##VIDEO ID:7RDXuK2_OfI## come to the order welcome everyone sou Conservation Commission meeting is Monday October 21st 2024 7.m we are in hybrid the South Town Hall uh with us tonight we have Andy R Chris Pratt Norm Cher kin Sol okay uh does anybody have any public comment okay anyone online public comment look like it nope okay we'll move on we do have a few minutes and get the minutes taken care of first look at the minutes for October 7th I just had a couple of grammatical Corrections okay 55 Foster Road Mark spinson that spelled correctly [Music] spinon so St i i s STI in the final decision by the commission was to create an order of conditions with supposed to be conservation restriction says con consecutive restriction spell check well spell check wouldn't have fixed that that's what I'm saying that I don't spell check right I don't have it in front of me but I thought there was something in there kind of grammatical about the s on there just didn't seem I know what the intent was like you wanted the snow fence and everything else up but the way it reads with I thought so um just try to find it and let Julie know it's in that same paragraph oh monumentation is in place for 55 Foster should M monumentation are in place monumentation is in place before War Street in orang snow fencing so I understand that monument monum in Orange snow fencing are in place before work begins right would be one of the restrictions as well as installing installation dryw discuss double SES and a bills um on 24 and 26 N C Hill it says that I know we thought that they were switching to a single family home but is that I thought it was still going to be a two family it is two family yes so we could probably just emit that whole part right it says the revision will change a project from a two family to a one family but I think we talked about that we thought that that was the case but I think that then they corrected us that it's still going to be a two family so we could just probably just delete that out I would say so yeah went single family on that I thought we thought that but I think it's still G to be a through family we'll find out when they submit the new I'm pretty sure though because I think we thought because they're moving it up to the upper a lot and that's why we thought it was going to be but I thought that just eliminate that sentence and we'll figure it out I don't know if it's think right we don't actually don't even need that in there yeah but I think either way it was just the relocation part is the revision that we were looking at see how it works in with the area whether it's a one p or two that has no bearing decision so um you mentioned the the silk fence double Sil fence or reinforced Sil fence pay Bales or straw bales for 55 Foster were you saying that yeah and that was part of the conditions I think it's a be good idea to put it that as part of the conditions yeah it's just a Sil fence doesn't really provide a lot of protection the ha Bale and Sil fence is better but having a double Soul fence with the hay bill is okay well we're going to talk about that yeah yeah okay all right yeah yes minutes right now minutes nothing else I'll take a motion and somebody ready no report from the sofield presentation on lpp is yes it was I'm trying to write it now the minutes later Norm so you don't have to rush it I can I can want you have to rush or yeah we can vote on it later okay we can we can put them off and go to our hearings and come back well we do that yeah okay not problem all right 75 and go to our first hearing uh we have an noi number 292-0435 section 40 off the Conservation Commission regulations and bylaw chapter2 and chapter 450 for No 10 via a hybrid meeting zoom and in person the project location tanri Road South Mass 01077 map 020 parcel 06-00 the applicant proposes the construction of a single family dwelling with the associated site improvements portions of the proposed work are within the buffer zone right chis Pratt chair the commit right hello everyone Ryan Nelson from AR Associates can everyone hear me yeah hello all right so this property um was Mr CH sorsky he uh few years ago had built the house off of conquered Road over here and recently uh through anr subdivided this Frontage partial off of Tannery Road um this delineation was updated about a year or two ago when we did the perk tests on the property which were successful um so you can see there's a 50ft buffer zone right here offset from this Wetland boundary that was the main constraint for this property um we got a house designed based on a perspective buyer uh that's interested in the property um the dimensions of this house fitting with staying within that 50 foot buffer zone no touch um so we we think we're able to make everything work without going inside the 50 Foot buffer typical sight improvements paved driveway septic would be offset over here Reserve area would be in the front well would be in the back you can see this uh squiggly line is the existing tree line so the majority of the project is taking place within an already uh mode Meadow area there's a little bit of clearing UPF front that would occur uh same with over here near the septic system so this would be work within the buffer zone only happy to answer any questions ran from the bottom note number one it says each site entrance I can't read the rest of it because it's so small could you explain that one please is more than one side entrance uh no that's just a typical note we have some sites have more than one but this only has one entrance okay we want to do a site visit on this one I think we should probably do a site visit on this one um yeah we were out there before for the house that was put not far from there right Ryan they did it that's my house which one is your house yeah eight con how many years ago was that it's only four years [Music] down okay do you have any comments or concerns as the butters or it's my property so you don't have any comments or concerns more than happy to see a house going read some comments from D there a single family house located on the original parcel the street address of eight conquered Road So you you're dividing the property yes okay um from a practical point of view is there enough room for equipment to maneuver around the foundation in that buffer zone area I know Ryan said probably I mean is probably good I don't know um we've had previous projects like this um in this instance uh you wouldn't have like a conventional you know work pad around the back of the foundation where your concrete truck would drive in this case you would need to have to pump it uh for that back foundation wall to construct it but um I think under constructed conditions there's like a 4 foot clearance um from that pinch point at the back left corner of the house can maybe put that in order conditions something right just a point of U interest here it looks like the entire house the septic system and the well are all in the 100 100 foot buffer zone 100% right that's why they have to file a notice in int but I know when we went out there looked at the site before Kell Brook is way the back th feet back at least a thet th feet back I know that whole area had been Disturbed many years ago they were going to put a subdivision back there originally they were going to extend that conquered Road subdivision or my driveway is was going to be a street so that actually that Wetland is actually a created drainage area by put in thereis are those is that still in there lot drainage that was uh put in you mean like the SW the Swale was created by them so that's what the the Wetland is now and then I have a storm drain that runs through the side of my property down to the right that's still active that's still oh yeah they they come out and inspected it a few times because I have a a storm drain on the side of my I would might take a look at it just for due diligence that's I would agree should probably mention the possible violation okay it says [Music] did so the commission should review aerial photos over time as it appears that clearing occurred either in the wetlands or very near the wetlands soon after construction started on that house and I'll just bring up some aerial imagery identifying that if I can figure out how this works with my computer was there a certificate of compliance s done your house the original one yeah all right so we have 2008 and let me just try to share via zoom and share my so this is the image in [Music] 2008 I think after say up on 2008 and then we'll have 200 17 right here let me see if I can get these side by side oh oh that's fine how about let's try let's just try this drag it open so 2008 to 2017 there's some clearing here and then right here is the Wetland line here was it wetland in 2017 this um yes so so may I say something yep the picture that you're looking at here is the edge of my yard so you're looking at the back of of my yard right here lot is over there right a lot that we're talking about right but eight conquered is still technically contains the lot that we're talking about today yes so that's why I wanted to bring we're looking at my lot right now yep yep y yep well they're both your Lots yeah all the whole thing is one parcel at the moment right yep so this again 2008 2017 and then let me here's a delineation let me get the date for that delineation that [Laughter] was deled in 16 2016 before the 17 photo the CH yeah so it was delineated 2016 and the 2017 photo was after it so it appears there's some clearing either in the Wetland or very close to the Wetland and I did talk to Ryan about this and asked him to um check the flagging I think I did if I didn't Ryan please just hype up um so when we do a site visit we can go out and have a look at that as well okay who name have any time this week supp be nice anytime is good time okay four o'clock any any day the only day that I would be available early is tomorrow yeah we have a site visit tomorrow at 3 it's too early to me well you won't be going I mean you can if you want um but that's for his certificate of compliance Okay so after that tomorrow for tomorrow work I can make tomorrow well we can only we don't need everybody there anyway I mean four of us would have to not be able to talk about anything yeah that would be a okay I said I usually can't make a lot of them I could this one all right well we say tomorrow four o'clock that'll make it nice and quick I have a conflict at that time but the commission's welcome toad you want to meet without Ryan or I think we should probably have him there somebody you can send in your place R um no one that's familiar with it so when can you make it Ryan uh literally any other day or time this week but tomorrow at 4 how about Wednesday Wednesday at four we go through all the days I'm good Wednesday's good Dennis how about you can make I can make Wednesday okay s Wednesday Wednesday's good you can do that okay we'll do Wednesday okay Wednesday four o'clock okay yes thank you all right number 10 are you to say is there a number for I don't think there a number yet um 67 what's it next to it's called 67 okay look for your truck okay so we're gonna be looking for a continuation on this sure well they have to make the continu requests correct seeking a continuance to allow for a site visit yep okay and that will be to next meeting which will be we have a date for that yet yes November 4th November 4th paper for continuance for November 4th okay make a motion on a continuance I'll make a motion to continue all second all in favor Andy Chris I Norm I I all right see you on well we'll see Ryan on Wednesday anybody else on the fourth okay I'll be guys okay wednes okay super sure all right thank you very much thank you very much you com again yeah all right did you check on that certificate of Appliance Lea for the the house check on that for us too I believe it was an RDA at the time oh so there was no okay the house was s set [Music] away move on to our next Noti tent beating Hills Road number 306 okay so this was a continuation I'm juston read the notice mind worries um so this is a continuation from last time um we were trying to sort through some old stream data that um didn't have good records of to repurpose so we figured we' just go go out to the stream on this property and get new uh docu documentate uh sorry four days documentation uh four days of the stream being uh not flowing so the stream uh starts up here we started farther offsite um so that there wouldn't be a 200 foot Riverfront clipping the property uh so we went beyond the property lines started here at bank 100 and we took video on October 8th the 9th the 11th and the 14th showing the stream dry and not flowing um all the way to the Culvert head wall on the north side of Route 57 there was a segment of the stream uh maybe between like Bank 130 and 128 that did have some uh standing stagnant water in it but we took some close-up videos and monitored that and you could see with the leaf litter on the water that the water wasn't moving at all and it wasn't connected upstream or Downstream it was just a little isolated pool um the wetlands adjacent to the stream are the same so essentially uh we are petitioning the stream to be intermittent based on our observations of four days and a calendar year the point at which we could not observe the stream to be not flowing uh starts at the covert head wall Downstream of the covert the stream had plenty of water in it and was FL blowing um we were unable to determine the status within the covert um covert's less than 200 ft so it gets treated as bank and Riverfront would start uh from that point at the covert head wall on the Upstream side so in that scenario our 200 foot Riverfront is drawn as a semicircle from that point which puts that line right here and no proposed work is located within Riverfront the only work within uh Wetland jurisdiction is one of the septic leech fields which would be in the 50 to 100 foot buffer zone in the rear right corner of the parcel um we submitted through one drive to Sabrina the stream videos uh affidavits um the conditions while we were out there have been similar to today warm sunny and dry um I do think on the 14th it was of October uh that was a Monday and we had a rain I think it was last Saturday and despite that rain uh the stream conditions were the same um so happy to answer any questions regarding any of that thought the determination had to be made when we're not in the drought condition we not in the drought condition we are not we are not not technically I can't water my lawn I thought we were yeah um so the way we the town says drought is different than the state says drought we go off of I think the Westfield River height we've been out there before when this came in and it's never been a stream right it's just on those Maps you're familiar with it they're all perennial streams yep all so do we have to make a determination on that or just on the notice of int so the water starts somewhere under the road is what Ryan is saying yes at some point I don't know if it's Road drainage um or just the elevation change it seems like the downstream side of the um of the road is probably sitting in groundwater more than the Upstream side um surface flows to attribute to it for that water to be there is there rating Associated to the septic systems um and if so how much of an impact would that have on the outer 100 very little so groundwater was pretty deep and the soils were good so if you look existing grade is between 103 and 104 where the perk tests were done and finished grade over the septic is 104 so we're filling half a foot okay and then it looks like that he wants to or the applicant wants to remove some trees in the buffer like right below that yeah right in this area and that's to provide a buffer around the Lee field so no true uh Roots interfere with it okay B cleared right that was cleared a long time ago well there there the existing conditions are in the light gray yep so you can see the squiggly line so they're going to they're going to take back um the tree line a little bit chunky here coming out yeah exactly all across the back around the corner yeah right that's that Big Empty lot that's been empty for years up there right yeah the chimney used to stand there used to be a chimney there yeah it was a restaurant one time was that auction place at one time a restaurant I thought prob both back in the 50s sure ni be nice to see that filled up yeah you guys want any monumentation or a 50 foot so do we need to vote on both or I think we vote on the delation in the Stream stats and then on the project as separate all right you don't have to close the hearing first we vote on it and well we'll close the hearing for the um noi part but I think as far as the stream goes I don't think we have to close a hearing mat I was asking you what you're the one I always ask Sabrina Ryan Ryan what do you what do you want us to do why don't we close the hearing yeah I would close the hearing okay second it all in favor Andy I Chris ey Norm Dennis I okay so we can do both together here now okay makes sense all right so as far as the stream stats go I think Ryan's proven that it's intermittent I mean um even though in the Wetland protection act does say that there supposed to be some uh field notes Ryan Ryan just give me the field notes just pending on pending uh field notes which would be just adding in like dates times that was observed conditions that was observed on I mean you just told us a little bit out loud yeah basically what so if you told it you know just write those things in as field notes I think that would suffice okay if it it doesn't have that you know that yeah beginning of each video has a post post card or index card the information I don't know if that's good enough but those are those are hard to file I need something on paper got it okay thank you okay so I'll make a motion on the stream stat change to find it intermittent I have a second normal second all in favor Andy I Chris I Norm i k i Dennis I okay now as far as the project goes anybody have any comments questions or concerns other than what kind of what kind of orders of conditions like what do you want looks like the same one we approved before without a notice of intent so buffers at all what do we got need monuments on the buffers at all where is the 50ft buffer is it even is it in the 100 or 50 foot buffer that's the 50 r yeah usually that's all we require is is in the 50 right have we ever asked for Boulders or monuments in the 100 no so really if they're not getting they're not getting into the 50 then there's a tree line there right yeah yeah the tree lines the tree lines could serve as a monument they'd have to they'd have to go clearing in further to put the you don't want to do that so just put it into the conditions that the trees Tree Line stays as a monument to the edge of lawn buffer the tree line Tree Line it would make more sense cutting the trees down and put the tree line in the southwestern or west southwest portion of the southeast e Southeast sorry side [Music] corner okay move drains or anything like that on there they need it's pretty flat area pretty flat I don't I don't think infiltration is really needed there that's anybody else thinks so [Music] but you're looking for a motion then yeah I'll take a motion everybody's ready a motion with conditions the conditions that the tree line remains as a monument in $10,000 Bond okay second that motion Andy ey Chris ey Norm I I Denis ey okay all right thank you everyone thank you right we can move on to new SL not so new business our RDA 100 Bricker AB closed review and sign negative determination trees thank you very much have a nice night thank you everybody is that going to be your house up there me is that your house or you just I just want to show you guys it's going to be a beautiful home you know I'm not going to put a g or you know something cheap it's going to look going to give you an idea it's going to be a nice house oh yeah been and they will look beautiful there very nice good super nice look at from the RO thank you again everybody good night bye bye so I have the negative determination of a ability for Norman Sher and then he did mention how he was recused himself he recused himself and how he would um do replacement plantings so the back page of this is um the attachment a which I mentioned the native trees and or shrubs that um he could choose from and then I say monitor replacement plantings for a minimum of two consecutive growing Seasons commencing with the First full growing season following the plantings um monitor monitoring should include assessments of survival rates growth and any necessary maintenance to ensure success of plantings and after of this two consecutive growing Seasons provided that the replacement trees have survived this condition shall be too satisfied okay essentially but you can read and sign or read and not sign or we can just sign and not read if you just run it for us here you wasn't here that's true the signature later I have to come in I could be my for a minute didn't sign his name all right we have RDA 15 Depot Street T quotes as well propos a demolition of a structure within 2 this one does not have any additional conditions added on to it [Music] okay then we're on to our noi 55 fter Road and closed we're going to be doing looking at the our order of conditions that you guys conditions at like 5 in the afternoon very comprehensive so if you want a chance to read them right here um we you guys do need to vote on a bond amount that's the one thing that um we didn't have and then the additional ongoing conditions or any additional conditions or the very last page let me know if um you guys want everybody sign this it's been signed oh you given it to this is the order of conditions for 55 Foster so and you had mentioned this the addition silk fencing and the armored ABS M armored that's what they call it yeah just a term than State then level reinforced see you did the research on the conservation restriction for the Sodom Mountain yeah it was a declaration of restrictions I think is what it was called I have a copy of it t I think that would be a great idea make sure nothing else is Disturbed on yeah it was just a simple like three page declaration that they recorded okay um I don't know who wrote it for them but I don't see why AI right I don't see why um we couldn't just copy this switch the names and stuff okay what do you think the bond amount should be I think it should be more than 10,000 riverr can double it I was just looking at that like Google says a $20,000 bond is between two and 600 bucks a year so it doesn't hurt a lot have a $20,000 Bond it's not like it's going to cost me500 bucks right I think 20 is more than fair it's reasonable reasonable okay is that a motion so is the armored armored hay bales at the limit of work is that where you wanted limit of limit of work and a limit of lawn it should be the same yeah since there's not much other space great um I just like that where do people go when they go up the back door like you're in nightland right yeah you I mean you can you just can't change it right you can walk through it that's kind of this house and also the one over on Tannery the same thing you see a house with no Back Porch or like where's the back door right that was I had a issue with stuff that was going up a Depot Street the same thing those houses right no backyard right people are going to make a backyard I recall hearing about that that like right on it but that's human nature to want to have a back D you know privacy everything else you it's tough to monitor that right but with the conservation restriction over the Declaration that may make a think twice about it that goes right on the D yeah was that something that would come up at closing is that I had asked that of a couple Realtors about the house on Foster Road why wasn't that like the realtor is not responsible to disclose that that's would be would be the lawyer and it would be part of the deed right when they're doing a siging with their at their closing right so this will make it that the new purchaser would be notified the guy the road said he was never notified yeah and again I going say when you're sing all those papers are you listening or are you just signing the paper to get it done with you know what I mean are you yes maybe he was told and didn't remember right well he got the U certificate of compliance so that goes on your de I thought he was all set didn't count anymore that would be the Builder right not the new owner new purchaser the new purchasers is the guy cross the road to cut the trees down so nowhere in the closing would he have been notified of that restriction that's but this will change that correct somewhere in the Clos right purchaser in 10 years from now the fifth new purchaser will also be notified should it be right okay so that's just a better way to GOP to right I was kind of amazed the realtor didn't have to disclose that like oh you buying this 10 acre lot but you can't use that other Seven Acres because there's a line right here did they the certificate compliance before they bought the lot in must at um Foster run yeah 19 Foster yeah he got the certificate so then they said okay that were conditions doesn't matter anymore certificate doesn't work the same way with the restriction except for the one for the ongoing conditions it still stays yeah ongoing any on WE list I don't know how they pop up though I assume that the order of conditions still stays with the property when you do a um title search I guess or a deed search so would be redundant on this but we might want to be redundant and put an ongoing condition in it saying that yeah I don't see why I couldn't so what do you want to say I just think it's fair it's fair for the new owner to be notified the uh of the problem like a leaky basement you have to tell them there's a leaky basement if you know it's there you got to tell them but how many real have you dealt with the Indi you don't have to tell them when I bought our house they told us that they didn't have to tell us about the title five feeling so depends who you're dealing with right but yeah I would put in their ongoing condition that the whatever it's going to be called Covenant or whatever is an ongoing condition remains in effect but but we can put it see if it sticks it should be anyway I mean not Chang should be yeah okay so the armored hay wheels at limit of work and on ongoing condition I think he suggested roof drains but that probably should make sure that's on there too I did I put it um you get a chance to really look too close I put it so there was the installation of dry Wells to infiltrate storm water roof runoff must be installed before the certificate of compliance is issued the amount in placement of these drywells must be approved by the Conservation Commission perfect okay and then The Monuments and quotation or in parenthesis do not disturb markers shall be placed on the limit of work line to act as a permanent marker for the limit of work of the parcel in its entirety monuments and their placement shall be approved by the commission before certificate of compliance is issued and then I'll add those two what I I wrote a aration of restrictions pursuant to the order of conditions as approved by the Conservation Commission with a with the restriction on the 200t riverfront area on the entirety of the parcel as agreed to by Patricia Stafford who's the current owner and Anatoli um who's the applicant shall be in place before work starts on this order of conditions yep perfect okay the B 20,000 we we're talking about 20,000,000 yeah and we have all the standard order conditions the D orders anybody have anything else you want to add I'll make a motion that that becomes part of our order of conditions have a second oh sorry all in favor and chis I Kev I didn't you did no did not then go say since he was a part of the uh order condition you guys decided at the last meeting I wasn't here they closed the the order conditions is right now I think that's how so worst going we already have right you don't need they can get pH okay request for certificate of compliance on uh 115 Fred Jackson Road uh so I'll recuse myself as a conservation commissioner I just have a few questions we've been going back and forth on some stuff for the um asilt the replication area like L was thinking that they need to do a full Topo there back when we did it in 200 21 October of 2021 Ryan has an email stating that all the grades were achieved there was hydrology and everything would be a working Wetland do we do you guys would you be looking for a full Topo of that or since they actually already they brought control out there stake that and Brian was there presid when we you know did all the work is a poo necessary or then basically I mean he already stated it in an email and sent it to the commission like I I that you never asked for a too before I think I've never seen one I mean as long as you got something writing I mean that's what we're looking for not looking for any Maps or anything just something writing just stating that it's built per plan yeah exactly okay you guys don't want an asil plan well we have we there making asil but the as won't have like actual like too on it's the it's built it's built per plan like they have a benchmark out there that we went off of when they originally sted it out and it was built you know off of that elevation yeah that's how we generally ask for okay unless the DP ask for something different well that's the one thing that Ryan isn't sure if the would want an actual Topo but that's not conservation right well there's a 41 water still so so I don't know if they will ask forward or not but we're not gon we're going to table anyways I just wanted for today visit so yeah yes there we we scheduled for Wednesday at 3 right for that certific comp okay yeah we're not we're not so we'll find out what this you know if it's a state regulation or not yeah we can't override state regulations but um okay so how does that work because it's with so there's a 401 Water Quality certificate for this yeah and you guys need to also contact them for a certificate of compliance correct so so I don't Ryan doesn't think that it matters who goes first okay so it's separate I don't do I don't contact you need one for the 40 one do you think maybe R was stum that's what he isn't sure if they would question but you know all right that might be the question that's there okay but all we need is something in writing saying that it was done yeah for plan yeah okay statement right okay request for certificate of compliance 32 Beach roads there's no update on that is that the the one with the wall the wall the issues with the wall there's the the uh Builder passed away they're supposed to get an engineer to oh right that was it very T whad right work y y okay so that's again tabled uh possible master plan open space action Norm yes um Julie sent out the package to you ahead of the meeting this is a potential uh resolution of the land resource or open space resource 1.1 which was create and distribute a pamphlet to all Lake fund property owners and it went on uh to give some depth so I put together a draft of what that flyer might look like and uh I was looking for comments on the draft Direction you'd like to go if any changes you'd like to make um if you don't I think I'm on track fine but I think there two separate ones one's for Connecticut and one's for Massachusetts well it would be all in the same pamphlet but would separate it would say speci Massachusetts is this the rules for Massachusetts are this the rules for Connecticut are this and the rules for the lake are and the rules for the lake are this okay and looking to get endorsement from obviously our concom Suffield comcom and both select boards I think that would make it more believable reach out to people so they can't say they didn't know these were but the goal is to get to maximize the different tasks that are allowed in each category with a permit without a permit and not at all it's going to be hard to get them all in there well but but I put down what I I came up with got additional I like now so I'm throwing it out for your comments on where we go from here so this is a um a draft for a pamphlet to be sent out to all of the L front owners yes and so this could be sent out when we send out the first lpp um manling with the applications correct correct okay I put a I put a a SCH SCH together that allowed us to make that very tight schedule um but I think it's doable if we keep our nose to the grindstone it's like telling people you can't put leaves in the lake and stuff like that yeah probably don't know any better best practice no fertilizing along the lake yeah don't dump any poisons in the lake Common Sense stuff yeah well you think you would think common sense and it will also point out the differences between the two states so are you looking for the motion on this tonight or are you just looking for I think we could review it maybe add or add it or you know give some feedback so I haven't really looked at it in full okay I'll be glad I have not looked at it okay but I like the idea you want vote on the idea no sorry individually send me your comments additions changes okay and I'll incorporate them and bring it back for our next meeting how about that sounds great okay and you got input from Lake management on that already what's that input from Lake management on that already uh they haven't seen it yet they'll see it Thursday night yeah okay move on to Old business outfall at Baker Shore in South Pond Griffin Road that's where the town of subfield has their outfall from the from Griffin Road into the oh any news on that I forgot how where we left off on this I know I sent something to Mark stina and d and he told me that we should treat it as any other violation so we should send a violation notice to the time ofield okay Circle back with Randy see where he stands on it right now any more access I mean any more um end with all this come would ultimately you make them move it or just go I mean they're going to move it a couple feet and it's still going to dump in the lake let's make sure the surveyor got everything correctly too because I've seen surveyors not agree on things right but U it's going on for years so we don't want to start the the war over the lake again so okay movement uh let's look at request for LMC to resolve doc situation at 129 North Lake three do seating over 600 square fet yes uh I did get a copy of the deed that Harris owns the property lot 46 that I showed you last time and despart has an easement on Harris property to have their separate system okay and then I drafted two letters one to the Harris family one to the desart family saying that uh and you got copies of it that was sent out by Julie um basically saying that you will be compliant to the 600 square foot maximum by we still don't know who actually owns the Waterfront though right the the strip along the land where the drive Lily Drive we don't know who owns that we suggested that the homeowners go take that it's there's called derel roads and they've done it before and they've gone out with L and said okay this hasn't been used in many years we're going to add it to our property and it's called the derik road and they do that so that we have a clear understanding of whose property that we're dealing with because it's water firm property I'm sure they're getting tax on water firm property but if you go to the Assessor's officer we asked they're not going to give you anything in writing and saying that that where that property belongs to so they need the homeowners thes Des Parts harrises need to go get that straightened out or we can't get a permit period for anything they have to prove they own the property permit so but where Lily Way goes across all those houses and all those houses not anymore because some of the people have gotten the Der roads and taking that over that's it it went all the way over isn't some of Lily way now actually underwater I think part of it is yes really is it's not a real road so well we know it's not a real road but I mean part of what was the leeway is now underwater so their property does go to the Waterfront yeah okay so it's not the same for every parcel there it's can be different but like to get that straightened out you know once this has been a pain for a long time well the sorry sorry that there's a couple of houses on North Lake a which they have a portion of Lily way right there and [Music] um we've been giving them you know permits and it's basically der La yeah because you know it's an abandoned Road it's um Lee Hamburg came in a couple weeks ago and kind of gave me the story on how that area came about um he can tell the story way better than me but ultimately it was like a toe path or something around the lines of toe path and then there to that came all the way around that turned into Lily way yeah so it's no man's land right now um but I don't think it would cost them that much or take that much energy to actually put that on their deed so they actually own the properties so without owning the property they can have no docks there what I'm kind of getting out of it so be great motivation you have to take care of this because right now the we made somebody else do it so it's not fair to make one person do it not everybody so now I I can't issue the permits for the North Lake a residence either right the ones that are on Lily way right some of those are up on top of the hill and we make could fight over it we don't want that to happen did we do something a few years back they know that agreed that those people had right to to the water there talk about the toe path yeah where they put up the gate they wouldn't let people go past MH and the town said it was okay right wouldn't that be under the same premise the co path was something different than L way it stops L way starts where Toe Path ends all right and foret whose house that's in front of but that's another yeah how far does l way go is it only in North pound yeah yeah see if I can bring it up right now so we may may be taking multiple docks off the off North P I would you know it's not fair to do it for one person not everybody so tell them they get it straightened out if they want to have a dock out that's going to be a rough year next year we've got all of these houses all of them hold on you can't see what I see let me just yeah share that um um share my screen share there so here so I think this is the beginning this right here I think is what you meant with the toe path the association that goes into the North Pond Toe Path see this line right here that's where the toll path ends I believe and then this is part of Lily way yeah and then Lily Way starts back up right here oh no I'm wrong that's Li drives this is where ly way starts down here L drives so is Lily Way not on this Parts Zone Des on the maps they they went their docks are on it two their do right that's one of them and then the other two are next to zo so one of their docks is here and what is the other oh I wonder let me see but that line is where Lily Way starts so so up here is this is this the it's lagged is that the toe path you're talking about yeah yeah so what's going on so can we issue them and this is way from the toe path that goes up so can we issue permits built on that I believe too yeah can we issue permits for the toe path because technically those people don't have water front them is what the to path there was a a legal document when they they built North Ponda States right oh yes except for 141 4 except for 141 okay now I remember now I remember P's got it I believe how far south is go just down to right here at 60 Lake Mont Street it looks like unless I think some of these docks down here aren't even on aren't even on these properties they go some of these docks above of the North Lake [Music] so we're saying because they don't own land on wly Drive they cannot have a dog it's always been my impression oh that's what's in the lpp I mean you have to have land owners permission or own the land to be a put that's what we're doing over in Suffield at that to over there the same thing same thing so will he drives on by the town no well he drives abandoned abandon derel Road nobody claims claims I did know what un stood for but I don't remember they go claim it they can have it you can self this whole thing over a bu the properties so could the town just handle an AB no I'm saying abolish it like otherwise instead having all owners every single property own has to do it every single one as far as I know yeah it's like why I couldn't town just like say all right we this is something that I'm assuming Town created it I no the private developer created that oh but also I think what would happen is their taxes might go up they might opt out of that pretty sure they pay I'm sure they do tax they have water view lot more square footage so the the value of the land goes up they paying taxes on that whole land all the way down to the wire so if we could dig up the document to find out how the who who was it that did that was that s that did der Road or he may have to up the do the corner there right Johnson I uh isn't he wait where am I over here um lakeem isn't he down lakem right here so this is his slot I think right okay that's yeah okay that that me so there's more work to be done okay all right I'm stopping my sharing leave on your old business we go 55 Sunnyside Road possible unpermitted work and alteration in the resource area I haven't gotten anything from also have that dead tree on North pound conservation prac I not finalize that letter update on 13 bks your land donation um actually Julie do you have enough for um this is for 13 Berkshire we had a bill to pay yes 6,000 something she did yeah how much do you have to have a purchase sorder an now for anything over 6,000 anything over 3,000 3,000 but I mean we've we've de with purchase right out a request for purchase order for the Woody account yeah she said it was approved it was approved it's in the mailbox okay in the mailbox all right we skipped over the Lumis South Lumis three South Lumis request for certificate of compliance or I still have to write oh go ahead if you want because um they didn't break the correct pictures to the last meeting and they had actually put the top soil the 3 in of it and planted and U it was definitely growing and established but it didn't look like it Mark said he put grass mix on top of the Wetland mix so it looks like the grass might have taken over so that's the only issue now I would see the top SS graded out okay did you write anything to the uh no not yet um do you want me to the only thing that we need to see is it is that what we need to see is wetland plants growing there is that yeah well there was also the the two growing Seasons portion of it which is cuz he said he planted a tree but it turned out to be invasive and they had the Norway maple I didn't even notice so he replaced it with the red maple yeah the nursery gave the wrong tree but yeah you could just you some a nice email saying everything looks good just need to two growing Seasons to show that the Wetland vegetation has been established right letter should suffice I would hope to so everything looks good butland mix established okay we have proposed amendments to local permanent program requested by a select board chief of police fire mastered I to move this forward I have no update on that State any report from Suffield presentation on lpp uh supposedly the one remaining issue uh was we needed to provide a document that says they can't have permanent member on their consumation commission supposedly Jason Peron has that document asked them for it and I asked him for an update but I didn't get one so I don't know any more than that okay it's right in the W protection act isn't yeah you can't live outside of the Town had people who can be on the commission itself it's pretty specific it's in the what L protection act it's in the not [Music] the not 310 CMR is it it's not that one one so what is it chapter I can't remember it I never refer back to it I was getting touched with Mac yeah know hopefully Jason's got it and we'll give it to me short that should be easy to get you can't hand it over you can probably right online okay report from kcom meetings yes this is an interesting one well see be two weeks ago tomorrow they had a meeting and at 3:30 in the afternoon I just happened to check their agenda and there was a retaining wall at 261 Lake View ter Lake View Drive on the agenda and it said to accept so I quickly put together about 17 questions I consulted Dennis and sabrinaa uh went to the meeting with my list of typed questions pictures to show them and what I learned at the meeting that acceptance means they're just accepting it into their into the their process okay and the next meeting would be a public hearing there would be a hearing and I asked if it would be a public hearing and I was told no please send my questions and pictures to Keith and he'll distribute them and which which I did and then Keith said that he had visited the site whether or not he took my list of questions or not because that me real steep slope no access I don't know how they get equipment in there and um but anyways he texted me back saying the land the homeowner has withdrawn to application for T okay so I don't know if my question not but anyways uh that one was a little scary and another meeting tomorrow night but nothing on the agenda but the pig farm all right so that's that super good job hey Noble Ste subdivision uh I don't think there's anything new going on there is there there some question about our certificate of compliance or well I mean I'm not exactly sure what that was about I haven't gotten a hold of Jesse yet but um Jason reached out to me to give Jesse a call he said that the sale of one of his houses was pending had something to do with conservation so I'm anticipating that maybe there's not a certificate compliance for that parcel for that house makes sense that's holding up the sale he just needs to so he'd have to come in and get yeah request to that's how it's done right they have a thing called request for so that was what we would have to do if indeed that's what it is okay and then we have possible Wetland violation 31 s West Road did you get an email from Butch leac supposed to put something in writing that they did said that they pulled the they pulled the silt out of there and revegetated it's way it should be I haven't gotten anything from him since a year ago talked to him earlier in the week so or last week so nothing yet hasn't gotten anything yet unless he has a different email now should go back to three South Lou for a second is there a bond on that yes so it might be reasonable to let the bank know that you're going to require that the bond be held until you release it and that'll assure the bank that it'll be done correctly if that's my understanding right you're sending this note how much is the bond for 10,000 a could release part of the bond what I'm saying is the bank wants reassurance that it was done and it was done correctly but we're also giving them that it's got to we got to look at it for two years and the 10,000 covers the two if there's a problem in two years there's money to correct it the bank's not on the hook nor is the new buyer you see you got to give the bank the insurance that the problem is solved and if it's not solved there's money to solve it it's not going to get dumped back on the new guys so just to add that like note to the letter right to the bank that there's money to fix a problem if it occurs within that two years Assurance right right because we're asking Mark and then guy to warrantee their work but there's money to pay somebody these guys don't come do it we can hire someone else thank you they keep paying a bond right oh we got a notice today um that a a bond is going to be cancelled because it hasn't been paid for and I love those because they don't give any information on the noi number on the applicant um like Julie this morning was trying to figure out she was making calls trying to figure out who it's for that should go to the treasurer she should I asked I asked he's like I don't know what this is for I all under the treasur I she's the one that keeps track of the bonds and they're worthless if they run out you I would assume that you could buy a two-year Bond if we're going to require that you watch something for two years we're also going to require a two-year Bond or if you're got to watch it for five years we need a fiveyear bond well the bond would stay stay until the appliance is issued unless they don't pay it so right so if you have a twoyear period in which you're supposed to bond it or the wetlands and we don't actually do the bonding that all goes through the treasurer's office right we have to go through them and make sure that it was done but we put the requirements of the bond we require ,000 they get a copy of that when when they get the bond that goes to the treasurer right so like if they're we have a certain like period of growing seasons and we know that we can't is a certificate of compliance before this date like a safety measure you would need the bond to purchased in advance for that block of time especially if it's going to change ownership and everything else it's like buy a Bonds in insurance policy you're just going to pay it those two years in advance so it's it's there forever so even if all the principles involved move to Florida the Bond's still here and can pay for the pick something to think about in the next project because we can't change anything now right well they require that when you have the bond posted the treasur requires we give them the order of conditions and that's written right on there and they see what the order conditions are and they keep track of it because they we're not to keep track of the bonds I know we're not I'm not was a treasure no said J yeah so have to get more information they gave us it's like a November 14th I think is when time is up on that one so we tried this morning to figure it out and couldn't we have to keep working on it that's why you get paid the big bucks why I all right I think we'll work our way back to our minutes yes um under report from Southfield presentation on the lp you going to type this up jul okay basically it's going to say that U the independent audit issue has been resolved if we can produce a document that says we cannot have a suffi representative on our concom they will accept the leaon approach all right okay I'll type that up thank you we get it to tomorrow we should have voting members I yeah that's the only issue is that the voting member part why would you want someone from Connecticut to be a voting member South no and you can't even be from Westfield and member through that hardly an issue comes up where you need to vote on an lpp issue I don't know right okay a motion on the minutes motion to approve as amended PA second all in favor was not here actually you can vote now we made motion was that sorry wrong wrong committee we could do it here too we could it's up to you guys make things easier but we'll wait and we'll think about that push that off to the next meeting got it and Community preservation we uh made an amendment that we can approve minutes even if we weren't at previous meeting as long as there's a quum from that meeting okay um minutes or b y Chris nor I I that sign okay you have a signature page this one's pretty oh then take it wait is it double-sided yes it is no it's not do it what your yours I got it wait that's September 16th don't have it I don't have it sign a double side we don't usually's all right we can do this one yeah all right okay okay make a motion of something else they wish motion to Second Andy chis Norm I I the meeting at 8:20 where