all right I'll give it a couple couple of seconds meeting of the Somerville planning board for June 12th 2024 will please come to order adequate notice of this meeting as required by the open public meeting act has been provided a copy of the number specifying the date time and location was one posted on the bullettin board outside Bor Hall two mailed facts emailed to The Courier News and three given to the clerk administrator this meeting is a Judicial proceeding any questions or comments must be limited to the issues that the board May legally consider in reaching a decision and the decorum appropriate to judicial hearing must be maintained at all times okay roll call chairman Nado here miss rosinski here mayor Gallagher councilman room here miss adir miss Warner here Mr CA here Mr cresties here Mr Cleveland here Mr adex here Mr Akens okay Pledge of Allegiance Al to the flag of United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty jice got to climb back up on the chair too what you complained when it was low I'm not complaining I'm explaining um okay approval of am minutes for May 22nd I'll move second any additions or Corrections okay when you're ready J chairman Nado yes Miss rinsky yes Miss Warner yes Mr kco yes okay we have a resolution for um the uh Route 22 application I'll move that we approve it second any other comments on it okay chairman Nado yes M rinsky yes uh Council Windom yes Mr crco yes Mr Cleveland yes Mr addex yes chairman I just want to point out the uh meeting right now is being live streamed under the burrow council meeting from last week so instead of being broadcast on tonight's night it's being broadcast on June 3D currently job figuring that out yeah I know right time travel we went back in time I just wanted to let you know that and anyone in the audience knows if you look back later right now it's being broadcast on the June 3rd meeting okay okay just letting everybody just letting you know after last week yeah okay and we have one pending resolution for the Tara on Division Street but we don't have that in front of us at this point um didn't we approve that about six or eight months ago I don't remember when we did that it was a while back yeah it might have been they changed something I don't know it's just pending okay so that brings us to the topic of discussion for the evening and as you all know we''ve been as as by the B Council to review our zoning ordinance and make a recommendation about whether or not we think changes should be made to um restrict where gun stores can go my original Hope was to have somebody come in and explain the whole process um but we were unable to find any law enforcement people who were willing to come in and do that which is why I produced that information that was distributed so that you could see the process and I think it's important that we understand the process and a number of things come into my mind anyway number one is you can't just walk into a gun store and buy a gun it doesn't doesn't happen that way and the process to number one get a Firearms ID card which allows you to buy lawn guns and you have to go through the process all over again each time you want to buy a handgun so it's and and there are age restrictions um you can't get a Firearms ID card until you are 18 or older and you can't buy a handgun unless you are 21 or older and all of it's handled by the local police department so having said that does anybody have any comments I think it's hard to make a decision I think it's hard to make a decision when uh you don't have all the information in front of you to make that decision so I I I sympathize with the position that you just outlined what additional information do you well I I mean you just discussed that but we don't have any U any of the complexities in front of us or the details in terms of going through the process of um I I understand that there's limitations on what people are supposed to do um but this goes back to zoning if if not if I'm not didn't you get the hand out I did okay yeah and uh and I saw the fact that I was very dismayed that nobody decided to come and discuss that with us kind of I would love to see an expert here yeah they won't come yeah they they just won't do it and and we talked to the state police we talked to the Prosecutors office no I think very thorough and they just won't come to a public meeting and discuss it so that that's where we're left so it's up to us to to decide whether or not we want to recommend restrictions on where gun stores can be located and my personal View is I don't see the threat it's you know the guns aren't visible because of state requirements so it's not I don't see where the threat is so that's my opinion so I just I don't think I can make a decision until I know what he actually could do as far as far as um lawfully change the zoning or lawfully change the signage or lawfully set up a safe Zone around an elementary school um I think I need answers to those questions what are we capable of making changes or are there no changes we can make because it's basically the law to allow this gun shop anywhere so my questions are more like what power do we have as a planning board we have none in this case we make recommendations a recommendation to the council okay but what what power does the council have to change this that's what I'm saying they would have to make an ordinance to say that it's prohibited sales within this but um would that be challenged because it's a it's an amendment right that's what I'm saying like what do we really in realistically I'm sure it would be challenged what do what what is there we can do can we do a signage ordinance the letter that we received says the signage is disturbing to people because it has bullets on it I can sort of understand that even though the guns are not visible but um and there's a talk about a safe Zone around schools is there already a set up safe Zone around schools can we create our own safe Zone around schools I think we need lawfully I need somebody to answer those question I think if that's going to be done that safe Zone has to be defined in terms of what's unsafe you know what and and I don't believe that the the state law that says you can create a a gunfree Zone around a school applies to a retail establishment it does not I did look into that it is a matter of actually listen you can live in a house that has it because you legally own it is that you cannot walk freely through those school zones or those safe zones with a weapon unless you're authorized to do so based on your job so you can't restrict on the sense of of you know like if I lived in a school safe Zone it doesn't mean I can't own a handgun and have it properly in my home you can't restrict based on the safe zone I'm not saying that we can't do this zoning wise but you can't restrict Bas because oh well it's a school safe Zone well that's that's my question I don't just like liquor like it's no different I that's my question it sounds from the research I've done we don't have anything we can possibly do so I actually on that point because I agree with gear I think there's I think the way that this is being approached is dangerous for us because it's a matter of what do we have the purview here when we did this God knows how many years ago when it came to tattoo shops in full disclosure my daughter's a tattoo artist so I have my own personal opinion but I understood why we needed to look at some restrictions as to where tattoo shops could go this was a process that we went through and we were methodical because we wanted to make sure we were doing it the right way for the right reasons and I think as a planning board member I think it's our due diligence to make sure as dud are saying what do we law what can we lawfully do what are we on dangerous terms with where we could get ourselves and the burrow because it's not really us it's the burrow as itself and I think that process was very methodical and I'm not quite sure why in this instance we are veering from what our normal process is at looking at zoning because I think we are close to very close to in my opinion spot zoning like yeah you can have that but you can't have this you can have this but you can't have that with no real reasons and we were very methodical in our reasoning and I'm not saying in the end maybe we all decide that but I think us looking at it why aren't we looking at everything else in those zones why is it just gun shops that we're looking at you know some people have some very strong opinions as to the smoke shop that's there is what's coming out of there why are we only looking at guns because it seems like we're targeting something now versus looking at it very methodically as to what's appropriate in a buffer zone as we call them versus what's appropriate maybe more downtown or on the outskirts of our town we've done that with every other retail type of retail in this burrow why are we only focusing on one no matter what our opinions are our job here is to put our opinions at the door and do the right thing but but are you saying that we can't restrict future gun shops to particular zones I think the question is if we can what are what are the regulations with that if we do it do we have a good reason for it are we allowed to just haphazardly say we don't want that there well what about you use an example of nobody wanted sell sites years ago courts decided that you can't just say no so we said you got to have it on a fivestory building God knows so all the cell sites that are up on roofs and stuff they're allowed towers are out there on psng I'm just using this as an example I think we're saying the same thing you can't just say no you got to at least have an alternative well this is what I've been telling people there has to be an you have to have an alternative so years ago when we were here talking about the bookstores that were controversial we talked about it and we said well the best place to put it would be in the industrial Zone The Eye Zone it never came to fruition but that was a place where we said yeah you could have it here but you can't have it over on gas at Avenue yeah and I think that's what I'm trying to say is there's a process we've never just looked at something and said we don't want it there we've always looked at it as a hole in the burrow and say okay well maybe it's not appropriate here but where is it appropriate where do we think we can put it so that we're not saying something is just banned and I think all of the changes we've made over the years at least the years that I've been here have been comprehensive changes where we we took a comprehensive look at a lot of different things and said okay we we want this here and we don't want it over here because it's not appropriate for a reason and then we make a recommendation to the borrow counsel and I think part of what I wanted to do this year was take a look at our master plan make sure that we get everything done in the right order take a look at the master plan and and look at lots of different uses take a look at schedule a and see what let's let's have another look at it even if we just took the mix Zone and said let's look at the what's allowed there and take that as a as part a piece of the pie and saying we look there what other uses or what other allow allowable retail there that we don't feel is appropriate maybe also needs to be moved instead of just focusing and so and I agree with with all your points there I think that I'm trying to understand what these changes would actually solve if we say in zone X Y or Z that doesn't mean it's going to be any further from a school or someplace where there's kids necessary and the second part is if we start drawing circles around schools or dayc carees where does that stop is it the middle school elementary school high school dayc carees home private schools we have private schools you start getting to the point where where do you start and where do you stop there's no point yeah right so I think those two things and then if you do that if you accomplish that either through zoning or through radius around schools or places where there's children what did you solve a Gunstar could go 100 feet from that line and did that really solve anything through all the effort there I don't know I don't know if it did right yeah I think I think um that whole area we looked at at making a development Zone and trying to that whole intersection everything was a little hodge podge years ago and we tried to um and it was dying hodge podge so we tried to turn things into retail and allow certain things um there are still buildings there the old auto shop that has yet to be developed so I think in this master plan wethink and looking at places that need a new kind of Redevelopment plan I think that intersection is key so I think we should be looking at that big picture and then part of that would be looking at what's appropriate for that area in Redevelopment I don't think we should try and find the perfect spot for a gun shop in Somerville that's not going to be you know that's not going to work never been the way done it before no we didn't look for a perfect spot for other things you know so even with the tattoo poar remember we looked we had certain regulations but um we had specific reasons for the allowing things in certain places as the town developed and that's why we did that I mean there was a big hubub I think before your time Lisa I'm dating myself about public um laundry mats people were arguing shouldn't have laundry mats in town I mean so um the gun topic is a very hot topic but I think if we look at if we pull back and just look at it as a whole we need to look at that intersection um there's no doubt that children walk by a sort of a hodgepodge of mixed uses it needs to be maintained it needs to be kept up the properties need to be kept up so there's no danger to them um but we also need to look at what we can encourage people to come in and put there that might be conducive to kids walking home from school or families walking by it um that maybe we haven't really encouraged to have happen on that intersection so that's my feeling is let's take a step back and in the in the process that we're about to do in looking at the master plan and everything we need to really look at that intersection and see how we can make it a better place to walk through rather than trying to nitpick what's already there yeah and to that point I'll just say one last last thing that on that point there could be something else that's there that we haven't even thought of and we're so focused on the one shop that we miss it so why not just look at the whole because it's really more about you know that topic can go either way based on your personal opinion and taking that out of it maybe there's another topic there that could be the same way so I think if we look at it as a as a whole we can be all inclusive and we can do the right thing for what we feel is best for our community as a whole versus opinions and just go ahead Larry is the goal to Zone all the rest of the Town away from it or to move this existing place so we can we cannot move this place that is done no this is what I'm trying to get to the point of so it seems to be to be a lot easier to say where can't you put it you can't put it all these places but it's there and it's there for forever we can't go back in time on that no no no I I completely understand I I I get it I'm just looking at it from the point of view of it would be easier and quicker for us to look at all the zones and say no no no no no no no no no you can't have it anywhere because it's already here but you have to have a reason you you can't just do you can't just say you can't have it here okay you can't we will lose we will lose back here understand but but then we have to look at every Zone that's what we're talking about but think if we start to deer's point at least we start there and then we see what maybe is appropriate and then because once you say okay this isn't appropriate there then you do have to go okay but where is it because we can't just say it's not appropriate can't say no you have to have a reason and if we know that's a hot that that's a very sensitive area because it's you know it's it's one of the in my opinion one of the last true what was supposed to be that transition that really maybe Isn't So transitional anymore of the way the traditional old school transitional was looked at okay I think what I'm hearing is that our recommendation to council is going to be that we look at the master plan and then make recommendations comprehensive zoning recommendations yeah I think that's the proper way to do it I think so that part of okay so I have no comment I was just going to add so T's point I mean we are we are B hting out to redo the master plan and look at the zoning and everything as well so we are in the process of we have begun the process begun the process let me say yeah not really in it um I I assume there's a crowd full of people here that are we opening this to the public for yes I'm about to do that then I'm I'm going to shut up then okay I know that Colin has something to say is that on there we go I turned it off right my name's colum driver I'm director of economic development for the burrow I have been charged by the mayor as has Cara of the attorney to construct three rfps requests for proposals for zoning in the burrow and I hear what the board is saying tonight and they're accurate in what they're saying we are going to investigate all the zoning in the burrow and we're asking for quotes and proposals from professionals who understand zoning because you heard the discussion here we need guidance so we're requesting people to come in and guide us through the process the same with the master plan the same with development plans we're asking professionals to come and work on behalf of the burrow to revise our zoning in accordance with the current law and according to what the community wants there will be public meetings in this room so um we're trying to get a little bit in front of ourselves and I know the mayor was very concerned about the gun issue but we can't get in front of our our El if we want to do it correctly so I think that's about it but we're really going to do it it's going to be a process which is done legally it's going to be done orderly and it's going to be done in a transparent manner thank you thank you anybody else please identify yourself for the record hi my name is me Walsh I am at 17 West Cliff do I have to do that for the address okay um I want to just say I appreciate you all thank you for serving um and I hear what you're all saying and I really appreciate that as well because I agree with a lot of what you just said um with regards to it's not just about the gun shop you know there's also the smoke shop there there's also the liquor store there's that whole corner is just I know a concern for a lot of people and so I'm very appreciative of the fact that I'm not not the only one thinking that and that you know that those thoughts are being mirrored here um with that being said I wanted to ask some logistical questions really because this is my first time kind of being involved in this and um I have a young child I'm going to have another young child and um of course this is something that I'm concerned about just you know generally making sure that it's a safe town for my kids and so what I wanted to know is it sounds like we're definitely moving forward with this with like the rezoning and and figuring it all out out and answering all the questions that everyone asked how does a a member like a a someone who lives in Summerville how do we actually contribute what is the process how do you okay yeah the the planning board is charged with the responsibility of developing a master plan that master plan sets the parameters for zoning M the governing body changes the zoning based on the recommendations in the master plan so the first place we start is examining the master plan to see if we need to change the recommendations for various areas um and it the master plan could be very specific um we have a number of Redevelopment plans at the same time we'll take a look at them and see if they are still appropriate and once that process is done we will come out with a series of recommendations for changes that might be required we have two schedules attached to our land use ordinance one is schedule a one is schedule B one determines the the the uses that are permitted in various zones and we typically do that by um business codes and one of the one of the things that happened and and while I have at times been critical of the way things have been handled in burrow Hall I think this was one situation where it was handled properly when the gun store went in it was a permitted use so there was nothing that was done wrong and the use the use is permitted so we're going to take a look at it we're going to take a look at at all the zones um we've got projects in the pipeline for East Main Street um for Kirby Avenue or Fairview Avenue actually um and we're going to take a look at all of that and during that process we will have public meeting meetings and you will be permitted to contribute during those Public public meetings it's it's not it's not going to be done behind closed doors and and the process is in general we sit down with the professionals and we lay out what it is we would like to see and then they come back with language to enable that we as as a town I mean we just like tonight anything any comments you got anything you guys say we we take into consideration we'll be adding that into recommendations you know if if I'm going to pick on Colin just because he's sitting there if Colin gets up and says you know I feel strongly it should not be involved uh you know XYZ should not be in the mixed juice Zone we take that into consideration there will be that discussion here with the public with the comment that Colin made that goes into the minutes and then whether we choose to use that or not use it becomes the discussion we have but you'll get to input at any meeting what you believe um is appropriate or not appropriate in those different zones that and and we we encourage the public to come out to those meetings and contribute you know when a number of times over the years and I I've been on the planning board for 35 years and there have been a number of times when we've had visioning sessions with the public when we created a plan for the landfill around the train station that was that was all done with public input we had a hundred people in a room designing what it was going to look like and it basically came out the way we thought it was going to look there are a few minor changes but the basics are there and it it wasn't this board doing it it was the general public and and that's that's the way we run things so my question is to sort of logistically where and how will they find out about like Workshop meetings and things of that nature can you hear me yes yeah okay I'm not going to sit I'm too old my back hurts um the logistics are once we hire the professionals to guide us through the process we will have a series of meetings where we say this is our objective here's the reason why um give us the frame workk and then um the logistics are on our website in the newspaper on social media we will advertise a public meeting to investigate let's say the master plan right the public is invited and there'll be a facilitator it may be me it may be someone else and you will say this is what we think and that all goes into the record then we go away again and we look at the stuff and we go through it and distill it then we advertise another meeting and we say this is what we think we heard this is what we think we can do and here's the legalities behind it and you can comment again and we'll do that maybe three or four times until we come up with the final document so it it it's we try and make it public and it's a lot better than it was 10 or 15 years ago when we only had The Courier News to advertise now we got a web page and we got um Facebook and we've got all social media so everyone should know when the meetings are taking place yep yes yep yeah sumerville nj.org dogovor that's us.org would you step closer to the mic you can contribute in wri I think you shut the mic off by accident try and turn it flip it again no no the other way flip it the other way I died there we go but no you can do it in writing we'll we'll tell you how to do it when we when we publish the notice yeah no you can send emails um you could write a letter or you can come in person okay okay that's what I was wondering because I wasn't sure I know not everyone's able to make it here you know like who wants to at all times of course but H I don't want to be fair um but uh yeah I was wondering so they can send emails they can do that and then it will be like entered into send it into into the record okay yeah cuz he's typing it while we're recording it as well right so you're going to want to send emails to Jenna here if you want to get something to us and her information's on the website no and we will tell you how to send emails know we'll probably set up a separate mailbox we have also in the past had daytime like weekend daytime visioning meetings and things so that hasn't been set up according when the rfps come back and we get the people are going to fac fa itate it um it will be clear and then it will be spelled out hopefully very clear on the website okay and then the kind of information that we would be expected to kind of bring in and contribute would that be just I feel this way or would it be like what you want the community to look like y this is where you get to plan your community so we wouldn't be expected to come in and like quote laws or or anything like that you're you're it's your vision of what you want somville to look like interested in your opinion okay all right I think that's everything that's how we all got up here we came in and we complained and car said what our vision was about so be careful all right great well thank you so much I appreciate it thank you anybody else Hi Megan Andrews 12 Walnut Street I've lived here for 18 years uh on May 29th the Somerset County Board of Commissioners committed to doing all the can to keep the community safe from gun violence they publicly declared June as gun violence yeah I think we're gonna have to have them sit so uh Somerset County Board of Commissioners did this after residents requested it the same request was made of Somerville burough County and to my knowledge uh they never got a response which was pretty disheartening um I'm very thankful that I'm finally hearing people in power discussing this it is a little disheartening though to hear at the start well we only have this one bit of information we don't really have the information when I feel that there have been a team of residents who have been sending all of the information to the buau the planning board and the zoning board with little or no response so it is a little disheartening um you've spoken of the permitted use uh and the way it's been referred to at previous meeting well it's like any other store it's like any other store it's permitted use that's it however our town didn't even have a zoning category for this store at the time and frankly several of us feel that the former uh zoning officer made a pretty arbitrary decision to categorize it it kind of went to three places before it fell into Sporting Goods it fell into one of the business categories that covers a lot of other right it went to miscellaneous it went but it was like kind of a interesting road map to get there he made the correct decision in your opinion not in the opinion of a lot of residents in in the opinion of our attorney and our planner he made the right decision okay given there hasn't been a firearm store in the town in literal decades it's hard to listen to our officials continuously say it's just like any other store it's just like any other store and then also so know that when there was going to be an adult bookstore there was all these meetings about it decisions and they were told nope they can't be here they have to be there the dispensary they everybody went out of their way to find a new PL you know it's not going to be in town so I I do understand there's a process in that this is part of that process but also I feel I wish I felt that the boards the members some of the members that we speak to uh were really hearing what we were saying because uh I heard earlier you know you can't ban it you can't ban it I don't know anybody who came here saying it should be banned it was about that specific location in town and that's that's what we're going to look for right we're going to take a look at that but not just for gun stores and you know they it falls into to a specific category of business use and it what's what are we using now used to be for if you look at schedule a there's a note on there because the SI most of them are 95% are SIC code standard industri industrial classification they stopped using that in 1987 so over is the North American industrial n naics so we look up those codes and drill down and cross reference that to the SIC codes that come up with the descriptions that the Chairman's talking about right I mean I have seen the paperwork on that that the zoning office you know yeah it wasn't it was not an arbitrary decision I I disagree and I know others disagree um I also just wanted to point out it while I'm hearing people say it's not about an opinion it has felt that those who are supportive of that store there um feel that their opinion is more important than others and I have heard some pretty shocking statements and um the way some of these meetings and not necessarily specifically the planning board meeting but a little bit in each that it's it's been hard to come up here and feel like we're being heard um and it feels like the town is uh afraid of this owner and therefore and so worried to do the wrong thing in checking that everything was okay with this store and that's how a lot of this started was some of us were like wait are all the tees crossed are all the eyes dotted and then it didn't appear they were and we haven't really been able to get answers in a timely fashion and in fact that property has been violating terms of its approval in regards to the parking lot signage and traffic flow and the town again appears to be so afraid to upset this owner that they won't take any action against these violations um they've been made aware of them for six months and it's again it's just felt like no matter what path we take we get thrown in a different direction I I'm not asking for an answer I just it was important to me that everybody heard this because this has been my experience um I'm still waiting on opras that um you know regarding this traffic situation and it is a a really dangerous intersection there's been five accidents there in the last five years um there's no sight line when you're coming out of it so changing the use of the store to any kind of big merchandise store as opposed to what it was I brought up a my initial uh thing the initial thing I was upset about was the traffic issues and the potential hazards in a store that was going to bring more customers than the glass store um and again it's been ignored for two years so um again I really am appreciative that we're finally hearing this topic is going to get discussed that we're going to have input um I thank you for listening to me and it's never been my um goal to be a thorn in anyone's side I just really feel like uh things were not handled well and that uh there I feel several of us have been disrespected over and over again when all we're trying to do is be involved and voice our concerns thank you thank you [Laughter] hi I'm Emily quazy I live at 200 West Cliff Street um I really appreciate the dialogue I heard here today um I really appreciate moving past uh arguments about a specific business which seems uh irrelevant at this point and um thinking more holistically about that area of town and how it can be developed um I would like to suggest that a common denominator um that could be used to look at businesses in that area would be age restriction if a business makes their primary business is selling age restricted goods or services that's not the best place for it um already I probably almost 50% of businesses in the two you know strip malls or whatever at that intersection are it's liquor store we've got the gun store we've got the vape store I mean I go past that intersection I have three kids I go past that intersection literally a minimum of like six times a day I'd love to just go buy a soda someplace where I could walk in with a 9-year-old perhaps that's that could be a way to think about businesses in that area in that residential mixed uh well that's what that's what we're going to do I I would just if you're opening the floor to opinions um and uh I would also just um like to put forward a concern that you know I'm really glad that this process is all happening I understand to do this job well to to rezone properly takes time and another lingering concern I have is that another Vape Shop could open as Lisa mentioned I really appreciated this comment that area has a lot of room for more Redevelopment right now there are vacant businesses um I have a concern that a new Vape Shop could open at any moment right because it would be cool I maybe it's impossible but if there's something you could do to sort of pause or be uh more mindful of granting licenses to new businesses going into that area while we're considering this rezoning I mean I think it's become apparent that this part of town is something that needs to be looked at um and if it takes a year to come up with a good new master plan and um it could easily I think um a lot can change in a year and a lot of new business could open in a year and um I would just like your consideration that um this is an important matter to a lot of people people in town um a lot of kids and a lot of families are there literally a lot more hours a day than I'd like to be sitting at that intersection and um I don't know what I don't know what you can do you're the experts of course but maybe you could consider that um while it processing hurry the process along as much as we can I not to the expense of quality but to just in consideration of new businesses particularly if another age restricted business are not age restricted but you know what I mean if they're selling bongs or whatever I don't know so so Bernie can can I just add something real quick yeah um I I do want to just point out that so this board we don't give licenses or say like this business can open this business can't you know using the Vape Shop the gun store the lior store there none of them come here and say like hey can we open up this kind of store so we don't we don't see any of that so like the gun shop never came in front of us you know none of them come in front of us we look at if they need variances from you know and deviations from what's acceptable so we're not going to be able to to stop and say no no stores can open up you know in the next six months while we review something um that's you know we don't issue you know to to Megan's point Sorry back there not over here um we don't issue the violations if you know if you complain to us we're just citizens as well volunteering we don't issue violations or any of that we we strictly look at the planning of it and the zoning um so we I do you know we're putting the notes down and we'll take that but we can't I don't want you leaving here thinking that we're going to be able to just tomorrow say oh you know we're not going to allow a vape shop no in there and that's understood and I do um I think a real take-home lesson you know and again the the gun shop is a great example the gun shop drives home the point of like how little authority the burrow has and oversight the burrow has once something's already opened you don't really have a a lot of control over choosing and picking and choosing a business I appreciate that like I work in a regulatory industry also it's It's Tricky um therefore zoning is so important right like it really just underscores you know you're not just Zoning for today you're Zoning for 10 years from now and Somerville the way Somerville is growing like that intersection I don't know the decisions you make in the next year or whatever I think you'll be surprised that the process won't take as long as you think it it's not you know we've been through this quite a few times um yes it is I want to say it's timec consuming are we talking two years we talking a full year no the the the timing is a lot shorter than what you think is it going to be tomorrow no is it going to be next month no but you will see this process move pretty quickly I think I can speak for this board it is just as important for us that we want to get through this for the community as much as the community wants it to get through get gone through so I think we're all on the same page it's just a matter of now taking what we are allowed to do we've started that process we started that a few months ago we've started the process once we have who uh answers and who we end up hiring then we take that next step but we've all been this isn't like discussions we're not even I'm thinking of it on a personal level even before somebody's here we're not saying oh we we're not doing anything we're just sitting back holding our you know folding our hand saying we're waiting we are having some of these discussions tonight even the discussion so I think you will be surprised in the long run it's not as long term as you feel off because to Jason's point there is we do want to make sure that we're going to do this in a timely manner for without under the restrictions we have where we can't say okay for moving right now everything stops nobody can put a license in or put a permit in for anything because we don't have the authority to do that so we do understand and we do respect that as well cool I appreciate it thank you for all that you all do thank you I just want to say that um a few years ago Lisa was on the other side of this table I was that was painful more than a few years ago but we won't say how long ago hello I'm Seline Graves on Spring Street and do you need the address specifically yes 97 East Spring Spring Street um thank you for doing this today um and I very much appreciate that there's a lot of discussion about um bringing the um specific um nature and character um of our town and what we all bring and what we feel and what we would like that to be um to the discussion it's appreciated because we have a very special um Dynamic to how we have a walkable town we have children coming through you know it's it's other than um our special education or special needs children they're not bust you know we have a lot of um families and everybody's out and about and so I appreciate that that's um something that is being um considered here and that we're having a hopeful chance to um say something about that one thing I wanted to bring up specifically was to ask um it sounds um Mr Nado that you were the person who added the link to the agenda to that second amendment um site and um that was and who approves the final agenda is are you the person who I am approves that and were there other um was this something that you did independently or were there was this um decision was made Jen Jenna helps a lot but um as planning board chair it's my job to set the agenda right one thing I wanted to point out um is I found it deeply disturbing that um in this vast array of things that you could have included in the agenda you did not include um something from a New Jersey State Licensing um process whatever about um Firearms you chose specifically a um Second Amendment advocacy um fighting against people taking away our rights website and so it it concerns me that either there is an agenda there that is being um presented from your end or perhaps a lack of um what what I did I I just want to explain I got that information from somebody else and what I did was I wanted to explain the process not advocate for anything but so that well I'm sorry to interrupt you because I intention aside intention aside what you chose to share was not State information on gun licensing it was not something about um it this was a second amendment advocacy site so either this is an agenda that is being presented by you or through you from someone else or there was a lack of attention to tr truly analyzing what was being shared and that's my feedback you don't have to agree with me but that's okay the the purpose of again and I'm repeating myself but the purpose was to explain the process that one has to go through to buy guns in New Jersey there are New Jersey state um websites that explain that that are not proun websites so well there there was nothing in what I distributed that was prun the website itself specifically that you chose to link to is not a neutral State organization it is a pro Second Amendment advocacy I didn't think I was going to have to spend this time on on this but I'm sorry did you have something that you wanted to add or would you like to wait the time wait my turn you're very welcome to I I just I would really like to like I said I don't expect an argument about this but I just wanted to give a feedback that the choice that was being presented was not neutral State information it was a partisan website and that might have been a mistake it might have been an Overlook on your part but it does present in the totality of what's occurring here one of the other things that I I'm sorry I didn't think that this was going to be um and I just want to say that I'm and I'm sorry I neglect it right on who said it I think you said as well you said that the store was not zoned arbitrarily um and this is not specifically about um the gun store what I do want to highlight um to point out that um there is a um process that occurs and one thing that could be changed I know this may not necessarily be under the zoning boards um purview but you're talking a lot about transparency and one of the things is that when um the when stores like The Vape Shop which you know just sort of sprung up out of nowhere for a lot of our families during the pandemic um and the gun store when stores like that are approved um sumerville makes a choice to not um inform the zoning board when it is a simple approval and that is not um that is not a choice that is required to happen in that way that is a voluntary choice that um the zoning officer and the way way things are set up at the moment they can choose to not um give that information to the zoning board if that information we're giving to the zoning board that a simple approval was made of that type of um retail establishment it would give more um more of the public a chance to have some sort of interaction and I think would have avoided um you know perhaps some of the um concerns with transparency um because I think that um dear just point about looking at the holistic um the holistic nature of that area in particular close to the school is a really big deal um and I just wanted to put a um one more point which is that the um it is true that a um a gun-free zone around a school does not um you know apply to um specifically um to retail or to um citizens who have their own um their own firearms however um local stores sorry pardon me local towns such as Piscataway have um decided to Zone around their schools to exclude certain things that include um the sale of firearms and so while um SP spot zoning is not appropriate while talking about a gun-free school zone it does not um apply to um keeping certain types of businesses away from the schools there are legal correct mechanisms that other towns that are close to here nobody said there wasn't right no no no so I just want to put that on the record you're going in a direction where we've already stated that we are full open to what you're saying but we there is a proper way to do it right I'm I'm just emphasizing in the same way that it's being emphasized that there's ways to do things I'm emphasizing that um that is something that can be done and that a lot of families would like um that to be very much considered thank you one thing I do want to mention just support chairman in in his sharing trying to share some information is I I did kind of what your mindset was I read this and then I went to the State website and I read that and to be honest Layman didn't see any discrepancies that would have made me sway either way I thought both were accurate representations and I thought what this was this this uh how to buy a gun in New Jersey act accurately represented it and I would encourage and you know and like I did myself go out and search it don't don't take what's given to you right no one said so I agree I'm agreeing with you okay I I but I I I don't see how that necessarily the point is is that the um you're right the the information was analogous could have been found at an analogous website that would not have been a okay a partisan all right but I don't think there was any agenda here so it sounds like you're disagreeing with me on that point yes okay all right thank you thank you as a 13-year Somerville oh sure Caroline flos 37 West Spring Street as a 13year Somerville resident I have found the events of the last five months disheartening and eye opening in November of last year I went back to work full-time for the first time since my son came home up until this point I would tell anybody who would listen how wonderful Somerville is and how familyfriendly it is is in fact my husband and I nearly put in an offer on a home in Bridgewater and we chose Somerville because the schools were better and we liked the community better um part of the thing I always appreciated about this town was its commitment to its children and families and I'm disheartened to see the inaction of the last five months right now as far as I understand it the person who is the zoning officer I do understand now it's a mixed position but uh it has like a new name but they're ultimately going to be doing the same job can approve a business based on their interpretation that it fits into the zoning of a neighborhood currently once they do so there's no publication of that approval and so there's no way for the public to know that that happened so like if a tree falls in the woods right and no one hears it did it really fall right that classic Loop of a question so the reality is at the moment our zoning board was totally in the dark when this decision was made right they were in the dark public was in the dark so there is no way to appeal a decision in a timely fashion that wasn't published Because by the time the business is putting up signage and opening it's too late to appeal it and so actually I think we have a bigger problem here um and it's our process for how these things are going with the zoning officer because just like another Resident who got up before I was shocked to see the signs go up for the vape shop I don't live that far from there I was like what is this doing across from the elementary school this is a weird placement and it's sort of become a bunch of these little shops uh kind of clustering into this neighborhood that are probably less desirable for a walking town with one elementary school because the at the end of the day we're not Bridge waterer we only have one elementary school so there's not like anywhere else for us to send our kids kids if we want them to go to the public school right uh and so at the end of the day it was a little disheartening to see that right now there is no publication and actually I think we might be opening ourselves up legally in that sense because it was never published and therefore that could open people up to like endless appeals really but in any event uh the current issue that we're discussing tonight is that we have a gun shop within a th000 feet of our um only Elementary School a public elementary school I should say and uh sadly one in five of our elementary schools in this country has a gun shop within a half a mile of it um this is concerning due to the crime that gun shops attract there are roughly five incidents per day where Firearms go missing through robbery burglary Laren or other loss too often these guns are diverted to the illegal Market nearly four 40% of crime guns re crime-based guns recovered in the states with the most guns per capita were bought at a gun shop less than 10 miles from the crime measuring crime through neighborhood levels of homicides and robberies local homicide and robbery rates increase alongside the number of gun shops in a neighborhood even after accounting for other factors associated with other homicide rates uh here's a nice local statistic in 2023 a gun store in Morris County FSS Armory was burglarized 20 Firearms were stolen most of the guns have yet to be recovered and those that have been found were recovered in crime scenes or in the hands of criminals including persons trafficking guns on the black market in New Jersey and neighboring states according to our attorney general as a member of our community I have more concerns about the safety risk of having a gun store in such close proximity to our youngest children and what that brings to the neighborhood especially a resident IAL neighborhood like the one in question I ask the planning board to consider the following number one the zoning board minutes should include appro approvals of B businesses alleged to be within the current zoning of an area this would allow our zoning board the opportunity to first of all become aware of approvals before the public in a timely fashion and second of all it would save our Town's clerks the extra administrative tasks of being opra every single week for every business business that has been approved that would definitely cut down on the paperwork the scope of miscellaneous retail should be T should be looked at okay um I think it's a little bit it's a logical fallacy to say that this is the same as any other miscellaneous retail store this isn't an ice cream shop you know it's not the glass store that was there this is a store that has to cover its Windows because people can't see what it's selling from the inside if there are state laws like that then we need to really be thinking about who's walking around on a frequent basis outside of that establishment and what could happen potentially as a result of that I also call for re review of other businesses in the area along with how businesses are classified I call for a review of zoning regulations per pertaining to business signage in areas that AB but Residential Properties um based on things that were opra it appears that in that area businesses were told in the past including the glass shop that they couldn't Frost their Windows um because the windows are intended for display purposes only and while I understand that variances can be obtained a variance was actually never obtained in this specific case and therefore there was no opportunity for public comment and not to say that it wouldn't have been approved it's totally possible you guys or the zoning board may have approved that but the reality is the variance never happen and so now we have a situation where they're potentially out of compliance with that and they're also out of compliance with um having bullets on their sign but that's for another day um I do encourage you guys I I think it's great to hear that you're looking at all zoning in these areas it is a mixed commercial residential area there are residential homes literally next door to this building um let alone the schools the daycare that takes children from five weeks old um all of the things that we have in that area they're very familyfriendly including parks and other things that it's a very nice section of town typically for people to live in um and I just want again to remind everyone that we only have one of each public school and so while I understand that the considerations might be different in a Bridgewater or even a pasca way where they made those decisions they have more than one Public elementary school in their town right they have more than one public Middle School more than one public high school anybody who relies on public school for their children especially since we were too small to offer busing right those neighborhoods in and around the schools should really be considered because the reality is that there isn't busing right so the children may very well have to walk there and I one last thing before I leave um the YMCA children who do the walking school bus now have to walk down Spring Street so they're going out Schoolhouse uh Road area and they're going down Spring Street and there are like no traffic lights there are no it's like I actually live on as I mentioned West Spring it's very dangerous walking around those intersections right and so once again I just think if there had been a variance meeting or anything else and I know we can't get in a time machine I get it but if there had been some of these concerns could have brought been brought forward by the public and the reality is that um it can be scary for the town to face up to big business owners but it can be scarier if we lose a child at the end of the day because they had to cross a really busy road um in a group right and so um children's lives are precious there's no number we can put on them and that's that's my final comment for this evening thank you anybody else rich rich O'Neal 124 Westcliff Street sville also member of the zoning board for more than a few years what you put out on that agenda was verbatim from the state it was the rules and regulations so anybody that say it was prejudicial is absolutely wrong it's the state regulations plain and simple I think Mr addex handled that quite well so I need to go no further with it the next thing everybody keeps talking about the zoning board the zoning board only hears applications for variances we're we're not a public information body we don't know about a lot of stuff and quite frankly you don't want everything going to the zoning board you'll stop this town dead in its feet because to get on the agenda and to accomplish something takes a lot of money and a lot of time so what they're talking about is what they don't know about so perhaps when you have these meetings you should explain the function of your board and the and the board of adjustment so people understand what the rules are we don't have the right to just go do something hunky dory we all have regulations and everything is a process so I I think we got a lot of people who are talking about stuff they know nothing about and I think when you have these meetings probably the first night did you should explain the process of each board so everybody understands what the rules are thank you Bill Cisco 37 Eastern Avenue the New Jersey Second Amendment Society our focus and mission is to end the Hostile anti-second Amendment and self-defense sentiment within the New Jersey legislator and Community you are correct and that's all I have to say Thank you so real quick just just because I don't want to harp on this anymore if you click that link this is what it brings you to that is not on this link you would have to deviate from the page I read from the I scroll down on the website and I read I'm saying the link the actual link that he put takes you directly to the state uniform code I just I just clicked on it right here went to the National amet not from you all right enough my my point is I enough can I just I just I think we need to be careful here I really do respect and I appreciate every comment coming in here I as to Bernie point I was on your side when I say in the sense on a controversial subject but I just to everybody's Point understanding what our purview is here we have no control and no decisions over what our zoning officer does that is for a Town Council and for our administrator to take care of we have no purview over those we have no purview over the zoning board so understanding I appreciate your comments we can do nothing about them okay not this board we can do nothing about it just so that everybody understands I don't want you to feel like we're not hearing or listening to you but we can do nothing about what our zoning officer does or what that is not our purview my name is Bick truid I live at 18 West Spring Street been here for 16 years my kids walked uh past the gun shop to get the school every day and back prior to the gun shop arriving and and being set up um I agree I have a couple points but the first point I want to make is that I think we're all missing the point here about the the link it's about perception if you wna have people come in and work with you right don't take don't take a website that's going to annoy the people who are opposed to having a gunshop put in here okay that's simple use the State website I don't think it makes any difference because the information it makes a lot of difference because when people look at that they're looking at at a Second Amendment right site and that has nothing to do with the issue at all you're making it part of the issue excuse me do not raise your voice I won can I continue you have anything else I do go ahead okay thank you um I was a little disheartened at the beginning of this conference or this meeting that there was no information on how to keep a gun shop at a summer you didn't get anything on it so I Googled it while I was sitting back here and lo and behold there's a whole uh article about piscatway and the uniform plan that they're doing with their planning board their uh uh I'm not sure what form Township it is but their basically their whole municipal government complex is working on identifying ways to keep gun shops out of Piscataway and so far they've been successful and I would really like to see the same kind of thing happen here all right that's all I have to say thank you so much thank you anybody else hi Christina Edelman 42 cottington place um I am excited to see uh how we can re Envision that intersection I'm excited to he to attend more meetings um and be involved in all of that planning I understand your function for creating a vision for Somerville and taking into account the perspectives and visions of all of its residents um as we move forward and I wanted to thank you for that and I uh the thing that disheartens me is that to get so many of us involved we had to see something come up that did not align with our vision of Somerville um and you know that's a really unfortunate way um for a fortunate thing to happen to get a lot of passionate people involved um and we're here and we're excited to work with you and uh I would agree with a lot of things that have been said in regards to age restricted businesses um having proximity to schools in general thank you thank you thank you anybody else all right we'll close the public session and like I said I don't have any comments so I will entertain a motion to adjourn motion to adjourn second all those in favor I I all those opposed thank you