we good good all right uh good evening everybody and welcome tonight to tonight's meeting of the sparta Township planning board on behalf of the members of the Entre High plan AB board our professionals we would like to thank all the people that are here in person as well as those who may be streaming the meeting from either home um or later later down the road on YouTube um I'd like to call this meeting to order to order for the record this meeting is being held on April 17th 2024 at the sparta Township Municipal Building located at 65 Main Street Sparta New Jersey the time is now 7:04 p.m. the live stream for this meeting may be viewed at YouTube at www.youtube.com spart Township which is sp T awp please note that adequate public notice of this meeting was given in accordance with the open public meetings act I ask everybody please stand and join the board as we salute our flag to the flag United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation indid with liy and Justice okay thank you thank you everybody uh before we do the roll call I just just want to make mention um we had a u a resignation uh from Nick uh pompilio um and I'd like to take a moment to to thank nick uh for his time with the board and everything that he contributed uh you know he he was uh his thoughts were appreciated and he'll be missed now with that tonight we have uh Joan Ferman who was joining us as the mayor's designes so so welcome to to John and look forward to working with you thank you so with that uh could we please have a roll call yes Justin Canalis here Ernie ragad here Christine Dunbar Mike Sylvester here Vice chairman bill enri here chairman Ron day here Deputy Mayor Dean blumetti here Joan Ferman here Janette Burke here celest Luciano Mr chairman we'll just confirm for the record that Joan Ferman has signed her oath of office and she is full member of the board thank you okay um so tonight we're going to have um two executive sessions um I'm going to recuse on the first one M Mr chairman okay and uh Dave Brady is here to replace me thank you thanks to okay so I I think before we before I said leave do we have to go through the motion and and go into it I think then we can yes you need to make a motion to go into executive session for the purposes of discussing litigation okay I'll make that motion second any comments okay roll call please Deputy Mayor Dean blti yes Janette Burke yes Vice chairman Bill enr yes Joan Ferman yes Justin caneles yes Ernie r yes Mike Sylvester yes chairman Ronde yes all right so the motion is passed so we're going to go into an executive session we're going to ask that um people if you could I I'm going to guess we'll probably be about a half hour or so um and then we'll uh once once we're done we'll we'll open up the doors again and they W be invited back in so thank you for your patience e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e thank you everybody all right motion to return to clo Open Session I'll second it okay roll call please Deputy Mayor Dean bti yes Janette bur yes Vice chairman Bill enr yes Joan Ferman yes Justin canel yes suano yes Arnie rat yes Mike Sylvester yes chairman Ronde yes yes I guess we can let everybody back in thank you DOR I always feel back think I'm in waai oh I know no thank you got thrown into the deep end of the pool have any questions [Music] all right thank you everybody we're we're back in into public session appreciate everybody uh give us the opportunity to to talk about what we did um so would that maybe we'll start with the motion please yes it would be a motion Mr chairman to authorize me on behalf of the board to sign uh the mediators agreement on the pending litigation with I have a second second I guess we need a motion because I'll make a motion I'll second thank you uh Miss Fox roll call please Deputy Mayor Dean blti yes Janette Burke yes Vice chairman Bill enr yes Joan Ferman yes Justin canel yes CEST Luciano yes Ernie ragad yes Mike Sylvester yes chairman Ronde yes all right the motion is passed thank you thank you Mr Brady thank you Mr Brady okay back to the agenda so the next item on the agenda is approval of minutes uh so we have one set of minutes to approve from February 1st 2023 um may I have a motion to approve the minutes from February 1st 2023 I'll make a motion to approve the minutes from February 1st of 2023 may I have a second a second okay does anybody have any comments I see none uh we have a roll call to approve the minut uh to councilman de yes Janette Burke yes Ronde yes Bill enight yes Justin caneles yes CES luano yes Ernie rad yes okay so the minutes of February 1st 2023 are approved thank you uh the next item on the agenda is correspondence uh we we do not have any corresponden tonight so we'll moving right into the public hearing um tonight we have two hearings uh one is from the Sussex County Tech Technical School Board of Education which will go first and the second one will be from East Coast Development Association uh ass Associates so if the folks from uh susex County Technical School Board of Education come forward welcome gentlemen Andy Mr col Bo well this setting up I just uh make sure everyone understands so this this hearing is a little different than some of the ones that we typically do uh where we I think we're we're given the opportunity to comment um but it's not a vote for approval or denial if you could maybe just maybe provide some clarification on that for everybody so this is a capital Improvement plan review of a public entity U Capital Improvement plan pursuing to the municipal landage law and that is not a site plan or a subdivision or variance it's um it's called a courtesy review because the boards the planning board sits in capacity to give advice to all public agencies who are undertaking Capital Improvement plans but whether they're local County Regional or State uh governmental entities in this case it's a County Board of Ed uh V uh technical school and they've been here before for the demolition of the pool building uh which was located at this same Foot Basic footprint uh if the board members remember that one so that's the status of this Mr chairman it's technically not a hearing but it it's a public meeting but uh it's okay that it's listed as a hearing and we will open to the public for comments and questions uh after the applicant goes ahead so gentlemen who will be speaking please raise your right hands um to sweare or firm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth to help you God please State your names and give us any uh qualifications that you might have or titles sure my name is Joshua Thompson I'm a senior associate at the firm of p s architects in Rockaway uh and I am a licensed New Jersey architect my name is I architect for this project I have witha for arits and both of you if you could spell your last names and uh give give us your business address c m a c h o Josh Thompson t h o m PS o n our business address is 439 Route 46 Rockaway 07866 thank you Gentlemen please go ahead y so if you'll permit me I I want to pass around a board as we speaking that's allowed this is a a 3D massing model of what we're proposing um before we get into the plans just a quick background of how we got here today I'm not sure if anybody remembers me me we were here just about a year ago uh on the demolition of the natatorium which is the the doed pool structure uh that has since been removed if you've driven down Route 94 um and that was the first phase of a project that started back in 20121 the school district applied for a grant under the securing our future Bond act they did receive monies for it and the demolition was the first piece of it unfortunately it was a onetime Grant so there was no ability to go back to the state for additional monies when the world changed because of Co and so the original concept for this addition project was actually about twice as large as we're proposing tonight um and that's just because of the cost of instruction has increased greatly so with the pool demolition coming down the phase two this Edition is actually two additions uh one being multiple classrooms and I'm just going to walk to this side of the table um the first being multiple classrooms with a corridor that is into the exact location where the Dome used to be Mr thomton if I could um I appreciate you pointing to us but I'd like the public to be able to see it to is a way to angle it you can go in the corner there corner at the edge of the the DK you name it a little bit yeah that that's good that's good we have copies of the drawing I believe I do so the first two classrooms are in the footprint of the existing Dome um much smaller as you can see graphically on on the model that's passing around the second is uh just upside of that off of the existing engineering room the construction of this building it it's going to be a 2B it's a typical masonry and brick cavity wall some steel studs inside steel structure for the roof um and there's not many Frills to it um our intent is to obviously keep it modular keep it within um masonry dimensions and as you can see on some of the elevations that we had sent beforehand there there's a little bit of Stucco in there a little bit of glazing um but at the end of the day it it's a little bit of a brick box Mr Thompson I apologize so if you I think if you put it on the board down there then that way the the the plan board members can see it as well as the public it's hard from there thank you yes my thank you very much and so what we have shown um on this bottom rendering here is the view from Route 94 so as you used to go down Route 94 you would see the Dome now you'll kind of see this one story masonry structure in context with the rest of the school behind it the um the programmatic spaces within this are all educational it is a school building the first program is going to be Allied Health which is a nursing program that currently exists Elsewhere on the campus so they'll be relocating into the new space secondly is a Kinesiology that program does not exist it will be a new offering by the school district U think athletic trainers and physical therapists and the third which is the uh the actual second edition is just an addition of the floor space for the engineering classroom so it will be strictly a classroom area as well as the lab area um with that I'm going to ask Mr kamacho to walk you through some of the particulars of the plans hello everyone uh thank you for Ling Us in and let us letting us present um we can start off with the engineering classroom I do want to emphasize we did take a kind of like a pre-layer approach to the design um in this particular case you see the two classroom Edition and the engineering um bump out um these are part of the actual editions but we also are renovating existing programming space that the the client currently has so right now they actually have um a couple electrical rooms SL robotic rooms and again try to do the most with the funding that we got um you'll see that in the title it calls for renovations these particular electrical rooms will get renovated with new univ ventilators to help condition the space and also to add AC to the current space again it's about trying to improve the working environment for the students so that would be in terms of the renovating the existing space the second layer goes into U making it a little bit more comfortable for the engineering classroom and that's where the the bump out of the existing classroom comes into play just because as a technical school there's a big push towards uh Theory in practice where a lot of the shops that are there now whether they're auto shops mechanical shops even the electrical shops they're already set up for a theory space where they can learn about the theory theory of the trade but they also have in the same space uh allocated for workspace to practice that theory the engineering classroom bump out that we see here takes up a lot of that space using the large Machinery that a lot of the students have to be familiar with so for that bump out the reason pushing it out and increasing its footprint is so that we can take the classroom Theory space and allocated into that bump out so that now the students have more space to actually take learning and Theory into practice and then if they need it they still have that work space with the heavy machinery to practice what they learned the third layer was uh what Josh was alluding to which is the two classroom uh addition which will be um basically taking one of the existing programs which he mentioned the Allied Health and also giving it its proper spacing um Ali Health focuses students to learn more more about a career in the health practice so same division you have towards the bottom you have your instructional spaces which consists of traditional workstations um variously connected to a wireless access point and then north of that you have more builting um workstations where they could get into the specimens and analyzing um the anatomy of the human body or in this case specimens on north of that we have the the physiology and what Josh was mentioning it is truly a physical therapy uh at least it's model after after that career choice but it also goes even further because it gives them um a branch between the existing former gym and the athletic IC field so our goal would be that the students here in in this Annex are kind of just the post between the existing gymnasium and the athletic fields on the far right um a lot of the workspace in that uh physiology room caters to providing room for equipment such as uh training tables uh running equipment but also open space to practice uh stretching um any physical rehabilitation ation work to the physical body and as well as your standard desks just so that they can understand the practice so the goal is uh pre layers um improve of what we have there supplement by the program by adding new new new programs and then the last layer in terms of site context would be situating the addition in between the existing gymnasium and the fields toward towards me and then it helps create a good uh hybrid environment for instance in case in the corridors as the students stop and intermingle they can talk about one another and see what each career path brings to quickly walk you through the utilities um we are adding two single fixture restrooms uh we have to do that because of Plumbing count issues and and the size of the school uh by adding the program space we just need to make sure that we're compliant there each of the classrooms um the engine ing Edition and the two classrooms together will each be served by their own rooftop unit it'll be a package system mounted on a roof fed by gas and lastly structurally speaking most of the structure will just be a SLP structure and we'll put the insulation on top of it as we get towards the existing curved wall where the Dome was to make our lives in the contractor's lives a little bit easier we're going to go with a flat structure and tapered Insulation at those um I'd like to offer an apology as we introduced ourselves we did not introduce who is with us we have members of the administration but also the civil engineer of record um who I'd like to bring up and if we could swear him in sure there please raise your right hand do you swear airm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you God I do and please state your name and address and give us some qualifications sure uh my name is Giovani G IO v n ni last name manilo m a ni L iio uh with Manara design address of 62 Grove Street in Somerville New Jersey um 08876 um so I have a Bachelor of Science in civil engineering from Syracuse University I've been licensed in the state of New Jersey for the past 15 years and currently in good standing and also licensed in state New York and testified in front of numerous boards throughout the state thank you you're welcome Mr manilo the board will recognize your qualification and also the other gentleman's qualifications and please go ahead thank you yeah so as Mr Thompson Mr kamano had stated the improvements that we are proposing to the site as far as a site engineering standpoint um the proposed improvements are very minimal um there's going to be little to no effect on the site um there's no changes to the amount of parking uh there is actually a pretty de good decrease in impervious coverage for the site um and the rough number is about a quarter acre less impervious coverage which would lead to less runoff as well um additional improvements we are going to have some lighting on the building for safety purposes um all those lights will be extinguished by 12: um midnight and as far as storm water we are picking up a portion of the roof runoff and bringing it onto the um site drainage system so it's all going to be contained on site uh no adverse impacts to any of the neighbors just going through some of the comments and and uh recommendations from your your board engineer um there is or was a well U previously on the site that was decommissioned as part of one of the previous um improvements to site when they were connected to the water system um and also by the proposed engineering classroom what we show on our plans is we show a um relocation of a high water alarm um and the purpose of that is there's an existing tank outside the auto body shop and really the purpose of that tank is to cap capture any um if there's any spills in the auto body shop it would go into that tank and it gets pumped out um speaking to the school um there has been anything that's been leaked or gone into that tank in in years because there's there's no spills that happens in the auto body shop uh but that's the purpose of the high high water alarm so if if that tank gets full the alarm goes off to say hey somebody's got to pump it out um other than that you there's really not much as far as site improvements yeah so the grading in general is is is um 2% um provide positive drainage um also I did forget there was one comment about um a cover over the proposed or existing water lines we'll look at that I I think there's room to work with the grading to uh maintain the existing cover over the uh water line okay thank you problem is there any other testimony or any other things okay open up to the board and to your profession so with that then let me open up to our professionals to see if you have any questions that need to be or comments that you'd like to have addressed certainly Mr chairman and board members uh just referring to the report I did dated April 9th 2024 uh the applicant described the proposed project and I made some general comments that the applicants professionals addressed but I'll just highlight them again so you know we're all on the same page U as far as the site plan goes again before the Dome was demolished it was a general slope and they're proposing a general slope a again approximately 2% is labeled on the plans uh Mr Giovani did uh indicate the 658 Contour I was a little concerned if they were taking some cover off the electric and water lines they agreed to check that I think that's a good idea just so they don't run into a problem there uh they had adequate lighting around the perimeter with building mounted lights and he just answered the question as far as the hours of operation those fixtures will go off at midnight correct and with regards to storm water management I agree that the proposed uh area is is substantially less than what the Dome was so as far as impervious coverage I agree with that and it doesn't violate any of the Township's ordinance over 500 square F feet of additional impervious so that's that's a good situation uh he confirmed that the existing well that used to be in the dome area has been decommissioned so that's taken care of further good last's project good and the township does provide water to the whole facility they have their own sewage treatment plan PL uh they can verify the capacity of that uh there were some lines shown on the plan where some electric lines and other utility lines seem to just taper off I'm not sure if they just didn't follow through the rest of the paper space area on the map or if they did terminate or what's to become of them yeah so that was um the limits of our utility locate so we had a private um Locate performed on the site uh since that was outside of the uh the work area that's where it was terminated okay okay but in general they're either connected to someone something or terminated yes most of them go to the uh to the Fieldhouse and bleachers okay correct and they also talked about the high water alarm I wasn't sure what that was for now we've had that answered as far as that tank from the auto body shop uh with regards to the architectural plans the only thing I noted uh as the architect mentioned uh rooftop units are proposed the ones on the one edition don't extend very far very far above the main Edition the one above the roof line on the engineering Edition did seem to extend a little higher yeah so to quickly address that um on the two classroom Edition there will be a parit which is why it doesn't seem that the RTS are extending very high on the one classroom Edition to keep the context of the existing building around it we are putting metal panels on it but it is also just a Scupper Roof System so there's no parit on the engineering Edition which is why the rtu appears a little bit taller okay uh with regards to any signage my understanding is there's no signage proposed for this uh an environmental impact statement wasn't provided but I because of the sewage treatment plan on site which is regulated by the state and the Township's water uh basically I think they've got those main issues covered as far as an Eis or any concern and I'm not aware of any wetlands in the area and maybe Mr Mello could just comment on that on the record correct there's no Wetlands that show up on geeb or through our site visits and all the activi is in previously Disturbed areas uh with regards to construction details I did suggest in the one thicker concrete they did have woven wire mesh I'd suggest that be incorporated in the regular sidewalk yep and we have no issues with that and then as far as it's applicable and I defer to Mr Collins on this I listed other uh applic or excuse me agencies that normally uh would be subject to Sussex County planning board upper Delaware Conservation District the township construction official and D if the well hadn't been sealed but I understand that the well has been sealed the wheel has uh the well has been sealed um CeX County planning board is is pending and upper Delaware has been submitted and the only other thing I have uh if you could would it be possible for you to send us the township for their records a copy of the well sealed Sealing documentation just so we've got that because the township is supplying water now and just so they know there's no possible source of cross-contamination anymore yeah I don't see any issues with that and that's my report Mr chairman thank you yeah Catherine anything I did not prepare a report for this because it's just a courtesy review but just one thing that came to mind um during the course of the presentation during the course of construction um is there going to be any impact on the existing parking will it be will will the construction um area basically impact the grab this sure it's may be the easiest way to address it so the area of our addition is the Dome that that's on the printout here the Route 94 kind of comes at the bottom of this board that would be the site Ingress for the the contractor the staging area will be south of the Dome as it's shown on here um which means that there will be no impact to the parking most of the student parking is on the other side of Campus um with just a lot of the facilities parking and and custodians in this back area so the staging area will be south of the Dome it shouldn't impact day today um this project it will actually take place during the school year um we're confident that we can isolate the construction from the learning environment especially because the nearest classroom is a gym which any any sound should be mitigated okay thank you I have nothing further let go down toas anybody plan board members have questions none I noticed a few outdoor I'm sorry I notic doors on both sides of the building um given the concerns and around safety in our schools are they going to be the same setup for whatever other doors are at the facility and so in terms of egis um we did include additional egis points at each um learning space on top of the corridor eager space uh for fire and then on top of that we have existing one that they currently use um near the ramp area so I think um we added to the existing but then we also we generous by adding individual exits to each classroom the intent of those exits is that they're egress only so they'll be flush panel um most likely F FRP um but whe the only doors that may have a key fob or security system on them would be the ones in the corridor but we haven't yet made that determination thank you yeah thank you uh appreciate everything youve shared I have a few questions uh the first is regarding uh environmental matters and njd I noticed that they haven't been involved in this and um this site is um within a confirmed Vernal pool radius of 500 ft buffer uh according to the D so so I don't I think it's right across Route 94 um also this is located in a Wellhead protection area I'm not sure if you're aware of that so given those two items can you discuss whether you think njd should be involved or you should get some authorization or permits for that yeah with the proposed um improvements um there's no DP uh permitting that is required for this project um again all this um improvements are being done in previously Disturbed areas so um these classrooms are in the area of the old Dome and then the engineering classroom is in the area of just a small Grass Island between a parking lot and the building um as far as Wellhead protection there's no um seepage or any um any water that's going be infiltrated into the ground um so there's no effect that will happen to any any wells in the area okay so you don't anticipate that the even during construction that there will be a disturbance outside of that immediate area no okay not at all speaking of the floors another question was can you confirm that there'll be no floor drains of course and no hazardous materials either during construction or during operations and I'm thinking as I heard you speak about Allied Health and about nursing and you mentioned some of the things they'll be doing to me immediately I thought of you know Medical Solutions and samples and things like that and then when you mentioned the tank and the high water level for the auto body shop area is that going to be connected to the new area at all no so with the Allied Health that we are showing two SNS so those will be handwash sinks only okay um as far as their curriculum they do um I don't know a fancy way to put this they do dissect animals those will be in the storage there's a large area there that has refrigerators in there that should cover everything so there is no floor drains or anything like that okay okay also the uh the lighting you mentioned about the the building lighting uh going off at midnight would you consider having that be cut off earlier um I say that because a lot of the things we deal with a lot of the hearings a lot of the new developments um we are encouraging them to do it a lot earlier especially maybe in this case given it's a school and perhaps it's not open 12 months of the year and just because there's a lot of wildlife in there and there's a lot of other you know negative impacts of too much lighting so we can talk with the district absolutely um the I'm not sure what the existing lighting system turns off at um my understanding is it's also 12 this is kind of adjacent to the sports field so on a Friday night if they have a sport event that that would be one of those areas where we would want them on a little bit later um but the it it so in short we can talk with the district about it I'm not sure I I'm pretty sure we're matching their existing standard with that okay um but we can have that conversation okay appreciate it U you didn't mention the Landscaping I know it's not a large area but if you're if you're planning on landscaping around these new additions when you're done I would just encourage to to consider using using native species TR you know shrubs plantss trees whatever is going in around there and if you have a ideas or plans can you just briefly share them we don't have any any for that that's the short answer okay if you would maybe consider that as you're as you're planning them out U I think that's all I have for now thank you okay to follow up on uh the safety questions unfortunately we live in a society where teachers and children and are faced with participating in drills for active Shooters um and with new construction you have an opportunity to address some things that a um old classroom cannot and I was wondering if any of that was taken into consideration some of it is costeffective like just making sure that the doors to a classroom can lock from and unlock from the inside and especially you have older students when you um need to hide uh from the shooter you need to have a space where they can't be seen from the door so maybe you could just talk about the door does it have glass can it lock unlock or have any provisions been made and I don't think New Jersey has adequately addressed any of these issues at all no thank you for that comment um we did actually uh talk to the door vendor a lot about security security has been a big push um and then just to answer one question how we addressed it and improved on it the door hardware is lockable from inside where teachers will follow the same existing protocol that they they have so they are able to shelter themselves inside if the Intruder was from outside um another point we did Mr if you could maybe talking to mic thank you oh another point that we did also take into account was reducing the visibility from the exterior so you'll notice that there's not a lot of U storefront um we they go with masonry so that helps limit what uh an intruder from picking what's going inside and stuff like that and I I I think those were the main considerations the only thing I would add is the windows that we do have the punched openings are offset by um awning windows that limit the the amount that they actually open so it's not a double hung window sliding up it's a very narrow area it is a classroom we do have to provide some provision for natural prevention um natural ventilation um but I think the combination of those strategies as far as a lock downst scenario I'll have to leave that to the the school district we do have these kind of windowless storage areas that are potential um for a shelter in place or lockdown I'm not sure what the existing standards are for that I'd have to check with the superintendent yeah I don't think New Jersey has standards and that's I guess my public service announcement I want to get out there and you know as you serve on other committees and uh work with other professionals perhaps you know it's something that really needs to be incorporated cuz if if you've ever been in a lockdown with uh 28 kids as I have it is tough that's all I have I'm good um just two quick questions so um we talked about exits but we haven't talked about fire suppression and safety so can you discuss that a little bit so by code we don't need to have a uh sprinkler system there is no sprinkler system in the school current currently um and with the euse at the 2B by code we don't need it so there's not one the materials that we're using um will be protected so the every column we don't have exposed columns there within a 1 hour rating which again is the minimum for code the ceilings will be the same thing um we do have a firewall that we're installing on both um coming up to the the existing building and so might be hard to see from across the room but they do exceed up above the existing uh roof levels which is compatible with code and the purpose of the firewall is that there if there ever was an issue in theic that would freef fall without touching the existing building and vice versa and so th those measures are implemented but as far as a suppression or a sprinkler system that is not and one more quick question about lighting is lighting up up lighting or down lighting do do on the building it'll be above the doors downl face downward fa yeah to to provide the egress illumination okay thank you that's it okay uh let's open up to members of the public if any members of the public have uh any questions about to the applicant about comments what bit about the U presentation yes you swear affirm to tell the truth the whole truth than nothing but the truth to help you God I do Jenny Derek's Tapp into sport I just have a quick question um funding you mentioned that you have a grant uh that took care of the 2021 the first phase removal funding is of course going to be am I see you tomorrow night uh at the budget meeting um do you have funding SEC like you're guaranteed that you have the funding you need to go forward with this whole project correct this was a a federal or state I apologize I'm not sure which um Bond act it has nothing to do with the dist capital reserve forance program or anything like that thank you any other members of the public okay so uh with that Mr Collins I guess we need a motion could help us with this one again it's a little little different than what we normally would do um entertain it motion to approve the capital Improvement plan review of the um prise you could just I'm sorry it's a motion to confirm that the board reviewed the capital Improvement plan of the susex County Technical School Board of Education for the classroom additions and Renovations at the Sussex County Technical School um subject to the the comments and testimony of the Board of Education Representatives here tonight and Dave Simmons's review report I did not have any other ideas on advise advisory comments but if the board had some advisory comments uh you could add them I guess there was one to consider they'll talk to the Board of Education about U reducing the nighttime hours from perhaps to an hour earlier than 12: midnight and perhaps consistent with u the other uh security lighting at the campus and Native landscaping and if they installed landscap could they install native Landscaping all right unless there say anything else anybody like to make a motion to adopt um the motion as Tom had stated I'll make a motion I have a second a second Miss Fox roll call please Deputy Mayor Dean blumetti yes Janette Burke yes Vice chairman Bill enry yes Joan Ferman yes Justin canel yes celest Luciano yes Ernie ragad yes Mike Sylvester yes chairman Ronde yes good luck all right thank you thank you for your time and your presentation good night started here's your chance to okay so we have a a second hearing tonight uh for application uh number 24. 2394 submitted by East Coast development Associates located at 9 and 15 prices lane block 120001 lot four uh the OSG Zone and lot five the economic development zone for purposes of a minor uh subdivision so we welcome the uh representative of East Coast development good evening gentlemen I'll swear in the witness if I might might uh sir please raise your right hand do you swear firm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you God and please please stay your name and address my name is Michael fiser professional engineer and Mike U if you could describe your qualifications that would be helpful um professional engineer uh licensed in state of New Jersey since 2014 uh practicing since then um have a bachelor's of Science in uh civil engineering from NJIT graduated in 2011 um I've appeared before multiple boards both in county and AD of County uh most recently in Hampton Township the board will recognize and accept uh Michael Fischer's qualifications as a professional engineer and uh please go ahead gentlemen good evening Mr chairman members of the board professionals and staff my name is Robert mcbrier I'm an attorney with the law for Miss price SM King and we represent East Coast development Associates LLC uh we're here tonight on behalf of the applicant requesting approvals for a lot line adjustment and minor subdivision specific specifically the applicant seeks approval to adjust the lot line between block 120001 Lot 4 which is owned by the township and lot five which is owned by the applicant to facilitate installation of solar arrays at the sparta Township DPW complex the Township's lot four is approximately 82.1 acres and is in the OSG Zone the applicants lot five is exuse me if you could if if you can speak into the microphone thank you hello can you hear me there we go thank you uh the Township's lot four is approximately 82.1 acres and is in the OSU Zone the applicant lot five is approximately 19.3 acres and is in the adjacent Ed Zone in addition to the lot line adjustment the applicant seeks approval to subdivide the reconfigured lot five into three New Lots such that new lot 5.01 would consist of approximately 14.3 Acres new lot 5.02 would consist of approximately 1.8 acres and new lot 5.03 would consist of approximately 3 acres all three proposed Lots will meet the bulk standard uh requirements of the Ed Zone we are in receipt of and review the Township's technical review reports and can address any comments or questions during our presentation at this time I like to ask uh that Mr Fischer uh review the uh subdivision plan that was prepared by his office good evening everyone um so looking at the property right now on this map um as it was noted there's two properties in question here lot four which is the DPW property and lot five which is our applicants property um sh there's a a multiple um array of colors and and and um line line types and hatchings that you'll see on the map before you on the board here um excuse me I'm sorry could you just um sure how about this I'll do you one favor I have I have smaller copies that I can pass out to everybody perfect thank you I'll give it a for way around already one of the it's just a smaller version of what is on the board here so that so would you mark that on the board as A1 absolutely please wait for it to make its way around now to be clear before I go any further uh the copy that you have before you and what's on the board here is not a new map that's been prepared it's a it's a page from the submitted plan set sheet three it was just highlighted with uh colors for the purposes of this evening's uh hearing um so you have a a series of gray shaded areas that are areas that are going to be uh as part of the um lot line adjustment that'll be going and annexed to lot four from either lot five or through the vacation of sustainable way which uh which was an approved right away from a previous subdivision application this property um there are addition uh areas that are either going from Lot 4 to Annex to to lot five or um through the again through the vacation of sustainable way and being annexed to lot five at no point is lot five prior to the um subdivis the minor subdivision that's also proposed that no point is lot five any smaller or larger than its previous state of the lot line adjustment um the previous line um essentially ran from the corner here this purple dash line and then it ran through this blue dash green line um up there's a a curve here up the property line and then it it intersects with the sustainable way right away at the time um the new lot line as part of the lot line adjustment it will be this uh blue dash green line um which will create the boundary limit for the Shaded area to the to the south of the property um and then um will BCT through the sustainable way right away um as a matter of fact lot four actually stands to get a larger by approximately 30,000 square fet a little bit more than that um so that lot the Township's property will get a little bit bigger but lot five will stay the same in in in size um once the lot line adjustment has been completed the applicant is looking to now um create a minor subdivision for lot five property lot five um and we have uh lot numbers assigned by the tax assessor consisting of what would be the overall remainder lot of 5.01 which would be approximately 14.4 acres in size um proposed lot 5.02 which which is this Center area here Bound by the blue lines um that is that meets the minimum bulk size requirement for lots of 80,000 Square ft and also in lot width and uh depth um and then the the final portion which is kind of like a an an enlarged L if you will proposed lot 5.03 which is um 3.08 acres in size also has the minimum required lot Frontage uh requirement so all three of these Lots meet the bulk standards uh for the Ed Zone um and and honestly that that's that's the extent of what we're looking to present to the board here tonight okay um thank you um any other could they could he go through though Mr Simmons's report just to make sure he's answered any questions was a comment that Dave raised about the U zoning line change that he asked me to comment on and I am satisfied that the subdivision complies with the zoning under without the zoning line change but that the Township in the future should um change the zone map so that the uh DP the new revised DPW lot uh has the same zoning of OSG for this uh addition to the lot but that doesn't stop this from being subdivided at this time correct and and what I'll say to that is that that new zone line anticipated zone line is represented on these plans that is the green dash line that you see on the plans before you it it is a little offset on the the portion of the the line that's mainly between the the two properties and then that's really just for graphical purposes so the information that was being uh um portrayed on the plans that the the the distances and measurements could be legible um it it's fully intended to follow the new lot line between what will be lot four and five pre subdivision um the former um or or current zone line per the um Township zoning map run from the property corner here through behind sustainable way and up to prices Lane and I was also just confirm that uh the witness has correctly explained that the DPW lot is the subject of a solar energy uh project that the township has uh approved by a Redevelopment ordinance and by a Redevelopment plan and the goal there is to use cover to cover en close the landfill and then to place solar arrays on the landfill uh for the township is that your understanding Mr fiser I'm sorry is that your understanding yes it is my understanding that there will be a solar R proposed by a a a firm hired by the the township that is not our subject of our application anything else so I just was thinking if if uh the Mr Fisher could just run through Dave's report and just see if there's anything that Dave was asking him to confirm um I I mean yes and I and I think Dave you can correct me if I'm wrong but I believe I can skip to the miscellaneous section five which is where there the bulk of any questions or comments from your report may exist in I I believe that's correct just so the board knows and again Mr fiser and I are both referring to the report I did dated March 18th 2024 there's a variety of pieces of the different lots and the proposed Road vacation and what have you and some are being subdivided and annexed either to lot four or the New Lots uh so I think the applicant and he can correct me if I'm wrong is in agreement with everything I described in that area yes and the one thing I would suggest my assumption is that if the board approves a subdivision they're going to propos to memorialize it by deed I believe that's the case that's yes so what I'd suggest because there are so many moving pieces to this if you will for future surveyors and what have you you've got a reduced copy of the Subdivision map right here you could reduce it another generation and include that in the deed so it's in the chain of title so that someone X years from now in the future would have a pretty good idea which piece went to which and how it was vacated with all the necessary information on it and yes I think you could go to miscellaneous now okay um item a in miscellaneous is is uh basically a statement indicating that there's an area shown in the area is uh the portion of proposed lot 503 of uh an encroachment of a a manicured La lawn area um from what is lot six the rear yard of lot six it's it's there's nothing there that I see that you're looking for us to do it's just a statement and observation that it's based on your survey yes yes based on the survey um Item B talks about uh some notation that's on our survey plan it does not it is not represented on this plan here it is represented on the boundary in Topo survey sheet two of the plan set where it talks about um possible overlaps between the properties and um we can agree to to um look into that further and and um look into any kind of quick claim that may be necessary Quick Claim Deed that can be done to clean up the title between the properties we have no objection to that um item C refers to the oil testing that was done on site over the course of the the history of this property um as I noted earlier this property was the subject of a um major subdivision back in 2009 I believe um and there was soil testing that that was done on site across the entire property from that point forward um and Mr Simmons notes in in his report that there are some soil test results in the lower portion of the property here which is roughly adjacent to the the rail line where there's some groundwater conditions um the bulk of the the um soil test results in the higher portion of the property did not experience any ground waterer conditions and and can support a uh a septic um and and again that was um a statement and observation he made in his report under item C so there's nothing for us to take care of there um we did just touch on the zone line in item D with regards to how that should be handled um as I understand as it's written in the letter here uh in the memo here it's not a matter for the planning board to to resolve the the zone line that's something that has to be done through the township Council to the recommendation of the the board that's correct and the board can recommend that to the governing body and then lastly is item e um which refers to a small portion of this property which happens to be located within Lafayette Township that is not represented on these plans here um we were not anticipating um having any impacts within Lafayette Township with regards to the the nature of this application um but if the board sees to it that we need to um yeah that's right have an application before Lafayette and and Lafayette board sees that we need to come before them um to to hear the application then we have no objection to that that would be on lot four right yeah I was going to say that they've pointed out to me where that is it's it's it's basically a long prices laying up by the Northwestern corner of the township lot which is the DPW lot and the the future solar energy lot that is is not uh something that is affected by this subdivision and uh they don't as far as I'm concerned there's no legal obligation for them to go to it would be the township and there's no legal obligation for the township to go to Lafayette Township for a minor subdivision of land that is not at all in Lafayette if it was changing the lot line in Lavia that would be a different subject but here the all of the changes are in spart attention and that concludes his his letter with regards with the exception of item six which refers to any additional approvals we're we'll absolutely obtain any additional approvals that might be necessary okay from other governing B governing bodies Mr Simmons any other questions or comments no Mr chairman other than when I suggested that the uh reduced map be part of each one of the Deeds for the maps just to make clear for future Generations okay Mard similar to the last application I did not prepare a formal review memo but I just um I guess I just want to clarify I understand lot four is owned by Sparta Township generally if if a right of way even a paper Street's going to be vacated the township has to approve it I'm assuming that this is something that the township has approved the vacation of the RightWay yeah that it it that will be requested by the township uh together with uh the vacation of I think there were two site triangle easements yes uh as well as uh what we discussed earlier the uh the realignment of the Zone boundary to uh correspond with the the new line okay so those will be requested by from the council all of those will be formally requested by the township Council okay thank you that's all were those included in the previous resolution the council passed I'm sorry was that included though already in the resol the resolution that the council already passed was there's a there's a resolution right that the council passed not too long ago that resolution uh was uh number 23146 uh and in that uh it uh among other things consented to uh the minor subdivision application uh and indicated uh that uh it would uh begin proceedings to vacation sustainable way so it was included in uh it was included in one of the um operative provisions of the townships resolution okay okay uh let me bring it back to De celest I'm GNA start on your side this time if I could any questions I am actually good for the moment okay thanks I have no questions no I have a few questions so um so okay as I understand there's two things going on here right there's the lot line adjustment and that's a in a sense it's a land swap right it's about equal and then there is the request for the subdivision of lot five into smaller Lots correct that's correct okay U lot five as it stands today is a rail adjacent lot correct yes okay the if the subdivision is approved will there be three lots or will there be four Lots there'll be three lots okay so five will go away it'll be 501 502 503 that's correct that that's that's that is noted on that plan that that's been circul so the the back of the large lot is the along the rail line that's that will be one of the remaining Lots correct that's correct if if if if it if it simplifies it for the board it's it's essentially the remainder lot um the the the smaller Lots were the lots that were created to meet the bulk standards this was the lot that was remaining as a result of that okay and it's lot 501 it would be yes um that's the one with the chain link fence across the portion of it um what is the what is the purpose of the subdivision request uh ultimately the the applicant is looking to develop the properties in the future we don't have a development plan before you because we're not here for a site plan we're just here for subdivision okay this time in your opinion are all three lots developable if that's a real word yes okay there was a a mention of a drain easement um can you just explain that I'm not sure if it was covered if if if so can you just repeat that again something at the back corner certainly um so there is a drainage easement on lot four adjacent to the rail line which would benefit proposed lot 501 um or if that sub never mind I'm not even going to address that uh to to benefit proposed lot 501 um and and that's to allow runoff to to discharge from the property down into the railway area as it currently does today okay um does that explain that when you say as it currently does today can you expand on that please topographically um property slopes in that direction okay okay now the sustainable way that easement is it used currently for anything or has it been used in the recent past for anything to your knowledge uh today as of six o'clock this evening when I was on site uh it is still a manicured lawn okay so it's it's just a paper Road in nature right now okay do you know the intention of that in the past why why it was created was that to access the 505 so so historically um as I stated previously in 2009 roughly there was an application approved by the board um to yield uh a total of six Lots on this property and sustainable way was part of the public RightWay that was going to be created and then there was going to be a private RightWay that connected to it off of it and and gave Frontage to uh the additional Lots as they were created through that subdivision MH okay so I guess I would I would ask Mr Collins if you wouldn't mind can you explain to us the the criteria for us to consider when we think about approving or denying a subdivision such as what's being proposed here basically when when you're reviewing a minor subdivision which is what this is even a lot of line adjustment is techic Ally A minor subdivision under the municipal Landes law um if it conforms with all of the ordinance standards including the acreage and the setbacks and the bulk standards um you basically should and under the municipal Landes law uh you're expected to approve it but it does not mean that U site plan has been approved yet it just means that the Lots can be created and the uh um the difference between a site plan and subdivision is subdivision allows for new lot lines to be to exist new lot lines cannnot be made up by people without there being an approval by a planning board or sometimes zoning board uh to allow a different lot line and so what this particular minor subdivision does is a number of things but basically it um adjust the lot line with the temp Township lot to accommodate some historical differences of use by the township on their lot and and uh that will allow the township to control the uh entire area for the landfill closure and the applicant is also asking for permission to record Deeds of minor subdivision that'll separate the remainder lot from these two new lots and they record those those become recorded U Deeds of um in the county clerk's office that are off a lots if they'd like to use them they have to come back to the planning board for a uh site plan approval for the change for the uses and the improvements on it such as buildings or driveways so it would be at a future future point where we would need to consider things um such as again Wellhead protection areas critical wildlife habitats things like that that would be later on generally speaking that is correct because those are the those are when something is changing about those those that land other than all that's happening today is the approval of the separation of the Lots okay and then what Happ they get they they prepare as you read from the report uh they can recorded minor subdivision by either deed or plat and it's more common to do minor subdivisions by deed uh that means they they write up Deeds with deed descriptions and they um get reviewed by Dave and by me then they get signed by the chairman and secretary and they get recorded into the in the county clerk's office in this case there'll be um the deed to the township uh looks like there's Deeds to between the township and the applicant to adjust those those lot lines okay thank you and and it is true that sustainable way is a dedicated paper street that that was never built and so that is dedicated though to the township so the township is the entity by governing body ordinance that vacates uh paper streets or even even built streets but the Township in this case would have to do an ordinance V vacating the public interest in sustainable way and that's that's the procedure that's followed and that resolution anticipates the township doing that in the future that's all my questions for now thank you yeah I have a few um on the Lots there's a lot of moving Parts here are there any open Environmental cases related to the SRP program lsrps assigned or these cases been previously open and closed what's the current environmental status of the light the lot in question I have no answer with regards to any open-ended environmental conditions on lot four the Township's property um my understanding is there is no environmental concerns with regards to lot five though um I mean Tom with on lot for I don't know all the details but I do know the township um is undertaking efforts to uh complete the closure of the landfill on Lot 4 and to the exent encroaches on this property as well and that that closure is ongoing and is um I don't think it's I don't know enough about it Mike as to if there's an lsrp or not um that would be something that Township well I would assume there is if it's currently an ongoing remediation and I think my concern is with all these transfers and and moving Parts is that one there's no car vs or any transfers of aoc's or open environmental issues to the other uh lots that are either swapping land and or uh being impacted by the movement of the property boundaries or lines yeah I'm pretty sure I'm pretty sure it's in the the township wants to have the LI line adjustment take place so that it can continue to perfect the closure so the answer to the question is no there's nothing that harms the township for from this um L adjustment it actually benefits the township well then I'm going to I'm just going to close on if there is a currently if there's an open case the lsrp or whever the oversight of notifying d and or getting this information into D1 two is any environmental Consulting and or lsrp overseeing that remediation is notified uh or they're not going to be able to properly administratively close out any ongoing or future cases related to all all the you know subject changes here I mean in Mr Simmons's point there you know I think a nice clean summary and um you know a new outline of a map is important to capture what was there what in the past what the changes or proposed changes are for multiple purpos not just subdividing but also to um close any existing into or deal with any future environmental cases that may exist we don't know right now other than we think that the Township's property is still an ongoing or open case well definitely the Township's property is an ongoing case and is the township is undertaking the completion of the closure and the capping and monitoring so but that's the Township's responsibility not the applicants and my last question then is in in a situation like this with different properties and lots and blocks here is there any due diligence done and or required to be done as part of this by not by the applicant but yes by the township and I believe it is undergoing that but I'm not directly involved in that in other words I believe this lot line adjustment helps the township perfect the completion of the closure of the landfill and the capping once the capping is done the solar energy project so they're they're in the in the hands of the township and the township that's my understanding is diligently uh completing that yeah my understanding is that the remediation is going is on going withd and the town has a consultant working on that and and that is paused right now caught up um a separate from that the plan is to put the solar over that site and this little space that is being traded is necessary for I think equipment for the solar panels but I think that it's the space that is being acquired is outside of the landfill itself yeah and I was just concerned that if they're going to you know eventually need to administratively close out that case yeah that it doesn't out that ability to do so yeah that's that that's short and sweet of where I was trying to get to I think actually Mike it helps the township accomplish that okay great thank you I guess just as a quick followup to what Mike was asking are there are there currently any monitoring Wells on lot five for the landfill you know any do you know of any monitorings not aware of any monings for all right left four definitely yeah left four there is yeah I'm just asking if there were you know sometimes stuff moves so they do adjacent Lots I'm good no questions okay uh just a one question I just want to make sure I'm clear so in terms of um are there any do we have the approvals that we need from the Town Council or is this going to be contingent on obtaining approvals from the Town Council or it's um there you don't need any approvals from the township Council for the board to act but as part of your action if you were to approve it it will be conditioned upon the vacation of sustainable way and um uh the recording of Deeds of minor subdivision but that's the technically not the township Council but the township wants to make sure that the Deeds of minor subdivision are in the form that would benefit the township and as part of their transaction with the property owner um but with that that's all they the idea to change the zone line is something you'll recommend but it's technically not required the township can do what the township wants to do on Township land whether it's zoned for osdu or whether it's zoned for Ed the township is not subject to zoning so um that's something you're going to recommend but it's not a it's a recommendation it's not a condition precedent to recording the Deeds of minor subdivision now Tom just to clarify the portion of property that was the town's property lot four that will become part of the new lot five should this be approved would still remain in the former zone or would it naturally s the portion that's that's Township property will will be switched by the zoning ordinance the portion that becomes their property will be switched to Ed um if the zone line is changed if it isn't changed it's technically a split lot it's a split lot then but that's also not the big biggest problem because the area the size of the area and the location of the area is pretty remote MH um excuse me if I be labor as subject um is there is there an opportunity put a condition on this subject to D and lsrp acceptance of not really I mean that's to the approval if we that's not it's not in our jurisdiction uh it's the Township's land and concern anyway so I don't I don't think we need to be involved in that they have to do what they have to do Township has to do what it has to do what about the other party I don't think they're subject to it because they're not in the area of concern but whatever the township has to do Mike it will do that's what that's what this I mean I think I'm trying to you know dive down there's nothing there's nothing that prevents recording of Deeds of minor subdivision in a transaction like this as it relates to what we're dealing with here but it do have an adverse impact of the overall Redevelopment or potential cleanup and redel M of that property if in fact it's not no it has an it has a beneficial impact in it in that the township needs to accomplish this to complete that closure and if that's the case would there be an opportunity to get that clarified or you're saying it issue I'm saying that's the township council's responsibility and it has nothing to do with the planning board's minor subdivision okay any other questions from the theas okay all right let's open up to to the public any members of the public wish to ask any questions of the applicant relative to the application and testimony please raise your right hand do you swear airm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth help you God I do please state your name and spell your last name and state your address Cathy AB Cowen ebb i n k hu y s n uh scutters Road Sparta uh first question what is an OSG Zone this is the first time open space governmental use Zone and generally speaking the land the township uh owns is placed in that zone um because it's public land and the DPW lot is public planned in currently in the OSG Zone uh second question where is the solar field being proposed on this diagram on the I don't have the drawing but there was a Redevelopment plan ordinance that was adopted and generally speaking it's on the um is it Southern yeah lot four yes lot four the land the former Municipal landfill behind the DPW building set far back towards the rail line okay um are there any safety concerns uh with the proximity of the solar field to the rail line um not that I'm aware I would say say no but we're not this is not the site plan or um approval of the solar farm I understand yeah but but generally speaking no and actually closed landfills are promoted by the state of New Jersey as the one of the best locations for solar rays on Bast mounting that's independent of a rail line though doesn't matter they they are surprisingly supportive of I'm just you know Department of energy Department of D the department of environment protection they're all extremely supportive of uh what do you call solar Farms on nonagricultural properties such as Landfill closed properly closed landfills okay and that that's that's part of that redel mment plan that was approved by the governing body a couple of years ago and there should be some documentation about that in the in that Redevelopment plan ordinance what is the meaning of annex in this context it's just a term I'm unfamiliar with in the context of a something that's given from one to the next basically given from one to the next okay um you answered my question that are you asked my question Dean about uh the purpose of the subdivision um and the lot line adjustment uh a couple more um was sustainable way is sustainable way is that considered part of 5.01 the new 5.01 that right no no it will not be the the intent is by the time that the properties are subdivided that the the um part of the land swap the annexation the land swap um in the lot line adjustment that sustainable way should have been vacated by then and it would be I'm so yes it is part of it will be part of 51 it will be part of 5.01 okay but if it's vacated it won't exist anymore because it's a paper road so if the or if the C the board will condition this approval upon sustainable way being vacated by ordinance the board doesn't do that the council does assuming the council adopts the ordinance vacating uh sustainable way the land uh that is where sustainable way is is a is on paper uh reverts to the property owner the and after this subdivision it will become part of lot 501 after the vacation and after the which before the minor subdivision and then the minor subdivision and the recording of the needs of minor subdivision it will it will not exist as of the vacation ordinance sustainable way will not exist and the conveyance of the land after that from the township to East Coast development will result in that section of land becoming part of the East Coast development lot okay so with a a paper lot I understand the idea eventually is perhaps to place a road there um and with sustainable way being part of the township uh owned property I would assume that in the future the idea was to put a a road there um and looking at you know um Lots five and four it looks like with that um um intention being removed that lot five looks to be landlocked is that the case how else would egress and uh Ingress happened to Lot 5.01 without that paper Road turning into an actual Road or is that the intention all three lots will have Frontage on Price's Lane just in Price's Lane yes and then what was the purpose of the paper lot in the first place would it be to get behind the paper Road suable way right yes again so so that is not portrayed on this plan um sustainable way was was part of the public road that was created from the 2009 subdivision off of it in this this um bump out here there was a private road that was owned by the applicant and would have been maintained by the applicant that stemmed off in this direction and then that gave access to it to the lots that were created ated at the time in the back of the property so they would they they were not landlocked because they had access via that private right away and that still exists no so my original question then is how would you get to 5.01 lot without Price's Lane how Price's Lane is on the other side right I mean how do you get to the back the driveway accessing from Price's Lane you could develop theoretically theoretically a building could be constructed proposed and constructed anywhere in this area with a driveway that would connect out to Price's Lane okay got it all right I think that's all my questions thank you thank you Ken anybody else from the public okay so seeing none let's bring it back to to the Das anybody like to make a motion and Tom can we get your help on this one uh Janette might have had a question though oh I'm sorry no uh so for board you could consider a motion to approve the minor subdivision um subject to the conditions of uh Dave Simmons is review report and the normal conditions and also subject to the condition that the uh Deeds of minor subdivision be subject to the review and approval of the planning board attorney the township attorney and the and Dave Simmons the boort engineer and his firm for the uh Township as well and the um Deeds of minor subdivision I think we should say that they can be recorded for a period of one year from the date of this resolution to allow time to make sure that the conditions can be met U because one of the conditions will be the condition that the governing body Township Council approve a road vacation ordinance vacating uh the public interest in sustainable way as described here this evening um and I think that was all the conditions that we have the normal conditions so the board recommends that the governing body uh amend the uh zone map line to be contiguous with the uh new lot lines of the DPW lot map oh and to attach a prepare and attach a reduced map to the Deeds of minor subdivision to help explain the U meets and Bounds descriptions is there such a motion I'll make the motion there a second I'll second okay roll call please Deputy Mayor Dean blti yes yes Bill en Jo fman yes Justin canel yeses Luciano yes rad yes Mike Sylvester justtin and chairman Ronde yes all right the motion has passed thank you gentlemen thank you very much thank you have a good evening okay I'm going to suggest a quick uh it's 9:22 break till 9:30 everyone we'll be back at 9:30 and we'll pick up on the agenda from there thank you e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e it's okay okay so let's move on to the uh to the update section uh we'll start with Town Council deputy mayor blti or do you need a minute see okay thanks all right thank you chairman a couple updates from the recent meeting which was April 9th ordinance 243 passed which was an ordinance that amended part of our housing code to align more with the um the state's language and their framework secondly those of you who watched we had another uh lengthy and robust discussion on short-term rentals uh with lots of valuable public input it was uh tabled for now to determine if any further modifications are desirable so expect to see that back at some point soon third the municipal budget was formally introduced there will be a workshop uh a public Workshop prior to our next council meeting which is April 23rd uh the workshop is planned for I understand 5:00 p.m. and the council meeting will then be at 7 pm. and the final hearing then for the budget approval would then be uh my understanding is most likely May 14th and uh fourth just I want to repeat again congratulations to our new mayor's design sitting next to me Joan Ferman thank you welcome that concludes my update welcome okay thanks thank you thank you uh so miss dumbar is not here for environmental commission tonight um in terms of the the master plan subcommittee uh ordinance subcommittee and the plan endorsements I have no updates for tonight uh Bill any updates on the minor sight plan yeah so we met tonight um and we didn't take any action because Miss Dunbar was not available and uh our our newest member was our her first meeting but we we did Come Away with some really positive changes that we're going to start to implement um heard some of the concerns about not concerns but some of suggestions from the public and uh in the past we the minor site plan subcommittee submitted two sets of minutes uh every six months and what we're going to decide to do is give an update uh and on the advice of counsel I have to put this in there if an action is taken um once a month so if we meet today then those minutes should be uh added to the planning board's minutes in May and uh Risha and and Miss Fox always do an incredible job of of helping us and and keeping us uh organized and and we look forward to uh an update on the next session okay thank you all right before we moved open to the public it was just pointing out to me that I missed the section of other board business um so we've got a a draft propos ordinance relating to park and standards um people are probably will recall that we've discussed this at at a few of our previous meetings and you know with each meeting there was in the discussion there were questions and comments that uh we needed to to go back and and look at so we believe we're at a point where all the comments have been considered um and we'll run through those tonight so with with that I'd like to turn it over to Katherine Samar Miss Samar who will walk us through the changes um we'll go from there thank you thank you Ron um so I believe I was not at the last meeting on the presentation uh providing the overview like as Ron mentioned uh I think this is probably maybe the fourth meeting we're discussing this um and initially it started um as an effort to look at the parking standards because um currently the the section on parking does not um really elaborate on on many uses and um but in one specific case um pretty much for for recreational uses there's incredibly specific category of dance studios and karate that basically captures all Fitness and Recreation uses um and so um and looking that at that initially I think uh when it was presented that's right now it's existing as a one space per 100 square fet which is fairly restrictive um there was thoughts to maybe potentially um making that stand more flexible and as we got deeper and deeper into it we kind of untangled some other issues with that and tried to um kind of address everything we could um and be as comprehensive as possible and so the um I believe the Dory provided yes a draft ordinance there's there's two versions there's a Redline version which um I've always found very difficult to kind of untease but just to see kind of the difference in uh how this is evolved from the last iteration to um the present kind of clean version which is a little bit easier to read um but you can't see kind of the evolution along the way and so um the taking the comments from the last meeting and all the feedback back um Ron had shared a pretty extensive list of some of the comments that were um provided at the last meeting the definitions were all modified um specifically um the indoor commercial recreation definition was pretty much included to not elaborate on specific specific sporting activities as a means to not hone in on something and then maybe miss something so to be more broad basically the definition did not um and this is a brand new definition this doesn't exist in the code today so I'll make that more clear um so as discussed at the last meeting there's kind of three broad categories that we looked at recreational uses that don't exist in the code today there's no definitions for despite showing up in some permitted uses health clubs Fitness indoor Recreation there's no definitions for those and so that's kind of where these came in we said we need definitions to Define what these different kind of uses are then we can create parking standards associated with these different kinds of uses and so the three broad categories were indoor commercial recreation generally larger indoor facilities pools courts Fields uh that are all indoor indoor commercial recreation health clubs kind of like your typical gym uh a fitness facility of some sort uh and then Fitness Studios which is more of like a boutique fit Fitness use uh think of a Zumba class a yoga studio um what else I'm trying to think of like a just a smaller kind of like one or two Class Type facility in that case for the definition for fitness studio uh we did elaborate because it is different from a gym and we wanted to kind of show that it's a smaller use included some some examples but not an exhaustive list by any means um and so all of the definitions have been updated even the kind of the terms so that they didn't get confused were updated so initially it was just commercial recreation now it's indoor commercial Rec or proposed to be indoor commercial recreation initially it was Health Andor Fitness club to try and it was trying to meld what was initially already in the permitted uses that's just health club now Health Fitness or Recreation Studio has been amended to be just a fitness studio so they all have kind of distinct words utilized so they don't get confused and Catherine if I can there too one one distinction with the fitness studio is that it's related to offering instructor or Coach side Fitness classes right correct so it's supposed to be like a like a a class-based um type of uh Fitness setup whereas like a a gym might have those in included but it's part of a larger picture it's part of a larger production whereas a fitness Studios is just supposed to be there's an instructor leading a class you see a lot of different kinds of them um but this is supposed to be more Boutique smaller than a than a full gym that might have classes offered as part of a membership so in addition to those definitions and I'll get into how those relate into some other sections deeper than just adding definitions we looked at adding different parking standards for each of them uh for for indoor commercial recreation the requirement is one parking space per 750 ft of gross floor area for athletic activities plus one parking space per 75 S ft of gross area for spectator viewing or gathering areas outside the athletic space and regardless of anything regardless of the size of the facility regardless of the size of The Spectator area you have to have 50 spaces and that's intended to protect that these uses can be a little bit you know they can have varying uh degrees of um visitors based on if there's a lot of kids there's a lot of um there's a basketball league whatever and then where tournament play so if the if a tournament's anticipated you have to have additional spaces on top of those so it's intended to have some some different variations of uh intensity captured and that's for the for the requirement on parking the next standard that was added was for health club clubs again would be like your typical gym one space per 100 square ft which is keeping in line with what exists there today for the karate and Dan Studios it's required at 1 per 100 there's no difference it's 1 per 100 for gyms um for Fitness Studios um it was kind of broken into two categories Fitness studios in some of the larger zones um that may want to occupy like uh an existing building like a flex space building so they would be if it's independent uh it's just they're they're utilizing an entire building on their own one parking space per 200 square ft so there's a little bit more flexibility from what exists there today uh versus the one per 100 but if they are sharing the uses on a site um so if it's a mixed use site or there's multiple tenants they're back to the 1 per 100 again to protect the parking to ensure there's enough parking especially when there's accumulation of uses um in all other zones outside Ed pdrm 1 and pdrm 2 zones it's 1 for 100 and that's to protect if there's any of these Fitness studios in in strip mall shopping centers in the Town Center Zone we don't want any parking issues uh so it's just one for 100 it's not really changing the I'll tie into how the definitions and the parking standards all matter to the existing Zone then I'll get back towards pervious coverage after that um so as I mentioned before there are a handful of of zones which currently permit similar uses but in in different name so um like the Town Center professional business Zone allows for um indoor commercial recreation or commerci indoor Recreation uh health clubs and then also kind of elaborates and says indoor Athletics like basketball and um here I'll read the section if you give me one second it allows for health and indoor athletic facilities in the tcpb zone um and so in order to kind of match the def the way the wording the verbiage is in the definitions now it would be indoor commercial recreation and health clubs to just capture that it's similar so there's no question about where it relates to as far as a definition cuz we're adding it for that purpose that was also done for the Ed uh Zone that was also done um for the ed1 Zone um and the ed1 Zone it does not affect there's a specific standard as a conditional use in the ed1 zone that has its own parking standard so it's only affecting it in in name only it's not changing anything about the standards in the ed1 zone it's literally just making sure that the actual terms used are now consistent throughout the entire ordinance because currently there's all floating around throughout different zones there's indoor Recreation there's health clubs there's um what's the other one Health Club and give me one second there's there's a whole slew of different terms and they don't match again with any definition or any parking standard so this is just to create consistency so that you see at the tail end of the of the um draft ordinance um or proposed ordinance that they're they're just intended to kind of clean that up Ron and I had a conversation earlier and this was a really good point um presently as it was submitted to the board um there there were I guess um I guess it's more more open in some of the zones like in the pdm1 zone it it pretty much allows for all three of the uses and so instead right now for the P arm1 Zone um or for the Ed Zone under four under Section seven of the ordinance on page three right now it just says indoor commercial recreation but it really should say indoor commercial recreation health clubs and uh Fitness Studios so it would allow for all three in addition The pdm1 Zone and prm2 Zone under the plan development schemes that are required in those do have permitted uses so it's part of a again a larger plan development but they do have permitted use in there so Ron pointed those out as well so we should add those in very very similar to the Ed Zone uh change it would just say you know this section should be replaced to show these terms just to update them in with consistency I wanted to talk um briefly with one more comment about the [Music] um the indoor commercial recreation and the parking standard because it the one per 750 may appear to be much different than what exists there today with the one per 100 but um I just wanted to put into perspect perspective and I shared this with Ron because he had raised the same question to me but um 50 spaces so a minimum of 50 spaces that's required regardless relates to about 37,000 Square ft uh so if you have a building that's less than 37,000 ft let's say it's 10,000 it still requires a 50 space minimum so even though it is 1 7 50 it still has a threshold you have to meet regardless of the size um and so just to put into perspective a full siiz football fields 57,000 58,000 Square ft so uh a building that would be you know requiring a a football field would require 76 spaces so if they had a full indoor football field you know multitude of different sports they'd still require 76 spaces just for the field alone if they have any benches or you know uh stands on the side if they have uh kind of like a breakout area if they have offices things like that those would all accumulate an additional parking standard requirement um in addition to just the the athletic fields if tournaments if they want to have an indoor you know winter football league with tournaments also would require more spaces so there are protective measures that would capture that um and I think uh I just wanted to explain kind of the the the Genesis of that and all the kind of parking standards layers there um the last thing was um I know Dean had brought up kind of at the beginning of talking about parking talking about coverage um and talking about the option for pervious pavement uh we kind of discussed some of the potential pitfalls of that that if someone used pervious payment they might still try and have per impervious coverage elsewhere to capture basically what they're allowed under the zone and so as it's drafted right now so under the parking requirements parking design requirements and the ordinance right now all off street parking areas other than Agriculture and residential parking areas have to be paid with pinous concrete so impervious coverage 2 in thick a stable Bas of soil Aggregate and compacted and it has that's how it has to be approved now so I added a sentence after that that offers kind of an exception uh that the planning board may an approve prove an exception to the above subject to approval by the town engineer so there's some coverage there they still have uh da would still have oversight and the town engineer would still have oversight and the Fire official to allow for alternatives to traditional Pavements way may include pervious asphalt pervious concrete perious interlocking papers and plastic grid papers the intention with that would be we don't have to the planning board would have complete purview over that and the planning board would then get to say you're trying to exchange perious coverage in your parking area to get impervious coverage elsewhere and not allow it so we're not we don't have to complicate the ordinance and say you can only do up to 10% it does or does not count towards your improved or your impervious law coverage we don't have to have the discussion I basically left it that if someone wants to offer that and hopefully like in good faith that they want to do it for sustainability purposes and to be you know environmentally friendly that they'd offer that and the planning board basically has has the opportunity to either say yes or no and the Fire official and the tan engineer way in and say you know you can't offer that for your fire lanane the fire trucks won't be able to be mobile we're afraid of the truck sinking in the you know uh if there's an emergency or anything like that so there's some again layers of protection there that the board will have kind of oversight on it but then there's other bodies that you know could review it and also say they agree or disagree but we didn't have to pull in kind of any of the pitfalls of of impervious coverage calculations as far as the bulk standards running in the zones so this is just a way to be sustainable to be en environmentally friendly give an allowance and alternative but also have some some perview over it as well um I just talked a lot and I don't have any visual aids to add to that so it probably didn't help much and late so uh I'll leave it at that I absolutely will answer any questions um that the board may have I hope I responded to a lot of the comments uh I really did read through and took a lot of them into consideration and tried to incorporate as many as I could okay so with that let me open it up to the boards for uh anybody have any questions or comments or concerns okay just um one question it's not part of the the changes but on page two in the industrial piece for heavy heavy manufacturing we've got in parentheses whichever is greater um can you just maybe you might have explained it previously but explain why it's we have that catch but for the that category but not maybe the other one or the other two um ones under industrial what's the difference between heavy manufacturing where we want to add that stipulation so I actually don't let me check to see if our ordinance has um and that wasn't part of kind of the the like like you mentioned the the the changes here but I'll try my best to um to answer that I don't even know if we establish that um as part of the code so I just need to double check the definitions to see how they're differentiated um it's likely differentiated just by the zones that per permit it I have to imagine [Music] um but that wasn't something that we well not something we looked at change here no we were looking specifically at like recreational and yeah that wasn't a change I was just curious when I saw that I don't know if that maybe it's something we think about applying to the other two and but I you know it's probably the level of intensity of number of employees that heavy Manu this is what I imagine just from you know experience with different uses I have to imagine heavy manufacturing probably had might have some more employees on site and so at some point it was included that there could be a potential manufacturing are usually larger buildings um and so maybe the employee count was something that was driving parking issues in heavy manufacturing and so it was included that maybe it's not the square footage necessarily let's just Cho whatever one's greater will protect us so that's why it's in there that's uh that's just an assumption okay but yeah anything else that's that's it for me thanks Mike I I have some questions so um uh Katherine the first question I have a few of these are minor and then I do have one I want to dig into a little bit uh page two this is the minor one on the table under indoor commercial recreation um it doesn't mention office or admin space should it or are we okay with leaving it out so if there was an office I think there's a provision in our code that basically says if there was a m m multi-uses that the parking count will be cumulative so office already has its own requirement for 1 per 200 and the commercial section above that the beginning of the table so if there was office it would be uh required to be at 1 for2 200 additional office space I'm thinking more of admin or office space within commercial Rec it would be pursuant to the to the office C category yeah so like a staff area or front desk area that would be okay okay so that's fine um okay page three so couple quick ones right at the top section five number five it references set forth in subsection 18- 4.7 what exactly is that so it's the section right below it actually uh so under Section Five that's basically just the list of conditional uses in the ed1 zone so right now the list of conditional uses in the ed1 zone I'll pull it up real quick um the conditional uses right now permit health clubs Andor fitness center subject to the conditions set for in 18- 4.7 18 -4.7 is the collective section of the code that has all the different conditional uses and all the conditions pursu into each use um specifically The ed1 Zone in 4.7 give me one second The ed1 Zone requires what you see underneath in section six requ Ires that it has to be intended to serve at least in part the other principal permitted uses in the ed1 zone that it has to be located within buildings used for other principal communes the portion of the building devoted to that use shall be architecturally similar and integrated with other principal permitted uses within the ind1 the parking for the health club and fitness studio should have one parking space for each 100 ft of florid air for assembly Halls Fitness rooms and pools tennis courts handball courts shall have four parking spaces per court and there shall be one space for each employee on duty at the center so those are the conditions that the section you just asked about are set forth in for the ed1 Zone specifically which is what I mentioned before that the parking standards don't affect the ed1 Zone be for health uses because they already have their own conditions that set set them forth okay and we're not looking to re refine those conditions no they're match they're incredibly specific so um we're going to leave them okay as they are so that leads me to my next question was when I when I read again page three section six number 16 that A and B those big sections there when I read those to me my questions are what is the reasoning of phrases like serving other principal permitted uses and also why are we requiring multi-use buildings so Tom may have a better I'm not trying to put him on the spot either the ed1 I think this relates to the if you remember ed1 zone is by sparter Medical Campus at um Route 15 and um Primrose Lane I think and the ed1 Zone uh the concept it's actually a very fascinating Zone in that it the office complex uh provides the internal provided the internal subsidy to subsidize affordable housing in the prim L's Lane development so that it's called a um inclusionary zoning pre round two where you could or theoretically you can still do it but you could allow the Commerce or op or offices to sub internally subsidize the affordable housing and thereby reduce the number of Market housing units required so it's so I believe leave the concept in this that that Frontage which has the Medical Arts Building in it had the potential of having a um fitness center I don't believe that it was ever made into a fitness center um but there are similar things like doctor's offices with I think there's Kesler physical therapy in one of the buildings and the I think the concept was integrated into the building complex don't have a standalone uh fitness health club um but you know I can't say that I remember a particular person trying to do a health club but um so and that's that's sort of that zone it's kind of the ed1 is a kind of unique Zone it's similar has some similarity to the Ed Zone but is unique and to itself because of that that concept that the offices in the front are internally subsidizing the affordable units in the rear okay and that to get built and it's you know there's an addition being done soon I guess or was approved but basically uh don't think there's a lot of vacant land left but it could be maybe Katherine we could check that you know you you could change that if you wanted to I mean but like Katherine said it has a very specific set of Standards yeah it's it's not just the economic The ed1 Zone it doesn't include the other kind of acronym it is a low and moderate cost housing Zone as well so Tom's exactly right so there's some kind of like subsidy share there um and it also allows for like hotels motels as well so sometimes you'll see Provisions about needing to be related to the principal use because maybe the hotel would have a gym or something like that that's what I've seen in like other ordinances so um it it it was specifically crafted for this Zone and it shows up in the conditional uses for that reason with those very specific requirements so um I like Tom said the the affordable housing portion and some of the frontage has already been developed so I don't know um if that's going to change much functionally this ordinance isn't revising any of that it's just changing the terms from uh what does it show right now uh the terms are health clubs and/or fitness center subject to the conditions and we're basically just changing it to health clubs Andor Fitness Studios so that's the only change in just the word it's just to Studio sounds like yeah pretty much Fitness Studio is the only difference yeah okay everything else is is is there yeah in the in letter B it starts with the health center is is that okay or do we want to change that as well let me look at the condition just to make sure okay it says the health club Andor fitness center so it probably should be the health club CL or Fitness Studio which I got tripped up I guess CU they're very similar a little bit different so I'll make that I'll make that um change as well okay thank you great I'm also by the way I'm a big fan of the new definitions that the way they came out looks it's great yeah much clearer okay I guess that you bear with me for a minute because I have I was not present at the um discussion previous ly and so I have my own questions um first one I'd like to ask is a legal one um for instance I noticed that um let's just take retail one per 200 square feet of gross leasable space New Jersey administrative code is one per 300 square feet so all the way through here it seems that the majority um Sparta is a little more strict in that regard um so we can become stricter but can we go below what the New Jersey Administrative Code States um AB in in non-residential uh actually the state code does not reg for non-residential commercial retail uh is not in any way uh applicable to municipalities it it it they do not preempt U Municipal they don't even regulate in residential all residential this I don't think anything here is residential all residential is preempted by the state by the residential site Improvement standards so the New Jersey Administrative Code that you're referring to is not preemptive if it's about retail it must be some sort of state standard that they use for state agencies or something like that well I just picked that one up for example I mean even the health Club one one parking space for um 1,000 um for 100 per per 100 the townships the town State the township can be much more strict than state but the state doesn't even um I guess I mean I could be wrong you could we could research it but New Jersey Administrative Code does not preempt Municipal standards as to non-residential parking then what is the point of the administ you're you're you're reading the casino Control Commission development 19- 19 Co um 1966 5.8 on-site parking loading requirements that's related to the uh roading loading requirements for Casino reinvestment Development Authority tourism District Land Development rules under sub chapter 5 so those are very very hyp specific requirements that relate to a different development um not applicable here they they do regulate them I guess in reinvestment areas and things like that that probably required some sort of referendum or something but not in Sparta okay to follow up on what Justin was saying then because I you know when I looked at it was very unclear um because there's really not that much difference between light manufacturing and heavy manufacturing other than the type of product that they manufacture so for one to be um whatever is greater and the other and one not there's a disparity there and there's a huge disparity if you're looking at employees versus square feet um but in looking at everything else and and the code that I was looking at um we are more stringent in each area except for this one section on Industrial and again there's a huge disparity and I think it should be um just based on the square footage like the code is saying the code for General warehousing and again I understand now that it's something different but is saying that um there should be one space for each 500 square feet of floor area and I would just like to see this really cleaned up so that there is no ambiguity and it's um based on you know some kind of standard that is out there but not one employee for 500 square feet for light manufacturing but a completely different standard for heavy and pulling all of the warehouse and Industrial into one so you know again I know it's different than you've talked about all the other stuff but this is something that really sticks out at me and I think if we're going to send this forward it has to be um understandable concise and fit in understood and um the purview of this again was simply to look at the parking standards for recreational uses and the definitions we are in the middle of a master plan right now and so I I will be you know taking notes on these comments as well for when we are looking at the over land use element and the parking standards and how they relate to um the different uses outside of this because um again we spent a good amount of time looking through simply just the recreational uses if we open up um right now if we open up all of this to the entire table and the table was only included to show what we have and then show the changes within it not necessarily to open up uh the entire kind of parking ordinance but we can look at these that's what this is these are all for parking ordinances and um I would hate to send it to the Town Council Without Really addressing all of the issues I think when we send it it should be a complete packet that we've all looked at and voted on no no I don't disagree with that I I think I mean to clarify that when we if if we do recommend this to council that we tell them that the the confines of which what was being looked at what was being analyzed in the past four or five months on this um and also share that we have more thoughts about parking standards not being adequate or needing to be changed as part of the larger master plan which is being done in the next year um to make those changes more comprehensively as we look at the land use in totality because they're probably our parking standards were definitely going to change where's probably ones we're going to add as far as like new and different uses there's probably definitions we might make recommendations to add and so when there's a more comprehensive look at the entire land use code you uses land use in general all the zones and the parking as it relates to those um that's when I think we'll probably make those recommendations one thought if I can add to that too is is you know the the concern is again which which it it this did start out as just recreational uses um and and we we we then expanded that to impervious coverages um and it doesn't say we can't go further but if we try to do everything now um my fear is it's just going to take too long we got a lot of stuff in front of us my recommendation would be because I hear both of the comments is that let's keep that in the back burner and let's address that as a separate update we can we once this is updated we can come back and update it again um but but we have to we have to go back and look at the definitions of the light industrial manufacturing that kind of stuff make sure we do it right and so I'd like people to consider just you know this is what we have now is this something that addresses the concern which was a specific use which was indoor recreational uses um and the thought process was our standards were more severe than other towns and we could be losing some businesses to those other towns so we're trying to be more competitive in along those those lines well actually your standards are as I said more stringent in those areas um could you give me a timetable for this then can we bring it up now and agree to look into it as this goes forward I I could not do that that's something we'd have to do with with with the board as a whole if somebody wanted to make a a recommendation to do that um then we could you know we could look at you know do we need a a subcommittee how would we do that um I don't think you need a whole committee I would make a recommendation um a v to vote um a motion to vote that uh we address the industrial parking square footage irregularities um the the part that had me concerned was the time frame no so you've got we have if we can do this one today but that we address this one um by the next meeting come back just to kind of um you know to expand on Katherine's point we are looking at all of this right just to kind of catch you up to where where we've been you know um within the confines of what we're doing right now with the master plan subcommittee we're going to be looking at every single one of these areas every single one of these and we're going to be doing a very deep dive into that now is that going to be tomorrow no it's not is it going to be before next meeting no it's not but it is going to be within the confines of what we're doing with the master plan um I don't know whether or not especially given our limited resources right now with how with how we have to move forward whether or not we're going to be able to parse this out and do a deep dive on that and then have to do a deep dive on it again when it comes to time to look at it with the master plan it might be beneficial for us to just kind of follow the master plan you know uh outline and and where we hit it we hit it was the master plan changing anything else or is it just looking new things it's looking at everything it's looking at everything from the I mean the last time our master plan was done was in 1984 so we're we're really we're really hitting it from the ground up okay okay any other questions or or comments I have one question it's more uh just for my own information we removed uh the rehab and PT uh from this uh from Health uh centers or health clubs where is that and what's the standard do we do you know we don't have um we don't have a a definition for rehab or physical therapy and we don't have a parking standard it would likely show up as um like a professional office likely um so it probably fall under that standard currently but this the this specifically excludes it so that if a if a if a rehab or physical therapy uh use came in with an application and applied to the zoning officer there'd be no question from the zoning officer to say oh this might be a health club use they're going to say no it's not a health club use it's some sort of professional office or whatever um and so it wouldn't it wouldn't fall under this category okay all right thank you quick question bouncing around Tom is this these are recommendations that we're we're proposing for your what Your Council consider or approve right adopt yes you're you're what you're doing is you're considering recommending a ordinance Amendment uh to the the township Council okay and they do they open that for a public comment period right yes yes govern the governing body would have to if it decided to do it it would have to introduce it and then schedule it for second reading and public hearing and then have a public hearing and then if it wanted to adopt it vote to adopt it as a law or ordinance of Sparta any other questions in the Das there okay um let's open up to the public for comments any any member from the public wishes to have any questions or comments on this ordinance Okay so none it sounds like that we've got something here needs a couple changes where we're going to add a couple zones uh a couple uses within uh Ed uh pm1 pm2 correct and the other change was uh there's it we're going to correct the uh the wording undering from Health CER to health club on 16b Section six on page three and then um I had already drafted it but I under each of the sections where it says section 18-24 Point whatever I put the name of the Zone next to it so that you don't have to go search back or if questions come up if it's introduced to council that they're what zone is this related to what is this changing so I just added in you know section 18- 4.28 of the Town Center Prof professional business zone so it's in there in the terms again it's just it's just for clarity so no one has to go back and reference it um so if we were to put this to a vote tonight I think we'd have to come up with a specific list and and Tom help me if I'm wrong of it would be this ordinance with these changes is what we would be recommending very specifically otherwise we'd have to reprint it and and you know take a look at it again so the question is I think we've G we've got like three or four changes so if we could find a way to amend this this document easily tonight that would be a good answer unless people would would prefer to see it all do you want me to read it out what time do you want me to say it out loud Ron would that make it easier maybe people can consider the way I'm saying it and if that's they're let's let's just let's just do that and that way we we're all clear on what it is that we're being asked to vote on okay so I'll go through all the changes that um I noted so under Section four on page two um the section title is revised to say section 18- 4.28 Point b.1 item F of and then the the words of the Town Center professional business zone tcpb is replacement its entire as follows um so all we're doing is we're just naming the town naming the Zone Z so I'm just adding The Zone and for the future I'll say that for each of them that we're just adding the name of the zone and the in the title um um under under section four there next to F it's currently says indoor commercial recreation and we're just adding the words and health clubs to be more consistent with the exists there today under Section Five we are adding the title of the Zone next to the 18- 4.30 for the ed1 Zone um under Section six under item 16b the word Center is replaced with the word club uh just a typo um under Section make sure I'm right under Section 7 the title of the Zone The Ed zone is added there and then under the item there number six next to what exists as an IND indoor commercial recreation we're just adding the words health club and fitness Studios again to be more consistent with what's there today what's allowed and then two new sections Section 8 and section n are filled in are added in there just to add in um section 18- 4.35 pointb point3 so the pdm1 zone is basically replacing the language that exists there today under number five of The Zone and section and section 9 will'll read section 18- 4.36 of the PDM 2 zoners replaced and then also adds in indoor commercial recreation health clubs and fitness Studios just to replace the terms that are there today so that that sounds like a lot more changes than what I what I thought so it's it sounds like a lot more it's just adding I want people to be clear you know when we ask you to vote on it what is it what's the exact wording so you know due to the number of changes I I was really hoping to to try to move this forward tonight but I want to make sure everyone's clear and comfortable so I you know I recommend that we just again let's come back with a clean copy um I think we've all we all understand and the changes um and I want to go to the public for their comments before we close in this but um why don't we did so let me open up to the public do you have any comments or anything okay I I understand I understand it but I want to make sure that people are clear on what it is they're voting for we want to ask okay can we ask anybody okay is anyone unclear on the changes that we're making I don't feel like they're very significant can't changes I I feel like I understand them I mean I would be okay with going I would State the purpose and intent of this entire exercise because it's done a deep dive and the original intent of what we were trying to do here again I just restated for a record and and I think we're good I I think we're clean enough to put it to vote I think a lot of a lot of what we've been hearing lately in these last naming changes are really just to ensure consistency you know there sections of other right so all right if everyone's comfortable then let's let's go forward with it that's good to hear need a motion yes so it's a motion to uh recommend the U proposed ordinance to the governing body with the changes uh as described by Katherine uh this evening is there such a motion I'll make a motion I'll second and roll call any comments yes yes Vice chairman Bill enr yes Joan Ferman no due to the confusion in the wording in some of it Justin canel yes Le Luciano yes Bernie R yes Mike Sylvester yes chairman Ronde yes okay so motions passed and we'll we'll I guess The Next Step Tom is we draft an ordinance to pass up to the final the final version should be final version pass to Town Council for introduction right great okay thanks okay so that takes care of that the only other uh matter of other business we can probably handle this outside is is just scheduling I think we had two applications that we need to schedule of that are are complete um and we could probably just do that maybe the with with a few of us tomorrow unless unless with because right now I I guess we got to see what we're doing with with the other applications first in terms of um the dates for um Diamond ship and then we can schedule the other so what while hand we put that one aside for now and then and then we can uh schedule them separately okay all right so other than that let me get back to my agenda here okay so now let's open up to the public for comments on matters that are not on the agenda or matters not related to a hearing on an application for development are there any members of the public that wish to speak hi Margie Murphy Pueblo Parkway Barda New Jersey um as I understand that many members of you are not allowed to vote and when anything comes to Diamond chip whether you can respond to me or not um I understand are we getting enough people to I fill out everybody that yes Margie um uh the the the planning board will be able to meet um on May 1st 2024 for a public hearing on the diamond chip application with at least one and perhaps two members of the zoning board serving as temporary assigns assignments from the zoning board to fill the seats left open by one or two um recused seats Oh I thought there were more recused seats well um Mr Miss Joan Ferman was appointed to S fit this fill the seat of uh Nick compilo right and there's a chance that the council will consider someone on the 23rd in which case there would be one empty seat uh which Ken Larry the most senior member of the zoning board is available to serve if there's a need for two there's and the second most senior member of the Zoning Board in accordance with the statute and if there's a need for three there's a third most senior member of the zoning board available as well one of them has a conflict that night so if we need two we'll have to use the third for that particular night um my concern is that the people that are not recused um Mr sylvestri who already voted against hearing Mr Dash and and Mr Clark originally would be part of that and M Mar if you're going to now focus on some sort of objection or something you really can't do that in this meeting because that's not about this is not the diamond chip application at all right I was just trying to give you the the schedule in response to your question about will the uh re will the board be able to meet and the answer is yes uh if you have an objection to the board on in that hearing you have to raise it in that hearing in that hearing to the people that are being elected or or ask as to be on the planning board I mean that are being asked to uh to vote if you have an objection to the board in the that relates to the diamond chip application you will have to raise that in the hearing on the diamond chip application which is expected to start on May 1st 2024 at 700 p.m. or any meetings thereafter so I'm asking you now to focus stop talking about Diamond CHIP app uh okay so I can't ask why we didn't appeal the decision that they made to take all these people off and I can't ask you can ask whatever you want but we're but you can't answer me I can't answer you about pending litigation right okay and I know I mean you and Miss Samad helped design the ordinance so that isn't actually correct ma'am but if you would like to make objections in the hearing the only I can do it that's right because that is not what we're doing tonight are we taking any other applications for people to be on the zoning board to fill in any of the people that are being recused or no it's being filled by the zoning board members I'm not aware of taking applications for the zoning board I am aware that the governing body is considering uh appointing someone to fill the shoes and seat of Ryan Caruso who resigned and if they do that they could do that on April 23rd um April 23rd that's right I think that's the next meeting of the governing body yes okay okay okay thank you interesting all right thank you any other members from the public okay sorry Jenny Derek tap into Sparta um thank you for your consideration Mr Enright and Mr day about adding back reporting out on the sub subcommittee um the site plan subcommittee I appreciate that Dory I appreciate getting the minutes working on minutes I've been pleading the case that they need to do something more you need more help because you're never going to catch up this meeting keeps coming so I'm going to keep making that plea we are severely um out of date with our minutes and it's not because Dory isn't doing her job um I appreciate Joan your your input and you already seem to be looking to do the work so I appreciate that um 2221 is the ordinance that was adopted in 2022 December to uh update um Ed pdm1 pdm2 as you remember you did the work appreciate that um but it's not reflected when you look up ecode it's not reflected there the changes so just confirming and I'm sure this has already been done by the professionals just confirming that the Nicholson resoning hearing that happened over here was used was based on the stand standards developed in the new ordinance for that Ed zone so the I don't think the bulk standards um that they were they were requesting as part of the minor subdivision was that the minor subdivision was you're referring to yes when they submit a site plan they will be subject to the new Ed they they referred frequently to the reason for the size of the new lots that they were were creating as referencing the the bulk standard requirements they're subject yes they're subject by time of application to that ordinance because the the minor site plan the lot line moves that they were making they said they kept referring to the the reason the rationale for making those changes were to be in in to be combat compatible with the bulk standards for the Ed Zone and I'm just confirming I'm sure it's already been confirmed but since the new the newest iteration of the edzone requirements are not available on ecode I'm sure that's just a for the Public's that's just the Public's problem but I just want to make sure it is just the Public's problem that's all no I understand your question because I have I mean I have the same frustration I use the ecode all the time so or wait we're waiting for it to go it's it's in the works um but let me double check and make sure I'm sure they did but I I will make I will make certain of it and let you know Nicholson would appreciate it too thank you thanks Jenny okay anybody else on the public okay so seeing none um we're going to move into our our executive session um to talk about the diamond ship um Diamond ship LLC versus SP the township planning board and a n Dash um yes that that' be a resolution to go into de close their executive session um and a motion and second is needed to it's you have a written resolution but it's to discuss matters of uh pending and anticipated litigation in accordance with Section 7 and8 of the open public meetings Act and the matters of uh Diamond chip Realty versus Sparta planning board and N Dash versus Sparta zoning board at L and clim privilege communication the matter is to be revealed to the public upon the completion of all litigation and appeals and the removal of the need for confidentiality is there such a motion I'll make a motion I'll second roll call please Deputy Mayor Dean blti yes Janette Burke yes Vice chairman Bill enr yes Joan Ferman yes Justin canel yes Celeste Luciano yes Bernie rad yes Mike Sylvester yes yes I want youti e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e do it all right do we have a motion to go back into public session I'll make that motion I'll second uh roll call a deputy May Dean blti yes Janette Burke yes uh Vice chairman Bill enr yes Joan Ferman yes Justin Canal yes Le Luciano yes Ernest ride yes Mester yes chairman Ron day yes I'll make go okay for okay thank you thanks Mike was anybody out there his wall and he'll be back he left [Laughter] wallet probably oh yeah the name she's dedicated oh you it's j I think we're um live yeah yes she is here yes she is thanks for staying J sorry to keep you Jen so if the board would entertain it's a motion to confirm that although the board is disappointed with the by the Court's decision uh and respectfully disagrees with the Court's decision the board uh thinks and concludes that it's in the best interest of the township of Sparta to move on and to let the board hear the case uh with the members uh with the five members uh and perhaps an alternate uh in accordance with the order by May on May 1st 2024 and to confirm that the board will comply with the order and will not be seeking reconsideration and will not be appealing is there such a motion I'll make a motion I'll second May or impl yes n Burke yes Vice chairman vill enr yes Joan Ferman yes Justin Canalis yes celest Luciano yes Ernie rad yes Mike Sylvester yes chairman R yes okay motion has passed so with that I think we've covered everything we need to do tonight so um unless everybody has any other thoughts You' like to contribute may I have a motion to adjourn motion to adjourn second second all in favor say I