##VIDEO ID:-DaDqLu1vjE## 534 like to welcome everyone to the water SE commission's meeting and um ask everyone to please rise conations flag United States of America stands na indivisible thank all right was absent from the last meeting so Steve motion and abstain from okay all right then I make a motion to accept the minutes of the October 8 2024 I second I second all in favor I I good to go good job as us thank you you're the best all right uh we'll just move right down the line we just want to go to the go new business we'll go right down okay um po engineering uh 257 259 mfield AV proposed utility plan presentation evening for the record B for engineering representing the or the owner IW the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers what's your name again I'm sorry m B yeah okay first off i' like to thank Frank I know he's corresponded with us a bunch of different times helping us get this thing just about right so I appreciate all this time and effort to make sure we didn't have the wrong plan hopefully we didn't have the wrong plan we came in here just as a a little background the International Brotherhood of electric workers has an office building here which is actually in Mansfield they bought this parcel I think right now has um a house here with a barn in this lot is kind of abandoned they have some poles set up here they're proposing build an 8,000 ft um facility so basically what's going to be is um something I'm probably not qualified to handle but they go and they train people to um to clim poles and to do it safely and to work around electric so they're going to expand upon their other training facilities they have there um yeah my understanding is this one's mostly um like office Bas or their headquarters and this be y yeah so I think even inside the building they would have doors for for trucks could pulling even have poles inside the building for training on the on the inside um so as far as water sewer usage I think it would be um pretty pretty limited it would be 10 to 12 person linemen per class they typically expect one class per day if they on have a rare key they might have two classes um a couple small office spaces around the Meine for the trainers and things like that um they would also have a sprinkler system just based on the the size of the building um for for water connection again I have to thank thank Frank because this wasn't our initial proposal but proposing an 8 in water line that comes all the way down the side of the building here it would end in a hydrant for for flushing out of the water line and then we would St um water and fire services off of that um I know fire was also concerned about um making sure the FTC was within 75 ft of the hydrant we proposed to put it here which is 75 ft of the existing hydrant but now that we have a hydrant back here also have some options to stick it back there so where are they going to put them now that's you see yeah I think we're opposing it still put put here but I think if they wanted to Swit it back they do have that ability to um and then for for sewer I interested in speaking on that but we propos to have it come out the front here there's an existing sewer man hole in the streets we proposed to connect I guess into the shelf of that of that manhole um the water line edge of pavement so hopefully not too much um Escavating in the in the road there the SE manhole unfortunately is a little into the pavement so we'll have to to deal with that is the water man on the same side of the street it is good feel like it's always on the opposite side no I remember the heer being on the other side I think he brought that over on the yeah right y So based on the layout and the proximity to the end of the the Town Line here there's no benefit to doing a loop here you're not you're not going to gain anything I think i' set you guys an email about it so uh basically this is a similar scenario to what the new Senior Center looks like with with that single feed coming in domestic and and uh and the fire service tapped off of that with the hydrant at the end they'll have room for the trucks to combine in case of fire Tru yeah Hy replacement isn't locked in stone on this map um it's going to be you know um looked at by the fire department make sure they have the this swep analysis and stuff and any type of ball or anything that necessary so this is this is 90% of where it's going to be that hydrant might swing left or right that's the only hydrant on there right um the only one that's going to be added there is one directly in front of the building that's so they don't need one on like the top right corner anywhere that those two would cover y that' be cover wise y plus it's going to have the the suppression system internal as well so right now there's a house there is yeah small small house it used to have like a small hobby Farm or something there years ago yeah driven by that [Music] mil she made stained glass she used want stain so the existing water service that gets capped by this project it will get cut and Capp is that by us is that no it's done it's done by the developer we'd recommend if wherever possible especially on the state road to try and get that 8 in line basically almost in the same Trench so you're not making two cuts into the state road and having to do extra repairs and extra work so um if the layout works we work they wouldn't use that stuff they cap it' be cut and C yep be different size anyways probably just so Frank I assume this is okay with you this is perfect with me good was the old property not connected to S it is not not sure what size and location of it they're going to need a larger Stone more likely sound was yeah yeah pretty minimal I mean we can look at that as an option depending on what what size St was there if not that'd be C just cing yep and what's the time frame for this um well we meet front plane board this evening after after this meeting I think they be hoping to um get going in the spring I think probably this year's obviously shot be a bad time to start construction but I think they're hoping to have everything lined up for for the spring they own the property already so none of that stuff has to go through right I like it me too pretty straightforward pretty simple right so we just make a motion approve these plans basically yeah approve approve them sign them like you guys have in the past and we have one on record is there a plan number to reference on this um we have we have a whole set I don't if you want just this plan or the whole so we can just read from it so we can yeah c501 that number I can give you a date is there a date yeah November 8th 2024 all right I would like to make a motion to approve the bowler engineering plans for 257 259 Mansville AV numbered c501 dated 11824 second all in favor I I nice [Laughter] J easy thanks for coming in appreciate it thank you we at least need one to have signed um if you don't if you want to leave the other with us that's great yeah we'll just sign one for now we'll keep the other two for the field unless you need them do you need a sign copy for yourself um it'll be in the vs right there yeah okay [Music] we have another gentlem here let see from Mr Design Group from here so we can skip over the do we have you guys sign these sign repeat the copy and move right on whichever one's easier [Music] one yeah find one just keep it on sorry so big hey it's just permanent when did this get permanent that's been permanent where you been I'm not looking at it all right we're going to we're going to skip ahead and um go to the old business um is a prern in level design is that correct yes okay yeah I just want to zero minutes fail to have proposed utility plan presentation it says 20 minutes no more just kidding just kidding it's have a good night thank you everyone uh Nick heling from Level design representing the s um going in for J Campbell uh we're speaking that on utility plan of changing the sewer um Dan sent over some plans I think to Frank overlaying the change from Gravity sewer to a low pressure sewer system um and that's basically what we do we finalize those plans with manholes the manholes are just U strictly used for cleanout purposes is for the low pressure system um basically it you know it gives you the ability to have inverts four feet from the surface so no crazy deep inverts um running through sorry running through long Manfield a long path Reservoir um as you can see here um as we move down the road you'll be tying into bags manhole um as you can see here at the end we can actually change the last leg of a low pressure sewer to gravity so that that'll give the ability of other systems any laterals coming in from other areas the ability to tie into that manhole and doesn't have to be pressurized what's the distance of that gravity portion from here to here yeah uh 173 ft um and we do have the ability to move that last manual so if we wanted it closer or further away um all the other manholes are spaced out at 300 ft um this one last one is uh 2628 so if I understand this correctly um this is at the um the intersection of reservoir we I know I'm familiar with the property so we're going to bring that up towards the center of town is that what I'm understanding or we going towards Reservoir this is right down SE from okay Ro y but um yeah he said that you know we see these plans we just finalized with those um I'm happy to answer any questions about the low pressure sewer or anything like that I know there were some other correspondents about a lot um the attorney John was going to speak upon that if uh if warranted but residents are able to tap into that so it's almost yeah it's like a water uh because it's such a small line and it's low pressure the the tap is the equivalent of like tapping a water service it's the um live tap with the connection um and to it and just drills right in and then it'll it's also an added cost for them to have the whole pump system and then they would need kind of power that power one out this is correct yes um if it's not the state won't uh mandate people connect if they have a working septic it's um I think it's 5 years a failed septic um unless they get a waiver if they're like you know couple hundred feet away instead of being right on the road um yeah is there a stud going to go up that that side road as you pass it what's that side Ro Pi yes right here one of that Stu that goes up there and then can be extended as as needed um and then sorry NOP it's good are the services being left to the properties like that doesn't show any Services people have to tap it later and cut the payment correct um actually the this uh the service is going to be you know minus the crossing of uh Reservoir a um it's going to be in the shoulder so there shouldn't you know if there's services that are coming down their their accessways and those would have to be repaved but everything else is in the shoulder and it shouldn't be required to be repaved um we slid it out basically from out we were headed at Center Line of the road we slid into the shoulder um I think Dan had correspondence with you Frank about that yeah so would this be in private this would the betterments are not in play here correct right yeah it's just that the cic fails have correct regular want to make sure that yeah the major concern is with not having the laterals across to each property so that it's at their basically at their property line to connect because now each individual person not only is going to have to pay the connection fee they're going to have to do a pump have to get a contractor to do the work in the street which requires a State Road opening permit know so there's a lot that you guys are leaving on the table expecting to be done by the residents here great yeah I I would I wish I could speak a little bit attacking you the way the gravity SE was before the stubs would have already been there and no one would ever have to tear up the street to the r right so now anybody that looks up to it will have to open up the street which could be an act of Congress some people yeah each one we need right which is difficult to obtain we we had issues obtaining one the and you're also saying that you're not leaving t's for the properties as as this is shown people are going to tap it like they would tap a water M correct yeah the low pressure system they would have to be have a pump in place so we're not going to like throw taps with pumps so that would be on the property owners to put their pump and then tie in because if you just leave Taps there the pressure of the system doesn't really U doesn't really work the same well in a normal pressure system we would be you know if we were doing it municipally we would leave the stuff to the property line with a shut off at each one so that it does so that it does work and then when they tie in they'll open up they open up the uh the connection and they install a check B that probably is how the typical system would work is that an option for this if they want to do this low pressure main to still be able to put stubs for the property so people don't have to dig up the road oh and that's how you would do it as a municipal SW if if you went into a neighborhood and you were doing low pressure sewer they would everybody would get stubbed just like the like somebody p and the whole E1 system but at least they on digging up the road yes property so I have a million questions um do we get anything like this in town we have a privately owned dedicated sewer line in a couple different areas um the most notable is North Cottage it's an inferior sized and inferior material and they can't even locate it because it's been in the ground for so long so it becomes an issue when you have emergency calls for markouts they actually had difficulties they hired a professional firm to mark that line when the East Main Street Improvement project was going on and it still got struck two times um the other one is the private line that was done by conine for the lendon street project um that's a dedicated main running down down the road no connections left for the residents there not a low pressure not a low pressure system with no connections to the street this this would be pretty unique so can we re maybe you don't I don't know you know how do we get this to the point Didn't we talk about gravity sewer it started it started with the gravity sewer yeah but didn't that change twice yes so the first time it was something else and then it came that and now we got this we did some value engineering we sat we had a meeting here with won and Samson with Frank and and uh I think it was Dan I think it was um and they explained that you know the gravity system the Deep gravity system in ledge and why it was cost prohibitive for them to have to put you know to be able to build their project and to have to front the cost of all of that sewer made it um you know it turned them upside down right as they try to do their math um so we had some discussions about making the gravity sewer shallower not going as far with the gravity sewer and then pumping to it um so there was definitely some back and forth on that and then I do remember that the last time consistent with what this is the last discussion was they were going to go to a precious sewer but I did think at that point we were still talking about Services across the road right is is what I remember so we had we understood that that was you know we didn't obvious we haven't nobody's approved it but we acknowledged that that was a cost savings but it's unfortunate you know the whole it's when you look at this system you know so if you flip down um let's go from the top down all they're really doing so from where their property is at the end here so you got the two buildings up there they each have quad E1 units it looks like so you got like eight grinder pumps total for the property they pump out to the street into this manhole and then they do um so before we were asking them to be gravity and go through that hump and downhill so now they're talking about pumping up to the top of the hill but then if you look from that point right there that is the high point Y so even if we call this a pressure sewer these homes will pump like if nobody else ever ties into it these properties will pump when the pumps turn off from that manhole if you flip the sheets all the way down it's just going to empty it's not going to m it's going to flow like at the gravity it's all just going to empty out which is just you know the whole concept is is frustrating that it could be gravity so if you could put in a shallow gravity sewer and do accomplish the same it would have to be bigger you would have to be 8 inch um but that sewer sh where those I think those manholes are in the same spot that they were when it was a gravity design if you know I feel like those were just left those are 300 AP so they're showing it as a 4 in which I question I had some questions about that so I don't we probably don't need to get into the nuts and bols of all of that I think like so we did a a significant review before and spent a lot of time we had a contract directly with Pyon that that contract is gone we're happy to do more reviews but there's no money in the in the budget to do that whether you're G to pay us or they're gonna pay us so I didn't want to go too crazy because this is a whole different concept right so it's a it's now it's a pressure sewer I did a quick review today you know I I do have questions about how it was sized I think the the 4 inch um for a pressure sewer is is probably too much I don't know that you'll get the right velocities but I I would need to if we were doing a Thor review I would just need to see the Cs on that which which is so maybe it would only need to be a 2 in or a 3 in if we ran the Cals it's been my experience it's it's too big yeah I think your velocities will be a problem you know especially if you you know eight grinder pumps I mean that's inch and a half or two inch I understand that it does need to be sized assuming that maybe everybody ties in along the way at some point but you would typically stage as people come in after you get to a certain number of homes you would increase the size you would you don't make the home M bigger you it really is incr and you have to size it you want to so that you get the right you keep things moving and it's not staying in the L which doesn't really matter in this system because none of it's going to stay in the line it's all going to empty when the pumps turn off it's just going to drain it's got an open before that Hill pie gravity that goes into that but you know so the I would question the pipe size the depth um see it's all like three to four feet deep and I understand this is all a this is all an exercise to be able to build their project and put a sewer in all the way down there that hopefully gives the town some benefit by people being able to tie into it in the future but but in the end it is about affordability and all of that but 3 to 4 feet is is too shallow I mean it's going to freeze you know especially if you know something this size if you're in the um in the frost layer you know when the frost heaves come it's going to impact it um you know like T and I were talking about earli I me water M's always at least five fet of cover is what we hold so pressure sewers we'll do four and a half fet and you might be okay with four but we recommend four and a half um why you insulate or you have to insulate it yeah for freezing and then and if it's in the shoulder then so it's both loading and freezing are you concerned so if it's not in the you know if we're out in the in the state highway we would also be concerned about the structural loading on top of it too um so it's just there's some concerns about the size of it the depth of it um and the lals yes so I've done as a civil engineer low pressure sewers for a community I'm just saying I'm familiar with the concept and B1 and the beauty about new1 if you don't know it does have built-in storage or the event there's no power so it's not like if you lose power you're can't you do have some storage capability so it's not I mean obviously if you lose power for 4 days you're in a lot of trouble um I like the idea except like I would like to see the Lal I agree we can definitely talk the laterals with detail you know whether or not it's a i gate b or whatever is at the end a curve Cur I would think that's um and therefore people can hook in easier and not have to deal with a state permit which is a diff difficult out get as most people wouldn't even know where to step we'd be a even know how to do it it it takes a little bit of little bit of time to get it in place and U then the contract is actually on on the hook for that trench for a year from there if they default then it comes back on the town difficult to patch the road with a state permit there's nothing easy about it for good reason I mean I don't know what I agree Steve I'd like to see the laterals in there keep the force man do we do we start with just that or do we have Steve do a little little bit more in depth review has be red by them once it's finally okay I'd like to see the hydraulic I mean I don't have to see the hydraulic act a problem but I think it we have to verify that it's going to meet a design self cleaning velocity is very very important this this becomes a maintenance nightmare I mean I know you have cleaned up the holes be happy to I'm not so sure the last time clean holes at Redmill Village have ever been opened so uh I'm just saying there's uh one more thing on this to in this letter there's a request that the water and sewer Commissioners agree to bear the cost of the repaving of the road we going to talk about that can ni speak absolutely so first of all um I'm Jack jaot on the attorney for Serv this isern we were told to be here at 6 so sorry the first we out of so um as I think we said in our mem that we sent up to you today we're trying to make this thing work uh planning board was it had an interesting take on things um as that I have appealed to the Superior Court um but with talking with the town planner and uh talking with uh others that they have suggested that maybe we could get this remanded to the planning board and this time they might take the positive vote they approved the site plan but did not approve the special permit for the two apartment buildings and so that's why we're here with you is to try to figure out how we can make this work financially because there if it doesn't work financially the project doesn't get yeah we think that there is an uh there were three requirements that the uh the indicated To Us by Town Council one was that we extend the sidewalk all the way up um into not only the two where were building but also lot e which is not a problem and they also had a second requests that even though your bylaw in my opinion is written backwards on the 10% affordability we agreed that we would go with that anyway and so uh of the 60 Apartments six of them would meet the affordability requirements which I understanding is you're at 10.02% 10 is the magic number where 40b doesn't in the head anymore I thought we were above 11 changes every year changes every year so as you add more houses so it can't hurt to add six more and so then their third request was that we give them what e if you want to flip it over one on the corner that's the one on the corner which is certainly commercially developable um it's every piece of property has challenges uh as I often say to boards all the easy properties were developed along time ago I've been saying that since Di and you aren't wrong so the bottom line here is that you know we're talking to them about whether we can give up any development rights but the whole thing is to make this work financially and so we understand that there may be some technical details as I'm listening here about the size of the line and and those sorts of things that that can be worked out but it would strike me that I've never seen a sewer name go in without the the laterals stub to the property lines so that the people along the way can connect in without having to get a state highway permit to dig a trench and you don't want your road duck up all that many times anyway so what we thought was that to make things work financially if you wave to the connection fees and permit fees uh and you also um found a way that we could get this paved on someone else's nickel than ours because I'm sure the state if we dig all these laterals the states didn't want the road to PID I've never seen that not happen so therefore the question really for you is is there a way that we can make this work financially because we think that there is a benefit to the town of getting this line in I understand it's you know it's it's part of your program to get a line like this in uh we think there is you know a substantial Advantage certainly there's an advantage to my client because he gets to build the to apartment buildings um but we're trying to make this thing work and so that's what we're asking you is how can we make this work financially so that you get the sewer line the planning board gets some restrictions or maybe a donation on M we have to look that out uh we get to build the two apartment buildings you get another six affordable units on the roster so that's where we are my initial thought would be that the value that that lot holds is probably uh more than what that Paving is going to cost so maybe the town will be interested in actually paying for the paving portion of it if you're willing to give them a that piece of land only because the sewer department is extremely small we only have a handful of customers so to put that burden on them and wave the connection fees that that's a hard sell well um I guess maybe the ask then is would you support our request probably through the town planner to find a way to get the paving done I don't see any reason why I mean I would support that if there's a way to come up with a that over water pay the bill well that's that's the concern is that there's no water upgrades being done here water was involved you know and there was an improvement to the water infrastructure you know you're looking at at waving something and and cost could be shared with the water and the sewer department but having two separate entities two separate Enterprise accounts this this primarily being a sewer project we can't take from the other Enterprise account um to support funding of that so there's there's limitations there by having the two separate uh Enterprise accounts but uh it sounds like the town themselves not not to put them in the light but they stand to gain a significant amount from this as well you know especially if you're being asked to give up that property that obviously holds some serious value yeah if you end up doing that the Town cover the B we prefer not to but on the other hand um you know we can try the case in Superior Court I feel confident we win but I've been wrong before just ask my wife uh but uh in any event uh you know you never can tell what a judge is going to do uh and and that could be 3 years from now when the trial comes up so uh there is some [Music] um if we're going to do this I'm assume you want this sewer line in sooner rather than later and so you know putting things off for three years while we try a case in the Superior Court doesn't seem to be in anybody's best interest so so I guess our question to you again is if we can work out the technical details with you uh in a relatively short period of time can we get some sort of a letter that says you took a vote to support the town doing the paving uh or you know however you want to handle it but um they might believe me but they might not and uh you know reading minutes of this meeting may be valuable by if you authorized your staff to draft a letter um you know to the town manager I guess saying hey we really want this project uh and it's valuable to us the final piece of the puzzle is the paving cost uh can can can we support the town bearing the paving cost that's that's where we are I know if you anything add it I think once we work out the uh the technical glitches that are there we have a a a better determination of what can and can't go into that Corridor and that the connections to the to the residents will be allowed then I think I don't want to speak for the board but I would assume that the board be willing to to entertain the option of of recommend recommending that the town look at supporting funding for Paving I mean if if we're looking at waving fees on our end yeah that's just it if they come back and say why you pay for it we're already waving fees right so how would everybody so if we wave the fees connection fees for the sewer connection on their property but not the Individual Services what that correct correct they the individual homeowners would still pay their connection when they need they don't have to in requirement but when so this would be a we want to tie in and they do there's a fee associ okay so so the W that wouldn't necessarily be waiver of water surfaces it would not okay be yeah this is all about sewer right strictly so my understanding of your bylaw is that just because the line passes your property doesn't mean you have to connect but if your septic system fails then you are required to connect unless you can prove and undo hardship because you're so far away from the road and I think that's a fair statement of what the violence says so so if somebody between a part property into the center of town receptive system failed they want to connect they would still have to pay the fee cor to you to connect the big advantage to them though is that the it's going to be stub right to their property line which should save them some money right oh the money and hassle yeah well they probably won't know about the fact that we're saving in the aggravation they won't they will not know that but we will be saving them aggravation right so our recommendation is to finalize well I don't know what the next step is these drawings we don't think are ready for design for review or well these don't have the laterals on them right so we couldn't approve correct well I don't anything I want West we actually do that we can review this now how many more iterations are there going to be how many more reviews are there going to be is the question I guess right so once we start doing it the meter is is that's all so so it doesn't make any sense well I don't know maybe I should make that I would think that you want to review the drawings in a more final sense with showing the laterals on the drawings and any details that I don't know what Beyond C40 there is for the S other the details whether not there's enough details on there showing the SE connection information home station whatever else part to all this and the hydraulic calculation have you Haven see the calculations right those are not you haven't seen those no no yeah no I haven't seen those I think the next step is to make sure you have a contract between them to do the iterative reviews um review the drawings do a couple you can you can agree to the corrections and then present the final drawings to us I me I sent Frank an email with just some initial concerns that we've already you know he spent a couple hours today that we can forward on as things to maybe look at before I we'll need to go into contract again for more peer reviews but before we churn any time giving a formal review of this I think if we give the initial comments yeah sets a sets a path for them moving forward that and then those can be addressed then we can RW that makesense so would you is it fair to say that the commission is in agreement uh with waving the fees for our project uh and supporting a request to the town and the paving that we know will be required um if we could walk away tonight with a straw V just saying that you agree in concept to that subject to working out all the details then we would feel confident with telling them to go ahead and finish the design work and get to the peer review process I would probably support something like that that' be okay with me yeah i' like to see the numbers but uh but I I'm agree yep well numbers will come out in the wash I once we review it and so we have a direction to go forward with now we'll get the design work done we'll get the the numbers to you uh and then um once we get to that point here you've agreed on the technical aspects then we'd ask you to draft the letter to the town asking for the payment to be dat and uh we can uh spend the next few months working on that right I'm sure the biggest question that's going to come out of that is what's that number yeah baby yeah it's one thing to ask them to to agree to it it's another thing to tell them what the cost might be even if it's a wide range I will say so if we're talking about 1 and2 in connections across the highway I mean we may be you may be able to do those either trenchless so I was just wondering or the problem with the trenchless is how shallow you are you know you all we go the you know sight unseen it's easier to just get underneath everything but um but other than that open cut would be a very narrow trench so it should just be as long as you don't have you know so you're talking a three foot wide you know cut pav that can be repaved and if they're every 100 feet I don't think do you know they every 50 feet do might say all right now we've got too many for 2 feet right but if it's if they're spread out enough I feel like um these they would probably approve and we don't know you know we don't know what they will approve but I think there is a way where it's not a curb to curve the whole of the whole length of the job I think you can get away with three foot wide laterals that need to be you know patched and infared to make it blend back in again which would be significantly less than a we don't know so those are the unknowns right so and that's a cost whatever that cost is that's the cost that you're asking so it might not that you're asking someone else to pay for so for the town's purposes it might it's a huge range right they're not just going to give a blank check is basically what we're trying to say so I think they have the ability to District Five yeah sure okay I yeah again with making assumptions you can have one that's the easy one is to just say we're going to have to do full the whole length I think we already talked about that number in our previous reviews we talked about how significant that would be and then the other question is just looking at how many homes there are how many times we have to come across the road and if if it was approved is because you just have to repave all these like I said call it five foot three three feet halfens call it 5 foot wide right to be able to feed down so we're going in the shoulder here correct so yeah so all the ones all the connections on the short side is no Paving corre so if you're only coming across every 150 ft with you know 5 foot wide you should be able to get approval from do which is patch do they allow you they allow you to jack on the they do allow you to jack on which is something else that what else is in that road FR unfortunely everything new gas old gas there's ledge there's old mob there's fiber there's you name it it's out there two water mains there's there's a lot in the ground we we've gone through that when we did the water main upgrades over there and ran the services across um we had refusal in maybe 25% shootting the bullet across so it it gets a little more challenging as you get closer to uh 123 up in the older section there um where the the Oldtown library is we uh we had prettyy good success T after pit clock as far as going across it was a whole different material so but again it's going to depend on what dep and so Ty job requ since it's private they have to do Bor or they don't have to do well uh I think we've made some progress tonight figuring out you know and how we can talk to to the planner and town councel uh about this um and uh other questions Nick so uh you know thank you for your time tonight and thank you for your strawboard support uh we will uh proceed with the design work thank you all right you coming in why don't you guys get to meet um not baby in the corner thanks guys you I just see just interesting to see what they are what the state's going to stay like good that's great point about about the paving because if they are close yeah but if there's like like you said if there's multiple of com across the state looks at it as an added benefit to them as well that road is deteriorating rapidly from the multiple trenches and stuff that's been over the years this was the last time there was a full p on that load there's been portions of it that were done back when TPC was active just so the bus ride was smooth and that was talk to District chief engineer go from there yeah I mean once we have a little bit better picture of what's involved I don't know i' agree with that statement after West Main Street I I didn't know I didn't know we were waiting for anyone so I would I wouldn't have started no I was unaware that they were how many I'm on my own that's how Ryan was when that's why he's not coming anymore I let him go so uh let's say moving right along the to water bill disputes we can start with one Hastings wait you want to leave the room Steve just we don't have anybody obviously coming in for this I don't believe anybody was coming in for the disputes and all questions are directed to Brook because she's the mathematician she's the boss this was the super high reading right before they change the M right yes this I didn't hear that P was out there and that actually said there was a leaking toilet no so before we get into this all any of the Steve you might be able to answer this I know you accusing yourself but I just want to ask you um the outside spets on on those buildings are they connected to a Master Meter or are they connected to someone's do we know if they connect because we had a problem individual a few okay nobody uses no because because there was a there was a a woman or a guy that had gone away he went overseas yeah and he came back and he had an examinant bill and we was a leak though sh what's that I remember there was a I can't remember I can't remember if we found him no different different house this this goes even further back than that it was uh at the time there was some Landscaping work and some masonry work getting done and that was the closest available connection for those workers and it was later found out after testing the meter doing leak detections on the house and everything um that a neighbor had mentioned that somebody else had been using the hose while those people were away right right right so that's not possible I'm sure that's actually where it happened well it happened once I didn't yeah in in the far back area where the houses are pretty much separated from from everybody else this is a separate house by the way y this is a separate house yeah not trying to no just it just it came up um it came up and that's when when I saw this that's I remember that happening I can't remember exactly how it panned out I do not uh believe any of that happened one so there's sewer involved here too right yes and in the past when there has been a week we've waved the sewer charge for that amount I don't know Steve what you think but that's the only thing I see here that you could possibly do because I mean he went from 1313 13486 a lot of water went through that it definitely went through the miror these are all actuals they're not uh yeah actual act actual act okay oh excuse me and if the was worn he would have it wouldn't register the water yeah and the new meter looks like it used four in a month and that kind of lines up with what's been going on so somehow he used a ton of water during that that one time um I don't know you can see I I have to assume that was a leak of some kind that didn't end up in the sewer right yeah I mean like like you said we that's what we've done in the past can we wave the sewer amount but only the difference from like what the average was because it's out of that 86 there should still be you know 14 or 15 or so it was legit right so we couldn't normally we do the average based off two years yeah um but they just moved in in 2023 right so previous previous yeah yeah previous quarterb would be September September it looks like it would be 13 was the last one mean that right yes so so when when did they move in uh look's like March 2023 March of 23 okay yeah so I you can kind of tell here this is kind of when they came in nothing much was happen that two years we could take the last September and use that number yeah I think that's fair so how do we calculate out the number of dollars to okay sorry okay so I can just make a motion to wave the sewer for the amount subtract what the previous one was okay so I would like to make a motion to weigh the sewer charge for one Hastings way in the amount uh equal to the 86 units subtract the 13 units from the previous September that work that right a second all in favor all right [Music] all right moving right along we have the other one the other one 18 golden Wood Drive God's country where is Golden Wood Road you can't it's it's rich people are there you can't you probably couldn't tell it is right right off of Maple Street just around the corner from here yep I'd show you on the map but somebody drew all over it with red Mo all the water knocking that off on oh okay this is the one thinks the high bill is changing the meter the high bill is from the previous meter can back us up on that if I'm thinking correctly the uh the question on Golden wood was that the high usage was taken during a previous meter not the current meter correct yes due to so that meter stopped working um so they received a red tag for us to replace the meter which we did and then they received their bill and it was a high bill when you said the meter stopped working you just me to stop reading we did not get to reading correct the visual reading on it was obviously read and they replaced the meter before the bills went out so we were able to Bill him for an actual reading is the is the previous reading they all it all says actual so all the readings we here are actual readings Tak correct okay they're all legit readings and he doesn't have SE right correct yeah so based on the timing of this I don't remember if this was mentioned in an email or not but that meter had had since been taken apart and discarded y yeah so there's no meter to test yeah unfortunately in this case there's no meter to to test and right here went out and Le detection detect did state after the fact that the homeowner mentioned that he had recently fixed a leaky toilet correct and the gentleman he's saying it wasn't a leak is saying it wasn't a leak at one point in time he didn't say it was someone said it was so yeah when they went out and did the leak detection there were there were no leaks found at the time um conversations that ensued while they were there going through the through the home um it was mentioned that there was a previous one no clear indication of when or how long or what it was but it it was noted by the tech there's much we can do here St there's no sewer there's no meter to tests everything was the old meter so testing the new meter wouldn't would be pointless you agree with that Frank I do agree with that um the only option um there seems to be some confusion with the uh the timing of the meter and we could offer to test the new meter to prove that the meter it's in there is accurate if if the board was interested in doing that we could offer that up as an option but again it's not the same meter that generated this reading I would be fine waving that test fee if it gives this gentleman some peace of mind I'd be okay with that but waving a bill though I don't see I don't WR if it was a if it wasn't an actual read that'd be a little more concerned but it was an actual read yeah I I'll agree with that also I don't think we should do anything with Theo okay so you want to just make a motion to wave this Fe if he decides test me yes all right I would like to make a motion to wave a a meter test fee for 18 Goldenwood um if the owner decides to go that route he may still not want to do it so I make a motion away of the 18 golden wood meter test feed for the current water meter so why wouldn't he want to go with that he quite but it's not because that's not the meter that is in is in question here it's the it's the old meter that actually generated this I understand so I mean so moot point do it is a moot point it is a piece of mind then it just shows the accuracy of the meter and that said $75 is that right yeah so he did go out to get a read in and he's only used 11 since it's been trans so the new meter is not reading high right it's in line with what it used to be it seems like now to test that meter is that we have to go put a bypass in take the meter and he's out of the meter for a week or whatever good yeah at a independent facility youry they so it's actually the um uh yeah so we PID a fee in M power such like okay I would think that' be fine I mean he's already declined to to pay that anyway so if that is an option for him to like Jim says it's peace of mind then we can offer that but other than that there's not really much we can do I it's 75 bucks plus a week's worth of water youon for essentially but whatever it's not that much if it gives them piece of mind and everything I'm on more of that so um I will reiterate that motion to wave the meter test fee for 18 Goldenwood Drive uh on the new newly install meter I second all favor I I I have one more Bill dispute that came in very very late if you wanted to take it out of order or if you want to wait for the end no we can we can do that now we're not waiting for anybody else right so okay right we can let's just get the way this is this is an interesting story so so we've dealt with uh with r for for many many years um it is right near you um he is the owner of the Fisherman stre restaurant and the four other surrounding buildings um over by like Oasis Club yeah um so for for many many years they've been um each building had slowly declined um penants had left didn't notify him I don't believe he lives around here um so we responded for multiple calls to pipes burst there uh we've been called in in the middle of night from the fire department you know water running down the road each one of them has been at one of his five locations there um unfortunately he he has difficulties paying the bill or or doesn't pay the bill and tries to write it off I'm not sure how his financials but um easily he's achieved about $7,500 in lean fees which is totally out of our department even though he's asking for us to wave it we don't have that option that's that's at at The Collector um the one thing that he is asking for is an explanation and I guess a possible favor to not be charged the minimum fee for each of the water services now um everybody in town has a minimum Bill regardless of the waters being used or not same thing with cell phone gas bill everything like that it's a utility charge to keep the service to the property active live ready to go um we've spoken to him this goes all the way back when uh Rose and Dwayne were here forun only one person knows who they are well three people um one person on the board um it was explained to him then that standard procedure procedure if you wanted the water service to a facility cut off you would hire a contractor we would be there to inspect it it' be physically shut off at the corporation stop on the main you would actively disconnect the water service from them border of Health would be notified building department would be notified and we would take you off of the charge accounts the problem with that is now when somebody goes to buy that property it's being sold with no water so that new applicant now has to pay the fee and go back into the road and basically reverse everything that was just done just because you're saving a minimum fee for a short period of time um it not only is is foolish in most of our opinions to to do something like that unless you have other uh intentions for the property if you're going to turn into a parking lot or something like that or it's no longer needed that makes sense but for a building that's in a state where it can still be repaired and could be sold you know there there's value to having that water service intact and ready to go for potential new owners uh he five buildings he has five buildings um they all right close to each other all right close to each other two out of the five are off the same service which is no longer allowed in all five on one meter but no that's not no so um we've dealt with an issue here in the past is a garage that's kind of squished all the way in the back you know you can see it from certain angles you can see it from from the oas's parking lot um one of the problems that we had here went on for a period of time they actually had a pipe break in the facility we responded turned it off the the place was vacant because they had no heat that's why the pipes uh burst they uh they started occupying the building again did the plumbing themselves and totally bypassed putting a meter back in and we didn't find out about it you know for quite some time that uh you know there wasn't even meter in the facility we used just assumed that they had done the repairs and everything was back but uh yeah so there's been been a few issues ongoing with this facility there's clearly no sewer there right there is no sewer there I mean so um you know he is actively working to sell the property which he has been telling us or telling me at least for five years um just maybe six or eight six or seven months ago um he was able to get the Last Tenant out and uh and we went and we made sure all the water was shut off to all the all of the the services feeding there but uh you know in my opinion he's still he still owes have the services shut off and keep the account active app you still pay the minimum water we so can we do any for him normally or just basically no action I don't think if it's cont the meter he's got to pay for what down the meter whether it's 75 or whether it's I mean that's a combination of late fees demand fees lean fees I mean everything's been added to that you know those grouping of water bills it's not just that that's one bill for one one facility to start waving a minimum fees I'm not that at all that's an open invation everybody why did he give a a reason why he hasn't been paying his bill on does no no income yeah limited limited income he he is 'sing well mh5 miles away so he's not a he's not an active landlord unfortunately I don't see how we can that stinks but right you know as far as the lean if you does end up selling the property we will see that or a majority of that come back to us at the point of sale which is great um you know as far as the minimum bills you know I'm sure if he has other connections to that facility he's bill paying for them you know we have minimum um bills that we receive from uh our Natural Gas provider and we pay even if we don't have any usage have it's the same it's it's the same thing it's it's all utility based yeah nobody had that then now you're paying a lot of money to maintain the system that nobody's using I get it um I'm going to go ahead and make a motion to take no action on 40749 411 RO water bills I second all in favor I I thank you for taking that out okay let's see we got Patton Road so uh at the last meeting we had a excuse me a discussion with uh Mr Freeman concerning the lots that uh he was able to get converted from nonu buildable yeah we have something on that that's um the it is so it was we continued it from last meeting trying to get a little bit more information um either from the previous Town Clerk or from the attorney who would have been present at the auction um luckily Paula is still helping out with the transition at Town Hall so we did have a conversation with her again um she again reiterates that Mr Freeman and his attorney are not wrong it was stated at the um auction that any betterment that existed at the time of the auction would have been wiped out um any any leans or anything uh existing taxes would also be wiped out because it's an auction everything's wiped free and clear um these properties did not have betterments assessed to them because they were non-buildable lots so therefore there's nothing to be waved um and therefore she she feels as as do I that uh you know the newly formed Town lots are subject to today's current rates for connections um I've spoken with with Paul on a few different occasions I've explained to him that that's all we came up with um to extent of what I've tried to figure out oh good so so U correct me if I'm wrong so they've got these two lots um and if there's and when they sold them as an auction if this was any vents or any back tax or any money's owed that would be waved so if they going to combine these and make these buildable Lots they need to pay the vents correct I mean they're not W they weren't buildable before now they're buildable now you've got to pay the bment now the bit have to be paid not those aren't the B betterments that she was talking about so I'm assuming if I'm not you know if I'm not correct I if if any monies that were owed were on those older lots that were not buildable so if they would have been assessed a better back in 86 of whatever it was whatever a dollar value and the properties were never built so they were never paid that would be still remain on the books attached to that map and parcel where these were not build it would have been wave which he has had luck finding some of those Parcels down there um that had letters to show that that fees were waved on the registry of deeds or they were paid in full and he's built out a few other Lots down there um not having to pay the current day connection fees which are more than what it would have been assessed back then um so these lots are AB buding Lots but he's actually joining them with other Lots on the opposite sides of them to make okay to make the Lots large enough um to be buildable originally it went before one of the other boards I can't remember which it was um initially it was denied he um he went back and and they actually uh they approved these lots and made them buildable so there was some concern that uh that Paul had brought up that many years ago when the town was looking to better themsel and to actually possibly put habitat for community houses on some of these smaller lots that a few of the neighbors actually were threatening to sue the town so the town backed out so you know he has the option to do whatever he wants he owns I think that there was just some some concern about the uh it's called nimi all right understood you go there was some concern about uh you know changing the the scope of the the surroundings way back when um so I iess said I spoken to Paul about this I explained to him that to the best of my knowledge and everybody that I've spoken to there were no minutes taken at the auction don't know if that's required if they are existing somewhere um but uh based on what poer indicates in a previous email to Paul um from Paula you know it he's he owes the connection fees for water and sewer because they were not ever provided to the property so he he has agreed and he has paid those and I justess I told him that we'd follow up and this is what we come up with so so what is the ask if he's already paid them to wave them the ask was to wave was to wave the fees which I I don't see how that can be Poss I don't either I don't so do we have to have a vote now or in this case not doesn't requir he's he's paid the connection fees already um so I I don't see if that even requires a vote this kind of was more of an update okay thanks jump right into my updates and see we can fly through these um I can't recall I I mentioned it last time but the seasonal flushing um moved to daytime hours so we could complet it uh we had one or two cold nights it kind of set the tone for what we thought was going to continue it did not thankfully um but uh we finish during the during the days and um actually right before the uh the the drought monitor was triggered so it worked out pretty well for us um referring to the drought where we're in level two right now you know that rain or whatever it was we had the other night didn't didn't do anything we we need uh you know a good steady steady soaking rain you know unfortunately uh we we had concerns about seeing the foot flop you know as we did heavy heavy wet in the early part of the year and then we're flipping right back down to dry um if this is the new normal you know it's going to have effects on water quality as we' had seen you know with the the flooding rains when they return hopefully everything comes in nice and slow but definitely something we're going to keep an eye on um the umara is going to touch on East Hodes Street um Le and copper sampling uh you obviously you guys are aware we've had some issues in the past with with the Gathering the required amount of homeowner samples um John spent uh almost two weeks going through through the uh entire list of approved and allowable homes we've come up with a new list it was approved by D um so there's many new locations that have been added to the list we do have to follow the tier structure and uh attempt to go with our one and two appointments first and then we can go to level 3es if if we need to um it'll give us a better chance at getting the required amount it's nothing's guaranteed you close 60 twice a year yeah yeah so now we have a bigger pool to pick from it doesn't necessarily mean that we're still going to have the the support with it especially with all the other stuff that's coming down now with uh you know the new lead comper rule the lead lead service line inventory you know people are asking more and more questions about what this may do about putting a tag on their property you know and we've explained to them if the samples are taken correctly this is an indicator of the plumbing inside your home has nothing to do with your water service or the the water main itself um and sometimes that raises even more more concerns you know they the biggest thing that I I receive is well I don't drink the water uh I I only use it to brush my teeth okay or I have a bit of filter I use my I use my my fridge for for all my water yeah well I mean in that case what what do you say to those people you know they're they're not coming into contact with the water that you know we're telling them you know could have a concern a lot of people are have even mentioned that they live in some older homes and not only do they not have the money to do the upgrades and change out the plumbing fixtures and stuff some of this stuff is pretty elaborate because it's old and nothing new fits that same um design so you know again how do you how do you target those people and tell them hey DP is saying that you have to go replace your yeah your force it that's 90 years old you know and that's the that's the source of of the contamination now what happens if it's not what if it's the Le blood solder that's leading up to that and there was nothing wrong with the force and just I understand the the cause and I understand the actions that M EP and EPA are expecting from this but uh you know it's a little bit more education needs to be done as far as the effects um especially if you're not consuming the water yeah so um leading to that is lead service line inventory we've uh we spent uh you know months on it you know cramming in the inventory that we have in house um we've had some assistance from from Representatives over at Weston and Samson helping out with some of the formatting uh for the online reporting and similar to what Mansfield has done we are also going to be getting out a postcard asking residents to help uh with if they can determine what their service line is is coming into the house so it saves us the actual step of having to go there if they can get us a picture if they can upload it online do that for us um the hopes are that we're not just going to Target the people that we don't have information on I think we're going to blanket the town and we can use the information that's provided to us to confirm what we already have to see if everything matches because there could have been upgrades that were done the house may fall into the criteria showing that it may have you know a suspect service and if it was replaced it's one more we can take off the list um even if we have to do additional leg work and go out and physically confirm it with our own eyes you know I I think that's a benefit that outweighs the cost of these not if you look in in the home at the pipe actually coming in what it is do you assume that that's the pipe all the way to the curb stop there not going to be some other weird interface it's it's the assumption that can be made yeah that along with the age of the house we know there's quite a few out there that may have had small repairs um it's unfortunately very common to have a leak where it comes through the foundation and you'll see that be a newer style pipe copper or plastic and it changes outside the foundation right so there's no 100% guarantee that it's going to match yeah that's probably not a good answer but that's that that's the answer not between between that information between that information and the and and any records that we may have with work done at that's the best we can really do unless you you right mm unfortunately going to dig up 7,000 servic I saying most cases the same material but not all not not always yeah so we'll go with the assumption that it is and it's more of a problem if it's uh a poor material than it is if it's a good one I don't know if it happened here or it happened in Rand but I think we once dug up a service that consists of three different material W we've had that yeah has to be older you know very older house that you know over time they just did spot rep it was whatever they had at the time or whoever did the job at the time whatever you know whatever the I had in the back of us 100% um so uh with that postcard that's going to be going out you know hopefully we'll gather some information um that can go directly to the website for the UPA MD um there is a notice that's required to go out by the end of of next week for any homes that we know have led service which not with we know we have none in town that are full Le Services we do have some that have Leed Goose necks which allegedly is still a trigger which perfectly fine so those residents will be notified um thankfully the large majority of them are going to be souer Street which is the reason why we targeted that knowing this was coming um but I would expect to see you know some some Fallout from the notifications going out and and you know hopefully it leads people to educate themselves on on reason for this you know it's not that we're we're targeting them but all the information is going to be public so that's the other thing that we've tried to mention to the people with the lead and copper sampling program is that regardless of whether you want to participate in gathering the water sample for us and having that information all of this other stuff is is coming down the line so hopefully that not to scare them into doing it but you know the information is going to be there sure no matter how you look at it and then the last thing is uh you know we've been basically living over on Dean Street for the past two weeks um I can't remember in my 24 years of being here one road that doesn't want to stay in the ground any more than this road um we responded a week and a half or two weeks ago and actually found a tea sitting on the road you know cast iron tea AC lateral I don't understand what you're talking about oh I don't have any pictures it was dark out main braks failes like a tea that was under the ground and now it's not on the ground to wow yeah I got your message later too right that yeah um you know and you know cutting those sections out dressing in New pieces of pipe building a brand new tea assembly and putting that back in um that section stayed in the ground thankfully still 20 ft away on the other side of Harvey Street we lost a 12T section of pipe um um same thing pressure spiral crack and the weird thing about the pipe I don't know if it's the age of the pipe or or it was maybe it really was a different material I mean Steve might be able to weigh in on this it almost seems like it's got more concrete than it does um fiber it it has a different texture to it it does not compress it's AC pipe but it really looks like it's a molded concrete waterm I it's very very strange and we're having actually problems with the couplings ceiling on it because it is so hard so we we use is the OD different no no no it's a thick wall pipe so the ID is small so it's very very strange looking but the OD is normal for for AC pipe um so we were there Thursday night for this section that let go had to respond so we're there Thursday night into Friday morning Friday afternoon had a call for a truck in the hole cuz it was still gravel the couplings leaked after being tored down up to pressure everything was fine dig the hole back out got a leak on one side tighten it up can't get to stop right well we're already here we take it apart take take it apart put a brand new coupling on it the other side leaks oh my gosh take it apart again put a new coupling on that finally get them to seal and then uh then Sunday night in the middle EO he kidding me Jesus so we've done we've done a large portion of that road in and around the end of Harvey Street you don't have to flush the area no it's it's well flushed and and thankfully we actually got a good shut down crazy uh 6 in you know no no rhyme no reason um for the first failure that we that we're aware of you know the consecutive failures after that unfortunately we dealing with a lot of brush fires in town so we've had a lot of mutual Aid help we've had a lot of hydrant opening and closed all around the area um not to say that that's a definite cause of it but you know if there was a hairline crack that wasn't there it's not going to take much for a precious Spike to to uh you know demolish the pipe but uh seeing a te and and the pieces of pipe where they don't belong that that that was a first you we' we've had some major major pipes let go we've had the 16 out on West Main Street we had a section of that let go and it it it took the road out but we' never seen anything sitting on top of the road so it was it was unique and yeah the guys and and women have spent many many hours down there unfortunately so the road is still gravel we've been checking it every day letting it pack down unfortunately we don't have any rain and the material we put in is so dry it doesn't compa very well um but because of the abnormal size and shape and overall size of it we're actually going to get some quotes to have it professionally paved if we can afford it if not we'll work with Highway and stop running multiple Tru and get it done do we have a contract with Paving a Paving contract with the company the highway department has has a Paving contractor that they choose annually and they usually get a better rate on it so we still get a better rate on the asphalt because we do all on trenches ourselves um but as far as an actual contractor they they're the only ones that actually pick and choose a contractor so um last time we had a large failure was actually young a and we brought in a private contractor and had it done and they were in and out of there in four or five hours you know it looks great so you said there a lot of fighters in that immediate area not necessarily in that immediate area but all on the outskirts of town we've had uh I believe it was last last Wednesday or Thursday the days Escape me we actually had Three Fires start off right along here one was in our backyard another one was a little further down um on uh on Dean Street and another one on on West Hodges so all along the power lines and they they were chasing them down so we had mutual Aid uh coming for that then just this past weekend we had a a large fire that took off uh between Eddie Street it went along woodwood street through the Backwoods there and actually come out to 140 um so much so that they actually shut the portion of 140 down uh between um woodwood and Eddy Street so that they could uh get the apparatus and everything in to uh to handle that so so our relationship with the f I imagine tip I mean do we go over opening and closing hydrant a make I mean we have newbies on the fight we have a lot is that something that it had a sensitive conversation with yes yeah there's there's ongoing discussions about um um we might actually bring in one of our training coordinators to explain some of that to them um most of that they learn in the Academy but they seem to brush over that now i' I've spoken to a few of the instructors and that's not really their main focus anymore which in a small community like us with some aging pipes it it can be detrimental um you know some of the larger newer towns they they don't seem to deal with those type of incidents as much as we do we had an incident redville Village not with a water main system with our irrigation system that our cons IR our landscape cont tractor was fixing irrigation leaks and then rapidly turning the system on and blow out all the te all theint so I had a they basically said look we're an irrigation uh company this what we do for a living okay do you know anything about kinetic energy water hammer uh anything about that I have no clue right so I had a on with TR MH yeah I mean if you're not familiar with the concept I mean people wouldn't believe it but oh the amount of pressures that you can generate are are astronomical and the Damage that it creates is is substantial it's the first thing we learn in engineering school you're really right [Music] yeah so we we do plan on having some type of a a short presentation or training class with having our instructor come in just run through some Basics with them um focusing on the benefits of not creating Hammer so it doesn't damage their equipment which will subsequently benefit us in the long run so that uh could happen as early as next month we still working on the details but uh where they they haven't gotten any sleep in in many days when [Music] P unfortunately you're correct so uh that good is all I have right now all right thanks Frank Frank I really appreciate all the emails you gave us today A lot of it was last minute and I apologize but really it really helped though okay yeah I know you're two sents you say pleas you we really appreciate you I I mean I I look at it I think I look at it objectively when I I we really don't know anything really we need your opinion anyways in order to make these decisions we do our best when we can John John helps a lot out a lot with the language too because I kind of get a little fuzzy with the keys sometimes yeah and I just want to say that we had an incident at redil Village during the month that uh I I uh don't ask me how why I do this you can criticize me later but I help out my residents who came s them and buil why do you do that and uh so it's very simple process it takes all five minutes in the process of me doing it when I turn the water back on the water meter was leaking at the bottom of a immediately care really appreciate yeah that was turning this out too fast huh [Laughter] that's crazy telling you embarrassing moment yeah it happens all right who wants to go first do you feel you want talk you both have seven and a half [Laughter] minutes first out um okay so um last meeting we discussed a um it's basically water quality uh posos alternativ analysis that kind of included posos look at Wells three and treatment plant potentially looking at wealth one and two modifying you know maybe combining those two sources or the wealth with a couple different options there just taking a little bit harder look at what we can do for water quality over there and then um also taking a look at the Toc color concerns that we had at the treat plant so that's kind of we decided to initially take a p study and kind of combine it all into one because it's going to be probably Footprints and issues that we need to probably deal with at the one way or another so um that was sent to you guys right before the last meeting and I just wanted to just check in to see if you had any questions on that wanted to sign this month where at I don't even know if it's in the packet maybe I already got sign I don't think you sign it no I don't think we did I don't think we had time to review it yeah oh last month you did not so uh was I wasn't here last wasn't here last month so we so I sent it out everybody some time just take a look at it um I read it over yeah I had comments I think I I asked all my questions I yes the only question I was asking is about the glass fuse tank issues of uh like expansion and Gra glass how do they solve that so not with the um not with not extreme temperatures we don't really see anything like that in our in our environment so I can get you more of a actual I was just I'm talking about extreme temperature change if the metal expands at a different rate of the glass does that ever crack the glass or anything no you have um it takes a while for that water inside to really change temperature that kind of is a temper exterior wise just dealing with a little bit of coal but it's not really a it's not it's not a drastic you're not going to see a huge change in temperature when they build something like that this is just my car I guess does it come already as metal with glass fused on it or do they build it and then go inside and fuse glass can do a f Tri I going I actually love that I'm not as I'm not as I'm not I didn't go to the plant and go see all the stuff happen but my staff um trained up on I was curious I don't work theologies yeah it's kind of the panels are kind of preset and they build build the foundation first you have a cop contract with you we have a cop contract I've printed my computer why you bring it up all right so um the title of the contract was water quality and key treatment Alternatives analysis how much call 9,700 and what was the date of the contract I signed it October 8 yes about that for again that is the exact it's not it's not dated until you guys sign no I understand but you want to make that motion yeah um I will make a motion to approve the water quality and PAs alternative analysis uh from Weston Samson in the amount of $159,700 dated 10824 right y second fa hi hi so I will go back to te's discussion so I did send you an email also on the iterator that came up the last meeting uh just giving you a summary it was first the airator study and then the other one was the uh was also sent you the storage analysis study for kind of the overall tanks you have throughout your system as well as kind of what we're thinking of doing for Hott Street elevated tank so the airator project we had a bid opening today I sent you a followup Emil just before this meeting uh we only had one bidder unfortunately the other Tank Company indicated to us about a week ago or said yeah we're not going to B on it um we required to have multiple not publicly advertised we set it up that we could have um a third party as long as they had a certified tank contractor sign off that they were either on site monitoring and or um considered the folks trained up and had done enough experienced tank you know modifications that they can do this it's not that complicated but um it is a DN tanks tank and DN tanks is the one that bit on the tank so um the competitor for DN tank didn't want to bid on the tank because it was a DN so um I'm not saying that that's necessarily the only reason re and that was over what we had anticipated before um so we had appropriated funds about two years ago um we did add on some tank improvements that were necessary there some safety precautions on the roof itself um replacement of the vent and um we obviously have to run some electrical lines to kind of get power over there for the air we also decided that it would be beneficial to add a mixer as well um we did do that as a bit Alternate which uh more or less all the penetrations of the main so they put all the the work in the the base bid but the alternate came in at $24,000 the actual equ for the mixer we would recommend going for that's such a reasonable price and might as well go with that however there's not enough appropriated money specifically on this line item for for that so um Frank and Jen are just going to check in with um Town Hall check in with James just to see what um there were there was previously I know there was some storage tank rehabs um Appropriations back in the past I just don't know if they're still sitting around whether or not we can use that whether or not we could use the current Cottage Street appropriation for design um to kind of go towards this or if we can use the water quality um this is for the thms reduction so it is a full systemwide purpose to basically R this um so to be DET I just did want to give you an update at least what the what the numbers are that we had today and then um we'll keep it posted once we hear a little bit more in town hall and the other options is put it on whenever was potential special time meeting hers if that's under you can put that on an additional article for that so and at that point we may want to do it depends on what you want to do but we are kind of ready to move forward with cage Street our recommendation was to replace that elevated tank and move forward with that as well so the full sight you know you started prating cash flow for that so what you propos to taking you taking that down that is new yeah that's our recommendation and um you uh the Iration system is going to go inside the new tank the Iration system is actually for the small the large stor elev is the smaller one and then you've got their large 2 million gallon I mean I just I'd love to get that done like now I mean I know but I mean the soon of the better well the goal was to have it up and running in in place before you know April May so we so there's a couple things there I don't want to delay if if you think adding on Cottage stre elevated into this package would would delay we'll just do it at Springtown meeting but the airor one way or another we just need to check in with Al see how it goes so you think we're going to find some money there's a possibility there's there was discussion many many years ago back when Bernie was here that there was monies that were set as de side either for a study or for Rehab of that facility um we did some work inside the pump house actually replacing the pumps and motors and most of it was covered by um if it was a grant or or something we receed from National Grid because we went from the low efficiency Motors to high efficiency and included new drives so I don't believe that that was part of it but it could have been um so we just need to see if there's any remaining monies that we could add to what's already been approved at town meeting for the air raor to come up with that total cost so a separate issue well the town accountant books is that correct all the motions and stuff they track all that stuff we don't track it we we track if we have a project that's open we'll we will track it that way if there's any monies that were approv the town meeting and not acted upon that's when we rely either going back through last year we did that annary of summarizing all so it' be nice to know about all these money out there that we haven't I don't know how you do such a thing we found some uh unexpended funds which we were very lucky to to kind of trip over so it's a work in progress um Brook's been digging through a lot of old paperwork and old files count it so that every year we don't have to reinvent the wheel try to find it again it never EXP right no once it once it's uh appropriated it's pulled from that fiscal year if you're pulling it from retained earnings um if it was approved to be borrowed then it just has you just have to go for the authorization and uh and step forward and borrow it all right so I I I would like to pursue that and if we can find the money we should vote to authoriz we definitely want to move on it as quickly as possible if it requires um an additional article either on the special or in the spring you know that'll be the the last result but there's a good possibility we may have something out there to use and the storage tank you're going to have to have a money for a springtime meeting and if you're looking to replace the the elevated tank you're going to need a lot of money so so would be a spring or be better to have a special so it gets to your truck thing we in this discussion about that I think the last meeting we talked about the beauty of our special the fall town meeting was a better time to have a motion to buy a vehicle because the money becomes instantaneously available after town meeting as opposed to a spring town meeting at the wait till July 1st right but for a vehicle what happens is by the time you appropriate the money and then come July 1 the vehicle is not there anymore at least a Specialty Vehicle that's what we've run into you know some of the basic pickup trucks and stuff like that you get you get a better option question here doesn't matter on that for the storage thing we start with the first is let's figure out if there's existing funds to C the erator right and then if we do need to go to I think we try to go for the fall town meeting and then the decision is whether or not you want to add on the elevated tank to that which may complicate things more I I can't predict what's happening at these meetings anymore so there's no prediction there there's not the biggest thing that comes that what we've seen is the the number if it's a huge number people really start you know pushing back on it so if it means separating projects and still basically asking for the same amount sometimes a small one number is just taken a little bit better than than a big huge number because that we're talking what we over millionar yeah right it's the same site unfortunately but for some reason everything's been so segregated yeah that's like 13 or5 or something like that same site than try to site this some somewhere in somebody El backyard yes so we can do that we put it we want you get for that what's up we just put the tank where we want to get with Slater you some you mentioned was um about our our underground storage tanks and taking one of them out of service for a length of time to see how that will work yes so we had proposed we knew that the aor project would be kind of happening like late winter potentially just taking taking B offline seeing how it runs um how the system runs there's there's a lot of storage in your system and that's one of the reasons why much storage there is there's a lot of there's a lot of water um however there's also the concern that if you need it so we have the brush fires you have some issues if there's an emergency situation um you guys have typically provided water to others have not usually gotten water from from from them so um how the system has run it would it's kind of a little bit of a discussion with the operaters and this is a slow change that might make them feel a little bit better about it but the main concern is um you know having the water is what the oper is main concern so it would be a little bit different than how you rent the running system but the 3 million gallon tank was built for something that was not ever never came to fruition so you have awful lot of water in your town um normally uh for well for that whole development up there that's just the development where TPC is now there's parcels and stuff in front that were designated pretty much for hotels and extravagant uh buildings and that just never never came to be so you know now they have that much storage you have it in the worst possible location in town as far as away from everything um you know it's just it's unfortunate that it is where it is and it could have been put somewhere else but it was part of the the land that was offered at the time so that they they jumped on [Music] it there's there's other limitations with that facility as far as it was never uh what's the word I want to use uh built properly built at the right elevation um so there's there's a substantial amount of water that you cannot pump if you get down to a certain level the pumps the pumps are set tooo high so if you continuously pump I hate when they do that yeah it's found upon yeah so if you continuously pump you can go below that level but once the pump shut off everything drains back and yeah now you got to wait till you put more water in the tank so yeah I've seen it all so we want to do a holistic look at your system just start the fastest of thinking about what to do and then have different size options opposite for if in the future if you want to modify one of the tanks take them offline I think what we've discussed with the operators having something more centralized having Cottage Street BRS stay online maybe do some modifications at at the three million gallon tank but you already have not filled it as much as so you could get some but there is there is that unusable storage at some point modification should be made to that tank um but in the meantime the main purpose of the goal it was to study you know what would be best to do for but the El but take a look at it do you want to make a figure in the in the thought that that you might eventually get rid of a three and so we just want to put all the numbers out there for what your usage was and what you have and what the standard recommendations are but yes so currently in the peak demands season at the treatment plant you cannot fill fast enough you know keep those things full but on the other hand part of that is because you have so much water to try to fill yeah and we don't have world four yet right which I can go into that next Su here too so well for we did have the driller come out on site we have started working um they were on uh they took for the holid they were also not there today but they'll be back tomorrow um I started work and um hopefully that progress will be quick so are they putting in a new well if test well we're doing a replacement well so cool scale replacement well and then once that's been drilled um we'll do some water quality and then check that but then in the meantime once that's finished and we know that there's no surprises we'll plan to go out to bid for actual construction how deep is that oh tesy we years ago I want to say something anywhere between 65 and 85 it it was deeper than the other well but not as deep deep as well five have the two of you seen a well put inally you really should take a look at how it's done we're having a time now Frank kind of does his own unique process yes the OU well the in well right drawing it down so we got we got the the the drill basically looks like a GI drill and then have casing pipes and you sh them in there yeah they they Jack the the well Cas inter I think it's pretty interesting when they put the gravel up and it's all you know it's different y so we're going to make sure we have somebody on site to try to you know just see what they're um screen the be curious what they run into there just it's not that far away from the existing but uh anything has got to be improving from from where that one is now yeah the Tes was all you know that was that was an optimal location so I mean that you don't need to be too far away to just well number four is near so on the treatment plant side of the it's the closest one to the pond so we've seen historically we've seen color and and levels that we you know don't don't enjoy coming out of that one so by moving it a little further away and a little higher in elevation um we'll get a little more filtration out of it so what's that well rated for or what we're hoping for 500 or 600 seven uh six and 700 or five and six yeah six and five five yeah that well for some reason rapidly declines it always has even after cleaning um so if we're getting 200 gallons a minute out of that right now I'd be surprised and we don't we don't beat that well up just because it it clogs so quickly so hopefully just moving it just slightly will will get us into a better how old is well number four that we've been operating it is not that old not even make me think it it is the newest of the wells okay I don't have but I think it's still 20 years yeah oh yeah yeah but I mean that's not old for no the other ones were about 40 or 50 thinking think 07 or 09 was last time we we did that one oh yeah well that was then right before we started the treatment plan design I think that's the last time it had work [Music] done so after the completion of well number four are we all set for our wells or number well one is four five and six the four five and six will be all newi is going to the treatment facility we then have to address what we want to do at well one and possibly well too um there is some new developments that there's an issue with the roadway over there there um if you're familiar with Pine Street in that sharp turn where the guard rail is steadily steadily lowering itself um the highway department is reached out to Engineers to see if they can relocate that road and it's going to encroach on well two and well one so we obviously won't put a stop to it but we want to we want to be part of the relocation to see just what it's going to do as far as impacts on our our area they they are concerned that they will lose that road within a a short number of years by how quickly it's been declining um that's that was an issue that Keith was dealing with years ago and it's there or just no it's just it's she sheia Cliff they built right on the edge of the cliff and just natural process of erosion with uh no control there it's just taking it away so I guess we have to be involved with that we we will definitely be involved with that oddly enough years ago this was probably 20 years ago we actually replaced the water man on that section we did it inhouse with a private contractor Excavating we put it 15t in the ground because the previous super had told us that he was going to not only move the road but also cut um you know a substantial amount off so you you take the crown you take the crown out and you take the turn out you know to make it a little bit straighter so that was that was an interesting excavation all sugar sand so plenty of road to be removed there just not not the right material to hold it in place you good I have one more topic and I know I did not seven um so we we talked about Southwestern e Hodes um a little bit um the last meeting so they were trying to get through their PR test and coordination coordination took a couple times to pass third times to charm them that sense they were going to come out this week they postpone till um till Monday so we're really trying to push them to get the services is about 17 18 services on that street that we need to get wrapped up um goal is to try to get them all in next week and then hopefully the week after um just just Paving we we do plan to meet on site next week Tuesday or Wednesday next week with the contract just to talk about what needs to get done Thanksgiving coming up making sure we're not turning off people's water the day before Thanksgiving and then also what to do in the inter because we've got a few six of pip to kind of install and connect in so there's a mystery pipe that we also want to kind of talk to them about that we found out what that was out there um we thought there was just an 8 in but there's an 8 inch and a 12 um we just want to make sure we're abandoning everything properly just live 12 yes um so they uh just they we did pay estimate number one last last meeting I P up number two for the next round it's mostly a little bit more of the 8 inch pipe Paving uh police details and whatnot so um we're making a recommendation for payment for $ 51,2 4121 to CC construction name and we approved Frank to sign off on pay boort so just want to approve the the price under this meeting and then 21 cents from uh that that was my two cents over week okay I'll make a motion to approve pay es number two for the South Street withes area water Improvement projects in the amount of $512 4121 payable to CC Construction Incorporated I second all in favor I I signing all these thanks sir question about [Music] about thanks thank you thank you Steve talk five and five and a half minutes so on the SE side so as of the last meeting Bob street is done phases one and two are both complete you guys approved that final change order and the final pay applications for phase two so okay I don't know we haven't talked at all about the phase three is the pumps you would put money in for that work so certainly talk about that about I believe yeah we'll have the circle back and it's been a been a while yeah so we can look into that um the peer reviews um I don't know where zero reservoirs at I hav I haven heard they addressed all the comments the plans as far as I remember are approved but I don't know and then obviously we talked with um heern and the Mansion have people tonight I'll send them a contract a new contract for additional peer review um and then we'll send them an evening with the uh with the comments that uh the initial comments from there is Slim in no way the town's going to pay for the pavement I've never unless they give him that land that's what he's saying right if it gives him the land that's the only thing that I I've never heard they don't want to give it up but I think that's the only way they probably I've never heard of that deal ever happening that the town does pavement I've never heard of it ever okay I'm just saying I don't know where they they came up with that also it's kind of weird that the town's not letting them develop that's third possible that also kind of yeah is kind which I think is why he mentioned taking it to a court it's not a wetland issue or anything like that right it's just you said it's a buildable pule right it's a completely buildable understand how the town has restricted them from doing that although they want it for whatever reason I thought they had said they were're not going to build on this as part of their deal to ease the town's uh what they didn't like about it there was some concerns about having the trees removed from the lot brought up by the local residents okay and the yeah the boards kind of waved with the residents and and felt that it was another concern that's why they're going to be taking the foot reality because that's none of that I don't know how they got that far overstepped I think but I don't know um so we continue to work with the Norton Public Schools um we got help them get there so they've now converted they they taken their treatment plan Offline that they're approval through the Board of Health to discharge um directly um to the legion fill so it's basically Title Five system now they're bypassing the whole treatment process and there's a three-year window on it they got three years to come up with a more permanent solution which is really a sewer yeah connection that is the permanent solution and everybody knows that so the clock is is now ticking on that so you know Christian basically agreed help agent agreed to to take it on so basically they're not under dp's jurisdiction he thr off the ground want discharge permit list so the Valentine will be very interested in that so it it plays into that yeah that discussion is that now they're they're on a Time cl to to do something okay so um I also have to follow up with them s Frank BR Frank had sent me email last week or the week before that apparently they have offer Monies to do the improvements to the connections at the L school and the high school that'll take out the minimal extraneous flow that's there as well as even them better connections to the Sewer but they need to be under contract by the end of the year so I'm still trying to figure out if they want to do that and if we can help them do that they've allocated like $330,000 for that work so we we'll continue to work with them and if they want to go forward we'll have to move quick on that um so the big one is really Elm Street so since the last meeting well since the last meeting here let's talk about the we'll call it good stuff so we open bids you know part of our strategy was to have the bids in hand um we got good prices um the numbers are you know are below what we've been carrying for the authorization the amount that that we've been telling people the project would be so so that's good um C noton was the was the low bidder um they did the Town Center project out here they don't that they don't want to work out here too the name is extremely familiar they're fine definit mfi too yeah they're good yeah they're good um so that's good news obviously we can't um you can't award because you don't have a town meeting authorization to do so we did review the bids so we've sent our recommendation so I sent it to Frank as email and I'm do them the high copy so we do um acknowledge that they're qualified we recommend you award to them um contingent upon having a town meeting authorization which would be a special town meeting we've also got them to extend their bids at this point the bids are now good through January 9th they would have expired shortly so we have one extension on that uh moving Target that's probably still not good enough based on where things are headed right now but it's something so right now these bids are good until January 99th I don't know if it's necessary but it might be worth a vote um tonight um to author you know to issue an intent to award to them if and when pending town meeting pending town meeting like you're not going to send anything out to them but that way if you get the town meeting vote then Frank could just send it send it out or you could vot the next so do now yeah we now V for right yeah yeah let's do that so I don't know how much you want to put into the authorization so the C not so that's their their bit amount the top one there so if be vote you know vote to issue in t to award to see n for that amount Contin upon and this is Sport I'm okay um I make a motion to uh so we we're awarding B intend to award okay I make a motion to intend to award the bid for the El Street sewer extension and water man Improvement projects to C nton corporation in the amount of 5 million 627,000 pending approval of a special town meeting you all y second all in favor hi I now we we have sign this right now nothing to it and if and when that happens so everything so this package here here's all the uh the bids you know so we tabulated and whatnot I think we still have the the bonds we'll return the the bonds once we know for sure what's going on anyway um so that's where we're at with that um obviously the bigger issue obviously is that we didn't get the uh the town meeting you guys all at town meeting oh we didn't know Jim was there next to me the plan now so we've met since with Mike units and Paul again we've met many many many times with many different people um the this whole concept of the Tiff is what's being discussed now I think it was discussed tonight and meeting pre pre meeting or whatever um we'll see what happens I mean they're still trying to figure out exactly what devco the developer is actually offering you know so that's Frank you want John I'm sure so it's kind of in Mike's hands Mike units in terms of And he supposedly was going to have a conversation with the developer on Friday I haven't followed up with him to see where he's at you know but I think we do do we need to go into the Tiff discussion or you guys get briefed on that I mean basically what it means is there there's a little confusion on my end and and mik's end as to what they're offering I haven't had any conversations with them but so there's the piece so let's writing it basically down the 8.6 million that we've asked for is based on our higher estimates we're still talking about those numbers even though we've got a high level of confidence now that the prices are going to come in $122,000 betterment that we're talking about are down as low as $8,000 but I still don't think anybody should commit to that other than hopefully it will be lower but we should still commit to the higher end so that you're covered on whatever the cost end up being but um so of all that money 2 and A5 million is associated with the sewer and not covered by the gr so that's what's we trying to be hover it through betterments and when you break it down the assumed units at the 47 m Elm 47 Elm is paying 1.75 million of that 2 and a half million so the residents are paying about 750,000 that so my understanding is the proposal that came back right in the 11th hour from the developers will pay for the entire 2.5 million so the resident won't have to pay anything but we want it as a tiff mean we'll font the money and then we'll get it's all going to come back to us over time once our taxes are due until that debt is drawn down and then the town will get the full benefit of the taxes I was under the assumption it was the the full amount that they were looking for Mike thinks and his offering that's just the seven fit that's just you're going to pick up the residence tab here so the Tiff is just for that part okay I don't know I don't know how I read the letter but okay that's not how I understand bu might should know and and he's trying to find out exactly from that so anyway long story short that um continues to linger continues I'm the internal Optimist and I've been optimistic all the way through this and I'm getting less and less the more I hear the angry people and the more that the boards don't support it and um maybe this tip will do it I don't know um my problem is I've been uh so we're upside down right now I've been holding out you know so we've we had the grant monies that got us to what was supposed to be the town meeting in the spring we' continued to support the project under the you know the goal is that once it gets voted we would get a Construction Services agreement and that would make us whole I no longer know I don't have as much confidence that's going to happen so I put together an amendment and presented it for consideration uh I probably waited too long to do it but I've been hopeful that there would be other Mees I mean bottom line is you know the contract you know was you know the end date of the contract was like February we've continueed to work um and we're over the amount of the grant so the [Music] $520,000 in Grant monies um we used up back in June and we're continuing to work so I presented an amendment um just yesterday discussion consideration um to make us hold on our costs do we see that I just I don't know if Frank V it or not I probably didn't I was out most today I just sent it um yesterday so Stephen I had this conversation the other day My Philosophy if we ask you to do more work we should be paying them there's no reason why they should all this stuff basically nothing so the intent was do it's it got away from us and the amount of you guys have done a phenomenal job for us and especially Ryan especially but I'm just telling you that I wish I had more confidence in him and I didn't have to send FR we have some we have done everything possible to make this Project work it's really up to others the others have for whatever reason have not come through we'll give it the old College try but there's no reason why they should be not compensated so that that's why I put a proposal together whatever it is I'm an so you're going to forward that to us take a look okay yeah I age with you should am, so the contract was 520,000 we through the end of last month we're like 50,000 in the hole and I carried if it's going to continue on I'm assuming now until February so it's going to be a full year beyond the original completion date so the new amount we can't stop now we couldn't have done it without you so I appreciate that definitely C us some money getting involved do we have the funds to pay for them no I'm broken not taking out couldn't afford that either I would have to look and see where the funding would come from where this was funded by a grant um we have it in retained earnings I just don't know what authoriz is needed all right so why don't we look at that and then I imagine we'll take it yeah I mean it's possible we just overrun I have that I can give them to Frank so you have the email if you want for it to these guys the language is simple there not I didn't go it's basically just all these extra meetings and stuff I didn't go and a lot of explanation it's less than what as far that's anation should be really no I just yeah it's just been it's but it's you've been working all right whatever I appreciate that definitely on board definely we discuss that speaking of next meeting um I do want to bring something up though um cookies we get y that's that's that's definitely the cookies will be next meeting I'm slacking I'm blame on that um Franken our department in Manfield got some calls from our a neighboring Town who's um suffering from this drought at aor and uh they were asking for uh water um temporary or permanent more permanent solutions for water we have a connection do we have a cross connection we have two we do okay we don't have MF doesn't have any but we we're going to do a temporary well potentially going to do some some sort of temporary thing if they can make everything work but they're asking for a substantial amount of water and I think you they they it was a different story with the conversation that I had compared to what they had with I'm just trying to keep you guys updated because these are the these are the talks there cuz they're talking all this in towns and so we're doing a little leg work and uh we actually still have to flush a certain area because if it happens we want to make sure it's not going to disturb our whole inner town so any that's what they're they're looking for some sort of permanent solution um so uh I don't know what your your plans are but I mean I know we can only Supply them X and I know but I I don't want to strap our town right with a with a permanent solution for them you know that's you know we have our own problem at the end of 140 or 123 yeah and Maple Street we have two separate connections so a is a d keep thing right and it's and it's it's on them the owners is on them to approach D about any kind of connection they're going to do so even if we were on board wanted to if the DP says no we can't open B right right eer situation is different but they're talking about I mean we're not going to be able to supply Manfield we're not going to be able Supply them water uh we'd have to do a temporary solution like a hydrant to hydr type of situation uh but so for North for um when w fall State I think it exposed down well before them we did um hyr hydr as an emergency GP to then we built a underground vault um with a Master Meter um to to make sure that the prisons didn't run out of water northw work out of well all the permitting yeah we have Hardline connections but we don't have anything that's metered it was all that compound so anyways just wanted to keep you guys updated I don't know what's going on we we tried to reach out to adabo the other day and apparently um the superintendent and her assistant went on vacation so um and there there's there supposedly supposed to run out of water in 3 weeks didn't they just get a connection to Pucket do every day they they did they did they and that was substantial too it was Million Gall a day something you're not this conversation I had the conversation before they met with Manfield and it was the discussion that I had was for they were asking for basically a small amount of water um because it was concerns with the drought getting worse so we had looked at what we had and without any major changes to daily operations or any major impacts to our system we explained we could probably do 100,000 gallons a day um no discussion about for duration or anything and then um there were additional discussions that they had with mfield that were as be a little more critical I imagine they're a different hydraulic Raad line yes but I'm sure those vales that you can put in oh is the chemical factors too I mean we we treat with fluoride I don't believe they do um but I mean this this we different they're they're surface water it's a different treatment than ground water what what kind of interaction probably none but I mean it's the kind of stuff that peach BCE all sorts of stuff all that stuffff start of come into play take a look at it pressures and so it's their burden Al I mean do we wait for them to I don't think we have a choice to wait but I just wanted to keep you guys updated so in case it comes across a plate there um because we're we're we're supposedly Mansfield is supposedly uh putting in a vault or going to be putting in a vault at one of our connections depends on who I don't know I think we're going to have more pressure than them so point but if they had more pressure than us then we they'd have to put in some sort of pump yeah some booster pump we've supplied them with water through the maple connection when they had some road work that they had to do and they had a pipe they had to replace but uh that's the emergency need even though it is kind of emergency and I think I think all of us Towns at one time or at least in my my career we've we've we've had connections um that we had to use for for Norton as well as Fox Pro and other people that we've been interconnected with but this is more of a permanent kind of scary solution if you ask me that's why that's why I want to bring it up anyways that's all that's all I got so one thing our last meeting was on have minutes the bowler engineering for the High Street Hill Street project to bring us in stamp drawing they do that I have not seen a copy yet yeah so we wait a we um we didn't sign off on that so we should just sign yes please we were looking for for the okay like a St right do we have to sign them all or just go one do two I like your signature all right this is being hung up by others in the town but that's the up so I actually have a question about C we don't have a time frame on how long they approv for should there be or is it common to have a limitation on the approvals or is there a limitation that be in place walls they come back 5 years later or if if the plans get sold to somebody else you know even though it's the same design but it's a different engineer I think we have to change our rules okay I think that should be our rule is that as simple as us making a motion to change it or I don't know is that part of our RS it's not in the RS that's the so concern Theon came up is because and in some communities that have a little bit more of a water concern like Ado if you approve a set of plants 10 years ago and they they have the water rights right what happens if they finally come back and say we want to finally connect and you know so is there a certain point that you want to set a moratorium on like a limit on how things are going to change other people going to build stuff and for planning boards and other things with stormore requirements with just best management practices there's a lot that every few years environmental concern change you know conservation you your order conditions only good for three years with the one year potential extension for planning board in I think it's 5 years right zoning amendments only five years right or three or five years we should have we should have a limitation I think we should too that question that's a great question just we' thought about it we I know John and I had thrown it around before never thought about it before because normally people can't wait to get approval but it seems like in this town they don't do such a thing for reason yeah so I mean that's it's a good example of years of back and forth and yeah I think you should put up by something fure some language okay by the way it's not just PL the board changes and right different yeah that's true I'm not saying staff would change but staff will change will I'm going with Jim I'm going to Alaska you been to angry are you still live Alaska oh yes so Steve did you have anything else I'm sorry okay packing up I wasn't sure didn't ask you I have um December 10th for our next meeting is that okay with everybody yep sound good for everybody sure BR is that good for you perfect all right Christmas body cookies Christmas cookies all right well if we're all good Jim I move to a Jour I second all in favor I all thank you very much everybody you