All right, we're gonna start the, uh, may the seventh, 2024 meeting. We'll have the invocation by uh, com. Um, Mr. Hart, Mr. Hart and, uh, pledge of Allegiance by, uh, commissioner Furner, please stand Eternal precious father, we thank you for the opportunity to us of grace and mercy that you've shown towards us. Allow us to come in together to conduct the city's business. We thank you for allowing us to live in this beautiful part of your creation that we call a accord. And Father, we pray that you'll fill us with the spirit of unity, even though we may disagree, let us never disrespect or disengage from one another, but work together as brothers and sisters. We spare, pray, say a special prayer over our first responders, our police and our fire departments, and our EMTs. And Father, as they go out on every call, watch over them, comfort their family members, knowing one as their, their loved ones are watching over us. You are watching over them. It's okay to forgive you, to praise the honor and the glory you do. And your son Jesus name we pray. Amen. Amen. Amen. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God and divisible with liberty and justice for all. Commissioner Kennedy Here. Commissioner Wilson. Here. Mayor Johnson. Here. Commissioner Furner. Here. Commissioner Oliver here. All right. We have, uh, three different present presentations and proclamations. We're gonna read two of them. We'll also, uh, 2024 Municipal Clerks Week, which we have municipal clerk sitting down there at the end, which is for them. I didn't get that paper. So we're gonna start off with the, uh, 2024 Asian American. We do have that one, don't we? You're gonna do that At what I understand is that you're doing that this. Oh, so we're not gonna read that tonight. All. All right. So we'll do the 2024 National Day of Prayer proclamation. Whereas History America has faced trials and Trump, trumps and Americans have responded to prayer, seek, and courage and comfort, inspiration, and joy filled celebration. Faith compels us to seek and clinging to the light in times of darkness and spread light through those in need. And whereas from the first gathering of our founding fathers, elected officials have prayed and re and treated those they serve and represent to join them in prayer, including the authors of our Declaration of Independence wrote that they, the representatives of the United States of America in general, Congress assembled appealing to the supreme judge of the work and carried on to present day and presidential proclamations, such as last year's invitation to join him in asking for God's continued guidance, mercy and protection. And whereas a National Day of prayer has not only been a part of our heritage since it was declared by the first Continental Congress in 1775, but it is a public law established in the United States Congress in 1952, approved by a joint resolution and amended by Congress and President Ben Reagan with Public Law 100 dash 3 0 7 in 1988, affirming that it is essential for us as a nation to pray and direct the President of the United States to set aside and pro proclaim the first Thursday of May annually as a National Day of Prayer. And whereas in every state across America, the observance of the National Day of Prayer will be held on Thursday, may the second, 2024 with a theme lift up the word light up the world based on the verses found in Second Samuel 22 dash 29 dash 31. For you are my lamp, oh Lord. And my God lightens my darkness. This good and way is perfect. The word of the Lord proves true. He is a shield for all those who take refuge in Him and unif. Whereas Unified Prayer is mobilized across America every first Thursday of May on the National Day of Prayer as neighbors and attendance services to seek God for the city and country where we live, learn, work, worship, serve and desire all to thrive. And whereas we express our faith and exercise our freedom and prayer, then unite our hearts and voices and personal prayer and public gatherings across America with forever praise, repentance, love and humble intercession for our neighbor and nation. Holding fast to the promises throughout the holy scriptures, that the Lord hears and avails much as he answers the faith filled prayers of his people. Now therefore, be it resolved by the city Commission of the city of oco does. Hi, does hereby declare May the second 2024 as National Day of Prayer. We have, uh, Ms. Chadwick, would you like to come up and We can take a I the commissioner's come. We can come down and get it, get a Picture, commissioners this, go that way so we can get side all step in just a little bit. Thank you. Last, uh, what was it last? Last Thursday? Last Thursday, we had a, uh, day of prayer thing out front out here is Land House of Prayer, prayer had service. We appreciate it very much. Thank you. Appreciate it. Appreciate it. Yes. Okay. Uh, commissioner Kennedy's going to read the, uh, what's you need the title of all that, right? You got It? Yes, sir. Alright. Uh, national Peace Officers Memorial Day Proclamation. Whereas in 1962, president Kennedy proclaimed May 15th as National Peace Officer's Memorial Day. And the calendar week in which May 15th falls is National Police Week established by a joint resolution of Congress in 1962. National Police Week pays special recognition to those law enforcement officers who have lost their lives in the line of duty, the safety and protection of others. And whereas every day our nation's dedicated law enforcement officers put themselves at risk to keep their fellow citizens safe. Our officers stand as leaders educating the community about the importance of public safety. And whereas as the city of Ocoee observes Peace Officer Memorial Day and Police Week, we pay tribute to the courageous men and women who wear the badge and keep the peace. And whereas we appreciate the extraordinary efforts and sacrifices made by officers and their family members on a daily basis in order to protect our schools, workplaces, roadways, and homes. And whereas law enforcement officers deserve our appreciation for the work they do, which is to help people on a daily basis protect our citizens, and if necessary, stand in harm's way for the community they serve. Now, therefore, be it resolved that the city commission of the city of Ocoee does hereby proclaim May 15th, 2024 as National Peace Officer Memorial Day and May 12th through May 18th, 2024, as National Police Week in the, the city of Ocoee, Florida. And publicly, we salute the service of law enforcement officers in our community and in communities across the nation and witness thereof, I hear unto have set my hand and caused the seal of the city of Ocoee to be affixed the seventh day of May. Honorable Mayor Rusty Johnson. Thank you, sir. Yes, sir. You have, you want to give it to the, uh, Assistant Chief? Assistant Chief? How about us standing up behind? Okay. Come on up here, Huh? We do. We're gonna take A photo with you. We going to get photos back here with you. Squeeze in there. Or of course, we wanna take a picture with you. Your eyes open. Did you I have my eyes open. Good. Thank you very much. Congratulations, chief Buddy. Appreciate It. Thank you. Appreciate it. Uh, chief Nair's, one of our new assistant chiefs. He's not new. How long have you been with us now? Uh, 23 Years. 23 years. He's the new assistant chief. He don't look like he's that old, but he looks like he's 20 staff. Reports None at this time. All right. Uh, public comments. I have one here for Mr. Moyer. Good evening. My name is Dr. Jim Moyer. I live in Arden Park and I'm honored to be the current chair of the Human Relations Diversity Board. Uh, I have good news and bad news. Well, the bad news is we had an outstanding event last Thursday for you. Those of you who weren't there, it was just great. We had guest speakers from from University of Central Florida who spoke about fostering a sense of belonging, and they're from the Ginsburg Center for Inclusion and, and, um, community outreach. Um, the good news is that they're coming back and I hope to see all of you here on Thursday, June 6th at six 15, we had, uh, Ms. Cavita Smith and, uh, Dr. Uh, EDA Andrews, and they are just experts on, uh, helping communities feel a sense of belonging. So please be there Thursday, June 6th at six 15. Thank you. Also, I wanna mention a couple other things this month. There's all kinds of observances. This is older Americans month And some months I feel older than older than other months and days. Approximately 17% of people in the United States are 65 years or older. It's also as mentioned earlier, Asian American Pacific Islander Month. Over 7% of the population of United States are Asian American Pacific Islander, and the state of Hawaii is majority Asian. It's also National Military Appreciation Month. And over 6% of all people in the United States are veterans or actively on, um, in military service. Please think about them, pray for them all the time. It is also Jewish American Heritage Month. Approximately two to 3% of all people in the United States are Jewish. It's also, that's more important to this state than many others. It's Haitian American Heritage Month. The state of Florida has more Haitian Americans than any other state in the United States. There's less than half of 1% of people in the United States are Haitian, but they're very important to our state. So thank you so much for your time, and God bless all of you. Thank you. All right. That's all the ones filled out for the public comment, so we'll go to the, uh, consent agenda. I need a motion. I make a Motion to approve. Motion made by Commissioner Wilson. Here. Second. I'll second. Seconded by Commissioner Kennedy. Any more comments? All right. I need a motion or a vote. You got it? A vote. A vote. Well vote a motion. I need a vote. We vote yet. That's good. All right, everyone. Did you make the motion? I made the motion. He seconded. All right. Let's vote. Motion carries unanimously. Thank you very much. All right. First read in avoidance number eight. First read of the warnings for 7 89 Pine Street. Small scale, comprehensive plan, amendment for low density residential to light industrial rezoning from single family dwelling to restricted manufacturing warehouse. You read? Yes, Sir. An ordinance of the city of Ocoee Florida amending the city of Ocoee comprehensive plan as adopted in 1991 as amended amending the future land use map of the Ocoee comprehensive plan to change the future land use map designation from low density residential to light industrial for certain real property containing approximately 2.51 acres. Located at 7 89 Pine Street on the east side of Pine Street, approximately 1,137 feet north of the intersection of Palm Drive and Pine Street, providing for and authorizing the revision of the official city future land use map prevailing in the event of any inconsistency providing for severability, providing for an effective date. Do you read the zoning one? Yes. I'll move on to the zoning one now. In ordinance of the city of Ocoee, Florida, changing the zoning classification from RR one, a single family dwelling district to I one light manufacturing and warehouse district. Uncertain real property containing approximately 2.51 acres, located at 7 89 Pine Street on the east side of Pine Street, approximately 1,137 feet north of the intersection of Palm Drive and Pine Street findings. Such zoning to be consistent with the e co e comprehensive plan, providing for and authorizing the revision of the official city zoning map prevailing in the event of any inconsistency providing for severability and providing for an effective date. Alright, these will be back on the second reading on, uh, may the 21st, and then they'll be open to the public. All right, item number that didn't world Well. Number seven, Six. That was six, not eight, I apologize. Number seven, first reading of ordinance for one Taylor Street, small scale com. Com. Comprehensive plan FLU amendment from heavy industrial to commercial and rezoning, one I one, restricted manufacturing and warehousing to C two Community commercial project. Ready. Uh, an ordinance of the city of Koi Florida amending the city of Koi comprehensive plan as adopted in 1991 as amended amending the future land use map. The eco comprehensive plan to change the future land use MAP designation from heavy industrial to commercial for certain real property containing approximately 0.21 acres. Located at one Taylor Street on the northeast side of Taylor Street at the intersection of Taylor Street in West McKee Street. Providing for and authorizing the revision of the official city feature lane East Map prevailing in the event of any inconsistency providing for severability, providing for an effective date now to the rezoning one, an ordinance of the city of KOA Florida, changing the zoning classification from I one restricted manufacturing and warehousing district to C two commercial community commercial district on certain real property containing approximately 0.21 acres. Located at one Taylor Street on the northeast side of Taylor Street at the intersection of Taylor Street in West McKee Street. Finding such zoning to be consistent with the OCO e comprehensive plan, providing for and authorizing the revision of the official city zoning map prevailing in the event of any inconsistency providing for separability and providing for an effective date. This will be the same, it'll be back on May the 21st for the second read. Alright, we'll go to number eight. First reading of ordinance for 1102 and 1104 North Lakewood Avenue. Lot property annexation In ordinance of the city of Ocoee, Florida. Annexing into the corporate limits of the city of Ocoee, Florida. Certain real properties containing approximately 7.17 acres located at 1102 and 1104 North Lakewood Avenue on the west side of North Lakewood Avenue, approximately 946 feet south of worst road and its intersection with North Lakewood Avenue. And assigned parcel ID number zero seven dash 22 dash 28 dash 0 0 0 0 dash zero zero dash 0 5 7 and zero seven dash 22 dash 28 dash 0 0 0 0 dash zero zero dash 0 6 0 pursuant to the application submitted by the property owner finding said annexation. Be consistent with the Florida statutes, the COE comprehensive plan, the COE city code and the Joint Planning Area agreement, providing for and authorizing the update of official city maps, providing direction to the city clerk, providing for severability prevailing in event of any inconsistency and providing for an effective date. All right, this will also be back May the 21st for the second read. Item number nine, first, reasonable ordinance for 1305 and 1113 Oka Apopka Road, MTTL enterprise LLC property Annexation, An ordinance of the city of Ocoee Florida, annexing into the corporate limits of the city of Ocoee, Florida. Certain real properties containing approximately 4.32 acres located at 1305 and 1113 Ocoee Papaka Road, approximately 2,616 feet south of Fullers Cross Road at its intersection with North Lakewood Avenue. And assigned parcel ID. Numbers zero seven dash 22 dash 28 dash 0 0 0 0 dash zero zero dash 0 3 9 and zero seven dash 22 dash 28 dash 0 0 0 0 dash zero zero dash 0 4 1. Pursuant to the application submitted by the property owner finding said annexation to be consistent with the Florida statutes, the COE comprehensive plan, the COE city code and the Joint Planning Area Agreement, providing for and authorizing the update of official city maps, providing direction to the city clerk, providing for severability prevailing in the event of any inconsistency and providing for an effective date. This will also be back on May the 21st for the second read. Item number 10, first reading of ordinance for ten five nine OCO Apopka Road, Rogers Property annexation An ordinance of the city of Ocoee Florida, annexing into the corporate limits of the city of Ocoee, Florida. Certain real property containing approximately 5.01 acres. Located at 10 59 Ocoee Apopka Road on the east side of Ocoee Apopka Road, approximately 3,284 feet south of Fuller's Cross Road at its intersection with OCO Papaka Road and assigned parcel ID number zero seven dash 22 dash 28 dash 0 0 0 0 dash zero zero dash 0 4 3 pursuant to the application submitted by the property owner Finding set annexation to be consistent with the Florida statutes, the COE comprehensive plan, the COE city code and the Joint Planning Area Agreement, providing for and authorizing the update of official city maps, providing direction to the city clerk, providing for severability prevailing in the event of any inconsistency and providing for an effective date. This also will be back May the 21st for the second read. Alright, second read of ordinance tonight, zero public hearing number 12, Koy pickleball Complex. I think we may missed number 11 1 4 11 11. I'm sorry. That's okay. I shoulda took a nap today. First reading in the ordinance for MDTL enterprise, LLC property annexation In ordinance of the city of Ocoee, Florida, annexing into the corporate limits of the city of Ocoee, Florida. Certain real properties containing approximately 2.17 acres located on the east side of Ocoee Papaka Road, approximately 3,392 feet south of Fullers crossroad at its intersection with Ocoee Papaka Road and assigned parcel ID numbers zero seven dash 22 dash 28 0 0 7 4 and zero seven dash 22 dash 28 dash 0 0 0 0 0 5. Pursuant to the application submitted by the property owner finding said annexation to be consistent with the Florida statutes, the eco e comprehensive plan, the Acoe City Code and the Joint Planning Area Agreement, providing for and authorizing the update of official city maps, providing direction to the city clerk, providing for severability prevailing in the event of any inconsistency and providing for an effective date. Alright, now let's go down to public hearing number 12. OCO pickleball complex essence Sports. LLC. Special inception is zoning manager, Whitfield. There she is. Oh, we also have, I have eight an open to public hearing. I have eight different, uh, forms filled up for, for speakers on that issue. Alright. Okay. Evening, Mr. Mayor. Commissioners. Thank you everybody. So this is the Coley Pickleball Complex, the Vasant Sports Property special exception. Um, the request is for special exception approval for the outdoor commercial recreation facility use on a property that is zoned C two. The properties are located at 1000, 1050 and 1100 Jacob Nathan Boulevard. Um, these are also known as lots four, three and six of the Goodman Center, um, commercial plot. So a little bit of background. The property's on the west side of Jacob, Nathan at the end of, uh, Matthew Paris. It's about six acres in size. The future line use designation is commercial. It is in the W study area and has floodplains on the property and wetlands near it. Um, the site's currently wooded, so this is the general aerial of the property. Just to give some context, um, Clark Road is here, state Road 50 is here, Jacob, Nathan, um, and then 4 0 8 is down here on the south. The surrounding future line use map is all commercial on the east side, high density residential on the north, commercial on the south, and then some commercial and conservation on the, uh, west surrounded by like C two zoning district with the R three on the north. And, um, so the requirements are coming from table five dash one, which is our permitted uses regulations table. Uh, it's codified through section five dash eight A and that table requires a special exception approval for a property zone C two for outdoor commercial. The criteria for, um, reviewing a special exception, uh, are laid out in section four dash eight B. There are three criteria. The first one is that the proposed use or structure would not violate the land use densities and intensities or other directives of the comp plan or the land development code. The second one is that the structure or the use would not, would be compatible with the uses and structures, um, or activities on adjacent or nearby lands. The third criteria is that the proposed use or structure would not violate any health, safety, welfare or the convenience of, um, those residing or working or owning land in the vicinity of the property. And this is with respect to density, bulking overcrowding, um, impairment of pedestrian or vehicular movements on adjacent streets, um, fire safety, noise odor, glare, vibrations or other, the ability of other adjoining property owners to, um, the legal use of their properties. So, um, our code doesn't require a site plan in the special exception, but staff has historically just asked for it just to make sure that the site can actually accommodate the use that they're, that the applicant is wanting to do. So, um, just some, some information on this slide. This red line, um, is a retaining wall because this dash line is the floodplain line that has been, to my knowledge, fuel verified. So our comp plan requires a 25 foot, uh, buffer from that floodplain line. So they're going to, um, build a retaining wall at that 25 foot mark. Um, the, the, um, this south southern portion of, of the complex are indoor courts, and this northern portion of the complex are covered outdoor courts, which is the reason why they're here now for special exception approval. So some of the concerns that staff looked at with respect to their criteria is the adjacent surrounding neighborhood neighbors or neighboring properties. Um, as you can see in this area, there's wetlands on the west, um, the city's retention pond on the north and some commercial uses on the, um, east and the south. Um, we also looked at building height. So the properties zone C two, we, um, checked to make sure that it complies with the C two design standards. In terms of the impervious surface area, the, um, the maximum building height, the floor area ratio, the, the site per the comp plan can accommodate hundreds of square feet of, uh, commercial. They're proposing, um, this 14,000 square foot building plus the courts, uh, in terms of parking. Um, our current code does not have specific standards for commercial recreation parking. Um, but the code does say that the commission can establish some, some reasonable standards for parking based on technical information that we have. So what the applicants are proposing is a 3.3 parking ratio. And what our staff has found in other jurisdictions is a range from 3.3 to four parking spaces per court. What they're showing here is a range of 3.3 spaces per court. Um, when we look at the site plan, there's opportunities to, um, seek more parking or to get more parking via joint parking agreements with the nearby properties. The code allows for us to consider nearby parking spaces within 300 feet of the, uh, property. So this is an area, um, sorry, not an aerial, a a conceptual rendering of the project. This is the top view. Um, the north is on the upper right hand side and south is on the left side. This is what they envision as the indoor courts, um, I'm sorry, the enclosed or covered courts. So the, the roof is impervious to weather, so it'll protect the courts and the players from sun, rain, things like that. Um, it also protects their, um, their quarts here. The walls as they're presenting it here are open. Um, they may mesh it or put install some meshing for, um, you know, bugs and mosquitoes and things like that. This is just another rendering. And then, um, this is, see my mouse. This right here would be the view that you would see from Matthew Parish. So going back to the criteria for, um, reviewing a special exception, um, as I mentioned, the proposed use doesn't exceed the FAR or intensity established in the comp plan is not a residential use, so it doesn't speak to density parking ratios. Um, as I mentioned, we'll look into that further. Um, should the use be approved at the site at the time of site plan review. Um, in terms of the structure it is and the use it is staff feels that it's use, the use is compatible with the surrounding commercial, um, sites. Um, it is one of the one lot, I think one of the remaining lots in a commercial subdivision that was, uh, adopt approved some time ago. Um, in terms of the use and layout, um, the horizontal site layout generally meets the city's code with respect to circulation, um, and ingress egress and things like that. Um, they will need to show fire turning movements, um, compatibility, the movement of the dumpster trucks and, and things like that. But that goes at the time of site plan review. The DRC considered this item at their April 2nd meeting and re made a recommendation of approval, um, subject to the condition that we still continue to look at the parking ratios, um, at the time of site plan review to make sure that it, it actually will, will make sense. Um, PCC heard it at their April 9th hearing. Um, there was some discussion. Um, in summary, the discussion was relative to whether or not the applicants would be willing to switch to court placements so that the indoor courts would be on the north side making the outdoor courts or covered courts a little bit further away from the, um, neighborhood to the Northwest. Um, and then questions were also raised regarding the site access and emergency services. So, um, as we review site plans, the fire marshal's office also reviews these as well as police and all of our other technical staff reviewers. Um, the preference from the fire marshal will be, of course, have two access, but they didn't say a hundred percent no to the, the single access, but they would have to make other improvements to the site, um, in order to have ingress egress safety safe ingress egress. Um, following the discussion, the PCC made a recommendation of approval subject to the conditions made by DRC, which are to, um, have a further look at parking. And, uh, with that staff is also, uh, making a recommendation of approval for the special exception to allow the outdoor commercial use on this property, uh, in a C two zoning district. And Mr. Mayor, the applicant team has a presentation as well. All right, I'm gonna open the public hearing for the, does the applicant want to come up front or we can go ahead and have the citizens' comments or you want to come up and tell us and then we'll have the citizen comments. I can't hear what you, Not yet. Thank you Mr. Mayor, thank you for this time. Thanks everybody. Give us your name. My name is Han Mah. I'm the project manager for the OCO Pickleball Pro Complex. It louder a little bit. They want you better. You got us okay? Yeah. Y'all hear me now? Yeah. Thank you. So, uh, we are proposing to build a, a world class pickleball facility in, um, the three parcels that were mentioned, 1000, 1005, and 1100 Jacob Nathan Boulevard. So if you guys are not familiar with, uh, pickleball, right? So pickleball is a sport that's blend of, uh, tennis badminton and ping bomb. Uh, it's appealing to all the, all the people at all in all the ages right now. So it's rapidly, uh, growing very fast and, um, it's, it's one of the fa it's not one of the, it's the fastest growing sport. It has been the fastest growing sport for the past five years, um, in, in US. And, um, over 3.5 million Americans today play critical ball regularly. And if you look at the adult, uh, adults, 55 plus, uh, players, it's been increasing at 12% or it has increased at 12% in the past year. So also the tournament attendance has, uh, increased a lot. Now it draws thousands of, uh, spectators plus the players who participate, uh, in the pickleball tournaments. So if we look at the growth, uh, to date, uh, 36.5 million, uh, Americans play pickleball on a regular basis, and it has actually increased 1 58 0.6% in 2023. And if we look at couple of pickleball facilities in the Orlando area, these are a couple of the popular, uh, facilities we have, uh, K Katy way in Winter Park. It has six outdoor, uh, pickleball courts and veterans park and winter garden, it has eight courts. Outdoor clear, one sports in Orlando, it has nine courts, all indoor air condition. Orlando racket Sports has nine courts, indoor air condition, central winds, winter Springs, it's just opened recently, 14 courts all outdoor. So all these facilities have their own, um, uh, disadvantages with them. So outdoor courts are very well vulnerable to the weather and indoor courts, they're very, uh, the quality of those courts are not, um, uh, top notch. So, and with that, uh, having said that, so there is definitely a need, uh, to build a massive pickleball facility to, uh, cater the raising demand and, uh, we call it the low availability of pickleball facilities in the Orlando area. So pickleball, I mean, it's, it's a lot of, it's, uh, getting a lot of attention. It's a community sport. A lot of everybody loves playing pickleball and get, honestly, people get addicted to, uh, play to the, to the sport once they get on the court. So, and it's also becoming a social hub, um, so where people come to a central location and play, compete together and build a community, and we anticipate that the ongoing raise of pickleball participation is, uh, is going to grow a lot. So why we, uh, chose Ocoee to build this project is oco. We, we know that it's centrally located. It's 10 minutes to downtown Orlando, very close to the parks and rec, I mean the Universal and Disney, all that areas, and the growing population in this area, there's a strong, uh, interest in the pickleball, uh, sport in this, uh, neighborhood. I mean in, not just in Koi also the surrounding areas like, uh, winter garden and all. So our project at a high level, so it's on, it's, we're gonna build this on a 6.08, uh, acre, uh, of land. So we are gonna, we want to build 44 courts, um, uh, uh, 44 pickleball courts in the facility with one championship court, um, with some spectator seating as well. So we are not just building, uh, another regular pickleball facility over here where you're going to build, uh, we are planning to build a top-notch pickleball facility in club style that can cater large tournaments. And, uh, we, we will, we, we are planning to put tournament style courts, rehab, uh, facilities for the, for the players, uh, workspaces, meaning people, if people want to work from, uh, the pickleball facility, we could be going to put some conference rooms and quiet rooms as well for them to work from there. And we are also going to have a kids play area and the families to enjoy over there. And we are also going to serve food and beverages if somebody wants to stay there for longer duration to play. So we, we providing them all these facilities over there, ities over there. So if you look at a couple of, uh, other facilities in Florida in this area and also, uh, in outside of this area. So we're talking about central winds, uh, pickle wall facilities. It's in Winter Springs, it has 14 outdoor courts. So that's the aerial view of the map for the facility. Uh, so this is pickleball, uh, facility. It's in winter park with eight courts. Uh, all these courts are outdoor. This is leaping more pickleball facility in Sanford, Florida. So this has six outdoor courts, Ville pickleball Sanford, it has six outdoor courts. This is one of the largest pickleball facility on the planet right now. So this has 60 outdoor courts. It's in Naples, uh, Florida. Yes. So that's all I got, uh, today about the project. So, uh, if you guys have any questions or comments, please feel free. All right. I'm gonna let the, uh, public comments and then we might have you come back up. Okay. Thank you guys. Alright, we're gonna open the public hearing. First, first one is, uh, and you have five minutes total. Kelly Wels. She wehi well. Well, She knows who she is. Mr. Mayor, can we make sure that we hear where people live relative to the Pickle Mall when they Speak where they live? Yeah, they don't give their addresses. I can Tell you they used to Have to. I know, I know, but, okay. Thank you. Hi, go ahead. Kelly Walsh, 1005 Featherstone Circle as the president of the hammocks, HOA and a dedicated educator here in Ocoee. I stand before you today in full support of our residents. I do not support the rezoning of this property to allow for a commercial, outdoor, recreational facility. This is not about a few pickleball courts like what you might find in an HOA or park. This is about the potential for a large scale intrusive noise, which threatens to disrupt our residents' quality of life. Additionally, we are concerned about diminished property value, loss of community character, and more that could arise from such a development. I simply cannot imagine any decibel level that would be tolerable for the sanity of our community when subjected to up to 15 hours of noise each day. If we are even going to entertain this proposal, it should come with strict requirements fully for a fully enclosed, properly sound mitigated facility. Our residents deserve nothing less than peace and tranquility in their own neighborhood. Thank you. Thank you ma'am. Next is Lisa Stinson. Hi, it's uh, Lisa Stinson 8 5 7 Hummock Drive. Uh, I just wanna start by saying that I have no issues with pickleball as a sport. It's great. I've played pickleball, I've got young children. What I do have an issue with is the noise that it's gonna create. So I'm here today to express my strong opposition about the rezoning. And I feel your role in this decision is pivotal for our community. Living in a COI has been a source of joy for me and my family, particularly my children who have some special needs. They love exploring our unique surroundings filled with wetlands, trees, retention areas, and the hilly streets in our neighborhood provide a beautiful backdrop for activities like walks, playtime, and community socializing. So let's talk about pickleball. You saw the positives. I'd like to discuss the negatives. It's a loud paddle ball sport. Sorry, I'm bit nervous known for its impulsive noise. These sudden sharp base of sound when played intensively or near residential areas can be piercing and disruptive. The sharp because of pop, pop, pop sounds of a paddle along with the players vocalizations, the cheering, the shouting disrupt nearby environments. And there have been hundreds complaints all over the cities, all over the country about this noise. The proposed facility is substantial, as you can see. It's not just a few courts in the middle of a park. Similar competitive facilities operate long hours, usually 7:00 AM to 10:00 PM or later. As a CO's ordinance goes later, this will subject our neighborhood, other neighborhoods and surrounding businesses up to 15 hours of repetitive high frequency noise every day. The developer's plan includes installing 44 cores with over half of these are outdoors. Now they are covered, but they are a hundred percent indoors. Studies have shown that this cover may not effectively reduce the noise. It could even worsen it by bouncing it around. Regardless of how the position is, the building is positioned with our areas unique topography with its trees, wetlands, and retention areas, it will act as an acoustical amplifier, intensifying the noise levels from court activities and making a challenge for everybody locally to concentrate, relax, or enjoy their homes. Distance may help mitigate some sound levels, but it will not mitigate the frequency of impacts and not for the number of courts proposed. The site is just not big enough to achieve what the developer wants. Our city zoning regulations are in place to safeguard the health, safety, and welfare of our community. They prohibit building if it causes issues with surrounding areas. And our noise ordinances do recognize both perceived and impulsive noise rezoning for outdoor pickleball. Courts of this magnitude will undoubtedly violate these codes and ordinances. Chronic exposure to impulsive noise can have serious long-term consequences on health and wellbeing. This is why I aid you to vote no on this proposal before any decision to made. It is crucial to conduct feasibility studies, an environmental impact study, as well as a sound impact study by a professional acoustical engineer. We as residents don't have the power to stop a developer, but we rely on you as our commissioners to advocate for our needs and preserve our community's quality of life. Thank you for your time. Thank You ma'am. Ellen Staples. Good evening. Eileen Staples 8 5 9 hammock drive. I wish to speak in opposition to the requested special exemption for the indoor outdoor pickleball complex and the C two Community commercial District. I have played USTA tennis for over 20 years and have belonged to several racket clubs. I have also played pickleball multiple times as a lifelong participant in sports. I do support additional athletic facilities in ocoee. However, this parcel of land is not where this should be built. 44 pickleball courts less than 500 feet from my property will destroy the serenity of the neighborhood. The hammocks is a peaceful neighborhood. My husband and I bought our house because of this in the con in the conservation area behind us. We did not buy in a neighborhood which offered tennis pickleball or outdoor facilities for a reason. Building this facility on the proposed land will bring intolerable noise for a minimum of 13 hours a day. This is unfair to the residents of the hammocks as well as the neighborhood of Crestwood Heights. It will also reduce the value of the neighborhood's, uh, properties. Please ask, please ask yourself if your house was less than 500 feet from 44 pickleball courts, 24 of them are not enclosed making the sounds of the game that it does for 13 hours a day, would you and your family enjoy it? I rather doubt it. Please support us in opposing this exception and find other land more conducive to the project. Thank you. Thank you ma'am. One quick question, Mike, what's the distance from the back of the hammocks to the that point? Mayor Mike Groomer development services director is if as the site plan was shown with the outdoor courts on the northern end, the most corner house from property to property 460 from building to, uh, patio of the house almost an eighth of a mile. The rest of the houses are about an eighth of a mile from the facility. Alright. Alright. And obviously if you move the courts to the south side, they would be well over. Okay. Alright. Lily Cordell, Good evening. Mm-Hmm. And first I want to thank all of you for all that you do every day to make our community lovely and a safe place to live. Um, I also don't have any objection to bringing recreational activities to kohi. I think it's a wonderful idea. However, I object to rezoning this parcel of land to an outdoor recreational, um, facility. It's zoned right now for commercial, but not for outdoor recreational. And I believe that, um, putting an outdoor recreational facility of this massive magnitude will create a negative impact on the community. Not just the neighborhood that I live in, the hammocks, but, um, surrounding areas because of the, the high frequency, high pitched frequent noises for one. And it's also that massive amount of people and, and I'm sure you fully hope to get lots of people there for competitions and things, that's gonna bring an enormous amount of traffic to an area that is already highly congested where Clark Road goes to West Colonial and to the 4 0 8. And it just seems hard to imagine that that's gonna be an, uh, not going to impact the koi community that uses Clark Road and Colonial Daily for their commutes to their work and and activities. Um, the other thing, I had a question, it's like, it's uh, why do we need to have outdoor courts? Can they just use indoor courts for their facility, which is that would, um, fit in with the way that the, the property is currently zoned? So that was one question that I had and I'm trying to find, to think of what the benefit to the entire KOA community would be to allow this as an outdoor recreational facility that seems much more appropriate to be in, um, a park setting versus this city setting that it's in. So that was a question that I had. Um, and no one's I, I saw that there, um, planning on having, um, beverages and food and it's a social thing. That sounds great. Um, but no one mentioned are they planning on serving alcohol in this cafe? Because if that's the case too, it outdoor, huge outdoor facility with lots of people drinking and pickle balling is going to be quite loud from the participants and the observant, the observers. Um, And I didn't see where there would be any, um, restrictions on the hours of the play. And I know, um, typically in a coa you have to even stop construction because of the impulsive high frequency noises by 7:00 PM So, um, those were questions that I had and I respectfully asked, I hope that you will deny the, um, rezoning of this because I think it will have a negative impact on our community as a whole. Thank you. Thank you ma'am. Daniel Stinson. Daniel Stinson 8 57 hammock. Sorry, I need my glasses. Uh, first I would like to say that my family and I love a coi. We could have lived anywhere in central Florida. We chose to live in Akoi. After researching the area, we made our the choice to purchase our home in the Hamms neighborhood. Our home borders the conversa conservation area and this is, this was one of the deciding factors of our choice to purchase our home. We enjoy the peaceful nature of the converse conservation behind our home. I do not support the rezoning of the commercial property. This project will impact our home, our neighborhood, our health and wellbeing, as well as the value of our home. I feel disheartened that our city has not done its due diligence. Before recommending approval to the commissioners, we are asking you to protect the homeowners. Uh, this commission has been presented with ample evidence regarding the noise associated with pickleball, drawn from factual accounts across the nation, not merely subjective opinions. After researching this the project, proposed project, we quickly discovered what will happen if this project is approved. Not only will our neighborhood be directly affected, other neighborhoods and businesses would also feel the impact. We have no issues with pickleball. We're not against the sport. What we are against is 44 court championship level pickleball complex being so close to our residences. Players will get to visit the facility, play their game, create a nuisance, disturb the peace, shout, cheer, and socialize, then go to their home, their nuisance free neighborhoods. This is not a formula for a cohesive community. The conservation area beside the proposed build site will also be affected by this type of complex. The conservation area has many inhabitants, including black bear, coyote, foxes, bobcats in all manner of migratory and non-migratory birds. We have several protected species of hawks and kestrels that also live in this area. The noise of this type of complex will certainly have a negative effect on this wetland area. The home values of our neighborhoods will plummet. If this type of complex is in our backyard, no one will want to purchase our homes due to the constant and relating noise created by the sport. Please take a moment and think about this type of championship complex if it was going to be built 400 feet behind your residence. Thank you very much. Thank you William Cordell. Good evening. Thank you Mayor. Commissioners, appreciate all that you do for our community. Um, I'd like to begin just real quick, excuse me. How many people here if by show of hands, play pickleball? Just, okay, there's a few of you. How many of you, um, here love pickleball? Okay. There's a alright few, a few less. Okay. Did, oh, I'm sorry. I should have included you. How many up here love pickleball or how many of you have played pickleball? I've had two back surgeries lately in the knees replacement. Oh right. Well, used to be a heck of a racquetball player at one time. I know that. Yeah. Yes. Um, okay. My point being, um, pickleball is the fastest growing sport in America. It is over. I mean, it is. It's like wildfire. It's great. I think it's wonderful. And I think what your drawings show as far as the in uh, indoor facility looks marvelous. And I applaud that and I hope that you can get that built. I think that's gonna be beautiful. I think it would be a boon to the community. Absolutely. Why not? However, there are a couple sticking points. Why does there have to be 44 courts? Why do they have to be outdoor courts? Why not go and have an entire indoor facility with the accommodating parking? That's the one thing I kept hearing over and over again is that there's an average, uh, of um, four. I mean that's the ideal average, but you know, you can allow 3.3 to four as far as parking is concerned. And I got a question about that. So, you know, I was wondering, has there been a DOT study requested to accomplish the regarding anticipated traffic congestion due to both the Wawa and the pickleball going in the same area, close proximity to one another in an overtax intersection of Clark Road Colonial Drive and the 4 0 8 entrance and exit? Both businesses are gonna produce nonstop traffic seven days a week. That means they're gonna be coming and going all the time from the beginning. They open up till they close. I would imagine this would also require far a greater influx of U-turns of both Clark Road and Colonial in order to access the only two entrances onto Jacob, Nathan and Matthew Paris Boulevard. Is the city preparing proactively for the resultant delays or will that just be whatever it'll be and we'll have to deal with that at a later time? All this is going to impact not only homeowners in the close proximity, but everybody who has to drive down Clark Road, take Colonial or get on the 4 0 8. Are you prepared for backups on the 4 0 8 when we have a big tournament here? People aren't gonna just come from Koi. They're gonna come from surrounding, uh, areas all around the uh, uh, Florida, maybe all around the United States. I hope so. It highlights our community. But are we gonna have the proper parking for it? Four spaces. I invite the, um, the mayor and the commissioners all to go to the Winter Springs. We went up there, beautiful facilities, all outdoors. They've got seven spaces per court of 14 courts. Um, that's 56 people at. And guess what I, I was wondering well how come there that was packed at the time we went, it was a Friday evening. You know, it's a cool of the day. Lots of people are there. It's on the weekend, it's about to be the weekend. Well it turns out that everybody drives themselves. They don't come together in groups. Uh, there's family members there to watch, there's friends there to watch, there's people waiting to get on court. So you've got an influx. There were hardly any spaces at all, even having seven. And, uh, the uh, seven spaces, I'm sorry, we're talking about 44 courts, 176 people, a minimum of 176 spaces. That's not considering the fact that people are gonna come, if this is a state-of-the-art facility, they're gonna come to hang out to go to the cafe to be inside. Enjoy. Uh, that's why people are gonna come because it's gonna be inside, not outside, but you have the outdoor courts that creates a whole nother issue. And that's a sound issue. So, uh, I just wonder, I, I saw the planning and zoning commission meeting and I was a little disappointed 'cause only one question came up and that was what about the emergency in and out and then it was shouted down or actually just spoken down. The fire marshal approved it. Okay. How can the fire marshal approve something if he doesn't know the number of spaces that are gonna actually be there? We all know about side plans and uh, how they can change in a heartbeat. Thank you for your time. Thank You. Catherine Carpenter. Hi there. Um, I'm Catherine Carpenter. I live at 1112 Wein Berry Court in the hammock subdivision. Um, the irony me, uh, the irony of me being here has not lost on me. I play pickleball probably four to five times a week. I do love the sport. It is a fantastic sport. Um, and I think that everybody has brought up a big concern that all of you need to take very seriously. And that is the noise level. Um, my particular property probably will not hear the noise, but I'm here to represent the entire subdivision. And what you haven't heard is why it's going to be loud. Um, a pickleball is kinda like a whiffle ball and the paddle is a short little paddle. And when you hit it in the center, um, it makes it, it makes a loud popping noise. Um, when you hit it hard in the center, it makes an even louder popping noise. Okay? And my concern is if this is club level play, they're gonna be hitting it hard and they are very good at what they do and that means that they hit it in the center of the paddle. So it's going to be loud popping, um, a lot and maybe there's gonna be some people at a lower level playing there. But with this kind of a facility, there's gonna be a lot of very, very good players there. Especially on a tournament weekend or whatever, there's gonna be a lot of noise. Um, I also am concerned about the retention pond area that is right next to it. If there is water in that retention pond, we all know noise travels across water even more. So these homes that are right adjacent to it are gonna get even more noise. Um, I feel like you as commissioners owe it to the residents to go out and visit some, some pickleball courts and just listen or maybe even step, step away from it 400 feet and see what you're hearing. The ones out in Winter Garden, the veterans, that's 10 courts, I go out there all the time. I can't imagine 20 quarts the noise level from 20 courts. It would be a lot more. Obviously I think that you guys owe it to the residents to go out and hear what pickleball really is. Um, before you make a decision on this, if you can put this decision on hold, I think it's your responsibility to do that because I am definitely opposed to the changing in the zoning. I think that it could all be indoors and we'd all be happy. Thanks for your time. Thank you ma'am. Okay. That's the last of the, the cards here. So we'll move it back, close the public here and bring it back. Give the uh, applicant an opportunity to respond. If you'll let me finish. Yes sir. Huh? I'm gonna bring the applicant back up. Alright. I thought you had Eight. Huh? I thought you Had eight. I'm sorry. That was seven Mm Nevermind. Go ahead. The applicant wanna come back up, answer questions. My name is Robin Tamala. I'm the project manager. So one of the concern that was brought today, we, we've heard this concern about the noise. We met with couple of residents last Friday. We, uh, we, we've actually told them what all steps we are going to take to reduce the noise level when playing pickleball. Definitely there is noise. I'm not denying it. Okay. But with the distance, the, this noise level is going to reduce. And apart from that, we are also planning to put some, um, noise barrier varying, um, equipment and at the facility, even on the outdoor courts so that those equipment or the pads actually or the mesh actually absorbs some, some of the sound or the noise. So that reduces the noise a lot. And also we uh, uh, agreed to consider the option of, um, moving the out outdoor courts together south of the property and the cover and um, indoor courts together, not of the proper property. So the distance between the residential area and the outdoor courts is going to increase or it's going to be more than 800 feet. So also, uh, we talked about reducing the hours of operations depend, uh, depending on the demand of the players. So we, we even, uh, said that, hey, we can reduce the hours to, to of playing till 8:00 PM and on the outdoor courts and let all the players play only on the indoor courts after 8:00 PM If that's an option, definitely that's, uh, that will be considered as well. So those are the things that we discussed on Friday with the residents. And uh, we are open for any kind of suggestions that we get from the residents or even any, anybody in this room to reduce a nice level. And, uh, we are open for that. Alright, I'm gonna, I'm gonna let the, uh, commissioners now ask their questions. I go ahead. I'll You can go first. It's in your, Well I have, you know, yes. I live in the hammocks. I, that's, say that right up front. Um, the folks who it's gonna mostly affect are the folks in the back of the hammocks. Um, noise is the issue. What we're going to, what we would have to live with in that neighborhood. Um, I think I do wanna hear what other commissioners have to say 'cause I have some other things to say at this point. Um, I did go out and look at some pickleball facilities over the weekend. Um, they are loud. Um, not as large as the ones that you're planning. I do like, I do appreciate that you're willing to invert the facility from the north to the south. Um, but still it does not address the issue of noise at this point enough from me. Um, and I don't think it does for the residents here from the neighborhoods. I'd like to hear the other commissioners, but I do have some more things to say. Okay. Thank you. You want me to go? Um, I'm, I'm not clear on where you're from. Is your company located in oi? My company is currently not located in Oi. Are you in Florida? Yes, we are in Florida. Okay. Um, you meant, you showed us in your presentation, you showed us five other pickle courts. Yep. Do you own or operate those pickle courts? No, we do not operate those pickleball facilities. What's the relationship to your presentation then? Why are they in there? I'm just showing how, what other facilities are in Florida. Okay. You showed one in Naples, you showed a large one in Naples. Correct. Do you own or operate that? No, I do not operate That. Um, you met with residents, you said? Yes. And several of them asked, uh, questions, repeated them and said they haven't gotten answers. So I'm going to get some answers for them. Um, are you planning to sell alcohol? Yes. Um, if PE can people bring their own beer and stuff? No. Okay. Um, why not make them all indoor courts? So, two reasons. First reason is people love to play pickleball outdoors as well with the natural light. So that's one reason we wanted to have a couple of outdoor courts or covered courts. And the second reason is the financial aspect of it. So if we put all outdoor courts, the, the cost of the project is going to double, or if not more than twice, it's going to be twice a flip. So those are the two reasons, and the project will not be financially viable. Okay. If we put all the courts in Draw and you are planning to have tournaments Once a month? Yes. Okay. And is it, is it true that if I wanna play pickleball, I need three parking spaces, but if I have a tournament, I need seven. What, what sort of, do people go watch people play pickleball Or, so my friends, four of my friends go from Sanford to, uh, uh, a facility called Clear One Sports. They go in one car, me and my wife, we go to play in one. Okay. Play pickleball in one car. I have, um, I have heard a pickleball court. Um, there's one right by the 10th tee that I like to play. It drives me nuts. Perfect. Um, it's within a hundred feet. Um, the decibel level, uh, I read the packet, um, I did some research. It says, uh, over 400 feet, there's not a problem. Did you, uh, calculate the water, transferring the noise? Have you done a study? Did you do a traffic study? Et cetera. Those questions were brought up. This, uh, technical analysis on the sound or noise has not been done, but we are open to, uh, uh, onboard a acoustic engineer during the project tenure or during when we submit the site plan and we take their opinion and we take all their suggestions to put in place, uh, to reduce the noise level. As far as the traffic study, yes, we did the traffic study. Okay. I get that. That's your job. Um, one more question. Did you study or do you have information about the impact on the values of the homes that was brought Up? Yeah, definitely. So I, when I moved to Florida first, I moved to Lake Nona in 2016. You guys know what Lake Nona is in, is in 2016 and what it is now. So one of the biggest May player over there is the USA tennis association. Right? So one of the reason why the prices have gone up for the homes is people want to move closer to the facility. People want to move closer to where they want to play tennis. So we think that having a pickleball facility here will bring the property price will, will increase the property prices. Do you think that's across the board, or do you think that's probably relative? For example, if I live on the edge of the hammocks and I'm subjected to the noise, mine might go down. But if I live in the center and I can't hear it, but I'm five minutes away, it might go up. So if you're in the house and somebody is playing pickleball next to your house, you're, you hear nothing. If you come outside of your house to, to walk your dog or something, definitely you hear the pickleball in ice. Thank you for answering the question. So one more, uh, quick comment, sir. So when you asked me about the organization that we run, we run a group called the Golden Paddle Pickleball Club. We run, uh, very big tournaments across Florida and also outside Florida. Okay. So all our tournaments bring about right now with the limited facilities that we have in Florida right now with bring about three 50 to 400 players to participate in the tournament. Okay. Thank, that's my relationship with pickleball and that's what we do right now. I think I, I tried to write down and answer the questions that people said they couldn't get answers to. So I hope that covers it. Thank you. Anybody else? Yeah. Um, it would seem to me that you're trying to add more courts than the lot can feasibly, you know, tolerate. I would think that if you did away with the 12 courts on top and converted that to parking and then covered the other 12 courts that you have there, that would answer all the questions. Uh, I can understand about the, uh, noise complaint pickleball off the top of my head, doesn't sound like it would create, you know, that much of a tremendous, uh, sound problem, but I'm sure it does. Um, you know what a perfect place for this facility would be was inside one of the vacant anchor stores across the street in the West Oaks Mall. So There, there's a couple of anchor stores in there that I don't think they're doing much of anything. And it would, it would facilitate your whole program here and it would be a destination to go to For sure. So I'm in favor of reducing the size of it, and I would like to see it all Enclosed. Okay. First question, uh, on, on the parking Mm-Hmm. So on a regular basis to accommodate the regular players on a daily basis, we are talking to, if this parking is not sufficient, so we, we are talking to our neighbors as well at the funeral home. They have empty parking spots every day. There's nobody over there except when, when there's an event over there. So we, we are going to come up with an understanding with them once the site plan is approved, and once the project is kicked off, we are going to come up with a formal ag agreement with them to use their parking spaces. And also when we have big events or tournaments, we want to, uh, use the parking, uh, that's at the mall and run a bus from there to our facility to move the spectators or the players from, from the parking lot of, from the mall to our facility. So on a daily basis, we think the parking, um, would be sufficient. The parking that we have on site would be sufficient for the, uh, regular players on a daily basis. One of the example that's brought by one of, uh, the members here is about the Winter Springs having seven parking spots per coat. That is, that may be correct, but Winter Park facility is not just for pickleball. It's a very bigger park and there are a lot of other sports involved. So I try to run a tournament over there, and they said that they can only give me eight courts outta 14 courts because they cannot accommodate parking for the rest, for all the players. Okay. Sounds like we have a, uh, issue with a big issue with sound, um, and the noise that would probably disturb the residents in the area, even if it's been inverted to the, uh, the south side, there's still gonna be an element of noise. Um, I did some research on, on pickleball, and it is actually, um, the fastest growing sport, uh, in the United States. Uh, it was 158% over, uh, past three years. Um, there is a, uh, certainly, um, some benefits. There's a, the physical benefit of of being, of being able to exercise is a, is a big benefit also, uh, the socialization is also a benefit networking as well as, uh, for some, uh, uh, senior citizens is a sense of belonging, uh, to the community. So there was a lot of positive things I did, uh, read about pickleball. I have not, I have not played pickleball myself. Uh, I have watched it on tv. I've watched it, the sport grow. I've watched it to the point where it had been discussion about being an Olympic sport. Yeah. So, um, I think pickleball is great. I think that, uh, having a pickleball facility in the city of oco, uh, is definitely going to enhance, uh, um, our city as far as bringing in, uh, folks to, to the city to spend money to uh, uh, bring in some, um, some, uh, non-taxable revenue into the city. And I, and I think that's great. Uh, but on one hand I look at, uh, this facility and I look at where this facility is being placed. I think about traffic. I think about getting in and out. Uh, parking is definitely, uh, an issue. I've kind of watched this through the planning and zoning. I've read all the information on it, and parking was definitely, uh, uh, a major concern. Uh, one of the major concerns to me was the fact that, um, we are, we're starving for more retail and, and restaurants in our city. And I'm looking at this location and it's, and it's right, it's, it's zone C two right now, and it's, it's right in the middle of a area of, um, it's a pretty much a hot spot, almost a donut hole where you have Highway 50 and you have Clock road, uh, in the four, you have the 4 0 8 right there. And, and I, and I see a lot of traffic going through there. Um, which could be somewhat of a retail destination as far as sit down restaurants, something that we are longing for even more, uh, more national, uh, brands to come to our city to enhance, uh, uh, the retail economic value of our city. Um, but, uh, uh, I think that this is a great facility, but I just don't like the idea of where it's located. I have to agree with Commissioner Ferner. I think that, uh, another location, uh, may be, uh, uh, a, a solution, uh, to this, to this issue here. But again, I still think that pickleball is a, is a great sport and I think it's gonna be a, a great enhancement to the city. I just think that we should probably look at, uh, another location and maybe reserve this, this area right here for, uh, everyday use for everyone that they want. Maybe go sit down to the restaurant and maybe do some shopping at a national brand. Sure. Even any project, sorry, The, um, restaurant business is nothing that, that, that's something we can't make happen. We try it happening. It'll happen eventually when you get enough people to come to places. Stuff. We, we can't make the restaurant show up. You can easily say, oh yeah, we want restaurants there. I've been hearing that for the last 15 years and we don't seem to get 'em, but I don't understand why we all spend money at. And also, but you gotta look at all the issues here. And, um, I, I don't take it wrong for what I'm gonna say. I'm gonna tell you a few things here that I've sit and talked to people that want to develop damaged properties. Those properties are going to be commercial or apartments is what they're trying to put in. Now, I looked at a set of plans and I, if I'm not mistaken, it was close to 700 apartments. Do you want apartments there too? I mean, or is there gonna be nothing go there? You know, I, I, I'm just giving you the overall view here folks. 'cause something's going to go there, you know, it's either going to be a commercial. And when we did that, when we did that shopping center, none of the rest of them were here. We did that shopping center, a mall, uh, we, we had the community come in and all that stuff. That whole side where you're talking about now was supposed to be commercial. Every bit of it. It was supposed to be with another million, something, uh, square foot of, of, of commercial in there, which never happened. 'cause everything kind of went, could poop. But I'm just going to, I'm, I'm telling you. And it is, uh, I, I would say if you did any, you'd need to put 'em, I don't know why you'd put 'em on the north side and not on the south side to start with that. But I also, and Commissioner Kennedy, you said, where are you, where are you from? Well, most of the businesses we got in this town are not from oco. I, I don't hold nothing against somebody because they're from somewhere else. Businesses just like talking about ERs. You're not going to get anybody living in town here to put a ER in. It's, it's coming from somewhere else. So you can't penalize the gentleman and them for spending money on 6.5 acres or whatever it is. I mean, come on folks. I mean we, uh, the issue is sometimes you, you should buy the other property behind you or side of you if you don't want anything else to come there. I think ham's is a beautiful place. I looked to buy there years ago when I bought mine. I couldn't afford it. So, but, you know, it, it, and, um, what do you think's going there? If we don't have something like this, this is gonna bring in generate restaurants. That's what it will generate. It will generate restaurants and activities like that. Uh, you can't just park and say, okay, we're gonna put these over here in the park. Well, the parks are all around neighborhoods. We, what are you gonna do there? You gonna make it quit? You talking about putting 'em in parks? What are you gonna do to the neighbors that live around those? Tell 'em to forget it. We don't want 'em in the other area, but we're gonna put 'em in this area that don't work either. I mean, there's gotta be ways and, and everybody's sitting up here and knows full well that there's a traffic study done. When you do these projects, there's gotta be, when the site plan comes, that'll also dictate what happens there. So there are all the negative stuff, but you gotta look at some of the positive stuff. I'm telling you, I looked at plans and I couldn't believe it. What they wanna put up behind the hammocks all the way down. So something's coming there eventually, folks, it, it is gonna, it is going happen. So, and it is a great place, but that's going to change somewhere down the line. 'cause the, the people are trying to, somebody's got a contract on it. I think right now, if I'm not mistaken, all that land beside you and down, but there's ways maybe working it where we can cut 'em down some or, or, you know, change the parking from down. Um, not the parking, but the, the lighting ones up. Like Commissioner Firster said on the north side to the south side. I mean, I don't play pickleball. My son plays pickleball. I I know, I know a gentleman that's, um, he built one in his, he built one in his yard in a, in a backyard. He built a regulation pickleball. I, I guess it's supposed to be for older people. I guess I is what I, but I watched them on TV one day and there ain't no way I'd be doing that. They were, they were fast. So I wouldn't wanna be doing it, but that's the way it is. Like I said, I, I I, I don't know, you know, no matter what I think goes in that part there, the hammocks are not gonna like it. So I, I can tell you right now, no matter what goes in, in that land, we'll have crowd back here again. So you can shake your head. All you want is, that's what's going to happen. Somebody's gonna come there to ba bill something somewhere down the line. Can Let me finish. Yes, sir, sir. So everybody talks, everybody does it. I'm, I'm not telling you what I'm gonna do till I put my finger up there to do it. So, but the distance to me in there, the distance from the top of that, if you, especially if you moved it, there's a lot of land, a lot of trees and a lot of woods in between that and the hammocks, you know, a lot of it. So I don't, I don't see how the noise is gonna be that much. I go to the tennis court and I hear them beating the ball around too. So, uh, like I said, I think everybody needs to think, don't get scared about, you know, not doing this or doing that, but you gotta understand something's going there eventually, you know, somewhere down the line. This gentleman bought the land, he didn't rent it, you bought it. Now the people at the mall, we'd all like to see something go in the mall, but it seems to me like they don't care. They don't, we've tried everything we can to get them to do things and they don't want to do it. We don't own it. We can't tell 'em what to put in there. Alright, commissioner, go ahead. I, I wanted, uh, to allow Mike rumor to address some of the things you brought up. He's out standing here. Okay. Alright. Now I'm gonna give you one time, well, I asked for, I asked The, I know I asked if I would like to come back after I listen You pictures. Thank you. Okay. Uh, mayor Mike Groomer, development services director. Just wanna clear a couple things up. Number one is, this is not a rezoning. The special exception means this use is allowed unless we find a detriment to a neighboring property. So it's not a rezoning. The this property is commercial. This is a commercial subdivision. This is a commercial subdivision that is borders on an art six lane arterial road and a four lane arterial road. This is a commercial property. The trips are already baked into the commercial subdivision. This is not bringing new trips. This is actually a di minimus in the amount of trips on six acres of commercial. Do wanna state, we have 1.2 million square feet of mall space that could have out, that has beer, wine, alcohol that, that has trips generated that are not being used as you said on the west side of, uh, Clark Road is another 900,000 square foot. All that commercial can go in without, with, without any, uh, just a basic site plan approval. So this is not a discussion on trips. The trips are there, it's a commercial property. If this were ag land or residential land and we were rezoning it to commercial to do this, yes, trips are an appropriate discussion point. But that's, that's not here. I wanna say the reason the building was on the south, the enclosed courts were on the south side were because I wanted that building to be prominent. When you're on 50, when you're in that, that retail mix, when you have the Wawa, whatever the space is behind the Wawa, if you recall the parcel that has the Wawa since early 2000, had a requirement that had a 9,000 square feet of restaurant space and 20,000 square feet of retail, nothing built. And we amended that to allow the Wawa. So we have all of this commercial with the building Mr. S built, we have all, I wanted that building to be upfront and be noticed. If we're gonna do it, we're gonna do it right. We want to have the best pick pickleball facility that we can. This is about 24 outdoor courts. It's not about 44. They're inside a building. Just like if you had a go-kart track inside a building, you're not talking about the go-kart noise. So 24 courts is the issue we're talking about. And we looked at it and evaluated. We cannot use as part of a special exception. You saw the criteria. We cannot use property values. The hammocks does not drive by this facility to go to their subdivision. The hammocks doesn't abor this subdivision, this property, the hammocks has a drainage tract and they have a big conservation tracked in between. And there's a city of Acoe tract. So when you look at ness, it is not adjacent. So that check the item off far list, and we're talking about 24 courts at most, being outdoor, there is not like we have transportation criteria. We have the ITE that talks about how the basic, the the use and how many trips are with that. The way they get those ITE trips is they have studies going back from the sixties to the two thousands and they, they, they show you all these studies and they have a generated trip off of use. We don't have that ability with sound on what? One pickleball court or 14 or 20 and is it bordered? Is there trees, is there a wall? So we don't have that criteria to look at. What we know is it's not a 44 court outdoor pickleball facility. It's 24 courts based off this plan that we are talking about. So I just wanted to provide that clarification to kind of say the trips are off the table, commercial property, the mall's not even generating a near the amount of trips that it can and with the property adjacent to it, this is, so this is not a new commercial property and it's not a rezoning, it's this use is appropriate unless like a daycare, a church, a school outdoor recreation. Unless you can show that it's gonna harm the person next to them or they can't use their property. And that did not check our list. Thank you sir. Yes sir. Any more comments? Scott? You were talk. No sir. No sir. I do. Alright. Okay. I do, you know, I have no problem with pickleball and I think we're excited about having pickleball in the community. There's a lot of pickleball players. I've researched a topic after receiving input from citizens and I attended a meeting with Mr. Rumor, some citizens and the developer last week. I also went and visited some local pickleball facilities and some of them were loud. I have a tremendous amount of concern expressed to me from our residents to the neighborhood to the northwest, which is the hammocks of this proposed, proposed facility. The big concern that I'm hearing from everyone is noise. The issue is that we are deciding if an outdoor recreation can be allowed as a special exemption given the number of courts proposed here. And the fact that the layout of this plan places the outdoor court facing the neighborhood, I can't support that special exemption without some assurance and conditions. And I'm going to look at the residents who spoke. As I go on with my next comment, if I was to vote yes for this special exception, I would propose the following items. When they come back with a site plan, the net sound pollution will not exceed that of an indoor facility, which means the outdoor facility would not create any more noise than the indoor facility based on a sound contour study and the use of appropriate, appropriate proven acoustical outdoor mitigation measures. And I want you to think about that as I look out there and look at the residents. If they could not, if they would not create, and this would come back with a site plan, if they would not create any added noise, then what would be with an indoor facility? Would that be appropriate? That is, again, I'm putting these things on the record right now to say this. Asking the, um, applicant, those is those issues that they would also turn the facility from the, um, facing the, the portion of the project facing the neighborhood. So the northwest shall be fully enclosed portion, which again means they would invert the facility to have the outdoor facility on the highway 50 side, the indoor facility on the hammocks and the retention pond side. I have been out there, there's a couple houses that in the back of the neighborhood that have no, no trees, no protection from the sound. They sit on a retention pond and it's quite a large retention pond. And yes, what mayor said, there is an area there that I think the hammocks all know that's a high density. And there has been, there's someone right now that's looking to put in some apartments and town homes and residential on the opposite side on the highway, on the Clark Road side. Um, but again, turning it and the noise mitigation, if it, if it had no more, if it was no louder than the indoor facility, which they're allowed to have, would that be something that the neighborhood would be feel appropriate? And based on the sound study, the percentage of indoor to outdoor shall be a, should I say apportioned appropriately. Which means when they come back with the site plan, that if they cannot put the amount of facility, the outdoor that they want, is that something that is accommodating? Do you, am I losing anyone here? But it's, again, if they can't fit that amount on there of the outdoor, they would have to come to an appropriate amount. But again, when I hear, when I've spoke to the neighbors, it's noise, noise, noise. But if they will accommodate that, that's something that I'd like us to consider. And I'm not, I don't know if I'm getting that comment. If, if they were making no more noise than they could with what they are allowed, if they're, they're, we can't say they can't put that indoor facility in that area right now that's not on the table. It's the outdoor facility. Am I correct Mike? That's what the exception is for that. It's that outdoor side. But if they were able not to, if they were able to mitigate the noise to where it was no more than the indoor facility, is that something that we would be considering at this point? And that's, um, because something is gonna go there one day, we know that it's a commercial lot and you know, I, I have had many sleepless nights lately over this. I will tell you at three 30 this morning, I was up thinking about this and it is not as in the first time. But if they were able to do that to the no with the noise, and that's something I'm asking you is, are any of these things possibilities? So the first, or they are not just possibilities, I wanna know that yes, this would happen. Let me interject first just so for the audience so they know the next step, the next step is a preliminary, uh, site plan. It can be combined with the final, but that because we have the square footage of use that would come back through the public hearing just as we're hearing it today. Just as we're we'll see more documents then that will come back in the public hearing for the next step as well. So they will see that. Just wanted to clarify that. Clarify. But what I'm asking is, can you accommodate that and guarantee the residents that you are not gonna make any noise, any added noise than what on the outdoor facility to what you're going to get from the indoor facility that you are Allowed? So, so the indoor facility, obviously they have walls. Mm-Hmm. So walls definitely are the top noise barriers. So it, it varies like 99% of the noise for sure. So with the covered codes, I'm definitely, I mean, to be honest, technically it's not possible to reduce the noise to 99% down. So, but uh, we, we will use all the equipment that we can, uh, put, put at the facility. We'll onboard an acoustic engineer, take their suggestions to put uh, any kind of barrier to reduce the noise, any kind of barrier that's, that's in the market on that particular day, we, we are going to use that. But the second, uh, suggestion was to invert the courts. Yes, definitely we can do that. But the indoor courts on the north and the covered courts towards the south of the property, towards the east colonial drive, Are you willing, if they are not able to, if you're not able to accommodate all of the outdoor facilities, are you at the point where you would reduce that? If the, if the site plan comes back and says that you cannot have 24 outdoor, is it 24 25 outdoor? It'll be 25 outdoor. 'cause you're having 24 19 indoor with a total of 44, which makes that 25 outdoor quarts, Definitely we can look at that option. So we are pretty much open for that. So as long as the project cost doesn't go drastically up as long as the project is financially viable, we'll, we'll definitely able to do that. Can I, can I ask a question? Oh, you, it's when I, when I first uh, heard of this, there was more indoor than were outdoor. That that is correct sir. So What, what happened to that? So the demand for outdoor courts is increasing a lot and, and a lot of players want to play outdoors as well in the natural light. So that's one reason we increase the number of outdoor courts. And if we want to go back to that plan, we, we definitely will, uh, get the new plans ready and, uh, we'll do that. Look. What was the, what was the original out? Indoor Original was half and half. Half of them were outdoor and half are indoor. It was about 50 courts when we first started this. They were looking at 50 total courts. Right. If you, if you move it to the south and cut back on the, like the, um, outside part, We, we'll definitely, I mean I cannot give an answer on that right now because I mean we are, we are open for that. We need to look at a lot of things to get that, uh, revised to revised number of courts. So definitely an option. Is this something may I ask? I'm sorry. Yes ma'am. Is this something that we can continue if, because again, I'm not getting the reassurance with the questions I'm Asking. So Yeah, your first point was you wanted a sound study submitted with the site plan that shows that whatever they do at the property line to the northwest is gonna be the same as if it were just an enclosed. Correct. So you want, you're talking about a sound study submitted with it. Yes. We'll get that. Is this something I, I just, I guess I'm not getting the reassurance that I thought I was getting from, I I was hoping to get, um, from the beginning. Is this something that can be continued, this Exception? Certainly this, this commission can do that? Yes. Yes, yes. But I think he just, I just clarified that you were asking for a, the way you worded it, it made it sound like you just wanted the after effect. But you want a sound study that shows that with their engineered plan, he said he agreed he would do a sound study with It, a sound study, but it would not exceed that of an, I'm reading my notes here, not exceed that of an outdoor facility. Yes. So what I'm asking is what are the, what, what's the issue if we continue this to maybe to get some of the answers that we have? Would that be a possibility? I don't know Craig or you? Uh, I, I was just going to, at the mayor's blessing request that the city attorney advise the commission on their options. Sure. In a situation like this with regard to placing conditions or continuances, et cetera. Absolutely. Cer certainly anyone and any commissioner here can, can move to table the item. Um, and, um, that'd be, you know, if, if there's a, a second and a any take a vote, um, you could do that. Um, I would say if, if you want to approve of the project that says approval of a special exception application shall be granted by the city commission only upon a finding of, and then it goes through all the standards, including that the use will not result in noise, odor, glare, vibration, which is detectable at the property line, which exceeds the level, which will result from permitted uses. Uh, and then it says, in approving a proposal, the city commission may attach appropriate conditions to ensure compliance with the provisions of this code. So those are some of your, um, powers, um, so to speak. May I make a motion or a motion By through discussing it and asking questions? Everybody, Uh, is this, can I ask other question before you do that? Sure, absolutely. We are able to continue this for added information Of, of course it is, it is your, um, prerogative to, uh, move the table. Uh, any matter. Um, of course you you'll need a second and, and then, and then, uh, then a vote. Alright, Scott, Uh, I'm, I'm a big believer in, uh, Cortez. Cortez burned his ships. And what I'm gonna propose is to burn your ship. Uh, I'm gonna make a motion to deny the special exception. Um, so you are highly motivated to work with the city and the planning and the residents to get an indoor facility appropriately designed. And you're free from this to come back through the process, through the commission with a plan that everyone loves. I think people generally like pickleball, they want recreation in the city, but you know what the issues are. And I think, I think with respect, I think this plan is dead. And what I propose to do is, is help kill it to set you free for the next stage. So my motion is to deny the special exception and move forward. Well here's second, I'll second that motion. Um, I agree with, uh, commissioner Kennedy. Um, uh, uh, it would just reference to Cortez is to, this is a way for you to win and you burn, you burn the boats, uh, you have no way to get back to the big one. So that means you have to win where you are. So if you bring a plan back that would satisfy, um, the residents as well as this commission, I think that, um, you would actually, uh, be able to win and have this facility in this location, even though I don't agree it should be there. But nonetheless, I still agree that pickleball is a great sport. And, um, yeah, I'll make that second motion. I'll make second that motion that we say no to this. Alright. Motion made by Commissioner Kennedy, seconded by Commissioner Oliver, any more comments? I just, I guess I also wanted, I guess I was looking at, I was interested if you were able to give me some reassurance on my conditions here. And I'm not feeling that At this point. Maybe, maybe I did not understand your first condition correctly. So, well, I, we already have a motion and a second. So I, I look at the situation that I'm, I guess I wanted answers and I'm not getting those answers. So I would hope you would, you know, bring it back with those answers. That was my hope, but I'm just not feeling that at this Point. I, I agree. I don't. Uh, can the attorney advise us on how long before he can come back? Um, probably Mr. Rumor would, would six months best be able to answer this at eight months? Six. We did six months under, uh, when, when we had a rezoning. So this type of a, it's not a rezoning case, but I think that falls under the same area for a denial would be six months. Okay. Okay. Thank you. Alright. Com comments was, I would think that maybe the representatives from this, uh, neighborhood could get together also with and Commissioner Wilson at a, at a meeting or something with the developer. Hold, hold on and get together with, uh, the neighbors and you, it come up with a thing. 'cause believe it or not, something's coming there that I, I, I don't think you want see the apartments and stuff like that. That won't be, that won't be a thing you wanna see either. So that's what I, and I, I, I, I, once, I know we gotta vote, but I know once again, if you, people keep bringing up, we want restaurants and we want all this, you're not going to get 'em without functions happening. When you get people here, they're not coming. If you don't get things that bring people in here to bring in, say if you bring in those people to play on the tournament, they're gonna spend money at the mall. They're gonna spend money at the restaurants, the ones we do have. So I mean, that's, that's what they're going to do. So let see if we can come up with a plan where everybody's, it fits the end to everything. Yeah. Something's going in that, all that area there. 'cause there's contracts out on it. So That's why I was looking at it for a continuance, mayor. That's what that Was all. So we need to, if you going, this one will be the vote note. No vote to do that. And then you can get back, I know it's gonna take you six months, but I think if you take the time and work with, with staff and it's Commissioner Wilson's district and with the homeowners, set up a group and see if we can come up with something. Sure. Sir, I take a comment. One of your resident, huh? I I've closed the public hearing. I, I'll, um, okay. I I You can't talk back there. If you want to come up to the podium, I'll open the public hearing just for, for, I just had a couple questions. Two minutes. Two minutes. Thank you. Thank you everybody. You're in the middle. All I got, I, hold on, I gotta go ahead. We got the vote now. So. Well, You gotta vote. I was hoping to ask you a question before you voted. I'm sorry. Is it, can we do that Public hearing? I, I I Huh? Public hearing is Closed. I, I know the public hearing's closed. We can open it too. Well, you, I hope the public hearing go ahead and make your comments. Where'd you go, bill? Right here. Make it real quick. I gotta get to the bows here. Thank you. Appreciate it. Uh, I had a question, I guess, uh, for the planner and 'cause I I didn't fully understand. And also the, uh, commission, uh, your points are well taken. We understand things are gonna happen, you know, life changes. We understand that. The question is, if this is an exemption that is allowed, is an exemption to the zoning. 'cause we all agreed, everybody agreed that enclosed facility, there's no issue whatsoever. However, if there's an exemption for the outdoor courts wants to prevent the developer from coming back and say, well financially it's not feasible to do the indoor we do. It gets turned down. Down. We can we do all outdoor courts or can we? No, that wouldn't never happen. You Well, I mean, But I'm not gonna sit here and argue that way. Yeah, no, I just, it's a question. I'm just telling you, if you wouldn't pass this, it ain't going pass that I can tell you. All right. That's common sense. Well, I like to think exactly. I like to think common sense. I gotta vote up. We gotta vote, we Gotta vote. But I, I gotta vote. We vote, but I just at this point, if there was vote The public here, bring it back. If there was A continuance that opens up the avenue that've been a better thing to do. No, I know. But if that, if there's a continuance, does that open up the avenue for the residents to have the communication with the, with the applicant That lets him move forward? We need to kill this. Okay. And, and let, let him come back. Alright. I'm Just trying to Make it to work. I know you're Alright. I hear you. This vote has to be, we're voting against. Yeah. A yes vote is to deny the special Exception and work on it with the system. Sir thing? Yes. Alright, let's vote. Motion carries Unanim. Let's see if we can get together with 'em and work this out. All right? Okay. All right. All right. Going down to regular agenda item number 13. Notice of initial three year term ending for one regular member. Move alternate member to regular member in consideration of appointment to the planning zoning commission. We had two, two forms turned in. And uh, one is for the, uh, we will fill the regular, uh, planning zoning seat. And the, uh, I have the other one that filled out a thing. The second one was, uh, Mr. Butler who put in for, uh, the, uh, the, um, alternate. Alternate. Is it my, my, uh, Ms. Williams was my appointee. Is that the one that's the name that's, That's going off because she, I thought That was cross. Well we going, we only have, we have two people turned in. Right. We gonna put one, one that's been on the alternate. We're gonna move it up to the Mm-Hmm. Move it up to the, uh, regular seat. And then we'll put Mr. Butler in. Who's in your district? On the, uh, um, as an alternate? Alternate. I thought it was Crocker that was leaving. No, I think it was, I think it's, uh, we had What's Mike? Tell uh, melody. What's the name? Mr. Uh, VMG guy. Okay. So we, there's currently, there's a few things. So we have the reappointment of Member forges because he has one more term left. The alternate member is asking to be moved up to the regular member position. It's um, member Chacon. We have two applications that did come in. Member Crocker has, does not want to be reappointed. So we have a regular vacant seat in which we did have an application for Joaquin Galvin. And we received an additional application for Kelton Butler. And there is an alternate position seat that's also open. So we were presenting you what we had on file, which is Joaquin and Kelton's application. So we want you to consider fors. That's what I said. Yep. So it's, it's in the staff report. Fors to be reappointed, chacon to be moved up to the regular position. And the mayor is, we Have a motion. Mm-Hmm. He move, uh, Motion made by Commissioner Firster for the Mr. Joaquin as the, as The alternate Planning zoning board member and Mr. Butler as the pro, as the, uh, alternate. I thought you said chacon. No, he got off. No Chacon iss moving up to a permanent. Yeah, that's When, so Fores would be reappointed Cone would take Crocker's and Yake would become the alternate. That's What No, Joaquin becomes, Joaquin's not on the board. He's, he's applied to be the alternate. So remember Lavonne's position, she cannot be reappointed. Oh, you Didn't mention That there's, sorry. It's, it, there's two positions. So Member Lavonne's position, she is cannot be considered to be reappointed. She served her two terms. Alright, let's, okay. And she's my appointee. Makes sense. Alright, that second motion. You second it. Yes sir. Let's vote. Well hold On a second. I think we need some clarity here. Who is the alternate and who is the regular member between Mr. Butler and Mr. Gal? I alternate Is Butler Okay. The Butler. Wait, I think what we're doing, are we doing first is moving Mr. Cracker That all in one motion? I'll, I'll repeat it if you like. That would probably be a good thing. So we're, we're moving The motion. You second We're seconding the motion to reappoint member fors to have chacon take Crocker's seat. Correct. To have ya Keen take William seat and for Butler to be the alternate. Correct? Correct, correct. Let's vote. Thank Youll vote now? Yes sir. Okay, Got it together. Motion carries. Commissioner Oliver abstained. I pushed my button. It didn't work. We need to reset. We had to reset a button. Didn't work. We Can't, let's vote again. Let's vote again. Press the push your button. I say you can't abstain. Alright. Carries you nicely. All all right. Congratulations. All discussion and direction on holiday lighting. I got some good comments for that. Uh, you go Most illuminating. Yeah. Well first of all, I would just like to say if you're going to get 'em, let's get ones that work. You know, let's find somebody that's rents out the ones we get. Buy that work. You had eight of them on uh, Bluford out here. That didn't work. So I I mean we don't wanna wait till two weeks or a week before Christmas either. We Are, our game plan is two years ago, mayor, um, we actually had every whole um, decoration working to put back and upgraded our entire city fortunately to LED lights and in the process on Monkey around with a lot of the connections last year was not a great year holiday light. So that's why we're bringing this back. Um, we want to get some direction now. We do have a game plan to go out and self test in August. All the holiday connections so that we can get a list to do, to have them give them time to make sure it's all done. And we're also looking to get direction now so that we can look at some additional contracts out there through our purchasing department through their contacts. We can get on the list and have not put some timeframes in there so we're not getting, waiting till the 1st of December before they show Up. Right. Well they didn't get up at the 1st of December. We warm 'em up hopefully around Thanksgiving. I, I think what you need to put it out to bid different people. 'cause whoever we've used for the last two or three years, they don't work. Hey unfortunately the company that we had been using had been good, has been bought out Byer why we're bringing this towards. So Yeah, what Direction do you wanna go? I also think that we and Commissioner Kennedy, I know last year we brought up other stuff to do with the uh, this firm that has the different things that you can put out that we didn't do, we should have done. So we need to look at that also during the budget process. Right now I know the parks department is looking at expanding. We're this is just gonna focus on the coal mounted declarations. All right. Okay. Anybody else got comments on that? Was appointed by the board to go ahead and discuss this with parks and with um, Steve and Public Works. What board? Recreation board? No, it was appointed by us. Oh, did we? Yes you did. You you asked. Yes you did. And that is why we've come up with some of the ideas that we had. Um, I don't know if Steve wants to roll with the next pictures. Sure. And I appreciate the commissioner. I was gonna mention that, um, we did work together with input based on the commission direction. What you're seeing on the, um, picture now is pretty much what we've had throughout the city. You'll find this up on Clark Road. Um, worse than 80 Mims, silver Star and South McGuire. Little dated. It's been more of a traditional look that the city's been using for more than 10 years. What we currently have on McKee and Bluford are these decorations, which are, um, upgraded a couple years ago so that they tie in with the new city hall decorations. That's not a random set. They've got a lot of compliments on that. We're proposing to keep those to just designate the area a little different and tie in with the rest of city hall decorations, a more traditional look what we're looking to put throughout the city. The other areas, except for McGuire, we've got a little different in McGuire, is we're proposing the number one, um, option here. The blue and white star to have a standard look throughout the city instead of, so when people pull in they're like, oh, I must still be in a coia. Look at this one. Color and decoration. The main reason we went with the blue is that it'll show up better also during the day when they're not lit. Um, as opposed to two or three. But we're open to suggestions either way. Right now I'm proposing number one on Clark, um, silver Star and 80 Mims, um, worst road areas and also address future expansion. Um, at the end of the presentation what we want to do on McGuire is put up a similar decoration, but um, McGuire, since we have a center medium poles, we thought we'd upgrade to where it's more of a star on the whole thing instead of just something hanging off randomly on the sides. And this would extend down, um, McGuire with the cost of all this. Right now we spend about $50,000 a year contractually and looking at what's available out there. Um, right now by changing up and adding the additional lights on McGuire, we'd be looking about $75,000 annually. Future. What we were looking at too is what can we expand to? We'd like to at least take it all the way up Clark from Silver Star all the way up to Clara Kona Coe, when the road is completed. Now that'll be this year. We don't have funding to add it or the time with Duke Energy to add the connections to the polls on Clark for this year. But our game plan is to include those upgrades, um, for the 20 for Christmas 25. So in the following budget year to where we can also expand the holiday decorations and any other corridors the commission may be interested in adding. So with that, I guess I'm looking for some direction on, if you like the, um, I try to go back. I like It if the number one is we get a consensus that's something you'd like throughout the city or if just even maintain what we existingly have Just for, uh, size wise. These are six feet tall. You know, you don't realize it when they're going up on the pole, but they're six feet, so they're quite large, but they may not look as large. Um, I was staying, I wasn't interested in doing the garland. I thought we've kind of been garlanded out and I think it was time for, um, a change. And I thought with, um, my thought was with, um, Mr. Ner is that the pole, as I drove down the pole in the center, having the stars, the um, snowflakes on each side of the pole kinda gave a little classier look. I like that. Yeah. And I know that on uh, McKee, we couldn't, we'd have to stay with the point Setta or the tree because based on the size of the pole. Correct. On McKee itself downtown it is a shorter pole. So the point set is ideal. The other ones are probably too large. They'd look outta place the stars. The other main road is Wir Road up on the hill. So Correct. You had anything planned for that? Well right now the stars Okay. Um, is what we had planned on. Alright. Just planned early. Yes. That's why we're meeting with you here in May. Yeah. You're just looking for consensus that we like, we Like. Yes. Well we got Commissioner Wilson there, she'll, Well, well when things go bad, they'll all come back and blame me. That's why I'm here. We'll make it, we'll make it happen. That was the Broad shoulders. Yeah, that was the Objection. And the idea too is 'cause we're, we're preparing our budgets now for the month of May, so as everything goes through to bring forward. So that's why we wanted to make sure we could at least incorporate what we need to Now. Alright. I've seen the star, the snowflakes in Ormond Beach on the bridge. They look really sharp. Yeah, they do. They do look sharp. Okay. And again, I think it's time for us to make a change. Yes, I agree. Because we know those, so those Garland ones, they, half of them aren't lit. But by doing this now we give um, Steve the option to go ahead and Need a consent. Think the, The polls are Appropriate. Good enough. So, um, you did mention that your future expansion would be all the way down to go from, um, all the way down Clark Right now, now To Clara Connoco. Yes Sir. But that wouldn't be till about 2025. That wouldn't be this holiday season. It'd be in the holiday season for 2025. Mainly because of the timing with finishing up, um, Clark Road itself and then adding the, getting with Duke to add the connections. Okay. So, so, um, we were able to earmark funds during this budget cycle for the 2025. It would be the upgrades to the polls. And then in the 2020 for this coming year, then for the next fiscal year, we will include the upgrade for the adding, adding the additional decorations. Okay, good. That's been a lot of questions I've been getting about, uh, Christmas decoration and going out clock road for the past two years. Yeah, and we looked at, we did look at what could we get accomplished this year. Um, and in talking with Duke, they said we're gonna need more time. Plus it wouldn't be appropriated until October, which wasn't enough time to get it all completed. Alright. Consensus is Okay. All right. Well thank you. Appreciate it very much. Thank you, sir. Appreciate it, Steve. Um, all right, we're down to comments from commissioners. Commissioner Kennedy. No comments. Commissioner Wilson? Oh, I Have few. Oh, I got pee. Yeah. Okay. I got a few, um, let me pull out my shirt here. Rusty, I know that I don't put A time limit on you. Well, I, we do have one. Don't start yet. I haven't gotten the shirt out. Um, I don't know, during the music fest if a lot of folks saw the shirt that was given. And you know, I guess I, I realized at our last meeting we really didn't say much to you about the event. And, you know, for all these years when you look at this 30 years that you've been working on this, probably most of those 30 years Oh yeah. There's a lot of names. Aren't there A lot of names on there that you have created an iconic event that's, that makes a coie. And I guess I wanna thank you and thank all the folks that work with you. I know in the early days I worked on it, but not to the extent that you did. And I know that this is a labor of love for you. But again, when we look at the amount of thank you folks who have been in a co e this makes this an iconic event for us. And it's impressive. And I guess I wanted to say thank you for that. Did I have to be time for that? 'cause that was, is that okay? That's okay. Oh, that's okay. Good. Okay, good. And I know there's a lot of folks that want these shirts, but I'm not giving it up. Okay. Uh, if you want it, put call in and we'll order some more Because they're kind of neat. When it says 30 years, it shows what, what, what you have done to make this an iconic event in a cowe. Folks wait for this every year. Um, as for we approve some neighborhood grants tonight, um, some of them have items on it that need, uh, permits. So please remember that just because the grant was approved, that you still have to abide by the rules that were put down at the bottom of the form that says some require permits. So please get with our permit department, um, so that you can go ahead and facilitate these neighborhood grants. I did too. So the next item I have, I'm not really happy about, so I'm going to just You're not gonna say it, I'm gonna say it. I'm saying it. Um, I was informed, Mr. Oliver, this is probably directed towards you. I was informed that you went to one of my HOAs, um, to one of their meetings. And it kind of angers me at this point because, um, I think your district's big enough for you to attend your own HOAs. But what it comes down to is that I feel very strongly about sunshine. And if that was my an HOA that I was planning to attend, I don't normally notify anyone that I'm going, but when another commissioner or the mayor comes, it becomes a sunshine issue. And I take that very seriously and I just have a problem with you attending one of my HOAs. Um, and here I am finding out about it. And it, I'll say it nicely, it rather annoyed me that I find this out because if we wanna go to another HOA outside of our district, then I don't have any intentions of going to your HOAs. I have no intentions of going over at this point, at current time to go over to district four to an HOA and I'm offended that you attended one of mine. And then if I had been there, it puts me in a very difficult position because it would have to be noticed. You are well aware of the sunshine violation. I'm not playing sunshine by any means, and that we should be notifying Sherry so it can be posted. And I think the same thing would go for the mayor, if the mayor was going to attend one of my HOAs, that we should be aware as the district that we, um, should know why, basically why you wanna attend one of my HOAs. I know you've got plenty of your own. And then to go ahead and not be noticed. 'cause I could have very easily been there and that would put me in a position that I do not want to be put into. If anyone doesn't understand violations of Sunshine law, you don't play with it. We don't discuss anything that we don't discuss up here or has to be noticed. So you can attend and an HOA that is, that would put us in a position of a very uncomfortable position. One of us would have to leave if it wasn't noticed. And that also makes your HOA meeting something that anyone can come attend. Because once it's noticed, anyone can come. That's why these doors are left open while we have meetings for anyone who wants to come in, because this, we are doing things in the sunshine. And I take that very seriously. So I'm, I'm rather offended by that. And I'm gonna go, I just wanted to go ahead and voice that. Please, please allow me to let, let her finish. Oh, I'm sorry. I just, No, I'm, I said no, I know, but you see what you're, I, let me look at my notes here to make sure that I'm sorry. And I do hope that we, as the neighborhood can get together. Um, 'cause I, this may come back to us and, um, if it does that we plan to meet with the developer as a group, bring it forward. This is the pickleball. Um, I'm not opposed to pickleball folks love pickleball. I don't think I can play. But, um, it's just the point that we need to come together if this does come back. So we are a cohesive group meeting with them much further in advance. Okay. 'cause the noise. Yes, I am very concerned about the noise and I know it's gonna affect the folks in the back of the neighborhood. So thank you commission for supporting that. And, um, if it does come back, we will need to, should I say, have a little better plan because I did not feel, I was not comfortable with the options. The items that, um, I presented, I did not feel as though they were being, um, addressed. Addressed. Well said. Thank you. Alright. You done? I'm done. Thank you. Alright, commissioner Aller. Uh, just I'm fine. Just to respond. Um, commissioner Wilson, please allow me to apologize if I offended you in any way. Um, I was not aware that there was any rules to state that we could attend an HOA meeting. Now, had you been at that meeting? Yes, I would've left that meeting. But the reason I go, I go to a lot of HOA meetings, and the reason I go to those meetings is I actually listen to some of the issues that each, each ho HOA has concerns about. And I listen, I take notes. I don't speak, I just take notes. And I take those meetings, I take those, those notes back to my HOAs to talk about some of the common issues that we all have. We have issues with, uh, soliciting nons, soliciting the solar people in our neighborhoods. How do we handle those things? Uh, a lot of, a lot of the, uh, uh, a lot of the, uh, um, HOAs in my district don't have any, any rules or any, um, answers as to how do we deal with certain things. So we go to other HOA meetings to listen as citizens, uh, what are you doing? What are your, your, um, uh, solution to some of these problems? So I bring those issues back to those, those HOAs. So not to offend you in any way, not to impede upon, um, uh, your duties as a commissioner in that, in that district, just simply as a citizen, just trying to bring information back to other HOAs that's looking for answers and, and look at the commonalities of the things that we share in our communities. That's all that's about. So it's nothing about anything else. So I do apologize if I offended you in any way, and I make sure that does not happen again. And I'll just have to figure out other ways to get to, to compare notes with other HOAs. Um, one of the things, uh, we have dealt with in, uh, district four is, um, uh, constantly every other day there's been, uh, accidents or near accidents, uh, along the West Orange Trail. The three, um, uh, crosswalks of intersections will be Ingram Road and the West Orange Trail, Arden Park, north West Orange Trail, as well as Clark Road on the West Orange Trail. So, uh, I get calls every other day about, uh, near mishaps or accidents from bicyclists and motorists. And, uh, we're definitely working on, uh, solutions. So if, if, um, you're dealing with that issue in, in District four, uh, I'm reached, I've reached out to the county several times to try to figure out what is solutions to that, that issue. So hopefully within the next few months, we'll have some kind of solution to that particular issue. Um, other things that I've run into in the district is, uh, we have a, a foster care facility. Uh, I actually did knocking on the door of a foster care facility just during the campaign, not really knowing that what it was. But, um, uh, we do have some foster care facilities in, in, within the, uh, the city of oco. And what I found is, uh, uh, just kind of did a little research on, uh, foster care and, and what does that mean to folks that are, or the kids that are terming out. So some kids, when they turn 18, uh, they have to figure something out when they get outta foster care. And, uh, what I did find, DCF has a program that any kid that's in foster care or has been awarded of, of the, uh, court system, uh, can receive free college. And, uh, I ran across a lot of information about that, and I just wanna maybe share that with the commission, possibly maybe, um, put it so on our website, so we have a foster care or, or someone that deals with, uh, foster care. They could actually go to the website and get information about how these kids can actually, uh, get free college. So I don't know if that's something we have to have a consensus on or something I need to talk about off the, uh, off the record. Uh, but I definitely would like to, uh, provide more information, uh, through our website about these type of programs for our, our, our young kids that are in dealing with foster care. So that's something that I need to talk to the commissioner about, or, um, the attorney, the city manager. The city manager, Right? Yeah, the city manager controls the, Um, I can, I can reach out to the city manager to talk about how we can get that information You Need to contact the State. Isn't That something? The state already Has information, the state has information on it, but, uh, again, I just wanna make sure we do have foster cares in the city and just maybe we wanna be able to bring it more localized. Um, also, um, finally in, in care of, um, of our National Prayer Day, which was, uh, which was May 2nd, I'm actually gonna leave you with this. It actually comes from Colossians three 13 and 14, and it says, bearing with one another. And if one has a complaint against another, forgive each other as the Lord has forgiven you. So you also must forgive. And above all these put on love, which binds us all together in perfect unity. Thank you. I relent back to the commission. Commissioner Furner, today's National Teacher Appreciation Day. Um, I've had the honor and privilege of being married to a special needs teacher for the past 15 years. She's been practicing for 45 years now. Yeah, she deserves it. And all the teachers deserve your applause. She's taught me so much that I've never realized the school don't purchase books for their students anymore. I don't know, I guess they once did when I was in school, but they don't do that anymore. They don't buy them pencils, paper pads, nothing. The teachers have to supply their own materials for their classes, and they, they just go unnoticed and unappreciated. And the parents come in and scream at them for their failures of raising their kids. Just remember that. And when you see a teacher tell 'em how much you do appreciate what they do for us and for our children, they're pretty remarkable. And it's a very unappreciated job, like many others are in this country. But, uh, they do their best and they deserve our appreciation. Um, it's hurricane Preparedness Week, May 5th through the 11th. Uh, you can get more information on the Ocoee Fire Department Emergency Management page on the, uh, city website. Uh, start preparing now. We only have one more month. Uh, June 1st kicks off hurricane, uh, season, so let's be ready. This year the Family Aquatic Aquatic Center is opening at the Jim Beach Center, and it opens Saturday, May 11th. So you have a nice swimming pool to take your kids to all summer long and enjoy, uh, the Aquatic Center. And please come out on Memorial Day to celebrate the ceremony with the city. It's at the Lakeshore Center here, Thursday, May 23rd at 11:00 AM We'll be glad to see you all come out. Thank you. Thank you, sir. Uh, I want to thank Commissioner Wilson for bringing, saying that about the O COI Music Fest. It's been a pleasure and it's a lot of work. The citizens, uh, get to enjoy. That's the purpose of it, was to have a free concert that we raise money to help pay for it. That have, we have all kind of people come to this, but a lot of citizens, I know when I was first married, when we had our children, I couldn't go to concerts, but we were working two jobs trying to raise five kids. So it was kind of a tough job to go pay a hundred bucks to go hear somebody sing. But this way we've changed the, uh, Friday night we have a certain type of music. Then Saturday night we have another type of music. So it's worked out. We bring in probably 10, 15, 20,000 people over the weekend. And it's a free concert for people to come sit and listen to it and get to enjoy it. Uh, the rules, and, and I don't understand this because what you brought up is listen, um, I call, and Melanie knows, I call, when I go, go to a meeting, I call and see if it's posted. It's gotta be posted or I don't go. So if I'm going to any kind of meetings, I, I've gotta check to see if it's posted. We all, this is not something new folks. This has been going on for a long time. It's not a new rule that just happened. We all know it. So yeah, we, we gotta pay attention to that because it is Sunshine Law. We had a gentleman one time that was a citizen served on the board and got charged $10,000 for breaking the, uh, sunshine Law. And he really didn't do that much, but they still charged him $10,000 and he had to pay out his own pocket. He had to pay it out of his own pocket. City didn't pay it. So we all know stay in your area or call. And if you go into one, notify them where you can notify the commissioner who's going to be there. The, um, speed bumps, uh, Craig, uh, uh, rose Commissioner Wilson at Shore Area. Um, and it's, uh, Mr. Brad's mother-in-Law. She wants somebody to go come on that street that runs all the way from one in the Prima vista to the other end. They want 'em come out and measure for speed bumps or do the test or whatever. We can get them the forms. Uh, that's what I, I'll give you the who it is. Yeah, just gimme the email address. Um, and the Christmas thing, I hate to do that a while ago to say that, but every year we seem to have a problem come Christmas time on the, on the lights and, and the function. So we have gotta be more prepared for that. I mean, it's, a lot of people like to see it, and that's what it was. And I also wanna make a comment about when, when we had, um, the Music Fest, we have fireworks every year. 'cause a few years ago in July it was so hot, like it's gonna be this year, we, we, the state wouldn't let you shoot fireworks off. So we moved it from July the fourth to the music fest. So on the end of this thing on Saturday night, we have the fireworks. We, we got a couple, the only comments bad about the whole Music Fest was somebody doesn't like the fireworks because it was noisy. But that's part of America folks, the fireworks, that's part of going with what goes on. So I just wanna let 'em know that we, we try to make it a nice one. It was one of the better ones I think we've had. But yeah, we had a, that was really the only comments. We got two comments back that was about the fireworks. So, and the o the other thing is, is, um, the, um, recreation department, I don't think, we don't give 'em enough accolades. I think they put more functions on it. I have a lot of people, I don't know any of you that go to the functions with the children. It's a, we have where we put these things on it, there's no cost to the children when they go there. They, they can come do these functions. Even when you're having the different things that your, your, your group. It's where the kids can come and do this stuff without having to pay the parent pay. It is part of the city with the parks. And like I said, I hope that we can get some kind of group together with the homeowners from the, the hammocks and with the, um, with the gentleman and with you commissioner and work out something there because they did buy the land. I know it's bought. And if anybody knows anybody that's hooked to the restaurants, please tell 'em to call us. We'll be gathered to make 'em a good deal and expect to get something in here. The restaurants and the mall. Like I said earlier, I I I, during the, during the election time, when you go around knocking on doors, you hear a lot about why aren't y'all doing something with the mall? Well, we try, we try to do things with 'em, but they don't want to do anything except just take the money they're getting out of those rents. So that's the problem. They don't improve it. So I, I've asked the city, do we need to, I don't care if they can hear it or not, we need to coat 'em if they're not doing what they're supposed to do. They have taken the plants out of the front of that mall and they have two deep places where the pots sit, where people walk over and somebody's gonna break their leg. And I, I called them a year ago and told 'em about it and they still haven't fixed it. So one of the things we need to do is code, code that place. Yep. So, and the other thing is, is going back to having a code enforcement officer on Saturdays. And I can tell you right now, everybody knows full well that we don't have 'em out. And on Saturdays they do everything. They're not supposed to do parking semis in our town. You go, you see a semi parked up here on the corner of Silver Star in Blueford over the weekend, go to Winter Garden or go to Windermere or Oakland to see if they got 'em parked. They don't have 'em parked out there. So we have got to enforce the, the law on the code enforcement. And somebody says, well, the police got, well yeah, if, if they've not been notified. And this truck that sits up here by, uh, McKees Street on the weekends, he does it all the time, but nobody, nothing gets done to him. And then we got the same guy that parks up here on the corner of Silver Star in Blueford. I mean, who wants to see semi trucks parked in town? So I hate to complain about that, but I'm telling you, I get, people call me all the time say, why aren't you doing something about it? Well, we do. The code, we have, and the, and code, code on commercials and stuff is, is a tougher one to do. It's better for us because you can do the code if it's on a house, which we have some problem with them, it, it's a homestead. So you have a hard time getting that solved. So I just wanted to bring that up. We need to go back during the budget process and put a, a person back working in our code back on Saturdays like they used to. I don't know why they quit. And the other problem, I hate to do this, but I'm gonna do it on, on the beach, on the lakefront. We need a person down there on Saturdays and Sundays to control what goes on. It is a beautiful place for people to come to, to have picnics and all that. But there's some stuff goes on down there that shouldn't be going on with drinking, little smoke going the other way that people might use. But they, they, there's gotta be some kind of control on that park. If we hired a part-time person during the summertime, say starting in the end of May, that stays there on Saturdays and Sundays. That can control what's going on. So I'd like us to look at that too. I thought we Had someone, I'm sorry. Huh? May be Yes, sir. All right. We had police from I'm, I'm done Memorial Day to Labor Day. I thought we had police that were supposed to be down there on the weekends from Memorial Day to Labor Day. Yeah, that's my, that was my understanding. Yeah. For the past few years that we've had that I'm assuming We, we don't that well, we don't. So I, I'm, I know police go out on the boat and do stuff during the summertime, but we need a person that works for the, the city on the, uh, on the weekends to control what goes on to the lake. Mm-Hmm. Alright, everybody, appreciate you coming tonight and thanks for the, uh, hammocks for coming out and doing your talk. Thank you. Thank you.