##VIDEO ID:Zkkc6JxdIyA## professional table is ready okay you ready calling to order the zoning Board of adjustment R and Township New Jersey regular meeting December 5th 2024 notice of meeting the notice requirements of the open public meetings act have been satisfied by the placing of a notice of this meeting on the bulletin board at the municipal building filing same with the Township Clerk and transmitting same to the hunter County Democrat The Courier News The Star Ledger and the Trenton Times Roll Call please chairwoman Miss Cynthia schaer here Vice chairman Mr assou DJI here Mr Steve fario has asked to be excused Mr Randy block here Mr Jim ferero Miss Lindsay K bral she's also asked to be excused Miss lorett gratina has asked to be excused as well Miss Donna Drew here Mr James Miller here four professionals board attorney Mr John drill here Township planner Mr Jeffrey ferella here on behalf of board engineer Mr aesh Dari we have Mr Ryan McCarthy here Township landscape architect Mr John Morgan Thomas here and all other board professionals have asked to be excused actually board secretary Taylor vaugh here okay can I a motion to uh excuse Steve Lindsay and lorett so move second H in a vote please chairwoman Miss Cynthia schaer yes Mr rul dami yes Mr Randy block yes Mr Jim Ferrero yes Miss Anna Drew yes Mr James Miller yes okay moving on comments and announcements hearing none distribution of Correspondence none minutes none moving on to resolutions for this evening there are three well there are four listed one's not going to be adopted because they owe escrow money but you should call that resolution in my opinion and then explain that it's going to be tabled because of that reason confirmed um I don't see it on my shouldn't the top one the top one no you know what I'm sorry I I gave out the wrong resol resolutions the wrong agenda I gave out the wrong agendas yes CE Main Street should have been listed first resolution okay thank you okay calling the first resolution resolution number 20 24-12 CE Main Street LLC block 41 lot 63 181 Old croon Road bo8 number 06 d202 explanation please so this uh application currently their escrow account is in a rear we have notified them but but unfortunately payment has not been received so unfortunately this evening the adoption is not up the resolution is not up for adoption so can you send the applicant and the applicant's attorney an email explaining the resolution was ready to be adopted this evening but was tabled and will not be adopted until and unless they bring the escrow up to Snuff correct yes I will okay moving on to the next one resolution number 202 24-13 Esco Precision in block 36.2 lot 14 15 16 and 16 71 and 17 Royal Road boa number 10- 2021 resolution memorializing modification of a of one condition one of resolution number 202 24-02 for the extension of time to revise plans and related documents and to obtain signatures of the revised plans to September 5th 2024 and and two condition number 15 of the res resolution number [Music] 2022-23 now they've blown through these dates they're going to have to seek another extension but I just wanted to again end of the year I wanted to get all the resolutions adopted I was hoping to come in to do another extension and You' save one resolution but it's okay and we're in agreement that this is version 20242 version 2 yes okay can I get a motion to approve so move can I get a second I a second can I vote please who can vote okay we have uh chairwoman Miss Cynthia Schaefer yes Mr Randy block yes Mr rul dami yes Mr Jim Ferrero yes Mr James Miller yes okay moving on to the next resolution Dave and Sally mcferson 3 amall road block 77.0 n lot 48 application number boa -9- 2024 interpretation and certification that the multiple family use and the department use are loly created pre-existing non-conforming uses and are entitled to continue resolution number 2 24-15 version 20 24-12-12 can I get a motion to approve well actually this version three yeah version three I'm sorry yeah it was late today I didn't have a chance to give it to you guys okay the only difference is on the last page under conditions number one the first sentence any future improvements that would result in an expansion of the pre-existing non-conforming use of the property shall require minimum D2 variance relief from the board that was the additional okay Mark yeah I want to just read this this last condition the the prior version said any future improvements shall require at a minimum a D2 variance relief from the board period third version the long story short there's a back and forth here's the agreed upon condition which in my opinion is acceptable and the applicants attorney's um position is also acceptable it's it's longer instead of one sentence so I'm going to read it slowly any future improvements that would result in an expansion of the pre-existing non-conforming use of the property shall require at a minimum a D2 variance from the board as well as site plan approval from the board period next sentence any future improvements of the property that do not result in an expansion of the pre-existing nonconforming use of the property shall require site plan approval from the board period Then in parenthesis while the use of the property is residential the property is not exempt from site plan approval because it contains multifam residential housing and not a single family dwelling or a two- family dwelling unit building and then I cite the statute which exempts those from site plan approval okay all right can we get a vote can I get a motion to approve so move second vote please no Randy Randy can right it's Drews Ferraro and schaer because the other people are either not eligible or they're not here tonight all right Jim you wanna I'll make the motion Donna you I'll second okay can I get a vote no Donna Donna yeah Donna's on it she's first I'm sorry you're right you're right she's good chairwoman Miss Cynthia schaer yes Miss Donna Drew yes Mr Jim Ferrero yes okay moving on to the last resolution of the evening Kurt fry 16 maner court block 4.01 lot 14 application number bo8 D12 d224 resolution memorializing Grant of C1 variant to allow a deviation from the maximum hard surface permitted to allow installation of an accessory Hot Tub resolution number 20 24-16 version 202 24-12 d01 db2 right so now we are up to version four and in fact our board secretary is going to read some late breaking revisions I got the um the numbers from the notes of the hearing okay um but the notes on the plan had conflicts so between Mr Fry myself and we had Jeff as the ultimate Arbiter on this we have what we all believe now to be corrected numbers so can you just read the corrections into the record and then that's the version that we're going to ask the board to adopt yes okay so on the first page in the first paragraph the last sentence and the applicant proposes to install a hot tub John had 2218 square foot concrete slab when it should just be 81 on the second page under Section a number one the first sentence the property is an undersized and irregularly shaped 96 acre and then parentheses square footage It should read 41,8 34.8 Square ft and that same exact correction is made on P agage three under number four findings and conclusions under a positive criteria again it's just the change of the square footage of the property right but just read read it into the record again it John had it as the 40511 when it should be 41,8 34 Square ft and then the last [Music] one on page six it's under conditions number six hold it hold it hold it remember that one I thought we were just going to re on the record that's saying meaning yeah I was just gonna read on the record that it's staying The appc Wanted revision to this condition but I do not believe the revision should be made so condition six going to remain as is and if the applicant has a problem with that tomorrow we'll deal with it okay that's what you were going to say correct correct okay all right can I get a motion and it's only the three of us so so moved Jim can you second yes okay say second say second thank you thank you chairwoman Miss Cynthia schaer yes Mr Jim Ferrero yes Miss Donna yes okay moving on to the applications for this evening there's four one two three four five five okay so first one Bo case number 17-22 applicant is shanty LLC block 41.0 lot 330 305 Highway 12 the applicant is time extension request for obtaining zoning and construction permits would you like me to read this into the record yes okay okay uh dated November 26 2024 dear chair chairperson and members of the board shanty LLC is requesting a six-month extension to obtain the zoning permit for 305 Route 12 lot 3 block 41.036927 [Music] matter sinly rajish Shing so the underlying resolution was 22-1 and 22-11 had a number of conditions condition one gave it a certain amount of time to make revisions to the site plans and the storm water management study and they previously got an extension of that in resolution 20 23-13 so the first thing I want to ask Jeff is have they done that by the new May 4 2024 date or do they also need that extended no that's done okay so the only thing they need extended then is condition 13 in resolution 20 22-11 and that gave them until November 4 2024 to get all the permits and they want that extended till when they say six months right so six months would be December January February March April May that would be May 4 2025 in your opinion is that going to give them enough time that should there was one condition that they had to clean up some of the materials on the site that has been done so it's it's really only his his request there there's no other conditions that are okay okay so the request in terms of a motion if the board wanted to Grant the modification of I number 13 of resolution 20221 to Grant an extension the extension would be to extension to apply for and obtain all construction permits by May 4 2025 correct now I know in here he talks about a zoning permit but it's construction permits he need needs the zoning permit to get the construction permit it's the construction permit yeah okay so do we need a motion yeah if if you're going to Grant the modification and extension someone makes a motion oh you're here with the applicant yeah oh come on up why don't you say something got it we're trying we're trying to kill the music first can you lower microphone John can you make sure yours is on go ahead can you identify yourself you're from like Santi LLC company we represent so the question I have is um I know we requested for six months and this is like winter period so would it be okay that's why I was asking if we get more than six months because then contractor then they just like it's winter my suggestion was going to be that you ask for a year instead of six months you ask for by November 4 2025 is that what you want to do yeah so yeah anyone have a problem with that no I'm glad you said something thank you so much and uh I have two more questions okay permit okay so my second question is like Bond um wanted to find out if it is not dependent on like the septic plan septic if it is not I have no idea you're gonna have to contact your attorney I have no idea um but the document that I was looking at it is if it is not dependent on like septics so can we get that build in the meantime or I don't know I don't know this is the land use board right they granted your application they gave you a date to get construction permits what you have to do to get those construction permits is talk to the construction Department okay okay so construction okay all right that's fine and my second question would be like uh yeah like um this is for like external like for Bond and all that requirement but when can we start like inside work like you cannot start any work until you have a construction permit oh okay okay so that will be valid for both outside as well as inside correct okay understood thank you to okay okay understood so the thank you amended request is for a one-year extension so a modification of condition number 13 of resolution 22-11 to get an extension of the time within which to obtain all construction permits to November 4 2025 that's the request all right can I get a motion I'll make the motion a second roll call please chairwoman miss anthia schaer yes Vice chair Miss rul DJI yes Mr Randy block yes Mr Jim Ferrero yes Miss Donna Drew yes Mr James Miller yes okay moving on to the next case for this evening boa case number LLC location is block 71 Lots 8 and 8.01 180 Highway 202 applicant time extension requests for obtaining zoning and construction permits good evening good evening Madam chairwoman members of the board Cara kazinski of mcal Yos kazinski in line here tonight on behalf of the applicant um I was prepared to make a little summary of the history you have the letter I know you have a long meeting tonight so whatever the board's uh pleasure is with regard to what you'd like me to do just let me know John do you want me to read the letter do you want it to summarize a look at how long the letter is a page and a half you know mind just getting a little bit closer to the microphone now why don't you just which condition so this is resolution 20239 correct and I correct me if I'm wrong I think the only revision the only modification you need is modification of condition number one I believe to extend the time within which to make the revisions to the site plan to get the site the site plans signed off on from June 7224 until June 7 2025 is that correct that's correct the plans have been revised you ready for this yep okay one year extension you have a problem with that Jeff I don't either one year to today one year one year from June 7 2024 to June 7 2025 what was about to say is they've made all the revisions they probably don't even need this long but this is just in case correct perfect yep okay can I get a motion to approve so move second roll call please chairwoman Miss Cynthia Schaefer yes Vice chair Mr DJI yes Mr Randy block yes Mr Jim Ferrero yes Miss Donna Drew yes Mr James Miller yes okay you want me to stay yes might as well okay next case Bo case number 16- 2024 applicant I'm sorry we're going to skip we're going to skip to right just stay there we're skipping to your other case Okay boa case number 02-2020 applicant family Flemington family Partnerships LLC location block 7223 lot 31 328 Highway 202 applicant preliminary and final site plan with d variant and both variances for proposal car dealership and this is anjman yeah yes can you first enter your appearance on the record absolutely car kazinski mcnell Aros kazinski and lime on behalf of the applicant okay and you're requesting to have the hearing adjourned I understand it to February 6 correct so first is there anyone in the audience here tonight on the Flemington Family Partnership application there probably is not because a lot of people were calling on this and they were calling the office and the office let them know that you weren't going to be heard tonight and then told the people to call in to find out the date because you're asking to be carried to February 6 2025 without need for further notice and you're going to extend the time within which the board has to act on the application to March 31 correct correct and I just want the board to know that the additional escrow was provided so um I'm assuming we'll get our review letters shortly hopefully fingers crossed correct so so on on this one um they didn't get any review letters because there wasn't any escrow so the board professionals were like well we're not doing any review letters unless there's escrow so now the escrow's been okay and we confirm that the ren notice was done on 11212 24 yes okay so anyone have a problem with that that one doesn't require a motion if no one objects make the announcement again the hearing in this matter Flemington family partnership which is board application number 02 2023 is going to be carried to February 6 2025 there'll be no new notice going out and the applicant has extended the time within which the board can act on that application until March 31 2025 do you want her to send something in about that or is it good enough to say it on the record if you want something sent in just tell I'll send it to you just so you have it for the record just want to confirm I it's February 6th February 6 yeah February 6 for some reason I heard February 26 it's February 6 okay and the only other thing I'd say is if there is anyone here tonight uh that would like to we already made the announcement there's I already asked there's no one here okay thank you thank you everyone okay moving on to the next case boa case number 16- 2024 applicant Jeff Anin location block 14.01 lot 14 one 14 Bart Barton Hollow Road applications for C variant for proposing a six- foot high fence within the front yard setback area and the property of the property and accessory structures in front and principal structure good evening Mr anen if you give me a minute um so two of us are going to recuse ourselves so we'll just State for the record that chairwoman Miss Cynthia Schaefer and Mr Randy block are going to recuse themselves okay and the board as a seven member board a quorum is four four is enough to hear the application it's a c variance you need a majority of a quorum so you need three votes out of the four to get the relief so the two people refusing why don't you to gu us go out in the H or whatever have a nice break and we'll call you when the next application is up no our vice chairman is going to be taken over as chairman correct yes yes I will yeah good evening sir good evening go so let me get everyone sworn that's going to participate as I understand it obviously the applicant's GNA get sworn he's goingon to participate Jeff anyone other than you or just you just you so can you two stand up can both of you raise your right hands do both of you swear or affirm the testimony you're going to give in this matter will be the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth yes okay and for the microphone can you identify yourself for the record Jeff ansin 114 Barton h Road Flemington and Jeff can you identify yourself Jeff okay ready go yeah yeah go ahead sir okay um I'm here to request to C variances tonight uh I have a corner lot being that I do have a corner lot I have two front yards which you know require certain certain things so the first uh requires relief from section two 96- 142 C1 to allow a 6t high fence within the 50 front yard setback the second variance would be for relief from section 296 131 to allow for accessory structures in front of the primary structure so the first one the 6 foot high fence uh approximately 31 ft of the 192 ft of fence encroaches on the setback by less than approximately 10 feet uh being a County Road it's a 50 foot setback if it was a residential Road it would have been a 33 foot set back um and just a point on that as people do drive down kinville road which is Corner Road by it's a 45 mph Road I believe that the six-foot fence would be beneficial as drivers might not be distracted at see people you know in the pool area driving by and you know it catches their eye the second variance um is for structures they're in front of the primary structure there is a pool and there is a a pool house um I moved in 32 years ago they were there the earliest survey I can find is 1981 I asked B and borne for one prior to that they didn't have one and I realized it's 7 19 1979 prior you didn't need permits so I have something from 1981 um if I can John I have pictures just to show can I give you yes let's let's get them marked as exhibits how many pictures you have oh there's there's three okay all right so we're gonna I'm going to Mark I'm going to take one packet I'm GNA mark one is A1 right in the order you have one is A2 and one is A3 can you give this board secretary and this let me have one and then you can hand those others to the board members so we're marking the top one A1 the second one A2 the third one A3 and Jeff you took these yourself correct yes I did and what do you know what date you took them on or if you don't know the date you know what months it was last month okay so in um November of 2024 you took these pictures you know this probably October October of 2024 you took these pictures okay at the current time I I have a copy of the survey with the 1981 dat on it you know that's a good idea and I assume what you're saying is the survey from 1981 is so close to 79 that the board could imply and assume that the structures were there in 1979 and in 1979 let's get Jeff to did you need permits for these structures in 1979 no there's an exception of 1979 okay and so let's mark this survey as A4 and we're going to give this one down to the board secretary and then hand those out too [Music] thank you so just first looking at the pictures um the first picture you see would be going West on kinville road so you can see you can see the fence but you can it is hard to see uh the second picture would be coming east on kinville you're past the pool before you would even see that fence um and then the last one is just an overview from the top you can see the pool house that's there in the pool the spill over spot says hot tub it's not a hot tub it's just it's just a little sitting pool and water just dumps into the main well there is no El associated with that and no [Music] heat and then obviously the survey shows that uh it's a date of September of 1981 so I would respectfully request you know the two c variants for for this uh any comments yeah I've been on site um and the pictures do reflect a lot of what um is stated there's a a long line of uh mature trees that block the view from even the the the fence and the structures and all the structures are within the fence limit well oh the the structures that are um that require relief are within the fence okay um and the fence it's it's just a direct replacement of what's the same location yeah and it's only that that section it's not the entire any members of the board comments no John any any comments from you no I say the board if the board's inclined to Grant the relief I go with the C1 the structures were already there he's just replacing he's replacing the fence and the from a to right from a 4 foot to a six foot no negative detrimental aesthetic impact as shown by the pictures sounds good anybody from the public wants to make any comments anyone in the public here on this application people are out there but they're shaking their heads no no okay uh Jim you want to go ahead we can close this one oh oh I have no problems with that I think it's pretty straightforward yeah it di Minimus impact I don't have any problems with it about you no problem at all I see what he's trying to do not not a problem okay I'll make some comments U first of all thank you so much it was very clear and so we appreciate that and I totally agree with you it will benefit the neighborhood so that's a good point too and I'm also in favor of it thank you yeah thank you this would be one of those I guess rare applications any conditions just anything else other than a permit for the spillway what kind of any permit needed for the fence so permit for the spillway and permit for the fence what kind of timing are you looking at put it this way you don't want to come back here like the other people did no I don't okay so why don't we do six months well it's now December right it's cold so you want a year yeah okay a year to get your permits and a year from when the resolution's adopted not a year from tonight okay okay sounds good ready to vote anybody wants to make a motion motion to Grant with those conditions anyone yeah second well I can't make it someone say so moved he did oh I didn't hear Jim said moved okay the other Jim second second you're James you're it's a Jim and a James Jim moved and James seconded okay uh Vice chair Mr R dami yes Mr Jim Ferrero yes Miss Donna Drew yes Mr James Miller yes okay thank you thank you right and then just give me one moment I'm going to go get the other board members thanks have a nice night I drive by that house all the time I come up left it's a weird turn to make a left it's awkward because the driveway really is like right on the corner bizar seems like friend now remember oh one time I was going to make left they came up left Direction but they're waiting for me to go I'm like f you just go and then I finally go and then I see him I'm like oh block him going in the driveway a nice chair sorry here Christian good get we lost power this afternoon really yeah again yeah I'm sure well it was um I don't know how well you know road if you had North from San Hillar it was just before Valley View mean they had it walked off the trucks and Spotlight chair picker up there okay so now we know we are very efficient yes I will give the builders credit though they just fired that's [Music] right it it's good I mean they don't have the side but we all here [Music] okay okay thank you moving to the next case boa case number 12-2020 applicant is the fud shop Land Group LLC block 36 lot 65 10 mbook Place application is for a minor site plan with d variant relief for manufacturing use and residential use in a B3 Zone good evening evening evening who is one as an attorney or oh yeah Scott Bullock large scam and Daner on behalf of the applicant the bud shop Okay okay so what do what do we have uh this is going to uh be a uh property that's currently located in the B3 uh commercial Zone uh it's block 36 lot 65 corner of milbrook Road in Bur Lane in Ron Township uh the applicant foot shop owns the property uh it's approximately 3.4 Acres it's currently developed with a one-story single family dwelling and an attached garage facing milbrook road with an L-shaped masonry building behind the existing single family dwelling uh that's currently being used for storage and some office space and there's also an approximately 2,000t 3bedroom apartment on the second floor and a storage shed with some uh Gra driveways and parking areas uh we're seeking a minor site plan approval with use and bulk variant relief and some design exceptions uh to prevent uh manufacturing use in the B3 zoning District the uh product that's going to be manufactured is going to be uh candy mostly I assume chocolate candy uh and the candy is going to be sold at the foot shop which is a pre-existing uh retail business located on Route 2 202 uh basically in front of and facing 202 from where the manufacturing area is going to be and I'm here with the uh owners of the LLC Mr bur and Mr uh Gilchrist who are going to walk us through some of the history of the uh business and uh the use now in a general sense and about what their uh plans are for when they begin the uh manufacturing so a couple questions sure the in the B3 zone I'm GNA ask Jeff the retail selling of the candy is that [Music] permitted yes yes it is and the retail facility is that on the same lot with the subject tonight no it is not okay so that the lot with the retail store so to speak is not in front of the board and that's permitted correct Jeff correct yeah this is a separate property that's to the rear Yep this want to get everyone focused so let's get everyone sworn and then you do your thing so anyone who's going to testify in this application the two principles we have looks like an engineer we have a planner here and we have the board's engineer planner and Landscape architectural expert can everyone stand up everyone raise their right hands does everyone swear or affirm the testimony they're given this matter will be the truth the whole truth nothing about the truth starting over there I do okay then starting back over there into the microphone if you guys find microphones please slowly state your name spell your last name and give your relationship to the applicant and or the board as the case may be Stephen bur b r y um owner of uh the fudge shop Land Group okay so the fudge shop Land Group LLC right yes are you um managing member president you know where your official title uh vice president you're vice president of the app of the LLC of the LLC is the LLC the applicant here correct okay okay next Richard Gilcrest g l CH r s uh and I am a president of uh applicant y okay James Kyle Kyle Kyle mcmanis Associates and Hell professional planner for the op okay Steve Parker P ke R project engineer okay you're a PE corre and you're the applicants engineering expert yes next Ryan McCarthy I am the board engineer or filling in for the board engineer well you're from you're same company same company okay Jeff Pella Township planner John Thomas for landscape architect okay we're ready to roll okay he Mr Gil Chris can you tell us a little bit about the fud shop LLC what kind of business that it does so the fud shop itself uh is a business that's existed since 1961 um we uh manufacture and sell um chocolate based Confections um we really are in the people business uh it we manufacture just real quick where do you manufacture now we manufacturer on the second floor of our 202 facility okay keep on going um by the way let's get let's get the address of that sure 461 US Highway 202 Flemington New Jersey okay do you happen to know the lottin block of that for that or going going to ask your engineer or planner lot 68 lot 68 same block block 36 okay goad keep on going um so the manufacturing we do uh we're really happy to say it's uh simple ingredients it's food and there're simple recipes like everything we make is probably less than seven ingredients so the manufacturing we do is very light it's very pleasant uh we never get any complaints about what we're cooking people always feel like we're luring them in uh but I I really uh the manufacturing we do is specialty food and uh so uh we've been doing that since 1961 um uh look our I'm sorry so that's the fud shop um a little more than 10 years ago in the property in question was available for sale uh I went and I parked in the driveway of that off of what is nowb Lane and I looked and they were dilapitated buildings broken windows uh leaking roots um the tenants that were in both of those structures had bad relationships with the families in that neighborhood um and so we thought this was something we could do and we could add value to our community and it had to be sustainable we didn't know fully but there was an apartment on the second floor of the that larger building and then there was a house Never Enough residential available in central New Jersey and we thought at the very least we could go start there um we did not realize that there was in fact uh uh 1984 uh something that uh in this Township that uh the the residential was switched over to office we did not know that people were living in that space and we assumed that's how it was so when we did purchase it we cleaned it up improved it put a new roof on and uh new heat and um and we have people living in there um since Co I'm so happy we don't have office space nobody needs more office space in New Jersey but we do need more residential so we hope to clear that up tonight which which building so we have a what have a site plan large lsh building a little one okay so looking at the of the plan a one Stelling with the garage closest to milbrook Road in the corner of milbrook and bur Lane and I was going to quickly ask Jeff bur Lane is that a count street is that yes yes it is yeah then to the east of the on story frame dwelling in garage is the L-shaped building you're referring to and it the plan at least again sheet two of four of the site plan shows a twostory masonry building let's say the bottom of the L and a one-story masonry building the top part of the L correct yes okay so and then there's a frame garage to the east of the L-shaped building and it shows now I know it says the existing garage is going to be removed I see the note and there's a shed it also says existing shed to be removed correct yes okay so start with this one story frame dwelling and garage closest to milbrook Road what currently goes on there and then what are you proposing to have go on there so in that house there's there um hold on hold on the one story friend dwelling it's occupied now it's supposed to continue to be occupied yes and that I assume is a renter unrelated to the business correct now [Music] [Music] Jeff no fa not [Music] um I I do not know I believe it may be you're applying for D1 to also have people continue to live that build correct I thought we were we want people to live in that building but I thought the variance we needed to get was for that Second Story there's there's a bunch of variances you need to get which the planner is going to address I just want to set the table so to speak so Mr Kyle I know you haven't been qualified yet but just factually so don't to qualify right now fact what Rel being s so the application was for a D1 variance to continue the single family use on the property and that way you don't have to go through and try to prove that was that was preexisting correct correct okay now we think it was uh built around 1956 now if it was built in 1956 the first ordinance account in 1957 195 yeah7 so Jeff do you have a suggestion on how deal with the one story FR of property when I when I did the report I called out that it should be a d D1 request so before you get what evidence do you have that it wased in 1956 um so I've been working with Rich and Steve tell can I can I want get me qualified here yeah sure so I've appeared before the board a number of times um I'm still licensed by the state as a professional planner I'm happy to go through my educational work um qualifications if you like but nothing's changed I think we we know anyone here is we have an interested party in the back are you that's Jo shans just in case someone's not here understand appr they file can we just get put your for the record testified here before he's been accepted as an expert probably over a dozen times well more than that just so I have a Bachelor of Science in environmental planning and design which I receiv received from Ruckers in 1996 I've been a practicing planner for over 20 years currently licensed by the state as a professional planner also a member of the American Institute of certified planners uh I've appeared before this board many times and over 230 boards in the state also qualified as an expert in planning and three vages of Superior Court in the state of New Jersey okay now you accept them as an expert yes thank you so Jim you were saying I want what kind of evidence do you have that that this dwelling was constructed in 1956 prior to the Township's first ordinance so I've been working with Steve and and rich on this in many forms since about 2019 um there have been many prior applications related to the site before they purchased it so there were a number of resolutions uh the information that we pulled together um through that through those applications some dating back to it was 1966 was the first time that but give me some paper that leads you to conclude that the house was constructed in 1956 so I I saw that date and some information that we had compiled just not a general history of the now what I can do is go and look at the tax record and produce that if that would be helpful but Jeff did that that's why he was suggesting go with the D1 variant I was hoping you would come up with something that the board could say oh no no no we're comfortable declaring that that thing was constructed in 1956 so we don't need a D1 use variant for that that's grandfather okay do we but do we have something like that um I can look I don't I'll have to look in the material that I have look at the material you have so for now for now one of the D1 use variances is to allow residential occupancy of the on story frame dwelling all right so you can that back for a second let's go back to Mr Gilcrest so now that next build the L-shaped building what is currently going on in that L-shaped building uh well there's storage uh and uh like we don't need office space no I understand but just tell me what if we went out there today what would we see in the L-shaped buildings you would say various things stor and then the part above okay so there's this is the one you were talking there's an apartment in in the bottom of the L the twostory masonry building there's an apartment above that or there's an apartment above the one-story masonry building the the part that says twostory masonry building the second level that is an apartment okay so there's an apartment over the L-shaped building and let's forget what's inside the building for now what's propos osed to be in that building the you want to propose the apartment to remain on the second floor yeah which is another one of the D1 variances and then we would like to produce product if you see the the part that says one story masonry building yes that that section we' like to produce uh candy in there so that would be the manufacturing facility yeah and then can the other part there's like there's garages under the two stor so we just keep that as it is okay so what is going to be stored underneath two on the first level of the two-story building business related things yeah or things related to residential use of the other building bus yeah it would be absolutely Stu associated with our business okay so the me get this right the first floor of the twostory of the L is manufacturing related storage right okay I understand what the application for you guys understand what the application for yep all right what else you want to tell them uh so uh I think um when I talked to our neighbors uh they were concerned about uh deliveries coming down bur Lane it's a very narrow road and we assured them we wouldn't have deliveries down B Lane as a matter of fact every Tuesday we get a delivery uh it's a mixed delivery and right now um you know chocolate goes to one part of the basement and some Vol canning you get both when you say when you say chocolate goes to the the basement the basement of what of the right now we get a delivery to the 202 the 461 202 uh address that's where we have uh our manufacturing and our retail at this time we split those deliveries into different parts of the basement the basement of the other building yes of the two two that's not subject correct keep on going so what's going to happen though if the board grants the approval where will the delivery still go into that building would yeah would still go to a two we would divide up what say if we had our manufacturing back there we would fill up our car truck or like just a pickup with chocolate drive it down milbrook Road and bring it to the back building to that really is not uncommon in the candy business where candy businesses outow their retail space they used to make candy in the basement uh and so they end up manufacturing often miles away and they end up a lot of varying but you know we move it back and forth in a car it sounds inefficient but we're just a little you know and so even as you know we're reasonably candy manufacturer but just still veryy yeah we so I don't want to throw a curveball we got a little issue here I just brought it to the attention of your planner we were under the impression that as part of this application there wasn't going to be any more manufacturing related stuff in the building that's not subject to the application what so so as far as not manufacturing no no but if you're doing storage in the basement of that building that's not subject to the application but that storage is related to Manufacturing in the building that is subject to the application we thought you were going to not you were going to have all the manufacturing on on lot 65 and no more manufacturing related stuff on lot 68 so I guess I was trying to yeah some like different processes no I understand but I mean to do this right lot 65 should also be lot 68 should also be part of of the application why because they want quite frankly we we can't find any approval to do any manufacturing on lot 68 that they're doing now we're just jipping where FR about okay so and we were so our assumption was they were moving it yeah so we wouldn't have to deal with it so hold on one second Mr Kyle hopefully you have something so part of the rather extensive material that and and Tony ker had kind of put this all together when we started the initial application back in 2019 um there was some discussion of an application I know so I think see back in 2019 no this was back in like 1966 when we when we were first talking with Tony ker about this yeah back then they were going to include all three lot all three lots well that was when there was this no no I understand different application I understand this so our assumption was because you didn't have lot 68 in this application that all the manufacturing related stuff was going to go on to lot 65 and you were just going to lead you got a retail store which is permitted in the zone right and you could have storage related to the retail but you can't have storage related to the manufacturing unless you put that lot in the thing I I'm not trying to be a a pain in the neck which I know I am being for these people but I'm just trying to do this thing right all right but wait wait wait wait wait I was assuming that because of the situation on bur Road or place whatever it's called that they were still going to have the deliveries to the retail store yeah and then the manufacturing piece would then be that storage would be moved over to the if they want to do that that's fine because that is on 202 I right I understand that makes sense but we assumed that they had changed that because the application as filed only came in on lot 65 it didn't they didn't include lot 68 well and and my assumption was is my thought process is they were going to leave it like that because they didn't want to have to worry about because they have a bunch of variances here about the driveway not being wide enough and all that no and I thought that's because they don't want to make deliveries back there and they were going to have that connected driveway that was going to be that was a proposal in the begin right but correct everything you're saying is correct the only thing that's missing is when the application came in and didn't have that other stuff we there was no indication that they were going to keep the manufacturing storage in that front building I should I assume there was because of because of the the con the lack of uh driveway and all that I assumed that something was going to still happen there he said let me ask you this how do you get the stuff from lot 68 back to lot 65 anyway I took some empty curtains back to the back building I pulled out onto 202 I drove to milbrook Road I drove into that driveway I open the garage door put him in there drove out back to 202 down the road around the little Jug Handle so put it this way let's assume that the I assume it's a transient position let's assume the board grants the application as they filed it if someone comes in and says they don't have the right to have that manufacturing related storage on lot 68 they're going to have a problem if that lot is made part of the application and then you guys approve the trans yeah then it's then it's clean then it's clean CLE now that's up to you guys what you want to also one other thing I I'm frequent there and one of the charms is you Manufacturing in front of the clients so more the reason I I I every week yeah you got thing like you know you got a Dunkin Donuts you go in occasionally if you you're a you go in every week I do you have an appearance of a comp every week how do you stay so I think he's a cholic I think it's it's confirmed I want to take your blood pressure thank you have a nice evening well I go there once every blue moon very rarely no problem but I do find CH the Charming of you manufacturing you can say that yeah I do find the of you Manufacturing in front of the customer Charming you see you see the difference but I do go I understand I'm I'm glad you well at least you're were honest about it that's yeah see what happens when you grow a be they have to make decision how uh oh correct all right tell can we take a five minute resar someone's coming someone's coming down back in order so where do we stand Jim you w to come on up and ex yeah articulate what the what the game plan is here so based on the discussion that we just had um there's a desire to do exactly what we were just describing there will be materials for manufacturing on lot 65 stored at lot 68 we're going to amend the application we will include lot 68 in the application uh we do have a survey for that lot but there won't be any improvements on that lot but we'll include it we'll give the board the information yeah on the survey can you also show where delivery trucks are going to come in and also have some indication of how you're going to take the stored material from that lot and bring it back to the manufacturing facility we can do that so we'll have to Ren notice because we're going to now include a second lot in the application so we'll we'll file an amended application the plans as quickly as possible and then we'll see when we can come back and we'll Reen notice okay okay um real quick he's gonna add I I I understand that Jeff may have to do another report I I have a good idea especially because we need to pick up a couple of more board members to hear this to be fair to them so maybe this is like a a dry run and we don't make the board members read the transcript now we going through a dry run the presentation next time is going to be crisper I say to start from amend the application do the Notice start from scratch pretend that this never happened other than take good notes yep okay that's my suggestion okay and then all the reports will have to be redone correct new application okay yeah but you see what you hear what you saying they're going to be seeking some some waivers for completeness because they're not going to put in a site plan for lot 68 right they're going to put in a survey basically an as built plan but they're going to have to describe what they're going to do in a narrative that will come with the application we can do that and just and show on it how you're doing the the deliveries okay I think we can do that okay so only one so only one lot so only two lots instead of three is it two lots or three l there's a third lot well are you Crossing it no we're not we're not going to will not there will not be any between the Lots I Gotta See do me a favor do you have something that shows we have a we have a survey in the yeah take the survey out let's just look we got some time let's just this is a hearing right fully note is public hearing this is not a work session we're still in the hearing okay but we're going to explore other issues that could come up to try to know expose them see if you have any other thoughts can we take another [Music] recess all right so let me see if I understand after talking with Mr Kyle on the break this is my understanding of what's going to happen and I'm GNA ask you correct me if I'm wrong okay instead of amending the application they're not going to amend the application this application is going to stay submitted they're going to file a new application for lot 68 that new application is going to be hopefully for minor site plan approval not preliminary and final hopefully for minor they'll see if it qualifies and a D1 variance when that application is filed the board will schedule both applications to be heard on the same night and the first thing the board's going to do at my recommendation is consolidate both applications for one hearing they're going to have one plan the plan's going to have the stuff for lot 68 on it and the stuff for lot 65 on it each file will have that same plan the board reports one report for both for both applications one resolution for both applications that's the plan okay you agree yes and and they're going to there's going to be a narrative to explain the delivery situation when the tractor trailer comes to lot 68 some of the stuff goes into the basement in the building on lot 68 for retail sale well retail sale is permitted and accessory storage for retail sale is permitted some of the stuff goes to the manufacturing facility but some of the stuff also stays in the basement for eventual transfer to the manufacturing facility and that's what needs the D1 variance okay and then once that cons once the board consolidates the two applications and then deal you know addresses it and decides it hopefully they won't have any problems are we I have to ask I just have to ask going be a new notice no I have to ask okay just ask oh my God are we saying that they can no longer make the chocolate cover listen listen we're not saying anything the board doesn't tell them that the board's not the zoning officer okay I'm good don't even go there the board hears an application are we going to carry this no this I told you this is as if it never happened okay starting the hearing is going to start from scratch got to be clean we don't want board members having to listen to a transcript if you listen to a transcript of this it's it's going all over the place yeah no fa we're going to have a brand new start Consolidated application boom beautifully put in application okay no confusion but if you need a recording of what John clearly explained it will be posted okay because it was a lot so I think we can be okay for the 16th of January oh really you think that you can get yeah because it's really I mean it's a survey we're not there's no improvements proposed we just have to rework the plans to get both Lots on the same plan get the narrative together you got to show this delivery stuff with the tractor trailers we will no the only thing is do you guys want the 21 Day rule or do you want the 10 day Ru oh okay let's assume it's deemed complete assuming it's deemed complete well if it's not deemed complete when do you think you're going to get it the application and the plan submitted probably probably next week right you see any issue with that so next week tomorrow is the 6th which means the following Friday is the 13th I'm not submitting it on Friday the 13th we'll get it in by Thursday if they submitted it by the 12th what's 21 days before January 16 [Laughter] Christmas 26 well put it this way the applicant then you can't complain if the board says yes to this timing you can't complain if you don't get reports until literally you know the afternoon of January 16th understood um I would think with lot 68 not having any improvements proposed the report should be relatively clean well the the only question is going to be how you do tractor trailer they're going to M to make sure that you can prove that that's done safely so you might you don't want to have to bring a traffic engineer into this you might want to have the board you might want to have Jay Troutman review it for that okay well and and and what we have here is not changing no what this just report je this is this part is staying the same right so we have the report right I just got John Thomas's today so we have their report and like you said on phot 68 they're just doing the delivery it's right it's the storage and delivery but I assume you're going to want to review the delivery to see how it's yeah oh yeah absolutely I I just don't want to I've read this I know what this is oh yeah yeah yeah yeah okay correct so getting something on the last day this listen this is not changing right they're adding right lot 68 and the only question is what reviews are going to need to be done for 68 planning review is going to have to be done I think you should have Jay Troutman do an engineering review do we need any more do we need a traffic engineering review you You' probably just take a look at it and see I'd be surprised if and we're not going to need Landscaping yeah yeah won be I mean no offense why why are we pushing so so much for January we sawell February what do you have on in February on the six it's the Flemington family [Laughter] nothing staying away from that one you don't want to be you don't want to be the same night as that what's on the second meeting in February right now we have nothing nobody has confirmed okay why don't you take the second meeting in February okay in of a rush we're we're gonna get it submitted if that works out better because if the other application's going to take time then yeah the other one is that that's already on for the reor that's good then I don't have to have Beth cover the 16th of January because I want to be in California yeah okay oh okay well I was also just going to say the deliveries aren't going to be mying is deliveries aren't going to be any different than what they are now I understand but what we're saying is but technically technically right now the part of that delivery the reason they're coming in on tractor trailers is because they're bringing in enough stuff not only for the retail store but for also for manufacturing they're going to want their traffic engineer to look at that I don't think you want to be on on the reorg with the application that's on and you don't want to be on the first meeting in February unless you want you always have the risk if you know an application has obors like both of those very much if you have a choice of having your application in a room with a bunch of people yeah that's your choice that might instead of going to the movies come here you might you know you could pick up an objector just for the fun of it I've seen it happen yeah unlike like tonight when you got nobody so I'm thinking if you pick the the second meeting in February you count yeah we're not discounting you okay second meeting gonna shoot for second meeting in February so let's pencil it in but it's got to be again that's February 20th okay yeah pencil it in but it's got to uh check the time extension please yeah now and try to make need one it's January 31st okay so the second meeting in February so let's get March April let's a April 30th let's extend to April 30th and let's tentatively we're not continuing the application there's going to be there's going to be new notice on both of the applications because you're starting from scratch new notice on both of the applications and you're shooting for a hearing scheduled Consolidated hearing scheduled for February 20th so do we have consent to extend to April 30th Scott yes okay and you can send something in to the board secretary on that abely okay microphone yeah maybe you can is there a way to clean up some of the plan revision going feary we will do get a report back you know any revision comments on we'll do that but can I just clarify for myself so is it the 21 Day Rule 21 day rule applies we're going to try to get this thing as clean as possible okay so all plans and materials will be submitted no less than 21 days prior to the 28th of February right so by January 31 not a problem okay all right now you got other stuff that your office is going to be filing around January 31 all over the state 30th January 30th all be affordable housing oh yeah yeah just good do then sooner than later what I'm saying yeah I gota okay we good okay well nice to see you all again thank you for having us and uh we'll see you in a couple months okay we'll see you next year you me don't anybody start going to a slud shop every week that be pretty funny yeah we have a blood test at the door when you come in just long I don't smell it I'm okay all right so can we get a motion to adjourn second all in favor John before you go can I talk to you