##VIDEO ID:JieD2fRx1sE## e e we got 7 o'clock so to get started it's going to start with case number 2412 23 E in Street um the zoning board appeals will hold a public he in the select board meetings room at Town Hall 16 L Street ready Massachusetts on Wednesday September 4th 2024 at 7 p.m. application of P of Construction LLC on behalf of the homeowner St to master Law chapter 48 section 9 your special permit on the reading zoning bylaw section 4.5 5.3.2 and 4.5.7 as may be determined by the zoning board construct a new story Edition with stre balling compromising 684 s f feet on the property located at 23 Eaten street map 22 lot 121 ining Massachusetts M's an objection I SP with the reading of the butters list except to say that the butters were notified as were the following select board town clerk Police Department fire department building department Conservation Commission Health Department Assessor's Office enging Division cpdc the members and Associate members of the board of appeals as well as planning boards of Wayfield lynfield North riding Stam wuber and Willington uh so testimony given before this board is stick count oath so if you think you may want to speak please stand and raise your right hand so anyone from this um who's presiding or yeah sure maybe shall I start just can we do the O first so you stand up and anyone anyone else who thinks they might talk um right yeah I swear to the testimony given by me before this board will be the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth the response just I do yes I do all right great yes just want to give us a quick overview application that' be great sure yes thank you and good evening thanks everyone for for being here could you come up to the podium please sure maybe I'll just say maybe I'll just say one or two words um my name is Elizabeth kif and I live at 23 Eden Street the the property that we're here to discuss um this is my husband Andrew here and my mother Kathy we just want to say thank you for reviewing the plans and for conducting this meeting um we are 18-year residents of reading always at 23 eating street we have a lovely neighborhood we're very happy there we have very kind and supportive neighbors as well and so when it came time to think about adding some accessory space we knew we wanted to do it on eaten Street and so that is what we're asking to do as you know from the plans add an accessory space I want to introduce my mother Kathy who would be living in that accessory space next to us um we're very happy to have her join this community as she is happy to join and also just to be near each other and support one another um so again thank you very much for the opportunity I know you have from all the preparations I know you have the necessary information in front of you um any questions Etc I'd like to introduce we also have Paul Catalano here Karen he is the the general contractor for the program and he'll be very happy to um field any questions along the way and so with that let me just again say thank you and and Les let you know that we're here for any questions thanks thank you does anyone on the board have any questions or comments about sor yeah it's U basically the special permit is for for the accessory apartment really is it the addition is by by right okay so and uh I went through the criteria of under paragraph 5.4.7 point3 of the bylaws which basically defines the requirements for an accessory apartment and I think uh I didn't find anything that didn't meet the requirements so I really don't have any problem here great agreed okay no anyone else all right I don't have anything else um sounds good uh yes so guess I'll open up the public comment is there anyone here who wants to talk about it um I actually just came on their neighbor I live at 17 Eaton Street and I'm just here in support of it as well and the right next door them thank you okay great um so we also got a letter of support from um your neighbors that actually put 16 in treat they just wrote a letter saying Dear Mr hton who Justin Patrick ready to let you know I support my neighbors cith as they are hoping rate their home they are across my street neighbors and share their plans with me I do not have any concerns please feel free to reach out to me if any questions or concerns 6 Street thank you Tom um want to see it but um any other public comment any other questions from the board all right um someone want to propose motion for this one I can propose that we accept the petitioner's request for a special permit under Section 5.4.7 accessory apartments and 5.4.7 two restriction of the town of ring zoning bylaw um to construct a 30x30 twostory Edition with 684 squ ft accessory apartment on the first floor as shown on the plot plan dated 7:15 uh 24 715 24 as revised August 5th who seen the revised version right that's what's on here as revised August 5th 2024 prepared by David P he got it and Architectural drawings dated 41424 prepared by Catal construction got a second I'll second special conditions Supply too standard special permit will be subject to the following conditions the petitioner shall submit the building inspector a survive plot plan of the proposed construction and proposed Foundation plans prior to the issuance of the foundation permit for the work petitioners final construction plans for the new structure shall be submitted the building inspector along with the asbill foundation plans prior to the issuance of the building permit as Bill plan showing the completed constr instruction shall be submitted to the building inspector immediately after the work is completed and prior to the issuance of an occupancy Rec second it all in favor yeah great pass all set thank you very much appreciate it thanks thank you okay let's move on to case number 24-13 2115 Washington Street uh the zoning board of appeals will hold a public hearing and the select boards meeting room at Town Hall 16 low Street ready Massachusetts on Wednesday September 4th 2024 at 7 p.m. with application of and Han bazilio on behalf of the property owner ass to mat law SE chapter 48 section 10 for variance under the reading zoning bylaw section 4.5.2 6.0 7.0 and 7.4 as may be determined by the zoning board to construct a covered porch which will extend existing extend a preon existing non-conforming structure and create a new non-conforming front y set back on the property located at 215 Washington Street this map 17 lot 90 in ready Massachusetts unless there is an objection ient to the reading of the abuts list except to say that their abutters were notified as were the following select board the town clerk police Department fire department building department Conservation Commission Health Department assessor's office engineering division cpdc members and Associate members of the board of appeals as well as the playing Boards of Wakefield Lindfield North ring stonum wurn and mington um testimony before this board is take under oath so if you think you may want to speak please stand and raise your right hand I know he's be presenting or if anyone else wants to talk to you sure okay um I swear the testimony given by May before this boort will be the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth response just I do I do okay great oh sorry all you need do we trusted everything that Anna's did and everything that she's sled for you guys but we just this is my husband Kevin I'm Sydney and we live at 215 Washington and we just wanted to come and show our support and uh let you know that we are expecting our first trials and we just wanted to add on the fors as like an extra barrier to our house um for safety reasons and uh sounds good um anyone from the board want to get started I have a question I don't not sure if one of you can answer I don't know when you say the the setback from the front from the street now is 18 and 1 12 feet are you taking that from the front wall of the house or from the bottom of the steps that are there the house house from the house yeah we're not taking the stairs into consideration because it's open open stairs so from the house to the uh end of the lot line okay and could you identify yourself and I'm basilo I apply for the variant on behalf of the okay uh can we just swear you in to since you're gonna speak on this yeah sorry so same I swear the testimony gave been by me before this word will be the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth and the response is just I do um all right actually the same question this you about where the existant was taken from um yeah I guess anyone else on the um so the the portrait definitely add some character to that house so yeah you add so the stairs I can't see the uh the the plans for the stairs coming out would they still be Bas we will be side masy stairs still no we will be we'll do a frame a PT frame for the stairs just a couple stairs it's not that high it's not even 3T high so a couple stairs just to go up the the FR porch yeah I guess so anyone else on the board comments okay yeah the the two things that I would say are um so unfortunately unlik the previous case it's going be a variance instead of special permit so it's a little more difficult to yet um I think one of the things we got to take into consideration we work on variance is the answer to the four questions you guys answered um but I think one of the questions is the first one about the soil conditions in demography and I'm not sure that um quite got addressed I think that what that that question is asking is to look for something that is unique about this lot that would mean that there should be an exception granted and I'm not sure that this answer really addresses that it's more about how it is like other Lots in the area um so that is something that is I think would um be a difficult for us granting this does that make sense what you question question so so the first question is describe the circumstances relating to soil condition shape or topography to especially affect the land or structures in question but do not but which do not generally affect the zoning District um and I think that you sort of answer that question in Reverse saying that this is like other Lots in the zoning District but for us to Grant the varant we need to figure out or we need to have a reason why this one is not like other Lots in the studing district yeah but I have a question though what am I what am I missing why wouldn't this be a special permit if it's 185 now and it should be 20 isn't it non-conforming already it's expanding but you're creating a new non going from 18 and a half to 10 and a half okay okay you know sometimes the simplest of cases become the hardest to justify in terms of the various criteria unfortunately uh but as you probably well know counter read doesn't generate the criteria for variance that's done by the state so we have to go by so and uh it it's it's I think the the one that I had most trouble with is the hardship criteria it's hard to to clear Define a hardship for something like this I'm sympathetically I can look at it and say yeah it's probably a hardship in one set of eyes but another set of eyes it's it's hard to justify so but uh that's the only comment I had I took I wanted to take a ride up that way the other day but then was some construction going on and I couldn't get to the house spent much more time than I had time to spend so I quit what I was interested in trying to determine is how many houses on Washington Street are already in noncompliance with the quite few okay whether this one's going to stand out from all the others or whether there other houses on that street that were already non-conforming it's not and that's what I'm struggling with because I did drive by you may have see me pull into your driveway because you can't park on that street um and that you know pretty much a lot of the neighbors around there also have porches or you know some sort of whatever that's pretty darn close to that sidewalk um yeah which I'm sure is you know old non-conforming issues and you know I had concluded that this isn't this what they're asking to do isn't really any different than what many buildings in the area already have however as s pointed out the criteria for a variance is more than just that if that were the only question you wouldn't have a problem but there's other questions that need to be answered yes and unfortunately you don't get there I don't think um I I mean I guess I I missed this tell me more about the the concern about um a car um slamming into your house it happened to a neighbor was that we wrote letter we um that side sweet eaten eaten um it's hard we've seen um a lot of almost car accidents and one actually in order to avoid the car accident came up onto our neighbor's la oh okay and I like you did say there is no parking there's no cars that separate not that that would be help but separate the street from a vehicle that might be out of control or driving really quickly and then the first um barrier is just the wall in then our living room right so we got um out of especially being inviting our first porn and that scared us a little bit that car sure good I mean I guess the one thing that's going to trip all us all of us up very much is just how stringent the statute actually is it's a circumstance where unless you are able to prove all of those four criteria that are indicated in that uh that statute itself where talking about how the soil and topography is different from everything else and how uh there would be a substantial hardship in these circumstances you have to prove every single one of those as in order to actually obtain a variance and it's just such a very very high standard that makes it very difficult for a lot of boards to actually Grant those it's a circumstance where unless you're able to prove each and every single one of those different criteria we are essentially required to deny so that that is the difference between what you saw with the eaten Street property was a special permit versus a variance so it's a circumstance where you have to kind of really kind of look at how your plant fit into the criteria for that particular variance and in order to convince a zoning board to actually Grant the variance is something where you have to really really kind of take a look at your property versus all of the other properties and really pay attention to how those particular criteria would apply in certain circumstances for for a variance itself so given where we are I don't know if i' be able to actually Grant a variance based upon the application as it is right now can I ask a question with the the amount of steps is that one of the criterias to blessen the on steps no because of the steepness from yeah they yeah yeah they they need to show that there's something unique about this lot not not you know that's different from the rest of your neighborhood the rest of everywhere that means you cannot comply with the rules with the setbacks and the different rules that are um in in place for instance if half of your backyard was an enormous piece of granite that you can't do anything on and therefore the house has to be far forward um but that you know that's the sort of thing that would justify potentially granting a variance but if you don't have something like that that's unique about your lot that requires a certain thing other I mean and the fact that your house is where it is doesn't count I'm sorry about that but it it you know that's not a good enough reason so um so that's if you know if you could come back and show um that you would that you do meet that criteria in some way that you haven't explained yet um you know we could certainly um reconsider this but um then suggest that they withdraw yes so what what we would suggest is that instead if you think that there's a chance that you you could rework this and come up with some different um information that would support us getting an act giving a variance then I suggest that you withdraw the application instead of having us vote on it because if we deny it there's a two-year time limit that you have to wait before you can come back so if you want to avoid that risk um you could withdraw your application and then you'd be able to bring it again much more easily draw anything okay withdraw continue well that you could you could continue it as you could ask for a continu as well to to like the next meeting or something except that I don't know if you're be going to be ready for that I mean you need to think more about it maybe so that's up to you but the key is you don't want us to vote on it right now because I think you're getting an indication that we can't allow it two parts the two questions is the topography and the hardship criteria there's four criteria as part of the application itself yes right and you would essentially need to prove each and every single one of those for us to even consider it okay so it would be that there that there would be a hardship that the Topography of the soil is different from other areas I believe that the relief can be granted without a detriment of public good circumstances that we're looking at there are it's one of these things where we look at precedent as well it's a circumstance where if we Grant this variance for you that means we would quite literally have to Grant it for every single other person on your street who would make that application so those types of circumstances that we need to specifically indicate and just kind of that goes towards how the property is a little bit different and then I think the fourth is uh how the relief can be granted without nullifying or substantially derogating from the intent or purpose of the zoning ordinance so I think it's something where look at why people have why towns would generally have the those those front setbacks and think about how some of these changes may affect that as well uh yes you got a general sense of where we are on the Varian side of things um one other thing you could look at is there is a footnote in the setback table um where you can actually look at your neighbor's setbacks um I'm not exactly sure what the whole process is for that I'm not sure how often that's yeah used I tried the average would be around 16t so it's still average like 19 yeah aage is 19 okay okay got it um okay um yeah so guess that leaves us so we can either vote on the application which you'd be subject to the two-year restriction if it doesn't pass um or we can continue to next meeting if you think you might be able to rework these um they could also withdraw or withdraw depending on how much time you think you might need to to come back or if you think you can come back okay so I just want to put the option is if they do decide to continue and they can't meet the next one they can always submit an email requesting that's true further extension yeah you can keep you could keep continuing it until you are ready yeah so we we draw for now and then withraw you have to have to notifying buts do the whole application process again you don't have to continue it to our next meeting you can continue it to two meetings from now I believe okay yeah okay so yeah I think that's a better option yeah yeah that's okay okay so I'll make a motion to continue until I believe our November 6th meeting that sounds right second I'll second second all right all in favor great Lu guys thank you yes that's how you got to do you got work how many two years suspensions of it it's okay I think the last thing on our minutes or agenda is the minutes from the August meeting um I wasn't here so I don't have any comments on them I I do have something I need to bring up so and I'm the one who made the motion at the last meeting and there was a lot of um of discussion and a lot of neighbors who were here talking about it with a lot of concern so we tried to Fashion we we did Grant the request but we tried to Fashion the order in a way to address some of those concerns and one of the things that I proposed and that was voted on was a restriction in the hours that the business could have people there could operate um and then there some research was done afterwards and determined that um this board does not have the authority to restrict our like that so although the minutes properly reflect what we did um what we did do was not um um correct or not not not within our Authority in that respect as far as the Limited hours goes so I just I don't know what the procedure would be to I mean if we can amend I I honestly don't know what we have to do it seems like we have to redo the like an addendum Maybe I don't know one thing we could do I think is just make a motion that remove the condition that was established for case whatever so and so it was at the last meeting but my question is would we then have to have give public notice of that and allow people to to I mean we certainly heard we certainly heard all of the concerns um want to noce also with the parking um in the decision as well go to a specific section it's General bylaws um I'd have to talk to Andrew about the proper mention has the case been written up so the decision was posted I mean the decision has the decision been written up yeah it had it has to be posted like about two weeks after the meeting so the expiration date so the 20day appe perod fires on so okay point is the decision has been approved and everything else so the process is complete so somehow that decision's got to be amended yeah that's that's the concern of the mechanism for that because right now we have an order with a condition that isw extra extrajudicial would be the proper phrase I think and um um it may affect I I don't know if it would not having that condition would have changed anybody's vote um I I doubt it but I think theoretically um that should be it should go through some kind of formal process to do that and I just don't know what that process is so I can Andrew um I'm not sure if maybe just having a conversation with everyone agreeing now and reflecting in next month's meeting to address that would be appropriate or not or if we do have to do something so I'll bring all right well that that sounds good then I mean what just in case it works why don't we put on the record now assuming that it's correct and you know if anybody has any further comments on it um that the removal of that condition um the it still would have passed and if we could put that on the record if that's sufficient then we're we've we're done if it's not sufficient then we'll need to just do whatever we need to do two conditions was it well there were there were several there were several conditions but the the the specific condition about the hours was what was not I thought also parking um I believe the ISS any issues revolving around parking might actually at the meeting itself yeah I I don't remember doing condition conditions on parking to only allow two vehicles outside outside and I I brought up we have much of a conversation I drafted it and it and then sign it all so that was something we did that they have toide byw top But whichever bylaw that something in the general specifically involving parking and Commercial businesses within within reading things along those lines or yeah yeah like the hour so as long as they to bylaw right okay all right so I guess maybe on both of those things then the the parking uh and the reason I had proposed that specific criteria was because he had said he can put Vehicles inside the building so I you know had imagined that any extra Vehicles would go inside the building um so but in any case so if if I not sure how to phrase this um ask the board to affirm the their vote on on the um the allowance of that petition it's case number 241e number 24-10 943 Main Street um without the conditions limiting the number of um vehicles that could be parked on the premises outside and without the condition regarding the working hours would the vote affirm with the board affirm their um approval of that motion um without those conditions I can say yes my vote would I'm trying to figure out who voted on it Capone Gregory would you vote on that one so someone voted no I think we all did I think it was either you or Terra oh I did for the pest you did for that one okay so we're all here so we're all here I think she voted for the first that's right she did vote for that one and then you got the second one yeah yeah okay so then I will affirm affirm affirm me okay so everybody has affirmed that they would vote for it with even if those conditions were missing so if that is sufficient to to fix the problem then um then fine and if it's not please let us know I'm surprised the decisions finalized if the appeal period is not over I would think so it has so the appeal period starts with time so we have I think it's about a week and a half or two weeks okay okay got it and I think he a very L day okay so like for this meeting I would have to have it filed by to cler by yeah I mean I guess the question from a legal perspective is if somebody would have if it were changed would that trigger a new appeal period you know trying to change substantial way decision said yeah what's PO he might have taken that out of the decision he might have taken it out of the decision already so I think that's probably that's why I say it be nice that the write up has someone could pull up go to the zoning of the website it should be posted on there under disc oh if it's not in there then already be done yeah we' wasted the last 10 minutes someone in in history would ever go back to those minutes could cause a problem well actually the specific conditions are not listed in the well I think uh 943 it says we discuss the following conditions but it doesn't say that we then you're good then mandated the following conditions okay yeah so this says the hours of operation shall adhere to the hour stipulated Ving General bylaw 7.7 okay and parking all commercial parking should be contained on site and by local overnight parking regulations no parking sh so the actual order differs from what the board voted on but in a way that was necessary because of our extra judicial decision so we're good makes sense okay okay thank you a yeah that was my concern if it was posted something different and actually got it registered yeah go to he goes through and he'll update some of that language okay we still want to do that addendum that says that we all agreed to it on the minute it's on the record it's on the it's on the record yeah I think that that's a good idea just because that is we on okay okay so any other comments on the minutes from last week I think when you when you show the voting on the minutes or the cases you can't show all six or seven people voting there only going to be five members voting I think choing the permanent members that are there and if one of them isn't there then one of the two Loop people vot you put all six names on on previous minutes well and then you put all on this one five I think one two three there there were five on on the special yeah I think on the minutes and the adjournment I think it is appropriate to put everybody down I think we've always operated on a premise that the five permanent members are there the for um just there's a typo page three it says the board members discuss the following conditions on page three oh yeah the board members anything else want I'll make a motion for for Tara on on on the second page where you show Tara you show MX Tara who's what's MX so MX is um for like binaries leg pronoun St there oh really yeah Tera specified her pronouns as we were leaving last time at the bottom of page three it says we need to verify who seconded that motion yes I have no idea who I went back I couldn't figure out who actually I think probably three people did it at once you you made the motion oh then I second okay I thought then I'll make a motion to accept these minutes with the corrections we discussed okay second all right all in favor I all right um motion to any other business all right great yeah motion to adern great second all in favor I I awesome thank you all right all right thank you thank you e