e sorry for being a couple minutes late no worries uh okay so I see everyone except for April who sent an email that she might be a few minutes late but she'll definitely be joining um so I'm going to call the finance committee to order at 6:34 um okay so in addition to uh fy2 budget work that we need to do tonight we have two um items that were not anticipated when the meeting was posted one um Ryan is here to discuss um a potential shortfall in the tax title uh budget for this year and and may require a fincom reserve um and Lenny is also here to talk about the fire department training wages line which is also been depleted so Lenny if you don't mind I'm gonna just take Ryan first and then we'll we'll jump to you is that okay all right all right hi Ryan can you hear me I can how are you good good good so I appreciate um everyone squeezing me in here to your what I'm sure is very busy time for you yeah so talk to us tell tell us what you're um what you're facing and and what the request is yeah so our tax title activity this year has been a little bit busier than we normally have um there was a um uh basically a filing error that took place between the collector treasurer's office and the um registry of deeds and our tax title attorney has helped spend some time cleaning that up and remedying it um and as a result it's just it's taken up more time than we thought in more of our expense line that we had initially planned on expending um also we've had a lot more activity taking place we've been more aggressive in trying to bring in some funds from this tax title balance that we have which also has resulted in somewhat of a shortfall at the moment the account is not overexpanded we have a balance of around $800 in there but based on the time that we have left in the work that we're doing and and kind of where we're at in a process on a couple things we're looking at needing another $3,000 to get us through the rest of this fiscal year I will preface that with um some of the work we're doing for example I have a check that's going to the bank this coming Monday for $9,000 as as to clean up a tax title account and that's a direct result of this tax title line paying the attorney to work with us and help get some money brought in so it the benefit of this line is that its purpose truly is to help bring in money to the town that is owed to us right okay so we've got a request for $3,000 to replenish that line any questions from the committee all right I don't see any hands uh is anyone inclined to make a motion I'll make a motion we transfer $3,000 from the finance um committee Reserve fund to the tax title line for $3,000 I didn't say that okay right thanks George made motion I think Bob was the first to second all right uh any other discussion on all right George you wanna har night ro oh Jim I think you're muted but I could kind of read your lips yeah Jim you want to give us a yeah yeah Hemingway ey sorry about that no problem cashew ey moer ey Stein ey Walton I okay all right uh so Ryan uh that should be all set um I'm gonna just for the per uh Becky can you give me uh sharing Privileges and oh sorry yeah I'm gonna pull up the uh current fincom Reserve balance okay so George keep me honest here is it does this look up to date I'm not missing anything right yeah no that's correct it's going to go to 5294 that's what I have tax title is this line called tax title expense that yes okay great that's 3,000 okay yeah so all right so we have a balance of $529 for okay uh Ryan any any other questions for us or um you're all set awesome thank you I appreciate everyone very much I will not make I've never in all of my career ever had an account get to this level so I'm happy that it's to help bring in some more money to the town I appreciate everyone very much okay all right take care thanks take care okay uh all right so why don't we talk to Lenny Lenny I know there's been a little bit of back and forth kind of behind the scenes through Becky about your training wages line is that what we're right yeah yes can you give us the background and tell us where we where we are at right well right now we have uh $1,537 left on the training budget we got four uh pay periods left to go uh got fire department trains every Thursday night between three and three and a half hours and we have nine firefighters on the payroll so as right now we still need three firefighters that have to take first responder class which is roughly 30 hours per each firefighter so that's total of 90 hours um that's separate from the from the the the weekly Thursday training that's they're gonna have to do that outside the weekly Thursday training got it all right so uh so but that still has to come out of the training budget right the 2024 training budget is 8,43 so if you do the math 50 Thursday drills at 3 and 1/2 hours long with nine firefighters at $21 an hour is 33,000 so when everybody shows up to drill you know I can make it if only half the people show up to training so that's kind of how I'm I'm seeing it um this doesn't cover if we get additional firefighters to join additional training through the mass fire academy or mandatory training like first responder or CPR training so right now we have four pay periods left in the fiscal year and each period cost on average $1,848 so I'm asking for additional $6,000 to cover the rest of the fiscal year I know Becky talked to you guys last week my back was hurting a lot so I'm sorry I missed the meeting um I'm not exactly sure what she talked to you guys about possibly taking money out of the call wages to Pally fund that and I'm not sure if that's going to be able to fully do that um we have roughly 10,000 left I'm not I did not shoot I don't 24 14886 yeah so we have 10,000 left um let's see so we did 1488 6 / 9 equals then times 4 equals at this going rate we're going to need 6,600 just for for the call for the for the call Wages that's not kind of including like a really busy week that we had last week so it is what it is but there is a balance of 10,000 right yes we're g we're going to need at least 6,000 of it though to finish off the year yeah so do do you see for see any problem with assuming that we can maybe take $3,000 out of the call wages line let's say and use that to at least partially fill the shortfall that you're going to have in the training wages line does that sound like a reasonable yes that would work if I had I mean yeah so right now we have 15 37 plus 3,000 that gets 4500 and we average 1848 per a four-week cycle so how many cycles can we do divided by let's see 18 48 time 3 well that gets us a little more than two two pay Cycles so I'm going to be I'm still going to be shy if you know that I mean I feel training is very important every week uh I I just don't see how we have new guys that can learn what to do if we don't go to training if we don't if we don't have any money I guess we don't go to training so I'm just wondering I guess what I was proposing is if I understood it correctly you you you're gonna need about $6,000 of additional funding for that training wages line was is that the right number is that yeah yes all right on top of whatever small balance you have left 1500 yeah I mean if I do if I'm going 1848 Time 4 that gives me 739 if we do minus 1537 which we already have that's 5855 right so so what if we did this what if we did a TR and then I I know Bob I see your hand up so I'm gonna go to you next um what if we did a transfer a fincom transfer of $3,000 to the training wages line and then we assume that we can um do a line to line transfer from of $3,000 from call wages into that training wages line would that would that solve this year's problems I think so as long as hard call volume doesn't go up right you know if we have like another week like last week would probably say no but hopefully we don't have another last week all right Bob uh yeah Lenny uh I'm just curious maybe you can enlighten me why this year we're going beyond our budget uh is it because of new people coming into the department or is it just extraordinary circumstances or is it some I think it's been low for a long time I think uh we have new people on the on the uh on the department and I also think uh several individuals have uh attended more trainings than in the past um I'm just I'm just going down that if we have nine firefighters and if everybody showed up every week for three hours a three to three and a half hours I would need $33,000 right you know I guess I'm remembering that maybe you correct me if I'm mistaken but I'm remembering that when we were talking about this line maybe it was Walter not with you but uh that these training that people don't show for the training but the new people are showing up yeah it's costing us money is that what you're saying well it it appears to be everybody's been having a lot better attendance yeah okay uh last year I was I did write that I was shy by like two grand and I think you guys took it from the call wages last year yeah I don't know exactly it did but I was shy last year and now this year I have more people on the payroll so I kind of don't know how these numbers even worked in the past um Becky um they work because of low attendance because when we originally started with that system I did the same calculation about if everybody goes to training and I even used 52 weeks um and came in with a $30,000 figure and and at that point in time um we the attendance was only the cost to the town was a quarter of their budget and almost never went over about 25% you currently have um people that are very responsive and helpful they're at the trainings they're at um they you used to only have one or two people going to calls you now get more numbers going to calls which is you know on a weekend last like last weekend it was critical to have that support stop doing such a good job Lenny yeah thank you all right any other questions for Lenny all right personally my my inclination is to do what what what I suggested beforehand which is do a a a fincom transfer ,000 Lenny I kind of understand and you've I appreciate that you're telling us that if there's if there's kind of normal volume of calls we should be fine but if there's an unusual period um we may we may need to do another transfer and I I think we understand that so but at least for now we can maybe take this step of of doing a $3,000 reserve a transfer from of $3,000 from pcom reserves so are you proposing just to I get 3,000 from my call wages and then 3,000 from the reserve that was that was The Proposal y with understanding that you know if there's an unusual call volume in this these last however many cycles we have left that we you may need to come back to us okay well as long as I can go back to you guys that should work for I should be uh we should be good for a few months at least okay Susie I see your hand up yeah so I just wanted to make sure that um it looks like there's 10,000 in call wages now and 600 6,600 is needed so that's where you came up with a 3,000 transfer out of call wages right yes and so at the end of the year we do other line transfers if we need to um so we would be able to meet uh something unexpected or we would have fincom Reserve at the end of the year also now um so let's let's tackle this year and then um so I think I'll just make that motion to um transfer $3,000 from our fincom Reserve fund to the fire department's training wages line second okay any other discussion all right George I Roes i m i casu I moer I Stein I Walton I okay all right so um Lenny I guess before you go I'm curious what your thoughts are on the fy2 training wages amount like if we if you um do we need to kind of rethink that this is tough this is a tough year to be doing that but I but I I appreciate that you've done some calculating here and it's like we may have a structural problem with this line so so if like say if everything's identical for next year I would need basically another $6,000 right and that wouldn't even cover another if if I get one or two more firefighters to join you know um and then at some point the state is going to start mandating math different types of trainings for firefighters that's going to that's going to be a different story to talk to you guys about um uh potentially every firefighter has to go to the mass Cal course that would be 240 hours and SE several other ones so that would be a huge uh that would actually be really huge yeah these are propos that are have been yeah it's coming down the pike in like probably 2026 that they're going to start doing so that's gonna be huge um but as for the way things are running right now I think if I had an extra six grand I think and if everything's the same for next year as it is for this year I think I'd be within it but again that wouldn't cover if I have one extra firefighter to join right you know so um right now we have nine if you added one that would be what 10% more off of 20 yeah so it's like 2400 bucks basically per a firefighter so yeah okay uh Susie I'm looking at the proposal that we have in our fy2 and I see that the um training wages are 239 so it sounds like it'd be more than 6,000 because I think you told us 33,000 for f for a full year yeah the the problem is I don't get to decide who gets to show up for training and who doesn't unless you know it's some some weeks a couple people are sick and a couple people are busy and there's only just a couple people and then I can go for a couple months straight where everybody shows up uh so then all of a sudden that friend will show up to make sure all the time just to have you know just to train with his other friend so the figure is actually in the budget is 23,93191 but if you look back at the actuals but it's tough the ACT it's a new department so the actuals never went above you know 14,500 in the past well we've changed it to a 3our minimum we changed to a three-hour minimum which kind of changes it I asked for a fair amount of more money and and you guys only gave 10,000 for the call wages when we were discussing the three-hour minimum um and I'm actually kind of surprised I'm within Budget on that okay so it might go over next year yeah and if you get a new person go all right maybe maybe maybe what we need to do is I mean we've boosted the the training wages line for next year to almost 24,000 maybe we need a year to um kind of evaluate um you know this Lenny if am I correct fy2 will be your second kind of full full year uh uh going on third I think okay going on third okay I I I guess the point being that we'll have I think we'll have a good sense next year if we need to um kind of re uh maybe sort of balance these lines uh we we'll have a couple years of of sort of track record under the the kind of newer circumstances um and and then you know and but we understand that we might be in a situation next year where you know if if you exper if you have a similar year to this year if you add um another um you know employee that that we we may run short on on uh on this line George yeah I was just gonna the one thing I would say is if what Lenny is telling us that um training wages are going to be go could go up substantially in 20126 right might be wise to give a little extra this year so we can start ramping up towards what our future may look like we already know that we're kind of running low on this line anyways so why not add three or $4,000 to it to start moving Us in the right direction you know because then we're going to end up with a big jump in in the subsequent year right uh it's not like this money isn't going to get spent because it sounds like it's going to if we put a few extra thousand in there uh Jim heavy way yes Lenny do you have any prospective candidates right now I mean how does the future look in terms ofre I got possibly two or three that I'm talking to ah okay so so so this this could these numbers could really rise quite dramatically if um if um if the fire department increases in size two to three more people yes I just did a quick thing with my calculator per one firefighter if they attend 50 training nights time 3.5 equals time $21 equals $3600 MH so you know that's if they make a 100 so one firefighter could possibly add $3,600 to the line item and that's uh so that's the perfect attendance assumption like that would be the perfect attendance yeah so what was that number 3500 you said I got 3675 3675 okay so I emailed Becky a couple things I don't know if she could send them out to you I of just some notes so you could just double check my numbers I I sent the narrative Lenny and I'll send the was it it was the training yeah the training narrative and uh Then I then I also sent you just a quick thing of the uh the call salaries just to give you a heads up that you know you can't take like six grand out of it and then not it won't be depleted by the end of this year right the the rate I'm we're going but uh I think 3,000 I think it'll be close but I think I'll I'll just be back to you guys by the end of the year uh Bob yeah Lenny I just want to ask there one other variable which we didn't talk about which is uh just from your description of this uh training budget and how it's changed it seems like now we're providing a lot more training to the department than we were in the past I think that's easy to see so that's therefore the cost has gone up as do we pardon me I don't believe that's the case I've always came to Thursday trainings and that's basically what we've done why is the so the minimum because the rate no the rate is only based on the call response I mean the minimum three hours is only for calls right not training not training I I think okay maybe I'm not clear with my question is that why this training cost is going up uh significantly as part of your budget uh is because you have 50 training sessions per year and they're now fully attended or more uh you're more successful in getting people to show up for these training sessions is that right well last year we had uh less people on we lost Mark but we gained three firefighters so so you're getting more training though Tred two firefighters and more and so like I said one firefighter if they show up to every training is $3,600 um we just gained two firefighters and had an overall higher attendance I guess and again La last year I was under budget as well I guess I was leading up to the question was that if we have firefighters now that are being trained are they going to need continue training or is this something that when they're trained up then they can they will sort of taper off on their training attendance I mean that's is that logical or I think training is you know imperative for everybody for safety and for the well-being of everybody to be fluent on everything and I stress everybody should be uh going to training regardless of experience okay so there's no that's not an issue then the the the length of time the person has served in the department and whether this is redundant to them or something yeah um no everything we got to cover a lot of stuff we gota we cover just as much stuff as a full-time Department outwhere you know we're kind of still um other departments train just as much if not more so the way we've always done is train every Thursday night and uh that's always been this that's always been the case um I know last year I was under budget um and now this year we have two additional firefighters so that's where we're at all right so it seems pretty clear that two drivers here which are the the number of firefighters that we have employed at any given time and and then the crew that we have now just seems to be more engaged than um you know attending trainings at a at a higher rate which is a good it's not a problem it's a good thing uh but yeah I mean I think it sounds like those are those are really the two factors that are driving this increase and so we the other question I was going to just continue the question how many firefighters are you looking for to to full fully staffed you know Department well um uh me personally as many as we can have as many as that are responsible that I could could get honestly it would be nice to have 15 people on the on the department uh if my back goes out and one or two one key person leaves town there may or not may not be anybody in town to respond to a call so I I take it seriously that we can actually make a crew of some sort for a call any day of the week and uh it's not going to be good in the long run if we're only depending on one person to be doing that because when that one person breaks you know if we don't have a pool to drw to uh pull from you're not going to have Department that can respond to calls now most most of our guys work out of town during the day so there's only a couple people in town during the day and uh that's just the way it is so uh Susie I just wanted to check if the state's newer requirements for training would come under unfunded mandate um principle or you just the towns all have to to suck it up because that will be affecting everybody and if it's not funded um then everybody will be in the same boat it might be an unfunded mandate I believe it's an OSHA unfunded mandate uh Jim Lena you mentioned that uh you have two to two to three more prospective candidates so so what you're also saying is is there's no limit on how many people you would would like uh to join the fire department is that correct to me the more the marrier uh the more people we have in town that's on the department that will likely reduce the chance that there's one only one person available for a call okay I still think it's cheaper than all I think paying call wages and training wages to nine or 10 firefighters I still believe that's all cheaper than hiring one firefighter and that one firefighter is only going to get you 40 hours a week right I mean I'm just trying to put it in proportion what um Lenny C can you can you give us a little perspective on sort of um the kind of historical trend of like how many what firefighters we've the town has had in any given time like have we ever had a crew of 15 people is that we used to have 20 the early 90s late 80s early 90s I think there was like 23 24 people on the on the roster got it when was the last time we had say 15 oh I I don't ever remember 15 um 15 years ago probably Pro around 2006 no before around 2000 probably yeah I it might be really hard for me to look look at it and figure figure that out but I don't really I don't ever remember seeing 15 uh 15 people at every any one time since 05 got it 13 I've seen but not 15 okay all right um all right before we let Lenny go I think we we have to make a decision about what to do about the FY 25 training wages line in our budget and I think we've heard a couple of proposals here one is to like just kind of stick with what we have budgeted right now which is a little under $24,000 kind of used next year as a as a another year to evaluate this line um I think George made uh a a pretty logical case for at least maybe adding bumping that line up by a few thousand doll also in to kind of prepare for what think is going to be um a more significant increase in FY 26 um does anybody want to make a specific proposal I'll make a motion that we increase the amount that we are currently have in the FY 25 budget by $3,000 27 then yeah basically yeah what why don't we use a a round number and just call it 27 I'll raise I'll make a motion that we raise the training wages line to $27,000 fy2 April seconds any uh discussion all right George oh B sorry Bob I see your here now I just want to you know point out the obvious which is that we're having a tough time with our budget this year because we have some substantial increases uh which are driving uh the bottom line up and I think that uh for that reason I would say to stick with what we have and evaluate it the way you suggested as an option to raise to bumping it uh we have a lot of issues that are a lot of requests that are pushing our budget higher and I think that this is something we dealt with here with the reserve we can deal with it again next year with the reserve we can evaluate it more fully then as far as going in the right direction to anticipating some future increases that I don't see the logic in that when they come we'll deal with those to but as this line goes we'll we'll have to see how it works out that's my opinion and we can address it just like we did tonight if lendy needs more uh infusion of cash uh next year but in the meantime we have a serious problem with our budget and with the with the levy so I'd say stick with the number we have or maybe go up to 25 or something if at most all right George anticipating a higher number is half the Logic the other half of the logic is we pretty much determined that $224,000 does not look like it's going to be adequate so to go up another $3,000 puts us in line um to make sure that our fire department is adequately trained we have a motion are we gonna vote on the motion yeah we're still deting it yeah we're discussing uh Becky I just want clarification George is the 3 hasn't going to training or to call wages or we we the motion was to increase the training wages line M to $27,000 right because it's a 24 right now or just y standing by to make a change if voted all right yeah we just raised our Levy capacity or decreased uh all right George why don't you start the voting say uh Groves I Hing I hasu I moer I Stein I Walton I okay all right so we've just voted to increase the fy2 uh budget for Fire Department training wages to 27,000 even okay anything else you you need to discuss with us Lenny I don't think so thank you all right how's your back Lenny yeah thank thank you you're doing a great job yes I think I think the fact that people are attending training at a higher rate must have something to do with h with uh the job you're doing so so yeah thank you all right how is the back how is the back doing Lenny it's been better okay yeah I couldn't move it all last week and this week I find myself walking around but still hurts get better soon sounds like physical Therapies in your future yeah sounds like you're speaking from experience here George yep you bet all right um for those keeping track we've got a a fincom Reserve balance now of $ 49,942 after the after tonight's two transfers okay uh let's um let's move Shi gears and talk about um fy2 budget um thank you thanks money thanks Lenny uh so I guess maybe I think I think a few of us might have an update or two from regarding the regional school budget I I had a chance to watch about 15 minutes of their meeting I think last from last night and um it sounds like um sounds like uh they're they're uh looking to have a four towns meeting on April 20th um and so I'm I'm hoping that you guys can kind of hold your a spot on your calendar if you're around I know that's um School's spring break but um fortunately I'm coming back that Thursday so I can attend um but I think we are moving towards a four towns meeting on the 20th um I think there wasn't I think I think the the amoris finance committee is taking this up at their next meeting which I think is happening like any day now this week I think um so I don't think there was a lot of uh there any kind of significant update from the kind of Town Council or the um the finance committee um from ammer I think pum the the rep from pelum said that they they didn't get a firm no on on the new budget which was a little bit counter to what we had heard at our last meeting but I think the way she explained it is that they've asked the regional school committee to do kind of a three-year projection of kind of where um kind of where they see expenses and revenue um kind of over the next three years and then and essentially they said they wanted to see that information before they made any commitments to providing additional funding Beyond you know the the last uh four towns uh meeting budget that that we looked at um so one thing that really confused me um and maybe Becky you might you might have some maybe there's some historical precedent for this but Doug was basically bringing up a scenario where um the the towns who who hold you know Town meetings the three towns could could adjourn their their annual Town meetings without taking a vote on the regional budget and and take it up at a follow-up meeting and he was talking about how there was some precedent for ammer having done this before they moved to a Town Council government that seemed like kind of a crazy idea to me to like would the idea be that that you would have to have like a second followup town meeting and I think the the the reason for this is I think he's he's sort of try like anticipating that there's going to be a lot of kind of last minute like reworking of the budget and I think you know so that we're we're we're not actually gonna put forth the budget that was passed um at town meeting but we're actually going to have to you know to do some kind of an amendment on the floor of this anyway so I just I just wanted to bring that to your attention because that sounded like a kind of problematic uh scenario that I couldn't really wrap my head around but um yeah Becky um so part of the problem is lever and chsb are both voting the week after the fordtown meeting right so um unless we come up with if we all agree at that meeting to a new budget number yeah but I don't see the value of what doug was talking about of I mean conceptually we could all have the information that you know we're all trying to get to a a specific Regional assessment number but I think the fact may be that the fact if we don't achieve what the school committee voted I think the vote is going to be a no right so the budget's not going to pass yeah well and I think that's so I I don't know how he wiggles out of that well I think I think his thought is that there's some work that's gonna happen after an April 20th four towns meeting that will allow us to put on the floor of our of a of a second or a followup town meeting that is probably has a budget number and corresponding assessment method that falls somewhere in between the February budget and the budget that the school committee's actually passed but I don't know I'm now I'm kind of speculating Bob I saw your hand up I think before yeah U I had long talk with John tricky today and he okay passed along to me some I guess some scuttlebutt anyway he said he's been talking to Andy Steinberg and John tricky from from the lever so he said he said that his committee defitely has voted and unanimously to not recommend the 88.2% so she said the uh the uh their rep to the school committee said otherwise he told me that just a couple hours ago so said that they are not going to recommend it to town meeting they're going to pull it out of the budget as an independent article so that it can be addressed independently from the rest of the budget uh he also said that Steinberg told him that he didn't believe that amoris would resolve this issue in time for uh say our time meeting and he reminded me that uh one town that revokes this budget down bust the budget it's all it requires it has to be an animous it's not like the abortion method the the abortion method is Takes Two Towns to to knock it down this is what he told me so Becky you may me disagree but this is what I what I heard from him and he thinks that the set the idea of having a separate special town meeting might be the way it ends up because Amis will not give us any real firm information about what they're willing to to pay and without that information we don't even know what we're dealing with uh you know we're up we're up in the air we all know this so maybe that'll be resolved at the fourtown at the fourtown meeting but according to what he told me he doesn't think that Steinberg believes it it will be so that's that's what I heard through the through through John tricky today I think it's kind of interesting uh so Bob can I just get one clarification because I I think it's important for us the their plan you're saying by by pulling the the regional school budget line out so that would allow them to basically approve a budget at the town meeting for all other aspects of town government other than school committee I see and so they so he's essentially in that scenario they probably wouldn't vote on a regional school budget at their at their town meeting at all well he certainly said that his his committee the finance committee that is uh is not recommending that the town meeting approve it uh they're recommending that it not approve it this 88.2% so it doesn't they don't have a place in their budget for that budy is what do we even have the discretion to not have like a a warrant article on um at town meeting like don't we have to have a warrant article that um to on the the budget that the regional school committee has approved like we don't have the option of not not on that at at our town meeting right well if we're voting against the budget we can put in whatever we can put in whatever line amount we want on that line right yeah right I okay so that I guess that's what I'm asking I I thought the budget will fail right um but I guess I I guess I was under the impression but I may have just making the wrong assumption that we have to vote on the budget that the regional school committee has passed that like we don't have the discretion to say we're not even going to vote on that at our town meeting we're going to vote on an alternative budget amount no you could do that I think we change the amount right all right yes um all right fail okay uh George um yeah so there's a lot to unpack here really um if we're talking about I I think we're going to put together a budget with a smaller number than the 8.2% increase and then there's going to be a Warren article for the assessment me method and that's going to be based on the 8.2 so Becky well in in what John's saying that they're going to do in the town of pelum I'm confused myself um you got to take both those things off and then have a special town meeting at a later point but what if we had both of those and we put in our number and pass the budget and then the towns agreed to raise the assessment a little couldn't we have special town meeting before the end of the years where we could adjust approve a new ass method and have a war article where we approve a new budget or a modification to the budget can we do that Becky well you if the warn article right now for the special town meeting is the assessment method with an 8.2 guard rail if at fourtown meeting everybody decides we're going to do 5% guard rail on it yeah and we well then for our annual town meeting where the warrant is already posted we could have a special town meeting to change that warn article to 5% and approve that um and supersede would do what what doug was talking about before you would just hold that article and and close the the meeting except for that article and okay meeting open to autate that's that's how how all the could converge to a point in time where they actually had a viable plan and then as far as our budget goes could we approve a budget with a what is where are we at now I forget 2.7% increase um but have a special town meeting to actually modify the approved budget if we decide to go to some other level above that then we we would need that special town meeting anyways for the warrant article then could we adjust the budget but don't the other towns also have to agree we can't do this unilaterally well no that's what I'm saying if the fourtown meeting is on the 20th our warant article is already posted I would like to put together a budget and prop propose and pass a full budget because I'm trying I can't imagine passing a budget with a line missing that's $1.6 million well we could I mean if we know on the 27th what our Target number is we can amend it on the floor could we if it's less than what what is that then yeah it has to be less than the original proposal so what if our what if our budget I I hate hate to say this but what if our budget is the 88.2% number with with an understanding that as a committee we're g to vote we're going to recommend not passing that and then you know if all goes well for Town's meeting we come to some alternative budget number that's lower than that then when it comes time for our annual town meeting we have an amendment is that something we need to run by Paul to see if he would be he would allow us to to amend that I mean it would be amending it down so oh you can amend down okay that's that that's not controversial okay I don't think I mean even if it's a significant amount we'll we'll talk it through with Paul ahead make sure he doesn't have issues but I think yeah I think when you're reducing I know Paul if if the amount is too large like he might have a problem with it but I think we can we could talk that piece that was going to be the second thing I want to talk about was and I I I mentioned this briefly in the last meeting that I was thinking about it when we go to the fourtown meeting we're going to have to come up with a number that we're willing to go up to anyways right we're going to all the town are going to be asked well what can you do and so I'm wondering if we could maybe figure that out tonight and put that in our budget and take that to special to to annual town meeting and if they go up to that we've got the money for it if they go above it sorry you know um because bottom line is we can only afford so much if we can determine what that is so I'm just throwing that out right now for everybody to think about when we get to the budget but procedurally Becky we can't we we can't amend on annual town meeting if it's if it's a if it's an increase right maybe if it's a trivial amount because the the the citizens have to be warned okay and if you gave them no notice of that potential for them to come and express themselves and and that's the benefit of pushing that number up to as high as we think we could go because if the region decides on something and say okay shoots can go to that percentage we'll work out a number that gets us that percentage or probably they're going to work something out it'll be below and we can lower it on the town floor right so that's it I won't talk again suy I have a couple questions one do we know what ammer timeline is we know we're on the 27th of April do we know what ammer timeline timeline is so I think there were a couple dates that oh I wish I had written this down I think so like I said I think the the there's going to be some initial feedback from presumably from the amoris finance committee that's coming I don't know maybe somebody can look whenever they're meeting next they're taking this out um I think the I think the town manager presents the budget to the Town Council on I thought they said May 1 is that does anybody does that sound right to people or anybody know Tuesday night I think that I think that's what they said um and but I think in the P I think what they typically do is they they present a number for the regional school budget actually before that date um that's been their practice since it's such a large component of of their budget um so but I think and I think maybe this is what Andy Steinberg might have been alluding to is that I think the timeline's going to be tough for for for ammer like I don't think they're going to actually have a I mean they're not going to have presented a budget to the Town Council before we before we have our annual town meeting I think that's that's my understanding and then the other question I have is can I it sounded like what doug was saying is the word adjourn adjourn our annual town meeting without the decision done so um and that sounds a little bit more like uh fitting the timing into what else happens and I I agree we could put in a number that um we like 8.2 and then not recommend it um and then everything any then we adjourn and then any number that we go after that comes after that when we complete our meeting would be a lower number than 8 .2 nope it's not going to be more than 8.2 yeah so we could put it in there at 8.2 we could adjourn the meeting with that it resolved and then we could finish that later if that's that's what I think is being suggested yeah I think we've got two choices there right we can well I think we have three choices we could we could put in our budget right now the 8.2% uh assessment number with an understanding that we're not going to recommend the town approve that and that we are working on an alternative amount that will be ready to either present at as an amendment at annual town meeting or some you know some something that gets taken up at an adjourned you know a following date that's scenario one I think scenario two would be to to put in the February number the 2 point whatever percent um and then I think scenario three would be to do something along the lines of what George was saying which is find a number somewhere in between there that we think is you know tenable for the town and put that number in go to four towns meeting present that you know we we think this is the best that we can do and so um and see if we end up at that number right I mean are those our three options yes April yeah I think those are three options and I I am leading in favor of what George is proposing you know I think that gives us something to work with and some something realistic um I'm also wondering if we adjourn town meeting would would we be adjourning without any budget you know would you know would we would everything be on hold or do we have to if we adjourned it without this large piece of the budget settled does that mean that we don't have a budget right we don't we don't have it we can't okay we would need another town meeting don't adjourn but you don't adjourn you hold the meeting open is that the word hold it open yeah you you continue the meeting there's a a procedure to continue a meeting holding it open so that you know the budget is still sitting there and then you would you know resolve this major issue and come back and finish your budget as long it would take weeks before we could do that because we'd have to post another well that would time to another town meeting I don't I don't I don't think the time framing is the same um when you hold open a meeting sometimes they hold open the meeting and and meet like shortly after isn't that isn't it can it's you know as long as it's in the same fiscal year I believe it's you know whenever you decide and the rest of the warrant would be settled so it would be just coming back because the meeting's been held open to solve the budget question but one key point there not to forget is we still have to have an ass sufficient amount so that we could decrease but we still wouldn't be able to increase because it's the same meeting right right yeah and I think and I think we would do that we would continue the meeting once ammer has actually approved the budget right like as long as we're as long as we're not resolving this at our annual town meeting we might as well wait until after the Town Council has actually voted to approve yeah why run the risk of like having to come back again uh Bob yeah I just want to say I person the way I think about uh developing a budget is doing it all together and knowing all the different the major components where they're at and then adjusting everything so that it comes out the way you want it in terms of the increase which it always is but not having this big piece uh not knowing what it's going to be really makes that impossible to do a a comprehensive analysis of the budget I really think that we're in a fix here and there's no way around it because as far as I understand amest is not going to make a decision and that's really critical to this whole process for us and uh they're not going to make a decision till after our time meeting that's what I have understood from listening to John tricky and and so if that's the case uh I think just putting a high number in there doesn't really work for me because I'm trying to keep numbers as low as I can reasonably do and uh this we already compromised we agreed to go up to extend the increase in the bud budget back earlier days with so long ago when we had what seemed to be a pretty reasonable fourtown meeting and now the thing's been blown up and we I think we need to have more information to decide what number what that number should be I think for me I would just put our old number in there and I think as far as the notification issue goes if we're going to have a second town meeting we can provide notification uh before it why can't we if it going to go up why can't we notify uh in the normal way if for the second the extended town meeting or whatever it is well because that that's not going to be enough time right we if if if we meet on a if we meet the four towns meet on April 20th that's already we're already passed our deadline right oh do you think we're gonna get the information from Amber that time I don't so will be posted when we go to the fordtown meeting it has to be and have been posted right so but but I I mean it to me in my mind we have to come out of that four towns meeting with a budget number that we at least as four towns have like a high degree of confidence is gonna it's gonna be that's exactly my point AJ so yeah but but but I guess but Bob like we don't we're not GNA have an opportunity let's assume that does play out and we do we do walk out of that meeting with a budget number some compromise that falls between the February budget and the one the region has voted on we're not going to be we we'll have already posted a meeting uh I'm sorry our our warrant articles right and so if the if that number is higher than the number that's been posted on the with the the warrant article then we're not going to be able to amend that that that that confuses me somehow seems like should be able to do that but you can't can you say no you can't no that's the point we can only amend it if it's if it's in a in a at the actual town meeting but if we're having another meeting why can't we well exactly I mean I guess I was I was sort of thinking like we're we really want to advocate for a process that's not going to require us to to hold the meeting open but maybe that's not maybe maybe I was wrong to assume that before tonight's meeting maybe that's not such a big deal to do that I don't in my mind it's at the time it seemed like when Doug was presenting this as a as a potential procedure it seemed to me like wow that that seemed crazy but maybe it's maybe it's not so unusual um George I just want to address the point that Bob made I I think what we're doing is what we should be doing and that is we're putting together a budget we're looking at the budget we're going to go through the process and we're going to decide what we can afford and we can put a number in there for that that I think that's we're going about it the right way way and then we send a message to the four towns that this is what we can afford and this is what we're willing to do that's what I'm proposing that we do I'm not proposing that the tail wags the dog here and then secondly Becky quick question how much does money does it cost to run a special town meeting there's that well it's okay so the the special temp you don't have the election potentially at the special town meeting so the costs aren't but you do have to have the autoark and it was like $1,000 to get the autoark oh it's a thousand or two not and then all the people it's like 2,000 bucks the auto Mark isn't involved in the town meeting it's only election so it's just hiring people to be the workers and it'll be minimal okay it's also people's time right yeah and I wonder if um a special town meeting can it totally revise a budget no you're not going to have a special town meeting that so it's not separate that well we would for the Warren article for the assessment method uh I don't I don't think so George I don't know we have to look at it more but holding open the annual town meeting where there all these issues oh I see I'm sorry yeah I forgot that point my bad oh you're right I forgot that process that you would probably file but AJ I I cannot find that sheet you shared with us most recent that shows what our figure would be at 88.2% okay I'll pull it up um okay um while I'm doing that Susie I see your hand up um yeah well I I was I was thinking the word special town meeting doesn't work because I can't believe you could run a special town meeting to redo the entire budget warrant article um that doesn't sound like it would be okay yeah um I just want AJ I just wanted to that I've been um I was texting back and forth um with Margie mcginness uh the lever at men because she and I spoke yesterday and she told me she was um I asked for what what was Leverett thinking about the new budget yeah from the school committee and she said she did not know so what she did in prepar they had their budget hearing last night oh so she prepared two budgets one with um out the new request and one with the new request so I asked her what happened at that point and she told me that to the old figure shoot now I can't see it so my understanding is Leverett has put 8.2% $126,000 in their budget really and okay got it and but they haven't voted to recommend that um approving that or they have I believe that's what the direction they're they're leaning I mean they're putting it they're put putting the full amount in their budget I don't know what that means for what they can what they're goingon to vote what's their town meeting their town meeting is April 27th same as shoot berries uh April what was I going to say um we also have that that uh for the assessment method the alternative method doesn't it show that we use the the statutory with the five-year rolling average so if that's approved how does that that's not reflected in their budget so it doesn't really work right I I agree Bob I think and and they did not I was a little disappointed because they did not um discuss this at their meeting last night that that I think there's a problem with the the uh assessment method um so I'm gonna reach out to Doug uh tomorrow and see and explain to him why well there really two issues right one that we we don't think it's kind of a fair um you know kind of it's not a fair attribution and there's also a problem where the language in the budget motion that they passed is does not exist does not accurately describe what they've done right we're not going to we have we're not going to approve that at time yeah yeah they need to change that uh Jim yeah I thought when we uh we voted on this and decided to turn down uh the the 88.2% we also were going to communicate that back um to the region or to the to the region as well as uh indicate that the methodology was not right that was used and that we recommended that they visit that so we've already communicated this methodology topic or issue to the to the committee haven't we to the region yeah but we haven't and are they ignoring it well I think I think they're so focused on the 8.2% um that they did not I don't think they spent any significant time discussing it as the committee we have communicated it to Doug um and but I just don't think he's particularly focused on this part of the problem so I I I'm going to talk to him about this express our concerns let him know that the current language is we believe is not appropriate um and then um and then I think this is going to be part of what we discuss at at the four towns meeting right yeah I think that's really important for shuberry I mean if the methodology is is is critical from shsb and that that that's visible and talked about and that we get back on track with the methodology that we've both agreed to in past years um one thing just and we don't want to get that let that get lost in this you know with all this turbulence that's going on now uh agreed um one thing is I I know that that um Doug mentioned that they're building in caucus time into the four towns meeting unlike the the last I think couple that we've had so I think I think there is an expect that we're gonna there's going to be some negotiation happening at this four towns meeting Susie and then April so I sent everybody a copy of the email I sent to Doug and it mentioned those three elements I did not send it to the regional school committee but Anna was at our um fincom meeting and she we reiterated the points to her I I think it would have been good if I had sent it to the regional school committee too but this really this document we're looking at comes from um the central office so that's where the the email was sent and Anna did communicate our response that you know we we do not think this is this 8.2% is workable for for shutesbury so she she she did give that feedback um at last night's meeting April well just part of the process I I feel like it's very unfortunate that the regional school committee went forward with this so late in the process after thing you know it it's just the process really is screwed up um and the regional school committee I it feels like I know they have a lot of authority but it really feels like they um overstepped or overreached um um and have put us all in a quandry because if we don't have a budget isn't there a facil doesn't the state freeze your budget for FY 24 and there's some mechanism where the the region loses our autonomy right the process is they they would put us on what they call a 112 budget which is basically they would take right they would take our the state would take our FY 24 budget yeah so this number I guess this 33.7 million um and they would essentially divide that into 12 portions and they would Dole that money out to us on a monthly Bas not to us to the region on a monthly basis and would Inc strongly urge the um the towns the various committees to pass um a budget so however long it took us to do that we would be operating on a budget that's based on our fy2 24 uh Jim yeah maybe just to muddy the waters a little bit more I just going back in in this negotiation process and discussion process the last time we got together with the four towns um I think we all did agree on a budget and now there's been this this movement since then that that might might not be adequate um but I don't think we have any substantive information today that suggests what our number should be or if if we indeed as shoot spy from a Sho spy perspective should be going should be increasing um so I I think from a negotiation perspective as part of four towns we should probably start with where we were in February and then and then work from there as we gather more information I I don't understand why we want to start with some high number other than you know the media and you can go up but not down and and whatever George I'm really happy happy to hear April um make the comments she did about um the way this this has been approached because I don't think it's realistic and we need to be realistic and I just want to go back and say we're here having one of the big agenda items for tonight is the budget and I think when we get to the budget and we start making some of our Maneuvers I'd like to send the Regional budget back down to $39,000 increase not 12728 and look at everything else and see where we are and see how much we can reasonably raise that $339,000 increase and debate that um we're we're kicking the can here um you know and I think we need to look at the numbers and we'll have a better idea and I I think we are far enough along in the process that we can do that uh Becky um I just want to throw out there that if if Leverett um goes to 8.2 and amers follows um I believe pelum will drop in place despite what John is saying now because he always does um which will leave us again in the position of being um you know if we're not looking at that possibility we're going to be the ones killing the budget do you think amers can really go up that additional amount they're not going to George there's no way oh you're right there so it's G to be amoris that makes the call as usual and and I agree with Jim Walton here that we we already had a four time meeting we did our job we worked with the other towns we came up with a number we were H we extended it a little bit we compromised upward and then then that went to uh Regional school committee didn't accept that now they're basically uh they're they're out on on on on island here basically as far as I can tell and I think P we we have no reason to just assume that we should go up to 88.2% I think that is irresponsible I think we should go in with the number we have as Jim suggested and then we have to read the tea leaves and see what's going on with Amis particularly and the rest of the towns and then make a decision about what we're willing to recommend if that means uh being flexible and in terms of being uh a good Community member then we'll figure that out when we get there but I think to preemptively go up to 88.2% is not uh it's not logical as far as I'm concerned but you won't have the option to do that Bob because you can't go up at that point well I think I think that's something I would look like to look into and talk to the moderator about because you know this is a very special circumstance and we could we could explain this to the public about what what the play is here his call If We the finance committee won't have control of whether you can do that or not that's the problem well I think we had this is an extraordinary circumstance so I think maybe we we have to deal with it with an extraordinarily different way I I know that Paul raised that issue for the first time in my recollection two years ago when someone wanted to amend a budget item he said no you can't do it because people haven't been properly notified uh and it's happen a lot but you think that I didn't we call it ever happening in the past it's the rule it's the rule BL we can't go any other way it's the rule I for that reason I was thinking if we did step one there was three options if we put 8.2 in the budget and shoot and the finance committee does not recommend it that says that says where we're at and I don't believe I guess then you're against up against whether there's a lot of people that come to the meeting planning to override the finance committee's recommendation that could happen um but we would directly translate into um we a tax number for the average tax bill that we would be telling them but if by putting it in at 8.2 and not recommending it then it can go down but you cannot go up that's the rule that's what a warrant is for it warns people um Jim yeah I guess I I understand that I um but again I guess when I hear that the other three towns are going to go up 88.2% that to me sounds that's that's speculation and and I and even if they do end up going that way I'd like to understand i' like to understand what drives it up to 8.2% and I just don't think based on the information we have right now we shouldn't drive our decision based on what we speculate other towns are going to do I think we need to focus on um where we are we we have a process we've been working with the four towns on the last time we got together was February we came to an agreement with them then um we've just gotten some information thrown out there and I I think we just need to have a a discipline process if we're going to go higher than what we've already agreed to with the four towns so my my only sort of push back on that Jim is that I think that that February budget does call for the elimination of 14 teaching positions which was not you know I think one of the mistakes in this process is that I think it was presented at that last four towns meeting as well we're not really going to lose 14 teaching positions there's you know like some turnovers and I it was I felt like it was kind of minimized at that meeting and it wasn't until after that meeting that you know the central office did the work of actually planning on okay what would it mean to make this $1.7 million in cuts and some of those choices I think really are um severe and I think they really would um it would kind of fundamentally change the quality of Education that that students and so while I don't I don't think the 88.2% is a workable number I guess I would advocate for us to to spend some time tonight thinking about what's a number what's an amount that kind of can supplement that February budget that we can support and we can live with and be at least prepared to defend that at a four towns meeting as a poos to just showing up at the four towns meeting and say you know you know this too bad you know you we we we came we arrived at an agreement in February and we saw we see no reason to to to move off of that uh Susie one of the things is the process is quite flawed the fourtown meeting is not representative represented by the school committee they are not there talking and advocating and defending we we're only doing a financial basically only a financial end at for toown meeting so we can walk out of that meeting with a p a picture but it really doesn't include all the stakeholders then it do Susie the this Regional school committee is part of the meeting they're not all there they're definitely not all there and and I think that that that's a problem and so when April says then later they come up with a full-fledged full-throated thing it's because they really aren't very integrated at the four Town meetings so I would say it isn't well represented and here we are how can we come up with a a budget number that will meet more needs than we represented at the for town meeting uh Jim Walton yeah I just responded to your comment AJ and that's about you know going to this this April 20 meeting um with some with with some idea of where we think we can end up and I I I I agree and support that and that's the way we've always handled the the process uh with four Town discussions in the past I guess the challenge for us this time is we already have to be locked into some number uh prior to uh you we have to lock in something into the warrant prior to that meeting that's that's a challenge yeah that's a challenge with that that's the conundrum right and if that and if that number is the the you know the $39,000 in then that's I think that's going to kind of guarantee that we're not going to be able to amend this the budget at at town meeting because I I just I don't think it's likely that um you know all four towns are going to reject the 88.2% proposed budget and and but you know and go back to the the 2 point whatever the 4% um for for amoris and other towns but anyway so yeah the other the other the other comment on it AJ is uh going back uh to what we've what we came up with in February is Doug Doug had some idea of what needed to be done to get that proposed budget done I um he had to if anybody in that room in that meeting knew had some idea what had have been Doug it had some sense for what had to be done to hit that number right I mean I think that's I don't think Doug would have just Dro pulled that out of the air those numbers he had some idea of what kind of changes had to be made right but I think I think I guess my my criticism is that I think it was sort of downplayed what how significant an impact that and it's certainly I mean it's it's it's it certainly didn't predict you know the the amount of public push back that they would they ultimately received which was really substantial and um I I mean like I think if if if at that meeting it was presented that well you know we're going to have to make these cuts and for example we're going to have to make this fundamental change to the Middle School language program I think there might have been some some more push back than than there was but the message at that meeting was you know this is workable we can do this we can manage this and I think that was a mistake no uh Bob yeah I just want to say to comment on Susie's remarks but I think you're right that the process is FL one of the way it's flawed uh is that the regional school committee hands out uh the contracts to the teaching staff which puts a lot of upward pressure on the budget and then we're left with the Dilemma of could we support this really significantly increased budget uh or reduce all these other functions of the school like the cooking program the home program all these programs were sacrificed in the past few years because of the upward uh pressure of wages at for training instruction and that's we're not part of that process we have nothing to do with the the contracts for the teachers and yet we have to deal with it we have to deal with budgets we have to deal with financial management and they are at this four time meaning to represent to Advocate and to pitch their budget and we our responsibility is to review it and to see what we could afford to pay considering all the other obligations that have put put a placed upon us to to us to to finance different departments in our towns so I think the process was reasonably uh open and uh I think that nobody I've tried to make a couple points at the meeting that you know the enrollment has gone down steadily in the region yet the cost of educating students is up to over $30,000 per each we have they have employed Choice down there at a rate of 19% of their student body is choice they get $5,000 for a choice student $32,000 for a regular homegrown student this doesn't work there has to be structural adjustments in the way they operate and provide services to our our our children and our families that is not as costly and as inefficient as this so yeah there'll always be resistance whenever you contract any Department especially something as sensitive as important as a school but this this is our job to like look at this thing and say that's one of the things that I liked about what tricky said stand back and do it let's do a three-year plan what's where is this headed with enrollment Trends with the cost of Education with all the needs that the buildings have look at it all together and say let's come up with a plan you know with a plan that that will work and instead of this adhawk method that we have and uh you know this is we ended up with a car crash because of that method and I think the the politics are as you say AJ they're very they're very intense and uh someone's going to take some heat anytime you let a teacher go but you know the cost is just not supportable I think at this point that's the problem you know so where this heads what what that means for us is we can't just say oh yeah whatever we's just put 10% in there for this as a marker and then we'll we always voted we could always reduce it later well I don't think that's really sound financial management either so uh I don't know what where we're at we're we're right you're right uh uh April you're right Susie that this process has put us into a real Jam a real jam and uh it's it's annoying because it's it this should have been worked out between the parties in a more amicable way it seems to me you know um April I have to say I love hearing you say Bob that I'm right I just wanted to say that that really that made my day it's been a long day thank youil it's been a long day been but I want to propose that we we end this disc I think we're having a wonderful discussion and I was right and that we look at the budget what can we afford and I would propose that we leave the current 8.2 number in the budget with the understanding that we will not support it but let's look at the numbers what can we support where because I think we also have to go into this meeting with a spirit of compromise you know that and and we are the bad guys once again and maybe but maybe not so let let's let's do the work okay where are we with the budget all right so yeah I good I think that's you're right fa we should transition um uh so let me pull up uh the budget that Becky sent earlier today um Becky do you wna just flag anything that's changed since the previous version that we've looked at he so the one thing is I added the $115,000 to New Growth um just going based on um the last two actuals that we've had it was 68,000 um this year 56 the year before this 18,22 I I I think it's you know it happened but in 21 we were at at 92 and in 20 we were at 72 and in 19 we were at 79 so if you all are comfortable with that I I I know there's reason to search for a revenue that's going to be there in the end and I I do believe it'll be there but um the assessors are just starting on the new growth figure they'll probably have it by miday but um you know that's too late for our process what what was the previous number we had in here it was 40,000 okay we add all right okay um and then there was a slight change in the amount of Levy capacity I've only made smaller changes on the expense side I added in two um longevity payments 2300 longevity payments for FY 25 um we look through um the I had already enlarged the equipment maintenance that is not new here there is the longevity bonus for the assessor clerk all right that's say 300 yeah yeah and there's a second one for the police chief for her first five years um the 300 for this one is for 10 years because it's um she's part-time believe that's the case um the I reduced I reduced the amount of the assistant town clerk um I'm sorry the assistant Town collector um and I'm not sure if that's a good decision it it I believe that yeah because I think it was budgeted at 3,600 the prior year was 918 and the year before that was 134 so I brought that down another $1,100 um let's see if you want to I tried to highlight anything I changed so I added 1500 to the planning board expenses because um this year they were running over uh they currently are running over and they ran over the year before in FY 23 um well they're approaching you know they are over so I did those two changes um the equipment maintenance had been done earlier the town news okay the Town report um had been at 11:30 but what we paid last year was 1950 uh to get the work done and so I put for next year I put in the figure that we actually paid you can see the actual an FY 23 with printing was $6 ,000 um so I think that's a reasonable adjustment it does not include the printing cost I hope to steal the printing money from the printing and advertising line um up above okay and then I'm sorry and I also I I added 420 to the newsletter line just given the fact that the cost to do a newsletter uh times three U was not covered in the 3780 um there's the longevity payment for the police chief here I haven't made these changes I Pro um I did in the you know we just talked about adding $3,000 here that's not reflected in this budget that you're looking at but I made the CH I'm making the change on the master so that's if you want to go to the next page um and this had been done prior there was an extra $121 for the Emergency notification um system that we use uh veterans benefits I think it's the last change I made um we actually have a veteran drawing um monthly that has started back up so projected what it'll cost for next year at the rate that we know is being currently charged so it's an additional $131 if you want yeah Becky I it looks like you did so you did put in the 88.2% um Regional assessment yes I did okay thank you quick question um you didn't mention two positions um that the Personnel Board had discussed oh um we're talking about um highway I'm sorry and grounds Cemetery grounds keeper oh no the ones that we were the alignment study you're right um I don't think those are reflected but did they did they change the budget yes they will change the I think they would I'm not I I think there might have been enough money in the Assessor's Clerk line but I wasn't sure that there was enough money in there's definitely not enough money in the treasury okay so there are two alignments that um need to get added to this budget and I think their total was about 4,000 5,000 it was 5,000 I mean that it it was a 5,000 increase but uh um 2,000 something is already in here of that 5,000 because the uh um the cola so I think the net effect was more like 3,000 I can look it up up for you but yeah uh but you know they do need to be in there we just for everybody's information we did an alignment study we compared salaries we do it every three years um Franklin County and local towns versus our town and there were two positions that were more than 10% below market and so we decided for those two positions that a rate adjust we didn't go up to bring them up to Market but we came up with a number that brought them back closer to Market so that's what we're referring to that's that's my Personnel Board report for today so we'll have an additional $3,000 but it's worst case like I've been telling you I put in the worst case we have the 127,000 for the regional assessment thank you for highlighting that AJ I don't know if you go down there might be a couple more looked like that was the last we want I thought it was oh good last stage here so this if if I've been keeping track correctly this bottom line here just is the only thing it doesn't reflect is the $3,100 that we added in training wages tonight and the $3,000 for this Personnel Board alignment study you know whatever the effects of that is that right yes all right okay so um um I'm gonna go so Becky this Gap is $4,910 so it's actually more like 40 no that's just between okay that that is I'm not sure what you're trying to do with that but this year there currently is a $40,000 Gap with the real things that happened um I mean with the budget changes that's has not that's not the 40,000 is not what you want to look at all I gotcha yeah y okay um so so does this value here does does this utilize any of our or how much of our excess 15,000 more now right 121,000 121 now yeah okay yeah that's what that's where the gap's made up because has to come somewhere right okay so that's about 121,000 okay um let me just double check because at one point I played with uh okay it took it back out um go back please go back to the revenue side I me this is where if we were on on the second page down farther AJ please okay total revenues so this is where we would decide if we we okay so we are right here I have 30,000 as part of this budget and that's and I have $10,000 in the budget for the building Renovations but I put 30,000 here and I'm sorry I didn't highlight it but there was conversation about approaching it that way and that was the approach I made we did you put 40,000 in the expense budget and you have third and you have this 30 in Revenue so the net effect is 10,000 appropriated and 30,000 from free cash 40,000 appropriated but 30,000 of it is going to be paid for by free cash the other 10,000 will come from the tax levy and then next year will shift so more comes out of the tax levy right yeah take a gradual approach so the number 5.38% is really low it should be it's going to be something close up to 6% is that right by the time we add these num these figures in that you just brought up these other increases is only 6,000 of increases right but on top of what we already had built into the budget bud with the excess ly capacity there'll be more so see I don't know how the rest of the committee feels about a six% increase su's hand is up yeah sorry yeah go ahead uh so yes do the cap X discussion because I believe that there is um an argument to be made of some free cash being used in um this budget that would lower the um that would raise theeven because we only have one of the free cash discussions there that would lower the excess Levy capacity it yeah it would lower the the um need to tax in this budget so the if I may speak for a moment I think the problem is if you're going up this kind of increases and we're offsetting some of the increases with reserves okay that's going to low low lessen the impact on the taxpayer this year but a lot of these things that are going that are being funded by reserves are actually going to continuing expenses it depends on that discussion we haven't had that discussion well we just discussed a couple of them right now we discussed moving more of the building expenses into the operating budget as time went on we've uh we've seen the school which is uh now up got over 5% increase which is going to be permanently part of our budget that's not temporary we're going to put some more cash into the hot the road repair program uh to help Steve do the roads but that's really uh can't be seen there anything but a kind of a continuing uh operating expense to keep our roads in shape so I mean I'm concerned that we're raising taxes this much when we have a policy of level Services you know uh where you know I don't know why we can't budget we're sort of going backwards here we're just accepting the requests uh more or less intact and we're not concerned with that number that number of the increase I'm concerned by it I think it's too high um I don't think it's it's it's it's it's reasonable for us to raise taxes that much uh Suzy yes we I feel like um that is your listing of things Bob isn't a complete enough and a round enough discussion I I believe that we need to talk about the capex spending and I have some rationals and some proposals okay uh George yeah I'm just I I think it is reasonable to use some free cash um especially um some of that sped cost in the elementary school is not forever cost and ramping new costs into the budget which there are quite a few um by funding portions of them with free cash creates less of a jolt to the tax rate these are things that we've approved and we put in the budget so clearly they're going to be in there in the long run but we don't necessarily need to hit the taxpayers with the full effect in the first year so I'm okay with lowering that excess Levy capacity number to some extent by looking at what those new items are and to what extent are we comfortable using cash because like we saw with the building repair line I think it is reasonable to take a portion of the out of District placement that we know is not going to remain in the budget forever and so I want to have that conversation by the way George I agree with the the idea of sped money coming out of cash because I I don't know how long this going to last but I do think that could be seen as a temporary expense all right so should we um I'm GNA pull up the the capex um funding table now um and let's let's discuss that uh let's see where is that and AJ when you get it up one thing I want to mention is yeah on this schedule is on the budget we're adding $86,000 to 86 I forget the number Becky maybe you know um 86 I'll get it uh you're talking about the 86,000 8624 right that's going to be a transfer to the capital stabilization from the operating budget so you want to include that in the analysis AJ so sorry explain to me again what where where that's coming from that 86,000 that's so in our operating budget to the extent that we don't have Debt Service we have a transfer line that yes the operating budget funds Capital stabilization account so on line 22 you want to put in transfer to Capital stabilization and then you want to go to the capital stabilization line and you want to put in the 86 214 okay right and so now what happens is you look at the bottom you can see under ATM we're going to be raising the capital stabilization it'll be at 2133 if that you know if the budget is approved got it okay all right uh all right so um so how do we want to do this do we want to go sort of project by project and and um make a proposal I mean I think Susie you said you were prepared to propose some things tonight but I'm assuming that's about um injecting free cash to fund Parts portions of the operating budget is that is that correct well I I think that we sort of have the whole discussion but I do want to bring up yeah the um out of District to placement and I want to suggest that some of it come out of the um fincom Reserve as it was initially intended and and the rest of it come out of free cash because it's not a permanent feature of our operating budget that's one I wanted to bring up all right um so just maybe let's tackle some of these smaller ones first because I think they those are the kinds of things we tended to recommend funding through free cash so things like you know $122,000 for body camera is is there would there be any sort of push back on use using free cash to fund that project assuming it passes free cash okay um $4,500 for storage container for the highway department is that reasonable all right yep um $225,000 for Highway Department generator yep that number is short the the tank yeah it doesn't include 3,000 more Becky I think I think the the total number um was like 22,000 it's close but I think it's a$ thousand short okay I'll I'll get that number for the next meeting I all right I'm gonna just leave it at 25 for now but we can we can revise that next meeting okay um and then $122,000 for Gravel Road repair I have a question about that pleas go ahead so what's the future of that line is that something we want to build into the budget or was that something that's going to fluctuate year to year and become a regular Capital expense or an occasional Capital expense what's the future of that so just to just to kind of remind everybody this was originally proposed by Steve to be um an increase in his operating budget and and we recommended as a committee to him to bring this to the capital planning committee and I think the logic behind that was that this is that that there's there's been sort of like um and Bob you should F you should correct anything I'm I'm misstating here but the sense I got was that we we've been kind of experiencing um we're facing a lot of kind of deferred maintenance on our gravel roads and um that that there is was kind of a need identified by him to do some Shoring up of um our our some of our roads and that while this is not something that's going to be we're not we're not going to solve this problem in a single year um I didn't get the sense that this is like a permanent okay think you think it could be you're saying yes originally he yeah go ahead Bob go ahead George I was goingon to say he originally asked for 28,000 and came back and said I'd like a $40,000 operating budget for this line so the question is is he gonna go go back to 28 or and my recollection was he was wanting this for the long run that's that's yeah I I believe that's true I think the the amount of material that was being put down was insufficient over the last decade um it's not he's talking about this 12,000 repairing 100 you know the most high priority small sections of road but at you know to to fully develop out the whole Road it's gonna you know it's going to take a number of years especially with you know the limited Manpower right so so to that go up during the same period yeah yeah U let me just say how I thought of it conceptually he said that the roads have been dressed with gravel from the budget every year and they're dressed uh on the surface and graded but that process uh sometimes not enough material was put on and they're down to the to the backbone of the road and they need to rebuild that section of the backbone which has been now disturbed by the by the drivers by the vehicles by the greater and so he sees this and I think this is an okay conceptual thing for me if they if he makes a proposal to us on a year-to-year basis through Capital planning he's going to do some work on Leonard Road he's going to rebuild a section that's softer that's down to its backbone and then use this heavy bony material to on as a base and then it'll be part of the his general maintenance uh budget to uh to address that and grade it on a year-to-year basis then I think it works for a capital expense and so I think he agreed that he would handle it that way this year so I may be contradicting myself now but I think that's a reasonable proposal I think that he needs to do some structural work on some of the dirt roads and there that could be considered to be a capital expense and I think as long as he identifies it and tells us what it's going to cost him in a given year what he has time to do and what the cost of the material is then I think we could address it as a capital expense and I support that line this year for that reason does that make it clear clear to me yeah um but I just want to point out that we've got $40,000 in the operating budget and so if we're going to treat it as a capital item I think we should have $28,000 in the cap absolutely that's what we did this for right yeah so I think we got a pick up in the operating budget of $112,000 yeah I didn't realize that you're right yeah thank you George you're absolutely right yeah line 126 grab road maintenance okay so that's going back to 28k and um and then then um I'm assuming we'll recommend a free cash transfer for for this one nope Susie I I think that we should be considering it in say Capital stabilization or stabilization we might need to prepare the town and not this year because this year's too too tough um that the town pass a designated um fund towards this 1200 ,000 and um I would guess Capital stabilization is the right place to put it so maybe we wing it this year but I think we need to prepare the town for an ongoing project that's like 12,000 a year um and let Steve figure out if that's going to be sufficient there's also some um there was extra money that came in from the state in highways and we hear it being studied so it may end up matching up to some kind of state thing but right now I believe the town should um put it under Capital stabilization with the goal of making it a regular expense okay any other um thoughts about that uh any reactions to that does that sound like seems reasonable yeah I don't feel like I have a strong opinion either way but um all right so let's let's for now let's put this in um as is it true that the cap stabilization money to be passed by two-thirds that's the only difference right um aot um I'm there's a law on the books I don't know if the legislators have passed it yet to remove the 2third uh restriction on stabilization and make it a majority vote I don't think that it would have trouble passing in any case but I just all right um so we've got a fund about a little under $26,000 of this Elementary School painting and exterior repairs project and so does anybody have a proposal for where that that money would come from AJ where did the uh the other 137,000 it's under other yeah so this where is that being how is that being funded so this is the um remaining balance of that earmark for the roof those earmark funds that we had received originally that we used for the roof project okay we didn't spend all of that so um um we we have that amount left and we're gonna proposing to apply that to to this Pro this other school project okay thanks so what we need is this $2,860 is it are you indicating on this spreadsheet that that's going to be borrow that's we're g to borrow that no putting it just it stays the other okay yeah untiled yeah until we make a a decision now so um what where do we propose which Reserve fund do we propose how about free cash any other strong opinions about this you know I think free cash for all of it really but sure except that should be 30 well actually I don't even think this needs to be here what we do is yeah we put at the bottom on row 23 we put in an amount that is on the revenue page for cash flow use Becky had 30,000 there yeah so we should be putting 30 there and then this 40 shouldn't be on the schedule because that's being funded by the operating line right and because right now the way it is we're taking 880,000 out of free cash okay so this counting it so I'm a little confused by why we're why we the decision to to present this on the operating budget as opposed to how we're treating all of these other capital projects can because it's appropriated okay and it's going to be ongoing right yeah it's built into the budget a okay that's why all right Del that so I think we delete this row and then we go down to row 23 and we change the 40 to the 30 that we currently have on the revenue and if we decide to add other things like we talked about we'll need to change that 30,000 to whatever we end up deciding that shows how much free cash is really being used uh AJ actually I think I can't see the column headings but I think you need to put it in the free cash column or but leave it there but also put it in the free cash column the cost oh I see what you're saying yeah yeah yeah so we can see the decrease yep yep yep yep got it yeah that that that changes this number here okay and now we're talking about the O OD district one that would be in line 22 right right but before we get there should we or anything else for that matter we should talk about this Cruiser right um oh sorry we've got a $70,000 should that be raised to the actual number that um the chief gave us 7504 was it I thought it was like 7,288 let me let me just say I looked into that as I yeah please Bob and the original the original ask was 470 that was on her on her application to the capital planning committee but then she came up with this pickup truck and and it costs more money surprised it costs more money for a pickup truck than it does an SUV so what's the number that you're you think it's 75,000 right no no 7,585 something I thought 88 7,588 I wrote it down from the last meeting right okay on the minutes yeah so the only I don't think this is a problem but the the the only sort of the reason I had it at didn't vote 588 is that that's what capital planning voting on was 70,000 I don't think that's okay it's closeing um okay so um so what are some thoughts about we fund that project U George well I'm looking down at the bottom free cash line and it looks like free cash AJ would you mind clicking on the 13,000 the 13% and telling me what the numerator is in that or the denominator is in that the so the yeah click on that numerator is F32 so and and the denominator is a fixed number right yeah it's uh 72 so 7 million okay yeah yeah yeah so it's close to our budget so what we're looking at is free cash after all these transactions would be 133% and I'm okay with going a little lower so I would be fine with putting 7588 in free cash and keeping our stabilization accounts because we got big Debt Service coming up and I'm wondering if we're going to be able to use our stabilization in fy2 six is be budgeting for some of those big Capital items um Becky is now an okay time to talk about we have talked about the debt in the operating budget but it's a very low interest rate number it doesn't have any of those Capital items that we approve so the debt service for all those is coming okay but we um so the conversation the treas Ryan had with Lynn our um our trust advisor loan advisor was that she believes interest rates by you know by next year are going to be quite a bit lower than they currently are and the reason the interest is so low is she's recommending we only we pay interest only this year and go out to bond next year um because it'll have a significant you know it'll be a significant savings and interest so if that's the case I'm wondering if in a year from now one of those three items and I know at town meeting we approved financing them through debt but I'm wondering if in next year when we're going through this process if we might have the opportunity to take one of those items and use Capital stabilization to pay it down in lower our debt service and our operating budget favor of that that's a possibility so preserving some of this Capital stabilization and stabilization could be very beneficial to us in that regard that's kind of thinking ahead of year so again another reason why I think I'd be fine with $70,000 7,6 for sounds good to me cash free cash all right any objections to um pulling that from our free cash reserves can you put it in so we can see what the percentage of free cash the budget would be yeah thank you that push it to 12 a lot we'll have a special town meeting and we'll be spending it the last two years we did yeah that's true um okay uh so before we talk about any additional reserves we would want to use to fund the operating budget are there any any concerns about these assumptions that I've made for for these what is it six projects seven six yeah all right I don't see any hands so I think we're in good shape there so um I think next we should talk about yeah any proposals that members want to make about additional um uh you know using reserves for any other aspects of our budget and do you guys mind I'm gon to stop sharing the the budget here so have kind of full access to all of your faces all right uh Bob yeah I just want to ask I want to look look into this idea of of funding of special education expenses uh from our reserves and how that would work and how what the conceptual framework for that is maybe sus or George could talk about that uh I think that that's an interesting idea uh but it's the school budget uh it's part of the school budget so how does this all going to work conceptually do you how do you see that wait are you referring to the out of District placement out of District cost yeah okay um so Susie it sounds like you've done some thinking about this do you wanna respond yeah I think that um we can view it as not a permanent part of their operating budget um and for that reason I feel like it should not be um it we should put in some Reserve cash to pay it off uh and so it helps meet the school budget by some cash reserves not all from the levy and it can be I actually believe we should use cash reserves both from the fincom reserve and from the um free cash we're talking about 25 now right next year yeah for the budget yes um so wait um so before we kind of dissect this what what was the George you would you would come up with um a number that represented both the tuition and the transportation cost do we do we have that handy or I could look it up but it's roughly $90,000 it was 92 I I I have it in a spreadsheet somewhere I can get it all right um George your hand is up did you wanna yeah I do uh well yeah I mean to some there's crossover between what I'm thinking with Susie and I want to ask her a question um this is coming up right now it's 9,250 58,000 is the out of the I guess the school the education cost in transportation was 32250 came out to 9,250 so the way I was looking at it was we have 9,250 I'm going to call it 990,000 we have 30 something I'm going to call it 30 in money coming in from the state for the circuit breaker so we got a $660,000 additional increase to the school budget which we we're going to fund we're going to leave it in the school budget it's in the operating budget but to me funding a portion of that with cash makes sense because it will drop out at some point what portion I'm thinking 50% 50% would be 30 ,000 um you know but we can debate that as a committee um but I also want to ask so that's the way I Envision it working mechanically if you will conceptually if you will in the budget that we present to the town um but Susie is adding another dimension and so I want to ask how does that work how do we are you saying increase fincom Reserve number or dig into the fincom reserve number and take away some amount right off thep I'm saying dig into it because initially we were at 40 and we bumped it up to 70 um 75 because of anticipating um sped costs that could be met through that and I I I think we should hold to that and I think we would sort of view our fincom reserve a little differently if we allocate some for this sped cost well I just to finish the in the question while I got the floor I I that's not a bad idea I would just say that you know think about how much we feel comfortable going in we we built that $75,000 number quite a long time ago and inflation probably should make that number a little higher so I would just like to take that I I I think that if the the fincom reserve has been used since I've been on the committee for for uh emergencies and things shortfalls like we just discussed with Lenny and I think that you know really if we don't spend the whole reserve it goes back into free cash anyway so is not correct yeah oh yeah so what we're taking Peter to pay Paul here so let's just pay it out of the fincom Reserve I mean out of the free cash account and I would I would actually support paying more because this is an extraordinary expense it's not an operating expense really even though it's part of their budget I think that if we're getting 30 from uh the circuit breaker why not fund the rest of it with free cash and take it out of take the pressure off their budget for some something which is not really related to education per se it's it's a it's a mandated expense that they have to undertake but I think we can afford to help them with that with our cash reserves so you're suggesting using $60,000 of free cash yeah I'd say you know like 50 or something uh would I would support that I think that that's reasonable all right so we've got a couple proposals here George 30 yeah Becky okay so if you have to sustain this for multiple years which they you know which we will WEA yeah you're we were led to that impression yeah years defit that you're creating so this a three year Becky this is for three years three more years right this year was the first right yes so I'm just saying the same margins on health insurance this year um we have the luxury of not increasing the health insurance line because we had a balance but this this coming year with the 9% increases we're we're not going to have any buffer from there which it has been over you know 60,000 in the past so we're losing free cash Generation Um I just some thoughts just some thoughts I hear you I still think we could afford to do this and uh I I would support doing this in for 50,000 this year uh and I think that I think that really it's it's reasonable I understand your point but we can shift down the road but you know we can do it for this year that just commits us for one year yep and it's always just a one-year vote I know um Susie I want to make sure I I feel like I didn't quite um present your um proposal here so you had suggested what amount from free cash um fromom sorry fincom reserves and and what I think I think we would do 20 from fincom reserve and um the rest could either be free cash or leave it in the operating budget Susie when you say the me the rest what number do you mean starting at 90 taking out the 30 circuit breaker that leaves 60 20 from fincom reserve and 40 from was I up to 40 y y 40 from free cash 40 from free cash all right so just one thing I've been keeping track of this our EXs Levy capacity started 115 if we add 6,300 it comes up to 121 679 if we subtract 12,000 CU it's an operating budget and shouldn't be there and we subtract 40,000 because and we and we fund with 40,000 from free cash for um the out district and then we follow what Susie said 20,000 we lower fincom Reserve by 20,000 we keep the school budget the way it is that's going to bring our excess Levy capacity um in uh usage to 49679 call it $50,000 that's where we would be right now and that is including of course an 88.2% increase in region just update everybody got it thanks getting better George yeah 50,000 I'd like you know that's better than 115 all right um so I'm wondering if somebody wants to make a motion on related to this because I I feel like we've got about three different proposals I think they all sound um sound got go can I just ask question I'm sorry so in total how much free cash are we talking about for Education it's 60 no 40 40 well depends on Whose proposal you so so Susie's proposal is 40 from free cash George's was 30 Bob's was 50 so all right so there we there we are um I'm gonna make a motion go just give me one second I'm gonna make a motion that we transfer from free cash $40,000 for the purpose to um for the purpose of subsidizing the outof district placement in the Elementary School um yeah we'll second that it's a good compromise any further discussion about that okay George I cash I mo i i Walton I so this number is now 70,000 George do you usually itemize this when you've done this before like where you um I we we it usually was always one item but yeah that's probably wise you only have two so you might as well yeah so operating budget um AO and then operating budget repair building repairs and in the wording we would just say for State mandated Services right sounds good right very nice so I'm I'm wondering if we're at a point where we can sort of I had a long day but it's it's almost nine o'clock and maybe we could sort of take where we're at um and pick this up next Tuesday when we have another meeting is our next meeting next tues I I I I agree with that I I agree with that I have a hard stop I have a hard stop at nine o'clock I have to go on at night next meeting is let's see Tuesday isn't it yeah it is yeah I thought we had I thought we were gonna meet on the 9th but that's the second April 2nd I know know for some reason I thought we were meeting on the 9th I think we probably are I think I think we're are we meeting on the 9th to go over the warrant articles with the um this yeah so this is uh here let me pull up our I think didn't put another that's right George that's with the select board we you are meeting on the nth so April 2nd we had said we would have we would approve our oh okay final budget um that April 9th we would meet this with the select board to approve the warrant articles Bob I just want to tell the committee that uh I planned a trip to Sicily and I'm going to be out of here on the 15th uh Miss toown meeting and I'll be back on the 4th of May so I didn't think the town meeting would be this exciting I didn't anticipate I thought we'd have our business all wrapped up before I left and it was appropriate for me to leave on tax day on April 15th so um I will be we'll be around for that hearing and for the town meeting I'm unfor fortunately but uh I just thought I'd let everybody know that it's going to be basking In the Sicilian Sun oh probably zoom in you can probably zoom in awesome yeah all you got to do is get up at three in the morning or some crazy number where's your commitment I tried to plot it out carefully but I didn't understand that the events sort of get out of control yeah there's okay so actually while we're talking about schedule um um I I'm G to be um in Arizona on the 15th and so that's actually not a great day for me um but um that kind of is what it is uh but I will be back on I think the 18th so I should be able to attend the four towns meeting we don't have an agenda item for the 15th is that right yeah we just kind of we had it as a hold it maybe the report people will start working on the report yeah right I mean there's like there may be some set of tasks that you guys can do without me on that uh at that meeting um but yeah so are folks comfortable I mean we are like if if we sort of stop kind of pause our process right now and pick it up on April 2nd George I think we're I we're close done yeah honestly I I don't know what else there is to talk about other than what do we want to do with the line for the Regional School yeah because we we know that we're using 50,000 of excess Levy capacity at the full 88.2% increase how much Levy capacity do we really want to use I think is the only question really yeah I think there's that question and then I think you know our practice in the past has been to sort of give members an opportunity to make any any sort of comments on any aspects of the budget and you know propose any any any votes so I think we can we can do all of that U on the second I think it's helpful to have the um tax rate impact figured out um I'm working on that right now I'm almost done okay but it'll I'll get that out to you okay so right now what I'm showing no I we just wait I don't have the 40 subtracted yet we were at $18.70 which would have been an average on the average tax bill uh$ 6,425 which is an increase over this year of $36 that's where we were we've brought that down and I'm working on the new number okay we can have that on April 2nd that'd be great yeah yeah and I would add to that not only the tax rate but also our estimate of the family home tax bill yes that's all yeah yeah yeah it's all tied together I know and we are tying it to the all the tax rates I'm do in the cost uh I'm sorry the tax amounts are based on um George long sought after figure for the FY 24 single family tax uh I mean single family value of $343,500 yeah that's what the state reporting less average all the time and while my hands up the one other thing uh uh I was going to say that I forgot oh yes um I'm G to start the annual report so Becky I'm gonna ask you as soon as you're done could you send me the Excel versions of the budgets so I can start doing some of the calculating sooner is always better but you know I'm I got I'd like to have a draft of it for everybody on Tuesday which is a a little kind of a tight schedule but I'll certainly give it a go and I also one thing I've been thinking about doing differently on that from what we've done in other years I mean everything else is boilerplate it's just changing the numbers for the current budget but is this the year we want to have a paragraph or two at the beginning to kind of summarize what's going on AJ is something to think about yeah you know I think a lot of towns I was looking at pums budgets after I after I had a conversation with John and you know they have they have a long verb I think they talk too much honestly but you know every Town's got a unique culture but um I think it would be good to kind of lay out what everybody's about to see and how we got to it yeah yeah bit of a challenge yeah all right great and um okay so uh let's let's uh let's adjourn for tonight then and um we will we'll follow up on April 2nd I hope to have spoken with with Doug Slaughter before then and um I think if I'm not mistaken we'll we'll have some information about what the ammer fincom discussed relative to the regional school budget that would be great and fixing the assessment or making sure the assessment method is correct yes yeah that's to yeah using the dollar amount to they approve in the formula right all right so George you wna vote every I cashew I moer I hi I Walton I hi thanks everybody everyone night all night night have a good one go Celtics somebody had to say it