If a housing and redevelopment authority to order roll call police Billy. What you're Johnson. I am here. That's 5 present one absent commissioners. Preventive is excused. And number one for discussion is resolution. 25 dash 500 authorizes a grant of 2 70,000 from the Hre Business Assistance Fund, 2 tenants of the Alliance Bank Building have 55 East 5th Street District. 17 more too. Or So I know that we have all been watching kind of what's going on. So I appreciate Director Newton being here today. Just to bring us up to speed on this item. I know that's time sensitive. So I thought it would be really important for staff to be able to hear our present on what this is kind of why it's happening. And then also just provide a little bit of a border point presentation. So sounds like
afternoon will be doing this. I headed back over to you. Thank you, chair. Yes, Daniela and Rachel had been working on this annual that was already scheduled to be out today and major cuts this point. So I'm jumping in just to go through their presentation. It's pretty simple. If you can see it as you know, on MARCH 10th and Madison Equities look notes and the tenant to the Land Bank building that they need to city out within 48 hours. They they not going to be paying for utilities and they were going to be shut off. No, no more security mayor and others from the city were able to work with utility providers to keep the building up until MARCH 31st. But even with that extra time there, 14 tenants in the building and getting them unable to move quickly, finding new space actually physically moving
doing a little, maybe some tenant improvements to get spaces ready and hs a challenge that we've been trying to to to support support. There 14 tenants in the building. Most are small businesses. Most are in the Skyway level. And again, starting that day, our staff in well as from from dsi and from the mayor's office and others have been communicating with all of the tenants to try to connect them with some some new spaces. Many are moving to spaces in downtown that they identify. Some are still looking for space. We would love to keep from downtown possible. We definitely would like to keep them in Saint Paul. But moving costs, unexpected moving costs and expected all of all classic. And was a quick move
in short notice like that. Think that we're trying to help with. What we determined was a business assistance fund is a possible source of funds to help with some of those costs. And you might remember that the business assistance fund with that. It's it's just hra funds that we have over the years set aside to help businesses in different ways and that this body has over the years approved various different guidelines. We like to have some guidelines because can make sure things are kept equitable. But sometimes our guidelines and that thing a little too restrictive and not giving us the flexibility that we need. So continue to have discussions what should we do with specific funding source going forward? But today there's you know, I don't know $150,000, maybe in that
funding for this year has some guidelines around it. There could have currently been adopted that mention, like must be for profit business and it has to be equity. These were these were loans that were the stricken originally conceived to be loans to small businesses that hasn't worked particularly well because after various different reasons, often the businesses come to us at that point when there. Too far for us to to help with alone. So so we're looking at that. In the meantime, 2 days we have that funding source. And what we're looking for is the ability to use up to 77 to help these tenants as they seek new spaces. So some of these guidelines would need to be approved waived in order for this source of funds to be used. The non-profit cast, for-profit business has to be alone. Those kinds of those kinds of guidance. We're looking for a Mexican resort
is up to $5,000 for each of those tenants. They have to have been there. They have to have the using them for using the funding for hiring movers are in to track certain 10 improvements, a building at a nice pace. I know one of the tenets is a Georgia jewelry store and there's very heavy safe like a vault that's going to be expensive t move. And so things like that. So we would be looking for from them letter of intent to release in Saint Paul and and kinds of expenses invoices with those amounts to verify expenses. And then we we want to put timeline on it. So it's not something that drags on for ever. We'd like enlist hail. So we're suggesting everything we need to be sent in by JUNE
30th, if if there aren't tat, if we don't use $70,000, money would just go back into that business assistance. So we're looking for the waiver of these guidelines. We want to make funding eligible to nonprofits. Some of the tenants are nonprofits. Removes the requirement for 10% equity in and then deal and removing the requirements that the funds must be alone the public purpose goals or retaining business isn't all employee since a full supporting commercial activities sporting our downtown and what we'll do next, assuming that approve waiver of the guidelines, his work with city attorney's office to draft French agreements to each of these tenants as needed. We'll communicate the next steps to the tenants create any kinds of materials needed for tracking the use of the
funding. So it's pretty simple. I would say going forward at some point, we probably want work with you all to again looking for Bradley. It. The business assistance and in we could have even at this point just made this in eligible use of the funding that we decided for for now, because it's just such an emergency that we would just come here and ask for a waiver of the current guidelines for this purpose and then we can continue to explore with you if yu need to change the guidelines serving in a more wholesale way going forward. So I'm happy to take any questions. Is time since it, which is why ticket jumped in here to get this to you right away in and try help the tenants as quickly as we can. Turn it. Can you just simply clarify
duration of the waiver? It we mentioned sort of highlighted JUNE 30, a sense period of time. And by then we would think tenants would be able to be moved and have their receipts for whatever those expenses were. if tenants have to move to a space, that is if they're looking for something more substantial in the way of filled out, it MAY take them longer. But for this sort emergency needs that wll move quickly. We still like they should be able to be and have receipts and Biden. Thank Commissioner Johnson has quick question directors. So particularly I know this is a discussion item. So would this be on our council city Council meeting? Are we taking this
action during injury right now, Chair Jones and Commissioner Billie. It's a resolution in your packet today. So you would just be approving that resolution, which would authorize the waivers of those guidelines use of the fence for this purpose. Thank you, too. home. Thank you for that clarification. Any other commissioners have any questions for Director Newton about this item. ok, I'd like to commend my team. They jumped into action that day. I Jimmy and Daniela and Rachel and Crystal Crystal Mansion. The mayor's office and others. Over there to building walking around and talking with people in reassuring them. So I just commend them. Any of them are here today. But but I want to for
I appreciate that notion as To really mention just how quickly I think this isn't for the response has been great. Just to Bt efforts we've trying to get especially with so much of this unpredictability for some of stairs. So I do appreciate that quick action and the attention to the times and city sensitivity of everything. Im pretty supportive of this waiver. I I'm pretty sure commissioner, anything was here today. She would also be very supportive of team that its many businesses and her war that been greatly impacted effective right now. And with that, I will take a motion from Commissioner. Kim to approve all those in favor say Aye. I all posts. If favored 0 Post resolution is adopted. Item.
Number 2 is a staff report 25 dash 43 introduction to housing policy. All right. I want to really bring forth this competition as an opportunity fr us to continue to discuss housing policy and out as it relates nationwide as well. So as here in the Metropolitan area, I know we've been actively looking at different ways here, both at the housing redevelopment Authority, but also in our individual wr's end, even in the city right now around all of the things that are related to just how we're going to address the need for our for housing here in Saint Paul. So I wanted to reach out to possibly can. I definitely think that's really important. I'm thankful a that possibly cause to get a time to come and have an opportunity to share their presentation with us. So at
this time I'll invite to get the presentation today. But also I think as we go through it, I hope that is helpful, but also something that we can in mind when it comes to just policy, transit, housing, development opportunities. In the broader in the broader scope as well. And so as people have questions free to leave your hand, we'll be able to kind of go through that. Action item and this, but it's really just an introduction to. To housing development positive trends that we're even here in the fall that nationwide. Thank you, everyone. And thank you, Jay Johnson and council virtually indication like that, said many Trump won. I and based in the Twin Cities and currently work at a national organization called Policy Link. We're a national research and policy advocacy organization based in Oakland, California, that have staff across the country. And our goal is to advance economic and racial justice. For the
100 million Americans living in poverty. We work across a variety of issue areas. My issue area is housing. And in that scope, we work at the federal, local and state level to support elected officials, but also city governments advocacy organizations in implementing and creating tenant protection laws as well as where protection laws and ordinances. So happy to speak. I'm going just 2. Getting your slides Just want to say thank you for taking the time to even come in and present to the spotty. really excited. And looking forward your presentation. And I know that you took time to even get the presentation up. So thank you so for being here today. It's I think it's voice activated. So for sites will
activate the It's like you have see Yeah, we'll act of her on on the street. Needed. It's not overhead. It's just that. When you had there because I find there were some 71 Usually pops Yeah, I don't know. Thank you. So, actually force activity is really just Kelly Activia time of the screen. Like I said this a little bit poll ceiling. So I have a nest of his own housing trends across the country and in a split into sections. I want to talk about development trends and then of course, policy trends in looking at how state and local governments are reacting and responding to not just affordability crisis in
general that we've been experiencing for for many years. But also this. Specific political and economic moment. So we'll start with these graphs Help us c recent trends of development in the context of a much larger time frame. So hear from the Joint Center for Housing Studies at Harvard they released a study annually called the state of side of the nation's housing. And this is from the 2024 study here. We can see development trend all the way back from 2000 as you can imagine, we saw a large debt both single-family in purple and multifamily in orange construction during the foreclosure crisis. And then we thing been seeing very slow but steady increases in development. For both single and
multifamily intel. About late 2021 early 2022. And next we have this chart from Fannie Mae, which provides mortgage financing for many developers across the country and this is specifically looking at multi-family development, split into apartment and condo construction. And this report came out in 2024 very early in. 24. So if you want in q 4 numbers are at that point. Predictions. But here we see a similar pattern, right? We have. that slow pace of development in the polls for closure crisis. With the gradual but steady increase until we hit late 2021 or early 2022. And that
if we transition from graphs just more more reports from which those scratcher pulled. See the following. So in the Joint Center for Housing Studies report we saw that multifamily Construction starts nationwide. Fell 14% to just under half a million units in 2023. And that decline has only accelerated as I think we have all seen. Not just Saint Paul but in Minnesota and across the country. Multi-family dive, which is. Multi-family real estate news site reported and at the end of FEBRUARY, just last month, 3 quarters of million units were under construction, which is a great number. But that was a 21% year-over-year drop compared to every of 2024. And then Fannie the outlook for 2025. Was that the multifamily
rental market would continue to see softness in demand from both investors and tenants and that there MAY a return to more normalized trends in the 2025. Again, not really sure normalize means right in the context of the last 10 years. The last 20, not quite sure. But links to all those reports are And then lastly cre daily, which focuses on commercial real estate, which is how 5 plus unit buildings are often classified reported negative apartment returns in 2023 that were influenced by high interest rates. We saw that impacting homeowners as well as multifamily developers and rising operating expenses which led to a 37% drop in multi-family housing starts. So the takeaway here is that samples development trends
very much reflect an echo. What the challenge is that folks are facing across the country. It's a very unpredictable full. So she'll pick as a political economic moments and in moments of that type of uncertainty, many actors from prospective home buyers to investors to developers our our cautious meaning business not always booming. So also think we not only pay close attention to what tenants and homeowners are experiencing and the housing market, but also builders and developers. And so I've brought in some industry voices from reports and that that have come out of various Home Builders association's multifamily housing associations. Just give you a sense of of what they are experiencing as well. So for multifamily executive,
we can see here that developers estimate supply chain issues and labor and construction being saying this, quote, specifically its construction delays, supply chain issues and cost increases in costs. And leading to delays in construction. And those have been driven by the commodities market, transportation costs and increased demand. And of course, in more recent months or just the last 2 months. But it feels like much longer the threats of tariffs have made things even more volatile as we consider the types of materials that need to be imported in order to build housing in the United States. Furthermore, we have the National Association of Home Builders, which does annual surveys on what is on the challenges that are facing their members. Here. We see that they report tight lending conditions, a shortage of
skilled labor and the high cost of development loans otherwise known as high interest rates in and terms of the challenges are facing. This survey, it specifically is very eye-opening here. We see. The Red Bar represents the challenges that home builders in the survey face in 2023. And the blue bars. But folks expected in 2024. Here we see that the top 5 concerns for builders were high interest rates which continue to be high. Rising inflation in the in the U.S. Economy, the cost or availability o labor and the idea that buyers just want to wait it out 1, 0, wait for interest rates to drop. So they they won't necessarily participate in the market and then the cost of building materials. So it's really important to note here that. These survey results from
across the country and nowhere do we see a local or state regulation or tenant protections as one of these huge challenges that faces the industry? So now transitioning to what state and local governments have been doing to address the affordability crisis policy link. We track policy passage and implementation across the country. And what we've seen is an increase in advocacy for and of course, the passage of laws that protect tenants in this volatile market. In which they have very little power and even less buying power inflation continues to impact people but disproportionately low income people. Policies that have gained the most traction nationwide that I'm sure you all have heard of that either the local or state level in Minnesota, part it right to counsel. So
the idea that every tenant facing eviction gets legal representation this very much helps in the face of illegal evictions or just giving people any line of defense in trying to stay in their homes. This exist in multiple cities also the county and state level. We also have just cause which protects tenants from no cause evictions discriminatory evictions. We know that many places where there are displacement pressures tenants can be evicted even if they have done nothing wrong, even if they have not broken their lease. So just cause has been emerging. Last year, both Colorado and New York State passed it and we have cities passing across the country well. And then we have rent stabilization, which has been gaining traction of the local
and federal level as of last month 194 jurisdictions have rent stabilization, some form of it. The state and local level. And we also saw federal momentum for it. And with the Biden administration where they had impose new rental caps on low income housing tax credits and also proposed 5% caps. A large landlords which was not acted upon. So talked about how challenging the development landscape has been across the country and that has been extremely difficult for jurisdictions who are keeping up with who are trying to keep up with housing for owing populations. And this has been especially challenging because governments largely rely on the private sector 2 to expand housing supply. And of course, during the bust portion of our boom and bust ccle, that
means that very little gets built. So one o the hopeful trends that we've been seeing across the country. Local government stepping in to the developer ruled themselves. So putting public dollars into developing permanently affordable housing that does not get lost in the speculative market. Very similar to the way that low income housing tax sometimes do when in private for-profit ownership. So a few examples of this and I between the time I made these lights and and now we actually had another city added. Mentioned it to we have at the Atlanta Urban Development Corporation, which is leveraging publicly owned land to develop affordable housing. We have a program in Montgomery County that many folks have probably heard has been uplifting their model as well. They've been using revolving loan funds to build Mason County, affordable
housing that is owned by the county and then in Seattle, they have also created a social housing developer which uses or will use an excess gains tax to fund the development of permanently affordable housing that is community controlled. And then the one thing add to this is not site is Chicago's of the city of Chicago is also putting the bond money into a revolving loan fund that would do a very similar thing. And Seattle, Montgomery County, so building affordable housing And no local governments are trying to d trying to do everything right there, trying to do the projections work, but also trying to do the production work. And I think that's an exciting they about that. Of course, whenever tenant protections to come up,
there are worries that they will have a long-term impact on dvelopment and I think one of the things we often do oppose the link is look at Imperial right. There's a bounty of empirical evidence, which is to say peer reviewed research on what actually happens as opposed to theories on what might happen when we look at the long-term impact of regulations various policies on development. So first. That's right. A few examples. First is the University of Minnesota study that looks at the impact of just cause that was passed at the state level in California and Oregon relating to housing development here. You see that construction rates. Did not drastically change after the
passage of jst cause. And you can compare the development rates both in California and Oregon counties that. Pass just cause as well as the dotted line, which were surrounding counties that did not pass just cost next, we have the same analysis for the for New Hampshire, which is had just cause for quite a while. The state level here we see that. Was a drop in construction prt prior to the passage of just calls. But this happened both in places with just cause and without just cause. So it's very difficult to say. One caused the other and then and next we have a graph showing development permits and construction completions in Portland, Maine. So for a little bit of context in 2020 voters in Portland past the strongest stabilization ordinance in the country, which was an annual cap of 70% cpi or 70% inflation with no
new cnstruction exemption. That was the year 2020. And here. We can see that they have had some record setting. Numbers in 2023, even in terms construction units approved year as well as construction units completed. But you're so I think Portland, Maine is a really unique example of how a robust local interest economy can be studied and how us city can hold both the importance of increasing supply while also making tenant protected from economic displacement. Other places where we don't action before you move on. I when I appreciate this kind of draw comparison. But I'm just wondering if you could.
Share a little bit more. Is there are there other factors to that? You're seeing? That possibly they have seen or look into as it relates to Portland's example, specifically as to maybe what is contributing to yes, having some of you know what you know with the passing of the ordinance still seeing. Increasing production, just kind of wondering if you're seeing like what? Other factors are, the decisions that have made in that time frame. That is notable. I a few things to think about. Portland, Mine has a very robust trust economy where they're it. There's both pressure. From Like Airbnb is, for example. That has served as a displacement pressure for for tenants, which is why the need for such strong and stabilization was needed. And then that food interest economy also means that investors are very excited to invest there because when we look at a typical real estate
perform rational analysis 5 to 10 years and it's very rare for an investor to expect increases in rent that are beyond what the market is experiencing. So, for example, if investor and choosing between a few projects to to invest in, if one is saying, oh, I can get you 10% increases every year. It's a great return. That might be a great return for me as an investor. But I would be very weary because I don't see market rents increasing 10% the year. And it's kind of a high-risk high-reward situation whereas what is more typical in real estate performances? You know, 3, 2, 3, 4, 5%, rate increases annually because that is more
realistic and less risky for investor to make that decision. I think. local. Like a very robust local economy in Portland, Maine, given all the tour is tourism activity, they have honestly that might have changed in the last few months. They depend on a lot of committee interests and I'm not quite sure what the impact has been recently. That type of economic activity, that kind withstands these boom and bust cycles means that investors are a little bit less weary to step into the development market. There. Even if interest rates are a little bit higher. So other places where rent stabilization has been pastor, where we have seen empirical evidence come from I New Jersey has had regulation in cities for over
30 years. And empirical research has shown that not only is there not impact on. New development meets with that rent stabilization in place. But when you compare cities with and without rent regulation, they have similar development rights. And that's over 30 years. So is a very unique longitudinal study that we often don't have access to for for many other cities or states. And then we also have a lot of impaired governance from Boston, Massachusetts, who at one point had run stabilization. One of the most interesting things about Boston is that once movement regulation, it did not necessarily lead to an increase in new construction. And again, I don't know the I
could look into the economic conditions around that. But I think what we've seen. From the real estate industry in terms of like the larger factors that are impacting development rates those might have had. A role in influencing why repeal of my control. We're in stabilization did not lead to large increases in new construction. The last thing I will speak to is another trend in the national housing policy conversation, which is the need to address outsized market power in our housing market. It's something that might not be felt as much in Minnesota, but we definitely see this in Sunbelt states and California and New York in terms of the financialization
of of housing post for closure. We saw many corporate entity is in real estate investment. Trust scoop up single-family homes during the foreclosure crisis. We saw huge transfer of wealth from from hona homeowners, but especially owner Abul lower-income homeowners, homeowners that we're excited to buy home with the mortgage products that are offered to them, that it later realize quite predatory. So we saw massive transfer of wealth from those homeowner households to essentially corporate corporate donors and in a supply and demand was never a perfect fit for housing as a commodity, but it's even less. So now that we have the rise of corporate ownership and other market
manipulation tools. And so one of those. But I want be to Israel Page, which folks MAY have heard about it. Rhythm that landlords can use to effectively collude on on rents and the algorithms suggests rent increases and even suggest they can see increases in order to maximize profits. And it's something that the Department of Justice investigated last year and we're probably more than a year ago. But then they They did Sue Real page and are in the middle of the lawsuit. That also involves a few attorney generals in terms of investigating the impact. And the last thing I want to speak to is just a recent piece in the Harvard Business Review that recommends that any plan to overhaul the
housing system or housing market in the U.S. Has to confront the power of landlords to raise rents and that we need both government regulation and government provision o housing, which is one of the hopeful things that we're seeing a policy link is this idea that nationwide local governments can both play the protections roll to the preservation role, but also increasingly played the production role and build housing at a time when market conditions are so uncertain that that many actors cannot or won't build housing. So that's all I have happy to take questions. Well, thank you so for that presentation as well. I think one of the questions that I really that's why the sides, I
guess I just wanted to go back to as for just a little bit more clarity, think just slashed further detail. My counsel that can make members commissioners know that I'm very interested in pursuing a continuing the conversation around to protections here in the city of Paul. I'm just wondering fom lens eye. I see that there are 3 different times. But also just share for my nation, my perspective. What are some of the other forms of protections that you're seen a well? The area, a few other things that we're there are so tenant screening is a huge one. And we know our neighbors in Minneapolis have have implemented a policy around that. But tenant changes to Senate screening to make housing more accessible to folks who might not have credit histories or low credit scores. Folks who have been
unbanked folks who have history with the criminal justice system there. There are many biases that are often built into that has been one way, way that we are seeing state's and city's address. This is through how make changing the standards for to means that they are more consistent and do not include just credit scores. MAY live? Can still use credit history, but they can't use just the specific number. They're also been changes to look back period in terms of of criminal history and things of that nature. Another thing is fiction ceiling. So They're sealing e a l as opposed like the ceiling ceiling eviction records helps renters who have former evictions in and making sure that eviction from say 10
20 years ago does not impact impede their ability to find housing. Now. And this takes the form of this those policies a little bit more coordination with the court system because you then have to figure out, you know, how is that information made transparent are available. How do court systems or the the private software's that Wheeler's MAY use to pull information about eviction histories and you do have to engage stakeholders in that sense. But it is given the disproportionate impact evictions on people of color and women of color, specifically, that's been a really good way to increase housing opportunity for renters. And then the one other thing I'd mention is, i mean, this one is very much a
it doesn't necessarily change the admissions system that just gives people a little bit more time. To ajust to find a new housing situation if they need is prediction. Notice. Know that that was recently increased. Belief that the state level, but we've been seeing this across the country as well, which is the idea that. In advance of a landlord filing eviction notice they have to give the a longer notice period in some places. There is no notice period or there's only 7 days. And we think about the work that has to be done to find new housing, to put together the savings for a new security deposit. First last month spent and that can be a huge stress and burden on Any advance notice that we can
give people of receiving an eviction helps them make plans for the future. Whether that is new place to live transferring your child to a new school, figuring out te new transportation to to your work, right? Any of those things? And I guess this is more so for Mullins of just really trying think that we've been talking about as well. Last year, we were able to work within the tree but to have a housing policy evaluation study that we mourning and now a $100,000 towards for this year to think about. We say evaluate and hear more about some of the house and policies that we pass. Is there anything in particular around know you mentioned kind of just within identifying with Portland. I think just some. Appetite for being more or look into what wat's going
on. There are other certain trends that you're seeing nationwide that yu might think could inform something if we wanted to do a study this year, it was an appetite of the body to say on our pass our housing policies that we currently have in place here in Saint Paul, are there things that you want us to that you think be beneficial for us to look at, especially with what we're seeing relation to trends. Yeah, I so the question long. I apologize a answer one. So safe. You have the opportunity housing policy study, What are things to potentially look at given what we're Yeah. I think across the country. Enforcement implementation of been a challenge. We know with. This eonomy that. The capacity to implement and
enforce policies can be limited and local governments are stretched very thin, right? And so I one of the ways to one of the things that could potentially be studied. Is creative ways that lcal and state governments have innovated in order to support and homeowners tenants in enforcing their own rights. Because we know that te legal aid capacity on the nonprofit side is also stressed and the local governments that is stretched and so what a great of innovative ways to to go implementation enforcement. I also think that. Crafting the right research questions is very key for research when you have a research institution such as University or
University. Affiliated institution, they are trained in research evaluation right? So they are more likely to ask. The question is where u actually get the outcomes that you want to look for. So, for example, if we are looking at a policy like just cause that is supposed to reduce evictions. Assessing whether or not that impacts development is us is not actually assessing the effectiveness of just cause right is just looking at development trends. Same could be said about rent stabilization rent. Stabilization is not a supply tool is a protection tools so we should be measuring how it protects tenants. When we have production tools like. Like Affordable Housing, trust funds or local housing dollars. That can be leveraged
with county and state dollars. That is where we want to be measuring the cow efficient production is it would be like, say, evaluating a minimum wage policy based on how much pay family leave. People get ready. Just doesn't make sense. Policies are designed to do very specific things. They're not sent to everything there for the evaluation that we do. The questions that we ask about how effective is has to match what it is designed to do, not the other outcomes that we would like to So, yeah, I think that's generally when it say about housing studies and evaluation in general. Thank you. To any of the other commissioners have any questions retion to this discussion at this time?
Mission, Boise over Commissioner will start commission and they got a commissioner. Thank you. I don't have any questions, but just wanted to for being here and to me what is really valuable and national research. It is. This is very timely to come in front of a jury to some because of the conversations that we have been having on tenant protections and also by an amendment on our rent, stabilization ordinance. That is coming up. And I really am grateful for the information just because as I think about conversation within the city about it, you know, a bar and stabilization amendment the proposed really do. Tink that there's been a deep absence research, long-term research specifically. And so I found what was really valuable. You
know what your slide about the empirical research? Because to me, I do think that it is really pay much or to to make policy decisions that really aren't informed by te results that we're seeing over even 5 years worth of the policy implemented. And so that is what I would consider that a huge flaw in our conversation now in the city here also a really deep disservice to you know, have many thoughts and opinions about that. But just wanted to say this is the reason why I really do appreciate information you're sharing because we're getting information about what is happening in other cities, too, which is a perspective that I have really been wanting to get, but not kind answers to some. I have nothing to follow up. I reach
out to you. There are a couple of things here that you share that I am interested in getting more information specifically like that just caused them that you have here that other state that 7 states have, I believe adopted. And I just getting like more examples about that and and furthering the conversation on. Protections for renters being that we and the city made up majority of renters. So thank you. I appreciate your work. Thank you, commissioner Commissioner Kim wanted to go to you. I just like to drop the I think to all the exact points commissioner you just mentioned, so I guess that. With just extended deep gratitude for the intensive
data you've provided long-term trends interesting. To look at in terms of contacts, contacts of this moment in time in context of our housing policies. And I really appreciate the comment in a row down rent stabilization is enough production to its a production tools. Of course, if we see studies that say rent stabilization is hindering production, it's like, well, that's not the intended necessarily the intended purposes. But there's other tools and policies and investments we can make to ensure that we are still increasing production because I do think that is that is the constant question that I have is how is kind of how his friend stabilization? We should be assessing its effectiveness the experiences of the tenants of the city. Have right now versus trying to trying to make it make sense in a different arena
that uses different tools and different mechanism. So I really appreciate that. And similarly, if I have any questions, I will follow u adjusted due credit. Huge for granting us like in this moment in history and aso the trends that we're seeing across the country. So thank you so much. It was very detailed. I really appreciate it. Thank you. Yes, but I - failed to mention 2 years that when you come in front of this body, most likely will now become friends of everyone who's here? Will be all I'm sure you could ask any of wonderful staff members that have also presented that that's actually true. But I think one of the good things about that is that it allows fr more on that and questions, I think a fellow, though, for could possibly for years. And so I just say no, even into the space Po 5, really just thinking about like all of it. All of the
thing of the goals that w year are sharing here as well around just making sure that we have an idea of what isn't the implemented in multiple places across the country. What are we seeing as a result of them? And so I also really just simply sincerely appreciate just having a couple of different municipality's too. Look at to compare, you know, our my team is actually still going through the wanted study because it is a unique opportunity. And even just one of the things that you know really resonated for me with your response to the study question is just how important is to have the right questions. And so our office just chain genuinely is interested in just continuing to talk about that with you and anyone else who you know is interested in just like, you know, what does it look like to have a city that's
valuable, especially for looking a maybe be in for some mechanisms or the tools that we have here in our city that could be strengthened or creative ways that we can partner even outside of the with what we do have in place here. So I appreciate that as well. Commissioner, fully a believer. So your hand get. Thank for us, as say. Appreciate the presentation. It was really thoughtful. And really interested in seeing how same pause actually impacted by eye and relations actually to what you had said earlier about just like a scope of the study and importance of how you form your question to actually get the outcomes. And in the even like I'm also in
the same space just even responding to the issue of or existing housing supply across the city. And how do we address that and what are the questions to actually look into some of those factors in? Do want bring your attention to the chart that has that's from the National Association Home Builders. Survey, where has listed the high interest rates being like one of the largest factors in terms of keep problems impacting on housing supply. Can you speak to particularly around like what is the study's particularly around researching financing tools and seems like finance has been like the biggest hurdle rate and specially sitting as a commissioner and also as a
council member. And from my experience, seems like governments that only subsidizing tool when it comes to affordable housing. And are pretty much the only way for developers to build affordable housing is through some type of subsidy from that either. State County are locals. So can you talk about like where the existing gaps and how have studied this and were the conversation around like financing shows up. Question. So I think. Big picture wise. We have to think about housing. Well, in our current system, right? Not ideally, but in our current housing system, housing investors, eyes is investment tool. And so one of the reasons why we see a evenflo and investment housing
is because at certain times housing is the most profitable investment tool investment vehicle other times, especially in times of like in tumultuous economic times, it might be Treasury bonds might be. I there are so many different tools, so many different investments that investors can choose to put their money into to get that return on investment leading up to the foreclosure crisis that if that very profitable investment vehicle was housing, which is why we saw such an increase in production. And unfortunately it huge crash when we saw the the foreclosure crisis the mortgage mortgage crisis. So I think the picture was in our current system, we think about housing investment as a tool
for 4 profit. I think if we are too. Take on. As some of these cities are taking on. Right. The role of financing and developing housing as local or state issue where local or state governments played the developer role you can essentially replace the investor part of the capital stack with public financing. Right? So this is how the revolving loan fund that's being used in Montgomery County that is being proposed in the city of Chicago. That's what they're doing. So when you look at a capital stack for development, you have equity and you have you have a loan. So the equity is what the investor puts They oftentimes expect a healthy return in order for them to put money into a project. And then you have a bank loan. And at this
point in time, interest rates are so high that the bank loan just borrowing money is expensive. And so in some of these places, the revolving loan fund is essentially saying instead of going to a bank or instead of asking investor for equity, we're actually gonna put public dollars whether that's in the form bond, whether that's in the form of just revenue, right, that they can collect from a variety of sources they can dedicated from there annual budget. They can create a new revenue, new revenue source. They're essentially replacing that the high interest rate part of the equation with public dollars. And that is an innovation that I think is worth looking into. I think Mike Henry County and that that revolving loan fund
system is very innovative because they have been able to build. Pretty rapidly a good volume of housing that is mixed income because they have effectively replaced the expensive part of building if they're still many expensive part of building. But one of the most expensive parts, a building in this economy with public dollars. So they use that revolving loan fund to replace the equity and then they don't have to. Spend as much on the development budget because when you think about what you can set rents at in the future, it really depends on how much you have to repay the loan. And so whatever you can reduce on the development side also supports operating budget side. Commissioner do such. And the question on are you one of the folks that that a I appreciate the question, too,
because I sw that I was like 90% effective. I wasn't. I was like that's a pretty high space. And even I think just and communication. What some of our local our local developers and up and home builders. Like we've continued to hear about the financing. And I think it's a piece that's been a struggle. And so and that's top of mind for a lot of us here. Do any other commissioners have any other questions? I really appreciate you taking the time again to come out the midst of everything get on just for that, providing this information for us what I see is continued. The continuing point out a starting point of a much larger conversation. And I would just ivite both yourself trauma and possibly to continue to kind of monitor to what especially over the next few weeks of what our
city is looking at and what the spotty communicates with and especially as we get really discussing end up, maybe the questions are identifying the questions that we want to see and evaluations that a a I know our office is interested buying as a partner as far as just like, really being able to inform with that looks like. Thank you. And just to add a little something, thank you for inviting me to present its really exciting, too. Central Council that reflects me. Really appreciate that Let's give it great guy. I could only parry and to come into a council meeting in for presentation, especially in the middle of the day on Wednesday. So thank you just for going that presentation as well with us. And thank you for being here. Tom. Other ay other things that we should
talking about. Joe Johnson, there's nothing else today. Then I think that there's nothing else on the agenda. It's going once going twice. And with that, we are adjourned.