no that was that was M all right the uh Council agenda we going to begin now yes uh Council agenda Township pcip Troy Hills Township Council agenda meeting of May 7th 2024 introduction posting of notice adquate notice of this meeting has been provided in accordance with the requirements of the open public meetings La by filing the notice in the office of the Township Clerk and by posting the meeting notice on the bullton board at the municipal building on December 20th 2023 where has remained posted since that date a legal notice appeared in the Daily Record and the nework Star Ledger on December 26 2023 may ask everyone to please stand for the FL salute flag United States of America and to the repic for it stands one nation under God indivisible liy and justice for all okay uh roll call Mr nandez here Mr McGrath here Mr M Mr neglia here Mr K also in attendance are mayor James Barbaro uh Township administrator Jamie cry Township attorney Michael Avery municipal clerk CED Madden council president we have a quorum may I begin please yes please thank you upcoming uh upcoming meetings are uh May 21st 2024 at 7:00 p.m. which is the regular meeting and June 11th 2024 at 700 p.m. at the agenda meeting at this time I will ask the council Administration to please review ordinances for second reading they will be on for Action at the next meeting [Music] okay seeing that there's no questions at this time we're going to go ahead and move right into the public session I'd like to entertain a motion to open the public session please make a motion motion made by Mr Mel seconded by Mr uh meglia I'm going to say roll call Mr Hernandez yes Mr McGrath yes Mr Mella yes Mr negrea yes Mr C yes okay so the floor is open to the public you can speak on any matter you have 5 minutes to speak please just state your name you do not need to State your address hi I'm Julie Peterson 25 Old perney Road um since May is a historic preservation month I thought I'd give you a little preservation story about our house um as you may or may not know our house is the 20 275 year old Livingston Benedict house was first built in 1752 um it was the Revolutionary War Refuge home for the first elected governor of New Jersey Governor William Livingston and his family they lived in pipany from 1777 till 1781 the house has been occupied by my ancestors since 1887 first it was a farm then a summer residence and finally a much love family home for my grandparents my parents and now my husband and me it's always been a residence ever since before there was a Township of syney Troy Hills so this is how why it's still there in 1950 a proposed Route 80 would have destroyed the house the working line was right through the middle my grandmother appealed and the house was placed on the national register of historic places so it's protected from Federal takings in 1970 Mars County rerooted bany Road they were going to put it between the two houses that are in those pictures but they decided that maybe ft from our porch was a little close for a four-lane road and dead end in precip Road and uh that's why precip Road runs the way it does now in the 1970s my parents were relieved to discover that the land around them was zon ro ro provided for large Lots no subdivision of the large lots and the buildings were required to look kind of the same um so ladex corporation which was the people who are developing it was very understanding of the needs of the historic importance of the house and being next door to it subdivision of the property was only allowed recently and the new owners neglected the vacant office building and grounds at 30 landed X West for the last two years that's how we knew it had been subdivided because all of a sudden there was no lawn maintenance no building maintenance know anything okay and 1997 a Green Acres Grant prevented a gas station to be built on what is now Governor Livingston Park thanks to Mimi LS in 1999 the New Jersey historic trust accepted a historic and conservation easement on the house and 4 and A2 Acres of property and there it says what's in it an easement protects the property from development in perpetuity on the deed doesn't matter whether we own it or somebody else's own it it's never going to be developed preservation efforts and planning however successful never seem to be quite enough a proposal for a truck Warehouse to be built between our house and P partry Funeral Home compromises the current residential use in our area precipes Revolutionary War houses are few and far between are they important should they just be forgotten about compromised do the council members have a commitment to property owners and business owners that are already on precion road and've been there for a long time to the commuters who need that road to get to their houses to work and to school pipany does not need more historic museums you guys do a splendid job supporting the Craftsman Farms stickly Museum and that's great and we have some other Historic Museum but what precip really needs to think about is supporting private ownership and preservation of historic houses and proper 30 seconds and they can do this by looking at the master plan how many people how many of you I this is a question that is you're not allowed to ask at the Zoning Board of adustment how many of you would seriously love to live next to a truck Warehouse thanks very much for [Music] listening I was here for the last two Council meetings and Mrs in regard to the flood wall I live at 66 River Drive Lake hawaa nobody has taking care of the brush would you your survey said had to be done I have a couple of pictures from April and May it shows just how bad it's got [Music] last year I went over to the Parkson uh recreation building and the guy told me that um he didn't want to send his guys over the wall to to clear up this brush cuz he didn't want them to get hurt I'm 72 years old it's beyond my capability to clear it needs to be done it was stipulated in that survey on what has to be done before the wall can be repaired so it's gotten quite bad it's like a jungle over there my other question is in February you said that the engineers had to do a plan and it had to be submitted for bidding is this going to get done this year or is it going to be put off till next spring is the wall going to get fixed at leaks all over the place so I'm really concerned seeing this how I live right on the river and I really don't want 25 in in my house again like Irene so that I spoke with you about it last last meeting so it's gone quite bad over there and it's and that's just my property I got 120 ft across the you know Frontage so this goes the whole length of the wall there trees growing back up which is going to damage the wall and the brush has to be clear so my my question is can you get some guys out there to do it yeah okay that's pres is that your only question man yeah okay so Miss Martin I'm sorry you had to come back uh to talk about this I'll keep coming back I know you know no no you're right we're we're wrong and I'm sorry about that I spoke with uh our engineer um uh Justin his boss yeah and he was stand over here please yeah yeah in jail he's watching you maybe put me in jail I know smoking uh he was uh going to call you and explain the process of where we are right now with the and all that stuff we are they're working on it it should be done shortly and should be out um forbidding forbidding in in in you know is there any possibility be this being done this year yes definitely that's the goal that's the goal that's that's really the goal that's what everybody's working towards otherwise I got to go out there and put my finger in the wall to stop the leak and with the with the brush we'll try to get somebody out there this week to it's get you know like I took pictures in April and it was just you know stalks but now it's it's a jungle yeah it's really bad okay I'll hold you to your word thank you council president can I just ask a question yes do um does that brush get caught up with the river flow or is it just at the wall I'm just curious It's the way the wall was constructed I was here when they did it it's like a giant all right okay only 4 ft is sh rest is underneath but with the roots grown from trees and brush it could compromise the concrete and and and that would you know all wouldn't be as effective also which I didn't bring up which I'm glad you asking that question when they did construct the wall they put a dirt Dam up and blocked the natural flow of the river so they could do the work on the walls when they got finished he never really fully opened it up you could walk across that dirt W Dam so the water has to get so high before it actually flows in the Rockway River so it's constricted yeah cuz they they they duck a channel on the other side from mosquito control and pretty much now the regular River all overgrown with trees and stuff you know and needs to be dredged again it was dredged once since I've been here since 1970 the wall was repaired once since it was installed in5 so you know I mean you're 66 what River Road River Drive River Drive okay another you come down high the boulevard area left and on the first house cuz you knocked the one house down thank you thank you any other questions hi um can you hear me okay so my name is Tracy Kad uh Tracy I'm sorry I need to speak into the mic a little B sorry better yeah okay so um I'm basically just going to read what I wrote um so I no longer live in town um I grew up on Min over in Lake high for many years um before I moved out and got married so I'm actually the spouse of a retired Township employee who's sitting here with me tonight who worked in I'm the spouse of a retired Township employee who's sitting here with me tonight um I dealing with the situation regarding the benefits that are provided to us um I started this issue about a month ago uh emailing the administration meaning mayor Barbaro and Mr cryan so um what I wrote will actually explain uh what's going on um because at this point I don't know what else to do um so my name is Tracy kirad I am the spous of Warren kirad who is now a retired employee who left the fory DPW in February of 2021 after 26 years of service since Warren's retirement the township still continues to pay our medical benefits premiums under the group plan until he reaches 65 the insurance covers Warren myself and her son Braden in 2009 so going back about 15 years when the township first had medical insurance with Horizon Blue CLA Blue Shield the carrier meaning Horizon approved an exception for Braden to receive ongoing mental health therapy from a place called stepping Ford Counseling Center in chadam um please understand that this particular facility it's an added Network provider that's being paid in network um with an allowed daily amount of $350 per session so every time bring goes to therapies meets with a therapist $300 50 is paid out for the last 15 years this exception has continued and carried over to every insurance company that the township has had last month I reached out to Jackie orti at Fairview insurance with a concern about the $300 $350 fee that was being paid she told me that I had to contact the township Administration directly if I wanted any changes to meet with regard to the rate I had explained to her that at the end of 2022 stepping forward increased their build amount of 375 so they were Billing at 375 for 15 years um 200 200 to 450 per session with a difference of $75 the co-pay which I should be paying is $5 the provider will then balance fill me and charge me the difference of $75 right now the balance owed is $1,125 which I can't afford to pay um for the last three years since Warren retired he's been in and out of rehab facilities and hospitals due to his mental health and substance abuse issues many of Warren's problems resulted from the ongoing harassment he faced every day at work he was bullied non-stop by his supervisors and co-workers in the road department the traumatic events that took place caused Warren to have severe anxiety imp panic attacks arly there were many instances involving burglary theft and drugs Warren tried to do the right thing and inform the administration about these problems however it was all overlooked and swept under the rug when the other DPW employees found out that he was a whistleblower the supervisors demoted him and sent him back to sanitation so um anyway when Warren was gone it was for weeks or months at a time I was left to pick up the pieces which caused Great emotional stress on myself and Braden last year I lost my job and have not been able to B employment since then money is very tight and we are barely scraping by with a little bit of money that Warren makes at his part-time job now what I would like to do is have the township negotiate a new rate with me due to the increased price for Therapy Services du to inflation um for the benett to be paid at 100% their new Quest is450 per session minus the $5 co-pay effective January 1st of 23 so it's only been about a year year and a half most people don't like going to therapy however in brayden's case he likes meeting with his counselor brayen has a great relationship with his therapist and feels better each time he leaves the office his sessions help Bren deal with his own difficulties as well as the challenges he faces having to deal with Warren's problems too I would really be grateful for anything that you are willing to do to help us it is really hard to rely on Warren's income especially when he spent more time away than at home on March 21st I emailed the business administrator Jamie crying directly I waited patiently for a response to my inquiry but never received any kind of acknowledgement or answer until yesterday um at that point I I found that to be I am professional both Jackie Ortiz and Stacy chant tried to reach out and they two got no answer from Mr cryan at that point it was feeling rather frustrated so on April 17th I emailed the air bar barrier directly as well as the action center but still got no response then on April 25th I sto by town hall with printed copies time's up man for 5 minutes time okay I mean there really isn't much more so we have it's a 5 minute rule I'm sorry uh my name is Bernie Clarkin longtime resident I'm here with my CPA haton tonight to talk about the uh proposed 2024 budget I've reviewed the budget in the cumulative 21.5% tax increase that it'll have generated over the three years that include this year it's clear to me we don't need this increase there's plenty of things that could be cut or Revenue that could be increased in 2024 to avoid this tax increase I'm going to start with uh other revenues other revenues represent about $19 million of this budget and while most people may not understand that a lot of the town's Revenue comes from items other than property taxes 20 19 19 million this year is coming from these other sources I'm going to talk about two examples real quick one is the construction code fees last year the town took in 3.8 million in construction code fees in real money this year the budget costs are 2.5 million that's a $1.3 million decrease and when you consider that you guys rush through seven pilots in December of 2023 that would be additional construction on top of what was already going on I I firmly believe that construction code fees should be the same or greater in 2024 versus 2023 another example is a hotel tax the hotel tax was amounted to $2,455 in 2023 2024 you budgeted the budget called for 1,750,000 that's a $300,000 decrease now the hotel tax is that extra fee that you pay on your hotel bill wherever you're at it goes to the town in par in paran's case I I see no reason why it's going to go down the only time it's ever gone down is during the pandemic and that was clear why that happened overstating expenses is another item in the budget that needs to be addressed a perfect example of that that we've discussed before is the legal services fees 2023 they amounted to 383,000 yet the budget costs were 600,000 in 2024 interestingly the 2023 budget was 600,000 and the the actual fees spent in 2022 were I think 332,000 there's a pattern to this we're on certain light items we're consistently over budgeting on the expenses just like we're under budgeting on the revenue another favorite example of mine from last year is the mysterious salary adjustment number last year I question the $750,000 salary adjustment and the mayor told me in no uncertain terms it had to do with Union negotiations all right so here we are a year later three out of four unions have agreed to terms as I understand including the biggest one the police none of that 750,000 was used and presumably the actual increase that was negotiated is baked into the 2024 budget already on top of that we now have a $450,000 salary adjustment fee coming in in the 2024 budget which is totally unnecessary when you look at the one Union that needs to settle which is an important Union it's the blue collar workers union there is most of that is most of their salaries are in the general budget at least are in the let me make sure I get the names right here the road department the parks department and the sanitation department and 30 seconds Sir oh okay you we're way over budget I think you're cutting me short here other people you have long conversations with there's no reason for these increases and when you add it all up you could eliminate the whole tax increase and I'd be happy to talk to any council member that would like to talk to me about what I've been cut off from talking about now please feel free to reach out to me you can find me thank you [Music] uh Nick hak from Lake high uh on behalf of the Petersons uh I was under the impression from when they got the attorney and they came in front of the planning board that that warehouse wasn't going to go there and it is an in appropriate location and to me and I think anyone with a a Civic conscience it's a violation of the public trust to invade the space that's left of the first governor of this uh of the state of New Jersey when we are independent is it just it to me it's just a a violation of the public trust and no historical consciousness at all no pride in precip none and and they're getting a pilot deal too um the storm water will be open to the public next session correct storm water cuz I have to jump around I only have five minutes so there be it will be open for public comments the the ordinances you're talking the update for the uh storm water I thought it was going to beeting yes okay I have a public during next meeting and on on the budget uh we were told that the average citizen it's going up $6 a month well maybe if you own your home but if um you have a mortgage with with the tax and the insurance my mortgage went up $180 a month I'm a senior citizen I'm on set income but I'm but I'm you know I don't own my own home so you the mayor says $6 a month average it's $180 for me so and you know what am I getting in return I'm getting more uh more police and the garbage men hopefully are getting a raise I I hope uh but I think uh that's uh you know something to consider too and the other question I was going to ask has anyone one thought about reducing the budget at all in any F fashion or form cuz I'm sure that there are ways to do it you know I I like to say the sanitation we're making a mistake we pay uh now it's 11125 a ton uh to the so it went up from 2019 to uh 2024 it's gone up $ 47,49 now if it's by the ton if we had Source separation real Source separation we could knock some money off that figure and it has happened in other municipalities but it seems like we don't even want to try now Mine Hill is set up to take single stream but it's still per ton and if we had the source set separation you don't you don't pay for that you might even get some money except for the plastic so that might be something to to to uh consider and maybe not you know driving around all over the place all the time burning up the gas you know leave blowers and cars and stuff like that so you know little ways but they might they might actually mean something in the end so I'll leave it at that Nick um couple things you you stated about your taxes going up $180 and how the mayor said it was $6 in change per month okay that's just the municipal part of your taxes I understand the $180 you know that's School Board the school taxes I understand that's in there the County taxes okay so when you say it's going up $180 that's that's not us okay that's you know our portion is $6 a change a month I belong to the we can't have a back and forth I'm just answering your questions and the other thing was we did have a number of meetings the finance committee and we did work on cutting the budget down I know you know Mr vanzi is sitting back there and you know one of the things the mayor didn't use any surplus from sewer and water this year and he's smiling again back there so we did we did cut you know you said oh nobody wanted to cut nobody cut we cut there were a lot of things that were worked and and the budget was dwindled down before it even came out with the finance committee the we're not have we can't have back and forth well I nobody told me my five minutes is up you said you were done you no you said you come on all right all right good Nick anyone else okay uh going once twice seeing no one I'd like to a motion to close the public session please make a motion second motion made by Mr Mella seconded by Mr Nea roll call Mr herandez yes Mr McGrath yes Mr Mella yes Mr neglia yes Mr Ki yes FL is closed at this time I'd like um the council and the and the administration to please review uh the budget second reading and the consent agenda just a quick question about the consent agend if I may um number eight authorizing the award of a contract for professional public relations consultant Services is there a um name of the company that it would be for council president I can answer that question yes please uh direct development yeah these are housekeeping uh resolutions that were done at the beginning of the year and now with our uh new qpa uh she's making sure that everything's you know all eyes are dotted and tees are crossed and that's what this is so it's the same decision that was made at the beginning of the year it's just doing it in a a formal way um on a a each basis so that this one with uh public relations Consulting and the one above it for hearing officer consultant Services okay see no other questions any other questions yes I have a I have a statement before we vote on this consent agenda well uh just so you know we are not going to be taking action this meeting it will be next meeting but you could still make your statement absolutely okay I still want to make my statement about Julie Peterson thank you for coming up and sharing your thoughts about in the history of your property I spent a lot of time at your home and it's amazing and and I fully support your views on land use in that respect and that's all I want to say um and and I will do my part to try to keep that vision and that Master Plan adhere to thank you Mr Hernandez um anyone else okay seeing no one we're moving along uh to presentation and reports mayor yes thank you um C on on April 24th I'm just going to go through um we had a um race to the Finish Field Day hosted by games with friends at the P which is an initiative between the township P TR Hills and the Board of Education and I got to tell you it was very heartwarming students were involved teachers were involved um and this event started like way back I can't maybe 10 years ago and it's really has enhanced our community and in the and the high school students as well being involved I'm very successful um on April 26 Arbor Day celebration um in in par siany and uh I'm proud to say for 48 years with Tre City USA and then um just I want to let the residents know that the summer camp registration is still open uh it starts June 24th through August 16th and now I'm going to get to some other uh I'll start with um to the counselor Mr lvery if you could really start working on that squatting ordinance uh with regards to no squatting in the towns of Pim Troy Hills we'll do mayor we work and then also I have met with several Mayors with regards to the affordable housing in here in Morris County and um we've all not all of us some have agreed that to file a suit against the state with regards to affordable housing because as they call it a Monumental um bill that was passed it's not Monumental it's detrimental there there's a difference and um um most of the Mayors agree that we should fight this together because it's going to really really um you know handcuff the township not just parcion but other townships um when you look at the fair share housing um the kind of um strength that were given with the ards to affordable housing um like I said we've been carrying over 463 units from the last round which is it's not that anybody here in this Council or the mayor is against affortable housing what we're against is getting rammed down our throat with no no funding in sight for the town other than the fact that this is what you have to build and it's going to impact Us in several ways our infrastructure it's definitely going to impact our infrastructure our traffic pattern it's going to affect that but when you have affordable housing none of those things matter to the courts so we've had several meetings myself Handover Township mayor Floren Park Mount Arlington Mayor Mount Mill mayor moristown mayor Madison mayor and we finally said you know we we have to somehow do something because at the rate it's going it's not going to stop this is round four and after round four there's going to be round five and I don't know what they think towns like parp going to be able to handle infrastructure wise and we just have to do something so I'm asking the council to join me um on this with regards to fing a lawsuit um hopefully it would be several towns together in a joint lawsuit with regards to the affordable housing because they rammed it down our throat in the sense that we have to have a plan ready by January 31st 2025 the original plan was you had to have a plan ready by December 31st 2025 so they sped it up at a at a rate where and if we don't have the plan ready then we can lose our immunity we don't want to lose our immunity um really we want to work with the developers and all those with the the special Masters but once it gets into the judges hand and the special Masters it becomes a whole different ball game so I'm I'm I'm I said to the Mayors I'm willing to to fight with you um I hope the council and I believe the council would be willing to fight as well because uh we just just can't stand stand by um cuz it's not going to get any better and you know if you're looking at another th000 units on top of 463 units you're already into the 5,000 units total and that changes the face of parcion in so many ways because that's just round four they're probably going to speed up round five as well because they seem to have this initiative out in the assembly for some reason want affordable housing to hit the Suburban areas and it's going to impact that impact us a lot why um I'll just give you one example why I I believe um and I'll say this we budget it properly for hotel tax and this and this is why because the rumor is one of the big hotels is going to be selling out to Comm to a residential and I don't even know if it's a rumor anymore I'm going to find out more information that's a big piece of property for residential and that's going to meet the requirements of afford housing and that's going to be detrimental to the town and we're doing everything that we can on our end but even the other Mayors are saying how much more can we handle how much more can we take um as you heard our water uh superintendent talking about uh pasas talking about things like that um talking about the infrastructure the pipes have to be replaced that's that's millions of dollars on top of the affordable housing what I mean by that is you know what the courts are going to do they're going to give another scarce resource order saying now all water has to go to those types of um structures which means even if we wanted to bring commercial in they wouldn't have the ability to really move forward without having allocated water so I'm just let you know where I where I stand and I want to get the council support as well um also uh the potential cannibal cannabis ordinance I'll be working on um to update it and get get the Cannabis um and I I know I believe the council's on board with regards to bringing in more Revenue to the township um so as of right now that's it for my report so I appreciate the time council president thank you time Council um yeah I would like to uh just talk about the uh the budget first um you know first and foremost I wanted to say that I appreciated the time I spent with the mayor with the business administ rator and the uh the CFO on Tuesday I think we had a really great conversation I went in with uh a lot of things in mind and you know there was some Merit to certain line items certain things I didn't agree with still don't agree with but I think we had a very collaborative and and productive conversation because we have a real need to deliver on affordability and I appreciate all the the time my uh my Council colleagues put into to uh also separately working to um reduce the size and scope of this increase so with that said after you know a thorough review I wanted to share some of my concerns um and some of the line items that I think we could edit and the the cost-saving measures that we could impose that could further reduce the size of this tax increase so uh starting with the executive I thought that uh the the 60,000 of portion for direct development could be eliminated the $28,000 for the part-time secretary um could also be removed um the Pio budget um in my view does not need to go up from 10 to 40,000 so could stay as is so there's approximately 128,000 savings from the executive when it comes to the administration I didn't see the need for uh the communication specialist role um and that was about 77,000 and also the assistant to the ba which has also been vacant at $ 7,924 for a total of [Music] $147,900 when it came to the clerk's office I I didn't think that this was the right time to be spending 30,000 on hardware and software upgrades so there's a 30,000 savings there the assistant to the CFO uh has been a role that's been vacant for 2 plus years at 85,000 and I thought that could also be eliminated from the budget um when it comes to parks and Forestry uh there's three labor positions that have been vacant for three plus years with a total of $145,300 so one idea there could be that we give $75,000 back to the taxpayers and $75,000 back to the other blue collar workers or some uh areas that uh we we have lost some really talented blue Coller workers to other municipalities so that could be a thought of how we might be able to incentivize and keep the talented Personnel to to stay um throughout the budget hearings um and still today I don't believe that the new expense of $74,500 is necessary for the park attendance so that's a total of2 9,892 when it comes to Recreation uh the the seasonal employees reduction um shouldn't go beyond the 400,000 that it has been at the last two years so reduction of 25,000 from the increase proposed there um again there's also a separate line item for Park attendance which is duplicative in my opinion that has 50,000 budgeted while was 25,000 last year so I think we should keep that flat and then I think the uh the increase in Township programs is is unnecessary to go up to uh 200,000 and that should be kept at the uh 155 uh 955 it was in 2023 for a total of about 100,000 in taxpayer savings uh I I understand uh the explanation I received about the 130,000 for pilot fees that is a a pass through account but I'm still not comfortable with um taxpayers footing the bill first for any pilot related activity even if we are going to be reimbursed for that and that would be 130,000 in savings and then when it comes to the water utility uh the proposed 45,000 in legal expenses when $750 was spent last year uh didn't seem to be necessary and then when it comes to the Sewer utility they've appropriated 100,000 in legal expenses when only 6,000 was was spent in 2023 my opinion is is that if if there an an emergency arises I think we have on Deck uh enough talented Personnel that could step in and Supply any uh legal services that are needed uh without budgeting them uh UPF front uh for a total there of 94,000 so in general um that's 978,00 is is critical for us and we could maybe in increase the salaries there but uh what I wanted to do is I wanted to share you know my solution oriented plan with with my colleagues and a professional way where they could hear where I was coming from and uh in a way that we could deliver uh a better budget that uh we've had time to review thank you go ahead Mr I also got a chance to meet with um the administration too on some of the items and we do have similar Sim similar ideas on where we could cut some things and I'm not talking about the senior center or anything that that would affect the community I did see in some areas where the actual dollars um estimated I mean actual dollars spent um were a lot lower than the appropriation for 2023 and I came to about like and I'm just looking at Water and Sewer and a lot of the those costs can be figured out ahead of time yeah you might not have snow and salt some years with the DPW but with water and sewer you know your electric you know your you know your uh chlorine and um there was like a 23% increase in some of those expenses and the Appropriations followed suits so I and was $1 and A5 million I understand that we don't always know what the actual is going to be but we can get close to the actual money spent when we're appropriating for the next um the following year 2024 this year and also I did this like 65 vacancies and yes I know we have we need DPW I know we need some people in the labs but that's also it in the wastewater treatment facility there's six there's 12 V full-time vacancies to almost six and a half $650,000 so I just ask that we can we look a little bit more at some of these more closely and and and yes and I do have a little bit of concern about the water and sewer and no utilities because yeah we we do use that overhead the mayor and the council sometimes answers questions for sewer or water but it's almost like in some cases a half half half the salaries are coming from the utilities so I just want to know if if we can just look at this a little bit more closely can we but talk about it how do we do this I think we are right sure okay right now so so I I also had an opportunity to sit with the administration and we went over some of the things that I looked at from a line item perspective and I went through our books and as I went down the list I picked out like 14 different items that I was like hey these are things that I think that we can go and really go after see if there's an opportunity to save money some of those things we sat down and looked at we actually found that they were actually already removed from the budget so they updated the book and they resent those out to us and they said hey here's the updated pages one of the big things that I kind of came to to the end state of is as I looked at what I thought we could pull from the budget versus what I think our impending disaster is and I've talked about this a couple times now Judy you made a great Point 65 people and some of these spots we just can't fill because we're not offering the right salary which means we need to increase our cost on salary to bring in more talented people to go and fill those roles that's more money additionally what I wrote down is you have our inspectors we're Outsourcing those after a certain point of time DPW we're Outsourcing tree services after a certain point of time when we can't cut them down we have to bring people in to go and Outsource it and I talked a little bit about this last time that I think is really critical Sean Andre's talked about an impending potential disaster posos being $5 million per well time 18 is 90 million or doing some sort of service that kind of collects it to do treatment or maybe you can cut that down to somewhere around 30 million We additionally talked about he has for replace the pipes in our town and at a $400 a linear foot 220 mil 5280 a mile that's $464 million those are bondable projects that we have to go after that's not in our budget though no no understood okay so just because people hear that and they think oh wow I'm going to tie it together so so what I heard is when we came into this that our credit rate was dropped if we didn't come up with a way to replenish our Surplus and come up with a model that kept our Surplus High a bond rating a certain credit level versus a lower credit level is at one point is at one and a quarter points when you times that by $500 million over 30 years compounding just like your home mortgage that's a massive increase that we're potentially up against so maintaining a high Surplus to me is a value to our town and the last piece I'll add and and we've heard it there's a billion dollar in potential reassess coming right that was submitted and we we know we're going to fight to the best of our ability to come up with the best plan for our town but if you just look at that number the revenue that comes out of those whether you're a hotel or any other taxable base that comes in those revenues are dropping in our town we're currently 70% apartment residential to 30 commercial industrial you take a billion dollars out of 1.9 billion in those markets we're now down to 85 15 so to me the idea of taking any kind of surplus out of the budget where the more I think about what our potential risks are I think we need to include more but obviously we don't want to take burden the taxpayers so I'm not going to say add more to our budget but think about what I just told you is the numbers that are coming down the pike are incredibly high and that's really where our risk Lies We can't fill the open spots got it so we're going to increase now our our dollar figure we want to offer out I've offered up solutions to part with the schools I had an opportunity to meet with uh Christy Russell and Liz Doyle from both the hill and the high to talk about two programs that they have one is interns we can have Hill and high students come in as interns to these different potential job roles almost like a job interview are you doing the job well is this for you do you want to instead of maybe working at a fast food restaurant get into something that's a little more aligned to where you want to go whether it's mechanical electrical carpentry whatever but bring those kids in we also have a op program where they get credit for going to do these things so I think there's opportunities to close the gaps on those types of jobs but again I'll go back to the long-term thinking of where we are and where we were to me the budget makes sense I agree maybe there's a couple bucks we could pull out but I don't see it as a huge value in the overall scheme of the budget that's my thoughts on it so we do appropriate more money even though the budget the actual costs are less just for that just just in case just for is that is that what we're saying that well we spent 5.4 million of our Surplus du to you already right that's paid our bills that's the start right so we have to replenish that but yet we know there's a billion dollars in tax appeals coming so we need to replenish it so this is like a this is a big picture what are we doing with economic development I I don't disagree there's that I think I was going to say I think that it's it's good to have these Solutions oriented conversations right because you're absolutely right we do have some very big uh disasters mandates that are completely imposed on us from the state that are not the Mayors not our fault that we have to deal with and then separately from that we hear from residents all the time that talk about how they want to stay here but it is getting extremely difficult to live here whether it's people on a fixed income our seniors Working Families I was actually with um some friends over this weekend and uh a friend of mine who's raising a young daughter in the town uh bought a home almost 5 years ago his tax bills already $1,600 higher than where he started and that's a real economic decision for uh a working family so I think it's incumbent upon us to do things that allow us to save money but also reinvest and prepare ahead for the future so a million is a million dollar that's a million dollars every year as long as we you know we keep it there and that can deliver taxpayer relief but it also can prepare us to meet the challenges of those big obstacles that lay ahead can I just ask one more question of Matt mcrath of course so are you thinking if we reduce the budget from any excesses that we might see and I hate to use that word you know but um that that would reduce our bond rating so my understanding is we had a lowered Bond rating from Moody standards and poor and we replenished our Surplus this my understanding from again our Auditors from our Administration as long as we maintain those 12 to 15% of that we can maintain a higher level of rating if we lower it our rating goes down our bonds go up and and this does get into exactly what Mr Melle J Council Melle said which is that 1% or one and a half% on a 30-year $500 million right you know loan Bond whatever you want to call that's incredibly high and and again that's us because if we're going to 8515 that's less people in the corporate space paying the tax bill that's 100% whoever lives in town is paying the bill myself included right so when they when these mandates do come down by the way they will have Federal funding yeah and state funding just like we did when we build the Wastewater and water treatment facilities back in the day but um we will bond for them and then that debt goes into this budget understand that we pay on so we wind up paying on those but if we lower our credit rating again I just keep going back if we lower our credit rating you're increasing your rate that's that's a fact now again I agree with you I I I don't know if there's you can do is find out how posos is getting the system I think they they've uncovered they've uncovered some of those people though from I don't know if call them super fun sites but people that have allowed it to leak into some of these Waters I don't know if there's anything that they do about it it's in you it's in new new new babies it's it's everywhere so again that's my opinion of the budget like I said it's it's we're not far off from what we're talking about in fact I think most of us are saying the same things we have too many open positions but how do we fill them I've offered up some alternatives to how we bring in some young talent to come and work those roles if we don't right we keep hearing these inspectors we're Outsourcing our inspectors now we don't have enough some of these have been long-term vacancies yeah and and some of them or need need to be filled but some of them have been long-term vacancies that when Janice McCarthy was on Council councilman de was saying we should get rid of these yeah they're long-term vacancies that might never ever be filled but they they're on here and they T and they get rolled over from from budget to budget so 12 people at the waist water Phil time people at the wastewater treatment facility Joe beire please don't get mad at me but that's $669,000 but but Judy correct me if I'm wrong when we met with them you thought they needed more lab technicians right well yeah that's right no but I'm saying but but in in general we need more but those people are higher qualified so if we can take two of those jobs and get a higher qualified person is that a value so so if we need to hire more qualified people and there's a budget Associated to that group that we can then collapse and say let's go get more qualified people to go do better jobs is that a value to they need a lab technician but I don't know if they need 12 full-time whatever they got going on there for what they have I'm just saying so I think the the results I'm not looking I wasn't picking one person here or there because I am not the department head I think I'm not going to make that judgment but it we could look at it I think the result that we all would like to come to is obviously one that reduces the size of the increase as much as possible while keeping the essential Services intact while maintaining the ability to hire new talent that we we desperately need and to prepare ahead for the future so that's why with that in mind um you I know all of us spent a lot of time going line item by line item and I looked for what are largely discretionary spending topend the cost-saving measures that won't Impact Services that will prepare us ahead for the future that will allow the administration to reinvest that money in either the workforce or much needed uh uh um objectives that haven't been met and I think with this plan we can go from 2.76 down to one and a quarter and that's a lot of money for people who need it right now in this crushing inflationary environment that we're in so I I I see it as a win if my colleagues think some of it is good and not all is good I'm more than happy to entertain any suggestions that you all might have to make it better well I think one of the biggest problems we have is retaining good solid people that are experienced and I I think by by cutting this budget you're you're cutting some of the funds we could pay them um if we talk about open positions well there may be three positions open we may hire three people for those positions but five retire that's why we have more openings we have a slew of people retiring ing as well and moving to other positions because one they they're of age to retire or two they um low looking for a better salary so they're moving to other towns and other locations so I I don't think by cutting our budget is going to be helpful because you can't cut the budget and retain your people because you just need the funding to pay them I we went over this budget uh counc president kifi and I with the administration we did cut a lot of things when we went over it the first time and the second time and a little bit the third time and uh I I think where it is now is will help sustain a town we don't want to take Surplus it'll be really easy to say let's take a million dollars out of surplus but we don't really want to do that but you you did take Surplus isn't part of the this budget using so basically you're talking about the current fund you're talking about the current fund you're not this this practice has been going on for know how many years since Mimi Lots you so we had 10 10 points I forget two .4 million in Surplus and we use 5.4 million no s we didn't use any I me but but yeah she was talking about using the and that's that's that's a practice that's used in um almost every single year since I was mayor since Luther was mayor since MIM let was mayor and then you replenish it but I and I and I know where Matt McGrath is going with as the councilman is that if you don't rep replenish it at at its level has been replenished your bond rating has a chance of going down not only that the bond criteria is a lot more stricter since 2022 they made it strict where you know you can lose your bond rating even if you're doing doing well so what they liked about what paron was doing is the fact that we were budgeting properly and and and I think it's in the reports as well we're budgeting properly wisely and we were replenishing the Surplus and not just not just um the uh the current fund but also in the water and the sewer utility uh and that's why every year at the end of the year we we we increase it uh 2% uh for the utilities only because of Pensions health benefits and stuff like that they increase every single year um and what Matt's saying is yes if your bond rating goes down your buying power becomes more difficult and that's a fact it becomes more difficult for you to to purchase things um without having a higher rate without high higher rate of cost and payback um and you know I met with Matt I met with Justin like like Justin said the meetings went well but the fact of the matter is this is a very prudent budget um a lot of the stuff that's being talked about in the USU in the water utility doesn't affect the TA tax B base that's a user fee that's where it gets affected it doesn't get affected in your tax um so that doesn't increase your tax your taxes but it it can increase I'm not going to say it can it can increase your user fee cost because you don't use water you don't get charged until two you don't get charged so and I I had to make that because everyone I guess everyone was assuming that sewer and water will lower your taxes um and that's even if we eliminate a position in a sewer utility or water utility it won't affect our tax base but it will affect the sewer utility and water utility if they don't have the proper amount of um expertise there because those utilities you have to have special types of criteria special type of license and stuff like that so that that's that's the things that we're dealing with here in parpy so thank I'm going to add a couple things that you know Mr McGrath brought up the fact of the the Surplus the fund balance and he talked about in the long run the long term that interest rate even if it's a quarter percent you realize over a 30-year period if we Bond something that's millions and millions of dollars that we're now paying extra over that long term just because if our rating goes down we have to pay a higher percentage on our bond okay so in the long run it's just like a mortgage rate you want to you want to get a low percentage you're going to get a higher percentage you're going to pay more um you know Mr Mel you brought up you know you brought up a good point about the legal fees and stuff like that um but if there was something if there was a legal matter in one of those departments in the water or the sewer years ago there was a situation at the library where the Town Council had to bail out the library they had a uh emergent situation um where they did not have the money to cover uh this uh situation that happened there and we had to bail them out and it was a large amount of money and if we did not give them that money they were going to have to cut their hours lay off people it would have been horrific for the library um but we we G you know we gave them that money to stay afloat if one of these things were to happen with us if there was a big legal matter or something were to happen in one of those departments and we didn't have the money you know then we'd have to come up with it um as of right now the municipal part of this budget is a six $6 and change increase per month and that includes three more police officers so you know when you're saying oh cutting people you know people can't afford now I know $6 a month to some people is is a lot of money but when you think about it you know we had a lot of residents come meetings months ago when we had all the catalytic converters getting stolen out of uh Lake precipi and there were residents in the audience were saying I'm willing to pay a little bit more if we're going to get more police I'm sick and tired of the burglaries I'm sick and tired of the thefts get us more police I'm willing to pay more this budget includes three more police officers okay you're not losing any services in the town whatsoever you're keeping your services and again it's for $6 in change our the part we control the counsil out of them out of your taxes that's just our part that we control um to put us you know to lower this budget like Mr McGrath said long term you know I I just I just want people to be able to understand that it's just like your home mortgage would you rather pay a 7% on your mortgage or would you rather pay 3% on your mortgage over that 30-year period you're going to wind up paying a lot more money and that's what would happen to us if our bond rating goes down if we don't maintain that Surplus and that fund balance that's what would happen as far as the positions Mr neglia brought that up we have a lot of people that leave because of the amount of money that they make they might find another town that's paying more so you might have two or three openings somebody comes in fills those two or three openings but then two 3 months later person retires two people go to another town because they're making a little bit more money I'd love to be able to compensate the these workers and I know we're we're hoping that the one remaining contract that we can uh help them out some more for the blue collar workers um but if we cut this budget I think that would have a bearing on that and and I don't want to do that because these people deserve whatever we can get them I mean these are hardworking individuals and we're losing a lot of quality workers because we're just not able to pay what these other towns are so again for $6 and and change per month three additional officers and if we can help out our current employees by giving them whatever whatever we can I just think that that's that's worth it thank you so what is the how much can you lower the budget I'm just just paying to those advocate here and not affect the bond rating because we keep talking about the bond rating what is that magic number just make a motion if you want to cut something out cut it no I'm asking a question I'm not I'm not that might be that may be a question for Mr Ho I was looking at Jamie cry Mr cryan or Mr hoe Maybe that would be a question for him I I I think it's it's not an easy question to answer there's no it's not you know a plus b equals c unfortunately I a member of the public uh uh mentioned that expenses were going up in this budget that were raising the expenses and what were were allocating to expenses and that were uh that revenues were underfunded well the reason we're we're in this we were in this boat and we're out of it now or coming out of it was because the opposite was happening uh a few years ago revenues were um overstated expenses were underfunded yeah it was that was the issue when you have a hotel tax that was uh uh estimated to be three times higher than it should have been all of that stuff comes to roed your budget completely a few years ago was underfunded standards and pors downgraded the Township in TW at the end of or at the beginning of 2021 um or in 2021 because of uh the issues that they saw they said this year when they raised it again um they said the Outlook revision reflects our view of the township significantly improved finances during the past two fiscal Years After experiencing material Reserve draw down in fiscal 202 this it's you know to me it's clear it's the examples that council president used with the credit card and the mortgage and um uh Council M McGrath used the same uh uh or similar examples they may seem simple but it's true if you have a budget that has no wiggle room that has no cash reserves um that that takes all of the Surplus away you get what you got a couple of years ago and you get underfunded budgets where in the prior years like these past two years you have to raise the budget enough to cover your costs and that's what happened now you're looking at a budget with an overall tax increase of 2.29 you're looking at a budget that is appropriately funded that is appropriate that takes into account everything that it should take into account and there's no onot games that are being played in this budget there's uh a there's no extra Surplus being utilized only the appropriate amount of surplus that is being regenerated and then s and the open positions I I get it that's kind of been the buzzword like I looked back on meetings before I came to to part7 that's been the buz that every Council has used open positions get rid of them open positions get rid of them well we provide better Services than anywhere else in the county by far it's not even close not even remotely close and nj.com did a study on the 2023 tax rate saying that we were the 23rd highest taxes in the county so by far the number one services with the best employees who need more help and the 23rd highest taxes out of 39 with many of so that means 22 of the municipalities in the county are higher than us and they're not getting remotely the the services that uh uh our residents are being provided um to me if you're looking I'll I'll circulate the uh uh reply to council member grad's questions if it's okay with you council member grad of course thanks so in it it talks about it goes through each of the three um credit uh looks that the two moodies and the S&P that happened this year every single one of them said the same exact things that in order to get a better rating you have to get more Surplus pretty much if you uh uh what can uh dictate a downgrade is reducing your Surplus or reducing your reserve position every single one of them said that it's it it's no secret sauce in that so if you're looking at what it is that gets you more a better credit rating or maintains your credit rating Surplus is by far the key cash reserves of BU far the kid to that if I can I just want to add one other thing too is you know as a lot of people know that I I train and I worked with law enforcement all over Mars County so I want I use that as a resource to ask and we have phenomenal Township employees in every department but I'm just going to talk about sanitation for a minute I've asked police officers from almost every town in Mars County and I tell them what our sanitation department does here in precip no one no one compares to our sanitation department in Mars County n no one whatsoever we're private companies so yeah and private companies you're paying $75 to $100 a month and they still don't match what our people do and what this town does for our our residents so I just want to throw that out there because those PE you know I've talked almost 39 towns and we have the top of the line when it comes to that and and if I may add council president uh out of those 20 with the 22 lowest and um or highest in tax but however you want to put it you can remember the towns below us don't and most of them don't even um offer sanitation so they don't include that in their taxes but the residents pay that um I guess it's a monthly rate um some some $80 to $100 uh a month so everything's inclusive in in our budget uh sanitation water sewer and all that so so if you would add that in we probably would even lower I think with that said it's time to make a motion for a vote I think we all spoken about how we feel um with all of that said I'd like to make a motion to vote on eliminating the line items that I've just read into the record so we have a motion uh to eliminate the line item mentioned by Mr muella is there a second second okay so there's a second um at this point um there's no discussion since I believe we've already had all the discussion we need so we'll go ahead and and put it to a vote um Mr Hernandez yes Mr McGrath no Mr Mella yes Mr neglia no Mr kifi no okay so uh 3 to two a motion fails uh at this time uh we're going to move along to the township attorney uh no report this evening council president okay uh business administrator Mr cryan thank you thank you council president I just wanted to real quickly thank uh this Council and as we we talked about how good the employees are we also have a very great uh Council up here um we were able to produce this budget after a lot of work and meet with each of these Council people who were very concerned and and very interested in seeing uh how things are done and getting into the details and it's uh refreshing to see the level of interest from uh our governing body um and it's appreciated um I just wanted to real quickly before I uh introduce our Redevelopment Council wanted to take the opportunity to um first wish uh all the mothers uh Happy Mother's Day out there the moms aunts godmothers uh grandmothers Big Sisters you know anybody who's a mother figure um uh it's coming this this Sunday my mom was uh an incredible influence in my life she passed away a couple years ago and I miss her every day and but I but I still have her with me every day and um all the lessons that she taught me so I really appreciate her my my wife is an incredible uh uh mother as well um to our beautiful daughters who one of them is um as her fifth birthday tomorrow so happy birthday to Charlotte um uh one of the items on your agenda is um regarding uh Redevelopment at uh 2030 ladex and uh the resolution it authorizes the execution of uh Redevelopment agreement with 2030 X urban renewal LLC for the Redevelopment of the property and the construction of a warehouse building um we have uh tonight we have our Township Redevelopment attorney Mark samaro uh from samaro and a Farney um hope I pronounce your partner's name correctly thanks uh here Mark has years and years and years of land use Municipal and uh Redevelopment experience and he he is a true asset to uh parpan we're very lucky that he's on board for us especially at this time when Redevelopment is so important uh um to uh sustaining our Economic Development and so important to make sure that we don't uh cross over to overdevelopment so he's here uh about two weeks ago we circulated a memo from uh Mark and uh uh some drafts to the council uh to review and in the hopes that there would be enough time or sufficient time to um review a prior to making any decisions obviously there's no decision being made here tonight so there's even more time uh uh uh to think about it but with that um I'm going to bring up Mark and I hope you find the information that he has uh that will be providing uh informative good evening everyone how are you okay with you attorneys in these pre cases so we'll do it standing yes please so as Mr cryan had indicated uh we have uh put before the council a consideration of a resolution designating the redeveloper and also uh authorizing the execution of a Redevelopment agreement uh this particular property the uh Redevelopment process began in January of uh 2023 uh the next step is the execution and the designation which would be by way of resolution uh presumably at the next council meeting uh the step after that and this is important for everyone to realize uh the step after that is a general typical site plan approval application before the uh planning board uh at that point in time uh people are free to ask questions regarding the uh application the site plan application just as they can with any other application uh they could State their concerns uh the board could address their concerns in a resolution by imposing conditions Etc obviously that's within the discretion of the board and it's within the parameters of the mlul uh but it is a very transparent process it's a very typical process what we're doing in this step is not uh promulgating or authorizing the site plan that's the next step this is just entering into the agreement uh which has to be done before the next step uh with the redeveloper um this property currently uh houses a 78,000 ft dilapidated office building uh it's in a major disrepair leaky roofs mold uh and it is uh presumably going to be uh replaced with 140,000 ft Warehouse uh with 23 loading Ducks I did hear some of the public comments before I addressed this governing body here today uh and I think that some people questioned whether or not that property would be lawfully us uh used as a warehouse and and the answer is yes uh a Redevelopment plan which is the equivalent of a zoning ordinance uh was adopted uh in I believe July uh of last year uh and that put into place the uh zoning that would authorize uh such an application uh I don't think that it's necessary for me to burden people with what my role in the Redevelopment agreement was uh but for to say and and I know that you all have received a Redline copy uh which were my proposed changes uh we did negotiate them with the redevelopers council uh I think that uh we would all agree that the changes that I had uh suggested negotiate ultimately uh included in that agreement are for the betterment and and uh benefit of the township uh and I think that it's also important for everyone to realize there's no reference to anything regarding a pilot this is simply a Redevelopment agreement no one's consulted me regarding a pilot that has simply just not been a discussion uh and that's not a necessity with respect to Redevelopment uh this is simply uh an agreement with the redeveloper that impose a certain time frames uh that are to the benefit of the township because it incentivizes it motivates uh the actual reconstruction of the site uh so that it could become a revenue Source uh for the township on a property that currently isn't generating the revenue it used to uh so uh it's a very good project we're bringing a very underutilized piece of property uh into a very fruitful State uh for the benefit all taxpayers I'm not sure if anyone has any questions okay seeing that there's no questions uh thank you Mr samaro appreciate your time on this thank you thank you okay with that um I do not have a report and now I'm asking the council Administration to please review ordinance's first reading for Action at the next meeting okay moving along seeing there's no questions to the approval and payroll of the bills list CFO Leonard ho recommends authorization for payment number one authorizes payment of the May 10th 2024 regular and miscellaneous payroll estimated at 1, 650,000 and number two payment of bills from voucher list of May 1st 2024 through May 3rd 2024 which is 2,540 22307 May I please have a motion to approve the authorization for payment make a motion second motion made by Mr Mella seconded by Miss Hernandez roll call Miss Hernandez yes Mr McGrath yes Mr Mella yes Mr neglia yes and Mr kifi yes motion passes can I please have a motion to adjourn the meeting second motion made by Mr neglia seconded by Mr Mella roll call Mr Hernandez yes Mr McGrath yes Mr Mella yes Mr neglia yes Mr K yes we're adjourned have a great night everybody thank you