##VIDEO ID:gojt0-fP31A## e e e e e e e e e States of America and to the for it stands one nation God indivisible Justice okay uh Madam clerk roll call member dashel here Vice chair Hawkins Smith here member young yes member Hurley here chair Lowry yes we have a quorum okay uh first on the agenda is the approval of the agenda um one thing I'd like to point out I think we've all figured this one out discussion item 5A that should be 1303 Gulfway as opposed to passag gr way 5B oh 5B I have it as 5A did something come on I don't know got the one from up there so we we had republished the agenda that might have been the reason for the change in the number but I did want to say that the design review thank you for pointing that out um that I am asking to withdraw from the agenda they will be coming back in February for that item they're withdrawing what one um discussion item will five five be on the current published agenda the design review that will be brought back in a later month oh okay and so 5A is is just the lot split correct which was that pre okay I got you so I just had an old one all right and then I'd just like to add a discussion or announcement item for the museum at the end okay and one other thing just for a very short discussion I just have a couple just brief questions kind of a View Brandon just kind of get an update on some of the stuff and uh you know what's going on won't be long good that would be update based on the hurricane damage okay all right next we have I think we have to approve it oh yes I know you're right a motion to approve the agenda for the Thursday January 9th 2025 meeting with the addition of two discussion items and the removal of item 5B I second V call please mam cler member Hurley yes member young yes Vice chair Hawkins Smith member dashel yes chair Lowry yes motion carries okay at this point we're at the audience comments which allows each of you if you want to come up and speak you can at this point if you have like General comments you want to make if you're here to speak about something that's on the agenda you can wait and talk about it at that point so this just for people who want to speak in general if there's does anybody want to speak in general okay let's move forward uh approval of the minutes says any of the members here had an opportunity to read the minutes I have so I'll just make a motion to approve the minutes of December 12th 2024 second Madame clerk roll call please Vice chair Hawkin Smith yes member dashel yes member Hurley yes member young yes chair Lowry yes motion carries okay next we're uh action items four first is 4A which is the local historic designation number 24102 for the residents at 16001 pass girl way uh who from staff was presenting that I'll present that thank you chair can we pull up the PowerPoint please so our first case this is both 161 and 1603 passor gr way uh two individual single family structures the applicant owner is Beth dren um they are requesting local historic designation of both residences at the subject property here's some historic photographs this is attached to the 1936 property card showing the southern structure the main residence as well as a portion of the residents to the north uh you'll see in subsequent photos that they have not been dramatically altered uh what's what's interesting about these structures is that they were developed in the tutor Revival style the southern structure is the only residential structure in pass gril that's included on the registry that is a prime example of this the northern structure was noted to be a frame vernacular with tutor Revival uh features that was as as of the 2003 boundary increase uh we have very few of these structures here in St Pete Beach the Palm Crest Resort um Motel up at 4200 Gulf Boulevard is another example of this um you can see the structures and it might be better in later photos uh there's the rounded Tower at the corner they both have the timbering at the roof line um the southern structure over the entryway the northern structure above the um front-facing Gable they have the Steep pitched roofs those are all um emblematic and common features of the tutor Revival style uh here's the northern structure from the 2003 uh boundary increase showing the structure it as well as fairly unaltered and here are some current photos of the structures again fairly um fairly wellmaintained even looking back at the oldest photos we have on file staff supports the application designate the primary residents and secondary residents as local historic resources I found the buildings to be significant and that they are both good examples of the tutor Revival style this is very uncommon in our city despite the fact that it was a very popular style in the 1930s when they were built um I believe one in four structures Nationwide were the tut to Revival I don't know why it didn't make its way down here but these are two well preserved examples of that style and they have been very well maintained and remaining good condition staff requests a motion to approve these uh this case for local historic designation of the primary residents in the secondary garage apartment at 1601 and 1603 pass gril way right is there any members in the audience that want to speak to this anybody present thanks for that great description we learned a little bit I'm John Jo this is my wife yeah come up to the microphone if you would please sir I'll project a little bit SE picture I brought a few but that's okay those those came from the previous owners uh the only thing I'd like to add uh since there were no thank you Brandon By the way uh no pictures of the interior inside that vaed roof inside that vaed ceiling is a pecky Cypress um pecky Cypress ceiling and I think that's equally unique I've not seen any others in the P Grill area bet Tia perhaps has no not many the um yeah we we did a renovation in 2003 and tried to find some and it was really difficult um 12 years ago to to find it to in a bedroom that uh that we remodeled um we came through the storms very nicely thank you very much whoever built the house there's some discussion about as as to who that who that was uh it was built up not the FEMA standards but five and about 5T above mean high tide well above the seaw wall and the seaw wall is about 3 ft above mean high tide so we came through the storm fairly well we lost our dock many people did not unusual uh we had extensive Landscaping to redo as as you all remember in passag Grill the water was up up about here and um so the the major thing we had to do was get dehumidifiers and blowers into our crawl space and that took about 10 days and several kilowatts from Duke Energy um the last thing I'd like to say is there's some urban legends surrounding this house um we heard from the granddaughter of the person that lived in the house for many years we're not sure if he was the original Builder maybe you know I don't know I might have some notes on it but I'll yeah in any event uh the granddaughters suggest and I haven't done any research I don't intend to because I like this story that there grandfather won the house in a card game we don't know what he put up into the um into the pot as uh uh to match the title but that's the grandkids story and we're sticking with it sound good thank you all for this uh important work you do for the city and especially P Grill thanks well I think I speak for all us you got that that house you have is so great we've always referred to it as the Enchanted Cottage my family always calls it so uh I'm going to add that to the folklore you go thank you so nice all right anybody have any comments or discussion no just made my heart happy to see it on the agenda for this month so thank you for taking such good care of it anybody have a motion I'll make a motion uh motion to approve case number 24102 for designation of the primary residents and secondary garage apartment residents at 1601 and 16003 passing gr way as local historic resources second Madam clerk roll call please member dashel yes member Hurley yes member young yes Vice chair hackin Smith yes chair Lowry yes motion carries congratulations yeah I also like to point out I think it's interesting about how your house did not get flood damag there's a there's a number of old houses that didn't either and it really was a difference I think in whether they built them up through 3 ft or 4 and 1/2 ft or whatever so uh I'm glad to hear there's more of them out there that survived it it's got great bones excellent thank you so much thank you okay 4B local historic designation case number 24107 which is the Residence at 1110th Avenue we get the PowerPoint please okay this is 1110th Avenue it contains three structures applicant owner is Eileen Gunther uh they're requesting local historic designation of the two story single family residents the garage and the guest residents on the property some photographs uh this is one of the oldest structures still remaining in Pastor gril definitely one of the first 10 um it was originally I believe according to the applicant developed by Ransom miles who platted Mory beach in the late 1800s um that was I guess when we learned to not build on the beach itself um this is on 10th Avenue of course and this is the structure shown in uh as attached to the 1936 property card this is a 1996 local historic survey um this was not done for National register purposes but we do have a photo from that time uh you can see the additions to the structure but it does retain um both the the front entry as well as the exposed rafter Tales the other Craftsman styles features of the residence uh this is as part of the boundary increase in 2003 in which the structure was found as a contributing structure to the National register historic district there have been fairly minimal alterations since that time which you can see here in 2004 and this does show the two structures at the back both the garage and the guest residents uh there is a non-contributing car port that is unattached uh that you can see in the top right of the screen that was a fairly recent addition but the other three structures were deemed to be contributing to the district and are proposed for local historic designation staff does support the application for all three of these structures the primary structure exemplifies the broad social history of the city it is a very well preserved example of one of the earliest remaining structures in passer gril uh this was the structure was built at a time that the area was a Leisure focused residential Community saw a significant later expansion and yearround occupancy through the late 19 tends uh the structure also continues to embody the distinct visual characteristics of the Craftsman and frame vernacular Styles in the period which is in the early 20th century especially on the main residence you see some of that Craftsman adornment that tended to Fall by the wayside later in the later in the first half of the century so it's great that those features have still been preserved so staff recommends a motion to approve this case for local historic designation of the primary residence guest house and garage okay any uh citizens here to speak on behalf of this property okay any discussion or comments by members of the board I have a question you said the three structures recommended for approval that's the the main house the guest house and what's the third the garage the oh garage not the carport though no the carport is it's a separate structure was a later Edition I would just like to say what a what a gift it is to go buy that property every day and just see how meticulously maintained it is and even today it reminds me of being when I was a little girl growing up and passive girl driving everybody crazy going by there it looks so much the same today as it did then and it's such a gift to have that in the community well personally in the mid 70s I guess it was I uh on a couple Spring Breaks would have slept in that little tiny room on or unattached building in the back cuz my sister rented the house next door who would that was owned by the same guy that owned that house Frank I can't think it was last night obviously passed a long time ago so I have f f memories on that Sandy alley myself okay uh I'd like to make a motion please I moved to approve case number 24107 for the designation of the two-story primary residents garage and guest house at 1111th Avenue as local historic resource okay I'll second that motion Madam Clark member Hurley yes member young yes Vice chair Hawkins Smith yes member dashel yes chair Lowry yes motion carries okay moving on 4C local historic designation case number 24109 for the residents at 3211 Gulf Boulevard good afternoon Mr chair board members Gail Martinez senior planner Community Development before you today is case number 24109 local historic designation for the property located at 3211 Golf Boulevard the applicants are Kevin and Patricia Hughes here's some images of the property from 2011 11 2015 and most recently in 2024 staff findings and recommendations staff supports this application to locally designate 3211 Golf Boulevard as a historic property staff finds that the building is significant in the following areas a exemplifies and reflects broad cultural and political economic and social history of the city it also bodies the distinctive visible characteristics of an architectural style recommendation is a motion to approv case number 24109 for local historic designation for the single family Residence at 3211 Golf bouard and I believe Mr Hughes is here to um answer any questions you may have okay Mr Hughes you want to come forward hi please state your name for the record please uh Kevin Hughes 3211 Gul B Lord um it's interesting because if you hang around here long enough you become part of the history um my uh my grandfather uh bought this house from a gentleman that uh Mr Hurley will know fairly well uh Colonel Hurley sold the place to my grandfather I thought it was 52 I I think I'm wrong because reading the reading some of the book that Frank Jr wrote uh it seems like it's probably more like 53 54 uh this building was is part of the same property as one that's designated known as The Bu house um it would been used for many years for uh housing for people who did work at the house and uh my grounds keeper still lives there the other side I got the same tenant that we've had how long Dan 7s yeah he's been living there since the 70s um funny how you we were talking about elevation and how it's just a little bit the the house my house itself the the White House that's 3210 uh sits on a little there's a little bit of a spine on the west side of the island and it was also built up about 2 feet and I was 6 Ines from being in real trouble over there with this storm uh got the cottage unfortunately but uh we're looking to uh take care of it renovate it rebuild it you know get things back to normal and uh I I still have the original brochure from when the colonel sold the place to my grandfather I couldn't bring it in because his pictures were about yay by yay I had I had the thing framed the PO the the brochure is about that big by that big doublesided which back in that time probably cost the colonel a whole bunch of money but was this what we're looking at where it is like the drawn almost like cartoon map the what we have we have something on the computer that's probably yeah the what you're referring to was an excerpt from the original brochure even even mentioning next to the main residence was the casino I think we all know that doesn't mean what we think it means today yeah no the the property that is actually on the uh on the west side of the property that was more of a uh it was more I the best term to use now is a mud room uh because it had showers for people coming off the beach so because you know you really didn't want sand in the house and uh that building was really was basically a mud room and a another little place to gather yeah I know the on on the beaches you know they talked about having the casinos you know you know back in the 20s and stuff I think it was more of a dance hall or a banquet location you know it wasn't a gambling site or anything like that very nice okay and I and you answered some of the questions I was going to have I always thought the house the Cod was connected with the other house but was never really sure and you know yeah that it's it's all been well right now it's listed in the county as two separate properties because I when I became a Florida resident I could only split off the property on the one side of the road for Homestead gotcha so if I didn't if I wasn't a Florida resident that property would it would all be one property still just with a Gulf Boulevard right away going through it yeah well you could put you could put a up there in charge of and well actually actually there's there's a piece of El Centro that was I don't know what the appropriate term was condemned converted vacated probably yeah El Centro basically stopped at the north wall and the South Wall the El Centro actually ran through there when the house was originally built and and when was that the house originally built that the big house The Bu house from what I hear was 38 okay so after the Dawn was built though so but uh Mr Mr Goldman who was the the guy who uh who bought the house from Mrs bu and basically that is not the original house or anything near it you know he's like everybody says well I'm just going to make a few quick Renovations well by the time was done it was not a quick renovation and it was not a cheap one it's beautiful location I love it thank you all right anybody else have any questions all right I'll make a motion that we locally historically designate 3211 Gulf Boulevard which is case number 24109 second mam clerk member young yes Vice chair Hawkin Smith yes member Dash yes member Hurley yes chair Lowry yes motion carries okay action item 4D local historic designation number or case number 24110 The Residence at 1051 17th Avenue ien good afternoon um Ivy Beville the owner of the property could not make the meeting today but she did okay it going forward if the board so agreed yeah absolutely okay please okay oops backwards okay the this is a local historic designation of 1051 17th Avenue case number 24110 and the owners Ivy and Blake bevel have requested local historic designation of this duplex residence on the property got some historic photographs of the property that was quick I'm going to go back to the other one show the picture some of the features of this property are that it's a masonry vernacular it was built in 1941 it's stuck a over block it has a hip roof asphalt shingles and the windows are are paired with they're called a ribbon window and those are the ones that go around the corner and they are encased in I think they're probably aluminum But Metal um casement my house has metal casements a lot of them um the structure supports the character of the pag gril neighborhood through its architectural integrity and um as and it has been well maintained come on on staff's findings and recommendations staff supports this application to locally designate 105 17th Avenue as a historic property it reflects the architectural character and integrity of the pasor grill National register historic district and it reflects the broad cultural economic and social history of Pastor Grill and St Pete Beach glad to answer any questions if you have them then I'm pretty certain this home was built by Joe Marsh who was the same Builder as the Camelot which was at the time the CIO i' probably have some family records on this building that I'd be happy to share and um the owner may have some of those records as well okay anything else thank you thank you okay uh I'll make a motion case number 24110 for the local historic designation of the residents there at 1051 17th Avenue I'll second that Madam clerk roll call Vice chair Hawkin Smith yes member dashel yes member Hurley yes member young yes yes CH Lowry yes motion carries okay uh 4E local historic designation case number 24113 for the home at 35 01 Casablanca Avenue Mr Martinez good afternoon board members for the record Gil Martinez this is an application for local historic designation for the structure at 351 cablanca Avenue case number 24113 the applicants are Miss Mr and Mrs Paul Natalie Looney here are some images of the property from 2011 and 2024 staff recommends approval of the local historic designation of this residential structure located at 3501 Casablanca Avenue because it embodies the distinctive visible characteristics of the architectural style the period and the method of construction I believe that Mr Looney and Mrs Looney may be here to answer any questions recommends a motion to approve case number 24113 for local historic designation of the single family residents at 351 Casablanca Avenue all right Mr or Mrs Looney would you like to come forward if there she just walked in what timing just hey come on up to to the microphone if you will and just so you know we've already had the staff speak about it and make a recommendation and so just state your name for the record and tell us anything you'd like to tell us about it people to like model after hi my name is Natalie Looney um my husband and I own the property at 351 uh Casablanca Avenue um we've had the house for about 3 years and we just moved in fulltime in July so um it's been quite an interesting like adjustment to being in St Petersburg um we um I was I'm an Acro college graduate so I've been um part of this community off and on since the 90s and I've always been looking at property up and down the beaches trying to find you know a little cottage or just something that I could call my own sorry I'm a little breath um um anyway so luckily we happened to find this cute little house on C of black an Avenue and um I would just love to see it preserved um sorry we're kind of at a kind of a point where these older houses you know there's a lot of things obstacles against them um and I'm just glad that there's a a board that is here to help preserve some of the original structures and some of the community F that we have up and down the beaches so I would just hope that um this house could be preserved and kept as it is um we don't have any intention of adding a second story or I mean I know you always have these thoughts like should we tear it down what should we do to you know keep it but in in reality if we didat any of those things it would not be the same house like it would be something totally different um and I just would love to see that house the way it looks the feel that it gives when you come into St Peter into St Pete Beach I would just love for that to be preserved if possible um and just we love being like members of this community my kids go to school and passor Grill so we um we try to stay on the beaches as much as we can we try not to cross the bridge if we don't have to so being down down on the beach area is really important to us um I think that's sorry about all I have no that's fine can I ask you a question we've kind of been going through this with some of the people did did your house get much damage in the in the storm yeah so we only reason I asked some people didn't some didn't and I'm yeah it's you know so our streets pretty interesting most houses are one story and um our neighbors you know luckily had said you know you should get these door dams so we had like the 3-ft door dams at the doors and we never had water like it's never been in the structure before and the water I think was like maybe an inch or two above the door dam and it just was able to to go over the door dams and we had about 26 in right like just on the main level um and the water it appears we're really working hard with contractors trying to figure out how to make the house more watertight because I've been reading about like dry flood proofing and different things things um and sorry I forgot I was going to say anyway yeah so the water came in it appears quickly and it went out quickly because the furniture just swirled kind of towards the middle and the front of the house so it's really fascinating so I feel like there's only a few places where it came in and out it's just trying to figure out where those fails were um so yes I think it was pretty standard up and down the beach like on our street atast I think it was too but some houses are built a little bit higher than others or there's little bit grade yeah we're at 4.7 Bas slood elevation so we have a little extra like so we really thought we'd only come home to like two inches right um but we didn't so yeah I had a friend that had one of those door dams and he sent me a video that showed how well it kept the water inside the house when he when he opened the dam it all came out I'm guessing ours came in and out a different route I don't really know I wish we had cameras to show us what actually happened um but I was also going to mention so I came kind of like a little bit of a whirlwind um I've also learned through this we have some really amazing residents on Casablanca we still have some really long-term residents and when I was trying to like figure out you know what history do we have in this house and what is there a significant it's amazing the oral history that's still exists on our street um and just a lot of support from the neighbors you know trying to do what we can to kind of you know keep people from leaving I think that's kind of one of the fears um but anyway it just it was really neat to find out that there is so much history and it's still preserved among some of the long-term residents so I hope that's something we can capture through all this yeah in my opinion I think your house is just an excellent example of mid-century monitor very interesting looking house yeah according to the contractor it was a what did he say this was a period he built this house to be um against Norms because there's like an angled fireplace and just everything you could possibly do to make it not typical right it's very neat yeah it's a nice gateway to the beach too you know we have that anchor that FS St of the Don CeSar there but the approach is it's just a really nice feel coming into the beach there I love that that's our welcome mat and thanks for protecting it yeah okay anybody have a motion I'll make a motion to approve case number 24113 for designation of the single family Residence at 351 Casablanca Avenue as a local historic resource second Madame clerk roll call member dashel yes member Hurley yes member young yes Vice chair hackin Smith yes chair Lowry yes motion carries all right thank you okay moving on 4f local historic designation number 24114 for the pass gr Women's Club located at 221 pass girl way pull the PowerPoint please thank you Brandon so this is our only redesignation for today we can talk about procedurally uh red designations later on under discussion but again this is 2201 passor girl Way Laurel big of the president of passor girl Women's Club is the applicant they're requesting redesignation of the primary club building as a local historic resource it was placed in the city's local historic registry in 1996 but that was prior to the city becoming a certified local government and the benefits that come with listing on the registry requires that the structures be designated while the structure or sorry while the city is a certified local government br that wasn't that was a I'm sorry that was a wrong photo I was going to say yeah these photos are correct though these these are all right my mind right right drive by so this is a structure from 2002 um it has been very well preserved uh this is showing it in 2015 as part of the city's resurvey of the area it was part of the boundary increase for the national register historic district in 2003 uh in 2015 it was resurveyed and found to be a contribut structure and it's actually one of the few structures in the city that was noted to be a potential National register resource on its own um and that's so it is eligible the structure was originally designed by Winfield lot who also designed the beach theater um he was responsible for several other Municipal generally recreational buildings over in St Petersburg St Petersburg actually just designated the Mirror Lake historic district one of his structures was included in that as well so we could potentially look look at it thematic grouping sometime in the future for this um the theater and some other structures but it is a very well preserved um structure it obviously has immense social value in passor grail one of the first um if if not one of the only remaining social organizations from prior to the city's incorporation uh you can see some photos here of the structure these were taken just a few days ago um it looks like the Landscaping is in the process of being replaced but the structure itself um at least from the exterior has been well preserved uh saf does support the application to redesignate this Clubhouse it is a good example of the minimal traditional architectural style includes those front faing Gables moderate roof pitch with minimal overhang um it has been well preserved especially when viewed from the street rights away the only additions have been to the back of the structure which did come forward for certificate of appropriateness when that was done back in the early 2010s I believe uh staff recommends uh planting addition Landscaping as was in place prior to the storm were viable um it appears the Landscaping on the southern side of the structure that blocked those uh air handlers um had been removed for accessibility purposes there was a there is a ramp on the southern side but just that that Landscaping be replaced for viable um the structure is obviously associated with events that have made significant contribution to the city's local history it is one of the few extand social organization from prior to the city's incorporation and uh the Club did assist with the local War efforts that led to the explosive settlement of penel County and passor Grill in the post World War II period so staff recommends approval to redesignate this structure under case number 24114 that's all I have anybody want to speak sure come up good afternoon I'm Laurel B I'm the president of the P of go Women's Club and with me here today is Ela schroer our past president and our current house chair thank you for considering this application uh for the redesignation of our clubhouse um to be an historic building ironically enough this club was started in 1922 as a result of a hurricane that started a fire in a resident's home in Grill and several women in the neighborhood wanted to help their neighbor um and so they got together to uh offer assistance through what was then called a pound party where you brought a pound of nails a pound of flour a pound of sugar Etc and uh the women loved not only helping their neighbor but the sense of community they got from uh doing something uh for the P Community as a whole and so they decided they wanted to continue to do those types of um charitable acts so from that um day forward and uh to this day one of the major missions of the club um is to contribute to our community uh it had several locations until 1937 when construction began at its current location um and it opens its its doors uh at its current location in 1938 since then the exterior exterior of the structure has remained unchanged and uh is a constant reminder for all who pass by of the good the club does from our Santa breakfast to cooking for Ronald McDonald House and contributing not only money but volunteer hours to dayar and other Charities uh it's well known for its home tour and shouter challenge community events co-sponsored by the city for the public to enjoy and a a portion of those proceeds from these events is was always put aside uh to donate to charity so um you know in conclusion I think um not only is it has been maintained um beautifully by the uh members of the club throughout the years since 1938 um I would like to add that yes on the Landscaping portion we had recently redone the all of landscaping in native Florida plants um they you know we suffered a lot of damage from the hurricane but we intend to um reinstall that and we have some plans to put a walkway through we're going to label all the planting so it'll be a place where the public can walk by and stop and go in and get educated about uh native Florida plants um uh and um as a a member of this club and now it's president I'm just extreme honored to be part of this history from over a 100 years 1922 and we're you know continuing to go strong and we intend to uh renovate it and uh hopefully it'll be there for another hundred years it's very wellb built uh all wood it's a what they call the balloon stri type structure and uh so uh we um appreciate your taking our application under consideration are you I'll be happy to answer any questions I would just like to add I walk by almost every morning and I see your team of people out there volunteers working and planting and I saw all the beautiful plants you planted right before the hurricanes and the pride that everybody takes and the work that you do there right speaks for itself so I have no doubt it will be back to its full Glory we just had it repainted I mean we really are extr it's our pride and joy and member you know it's member maintained we don't have you know a big corporate structure overlooking us or helping us it's all from the love of the members that that um building continues to look and as good as it does and serve such a important purpose in our community thank you thank you it's a it's a great place and has so much pascor history it's excellent thank you uh with that being I'll make a motion okay go ahead motion to approve case number 24114 for the read designation of the clubhouse building at 2201 passor grow way as a local historic resource second Adam clerk roll call member Hurley yes member young yes member Hawkin Smith yes member dashel yes Cher Lowry yes motion carries okay moving on 4G certificate for appropriateness for the demolition of the shuffle board court Clubhouse located at 101 nth Avenue which is case number 24118 who has The Misfortune bringing this that's mine we can pull the PowerPoint we all got our eggs underneath so this is a city application of course the city is requesting a certificate of appropriateness to demolish shuffle board court Clubhouse building it was listed on the city's registry back in 2010 and it is also a contributing Resource as a site on the pastor gril Park site so here you can see uh the aerial of the building this is commented on in the staff report but this is outside of the coastal a Zone which means that a reconstruction of a building like this could relatively remain of the same look at grade um there would be venting requirements and and flood resistant material requirements but the east side of the lot is uh within the coastal a Zone it has those higher velocity standards where the structure is located it could be reconstructed with generally the same look as it has today here are some photographs of the structure uh this is pre-storm of course and uh here is the post storm condition I did speak to the president of the club just the other day they are still out there playing shule board of course not using the building um for obvious reasons you can see the the damage to the the building um it was moved off its foundation there's some scour beneath the found Foundation as well and so this one side you can see what appears to be the original supports for what is believed to be the open Pavilion style of this structure so as with any other structure those that have been placed on the local historic registry um cannot be denied demolition because the structure did take advantage of the substantial Improvement variance back in 2010 uh stay up to 90 days could be placed on demolition due to the extent of damage um staff is recommending approval without a stay um I believe that FEMA was out today to take a look at the structure and um I I don't know the results of that but we should be getting details on that soon uh the structure itself is important on the basis of scale there have obviously been significant exterior alterations to the structure over time I'm including its enclosure uh the structure is more important from a scale and from a recreational standpoint than from an actual aesthetic standpoint architectural standpoint um Lynn and I are looking at a potential and I'm blanking on the name of it now but the uh the a a grant um coming up in the next cycle for a possible reconstruction grant for both this as well as the Mary Pier building we are under a little bit of a deadline for the Mary Pier building we only have two years reconstructed given that it's overwater that is a limitation that the county places on reconstruction of buildings overwater but um we we don't have that limitation for the clubhouse we are looking into a grand application this year special category Grant I'm sorry and that is up to a $500,000 matching Grant so we're looking into the potential for that um in the upcoming cycle so we would have information on that as long as we make application by May uh we would probably receive word at the beginning of next year whether um whether that those funds could be awarded to this project and they are eligible for reconstruction of historic resources so we'll we'll be looking into that and bringing that option back to the historic board in the next couple of months but we are requesting um approval for this without a stay on demolition okay well that all made a lot of sense and when you talk about the Reconstruction I know we're going to be brought into this later on from what you've said and stuff but can they make it like exactly the same is that where you're I I know there there' be some qualifications but is it just using different materials but so the I can't say for every single material but the exterior elements of the structure given the location on the site with it being outside the coastal a there would be venting requirements um there would be flood prooof material requirements certainly for the inside but it appears that it could look relatively close to the way it did pre- storm and and is it capable of being reconstructive uh irrespective of whether there's a grant I mean is that something the city could just do on their own if they so want what what hurdles do we have to jump to get it done that be have it reconstructed The Way It Is Well zoning wise there's nothing preventing the building from going back there's going to be you know funding when we receive the funds for the the insurance payout and all um but okay so one my question I guess is and that's all great but where's the authority that says we can build it back the way it was that would ultimate that would ultimately come back from the down from the city manager and the city commission when they're ready to move forward okay and and I'm not trying to be nefarious by I'm just asking so like but is that and that is that because it's a city-owned piece of property we can make that decision to reconstruct it as it originally was correct I mean ultimately the design would be up to the city that's we would bring it back to you as part of the design review as we bring any structure and of course this being not a residence we don't have to worry about uh FEMA and elevation and all that kind of stuff really do we it would need to be flood proofed if it were a grade but we would not you wouldn't be subject to the elevation requirements correct is it on the agenda for commission or any part of this on the agenda for commission I don't believe the demolition is no I believe that was a city manager decision um I'm assuming budget for 2025 is done is there any funding in the budget for 2025 for the rebuilding or renovation or repair of any of the seded not for reconstruction that I'm aware of um the budgeting was for the demolition specifically so and then just sad if we know so obviously it's going to get demolished and then we it just sits idle I mean it's just a blank cor nothing gets put up there temporarily or anything of that nature right I I don't believe so no I didn't think I just asking all right so uh assuming we which we don't really have any choice will grant the demolition you will be putting it on a future calendar once we get an idea about the Grant and uh and who will Who we doing design on that or do we even know that yet we we don't know at this time it's all just what obviously first step is knocking it down right okay I spoke with someone at the uh Gulf Beach's Historic Museum today about the shuffle board Corp and they said they would be happy to accept any artifacts or remnants from the shuffle board court and and paintain and curate those does and add it onto the back of the museum I'm I'm kidding but uh no right um yeah okay and so just s clear was talking about the building itself there's going to be nothing that affects the shuffle board courts themselves or anything of that nature no no okay there are about 10 people out there playing this morning it was cold they're back yeah they're back yeah they don't live here right now do you have a motion go ahead please okay I'm make a motion to approve this certificate of appropriateness number 24118 for the demolition of the clubhouse at 101 9th Avenue I'll second that Madam clerk roll call Vice chair hackins Smith approve member dashel yes member Hurley yes member young yes chair Lowry yes motion carries all right moving on 4H certificate of appropriateness for the demolition of the residents at 2105 Gulfway case number 24119 get the PowerPoint thank you so this was a late addition to the agenda um 2105 Gul way case 24119 applicant and owner are Bill and Cory Stover they're requesting demolition of a two-story single family residence on the subject property that is deemed contributing to the P Grill National register historic district here's the location of the property you can see some photographs this one we actually did have a early photo of this is from its property card obviously pre- elevation up there in the top left of the screen uh you can see in the bottom right as part of the city's 2015 res survey um the structure it has generally retained its its massing um you can see the the knee braces under the roof line uh the louvers um which have been changed out on the primary facade of the roof um it of course has been elevated over a um elevated patio here's some photos from the applicant so uh this has not been the recipient of any of the incentives under the city's uh demolition permit or sorry local historic designation uh benefits um so the request could be be stayed but only for 30 days um it is deemed a contributing structure with respect to the proposed demolition um the historic board cannot deny the demolition however stays up up to 30 days can be imposed the applicant who I believe is present um staff requests additional testimony regarding the structural deterioration of the structure including whether a LIC professional has provided such an assessment staff also requests the applicant preserve the Historic Site wall on the Frontage of pable it was called about to be determined uh original in the 2015 res survey so we were out there the other day at the site um this the wall was still in place I know the applicant's looking to move forward with the Demolition but we would appreciate comments on whether they plan to preserve that wall so I believe the applicant's present didn't know I was speaking today uh so we don't really have a I'm sorry just state your name for the record Bill Stover yeah go ahead uh so we don't have a real plan for what we're going to do we want to build a new house here uh born and raised in St Pete my dad went to the sunshine School graduated 1953 um so you know we've been associated with pasor Grill in St P Beach forever um and we want to build a new house there we want it to be appropriate for the for the area but we we just haven't gotten to the point of of design yet so uh I do know that it is that one of the issues is how do you demo a prop property like that over a wall like that I mean that is a a problem you can't really go in from the back from the alley side and block the alley so um uh I don't know what that process would be I don't know how we would necessarily save that wall um because it's just not I have I'm not a demo person so I don't really know what the the requirements are but I do know that they said it would be very difficult to to try to do that with without potentially damaging the wall or causing potential other structural issues since the homes next door to each are pretty close by you can't really come in from the side either right and and just so like say so Brandon that's just a a question that we have that's been answered not a requirement it's not a requirement or anything I would base a decision just all we're saying is if there's some way it can be saved that would be great rightly but that's balls in your or we can you know I mean ultimately when we rebuild we' most likely have a wall there anyway so yeah our uh prop save the secure but but you know we can also you know whether or not it might look I I don't know what the house will look like yet we're not even there yet um you know we had about two feet of water through the place and um mold and everything else so it's just been kind of a disaster since and then we got the roof ripped off part of it uh from Milton so it's just been a real kind of difficult time okay well does anybody uh on the board have any I mean obviously we could delay it for 30 days if we wanted to but is there any I don't see reason to do that I don't either the only thing I would ask obviously you you know the drill a little bit when you make the plans for your new home I mean please get in contact with the city early on I mean obviously there's a lot of styles you can do and we're big fans of the ones that are a little more historic and I understand and and maybe by that time some of the ordinances might even change to to try to tighten that up a little bit but that would be great you know the people so you know um we'd appreciate that and then we'll see that we'll see you in some future date I suppose here yeah well you got it you have to approve it anyway so me we make it attractive right and appropriate the wall the wall okay all right thank you Mr Stover is there any um any version of our design guideline that's sharable yet or our guide book book it's finalized for the workshop on oh sorry the design guide book no that is something we're going to be starting soon um I have a meeting with our consultant shortly so yeah we obviously got sidetracked on all that but understandably we are working on a right on a guidelines design book to share with people who are building new homes when that's available obviously let you know all right with that I'll make a motion that we Grant a certificate of appropriateness for the demolition of 2105 GF way which is case number 2411 n and we will not requ request a 30-day stay so no stay Madam clerk uh roll call please member Hurley yes member young yes Vice chair Hawkin Smith member dashel yes chair Lowry yes motion carries all right okay now I think if this is correct we're on to number five which is a discussion item uh 5A which is the lot split requested case number 2411 two at The Residence at 104 12th Avenue we get the PowerPoint pulled up so this is 104 12th Avenue I believe the applicants are present and they are requesting approval to split the property to its original plaed condition being Mor Beach block three lots six and seven which would each be sized to support one single family residents constructed the house medium building type of the pass gril overlay District or the underlying rlm2 zoning District District that is based on the current standards um based on the drafted upcoming uh ordinance that would that would remove the ability to build to the underlying zoning District uh the existing contributing residents and out building on the western side of the existing property I'll show that in just a moment so here you can see the proposed split for the property I have asked the applicant for a new survey that shows that split prepared by a surveyor which I understand they're working on this is two full lots of the mor Beach subdivision uh the western side of the lot the western side of the uh the platted lot contains two single story single family residences those are both proposed for demolition that would be coming forward to you uh through a certificate of appropriateness for demolition the Eastern side of the lot is vacant however they are combined any lot split in passor Grill um is required to receive City commission approval and we have been bringing these requests forward to the historic board for commentary as well I did want to point out that the alleyway to the South is 10 ft uh the alleyway to the east is 18 ft so should there be reconstruction after the new standards are adopted we would ask that the Eastern lot have access from the alleyway uh the Western lot would be allowed an access from 12th Avenue so I just wanted to point that out was the last thing the Western lot would be access from where it would be allowed access from 12th Avenue based on how the standards are drafted and this would all come down to when the applicant makes application as well as whether those standards are adopted right okay and and on that note just so for for future discussion I know we've talked about it before when we talked about Alleyways and what the platted widths of them were and is is 10 feet do as far as you know that is the platted width of that particular alley there I believe so yes and so the way you'll have to refresh me if you can again this is for future reference but you know what I I'm getting at right so when we talked about potentially making the alleys the the exit and egress for uh parking what was the width we had on that it's 15 ft okay and it's and and this is one alley that is is it you know it's 10 feet the whole WD length of it the east east west length I'm I'm fairly sure I believe we only have a few Alleyways for the Northern end that have that have varying widths throughout I believe it's 10 ft okay and and for future reference again you know can we at some point when we talk about those potential changes find out exactly how many alleys are less than 15 feet because I know when we discussed that 15 was kind of an arbitrary term and I'm just thinking that 10 feet can get a car down it as long as you know we might have to have it one way or something like that but yeah I I could come up with that all right good okay and then after the if these do get split these are actually basically 50 by 100 that's what it turns out to be it looks like 4 44 by 100 okay yeah it's strange because it says 50 feet in the middle is that because maybe I'm looking at something strange here so this would be what what would the two lot sizes be they would be 44 by 100 which is the minimum for that zoning right and they but they originally platted as two to start with correct they were combined at some point all right and of course this is just a discussion I had mean that you're just looking for us to give some guidance so you can tell the commission what our feelings about it was correct yes all right well chair people what do you I mean uh board members what do you think about this I'm tell I'm familiar with the property I know that lot's probably been vacant forever maybe I don't know if they ever had anything on it and and and most those lots right there are all that same width aren't they yes so will our approval for demolition include a requirement for or approval for the lot division include a requirement for the demolition because if not then you have two single family homes on one single family lot with encroaching setbacks right that's something we handle administratively the demolition needs to be completed prior to us approving it through the property appraiser they would approve that split okay so do we need put that language in our motion there we go but do we really have a motion or we just have a motion to make a recommendation this is just a discussion you're talking about when the demolition occurs when right but at this stage we're just you will go from this to the commission and if there were any comments that the board had that you would like us to carry forward which that's certainly one we'll we'll bring those up to the commission does anybody have any comments that you'd like to hear the commission here about this potential a lot split uh no it's if they remove the multi-units on the one half of it it would meet all the requirements single family home and a and a studio on the on the west side which as it sits would meet density requirements for the entire parcel but if they remove that then it would be open I have spoken with the applicant and they understand that they would be allowed one single family residence per lot so just out of curiosity it's two single family residents by the same owner though right and how is this any distinct how's this a distinction one from like a garage apartment that's unattached just that it's not a garage or what they would still be treated as one density unit some municipalities allow for garage apartments at a certain size or in a certain location to not count against the density regulation St P Beach does not do that right so for all so there's quite a number of homes that built you know rage departments in the back and so at least the way it is now in the future if somebody demolishes that they're they can't rebuild it the way it was correct well we do have that special provision in passor Grill which is being retained in the new amendments um that if someone has a non-conforming structure which is very common down in P gril they do have the ability to rebuild it now the current constraint from what I've heard from Property Owners is that there can be no additional square footage added on to that structure in the rebuild which can make it challenging with building and fire codes heard that right okay but um they they have the ability even even if they were to have three units they would have the ability to rebuild but they would be limited to that square footage gotcha so okay all right you think you've heard what do we you need to hear so go forward okay all right so we had some other items for discussion uh it states that we're supposed to make a motion but does it I had I had moved that on if if the board is if you made your comments you can you don't need to provide a motion so okay it's thank you I do something wrong I'm just kid okay so now we're talking about uh some of the additions we've had to the agenda and uh one of the so Brandon I just wanted to ask this some some just some general questions I I you know I get a lot of people that are ask questions you know on Pastor girl about you know there's substantial damage letters or they haven't got it yet that kind of stuff and you and I have talked about that so I'm I'm just trying to satisfy some of my own curiosity and and it seems like lately there's a new little wrinkle that they the city's telling people to go ahead and have their houses re appraised weren't we initially just going by the property appraised value has that changed or I've just been hearing that in the last week so and and this is only for structures that are not in the local historic registry we are no longer sending letters substantial damage letters to Property Owners with a home on the historic registry when they are eligible for a substantial Improvement exception um they can just proceed right on to permitting for anyone else um we have based our damage values on the property appraisers estimates one of the most straightforward ways to appeal is to have a certified appraisal that shows that our estimate of the damage is less than 50% of the reappraised market value of the structure um if someone hasn't contracted yet to have their home repaired if they don't have that estimate for the cost to restore the structure having that appraisal is one way that they can appeal without necessarily having that in place so right and and I knew that's the way it kind of was I mean that's what I had been hearing in the past and that made sense but I've recently heard from two properties who claim they have not got a substantial damage letter but they're being told by the city to go ahead and get an appraisal a new appraisal you heard anything like that which is I just want if they maybe they've changed and they decided not to go with the the property appraiser because these folks don't even know what the percentage is you know what I mean and so I can see how it could be advantageous in the long run but I don't I thought maybe there' been some procedural change that they're being told to do it before they even get a letter I'm not aware of that the only thing I can think of is it does take us several days to process that data once it comes in so it might be known but there might not be a letter produced yet so well and obviously you can see the the I wouldn't want people to go to get a new appraisal if it turns out they're not substantially damaged then they just wasted their time in a way on the other hand if the city's not using the property appraisers appraisal then that makes sense that's why I was wonder if there's something been a change or something no that's still the basis unless we have information to the contrary so I think for some people if they had four feet of water in their homes and they don't have their substantial damage letter yet they can probably assume they're going to get one well they certainly can because everyone gets substantially damaged even when they aren't cuz you're getting a lot of appeals of people who you know I had a lady who all she needs to do is sand or floors and they said her house was like 78% damaged and it wasn't I mean you know she you know because no one got in the house they're just making a lot there's guest work so uh I mean I think you're right Tia but the way I heard it came a little bit different that's why I was I was questioning whether there had been a change and what the city was doing but I think substantially damaged or not substantially damaged it behooves somebody to get that appraisal because if regardless of the percentage it could be a lesser percentage depending upon the appraisal value yes and it it could depending on your situation show your loss if you you've taken a loss on your property you know for your tax purposes yeah I'm not saying there's not a valid reason to do that just the way it came to me questioned whether we were still operating under what I thought was going from the property appraisers which apparently we are so the people that have said something to me they're even they have either not giving me the full story they don't quite understand what's going on so that's all I want be know and I I haven't heard anything to the contrary but and I would I would do this in in private but I think if actually someone's listening they can maybe hear something you know so that's why I'm saving it for these kind of situations okay well that's really good and we still don't know on the substantial damage letters that we don't really know people I got a question is everyone on the beach going to get one even if you're FEMA complain or only the non- FEMA compliant homes do you know the answer to that that is a good question um city manager is coming up oh hello hi hello good afternoon right now the plan is to try to get everyone a letter right so even we have a group of residents now um in Vena in particular where there was probably no water intrusion at all in that neighborhood based on the flood elevation we're look maybe a few but even in those cases we're starting to look at flood elevation and if you were above I think seven and a quarter is the the number we're using right now we're going to send you a letter and say you had none so we want every property to have something in the record given the substantial nature I understand why you would want to do that I just didn't know and then you know in case they want to sell down the road that they have an official document from the city of whether or not there was water yeah that makes sense and I I just you know I know it's you know we don't really have a a a calendar on when everyone's going to get them or if you get if it's neighborhood by neighborhood I realize there's a private entity kind of involved in s of those things but okay I thank you very much that that that answers some of that I think the website's been a great resource as well to be able to go on and pull up the permits and just take you know type in the address and I've been able to actually help a lot of Neighbors in Vina um to try to find out what their percentages are and and get the ball rolling for them whatever the direction might be John hi thank you I have a couple of general questions about this whole substantial damage issue we received a non-substantial damage letter and I'm curious as to how the percentage was determined I have no quarrel with the value the tax assessor says the structure is worth or valued at but I'm very curious about how the percentage was determined because when I apply that percentage to the Assessor's valuation there was nowhere that number was nowhere near the damage we incurred which as I said earlier was essentially minimal well I don't have to answer that but I would also say maybe you shouldn't ask I don't know I'm I'm I'm weer I'm leery of kicking the Hornet's Nest believe me know right I don't know and I don't know Brandon if you know the answer either you had 30% damage and you didn't and then if a storm comes down the way later and it says you have 50% damage and you already had 30% and don't have anything on file that you remedied 30% I feel like that could be a little bit of a you anticipated my second question thank you so this non-substantial determination goes in a sense on your permanent file as we used to say in high school is that correct it it does but the city now has no cumulative calculation so what and and other homeowners have asked this as well if the city sent a letter stating that we assume that your structures sustain 40% damage but in reality it's sustained 10 that's the C you know repair cost of the structure in the issuance of that permit and the close out of that permit that is effectively the appeal of the higher non-substantial damage now for those homeowners who receive no damage at all in which they are not going to be applying for a permit at all um I would recommend that you just reach out and request an appeal of the non-substantial damage because you don't want that to be something that comes up down the line um because it'll be looked at as non- redy damage just so you have that in writing that it's not your record expunged yes yeah so I I don't have to sit in front of the principal's office anymore um to whom do I make that appeal it would we we have um and I can send you the information it's SDA appeal STP beach.org s c uh SD substantial damage appeal SD appeal at STP beach.org thanks um you reminded me of something and brain cramp I'm sorry I'll think of it um SD appeal at St Pete beach.org correct yes thank you appreciate it you're welcome thank you okay any as far as discussions on those anything else about that I know you have something else you want to add to you um well I wanted to talk about the museum just very briefly but then I had one other item we received late in the day the letter from the attorneys about the redesign ation I don't know if everybody on the board had a chance to get that letter before coming here but um I I don't think that our intent was to do a mass blanket redesignation on everything that was designated I know we need to go through the process but I thought maybe if we compiled a list of those properties that need to be redesignated rather than wait until there was a need to do it on an individual basis that that might be more efficient yeah absolutely we can certainly do that and we we have our list we know which have not been redesignated so we can have those ready to go um I think our concern is that despite the fact that you you saw the uh the Women's Club today it obviously deserves to be redesignated on the registry um we just do need to have that that pass through because those criteria the secretary of the interiors's uh criteria were not evaluated when they were plac in the registry I know it still needs to be documented and photographed and um more recently defined before we can approve anything but to be more proactive than reactive might save us time later we have a lot on our plates right now but um well you know for example in the Women's Club which we all agree with that and that was a a great presentation that staff put together on that too because it helps you know the whole record historical record as far as that goes but on some of these other houses is there abbreviated review you can do you know or or it it there's there's another there's a file already exist I think we had a conversation you and I did about some of the files being missing or being and and I don't know the status of that but you know and because some of the property owners on these properties are not the same as when they were designated initially and it's voluntary maybe they don't want to be so maybe the initial thing is you were designated at one time you have the opportunity to be redesignated do you want to and then kind of make our short list from there yeah I think that's that's a good point and and but as Tia mentioned too which I think makes a lot of sense you know if you're absentee owner and you think your house is a storic and you got some damage and then you want to get it fixed now you realize it's no longer considered historic because it was before 2005 you know that puts people in a delay mode that causes some anxiety and stuff so I think we should try to grab the bull by the horns and and contact the people to find out if they want to do it or not right and then again while we're in such communication with the Property Appraiser's office for getting all of this Flood information correlated it might not be a bad time to again address the disclosure of historic designation historic district properties in that public record on the property appraiser record on the property appraiser website yeah is there even a place for that there is okay all right anything else that's all unless we want to talk about the museum very quickly go ahead okay so um Gulf Beach's Historic Museum they um they have their super supper tonight which is fundraiser and information at um Warren Webster at 5:30 this evening um the little Christmas trees that they made from debris from from the structures they're so cute um anyway we had those out in front of the museum and people hand paint little seashells and hung them on the trees and every time I walk by I see fewer and fewer seashell ornaments on the trees which made me mad at first and then I thought how sweet that someone like took that as a little gift from the museum and probably put that on their trees so if you're out and about and you want to paint a little seashell and hang it on the tree maybe somebody else will take your seash sweet they can sweetly steal it that's Ste it I think they just thought it was a gift I thought it was there for the taking I really do cuz it's right there on the sidewalk and doesn't say don't yeah put a sign up this says take one only one so take one leave one please are they going to stay up for a while you don't have anything else to put there so I think it's great I think it's wonderful I do love it it's very sweet um no no permits there yet so friends of Gul beaches have applied for FEMA assistance um for the artifacts and the interior uh materials and the county has applied to FEMA for assistance for the exterior and the structure Cal uh reconstruction um no site visits for either of those have been scheduled yet so they're waiting for those donations are always accepted the mailbox slot is working on the front door so drop a check in the door and someone will come and pick it up maybe we should do a donation and take a ornament sh ornament yeah take an ornament put a dollar in the door or more okay chair I did just have two things to add I just wanted to remind the board that on the 28th will be the workshop with the commission for to discuss the changes to the overlay and the community redevelopment District 8th Avenue um staff is also working on applications for the February meeting and we've started to get a few in that may be on the March meeting um we are holding the applications open till tomorrow for the February meeting I think we're well over a dozen at this point and we expect several for March after the March meeting we are going to try to work back toward our typical lead times for applications which is usually about five weeks um we understand that emergencies come up but those are that is something we're going to try to sustain it's been um it's been a lot of Staff time getting these applications moved forward so uh the February meeting we're working on the agenda now and then we'll have several other um items that we know are coming in for the March meeting but we just wanted to make you aware of that okay and on 28th is that at 4 o' that is it might be at 4:30 let me see here that is it four yes and so that's that's our meeting with the commission where we're going to talk about our proposed changes right right this are you going to resend things before then I mean I know we probably had it sent a few months ago but change or not we made some modifications based on the planning board's feedback and this will be specifically to discuss in the same type of Workshop format after that barring any major changes we'll bring it back to the historic board from there it'll go on to the planning board and then return to the city commission for vote so we can tweak things on the 28th yes if we need to absolutely for sure okay anything else yes yes l hi hello Lyn Rosetti historic planner for St Pete Beach we are having a community meeting here in city hall with the Don cazar and Bel Vista neighborhood associations to discuss the historic survey results with them let them know what we did what we found and I'm sure it's going to be a big question and answer type of thing it's going to be like I said on the 27 2nd of January beginning at 5:30 is that here in this room right here in this room okay M at what time 5:30 okay okay we but did we're we're uh wrapping up an agenda development right now and you know we hope a lot of people will come will that be something that will you when you do the agenda will you send that a copy of that to the historic board we could do that absolutely I think that would be excellent if you could include us so it be a reminder and we know what's what do you want to call this Lyn so I can get that information out to the belvista association I'm gonna do do we have a specific name Gil for this or the DVP all right flower that up a little bit okay yeah thank good one all right so right now then our next me meeting is set for February 6th any other matters journ thank you all