##VIDEO ID:Wbu6LS2gFe4## [Music] he good evening and welcome to the 15th meeting of fiscal year 2025 for the uh for the Milton planning board at this now at this time I would like to Now call the meeting to order um we can begin with our administrative items uh the first item um is the approval of our excuse me is introductions and I'm sorry let's begin um with those in the room here and those are on Zoom Cheryl toas clerk Jim Davis member and Meredith Hall serving as chair um tonight uh we do not have U Maggie Sean may be joining us in a little bit but we do have staff um on Zoom is uh Cheyenne Cheyenne Frasier assistant director of planning and Community Development and Julia Julia getman clerk great thank you so much um so we have one set of minutes um the November 21st I haven't had a chance to review those yet we we defer those until our next meeting let's do that let's um is it motion to defer that was I'll take that as a motion yes second all in favor I great perfect um the next item are our next meeting dates um we have two um meetings that are coming up we actually have a meeting on uh next Thursday which is the 12th and the following Thursday which is December 19th so those are our next regularly scheduled um meetings and now um Cheyenne do you have an update stuff update I do um we looked into the budget I mean this is like a brief overview we looked into the budget um we are able to extend mpc's contract but obviously we can get into the nitty-gritty next time um as for looking into the future this meeting and the next two meetings we are going to be working on Town articles we have our gardener school coming back next week U's coming back next week and we have a um special permit public hearing coming up on the 19th for the your Nursery Great perfect on the 19th the 19th yes and excuse me my pen um okay so at this time um if there's anyone who would like to speak um on something that is not on the agenda uh at citizen speak either in in person or on Zoom uh you can raise your hand on zoom and you will have an opportunity to speak on anything that is uh on our agenda at that time are you seeing any hands Cheyenne no one on Zoom can I can I um just take a step back to Cheyenne for a moment sure Cheyenne uh you sent us an email um earlier this week or perhaps last week about the um tonight's I think it's tonight's meeting needing to vote for articles to go to the February town meeting meeting so I can you just um run through the the schedule just so um we're all clear and anyone who's watching is clear in terms of the February town meeting yeah sure so I spoke with the Town Administrator he mentioned that um select board will have a meeting on you know Town articles that are going to be going for town meeting he mentioned we need to be working on that by a certain date so our kind of hard deadline we need to get a final draft in by the third week of January and a rough draft in by second week of January but you know given holidays and everything that is why we're having um three backtack meetings because we will on the 19th be having the public hearing to do our final vote so that's kind of our our Backtrack on the timeline so we need to do we need to vote at least to submit articles as um just by title tonight or by content in order to meet the deadline by title okay yes uh the Town Administrator already has a rough draft of our zoning map Amendment um everything that we talked about he already knows that there will be edits but he just wants that on record that this is what we will be submitting okay thank you for clarifying great thanks no problem okay so we could now move to um discussion of our Warren articles the first item um we have in front of us is the site plan approval uh bylaw which um we've been working on a framework for those are just tuning in um we've come to a framework we've had comments we've been going through and we have a pretty clean draft um of what we're looking to submit at town meeting and and vote on this evening um if Cheyenne would you be able to pull up um the most recent uh what Cheryl's clean copy yes that draft which really Incorporated nicely the comments that um the majority of the board had give it a minute okay great thank you is there a way U can you enlarge that that's helpful that's great okay so what I thought this um I've looked through this I think it is in really really good condition um good shape um what I thought is maybe we just go through and if Page by page and if anyone has any comments I had a few but they're really small things um that we can go through I did you want to say something um no I just I think that's fine I I just there's a few more things I think I'd like to tweak in it um may be this yeah and whether we do that tonight or after and I said another another draft we can discuss I guess okay perfect um so I didn't have anything on page on the first page to change did you Jim have any coms yeah I have a couple um so applicability BB number one should we include adus in there that's what I was wondering too whether we needed to include it here because referenced yeah so you know because we say attached single family residences is that considered two families I think the attached single families will hold over from what we had before and I think that was town houses but I think what we should just it's confusing so I think we just say um I mean my thinking is we want adus to site plan RW so I just think we get rid of attached single family and we just say adus love it and then don't address two families at all cuz we don't want two families on our site plan review because just get okay so we we'll so is that something that you're doing live Cheyenne yes make that change so I'm going to just pull up the so construction Redevelopment or expansion of multi family residences and adus yes beautiful and then under Jim did you have anything under purpose I want to jump back to purpose then we can go to to what you had no I'm good with purpose um I was thinking that um we might add something about resiliency or um sustainability or climate change or something um that nature in that purpose section too um although we do we do reference that we hit that somewhere else we do reference that in the um design in the in the guidelines yeah should we have it under purpose too um like what would be I think under what we would be reviewing design review maybe did we mention it there too so we could say whether it is uh in compliance with sound sight utilization principles relative to um sustainable practices or something like that you know like right to where we have traffic circulation I mean I can think of try to think of something to add to it there maybe not on the Fly storm water screening signage exterior visual impact storage sorry I mean this is almost so specific ific I mean it's understood that we're going to okay hit what Dage whatever's Beyond in the document but I if I you could do what you want really have uh okay yeah ience all right same okay so if you want to play around with okay I'll think about it think about that how you would add it okay okay so Jim you had others I think that yeah and I know I'm going to take the conversation backwards but applicability number so I'm sorry letter B number two we had mentioned interior work shall be excluded I'm sorry we we were talked about that but then it got taken out do we want to subject all interior work to to site plan review no no that's why I don't think this is you mean Redevelopment or expansion here what at the the fourth one is where I tried to capture the interior that we thought might have a a magnitude of impact mhm like going to um not the last one number three yeah number three Redevelopment of an existing building into a restaurant bar entertainment use because those are different kinds of impacts than let's say a dental office or a nail salon or a hair salon or something right because the hours are totally different yeah so that's the way so I didn't I don't think number two is intended to be interior just general interior do you do you read it that way well I just so um there's another clean version that that went out applicability B there's a line that says um interior work causing any change of use increase decrease or a different use of commercial building shall be excluded from the site plan review I I take that as if you're just building out an interior space would that have to go before site plan review I think that was what we wanted to take out I think that was what we wanted to remove cuz we didn't want to trigger any site plan appr approval for any interior use so so is that in here anywhere cuz I don't see that in in in this version that we're looking at can you read that again J uh interior work causing any change of use increase decrease or a different use of a commercial building shall be excluded from this site plan review requirement so um we could put that with the exception of um restaurant bar entertainment use because I think what we were trying to do is capture the kind of situation we have with the marketplace right where it could have more parking requirements or it could have more impacts to neighbors be because you're having a higher intensity use right so we could put that back into three and just you know put an exception for these uses okay I just don't want to see us getting bogged down with every little thousand square foot barers shop that turns no and maybe that is more clear the yeah that that is not included seems to be looking for that language from the prior one now see if I have it in or maybe Jim could just read it for you again Chey you can just just put in number three there three yeah and then we'll rework number three ready yep interior work caused cusing any change of use comma increase comma decrease or a different use of a commercial building shall be I'm sorry excluded from this site plan review requirement and then you would say with the exception of restaurant bar or entertainment uses maybe mhm sure and then you'd get rid of the part of restaurant bar or entertainment use yeah see that read okay anything else so you would just change you would just need need to get rid of that first part of that sentence now m on number two or number three on number three no let's she's number three [Applause] now you might say what shall be subject to this re this section at the very end mhm oh no at the very end I think I'm sorry the very end of number three well maybe that's not that's that's never mind that's getting too you can just leave it at ending it there I think entertainment youth I think that's great that's great I think we actually need the word and after that not just semicolon because it's four is the last one right that's yeah uh I see one more thing on this page mhm so the pre-application conference um in the clean version there was an opportunity for the board to Grant a waiver from site plan approval based on Project size and potential impact that's in that is included but it's in a different place it is yeah yeah oh I missed it um and it might be towards actually the end of the site plan approval I think that's where I think I may have put all the waivers in yeah it's under um it's under authority of the board a waivers I'm sorry it's under L the board May upon written request of the applicant wave it says the board upon written request of the applicant wave any of the submission requirements of this section um applicants requesting waiver shall make such a request at the pre application conference on page nine beautiful thank you long it's in there that's great okay is that it for one page one that's it for me okay great okay can we just look at that language again on the preapplication go back it was that's on under L che um no in the in the beginning right here um under the submission requirements yeah I just wanted to re that real quick so uh um in that sentence that said in addition the board May hold pre-application conferences um at any regular or special meetings of the board [Music] um that should be prior to a formal application right M really special meeing in the board and prior to the application and the and the beginning of the public hearing does it it does say um a little bit later applicants May request an appointment on the agenda of the board with the planning department the scheduling of which uh is the decre of the of the board submissions uh of brief material including um thought it does say somewhere that a application okay let's see to the board yeah it does say right here applicants May request an appointment on the agenda of the board with the planing Department scheduling which is at discretion so do we need then let's second let's go back up uh can you scroll sorry can you scroll a little bit since it's on the two pages there okay um this meeting May provide all right so discuss proposal [Music] any Bo will need to coordinate review okay we don't think that's the time to mention the waiver huh during the pre-application conference let's see now under waivers again yeah just leave leave it where it is you think it's okay leaving it n well you can we can make a note there and ask me it says in this it does say here they should make them at the pre-application conference at with the board at a public meeting which is that way that way it's in the public record that the request is being made so we could we could reuse that first sentence under l yeah because and then it goes on to here if after the application has been filed and during the review process in in public meeting or hearing the board determines that additional information is required in order for the board to evaluate the project the applicant shall submit the desired information the clean version just says um this meeting may also provide an opportunity to discuss the procedures and information the board would need to Grant Grant a waiver from site plan approval based on Project size and potential impact so that was a different version you're talking about well this is yes so in our emails we got got yours we got the clean and they got the redlined one um and this was under which section again 4.1 pre-application conference confence okay in the conference and can you read that again Jim sorry where am I this meeting may also provide an opportunity to discuss the procedures and information the board would need to Grant a waiver from site plan approval based on Project size and potential impact so the what I wanted to add here was that it was also it was an opportunity to ask for a waiver for other things too so if we didn't feel as if certain things were required they wouldn't have to wait until later I mean because once they make the application going to do everything that's required right so the only time it's not just a wa um a decision about whether the whole thing is waved it's a decision about whether the traffic stud's waved or the shadow study's waved or something else so you know what we could insert we could insert under this line um this meeting may also provide an opportunity to discuss the procedures and information the board will need to coordinate reviews if the de if the development requires other Town approvals and requests impact analysis such as is a traffic study so maybe we could insert this is the time to discuss procedures comma waivers and information the board will need to coordinate yeah okay so we could just use the that yes so procedures and waivers okay procedures comma waivers Cheyenne and do you see where under C on page one so she's typing there is that where you had their mind yes can you see it so small I I have it here too if you see it she's got it right this section here yep waivers and app yes perfect and information the board will need we have here the procedures and information so we're just going to add waivers up there right so yes that's actually not the line so it's a line above it's the sentence above um sh so uh if you go back you see right where it says the first in addition the board May hold discuss the procedures in the first line and information so you could say discuss the procedures information and information the board will need to coordinate well let's see the procedures comma waivers and information yeah there you go great there you go so there I think you could see yeah you need some other word there right oh wait oh you put in the first sentence I was thinking a little further down um but it just it's as long as it's in there I I'm not did you want it in the first one so it's actually hold on let me go one no not the um so there's the sentence in addition not that one but it's the third sentence this meeting begins with this meeting M because that's talking about the procedures waivers and so it's right at the very bottom of what we're seeing here on the screen that you say that this meeting halfway over yeah and this meeting may also provide an opportunity to discuss the procedures favors and information the board will need yes that's exactly cool because I think we don't want to necessarily want to start off for sence like about waivers waivers okay great anything else thank you I'm good okay anything on page two I'm good I'm good with page two as well um page three so Cheryl you're going to kill me but do so halfway down all s plan shall be prepared by a licensed architect do they have to be licensed in the Commonwealth of mass and I'm only thinking that because of and I don't but if I had a friend who lived in New Hampshire and would provide architect services for me or you know the last kitchen I did the kitchen designer was from Connecticut it just people seem to be all over the place now um if they're going to file for a permit on those drawings it has to be licensed in Massachusetts yeah the now doing a a kitchen you know that you don't require a license necess for the kitchen designer so not everybody is required to be licensed but site civil engineers surveyor Architects landscap do landscape arit have to be licensed mes a landscape architect does and the some things I think we could wave the requirement of the landscape architect but on something like the daycare those you know they've been having civil engineers they've been having Engineers doing and and it hasn't been a good result so it's one of those things where I think if it's if it doesn't require for the building perment to be licensed it's a good reason to uh Grant a waiver for it you know but if uh you know in these instances I I just think it's better to start with it and they can ask for waiver down from it okay sure I just know that people are working from home and there aren't a lot of yeah I mean licensing is state by state so like I'm licensed in a half a dozen states because I have to licensed separately in each one there's reciprocity it's not complicated to get so okay but it is that way good question in that case I'm done on that page okay okay all right so the three um anything on page four no I had just one um under fa the end it just has a period but that should be a semicolon okay that's all and then I think on Q there needs to be a semicolon in the word and mhm okay anything else four page five so I've got something under H as I read that um a landscape buffer shall be provided at the parking perimeter shade trees ornamental trees shrubs and other plant materials shall be included in the buffer um I wanted to follow that with as is reasonable I mean it's this Treads like it's expecting shade Tre ornamental trees shrubs and other plant material all on a 5T width I'm sorry which one are you on I'm sorry I'm on H Landscaping at the parking perimeter okay I would rather see that kept in and that's something that they could ask for a waiver if they felt would would be necessary okay but I think just seems like we're expecting to stuff an awful lot into um that landscape oral TRS um a few or other or other plant materials or as is reasonable like if you if you do shade trees and shrubs but not shade trees ornamental trees and shrubs depending on make it sound like it's just seems like um it's almost like it's too much Tre ornamental you could maybe put um it also kind of depends on what the availability or access to Daylight and so forth is there right yeah so we could say or or other plant materials so that's not necessarily yeah I guess we've got other plant materials in there already so yeah I guess the one thing is that you don't want necessarily there to be no trees unless it's not reasonable you I think we could say within as reasonably how did we have done that in other places I always put as as is reasonable I mean I put as the contractor sees fit but we don't want to put that absolutely as is reasonable I think I think that's fine adding that to the end shall be included in the bu in the buffer as is reasonable exactly that sound okay fine Shen can we add that to that she just did good okay I'm watching a little bit live do it too that's great perfect um okay anything else on five good okay good okay on six I I had something under under you where resiliency and sustainability these are actually because I think I had taken W down below um from another site plan review which has low which had low impact um development and high impact it had different levels of the impact what I was thinking this consider consider present and future climate conditions and assessing project environmental impacts um it said including carbon emissions extreme prec precipitation extreme heat and sea level rise those seem to be very like not General actions that we would want to be included in a project where I thought if we took out uh W and we took the line projects shall utilize low impact development strategies to the greatest extent possible such as limiting the amount of impervious surf area preserving and creating connected natural spaces and using green infrastructure techniques such as rainwater harvesting rain Gardens swes permeable permeable pavement green roofs and tree canopy that seem to be um giving more specific ideas of what we would like to see and if we wanted to somehow include um but I didn't know if it was contradictory using green infrastructure to add um and reduce carbon carbon so you know low impact development is is more specific um certain on the you know this this U came from one of the ones that was in the um me Community zoning from article one um because it was kind of anticipating sites that are closer to the marsh and so forth and which we have also uh in Milton Village so it kind of deals with we don't have a lot of this but it deals with a little down IDI War yeah in some areas it does deal with it a little a little bit differently than the low impact development um so then let's keep let's keep that in it doesn't apply to a lot of things so it's probably one of those things that could get waved on a lot of projects but but kept in for some okay so let's let's keep you as it is but when we get to W just take out the words low impact development that's fine Y and then just start with projects shall utilize so then we'll keep keep both that's that's all I had on six so I actually love this page because a lot of times it says to the extent allowed consider present where possible as opposed to shall just a little more inviting I like it yes one well one of the things is that it's balance because this is all as of right and so you can't have too much much discretion um it has to you can't say like um you know like design that fits into the character of the Town cuz that's just too General like so you have to be specific enough but not be something that's too prescriptive it's a tough I think balance so we'll see how these get reviewed at the state level when they do but I thought it was great thanks good okay so page seven the only thing that I had um under H when you get to d e f then you've got another E and then another F so that should be G and it just everything just got off on that so the E should be G formatting is exactly h f should be H yeah g should be I yeah good catch and just um yeah um so yeah and ends at the very end with r q will be S um but that's on the next page did you have anything on seven yeah looking at the well the the original so Fe e and then the second F under the second F1 parking shall not be located in the setback between the building and any lot line adjacent to the public right way I was going to follow that with whenever possible just because sometimes there isn't room for parking around back I mean I'm thinking more of a three family as opposed to a larger development if you have to park cars in your front yard yeah I think well I mean we did pass a bylaw or Amendment to the b a few years ago which limits the amount of parking in the front yard because people were concerned about pay too much Pavement in front yards um totally omits that right shall not be located in the setback so this this tells me that you can't in the front you could say unless approved by the board or something like that or by the discretion of the board all right um to the rear of this yeah so one I was going to follow with a shall not be located in the setback between the building because here's the thing just like that Gardener school they chose to put the parking in a particular location just like the um Goddard School and the Gard chose to put it in the front because it wouldn't require them to get any variances otherwise and you know sometimes you know when you seeing that big parking lot in the front instead of seeing the building you know I think we want to set our expect expectation that we want the design to to factor that in So when you say somebody might say well it wasn't possible you know so I don't like whenever possible for this I'd rather say unless uh approved by the board because that way it it sets what our expectation is okay yeah our desire is and I'm just thinking more from a smaller development a smaller developer I mean like I have no place else to put the cars three have to go in the front or two or whatever what it might mean that that site doesn't work for the development is kind of the way I I see it you know yeah yeah so do we want to add anything there or put you know at the discretion of the board or or just nothing the way um cheyen just put at the end of that sentence unless approved by the board oh beautiful okay great I'm good on that page okay great okay all right so on eight um anything on that I am good with eight so I just had one thing because and you may even have some language that we could revisit this um you know in what you're seeing in when you work in Boston with um with Windows being inset so there's a shadow line know that's come up um so I would which one are you looking at oh sorry um n n oh adding one so in general all windows shall be taller than they are wide this requirement shall apply to Windows on the first floor as well as the Upper Floor and I was going to say windows um shall be in what page you want sorry eight eight okay sorry windows and start um and take out that are horizontally that are horizontally uh oriented and put in instead shall be inset in order to create a shadow uh Shadow line I keep I'd like to keep the horizontal actually but if you want to add something here yeah I was going to say and be broken up with the use of mull Mion when possible cuz I think if we could suggest using it when possible is a more consistent character in the town you know we had that with the you know there was some window issues at the memory care you know they were just doing some big Square Windows mhm and they ended up doing it um with more mind so you wanted hear this to to say um in so Windows shall be inset in order to create a shadow line should be Shadow line um or Shadow and broken up with the use of Mion when possible so that's not saying it's absolutely required but suggested especially with adus that are residential to be sort of consistent and of course if it's not appropriate for that building that would you know it's not saying that that shall you have use of Mion yeah I think of inset Windows definitely on a Mason rebuilding you want them in a little bit um on a wood frame could go either way yeah I mean they're very flat if you especially but the the energy codes and the uh exterior instulation now um if you want you're going to have to build out your jams if you want to get them out to the face anyway so if you keep them back back then you just have to deal with your detailing of your finish your exterior cladding material back into the window but at least keeps your um it's it makes a little bit more of an energy code challenge to to put them in all the way but I don't think you're saying all the way you're just saying set back for shadow so I think that flexibility that's exactly giving some Dimension to the to the building all right so then I think I think you could get rid of the rest of that s that part of the leftover part of that sentence cheyen so it would read Windows shall be inset in order to create a shadow line and broken up with the use of Mion when possible the stairways to the Upper Floor though needs to be a separate um bullet point correct and then that that's just n and then O So then it begins with and I'm good with everything else here me too me too okay okay okay nine the only thing I had on This was um under L waivers it's a double space and I didn't know if that was intentional it's just a form I think yeah so just a single space that was all I had on that did you have anything on nine I'm good I'm great thanks for the timeline okay and then timeline I do want to discuss that six months we should do less oh no oh the oh should we do less no oh no six months I think six months is reasonable I just don't want people to get the perception that we're just dragging it on that's all so and I understand we can extend it but just want to say look we should get this done in 6 months but so I think we don't want to set an expectation either way because if you look at things like um on um the Robin Street project I think we approved that in like two or three meetings like that we wouldn't want people to think it's going to take them six months or like that that's a normal that Amendment right but I think it also could set us up for you know like in the case of the memory care where we're seven or eight months and we're it's very complicated with engineering and getting a lot of um a lot of um sort of peerreview on on drainage issue you know different issues that it could it can take up to a year so it's it's could say I I think what you could say then well the end with I completely expeditiously yeah but there should be something that gets keeps I think there's this sense that the some things drag out too long so to to Jim's point before like we don't want to be perceived to be hostile to these applications in some way so um you could say 6 months um after the submission of the application of say average of of projects of average complexity or something like that just to kind of leave it a little bit more open for what you're trying to address merid which is a longer or more complex project exactly and I just wouldn't want it to be a grounds for an applicant to feel that we had to make a decision because it said a it says in general so I don't think it's you're tied to it it doesn't say must it says should long as it's something that we shall that we're not setting ourselves up for um yeah so I mean I like this because we get all of our information and then we have 30 days to start MH and then generally we have 6 months and I think a pre-application conference will help speed things up too because 100% And all of this I think this whole site plan approval um bylaw is going to help too sort of for the applicants to come prepared and let them know the expectations okay that's fine you could say for the application for projects of average complexity instead of of I think in general site plan review for projects of beverage complexity yeah I think that's right maybe change that sorry Cheyenne I think up up there's better I plan review of projects of average complexity that was the only thing I had I'm good on that page as well I'm actually good on the last page as well yep okay so um I think it would be appropriate if we want to have a vote um yeah knowing that this is you know this it's still working our other our board members will have time to to share their comments as well all right so then I will make a motion you oh sorry sure for the approval yeah absolutely please come for you good evening hello is on okay you should be on all right good evening uh Brian F uh I live in Precinct 10 and I just had a quick comment on I think it was number six um I'm actually here to speak about what the next item on the agenda um but wanted to take the opportunity to ask if you're going to be specifying specific potential um Environmental improvements if we could add um the goal General environmental improvements of of um page six or number six number number number six I think you said number six so what it's going a BC this was on with regard to the different um different ways of mitigating storm water yeah okay okay environmental improvements just just wanted to suggest that we add rain Gardens if it's not in there I couldn't hear them that was one of the things we are going to um it's in it says projects shall utilize low impact development strategies to the greatest extent possible you aren't listing specific things yeah but such as limiting the amount of impervious area preserving and created connected natural spaces and using green infrastructure techniques such as rainwater harvesting rain Gardens bi biooils per permeable pavement green roofs and and then I was wondering if we could also add pollinator Gardens for part of the Milton million project yeah that's a great idea be great that was my only suggest so tree let's and right after rain Gardens I think it's it's fine if that's where cheen that's great great great addition pollinator Gardens yeah great okay all right okay I guess then that was a good thing to see if there's anybody on Zoom who has any yeah cheyen are you you seeing anyone who would like to also comment and we will be holding a public hearing on this as well so nobody on zoom on the 19th love it yeah all right so then I'll make a motion okay to submit this um article site plan approval for to the select board for the February special town meeting second second all in favor I good that's in really great sh great shap okay so the next um we'll move to the um Adu um zoning article and there's been a lot of edits being made on this this is very early in our stages so this will have a public hearing a little bit later um it probably um we'd like to have it ready though for the February 24th town meeting um in going through Cheyenne would you be able to pull that up so C can I run through some of the things that I did on this today so sorry if you didn't get a chance to look at it and I did it in the one that was in the folder so that track it I looked it up late yeah so but but let's go through it yeah yeah so in um I just want to clean up it's you know with the recodification we need to be mindful the chapter 275 but there's we have um an two places which kind of address accessory one is accessory use and one's temporary partment so this motion the number one is to strike those sections just to be clear it's a very simple sentence here but that's what it's doing so because now um our accessory use thing says it shall not include dwellings um that whole section doesn't make sense to have or that whole paragraph doesn't sense to have I was going to say I I was going to write back I completely yeah I completely and then the temporary apartment doesn't make sense anymore either and Jim I think your point before about just rolling those in I I change that that it's not at the time that they expire it's just at the time of adoption they just they get to apply to be considered an Adu to the right to the Building Commissioner and not to us yes all right because they already exist when we get there there's yeah there's some language that would would address how that transfers so that um thanks cheen for taking accepting that and that makes it cleaner to look at um and I would just change the word substituting under one I don't know if substituting is fine but I think to be consistent don't we typically say insert okay well we we haven't deleted we don't have an existing accessory dwelling unit so I guess it is inserting is more accurate yes I think you're right putting it in it's not so just change that word it's so it's a whole new section correct well does it go there or does it go under add the following see there's two things the first one is your deleting sections and then you have and the second item is adding the following but it could be inserting instead of adding but just not in the spot that you put it Cheyenne I just thought in inserting it sounds but you see you can do it in number two in number two instead of adding you put inserting and and so this whole whatever three-page document goes under six right in our 27532 uh bylaw within that that is that what we're doing here section T ktk yeah I double check that you have to double check exactly where in there it goes yeah because it says under subsection a paragraph 6 is that what you're exactly yes so we're striking our existing six and we're adding except that the temporary apartment doesn't fall as a standalone so I think we want this to be a you know its own section so I just think that's why it's put in here as tktk we have to determine where it goes okay yeah I assume it become six but okay yeah okay I'm with yeah that's we have to I think in the meantime we can edit this look at that okay and our temporary apartment bylaw stays in place right this doesn't change at all no I was suggesting that that needs to be deleted because whole thing is that what you yeah cuz I lost you when you were just speaking Yeah that whole section maybe that's a question for Town Council I think we should ask we can ask Town Council before we well my thinking was we leave this just because it's been working and what um you know what if there's somebody that wants to have a nanny or to have an adult Aging in place but doesn't want to convert their house to almost a two family still it's the same it's it effectively does the same thing it provides another dwelling unit but that is a more restrictive dwelling unit so there's no there's no point in having is it more restrictive as far as what you like you can't rent it and is it less I thought it was less restrictive in in the physical changing of the space you know you sort of close off a wall and you don't have to go crazy with the um building code with this one but you do with this is that safe to say or no am I reading I have to go back and reread it that way but let's just I think it's put a pin in it yeah we should also last Town Council that's what yeah I mean the whole idea about the Adu was to replace the temporary apartment okay so if you want to yeah but if there's anything that any reason to allow people to continue without having to go to the building department I thinking the original the original intent of the law was if I have my mom move in with me and she's living with me but we have she needs Round the Clock hair Around the Clock here lives in the Adu not with us so the thing passes the place reverts back to a single cuz maybe I wouldn't want my house to be a two family maybe I just want it to be a single but I have this extenda circumstances for the next five or seven years U that's all the thing is the temporary apartment that you have to record that and it has to be renewed it's a whole process that I think is counter to what the Adu I just think they're going to see it as as something where somebody else is just going to apply for an Adu and you say you can't apply that section I don't know let's find out that's a good question if I'm just wondering if we could have both that's all it's not a deal breaker for me that's for sure okay so so is that something uh that you want to follow up with you want Cheyenne we we can talk to Town Council and ask um and maybe even short term keep both to see if it's until we I think it's it would be good to find out before town meeting because it's it'll be a question very it'll definitely be a question that comes up okay good um so then under purpose I agree with you Cheryl that the the the purpose the way you wrote it and added down below it seems to be more in keeping with what we were trying to say yeah I took some of the things that Maggie suggested out and I rewrote a couple of them a little bit and put them in is six and seven and eight mhm [Music] um so where are you guys seeing six and seven and eight um are you in the document that's in the folder no I'm on the one that was printed okay let me I'll you guys keep keep pushing forward I'll I'll find it okay yeah I think you brought in some things that so I'm good with the purpose um section for now we'll come back this is very early so yeah um good if we see something um okay that we can add later okay so under definitions so I'm good with that's comes from the statute the statute exactly we're not going to have any choice on that one exactly um there are places where accessory structure is mentioned but I don't think defined anywhere and I just put it here to kind of flag it if we need to Define it MH um and the same thing for these other definitions because we don't have a definition section generally overall in our zoning bylaw um I don't know it doesn't say in the um statute 900 sare ft gross or 900 sare ft net but when someone goes to apply to the building department it you know it it's not a huge difference but it it does make it is something that I've seen flagged or I've seen questioned by a building official so we might want to say 900 gross square fet or net square feet even though the statute doesn't isn't that specific but so add that into our definition yeah so I have the areas in here but the I don't have the 900 square ft so I added I added some definitions mhm are you guys on definitions Adu the first definition where are you yeah the Adu one is by Statute Jim so I don't think I'm just catching up right okay but the question is do we add to to that language gross well or keep just the dwelling unit of 900 statute so we can't add to that but we can add somewhere else well I'm just wondering if if we clarify um if we need to clarify that in any way so I I just put that in here maybe we can ask Town Council about that that's yeah 9 sareet of living space maybe yeah if we can somehow incorporate measured in so the are the way you know if you think if you're if you normally if you're talking about doing a new building you would say that building's 900 ft that would be gross right um so but someone might come in with a plan that shows a 900 ft net yeah inside wall W wall yeah and so you would say okay well does that comply or not comply it would be the interpretation of the building official otherwise so I I think if you want to say be uh we can just I think we could try you know putting it in by definition to be clear but um I think that would be useful maybe to the we could say we could just add the word gross floor area half of the gross floor area or 900 ft whichever is smaller well actually which is not larger so maybe what we call it is gross square feet and net square feet because this is the statute uses square feet instead of floor area it's just it's probably not consistent across the zoning code then that way I don't know that'll be a question that we all right let's just pin and come back so can we go to detach unit real quick I know you guys have passed that but no go ahead a building having 5 ft or more of open space on all sides I was kind of hoping we could the ad especially if it's a a new construction a new structure would meet the same setbacks of of the principal structure as opposed to using the um accessory I changed this to 10 Jim what's that I changed this to 10 okay 10 ft or more for it's just a definition though it's not what the requirement is it's a definition okay well we need it to setback somewhere else then okay okay were there any other changes on page two that you had made uh my old sheet two or three we're on three now not three yeah um well I thought it's important like the language that was here did not contemplate new construction but new construction could have an Adu so it's not just expanded or expanded or remodeled so I added the word new and I I did primary dwelling because that's there's there's the primary dwelling and then there's the Adu so we need to kind of be clear which dwelling we're talking about um so this isn't this lawful single family dwelling use so I I went and looked at the language of the statute again because it it actually ties to the district not to what exists as a use so you know how there's non-conforming uses the statute says in a single family residential zoning District it doesn't say at a single family house you know what I mean MH so because that can be a two family within a single family yeah so here where we say I do have I have some language that I wanted to add which I pulled from the last uh um time we looked at adus there's some language that was good I thought so just while we're looking at this on it's on C the general conditions and requirements for all accessory dwelling units where it says if you look at the number one the second line from the bottom it says the use accessory to a lawful single family dwelling use that really should be accessory to a use in a single family zoning District right because it's not it's the district that's got the opportunity so I just want to look at that again now cheyen can you enlarge that a little bit more please yeah even a little bit more yeah it's good yeah I think that makes sense I think that's yeah so I I think that makes sense right mhm because it's based on the district yeah yeah okay okay so so then now number two is the same thing um to add to or include means that it's again contemplating new construction I agreed with that too okay so then we can keep scrolling down got a couple things in number three is killing me there were a way we could condition it you know so that the owner is at least in Massachusetts or at least in the it's just the statute doesn't allow it no it's not I know it just doesn't allow it trying to find a way a work the parking is the same thing that's in the statute itself mhm so I think then we look at number five um this is the part we've talked about with the statute not being 100% clear if you're mandated to allow a second one so I think I I my understanding from sitting in on on the hlc's meeting was that we were town would have the opportunity to limmit it to one okay so what do you think about this where it would only be by special permit which if it's by special permit it could be denied because if you have a large lot a large parcel um you know let's just say you wanted to do two adus for each each of your kids or some or your brother or your whomever I mean I'm just you know thinking is that an opportunity that should be afforded people well I mean I think of it more as I moved into a neighborhood of all single family homes and all of a sudden I'm getting ad I'm getting two families on each side of me and now there might be three families on each side of me I mean I I I personally don't want two families on either side of me let alone the option to have three um so I would I would try to shut that down any way possible I think just as we rolled this out initially for the town I think I I look at the building department I I look at what what kind of capability we have to enforce and to handle and oversee the development if depending on how many we start to get so I guess what I would do is maybe we can um ask Town Council about this too if they've heard anything about this in their because the language in the statute says for more than one accessory dwelling unit or rental thereof which is confusing too because you're not allowed to restrict it to not you're not allowed to restrict rental but anyway it says for more than one accessory dwelling unit or rental thereof in a single family residential zoning district there shall be a special permit for the use of land or structure for an accessory dwelling so it says shall be a special permit mhm so does it that shall be mean shall no no I get it that's the part where I think we we should put it in and then we should find out if we if it's something that somehow Town Council or hlc issues something differently because what this is going to control anyway so if somebody applies for it and we don't put it in here then um what's what's going to make it fall under this requirement this procedural requirement because if the building if if if somebody appli for it into the building department the building official is going to say it says sh and it doesn't now it doesn't say who's issuing the special permit right whereas if we put it here we can say that was one of my questions too is we we don't say but you know we at least it's going to be clear that it's it has to be a special permit issued by either the board of appeals or us but this isn't saying who issues it in in the LW itself so it kind of leaves us a little open that way and then if it's F if it's found that we that it that you don't actually have to do it then that can be stricken out before we get to town meeting but I at least I have a placeholder in there for fine I yeah I don't have a problem with that and we can discuss it but I don't think we're going to know yeah before I we can change it in May too if we find out something between February and may right exactly I don't think we're probably talking about too many people are looking at doing that but it's hard I think we don't yeah we don't know um so then the we those other we know that five well the things that were next here had to be stricken right CU they came from one this the basis for what we're looking at was what we did three years two or three years ago right and so we couldn't do these things now we couldn't require an owner information correct so I think we move on then to no Adu shall be separated from the principal delling unit through condo conversion so that that's definitely there and it can't be conveyed separately right I don't know if that's redundant but we can keep it in someone added that boarding or lodging yeah this is perfect [Music] and I and then you know the conversion of a pre-existing non-conforming accessory building um you know maybe it's a garage or a carriage house so maybe it should be allowed but it should be looked at um as a special permit because it doesn't meet zoning otherwise right so because this doesn't you know the statute says that you you can have it be required to meet this your standard zoning right MH so where it says pre-existing non-conforming accessory buildings shall be moved that's what I changed because that didn't make sense to me you can't tell someone to move it no but so I thought this was language from a previous draft well it's kind of a crazy thing though um know but then yeah if if an accessory dwelling unit in a separate accessory structure that structure shall exist in compliance with the zoning and shall have been built for um prior to for us it would be January 1st 2025 semicolon it shall meet the front rear and side setback requirements for a single family dwelling in the relevant zoning district and have and shall have a full foundation and suitable construction for economical economical conversion into an independent dwelling unit um all right can you send that so we just take a look at yeah um I think being clear about the pre-existing nonconforming is a good idea because I I'm sure people will want to convert garages which are sitting on the lot lines and yeah this is a way to sort of address that and then what if your garage is in the front of your house I mean I'd hate to see adus in on the front yard so it would be non-conform so it would not it would not meet the standards of today's zoning right okay that's what this would that's what this would so one thing you want to consider is like there are things where you know you might want to have a historic structure be able to be converted because it's a historic structure and it might not meet the zoning that's why I was thinking it would require special permit and it wouldn't be just as of right if it's not if it's pre-existing nonconforming so I'll be happy to take a look at the language that you've got there to see but I don't think it should be prohibited because you know why somebody might tear down a perfectly nice structure to put up something else or you know have to do an addition somewhere else or a new structure somewhere else instead of being able to use the structure that they have yeah maybe we do limit limit it to new construction I just have been looking at placement of garages and there's a few not to name names but that I wouldn't want to see an Adu you know be converted to an Adu and I it just made me think what if people have these gorgeous front Lawns and they start putting their structures there because they can't fit them in the back so all right so I'll send I'll send this language let's think about that because that's something that was discussed at the you know on the hlc's call people were asking about this what about all the non-conforming being a historic you know Community um a lot of communities have this issue so um okay and then next was at the occupancy limit Jim I I really I don't agree with three at all and I really don't agree with limiting it because we don't limit occupancy in other single family or condo or apartment and and who's policing it you know like are you going to say okay I saw somebody going in and out of that ad my I'm going to call on my neighbor because they've got more than three people living there Ian it's going to be kind of a lot of very privacy intrusive kind you know intrusive of of people's privacy um so the build the building codes will dictate like if you have building codes require if you have a bedroom it has to have a window it has to have access to Air and light so if somebody's taking a room that doesn't have any of those and trying to make it a bedroom it can't happen right you have and it says by definition you have to have living space that's what these are they're not just they're not a rooming house right so I get it I get it I just don't it be a shame to have a family of five living in a one bedroom that's what I'm saying and I you're right I don't know how you limit it it's it's a shame to have people living on the street and on the sidewalks too because they can't afford a place and you're right but I don't see a lot of people living on the streets in Milton well there was just something on Facebook about someone on the on the street so one thing that's so he would be one guy he wouldn't be five let's I mean we again we could not dwell on this um we have been consistent in our in our temporary apartment bylaw and even in our drafts both by special permit and by right that it was a limit of no more than two bedrooms two bedrooms is fine it's just the people part so this is so what I and we can talk again talk about that but I do I did want to bring that back um that's fine bring back the two-bedroom fine as a maximum right but what um just my experience um in property management and leasing for rental units it is industry standard to say no more than two occupants per bedroom oh yeah you mentioned that I think um I think that that's consistently in all the leases that we offered it was sort of a it's very common place it's not overly restrictive but I just don't know about in zoning so I guess the question it would be a question to ask cuz that maybe that's the way to solve yeah not having you know a bunch of Curry college students renting out you know they need a place to live to though they do oh and they find them they do so there just a something to okay we can maybe um think about that and and bring back that you know two bedroom because it does seem consistent with everything that we've done in the past okay okay um so this under the process are we ready for processing yeah CU I there was okay go ahead yes yeah I just um this was just you know being clear that they require site plan approval and referring back to the site plan approval section that we just reviewed um again I think this was a question I had but it seemed like we should include everything even though there things that would be obviously waved and this kind of comes back to like Jim's point before about my minor versus major site plan approval but just we don't have time to kind of I don't think flush those out at the moment yeah um so there was one version that had really good language on the importance of and I'll find it and I just oh it was under design requirements no it was not sorry um it was talking about the process and the going to the building department that um it's very clear that no construction should should begin until the building department until the building department has issued a permit a building permit um I'm looking for it now and that um no one should occupy until a certificate of occupancy it's very specific in it's in the zoning it was in one of our drafts and now let me see I'll find it I'll look through it but I'll um but it was really for the Building Commissioner with what his authority is okay might be under that actually so while you're looking and number one this one if it's within an existing house without an addition or or a new structure or the conversion of a structure this doesn't isn't triggered here so I don't know if that's different than under applicability we would need to look at that but this says the creation of an ad in an expansion of an existing dwelling or a detach building structure on a single family zoned lot shall require site plan approval by the planning board in compliance with this section and provisions of the other of the section site plan approval so that's just something for us to come back and make sure that it's consistent and I think it was along this the lines of this paragraph um if the building commissioner or Board of Health no not that one sorry under permits um no accessory dwelling unit shall be constructed without issuance of a building permit by The Building Commissioner no use of an accessory dwelling unit as an independent dwelling unit shall be permitted unless the certificate of occupancy for such accessory dwelling unit has been issued by the Building Commissioner a certificate of occupancy shall not be shall not be issued unless the Building Commissioner determines that the accessory dwelling unit is in Conformity with all of the the provisions of this paragraph of this paragraph of this section well all right so that would be under process and procedures so that would be process and procedures but I'll send that over okay mhm okay okay so and then under the process and proced requirements um so I would put that my what I just said under expand to and so the Adu here does refer to site plan I yeah I added that um to to re to refer it to the site plan approval and we should just look through it with that in mind like the site plan approval just with Adu in mind to see if there's anything about that that we wouldn't want and that might be a question for Town Council how do we there has been a lot of language about Board of Health they only have jurisdiction my understanding is is in places where septic systems so I just Tred to be clear about that we're not sending everything to them right that makes sense okay and then I think go down to the use and dimensional requirements MH maybe this this is where we do the square fet um it's just a determination of gross or net square feet we just pick a word and add it in there yeah so be smaller right right slightly but yeah not by not by much whatever you guys want to do there I'm okay with I'll come yeah I'll come back to that I'll think about that and for the next [Music] time so a question on this is do we want to break out sort of General use and dimensional requirements as the physical space and then add a section on design requirements which some of these things could be um included like the stairways cuz I had a few that I wanted to add in and I don't I'll I'll add the language in um I'll just you know I'll add it to the comments but [Music] um there were a few things that were dimensional but then there was language in the previous language um the accessory dwelling unit at a minimum shall have its own living area full bathroom and kitchen yeah so that's in the definitions now so I don't think you'd want to stove kitchen sink refrigerator accessory ding is a self-contained housing unit inclusive for sleeping cooking and sanitary facilities on the same law as the principal dwelling um so we don't need to restate that I don't think you need to rest yeah um there is one paragraph that we had that any addition or exterior alterations to an existing dwelling which are needed for construction of an accessory dwelling unit shall be compatible with the with the architecture of the existing dwelling new dat new detailing on the side or rear facades shall receive the same architectural care as the detailing on the front facade um and then it says any new staircase shall be enclosed but that's already on here okay so I'll I'll add some of the just a few things that um okay I had looked at um one I thought was interesting that I found in other draft all new utilities and electrical wires should be placed underground all exterior lighting shall be dark sky compliant I think we had that in there and in Adu and principal dwelling shall share common septic Wastewater and water service facilities so you're not bringing in we're not requiring that they bring in additional septic tanks but we can talk about all these I'll just okay add them in um okay so let's keep stairways then you had yeah so had stairways enclosed so we had entrances separate and then the appearance after the Adu should be that of a single family or a single family with an accessory structure such as Carriage House other all right but I think what if you want to that maybe would just send in this would be the place to to send things in yeah and then just to okay and then we get to the temporary apartment piece which I just put here struck the part about after expiration and just had it be that the property owner could do it now right Jim so um actually Cheyenne under under seven if we just un we sort of cross that off if we just bring that back that basically says that one what you wanted to keep okay yeah that's and that would become number four five I think instead of seven yep so temporary Apartments okay and let's put a pin in temporary Apartments until we find out from Town Council what what's most appropriate there so also under H Administration enforcement that's what you had no so um yeah that was stricken before so you could see about putting that back yeah yeah so sh on page nine towards the bottom H Administration and enforcement but I don't think it would be a separate section I just think you would take that first number one and move it uh up under process and procedural requirements maybe after number two and there was one um one draft we had done at one time that did have language on how this how this will be enforced because I think it's we're going to have to be really clear on what what we can like what can the building department do or not do obviously um with the bylaw here but if it's not um if it's not done properly construction like what what are the well nobody can start construction without without a building permit or I mean heard from someone recently that there's there is such a a whole big building that's being built and Milton that um didn't have permits and they kept going with even though they had cease and desist and it went to court and they're required to take it down so really you would take it to court well it's you know the requirements are there so you need the building permit um and so they can't build and they can't occupy without their certificate of occupancy so it's really um the building uh commissioner you know will get an application and we'll have to be mindful what the statute said and then also what this bylaw says at the time right I was thinking more if somebody just goes and builds one on the slide then the neighbors or somebody finds out about it do we have does the Building Commissioner have the power to evict them or like how does that work you going to throw people on the street like you know so how does that I mean that's what I'm thinking about when I when I think about enforcement well like I said what I heard was from a a a builder who had been told the story about currently in Milton that this situation happened but nobody was occupying that that building right it was under construction I'm thinking if you have like I you know I there was an incident where somebody in town had a basement apartment mhm that had like 6ot ceilings and was pretty egregious and the building department went there a couple times and finally I think they had to evict the people so it's not a legal unit that way no it was totally illegal as with one of these if someone decides to build it with no permit right even if they built it the code it would be illegal right that's and that's why I think the language having a certificate of occupancy prior to yeah um and again Town Council can review and see what we're able to require okay and I guess the consequence for finding an illegal Adu would just be eviction and they would have to apply for permits mhm but that's beyond this right language right so did did you just take a um add back in all at the end there because that part does not belong in there um I had to add it back to copy it to bring it back up to number two okay because you have to get rid of a lot of that language again the H okay all right I get it now thanks all right so um because otherwise that's all gone yeah s the premises doesn't matter is that all stricken yeah okay all right so I think we have some more work to do on this but um we on plan requirements plan requirements was there anything on that yeah and we'll definitely um have comments and more work to do on this so I'll add some of the just a shame wrong one oh you know what I was one of the things that was in here that was taken out was a buffer we and we' put it in our adus um some of our drafts previously we always had screening between parking if possible um doing some sort of hedge or fencing remember I and I think it was in somewhere in our current red line or I'll find it and I'll put in that language just for us to discuss because I think it is nice if you're adding another parking space that if you're right on you know close to a neighbor's property that you do have some sort of a green buffer between the two properties if they're close together okay yeah it's good idea so I'll I'll look up that so this gets cleaned up and then we have a second chance to edit it what this coming week that how it um we won't have or for the next meeting um I think tonight all we have to do as I asked Cheyenne earlier we just have to say we're going to submit an ad bylaw we don't have to say it's this right I guess and but I'm just asking we'll get another chance to edit this just the way we did oh definitely definitely when everybody's back right and then we'll have a public hearing on this I just think this public hearing will be in Janu maybe January we won't really have a close to be complete I think it's going to take us maybe we can maybe we can get it done but we already have we'll have the a public hearing scheduled on both the map and the site plan review so I thought having two public hearings I didn't want to do three um and actually we and then um the their Nursery special permit will also be on the 19th so I thought maybe the first meeting in January we could have a public hearing on on the Adu and give us a little bit more time so we'll we'll have it on we'll have this on all agendas so if we have time we can so is U coming on the 12th so cheyen that's what you just said right yes start coming on the 12 yeah so it's going to be sort of a packed agenda um but maybe have time to so over a few things I guess you know maybe um if like sorry Jim I spent some time on this today and you probably didn't get a chance to see it so maybe we can agree to try and get some whatever edits done so that we all have time to look at them before we discuss it again so that's great um we we're going to discuss it you think on the 19th Meredith no on the 12th not on the 12th probably um Julia just did two agendas um I'm sorry Julia I haven't had a chance to look at yet so are we setting like like get it done by the 13th or we'll have it on all we'll have it on both agendas so if for some reason we do have time we can we'll be able to talk about it okay so I just might be yeah busier and you wanted to join us and had some comments if you don't mind sure I know it's a public hearing um but it's hopefully just give some thoughts to some of the things you were talking about tonight I appreciate all the efforts on this I know it's not easy to write these things uh Brian F 630 brell Road um a bunch of the things I had written down were already commented on uh I did want to address the idea of adding a unit where there's already two um because I hear the point around not not wanting to have a lot of uh additional units added in single family areas but I do think that there's opportunity in some of the two family areas that already exist today in a non-conforming way to potentially add some additional units there where there may be more of an appetite for it where you already have density where you already have people that have that more urban living environment so I know there's a there's a discussion about if there's already one there we're only going to allow one perhaps There's an opportunity to say that existing pre preon uh me non conforming can add one unit as well so maybe there's language that says something along the lines of uh each property can add up to one unit and then you would be confining the single family homes to only adding one but you'd also be giving the opportunity for properties with room that may already have a second unit to add another unit so that's a thought that I would uh put before the board um I do think that um as a uh the um number of people living in the unit I think that was a good discussion I think the idea around uh number of people per bedrooms probably makes more sense I I was a little bit concerned about the three if you have a young family that moves back with their parents because they're in graduate school or something and they have two little kids that's obvious going to be a problem for them so I'd give a little bit of thought to how you draft that so that we don't have unintended consequences that make uh families unable to use the benefits of the zoning um I think there was a lot of discussion around the zoning District versus the uh single family so I think that was covered and and done appropriately um I would I couldn't follow exactly where we ended up on this as far as whether it needed to be part of a uh existing structure or a detached garage tach garage um but I think there's a lot of really interesting and Innovative architecture out there today for tiny homes so I would want to make sure that that was uh something that this bylaw considered because it's it's a far more economical way for a family to be able to add uh in many cases an Adu for an in-law or a younger child um than having to build a whole garage structure that they may not otherwise need um there was a comment about the barn or the the building having to move move I think asking people to move an existing building um is probably a pretty big burden um so I would I would encourage us to think about the historic nature of that there's a lot of nice Carriage Houses out there that are definitely not conforming but that would provide opportunity for these adus on the second floor um just a couple more comments uh I think uh I have the same comment on the um the environmental I would love to see that same language added to this bylaw that you were discussing on the last approved plan to encourage uh low intensity or low impact uh development uh and citing some of the examples that you're citing on that previous draft uh for the for the plan review um there was a question in here about dark sky dark skylighting and whether it's enforcable um it definitely is but I remember from when I sat on the planning board that you have to use very specific language as to what you refer to so I would ask the board to just check on how to do that you may have already done that but uh there was a very specific requirement of how I think that's in our site plan approval so we could bring that in as well to this um I think that might be let's see yeah that's all the comments I have again thank you for all your efforts on this uh we end up good thanks Brian thank you okay um great so with that um could I have a motion um I will move to some notify the select board that the planning board intends to submit an Adu article for the February special town meeting the language of which will be submitted at a later date second second all in favor I I okay great so now we can move to our map um language and so I had a question about this because I thought um I thought when Tim was saying and Cheyenne you can probably clarify this I thought he was saying that it was the Brook Road overlay and the Milton Village overlay I didn't I didn't know it included the Central Avenue um the central Rue um he just mentioned it was the Milton Village PL unit development and I think in the bylaw it also included that cuz we took this language straight from there and just it down so maybe I'm unclear but it says mil Village mixed use planned unit development which is different from the you would when Cheryl was you know the board created a Central Avenue District that was different from what we voted and did the design guidelines for the Milton Village because High Street wasn't included it was Adam Street um no high Street's included in the Milton Village overlay so this map here I don't know if you want to pull the map up Che was that that was included okay because I think what Julia printed out just didn't have all of that on there so that's why I it looked more like Central Avenue but weren't they oh I see yeah so I'm looking at there okay that's what we're looking at great that's so I didn't have all of that okay I was seeing more of the central yeah Avenue business this is the map there was a map at the time that the the zoning was approved but must have not have been a map Amendment article at the time which I think is just something that was flagged or noticed recently the maps were were separate when we did the overlay the Milton Village overlay zoning so there's the interesting thing is that the business I think it's there's one there's several overlay districts and and and I don't know that why that the central AV needs to be on this map unless there's a re because of these other districts I'm not sure but the red line on the map is the boundary for the the the most recent so were there three Maps then that did not get amended I don't know those other two maps are are actually predate my time on the board those other two and I think they are just the the entirety of the business district and what they did was they limited it was limited on the parcels based on the parcel size requirement so this one um didn't do that you know so this one needed the map I I don't know you know they're not tied the other ones were not really tied to a map they were just within the business district and if you met the other requirements then you could do it this one's actually tied to a map I don't know if um Milton doesn't have too many overlays that are actually tied to a map they're tied to being very restrictive so but they're calling this the Milton Village planned unit development that's she said that's from the zoning apparently I just want to make sure we're clear on this before we're presenting it to town meeting um so we could go to the zoning section yeah cuz the portion of the Milton Village SL Central Avenue buct business district which to me sounds like it's all one District but the but the Articles went separately to tell what you saying to tell meeting sorry sharanne we don't want to confuse you but it was no I can try and pull up the language that we used um I'll do that I find it very difficult that the yeah we could at least look at the Milton Village that was the most recent because I think the Brook Road is very clear it's distinct um it's just the it seems like we should be voting on three Maps yeah and then even within one of the maps you have JD Wild's parcel in purple which I also don't understand e22 D1 Elliot Street LLC right like I don't get why that's in purple in between that's a and there's no oh it is in Milton Village plan unit development I guess but it shows it that it ends so it would that I would think the purple would continue over to the the [Music] side so Chey's got that pulled up did you see that ah okay great I was just going to do the same thing thing so okay so it's called that's what it's called the Milton Village mixed use PUD and I think it was called that because at the time that's what the others in Milton Village were also puds and I remember some discussion about whether it should be called that or an overlay district and mapc just kind of landed on this to kind of keep it consistent with the other two okay yeah um so it's all part of it's considered all part of So within the business district itself which is the entirety of the green this applies only to a portion of it because the the only so when we amended the overlay zoning which was before I was on the board for the Milton Village I came on at the design guidelines phas when that was approved that was combin that was adding that to this it was um to the Central Avenue yeah so if you look here on what Cheyenne has up uh can you enlarge that a little bit Cheyenne um where that it describes the the the district boundaries yeah I have that here north south so it says that portion of the Milton V Village Central AB business district so what you're seeing in green is that the entire Central a I mean Milton Village Central business district this overlay only applies to the part of it so that's why it shows the entire so it's from here over I don't know why he called out that property separately that's why that's what threw me off yeah because it doesn't that doesn't have High Street it doesn't have Adam Street it just has the Elliot Street um it and at the time that he that he did that it was also Alan Bishop did a map that was just like this it just didn't get apparently a map modification done in our zoning to the zoning map that's the our official map so maybe cheyen and I can work we could talk about this you could talk to to make sure that the map is correct map that's all we're trying to do is tie a map to that language right that's correct yeah okay so did Alan Bishop do this Cheyenne yes I last or with the with the sort of the purple cuz we're trying to understand why the purple is segmented off separately from the rest of the Milton Village so I'm not too sure on that but I can ask him when he gets back okay that would be great we'll just we'll just want to make sure we clarify that before presenting it to town meeting and our public hearing great so um the language seems fine um once we just get make sure the maps are clear um so with that if I could have a motion that we want to move this for okay for our February 24th town meeting okay so what was that described on the agenda as it's the Brook Road uh oh sorry it's the zoning here I'll let you read that that um I'll make a motion zoning map Amendment yeah for the board to submit a zoning map Amendment uh for the February special town meeting uh for the Milton Village plan unit development um I guess overlay overlay Y for the 24th yes for the February 24th for the February 24th special town meeting yep second second all in favor I I great okay um is there anything else from we need to do the brook mured one right yeah we just did the we didn't do this one it's all okay it's all included in our zoning language so yeah this map is fine this map looked great it's just this was the one that I had the question on okay so I should amend my motion to include both um do a second motion to okay I I'll the motion to to amend the zoning map to include Milton Village plan unit unit development and and the Brook Road overlay District as described okay so that's the motion that's the second second all in favor I perfect great great okay so that um completes our agenda for this evening is there's not anything else um I would entertain a motion to adjourn so moved second all in favor thank you good night [Music] is he