenda we have a public hearing for 2023 d33 96 hang on I just want to say again thank you all very much I hope you have a great Thanksgiving thank you all thanks for your time go ahead Heidi sorry sure an ordinance providing funding for various Capital Improvements for the township of Middletown and appropriating 2,567 500 for such purpose any member of the public wishing to speak on public ordinance number 2023 Das which one am I on 3396 B eight I think that should say that's a b it is a b it's a b okay I've never seen that before all right all right uh seeing no member of the public stepping forward move the Clos public portion and approve second commit Clark yes commit cratz yes committee srino yes Deputy Mayor hiel yes mayor Perry yes motion carries to pass this ordinance on second and final reading our next order ordinance for public hearing we have 2023-24 Bond ordinance providing an appropriation of2 milon $261,000 for various Park improvements by and for the township of Middletown in the county of Mammoth New Jersey and authorizing the issuance of 2,479 in bonds or notes of the township for financing part of the appropriation any member of the public wishing to speak on public ordinance number seven seeing no member of the public stepping forward move to close the public portion and approve second committee man Clark yes committee woman Katz yes committee man s brino yes Deputy Mayor hial yes mayor Perry yes motion carries to pass this ordinance on second and final reading our final public hearing we have 20 23- 3398 a bond ordinance providing an appropriation of $5,499 th000 for various capital Capital Improvements by and for the township of Middletown in the county of Mammoth New Jersey and authorizing the issuance of 4,968 1813 in bonds or notes of the township for financing part of the appropriation any member of the public wishing to speak on public ordinance number 223-3307 forward move to close the public portion and approve second committee man Clark yes committee woman Katz yes commit man s brino yes Deputy Mayor HBO yes mayor Perry yes motion carries to pass this ordinance on second and final reading at this time we have introduction of proposed ordinance 2023 3399 an ordinance establishing fair market value for property identified as block 835 part of lot 18 within the township of Middletown and authorizing acquisition of this property by purchase or eminent domain for the purpose of maintaining open space and enhancing public recreational opportunities MO motion to introduce second mman Clark yes many woman cratz yes minman sen brino yes Deputy Mayor hell yes mayor Perry yes motion carries a pass this ordinance on first reading with a public hearing to be held December 4th yeah December 4th 2023 at this time we have a consent agenda oh our first item on this agenda though is the New Jersey state best practices survey if anyone wishes to discuss we have to do that for State requirement any member of the uh Township committee wishing to discuss NJ State best practices survey just for the Public's sake we approve this every year right Heidi sounds great all right let's roll okay for our consent agenda we're going to have um items 23- 269 through 23285 including firefighter applications removing 23- 283 for a separate vote how you that you said 285 283 no no it it was 269 through 285 correct yes okay uh motion to approve second M Clark yes manyan CRA yes minman SBO yes Deputy Mayor hell yes mayor Perry yes motion carries to adopt consent agenda now we have resolution 23- 283 a resolution authorizing ward of contract to vendor with State contract for health and wellness app okay like to move forward with go ahead Rick okay like to move on on second please comman Clark yes committee woman Katz yes committee sen brino yes Deputy Mayor hell yes mayor Perry recuse motion carries to adopt resolution 23- 283 with recusal noted his time we have Township committee comments all right L M Clark thank you Mr Mayor I'll make them as quick as I can first congratulations to the uh Middletown South cross country team as the mayor said it seems like we uh every month we have a new state champion coming up from uh both of our high schools and that's pretty awesome it just goes to show what an outstanding sports program Middletown is offering in our school district um I'd like to thank the public and my uh colleagues up here for the opportunity to serve again last week was uh it last week it was two weeks ago time flies when you're having fun two weeks ago was election day and uh myself and my running mate were fortunate enough to win and uh just want to say thank you to everybody for the support and I look forward to another three years of trying to do all the stuff that mayor Perry uh and our lawyer spoke about at length um you know we do get and I said this last month we we sit up here and um there's a lot more than just sitting up here and talking to the public that happens uh the interface behind the scenes and the planning and the thought process process is uh is in-depth it was a lot more than I expected when I got up here I've sat I've served in other capacities within the town and um have had the opportunity to be involved in some pretty heavy conversations and I got to say some of the stuff we get involved with here affects Generations right it's not doesn't affect next week um and I've got two young children in in town and I want them to grow up here the same way that I did so I really really appreciate the opportunity to do this again and I'm looking forward to helping make some great decisions to further us um and I want to re reiterate what I said last last month as well we're going to fight our butts off up here all all five of us uh with the support of our of the entire team that's sitting around us as well and everybody within this municipality that has a position to do the smart things right not just with Land Development with every single thing that we do um whether it's supporting our emergency services or our our school district um whatever it is we're going to we're going to be smart and we're going to work our buts off for everybody so thank you again that's it thank you thank you Mr Mayor want to congratulate committee Clark and committee woman cratz on a great election and uh they've always put the town first and uh I look forward to working with them for the next three years congratulations again uh makes H makes life easier up here to have continuity for the township committee and for the town as well and uh just uh wish everyone a a great healthy and happy Thanksgiving go ah have mayor thank you thank you mayor um also just wanted to congratulate our girls cross country team too just an amazing accomplishment for them um also wanted to thank Middletown for having their faith in me again for the next three years um it's a pleasure to serve this community and it's an honor truly um it also is not a a bad thing to serve with the four of these guys so it really uh we're a wonderful team that really works well together and it's it's really an honor to serve with all of you so I thank you for your support always um also just a a real big shout to Middletown helps its own I was able to again volunteer with my family along with many families and many of our First Responders to put baskets and and boxes together for our Middletown residents 350 of them this year so really just what an accomplishment and a testament to neighbors helping neighbors in in really such a a beautiful time of year so just wanted to acknowledge them and wish everyone a blessed and happy Thanksgiving Deputy Mayor um when cratz said I was her favorite though congratulations certain that that's not true great job we look I look forward to uh serving uh the rest of my term with you guys uh this committee Works uh great as a team and we look forward to Contin continuing that uh I want to thank all the people that came out I know most of them left tonight it's uh it's good to hear what you had to say uh we all uh we all listen we all live here and we uh we hear what you're saying so um I also uh want to wish everyone a Happy Thanksgiving and that's all I have mayor all right uh just want to Ryan Kim congratulations again look forward to the next three years with you um two other items December 3rd 5 to 7 is our Christmas tree lighting this year over at the Middletown Arts Center hope to see you it grows every single year it gets better every single year um and I know that the No Limits food truck is going to be there this year um which which is great so hope to see everybody over there um and again wishing you all a very joyous Thanksgiving I hope you all um get to spend time with family and friends and and those important to you with that I'll open it up for public comment any member of the public wish to make a public comment may do so ask that you keep your comments to five minutes at four minutes I'll let you know that you have one minute remaining um and if you can begin to wrap up your comments uh also please state your name and address for the record hi Susan Penrose 12 clav in I love that look how fast that was and I'll be really quick I I just saw an article on tap into Middletown we were talking about uh Road PR preservation and micro resurfacing on Kings Landing Road and I was wondering what that is going to entail is that a complete repaving or is that repair or what is it so it's it's a pilot program that we are trying okay um and I think it's a very exciting way to be able to uh enhance the um the not only the consistency but the safety and the um the life of a roadway so basically what this does is our team will be able to go in and seal cracks and Ted can talk to this more um but uh in fact just so you know Somerset County started off I think they started at half a million dollars a year they did they are now up to $5 million a year that they dedicate just to this practice um but several years back we um we were discussing this very topic so what happens is that a rather than knilling a road down and and completely putting new asphalt roads that are in a fairly good condition that can be um repaired patched in certain areas crack sealed in certain areas then they come over with um asphalt and um I don't want to call them Pebbles but it what's the right gravel gravel um they come over and put a brand new seal down on that road extending the life of the roadway um beyond what what that can currently serve as so we at the team is right now evaluating the roads that would be uh viable for this but it's a way that we can now extend not only the life of the road but also provide um extra time in between Milling down and repaving a roadway you know it's so expensive and so timely the the amount of time it takes to PVE a road in my opinion is ridiculous um and there are certain roads especially those high volume traffic area roadways that rather than Milling down and repaving if we're able to extend the life of that road to get an additional five years out of it 10 years out of it by doing this process which costs a fraction of what it does to Mill and and repave let's try it at least you know let's give it a play so just to be clear just to be clear this is a pilot that you're trying and we be part of it in King's Landing is that but you said this is a pilot program for Middletown it's it's a pilot to see how does it work how does it work you know is it is it is it cost effective is okay does the time is it easier on the timing all these different aspects of you know we we think it works because Somerset County you know you know has done such a such a large amount of capital into it for several years now um but you know then again what works in Somerset County Ted might tell me and and our Engineers might tell me this really isn't isn't the right time to embark on this and so will we be giving notice that you'll be coming into the community because that's our main road into K Landing so do we'll notify we'll notify your your your property manager and and make sure that everybody has access to vehicles and the ability to do this but it it what from what they have explained um this is a very quick process so the disruption for your neighborhood will be minimal compared to what it would be if we miled and repaved it okay I appreciate it thank you very much thank you Happy Thanksgiving you to any other member of the public wishing to make a public comment yes sir you've been waiting a long time away I appreciate your patience thank you uh good evening my name is Will mford and I live on cresu drive right off rout 35 next to Whole Foods um so I am a nurse up at Robert Wood Johnson and I'm here to request that you as Municipal leaders please pass a resolution in support of Bill a 4536 which establishes minimum registered professional nurse staffing standards for hospitals and Ambulatory Surgery facilities as well as certain DHS facilities as you may know 1,700 nurses have been on strike at Robert Wood Johnson University Hospital for over a 100 days and Hospital management has spent over 150 million on replacement nurses rather than meet our key demands for safe Staffing appropriate and enforcable nurse to Patient ratios that are evidence-based and keep nurses and patients safe um so just to kind of illustrate why these enforceable ratios are important so I work on a narrow step down unit we have a lot of stroke patients and it requires a lot of um frequent and very precise neuro assessments so I had a patient one day he had a massive stroke was in our neuro IU for several days was downgraded which means he was deemed stable enough to come to our floor um I came in one morning at four other patients we did I did his neuros assessment and he had a very slight defect in his left field division so I alerted the resident who alerted the attending it turns out that a vessel had reoccluded if we had not caught it he would have been at least severely disabled or died um so if you I had four relatively stable patients that day if you had a sixth or a 7th has sometimes happened the chances that something like that would be missed increase um and there is a large base of scientific evidence showing um decreases in patient outcomes uh increas in patient mortality um and nursing burnout room with that um so studies show repeatedly that understaffing compromises patient care and safety understaffing in hospitals is an urgent Public Health concern that impacts any Resident who may spend time in a hospital which I believe is all of us um I'm here today to ask you to put a resolution on the agenda and to vote vot on it at the next council meeting in support of legislation that needs to move forward in our state legislature this resolution would demonstrate your commitment to our communities public health and advocate for legislation that would address the serious concern that impacts all of us um this is a bipartisan issue whether or not you get sick and will spend time in a hospital is not determined by your political affiliation we need our legislators to co-sponsor this bill and this resolution will demonstrate your support and also encourage any of our legislators in our district who not yet Co sponsers to take a closer look um safe Staffing results and safer patient care and decreased mortality rates fre Admissions and length of stay uh safe Staffing isn't just for nurses it's for you and everyone else in our community who may one day find themselves in a hospital um we look forward to working with you my colleagues and I to answer any questions you may have about the bill or resolution and provide any additional information that you may thank you for your time first of all thank you for everything that all of you do um I work in a hospital Hospital not Robert Wood but your main competitor um but but thank you for everything that you do um I I I have to say I I like most people you don't really realize everything that goes into to being a nurse they they are truly the backbone of a hospital uh hands down there's no question about it um and I I'm fortunate to work uh with a lot of them well I'm not on the clinical side I get to work with a lot of them and understand the stories of things that you just you just told um and and understand the importance of ensuring that when when you're checking a family member into the hospital into the Ed or whatever the case may be you're you're going to have those Staffing quotas that are needed to ensure that your loved ones are getting the proper care that they need um so I I'll take a look at the bill Brian just brought it up for me who's your who's the Senate sponsor vital yeah vitalian Greenstein has has it gotten a um a senate health committee vote I don't believe so no it's sort of I think been languishing for 2 one year all right V vital is the chairman of the Senate health committee okay that's weird I'll take a look at the bill and and just get my card get Laura's card here and and I'll I'll give you a buzz on um work working towards something if we can all right thank you for your all right thank you again for all that you do appreciate it any other member of the public wish you to make a public comment how are you hi I'm lean Capa I live on L Terrace in Middletown um I'm just following up on this to provide some further Insight on what we experience I'm speaking today as one of the 1700 nurses that's been on strike since August 4th for sta Staffing we're not on strike for money we want more nurses I work with some of the most vulnerable people who come into our hospital I'm a pediatric emergency room nurse and I have been for six years I personally have been with Robert Wood for two years and within those two years most of my shifts are short staffed I'm stretched thin every shift trying to ensure the safety of my patients as well as the safety of my own license I work repeatedly under staff because New Jersey does not have standardized nurse to Patient ratios just because this is how it's been done for years it does not mean that's how it has to be because it's not morally correct we can improve and we can change I have witnessed terrible things from car accidents to Strokes to sepsis and children infants and teens this is a burden that I live with as this is my profession but what I cannot live with is the inability every time I arrive to my shift to be unable to care with the highest quality due to the number of patients I see and due to the number of patients I'm assigned to will was saying he might have one to four one to five one to six in the emergency room I have had 1 to 12 1 to 10 most days are 1 to8 what I would love is 1 to four because we are the level one pediatric trauma center for the state for Mammoth County everything get shipped to us I'm asking for your help in supporting Bill a43 sorry I'm really bad at public speaking a 4536 s304 as working short staff is not an isolated problem within New Brunswick I ask you to take a moment and recognize that this affects us all everyone who's receiving care within the state is most likely receiving Care at a facility without appropriate nurse to Patient ratios thank you thank you very much any of the fellow nurses can feel free to come up my name is Renee bisani I am a resident of Middletown Going on 30 years this coming January I um live at uh six Decker Drive in Leonardo I've been a nurse at Robert Wood for 17 years I started my career there and I hope to end my career there I have um since I'm there for 17 years I have seen a lot and the staffing has definitely gotten worse since I started my career I want to improve the conditions so that these young nurses can come and stay and they stay at the bedside and unfortunately this affects all of us we come into the world most likely with a nurse at the bedside and many times we go out with a nurse at the bedside I want to make sure that when I'm on my way out that I have a competent nurse at my side that has the time to hold my hand so I hope that you will consider sponsoring and helping us in signing this resolution so that we can get what we need in the hospital thank you thank you very much and Happy Thanksgiving you too any other of our nurses okay I thought you know Rick would have like you know thank thank God you were here because if he had to race one of those cross country side would have needed all right any other member of the public wishing to make a public comment Melanie you say that every time you come to the microphone this time I really mean it uh Melanie eler Green Street terce Lin coft code enforcement in Lin coft uh we had the opportunity The linro Village Green board we were invited to go to Left Min Towers in the Pavilion with the residents there just to meet them and just get a pulse on you know what's affecting their lives and you know how they feel about you know Lin coft are they able to get around and the one thing they they complained about a lot is the garbage on the Acme Road it's always been a problem I've called code enforcement so many times it's partly the um Property Owners uh issue they have dumpsters back there they let them overflow they're not careful when they dump people leave things there and dump things I know there's a lot of illegal dumping they're not enclosed but it streams all the way down towards their walkway to get to the Acme to get to that the stores in that area the bagel shop and things like that so they they said it they don't feel safe there they can't even on the sidewalk it overflows there's you know vaping equipment liquor bottles uh but just generally just garbage just garbage and any given day you drive down the Acme Road it's a mess so I've called many times and I just don't get really any resolution so I'm hoping because the seniors are so affected that you know maybe you'll hear their pleas and and possibly have someone uh take a look at it and talk to um Miss Falone who's the owner of that property back there and um and maybe the Acme can help as well I don't know where the boundaries lie a lot of times that's the issue but I am a firm believer that the more you see that the more you see our other problem which is graffiti it's getting very very bad the um Village Park that uh the lvga are stewards of has been tagged our little Free Library was completely covered in graffiti like the nice kind of graffiti not like kids just scratching their name but like the real tags and we're seeing that more and more throughout town the stop sign and the the left turn at the Acme tagged all over we called uh Alberton to get that replaced but it's just kind of creeping you know and I think the the more you can keep the town clean and set the expectation I don't think you see that as much and um and so I'm just hoping that they can just do more on the code enforcement end to try to get the areas cleaned up and make the property owners more responsible the business owners you know here here's my thing is the people that are doing that the mom and dad have to be involved of course of course they're doing that in other towns making there's nothing there's nothing code enforcement can do about about graffiti no I know I'm just relating it to the the more you see the conditions lowering the more opportunity it is for that to be to blend in you know that it's it's they think it's not noticed they think it fits you know it's like the broken window the amount of time the Public Works scrapes graffiti off of playgrounds is outrageous I know I know if anyone wants to know why we can't get to X you know by this date is because they're scraping they they're sanding graffiti off of off of this or off of that you know I I think that there has to be some type of level of personal responsibility when it comes to parents that are figuring out what it is that their kids are doing at night um I've had a couple things spray painted about me on a road a couple years back and very flattering stuff um but but the the eventually I got you you know um but again for every time that that happens there is something else that has to get pushed down to the bottom of the list because people don't want to see the Graff I'm not I'm not asking for that I'm just asking for just a general um care to be taken by the property owners to clean up and perhaps keeping that standard higher that you're not going to allow garbage everywhere um will help in other areas I it got mama yeah yeah yeah that guy all right thanks Melanie any other member of the public would you to make a public comment seeing no other member of the public stepping forward move the close the public portion and adjourn second commit man Clark yes commit woman crafts yes committee s bro yes Deputy Mayor hell yes mayor Perry yes Happy Thanksgiving everybody