##VIDEO ID:Hl1rqaW5hEk## e e e e e e e see Power problems call the meeting order at 401 let's stand for the Pledge of Allegiance Pledge aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible liy and justice for all amen thank you roll call please president Mungi here vice president Matthews here member Furlong here member brire here member gardi here Council representative Cole here and staff and ex official members present today are executive director frandle community development director Grahams um Finance director Winnick and Eda secretary jurny thank you very much I apologize I'm using my work computer because I didn't have time to get home so you're calling me on my laptop um can I get a motion to adopt the agenda please so move so move second second so we have Mr furong and Joe Matthews Matthews that sounds good to me it's nice to hear these names again all those in favor say I I thank you Williams that's right all right approval of the minutes for that do I need to um vote on that or okay can I have a motion for approval of the minutes so moved so move got member Wong representative council memb this is so weird second vice president Matthews did he do that on purpose did I say Wong yes I did too I thought he was joking was joking boy if everybody believes I'm joking let's go with that they won't realize how how the mayor's out of it okay thank you all those in favor say I I I I think I'm going to oppose I can't believe I did that she's not even here I know it g all right open to the public do we have any thing as far as I don't think so so nobody online anymore that's right okay that's up to you now ran got that right right so we have discuss items talking about the downtown design excuse me talking about the downtown design manual uh part of the CIP item and the budget aspect turn that over to Mr Grahams or or sorry Dan wi Finance director well good afternoon uh yeah we have an item here uh to talk about the downtown design manual uh currently it is in the CIP to be funded through the general fund um both at uh city council um and myself it really does fit uh more to be funded Through The Economic Development Authority but to do that really needs to get your approval um for that um and then we'll kind of talk about do we want to fund it for 2025 and do it in 2025 or postpone it for 2026 but before we get there um from our last discussion on the budget um there was a considerable time that was spent um as far as the alloc uh allocation of time for the community development director uh when the position um was established from a former uh um city manager um the city council um had approved that 50% of the community development's time was to come from The Economic Development Authority I think we're all in agreement um from our last conversation that that's just too high um and so we have changed that to be from 50% to 25% and so that other 25% is coming from the general fund and then it's been reduced in um the budget that's in front of you right now um and that's what's being proposed to that will be being proposed to be um uh passed um this year for for um taxes payable in 2025 um so the question that come comes here is that there was a CIP item that um talked about updating the downtown design manual um and I'll just read kind of the description that was written um and it was written by the former community development director it was the downtown design manual was approved by City Council in 2005 the downtown design manual was developed under the guidance and direction of the design historical review commission and was adopted by Council in 2005 the manual illustrates portions of the zoning code as it relates to the desired built environment within the downtown the zoning ordinance was updated in 2015 the 2040 comprehensive plan was approved in 2018 the Redevelopment master plan was updated in 2022 and the downtown design manual is no longer consistent with the city plans and ordinances and should be updated um and it uh so the question is I is first of all is is everybody in agreement that it should be being updated to reflect the current and I'm seeing a nod and so then the question really comes to do we fund it in 2025 or in 2026 part of the reason for that is that there's a great component in this design manual that is regarding the facade improvements which is going to be the second item that we're going to discuss because we've been discussing about um the PO potential of having um either loans or grants um for businesses uh regarding the facade and so there's a little bit of a discussion item that needs to take place with that if um our community development director is okay I kind of want to turn that component over to him because he um him and I had some conversations and he has some thoughts on whether 2025 2026 and how it relates to that facade program program that will be being discussed up up coming up next so with that I'll just kind of turn that portion over to Riley yeah thank you Dan um so um obviously uh you know I've been here three months now uh still pretty new still learning everything here um and Dan and I did have a conversation about kind of you know what what item comes first what what makes most sense um I I believe that we had talked about pushing this to 2026 or no yeah that's right I'm sorry um pushing this to to 2026 would uh allow us some time to um Define uh the facade uh Improvement um project through the Eda uh and then allow us a little more time again like I said to um uh update the the downtown design manual based off of that so that's that is kind of our just really quick recommendation for the Eda so that would give us all of 2025 to look correct all you yeah before you would end up hiring a consultant to come in um so it would be an opportunity for the Eda to discuss that um we kind of look at it as that it shouldn't Pro it doesn't necessarily mean to um push out or delay the facade program um the facade program when you're going through that may give you some shed light on how you want to or how you want to incorporate that component within the design manual itself um so that may give a it's kind of like the chicken or the egg which which one would come first um but um part of it is because of Riley being new to the city um it gives an opportunity to kind of see and get kind of a flavor for it as we're working through this facade program see what type of requests are kind of get the the you know the consensus from the Eda on on what's important what's not so we can you know update this update the manual correctly but it would be in 2026 what that does is that you know from a funding standpoint that delays the decision whether it's going to be from the general front or the Eda um we don't have to make that decision now it would just be pushed out to 2026 for that decision um but really comes to to this group and this body of whether they want to move that design manual into 25 or into 26 and if it's in 25 is there a willingness from the Eda to incorporate that within its 2025 budget and pay for it or is your recommendation to leave it into the general fund clear as [Laughter] mud and your recommendation is to 26 is that what you were that's kind that's where the recommendation is and then on top of it the recommendation is we started it last year when this was written up it was funded in um from the general fund uh we had uh city council support um last year we actually had some other studies that were being funded from the general fund and it's been the consensus from the from the city council to move that funding out of the general fund because it's an up and down swing part to it and it really should be tried to find a better place for it and so the recommendation would be that it would be funded from the Eda in the in at the time that it it's necessary so if we the recommendation would be push it off to 26 we'll have that discussion at a later date or um you know put it into to 25 our recommendation is to put it to 26 we'll have the discussion later on I think we need to to learn more from the program and not hold that up any longer seems like a long time a year we do like half a year well you know another you know option there's you always have this the this option we can incorporate it into the budget and you can make that determination at a later date um if Eda decides to to fund that um we can put it into the budget it hasn't been approved yet hasn't um so um there's always that as an opportunity or you can always come back um sometime next year um when you decided yeah we want to get going on the design manual um we would just uh make an amendment to the budget um it would be your recommendation and then it would be approved by uh full Council um at that point in time it definitely would not be funded from the general fund because the general fund is is heavily backed by Levy yeah I do I do agree it does seem like a long time I mean we're sitting here in September of 24 and you're going to say we're not even going to start till 26 just for the facade program or is it for the to do get your mic on is it f funding for the facade program or is it for the funding to to do the to do the work to put it together it it's it the funding would be for updating of the whole downtown design manual which the facade is a component of that and what is the cost of that um it it's been estimated at $60,000 um there would be an RFP that would be put out there and we would see what kind of responses that we would get um but that's what it was estimated at that is a while out I mean it could be reanalyzed you know halfway through the year well after the study came back as well say it again I said that it it could look at uh bumping that time frame up too I mean if we you know got going on it and you know you got it in the first second quarter of next year you had time to review and wanted to move on to the facade Improvement program then we could you know do that that time instead of put pushing it out to say that it's tied to 2026 I know when we were in budget talks talking about things you were talking about different ways because the levy is going to be up there was that was this part of that in that conversation yes yes it was it was an option so for for everybody's awareness and this upcoming Tuesday um city council will be passing the maximum Levy for the the city um and when I'm talking total City I'm including City HRA Eda right now we're sitting at a 9.88% levy increase um so part of my job is the finance directors to come up with opportunities or other thoughts to try to reduce that that Levy um we have a number of unknowns um we are in Union negotiations with um all of our unions um so it'll be the beginning 25 will be at the beginning of um which historically has been three-year contracts we don't know where they're at um there's some other unknowns as far as we're still waiting on uh a facility assessment um because I I think our facilities what we have in our current capital Improvement plan are are um very much understated um and so we need to get the real numbers of what that's going to take um and then also um The Parks Commission is working on a um and they've done a number of different Park plans are out currently right now with hga that's looking at three of of the parks um those were the parks and Facilities were two of the three areas um of infrastructure that have been identified that's going to have funding needs the other one being streets which the city council um has already started um funding with a direct Levy component for that so city council is looking at the opportunity of maybe increasing um a levy component for parks and Facilities that's another one of those unknowns um for those two so there's three unknowns the union contracts um is there additional funding needing for Parks or is there additional funding for facilities so I put together a number of of options for um the the city council to consider in reducing those those levies we've uh City council's decided to kind of defer that right now certify the maximum Levy knowing that the final Levy isn't approved until as uh as me as Eda member Furlong um knows that isn't until a later part of or middle of December so they have time to get those unknowns um figured out and then reduce the levy one of the options here was because it's currently being funded in the G uh general fund is to reduce that 60,000 and move it over to the Eda um and so my first question I I I'll start is is there an app TI to do that from the Eda to fund the design update of the design downtown design manual I'm I'm seeing I'm seeing one member a in agreement um any other thoughts I support funding it from the Eda okay any other thoughts to me this is kind of an edad driven thing so and that's that's really kind of the way that we've looked at it and it really should have all the all along been identified from a funding source from the Eda instead of the general fund that's the reason for that that switch um so do I hear consensus that there's an appetite to to move that in um and if there is then I'll give you um what I would my next recommendation based upon that I think it should be under should be under the Eda okay so then what I would do is to to give that freedom of moving quicker and with the possibility of moving forth with that in 2025 I would change the budget again the budget hasn't been approved so when you're looking at that right now you've got your uh revenues and expenditures both matching we can't change the the uh property tax or what is looked in there is the revenues that ad valum taxes of the 200,000 that's what we're we're proposing to set for the levy but what we can do is we can change um the capital and put $6,000 in there for the capital so it's it'll be approved um or at least it'll be proposed um and approved if everything goes forth in December that um they you would have the funding coming in January 1st of 2025 for that 60,000 so then it opens up the opportunities that if you want to start at 2025 the funding is already there you don't need to go back we don't need to go back to the Eda we don't need to go back for the city council for any approval if you decide to postpone it at that point in time no problem with it it's just not spent in in 2025 I like having it under the Eda category because that's part of it so we can keep your books Neer yeah and so I'll incorporate that $60,000 into to hear so it it changes the budget component to it okay everybody on kind of an agreement on that um and then oh I think just kind of wanted to to to share with you and again this material was as of uh I think the end of August but uh just to kind of let you know where the the Eda itself is that uh you know you had cash of um $518,000 um there's fund balance of $528,000 so from a financial standpoint um you're you know sitting pretty good part of that information will be beneficial when we go into item number two um when we talk about the facade Improvement program any other questions any other comments on item a downtown do L manual so moving forward 2025 would be the kind of the start date for it and yep yep we get done sometime in 2025 we can start the program as yep really as possible yeah now we're not worried about the funding the part of it we're already set so we can go forward when we're ready to go yep yep and it'll be incorporated in the budget yep yep correct thank you that sounds good want to move on to the facade Improvement program please Dan facade Improvement program um I think uh when we had talked about this uh we were at the point we're very much interested in moving it forward and so I had mentioned that there was a couple of cities that um have had facade uh Improv Improvement programs um city of Oakdell but they've discontinued their's there's the city of Northfield um they still have theirs um and so um plagiarism is a key to key to my life when it comes to writing uh things and so I I was fortunate enough to uh have made connection with h the community development director um at Northfield um and so um kind of wrote um what you're seeing here is is a basically quite a bit of it age we're all kind of trying to figure 115 I think it's 115 of 125 I'm sorry thank you appreciate that I think I think is everybody finding that 115 115 so it it's a the city of North St Paul Economic Development Authority facade Improvement program um and so um this kind of describes the program the purpose uh who can apply um for a matching Grant how much are the matching grants um and uh when are the grants available uh what will the matching Grant dollars U pay for um what will the matching grants dollars not pay for um what are the eligible properties and then kind of gives information of how do I receive a grant and kind of walks through through all of that um there's a lot of decisions here um again this is just a a draft um this is really up to you to decide um how you want to do this um I think the program the purpose is um you know if you want to read through that um I think it describes what you've been talking about um I I can quickly go through it the city of nurse nurse paaul recognizes the important role that donon plays in the city's Vitality strategic planning efforts of The Economic Development Authority identify downon r revitalization as an important objective a well-maintained and attractive public realm reflects Community Pride and contributions to Urban Vitality building facades are critical elements of the public realm and in a downtown district the need for ongoing maintenance is crucial uh to preserving a character and experience known to visitors of Downtown North St Paul the facade Improvement grant program aims to strengthen Revitalize and sustain the downtown by encouraging and assisting Property Owners to make improvements to buildings within the downtown area by providing a financial incentive the program will stimulate private investment and support stabilized and increased property values the Eda is funding this program over the course of three years each year the Eda will review the program outcomes and make adjustments as necessary that's kind of the overarching kind of purpose for it [Music] um who can apply for the matching Grant right now and this is up for discussion um it's the program would extend to all commercial properties along 7th Street and marget Street to Highway 36 to 6 Street except for the postal office um that would be the program area um building owners and Commercial tenants with property owners approval of commercial properties within the project area can apply for a facade Improvement Cod Grant for-profit and not for-profit entities are eligible to apply as long as the grant is used for a commercial building does that make sense and then how much um are the grant matching grants grants will pay for 50% of the total project costs up to a maximum Grant amount of $20,000 per property and again that's just a number that kind of threw out there um Grant funds must be matched one for one with private dollars owners of multiple properties can apply for separate grants for each property as long as the cumulative Grant amounts awarded does not exceed the maximum Grant amount um the minimum in other words that total 20,000 um the minimum Grant amount is 5,000 or 10,000 for a total project cost and the total facade program Grant amount is is limited to $200,000 so putting an overall limit on it right now again that's something that can be changed as we review the program the interest and so forth y sounding so good so far most we discussed the last time yep so let's keep on going then yeah roll R and roll or maybe we stop right now uh when are the grants available um applications will be accepted at any time throughout the year um so again if you're looking to move forward with this I would adjust your budget um to U put $200,000 in there again it's you know basically it's being funded through your fund balance and that's why I kind of told kind of shared with you that you're at $528,000 um you know right now uh currently uh what will the matching Grant dollars pay for uh facade Improvement Grants can pay for a variety of exterior billing facade improvements the work must be visible from a public Street or sidewalk the following types of improvements are eligible for Grants now this isn't an exclusive list this is just kind of given an idea of what some of those are and that's part of that um what Riley was talking about we'll kind of learn as the applications come in obviously this you know this Eda would be the ones we you know um you know we would see that um through the application that um staff would first kind of review um would bring that to the Eda um for your comments um and whether to move forward with it or not but I think we can learn from that um so this list isn't exhaustive it's more or less just to kind of give kind of a flavor for it it can be a restoration of exterior finishes and materials masonary repairs and Tuck pointing exterior painting or reciting removal of architectural inappropriate or incompatible exterior finishes and materials repair or replacement of windows and doors replacement must be architecturally appropriate uh contracted labor related to any of the above improvements includ including designed work for improvements um that are to be completed up to 25% of the total project cost is eligible other improvements similar in nature to the above and then Grant funds um may be used to pay for materials uh and you know some projects may require prior approval from the historic preservation commission do we have a commission I'm not sure I don't think we have one anymore I think we have one so if it has a historical nature how is that done in this city excuse me it was blended into uh what did we blend that into the U we used to have the Planning Commission kind of took it over generally yeah I think that was it yeah we used to have a design and historical Review Committee that says prior approval approval from a Planning Commission not historic preservation commission yeah okay got a lot of Architects a lot of good knowledge on that one so I think take advantage of that okay that be changed uh the St Nur St Paul requires permits for most of the eligible uh improvements listed above for questions about permits please contact the Community Development Department um information is there what will the matching Grand dollars not pay for the following activities are not eligible for matching grants improvements already in progress or completed prior to contract approval so in other words we won't reimburse for work that's already been done improvements to a building interior rear or side not visible from a public Street or sidewalk improvements to non-commercial buildings Roofing HVAC systems building Mechanicals or security systems fencing exclud excludes decorative fencing as part of of landscaping Improvement parking areas Billboards roof signs or temporary signs uh Dynam uh Dynamic display or electronic message signs conforming signs or onings other than to bring them into compliance with the zoning code purchase or rental of tools and equipment or for labor performed by the building or business owner family members employees or any other person with a financial interest in the Pro property or business and any other improvements not deemed eligible what about permit costs typically I've seen programs like this where if you know if the improvements require a building permit then we would not allow these Grant funds to pay for the permit cost itself I've seen that in some facade Improvement projects thoughts something think I would I would put the cost on the on the owners so make that an exclusion exclusion ineligible expense that would be that' be my I think that makes sense I agree I don't think that's something the city needs to in a sense we're paying our right yeah we're paying paying half of it yeah right yeah okay keep that separate we did have some pretty good discussion about signage as well before I mean there were some different opinions on that not to the waters but build you guys okay with the wording in here when it comes to the sign aspect of it okay any signs on any one that one you're talking about for the non-compliant yeah I mean clearly like Billboards or roof signs but um you know some signs window signage you window clings that type of stuff yeah there's some things that can dress up a building too that make look pretty nice so but I just want I know we had some conversation about it previously and I didn't know if anybody else anymore put on that what kind of what do you thinking well you could look at you could look at it two ways it could be a a brand new sign or it could be replacement of an ex an existing sign that may be dilapidated looks bad you know I think those signs you might want to be eligible to improve because that's going to overall improve the look of the facade well I think the whole I think the the overall expectations of this program is to enhance the structural capability of the building I don't understand totally agree that signs is going to help advertise magnify the business I think that's on the business owner we're talking about the structural integrities of the buildings those are separate sign is not an instructural I think if you I I do agree with you I think if you do open up to signs you're going to get a lot of sign sign requests probably any other thoughts on signage I'm kind of as I've driven up and down I'm I kind of a more in line with depending on what the sign is um there's a couple buildings downtown that cleaning up their their marker on their front would make a huge difference um and if this is something that can tip them over to get it done I would be supportive of it um if it's to hang a sign that doesn't exist if it's to do those types of things I I think I would I would question it but so what I'm hearing is is if you have a sign that's not really fitting in or it's it's deteriorated we're going to want you to revamp the front of your building first before we put a new sign back on you're putting lipstick on a pig right yeah I mean I can I say names I have an example okay I won't say [Laughter] it so but there's a there's there's a couple examples of where it would it would benefit the downtown greatly by update having updating the S the existing sign but to your point do some additional work to the front of the building as well so as long as it's attached to the building I was thinking you know can't be window signs or stuff like that if it's a permanent attachment to the building maybe that would be so we uh at the liquor store when we remodeled the biggest one of the uh big price what do you call it uh obstacles for us was to uh put money into a new sign in order Oakdale actually had a sign program just for signs because it was a great Improvement but signs are very expensive it really hinders a lot of people from upgrading their signs because they just can't afford it and they're putting in half we're only paying for half so they're paying for half of their sign so were you were you looking at more from an existing signs not new signage brand new signage what I don't want to get into is if we have if we have a business that the we take off the sign we still have a structural component of the front of the building that needs to be I don't want a nice new sign going over the structural Integrity that needs to be improved that's not that's not making any that's not making any Financial sense yeah my my from our from our seat on this money it doesn't make any sense my concern is if you open it up to signs I can I can see a lot of applicants thinking hey I can get 50% of his new sign paid for I'll do it without doing any other improvements whatsoever correct I don't know if I don't know if you want to go I I think that's your part of one of your that's where that's they're only going to submit applications for a new sign could you Ty the two together you make the necessary improvements to the building and then you're eligible for that's what I'm thinking I think that would be smart what if they don't need any improvements to the building and they just want to up I think that's a different that's a different conversation you know is there something with code with the front I mean is it just making it look better or it's not under compliance it's probably under compliance it just doesn't look good is what we're looking at we still have our sign ordinances and I would assume that even when that new sign went up they asked to see what you're were going to do with it wouldn't they still review it yeah if they're replacing a sign that's not really changing size dimension how it's it it you can just like if you're just refacing a sign you can do that if you're changing anything now it has to come into whatever the updated whatever the current sign signage code is so if they're going to change this their sign that's where the real expenses because it's essent essentially a whole new sign I I just I don't know I don't know how you tie those together I don't know how you say okay we'll give you I'm just using round numbers here we're going to give you $10,000 and but you have to spend $7,000 on building versus I I don't know how you write that into a a policy some sort of appro understand that's that's difficult to is it just painting is it stuckle work is it you there's so many variables and at the end of the day we still have the ability to accept a reject re the request they would still have to get a signed permit because that's a totally separate permit so that has its own separate view by staff I mean that the easiest is you just no signs right that's clean and cut that's the simplest the problem is I I think what Tim was saying I think you could benefit by having some businesses update their sign because I think that's going to improve the look but then now you're getting into a situation where they can get a free half free a half of a sign for free and that's all you're going to get a lot of applicants for and they look at yeah we got that's that's not the spirit of this right they look at they got to you know we do in the front we still got our old sign because we can't afford to replace it then you got the opposite where you got new but the crappy old sign hanging there still so is it possible to do a couple phases where we focus on the building itself see how popular the program is and then take a look at sign I think could probably do just a facade only Improvement um plan project see what the see what the temperature is like if it's really good do a second maybe in a year or two let's do a sign one nothing stopping us from doing that great idea Brandon thanks and you can always you can always amend this to include that at a later date and I think add more money top yeah a separate deal is just for a sign mhm just for signing alone just for signage I think that's a great idea all right I'm for that so it sounds like stick with only facad improvements this round this round mhm see they know if they fix the building hey there's going to be you know something else coming along and then you know we're looking in phases because we want be able to work our way with people to help them does that sound good to everybody not to throw another kink in it but you're' been full of Kink so far what side are you playing on impr the front of their building but they want to put a sign on it as well I don't want to put different holes in it than what I need to if I'm going to do a different sign later to remove a bad sign to get the tuck work done again very many variables oh was a good idea to use both I know it I just got a hey Brandon that was a bad you're off let's go back your back your mug once we agree everybody stops talking that's the new rule there's too many variables I get what you're saying though if you're going to redo the front and you got to take it down to fix it indeed I I think it's a tough one I mean can we put it that um signs are at the discretion of you know put it in there the second L I know as far as I know that face you make it yeah we don't yeah I don't say what they have on it but yeah and I mean for me if it's if the sign is in conjunction with the rest of the facade I would include that as part of the project if it's strictly signed no no I just where my My head goes is the new construction that looks fantastic down town the structural Integrity of the old buildings you know I just I like that focus and getting that back up and where we need to be signs are important don't get me wrong but structural Integrity I think is yeah is huge but I do like what I'll use your proper name this time council member Cole or member Cole or whatever it is on here um said it's part of the thing it's not just signs only if it's the faade and the sign needs to be done then it can be included in it okay what if they have $50 worth of facade improvements and then well that means they buildings in good shape yeah or they're just finding the cheapest thing to do turn off your microphone too so one thing we do in the electric department when we offer rebates um there's items that don't fall nicely into a pigeon hole so we call it a custom rebate and then we can assess that to see if they're still saving energy we can still get you a rebate maybe do we have like a custom uh type deal to where if it comes to a sign or something out of the ordinary that you guys need to contemplate make a decision on uh for something unique you could do that it would still be available right would have saved a lot of conversation you said that first I mean for me at the end of the day I would like the sign portion incorporated into a facade Improvement if it's a oneoff it's a oneoff um I mean part of this conversation was driven by a local business that did come and ask um if the city had a facade program and at the time we had let it lapse or had elected not to do it um and if I'm not mistaken I think that did include a sign um I know they've done some of the additional facade work already um but so that's that's my only reason for holding holding through to to doing something sign related if it has something to do with the front but I also get the point if you're going to replace the front door do you you know for 50 bucks do you get MH so I think car's kind of a one-off when it when it comes in is kind of the deal there's subjectivity involved in everything yeah I I you know going down that road I think if you if you require the business or the the property owner to show that other improvements other than just the sign are being done then that would be eligible and that's that's easy for us to verify that you know instead of trying to do you know play discretion that's that can get really sticky quickly so in the section that says what will the matching Grant uh dollars pay for why don't we have something to the effect of uh signs if they are an integral part of the Improvement will be considered so we leave it kind of open and it's again as we move in through the program we're going to end up seeing that it has there's a review process and so that can be we're not eliminating it but we leave it open for you know for this type of discussion at a later at a later date I like the opportunity of a gray area yeah at least for discussion for the discussion piece to it now is Staff making that termination or is that going want to be coming back in front of that's on you guys we'll put some verbage together for yeah it's on the mayor sometimes sometimes it's give it to the color blind mayor let him decide that's why he makes a Big M keep of it all right are we good with that I think so okay all right thank you and then it's uh right MH pardon whatever you write whatever I write I like this uh and then you know how do I receive the grant you meet the program requirements uh there's step one step two you contact the Community Development um Department uh contact you know contact Community Development staff to set up a meeting to discuss your project um his darkk buildings may require prior prior approval from the Planning Commission step three submit the application and agreement the agreement um still needs to be written up we'll need a little a little bit of a an attorney um assistance on that uh so you submit the facade Improvement matching Grant application um and then there will be a participation agreement to the program administrator including a written description contract bids that meet the following guidelines um and then it'll be review and select uh The Proposal review and Gant selection will be conducted by Community Development staff and The Economic Development Authority and will be evaluated through a competitive process selection will takeen account the following total value of project current conditions of building Aesthetics of finished work available funds for Grant and preference given to projects prop U proposing structural repairs so that kind of gives where where Joe was talking about um and then uh a secured sign copy step five secure secure a sign copy of the application and participation agreement uh before you begin be sure to obtain all the necessary City permits for the the project or ensure your contractor pull the necessary permits permit and taxes paid verification is required prior to Grant dispersements uh step six uh complete the project and submit the documentation of course we're going to be asking for proof of payment to contractor in one of the following two forms either lean waivers cancel check sign receipts and so forth so they can't uh and then attached U beginning on page 120 is just kind of an you know uh an application um form um to kind of get the whole entire process um started and again we we would need to work on the agreement component to it um and with the application in the agreement once those are approved and assigned um then the uh owner um can move forward with the Improvement project and at completion they would submit all the necessary paperwork and get reimbursed for at least half of the cost up to no more than $20,000 per project clear as mud thanks and again this can be adjusted and amended as we're moving through as time moves forward um it's just kind of there's been a lot of discussion let's you know try to get moving and move forward with something and see how it works out um and then it continuous evaluation so one question so this is basically a downtown facade program you know so people when they look at this you know maybe we should say downtown Improvement program so that yeah is over on the other side of town goes a little bit further and it also incorporates Margaret Street yeah which is part of the downtown yeah Corridor yeah so it's kind of defined for that y yeah as far as and again that could be something that as time moves on can be modified too I was thinking if if we don't get a whole lot of response from downtown there are some properties outside of the downtown y area that could use some help yeah so so the name of it is a facade Improvement program it isn't specifically for the downtown right now the geographical area is that just kind of started off but again um you may end up finding you know you could have 10 applications which 10 applications tomorrow or $200,000 that uh um that could be um right away or may find out that there's nothing that's coming in and so you may want to expand that and again all that does is is Take Your Action to be able to do that yeah like phase one type of thing absolutely and and again this is a program that's you know should be being evaluated and and modified as we're going through we're going to learn things as we as we move forward um to me there's never a program that's set on day one that's absolutely perfect um and we should be evaluating it and making sure that you know um that it's meeting the criteria in which your your vision I mean I I think Joe Joe said it with a lot of a lot of passion what the intent of what this Improvement should be and then it was good discussion on that sign but you know then it comes around that you know if it's an integral part of that of that Improvement it should be considered it shouldn't be um you know Brian he cre more issues with that with this with his holes you know on the side but but that's a true piece and so I think we're going to learn and that's where whether you know the conversation and and R Riley's um thought process is do you how quickly do you start that updating of that design manual because we're going to be learning things as we're moving forward that could be very insightful and help lead how that design manual is going to be because we want it to be something that's going to stand for at least at least a decade yeah I I do like the gray area like like like uh like Terry said because if you say business facade you know phase two may be doing we have two other you know business centers that uh are getting older that could probably use some help too so it's not why is everything happening downtown what about the rest of us that aren't downtown you know be able to keep that a little more General and hopefully work our way to other other parts of the city too and be able to help them out as well absolutely absolutely abolutely yep Go sir can can we talk a little bit about our action plan to get this out there um so businesses know about it CU that seemed like um way before my time but it seemed like when we had this program before nobody utilized it um one I because I I don't think that they knew about it um how can we how can we make this second go around a better better experience for this for these businesses one thing that's working well right now is now we have a Communications specialist on board here and she has already done that on several occasions walk the downtown whether or not it's giving out information about um you know events that are coming up or just really being plugged in going to the Business Association making sure that people know about this stuff to get it out there so I don't think at that time we had that um so I think that will help get it out of course it'll be on the regular the website uh we can put it in the city newsletter but I think we can hit it better than we did before Oh i' be more than happy to get out there and knock on some doors for you guys and do the face to face and let business owners know this is coming in the pipeline this is the process this is what we need to do rather than just a a marketing material whether it's online or whatever uh at the end of the day we are still very old school in North St Paul so I think knocking on the doors shaking hands and eye to eye contact will go a long way with this program so Riley the communications director if they need help please let me know and a suggestion on on in the on that line is is that there should be some sort of like pamphlet or brochure or whether it's a leaflet or whatever that that's that's made that we can walk through and hand out and and you say kind of old school I don't know isn't that e extraordinary to to actually show that you actually care and you're walking through and making sure that they're informed to show that you know the the city is you know um is working with them so I I I think that that's just a very positive gesture and that I think we're you know as as uh I'm I know he's executive director but I'm still call him city city manager as as city manager frandle had said we have staff now that um has already been starting to do some of that stuff and and so I think we were in a better position um so it just let's get that agreement going so we have everything set let's make sure we get our website prepared get some sort of pamphlet together and and let let's hit it another question I thought of just don't be covered it and I didn't remember but as far as um timeline so somebody doesn't start something and it drags on forever is there any kind of timelines or anything like that we should think about I think first we're talking about going out for the RFP for the downtown design manual no I was talking about the facade for the for the people that we we um give the money being started yeah we give the money exactly you can't start and then have it sit there and then that's what I was talking about is you know they get the Grant and you know they get signed up for it and they get started and it's like you know they'd have to get a permit what they to to do the the project the one year Chris six months so they would have the the permit itself would have would kind of be your timeline of when you got it we do have a couple that are in right now in Q in in this area that have redo their permits on a a normal basis and don't seem to get too far and I would sure that they would want to update or uh you know fast trck that since they're going to pay for it and we'll reimburse them all right yeah it's not up front all right yeah it's not yeah it's not upfront and to me that if you wanted to put a stipulation that you know uh once approved it needs to be done within a certain time frame whe let's just say 6 months a year whatever to me that would be incorporated in within the agreement itself that they're going to be executing I just want to make sure that there's some kind of we're not come back two years later and say hey but then you also have to you also have to be prepared that you're going to have to have have some sort of way that they can extend that okay thank you um as far as when the program would start since we're sitting on September 10th um there would be a lot of communication type of work the agreement everything to be set up um easiest way to put the funding sources just incorporated into your budget that would go to effect January 1st 2025 but if you wanted it before that that would you I mean we can always make that happen too but that allows ample time that there's you know and and you know Riley will have a lot of work um with his staff to be prepared as applications come in and I do like the idea of a marketing piece yes and you want to make sure you're yeah you want to make sure when you're when you're kicking this off that we're taking we're taking it seriously exactly that's why I think January would be good just because there's a lot of yearend stuff that happens around here and a lot of craziness and yeah so we agree on that sure okay so we won't review any submissions until first that what I'm I mean we aren't going to fund anything till first correct yeah yeah which I asked which one right yep yep to your first question though is this body anticipating to review the submissions for approval or is that on a staff side s like yod I mean that could delay things you know if this body only how often we meet right right I if it's within the parameter of the policy that this body created I don't see why this it would need to be that's kind of how I view it yeah what what we're talking about is the set it up yeah we can't babysit everything that don't make all lot yeah no I whatever is easiest for the person applying yeah okay I think you would want to have final approval coming from the Eda on the application and thing but I think it should be staff doing the reviewing recommendations they may give you a report too in your time of how many applicants you came in this is the only one that we're bringing forward um or whatever the case this meets all the criteria this is ready to go yep we're ready to go here it is everything said but let staff do all the review and and Merit of the project itself um because they can work with you know the the business owner if they need to tweak their program before it's asked for a final approval there's anything else that needs to go with the Planning Commission because maybe there's some zoning type of thing I mean you don't know what's exactly and they would have all that wrapped up in a bow before it comes in front of I like that all right pardon you're good I I'm good I think this is very exciting it's nice to see it moving forward and I thank you all for uh the opport to speak in front of you tonight so you I'm going to I'm going to go now and uh I I'm going to my uh oldest grandson is uh in Cub Scouts and tonight will be the first Cub Scout so last night we built a rocket and tonight we're shooting it off nice nice so I have super glue all over my fingers to prove it but oh Sticky Fingers is what you're telling sticky fing well you let's check his pockets on the way out I think I thank you very much this is good good to get off the ground and move forward I appreciate it appreciate all the work if you're playing with rockets you're going to be off sick tomorrow we're [Laughter] goggles all right next up is Staff updates you want to tag team this one here Mr gram sure so article 7 uh just give you a quick update they're moving along very well on that um fourth floor FL is getting close to being even done I mean they're getting appliances in uh final touches on it they're still looking at that December 1st date for uh opening um I think you had some meetings won't you yeah we um you talking about the meeting this afternoon yeah yeah so we had um see me counil Ramsey County henen County and deed all um do a uh an update for uh a Brownfield grant program that they have going on um and we had a a pretty good attendance from local other communities they had one in uh Golden Valley two or three weeks ago they wanted to hit something over here on the east side and so they uh were just here I was I was just there this afternoon uh and then they walked over and did a a tour of article 7 because that used um some of that grant funding so kind of a success story that they wanted to show what could be done with those grants nice good deal that was very helpful I'll take Delaware think it'd be a good idea yeah um so we got shovels on the ground started actually yesterday uh they came in and paid for their uh building permit and um so yeah that's that's moving along I I popped out there over my lunch break just to check it out and they've got backos and excavators all going uh the first two units are going to be um if you can Envision a map here uh along 17th it's the 9th and 10th units which is the Far Eastern two units um so closest to that house that house on 17th so those those are the ones they're going to start there and build those as sort of a demo uh show home um and then uh over the over the winter continue to build out the rest uh hopefully be done by spring so um so that's moving along great um Margaret re Commons I'll jump into that then uh so we did have uh a Planning Commission meeting uh was that last week yeah that was last week uh the the Planning Commission uh reviewed a um a draft RFP put together by staff um had a couple minor edits but that is looking good we're going to be sending that to the city council at their meeting on the 17th for approval so um you'll see that um kind of long-term time time frame for that we'll we'll get it out assuming it's approved by Council we'll get it out here mid September um submissions uh for proposals will be due uh by the first of the year again you know second last quarter of the year is kind of has a lot of um uh holidays a lot time off so uh I want to make sure that we give our developers a plenty of time to put together because it's it's an extensive uh thing to respond to an RFP for a development project so um and then once um once we're pass that we'll uh sit down and review them and and pick a couple we'll work with the Planning Commission on that before we finally go to the planning or to the city council with a couple selected um options and and let the city council look at that and decide that's exciting stuff it is thank you tle Bell is also one of those programs that have very quick up with the building um they're up and going we've got uh power over there got the Transformer set um they're getting close I don't I haven't heard an open date have you on that it's very close though yeah they're moving along really well um one issue that we kind of saw with it the neighboring property is kind of let that grow up pretty high I mean some of the trees are probably 20t tall I mean you can't even see that back there so we have reached out to them um we did get a response from them as of uh today that they are going to be hiring their own uh contractor to go out there and get that mowed down cut down um they gave us a one to two week time frame for doing that property to the north and property to the South that's true too it's to the north this one's to the north but the South yeah has issues as well uh Pine Tree Center um they've had some issues over the time some people were doing some dumping out there they got them cleaned up um you know they sold the Pizza Factory it's now buddy's place uh I know that they'd give him at least a six-month extension probably till the first of the year it sounds like before they may be moving on at that point uh our contacts been with the owner's son he said that uh they have the possibility of maybe demoing that and then putting it up for sale uh they've been back and forth with different ideas they've even talked about development themselves but uh so we'll see how that pans out um it's getting pretty rund down I didn't know if you'd heard anything different knowing no okay yeah oh you wonder who you was down here okay well it sounds like they might be moving over to Lake Elmo um but yeah nothing new yet um that would be a good place Peter for you to build your worldwide headquarters yeah right on that spot is what I'm thinking yeah maybe we'll we'll we'll build there there you go there you go yeah last one there's that Eda consultant um I had reached out a couple times with uh Baker Tilly I not heard anything back so uh we'll have to go down a different route uh so more information to come next time so on the consultant piece I reached out to the league um didn't get a lot of Direction because the league Minnesota cities doesn't provide recommendations um but they did encourage um two things for us to do one go out on their website and utilize their Marketplace which is someplace else we can you know we can drop rfps if we don't already do it today um and they just said po pose the question out there because there are companies out there that utilize that um as a for lack of a better word a lead source so they can come back and talk to us the other piece that was out there is is there's a kind of a bulletin board for city managers um if you haven't dropped that out there yet that goes to all city managers in the state as well to see if anybody came back with recommendations we get it every day y it's good source thanks for the update absolutely um turn it over to you for Eda member updates okay Peter I can never say your last name right so Peter nailed it I don't have any updates okay remember furong lot of bears out lot of bears out there I'm glad you made it back in one piece and on your end no updates okay for me than you sir no updates I'm pretty excited about this facade program though I think this is a this is a really neat thing for our community yeah I agree um today council member Cole and I were at the ribbon cutting for Old National Bank so that was a it was a nice beautiful remodel inside there they gave a check for $1,000 to the North St Paul food shelf so I thought that was very nice to them as a community I did not realize the heritage of that bank they said they've been in nor St Paul for 114 years wow as different names but that's it's been in our St Paul for that long so that's quite a nice little I actually have a savings book for my dad 1937 or whatever they actually go in there and they would write in the balance oh really you know they' write they subtract and then they' sign it Y and that's how much was in your so that was that was your in there cool so yeah it was a very it was a great um a great uh lesson has it been same location sorry same location NOP in fact that they said it was the old K&J at one time it was there I don't know if there was one before that but K&J and then they built they weren't sure they put a new drive-thru on in ' 86 but they weren't sure that building up there was built we had a nice conversation a lot of uh a lot of people showed up and um was it was a good group so that was exciting anything else that I can think of I mean we we covered off on everything of mine my my question about North and South is you andit had conversation along mcnight the properties to the South I don't know if that's at easement land is owned by the county or if that's owned by the businesses but um with Taco Bell coming in there there's no visibility from Highway 36 that there's that there's anything there either and I don't know who that falls on but that might be something we can to take a look at but and then the other piece is the uh the lot to the west of um the credit union um which is owned by the Yeah so that could that's got some pretty tall stuff growing in there too just to kind of clean up that area as we've got some newness in there it would like you it would be nice to make sure that we move forward with you know the best foot forward that we can for for the newness that's going in um the only other thing oh um should somebody reach out to to buddies and see if there's any way we can um as we did with Cal to see if there's any way we can find property for him in the city before he moves out um I've been in there the food's still as good as it was before still have the little chips and the so I know we tried when Kell was still in there yeah so I don't know um I mean I've seen on social media it sounds like they've got a commitment to Lake ELO but that's what I've heard is it is it worth One Last Shot knowing that we've got you know some some open facility you know here in here in the city whether it be downtown or you know some of the other strip centers uh and the only other thing is my tenure with um Eda is coming to an end at the end of the year I chose not to to reup um so as my official Duty as Council representative will go away I still have a desire to stay here come January 1st so um I do know that there is currently one opening if not two on the Eda uh mayor assigns who gets to based on um based on city rules um gets to ass sign but I would like to throw my hat in the ring uh I've got three and a half years on here and uh I still have a lot of passion for the city and a lot of passion for the development so just wanted to air that out as well thank you very much sounds good if nothing else call for adjournment at 511 so moved so moved council member Cole second council member Matthews or council member sorry vice president Matthews just getting all sorts ofs I know it's just stay with me man it just keeps going it doesn't really matter all those in favor say I I thank you very much appreciate it our next meeting we are didn't really talk about that did we October 8th October 8th okay good to see