good evening my name is sha young opening the April 16th sorry April 16th 2024 open meeting I am the conservation agent for the town of Newberry Conservation Commission please let me confirm that all members are present and can hear me conservation members when I call your name please respond in the affirmative Bob Connors yes Brad Duffin yes Diane O'Brien yes Mary Rimer coming later Nick Brown no Mick Mick uh Mick is here but he might be on mute uh just double check okay um DJ Cony DJ texted that he he's calling in okay and Woody Knight yes check uh check check the waiting room again Sean just to make sure Mick might have get kicked out yeah here back in I'm not sure yep no there he is can you hear me hi Mick are you there yep okay Mick are you on your iPhone you're on mute if you are I just had to switch uh computer screens oh okay so sorry about that no thank you Mick okay so good evening so so Sean we have everyone but TJ and Mary at this point for your roll call TJ could be the iPhone you said he was going to call in well maybe well we have a quorum so we'll just we'll go get going and TJ will certainly chime in when when the time is appropriate good evening this April 16th 2024 open meeting of the Newberry Conservation Commission is being conducted remotely consistent with the ACT Rel to the extent extending certain covid-19 measures adopted during the state of emergency which extends the governor's March 12 2020 order sus suspending certain provisions of the open meeting law go 30A 20 until March 31st 2025 this order suspends the requirement of the open meeting law to have all meetings in a publicly accessible physical location and allow allows public bodies to meet entirely remotely so long as reasonable Public Access is afforded so that the public can follow along with the deliberations of the meeting please note that with this that this meeting is being recorded and that attendees are participating by video and or telephone conference and the recording will be available on the Newberry YouTube access Channel meeting materials were provided to the commission members prior to the meeting for review before we turn to the first item on the agenda permit me to cover some ground rules for Effective or clear condu conduct of our business and ensure accurate meeting minutes the chair will introduce each speaker on the agenda proponents will be given time after they conclude their remarks we will go down the list of commission members inviting each by name to provide any comment question or motion please hold until your name is called okay okay thank you Sean all right uh upcoming meeting dates May 7th and May 21st first matter before the commission is meeting Minutes review we have uh the March 19th meeting minutes when we take a moment review those see if there's any questions comments Corrections Mo motion to approve Mr chair okay do we have a second second second okay uh all those in favor roll call vote Woody yes Brad hi Mick hi Diane yes and Bob Connor's vot yes okay the next meeting minutes for review is our April 2nd meeting okay are there any questions or concerns or Corrections hearing none is there a motion to approve the meeting minutes for April 2nd so moved we have okay roll call vote all in favor Woody yes Brad I Mick Diane yes and Bob Connor's both CH TJ good evening we just went through the meeting minutes and we're going to be going on to our first RDA okay request for a determination of applicability uh our file number 4403 Gerard Way repairing existing Deck with footings adding an emergency eress staircase does the applicant is the applicant present and do they have uh would they like to make a presentation they should be present or they told me they were going to be present okay is there anyone from the Mahoney family that is present if you are you may be on mute hi oh okay he there you go you're on the guys yeah all right hi I'm Bob Connor I'm chair of the commission and we're reviewing your RDA request you want to give us an overview of what you're looking to do you're talking about the address at three Gard Street yes okay great yeah what what what I'm going to do there is basically remove the existing deck hold on let me let me uh put put it on the uh one second since you're on an iPhone I can share my screen oh [Music] boy well what why don't you why don't you make your presentation and then while Sean is pulling up the file to share it for the rest of us we can hear what you're looking to do yeah basically I'm removing the existing deck and just building a new deck the same layout uh using Composite Materials um we I I put like a a photos and presentation together so you guys can see what's there right now and what's proposed um we're going to we're not going to be digging the ground we're going to do like a helicop pi which is going to be mechanically uh install in order to avoid um disturbance on the for the for the ground okay question what what's the elevation of the deck above grade uh there is now is around it's about like six feet right there so he's putting yeah right there okay so that's the existing deck right there and then I think he's going to show more information yeah that's all the pictures but that's how the phoning information so how it's going to goow down let just like framing so there you have all the information for the deck okay so just to do a recap you're replacing existing uh deck you're not expanding the footprint you're keeping it at the same elevation uh and you're going to what currently do you have for piles is it Sona tube concrete or what what is supporting the deck now right now they have a combination of Stoner tube and some concrete okay are you planning on removing that after you put your helicop piles in and no unless you guys tell me to I'm not planning on starting the ground at all okay all right why on a hold there question from the members uh TJ any questions on this RDA um only going to the the point of the um concrete and the and the Sona tubes is isn't it better to remove them then just leave them are you asking me yeah TJ typically we would ask the applicant if they weren't reusing them to to remove them to remove them and be no harm no file doing that but let me ask you guys something the whole point about the helicop was not to disturb the ground right now I'm digging all the the foood to remove the existing concrete yeah the the PE are are so doesn't float away yeah t typically concrete wouldn't be wouldn't be applicable uh in wouldn't be allowed today and and traditionally it's been removed uh and ilal pile would be the preferred method diamond yeah but that would be the tip to remove it not just leave it okay that's it okay all right thank you TJ Woody any questions uh for the applicant no the my only question was the if the so tubes have being removed so that okay yeah yes okay Brad any questions for the applicant on this matter I'm good Mr chair thank you okay mick how about yourself any questions uh no questions Mr chair thank you okay and Diane any questions um you mentioned this this when I was reading there's gonna be a concrete slab at the bottom of the stairs is that new or is that there now are you replacing one that's a new one how large is it 3 feet by two feet just to comply to code not muted anything else danan no okay uh so the the only thing is typically once you abandon using the Sona tubes they're they traditionally remove all right if you guys want me to remove I'll comply that no problem okay and other than that you're doing a exact swap you know for size uh the big thing what we always ask is use your current driveway for a staging area for materials um avoid putting anything on the you know the the vegetation in your on your lot okay and those are typically the the guidance and if you have any questions at all just contact uh John Young our conservation agent and he'll he'll help you walk you know work you through the process I will do that thank you okay any any other questions from anyone any any questions from the public any raised hand on this matter I have a question Bob go ahead then when when I'm reading this he's adding an an emergency eress staircase is that staircase not there now no that's the staircase is part of the deck so it's it is there right now oh okay so it's not yeah it's so so the stair just said adding a staircase and I I saw the plan and I saw there was a staircase I didn't know if there's another one or an emergency eress or something going in that I didn't that's the same as the back yeah it's being used as a second form of egress for the house okay fine okay so okay team any other questions no all right uh I'll is there a motion to issue a negative finding for three gared way Gad way or whatever the heck you pronounce that so mov okay roll call all in favor Woody yes TJ hi Brad hi Mick hi Diane yes and Bob Connor's votes yes thank you good luck thank you very much appreciate okay next matter of business is an RDA for our file number 441 17 Harvard way uh generator Super Center for installation of a whole home 18 KW generator uh with a automatic switch Sean can you provide us an overview on this one I think the applicant was here um you know let me go right to the applicant joh hi okay Mary hang on one second Mary we just were on the second RDA you generator for 17 Harvard way hi guys I'm just going to chime in this is Nick I come up as Matt cder but my name's Nick the project manager with generator super center and John's also here on the call with us who's my salesperson so we'll work in conjunction to hopefully answer any questions or help or surprise you do anything we can okay well why don't you why don't you describe what you what you're planning on doing uh is Sean on the application uh is there a plot plan or a sketch that shows where the proposed location is there is a plot plan with a square on it yeah could you post that put that up share that with the members so that's that's the proposed location okay do we have any pictures of this area I do they were taken from the public way okay oh he why don't you to scroll through those pictures John if you you could I think were um on the slope there this one is probably more descriptive yeah that in that open area there yeah that's a more accurate picture there I believe okay what is the what what what is the flood zone in this do we know so the ground height well yeah I'm just looking the ground height is is 10 is average it depends on where you are if you're on that slope it could be anywhere from 10 to higher um the flood zone is ae13 okay all right one depending on you where exactly where they put it it could change because that's as you can see it's a slope so okay so uh Nick what are you proposing for a platform to as a base for this generator install okay so um my first question is um you know after hearing the last one we're obviously opposed to sonot tubes which we would typically use correct correct yeah it's this is an issue with the concrete being in direct contact with the Earth uh it is a de it's a de manner that concrete Zer tubes are you know no no longer encourag to be used okay even if there was like a plastic lining or something yeah it's the concrete okay um so that being said so that's off the table so our second option is um like a diamond pair system which uses um John do you have yeah we're we're familiar we're familiar yeah so we we would drive the we would drive the stakes in and use the diamond pair platform as a a footing and then mount a twoot aluminum stand and then then the generator goes on top of that okay so there's a specialty stand we use that's specially designed for the generators it's rated and everything it's rated for wind loads and flooding and everything like that of course it's aluminum so it's it stands up and uh we would Mount we would use the diamond pair system for the feet and then it would be two feet above that then the generator would go on top hey what what's what is the what is the power source or the fuel source is it propane or diesel uh liquid propane John yes that's that's per perfect time for me to Jack so um this whole process started when we found a customer interested in the generator they had existing liquid propane tanks on site so the first thing we did was come to the town to make sure there was nothing um wrong with those existing propane tanks and then we presented the um the generator installation excuse me with the soner tubes and that's when we found that those were no longer Revival so Sean was very um helpful in providing us some input on some Alternatives which Nick just mentioned to you about the diamond Pier um so what a main accomplishment for me at least especially today is to find out what is acceptable so that we can then go back to the customer because the customer already U purchased our initial quote which included the two foot stand in the saer tubes which we made him aware that are no longer viable and we're just making sure that the alternative that we go go back to him with is viable and that we can proceed forward and give him a cost price for that okay so propane how do you plan to run from the tanks to the generator are you going to dig a transfera yes yes sir that's uh code requirement has to be minimum of 18 inches in depth um sand on both top and bottom um will we pull all the permits for that yes sir okay why don't I stop there and open this up to questions from the members Mary question yeah I don't see a plan other than just the assessor map with a square on it so I don't have any information on Dimensions or what is whether this is vegetated area what any detail on the platform or anything like that so I think we're um we're kind of missing some information on this um what which I could readily make available I was not aware that that was I'm looking through the application I noticed that you notified Butters which actually isn't required for RDA so you did that in in extra effort there but um yes we need a a plan of the property showing exactly where this is located uh it's height above grade the type of footings and whether or not there's impact to doing vegetation and if there is then how that's going to be mitigated we can give get you exact pitures uh we have a a um a mat that's a blueprint of what the generator is and I can get you the dimensions of of the stand um didn't realize that that was what was needed today so I apologize for not having that yeah and it's and then to address that I don't know about the vegetation I mean I I would have to give you that information by just where we're we're putting on placing the generator well well I just without that information I can't make a determination whether or not this should qualif ify for an RDA or should be a notice of intent so I guess there's missing information so I guess that that I'll pass it on to the next member but I'm not prepared to act tonight I'll I'll Circle back Mary too after with everyone TJ comments or questions uh for Nick no more than Mary just brought up no okay thank you TJ Woody any questions on this matter no same as TJ and married but otherwise no okay Brad questions uh I I'm also looking for more detail but thank you Mr chair okay thank you Mick questions yeah I agree with the rest of the uh that we just need more info and a detailed plan Diane questions ni yeah my note only had the just the relation to where the liquid propane tanks are going to be in relation to the gener erator so how long like the distance between okay so so Nick basically the feedback is this uh if correct me if I'm wrong you're proposing to use Diamond Piers as your base you're proposing a twoot aluminum uh base that meets manufacturer specifications correct and I guess the question is what vegetation is going to be displaced and what is the plan to mitigate that that's usually I don't think there would be much um disturbance to the vegetation with those Diamond pair systems I I mean there's not much vegetation in the area we plan on placing it um apologies for you guys have an insufficient amount of um stuff that was proposed to you um we'll we'll get that over to you but um the that you know you're talking about four legs that are um 3 in in to 4 in in diameter um sitting on a diamond pair system and it's just um you know I don't I'm not an expert on vegetation but there's some there's not much vegetation it's mostly sand in the area so there's you could probably place the four feet down and miss anything and just be in sand um so I think so I I think the point Snick that we're trying to convey is one having the location of the propane tank that you're going to be tying into existing it's with existing propane tanks are there up against the side of the house Nick let me finish my my question to you and and then you can respond the distance and pathway of the trench that you're proposing to the generator and then the actual specific location of the generator that that's typically the minimum we require to look at this as a a determination and but it does require a little bit of work the alternative is you you're going to wind up having a filing a complete notice of intent uh which is a little more of a complex process what typically would happen is youd have a a site plan it would locate the generate a proposed location it would locate existing propane tanks and and then it would show uh the pathway of the piping uh with the appropriate pitches if it's all sandy area but looking at this picture looks pretty pretty heavily vegetated from this picture we would have to consider what mitigation you would need to do it could simply be removing the gra grass the beach grass that's there now putting it aside replanting it after the fact uh but the the consensus of the board is more information is needed before we can take any further action of this understandable okay and thank you sir for for saying that in and again my apologies um I believed I did at the point in time when I initiated this because this was initiated by our we did BR bring this to the town's knowledge we did ask first uh if there was a problem with the existing protane tanks which we were told there was not uh so my apologies I if if if I understood that this information was a little more needed at this time than I would had that available so again um I'll make sure that that doesn't occur the second time yeah welcome welcome to a Barrier Island John it just yeah I've been I've been multiple times to the town to to ask so I'm not putting fingers anywhere I'm just looking for knowledge so that I have a customer that's very interested in wanting a generator so I want to make sure you know I meet his needs and also keep him informed so um I have no problem with putting a plot plan together with corresponding pictures with details of the specifications and size of the generator and so forth um does that sound correct in what you're looking for let me do this I'm going to circle back to Mary Mary I gave kind of a broad brush overview uh yes thank you um Bob and and I agree with everything you said you my only additional point would be that since this is in a flood zone you'll need to check to see whether or not it needs to be elevated above the flood zone in which case you need a topographic uh survey to determine what the ground elevation is at at the location that you want to put it so that you can make sure that you're you're above that and I also suggest when you do put a plan together that you run it by Sean and uh he has an opportunity to look at it and advise you as to whether or not the impacts are likely to be significant enough to Warrant filing a notice of intent so you don't we don't cause you to keep circling around and not getting not moving forward so if I can um re restate what you said basically put together what I believe is what you're asking for and run it by Sean before we go any further that would make sense before you before you you come back yeah might want to contact a surveyor or professional engineer to get that data okay okay any other questions for the the applicant on this TJ any any additional info you think we need nope I'll set thank you Woody how about yourself any additional info just uh because it was said but hasn't been said at the end where the ditches are going for the oh foror everything okay that's on Woody do you want me to put the picture back on no well no we we're good Sean at this point I'm just seeing if there's any further information that a member may require Woody any anything else no thank you Bob okay Brad how about yourself any any further information all good Mr chair thank you okay Mick any further information you deem nothing at this time no and all set thanks thank you mck Diane how about yourself no thank you okay and I have no question so guys work with Sean uh and basically you have an issue of you need to know your baselet elevation and then Pro the electrical code uh as I recall you you need to be two feet above baselight elevation so hence why it gets a little more complex when you're right here on a Barrier Island and a FL okay thank you all right thank you thank you for your time everybody thank you thank you okay next matter public hearing D file number 0501 1422 106 Street who work construct and raise single family dwelling onto pile supported foundation and other site improvements is the applicant present yeah I think good evening Mr chairman Matt steinau from Millennium engineering okay thank you Matt can you get going on your presentation Matt and absolutely thank you so um I if everybody can see the screen I just shared mine um this is an existing single family home uh constructed on uh number uh 106 Street and the applicant uh tonight would like to uh propose to demolish the existing single family home which is represented here on the left side of the screen and to construct a new single family home which is represented here on the right hand side uh Millennium engineering went out and conducted an onr survey to produce the plan that you have before you tonight and you can see the areas that are in green on the left hand side are the areas that are uh designated as vegetated areas on the site currently and there is a shaded pattern here you can see that's identified as the proposed vegetated impact area this is where the new structure will sit over the existing vegetation so that's you can see is identified here as 8 33 Square ft uh we tried to keep it in the general area of the existing home and over some of these areas that are not currently uh vegetated um we have some brick um perious brick pavers that are sitting on the ground here um and I'm going to switch screens here real quick just to give the commission a little bit better idea of what the site looks like if I can get the site photos up and everybody can see the new photos yes y so the structure here on the left um to the to the left of this white car is the structure that's in question so that's going to be the one that's coming out and you can see on the uh the side of the house here there's a little you standup shower there's some uh pavers in that area there underneath the shower there's a walkway here in front of the home um that's also prvious pavers and then as I kind of go around the structure you can see um you know a Sandy gravel driveway um we have a neighbor uh with a good relationship with us and and they're utilizing uh the same driveway to park against their property on the side um areas along the side of the property where there is you know sparse vegetation and some areas Sandy areas and you sporadic vegetation with a few shrubs and minor trees around but for the most part the site is vegetated and you know the back of the property looks a lot consistently like this with you know sporadic areas where there's some sand areas but mostly vegetated um and that's that's kind of what we show so this this area here you know is the area where my in my survey instrument is is that one sand area that's kind of to the back left as shown on the plan um and that's essentially the footprint is going to be encompassing that sand area there um and then you can see going down the side here there's again areas where there's sporadic sand and vegetation kind of mixed in it's all low growing ground vegetation um very few shrubs um with the exception of one over here near the uh the back uh paper Street that's on the property um as you come around to the side of the house there's Sandy areas here where the people have occupied and sat out and had their little fire pit and utilize this as yard area so there's some sand areas there that aren't vegetated and then as you come back and looking in the back of the property there is an existing um air conditioning slash heater um allinone system that's attached to the back of the building here um in the back of the property it's it's not obvious when you're out on site looking at it but we these utility poles they run down a paper street that runs along the back of our property so we we are not proposing to go anywhere near that there this is all going to remain untouched in the back and then you can see some additional shrubs and vegetation here along the property line as well and Beyond the uh the the ride of way um as I come back around this here this is looking down the front of the property towards the driveway um and you can see the stairs on the front and kind of a three-season porch here that's elevated where the rest of the structure is all the way down to the ground on a foundation um with a side entry I think that pretty much covers uh the photo so I'll go back to the plan and so that's that Sandy area I was talking about where my survey instrument is set up in here and then the side Sandy area is over in here uh where they have the fire pit is on this side over here um so we're proposing to remove the pervious pavers we're proposing to remove the structure in full foundation and the new structure will be placed in the same general location um but it'll be on piles um it'll be up in the air and you'll notice uh this is a little bit of an odd shaped building I I mention that to the the homeowner and to the architect involved uh because it appeared that they were looking to design this to keep it out of the flood zone and I informed them that they didn't necessarily need to do that it just needed to be above FL flood zone but they really felt strong they wanted to keep it out of the flood zone they wanted to have you know not a standard Square shaped building they wanted to have something a little more modern and unique and so they've specifically designed it to have this angle in it to keep it out of the flood zone but also to kind of give it a more modern look um but having said that the flood zone here is elevation ae13 and the uh this is a uh static flood zone not a wave action and we have the lowest horizontal support beams at elevation 17 .4 so even if we were to be in that flood zone we are significantly above the flood zone and and in compliance with any of those potential requirements if we had been in the flood zone um as part of this I've identified that we are proposing to impact approximately 833 square feet of Doom grass or or you know Beach Heather low low-lying ground cover and we've show that here in our table and then we have proposed American Doom grass mitigation 800 144 so it's essentially a 1: one um and those are the areas identified on the right hand side of the plan here that are in the darker green areas that totals up to 844 square feet so we put back everything that we've damaged a hair over that um and we are maintaining the existing driveway area for our current parking situation with us and the neighbors um and as you can see on sheet two I provided a profile of the home I've identified that the existing High Contour under the structure is currently 15.2 and the lowest horizontal structure is at 17.4 so we're 2.2 feet above the high contour and the majority of the structure is actually even further above the grade because the grade's kind of dropping away as it goes back towards the the rear of the property we provided details here for both installation of utilities new utilities although the intent is to connect to the existing utilities if when dur construction they're excavated uh found not to be damaged and of sufficient size they'll just extend them and tie them into the new building however we've given them appropriate details here if necessary to go back out to the road and make new connections that they're deemed not to be of substantial or sufficient size we have a detail here for orange construction barricade fencing on sheet one you'll notice that we do have a uh a CF line here construction fence line to go around the property um go around the the uh proposed building essentially and to keep heavy equipment and Personnel off of the the vegetation that's out there during construction making sure there's no um staging or placing of materials outside of the area to further impact the Doom grass I believe there's actually a node on here oh I don't have the node on here I usually do um well regard oh no I do down here uh we have a note here that says that staging shall occur in the driveway of any dumpsters and building materials and absolutely no staging or storage of material shall be permitted within any vegetated areas uh so it's very clear that the intent here is for all work to take place within that construction fencing barricade and within the and to be staged within the driveway that exists currently today um pretty pretty straightforward home replacement project um this was submitted to DP and we've received a d file number um there are no comments currently on their website um but other than that I'm happy to answer any questions that the commission has okay Matt if you could go back to the the site plan uh and zoom yeah right there zoom up on that so the uh Zone X in the AE what is what is the boundary in that I see the notation how far does Zone X go does that incapsulate most of the house no so yeah I'm sorry so the Zone X is the enti essentially the entire house the corner of the structure as it's laid out might strike that line just ever so slightly right there but essentially it was designed to run along the face of that building okay so the structure is proposed primarily in a Zone X oh correct okay all right why don't I hold there and open this up to questions from the members Mary questions for ad on this project um yes I I had a opportunity to swing by and take a look at this this afternoon so that that was helpful um I'm assuming the existing I think it's cinder block Foundation is being removed and the is there a basement that needs to be backfilled as well it's essentially a crawl space at grade um if I can go back to the photos it might be make it a little clearer um you can see on the back side of the structure get to that one there um so well it's a little hard to see but you can see there's Windows here there's a center block Foundation here and you know the the the distance from here to here would indicate that the floor of that inside Area there if it were below grade we're talking you know 12 to 24 inches it's sitting essentially at grade okay so so you probably will need some back fill of some sand so we would condition that to be compatible sand for any to to reestablish grade I would think that should be a standard condition even with a slab at grade because even with a slab you're removing footings and stuff so there there's going to be some depression that will need to be filled right just getting some getting some idea of how much would be needed there and then the other thing I noted was that the are some of the areas that are showing on your plant is unvegetated are actually vegetated or at least slightly um and so I think your your mitigation is a little a little under what's needed in this case and the front of the house actually has shrubs and your those are not shown and um there's some to to the right of the existing house near the stairs there's also some vegetation that's not shown so I I think that there there may need to be some beefing up of the mitigation that you're proposing in order to uh to fully accommodate yeah there's vegetation there's you know shrubs that obviously have to be removed there and then to the right of the house um near where the image you just showed and and in front by the fire pit there's vegetation there too it's not completely unvegetated so that would be my first comment is that I think that we need additional mitigation and the second is just that there's also um your construction fencing is going within areas that are presently vegetated according to your your plan so there will be a fair amount of temporary impact at least temporary impact um and no opportunity for any unvegetated areas around the back of the building for access or anything like that so that's why I'm I'm suggesting that your impacts vegetation impacts are significantly greater long term than what is shown here so I think that the mitigation needs to reflect that but other than that definitely yeah the uh the filing seem to be in my mind um pretty complete I like that you included the profile we have the foundation plan and above the flood zone um so tis ties a lot of the boxes that we like to see so Matt I think you know typically most most uh projects that are presented it's usually a one and a half to one on the mitigation and and part of that was is when we when you call for a certificate of compliance if you have a 70 or 80% success rate you're you've equaled the one to one the minimum requirement that you ow to have so Mary I think that's what you're hinting at is bump that up from it's almost one for one bump of the mitigation up to one and a half to one yes and also just um you know provide some there's got to be some access for around the building for the homeowner so I can't I don't think we can count mitigation around the entire building okay Mary I'll Circle back after we've heard other questions TJ questions on this matter from mat I'm good okay thank you TJ Woody questions from mat on this matter uh no questions Bob he's very informative thank you thank you Woody Brad questions well good Mr chair thank you okay Mick questions for Matt on this matter uh yeah no piggybacking on Mary which I commonly do um just like the only concern was the compensation for veget that's going to be disrupted or temporarily disrupted or destroyed uh during construction activity and some of these revegetation areas uh might be part of that and I think especially in the in the front uh I guess if you scroll down a little bit um this vegetation area to the or revation area to the right um excuse me to the left seems to be partially vegetated at this point so again question whether it's it's a one for one or um you know some of the areas that are proposed for revegetation are currently like partially vegetated so uh again just to kind of revisit that number of square footage and for vegetated area versus vegetated lost I guess yeah that is you know that's my concern and it kind of a more descriptive what is the area of like active construction and and what vegetation in the active construction area needs to be replaced okay any anything else Mick oh that's it thank you okay thank you Mick Diane question no Mick and Mary covered it thank you okay so Matt one I I I'm I I like having the construction fencing kind of keeps everybody uh out of trouble it looks like it's what about a 10t buffer around the the work area or an eight foot buffer as an offset yeah it's approximately a 10 foot buffer yeah okay so I think mix's question is there's going to be a disturbance in that area of some sort but we don't have a mitigation plan to restore that um Mary let me ask you a question we could condition uh if if the applicant considered increasing the mitigation s footage uh we could condition too that uh prior to the certificate of compliance the agent would do a site visit certainly and and determine whether any additional planting in the proposed construction area if it all recovered great but if it it didn't so just throwing that out there Mary I'm going to circle back to you uh for WRA follow-up comment yeah no I I I I agree with um with you and Mick that the temporary the everything inside the construction fence is likely to be altered and that should be you can put it in a lighter green or something and call it um temporary impact to be M mitigated but we should have we should have a good idea of what how much vegetation is out there now versus what we are going to be looking for following completion of constructions and and exactly where that's occurring so there's a way to to be able to say whether or not it was successful so um some of it can be conditioned but some of it can't and yeah so all that area is you can see there is some vegetation and so maybe you count a percentage of it or something creative but right now I just think we need more planting do you want like a a Matt please wait till you're recognized by the chair Mary what what I would suggest is it a site visit might be beneficial on this yeah like I said I've been out there and I looked at those areas so I I'm comfortable um I mean I don't me personally I don't feel a need to get back out there but other members might want to do that and I think that we need more information so uh probably a continuance would be in order okay Matt you want to ask Mary some questions specifically or what additional information you have any questions no I think I know specifically what what Mary's looking for I just wanted to point out that I recognize what what she is saying about um how some of the areas have a little bit more vegetation than maybe the plan shows specifically in this photo and this is why I wanted to bring it up is it's difficult for a survey crew to outline you know single sprig here single sprig there and so although we we show the bulk of the line going around the predominant vegetation and we don't pick up these little tiny spots um I'm also you know willing and I think the applicant is is willing to concede that there are plenty of areas throughout the entire site with this sporadic vegetation yeah that we can't identify on a plan in such small scale but a condition that you know some of this be vegetated that throughout the entire site um some of these areas get vegetated would far offset any of the Little differences in the areas that we are identifying yeah um so a condition of of you know maybe the entire site outside of all construction areas shall be vegetated um and we fill in all these areas with either Beach Heather or with doom grass or something like that it it's just very difficult to quantify when you're talking about spot spot uh spot areas with minimal vegetation whereas right next to it you have a highly vegetated area you know how do you how do you break out these little we have those routinely and you know Mr Hughes who you know well is is providing that on all of the plans that he submits so it we just need to make the math work and as long as you've got you know a a acceptable transact measure of impact and one and a half times that for mitigation then you'll you to be in good shape with that requirement so how you choose to to present that it will be up to you guys okay I'm G to C Mary anything else before I move on to the other members no okay thank you Mary TJ any any follow-up questions from M on this no I'm good okay Woody any follow-up questions no thank you Bob okay Brad any any questions for Matt no I think thank you Mr chair okay mick how about yourself any questions I am good at this time thank you Diane any questions no thank you okay I have none and I see one raised hand uh Steve hang on one second sha are there any other raised hands besides my friend Steve Mansion no just Steve okay Steve good evening thank you Mr chair this is uh Steve manin on 14th Street I've been admiring the pictures of the fire pit which is displayed under existing conditions I uh my question concerns the fire pit I um know that the fire department doesn't allow burning you know fires on Plum Island including fire pits and I don't know whether the Conservation Commission has anything to say about a fire pit uh but if it does I'm hoping it will be make clear in its uh conditions that a fire pit oh is not to be allowed on Plum Island and that's my comment and question thank you okay Steve yeah Steve we we operate under the premise of the local Wetland byw and the the WPA um that that's the extent of our our jurisdiction but but I hear what you're saying okay any other questions Matt any questions for the for the uh the commission not at this time I think I have a a good general idea of the feel of the commission what they're looking to see on here we'll go back and make some edits to the plan and we will uh resubmit and be prepared at the next meeting to provide you some additional detail about the vegetation which I think was the main focus of what the commission brought up yeah I I think it's it's the math more than anything else so excuse me yes I just wanted to make a comment I'm sorry I'm I'm not used to doing this um as an AB butter I know that they did a an extensive vegetation could you do me a favor just identify identify yourself in your address but just for the record thank you I'm at 12 6 Street and I'm Robin gersy but they did do an extensive um vegetation because there were little pink flags even on my property so I was wondering what became of that yeah I I I think that's a good question yeah somebody did a very extensive um uh look at what was growing in the area because I had pink flags on my property they were in the they were in the right way delineation is that the delineation no not recently but they were pink flags that were identified um vegetation on you know different areas yeah I'd have to um uh honestly I'd have to meet you out on site to see specifically what the pink flags you were talking about our survey crew when they're there they'll use the flags to identify iron rods or property markers things like that I I've had I've had my property surveyed I know exactly how it works but they were pink flags they're no longer exist but they were identifying all the the vegetation in the area around that incling along the side of the it's a pork chop lot so it's it's a very difficult shape of a lot and it was they were in my property as well and identifying all kinds of vegetation so I'm just curious as to what happened to that I don't I don't see it in in the photos that were presented I don't see anything that indicates any of that truthfully I don't know what these pink flags are my crew didn't hang any Flags you can see this the photos they took the day they were there and there were no Flags in any of them so I don't know if somebody else came by at a later date and did some other quam of delineation or review but it wasn't related to this okay well somebody did so somebody knows what's growing out there any any other questions M oh Mary has her hand raised no no I understand that I just want to finish with with the neighbor do you have any other questions on no no I'm just uh I just wanted to see the layout because it will affect me obviously how tall is this house going to be so on sheet two of the yep sheet two of the plan set we have an elevation here which shows that the uh existing mean average grade so the the grade the average grade not the high Contour is about 14 just about 14 and then the proposed structure up from that there is 33 1 in so it's about 4 feet lower than the the zoning maximum okay it's very pretty so that's the peek okay okay okay Mary I see questions Mary oh just to get Circle back to Steve mion's um earlier comment about the fire pit that fire pit is looks to be off the property so I would imagine it will be replaced it's it's you can see from the photos it's it's it's on the other lot yeah no that's it's on the property it's on the property you see the stairs here Mary yeah see those stairs and and it's right here so if you look on the on the site plan these are those stairs right those stairs gotta okay yep look at it backward yep okay you're these stairs yet thank you okay do we have any other question any other members of the public have a question okay hearing none Matt I'm I'm anticipating that the applicants going to request a continuance of the public hearing through our May 7th meeting we are okay all right is there is there a motion to continue this public hearing to May 7th don't mov no moves second okay roll call vote all in favor Mary yes TJ hi Woody yes Brad hi Mick hi Diane yes and Bob Connor okay thank you Matt thank you okay uh continue public hearing D file number 050423 17 Main Street Lot four for work to construct a two family dwelling for the septic system utilities and Associated site work team as I recall it uh at our last meeting uh this was presented and we did a site visit following that meeting and is the applicant here here M Mr chairman George soris Atlantic engineering hey good evening George okay George why don't I do this why don't I open this up to questions Mary it seems that we had the presentation at our last meeting and it was really taking a site visit on the impact so one start with you if you have any questions for JY I don't have any questions thank you okay TJ any questions for JY I do not woody any questions for George no I do not thank you uh Brad any questions for George I do not mck how about yourself question I know George thank you for taking the time to meet uh Woody and I out there and uh we had talked about uh putting a either some flagging up or something DeMark your your Timber cutting line like which trees you're gonna remove I don't know if you you've done that yet uh it was it was done on the plan it's uh it's it's identified on the plan and uh we mov the uh the septic Chambers out of the buffer zone as you would suggested yeah that was good great yeah I just uh George and I talked about a part the part of the Titanics of the septic system where within the 100 foot buffer I suggested just shifting those out of the 100 foot buffer so we didn't need to uh condition those those tight tanks with you know periodic testing or whatnot um other question I was looking at the storm water plan George and it was just excuse me one thing I noticed in the uh during construction you had described that the spoils are going to be stored outside of the Wetland zone so it doesn't really Define is that outside the 50ft buffer 100 foot buffer I think you just might need to add a little bit of language to that that just just you know satisfies that we're going to store any excavation soils uh outside of the 100 foot buffer so I think it's probably assumed but it just to make the statement within the uh within the storm water control plant and and that's what the intent is yes yeah I just I think maybe just to add that outside the 100 foot buffer would would satisfy us and I think all the other erosion control um and the you know the spoils you know storage and and maintenance seems to be in order so it was just those those two things um that that I noticed uh but other that other than that yeah thank you for meeting us out there Mick let me ask you a question if if we included that as a special condition uh that any construction spoils has to be outside of the resource area whether that's buffer uh you know or or Wetland would would that suffice I think that would suffice rather than having George go back in and change the language on the storm water plan that would I'd be fine with that okay Mary what are your thoughts on that that sponges me okay all right moving on Diane questions for George no I missed the site visit so I will defer but I did look at the plane okay look good Brad did I ask you did I skip over you inadvertently that's quite all right Mr chair I'm all set thank you okay I I actually was able to get out to the site visit but uh and Mick and Woody was still there I was actually amazed George at a lot of the Dead Timber you have on that loot I mean it there's a few Widow makers there man that we could use uh use some proning there are quite a few yeah I agree any logging that you do in that area George is going to be a probably a an improvement Sean any any questions or any questions on this one you have for George no no I think everything was good um keep up the the good work okay are there any raised hands from the public at this time okay all right do any members have uh a request for additional information or plan Amendment or adding additional content to the plan set no okay I'll entertain a motion to close the public hearing so moved second okay roll call all in favor Mary yes TJ hi Woody yes Brad hi Mick hi Diane yes and Bob coners vot chers uh special conditions outside of having uh no construction spoils uh completely outside the resource area including buffers is there anything else Mary that you want us to entertain was there something Mick mentioned about moving the tight tank yes I uh it was partially within the 100 foot buffer and I think George and I talked about just shifting outside the 100 foot buffer and I think George you said your advised plans show that yes that is correct okay George status of Board of Health approval where are you at on that um they have not yet been submitted the plans are pretty much done they'll probably be submitted uh next sometime next week all all the perks have done the designs have done so it's just really submitting the um the septic designs for approval technically all go ahead Mary yeah sorry um technically all other local approvals that are required are supposed to have been submitted at the time of filing or at least during the hearing process so um I I don't I don't know if we anticipate any problems with the Board of Health but that's the Wetland protection act regulations are all their local approvals be be submitted the time of filing I mean the uh the tank itself is well out the field is almost 300 feet from the edge of the Wetland area so you all the only thing that's um it's not likely to affect us in anyway it's outside of our jur matter matter of fact even the pipe work is outside the 100 foot buffer yep okay okay thank you CL uh in my bad usually I ask that question before we move on to closing the public hearing so okay any other questions uh any other special conditions TJ anything you want to add no I'm good Woody how about yourself no it's good okay Brad all good Mr chair thank you Mick uh no no other questions thank you okay Diane no and Bob Conners has none all right I'll entertain a motion to issue an order of conditions for 19 oops excuse me getting ahead of myself here for 17 Main Street Lot four with our usual conditions and one special condition of including a note on the storage of construction spoils outside of all resource areas don't moved a second okay roll call vote all in favor Mary uh yes I would just ask that if Sean could provide us with a copy of the order before it's issued so that we could have a chance to take a look at it and we use the old order since this is a a repeat filing the old order of conditions will be a good reference okay okay thank you Mary uh Woody yes TJ I Brad hi Mick hi Diane yes and Bob Connor V CHS thank you George thank you okay uh next matter continue public hearing D file number 0501 14259 Independence Way West for work to construct a new dwelling with Associated sitework uh Tom Hughes good evening good evening uh Tom Hughes with Hughes Environmental Consulting here on behalf of Matos um so uh at the last uh hearing we went through the you know the um the project and the procedures by which We'll add sand into the Dune and add sand as we remove that wall along the property line talked a bit about the invasive uh removal protocol and and our need to raise shuring up above 13 that we needed to cor on the plans um had a site visit and uh also more detail was was asked for on landscape um so we've provided some materials today I just wanted to run through that stuff quickly um show you where I was going with the landscape plan just to kind of get some feedback um uh in particular from Mary because she was the one who raised that comment I also understand that there was confusion on the meeting date with the neighbor and and she wasn't at the last hearing and uh and she may want to ask some questions or uh or you know have some comments on the project and then um we also got some D comments that were pretty some of them were a little bit odd um talking about Coastal Bank and by definition a coastal dun doesn't have a Coastal Bank um uh the one thing they did focus a little bit more on was the invasive plan and the request for a landscape plan so responding to the commission's comments on that were also something that um will'll address the de comments I did respond to the D comments uh but indicated I would be sending additional information on that landscape element um so anyway let me um just quickly share my screen the other thing I'll note is that the um I did double check and the cleanup was closed out with deep uh so that's all said as well all right so I'm going to share my screen I can confirm that I se I've seen the the what he said so um sorry this well I'll note that while I don't have this in in the record but this is uh the sand we bring in for the um work all will as all the sand brought onto Plum Island should uh comply with the the beach management PL gradation um so this is this is one of the things I'm working on to make it clearer for when we come in for certificate of compliance what should be vegetated so this graphic makes it much clearer that basically everything outside the footprint of the house the driveways walkways um is going to be vegetated when we're done and um you know the client really doesn't want or or really need any areas to kind of recreate outside everything's kind of built in there's a proposed deck uh that's part of the structure so they feel that that they're fine as far as that goes um what I plan on doing is marking this up I see kind of a couple distinct areas there's an area and I'll show you some photographs of it we saw during the site visit in here that is largely native plants with some small Bittersweet kind of growing up in that area all we're really doing is removing the Bittersweet there's no real need to do any significant plantings there uh we're just going to remove the bitter site um in this area there's uh there are some trees and then there's a lot of invasives kind of growing under there's also I think a lilac in there too um but our intent is just to remove the invasiv but leave the native there and then in this area that borders the property line um with the neighbor of 57 Sunset it's kind of a hodgepodge of invasives there's multiflor there's Bittersweet uh honeysuckle but there's also a bunch of um of cherries a few different species of cherry there's some other natives that are growing in there um so in this area it's tough to quantify the number of plants that will have to go back in because the cherries the Cherry saplings are fairly dense in there and when we remove the invasives there's likely going to be plants three to four feet on Center that remain but we would be filling in any gaps so I do plan in on that area of just specifying based on it on a density for that vegetated area kind of the rough count of live native plants should be present when we're done and if we're short of that we would plant um and I am going to call for a few plantings uh down in this area you know during the site visit I mean I think we all saw this you guys saw that during the um you know during the last hearing this is the area where that uh that wall will come out of the the dun slope the corner that's on the neighbors's property the wing wall back and and the stairs right there and as this is removed section by section we'll have uh clean compatible sand that will be essentially placed immediately upon that uh that removal of that wall in addition to backfilling the uh depression from the removal of the foundation and the contaminated soil that was done uh when the town on the property so again you can see the depression you can see an old monitoring well there um I believe that's actually groundwater in that depression I've seen it uh present on a number of different uh site visits they dug down pretty deep so again there's that depression um but this is the area where we have invasives and natives growing kind of comingled again this area here same thing so we've got some honey suckle growing here in and amongst and next to some I think those are some cherries right there again it's just kind of a A Rat's Nest mix of of Natives and invasives in there and we'll be weeding out and removing the invasives um I'll be marking them most removal will be pulled except when they're so comingled um in which case there'll be a very targeted application of of herbicide and uh it'll be done by somebody who's licensed to do the work and uh and knowledgeable with invasives or with somebody like me uh monitoring the work to make sure that that what they're doing is uh in line with the protocol so again this is that same area kind of continuing towards Sunset and then we have this area that's kind of a combination there's some sedges in here there's overgrown lawn from days gone by um and but overall it's a pretty nicely vegetated area in here up near Sunset but you've got little growths of Bittersweet trying to grow in and amongst these Natives and uh and so those will be removed we're probably going to put some plants back in here but but the native plants that are there provide plenty of cover and the um and the ground cover is is pretty much 100% And then along here we do have the driveway we'll be coming in here and then on the other side and the intent right now is to save these trees um the driveways will run on either side uh and that but there are invasives growing under there under those trees and you can kind of see again it's just a mess of plants and so sort sorting them out and getting them out and then determining whether the natives that are there are so damaged that it's better off just to replace them uh rather than you know removing the plants that have been using them as a trellis and then finding that what you have left is uh is struggling to survive so with that I just want to kind of give you guys that update and then uh see if you have any questions or feedback um if you want I can pull up the the uh profile views that we submitted showing that the the skirting has been raised up to 13 but we've submitted those um and then I guess what I would want to do is uh turn it over to the commission and then and then hear from abutters and uh and then look to continue so I can just write up a more comprehensive response any issues from tonight and uh and address the issues from D all right thank you Tom let me open this up to questions from the members first and then to the public Mary questions for Tom at at this time um more a couple of comments um just yeah I would like to see your written responses to D's comments um I didn't see on the plan construction fence or some kind of limit of work during construction to prevent an inverting impacts to vegetated areas uh that is there that's on the on the project plan what I just pulled up was more graphic for uh okay it is on it is on there I can I can pull that up I see limit of work but I don't see what it what is being used to establish the limited work right that's a that's an orange construction F okay it should be labeled on there if it's not I didn't I didn't see that um I I think that it would be prudent to have you or an environmental monitor present during the dune restoration activities yes no that I think that is in my narrative but but the intent is that I would be present for the removal of the wall and the uh looking down the road to special conditions that we want to includ abely and we would right and monitoring of any uh of the final landscape plan for two growing Seasons so those are I'm just thinking ah had to um potential special conditions for this one yeah we would welcome those conditions okay Mary anything else that's all I have for now thanks thank you Mary TJ any questions for Tom on this project um no no questions uh did the sidewalk and you cleaning this Pro the cleaning up of this H property um I think is very needed it was it's it's in tough shape so that it's a good project yeah this has been one of those orphaned somewhat abandoned homes for probably more than a decade or two which is too bad but okay thank you TJ Woody any any questions on this matter for Tom uh no questions thank you Tom and uh thank you both okay thank you Woody Brad any questions for Tom and this no just echoed uh TJ's comments thank you Mr chair thank you H mick how about yourself yeah Haven walk the site um Woody and others were there Tom appreciate your time out there uh I do agree kind of with the Western most or the closest to Sunset uh that driveway area is really just kind of a a tangled mess and not to try to I don't think a concerted effort to try to save indigenous plants in that area is really worth the effort where it's so you rip one out you're going to rip 10 out and really just create the driveway and then create replanting areas and I think you you've shown that on your plan uh so I think that's good again with the rest of the committee I think it's uh you know it's property Improvement really from from its existing condition um just general practices Tom I don't know what's on the docket for your work or for uh the Matos work but um I would remove those existing monitoring Wells as soon as possible and you might even be able to pull them by hand it's just gener it's just an opportunity for people to pour stuff down those Wells and impact ground water things like that they're just you know not that it might happen here but usually you know when when a site is closed uh under DP the first thing you do is is close those monitoring wells in place so that's something I would do either cut them at grade and cap them fill them you can but or or just pull them you know that's that would be a suggestion yeah no it's a shame the LSP didn't didn't really do that yeah I mean that's usually like part of the closure plan is you know in order to you know finalized the closure you have to pull uh existing monitoring Wells and and close them or close them in place yeah I'll probably be going by to field verify when I do my landscape updates so do that I'll probably see if I can yank them myself yeah exactly I mean we kind of looked at them said they're they're screened above grade so I mean they're not even really viable groundwater monitoring walls anyway so right yeah all right thank you okay thank you mck Diane any questions at the Tom on this matter no okay so so Tom just to do a recap before I open this up to the Republic comment you're you're going to finalize the planting submitt uh you're going to share whether is your responses to D and looking over the rizon we've discussed a couple of additional special conditions that will likely be incorporated yes and and to give you any so so D's comments included must include a narrative addressing the Dune performance standards and so my response is see page four and five of my narrative so I and then must include profile view well it's like they were attached so but we just updated them so I sent them the updates so it's some of them were just kind of funny and it's almost like did they get a complete copy of the noi um you know I was kind of but but the Coastal Bank and dune it tells me it's a relatively new analyst because um you know there there's administrative law decisions on it but it's also very clear in the definition that of Coastal Bank that it does not include areas of coastal Doom okay uh Sean any questions on this for Tom or any any points you want to raise I I don't have any any questions but I know the public does okay um Stephen well you know what Julia Julia had sent a communication and she's a director butter so I'm going to go with Julia first and then Steve I'll follow up with you if that's okay hi Julia if you you're on mute uh if you would like to ask some questions or make some comments I just state your name address but you're still on mute if you're there you go hello I'm Julia Yoshida I'm at 57 Sunset um I do have a few questions I guess one simple one is what is the interval time that you plan between the removal of the wall and the installation of the sand uh through you Mr chair uh the the protocol is is basically we'll be doing it at the same time so is we remove a section of the wall you know we remove four five six feet whatever whatever comes out and put push some sand up against it there'll be clean sand staged right there so it'll be you know within the same day the wall and stairs are removed and all the sand is there and it has a minimum slope of three to one which is a stable Dune slope for sand uh especially in a back Toom environment okay um I'm assuming that the people who made the site visit were able to see that there is a large portion of exposed root of the black cherry uh on the Dune yeah there's a lot of exposed roots there and the uh the approach is we're going to Place sand basically by essentially pushing it in there so that should help surround those roots and give them some level of protection to the extent they're they're exposed I can't think of anything else particularly at this time thank you okay thank you Julia uh Steve Mansion once again thank you uh my good friend Julia oh sorry I do have something to mention um while Julia while you're here and you weren't here um the previous meeting we did have email contact but I just wanted to while we're here um to notify you that Tom has to um you have to give permission to Tom and Tom so um at some point there has to be communic or a letter some contract written that you give permission to Tom y I would like to get the um information that he just mentioned he has on the planned Landscaping because I did not see that yes and and and to follow up with what Sean was saying um to the extent the work goes over the property line obviously Julia we can't do that without your okay and whether that's just a verbal okay or contractuals can to be between you and and uh Steve Matos and we'll we'll let that kind of work out the landscape plan um I'm going to be beefing that up a little bit and I'll I'll copy you when I submit that into the commission I'd appreciate that thank you y okay thank you Julia Steve you're your turn at the B at bath once again thank you my good friend and chair uh a comment that was made about the uh monitoring well screens being above grade caught my attention and again I don't know whether it falls under the purview of the concom but have the monitoring Wells which are are looking at groundwater quality has the data from those Wells been reviewed and shown that the um fuel oil or gasoline contaminants have indeed dissipated which does occur through time but I'm wondering whether any of that falls under the purview of the Conservation Commission thank you it was mentioned earlier Steve that the LSP closed out and de closed out this matter Tom if you want to add yeah commentary to that yeah if I can um let me share my screen again I think in my uh my multitude of PDF documents I think I actually have that here hold on a second let me see if I can I wait too many windows open Tom do you have it or do you want me to pull it up um give me a second okay that's it right there um so this is the the closeout report and uh basically they talk about how they went through and monitored the wells and did all this good stuff um four Wells two downg gradient two uh Source area Wells and then they talk about the risk characterization and uh and basically concluded no significant risk exist at the site so they did go through this process um Steve I think as you probably know the cleanup involves you know certain levels of reports and then there's a final report and this uh does say that was was audited by uh you know Wayside cleanup so it's gone through and and checked off all the boxes beyond that it's not really a wetland protection act item but it is something that folks ask me to look into and make sure sure and I appreciate that Tom um um may ask is is that report part of the um on the town's website one of the takes to look at the data well so so I pulled this down from the D website D has a database much like they have the notice of intent database so if you go to um the easiest way I find it is I go to the D notice of intent database and then I click back up to the menu and then there's a a drop down where you can choose a bunch of different search things and you go to the way site cleanup and then you can put in an address in this case if you just put in Independence it shows up and then there's a you know multitude of reports and documentation and you know I think they even have the bills of lathing for the contaminated material and where it went um fair enough and thank you uh though I will say historically I found getting into the D databases to be a little bit cumbersome but it's on me to take a look at it and if anything does catch my attention I'll certainly let our conservation agent know what caught my attention so that he can relay the information to you so thank you yeah know thank you thank you Steve H Mick I see that question uh yeah I just excuse me am I muted no I just want to respond to Steve I was out there on the site uh Mr Manion and I've got a number of years of experience in environmental remediation and it's not uncommon that the removal of of uh the groundwater monitoring Wells is kind of overlooked sometimes but uh just looking at the soils there looking at the exposed water that was in the pit uh there's no sign of Sheen there's no odor there's no staining on the soil uh this was I read the D closure report it's a typical what we call Di and Hall where they pull the remediation soil they pull the soil out until they get to clean soil they install the monitoring Wells and just make sure there's no return of of uh contaminated ground water or contamination of the soil and the LSP closed it out so yeah I know obviously with it not that I'm an official voice but um you know it looked like it was done properly with the exception of removing those groundwater monitoring Wells Mr chair thank you I appreciate Mick's comments and uh my uh questioning perhaps reflects my prior career in the environmental business for the government I never would have guess that thank you Steve thanks all right are there any other members from the public that have a question or a raised hand at this time John I nobody has a raised hand okay so Tom you're requesting a continuance of the public hearing to our May 7th meeting is that yeah and I think um if it's not too presumptuous if uh if the if staff could start working on the order in the meantime just so that we're kind of ready to go after that next hearing that would be really appreciated but I'll you know obviously that's up to staff and to the commission um but with that I would request a continuance to the next meeting okay I I I would always think that our uh conservation agent would welcome a sample draft o for his review and and red lining by us happy to help out okay uh is there a motion to continue the public hearing to May 7th at the owner's request so moved second okay all in favor Mary yes TJ hi Woody yes Brad hi Mick hi Dian yes and Bob Conor votes yes okay thank you so next matter is uh continue public hearing and D file number 05014 9 18 forom way bleue in LLC for after the pack approval of work to replace two sets of beach access stairs and a beach management plan uh Tom as I recall and team as I recall we were just waiting on the natural natural heritage letter uh on the beach management plan submitted Tom can you give us an update on this yeah the um natural heritage reviewed the documents and um sent an email basically saying our original letter replies so they didn't add any any additional conditions they just and then they resent the original letter so uh they've now responded um so we have attached the sediment uh grain size analysis from the the town of Nuy Beach management plan which I think originated with the sewer project um But ultimately it's what's supposed to be used on Plum Island and then we've also uh attached that natural heritage letter with their conditions to our beach management plan document so uh so that's all kind of together as one and then we would anticipate your order of conditions would um would also include those natural heritage proposed conditions uh you know in the uh in it decision and um lastly I do want to remind the commission we had a discussion about those the design of the walkovers and a d comment on them um where D had talked about elevating them up and we talked about why that actually is uh is more harmful to the resource area because the the stairways are built over an area of Stone revetment cover covered with a veneer of sand and if we lift them up necessarily to get up to the walkover and to get off the walkover we have to extend them and make them longer and we bring them out into more functional resource area um in addition they're narrow so the and there's no vegetation on that slope so they're not blocking vegetation and sand is able to move around build up under them on them uh my understanding is sand you know some years sand covers them the stairs and other years it is um washed right down to the Rock so um so we would ask that just a finding about why it makes sense to have approved it at the you know as constructed as opposed to up in the air and extending it to be a longer structure uh would be appreciated and uh I'm happy to uh you know to help out with with drafting that finding if the commission so uh so request okay Tom let me stop you there and open this up to questions Mary any any further up any further questions for Tom uh I'm just re-reviewing the um conditions from natural heritage there was a time of year restriction April 1 to August 31st in which work couldn't occur the property owner has responsibility for protecting piping plovers and must allow monitoring for presence of lovers and turns by a qualified shorebird monitor as determined by the division um and shall allow any Nest scrapes or unfledged chicks to be protected with symbolic fencing this is this is town beach in front of them is or is this private this is private property it's private it's private beach so how how are they does this mean that the private property owner is required to monitor for returns and plovers if they're you going to be using the property in a way would impact them during that time of year I don't I don't read it that way what I read as is that if they have a monitor coming by we have to give them access and that if we do anything that is an alteration not just using the beach right like if if it's obvious that there's a a bird there we have to take action to protect it but you kind of have to do that if you know it is there any way under the you know mass and dangered Species Act you can't harm the the birds um that's something that's fairly standard that that natural heres started putting on private property uh for anybody who does has sort of these primary Dune properties that extend down to the beach they've been putting that condition on there I I just see that as you know saying that you know these guys are operating an that they're you know cleaning up the beach they're they're doing things that are maybe a little bit more aggressive than your average homeowner and in doing that they've got a responsibility to protect the Shorebirds if they but they also have guests using that part of the beach right during time of year restrictions so yeah yeah but I don't think it says they can't use the beach um I think it's that's not the that's not the way I read it I think it's um it doesn't I it does it says that property owner must allow regular monitoring doesn't say they must conduct regular monitoring I understand what you're saying there um it's just uh I'm not sure how this fits into what we can condition well I think I think it's let me jump in here yes those are all unconstitutional you you cannot incorporate the use of someone's property an anticipation of a prit uh there's private property rights there that you know supersede and I'm involved in litigation all over the country and we went 100% of the time on on these these claims and and I'm actually surprised to hear this that natural heritage is starting to do that because it it winds up being protracted litigation and many times it winds up at the US Supreme p and it cost everybody a lot of money except the property owned but I I think they've been they've carefully worded this in a way to not outright require it so they can ask but they can't demand and they can't can do that's what it looks like except if there is somebody that shows up and says there's plovers nesting on your Beach they have to take they have to allow measures to protect it right well not not private proper not not on private property well that's what it's this that's what this is saying so I'm not because we're we're having this issue with uh a lot of other property owners and and basically monitoring uh other than on public property is required permission from the property owner or it's classified as Criminal Trespass uh we're having a problem on the northern part of the beach that uh the monitors have been erecting symbolic fencing in the property without permission and they've been ordered to remove it by the town uh we had a meeting with the Autobon uh on on cwp that the town was involved in and this was all pointed out with Clarity that you cannot trespass in private property without written permission or or certainly permission of the property uh and but it seems to happen anyway so yeah but the letter is what it is I mean we that's what they how enforcable it is and and we're in a as the applicant we're in a difficult spot right where we have to apply for the Misa approval through the notice of intent process we give them a a period of time to write a comment letter they write one and they comments and their conditions are required to be put into your orders so you know I think we just have to have some faith that they're going to be reasonably executed as it relates to doing alteration as opposed to use that's what I'm wondering is that this is this is a permit condition this is this is authorization to allow you to do something not it's not being applied to some property owner that have that hasn't asked for a permit for something right that's that's where it comes down though you you can't demand access to private property uh as a condition of getting a permit it yeah I don't know how this other than it's it's included in your order is included in your Beach management plan now so it will our order of conditions will reference your Beach management plan yeah no exactly it it won't be enforcable Tom is is that in the Dropbox John that the yes it is I'm looking at it now okay I mean it most commissions put those conditions right in the order and I guess I would ask if you put them right in the order I wonder if they can be uh phrased with the following natural heritage during during project activities subject to this order the following activities or you know the following conditions apply yep and that would at least make sure that there was a Nexus between the permit and the permission being granted and I think it it is typical that a commission does cut and paste those conditions right into the order um so I think maybe that is something where maybe there's a maybe it's a natural heritage condition and those go from being bulleted as numbers to being like a through whatever and there's an introductory paragraph that says that they apply as they relate to project activities regulated by the order and and I think that would make the applicant feel better about it because then that tells me that we're doing things under the beach management plan or doing any work related to those walkways um you know working on on them or whatever then we have to make sure that we're complying with all that does that would that be amendable to the commission sort of incorporating them in in a fashion like that is is it is it now attached to your Beach management plan is it part of is it yeah it's it's attached to it so it only applies to the beach management plan when we're doing Beach management activities should be St Beach management plan and become part of that document right but we also have to reference it in relation to the boardwalk construction which is what the notice of intent was originally for it was after the fact notice of intent for Boardwalk construction so and it's only valid for five years right yeah no there there's a there's a number of Supreme Court cases that I'm actually well aware of Nolan versus Dolan uh where that when you incorporate these type of conditions in order to get a permit it it's just deemed as unconstitutional but I'm actually going to send it off and and get a legal opinion on it but that's unrelated to the matter before but yeah in the meantime I think if we just incorporate it into the order with that that language about it to the extent you know work is being done under the order of conditions the following conditions apply and then just put it in that that way so that it's clear it doesn't apply to the you know the beach in guest you know the G the guest putting a towel down on the beach and I mean I think that that's probably fair enough to get us to get us by and I you know it's a it's a delicate dance sometimes permit conditions and uh now nub ran into this when D Su issued superseding orders and intervened when Property Owners got local approval to rebuild their homes after storm damage and and these Draconian requirements were then required uh and it was amazing when a legal opinion came down that was brought to everyone's attention the unconstitutional aspect of it all it disappeared within 24 hours and everyone got their their permit but so well listen any other questions Mary on this no other than Sean if you need some help with the order I'm happy to help you with that okay thank you Mary TJ thank you Mary any questions on this one no good yeah thank you Woody any questions on this one no questions thank you Bob Brad any questions on this one no Mr chair thank you mick how about yourself any questions all set thank you okay Diane any questions on this matter just one Tom so are you saying that your client or the owner of the property is accepting the conditions as set forth natural parage because if we incorporate it into our order of conditions I'm just concerned if they're going to come later and well so so their conditions are a decision under the mass Endangered Species Act Right and I think our I think our only way of contesting them would be to appeal them and I think that if if they were couched in such a way that it was clear that they applied to activities subject to the order as opposed to the beachgoer and the inest and just walking out on the beach you know which we all would agree I think is exempt from Wetland protection act so therefore the order wouldn't apply to that I think we can accept them um and I don't think we have much choice I think I think you guys are you know the way that the way the uh the regs are worded we have to give 30 days for natural heritage to get their comment letter and and it is essentially an approval under the mass Endangered Species Act through the Wetland protection act approval so I guess our only other thing would be to say don't put them in the order and then we have to go get our own permit from the endangered species people and go through a long process which seems ridiculous so well I don't think we should be word smithing it the document should speak for itself well and have it attached I I also want to add in that it's also a migrating species oh no it so the the question is this um wouldn't we just typically reference the letter and not the content or try to qualify it it's going to be attached to the beach management plan Document Speaks For Itself and if it's deemed to be a problem later on uh these avenues for all parties at that point I I think if you just make the conditions say work associated with this order of condition must comply with the um natural heritage conditions attached to the beach management plan and I'd agree with that I thought we were going to start cutting and pasting it into our own order so that's you make it you you include it by reference right yeah it's is fine but it covers what Tom's trying to do but you don't have to actually cut and paste it into the do yeah how however you do it most most commissions will just cut and past paste it right in without much thought just right in and I actually appreciate the thought the commission's giving this it's uh you know it's a delicate thing I mean certainly my client you know doesn't want to do any harm to blubbers or or threatened or endangered species so you know in general we agree with the the nature of the conditions to protect the species but certainly not if it's going to be onerously enforced okay thank you yeah okay anything else danan no okay uh Steve any any any comment you want to add on sure once again thank you Mr chairman this is Steve on 14th Street um you know the the storms we've had during the last two uh spring tides have certainly caused a lot of erosion at the southern well south of uh the in at the beach uh as you may know some of you may know the um off ation platform at lot one on the Wildlife Refuge was taken out or the Sy were taken out during the storm this happened about 10 or 15 years ago as well so there is some periodic removal that occurs um with that introduction uh did the last couple storms cause any need to implement the beach management plan on your on on your client's property Tom and if so what was done and then I had one other question not that I'm aware of but I haven't specifically asked that um and I occasionally look at their Beach webcam to just monitor storm conditions and I didn't see anything but so so honestly I can't answer that I think um the chairman probably would be aware because he lives right near there I walk my dogs down by there steveen there's been no damage to the stairs that have been installed thank you for that and again that does point to how uh the Locust of erosion can be very particular and can shift through time as most of you know already but uh the other comment I would have was a word that the chairman just used U and I'm thinking about Beach management plan plovers and what if Plover show up or turns or other migratory species what does that say about dogs on the beach at the property in question I don't know whether blue is a u dog friendly establishment but are there Provisions to think about what to do with uh dogs on the property of blue I'm not talking about other properties up and down the beach front but rather this one as part as it might pertain to a beach management plan I don't have a solution that's one way to a town meeting mention dogs yeah let let me let me just say when we had a meeting with aabon under the coastal waterbirds uh program this was discussed and and and the police chief was in attendance there's no leash La in Newbury on private property uh dogs are allowed to be on the beach because it's private property on the public section of the beach which is about 400 feet long from Center Island up before the hours I think it's 800 in the morning and after 5: at night or could be 8:30 and 5:30 during a particular season that's what the bylaw says dogs are allowed before and after Sean actually Sean didn't you have signs made up we when we were talking about this trying to find a middle ground of how do we protect the birds respect private property rights uh and we were adding signs at all the rways that if you see symbolic fencing urging people to put a leash on their dog whether even if it's private or not but it it's a suggestion and it's something that's not enforceable without a leash law and and again a leash law is not enforceable in private property I I so I'll pull up the the piping Clover um fine yeah I I guess to answer Steve question though I think if if a dog is going down the beach it's part of using the beach and there's not a roped off plever area and it you know it's not known that there's a plover there then you know it's it's not you know it's not something that that we're going to worry about I think if if you know a plover is there then I think obviously you're going to take steps to try to you know do you can to to work people to try to protect it and you know and I think the way I read these conditions is is they apply to work that we're doing under the beach management plan which is strictly about cleaning up you know rack and debris and lobster pots and stuff that washes up and and covering the Rocks when they get exposed with clean compatible sand um it's not you know it's not a wholesale you know whether or not they allow dogs it's not it's not of that level of it's not like the rules of using the beach for for in guests um you know and it is it is a delicate issue but who's also to stop you know if if some neighbor is walking along the intertitle Zone with their hunting dog um you know what guys let me stop this dog conversation yeah we don't have jurisdiction to dogs it it it's a fascinating topic but it's approaching 8:00 and I just really want to stick to the matter at hand which is uh the order the notice of intent that's before us Steve any anything else you have before I no and I thank you I'm I'm quite heartened to hear that the storms do not require any serious well any implementation of the beach management plan but since this has gone on for so long the uh question about nesting season and invasive dogs came up but I appreciate what you said M Mr chair and with that I'll lowered my hand thank you s Mary you have your hand up what I didn't see the beach management plan in the Dropbox is that has that been submitted yeah we had it at the last um thing and actually I can share it hold on oh I don't I don't need to go through the whole thing now I just wanted to make it was available I'd like to look at it again um not to to drag things out at all yeah and um you know what I would Envision with this and I'm I'm just going to re-email it to you guys right now um what I would Envision is that you know as as we live and learn this can be a living document we could come back to the commission with modifications to it if as needed um yeah the the one thing I was interested and is about the rack management and rather than removing entirely from the beach if it can be put up against the base of the Dune or someplace out of the way so that it's that material is actually beneficial for the beach um right it is um and it's something you know DCR also removes it from from Salsbury Beach and it's a yeah it's a struggle because often times the rack line it in this area is not just yeah maybe it may contain other materials so y right I mean you get yeah you've all seen what washes up on the beach it's not always pretty probably a good idea if there actually GNA be guests there so yeah okay 800 million gallons of csos washing onto the beach and contaminating the racket may be a nutrient from one species on the planet but it's pathogens for the rest of us right I mean I've always thought that like for example the DCR rack that gets collected should be ground up and mixed with s nourishment projects especially when you're getting um hey team why don't we get back on track here with the matter are there any other questions from any member regarding uh the project no okay do any members have a request for additional information plan Amendment or adding additional content to the notice no okay I'll entertain a motion to close the public hearing so moved we have a second second okay roll call vote all in favor Mary yes TJ yes uh Brad mck did you uh I didn't hear Mick oh I said yes we have Mick and TJ still in here okay you know Mick is here uh Diane yes and Bob con is a GS I don't know if we've lost TJ or not but we've got a majority vote okay so the worst case Sean you would record this vote as 60 if is TJ hasn't voted on it all right team this is thank you so much well this is Tom don't you want us to consider special conditions and consider voting for your order oh yeah actually I do okay kind of see we you know when we talk about dogs you know the passion of all of us that uh okay team this is a time when we talk about special conditions we have a usual conditions I mean the reality of the STS were an after the fact uh install very common along coast of Plum Island uh and the beach management plan is self-explanatory and natural heritage has signed off on it and conditioned it accordingly Mary any other special conditions you want to add yes um well there was a there was a draft of the order of conditions that was put in the Dropbox and had some conditions that were highlighted um one condition says the order of conditions applies only to after the fact approval of the replacement of beach access stairs and Associated site work any other proposed work shall apply for amended or separate permits so I think that's accurate we're not necessarily approving the beach management plan as part of the order of conditions because that there's another condition that says a permanent Beach management plan shall shall be developed and shall be subject to review and approval by the NCC this management plan once approved may be implemented perpetually and any conditions therein shall survive the issuance of certificate of compliance so the con the order as it's written right now anticipates that a management plan would be developed and it would be approved by us and then it says all conditions set forth by the natural heritage and danger species program and outlined in the letter dated July 14th 2023 referencing blah blah blah file number shall be adhered to where the beach management plan has been attached or incorporated into the noi are are you think Amir we should vote it hasn't actually been attached to the noi because it was filed SE separately as a separate document so we could approve it as part of this order of conditions and and put in the date of its approval but the way it's written right now it's not okay but that was a draft right it's a draft Yeah okay Tom let me let me jump back to you and um yeah so so just um I just wanted to remind the commission I think that was the original draft perhaps Sam had drafted that that was going to condition submission of the beach management plan and the commission was uncomfortable with that wanted the beach management plan to be part of this decision which is why we delayed and submitted so just want to point back to the record on that I know the hearing is closed but that makes sense so so in my view this was actually submitted as part of the noi as a as an addendum submission so to the extent you want to condition that it can be updated and maintained over the years I think it's consistent with how that was drafted but we would Envision this order actually approves this hopefully so it would just have to this order as it's currently drafted would have to include it then where it lists the notice of intent and the site plans and all the documents that are part of the decision it would have to include that in the final date of that plan yeah correct Brad you have your hand up yeah I I was just going to Echo what what what Tom said that the part of the reason there were two fold of why uh blue was appearing before us one was the fact that they put the stairs in without a notice of intent or an RDA uh and secondly and and I think from from my perspective most importantly it was to develop the beach management plan so they would not have to come back annually to put the stairs in or take the stairs out or repair the stairs um that they had in memorialized in their Beach management plan the ability to do just that so Mary I I agree um that that particular uh draft that Sam may have put in there is incorrect and that and that we now have the ability to put the conditions on this beach management plan and this uh notice of intent such that going it's memorialized and going forward they can go do that work y that was my only comment Mr chair thank you no thank you thank you Brad so Tom what I'm going to suggest and you know what and it's it's done in a lot of other communities uh feel free to PR prepare a sample order of conditions for review and edit by Sean Mary and and potentially the committee um and and I think that way there we all the all points that we're talking about are Incorporated and it's more of a red line just to make sure we we want that so you would share that with Mary and Sean I think that would be a good a good approach absolutely if um if Sean could email me the draft that was prepared what I can do is start from that and then edit um accordingly and then get it off and then I think ultimately probably Mary and Shan should do the final wording on it but I'm happy to kind of get it get things started with some suggestions for language yeah I would just want it also to be clear that it's it's doesn't include repair or replacement or should I should say replacement of the existing boardwalks it includes maintenance of them but not replacement right now now question I had a um question so I can't see it on unfortunately right now on through the software that I have here but is there something about heavy machinery that we can um put in there because uh through GIS a point got brought up internally that they have um that there's heavy machinery being used on the beach for that site well whatever's in the beach management plan well that they scooped it from the lower half of the Beach well under the conditions right now it it reads no equipment is to enter or cross Wetland resource periods at any time unless the location of the disturbance is marked on the plan referenced in this order and it's within the limit of work shown on the plan so that's obviously uh meant for a different condition an inland condition but it would also apply to it it applies that one needs to be revised I should put it that way wanted to that one yeah and and the reference to Upland sand is the source Supply as I recall okay well it's that time um I'd entertain a motion to issue an order of conditions for 18 forom way the usual conditions and the inclusion of the beach management plan so moved second okay all those in favor Mary yes TJ Woody Brad hi hold on are these are these are people abstaining or are they not no no no no you know what it seems some people having trouble staying on uh Woody how do you vote okay okay so only TJ seems like we've lost TJ he's he's out of state uh Mick oh yeah Diane yes and Bob Conor Ro here so that's 60 Sean all right thank you very much and hope you guys have a great night okay you too H now Tom we have uh 18 Temple Boulevard but that's been continued until what the May May 7th right May 7th okay so no further action on that then y all right and all right uh continue public hearing D file number 0501 1422 94 Northern Boulevard for work to conduct landscaping hardscaping and Paving work Sean can you give us an update I know that the uh the the applicant has bounced around on withdrawing this to maybe pursuing it and I think Tom didn't did she reach out to you on this do you want to comment on yeah I can tell you so that um it's uh it's in my queue to review a draft my understanding is that they've uh removed a lot of The Hardscape and really simplified things but I need to review it and get it in a condition to uh to bring into you guys um so uh so it is right now on my court as you guys might imagine I've got a a big a big whiteboard this is this is 94 yeah a 94 yeah so I was contacted by the owner um she was asking I don't know if she's here she asked me um if if she could attend to ask you guys some questions I don't know if she's here if she is um so Sean definitely speak on her behalf but it sounds like Tom's taking over she reached out to Tom I don't know if the owner is here I don't see certainly if the owner's here then then I don't want to speak for her um but they have asked me to look at things and the surveyor has prepared a uh a plan for me to look at and I just uh it's it's in my queue it's the best I can well do you want to continue this you want to request a continu it to our May 21st meeting um if the owner is not present to do that then I would uh then I would ask that I continue to May 7th just because I haven't talked to the owner about their schedule so I may then follow up with an additional continuous request but I'm uncomfortable asking to have it pushed out too far without having to talk to the owner about it okay uh it there's been a request by the applicant to continue the public hearing to May 7th do I may meeting we have a second second second okay uh all those in favor roll call Mary yes PJ uh Woody yes Brad hi Nick hi Diane yes and Bob Conor votes yes all right now thank you and have a great night okay Tom thank you thank you Tom all right what do we have left on our agenda here [Applause] all right staff reports excuse me can you hear me yeah yep we can hear you hey so this is Ed Leonard uh I was on this to get a certificate of Appliance for 61 Elm Street 61 Elm Street um I don't think I had you on the meeting yeah we did meeting you weren't on this agenda oh no Well Chrissy emailed me and I know uh Sean you came out to my house the other day so I don't know how that got mixed up but I got this code and stuff for this Zoom meaning to chrisy and uh I guess I got a couple questions anyways for you guys if if you have a second yeah I mean what I I I guess if you're looking for a certificate of compliance uh depending on when you requested and when Sean had a chance to look at it we we usually have a cut off of the Tuesday before our meeting yeah no I filed it with Chrissy probably two weeks ago or so okay um let me ask you a question is there some urgent need where you're refinancing selling or something like that no no not at all it's just my order conditions expired at the beginning of last month and I've been trying to uh you know just you know close everything out and do it the right way what here's the good news if you've completed the work and the work complies with the order of conditions that the certificate of compliance isn't time sensitive to the three-year period okay if if if that's your concern okay and the only other thing was when Sean was out there I know he took some photographs uh but I was not sure do I need to get an as built of my property or is that something that it's just something Sean looks at what what was it for I built a new house at 61 Elm Street and the ordered conditions my driveway was within 100 feet of a intermittent stream oh yes yes um I remember this one uh so sorry we I like I said I didn't add you to the to the um schedule um his his driveway was or do you want to speak on your behalf uh yeah so the only part of the build that uh was within the 100 foot buffer zone of an intermittent stream was you know the first you know 150 feet of my driveway and uh all the building and everything was outside of it but uh I just don't know if I need to get an as built of the whole property to close out the order conditions or if it's something you guys don't need I just would like to be prepared if you do push me back to the next meetings that I can receive it so Sean question you you've been out to the site I have been out to the site um I actually seen it when I was um wet there as well so yeah there's a lot of rain what what does the area look like is it stabilized with vegetation yeah um I would say it's it's it's back to the way it it should be um the section that he's talking about is outside of that buffer zone but um for some reason you know some parts of the house were were um I guess it was the propane underground propane that was um kind of notified by us as well um but the driveway part um everything looked good uh I can pull up some pictures from that site if you if you so wish no you know what we we can't take any action on it tonight I I was just curious it sounds like it's pretty stable site Mary thoughts um just uh typically the or the order of conditions will say whether an asil plan is required that um and for for a new house typically you do need some kind of ASO plan so we can document that the foundation is where it's supposed to be so you should if you don't have a copy of the order of conditions which probably do it's been recorded at I I presume towards the end it should say whether or not an asilt plan is required um in the special conditions and that will guide you but um you know even if it's you you need some documentation that the the work was done according to a plan sometimes you just need you can get a letter from a professional engineer or a land survey that would that can provide that documentation and sometimes you need an asil plan so it depends on what it says in the order yeah I think it either way you need some documentation okay I I believe I did read that that's why I had that question for sea when he was out there yeah uh and but I I think the wording I didn't know if I needed both or one or the other but I think you just kind of cleared that up for me well it depends on the wording yeah no yeah in that special condition yeah and usually you don't need to hold you know that I don't know how big the property is but just the work area is what you need to yes yes okay so so if the house is outside of the jurisdiction does that still apply no it's just the work that we that would have been subject to our review yes okay so the driveway it would be whatever whatever work was part of yeah so I needed approval for the whole house but the driveway was the only thing within the 150 feet 100 foot buffer but I yes I'll get an as built for all you guys and hopefully I can if it's just yeah question without seeing the plan in the order of conditions yeah yeah I I think where Mary was headed was if the jurisdiction is simply the driveway that may be all you need depending on the wording of the order yeah okay well well Jody was sorry about that and uh why don't you get your your has built get it into Sean and we typically handle certificates of compliance and rdas and stuff like that at the very beginning of the meeting so you're not sitting hours of on the email I got from chrisy actually it said you know certificate of compliance was the first thing so that's why you should have spoke up you should have spoke up uh right after yeah I know well I didn't I I know she I was kind of late sorry late to but but if I can get on next time that works for me well here's what to do is an a certificate compliance doesn't require any advertising it just requires a submittal so if your order requires an as built you're going to need an as built to get you know final final sign okay okay yep all right team it is now 8:20 [Music] and I I I am waiting to hear from Mary on what uh the US fish and wildlife service has completed the required permitting for this project work is authorized through June 1 2029 how many acres is that Mary 1450 holy cow yeah they they they got their final uh water quality certificate um from deep and Army Corps approval so they're they're going to start that work uh this month well that's it'll take it'll be in phases but yeah um and then you will be seeing another uh several hundred acres from the trustees of reservations when they get their phase three submission together so it's a unified approach on the great m is same yes Unified approached exactly there's a kind of a a team including the you know project designer and a bunch of scientists um and restoration practitioners that have been collaborating on developing these new techniques and getting them uh authorized through D so all right uh Brad on CSO releases uh it's bad we've had too much rain but I don't know if I really want to spend any time talking about it when we're here at you know two and a half hours in on meeting no I'm I'm good Mr chair my head wants to explode okay all right so all right so Sean can I ask one at the risk of seeing Brad's head explode um just do we have a site visit scheduled for d for the 33rd Street project did they appeal on that uh no there no we filed a notice uh Town Council filed an appearance notice with d so that we would be included okay on has hasn't happened yet okay and Council has been looped in on that so great all right anything else team that this Sean this is what Sean worked on when we had a meeting with uh with all the players back in in in February regarding the uh Coastal water bird program and you know in in in an effort to find a way to protect the birds uh and educate the public within the constraints of our current bylaws this is what we we crafted was that recommending to people that keep their dogs on a leash near plava nesting this was going to be installed at every beach access going to the beach uh you know as a as a good first step and and again you know an attempt to uh protect PLS and turn Sean did these all get installed do you know if they put them up yet they have not been installed yet um they are being ordered oh okay so it's still those are the access sites that they'll be put on or in or near um they're not they're not going to be installed invasively I mean oh yeah so I'm pretty sure it's probably a bucket okay put next onto the RightWay okay all right team I don't know about you guys I'm done I'm tired I'll I'll entertain a motion to a Juran so moved we have a second all in favor Mary nice Woody thank you all for your patience tonight this thanks everyone bit of a chall good night bye bye