e e e for for e for okay welcome to the Joint COA recal meeting um I think we'll Begin by taking roll call we'll start with the Council on Aging um uh Gan C here Karen fatino Karen sorry I couldn't get it off mute I'm here Marilyn here um Janowski yeah Joan K Coco yeah um and I just need someone to appoint me as motion to elevate Nancy to full member for purposes of this meeting second all in favor Jean yes Marilyn yes yes Karen Janowski yes um Joan coko yes and Karen fatino yes perfect okay I'll call recap to order and do the r call so we have Ron aini here we have Nora bucko here John Sasso president M doer here John Pon think my understanding will not be able to make the meeting Michael Colman okay and John O'Neal present so we have a quorum great so um I know that we have a few members of the public here and we're going to open up the first 15 minutes for public comment um and uh you can say your com no comment no okay um and you probably should make clear you don't mind that this is the time for public comment now right not not another time during the meeting right want to make comment now would be the time to do it thank you Mark and also note that we did receive I think everybody received the comments from uh the neighborhood of you know Oakland Road so we do have those and we have have read them sure um I don't see anyone on Zoom that's raising their hand to make a comment during public comment so okay so we're here tonight basically for um the recal members and the Council on Aging members to take look at the Consolidated site ranking uh worksheets and to have a discussion we are not voting tonight we are not making a decision we are not choosing one of the sites tonight this is simply a discussion of um what uh what we all uh chose for the rankings on the um worksheet here door so actually here it comes yeah can we share the that Jenna yes yes sit next to my okay and I asked um Mr Colman if he would uh review the worksheet and and give an explanation of what's in the worksheet and then we can go around and we can discuss um our interest that and I left all my notes at home but that's okay um so the I I have not any spent any time on the on this front page if you go to the next [Music] you said the summary scores were the organizations yellow is recal and green is Council on Aging and uh for the three sites going down I think if you click on this do you get them all on on a on a particular score there's a way to find out how everybody scored not sure which tals on I mean individually individually yeah I know that there there was there was I don't oh there were columns this thing starts I think at like column G or something so they must be hidden was my guess yeah but do it does doesn't really matter yeah we we don't it didn't it wasn't a lot of information as far as I was concerned um so the way this this parses out this is these are the U 12 criteria that we had listed and um Chris did you did people from the town fill this out as well did just him and I just you okay yeah where which groups are you in not in a group you're just in the all category no we weren't we yeah we're Town staff so we we're not included we just did it for fun thank you I don't know whether it would be any different that's idea and then the the final column um columns are in the um purple think uh is BHA and there were uh Joel and um forgot his name um Mason Mason thank you uh filled it out and then the so people know architural the architectural FR so so Michael real quick so um Jenner do you have the plus signs on top of the um things I do J so if you click above J the little plus sign and click that plus sign so that's where all the detail thank you the rows are hidden The Columns are hidden for each of the individual this is just a summary um sheet so if you click on the plus above each of them you'll get the individual um ratings for each for each person thank you thank you John there is a hand up um but I know that we're not taking any public comments at this time all right okay thank you so I you know I have not really studied this I think it you know it didn't really say anything to me we all do score differently um but when you do the um when you get the average scores I don't think it I don't think it changes at all and I didn't really see anything in here that one person was scoring somebody very high in U one location High versus another yes and there was an analysis done um on the third page and it gives you a description underneath the summary of scores and removing the best and worst scores that does get gets to that yes get and there's also um removing um particular category in the bottom of that sheet so if you for instance traffic conditions you can remove that category and see whether it makes any difference in the in the sco and as far as I could tell it didn't make any difference the scoring still came out all the same way and the final tab which is actually where I spent most my time um which lays out people's comments on the particular sites and what what they thought were was good and bad and um why essentially why they were scoring the subjective scores the way they the way they were and um and then at the bottom of that is a summary of concerns and this is just where you've you've highlighted um a particular criteria that's a problem for a particular site so for instance for here Oakland Road um we're all concerned about the abuts and for um wasen street parking program space um so on I found the comments to be interesting particular um Ju Just to ask a clarification so the number six for example or three that's the number of people above that highlighted one of those concerns right so it's it's not it's not a level of it's just the number of people in the comments above that that said this was a particular concern in the comments not even a level of concern just they identified a butter right that's all yeah that's yeah right exactly okay I just just wanted to be want to make sure I understood that yeah so I'm wondering if um that we should start with the back page and talk a bit about individual concerns that people have with each site because one of the things that theh plusa said was that we generally both COA and recal were very similar in the ratings you know minus a few points here or there um uh Simon's way tended to come out on on top then it was Oakland Road and then Pleasant Street Center so um perhaps what would be most beneficial rather than going through each one of the 12 points and say you know I scored a six and Maryland scored a four you know that we we just kind of go right to the um because those were were pretty uh the same across um both groups so just a quick comment so just as an FY to COA whether you saw our meeting two weeks ago I think it was we actually did exactly that we went through every criteria each person presented what their their numbers were um and there was some discussion but I think to your point um we all whether we picked a particular number or not the general the general gauge was was exactly aligned there were very few if any wide discrepancies in in the in the ranking from a points perspective anyhow um and I just quickly looking also at the COA stuff I would agree I don't see a whole lot of discrepancies either so I actually think it would be good to your point to move to that but I I I would like us all to just at least agree or disagree that that's the case I mean I certainly think that's the case but only question I have is uh I want to know if anybody's opinion or rating would have been affected by the comments that we've gotten from the abd's M Ro so that's yes I was hi neck and neck essentially between Simon Sway and Oakland and I used the extra 20 points to be arbitrary based on something that wasn't among the 12 which is sort of the community engagement location to push Oakland up over Simons although before I did that Simons was was ahead but even though I haven't had a chance to change in I need to change anywhere I would if I were doing it today I would I based on the abutters I would put Simons at the top instead of Oakland they were like two points apart me small difference but I was really compelled to change it once I heard theuts Ron R has a hand up yeah so I have to say I I did not know of all all the issues there we go thank you all the issues that were um that the residents around the um Oakland Road were experiencing and so those letters that they submitted and emails that I received were I would say it swayed my it swayed my um decision because I was originally you know I I thought Oakland Road was an interesting area first but so I would say yes it did no so um I think that one of the reasons why we set the criteria the way we did is so that we could look at the impacts of different things and not kind of have only one thing sway us in one direction or another I think every site that we're looking at or could look at has blemishes and warts and things like that using those criteria to help us guide in to to see what makes the most sense um I think we all did hear in our hearing um you know some push back on Oakland we're hearing some push back on assignment um haven't heard so much push back on on Pleasant Street so far but um I think that I use the scale that we were using to to kind of reflect that in terms of the point value and then also just in in the comments you know noting you know what what's going on what are we hearing so you know Oakland Road certainly you know has had a lot of development already um flips side is its location I think is a huge plus but other people don't agree with that I think Simon's one of the issues we'll have to deal with is that uh there'll be killum Construction in a similar time frame and that you know that that has some some issues associated with it I know when we we had a a quick discussion and Matt canel's Town manager was with us too and you know the town understands that they'll have to figure out how to mitigate whatever we do wherever we do it and once we pick the site they'll have to do a lot of planning and starting to think about that so I think if we're I think we need to understand that we're we're looking for the the best not the perfect and we'll figure out what the best is the remaining element that goes beyond this too is still the permanent building committee having some feedback so that's where we are actually John U I already had had ranked Simons first but it was relatively close from Oakland uh I would drank Oakland Road a little further down after you know the the input I already was concerned about you know traffic in in the trees you know those are the those are you know two big concerns I had about Oakland Road I think what would have changed to Marx's point is not the individual things so much as that subjective my subjective thing would have I would have given fewer points to Oakland Road uh because I'm also mindful that a town meeting when they talked about having an Early Education Center there even at that point that was 10 years ago or so people were saying you know geez we get everything up there at Oakland oldland Road and I remember at that point saying yeah that that makes sense if I if I had everything you know where I live I'd be kind of I'd be kind of concerned too and I think this was a good refresher for me to get the feedback from the people from over okay clarify so you in your subjective comments you did factor that in or you not did not I did not to the degree so I'm saying I would it would change my subjective points I would lower that for o yeah I was going to say something similar in the sense that the the criteria comments I think we're set up to Define some very specific things within the site um certainly impact on a Butters was one of those um so the feedback I'd like to think I'd try to address that within my rankings um I think I think all of us to some extent if you look at our comments did kind of talk to impacts but but I think it's really good that we've heard that additional feedback um as well um so I I would say it probably wouldn't have affected my you know numerical rankings so to speak um which and um didn't have Oakland coming out on top anyhow um but I I do think the um the additional um input uh will Sway and and view uh how we how we consider this moving forward and I think that's a reasonable thing I think we've kind of moved into a discussion of um the uh more subjective criteria and um um um let's let's uh is there can I just mention something about the abutters yeah um because it just seemed that with the Oakland Road um that there was a lot of uh voice about previous construction experience with the cell tower the water tower the drilling whatever it seemed like a lot of that um sort of s not sueded but biased almost their their hopes for for the new Senior Center being on Oakland Road that's what I felt I mean there are definitely issues with the abutters um and housing whatever but it just seemed that they had such a horrific experience with the previous construction um that there should be some sensitivity if this site was chosen that the communication or whatever those issues were be addressed so that they feel more comfortable with this yeah but in our regular meetings we would just talk so just talk I I so Mike so um know when I did my rankings I I did worry about the abutters and particularly um the probably the need to to do some uh certainly Drilling and probably blasting of that ledge to to build this and that there would be an impact during the construction phase particularly to the ABS I thought that the of the three sites the biggest impact to a butter is was probably really a Pleasant Street because you'd end up with a big building right on top of other buildings right and it highly congested already and all that's and in fact one of the things I thought about Pleasant Street in the trees and other things is that once you build a building that we're talking about that that would be a very nice site it would probably have the most trees on it um if you if the town were to develop this site for whatever purposes it might have I mean it's considered early childhood stuff I don't know what other things might the town might consider but there's lots of ways that that piece of land could get developed that would be a lot harsher for the other Butters than a senior center except for the construction phase that the construction phase is is sort of what I worry about the the traffic concerns I think of the three sites averil street is to me is the most problematic Street um in town I ride a bicycle and I will not ride on Hail Street in that in that zone up farther up north you can but um it's so traffic-wise that's really there's a lot of a lot of traffic on Oakland Road except for a couple hours a day has hardly any traffic on it at all and I walk around up there too so that I'm not so I just you know I'm trying to think about a Butters in in a thoughtful way of what is it that um long term they're going to have to deal with there and so I did consider it and and I did have concerns about it but I wouldn't necessarily take it off the list because of and Pleasant Street the the streets are so narrow you can't have a lot of traffic there um I was leaning toward Pleasant Street for I think it's very Central my concern was when I saw the design wise part of it I think if it was more historically designed and no offense that we had to have a parking garage I believe that the building itself is it was designed to on a smaller scale maybe if we didn't need a parking garage uh and consider what cities do with their senior center they don't have parking garages uh if it was Pleasant Street definitely to keep the historical side and cultural side of the building to accommodate what the seniors need I definitely do not feel Oakland Road is the site for me my personal thoughts I think with the grading of the land the ledge Etc and taking down trees that bothers me again if maybe the town uh we would cons consider all Sites even though it's on havil street and I think further away than I would like to see a senior center for the residents to transport themselves to I think Simon's way right now is the best in my thought Oakland Road I I just feel that is a piece of land should that schools need a larger site for building purposes that should be maintained uh for school building uh I would like to see perhaps where the town I'm hearing a lot of concerns by residents for the tax increases so is there any way whatever site we go for or decide upon can something be on a gradual level in other words a structure designed yes we're putting a senior center in first and then add on to it to other offices or a community center that is my concern but right now I feel if we cannot design something for Pleasant Street and a historical manner to give the seniors the facility they need I assign Ro anybody else well I have to agree with what Mark says None of these are perfect it really is what is best and taking into consideration I mean I attended the abuts meeting last week too and that really had an impact on me I mean I didn't fill out I didn't rank this I honestly didn't believe my my opinion would differentiate from any what they conclusion was and and I see it wouldn't but the um the parking issue the abutters concerns as well as the cost I was very surprised to see how high the cost and how commensurate it was across all three locations I'm very concerned about that to and to see the concern of cost wasn't such a big concern at any of these and yet it really is what I think the community is Con concerned about is the cost and the tax implications so um those um it's a real challenge in terms of what's because I I hoped for Pleasant Street too that you know does it need that big garage does can we do some some some a little bit of expansion here and there but real reality wise long term that's not really going to make a difference we need something more long term and something that's Visionary and so I think it's what is and recognize none of these are perfect and they all have real big challenges too they really do it's not easy it's not an easy decision wisdom of Solomon here I actually did not feel like this section and [Music] um and everyone's comments if I did I would just mimic everyone's comments in this room because um you know none of the sites are perfect the sites have some very definite cons um and um you know the ab buts Roa Butters immediately recognized that they were not to be happy with it I don't think the Pleasant Street Center of Butters have quite woken up to that fact um but when they do I think we're going to hear from them too and I I'm with Jean in that Simon's way is seems so far out of town but for some people it's the center of town there's a lot of residents over there there's a lot of um houses over there so for some people that's going to be an easier Place get to um someone else had an interesting idea that you know perhaps we could set up some kind of almost like transportation services so that if someone um was lived in town and usually walked but I think at one of the meetings we saw that they um most people drove to the center and didn't walk to the center but um I think that there are ways that we can figure out how to get those people that don't have transportation to a place like Simon's Road I do have to say though I I wish Simons um Oakland Road was better situated because I like the idea of the senior Center and amongst the schools and the Li and the whole Birch Meadow the walking paths you know people could go down and watch a baseball game you know I I like the fact that it's very social um I I just wish it the site was a little bit easier to build on than it probably is going to be so kind of my two cents would you have something else John uh I just wanted to you know bring us back a little bit to some of the history because I know we've talked a lot about information tonight that just want to remind us so obviously recal um in our first uh rendition of recal did the survey we went out to all the centers we um kind of put together our our recommendations for how to put this together and I just want to remind us of a few things because I think someone mentioned about the well you know maybe maybe some of these centers don't have parking or they don't have enough size I mean one of the things that we heard I think pretty loud and clear from every Center we went to was gez we wish we had more space and boy did we wish we made some more parking um and and I I mean that I think those I there were other things obviously but those I think were two that we heard very consistently and it's certainly one of the reasons why I I feel the the Pleasant Street site and the proposal there is a really tough site to swallow because I think as as Karen just said you know we're we're not going to be happy with it if we do um go in there and try to do something and then you know five years from now say wow this is this isn't the working out the way we wanted to um we did also talk about Transportation that's been one of our more recent things and I think we made the the comment that you know we're not we we can't just look at this as building a new center for whatever it might be we have to look at the other aspects of it which include Transportation which includes the operational aspect of it um so there's a whole bunch of other things that that we have to look at um so one of the things I just again I'll just want to try to get all this out because I I think we do need to make maybe set some some priorities and whatever recommendation ultimately comes forward we we should talk about what are those priorities and I I I do think the size of the building and the and adequate parking are two important priorities regardless of what site per se um I think those are things that we want to make sure um to address the programmatic needs of of the things that are supposed to go on there whether they're senior only or Community Center related um and then uh again those other aspects we've been talking about in terms of transportation and parking need to be incorporated into that um so I mean I really do think that's something that that we have to look at uh because you mentioned I think you know how do you phase some things well there may be aspects of this things that you can phase but one thing that you can't necessarily phase at least easily is you know an original building footprint size per se you know you know maybe okay maybe you can do an add-on gym or something like that later but but you know once you set it up it's really tough to say okay well now I'm going to add a little more Wing here and how much more is that going to be so I I I I would be I would hate to want to go down that path and generate a whole another activity and construction project on that piece that way but but maybe people can think different well I why I say that is because in the town of reading we do not have that much open land if another building site is going to be needed so that's why I'm thinking if we determine a particular site keeps in mind that we not the town is growing can we add on to that in addition to what we're putting in yeah I mean I think to to that point though there's also there is also the financial implication of it yeah I mean what can we afford what do we want to put in there and how much do space do we want to have um and again I'll go back to the original survey that we did um with regards to what people think now again it was done in a vacuum in the sense of just on that particular topic you know what are people willing to pay extra in their taxes so that's we have that piece we have that data point um and so we have to consider that and I am hoping that the community comes together and talks about priorities overall and figure out where we want to spend our money because this is certainly a big impact on that and I think there are some things within the recommendations that we make about what things we would say let's let's peel them away um because either they're not a high priority or you know there are things we can potentially do later or you know whatever the case may be and that should also serve as good input to figure out okay how we want we we think this is an important priority we want to make sure the community thinks it's an important priority but even with that how much are people going to be willing to spend given all the other issues that are going to be coming up to the community over the next year or two years or whatever it may be so um the uh only other comment I wanted to make in um so we've gotten a lot of input over the last couple weeks and months or so on this project um we are still at least waiting for one at least one more piece of critical input and that's input from the building committee um and do we have an update on on that at this point um I can share that I think we probably to talk kind of more broadly about all the schedule in pieces but I guess before you close Okay um one of the things that I heard loud and clear I think if we go back to our surveys is that those centers that did not have a gym when asked what's missing what do you wish you could have done what would you do differently if you had a second chance they all said we'd have a gym those that we went to that had gyms are full the gym is in use by day with all sorts of activities so I I think I I hear you in terms of what are what are the key pieces I think that from from my perspective to really attract the age 60 plus Community completely the gym is actually a pretty important part of that and it played out pretty strongly in the places that we we talked to so I I you know I I appreciate the discussion of you know what are the the wants versus needs or needs versus wants and things like that I'm not ready to dismiss the gym as a as a want I'm not suggesting we dismiss anything at this point I'm just saying terms of approach we need we need to look at you know okay now I'll give you the update ahead so um one of the things that would be a next step for this project once the select board approves a site is to form a permanent building committee and we have models for that that's how we do all projects over1 and a half million dollar and obviously the school is is exactly that right now in terms of what's going on and that would be a committee that is the existing permanent building committee and then usually there'd be one or two sponsors and I say one or two because it's literally one or two sponsors from the the the parts of the town that are that are kind of driving it Forward um on the select board agenda going forward is a placeholder for U forming a building committee for this project what we had talked about at even the last several meetings has been that we would love to get input from the permanent building committee before we would close on a site and see what's going on so the information on uh the three locations um had previously been shared I think John CP may have shared it with who was a member of the permanent building committee he was involved with us in the selection of the Architecture Firm um so there were some updates that were made I've been in touch with Pat Tomkins the chair I've sent him all the information that we have so the the three locations that we're looking at some of the drawings all the drawings that came through from BH plusa I've now shared with him this input from from what we've talked about and so the next step for them is to discuss it a bit their next meeting I believe is May 14th I think 13th or 14 13th or 14th 13th I thought that's what I read uh 13th to 14th I could I could be wrong so um and and the intent certainly would be to have that on the agenda exactly what would be on the agenda is is still kind of TVD the question is what can they talk talk about before what can they look sorry they can't talk about anything what can they look at beforehand to be able to talk about it so um it may be that they in one meeting they're able to accomplish that and give us some input it may be that it takes a second meeting as well um which would push us out toward you know a June date because our next meeting I think be to be June um so that's you know we're just starting to have some discussions um I don't know what's possible yet the nominal schedule we had talked about was to be to the select board on May 21st with a recommendation from recal and there's on the um future agenda that's of the select board that's still there at the moment and I think we need to learn more about is that a realistic date or not and if it is great we got to get ready for that if it's not then we should look bit further out see what what's going to happen so that that's kind of really the update on that um at one point did you want me to talk kind of even longer yeah so hypothetically the the next big decision is for a recommendation to come on site nely from recal to the select board and I think we're all in agreement that the council's a big part of what's going on with that the select board then would need to agree uh on either the recommendation or ask questions or or send us back we'll see where it is but assuming that at some point they agree with that conclusion that would allow us to go forward forward into more of the schematic design phase we already have contracted with BH plusa to do that that was another activity that was already thought through and paid for with arpa funds so that would all move forward those schematic designs would then allow us to get much more detail on the site that we have selected we'd be talking about more about the building itself if there are options that will come forward whether it's stages or whatever we want to talk about and then once they they kind of bring that back then the community needs to digest then it needs to get to town meeting and T town meeting would need to approve a project of that size and magnitude and then it would then go to the voters to do the same to approve that that project where it is so from a timing point of view I think is it two to three months in that design in that schematic design phase is that what I'm remembering I think that's right so from from go it's it's at least two months approximately um and then I think we want some time to work with the community to share it to get more input feedback discussions see you know there maybe modifications that come from that um and then it would be to get it to town meeting and get town meeting the information they need to make a decision hopefully a favorable decision and then AR with that to the voters so does that mean if you you know if we're in kind of June July you know August maybe there's stuff that is available to start looking at August maybe September um sharing that with the community having a lot of input sessions Taking It Forward may or may not be doable for November town meeting starting to sound a little tight um and then you know armed with that the I guess the good news is if you have to do a special town meeting it's not a very high cost um you know it's a lot you know better than having to do an extra election but you know let's see what happens with that so that could put a decision into town meeting maybe very late in the year plus or minus and then I think he needs 64 days or something months 63 days yeah yeah between a town meeting and and it has to be a certain number of days after town meeting actually for a couple of reasons and then 63 days from there so that would probably be you know the person change of time thank you a quick question is there you mentioned about informing the residents in town Etc is there any way months ago I believe at the senior center uh it was given a presentation of the town's budget what we're not going to be paying for I think in 20125 I think that needs to be stressed again to the residents in town that were not taking on something additional to what we already have big time so so thanks for for bringing that up so I can talk a little bit about it and talk about a step that is going to be taking place for the public also so the um the Woodin school the high school and the library are all going to be those were debt exclusions and two of them end in the end of June of this year and the third one I believe ends in June of next year um the town accountant estimated I believe the impact of that is 37 thank you $377 reduction in in tax coming off which is marvelous this is what they need to be yes absolutely and also the fact that we are handling and do handle almost always multiple projects at the same time it's not one then there's a gap you can we're always handling multiple things there are always multiple needs that we have that said we need to be very careful with how how the dollars are spent but the notion that 377 is coming off is great in the face of looking at some new project so to that end one of the things that we usually do for town for before town meeting is the finance committee meets in What's called the financial Forum it's actually the finance committee school committee the select board um and various other boards can attend and it's a public meeting it's open to everybody and ofttimes that's to figure out what the budget for the year is going to be that's the usual reason we do that but now it seems that because we have all these things potentially on the table it would be a great time right after town meeting to have this meeting and get everybody talking about here are the projects here's what they look like there are not definitive costs on anything yet in a sense the center we have some numbers that's great the school project isn't quite there yet they're getting toward it but they're not there yet so we're starting to have some numbers to work with but not kind of this is exactly what it is but order of magnitude we can probably figure it out the reason why it's a lot harder for the schools is a substantial portion of that hopefully will be reimbursed by the state and obviously the more the better so they need to work that through and and work with the state they in fact I believe are going to have a preliminary presentation on May 20th so I mentioned May 21st select board meeting May 20th I know that that taken place so that Financial forum is a chance for the community to start digesting numbers to think about it to understand exactly that hey 377 is coming off and here potentially are things that could be going on that you'll be you'll be asked to vote on and the goal from that also is to get the information out to everybody let people ask questions make sure people understand what you're getting and and and how that might work thank you and and that we're you're kind of looking at the end of May to so the the the chairs of the uh of the boards are talking already so I know that the chair of the finance committee chair the select board uh Town manager are already having discussions about when to do that but yeah the date that was floated I think was me good [Music] good because of some of the comments from Oakland Road I just wanted to tell people a little bit about what already had been done people were saying you know did you look at any other places you know downtown is a great location and everything two RP would done and it's town uh the first one it to all all the bu open it up to all the businesses to see if there's any interest in you know either PCH you know selling or long-term leases only one responded that was Walgreens so there was a lengthy exploration of that possibility at the end it couldn't couldn't work out the town and the you know the owner couldn't reach an agreement for a number of diff different reasons second RFP though once again when went out and in between times the then Town manager Fidel met with a number of the businesses and I I know people have talked about the athletic of the twin flows because I specifically had talked to him about that because I said that's a great location you know and you already have a size of the building that might actually you know work and right the owners absolutely didn't want to have anything to to do with selling selling that or at least ing it he had some long-term plans of his own which we we'll see if they overc come the fruition but anyway so that was that so that left us with the only possible options were the things that the town controlled uh so that part of the history another thing I want to mention is that the Pleasant Street Center one advantage of not going besides all the other reasons there are many reasons not why the Pleasant stre Center wouldn't work as a long-term solution is that that you would have another town-owned property would be left also if pleasantry were the center you have to find an alternative site for the multi- years that a new center would be built so there's you wouldn't have the disruption and you would have an asset the town could that could generate some income either rental income or or sale rental might make more sense F town as far as you know long term so that you know comes into the and then there's a personal thing of mine as far as the intergenerational side of it and that was one of the things recal was supposed to weigh in on is that to me and I work you know in Asia for for many years uh we're an age denial Society nobody's old I had people in their 80s talked about those older people you know so it's not them and so so when you have a place that's a senior center that that's the only people that go or that's primarily the use and the identity that's why it's called the Pleasant Street Center and many other senior centers throughout the state have changed the name taken the word seniors out of it but anyway if it's a center where you go when you're in your 40s where you're 50s based on they have some you know activities that are attractive to you that you want to participate you don't even give it a thought when you hit six or 70 do same kind of thing there are there things you know that you would be interested in doing and it's a place that you're can have a mixture of Ages there you know sounds like pickle ball to me there is that pickle ball is an example in ex you know it's an attractive activity generational intergenerational and I think that's that's a that's a plus in a lot of ways so any comments from the town side of the table I think you all are doing a great job all the comments are relevant and think you're all on a good track in my opinion any thoughts I tend to agree um I age with what Mark said earlier and someone else had said like we're not going to get a perfect site we're going to I think we're going to get a good site there's always the pros and cons but so just like jimy said you know I want to make sure thank you to everyone I mean this is I know I appreciate it the people who attend the Pleasant Center now appreciate it I think everyone's doing a good job like Jen just said so um hard job but I think good things are coming um I I know I look forward to it but thank you and see one of the things that's always in the back of my head is what's going to pass the first time and so I really think that that takes Community involvement hearing uh you know it's what's going to pass the first time I think cost is going to be a big factor I don't have any answers but that's always one of the concerns that I think about and so we want to be um receptive to what the community is saying too while Al I mean we've got the um the open house on Saturday for people to come and see what what the current uh conditions are because I think that that's really important when I talk with people in the community they're like well what's wrong with there then people need to see it they need to see the value and if you don't see the value then you will not vote for this at all I agree with you Karen there are a lot of people in town that don't even know we have a center number one uh but I do think by informing residents this is why we need a senior center and I agree with John as far as the young in the let's say the elderly are together that enlivens community so I think going forward we need to be informational to people that are out there yeah I think once some decisions are made about the site and then as we start talking about the schematics um there's going to be um a need for outreach and information out to the Community about um what the options are and why and we just listed like 10 good reasons we think they're 10 good reasons so um um that's that's going to be uh really important as we move forward because we want it to pass on the first time we want it to pass and um and I know that the uh um this has been going by many different names active Living Center um 60 plus 60 plus but um you know I I think that if if everyone can understand the importance of this for all age groups um hopefully we're going to be successful and I think we will marn the board the work the board of Health's been doing really dovetails with all of this they are trying to put together they've actually Drafting and is it next week we have the soon there's a meeting that's yeah I think they're actually going to be presenting to the select board too their findings but before that I thought there was another I don't they're close to their final and in their research both through relatively small survey study they did also the more expansive research there's nothing terribly unique about reading and how aging affects people and what people need to have healthy aging they found a very strong message at all ages for more social interaction and for settings that would Foster it and what we're doing is perfect in my opinion um but I don't know that there's much communication going on there's still this kind of mindset of Board of Health is sort of under 60 and Elder service is kind of over 60 and they've expressed a desire to try to meld those anything we can do to help with the integration of those two efforts I think it help everyone in the community um I just want to add I also want to say thank you to um folks in the community who over the past more than two weeks have the butters who have been you know calling or emailing you know and and you know voicing you know their thoughts and it's a very it's very that's very valuable um and I want to say thank you to them for you know for being part of this and communicating with us you know and having you know having good communication with everyone is so important um so I do want to say thank you for that um to to all the abutters and folks of the community outside of the committees here and and the town employees here you know you know it's great to have the community as much of the community as part of this as possible so I want to thank thank those folks for stepping up and communicating with us and sharing their thoughts so thank you and great point about the Board of Health and I think we're working on that we're working currently it's nothing set in stone but we are trying to work on doing a shared nurse position um to collaborate more and get that nurse to be um involved in all areas all ages and so that's that's a great Point hopefully you'll be seeing something within the next couple months that shows that collaboration that would be nice yeah and again emphasize the sort of bifurcation has been mentioned as something that we need to make it a melding and not a separating it's a goal already so anything we can do to say what can we tell you about the senior center and this is what the community center or whatever we're going to call it um I think we'll find there's a broader audience because they've actually got a plan to release a document that will that they're currently pulling people's input on what could we've seen the issues what could we do to help and sort of my take them where we are now with that process they're coming up with a um can't think of Chip is the AC acronym Community Health Improvement plan it's like a town plan only it's focused on the health stuff but we fit right in there actually do so and then the um Dei assessment also is has a lot of similar information and there's a lot of talks with PA and in the community um um forums that we've had about creating more accessible buildings and um making spaces more inclusive for all ages so a lot of different boards and committees are working towards the same goal so I I think that's a really great point that you're bringing up so I yeah I just want to get back to Karen makes makes an excellent point which is how do we make sure we can get this across the finish line and I we've heard this in a couple meeting and I just thought it would be worth bringing it back up is that so recal had a charter um to really focus on the center for active living and and we've had a very specific set of things that we had to accomplish and our Focus has been on presenting the information and educating the community along with COA on the needs and and making sure we had that clear um but we haven't been and our survey by the way was focused on that initially as well uh what we haven't been focused on which I'm going to throw selwood under the bus for a minute um um is the consolidation and organization and and matching of all of the different projects and we heard that I think a couple times during the process and and I can't bit because select word did did actually recognize hey this is an important process we want to have a specific committee that's focused solely on this and and I've had a couple conversations of hey you guys pointed us you agreed this was a priority so I I think we we do have the support of the community from that standpoint but we do need to continue to communicate um but I think to to really get to Karen's point we have to show the community that we have a plan that this is actually part of the overall perspective how the community is going to move forward in all these different areas not just for the needs and the services but also the finances um and and if we can't do that then it doesn't matter what we come up with so I do think there's a and and maybe some of that is out of our control but but certainly I think we have to that's why I talked about you know what is it that we need to do uh what sort of things can we put together and present so that there are options and there are levers that can be pulled um to help get all of this across the Finish Line because there are competing priorities in the community right now and you I Mark said this a long time ago and I agree with him it isn't one or the other it's both I mean you know we have to figure out how to you know walk and CH on at the same time on these things and and there's a lot of that that's a big impact for a lot of people so so I don't know how we're going to I don't have the answer by the way but I know that's really what we have to have we need to the community as a whole has to have that answer or it doesn't matter what we put forward we you know people are going to say well you don't you don't have a plan you know you yeah I vote for this I don't know what the next thing's going to be we need to be able to communicate that to them tell them from a community standpoint and again this is maybe beyond what recal and this particular group is focused on today but we have to kind of keep that in the back of our mind and so to provide our recommendation to the select board with the information that we have we got to give them enough information uh so that this process can continue and we can have those answers for the community and I think that's and right that's where we kind of are today and and where we need to get to is that we have to be able to get a a solid recommendation with those sorts of pieces of information and we know that more detail is going to be done in the feasibility stage and that'll obviously add some more to it but to get our work completed we at least have to get there and then I don't think anybody around table is going to stop advocating for this project at that point um and certainly COA will continue on their path for communication but um you know educating the community will be is just a constant thing on on any topic for that matter I would like to see improved communic some formalized channels of communication with the school uh you know we hear about killum and I have to remember when I saw one presentation by the school oh more than a year ago they talking about the things that are coming off the tax roll and Shez so they were all that's going to go towards you know offsetting the killum as opposed to what you're saying yeah I totally agree it's have to look at a commun it's a community thing and and I don't think if you talk to people on the I mean I've talked to people on the kilum group and they don't they see it the same way we we you know now that happens to be one of the largest impacts so by all means it's it's the one that people are focused on but there are a lot of other pieces that are going on which is to Mark's Point why it's important the community come together and have those conversations I I think that what Mark spoke to earlier of the uh fincom and the select board and the school board and the um uh you know who whatever whatever there's a community preservation act that people are talking about so all those voices need to come together and just like us we have to pick a site and we have to recommend a and I should say not pick we have to recommend a site and we have to recommend um like an interior layout of the uh of the building but um I'm hoping that what comes out of this meeting of all these interests the school and the select board and fincom is almost a onepage fact sheet it could be double-sided and it's it's got to say very clearly here's where we are here's what we have and this is where we think we should go and it needs to be very clear in English um you know not the big town meeting warrant book and which is very um complicated um and and I I I think I think that we're hopefully on that path to get that onepage backtack back sheet that brings this all together I don't know I might by I might be naive but um you know to what you're speaking to John and and Mark what you spoke to earlier the other option could be is have an open Panel have a panel discussion Q q&as invite the town to a high school as you would a town meeting have the residents come in and do a panel we're here to answer your questions and we're giving you information and I think that's something that should probably be sooner than later well so I think we're doing that and we'll definitely do that I think we need a little bit more stuff to chub on I with to be able to understand it fully but yeah I mean all these meetings are are open the Outreach is happening um we need to continue to do that and I think to ny's point you know I don't know if it may take till sometime in the summer late summer to have that one pager truthfully but we can be talking a little bit more about it certainly answering question questions as they come in I think one of the things that we have to be get in front of is to be sharing what we do know sharing that's what does exist we know that there is a severe need for a a new center for age 60 plus as we know there's a need for kilum to change pretty dramatically also so those are are kind of the facts that are out there but it needs to be spread there are plenty of people who don't know that the biggest problem is going to be getting people um to come to a panel discussion to to look at something online I mean we had an open house at the center uh couple of Wednesdays ago what do we have six seven people show up we 10 10 oh I'm sorry double what you said we had food for about 80 wow and we enjoyed it so but but to me that's you know one of the bigger problems trying to figure out how to get people to to show up for these things to to take the interest to learn about what what we've got to tell them I didn't know there was food and there's food Saturday Saturday yeah but there were I think there were weren't there 80 reps I know 50 meeting on Saturday house an open house on Saturday from 9 to 11 there is food and and coffee and so we suggest that you go to the mission of Deeds yard sale that they're also having on Saturday walk up the street to the Pleasant Street Center get a cup of coffee then do some shopping in town and call it a Wells spent Saturday so I think it would be a good idea we did the video well we didn't a lot of people like J did a l lot of work on the video but the video was done and we had the open house and everybody spiffies up the place so it doesn't really look so bad go say this isn't really when you see it with all the staff in there and all the programs in the chair you to go get the second room upstairs Al until until until you have to ask where the bathroom is which is on the second floor right or the basement although I do have to say basement even though we had 10 people there um at the last open house though there was a lot of good conversations among the the 10 folks that came I know I chatted with numerous folks for quite a long time and I I noticed a lot of the other COA members were having really good conversations um and I think those conversations were important um and they got a lot of good feedback and they asked a lot of good questions so it was still even though we don't know what the numbers are a lot of good conversations a lot of good feedback and it was very valuable and one of the things that we're proposing for Saturday is to have handouts of the importance for a facility for the seniors our 60 plus Community how they benefit by it uh what their contacts are in case of Health needs Etc so hopefully we'll get more than 10 can I encourage a QR code too so for people who don't like paper they can just younger people might prefer don't know if we can do maybe a next one in May I don't know can do it yeah NY can do that can do it and I asked that we're getting closer I know um what so I want to make sure we have good next steps to find in terms of um where we're heading um what what additional pieces of information I mean I'm I'm my sense again is that the information that we've collected the feedback we've gotten um has given us all a pretty good sense of where things stand today um we do to Mark and everybody else's points we we do have to make a recommendation whether it's May early miday early late May early June we we we need to to fulfill that responsibility and and so I know I know Reco will continue to kind of push to do that but I'm just I just want to make sure I know what other tangible steps that we need to take at this point um so we can plan out the next the next couple weeks to support that John if you have a yeah I've been you know thinking about that once I heard about the timeline of the permanent building committee we had recal had scheduled the may8 meeting which doesn't seem like there's a reason for for that at this Point uh not knowing what the Perman ability committee I mean I'm not sure John I I would rather just set a meeting and yeah I mean I I actually think well my view the committee can comment I think it's still worth having a discussion and I think it would be good to actually start my vision when we make a presentation to the select board I I think we need to lay out some of this and you know these this is this site here are the pros and cons this is this site these so I think we still need to do that okay even without necessarily saying okay today we know exactly what our recommendation is I think we have I we have to lay that out because we we're all we've been very involved in this stayed in day out but we got we got other folks on the select board okay maybe some of them have attended some of them listened in but we need to be able to present that good picture to them so I think we still should do that John um even as a first step after May yeah I think yeah no I think we can I definitely think we have plenty of plenty of information to use and pull together I think the tough part is going to be what do we say what what don't we include so and then maybe some of that might be colored by the ultimate recommendation we make but I do think we have to provide a good picture of of all of the sites to them so that they can see that that's just my perspective and I think I I agree and I think you know kind of what we did how why and where we are I think is part of the expectation and regardless of you know I think we have a leaning at the moment we'll see what the PBC has to say if they're in support or they have some other concerns that we need to factor in but we know what we're trying to do and why we need to put that together really concisely so the board can feel comfortable that you know hey they did what they were supposed to this is recal and the COA have come together on what we're talking about here there's there's agreement on how we want to approach this for the site at this point because this is the site selection that we're working right um and that we are ready to take it to the next step which is get the board answer their questions get their approval uh get BH plusa working on the schematic designs so that it can get to the next step and those next activities that that's the kind of the next hurdle that we need to get to and then we know something of the timeline after that in terms of getting designs let's get ourselves set with the strongest presentation we can I think as a board member individually what what would I like to see I'd love to see that these folks did what we asked right in terms of their Charter they've come forward looked at the sites that were available that made the most sense assessed them had a bunch of meetings talked to people have come forward with a recommendation these are the reasons why appreciating pros and cons and on balance this is the right place to go what are the questions do you have and we can do all all accept the the last slide in Advance kind of most of it so so I do think we should still plan on the ma the May meeting and and and start that and it's GNA take I mean that's not gonna happen instantly either so it's G to take some time to pull that together do we already have a a Ru select uh um for that NOP no room booked yet okay but typically Wednesday um conservations in this room and typically we that one okay so that should be okay I won't be there fortunately can't be there it's my final wedding meeting that's the reason but I'm sure will be able to stand in for me I any any other comments I I think this has been an excellent discussion tonight we have um kind of gone from you know the worksheet we've we've discovered that there's a Common Thread that runs pretty much through COA and recal um there's a timeline you know out there and plan to move forward with a presentation to the select board so I think it looks pretty good okay one more thing so oh and uh the financial form final form the other thing I was going to suggest also is that in John pointed this out the different pieces um so this the Simons by exploratory committee there is what we're working on there is the kilum school building committee all these pieces as we are thinking about getting Clos to a site and numbers um we all need to talk and it shouldn't just be that Suddenly at one presentation oh know what happens we need to get that that flow uh even more and I know Simon way I think is coming right around that same date of May yeah 21st yeah I'm not sure what the date is but yeah see the 7th to the 21st I think it's the 21st perhaps but any we need to be talking about how all these pieces tie together we to some extent haven't been able to but as we're getting closer now we can and have to so it's a good thing to do and I've been in touch with um and and happy to refer to you but I've been in touch School building committee a little bit just in terms of how do we start thinking about these things and they by the way I think that LE one member is very much in favor of getting that Financial form going ASAP getting the information out starting the discuss not starting But continuing the discussions and going because two critical needs we need to work on them both we need to get them done so you need the facts on paper so that people can see them and we don't see different facts on different sites on Facebook book or in the news or whatever but we have a fact sheet that we're going to work from that has numbers that have validity behind them so I think that's good move to a j second um all on favor I think we're going to have to hybrid I don't know yeah okay Ken and Joan are still there right y it Isen okay why don't want me to do it you do I'll do it for rec yeah oh all right so I'll just do quick roll call because all seven members are here ri yes uh oh joh passons yes okay M dark yes Michael Colman noro John Sasso and John O'Neal so uh pralus a till May 8 so I'm gonna take a roll call kared patino yes and um Joan Poco she left okay Marilyn yes Aon Janowski yes and Jean C yes NY ziml yes and um John Parson I don't know Kenny double vote well there two different meetings yeah yes I'm always willing to vote for a Jour I do it three times thank you everyone you'd have to join another committee do that e