good evening my name is Bob Connors it is 6 o'clock pm and I'd like to call the March 19th meeting of the newb Conservation Commission to order Sean can you read the remote open meeting law Preamble and take a roll call of members present good evening my name is sha young opening the March 19 2024 meeting I am the conservation agent for the town of Newberry Conservation Commission please let me confirm all members are present and can hear me conservation members when I call your name please respond in the affirmative Bob Connors yes Brad Duffin yes Diane O'Brien yes Mary Rimer yes Mike Brown TJ KY Woody night good evening this March 19th 2024 open meeting of the Newberry Conservation Commission is being conducted remotely consistent with the ACT relevant to extending certain covid-19 measures adopted during the state of emergency which extends to the which extends to the governor's March 12 2020 order suspending certain provisions of the open meeting law until March 31st 2025 this order suspends the requirement of the open meeting law to have all meetings in a publicly accessible physical location and allows public bodies to meet entirely remotely so long as reasonably Public Access is afforded so that the public can follow along with the deliberations of the meeting please note that the meeting is being recorded and the attendees are participating by video and or telephone conference and the recording will be available on the Newbury access YouTube channel meeting materials were provided to the Commissioners commission members prior to the meeting for review before we turn to the first item on the agenda permit me to re some ground rules for the effective and clear conduct of our business and to ensure accurate meeting minutes the chair will introduce each speaker on the agenda proponents will be given 10 minutes to present more time may be allowed at the discussion of the chair after they conclude their remarks we will go down the list of the commission members inviting each by name to provide any comment questions or motions please hold until your name is called further for all attendees except commission members and staff please remember to mute your computer or your phone when you are not speaking please remember to speak clearly in a way that helps generate accurate minutes Please be aware that the video participants can see you and that you should take care not to screen share your computer unless you have been allowed to do so anything that you broadcast may be captured by the recording should I do another roll call I have we had any additional members I do not see anyone that has joined okay has have you seen anyone else join the meeting Sean yes but not from commission members okay that then that's fine all right team I'm gonna I'm going to get going here upcoming meeting dates our next meeting will be April 2nd and April 16th meeting Minutes review December 5th January 2nd January 16th uh these were in the Dropbox and why don't we take these at uh one one at a time okay why don't we take a look at the December 5th minutes the good news team the four of us uh Woody good evening you just just get going my friend Woody what is here thank You alaxy tab a yeah I I had to go through regular Zoom I couldn't get it off the agenda get in off the agenda yeah well thank you for the effort my friend at Woody we're we were just getting into a meeting Minutes review uh we're looking at the December 5th uh meeting minutes we take a minute to look at those I have a just a general comment Bob yes I'm Mary um just under members present I think Sam typically would check um off after the minutes were approved what members were present so I just wanted to let Sean know that just be that's the entire list of everyone but that doesn't necessarily mean that was everyone that was present so you might have to double check that against the actual tape or if anybody remembers if they were present for the December 5th meeting yeah you know we had to check well actually what what Sam would do was highlight the the person that wasn't in attendance so on the December 5th meeting TJ kti was not in attendance okay that makes it easier yeah so that we'll see that highlight on each one of these yes so so that's the rationale behind that okay uh any questions on the December 5th minutes okay is there a motion to approve the meeting minutes for December 5th so moved okay okay uh roll call vote all in favor Mary yes Woody yes Brad I Diane yes and Bob Connor's votes yes I don't see Mick hasn't joined us at this point all right moving on to that's uh January 2nd meeting minutes okay we take a look at those uh Diane and Mick were not in attendance uh for the January 2nd meeting minutes so we still have a quorum of the members that were so okay any any comments or questions Corrections on the January 2nd meeting minut okay hearing none is there a motion to approve the meeting minutes for the January 2nd so moved is there a second second thank you Mary okay roll call vote all in favor Mary yes Woody yes Brad hi hang on I'm sorry uh okay Diane you you weren't in attendance and Bob Connor's vote for you so we get Mary Woody Brad okay we have a quum of the members present thank you okay uh let's look at the January 16th meeting minutes I was not present for that it was on an airplane okay any any comments Corrections or concerns on the January 16th meeting all right hearing then I'll take a roll call vote all those in favor Mary yes Woody yes Brad hi Diane yes Mr chair you we did not have a motion to approve well then let's REO a reset on this is there a motion to approve the meeting minutes for January 16 so moved we have a second okay roll call vote all in favor say I Mary yes Woody yes Brad I Diane yes and I wasn't an attendance all right moving on uh first order of business certificate of compliance for D file number 0501 14561 Boston Road uh for work on a septic system Sean can you provide a overview and a recommendation on this John you're on mute yeah so I went to the site uh everything looks good everything's grown over um yeah it look good to me okay all right questions from the members Mary any any questions on this matter no I don't have any questions okay thank you Mary Woody any questions no I don't have any questions Bob okay thank you Woody Brad any questions no Mr chair thank you and Diane any questions no I have no questions Sam any ra excuse me Sean any raised hands from the public at this time no okay is there a motion to issue a certificate of compliance for 61 Boston Ro sove second okay roll call vote all in favor Mary yes Woody yes Brad hi Diane yes and Bob coners votes yes all right next order of business a certificate of compliance for D file number 0501 1263 6 Old rowy Road the work to add a portable water tank Sean can you provide an overview and a recommendation on this matter yeah so this was a a pable water tank put in to replace a well um it was put into the side of the mountain as the pictures as you can see in the pictures everything's grown over everything looks good and there's um sufficient uh topographic replacement because it was put in into the hill now was the who was the issuing authority on this was it the Board of Health that would oversee the installation of this portable water tank Sean did we check with them I did not check with them okay this this was done uh prior to Samantha this was an open COC that never got closed out so she wanted to close it out I did not check with the Board of Health for this I think there's a size requirement for that okay all right well one don't I hold you there questions from them I was married questions on this matter no I think I vaguely remember this project and I I believe that they had to do this because the well and the the lot was very small and the well and the septic system were too close together okay any anything else Mary no uh Woody any questions on this no I don't have any questions thank you witty Brad any questions on this one no I'm good thank you Mr chair okay Diane any questions no I looked at the pictures that look good to me all right and I have no questions in this one Sean any raised hands from the public no okay I'll entertain a motion to issue a certificate of compliance for six old rowy road so moved second okay roll call vote all in favor Mary yes Woody yes Brad I Diane yes and Bob Connor votes yes okay next order of business certificate of compliance D file number 050 1352 22 Temple Boulevard West the construction of a new residence and Associated work sh can you provide an overview and a recommendation on this matter yeah so uh pretty much everything looked good there um they did some vegetation replacement and follow the order of conditions so I everything look okay okay thank you Sean questions from the members that Mary questions on this matter no I didn't have a chance to take a look at this site so I'm R relying on the pictures here um so far what I what I'm seeing looks good maybe some other members there's there's a fair amount of be be ground here so I don't know if there was a requirement for planting that didn't take um yeah there's it's a little bit hard to tell whether the plantings are viable because of the time of year from these um photos maybe maybe someone else is familiar with this location it looks like there's a hand raised okay we'll uh Woody any questions on this matter and then we'll go to the public no I don't have any questions B thank you okay Brad any questions on this matter all good thank you Mr chair okay Diane any questions on this matter no I mean it did look like there's a lot of brown plantings around there but I don't know if that means it was just the time of year that the pictures were taken okay uh is the does the applicant have a representative here that could answer Mary's question yeah Tom is yep uh Mr chairman members of the commission yeah I think the color you're seeing in the plantings is the time of year they go dormant and um and the area has been planted beautifully actually um one of the nicer planting jobs that I've seen uh for for these projects who are conscientious and did nice job so um I think this project was successful and and did everything that we told you guys it would when we uh when we permited it Mary any any questions for Tom no that makes me feel a lot better so thank you uh I see a hand raised Amy yeah Amy do you have a question hi Amy and Christopher Christo with the property owners so just to answer Mary's question we we had uh 400 I don't we call them sprigs or plants of Beach Grass installed and uh the rabbits did enjoy some of them and but you know they've all gone brown but we think they'll be doing well in the spring great okay all right any any further questions uh Team no just when were the plantings installed if you don't mind they were it's actually difficult to obtain them at the different time so one was uh the the ones closer of the house were early summer and then the others were in the fall I I was maybe October thank you okay Mick good evening we're on a certificate of compliance for 22 Temple Boulevard West I I'll let you get settled in Nick yeah sorry sorry I was late I was uh on the road and up at the Naval Air Force Base in Portsmouth today so traffic traffic traffic Bill your pain my friend so so M because they say we were on 22 Temple Boulevard we just had some questions uh Tom Hughes responded uh and it's for a certificate of compliance okay thank you all right I'll entertain a motion to issue a certificate of compliance for 22 Temple Boulevard West so moved okay okay roll call vote all in favor Mary yes Woody yes Brad hi Mick I will abstain seeing I was not here for the discussion so okay thank you understand yep Diane yes and Bob Connor's votes yes right next order of business is a request for determination of applicability it's a power file number 437 salt marsh along the Parker river map 16-7 parel 26a placement of a single temporary research station for collecting data on Town owned land within the salt msh along the pop PKA River uh Sean do you have uh any an overview on this I did I did reach out to the Town Administrator uh and her guidance was that the applicant needs to seek approval from the select board on the proposed work if it's an addition to what is previously so they they don't they didn't have any conditions in in their approval uh but I spoke to my circuit riter and she met so I think I think the the only question that that I proposed was it's owned by the town of Newbury uh and in talking to the Town Administrator if if this is an addition to what was previously approved by the select board they would just need to go back uh and go through the formality of getting uh approval for all this work okay okay again where it's owned by the town uh all requests to use the town property uh has to be go before the select board and if this is expanding what they're doing from their previous approval by the select board so is there anyone here for the applicant uh good evening Mr chair this is EV veteran D Ro environmental I'm here representing uh the Marine biological Laboratory um for their research project um in Newbery also on the call is Michael doosa doosa environmental um and an Giblin of marine biological laboratory as well um so if the commission remembers in 2021 we submitted a RDA application um that was approved to install a temporary research Tower um and a small access Boardwalk um to the tower this application requests approval for another three years because the original determination will expire in November um we did for the initial filing in 2021 we did get select board approval and have a special use permit uh for work on Town own land the Project's not changing the purposes all the same there are just some small minor tweaks that we're proposing in this uh new application but we don't think it's substantial enough to need to get go back to the select board um and if I may I'll share my screen um and talk a little bit more about the project um so I believe most of you were on on the board um in 20121 but as a refresher um this is Triton Regional High School this is the Parker River that's winding through um and this is the brackish Marsh uh we call it the TAA Marsh um because the primary vegetation is Cattails um in this area so this is the the location of the research Tower in Boardwalk that's installed um to date so here's a um a good photo of off Google Earth so this is installed Boardwalk um each of these planks are 16 ft um in length uh 2 in fi uh thick excuse me and 10 in wide so they're very small um they're all Timber Just rough cut Lumber um and they access these solar panels um and the Ty tyer Tower and there's another solar panel here so the only changes from what was originally proposed in 2021 is that MBL would like to install just one boardwalk length perpendicular to the existing Boardwalk um and there's two reasons for that the first reason is that their focus is for this year's study um is on the dynamism of tidal flushing um and that data will be collected from the typa that's closer to the river here um so that's the first reason why they'd like this additional Boardwalk so that they can have more um access to a greater sample size the second reason is because the researchers when they access the site don't trample the vegetation they only remain on the boardwalk and that's to collect their samples um to get to the Tower to the solar panels um and write their notes so if one person is on the boardwalk and another person needs to pass it's really difficult for them to shimmy around each other so this perpendicular platform allows for a researcher to stand off to the side for another to pass so that's the first Small Change um and the second Small Change Is that they've gotten inspiration from um a Minnesota bog research project um where they use these uh aluminum scaffolding ladders that they suspend down um that's a temporary structure so they they suspend them down so that they have greater sample access um at certain points throughout the tyam marsh and in order to utilize those scaffolding they're looking to install just a couple supports um parallel to the boardwalks so that the rear end of the scaffolding can um won't stand directly on the vegetation it'll stand on those supports so the use of the site isn't changing it's all just really minor um for greater data collection um and I will show show you some photos so as part of the 2021 determination the commission required monitoring reports at the beginning and end of each um data season so this these are photos from the report that was submitted in March of 2023 so it shows the installed Boardwalk so as you can see it's it's really narrow planks this is one of the solar pan panels This is the tyer Tower and as you can see the researchers only walk on the boardwalk they don't disturb the vegetation all the vegetation has densely grown in around it um no showing no signs of adverse impact to the marsh and here's photos from the monitoring reports submitted in the fall as you can see the Lush Ty growing up around the the boardwalks um and around the solar panels and the tower um the com the commission originally had asked for the boardwalk to be removed at the end of the season um in 2022 the commission granted approval for um the allowance to keep the boardwalk in year round um because if you can see from the photo to take this entire Boardwalk each season would be an extreme effort um so the commission granted approval for the boardwalk to remain year round um and as written in the reports you can see that there was no sign of um destruction to the March greater disturbance all the boards were kept in their place uh throughout the winter so that's a quick brief summary of the project um and Mike and I are here to answer any questions that you may have um and we hope to receive approval thank you okay questions from the members Mary any questions on this matter no I I remember that um this project was presented as a temporary project which is why we didn't require no of intent and um and the you know obviously the boardwalk doesn't meet all current standards for Boardwalk construction or I'm sure even building code standards um so my question is simply you know what's the dur what do you expect the duration of this Boardwalk will be I think that we talked about five years when it was originally approved is it still within that time frame so yeah so the project is only going to continue as long as there's funding available and at this time they only have funding available through 2027 um I if I and if you have more information on if you think this will be a longer term project um yes we have funding through um about 2027 um I I will say that we have some Towers on The Refuge uh and they're now the longest running salt marsh Towers in the world and the data has been really really useful um this Tower is giving us information on how methane flux is change with sea level rise but um how long we keep the tower up is totally dependent upon funding and of course your your approval but we built the boardwalk with sort of as absolute minimum footprint as we felt we could you know work with um the reason the tower is so far back from the from the creek bank is that it's um the way the instrumentation works it's it's drawing from a different vegetation footprint depending upon the wind direction so in order to really characterize the uh area we had to be back away from the rivers away and remind me how high it is above grade um the boardwalk itself maybe Aaron has the exact figures the there's a platform that that it stands on that's about uh 5 feet high I would say the tower itself is probably another oh maybe two meters but the but the boardwalk I'm thinking of oh the board the boardwalk is only uh about I don't know I'd say maybe 15 20 inches off the off the surface okay it's it's supported by um just sort of a U-shaped set of boards right and that and right between it goes the 2 by8 okay thank you um you know I'm sure the commission is very supportive of the research that you're doing there and you know hence the easier permanent pathway that you have and just to I just wanted to reiterate that you know could be different members in three years and you they may not feel the same way if this comes back for another extension so completely understood and I appreciate the fact that you all have been so uh helpful Mary thank you thank you Mary Woody any questions on this matter no question is just uh interesting project and I hope you're getting some good data out of it thank you okay anything else Wy no thank you Bob thank you Brad any any questions on this project Brad you might may be unmute if you're yeah you're you're on mute Brad if you have a you have a [Music] thanks thank you Mr chair no Mary and I were the only two current members that were on the commission at the time of this uh original application and approval and I do remember uh giving granting the waiver for them to keep that in um in place uh throughout the winter um but I I Echo Mary's comment about uh the five years and if this was 2021 um when we first approve it and you now have funding through for the applicant now has funding through 2027 then um it kind of concerns me that uh this isn't quite the temporary that we we had talked about I I I Echo the other members comments that this is this is good research but it seems like uh it's been a moving Target with this and that's not the original intent of the of the uh um the negative determination request so um I I also question whether or not this should be a uh noi just from a procedural perspective okay thank you Brad Brad anything else I'm sorry I didn't mean to cut you on no I'm good thank you Mr chair okay thank you Brad Mick any questions on this matter just uh I'm assuming but uh to confirm the construction of the supports for these ladder extensions uh are they be you know similar or identical to the supports for the current walkway yeah they they'll be almost identical okay that's all I have Mr chair okay thank you McAn any any questions on this matter no I think my camera is messing up but I can hear everything even if I'm not moving around we can hear you just fine Diane okay okay and the only question I have team is is that I I where this is a modification even it's slight uh in its on toown property Town Council has recommended uh that the applicant come back before the select board uh for their approval on this minor uh modification so where it is town-owned property it would seem that would be the appropriate step before we would entertain a motion on this finding can we make it uh contingent on I think so yeah Mary we could approve contingent on them getting approval from the okay the um select okay okay uh I'll entertain a motion to issue a negative determination finding for salt the salt msh along the paret river map 16-7 fil 26a subject to select Bo approval of the modification second okay uh roll call vote all in favor Mary yes Woody yes Brad no Mick yes Diane yes and Bob Conor's votes yes so team I I think you get the sentiment of of the commission that this is probably if it goes beyond this three-year period you're going to have to think of this as a more permanent project and come back with a likely an noi just is understood thank you very much great okay thank you than you thank you very much okay next matter of business is the request for determination uh our file number 438 Mass division of fisheries and wildlife habitat management for rare and declining species pent Island John can you provide an overview and a recommendation on this matter John you're you're on mute Sean if you're yeah so there this is uh they want to do some um invasive species removal but this this land is on Wetlands um it's outstanding resource water and priority habitat their their map is is General it's broad it doesn't describe exactly locations where that is happening and since it is over aund something Acres uh it would be nice if they had a little more detail on it okay is there anyone from the applicant here that can make a presentation and answer question okay apparently we don't have anyone uh from uh MDF okay why don't we open this up to questions uh Mary I think Sean has raised a a good point on the side yeah this thanks Sean and that was my point too I don't know where this work is occurring um and you know really it's it should qualif it should be filed as a um ecological restoration notice of in probably um not not an RDA especially when we don't know where the work is occurring so we can't really approve it also we need if it's in a rare species habitat we need something from natural heritage I know that you know division uh fishies and Wildlife is has natural heritage within it so just we need some correspondence saying that the work is consistent with the Eng janger Species Act as well which I'm sure it is um and they've coordinated on that but we would need that information so I just think that we need a little bit more um detail on where this is happening and what exactly what methods of treatment they're proposing okay thank you Mary I'll Circle back to once we go through all the the members what do you what are your thoughts on this matter I agree with uh some of the points Mary just had and I also is this all state property that was proposed and this is all state property okay and then basically where's the what's work where's the work and I agree with Mary on that but so um we need more information okay thank you Woody Brad any any questions on this matter yeah more comment Mr chair uh with all the issues raised by the other members uh and the fact that the applicant is not here has not taken the time to uh present this uh this project to us uh uh I think from that perspective uh we should not even vote on this or vote no okay thank you Brad Mick your your thoughts and comments on I I share Brad's comments it really needs to be presented by the go of doing the project it's uh not you know we can't make a decision on that without that information thank you Mick Diane what are your thoughts then nothing new that anyone else hasn't already said okay so my thought is the the share scope uh of this project would seem to require an n and the the lack of information the scope and we would require anyone else with a 100 Acre restoration to come back with an noi uh so I would entertain a motion for positive determination on this matter can I make an alternative suggestion and yeah certainly Mary just to consider that we uh continue this because we don't have the applicant here and in the interim that Sean is communicates with them that it's that you know in that the board is leaning towards a notice of intent and that they may they they can provide he can provide them an opportunity to withdraw or show up at the next meeting and explain why they a notice of anent is not needed okay all right so what's what's the pleasure of the board Mr chair I I I uh think that uh this shows a total lack of disrespect um by the applicant of not even providing um uh explanation or is taken up our time to give them a continuance I think is uh plating to their uh Superior Authority the way they feel uh and and I'm and I'm I'm putting there my words in there uh so I I I would say either an A positive determination or out andout rejection well I think it's either going to be one of the it's either we make a finding or or we continue it I I always lean towards the traffic guards where that some well-intentioned person who may want to participate is still stuck in traffic somewhere but okay Brad I we hear you loud and clear Mick what is your thought on uh no further thoughts I think uh yeah I have nothing at this time you so so I I guess the the question before is Diane any any further thoughts from you on well I mean I know we've considered projects like this before and people have presented and shown us where they're going to do and what they're going to do and um you know there's more detailed maps and everything um so if we're going to make it decision based only on what we have in front of us I'd say find there to be a positive determination at this point or give them another week to show up I don't you know I'm not ready to vote negative by any means yeah no I I I don't think I would entertain a a motion for a negative determination tonight you know what I I would lean towards uh let's table this matter give them an opportunity to gather the thoughts and come back in uh it's going to be the same amount of a Time whether we find it positive or we give them a time to regroup and and come back and make a presentation but that's my thought I'll entertain a motion whatever whatever the board wants to do and Whatever Gets A second we can vote on and make a motion to make a positive determination Mr chair thank you Bren is there a second okay all right roll call vote uh all those in favor uh issuing a positive determination uh Mary uh yes I'll go along with that okay Woody yes Brad hi Mick hi Diane yes okay and Bob Conor vote Yes all right uh next matter continued determination of applicability our file number 436 for Johnson Lane for work on a septic system John can you give us a an overview and a recommendation yeah so we had a a site visit last Tuesday uh the site looked good um there was uh some need for some conditions other than that the the site that they're working on is is um far enough from the buffer zone plus it's split off by a a rock wall there um they are going to remove some trees or two trees for access to the the septic so okay this had border of Health approval as I recall I think we would we tabled at the last meeting to afford a site visit to the members okay all right questions from the members Mary any questions on this map um yeah I'm sorry I didn't get to make make it to the site visit but I did go by on my own on Sunday met with the uh property owner so I was able to see the site and um again this I think came in during the transition period possibly between Shawn and Samantha but I would say in general that septic systems should be notice of intense and not rdas due to the amount of equipment and soil disturbance that's um that happens especially where equipment has to drive pretty close to um the Wetland to get access to the the um the repair site um and the Wetland delineation is based on mass JS and it it wasn't entirely accurate I had a question as to whether or not it might even come over the stone wall right there but I didn't have an augur to to look at the soil there so with all that said I am U with the exception of requiring erosion controls um on along that wall and around the corner you know that to provide some um sediment control that the wall provide some but at least that will keep um you know keep some of the muck from going towards the Wetland there I would think that that we could approve it um as is with the with the erosion control barrier installed so you know we've done in the past Mar we've actually had as a condition some symbolic fencing to delineate where equipment can't go and where they can work in the erosion control and I think this may be an appropriate application for this matter sure okay anything else mayor that's all thank you okay what any any questions or M suggestions on this m I agree with what's just been said and um I have no other questions thank thank you wiy Brad any any questions on this matter yeah um thank you Mr chair uh Mick and I were out there for the site visit went through it with the engineer uh his Total Station had broken down the day before and that's why he wasn't able to delineate the wetlands we were out there after uh it had rained for three days straight um but the the site was relatively dry where they were going to uh put this in I agree with Mary with the erosion control and you Mr chair with the with the delineation of work uh and and to Sean's comment about the two trees need to be removed I would put a condition on there that those two trees are uh replanted with new trees okay thank you Brad Mick any comments on this one uh yeah I think uh couple of things we had talked in kind of building off a Mary's point and we had talked with the engineer at the time about extending I guess if you're facing the back of the property facing the stone wall of wrapping their erosion control up along the stone wall uh to create kind of a pooling area in case there was Heavy siltation uh so that was one thing that the engineer had agreed to at the time yeah they're they're looking at pulling out or cutting down two red Maples uh you know replace them with like species and one of the thing I don't know if Sean if we had discussed this I think we had they were going to delineate they were going to bring in uh you know Crush stone or or rrap fill to facilitate the the vehicles or the you know the excavation equipment coming in so um I think if he was going to the engineer was going to delineate that on a plan so I think we should condition that as well that we know where that additional whether it's Crush stone or whatever it is is going to be brought in and then condition that it's brought out as well after the project okay thank you m Diane comments or questions on this project no I'll defer to Matt I mean excuse me Brad and Mick I wasn't able to go to the site visit okay I who is is the applicants Alec are you on this one yes I'm right here Alec what are you can you pull up your plan yeah  I just had it all organized one second I don't know why it's not here now that's dunable wrong town there we are can you see that yes okay all righty so Yep this is the uh the Roa control essentially was going to be on the edge of lawn this is zigzag line so we but no no vehicles will be going into the wooded area but if you the construction entrance we could certainly put a construction entrance on there it would just be your standard you know 20 foot x 10 foot construction entrance and that' be coming up in the roadway this way this is uh Johnson Lane right here okay Mary what specifically would you like to have included on this plant for erosion can you slide the um plant let me just minimize okay now I can see um and can you just highlight again for me where the erosion control is uh this brown the uh EC the zigzag line there okay the zigzags the edge of wond erosion controls the EC the brown got it so the equipment is going to go where will it pass through it would be passing through here this erosion control obviously would shown here this is the AIS for the construction got it and it's really it's kind of already set up there you're not gonna because this is all edge of lawn that kind of brings you all the way to the road so not like they're gonna drive through the woods and drive up yeah no I wouldn't okay yeah that makes sense to me okay and actually the erosion control would would be the the footprint to where construction would stop any correct y right to the grve lims okay all right let me go back through uh Mick any you have a plan in front of you any questions for Alec no Alec and you and I discussed this where we had all discussed it and it looks like you've already added that additional kind of tail the erosion control uh to wrap up along the stone wall so I think that's that's an important part and uh so it looks good me from here any any other questions from the members no okay uh Sean are there any raised hands from the public at this time for this project no not that I see okay so Tim I think the plan M are you are you satisfied that the plan uh contains the the proper erosion control I'm satisfied that yes that looks good I just couldn't pick that out on the plan very easily okay all right I'll entertain a motion to issue a negative determination by in for po Johnson l so moved can we modify that to add some special conditions sure sure um that there be uh replacement of the two maple trees in kind somewhere on the property a minimum of what five foot tall six foot tall trees something like that um and that there be a stone apron at the street to minimize tracking of mud out off the property okay right any anything else that's all okay so uh why don't we do this again uh I'll entertain a motion to issue a negative determination with the findings as mentioned by V we moved Okay we okay all right roll call vote all in favor Mary yes Woody yes Brad hi Mick hi Diane yes and Bob Conor thank you great thank you guys okay uh next matter public hearing uh D file number uh has this was unassigned Sean has that changed since uh I looked this afternoon but I haven't seen I checked around five after 5 5 30 but it still did not see a number okay so this is for 18 Temple Boulevard West for addition of a deck elevated walk to dwelling rep Reclamation expansion existing parking area uh as we don't have a file number we don't have any technical comments I deem the submitt incomplete at this time and I would ask if the applicant wants to seek a exension a continue uh Mr chairman um first I I was in touch with the EP today and while they cleared the check uh they are unable to find the filing I have the certified receipt they they received it on the sixth so um what I would ask is that I because I understand at least one neighbors sent in an email and if any neighbors have attended um that I just give a very quick overview of the of the filing if the commission wants to set up a site visit we just scheduled that I won't even bother responding to to neighbors unless you want me to and then we just uh continue to the next meeting but at least give neighbors the opportunity to have their voices heard and have the commission at least have understand a basic idea of what we're proposing and I understand you'll have no technical feedback uh tonight yeah meantime typically we don't entertain questions from the members if the file has been deemed incomp complete uh I I do agree with you we could schedule a site inspection for this uh tonight uh and that would be that would be my recommendation and it it's going to be continued regardless so uh I would suggest you seek a continuance to our next meeting see if we can schedule a site inspection prior to that uh and then afford everyone an opport Unity at the same time for feedback and we will have whatever technical comments okay no I just I I understand it's just that we you know we we sent it in on time and we and we notified abutters and those abutters you know don't have anything to do with the fact that we notified them and I just thought it it was just out of fairness to them if I pulled up the plans and they got their opportunity to have their say but if we want to continue to the next meeting and if the commission just wants to set up a site visit we can certainly do that okay well team let me continue with questions Mary setting up the site site inspection certainly makes sense on this project yes I would agree that would be helpful okay uh Woody site visit work for you yes site visit and continuance y okay Brad deam what about you uh Mr chair I would suggest that we let the conservation agent uh do his due diligence with the site visit and uh and uh bring his recommendations back to the commission okay BR Mick your thought yeah I would entertain a site visit and uh not entertain comments at this time until we have a a complete file thank you mck Diane what do you thought something yeah in agreement it wasn't even on the D screen so so team go ahead Mary I'm sorry just I just have to say one more time and I know Bob you and I disagree on this point but the commission's obligation is to hold a public hearing within 21 days the receipt of a filing failure of D to issue a file number does not mean that the file is incomplete um we can't close the hearing until we get a file number but we can certainly open it so how we proceed is up to the board I just wanted to let you know that you know it's it's my feeling that if if the applicant has done done everything they can to to provide the information in a timely way and met all their burdens to meet deadlines for submission to us two weeks prior um that they should have an opportunity to be heard if they wish to be heard no I Mary I I I don't disagree with you that if Tom wants to make a presentation tonight he certainly can but I'm not going to entertain any questions from the members which is the feedback you very SE seeking because it's an incomplete file we don't have technical comments we don't have a file number we cannot take final action on this matter can't take final action correct right so it's going to be continued regardless so so team we typically schedule site visits the Tuesday after a meeting so that would be March 206 at 8:30 I'm available Mr chairman I'm unfortunately I'm in Washington that week um is there another potential day either later this week or early the following week uh yeah I mean I think let's say Thursday the 21st how does that work everybody is that are you available Tom um I have a d site visit in the morning but I could do something in the afternoon okay why are we doing a site visit on this one already I'm just was there anything in particular that we're looking at that wasn't already in the submission my just my understanding is you guys have been uh favoring more site visits lately and rather than have further delay opening the hearing at the next meeting I was suggesting that if if the commission was going to be inclined to do a visit that at least if we could schedule that um I tend to agree with Mary that you know the hearing should be opened if you guys don't want to give feedback that's fine but it was more so neighbors could at least air any thoughts they had because they've all been notified and now they all have to log in again in two weeks um that was my point of of opening the hearing tonight um but it was really also so we don't open the hearing at the next meeting we have done everything we sent it on time and uh through no fault of our own D can't find it um you know I have a certified receipt they cashed our check but um but regardless it comes down to one matter Tom we we we can't give you final action tonight no I I absolutely I'm not asking for final ma action and and it was a matter of just getting the process started and uh and you know getting the hearing open giving people a chance to to be heard and then and then Moving on but I understand the chair and the the majority the matter being discussed is the date of a site visit that would be right so so the 21st the 21st in the afternoon would work for me okay how does that Sean does that work for you yes that works for me the afternoon okay does that work for you Mary uh it doesn't work for me but I'm happy to swing by and take a look at it with the plan in hand um I don't think I mean I'm familiar with the site y so okay well why don't we set it up for the 21st at what time one o'clock Tom um it's a it's a big 40b site I have a site walk with d in the morning on so I would maybe a little later we could do two or three okay let's make it 3:00 on Thursday for a site visit uh at 19 Temple Boulevard West uh 18 excuse me 18 18 Temple buev but my dyslexia is kicking in at this hour and and for those of you who aren't familiar with that end of the island you have to approach it from Sunset you can't get it get to it from uh Southern and forum okay at CH you're requesting a continuance of the public hearing to our April 2nd yes yes Mr chair okay uh I'll entertain a motion to continue this public hearing to April 2nd at the applicant's request so move second okay all those in favor say I Mary yes Woody yes TJ excuse me Brad hi Mick hi Diane yes and Bob Connor's votes yes thank you all right next matter next matter is a continued public hearing on D file number 0501 14216 marshm Lane who work to construct a two family dwelling with a septic system and utilities Sean can you provide an overview and a recommendation on this you're on the mute yeah so we had a site visit for this site um it is a it was an expired noi uh they wanted to reopen it up they missed a deadline I did notice that while my time at the site the erosion control was settling in and has pretty much become level with the ground and I would recommend some more sediment controls uh maybe even erosion control okay other than that the site was dry and they had the wet the wetlands you could see further in the back but the site itself was dry even with the heavy rains that we've had okay I see Bob Grasso Bob can you pull up your plan and for the record my name is Bob Grasso from engineering Land Services and I'll pull up the plan see we go can you see that not yet no okay share screen Let's see we got see sh [Music] screen not seeing it oh here we go should come up any how's that no you see that no you see you you can't see me we see you you not the plan okay I was trying I'm trying to share the screen here see share screen still nothing does Sean need to allow you to share your screen nothing I I have not had to do that in the past okay Sean let me ask you Sean do you have a copy of the plan can you pull that up see your screen but I think the point is we we'll go over what erosion control is on your plan Bob and it sounds like it might need to be refreshed yeah there was uh on the Northeast section towards the um Flags 21A through probably 16a it did it has flattened out a little bit and um when the the agent had talked to the owner Ryan Kelly he had stated that he was in agreement that he would add additional erosion control to make it up to date can you see screen yes see that can you just expand it a little bit zoom in a little bit try okay Bob you can see the screen yeah um yeah just to the right of the building uh where the raing was right there that was about the only spot that needed to be beefed up again uh what happened there sorry about that okay um and all the members saw that the site was uh previously under the old noi was um the trees has been cleared um there's some grading we've been prying up the ledge just to see uh to adjust the uh the dwelling conditions for the the bottom of the cell floor the height of the first floor uh that's all been adjusted with the architect uh I've laid out the the existing DW the proposed dwelling at least three times we've made adjustments three times to exactly where the stakes were at the S sidewalk and as as is shown on the plan right now those were the stakes that uh Stakes of the corners of the of the building and the entrance has been cut in it does drop down so there' be no sediment coming out onto the existing uh Shar common driveway out there uh once we get started that will be filled all filled in with a stone uh stabilization entrance uh once the vehicles go in and out there's no there's no machines on the site right now um we're just waiting for the noi to be issued uh and then wait for the appeal period to uh exp you know to go through the appeal period to stock construction so why IOP why don't I stop you there Bob and open this up to questions sure only because this is a fairly familiar project to yeah well there's new members that's why Mary any questions for Bob on this one uh not really no I'm not thrilled with the amount of pavement that's proposed here um and I don't know exactly it looks like there's not any storm water management for it I know you're not you don't trigger DP Water Management standards but do you have um infiltration trench along the the Ed Edge of it is that what I'm seeing yeah that's that orange line be um there's actually details on the left side of water quality grass sale they are shown in a detail on the left side of the U front entrance I'm not seeing where that is uh right along the edge of the pavement um um there's a orange line heavy heavy okay yes yes yes okay thank you see all that sheet FL would go towards that s okay thank you that's all I have Bob thank youy uh Woody any any questions for Bob on this project no I don't have any questions or comments thank you okay thank you Woody Brad how about you any any comments or questions yeah no Mr chair uh Mick and I were out at this site visit walk through with Bob uh and the owner uh the owner's rep and went through this and other than what Shan had brought up uh about beefing up the uh erosion control I think the this is this is fine with me okay thank you uh Mick any any questions or comments no uh just follow up with Brad now that we were there after a heavy you know a couple of days of heavy rain and didn't see any evidence of siltation or or transport offsite or down into the towards the wetlands um and it's kind of surprisingly well- drained for a glacial till situation but it's you know it's uh I think just make sure that they have the proper citation or build up what they have I think Sean and uh we had talked about with you Bob about uh maybe piggybacking some of the some of the silt socks that you have there to kind of build up a little bit higher barrier for your times when you're doing doing major construction yeah that was in agreement with the owner also have to say yes yeah okay Mick anything else no that's it thank you Mick Diane any any comments or questions on this matter no thank you Brad and Mick again for attending that okay so uh I don't have any questions but one observation typically what is our procedure for preconstruction where the conservation agent goes out usually as a preconstruction meeting and we could make sure that that erosion control was was restored prior to construction and that can happen during the during the appeal period too yeah yeah well certainly prior to the work any additional work they performed I think correct don't need to wait for the appeal period to expire right I believe that's a stand Ed condition that there be a pre preconstruction meeting if it's not um Sean can you please make sure that it's in there for this order and that they that the erosion controls are effective at the time of the preconstruction meeting so they'll have to if they're not effective now they'll have to be upgraded okay okay any other questions from the members before I seek a comments from the public no okay thank you Sean any raised hands from the public at this time no all right uh do any members have a request for additional information or plan Amendment or adding additional content uh to this notice no okay I'll entertain a motion to close this public hearing so moved second okay roll call vote all in favor Mary yes Woody yes Brad hi Mick hi Diane yes and Bob Connor's vote Yes all right team uh we closed the public hearing I we're at this point to Sean we have a running standard the conditions uh that we attach to order all all our existing order or proposed order at conditions um make sure if you have any questions on it reach out to Mary or me we just make sure that the it's more of a duplicate be previous order um so Mary for special conditions you just wanted to I think it's our regular order regular conditions cover everything we've talked about I think they do yes so do we feel there's the need for any special conditions Beyond normal unless there were some already in the original order which could be repeated okay um I think that the standard conditions should apply I I know that the way our special conditions work you check the ones that are applicable to particular sit so some of them that have to do with operation and maintenance plans of structural storm water management or something you know wouldn't apply so I would just reference the original order and and have that be um similar and and maybe one of us can take a look at it like you said Bob before um it gets issued okay thank you Mary all right uh I'll entertain a motion to issue an order conditions for six marshmallow Lane with the usual condition so moved we have a second second okay roll call vote all in favor Mary yes Woody yes Brad hi Mick hi Diane yes and Bob coner vote yes thank you guys thank you for your time thank you guys thank you very much good luck thank you okay we have a continued public hearing G file number 0501 1422 94 Northern Boulevard but were to construct landscaping hardscaping and caving work Sean at the at the last uh meeting we had requested an updated plan uh from the applicant one that was stamped showing proposed and existing conditions um what is the status of that been any submittals on this or has it been a request for continuing hi yeah so the uh d information came back they requested that it needs plans photos of all projects site are not officient needs engineering site plan they received that so the applicant has put it a request for a continuance okay to our April second meeting is that the applicant's request or to the April 16th they just ask for continuing you're you're on mute CH they ask for a April 2nd continuance okay all right I'll entertain a motion to continue the public hearing to our April 2nd meeting at the request of the applicant so moved we have a second second okay all those in favor Mary yes Woody yes Brad I Mick I Diane yes and Bob Conor vot yes okay moving on continue public hearing D file number 0501 1409 18 forom way for after the fact approval of work to replace two sets of beach access stairs the beach management plan Sean I at our last meeting Tom was going to submit a beach management plan did did that get received I have had a chance to check the dropline you know what CH I I see Tom Hughes sitting here bigger than life uh Tom did you were you able to get in Beach management plan and where are you at with natural heritage those were the two outstanding matters um so just this evening I had uh was little two ships passing the night getting together with the client we reviewed um the issues that I had in my draft and actually I dropped about four pages from it down to a simple one pager because it seems like what they do year in and year out is actually really simple and the things that get more complex and and I can pull it up on screen it is a really simple Beach manip plan um and that is has gone to natural heritage this evening as it was submitted to you as well um but what I would like to do is go through it quickly with the commission because I can think I can describe it and then you guys can certainly read it and get more uh feedback to me but let me share screen thank you this is Pago by the way all right so this is my word version of it I sent a PDF to you guys um so basically um the the back ground here as we've talked about before is is the blue in has guests year round um you know it used to be a little bit more seasonal it's now year round they need to maintain beach access you know a clean Beach and uh and basically there are going to be times where things are unforeseen that need to need to happen and with that the initial discussions with the conservation agent to see you know do I need approval is it an RDA is it noi uh what have you but the general thing on the beach there's debris and rack that wash up regularly um in the past there was some mechanical removal of that material um but what has been the recent history um over the last several years has been hand removal you know raking of the material maybe a wheel bear or something but nothing nothing major on the beach just cleaning up rack cleaning up lobster traps and debris that washes up uh keeping the beach clean um if we have a major storm or or a significant amount of material washes up and it's necessary to do something more aggressive then go to the agent contact natural heritage and make sure everything's good uh before doing anything so I'm just trying to basically say what they do regularly and then set the guard rails for when they uh when they go to um the agent into natural heritage with the Dune it's first of all important to stress what we talked about earlier the Dune is really a revetment with a veneer of sand over it and um so this year it fared really well but there are some Winters where the winter storms wash the sand off it and they typically bring a skid steer up to the top of it and dump the sand over it um they don't uh normally have to drive down on the beach in that process and it's just sometimes a mini excavator but it's really just veneering the Dune so that's that's when we have an A Ive condition when we have a cretion um then initially Sanders removed from the stairs just to keep them passable and then if they get buried significantly um in the past they've they've dug them up and reset them um basically what we're saying in this case is if it reaches a point where they have to do mechanical work like that they would talk to the agent talk to natural heritage and determine what type of approval was necessary depending depending on what had to happen but the normal um you know operation there would be uh would be that they're just kind of kept passable and and free uh and that's really the sort of the ongoing Beach management is really related to just having it be safe access down to the beach um and a clean Beach and this is kind of how they how they manage it day in day out and then what I've tried to do is if it gets to things they're going to be a little bit more aggressive than uh make it clear you have to go to natural heritage you have to go to the conservation agent and obviously natural heritage would um really care on where it is in the time of year right if it's after April 1 then uh then they'll probably require shorebird monitor things like that but the um debris clean up happens year round it happens year round at you know at DCR over in Salsbury that's habitat um that's that's a pretty acceptable thing so I don't know how long it's going to take natural heritage to uh to get back to us um but what i' like to do is just answer any questions if there's anything you guys want to have in there I can actually it's in word now so I can actually type anything in and uh finalize this thing with any um with any feedback you're willing to give tonight with this uh this quick review or we can come back in two weeks and just get any feedback from the commission on what's written and if we have natural heritage by them we could finalize it then um if not we would just have to push one more meeting while we wait for their comments okay well thank you TR why I open this questions that from the members Mary questions for Tom on this beach management yeah I'm pretty sure that natural heritage will weigh in on this but what a couple quick thoughts one is um documentation of the grain size that contractor should provide um but to the agent prior to to any sand being brought to the site and then also um okay so I'm gonna Bo say uh well I don't want to Wordsmith it right now no no I'm just I'm just typing for myself um and the other is just the time of year restriction for um plovers I think you probably just want to put that in in your in the Dune section here that uh you just don't do any any this work doesn't occur during the it's April 15 to whenever the whenever they fledge yeah I think it's actually April 1 now but I've got the um I've got the natural heritage letter so I just wrote a note to myself I'm just going to cut and paste the whole list of conditions yeah that natural heritage had in there yeah and then other than that I I just need more time to look at this yeah understood y I will resend what I sent earlier this evening with this addressed tonight so you guys have it okay with any other change in any feedback uh that results from tonight okay Mary anything else that's all for now thanks okay thank you Mary Woody questions for Tom on this beach management no I don't have any questions or comments thanks thank you Woody Brad any any comments or questions on this straightforward Mr chair thank you okay thank you Brad Mick any questions no questions uh for me thank you Diane any questions or comments no thank you m okay I don't have any questions you know certainly Tom uh natural heritage whatever they however they Tinker with this we'll have to incorporate so right all right Sean are there any raised hands from the public I see my good friend Steve Mansion up there and Steve is following this uh Steve do you have any comments on this or is there anyone else that has uh wants to add a comment or to this matter Mr no questions for me at this time so thank you okay thank you Steve Sean any any other hand raised hands no there's no other raised hands okay uh the the applicant has requested a continuance of the public hearing to our April 2nd meeting that's am I correct Tom on that yeah I think natural heritage is often pretty quick on these um things that they already have rendered an opinion on so I'm hopeful I can get some feedback by then okay so uh I'll entertain a motion to continue the public hearing uh to April 2nd at the applicant's request so moved second okay roll call vote all in favor Mary yes Woody yes Brad hi Mick hi Diane yes and Bob Connor's votes yes thank you very much okay all right the the next matter is D file number 0501 386 333rd Street oh God here we go the work to install a driveway to provide on-site parking with Associated site work including work within the 33rd Street right way the commission closed the public hearing at the March 5th meeting the applicant has requested a variance from the local bylaw to exceed the 324 square foot uh 2 9 by8 spaces to 466 Square F feet citing a public safety concern backing on to uh 33rd Street without the requested approach apron as 33rd Street is the the primary Beach walking uh area access for this area so I'm just going to read our from our bylaw the town Wetlands bylaw allows the commission to issue variances from the bylaws requirement where one there are no reasonable conditions or Alternatives that will allow the project to proceed in compliance with this bylaw two mitigating measures uh proposed that will allow the project to be condition so as to contribute to the protection of the Wetland resource area located on the barrier Beach and three the variance is necessary to accommodate an overriding public interest or to avoid a decision that so restricts the use of the property uh as to constitute an unconditional taking uh the the variance request uh letter that was submitted by Hughes Environmental was sufficient to stop the commission uh and the relevant information on to each variance Factor uh first no alternatives to parking safely at the property other than the turnaround exists as the street indeed must be plowed in the winter and the town determined the property owners could no longer Park on 33rd Street second uh the noi does indeed show the French drain and raised edges of the to mitigate runoff and cars driving into the Doom uh and there was also a two to1 planting that was proposed uh to mitigate the disturbance of the uh driveway and third the public does have an interest in driving safely along the dense Northern Boulevard now the commission must decide whether the existing parking spaces without the extra turnaround space required uh backing out onto Northern Boulevard which in turn could pose a danger to Public Safety so that's the bylaw and and that's quick recap why don't I open this up to discussion and deliberation of the members Mary why don't I start with you thanks I I've gone back and forth on this one a bunch um I know it's it one of the things that I've come down to is that we're being asked to make a determination about Public Safety which is not our baywick and it would would have been nice of course I thought of this this afternoon not not at the last meeting but um to have some kind of uh feedback from the from the um Public Safety department in Newbury to determine whether or not backing out of this driveway would actually be a public safety issue um I don't feel like we're necessarily equipped to make that determination but if they determined that it was a public safety issue um then I would feel comfortable if there wasn't a reasonable alternative to the variants um so that's kind of where I'm landing right now okay Mary I I'm gonna Circle back obviously with everyone so uh Woody what's your thoughts and comments on this I don't have any thoughts and comments on this Bob I'm going tostain from voting okay thank you wiy Brad what is your feeling on this matter so so thank you Mr chair I'm I'm with Mary on going back and forth on this um I have a problem with saying that well here's here's my two issues one I believe the property owner deserves the right to be able to park on their property and from that perspective I agree uh but I don't necessarily agree with the fact that they're looking to um pave additional section or or use um some type of um pervious cover on 33rd Street so that they can back out of their driveway and basically turn around and drive out of 33rd Street if they have in fact been used in 33rd Street to park on for all these years which brings us to where we are today then obviously they've been backing out onto Northern Boulevard for a number of years because they clearly were not turning around on 33r Street uh I've walked up there I've been to that site I walked by that house every single day walking the dog um I I was I was very perplexed about this um only because of I don't believe uh it's right for us to provide a variance I I believe though that this uh home owner does deserve to be able to put two parking spaces at their home okay thank you Brad Mick what's your thoughts on this one uh kind of py backing off of mar and Brad uh yes I do agree they have the right uh for the bylaw to put in two parking spaces uh I think just and the as the variance is defined there is to approve it there is no other reasonable alternative and in Tom's last presentation at our last meeting he presented two different Alternatives uh so they're all Alternatives although not optimal they are alternatives so granting a variance just purely based on that I don't agree with granting a variance uh in addition really that you drive down Northern Boulevard and there are multiple multiple homes that have headend parking on Northern Boulevard to their properties they back out every day uh so it's not uncommon at all for people to have backout parking on Northern Boulevard so I guess to Second my position uh the justification that it's safety issue I I I'm just not uh I guess I I don't think that's a viable reason to Grant a variance so that's that's my that's those are my thoughts okay thank you m Diane what's your thought on this one okay I've given this one a lot of thought I think we all have in my concern isn't even so much the backing out onto Northern Boulevard but if you think about it when they're coming down that driveway say we've all seen the plan where they have their two spots they actually have to back out onto 33rd Street from those two parking spots and that's from my perspective where the problem lies almost because right now there's some you know it's sand there's some beach row pedestrians aren't going to necessarily know that there's cars that can be backing out of that area up at the top of 33rd Street so from that perspective I like the idea of having the turnaround because at least there is a little cut back there the street would look a little different it wouldn't just look like sand and it allows the drivers to see what they're backing out onto and it would also allow any pedestrian that's coming off the beach to know that there was a different delineation of that particular space and it's not a lot of space it's about what was it like 124 square feet extra and my driveway sort of the same I back out and then I I do my turnaround and then go head first down to Northern Boulevard but I'm on the other side of the street and I don't even like backing down and I think we said it was about 55 feet right um backing down out onto Northern Boulevard these people would have to go over two lanes of traffic not just one so they'd have to basically back out and then go toward Center town I imagine and I mean I looked at the different Alternatives and I don't think that the Alternatives help actually because you it's either a tandom situation where you're going to have two cars backing out so the other one can get in and out and I think it's going to kind of cause somewhat of a log Jam up the top of the street there and granted there's only two cars so I you know it's not going to be a huge Log Jam but I just think that having a safe access into the property to the two spots and then just being having a safe access out where they can just do a little turnaround no one's you know it's 124 square feet I didn't see that as being um that um I didn't really like the Alternatives I thought that you know they've done their mitigation in my view um they weren't going to be cutting back everything they everything was going to be pervie you know um what else did I have here I just think if we're going to give them the two spots we should give them a reasonable way to go in and out and again my concern wasn't so much backing onto Northern it's at the top of the street and backing down that street even it's kind of more of a beach walkway and if you're backing up and there's people walking up and and if anyone's been by that site a lot there's usually a car parked on the side of the house that's on Northern Boulevard so you know people backing down that are actually going to be usually my own view I guess be you know backing down the street that there's another car parked on that street um so I just thought you know I don't think it has that much of an effect on you know the Wetland area there and I just um think that they've done their mitigation and it just makes for a safer situation and where they're cutting into it's it's not really well anyways that's I guess I've had me say that's it I I would vote in favor of the variance all right so so team we're g to I'm going to approach this in in a two-step process that's what the applicant had requested the the the first request was a variance to exceed the 324 Square fet 2 9 by8 parking spaces to 200 excuse me to 466 Square ft uh citing the concerns that were raised by the applicant uh so what is our pleasure do we want to uh I'll entertain a motion to oh Mary go ahead sorry I just wanted to add um a couple more thoughts and one has to do with um well one is I don't have a lot of faith in people's backing ability and that they're you know eventually somebody's going to use a turnaround anyway um because that's likely what people are going to end up doing over time um but also I just wanted to point out that the this are the state rules that we're Al also operating under don't have this variance provision so it's just you know it's strictly the do and performance standards it's still a minimization they still allow you to provide access but the there's a little bit of a difference in um you know it's possible that we could come out come down differently on the state rules than we did in the under the local rules presumably DP approved this you know local bylaw at some point or another I think they did so they they must have signed off on that provision at some point or another so probably cover either way but I just wanted to point out that we're we are operating under two separate jurisdictions so that's all I want to say Okay okay so team I I think we should uh make a determination on whether we want to proceed and Grant variance uh and I'm going to reference the square footage because that's what it comes down to uh so I'll entertain a motion uh to approve the variance request uh exceeding the 324 square feet to 466 square feet so moved okay do we have a second I'll second it okay all those in favor uh Mary yes okay uh Woody judgingly Woody's abstaining oh Woody you're abstaining Brad no Mick no okay Diane yes okay and the the reality is we so we two to two two to two and three doesn't do it so I'm going to vote Yes but we don't have uh we needed four votes for that to carry no we needed majority of the eligible voters okay so we have six members here five voting okay so yeah I guess you need four yeah so the motion fails so let's undertake the uh this this the alternative which is the plan that was proposed for the 324 Square fet uh to 9 by8 parking spaces without the approach APR I'll entertain a motion to approve a order of conditions based on the buw so moved a second I'll second okay uh all those in favor say I Mary yes Woody I fig excuse me Brad I Mick hi Diane yes and Bob Connor's vot yes all right uh any special conditions I don't think we pretty clear cut any special conditions we want to consider thought the plan was pretty explicit yeah it was very detailed and I mean the overriding factor to me was the mitigation uh and the fact too that the the town ordered them off of that street because it was impeding foot traffic so but I think you brought up a valid point Mary that maybe had the appli secured some sort of notification from the police department on that uh it it might have done the trick but okay uh there question yeah go ahead I'm just before what's is one of the alternate plans been approved um I'm just want to be sure before I the meeting which which alternate plan is it just up to them to decide what square footage they use no Tom had presented the the two plans two yeah one shown the the approach uh and the other was just the two 9 by8 perpendicular to 33rd Street but I thought even that required a variance didn't it no uh no no that one didn't yeah because that's what they meant yeah the by the bylaw the bylaw allowed uh 324 square feet to P so they can just pick whichever alternative they want to no no approve the second one right okay the second one that's they they get two they get two parking spaces only Diane and they don't get the approach April no I know but there were two Alternatives that Tom had presented one had a tandem situation where there was one and two in Tandem and then he had another alternative that was Plan B that I believe had two right beside each other right at the road and then they were going to kind of jockey in and out but they were two side by sides rather than that's correct I think that was the 324 that's the 324 they're two side by side okay my understanding of what that was the alternate plan that they were seeking approval and variance failed thank you okay all right any other any other discussion on this all right this was a a long one okay uh now if I'm not mistaken is that that ends our agenda agenda for public just double check here yep that's it okay uh Administration section uh staff reports and updates uh Sam uh Sean excuse me any uh any questions anything you want to Jesus Sean and Sam I'm going to get that run for the near future um some updates working on some signs for the clovers with mass autobond uh and that that's pretty much all I got for you okay uh CSO release discussion Brad how we've had a lot of rain I can only imagine how many millions of gallons of of affluence we've uh we've gotten no progress no Pro no progress Mr chair it's a half we're at a half an inch of rain is what triggers the Cs csos now up in the upper part of the the only way the only way to control the only way to control these is to put a moratorium on building permits of every city in town that is emitting a CSO until they fix their problem no I I don't disag agree and I think that the sad part is our shellfish beds get closed with I think it's a half inch of rain or more and that's up up to a week uh if if I'm not mistaken okay why don't we go around for final comments Mary any any final comments or words of wisdom you want to add no good job Bob keeping us on task now it's just getting done here and 33rd Street you know what it it's it's a tough one that was a tough one it yeah I think the the intent of the bylaw was to get vehicles off the road uh yeah but but Pion is so unique with these 10 foot wide rways that it just it's it's a challenge okay thank you Mary Woody any any final words or any comments you want to offer just a good meeting and uh to go back to CS those it's unfortunate um with the rain last year only open six days the summer season so it's for the people who do so other than that no it was a good meaning thank you okay thank you witty Brad any any final thoughts thank you Mr chair okay thank you Brad mick how about yourself any any final thoughts uh yeah no uh as far as the site walks uh that we went on uh last week Sean great to meet you on site uh it was good to get Sean's perspective I think he's going to be a great addition to uh this commission and to the town so uh really liked his attention to detail and and also his rapport with with with the client so I thought that was great Sean and thank you for uh you know for joining us uh both on the on the S sidewalks and uh for the Commission in general so uh looking forward to working more with you and uh yeah the 33 uh 33 33rd Street was a tough one GL we were able to get through it um and I'll just leave it at that but thank you thank you for keeping us on task as as was said Bob well you know what it it was two Alternatives and we addressed them so okay thank you thank you m Diane Dian there has to be some wisdom you want to offer to this group of NOP six people motion to adjourn Mr chair we have second oh hi Mary Woody good night everyone Merry Christmas