##VIDEO ID:5Nm1iwPXbbI## e e e okay we have a few administrative manners I think we have folks office okay Mr chairman good evening and happy new to everyone so we have a couple of uh uh members being sworn in tonight uh Ray Mass Chris Havens uh Anna Cruz and Ben Euro so if you all could stand up and raise your right hand and we can all repeat after me together but when I first start I'll have you state your name and we'll just I'll point to you so if you can all Raise Your Right hands i r m Chris Havens Anna do solemnly swear doly swear that I will that I will faith faithfully impartially and justly andly perform all the duties perform all the duties of the office of the office of a member of a member of the Red Bank Zoning Board of adjustment the Red Bank Zoning Board of adjustment according to the best of my ability according to the best of my ability so help me guys okay we have re organization of our board um sure so what um what I would suggest is um we'll take nominations for those individuals uh uh to serve as chair for the upcoming year do we have any nominations in that to that regard I'll nominate Ry mass is there a second I'll second all right are there any other nominations for individuals to serve as chair all right so we'll do a vote on yes Rond M yes Hogan yes Beno yes Sharon Lee Yes Paul Anna Cruz yes Eugene hor yes Chris Havens yes so now Mr chairman will'll do the same thing on Vice chair are there anyone here who wants to make a nomination for someone to serve as Vice chair for the up coming year yeah nominate and okay do I have a second second all right are there any other nominations for individuals to serve as Vice chair M yesen Hogan yesu yes Sharon Lee Yes Anna Cruz yes Eugene hor yes Chris a yes okay we have a a nomination for board secretary I'll nominate second thank you Raymond Mass yesen Hogan yes vanu yes Sharon Lee Yes Anna Cruz yes Eugene Horwitz yes Chris aens yes okay we have nomination for board attorney I'll nominate Kevin Kennedy second Mass yes Hogan yes Beno yes Sharon Lee Yes Anna Cruz yes Eugene Horwitz yes CHR Havens yes Mr chairman I wanted to thank you I've been fortunate enough to uh be the board attorney here for a number of years and I'm still very excited about the appointment I still very much appreciate the appointment and I still very much like the appointment and I thank you and I look forward to working with you all over the next year thank you okay we have a conflict conflict board attorney also um I'll nominate Mark lexin anybody second I'll second who was it Shar yeah sorry rman Mass yes Hogan yes vano yes Sharon Lee Yes Anna Cruz yes Eugene Horwitz yes Chris hav yes okay nominations for board engineer engineering firm I'll nominate tnm I'll second Rond Mass yes Hogan yes Ben Euro I have to recuse myself over potential conflict of interest okay Sharon Lee Yes um Anna Cruz yes e Horwitz yes Chris Havens yes and a nomination for a conflict board engineer I'll nominate C I'll second rman Mass yesen Hogan yes vano yes Sharon Lee Yes Anna yes Eugene Horwitz yes Chris hav yes okay we have we affirmation of zoning board B I make a motion to approve those make a motion second bman M yes Hogan yes Beno yes Sharon Lee Yes um Ana Cruz yes Eugene Horowitz yes Chris Havens yes okay we have official newspaper um and ASB Park pres to River T second Rond Mass yes Hogan yes vano yes Sharon Lee Yes Santa Cruz yes Eugene horns yes Chris Havens yes okay we have the 2025 Bo meeting calendar I'll go ahead and approve that second reman Mass yesen Hogan yes vano yes Sherman Lee Yes Anna Cruz yes Eugene horz yes Chris aens yes okay then we have meeting minutes uh regular meeting minutes from December 5th 2024 somebody like to make a motion to approve those motion second Mass yes Hogan yes Beno yes Char Le yes Eugene horz yes okay we have uh meeting minutes from uh December 19th 2024 those weren't provided to the board but it was a short meeting only five minutes but they are drafted so so make a motion to approve those second a second and Mr chairman just for the record Shaun I think all that was was we opened up the meeting to carry yes the uh Riverview Hospital application and the Morales application to this meeting night that is correct that's all the minutes will reflect righto yes Sharon Lee Yes Anna Cruz yes and hor yes okay next we have a resolution of denial on 187 River Side Avenue Mr Ten Mr chairman that was the uh outfront media billboard application uh this resolution little bit lengthy it was distributed ahead of time if it's acceptable to the board uh we can adopt it subject to engineering and and and sha a review just remember there were three sets of plan revisions uh and I just want uh Ed Herman our our um engineer to just confirm that my numbers and measurements and calculations are correct so if it's acceptable we can adopt this resolution subject to engineering uh and legal review so I make a motion to approve hold on make a motion second R Mass yes Hogan yes Beno yes Sharon Lee Yes Eugene hars yes and chis yes okay we have one more resolution of approval one no Mr chairman that's a work in progress mainly because the first one was a big work in progress but if we can hold that to the next meeting sure thank you okay new business we have 232 South Pearl Street okay and um Mr uh chairman as the applicants team comes forward uh we're going to do a couple of preliminary procedural things so first up uh we're gonna swear in um Jacqueline German our newly mitted board engineer and uh and Shauna Ebanks our director who's a planner and director of Community Development Shauna and Jackie if you could please raise your right hands do you swear that the information and testimony you're about to provide to the extent you provide any will be the truth the best of your knowledge to help you guide yes okay let the record reflect that both Witnesses have been sworn uh you'll recall we accepted uh jurisdiction at the last meeting um and carried it till tonight and what we will do is we'll mark into the record what we as a board have before us so let's see A1 is the zoning application dated August 28 2024 the entire package uh thank you A2 is the zoning denial letter dated July 12th 20 4 A3 is a survey prepared by Morgan engineering and surveying dated May 30th 2024 consisting of one sheet A4 is the uh plans um for the new single family home prepared by Edward O'Neal and that's dated August 15 2024 consisting of five sheets and A5 is the TM associat review memorandum dated December 18 2024 sha do I need to Mark in what you out or is that just a larger easier to read copy these the same plans a little bit more yeah so I think we do all right so a uh should I Market it all in as one or yeah so A6 is this H package uh and it's consisting of a survey and an aerial view and photographs of the site and floor plans and a lot area study um Illustrated and so we'll mark that entirely as A6 so uh this is Kevin assadi applicant attorney good evening good uh Happy New Year and uh welcome aboard thank you very much congratulations to appointed today bring it closer to you thank you we have a new M today new MERS well thank you for your service and you know and Kev just excuse me we Mark that uh Chris Havens ex recused himself on this application and alen just her ordinance will just make sure that goes the resolution and the minutes sorry great yep thealis um we're here today seing the VAR for the property which situated in the br2 Zone located 232 South curl Street it's a big undersized V it contains 2,686 27 for very long time uniting his family here in red hopefully many of you recall Mr Morales came before this board last year regarding a similar application for a property located at oneberry Street at that time in a g property owner expressed interest in purchasing the land he commissioned an appraisal and ultimately completed a purchase of the with while that resolution aligned with suggestions was deeply disappointing outome Mr Morales as it delayed his dream of bringing his family together in r has been determined to move forward and Mr Morales has since identified a new property the subject to 32 South PE street that presents similar opportunity for family uh this property is also under sized and vacant requiring variance for to construct the proposed home we reached out to adjacent Property Owners offering either to purchase or sell excess land and at this time I would like to add this Mark which is a packet of four letters that were sent certified mail so mark that A7 uh letter certified uh four of them that's correct and uh off hand you know the date uh September 11th 202 September 11 2024 all right have I just cut to the chase where there are any responses from any of those letters I received I received two phone calls um but nobody expressed any serious desire to buy or sell um so it didn't go and uh Mr s if I could just jump in for one second we'll get into this later on but remember um we talked about the um Mr morales's first application this is all effectuated under the dalm case and and that is a special case when you're dealing with isolated undersized lots have no improvements on them and they said one of the standards is and I'm sure Mr will get this up to this but one of the standards was you have to send letters to the adjacent property owners and ask them hey are you to buy my property or sell me your property so that I can make mine conforming or more conforming so that's what those letters are that were marked A7 and or collectively Market A7 a c and d okay thank you A7 does also include certified mail postcards thank you size as well as potentially dve specifically my client is seeking sidey setbacks of 3.25 ft where 10t is require we believe the saw is is reasonable and appropriate because the prop is currently a vacant lot um the proposed development will improve the neighborhood by utilizing the lot for its intended presal the requested variances are consistent with the character of the surrounding neighborhood and the granting of the variance will allow Mr Morales to achieve his family's goal living together in Red without the without any detriment of the public substantial impair so without fly do um well we have two witnesses this evening one is Mr Morales who seated to my left and we have Ed O'Neal fromits will Tech information so without further Ado the board has any questions for me all right good evening if you could just uh raise your right hand and state your namec mores Mr get the microphone and it's m o r a l yes all right if you could just raise your right hand do you swear that the information and testimony you're about to provide will be the truth the best your knowledge to help you guide right and just for the record you're the owner of the property and how long have you owned it roughly we have to speak closer or louder sorry about a year okay and the property as Mr Assad indicated is vacant thank you the mics are very sensitive so just keep it close yeah you just keep really CL okay U Jacob can you uh Enlighten the board how long have you lived in red uh been few years now and um honestly justy City you guys remember my story from the last time and um I honestly was this nice so I just wanted to bring my family honestly to experience this expi my mom I feel like my mom is like the last m in piece that to come and actually experienced this and uh see how nice it is Mak New Jersey is hly but she's used to Jersey to and it's pretty rough around there so yeah and you identified uh this property with what purpose in mind oh with my mom honestly uh to build something where it's convenient for her and then to have her have better life over here because honestly she's she's struggling a little bit at I would like to honestly need to sign the house um what did you have in mind as far as you have kids no and but do you would they expect to have kids oh absolutely my brothers have see your family gathering themselves absolutely can't wait I don't have to go to Jersey City no more on the holidays I could just stay in Red Bank that be we have everybody together unless the board has any questions all I wanted Mr Mor to testify okay any questions from Mr Morales any any questions from the public for Mr Morales okay move on okay uh and there's going to be a time for public comment in a little bit um and there's this this judicially sanctioned process that we have to follow so do you have any questions from Mr Morales right now um no no questions I saw the plan so okay so we'll get we're going to um they're going to bring up another witness and then the board is going to ask him some questions uh and then we're going to ask you if you've any questions for their witness now that's okay and then they're going to give you an opportunity to make any public comments that's okay no problem all right so uh Mr O'Neal uh good evening if you could uh state your name and business address and if you could just raise your right hand do you swear that the information and testimony you're back and provide will be the truth to the best of your knowledge to help you gu and just for the record you're testifying tonight in Your Capacity as architect thank you you want me to Mr O'Neal you know what he's been before us several times understand I think we're all familiar with Mr O'Neal so then I submit Mr O'Neal is an expert in the fields of architecture and professional plan so noted thank thank you you can go ahead so um again as as Mr said it's an isolated undersiz lot my investigations show that the photographs 2001 decided to be vacant I'm not sure how much further back it goes be vacant however I've also looked at sandborn maps from the 1920s and there was a house on the site at that time so somewhere between the 1920s and I'm sorry somewhere between 1920s and and you know it just speak into have to really yelling mic so the proposed house is 2,119 square ft I'm sorry 219 and that includes fin attic which is one open room it's not a bedroom there a bathroom an extra rec room the height is 29 ft or 35 ft and the basically the as Varan sought our side variances U considering that the line is 27 ft wide Mo here to the back of 10 ft it be 7 area which isable area so to side set prop we do conform to the front and rear and we do conform to L coverage there was a question in tnn's review letter regarding calculations of lot coverage and whether have Supply those as a condition to approval there was also a question regarding the heights of the front your Stoops and again a condition of approval would be brought raing plan and at that time would be confirm the size of the stupid we St based on the number of steps so we kind of made an assumption about the steps I think the fact that they would be under three fet between the sto and grade is where we would try to be therefore they're not counted in the BL coverage calculations there's also a question about the driveway that's being proposed which is another variance um we would be more than willing to look at that in different ways use the term correctly excuse me the tire channels um the question of course becomes if we use Tire channels is it the same as being is the width mentioned the same um for dver where that's not paid to why I'm not sure how you interpret that but if that was pleasure modify the I I I I think we would still I don't think it would make a difference if you have Tire channels or not you would still have the curve cut that's 18 ft wide right yes yes so I would say that driveway is still 18 ft wide okay yeah it's an interpretation you're interpreting yeah I would say the curb cut that's what a driveway typically is depression of of the curb so whatever the width is is it's 18 ft and and again the wheel Channel issue may be an issue depending on uh the heights of the entry Stoops for lot coverage so we may go back to the wheel channels okay coverage but either way we would conform to the 35% coverage issue okay but we need a little more information and again just for the board information the idea of the 18 by two off street parking spaces which is what's required by the so we conform to the a parment requirements the reques a wider driveway because the lot is narrow enough that we can't P around to the back to park the car and if we put a twocc car garage in front of the building until just a twocc car garage is approximately 24t so kind of caught and there are um one of the issues that is in some of the documentation being fret is that there are two other properties on South Pearl that have driveways that are Bas also couple properties put that in cont and if you want to take a quick look at the floor plans and the first floor PL is fairly standard it's a kitchen FR half between and then up on the second floor there's a master bedroom in the two bedroom behind there's a master bathroom and aall so it's a two and a half bathroom three bedroom I'm sorry two and a half bathroom three bedroom yeah that's the 28t for as new letter goes we will conform to all the outstanding issues Mansion requiring uh like features like walkways things like that um we are not planning on necessarily providing trees in the front we could if you would again at the pleasure to shift the the 18 liveway is approve we have centered on the lot we could shift it to one side in order to have more area PL to trade if that was something there would be 4 and half ft on each side we could probably plant small trees DRS again um we look at this from a planning perspective uh again we're compelled to kind of talk about the positive and negative criteria so I would say first being somewhat positive person start with positive criteria which is the purposes of that um the first one listed in the purposes of the ACT would be criteria a which is to promote the health safety and Welfare of the community I think developing an abandoned lot to get home if yous that and that's the way proper Works developing that property be a thing I think most people in the neighborhood when we talked about the Berry Street project spoke about hey you know there's a St look at it enter through an agreement to purchase the property so I think it's also a continuity of the overall neighborhood I think uh posi is appropriate population densities toeng residential neighborhood today which is mixed it's mixed with residences and Commercial properties and I think struction house uh G is Def space for Housing Development housing during current it's a house that located more affordable than and also desirable visual environment again the site is very from Park Boulevard can travel west across the he also has a very nice feature property to it to the South fronts on Dr spk boulard so rear yard very and so this house took advantage of that or try to and it's sou side windows which is the sun side a lot of Windows on the south side which will help from solar standpoint to passic reduce the amount of air conditioning things in the house and there it's a large stretch of open so I think the house will appear to be larger than it is just because of the location in the house next store um if we look at the Red Bank master plan we looked at the goals and objectives the 2023 plan if you look at the section they called balanced uh it says to embrace smart growth a smart growth mentality with targeted in development negative impacts and I think this it's an existing bacon uh It also says that um to preserve residential Quality of Life by addressing nuisance issues and preventing incompatible development in adjacent area I think this is it is an appropriate adjon use and then the other section of the master plan Equitable is strengthen existing neighborhoods to enhance safety Community Pride and it's a vac l so we're add another residence bwell will only raise the standards of the neighbor as to the negative criteria and if you look at the various studies which are the last pages first one that has the kind of bright green on so that's about the areas that are dark green are alliz blocks are what undiz blocks so they are all Propel neighborhood yell are non single family users see there's only really five properties that a single family uses form the others don't or their commercial uses or their the next sheet 50 as you notice besides the H site um none of them perform none of them have a proper I don't think it's a negative impact to have this side which is doesn't have the frontage within a neighborhood of properties and don't have the front um last is she the setbacks setbacks now again this is kind of a guate based on the areas that you can draw from information so this is from the County GIS map and you can see that all of the yellow lots have setbacks that are less than 10t so it is a neighborhood that mostly doesn't have 10 foot setbacks if they do have 10 foot it's on one side at the expense of the other side so that they could have driveway to a garage in the back so again the distance between houses and their property lines are consistently around 3 to 5 fet and three to five feet is kind of an odd number you think about it but it isn't think about the building code because the building code def finds 3 to five ft as the distances at three and the reason for 33 in is that the wall has to be high rated but it can't have Windows on we think that's very important because of the South faing Side that opens Sun so we're dealing with as a solar issues we're trying to be energy conscious which again is part of the master plan so the idea that the um that the property is overbuilt to its width it's going to look like all the other houses all back but but looking at this this house would be set back a lot farther than ones that are currently there right correct and and the reason for that is the depart and and with that block there's a single story house behind back there in this picture would that really be blocking everything that that house would get from a sun standpoint being that FL back no no because again the the setback in the back requirement is 25 ft we're 27 okay so we're actually further back than it could be I don't see that being a major issue uh again we need requirements for front yard rear yard block coverage Building height all street parking the impact of the development neighborhood is minimal so I guess my conclusion is that based upon the positive criteria think positive criteria far outweighs the negative therefore from planning standpoint I think that it's a it's it's smart development as master plan calls and questions um the data that you showed in your packet I think it all leads to a conclusion that kind of ask me can make which is that the propos development is consistent with the character consist neor is correct absolutely yes absolutely and the um the lot size and shape does that present any challenges in designing a house here that would bit under a C1 hardship standard yeah again the part of the problem you're designing it is if you adhere to the sidey guard setbacks there's no build lay right I mean if you insist on the setbacks property can't be built upon it's a taken and um we can't really restri that so it's kind of the best we can do the house is only really when you get done with it it's less than 19 ft wide so it's really like a wider couse and we wanted to go to 19 because that allows us to put two bedrooms in the back that both have new windows both have side windows you go back to the um master plan and and sustainable design and and that's also like firm has always been champion of sustainable design anyway rooms me you5 so um yes so I think it is challenging but we've done it I have one one last question concerning the driveway and um it appears that we uh also would need a variance to go 18 feet wide on that curb cut uh if we were to conform to a 12 foot wide driveway you mentioned before that might we would lose one off street parking space is that correct yes and in in your opinion as professional planner is it a better zoning alternative to go wider to get the extra car off the street yes and and I've been to the street many times actually you know somewhat personal about it my father had a business at Pearl Street so I grew up with that business being there for about 20 years cred service pars there used to be a building back there on that was my father's business so I was on South Pearl Street and there were always cars park on the street so with that knowledge as well as my planning experience I think unless the board felt it better to have an 12 foot driveway and Par paring variant I don't know I think that's kind of shortsighted I think with this the way we kind of move the 18 ft we can plant Shrubbery on both sides I think we can also plant Shrubbery against the house I don't think it's going to have any not going to be an is well we've we've always maintained no parking in the front yard which this actually goes into our front yard I mean we we've turned down applications of people wanting to park in the front yard well that kind of becomes an issue yes but again you know because it's a driveway that driveway part of the parking you know from s parking lot um so if we went to 12T we'd have one car but there's no way place to put another car unless it's in the front yard so if the board was compelled to provide a parking variance for one space you're perfectly fine with that um you know the house that's to the South doesn't park on the street because their Frontage is on so there probably will be available parking between the house Street of the South I guess my only concern would be the parking lot across the street which is s of Big L and whether I don't really know whether that's an tax parking to it so that that design Choice was definitely made with the idea in mind that it's better to offer an additional parking space off the street especially in this part of town where parking can get understand it just creates some issues for us on past applications that we haven't allowed that to to be part of so that could be an issue we're we're we're um proposing it under the hardship standard um under the L use law where if there were alternatives to provide parking Elsewhere on the site that certainly would have been done but given the size and width of this site it becomes you know an impossibility from a design standpoint that's why the hardship standards exist but again we are willing to into the board's pleasure if that's an issue any questions from the board on this I do see that as an issue they're right in front of the house right the spaces are right in front and that is that is an issue for us I mean it definitely has been has to to put cars right in the front so and then my I have one other question the size of this home compared to the street this is GNA be a lot bigger or I know you said it might appear bigger you know because be bigger it could probably be smaller three bedroom than 2100 square feet roof it's really going to go from 21 down to about 1600 okay and I would think that the who's on the street all the night I'm sorry the houses are in what range at range of about 1600 square feet I would say anywhere from 12 to 1600 so is the third floor like is it higher than the houses on the street then most of the houses well most of the houses their roofs go if you if you're looking at it from the street left to right this would go front to back and front to back is to get more exposure to South elevation because I went over there I mean I was looking at it I don't have a measure add didn't how high everything was I was looking at but if you put a house on there you know I'm looking at this and then those houses are more down towards the street and then you're going to have two cars parked in front of it okay all right yeah and again we're certainly flexible on par we initially wanted to not have that as a variance in the application which meant we had two spaces that we met the standard but there's a design waiver I believe it would be because of the parking as what okay as opposed to a variance for not having parking spes so kind of te it on the side of dealing with the parking right because this is all the way you said on this property line there's no way on the side or anything so you're saying they have to go in the front they have to go in the front yeah because again if you if you set back for the fire reasons and then you put a driveway that go back again it's an unil any other questions from the board any questions from the public for Mr O'Neal okay any comments from the board on this application Jackie has a question oh Jackie yeah I just have a couple questions from our letter that I think we missed oh sorry okay just a couple questions to make sure we address all the the items that we brought up on page three um we asked about air conditioning units are you proposing any air conditioning units at this time yes and we would put them on the if you look at the um on the page C1 yeah stairc out uhuh staircase building would that require variance where you're proposing no the air conditioning unit okay anything there two okay um and then um 2.3 on page four any walkways or you have any walkways proposed from the parking area to the front door yes it's a small area that would go from the edge of the parking to the base of the steps and you think that would be concrete F forward either concrete or um are you taking down any trees and I'm sorry this I just noticed one more thing that's not in the letter there's a gravel area in within your lot um that has a depressed curve I think would you close that depressed curve where you don't need it yes okay thank you I have one another question when you're looking at this from the front and the the driveway the parking spots are in the front the other houses are closer to Street yes okay turn down Barry Street there's houses there is this house going to be set in the back like in their backyard if you're on Barry Street no because the lot the two houses to the north at the same dep line okay so the properties behind this that okay it would only be that the two houses more would have this house slid back so they would have more view they more in front of their so it would be behind the house but it would be 20t more in front so again if you think about light next door it have more light in front from the side South and North there's nothing okay I'm sorry East and West there's okay I just have one question um is there an access to the basement from the outside or do you have to do it and the the basement's just going to be used for recreational Space Storage not for living space and probably for mechanical equipment okay no can we make that a condition I'm sorry that was the condition I mean I'm concerned about the third floor I think it's just GNA door what it doesn't dwarf it's going to throw in Shadow uh I think you have a full stairway going up to the third floor yes in order to finish a regular stand you can't have a cing stand it's a fire Cod issue yeah I think it's it's big and it's tall I just see it's such a difference to the the properties that are next to it say the length you could I could see that you can get away with some of the length depth don't a lot but height is yeah the height is determined by the walls of yeah that's that's a lot but it is under the ordin by by just so I know is it third floor is it third technically three floors it would be two and a half story excuse me it has to be two and a half stories clarify um here a question called it a third story is is this a third story no not not under the ordinance nor under the building so a full walk UPS not a third not a no as long as it's a third so a half story is considered to be a third of the second floor and at a height of seven feet so they flipped it okay and the full size window at the uh basement level is for since you don't have a door to the basement the bottom window that's just it's not a and based on the grading plan we don't have it might get small went I still have a problem with a front parking that I'm gonna that's gonna be an issue I have a problem well again we can modify space par end up having um I have discussed some of the policy with concerning parking and it yeah well we're not done yet either we we have some public comment we got to listen to um I'll make sure nobody else from the board has any comments I would I would want to just let the record known that if board wanted us to eliminate the driveway and front yard parking Al together we could do that um you feel it's a better solution to have off street parking even if it's in the front yard but hearing your's comments I understand that it's just a value judgment and you don't like the front yard parking we would be agreeable to to modifying the application to remove the parking Al together I guess that may be something that we we don't like the Aesthetics of uh and trying to create a neighborhood but you have the potential to have quite a few people in this house and the parking is going to be a major issue for you when on that street I mean I could see six adults in there easily with six cars or Plus I think parking better um but you know listening to the comments speaking with my client so I mean I'm not the favor but I don't again I think the house is just too big just it's just it's just too big well it's it's very important that we all kind of also realize this is a very challenging lot and so there's never going to be a perfect solution or a lot like because it's an undersized line it's it's you know by by not a little bit and where the law is on this is that even an undersized lot that's a challenge needs to be able to be used right so we're coming in with an application that conforms in almost every respect except for that which we have no ability to um we're offering parking but I'm hearing that it's not a great popular choice so we're willing remove that we height building coverage loot coverage and and every other standard on a very challenging site so this is a very modest task that's being proposed um well I think M show Neil said it's bigger than a lot of the other houses sure and a lot of the other houses were built in a very different Europe right than today um you don't really see modern construction unfortunately the size of you know the homes that our grandparents live but um for today's standards this is a very modest home it fits on the site I understand challenging lot comments you know agree with that is a challenging L doesn't doesn't fit on doesn't fit on a site if you don't have setbacks requirement obviously yeah and that's why the whole so you're sitting here tell me if it's on the site but you don't meet the setback requirements so but but I I would only toun to say that if we met the setback requirements the property is on building my understanding is that that amounts to a public that would be a reg I I'm just a little confused by some of this conversation um my Mr Morales this house is intended for your mother correct my nieces my nephews whenever I want to come for holidays and everything okay but would multiple people be living in the house or would just your mother be living in the house well mostly just my mom okay since we all live in red kind oh okay yeah I I that's what confused me because um my colleague you know Sharon said something about six adults and that's where that's where I wasn't clear so it would be just your mom living there yeah so there'd just be your mom living there and you have a car okay and this the photos here of the site I don't see any cars parked there is is I don't I'm not that familiar with the street there typically lot of cars on the street or are there typically spaces available okay but that's legal parking there okay so the space is there okay that's what I I just listen and as to the size of the house um bear with me somewhere I so it was like 1,00 plus the attic would make it about 2100 something like okay 2119 with the attic and 185 by my calculations without the attic okay that's again I wanted to reconcile because and it's a subjective emotional reaction let me 1800 foot house isn't big what are the others in the neighborhood are they well you have to remember there's there's two two family houses which are larger sure they exist there are there's the half multif family which is there's an office building um the two houses next door are smaller but the others are probably in the vicinity of at least 1550 okay in this vicinity of what ofth street heading I'm sorry I just didn't hear what was the number about 1500 1500 yeah that's what I want to understand how it compared to other single family houses that are already there and it sounds like it's a little bit bigger just for lack of a better probably a little bit but probably the two and a half bathrooms helps contribute to that okay but you know most of these hous again when I looked at they were built between 18 202 1922 on neighborhood and so said it's a very buil I know for the fact I live in one too there was no public infrastructure houses the back that was the kitchen and bathroom it's going to be bigger because just infrastructure right okay thanks he said two and a half bathrooms um I count two oh where's the half bath on the first FL okay thank you any other comments from the board before I open that up to the public I would just say on the parking my thought I understand what you're saying about the parking but I'd be hesitant to put the cars on the street if there was an option to take get them off so maybe one spot I know that would be the parking variance but I don't know if no parking is the answer interesting uh situation but it's certainly a non uh traditional street with all the different uses on there open it up to the public does someone from the public want to make a comment about this application come on up come on up and we'll get you put you in the microphone and we're just going to have you state your name and then we'll have you are you in just to be uh totally consistent if you could state your name please and address George okay and your address okay and I'm just going to swear you and if you could just raise your right hand do you swear that the information and testimony you're about to provide to the extent you provid with the truth best your knowledge to help you guide yes thank you go ahead je you can your com my main concern is that this building is too close to my house now which is your house just for the record okay and where is that in relation to this are you right next door are you across the street right next to the wall okay your concern is a lot I can't see that I I could tell you that so your concern is that the proposed house is too close to your lot uh yes the building I know when they gonna make the last question I mean do you have any more questions or comments resing now I'm objecting this okay building okay very sorry but I Okay so we've noted and thank you for attending and thank you for making your comments yeah relative and and and thank you I always would rather hear public comment than people complaining with the facts so anybody who comes that's a good thing um relative to that comment that it would be too close looking at again this picture okay with me the houses across the street 227 229 would it be closer than like those houses or would it be about this like across the street there's a number of houses and they all look pretty close with this comparable closer further apart no I mean going be okay that's all I want I'm looking for context yeah okay 139 okay yeah just looking for how it would be relative to what's already there thank you can I I just also wanted to explain to the resident that gravel and to the board there's this gravel area on the survey that exists on the applicant's property and to the next door neighbor me may be using it as a driveway right now I don't know if you are are you using the gravel area as a driveway yeah there stone is there there Stone okay so I just wanted it to be clear if they were parking in that gravel area they would no longer be able to park in that gravel area I don't want it to be a surprise later on when the house is built that they said that there was a they were parking there yeah that was actually a question if there was like a shared parking agreement there for that no but it it had been reported to me that on visits to the site that there are cars parked there we don't know to there we can presume but yeah and Park on your lot majority of is on most of the okay and You' off heard this property through your mailing yeah sale to miss George you just heard from as well as each of the other Jason property can I just give one legal uh so we talked about this um briefly um the issue of these undersized Lots had always been a real issue and different judges were doing different things with it and because of the challenging issues so the the seminal case was back in 1987 it's called dalm versus Lacy Township Board of adjustment and it was in 1987 it was Judge serpentelli who was then the Ocean County assignment judge and he basically nailed down um what the issues are and what the law should be and what the law is so basically in that case um he said that um he summarized what the law requires of the applicant in undersized lot cases and I'm reading from the case he said the applicant should one be required to carry the burden of proof as in all other cases as to both the positive and negative criteria two the applicant needs to demonstrate that efforts were made to bring the property into conform with the zoning Ori by attempting to acquire adjacent property or by offering to sell the non-conforming property to adjacent owners three the applicant needs to submit detailed plans of the proposed home which describe its appearance and prove its compliance with building codes four the applicant should attempt where applicable to demonstrate compliance with the use side yard and setback requirements and location of the house among other homes on small tracks with similar frontages and five attempt to demonstr rate that the proposed use does not violate any traditional zoning purposes such as light air and open space and then the judge went on to further state that in these situations the board should one evaluate the testimony to determine whether it should elicit additional information to supplement the record two the board should make specific findings of fact based upon the record to support its conclusions three consider whether in lie of denying an application it can approve it subject to reasonable conditions which would modify the proposal and oviate or minimize any negative impact and four remember to be conscientious in its review of The Facts since outright denial May amount to confiscation thus requiring condemnation by the municipality so basically what the law says is you should be sensitive to perhaps if the applicant proves their case to allow them to build something maybe not as tall as they want maybe not as wide big whatever um and it said just be mindful that if you don't you could it's not an automatic thing but you could potentially expose the town to a condemnation claim because they say hey said you you basically Zone my property into effectively into inutility because I can't build anything but again it is clear you should let him build something if he demonstrates the proof to you but it do doesn't necessarily have to be as wide as tall as big as large and that and that's okay so I guess just Kevin are you resting the case your case yeah Reserve I'm gonna say I have the size I know you know it can be smaller and I do have an issue with the parking in front and that is something that we've not allowed in the town we've said no it is not something I would pretty much be willing to negotiate with parking you're modifying the application hereby so you are so I have this modifying application to eliminate all parking all right you're so I just I have it you're modif the application to eliminate all parking it sounds like that's the right thing to do okay and then you're asking I'm assuming for a parking variance yeah we're requesting a parking variance is having no parking in the front being a better zoning alternative okay I I think I just wanted to get that thank you any her testimony concerning uh the availability of on Street spaces um and so forth um so we feel that a variance for those parking spaces is well justified by so we're happy to make that modification okay and yeah well I think you you're building a very nice house I wish you had two lots to work on um member and for the future residents of your property and the properties next to you I think that's where my obligation lies I think you can build a really really nice two-bedroom luxury home on that spot with the basement not go as high no atct and still get a beautiful home that would accommodate your family I just think it's not you know I mean it's huge and it's going to be huge I just think you should cut it way back um there'll still be plenty of room for sleepovers and Grandma and you know you don't have to walk up to the attic and you don't have to try to worry about finishing that or even finishing the basement you can just shrink that down to a really nice two-bedroom and I think could be acceptable to the community it would look like it fit in and and I see what you I see what you're seeing when you see the houses on Dr Parker's Boulevard and you see them they're very big but those are multifamilies and yours looks like it's a a slice of pie that's been hacked and to squeeze into this lot and you're just going to make people around you miserable you're not going to CH I mean you're not going to change that they're going to be pretty they're going to be accustomed to having the space and that's not nothing we can do about that but I think you can you have the option now to make your place a better place I mean making it a little bit smaller and I realize you're trying to get every dollar out of it and that's what that's what developers do that and I think I I totally understand it I just wish you had more space to work with you don't um you're probably never going to get further away from the neighbor than that 3.3 feet going to be able to pass a cup of sugar out the window but I think you can make it a little bit smaller I mean again you've got you've got three large large size rooms and again yeah we can compare it to uh you know the 1922s but that's when that lot was built and developed and that's what we to work with so I would just like to see you cut that down and just ask my architect to to listen just one testimony that I think I guess I think what you've heard there's there's doesn't seem to be an objection to a house being built on this undersized lot it's just the size of it and the parking is problem um you know that I I think could you could fix we've been flexible on the parking issue we've withdrawn any uh front yard parking um and so we've been flexible on that and we've addressed that um but I just have a question for um Mr O'Neal um compared to the house immediately to the north for um how much taller is the proposed construction than the house immediately to the I just want the board to truly understand and let Le comments I don't want there to be a misconception about the height size of this house compared to the others because I think they're afraid they well again with the manner in which the I'm sorry with the manner in which the board determines height we at approximately 29t 35 ft my estimate from looking at the photograph be the house next door is at about 24 to 25 we're talking about a four five minous considering so I just have a point what was the size of the house that you were going to build on Barry Street because that was a total of 1,675 square feet and this is that's a small that was a smaller how right so would it be possible to put that same house on this lot because that's a smaller lot I mean smaller house and you that you found that one acceptable and it give more space you can put that same size on this lot and I think that would be acceptable or this is 2,19 that other one was 167 the other one was going to have your mother in it and this one's going to have your mother in it right so either either way yeah and that had the same amount of bedrooms too what was that I that had that had the same amount of bedrooms it had a master bedroom and um two smaller bedrooms it's about the same size com yeah but I'm just you know thinking since the size of the house is an issue what would it be just as complicated to put that same size on this lot that's much bigger and it won't feel so humongous next to other people property do you happen to have cop of PL from one I I have it right here my C tells me that was a two and a half story oh yeah two and a half stor two and a half stories and with a in the two houses next door is that I mean what would you estimate the size of those houses to be um I would say that they're somewhere between 13 and 15 so then the issue with this house would be the um wi this this the house on Barry Street was 22 feet and we can't do 22 feet fire regulations as far as the setbacks have to really be over 3 feet so we can only we 3 feet narrower and then what happens if you go 3 feet 3 feet narrower is that the bedrooms get reduced to two instead of three because they become too too narrow these are the ones proposed are going to be less than 10t wide they're 10 by I think 14 which is pretty minimal as bedrooms go uh here they if we went to this plan they would have Boost down excuse me a second I mean they'd almost be red they'd almost be reduced to a point where they would be building there is a minimum size for for a bedroom and building it's a minimum square footage and a minimum Dimension so you'd have to go down from a one bedom I mean from a three bedroom to a two bedroom right which programmatically for M moral his mother and situation that they have I think with two bedrooms would be problem that thank you for lightning fast okay well I don't know what to say when two bedrooms is not acceptable for a solution to an undersized lot is a plan that fits it to me um looks like like a hotel from this side just look at can see you can't I mean I I I understand getting all you can get out of it but it's just awful big house your person your personal needs for it we we really can't consider your personal needs for it because that's not what we're here to do consider your personal needs you know if you had 10 kids we saying you know you have to get bunk beds you know this is you know you're only getting so many much space in there Mr chairman what I would suggest respectfully at the risk of overstepping my bounds is um Mr assadi I think you've heard a lot of the comments um both Pro and and concerned so you can either um say hey I need some more time to think about this not in the pressure of these lights um and I'm going to come back or hey I'm going to consider revising the plans I'll come back or I'm pretty satisfied with what we have we've made as many modifications as we can and you'd like to vote tonight or something Mr in between Mr chairman does that sound like a pretty accurate I think that I'm up pretty well so but is there I don't know is there a way to get some sort of General consensus about say the parking issue because we can't really locate the house if we're going to have two Wall Street parking spaces the house is located when sub can't change that I think the board is okay with moving the parking space so maybe then you can no it's still too big well no it's a matter of there's no proposal is no is to have a two face parking building then the house can move forward because it doesn't need to be set back to the but then we need a front yard to line up with houses next door in this Zone guard area alignments aren't permitted in other zones like the Zone your Zone you can make an argument that you can Aline therefore front y fact doesn't apply but not in this Zone because it's a br Zone not in a b Zone um so that that's a question the other question is again if we if you're willing to consider not having all street parking on the site the S property can move wherever we want to toward the front if you think aligning with the houses next door is a preference we can certainly do that um the only thing that is really not possible in the plan is making narrow because once you make it narrower things don't work inside but we can try some other imaginative way to do it but rather than spin wheels if I could get some sort of consensus or suggestion about what the board thinks would be a way to an Avenue to pursue I wouldn't just be kind of guessing I'm I'm less concerned about the parking being on site than I am I know the size of the building too so I me I don't have a problem if there was no parking I mean there's a lot of houses in Red Bank have no parking and it's an undersized lot and it's uh a pretty big building I think you have an opportunity to uh make it a little smaller I I'm sorry I'm just I'm fresh out of my opinion to make it smaller to a two bedroom I think that was pretty clear what I think on you can share that with the others if You' like I do think it's from what was read or about a buildable lot it is a buildable lot it is I think something can be there smaller you know I just I just think this is big for what it is and I definitely you know I think there is something that can be there smaller I'm not saying oh the parking the parking yeah I don't want to even start yeah the front I'm not for the front part the parking and F I'm more for the off off I mean on Street what am I saying on Street par yeah yeah even though I don't like that in red back because there some at that area I think it's okay anybody I disagree with you guys on the parking but I'd lose the uh consensus vote so I think you have to be as creative as you can in the this housing market I'm glad you found another lot to potentially build on so uh yeah I guess got get a little creative and S but I'll defer to the others on the parking if I'm the only one that i' I'd like to see one spot at least but I get it yeah don't me I'm usually the first one saying I want parking on the projects it's just the front of the it's just your location cuz you go to meetings I'm always the first one saying I want parking you know provided with the application so that's my issue it's just where it's located in the front of the house I understand pardon not trying to be funny here but I'm I'm sensing from the last the comments up and down the row here we have like violent agreement here um parking on the street in a smaller house is anybody doing this I think we're all saying that except for Ben okay so I think the variances are minimal I I I get the Lots undiz but I think the V like there's no height variance needed it's they're within the code on a lot of things that normally we'd see way out but again I'm open to seeing a different interpretation if that's what the rest of the boards respect the the years that the other people have had on here so sorry is it possible just to go back and see if we can come back with a plan for a smaller square footage house with the two spaces on the street and the last thing we want to do is go through this and then you get you come back with something that's 1600 square feet and we all say no that's too big so can we decide on maybe a targets wor something so that you know what I'm saying can we go back see if we could redo the plans based on what seems like is getting to some head nodding up here I mean if if the concerns number of bedrooms then square footage really I have no concern with I have no concern with number of bedrooms it sounds like we have to have three bedrooms yeah I know with all respect to you if you're talking about square footage how I do the square footage what the program is is really a material of P if you could have the house at a smaller size with still have three bedroom which there well even though I can't speak for his mother but as a mother someone about his age I say I will still want my big big bedroom and my private bath I'm just saying while the the house guest can have the single room at the other end of the hallway I'm fine with that I just think it's going to be it's going to be heavy loaded with people it has that potential if their family is one person or 20 people I don't mind it's it's going to be a property that you're going to want to use and to create a better neighborhood we're not we're not trying to get you to build an apartment which is wall toall house and we want you to live well and comfortable in it so I'm not trying to say sque that squeet that the room bedrooms make it so there's really a livable spot and even if she hasn't got a car or she has parked on the street or have to walk over the par of the car down the field whatever you have to do but I think you can get a better quality of life in the house said if I was your mother I know what i' want but but that's just the way I see it and I'm not I'm not fighting about the parking because when it snows you're going to move it to somewhere so they can plow the street you know you're going to take care of that so I just less square footage on the house um you know again the whole attic I think you're going to Tower over while five feet difference in height between the two properties um is not a lot to just tell us five feet difference in the highest point five feet when a house is 3 feet from you is a lot different than 5 feet from a house that's 15 ft from looking out to a house you just see a wall straight up so I think if you come down like this and you you'll you'll be everybody will be happy I think so Mr Saudi your your preference for tonight is give you 60 seconds to find out take a quick quick recess sure I'll give you five minutes five minutes such important thank you okay Mr s okay Mr chairman um we understand that we could be um back on your agenda for February 6 um that gives us enough time to um potentially make modifications to the plan submit in time uh so that you can have them see them um and then you know some action um on that them okay um we have we can't commit to exact you know changes that Mr Mor his father and have to discuss a little bit but that gives us enough time to do that and get the plans in okay okay well thank you for that so what we're going to do is we're going to carry this hearing to February 6 2025 at 6:30 p.m. uh Mr Assad for the record uh do you consent on behalf of your client to consent to extend the time frame within which the board has to act and what we'll do is uh Mr chairman I'm assuming we're going to say no further notice unless there's major changes in in the variances that are required um I'm assuming that's not isn't that an issue because they're gonna remove the parking so that's a parking so you do want re notice is it it's up to what do you think Kevin I'm just throwing that in because that is a new variance that we're adding in there re notice okay so there will be new notice um thank you for that but Miss George uh you're GNA get get notice again but can you come back February 6 if you're still interested okay um so Mr chairman if forg a to carry this to February 6 2025 6:30 p.m. with new notice okay I'll make a motion to carry this a second you just all in favor all in favor thank you thank you it you don't have to you know the other the other consideration is we did have an owner also you know he's got to take in consideration Property Owners okay and I don't think she's opposed to something being built know I didn't hear oh she just said she's supposed to have close that seems like it becomes an nonissue with what we said were here don't want to be alone I don't I need okay moving we have 103 East Front Street Medical Center okay Mr chairman well let do a couple of preliminary procedural things Shauna we already accepted notice for this application at the last meeting correct okay and uh so for the second and final time tonight let's wear in Shauna Ebanks uh professional planner and director of Community Development and Jackie durman our board engineer uh ladies if you could Raise Your Right hands do you swear that the information and testimony you're about to provide to the extent you providing be the truth the best your knowledge to help you God I do let the record reflect both have been sworn and what we will do is we will Mark into well um Eileen um Hogan has recused herself from this application so we'll let the minutes uh reflect that as well as the resolution and we will Mark into the record what we we as a board have have before us so first will be A1 is the burough bread Bank Department of Planning and Zoning application package A2 is the uh burrow of Red Bank Green development checklist A3 is a letter uh prepared by the applicant attorney dated August 7th 2024 A4 is the denial of development permit dated March 17 2024 A5 is the uh use variance narrative A6 is the grading and uh SCD plan prepared by Jensen Design Group dated April 17 2023 consisting of two sheets A7 is the minor site plan and use variants prepared by Jensen Design Group dated April 17 20123 revised December 5th 2024 consisting of six sheets A8 is the storm water report prepared by Jensen uh Design Group dated December 5th 2024 consisting of Three Sheets A9 is a response letter prepared by uh Jensen Design Group dated December 5th 2024 consisting of two sheets we have let's see um an INT A10 will be the intent to proceed August 6 2024 a11 is the disclosure of ownership dated August 6 20 24 and a12 will be the tnm associates review memorandum dated December 13 2024 and just for recordkeeping purposes I think the intent uh I'm sorry the disclosure of ownership said it was 100% owned by hmh hospitals Corp um so we didn't have any particular names of directors that we had to relay or anything correct okay uh so does that name um bring up any conflicts or questions of conflicts for any of the sitting board members seeing none all right good evening welcome and thank you for waiting my name is Tyler Spyro Harrison and Nelson and how you sp your last name Tyler zebra could you speak real it's microphones Z like zebra e like Edward E like e like Edward R like Ralph and L Like Larry c b e r l y got it and uh we represent the property owner Riv Riverview Medical Center in connection with the D variant application that before the board this evening uh we have one additional exhibit to Mark which is an aerial of 11 five so we'll mark that as an a13 and that is an aerial photograph so to speak illustrated by way of background R Medical has owned this property since 1987 uh the property is situated in the Waterfront development District consist approximately 33,100 Square fet uh it was formerly improved with the uh with a 4500 square foot commercial building the Terrace building uh and that building has been bacon for approximately 16 to 20 years uh on December 11th 2023 burrow issued a notice of unsa structure requiring the demolition of the existing Bel uh building in an effort to comply riew Medical Center submitted the demolition permit application on March 17th that application was denied as we proposed continuing to use um the parking that has been in use for nearly 20 years uh thereafter the building was torn there anding the Park area and reconstructing the parking area 23 spots um two which will be handicapped and the lock Total Lock coverage is going to be reduced from 13,000 this uh 13,985 square feet to 7,274 feet um we're the reason why we're here tonight is because we're not proposing a principal use on this we're proposing use property just for parking tonight I have with me Paul our professional planner he'll speak to you about the positive negative criteria and go through all the requirements for the D variant I also have with me William Jensen our professional engineer uh and he'll go through the overall site um and what we're planning to do here so it's that you want me to De sure if you could just state your name um and business address please yes good evening it's Paul GLE last name spelled g r y g i e l I'm sorry g r y g i l okay and your business address 70 Hudson Street sweet 5B hoken New Jersey all right good evening you swear that the information and testimony you're about to provide will be the truth the best knowledge to help you guide and just for the record you're testifying tonight in Your Capacity as licensed professional planner in New Jersey thank you give us a little background on here certainly I've been licensed since 1999 by the state of New Jersey I'm also me meric intive certified planners I'm currently a principal of Phillips price GLE ly Hughes planning and real estate Consultants uh I represent both municipalities and the planed for about a half dozen towns currently as well as applicants such as this one have been accepted before this board previously years ago I've been doing this a while that I forget exactly how long ago as well as over 150 other boards throughout New Jersey as great thank you is your license valid and yes I would like to have Ral accepted as expert in professional planning State yes accepted well if you can take us through the um the used Varian aspects of this sure youve already provided some council's provided some of the background of the site and I'm sure the board's very familiar with those as well but exhibit a13 shows it just for the record the property is roughly in the center of a13 where the building is still shown that no longer exists uh this just points at that the area which we're located really it's a campus for Riverview Medical Center even though it's a separate lot um for some time it's Now function as in that regard with employee parking being provided for around 20 years is my understanding on this property couple the key facts even though it's a large site at 33,000 square feet it's um irregularly shaped it tapers down as you get up towards the Nava syn it Narrows down to about 20 21 feet wide so it's um almost a triangular point at the rear there's also a significant grade change behind where the exist the former building was uh the site drops off it actually the elevation steps down about 37 feet uh from East Front Street down to the rear property line so the applicant as we mentioned is seeking to continue essentially to use their property for parking just without having the principal building that previously existed on the site um the property is in the Waterfront development District the WD zone so that is again different Zone District than much of the rest of downtown or the nearby area uh it's primarily intended for other uses other than parking although parking is permitted as an accessory use to offices as well as single family dwellings other permitted uses that's really the primary reason for our appearance here this evening is to allow for the parking to continue uh there will be one other one of C variants we'll be talking about uh briefly at the end of my testimony as well which we'll get to with regard to the Waterfront access um walkway essentially along the navn river but with regard to D1 variant I feel like I can just come right to the chase of the positive and negative criteria because I think it's relatively straightforward the applicant is requesting the D1 use variants that needs to demonstrate the positive criteria that the site's particularly suitable or that it's an inherently beneficial use in this case it's actually supplementing or aiding in Access excuse me inherently beneficial use located a short distance away a hospital is considered inherently beneficial under the law that is by its very nature it promotes the public welfare uh so we are essentially allowing for employees to continue to park for the hospital on this property in addition in terms of the site suitability a 13 shows it pretty well it's a parking lot within essentially the confines of where the asphalt is today we are modifying it somewhat you can hear more from the engineer but the site will be brought up to current standards with regard to aisle widths uh getting rid of there some Center Parking SPAC is currently between the two aisles uh that will be removed so it will just be a standard two-way access aisle with parking on both sides Ada access will be provided uh we'll work to upgrade the lighting and address any other concerns with regard to those engineering issues again despite the fact um it's in the WD Waterfront development Zone the property really doesn't have Waterfront access uh there's no way to provide for a use that really is what you'd find elsewhere in this Zone District where it's you know large waterfront properties that benefit from the views benefit from access to the Waterfront uh the other issue with regard to the lot as I mentioned there's a substantial grade change so we do have a parking lot that is at grade with East Front Street that as you drop off behind there there's essentially no use of the property because of the significant elevation change and this topography we're proposing to continue to use the flat developed previously developed portion uh for parking so I do believe that those reasons with regard to suitability would be adequate to provide the positive criteria for the use varience that again it's continuing a long-standing use of the property that supports an anchor of downtown Red Bank I think for those reasons purposes a of the land use law would be further the public health safety and general welfare it's allowing the existing parking to remain and to be utilized uh to support a hospital which needs this parking as well as providing sufficient space appropriate locations for various uses purpose G of divisible land use La the buroughs master plan in fact talks about keeping the hospital expansion on the north side of East Front Street there specific language regarding this and we're essentially doing just that we're keeping parking north of the street within walking distance so um employees don't need to cross the street you have a very busy intersection or crosswalk just to the west of the site uh we're going to be able to have parking provided on the north side of the street to make it safer for pedestrians to continue to walk back and forth as opposed to crossing the street uh lastly with regard to the positive criteria I could go into great detail on the inherent beneficial use but it said there's a four-part test won't bore you with all the different steps your your attorney can sure F more on it but essentially we need to talk about how the public interest will be furthered for inherently beneficial uses uh by allowing this use and here it's again supporting a long-standing hospital use which has a need for parking um we're doing it the same locations we're not further encroaching into residential neighborhoods or any other locations within the burrow and frankly I think this the fact that we're upgrading a lot reducing coverage speaks to the fact that it would be supportive of the inherently beneficial Hospital use I think for those reasons the positive criteria would be addressed uh just briefly the negative crit I've already alluded to some of it the fact that the use was not be changing from what was there previously uh we anything we're going to be upgrading so lighting and other factors would be dealt with and there'd be no substantial detriments from continuing to utilize the property as it has been for some number of years despite a building not being on the property uh lastly if the demonstrate there's no substantial detriment to the master plan of public good a couple quick things the zoning ordinance actually allows for off-site parking there's a St there's a section that says within 500 feet of a principal use you can have off-site parking we're not saying we don't need a use variance but there's precedent that if you have a building that has off-site parking it is permitted under the zoning ordinance so it's anticipated sometimes that's the case here um as I mentioned before about the master plan the 2023 master plan recognized that the hospital is important and wants to make sure it can stay in place but also accommodate its existing facilities as well as any growth and that constraining uses to the north side of East Front Street is important so we're doing just that uh so I think we're we're certainly consistent with the master plan objective to try to support Theos hospital and to maintain it in the location where it is today I got I got a question will there will there be a gate to access to that parking or how are you going to control who Parks here question I think that's a that's a question that'll be our when we call him up okay make and just briefly there's one other variance or waiver we're seeking uh from section 490 - 148 F2 where it talks about in the Waterfront development District that all applications for uh properties abing are continuous to the river need to provide for a 25 foot minimum width walkway uh we're respectfully requesting a variance or waiver from that standard because the site a doesn't really have much the way of access to the water there's a 21 foot it's hard to see out here I know but there's a very small area where you're kind of at a Cove in the river if you to the east of that it's single family residential to the West we're essentially a another hos and property then the building itself in fact if you stood there and look up we do have photos we can get into if you need to that show that you're looking right up at patient rooms at the hospital it's nothing that's being connected by providing for a strip of Waterfront walkway on a 21 foot wide site that's not connected to other walkways um so unfortunately while it's a nice objective for most of the Waterfront of Vel Zone maybe further west you know in this District doesn't really make sense on this particular property it would be a hardship to provide for it in fact to have to put in Ada access to get down 37 feet from the street to that walkway that would be really a walkway to Nowhere uh so we are requesting a C1 hardship variance from that one particular standard okay any questions for Miss witness uh a quick question that maybe is more for the engineer but I'm to throw it out there so he can get it together um since it's not available to walking down the hill um will you have a fence of some sort to control people from walking down and trying to launch a kayak in that 20 fet and I don't know if you can do anything about people who can access cuz people who are on water don't know that they can access parking lot or they think they can access Park Lot have you thought about that that's all maybe aent or two just question again the only point I would have is if you look at the lot and we have some photos that we can show that help illustrate this it's kind of a undeveloped wild area there you can't can't even you have a hard time hacking your way up the hill to get there we haven't seen our creative kayakers fa yes I'll defer the engineer with anything else we're going to mark that well uh A14 is an illustrated picture of the uh water area of the site this is looking west from the northernmost portion of the property all right and just for the record do you know who took that photograph represent a partner of my my friend Brian Nelson went out took this photo thank you hospital and the and roughly when month ago approximately yes thank you just before the last schedule corre the director it's looking more to the north kind of hard to point from the end of the property looking towards the hospital building itself so you can see how it's farther out into the ri you know towards the river those are patient rooms that you can see at the end there there's a parking lot below that if you turned and look completely to the right you would see docks and backyards of single family residential properties in the other direction where certainly is no Waterfront path in this C and our engineer can further all any other questions for this witness any questions from the public no don't see so okay with that um I'd like to introduce our professional engineer um you just give your name and business address please yes so my name is Will Jensen J business address is50 35 s 250 and New Jersey all right uh if you could raise your right hand do you swear that the information and testimony you're about to provide will be the truth the best your knowledge to help you guide yes thank you and just for the record you're testifying tonight in Your Capacity as a licensed engineer profal Engineers first time in front of the board I've testified for various boards through New Jersey mostly M County um I'm a licensed professional engineer in the state of New Jersey I started my own company in 2015 graduated from Clemson University in 1997 after practicing in and civil site design and traffic Transportation projects well except thank you um i' just like to quickly describe I'll show the so on the aerial I'll just talk about the existing site and go into the design I don't know if anyone has our plans in front of us but we also have sheet number five which is the skate plan I could flip over and show you once I get talking about the actual design of the project but as shown on the existing aial um existing building is down the property's been properly uh vegetated and slope stabilized requirement um once the building was down the existing parking facilities still exists the asphalt currently in the parking area there's a cross slope across all the parking stalls that goes 3 to 4% uh we're proposing we're going to do an improvement there to propos it to be around a half% 8 comp for the whole parking area so that was one reason for the improvment as um part of the product as well and as recommended by the professionals we're proving a stor management system underground to minimize to collect all the run off from the roadway and also providing some inlets to help with the and colle the tra before it goes into the recharge system under the um sheet five of six around our lands plan thank you uh there's also request for up in the western portion of the property there's a commercial property and then halfway up into the parking lot when you go to park there's a residential property that's there so opposing landscape buffer in area with approximately 20 Evergreen Green Green Giant trees to landscape and offer that residential property there's also existing vegetation along that property line with fencing coming back to your your question there is an existing fencing on the bottom it goes across the entire property it looked like it was collapsing in the other picture it is deteriorated but that that's the existing fening exists we haven't proposed any but the something that cly something the propos and and along that along that uh Eastern side isn't there a bunch of bamboo that's up along there also there's a a bunch of different types of I think it might be in the photo but there's a bunch of different uh on the western property line you about on the Eastern side yes it goes along there's existing fencing there as well um there's some well Mark that uh ly what are we up to A4 so a15 is next a15 and what a15 is an illustrated picture of the site taken by Brian Nelson again area looking to the east I was down in the parking lot the other day checking it out I live just around the corner so and in this Photograph you can see the residential the white structure there's a residential property uh the large mature trees and there's some other vegetation that goes down the hill along so that's that would be the area what's the address what's the address of the residential of the house microphone what's the address of the residential property shown in the photograph driveway Drive wait for that property comes down here right along the Eastern property line and as it crosses there's also a fence line that blocks out the commercial property here and it enters right into there driveway there there's a driveway there I think it's 109 also two existing light F pictures on the west east portion of the center of the existing parment facility they continue to use um professionals require requested lighting study which we're in the process of preparing and if it's find that there's any additional or some lighting required we would add that their requ me ordinance requ again are you planning at eight to this parking lot so there there is no gate as part of this project it's purely private for employees and each employee will know who was allowed to park there so and it's it will be pretty much full every day so it's not like you have worry about public coming in and out of there you could also put signs in the front to say private parking by the board just just uh to be clear this has been used as employee parking for approximately two decades without issue and I don't believe to the best of my knowledge there was ever a gate in at the front of the c um will this be like will it be employees that are shift working around the clock or administrative only I'm I'm curious because if there's going to be shift changes at 11 o'clock at night or with the new shifts something else that might change it with the foliage change the lighting spillage change um that may change once it becomes an official parking lot and you're shifting your shifts are working I I'm not sure that we have any designation uh for what which employees are going to be parking there I can tell you it has been used by employees for 20 years um and but you don't know if it's been used for night shifts early it will be used the same manner that it has been that it has been so okay so the residents and the that single family home would be aware of the shift change if there is one yes and we're also proposing all of these um plantings to provide a buffer between the resent leaves just to confirm there will be Evergreens so green giant what will there will there be fence put up or I think there's kind of fencing that's like that's not something that was proposed um I can certainly see if that's something that would be considered um but as of now no no fencing is proposed and one last uh question regarding the two part the two handicap paring spaces will be Ada compant and also the front currently where the the sidewalk comes across our driveway access point I believe there's sidewalk steps up and steps down it will be making that ADA Compliant as well so we have a full ADA Compliant walkway that goes across our property across our proposed um access driveway and then continue down towards towards the hos detailed design of that will be submitted to the professional for review and to meet ada8 requir lastly all outside Agy are ending submission come back and willed any questions from the board the light fixtures um the light poles where exactly it's going to be where the existing ones are so right now the existing you see where the existing light fixtures are right those are all that's proposed until we get the the light study back and if it determines that additional light fixtures will be required there would either be have to go to the front towards the front of the property or towards the the rear par for the parking facility any new light fixtures would have the house Shields and the [Music] LED town the the request that be a condition of approval that we can either demonstrate compliance with the ordinance uh with the working closely with tnm uh the bur Engineers uh or to provide a lighting plan if we cannot demonstrate that it satisfy thank you and I'm sorry what did you said that if it's required the additional lighting fixtures would go where the additional light based on my preliminary view of it it would either go towards the West to the back back portion of the the parking lot or toward the the front Corners thank you the existing light fixtures are pretty much in Center on both sides of parking lot and I think either way you said it's not going to have an adverse impact no lights SP over onto the adjoining uses any any new fixture would have the house you could call it house cut offs that's what they're called very house Shields that keep spillage from going over on the property the only thing I think that you could consider as a must do is a fencing along the existing with the residential and the side where it does have the drop to the river I think that that fence looks like I mean put that up again yeah chain link pretty bad yeah that's long see that's the existing CH something to consider to uh the what kind of fence you want existing fence is chain and there's a section where it's fored or is that no longer like towards the end um would you suggest the fence be barded on the side that um face is the residential property and then chain link towards the back if they put it in the AR that you once they mature trees will be better than the um board fence you maintain and something more sightly than those white big concrete things they have at the end of the parking lot now so right now that's that's 100% for safety I know yeah but it's pretty disgusting uh if we get approval those will be gone and there will be a lovely new parking lot um and I'm sorry what what is that Ray that's going to be removed the cinder barriers got it Jersey bar and just for the sake of the board so um I know we brought up the the planner brought up the um the special requirement in the ordinance that requires for um property owners that are uh requesting site plan approval um to Prov provide an access easement so it's not that the board the burrow is asking for the applicant to build a walking path but just to provide that easement should we decide to do something with that with a path um that easement is provided to us so it's just the access easement that we're needing not for the applicant to build something for the 21's but the 20 foot at the at the base um yeah oh 25 25 foot accessing yeah right so that that is something that we are going to be requesting a waiver for as you can see Bill maybe you can explain that rear portion of the site the 25 ft 25 foot just across the that yeah so this this this would be the area that we're talking about in the back here that's deals with the you know TDE movement I'm not sure it's a lot of other areas you know also have the tide movement along the river um the riverfront so it's not an issue it's it's basically based on on the board on the Burrow's design for whatever is to come in that public easement um whatever future plan that is but a river Walker walk or whatever type of um enjoyment but we understand that the terrain and the grading is difficult um I've just walked on Sunset um the site the incinerator site on Sunset Avenue and there's Parts where it drops immediately and there's times when it slowly grades down so I understand it's a difficult um terrain but um that is something that the burrow has placed in an ordinance especially for the Waterfront um district and um the other districts that AB the river Swimming River and the navyn um and I understand your concern about that the sloping and again the terrain is is difficult but um that's just for future planning for whatever the burrow has in store yeah so we're not asking you to build anything we're just asking for these but right that's not something that um we we are seeking away from that just well you better go back that's probably not negotiable believe our property this property is the residential property that's out of the where fronts would be the last property and you have the the hospital and I'm not sure what the BAC and that's all all the hospital so we're really talking about one piece of property in the water front then we're talking about Hospital uses to this side the chemotherapy uh unit is right here and they're building out chemotherapy and if you can actually look at this photo you can see people in the chemotherapy board so we do have an interest in preserving the privacy of our patients and that's something why we another reason why we would not we were looking for that waiver or variance for the 25 Y water yeah I shaa you know what um part of our master plan isn't it it's a part of the ordinance itself and yeah just Deni the way on that that's all SE as I understand and I could be completely wrong but I just from years and years ago I seem to recall that in the master plan there's some type of reference to yeah Riverwalk River yeah with the idea that it somehow connect at the time if it if if it's ever I mean this is from decades ago Oyster Point all the way to the the the Park yeah to the park but it any any property that abuts the river yeah and my understanding and again for what it's worth is I think that in the buroughs master plan the concept was if it ever comes to play presumably they didn't want to have to spend a lot of money acquiring all the the nation all the easements that's what I'm assuming the right right yeah that that was the point of this um this ordinance um and again the burrow can decide not to extend it all the way out but just to have the ability to to have that act that easement um is just the choice um but I I understand that you would like the privacy of the um the patients and we respect that but um it all depends on again the design if there is something that to stretch all the way across um but it's just a design and the whole purpose of it is for enjoy enjoyment of the public to the river no no we understand and Tra just out of curiosity I think usually the hospital goes to the planning board right yeah well because this is an um use variant it's a used variance but the hospital is in its own District the M Ms um Zone and this is actually in the WD so this is outside of the medical um Services zone so I didn't know this but I mean just because they've gone to the plan board have they ever had to give the easen for the other part of the hospital or that's never really come into play it depends on when the that ordinance was on I think when they put the cyber knife in yeah yeah the chain the chain link is fine second chain link fine sorry yeah chain link is fine okay you make a black chain black I mean quite frankly you won't see it from the road because the but if you want black chain I see this picture again you have to walk many feet down um actually see this so the grade is quite great um what is the gr front back I think the 37 from front to back right now the parking facility drops off you it closer to the mic please thanks sorry just from where we're proposing the end of our parking skall down to where fences 15 to 20 feet but um blackchain four foot high would that be fine or you go up to six that look like four feet it's existing is the existing what you say I think you could go up to six so it's it's in a rare so you could go up to six if you want to I'm okay with it if there's going to be an easement and you don't want people walking back there looking in the windows then you want a six foot fence just as long as it's not within the easement where the easement we if it is a condition of approval to have the place place it most likely the same okay I don't know if you can see on the plan but it's that's in approximately think 30 30t from the back of the the parking line and then Mr chairman just one other real a probably a stupid academic question so for the attorney or the planner there's no there's been no merger of the Lots right because you don't the hospital does not own the adjacent L you got the single family home and then so no there has not been merger so this is owned by R Medical this is riew Medical Center this is riew Medical Center this is another entity of the hospital there is no so so condition and approv this include getting rid of the waiver they're asking for you won't Grant it you won't grant that variance because that it's actually not a waiver it's actual variance okay so so we grant that variance if the board chooses not to I have a couple minutes sure take a break minute break we could take a break yeah could take a break we will take take a five minute break in of the comments from the board uh we'd like to request this application be carried so we have time to discuss with the proper okay problem how much time do you need I mean I can have you at the next meeting the 16th I have a large appli on that night um but I can put you on first depending on how long you need uh could you put us on that application or that um that meeting date and out to you that okay what is that dat that's the6 and then after that it is [Music] it's the February 20th so we're going to adjourn this to January 16th or the 20th February 20th February before we we have any other questions for our professionals if it's a matter of me just coming back and being able to agree uh to the to not request a variants U there any other questions that are for our professionals on other views variants or the uh I guess that's really it any questions from the board any questions from the public any comments while we're at it oh okay y so we're carrying it to the 16th yes but I I think um Mr chairman what what the um attorney was asking is I'm assuming he's coming back without his Witnesses right and so that that's that's okay think that's a A wise choice well it should be an easy one either either you're not gonna go for it or you are January 16 is fine okay so just for the record you consent to January 16 2025 at 6:30 p.m. uh no further notice um and then uh there's no one here but if there is anyone here from the public or they're listening to the tape uh please come back January 16 2025 we have the applicant's consent um and we can have a motion to that effect I'll make a motion carry it to January 16 second faor great thank you motion toour second was second Sharon Sharon yeah oh take them it's