##VIDEO ID:EuTkqXsxtvM## e e e e hi April H no something from that just for e greetings hello he right 615 really today thanks for doing the minutes for me Susie you're welcome I will do them I will do them today okay I'll take the corrections okay thank you what's the process for that I didn't want to be nitpicky but I just saw a couple of little things should I just send them back to you when I see them I'm I'm assuming he probably saw the same ones I did uh yeah I don't usually get them ahead of the meeting I don't see why they couldn't be sent um yeah we usually we discuss them in a group so what I do is when I get the minutes I just mark them up and then when we have our meeting now I just raise my hand for those items okay and so basically we amend the minutes on the floor okay meeting thanks folks hey looks like we're all here everybody's here great all right Summer's over thanks for right it is uh all right so thanks everybody for meeting on a a weird night for us so just uh for those of you who weren't at our last meeting we're trying to get back on the correct uh cycle so um we will meet guess in a week and a half or so uh and that'll that'll put us in back on on track we can stick with the Tuesday nights then 17 yeah correct yes and uh actually one of the things we're going to do tonight is look at our schedule um and uh including the um you know when we G of plan on meeting with each of the Departments so we'll get to that a little bit later all right um I have one additional item that wasn't in the posted agenda which is uh we have to discuss um an open meeting uh law violation we'll get to that uh a little bit later but um other than that I will kind of just take us through this agenda so bear with me for a sec uh okay all right so why don't we first uh look at minutes from August 27th okay so I'll move to accept the minutes from Tuesday August 27th second all right any comments Jim yeah there just I'm I think Kathy was referring to the same things that I noted too they're just a couple of grammatical things that caught our attention y uh you want to walk through this yeah 2C uh require should be required yep and 3E 3E meet should be meetings Kathy did you were there others uh for a uh the contract is not projected to effect rather than a good yeah that's the frustrated English teacher in me yeah well I never get that one right yeah we're two English teachers here on fincom oh boy and I'm doing the minutes now we're in trouble yeah yeah you're in trouble George no it's a learning learning yeah learning I'm gonna benefit from this thank you nice one sometimes any other no sorry any other suggestions okay uh so we've got a a um motion to approve the minutes uh what do we say as amended uh and we have a second so uh George you want to well actually iin Groves I heav way I cashew I moer I Salvador I and Stein abstain okay okay thanks um and thanks Susy as your your your last minutes until uh you get roped into this again in a few years hopefully it's a few years and in a few weeks uh okay next up uh we are gonna just look at um our budget request letter and you give me a sharing privileges oh yeah sorry no problem so last meeting we looked at a draft um that I put together but we really didn't give you all enough time to make suggestions and uh so um our goal is to finalize this letter tonight um and Bob uh has a uh some suggestions that he shared that I'm going to put up on my screen and then if any others have uh suggestions as well we ought to look at them uh those come I didn't see them they were they just came they just they just came okay I'll I'll it up then and I I couldn't open the paragraph the the pages so the version I have word and and pages I believe but yeah so this is this is right they're the so this is this is what Bob shared Bob I just highlighted I think the two if I if I um read this correctly the two suggestions that you made right they were limited to these highlighted areas yes that sound right bub okay all right so um the first and maybe you could give us a little bit of kind of your perspective on both of these suggestion so one was to strike this sentence that concludes the first paragraph despite this our budget related articles were passed with only a small number of descending votes at annual town meeting uh anything you wanted to share well on that well I like the idea of that being struck from the draft but it was shown as strut when I received the copy that you sent me uh I guess this oh is that right yes okay but I like it because I don't think we should make kind of those kind of statements about about uh you know celebrating the fact that when people come to town meeting and and and many people are motivated to come down to T meting in order to support spending to you know I don't think it's necessary to to make that statement that's my own view uh the paragraph that I inserted which follows it is simply just a statement that we understand as finance committee and as managers of the budget that uh there's the balance that we all know we have to strike between uh useful and necessary uh and costly services and the the burden on taxpayers so I thought that would just reference that issue to town departments because it's I think it Bears repeating that this is part of the process that we have to uh undertake in order to come up with a a budget that works for all and it's I think it's really important to point out that a regressive tax because it is a regressive tax and it falls much more heavily on certain individuals than on others uh that this is just mind-blowing to me that we haven't we haven't been able to address that issue except through this kind of means tested uh subsidies which I don't really care for because they I don't like the way they're structured but again we have the system that we have it's not likely to change in the foreseeable future so that those remarks just reflect that okay all right um let's see if there are any reactions comments on Bob's suggestion so George well yeah I this adding this paragraph I'm not sure it's our responsibility to tell the department heads that the property tax laws in Massachusetts are aggressive um we all know that I think it's more important to tell them that you know we our goal is to keep the total increased budget and that's why I'd like to word it at two 2.5% if we want to put in the comment about regressive I think we should Define why we think it's regressive which is this property tax is based this tax is based on the value of properties not the income of individuals and I would also say it falls most heavily on retirees or fixed incomes or other fixed incomes I don't think we should say that because we're we're picking out retirees and people on fixed incomes I think what we can say it falls more heavily on indivi on low earning individuals households with lower incomes because that's true there's other classes of people and other types of people in our town who are also affected adversely from property taxes so those are my comments just about this paragraph I got more comments further down good okay um sorry one second uh so one of your suggestions here I'm not going to make it permanent but was it falls most heavily on households lower income households I lower income yeah it's not just retirees we have lots of parents in town who are struggling and yeah okay um I um feel like that is not an appropriate um this is not an appropriate place for these words I feel like it implies that that's not something that the people who um organize their budgets and send them in to our town it implies that they're not aware of that I don't I don't think that's true um and I think that we know that the people that do the work in this town work hard at what they're doing and dedicate more effort than their salaries even indicate so I just don't feel like this is the place to um bring up these topics if if this topic this topic might go in front of Voters um but not the service providers and then we did not come to a conclusion as a committee that we wanted to keep the total increase to 2.5 so that's a debate that we all have to have here um and in fact we um in the draft that AJ put together it it talks about level service so there's a piece to be worked out here and then if if Advocate if um advocating to take out despite this budget related articles were passed with only a small number of um dissenting votes that also is political um is that relevant to depart depart Ms um it is actually to me it is because it says to the Departments that they are um the voters are supporting the numbers they gave us that we put in the budget but I don't I feel like maybe we could take that out if we want to say this isn't a political instrument this is asking the Departments to put together a budget April um I have no problem striking the last sentence in the first paragraph I I don't think that's necessary and I I also agree that this isn't a time to be political with this request to the department heads this is certainly material we can discuss when we're meeting with people and discussing their budgets but I'd rather not see um the second paragraph included in this draft letter okay uh Jim yes well I support um the second paragraph it's good for us to remind um everyone including department heads that the finance committee does represent um or supposedly is supposed to represent the interest of the taxpayer in town and um it although I'm not sure we always do that neverthe less it's important to remind people that that is something at least that we do have some belief in and this paragraph does go uh to and speak to that issue Bob yeah I just want to defend the paragraph just a little I'll say to me uh my definition one of my definitions of politics is how Public's money is spent that's what politics is the method that we use to figure that out both in national state and local governments and you know we all believe I think that we we all believe in a value of fairness and I think that I'm just trying to point out in this paragraph that fairness uh is part of our concern as members of the fincom when we work on this budget yes people that come to us requesting funds to run their various departments will always need more to do more work to do better work to perform more successfully and we always have to balance that against what I try to point out in this short paragraph which is the ability of people to pay particularly those who don't have the resources that many do have in this town There's No mechanism other than trying to control spending uh that for us to address that uh uh as as members of this committee now I just found out today that my social security is going up 1.8% this year so if I look at that one 1.8% and I haven't figured out yet the Medicare is going up as well uh you know 2 and a half% of my property taxes uh will be or the budget which will be reflected somehow in my property taxes uh you know it's it doesn't really work out mathematically uh you know it's uh we have to address that issue and the fact that people I agree with with with you know I understand the point that that George made about that retires are not the only people that have Financial uh uh challenges but it is true that we have a significant de demographic in this town that does fall into that category and just from my own observations uh there's many people that are having a hard time keeping up with the inflation which doesn't just affect the town's government but it affects the taxpayer as well so I I think it's a very simple and I was hoping it be very uncontroversial uh paragraph and I I stand I still support the idea of us putting it in there um the idea that it's regressive tax I I don't I'm not wetted to that it's it's not obvious to everybody that's regressive tax because I've I've been engaged in uh discussions in this committee where people have pointed out to me that well my house is uh is appraised at X number of dollars and so I pay more tax than you do Bob well you know it that does that argument doesn't is is fallacious because the the gap between you know incomes as a taxes as a percentage of of income and is is great it is is is very very very very remarkable because you know someone could make hundreds of thousand dollars and pay less than a per the property tax and their neighbor might pay up to 50% of their income to property tax so this is an issue that we have to be aware of B I think your your I think your point really is that right it's a fixed rate that applies to all households right it's not a graduate at rate like an income tax so I mean I think that's what defines it as a agressive tax well I would say what defines it as regressive is the basis for the tax is not your ability to pay the tax that's what makes it regress it because if I inherit a big piece of property but I don't make a lot of money I'm up shits Creek you know so that's why I consider it regressive um I you know listen to everybody else's comments I just want to speak up on this right the I didn't even think about the 2.5% yeah we don't know what it's going to be what our total budget goal is because we don't know what our revenues are we don't know if there's going to be new revenues we know there's a number of bills that can provide us with new revenues so we don't know that at this point in time that we have a problem also I do think this sentence is political we're making a statement about the way the state of Massachusetts taxes and I don't think this is the place to do it and I would also say that all our department heads know what's going on we're not telling them anything here about regressive tax that they don't know most all of them live in town except for I think the police chief and Ryan um so I'm I April made the point that we could certainly talk about this in meetings with these different department heads or at some point if we find ourselves in a difficult situation but you know in the next sentence we talk about financial challenges everybody knows we have Financial challenges so I I I would vote against putting this in and and the finance committees job can debate that all day long by the way Jim Hemingway made the comment that we represent the people but you know we do more than that we need to keep the town operating and we're the ones who have to balance things and so we have to look at where we are and overall I like this budget because we're requesting them to tell us what they think they need for level funding and we can't tell them what to do now we wouldn't know what they need to operate their departments if we told them to give us strip down budgets I want to know what they need to operate their budgets if in March we find that we don't have the revenues for the budget then we need to go back and find places to get that money that's when I think you go to the managers to say now we really got to work with you I'm sorry I I speak too much Kathy uh I don't have a strong feeling one way or the other about the second paragraph but I'm wondering with regard to this the last sentence of the first one um what it may more sense just to spin it differently you know I'm assuming our job is to remind the department heads of you know how difficult a job this is and how fiscal 25 was challenging but we did it we got it they we and they got it done um even though the budget increased by almost 4.5% so rather than say it was passed with only a small number of dissenting votes maybe just say something like despite this U our budget related articles were passed you know with a majority or or however you want to say it in a more positive tone something like or passed by a majority yeah I mean it's it's kind of stating the obvious but it's reinforcing that it was a tough year the majority of Town's people recognized you know the work that was done yeah okay uh let's see Susie I think George U misspoke when he said level funded I'm sorry level yeah service especially as we have a new um person and sometimes that word does get lost on us but it's a level Services proposal further down on the paragraph sorry about that yeah um all right so if I can just I'll give my two cents here so I'm not hearing a lot of uh supporters of this first sentence so I I'm going to suggest without actually doing a vote uh that we just strike this this sentence even the the cleaned up version that Kathy shared um that that seem reason anybody wna make a last ditch effort to salvage the sentence all right so let's get rid of that um okay so now we we get to this paragraph it seems to me that the critical point here right is is not so much what the the detail well it's not so much the paragraph but it's kind of what is the guidance that we're giving them right because we're we're potentially giving them con contradictory guidance at one point in the in the letter we say um we are asking you to present a level service budget okay that's potentially produ produces a budget proposal that's some num number different than 2 and a half% right it could be it could be lower it could be but you know in some cases it may be higher and so I think what what we ought to get clear about even aside from the language that's are you know that that's shared here is what is our guidance for this essentially first step in the process of having department heads propos a budget is it to come back with a budget proposal that is a two and a half or no no greater than a two and a half percent increase from fy2 or is it to come back with a level service budget and I think we have to like just make a a critical like a just a decision about what's the right guidance and that'll then determine what we communicate in this paragraph or in the L in the later paragraph folks does that does that seem to make sense to people so um I'm wondering if I don't um does anybody have I mean I think we I think we have a pretty good sense of like you know where people sort of stand on this issue so I don't know if maybe we ought to just vote um uh you know on on on which of these sort of competing uh uh bits of guidance to to share with with department heads so maybe from fincom Members if you can if you can tell me how many of you support the guidance that would read something like would like to keep the total increase to no greater than two and a half percent over fy2 um can we just take a little poll without doing a motion here yeah Arvin okay Arvis nid says no I wouldn't want to add that in there I'd like to shrike this whole program okay uh let's see uh Bob well yeah I I yeah uh Jim yeah I would keep it in okay all right uh I'm G I prefer the level service guidance so I'm gonna vote no on this uh who's next L services from Susie moer okay and uh who's next Kathy yeah I guess level service budget works for me okay all right and April oh you're muted April sorry my husband's practicing drums um uh I would support level level Services as the guidance which could be could be two and a half percent right right hopefully hopefully it is right for for for many departments imagine it probably won't be for the school but we'll we'll see right um okay so I think given that that has implications about what we do with this paragraph so um I don't think we can say at least this sentence with this in mind the finance committee would like to keep the total increase to 2 and a half percent because again that potentially contradicts guidance we're sharing later so I think with given how we just voted I'm going to strike at least that sentence um so then the question becomes like is there do these first couple of sentences in this paragraph do they you know add some value to this letter so does anybody have uh any other additional thoughts about that like is there some way to include these two sentences or the concept somewhere is it is it worth doing uh Bob to say something to respond to embellish what Jim Amway said and to respond to what George said U and if you and George you know because you've read the handbook that we get from uh the mass Municipal Association and from the the association of Finance committees that lays out the history and function of Finance committees in town government and they refer they refer to the finance committee in various ways one of which one description is a watchdog one is but but it's very clear that they say that we have a checks and balances government and of course it does it does include the executives which are the select board and also the town employees are represented by the select board in in rough understanding my understanding of the document but the town meeting which is our our our our populous is represented by the finance committee so that is we're in between the town government it's need for funds and the taxpayer and that's our job is to mediate that uh that relationship and we represent the taxpayer I think that's pretty clear to me and I I disagree with you that it's not I know we have responsibility to undertake that negotiation and end up with a budget which is fair and Equitable and represents uh the interest of the taxpayer overall basically because the taxpayer needs Services as we've all understand and we can argue about what services are essential which ones are not but we definitely I think represent the taxpayer and that that is why I put this set I wanted to include the sentence in our document because you know in good faith Town employees Town department heads really do want more resources to do a better job you know whether it be a new firet truck Cruiser uh you know whatever it might be and we have we have to uh stand in the way of that and represent the ability to pay part of the equation so uh I don't think there's anything wrong with that's the way it's designed that's the way it's supposed to work uh Susie I've read that manual twice um carefully and I've taken a lot of notes in it and what I read in that handbook is that we're involved in a process and I've actually found sections in that book and I'm like wow we got that done we're doing that Capital planning projecting over time the town of shutesbury has worked at creating a budget process that has a lot of pieces in it that are right in that manual it is not saying that we are in some sort of adversarial role or the only people who are thinking in terms of the taxpayer and it's not that we're only thinking in terms of what departments want it is a process it is a balance we've taken many of the steps to make that that happen and um and I think the town of shsb is doing quite well financially it's stable it's met a bunch of things that are like not expected and it has met things that are expected because it has processes in place so I do not see I I know it has the word Watchdog in that once but it has a lot of other words in that manual that say we have a job to keep this together to to see the longer picture and to meet the needs of the town and we rely on the providers of those services and I do not believe we're excessively supporting them and I don't believe they come to us with excessive demands I feel like we're very balanced about this and in reading that manual a couple of times through my notes keep coming up with oh we're doing this we're doing this right and I think that our success shows in the way our town runs um so one suggestion just to wrap up this this letter I mean I think my feeling is these sentences are probably not necessary but I also don't have like a huge objection to including them I think I if we include them I think we probably just ought to move it slightly uh to and I I was thinking maybe um because I just don't think it sort of belongs as its own paragraph So potentially somewhere like up here after we talk about how fy2 I don't know but again I'm not I'm not convinced it's necessary but but like I said I I you know if if member you know if few members feel strongly that it adds value to the letter I'm okay with it being in there uh April yeah maybe just one way to change it would be our budget is supported mostly through the residential property taxes which has a greater impact on lowincome and fixed income residents or households something to that effect yeah which has a greater impact uh is that you said yeah on lower income household fixed and fixed income low yeah lower and fixed fix Yeahs okay how do that how do people feel about that Bob how do you feel about this I I would I find that to better than leaving it out yes I would accept that okay okay um George I don't know what value that sentence brings to the process we're asking the department heads to give us their budgets we want detailed budgets we're going to follow up with them to learn about and make sure we understand how their departments off operate what they need to provide level Services I think it's more important to put a caveat in this and say at the end of our budget process before town meeting we're going to review the total impact of all the budgets and at that point we should warn everybody there is a possibility we'll come back and ask for more Cuts I think that's how this letter should read but that's me I just don't see value to this uh I don't see how that's relevant to asking them to tell us how much money they think they need to operate their budget they already know about the challenges they all live in town they all pay property taxes just like us all right um so why don't we do this why don't we take a vote on whether to include this sentence in this first paragraph As written here you know as modified here and see how people feel about it and then uh and then we can take it from there uh George AR ntis take it out rooves I Hemingway I uh cashew I'll say I moer abstain who's next uh Kathy did we lose Kathy I no I'm here thinking Salvador I my only suggestion might be if you're going to leave it in um it maybe belongs better in the third paragraph than in the first one two three yeah uh Comm minimiz all right uh well let's let's take uh April's vote and then we'll figure out if we want to move it ail I I think we could should keep that uh sentence included and I am open to I think maybe the third paragraph is more appropriate all right so we commend departments for minimizing uping SP resing PR uh and maybe after this is our starting point throw it there okay so yeah should I work for folks sure sure okay yeah all right death yeah thanks for hanging in I know I know this like editing by consensus can be uh painful process but you know I'm I'm happy we have a something we can we can share now so okay I will I'll clean this up uh after we wrap up but um this is our budget request letter so let me stop sharing and uh Bob thanks for taking the time uh you know to draft your suggestions I appreciate that let me talk about what was important to me so I appreciate it yeah okay uh let's say okay and I don't think we necessarily need to do anything other than update the fiscal year to the budget form but let me just share it um quickly just to make sure that we're good with it uh why isn't that open sorry guys my computer's slow okay it is okay uh any need for any changes to this let me make it bigger all right so uh we will again like we've done for the least I think the last couple years we'll pre-populate the fy2 budget amounts and then they'll enter proposed amounts for FY 26 and then we have a short little section for them to mention uh any potential Capital requests they might make this year so let me go to Susie last year when I Was preparing for our meetings I would look to see um what the actual expenditure of the previous year was um which is not the same as what we have on that um column FY 25 budget amount so I'm wondering if we I mean I I wonder if that would be helpful okay so the point is is about whether as the Baseline column their budget their budgeted amount or their actual amount expended or maybe it was just the way I filled it in maybe I shouldn't have filled it in with um what was on the budget but anyways yeah I think it's a good idea your budget for fy2 your actual spend of fy2 24 it's the same thing we put on the budget that we present the town um I think it's a really good idea so potentially both right yeah I would say actual spending I mean Susie you're doing the work so you can stupid actual spend FY 23 budget FY 24 and then your requests for or 25 excuse me I'm sorry actual 24 your budget for 25 and please fill in oh yeah right you're 26 request also I would say let's think about this yeah so so it would be fy2 before you get far and have it finished um we don't have those final numbers yet no no it have to be expect final numbers for 24 Susie will have that I don't have them yet the budget is not closed right so so that's what I was thinking about is how uh first of all I would need to figure out um maybe I would put an asteris um you know it's it isn't closed um probably a lot of it's closed but some of it's not closed so either an asteris for those that aren't closed or um just in general an asteris yeah I mean how different could it be on some of those departments it depends it depends yeah Department yeah I mean that's the way we always did budgets we always we always gave those actuals because there could be differences and sometimes they spend their money in fy2 fiscal 24 and they're doing that long after they already created their 25 budget so there could be a variance right there because something changed in their department and so it's kind of a way to highlight that to flag that the other the other thing I wanted to say was um should we put because Susie you're making one for each spefic spefic Department can we put the liaison name on this is that's the contact that's the contact okay and then um the and finally because this is an Excel spreadsheet I would reformat it slightly I think the format's fine it's just the way the numbers go in um I don't know Susie if you want maybe we can spend 10 minutes and I can just change it slightly yeah just so it's I don't know I maybe it doesn't matter but I think I could make it a little easier to use for you yeah yeah I was thinking about um I have all of last years and I was just going to change the dates and if any Liaisons have moved around but um I you and I can work on it I think we're we're close here yeah um well that said I might not have time but yeah okay Bob I was just going to suggest Susie I don't know if this makes sense to you and George uh we have the budget from last year which has the historical record for every Department uh built into it and has the actual and the uh budgeted mounts for each department so I think we could simply copy the the the page the relevant page send it with the with with with the rest of the information going to department head it might save you a lot of work having to draw up a new spreadsheet and the information you're going to be harvesting it is from that document anyway is it not no it's new a and we send um the the we send it by email so you know would we we wouldn't send the whole budget form to them so anyways we'll we'll figure it out I don't mind doing the work once we figure it out I think it'll it'll um become clearer okay so um Kathy so just to Bob's point I'm looking at the the town budget and I understand what he's saying it might make sense to follow this this format which also shows percent difference I don't know if that makes a difference in this budget request form but it might be a reminder to the department heads what the previous year looked like in terms of a difference from actual budget to actual that makes sense am I speaking another language no that makes sense it's a little tricky right because we're in fy2 right we're basically in the first couple months so um we want to be able to see how each Department's proposed budget within each of their categories compares to what's been budgeted and approved by town meeting for this current fiscal year which we can't really say a lot about how they're expending money because it's early in the year but I guess you're I guess there's some some of the points here are about kind of going back and seeing how like for example how their FY 24 expended amounts corresponded to their budgeted amounts um so I kind of feel like we're probably going to talk about that with them when we meet with department heads right like we're gonna in addition to looking at their budget we're g to all have their you know have have our expense reports and we'll be able to kind of well I guess the budget and we'll be able to kind of look back at the historical data okay um we do that in a regular basis we're looking at the expense reports as the year go right yeah and so like if we're okay so if if we've got a department head that's got a proposed amount it's let let's say it's larger you know than their FY 25 amount budget amount and you know we've been looking at you know the expense reports and we and we know that they underspent their budget last year like that's something we we're going to bring up with in discussion with them right like why do we what what's if if there's been a little bit of a pattern of us UND spending this budget line what's the rationale for increasing it right that that's part of the discussion we're going to have with department heads I'm not sure we need to put that information in this form all right so can we leave it as at that George and uh Susie will do a little bit of tweaking but probably nothing substantial that would require us right um that would require us to have to conversation about it Bob I see your hand up I just wna uh just so reflect what George and and Susie are doing here Susie is correct to ask for historical data because we've had experiences on the committee since I've been on it somebody will come and just make a request and there's no context whatsoever in the document I think it's good to provide that context for everyone's understanding of the history of this of this department and so we have a better understanding of the trends whatever they might be and so just the way this form is better than what we had in the past I think it's an improvement just the way it is so that's a good thing yeah I agree okay all right so um George it sounds like you might do a little bit of tweaking and if if you can um collaborate with Susie on that and then Susie you'll you'll kind of do what you've done in the past really appreciate it so I'm a little confused do we decide not to have spending the a column for the spent money in 24 do we I we know it's not fixed I mean we know it's not finalized but would we put an asteris and put in that column of spent money in 24 what was what was appropriated at town meeting in 25 and then their proposed number or we not to do that I I would be in favor of that as long as we're doing that's an additional column it's not replacing right the fy2 we fitas right yeah we can fit it easily right as long as Susie is okay doing the work yeah yeah that's really the question yeah yeah because I do I do think that's useful context um three columns okay got it yeah okay great all right great so we've got budget letter budget form and then we also have I'll just pull it up our actual meeting schedule which I have to share with you guys because the version that I before our last meeting had dates that needed to be updated because they were dates that were overlapping with select board so this is our new kind of tentative schedule with um meeting dates that don't conflict with this the regular select board uh meeting schedule so we start with Highway fired department on November 12th and um you know you can see the the rest of this basically follows the order that we used for last year we've got our Target is you know annual town meeting on April 26 public information meeting on April 24th what's not on here are Bown meetings but obviously those are going to get scheduled and and we'll we'll we'll this is a document that we'll update you know I'll always share with you the the uh the current version as we make changes to this okay any questions about the schedule or any concerns about the order in which we're putting things Susie I'm gonna follow up with the um school committee right off the bat because I think we keep running we run into this thing of when we're trying to um do ours which is January 21st and I think that will work but sometimes their meeting schedule is the third Thursday and they may not have done their official vote by then got it okay all right that'd be great um Susie I can't recall why yeah sorry Becky go ahead yeah but they've often had it you know by the beginning of the year so it varies yeah yeah and they had a funny meeting schedule last year and I I'm going to make sure they they figure it out because I think they've been trying to skip a meeting in the in uh December and then they're not ready in January but I'll find out okay and just to remind people we do something slightly different with with the elementary school which is that we we' look at an early draft budget um without any of the without the finance director right just to generate a set of questions that Susie then can bring back to the finance director um so that we can get answers to those questions when we you know before we meet with them in January um Susie can you can you I can't remember why I've got Saturday December 24th on this probably a placeholder for the fourtown meeting I bet maybe yeah all right so um all right that's why it's Saturday right yeah but it's unlikely isn't it yeah yeah no I agree can't see that happening right the day before um I'm gonna take it off for now but obviously we're gonna have to add multiple dates to this for when you know we're going to have more for it's certain that we're going to have more four town meetings than we have in in the last couple years so we'll just have to add those as they get scheduled I believe we're GNA have one on either the third or fourth Saturday this month um more on that in bit but um so I think it's possible that like on the 21st or 28th Becky you haven't heard anything have you uh from the school committee about or the superintendent's office okay um that December 24th is a Tuesday not a Saturday oh that's what it was okay oh sorry and like the the 31st I mean December 31st for the select board is you know a problem just like the 24th Christmas Eve you probably don't want a meeting yeah yeah uh so anyway I'm gonna take it off for now and we do have a b of a significant Gap here in between December 10th and January 7th so I think it's likely that we'll add in there at some point but let's just leave this schedule as it is for now and and we'll we'll modify as needed uh George yeah well that's the reason I raised my hand is probably a gap in there is probably good I'm noticing that we're meeting meeting meeting meeting with people people people departments departments departments and no time to take care of our own business which ends up causing us to have three-hour meetings so I was just going to comment it would be good if we had one or two Open dates not only for us able to conduct our own business but invariably some Department can't make their scheduled date we need to move them around so it's always good to have gaps in the calendar yeah you know and then I was looking at the elementary school well I know Susie is going to be talking to him but and I I don't like the idea of having the elementary school with any other department on the same night because thee Elementary School tends to take a long time and then whoever is there to meet with us is waiting um also the collector's budget's pretty simple she's usually very organized and very detailed and we get through hers quickly so I think and the accountants is really her budget she's the same the two of them I think what if we did that yeah exactly that's what I was going to suggest yeah okay I think that makes sense yeah all right um that's good and I think what we might do is is kind of somewhere either Wednesday uh December 18th 18th or potentially Monday uh December uh what is that the 23d I could see us having an open an open date something like that um why Wednesday because well meet on the 17th because that's the select board oh got it on on that Tuesday so we would have to have an alternative date so uh anyway so I'm gonna I'll keep I'll keep potentially you know those two dates as as Open dates okay okay right uh let's see up where did my agenda go uh okay let me give just um an update on as we just talked about it so the regional schol committee met I think I mentioned at our last meeting on 27th of August that that was same night we were meeting it was their first proper meeting really since I think June maybe early maybe July they early July they met um a number of important Finance related details came out of that meeting I did watch a recording one of the things that I found extremely helpful is there was a presentation by um Trac uh Tracy novic is that I think I'm getting name yeah who is the field director that's responsible for our area um for the Massachusetts Association of school committees and she's really um an expert on school Finance issues in Massachusetts and so the school committee had asked her to give an uh a presentation which she did prob was about maybe a 45 minute or so presentation it's quite detailed I shared with you really just you're breaking up you're breaking up we can't hear you oh am I yeah can't hear me now or is that I can hear you now all right um so what I'm going to suggest is before our four towns meeting I'm gonna strongly encourage everybody on the committee to watch her presentation and have these slides open it is the best explanation that I've heard since being on the finance committee about how um the foundation budget is um produced calculated and uh it is such a complicated process and it is so hard to understand it if you're just reading the the documents that desie um you know shares and without having somebody kind of walk you through the process and so and I just really think it benefits um anybody who's going to be participating in these budget negotiations to have this kind of foundational knowledge so I'm going to send you all um a link to the with a Time code uh to the recording of that meeting and would really like you all to watch that um before our four towns meeting they did discuss um the both the the kind of guidance that amorist and pelum had shared in their letters to the school committee and the feedback that they've gotten about needing to get a much earlier start they committed although they didn't set a date at the meeting they um um they did commit to having a four towns meeting in September and so that's why I think it's going to be the third or fourth Saturday of the month so maybe you can start to like put a little hold on your calendars just in you know for what until we hear when that meeting is going take place I assume it's going to be a Saturday iess I suppose it's possible they'll pick a different day um there was a little bit of a discussion and maybe even a disagreement about what the focus of that first four towns meeting ought to be uh some members of the school committee were really kind of took the position that it's too early to talk about concrete numbers and budget amounts and C apps and um you know what increases towns are willing to accept that and that it really ought to be focused on process what is the budget what what is the information that we all as a large group of people who are going to be involved in this discussion what is the data the information that we're going to need um what is our how how often are we going to meet what's our process so there were there were some members that were kind of suggesting that that ought to be the focus of that meeting and then there were some other members I think including uh the Leverett rep uh and um IR from ammer who who just were saying no we need to actually start to have kind of you know even if they're highly like super tentative numbers we need to actually talk about numbers so I'm not it's not entirely clear what the agenda for that um meeting is going to be but but I just want you all to know that there is going to be um the first four towns meeting to discuss the FY 26 budget should be happening later this month which I think is is a is good progress I think we ought to I think we ought to have a conversation about what it is that we want to communicate um at that meeting if there if there is a place to talk about like what are towns willing or or like what guidance we are going to be providing to the committee um so essentially pelum and ammer have put in writing that they are um that they want to use a two and a half percent um increase as um kind of a a limit to what they would like to see right that's that that's kind of their official guidance as articulated in the letters that they that they've sent um I think we ought to have a conversation I don't know if we can resolve that tonight about whether we wna have a position that is tied to a specific number I'm not sure I personally um uh feel like that's necessarily the the best way to go into this meeting but but since two of the four towns have have communicated a number uh a percentage increase we all it I think I do think that a couple things I do feel strongly about that I just want to share with you all I think there's probably G to be consensus about this is that this whole idea that ammer put forth in their letter about extracting the portion of their increase that they incurred for fy2 that came from Esser uh not Esser uh sorry um arpa funds that they they somehow want to remove that I think we ought to be very clearly state that that's not that's that's not um something that we can uh that we approve of I just I just think that's a bad precedent to have any one town say well we want to have a different Baseline than what we were actually assessed in in the prior fiscal year I just I don't think that that that's a good practice so that that is one I wanted to just make sure that we were in agreement about and then I think the second thing that I I do feel strongly that we ought to be prepared to communicate at that meeting is that we're not going to um uh we're not going to be comfortable with a budget process that says here's a fixed increase that is going to be imposed on all towns whether that's two and a half percent or 4% or some other percent we don't want a budget process that just says okay let's find a compromise on what's the percentage increase that all four towns are willing to live with and let's apply that on those two points do do we do we have agreement about that or does anybody want to speak to that Bob yeah I I I disagree with you on those points AJ I'll tell you I've spoken in the past and I'll say it again briefly now that there's some serious structural issues with the regional school I think frankly there is with our school too that have to do with enrollment uh declining enrollment and and increasing budgets over time and I seen that the last year I think we got kind of sideswiped by by the school committee and the uh we were all put in a bad position where we had to try to enforce uh some fiscal discipline on them but it became politically impossible to do so because things had things had Advanced so far uh that we couldn't we had to go ahead and and agreed to 6% which was a lot a vast increase for us uh and then we we got out of there the uh the system that we have so carefully uh sort of lobbied to support you know that is the the the statutory method and there was no equity really in in the the budget process or the the way that it was paid for as far as I could see that was all removed except for the the guard rails so I think really I I don't know why uh I know it's very difficult to run a regional system like we have and I feel a lot Sympathy for the people that have to do it but I I would like to know from you number one have you spoken to Doug Slaughter about what his views are as the financial director and how he feels about it because I think he's a big part of this process along with the school committee but I do think that there's a limit to what uh what people can pay just like I said before about our budgeting process and the school with a declining enrollment has to has to address uh the number of students they have now and make real budgets on the for the real population which is on is now on a a decline of a couple of decades I'd say at least and I looked at the at the uh the the uh slide stack that you sent and it shows those data uh pretty pretty clearly so I I don't think that uh anything should be off the table I think there should be some Financial discussion at the first time four time meeting absolutely that's why we are calling for it because we don't want to have uh a confused chaotic situation like we had last year so yeah so hopefully we can encourage the school committee and Doug to come up with some preliminary ideas and face fact is going to have into some resistance including from me if they just want to continue business as usual because I don't think that that that's going to work considering the state of things so yeah I disagree with you on those two points AJ U and I think there should be a financial discussion I don't know if you support that idea but it seems like that's what this is all about is the financial uh discussion yeah uh Susie it's taken me a while to think about 2.5 increase in a tax rate is not the same as um 2.5 in a budget because there's revenues coming from other than the tax um increase there's new growth there's state aid there's grants so when they put a cap on increasing a specific budget to 2.5 that does not seem um tied enough to me to the fact that the revenues the the the the full Revenue picture is more than just the tax levy so I I think that somehow these two things get tied and I don't really see that that is a particularly logical idea um and I think it's true we need to talk about some of the um some of the increases we feel prepared to handle but I mean our our budget went up 4.5% but it's not clear to me yet what our tax levy is going to go up we won't know that till November and so it may it it's not those things are not as tied as people like to put out there so I can see why they don't want to go deep into the the numbers in September um and I I would love to have a talk with amist about what kind of New Growth Revenue they're getting um so I I think that there's a reason that some people are saying we can't um be talking about like the Staffing pattern um there could be talking about the staffing needs and I do think even though we have a decrease enrollment we have increasing needs needs in our student population all sorts of needs and I believe we're not out under out from under the covid demands and so um there's a lot of different pressures we probably just need people to begin to identify them but we can't come to the numbers yet uh George yeah I'm I'm in the same place um I think it's too C to commit to anything I think it's good that we're going to be meeting regularly and I think the first thing that I would like to see is have Doug crunched the numbers these different ways that he's talking about what would it look like if they pulled Esra all that Esra funding out and then what would increases for each Town look like that's just raw numbers that he could easily put together and that's something that we can start to look at and get a feel for as far as the decreasing population Susie brings up a point that I wasn't thinking of and that is and I I do think about it often is we know that there is increased service requirement in the schools because of the need needs that we found during Co for the for the students and also we've been cutting this budget year after year that I mean the budget goes up maybe for sure but there have been Cuts in the Regional School System many times in the last 10 years and a lot of that was definitely a result of lower enrollments but we were also cutting to some extent programs so when you have lower enrollments I'm fine with lowering costs but when you start cutting programs that's not because of lower enrollments you're cutting programs because you're having a financial financial problem and so I am very curious to see there another reason why I don't want to commit to a position at this point in time is the superintendent is has having an audit right now of the finances so she's doing a deep dive on the finances and it would be very interesting to see what she comes back with so at this point I would say we're Switzerland on this we'd like to see the raw numbers because you we know you can put them together what would happen if you do what Amis and pum is suggesting but I wouldn't want to go beyond that and as far as the revenue conversation that Su is bringing up I I think that's really important it's we don't know what our Revenue position is there are some bills out there that could really help us tremendously and this year even they increased the um pilot numbers and we might even see a small bump in the pilot I think we're going to we are definitely not going to be digging I'm pretty sure we're not going to be digging into our excess Levy capacity like we thought we were at to the tune of $133,000 I think it's probably going to be the other way so I just don't think we should commit to anything at this point right okay um I would agree with you George um I think what what we do want to do though um I think early is reassert our expectation that we're going to utilize a method uh the the modified statutory method how however the budget falls out this year right so what whatever however whatever percentage increases we you know the four towns end up experiencing I think we want to set an expectation that we want to get back that's off to um yeah to to uh and and with by starting the process early earlier we ought to be able right that the region ought to be able to avoid the problem we haveen we had last year which is it just became too complicated and too late in the game for us to be um applying uh the that the the modified statutory method um you know and so there's enough planning and enough time to make sure that this year's budget does bring us back to that maybe there'll be some guard rails but it won't be the kind of process we saw last year April if I'm maybe April I would just say yeah um moving around the assessment method isn't going to solve the problem and trying to get shutesbury to pay a little extra under some other method they want to use it's not going to make a difference it's not a lot of money yeah there's a structural it's a structural problem and you know more money definitely needs to come from the state but I I also I concur that you know we need to how do you pronounce the superintendent's name x z z yeah like to support her completing the audit that she's proposing because I think that's a really good place to start and I absolutely think agree that we need to be pushing the uh our modified assessment method that every we worked so hard um and not come out with you know not a percent but use our the statutary modified method that we have yeah um I just wanted to share one point that I thought was pretty persuasive that this field director from uh uh Tracy novic shared which is she really cautioned people against doing a kind of per pupil spending compar comparison between one District district and a neighboring District like that's a that's a kind of common uh theme to I think some of the comments we hear at these four towns meetings well why are we spending this amount of money per student and why does that look so different from a neighboring community and um you'll you'll see her articulate this point when you watch her presentation but I think she made a really strong I think argument for avoiding that kind of overly simplistic way of kind of analyzing this information and um and I also just want to share you if if you had a chance again you didn't have much time but if if you had had a chance to look at the slide deck um there's you know Bob I think you were alluding to this slide which kind of shows an overall enrollment pattern of you know of a of you know significant decline um over the last 25 years um when you go to the next slide one of the things you'll see is that you know we we as a as a proportion of our enrollment we are serving as a region uh significantly higher proportion of both lowincome students and students with disabilities and maybe to a lesser extent um English language Learners and you know the foundation budget right tells us that it costs more to educate these subpopulations than it does um students that don't fall into to one of these subpopulations so I just want us to kind of the you know as we as we have these conversations to kind of keep in mind that there's a little bit more a little bit of nuance to this this kind of trend that I think we've we've talked about about enrollments and how they've changed over time it's definitely true that the district is serving fewer students than it had you know 20 years ago but um the students that we are serving have different like significantly different characteristics and and some of those characteristics come with um a responsibility to provide services that don't come with additional funding um so that's I think an important a bit of nuance for for us to have anyway I'll just I'll stop sharing this now but thought just wanted to mention that okay so um let's see uh when this meeting gets scheduled like I said it should be um towards the end of this this month and um you know I think we ought to look at kind of what's on what's on the agenda that'll give us an idea about kind of what the scope of that discussion is going to be uh anything else on this topic so what are we GNA what what's our position how we what are we going to say to I think I I think our position is um at this point we want to we we want to see what um we we want to see a variety of kind of budget models right maybe some that are tied to the guidance that pelum and ammer have provided some that are are related to kind of level Services budget what that would look like and what kind increases that would result in for communities um but we want to assert expectation that the budget process is going to utilize the statutory the modified statutory method in C making calculations about you know um you know member towns contributions and that that's a really important point for us I think other than that I think I don't think we have um enough consensus to to state any other positions at this point does that seem fair okay um one other school related update I um I had an exchange with Mato um about the uh track and field project uh let's see um I'm gonna share his email uh there there is news on this that I think you all should be aware of see uh so submitted a request for um an additional $136,000 of open space Recreation CPA funding from from shutesbury uh just to remind everybody this is because the region is trying to move forward with the version of this project that has a $4.4 million budget they don't have enough funds right now for a $4.4 million doar budget um and so the CPC has given them basically uh uh permission to submit an off cycle request they are going to vote on that application at uh their September 19th meeting uh if the result of that meeting is yes they recommend it as a committee then then that's another Warren article at the special town meeting that uh Becky's working on scheduling what was the day that me okay what was the day that uh September 19th okay thank you I'm just getting it for the minutes um okay we would event let if this gets recommended by the CBC obviously we're going to have to have a discussion as a committee about whether we recommend um you know approval of that Warren article when it comes before the town special town meeting uh Bob I think I saw your hand up a minute ago did you have something there no okay all right uh let's see I I'll just skip it for now okay uh Becky um can you uh we need to have a discussion about this open meeting law violation can you fill us in on this sure um let me put up so when we receive an open meeting law violation it um one of our residents Amanda Alex um submitted an open meeting law complaint to the state to the AG's office um regarding the shb finance committee and I apologize I should have probably I don't have have a scan of this right now but um so basically let me just read it to you the bottom line just is on June July 30th there was a select board meeting the subject on the agenda was Personnel Board ta contract um a number of personnel board members ended up coming uh the Personnel Board at no point in time had the opportunity to post a meeting ahead because this was um the agenda item was submitted late uh just about an hour before the posting um the deadline posting of the agenda for the select board um and then when they um saw it on the agenda Personnel Board saw it on the agenda over the weekend um the chair emailed members of the committee um saying our you know our agenda item is going to be talked about by the select board so a number of members showed up um I think four Personnel board members showed up um and um part of the issue here is there was a transition July 1 so we had the finance Committee Member uh to the Personnel Board had been George arvanitis um Kathy Salvador was um elected by the finance committee and both members had been at the first meeting in July of the Personnel Board as they handed off um traded uh duties and they both had been involved in the issue that um had been at the meeting where the issue was discussed that the select board that was on the select board agenda and so we had um ended up with the current member the current members of the Personnel Board April and Kathy at the meeting uh George also came um and Susie moer attended the select board meeting as she often attends select board meetings so Amanda Alex and uh noticing that four members of the finance committee are Quorum rightly um put in um a statement to the you know it is correct that there should not have been a quum without a an agenda posted part of the problem with our longstanding committees is a number of these laws surrounding open meeting a number of the subtleties have changed over time so the me Members um remember the days where you didn't have to post a meeting if you were talking only to the select board or the appointing body um but that's at this point in time we can't take that chance it's too um it's too hard to determine who was exactly addressing who at a meeting so um we end up with a situation where the best force of action always is if you have any idea there'll be a quorum of your committee attending another meeting to post an agenda for your committee at the other committee meeting um so I will read you what Amanda wrote and then I'll put up a letter of potential response I'd like your input on it's similar to what the lawyers have directed me to do in other cases and then you can decide if you want to change the language but right now here's the uh description of the alleged violation I contend that the shutesbury finance committee violated the open meeting law when a quorum of committee attended a posted hybrid meeting of the shuberry select board on July 30th 2024 and deliberated outside of a properly posted meeting regarding the agenda item Personnel Board recommendation ta contract since this agenda items Rec recommendation was to request that a representative from both the Personnel Board and the finance committee be present at Future Town administrative contract negotiation sessions and since three members of the Personnel Board are also finance committee members which is not true there are only two um are also finance committee members and for constitute a quorum it should have been anticipated that a quorum would attend and of course since the meeting wasn't known about nothing could have been anticipated um but that doesn't change um the situation during that meeting members of the committee who were physically present sat near each other they discussed matters within their jurisdiction that would later be discussed and voted upon at a finance committee meeting on August 12th where some of the same statements made at the select board meeting were repeated an individual who earlier spoke as a Personnel Board member later prefaced additional comments by identifying himself as a finance Committee Member formally of the Personnel Board another member of the finance committee made statements that echoed opinions voiced earlier in the meeting regarding policy and the makeup of the negotiating team for the town administrator's contract a remote member who identified as a finance committee member and Personnel board members stated she agreed with her cohorts that there should be representation by both the Personnel Board and finance committee a fifth finance committee member also attending remotely did not comment what action do you want the public body to take in response to your complaint her a her response is I want the shsy finance committee to post meeting notices Whenever there whenever there a reasonable expectation that a quorum will attend the post a meeting of another public body and to record approve and P publish meeting minutes accordingly okay so um let me bring up got it the letter or did you want to do that do you have it AJ I'm I don't have it so if you can if you can share it SHO AJ and I did email it to you so you should be able to find it oh I'm not sure I saw it okay yeah this is the draft response letter yeah I sent it too it was right before the meeting so oh okay gotcha you don't have it all right as you can see from that folder I have way too many open meeting law violations on my computer it's been a busy time all right so this is a letter to Amanda Alex that will also be sent to um the open meeting law division of the Attorney General's office um can everybody read it does it need to be bigger yes is that better so this is standard format that you use Becky Yeah so basically um first paragraph we've received your complaint we respond according to statute uh second paragraph in summary describe what happened and the third paragraph is we understand we screwed up and fourth paragraph in conclusion the finance committee believes your complaint is violation of oml and will do their best not to let it happen again just to clarify make sure just for the sake of avoiding these issues in the future it wasn't an issue that just four members of the fincom attended the meeting it was that four members attended and made contributions to the meeting is that yes is that an important distinction okay yes if all four members had been silent or if even if even only three of them had spoken like she didn't count the fifth member that stayed silent right so so if you do notice because this is a very tough situation to anticipate um and so you just have to be aware that if you are at a meeting with a number of your um people from your group and it's really difficult to know that because if you're at the Hybrid meeting you probably don't know who's on the you know there's often pages on the zoom so you're not going to see everybody on screen um so it's pretty tricky to figure out but I think given this experience maybe some well it's tough because meetings change at the last you know we it's very difficult to post select board meetings ahead of 48 Hours um there's continual change to the agenda through that last week and um so how do you even know you most the time know like if you're at a meeting tonight you don't know what the well I just posted the select board meeting for Tuesday but then everybody would have to re it's I think it's it's hard right because I don't yeah because yeah I mean that would require that I would look at the agenda for Tuesday select board meeting and you know I've gotta if I'm gonna post a meeting I you know I have I have to do it with enough notice so it is hard but I think there are a couple things that we can do to avoid these issues in the future I mean one would be certainly if we're if we are asked by the select board or any other body to to you know are notified that there's potentially a fincom related agenda item and they're actually seeking some some input from us that's that's a no-brainer right we should be posting that um if if we're if if they're specifically asking you know us to contribute to a meeting okay I think what can happen in in this more ad hoc situation which was hard to anticipate is let me just run this by you guys see if it's you know if it makes sense but like if if you're going to if you're attending a meeting of another board it's not a posted fincom meeting um you see other fincom members contributing to the meeting um I think it's is it a reasonable expectation that we keep track of how many fincom members have have have U commented during the meeting and if you if you're if you see the three other members have already um commented at the meeting and it's not a it's not a fincom posted meeting that order to I think you know that ought to caution you that it's probably not appropriate for you to to to speak at the meeting is that is that a crazy idea but Susie That's not a crazy idea it's just the reason people go to meetings and contribute is because they care so here we come up to September 19th the CPA Mee meting and we're we're encouraged to be aware of it and we have some some input because we've been talking about it and thinking about it sure and not all of it's because we're on fincom I don't I guess the word deliberation is not totally clear to me but I think the solution that you're talking about and the solution in this letter is the solution um but I I guess I would feel that people um can easily be caught unaware because we're a group of people that care about this town and we work on it and we show up right and uh oh then keep your mouth shut well that's really rewarding right I know stuff Bob yeah just a couple things one uh who's going to submit the minutes for this meeting because it was a meeting uh that's number one number two as a member of this committee uh who was not informed was not aware of this issue uh that was the subject of the the I guess LED this members of the finance committee to go to this meeting I see it from that point of view as a member of the committee you don't want your committee to go and Advocate or or argue in favor of a position as finance committee uh members without letting all your colleagues know that this is a a running concern for the committee so I think the letter is a good letter it covers covers the territory you need to cover and I think we have to be aware of this uh as has described our obligations under the law I think it's a good thing that this law exists and uh we should try to be more careful in future George oh yeah a question to Becky is this this is coming from the Town Administrator this letter um no that's why you guys are well can we see the bottom just see who's got it got it okay yeah so when did this law change because I think everybody in that room we actually talked about it in that meeting and you know one of the select board members said said didn't recognize this as being an issue Melissa right Melissa said it wasn't an issue so the the problem is it has changed three times since 2012 and the most recent changes um were in 20120 and we have not had you know how you might all recall Susie's meeting where she had different hats and we had a really good um you know we had a session on oml at one point we have not had um a town clerk sponsored oml session and we desperately need to do that because things that uh longers are assuming are true are no longer true yeah and um so I think it's something that the select Board needs to follow through with with Grace and make sure that the next all boards meeting has a significant section on open meeting law and hopefully people will attend because these complaints are time consuming for everybody I I would suggest I think it's a great idea I would suggest that it gets recorded and made available to people who can't attend um the other thing I want to say about this was um sometimes we have difficulties because we have people who serve on multiple committees like Melissa for the Personnel Board you know Melissa is one of the members so of two other Personnel Board board members show up they've got a quorum so we really do have to be very conscious of this and really pay attention to it and all departments should be thinking about it for sure it's an educational lesson for me I didn't realize that this was an issue yep things change yeah so I will um leave this in your box for everybody to come sign um I've been told that the signatures I'm going to send it in without them and again when I get them all it's just you guys don't have the best track record on timeliness um I still have a few transfers that um well AJ made sure we have a quorum now on each of the transfer sheets um but if you would come in and sign this that would be great and I'll get this sent over to the Attorney General's office Beck Becky a quick question clarification for me you said something about if we put ourselves on the agenda of the select board that that would somehow solve the problem is that true is that is I understanding that right I'm not sure we' have to post it we' have to post a meeting Bob yeah have to post a meeting okay so that's that's easy a thinkom meeting that that runs simultaneous to the you know in this case it would have been a you have the meeting yeah um so to that I guess to that point oh sorry go ahead George No I I I just one point Becky made I went and signed the transfer forms the other day and I and I just want to reiterate what she just said that some of the transfer forms need to be ass signed I noticed that when I signed the transfer forms that there was transfer forms underneath them and I noticed some people signed the top transfer forms but the bottom ones had no signatures or one so if you think you signed the transfer forms you probably haven't and when you go back you should go through those again and make sure your signatures on all of them because I noticed that the other day I can't remember when I was down in town hall sometime last week we yeah I signed about 10 of them yeah me too but I noticed some some people didn't yours is probably the one signature I saw and on the other ones but I saw some people sign the top ones but didn't sign the bottom ones yeah so when you go in to sign this letter just there's a stack at their their um They al together all these transfer request forms so just take a look go through all of them if you and just sign any that you haven't signed um Kathy um you're off the hook except for one of them okay I was gonna ask what they were in the first place so yeah the I think you were the transfer at your first meeting July 9th I think you're part of the the close out fiscal 24 transfer okay but we're prior to that so Kathy well you know sometimes we take action at our meetings where that involve a transfer of funds from the fincom reserve fund or you know some emergency that's come up or some unanticipated expense when we do that um it requires um you know a a a transfer form to be signed by members of the committee at least in the Quorum of the committee so um yeah so that that's what uh they refer to okay um maybe what uh I might send an email out next week asking for a headcount of who ex anticipates going to the September 9th uh CPC meeting and if it if it looks like uh the 19th right September 19th uh and if it looks like um if it looks like we might run you know have a potentially a quorum there I'll go ahead post it so um I'll I'll send an email about that okay Susie I just wanted to mentioned that there is going to be a fall Town newsletter and we one time maybe two times put an article in that was a a little bit of a summary of what had happened um and where we are and I don't want you to take that on yourself AJ you've done that before um maybe there's a volunteered to do that I think it helps because some people didn't come to town meeting and it helps to sort of keep people informed and we used excerpted information from our uh annual Finance uh new uh report report do you know what the deadline for that is sus I haven't seen that yet um maybe Becky knows uh Jim yeah uh all of these forms to be signed are all in the fincom mailbox is that correct yes correct yeah yeah and and Becky you might as well correct the spelling of my name um if you want to make it truly that be [Music] great I'm sorry could you correct spell it for me Jim just one just one m just one m much better thank you Jim except I just printed it and put it in the Box I'll do it sorry about that you can just strike that [Music] better um Kathy well I thought Jim was gonna mention the thing that I was gonna mention Becky so he but he didn't um just one minor typo um when a quorum of their members attends a quorum attends a quorum is I think that should be a singular sorry a quorum of so this that last sentence of that paragraph yeah that that sounds right go all the way up and make sure there aren't any others I think we might be good I think it's good all right right okay um George yeah I was just gonna ask Becky um if she would just send she could send this a copy to me to us it would be helpful to remind us to go into town meeting and I'd like to have a copy of this and also want an unsigned not a signed copy yeah I it doesn't matter me if it's signed or not this is what we're going to be signing right yeah I just want to have it as a reference sure for my records and AJ I'm sorry earlier in this meeting you said you were going to send us the link to the dessie presentation yes okay yeah so when uh as soon as we wrap up I'll send you an email perfect yeah i' like read it soon okay yeah um so what I'm sending you is is a link to the YouTube recording of the regional school committee meeting that happened on 8 on August 27th and I'll send you the time code for when our presentation started so you can just fast forward to that that point that's right okay uh Susie um I hate to heat this up a little bit but I'm going to be doing those forms um I feel like AJ's done a lot George is doing the minute so perhaps one of the people who hasn't been doing some writing could take on writing the report for the town news letter and you know maybe as a group we don't agree that it it helps um but I believe that when we're talking about people getting information this is one of our few sources we can do it anybody want to volunteer for that April appreciate it I'm a I'm a middle child no I can get that what I what was the DAT this needs to be done by do you have the um deadline Becky for the fall uh Town news I'll have to say I'm doing a mailer tomorrow I'm not I don't want to give out the wrong date right now okay but not right now not today okay I'll but it's um I think it's I can't remember that's all right we changed it like seven times yeah I bet chance giving you the wrong April it's helpful send no I can justful I can send you the text that I shared uh with them the last time we did this I think which is probably two years ago yeah I can just go through U minutes and just pull pull things out that way or the finance committee report is really helpful yeah our annual report is kind of the the yeah s that best resource for this so I I'll share that with you um okay any other I know we've been going kind of long tonight but any other business for us to discuss any updates Jim I have just a completely unrelated question um that if you want if you don't want me to uh continue we spent $5,000 for the uh the insect um you know for that committee to take a look at the insects have they been doing a good job on that Becky I'm wondering because a lot of us who live around the lake are concerned about Triple E and all that's been going on with h with mosquito problems and I was just wondering if we if we're getting our money's worth uh on on notification that there might be or might not be a problem um here in shutesbury because that information doesn't seem to be very well known or distributed as far as I can tell Board of Health the Board of Health is monitoring all of their their information and they put out notices to the public and you've and you've gotten those notices yeah okay I I I I'm sorry I a commentator on on National Public Radio commented that a lot of these insect um uh uh research projects they weren't coordinating with each other and so the database wasn't being updated uh very well and so nobody really knew what one town was doing and another town was doing and and it was really important to try to get all towns to feed information into one Central source so that pattern could be seen in how these how these infestations are spreading or not spreading uh that's what brought up my concern that's all I just don't know how that the gentleman who does the the field work has come and met with them and he's very good and as someone who was in an emergency room quarantine because I thought I had triple um I I appreciate the updates that we get um well if Jim if you want to search for this Pioneer Valley mosquito control district you'll get this web page and then if you scroll down you'll see the the surveillance reports I don't know maybe that's that might be useful information for you it looks like there was one on in April maybe maybe that's helpful well I was just checking because we had some discussion about whether we were getting our money's worth on this and then there's the other issue having to do with whether these reports are really being being synchronized with all the ones from all over New England for example to see whether there's a problem and if it's sort of moving one way or another just a lot of people are concerned about it that's all including myself okay all right any other sure any other uh any other business any other updates okay so uh we are going to meet again on what is it the 17th yes that right y yes 17th um and I think uh if if all goes as I think planned we're gonna have to we'll do a little four towns meeting that'll happen uh later this month Susie I think you've got everything you'll need for getting those budget I appreciate that um and uh April um I'll send you the text that I share but obviously don't don't feel obligated to to uh use that as your template uh okay so uh I'll make a motion for us to adjourn second George Ro ey ey Ash you ey Mo your ey you're M I could read your lips Kathy yes I said I Stein ey all right good night everybody night take care e