##VIDEO ID:Eqyan8kno5w## [Music] f all right folks uh we'll get started uh it's uh November 26 at 7:09 p.m. we call the the call to order the meeting of the Milton School building committee um just running through a quick attendance with the house is Scott Terk present John cohane present online we have krie Hurley here Glenn Hoffman aquar [Music] bong present all right Dr Miranda pres Tim Lumbard present and Mark Lauren here and Shan perfect uh so second thing on the agenda is uh citizen speak uh so we reserve the first uh 15 minutes of our meeting uh for Citizens that want to speak we ask that you limit your uh commentary or or speaking notes to three minutes U and please just state your name and address uh there's nobody in the room with us tonight so so just look online in case somebody would like to speak just you please use the raise your hand function that's just me your panelist because I can't share it [Music] than and see none move on uh item three is approval of our past meeting minutes our last meeting was about a month ago Monday October 21st 2024 those minutes were distributed as part of your packets um you know just see if you have any uh edits comments or anything like that on the minutes if people do not have comments or edits i' entertain motion to approve I'll make a motion to approve the meeting minutes from October 21st 2024 second all right and then we'll do a roll call vote unless there's other discussions I don't assume we do have any so roll call vote Scott Kack yes John Co yes Carrie Hurley yes Glenn Hoffman yes Aqua bong obain okay Dr Miranda yes uh Tim Lumbard yes uh Mark Lauren yes and John work yes item 4A schematic design update um so essentially we've got two portions of this there's uh some updates to the or that's under new business right the renderings um yes yeah I think put it in new business yeah you put it yeah you put it into new business so we'll touch base on that so so is part of old business for our schematic design update um there's many of you whereare we work to uh refine the design that we did over the summer uh sharpen pencils for lack of better word and with that uh tighter design that we had there we've had an updated construction cost estimate provided uh so with that you know you or Sean take it away sure that so just so everyone's aware this is in um it's up on the share drive we send a link out to that just to remind you where it's at y um as is the full estimate so uh there's two columns here one is our estimate that we did on in July 22nd 2024 the right column is the 118 uh 2024 estimate uh just so you know there I think there was two or three minor revisions to this they sent out one we provided comments back um and so this these numbers here represent the the final one that's included in I think all of them are actually up on the website up on the our shared folder but the most recent one is is noted uh most of the items um are pretty close I mean there's some uh big changes in Roofing went up Interiors went up but then other items went down hbac went down and the I think the one thing to note here is the total construction cost uh has actually decreased um by a little bit and most of that money is coming out of our contingency I think we've drawn down our contingency uh um a fair amount by about you know went from 14.2 million to 9.6 and that happens as you get closer and closer to your construction start date the estimators get more and more sure about the actual cost of items so they hold less and less contingency so that's really what you're seeing here is that that they're seeing construction numbers holding firm um on the dates we're going to construct that and they're able to pull out some contingency out of that number and feel more com comfortable with this 28.9 million construction cost only that's not total project cost also just to keep in mind um this um updated uh estimate one of the other bigger difference is that the escalation includes pushing out the construction much further than the earlier estimate and so while the overall construction uh cost went down by that 3.42% we were able to include the that change in the start date um which does obviously impact the bottom l so that was yeah we have that here as well as well um I think also the other thing to note is that the um site work package went down um um because the moving of the valve Road got a lot more precise with uh the way that they're treating the grading um at the road and the way that grading has to come down in the building so that um those draw lines that describe the road move are significantly more specific and have um less cut and fill than what was in the earlier estimate and we're going to continue to work with the civil and Landscape Architects to continue to r on that because that is um a big move as part of the um just so go down you can see it down here building site prep one from 2.28 to 1.5 um and then the building site went from 11.5 to 10.5 and think that's the sh's point the more and more they refine these drawings the better the uh estimators can estimate these and so and I think the more they do it the more comfortable the estimators are and that results in that contingency decrease the drawings are much more refined than the uh drawings that were sent out in uh July those are more square footage rough number estimates and these ones are really take takeoffs and of glass and exterior and dirt and interior the whole the whole l so that's and that's what we expect to see and that's we hope to see is we continue to to force the issue and to move that cost uh down and certainly not up and that's some of the tradeoff to for contingency budget that was there right so the five million that's come down to is still distributed you know it kind of gets redistributed up as things get fine tuned where they go higher right it will yes that the case in our case here yeah we're actually about yeah just under 5 million right around 5 million lower y so you could say that well got taken off here but the reality is you're right yeah money items that are higher items that are lower all kind of balance out and then our net result is that that 3.4% decrease to the bottom line the 3.4% even with contingency going down escalation has gone up but overall it's three 3.42 yes and so that LE our total project cost now based on WE you we we ran the same numbers left the same design fees left the same epan all that we set up 169 million 021 673 so that 173 comes down to 169 so it's about a $4 million4 and half million drop then we also have just on overall project costs if we do the geothermal there's a rebate cost that comes in with that too right yeah so that was on that previous I didn't bring numbers with can have um I would suspect that the geothermal rebate and the number we estimated the same number of GE geothermal wells in this as in the other one because there wasn't a square footage change in the building this you're seeing the cost savings come from the Precision of the drawings but the square footage of the building didn't essentially change so you're going to still need the same number of geothermal Wells um but those rebates as long as they are still in um you'll still be eligible for them um okay right open up to any questions from Members Mark yeah Mark you recognized thank you uh just three questions for two just to make sure I'm fully um am communicating this correctly if anybody ask me but so the understanding is the overall cost of the project is now based upon this estimate reducing from 173 to 168 169 and at the same time we've been able to push out the estimation includes escalation that pushes Out start date to June 2026 is that correct we have early enabling packages um for March 2026 which is like the road work is a separate flatwork package building construction July 2026 is what our escalation is carrying us to for start of construction it's on the front page um the yeah yeah yeah I saw that I just want to make sure I wasn't misunderstanding that's correct so the escal so from the feasibility to the SD we did push out I think it was like eight months or something don't quote me on that but like there was we pushed it out so you were going to see an increase in that escalation um as we get to a more realistic timeline for when we're going to start but at the same time you're going to see some of the other costs come down as we get more precise and we pick more specific materials um and we hone in on the exterior um and there in you and I have ideas of other areas of savings that we did not Implement in the SPD package because we haven't been able to present to you design options so when we get to the next phase we can start talking about those larger moves um if if there's more savings that need to be achieved you're talking about how much glass you put inside the building right instead of walls and different finishes tiles andion of brick to rain screen um you know like roof material like uh the scare materials like there all these things that start to impact the overall costs and so if you want to change FL material what does that meanu um what does that mean in terms of the thickness of the walls do you lose SC footage like there all these things that we need to like sort out but these we can't do on our own these have to be done in conjunction with the school building committee and with Dr Burrows to make sure that everybody knows what's happening with the project you know on this estimate comparison you can see here our escalation went from just about 5 million to 6.2 so it's up 1.2 million in escalation by moving schedule that's represented here yep one question for you on the estimate the it looks like the square footage actually went up too it was 152 now it's 161 so that the biggest change the reason for the um for footage change is so as we all know there's a new energy fode that came in and we haven't seen any buildings really come online yet that um have achieved that envelope and to meet the rating and so in the feasibility study again there were really no buildings online but what we've done is we've worked with paper ver director sustainability and we have two schools in the office that are ahead of ahead of M right so they're really working with the engineers to understand that thermal comfort and so the thickness of the exterior on the Lo wall had to grow substantially to capture the insulation to meet Cod and so uh instead of pushing the instead of losing square footage in the classrooms we kept the classroom sizes you know what they were but those walls had to push out and it is a little shocking that when you do that with such a large perimeter that that's really the bulk of your square footage and then there are other areas where like we had to move a door out because it was we needed to get an extra 5T for Cove for erress like the all these things so it does we're in the same ballpark but again in the next phase we can look at those numbers and really discreetly say here opportunities to cut but we felt it was in Milton's best interest to go with the more conservative higher number so that we know that we can achieve this um and it's easier to talk about cutting after rather than add we can't add so just one clarification on that too the the energy code you're referencing is a stretch energy code corre not the opin electrical one that the town recently that correct it's it's the envelope we have to meet a certain why the envelope we did bring the glass down to 23% like so the glass to solid percentage is there um but again it's that wall thickness that drove a lot of that change in the footprint I I see that in my line of work all the time because I'm figuring the square footage to the outside edge of the shelf and a lot of other ways they figureing square footage to the inside surface not the outside surface so we come across that a lot when we have to make that change that was was a really big deal that day messed up like your geometry any any other questions from uh members uh that are online are present to uh you know for the overall estimate I had M were said I had that why did the percentage go down from 15 to 10 but you explained that so I understand that and if there are any other questions they can just run them through you and shali and I are our team we be happy to answer what any other anything else that pops up sure they should they it's a pretty straightforward estimate so it's should be pretty straightforward answers for you right right I think we'll move on then oh Mark has his hand raised sorry problem sorry just I'm just going back right now actively like looking at the two things like overall the it looks to me the subtotal of new construct of the new Middle School line the prek line the site work line between between the July estimate and this estimate are actually pretty remarkably equal um like they're they're pretty spoton with each other in terms of like 966 versus It was 95 so that actually number has gone up just slightly in terms of the those three construction lines but as you say all the other stuff related to the kind of escalations and general conditions and things like that those are the places where we are we're tightening things up because we feel more confident about those top three line numbers but like the overall cost of what we're estimating that kind of the Middle School to cost versus the 3K to cost versus the site work to cost is all generally around kind of what what we thought it was going to be biggest change really is like site work got you know yeah the building went up a little bit and then the site work came down a little bit in that balanced out yeah and you're right the direct cost subtotal it's about $400,000 difference so it's pretty close on a97 million yeah that's really close great thank you all right any other comments questions from Members see none we move on to next agenda item theend so item 4B uh which is msba update [Music] um so essentially what we've asked TMA to do so is as everyone's aware at least on the committee uh in the next coming weeks uh msba will make their decision uh whether or not Milton is invited into their core program uh for basically uh Construction um what we've been talking about a lot of the time too is is an analysis of you know if we get invited into msba it's going to basically hit us onto a longer timeline so the discussions that we're just having around escalation come into a play where we have to look at the overall project assume a longer timeline and what that escalation cost is associated with that and look at that escalation cost and then look at the amount of rebate that we be getting as part of joining msba and kind of compare them to see does it make more sense to just complete the project quicker on our own and forego msba funding or do we go with msba and just see what that looks like so I've asked PMA to kind of work through a potential analysis of that so Sean if you want to take it away on that so we I mean for for the new estimate we ran through um a new a new analysis of what what we would expect for a grant it roughly the same as what it would be before the project cost is slightly less but most of that would be um you there would be some Savings in there but we're right around that $49 million Grant rate off of that $170 million project cost yeah so just for for the Public's uh education too so the the published rate by msba was roughly a 45% reimbursement on eligible cost but based on the project that we have there those 4 that 45% essentially gets diluted to about 29% yep to an effective rate of about 29% right and then if you we did have scenarios in the last meeting where we ran escalation years and years and showed um you know but I think with p andc is saying it's about 4% a year at this point so um if you do the math you're going know the msba grant is not likely going to increase your reimbursement rates going to be about the same they will increase square footage cost um ever so often uh normally it will keep up with inflation uh it'll be somewhere depends on the year some they don't do an increase some years they do so if we assume a you know a marginal rate of an increase we um we start outpacing if you waited longer than I think it was four and a half years or something you would basically delude the grant with um escalation with escalation yeah okay so essentially like the break even point on that is four and a half year timeline so if we've got msba and we got it done exactly in four and a half years it it would be the same cost of the Town roughly as if we didn't build msv and yeah I'm going to pull up the one that we presented last um at the last meeting it shows so these are [Music] from um starting at the base here and then if you go one more year um it shows that you know if you're keeping the same roughly the same Grant or a slightly increased Grant but you're adding escalation to the project here's your escalation and this is where you end up at right about five years in between four and five years somewhere is where the math the numbers start floing um the hard part to understand about the MSP is that until you we have a little bit more detail in design um knowing where the exclusions are going to lie with the MSB project is still tough so right now it's it's really just a an estimate historic um you know where we're at and as these estimates get further and further refined we have a much better picture of what they would exclude for cost what they wouldn't exclude as to how much site work you have is um uh hbac it depends if theyve carried the geothermal package a lot of that the msba considers as part of your site work so that will increase your sitework solution so there's a lot of details that need to go into this to to further refine it but we just took a rough stab at it from the history of the msba and what we see as their reimbursement rates um and what we think you can get but I think that you know for rough numbers I think you can probably assume that somewhere around that 29 30% is what you'd expect out of any y out of any project from the NSP from a reimbursement rate for a typical msba project do you see them being completed in a four to five year window typically I think we when we did the math if they said yes this year we would add I think we said three years to the project on an aggressive schedule because we'd have to go back well actually I'll take it back it really depends if they make you normally what happens if you get invited to the msba program it could be up to a year before you even hire an OP right that's the normal SOI you form a committee you 270 days 270 days you do all that if they let you accelerate that and said okay we already have a committee they're still going to make you go out for OPM selection they're still going to make you go for designer selection so then you're still going to have to do a feasibility study if this is the project you might be if you use the same players you might be able to significantly decrease the amount of time that that takes yeah because the the formulation of teams actually mod two I think right so module one is mod is forming committee SOI and then and then for for module two will be hiring the OPM yeah and then module three we'll go into schematic design and feasibility if I'm not mistaken yes so right now as we sit we can get a building ready to go in 18 months from today if you said go roughly right that's our schedule July 2026 so if you're going to add another three years you know if you're going to add another year and a half to to do a feasibility study Plus hire a new team and then another eight you know in you're assuming you're at that point 18 months from now it's another 18 months to get you instruction any questions I have a question can you hear me yes sir L clear yeah I'm not very sure I wish we still had the other document you were sharing on the screen my question is on that here we have we know you were showing how we lose period of period how potential of losing money yeah I'm not very sure that I really understand um the 9 million loss per year and the consistency of it over the periods of time um I'm not sure I understand it enough to be able to explain to my constituents W that's that's soing um we so this is the msba um 31 form so what we did is just escalate construction costs uh within this form year-over-year and what we're saying is if that you know every year it's going to get x amount more expensive and we used um at pmc's escalation rate so one year it's going to after one year it's going to tell you that that 7 $173 million project went up to 1882 million after year two um it goes up to the 192 after year three it goes up to the 202 so it's it's increasing in escalating construction costs based on um just the general idea that things get more expensive as time goes on I get that if that's the case then shouldn't the percentage that we get from them also be increasing it seems we have one figure increasing over time but yet the benefit we have is not are also increasing over time uh we does that make sense yes yes it does so if if you look at the calculation we're carrying the msba building funding limit at $586 a square foot plus $60 uh for site work in each of these scenarios so I think you're right in that you could you could make assumptions we have that the msba is reimbursement rate will increase year-over-year but we've seen in the past that they just made an increase so it may be another two to three years before they do that we just don't know um if we want to make an assumption and say you know let's assume the msba increases at a certain percentage year to keep up with this we can certainly do that and rerun the numbers so I'm not asking I'm not talking about an increase if we're doing percentages and we're saying that one we're doing percentages period over period if what we expect the cost of building to increase then if we're getting percentage we're supposed to get a benefit of the increased percentage but you're showing here you're showing 48 million consistent across every year that computation to me is erroneous it's because the msba does not reimburse off a straight percentage the msba reimburses off a percentage with the cap so you're you're seeing that cap being hit year over year so starts from from inception the the cap is based on the square footage of the building so if the square footage stays the same and the cost they reimburse per square footage is the same you're not going to see a year-over year increase in their Grant unless you up unless you increase the amount of cost per square foot that the MSP is going to reimburse you so so just sorry for taking up this much time I just this is a really good point it's not an easy point to understand so I'm glad that you brought it up and I'm glad that we're having the conversation because it is very important for people in the community for the public to understand that yes that's where I struggle to tell my my constituent score if we look at year one we have a $9 million reduction yet we have a benefit of just rounding up here 9 something the other one is 48 we go to year two it still stays at 48 but that doubles to me I I've heard what you're saying but it just the gut feeling is really difficult to explain this to anybody who maybe it's just me does anybody else feel this way I yeah so it's it's it's not just you it is it's the assumptions made is that we don't know what the msba will increase their cost per square foot cap year-over-year and if you look at the historical data there are there are stretches for multiple years where some years they don't do it so if you assume that they are going to increase their cap year-over-year and then they don't um it's a poor assumption um so we've held that we've held the cost per square foot at with they're going to be that they what they've just increased it to or what it will be increased to actually at the end of the year by their most recent uh vote and we have not increased that year-over year because we don't know when if in in the future they're going to have the money or and the availability to increase that and if they don't increase that cost per square foot cap you will not get more money as buildings get more expensive you'll be capped at the cost per cost per square foot of eligible costs yeah just just to touch on touch on something too Aqua so the the the building cost that's there the 586 a square foot you know for the building that we're doing you know in regards the overall 173 million is less so even if it increases you know ill linearly the same as the other one it's a smaller overall percentage of of the number yes yeah if you do the the calculation of what the the construction cost per square foot is I mean our our construction budget maybe this is easy way to explain it our construction budget in this scenario the four-year is a um 164 million that's for hard cost of construction of that the msba would exclude this $84 million because that's what they're saying is over the funding cap so the more if this if this number goes up and that exclusion is going up at the same rate you're not going to get any more money from the msba I mean it is it could certainly be a conversation for the committee if they'd like to make an assumption of what that might increase we can we can show show you linearly over years how how much that's increased we can show you over the last couple years we can show you historically and then the committee could make a decision that as you're reporting these numbers report a cost per square foot of x amount per year as part of this calculation and then we can provide those numbers as well that would be fairly easy to do it's just hard to nail down that number um yeah you don't want to be too aggressive on it right and yeah but do maybe maybe we're not aggressive enough here and maybe we should be making some sort of assumption so um let me do some maap on that and send it out through you we can send the committee we can show you historically how there have been multiple years where they have an increase and there's been years where they've done two increases in a year um so again it's just a hard number to nail down so I think it's a fair point that we can look at that and then maybe the committee can make a decision on what they would like to use as that number and so when they present it people aren't as confused but but as it stands it's just based on the increase that happens this year it's the increase that happen I think it's December of this year so yeah we'd assume that you'd be at that no others right and the other thing to note is that once you lock in of an on an msba project so if they let you in and then you got through your um your SD at that point when they signed the Project funding agreement that's when your cost per square foot locks in okay so depending when you now and then it's not between now and five years now it might be another year or two so the number that you're going to see may may not be as drastic as you think it might be if that if that makes sense right they lock it in as soon as you and then nothing changes and then nothing changes correct um I I'll cave one time they change where like with Co and things like that they did make they did make some budget adjustments but that's the first time and I believe the only time they've ever done it after Project funding agreement assign where they they gave more money for scoreb but the the standard operating procedure for msba is once you get into that period and you lock in your free your project scope budget agreement you get whatever it is at the time and that's it one fig there must be some point where it stops yes and it's fairly ear process it's right at uh PSR right yeah it's the schematic design and so that's when you have to go and vote and approve and move the project forward that means everybody's committed and you're and you locked in at that point um and you're not going to get additional um incentives like it's a Le it's contractual legal agreement toen so um and everything's Happ out at that point what's included what's excluded there's anything extra the town of milon w that the msba doesn't reimburse you're committed the town has to say yes we're paying for that um and the msba will commit and agree to all the square footages like it's it's a big finder and those numbers those are the numbers and I mean and this is the form they use and so they they publish this refill it out they check it they send it back to us um but that's why we use their form because it's it's it's what you would expect to see from them um the town can appropriate money before this happens um normally they do it doesn't matter if you vote two years before this happens as long as you have enough money in there um you're okay but after you sign this even if you add scope that is technically under their budget they can they will exclude that scope because it's not part of your plan so at this point they really want you to have a project in mind they want you to have it fully vetted out they want you have your full scope included in there they want you to have the cost in there you sign up and that's it there's no more no additional funding from them beyond what they agree to and it's you know set them so they can plan out their their budgets over the next couple years as well I think something else we might not be accounting for would be potential sunk costs so if we have to go to msba you don't get where we are today if they follow the the letter of their rules we basically starting all over we go back we redo a fe feasibility study we redo a schematic design to get to where we are today so all the money we spent to to date is essentially sunk that's a good point become cost on there as well yeah we have not put it in this bu would add that to the cost of an SBA SBA project so that over Road some of that increase pretty quickly like if you've already spent million and a half then you have to spend that again then it just goes right on top of that budget ideally somehow they would let us reuse a lot of it but I don't know I don't know I mean all I can say their process does not allow that and the procedure doesn't allow it um I'm not sure if there's any historic towns that have done it before that we could lever to figure out how they fig how they did that because it would certainly save the town time and money um and the state too really yes but they also you know it's it's a program that you willingly enter into and part of it is you follow their rules and I when they start making exceptions and changing rules you know that could that could make it a lot more difficult for them and it's a pretty detailed set of rules module [Music] one but this will be a have to be a quick decision too right I mean we find out December December 13th and we're going to want some what we have on the ballot I mean on the town meeting um one way or another we got a shut yeah this this this is this is e e eily familiar to what was going on with Fon but when we went after fonon before and it was around December when it fell through and that um fell through it the last minute and you know the basic you know gave us you know kind of clear direction to go to the lands swap at that point so you know if we do decide to go with nsba right now yeah if we're accepted in there and I mean it's a you know kind of decision Falls up to you guys at the select board for the most part um and you know the the superintendent school school committee um if that's the decision that's made then you know we pivot we go that way but if we're not if we're not accepted I think we're clear enough with everything that everyone's done so far that we we've got tended Direction on where we want to go we've got a program we' got a yes and everything there so the good thing is if we do get into msba um you know I've talked to a Town Administrator that asked you know what can we do for the fall the February town meeting to get us a jump start on this as quickly as possible so once we get into if we get get into the program you know those first couple hurdles that are 2 170 days love to shrink that down well that that's what I'm told the first step is we need to approve the um preliminary design for this eligibility period we we have to show them that we have approved that money for the preliminary design for for feasibility feil the wrong term need to show them that we're so that's what would be on February 24th would be that feasibility money I think you're 270 days from the time you're from the time you get invited you have 270 days to secure funding form a committee and then kind of show them then they'll let you go and hire a don't arit yeah what I would what I we want spe that yeah what I would like to do is get that feasibility funding so publish everything on their website so we have an idea ballpark or what it's going to cost to get that a portion appropriated so that we can you know when the time comes we don't have to wait for another town meeting to do that we already have the Appropriations done there and then we can hit it you know as fast as as possible and they paying 45% of that too yeah yeah when it when we get into the overall projects town would basic run over first yeah one second [Music] and there are some things that the msba has to do as well on their end so it's not you may have to accelerate but it's not going to be like overnight because they have to go through enrollment options they have to certify enrollments and things like that so there is some leg work ahead of time that needs to be done if you're reading through that module you'll see you know there's a lot of stuff in there that has to happen and you probably speed it up more faster than the 270 days um but it's not you know they're going to have to do their leg work and they're going to want to meet with the town and meet at the school and talk through all the enrollment issues the overcrowding issues and really discuss that any other questions from Members raise your hand if you do and if not we can move on to the next agenda item see none so pull up the agenda than all right right so that was item 4 B sorry I was just pulling the invoices up and it messed me up yeah s sorry yeah so I think item 4 C is approval of invoices for PMA invoice 10 for October 2024 and and then Street and then streets October 2024 so again those were sent out as part of our packets um so I just leave that open to everybody kind discuss and then you know if if and when the time comes ENT uh do it one at a time for you know start with pmas in for October all right there we go so the PMA was 38 3,858 [Music] I'll make a motion to approve the PMA Consultants invoice number 04745 d10 dated November 15 2024 thank you Carrie is there a second second joh seconds any discussion hearing none we'll do a roll call vote Scott Terk yes John Cain yes krie Hurley yes Aqua bong yes uh Mark Lori yes Glenn Hoffman yes Dr Miranda yes Tim Lumbard yes and sha work yes all right uh the second invoice that we have up also is from Arrow Street full of the design um so we'll get that kind of pulled out a little bit there total on that invoice is 82,500 U you know similar take a look review and when you're ready uh entertain a motion my motion to approve the invoice number Arrow Street invoice number 729 844 dated November 13 2024 all right is there Dr Miranda thank you all right assume no discussion and so we go to a roll call vote Scott tack yes John cohain yes Carrie Hurley yes AKA bong yes sorry it keeps jumping around on me here Dr Miranda yes Glenn Hoffman yes Tim Lumbard yeah Mark yes work yes all right next on the agenda I think is new business think we're done with the old business versus yeah new business school design update and then MSB update School design is the presentation right yep so School design update I'll let Andrew and chali kind of take it over so just just to give an introduction to so everything we've been doing to this point uh that we've seen has been you know floor plans layouts and stuff like that um we're at a point now where um the exterior of the building started to take shape and what what they wanted to do is kind of walk through um some views or you know give some depth to kind of what everything looks like now so Andrew you guys take it away yeah sure I'll intro sure Andrew will be able to speak the design but um just to practice this is obviously uh something that we did based off of the earlier estimates in terms of the proportion of the materials and things that we wanted as a design that we intered hearing from the visioning sessions and our ongoing conversations with um the principles and burrow just to get something that feels like it would fit in with milon at the same time um we haven't gone through a design shet with any of the principles or death burrow or any of the teachers to really get into any of the level specifics so this is our first out of the gate taking all the information that we learned about the Town Milton and when we start the project back up in the next phase we'll have a charet where we can get into the specifics but this was a combination of us a culmination of everything that we learned about Milton but also trying to get something in there that was realistic for the estimate so that um Peter Bradley could put numbers to something so as you know that you've seen in the past that um the there's an academic wing and then there's the larger spaces Wing we can go to the next slide and Andrew please feel free to jump in so I also want to preface before we move forward that these are not uh what we call realistic renderings where there's colors and all of that this is really to understand what's the solid what's the transparency on the Windows what is the roof lineing how are the two buildings of the middle school and the preschool speaking to each other how are we navigating around the site we haven't presented any exterior material colors so just to keep that in mind that we're still nice step up from just the Box yes step up from white box um but we do own um from the estimate we own a certain percentage of brick for masonry we also own a certain percentage of rain screen and glass and that's all reflected in these views um so here we have overall aerial that towards the entrance we see the new gal Road and the parking on the academic Wing uh the gymnasium on the right and then the preschool in the back but if we go to the next view actually chol could I could I interrupt just um if we could stay back on the first slide for a second um sorry to sorry to interrupt um but I I think it's just worth taking a moment to talk about the kind of um and I age with everything that was just said about you know the everything we've learned about Milton and this is really kind of synthesizing the the educational plan of the district the the kind of constraints and opportunities of the site the desire to collocate you know prek with the middle school on the same piece of property but have a campus field with um kind of independent sense of character for the prek and and the middle school and and thinking about even the larger Campus of how this facility can relate to the high school which is you know just up up the road and so you know what you're seeing here is how all of that which until now we've been kind of looking at in terms of two dimensions and um uh budgets and schedules Etc how that can start to take shape physically um and kind of be uh something that's you know an inspirational facility for for the town and for the students and um and so i' I'd like to just you know take a minute to talk through how those ideas are playing out and then we can kind of point out the the attributes of the specific parts of the school um but you know when just looking at this view I think it's very very telling at how we've kind of created these two um spaces that where the buildings are are you know um on the hand of the of the Middle School responding to guile Road and and creating this this moment of arrival and um using the curve of the building to kind of echo the curve of the road and of the athletic field and of the Contours of the site um and while if you you you look to the back of that image you see that the prek has a different kind of roof shape um and we've adjusted the the roof of the auditorium to kind of echo that and then you so you can kind of get a feel that there's a sense of arrival in place for both the prek and the middle school and they both have um a kind of uh feeling about them that's that's appropriate to their use um and to the the kids that are going to use it and so if you go to the next slide um we we've added some just some labels to kind of Orient where things are and and you know the um the entry is where you would you would Sort of hope to the middle school where where the kind of volumes are coming together I'm going to draw over this a little bit I think it'll show up um and um so at the ground level you know people and students and kids and they're able to kind of in a way be cradled by the by the volume of the overall building but then kind of arrive into um I'm going to try not to draw too much okay um and so that's our entry point we have our academic Wing kind of curving in along the top here which you know is sort of creating this this counter point to g Road um we have located in um our loading dock here off of g Road um which works out you know quite well logistically um we've got our gymnasium sort of anchoring this end of the building and then as I was saying before that you kind of come back up here and have the prek um space we've got another view of that which is a little bit more um zoomed in and maybe also the other thing is to note and this is we've talked about before in the plans is that we made the taller portion of the building more forward towards B Road being sensitive to the houses that are on the other side of the prek so it stays relatively low for a much longer distance than we've been seeing in past iterations to um be sensitive to those houses on the other side of the tree line and so here's here's a view looking um from sort of the athletic field side to give you a sense of some of the complexities of the of the site that the design has now sort of negotiated and what you're seeing here is sort of the backside of that academic Wing um but you're also getting a feel for how we're taking advantage of um setting the the cafeteria and media center which are here um with views opening up to the landscape and um with uh the pre kind of creating a play Space um up against uh the hill here and interestingly you know the um uh sense of scale of the building is you know at least if you're from it's different depending on where you are so if you're up here on the on the athletic field looking you know this is this feels like a three-story uh volume possibly slightly less um than than what how it would feel from uh from guile Road and um if we go to the next slide we can add the labels um so here's that that cafeteria and um what we've talked about in Prior meetings there's this um entrance to the school or um from the sort of second floor where you can kind of spill out to an outdoor area and have a landscape connector that slopes back down to g Road and then back up uh to the high school which we imagine could be a valuable um connection um we've got our pre prek um volume which has a very residential feel to it and um we imagine this as a a woodframe building and um one of the advantages of of separating separating out the prek from the Middle School um and to chal's point you know I think will successfully kind of blend and relate to the the residential abutters um on that end of of the other side of the property and then you can see how the roof of the auditorium um Echoes what's going on with the prek and becomes um and sort of carries on over the cafeteria and how those two um work together to sort of Define a a kind of sense of place and belonging for the prek that that is all its own and and sort of independent from the Middle School um and if we go to the next one so here's um zoomed in and and sort of looking more as an entry View kind of from the guile Road perspective um and where you can really kind of understand the the form of the building and um the kind of path to move into the um uh front door and um we can turn on the tags on the next um the other thing to note really that's really important about this view is in addition to the entry is the separation of the bus and the car lanes and how wide that um sidewalk is at the relationship to the edge of the building we try to um make it as welcoming as possible for the kids for crossing the road for getting their safy but these are all things that we think about and so from the feasibility to the schematic design that um Trucking area that's significantly refined um partly due to the change in the grades of the road and the way that the g Road was turning into the building but it also gave us some breathing room for that overhanging at the front of the building that helps draw you into that entry area and protects the students um in inclement weather and then lastly this is a view from the um entry side to the prek excuse me um where you can see that even though a portion of the middle school is visible that it's it's working together with the language of the prek to kind of make this feel like its own place um with its own separate entry and own separate identity um which is something that we heard was um really desirable and important when you know collocating um cohorts of different of such different ages that they really feel like they have a part of this that that belongs to them and we think that that's starting to um to be expressed here and looking at a language of uh you know in the prek more playful sort of window um placement and sizes um and creating some texture and and tactile um opportunities along the exterior of the building things that that are of a the scale of a child um young child and that would be feeling uh more welcoming uh to them and if we go to the next slide so just to kind of again point out that we've got our academic Wing in the background here and then the auditorium and cafeteria volume that's uh fronting onto um the the north side of this uh arrival area and how that's working in concert with the prek volume and its um sloped roofs so we're we think that it's gotten to a very nice place in terms of really negotiating a lot of um complicated challenges and I think you know one Testament to the the success of that process has been that you know some of the site costs have have come down and and since the earlier iteration and that has come from very careful tuning of the um the grades of the building and where the uh finished floor should ideally be located so that we're minimizing the Cy work and need for retaining walls and so on and I think we've done been able to do a pretty good job of that um as evidenced by the the kind of stability of the estimate um so yeah that's sort of where we're at happy to take questions um all right so you got a couple hands up so jump on first Aqua you recognized thank you um my understanding is that what was shown to us is not not the final product they there will be some more coloring or color choices added to the building is that correct yes uh good question the so just to be clear these are um these images are not meant to show you that like this is the actual color and material of the building and in fact we've kind of done these renderings as if these were built out of like out of wood as like a a model in a model shop almost um which sort of just a reflection of where we are in the process so it's more about how it's organized what is the mass of it feel like what's the character of it starting to feel like and sort of the next step in this if we were to um you know be starting up a having another meeting in in two weeks would be to start showing you um options for materials and we're thinking about you know masonry and um you know some wood on the prek but on the Middle School large working with um with masonry and and there's many different types that can be used for that but it's in this economy it's quite coste effective while also being beautiful and durable and and low maintenance and things like that so that would sort of be where we pick up uh when we do um is to start to look at that thank you all right Carri um I just would like to comment on the prek I think that the roof line is fantastic and I picked up immediately that you were going for that residential look um I think having that a but uh the the neighbors um is an excellent compromise and I was just thrilled to see this so thank you so much for the care and attention to all of the comments that have been coming towards us this is terrific thank you anybody else online yeah Mark go for it yeah I don't no questions I just I'll Echo what Carrie said I I think all of it looks really good especially kind of the prek wing um you know I know I think Tom McCarthy might uh prefer a flat roof uh just from a maintenance perspective those are easier but this looks really nice the whole thing looks really nice and so again appreciate all the work yall have done and wish wish we could have that meeting in two weeks we had board unfortunately but um yeah really appreciate that yall are doing this looks great thank you yeah so just a question on my end too Andrew so the white boxes around the window those are opportunities for color so similar similar to what you see at the Josiah quiny school that just went up along the Mass Pike yes that that's exactly right yes those are those are opportunities for for color and character and making you know unique moments um in the various classrooms you know so that one classroom is a little a little bit different from the next um you're exactly right okay and then on on the prek the vertical components if you want to call it that that are there is is that like a rain a vertical rain screen or something I'm just trying to understand exactly yes that's correct so the thought there is that you know if this is a wood frame structure that we might be able to incorporate um some uh wood elements and we've been looking at um and have used on some some prior projects uh the the generic term is thermally modified wood um which gives which is you know actual wood but it's been uh stabilized and modified to be very durable and hardwearing and not requiring the kind of Maintenance that you might have from uh a typical something you might do on a on a home um and so that these are potential areas where we might look at incorporating something like that um and thought that it could be a really lovely um kind of CounterPoint to to the the the big kids in the big school you know at the middle school and that you know you can imagine kids running their hands over it and um you know just relating to the scale of that all right aqu you still have your hand raised and you do not anymore so anybody internal questions comments all right no more questions from me that was in there no no no problem I'm guilty that at times to um all right uh so I think we're good on this one thank you guys very much thanks [Music] so um MSB update yeah we kind of covered that previously so again you know we're just waiting um for you know a decision from msba and based on that decision you know we'll go down one or two paths that a figure out so um patiently waiting I I think that kind of plays into one of the things that we're going to need to um when we talk about our next meeting is you know just um have some availability probably may even be sure yeah I think our our next meeting May would be the 9th yeah yeah on the agenda it says the 2 or the n9th the second I think is Monday right yeah so I'm not sure with the holiday if the administr is GNA get back to you between now and then be it' be interesting if they did I think be a better chance that they got back to us by the n9th by the seventh yeah and the the next select board meeting you know what that is that's the 17th 17th okay I just want to make sure we got a meeting in before yeah we the 17th yeah so so you know so we on that agenda item yet for yeah future meeting is the next one as unanticipated items if there is any and then it's future meeting date yeah we got no unanticipated items unless anybody else has anything you know they want to throw out there one of the things that the in the attachments was the select board questions correct yeah so so we we have got a number of questions in from the select board I think I forwarded it to everybody or it was in the in the packet that we have here so for you know some of the questions based on kind of where we're are we're going to be able to answer them you know to to the best of our ability but other things may be a bit um too technical I know one of them was in reference to what Mas block we using and stuff like that we're just not there for this kind of where we're at so you know this is this is something you know we're all you know the design teams working on Stu like this so you know the the anticip is you know as we get to the select board and you know we give our next presentation assuming we don't get accepted to msba and we're going the other way we just want to make sure that you know all the questions are there and obviously there's probably going to be follow-ups which are understandable um but you know at least this gives us a head start of so we just don't walk into the meeting and you know have these um presented to us or requested from us and we're just answering live over there yeah I looked at the list of questions and I would say that a lot of them we can provide some answer to at this point some of them it's just too early but then there's some like what is the cost of implementing the new energy code in the building that's going to be a hard one to answer without designing a non-energy code compliant and then an energy compliant building having them estimate both of them and you take the difference they're designing an energy code compliant building and that's what we're estimating so things like that get a little bit more challenging I I wonder I don't know if that's talking about the new Milt and optin code and trying to get some insight onto what it's what the extra cost for this building is but I'm not sure how we would be able to and I think that's gonna be one that that's going to require followup um you know mainly that's why I pointed out earlier when you were talking about the building getting larger due to the energy code was the stretch energy code that was adopted a couple years ago not the op electrically so part of what you can do is there are I'm going to get a little technical there are a couple of different of running energy models like you Design Energy Model A Teddy model like the new like there're different series of models but for the schematic phase we did not run a Design Energy model which we would do in a normal course of a project but we will do it when we pick up a DV but that will be one of the first tasks that we do so we could run an lcca model which is what um ggd will then take sort of that model information and run the lcca that will help you get a baseline difference between not necessarily for cost but change in enery usage which then you can help extrapolate further down the road to answer this question but we don't have that information yet because we haven't run those models y um all of the that information was provided in that updated um fee proposal that sent so when we get there we'll be able to answer that question and it's actually going to be one of the first things that we have to do in the next phase is to start getting these specific metrics on the building so that all of the design teams um can move forward with the right level of information and we wouldn't have been able to run it until now anyway we just didn't have enough of the building designed to put in the right um information into the model like you have to know what the exterior is going to be you have to know how much installation there's going to be like you have to know all these things and we didn't know it until we did the schematic so and some of the other ones like what type of roof and what is the warranty that question we answered well there's different roofs you could put on the building and that would be a decision that the committee would have to make and oftentimes it's based on you know cost you know you can you can get different types of roing systems that have different warranties associated with them what what do you want tell you how your cost we can answer was assumed at this point yeah and the facility his director will in yes yeah yeah y y um just going online Carrie I saw your hand up and Glenn I saw your hand up and just didn't know if you guys still want to speak yeah I was just gonna mention that we probably need the school committee to answer some of these questions right like the Staffing cost like that's not us I wouldn't think yeah correct it would be a combined effort between us school committee just we don't want to get out of our Le we're just building right we're not managing right all right Glen Sean I was just going to ask and I know I just realized we're probably not there yet if we've done any kind of comparison between the energy costs of the current pairs middle school and what this new building is going to cost to run because I obviously the new building is going to be far less to run from an energy standpoint than the Pierce Middle School and that might be a kind of a Goodwill thing we could show the public at some point but like I said I don't think we're there yet as far as analyzing what the costs are going to be at the new building yeah so you you're reading my mind Glenn so when when costs of energy you know came up to operate the building over the course of the year I know that question has been out there a couple times and obviously to get that done there specific needs to flow into an energy model run the calculations from a worst case perspective you know Pierce is roughly the same size and you know has 20 year old systems in it so we get you know what I was going to say is we could take that and say that's a you know whatever we agree to as a committee that's a worst case you I mean if we were to look at that to build something now see what that cost is and just know whatever our building annual cost is is going to come in significantly less than that what percentage um you know that that' be one I want to dive into a little bit more to look at you know how much more efficient it would be but obviously that for me if people are looking for a hard number to put there that was like the worst case number I would put out even with the new systems of the P the wall construction the roof the R value on the roof is going to be probably less than half of what you're going to get on this new school um I just I think at the end of the day you're going to see that people would see that this is going to be a much more efficient building then really any other you know municipal building in Milton right now except maybe the new fire station I think they have percentages out there too for how much better and rough idea for how much better codes are now than they were you know along your lines of trying to come up with compare Piers to and that's exactly what what I was thinking when this came out obviously we wouldn't be able to get a full energy study done but we could take a similar building call it pierce it was built 20 years ago and look at some efficiencies that we think and you know apply some percentage to that of efficiency there and you know steal that based on the cost model for that and assume that's what this new building is going to cost I think that's the only way to kind of get to a a logical response for that question rather than just saying we can get it later so any other questions regarding these just again we're we're kind of on unanticipated items so anything else that anybody has to feel free to chime in anything just double check all right so next thing on the agenda I think is next meeting right yeah future meetings so you know I think I think for us you know for now we'll aim for December 9th uh for our next meeting you know between um now on the second again there won't be much movement so I think the ninth would be our best our best exped for our next meeting so see if that works for everybody and just you know see a lot of nodding so that helps all right so last thing on the agenda is the German so Iain a motion to ad second second right roll call vote Scott ter yes John Cohan yes Carrie Hurley yes Glenn Hoffman think that yes aqu yes Dr Miranda yes Tim Lumbard take a second go next Mark Lauren yes and Sh of work yes come Tim is an exension all right thank you very much see you in a few weeks have a good night Happy Thanksgiving [Music] he