e e e e [Music] are we ready okay before we start Anita yes this is Mark hi hi Mark nice to meet you nice to meet you and that over there is Frank hi Frank hey now how you doing good how are you okay so it's 401 let me call this meeting to order roll call please Cher cenny yeah Vice chair brille here board member kovis here board member Hawkins board member Noble board member Moser here board member mccristal here okay let's rise for the [Music] pledge I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with li Justice for would you like to swear in our newest member of course uh for the record Lee bagot City attorney um mov kovas kovas kovis you'll raise raise your right hand uh do you have the oath in front of you I do not no we have an extra copy hi it'll be easier to follow along sure great thank you so if you'll repeat after me I state your name I Dr Anita kovas am qualified under the Constitution laws of Florida and the code of ordinances for the city of Stewart Florida am qualified under the Constitution laws of Florida and the code of ordinance of the city of Stuart Florida to serve as a member of the community redevelopment board to serve as a member of the community redevelopment board and that I will well and Faithfully perform the duties of an Advisory Board member and that I will well and Faithfully perform the duties of an Advisory Board member on which I'm about to enter so help me God on which I am about to enter so help me God thank you okay congratulations thank you this is like your third board isn't it second for the city second for the city okay uh can I get a motion to approve the agenda so moved can I get a second second we have a motion by marks excuse me second it all all uh in favor I okay approval of the minutes I got Mo Mark you're you're making a motion to approve yes and I got a second second second by Andy all in favor I okay chair can we just U let the record ref like that Andy Noble arrived at 401 p.m. he was so silent that I forgot to mention that okay comments from the public Milton are you public comments by board members non-agenda items okay none of that Aaron let the record show that Aaron has arrived all right welcome okay pel you want to take it sure um so this is a D and D item discussion deliberation uh this was actually requested by the crb board to bring forward the landscape code for discussion um it's been a while since um we've amended this code so uh it's probably a good idea to start uh revisiting and and looking at the code uh we did ask the board um to provide your comments uh prior to the meeting I did send out an email as a reminder um so that way we have those comments ahead of time so staff can be better prepared to respond I did get comment from Nick shro who is no longer on the board and Bonnie Moser um so we can go through some of her comments also and um and then if there are any additional comments uh we would like to hear from the board and uh also recommendation on if we should move forward with uh amending in the code which would actually have to go before the city commission uh requesting them U to move forward with amendment process uh I have Chris here from the development team um they regularly use the landscape code so um he's more familiar with um of the uh code requirements um so he's here to help me or assist me uh with the process um so if we can you read those the comments were provided in your agenda package um let me see if I can enlarge it so the first comment that we we received from Nick uh was to create some sort of mechanism whereby the health of the site Landscaping Etc is more than just the plan for example if the mitigation was 100 in and the replacement was 250 in as long as the inches are there uh the landscape plan doesn't need to be strictly adhered to so long as the are there um we would like to hear from the board how they feel about this um typically um the landscape plan is provided as part of the development project so the city commission um does review it and approve the landscape plan so if they want to um deviate from the plan it could go through administrative approval process where the development department um could review it and uh it would be at the discretion of the development director uh depending on um you know the type of changes they're making to the plan or it would need to go before uh the board as a minor or major Amendment um so do you think that um if they are deviating from the landscape code um that as long as they're replacing it on site um do you think um that it shouldn't matter uh but keep in mind when it's a buffer you know we do want them to put it back where it needs to go um so it will depend on Case by casee basis okay Frank do you have any comments as I recall this conversation was about uh what we see with the developments that pretty much clearcut everything and then say oops and then they pile tremendous amount of landscaping into a small space around the outside provides cover for for the development while it's being developed kind of quiets the public for a while but what you what you end up with is a bunch of trees that are planted too close together fighting each other for everything and unhealthy trees but in the end the code works because uh again those inches are about circumference around you know how much circumference is in the trunk in the end I guess the uh some trees shade out the others but a long decade long process of ugliness and basically as far as making a community livable and having shade trees all throughout the community you know they're just they're just getting as much space to build on as possible and and use and and and getting getting through The Code by by doing what what we see right now and uh he was he was a he he agreed Nick agreed that uh you can you can look at well one one good example is uh the the community next to Walmart and behind Aldi's uh that's a good example of of what you end up with u so anyway that's that's what this is all about I don't it's it's not going to get changed I mean we can't fight we're not GNA fight and we're not going to win a battle on this that but that's what it's about it's it's wrong and but I don't see his change in it Bonnie um I don't have any comments about that but I do want to say I have a master's of landscape architecture sometimes the strategy for that over planting is to provide the immediate buffer um and I made a comment about it um further down but um the idea there is that down the road maybe you would call some of those trees um but there like there should be a strategy to it the same with whatever you're plan underneath right because when you initially plant underneath you're getting full sun but in 15 years when those trees grow you need new undercover and and that was next point that that once you know once it's done nobody really thinks that way and goes back and does what really needs to be done to make him healthy yeah uh Andy do you have anything to add not really not really okay Anita do you want to weigh in I have to go along with Bonnie on that um yeah you want to do immediate to to get the shade and to get that planting in there um but also be mindful of of trees that are going to have big routes that are going to disrupt you know sidewalks and roadways and that sort of thing but I'd also like to hear since we have Milton in the room if he's got anything that he wants to add because he boots on the ground did you have anything that you wanted to add to the conversation this time thanks Aaron no don't don't really have anything Mark yeah I I kind of I kind of somewhat agree with Frank uh but my comment relates to the fact that who cares because we don't have any enforcement um you know we had a project out there that chopped down everything I think they should have been shut down I mean you've got a PUD that that's part of the design and you don't do it then you got to go back to square one and start over again and we need some sort of enforcement that's a different question no sorry no it isn't because the question was you know relative to this this situation on the same site it's the same thing if if they've been told to do something whether they can mitigate it or not that should require approval in advance and the fact that they don't do it and and in many cases it's not possible that the one that we're talking about it wasn't even possible to do it so you know I would like to see that there's some language put in all of this that allows us to re these things in because when this came up before the commission you know a year ago or whenever it was everybody just sat back and said well you know there's really nothing we can do and that's what I'm upset about well I'm I'm just going to comment on this for the moment and I'm going to say if I I think it should come back to development so that someone that knows a lot more can say yeah this is this is fine or this is not fine and if you believe and at some point if you think in development that it should come back to a board or the commission then it should come back to the board and the commission we're not talking I mean if you're asking me do I think what happened two years ago was fine the answer is no but I as regard guarding this particular comment I believe that it should come to development and development can make the decision whether it's good or not and if whether it needs to go to a board or not for final determination could I just add yes you may um and and penol I I think that you're 100% right is that you know some of this buffer was a buffer you know some of it was there to make these things not look ugly so that as you drive by you see this monstrosity you know it was to it was to make it you know a little softer and and that's a big deal if you take that out of a project I think so anyway that's okay do you have enough on that I hope yes have enough Direction all right um moving on to Bonnie's comments um first one is some species listed in the shade tree section are not actually considered to have a shade canopy either their shade or size of uh varieties wouldn't be effective American Holly dahun Holly and Mongolia are three that I would recommend having a landscape architect review for potential new recommendations um we agree with that comment again we have not amended the code in a while so it is time to look at different type of trees that we should add um as a as shade trees on our list um if you have any other comments on that inste of me going around does every anyone have a comment on that and staff would like to see that in the code okay uh no I think it's a good idea so I think B I mean let you know I will let Bonnie take the lead on stuff like this since that's where her degree is so I think she could guide us very well did you want to say something I agree with you okay uh second next one question is um who is enforcing the twoyear survival uh requirement are there any requirements for developments to have a long-term Landscape Management plan I ask because sometimes tree plants are designed to provide immediate shade with mass planting and then intended to be pruned thinned as planting is mature um do you want to respond to that I know um it has to do with uh resources uh we just don't have the resources to um manage uh the landscape plans that get approved um so that is something the development team would be looking at hiring additional staff to help um help meet this requirement would you like to add anything yeah I mean I'm not the development director Chris mccraine for the record with the development department um but our uh development director is looking at Staffing a position that would be like a compliance officer uh that could keep track of some of these conditions of approval um for landscaping and and different various aspects of the the development plan so um but yes the funding is is tough so but we're looking into that okay um we don't have a city landscape architect do we have um anybody contracted for the position you do yeah we uh use I believe ew uh is one of our environmental Consultants we also use kimley horn okay um to to review most of the bigger landscape plans um some of the the minor development plans we review those internally but they they don't enforce anything they review the plan and say to our our board or the commission this is a good plan this meets with the requirements yeah the the the consultant would receive the plans review them and then based on the plans they would provide us comments um suggestive comments you know anything that needs to be updated uh per our Land Development code um and then we would give those to the the applicant or the board itself could make a deviation from the code well I'm with Mark I you know I think I think our enforcement part is well under what it should be and and so you know it's nice that we go through the steps to get something approved but if if we don't enforce it then what's what's the difference so yeah I think that's a pretty I think that I think a person to enforce our code when it comes to things like that and I'm not talking about the building official I'm talking about landscaping and other less serious matters I I think it's important because that's how people see the city so we spend a lot of time looking to do something and then we get it done well in six months from now was it really done or two years after the development we don't nobody knows and nobody cares so I'm with Mark completely that we need someone to to do that it's well worth the money otherwise we should lessen the codes so that they don't have a hardship but I think they're very important okay thank you we agree um next is generally I would recommend having a landscape architect review and update the codes particularly to incorporate U liid low impact development and storm water treatment guidance as well as to review plant materials um a we agree we need to incorporate some of these elements into the code and we need to revisit the code and update um to meet the current situations current events um so that is something think the development department is looking at and hopefully um they will bring this these comments and any additional comments from City commission and and work on amendments um hopefully in the next six months six to one year six months does anyone disagree with that no yeah I think it's a good idea did anyone have any additional comments regarding the landscape let's go in order so that we don't go all over Frank do you have any additional comments yeah one more Barb on the uh you know scrape everything and then put the buffer around it to make sure the public kind of calms down a little bit uh on the way to Indiantown on the right hand side is a big industrial Plaza just went in and they did the same thing and what's interesting is they use a ton of uh the native uh long needle Pines I don't know what else to call them but man within two weeks I'm looking at those things and they're literally jumping out of the ground they're look like they're growing like new new growth about an inch a day or more and I'm thinking wow unbelievable what are they doing here and I got to thinking they're watering the hell out of those things every day so now we've got this monster buffer that's going to have no no roots whatsoever so first hurricane man it's all coming down because those trees are not not throwing their Roots down as as normal and just one more Barb that's all and are we G so are we off this totally or there more is there more to go on this topic these are the only comments that I received from the board um it's open for discussion at this point I I got a question for uh for Bonnie uh couple one is it folklore or because everyone in the business is always told me this to be true a palm tree gets 60% of its new growth energy from reabsorbing the chlorophyll from the lower fronds that get back into the heart and that's about 60% of the new energy of the tree is that true uh I don't know specifically but I have heard your comments about the palm trees being overt trimmed um around town and I would agree with you there I think no so so you don't that's you have never heard of that you don't know that to be true or not no I'm not sure okay well anecdotal evidence say if you watch them you see the ones if you look at a sable over 10 years the ones that get butchered every usually happens in the winter time when the landscapers don't have any work for their for their guys and they got to still bring in income uh and they take it to the rich people and cut all their palm trees and make them look worse and less healthy um next question for Bonnie um I guess there's a disease because I'm a big you know advocate of Sables thinking they're bulletproof as but come to find out in the last month I'm reading and hearing things from other landscapers that there really is a a disease that's affecting all palms and the Sable Palm which seems amazing to me uh I heard it was brought in from another country on different Palms do you know anything about that and do you think we're in the beginning of something that's going to wipe out a lot of the Sables um I don't know about a new one I do know that a lot of the Phoenix species get diseased really easily because they're not native to here but no oh yeah I I don't practice landscape architecture anymore I have it for probably four or five years I just do Urban Design since I read about it and started looking around I like looking and I was like oh yeah and just here and there can we bring this back to the sure Thomas have some fun at it go ahead no no I'm done we're good sure why not all right Anita um I just a comment do we ever work with the AG Agricultural Extension agent that's over um at the fairgrounds I we've worked with Native Plant Society of mar County um they've recommended some species to us for some of our neighborhood uh res residential uh tree program and also the Federal Highway tree program um and I believe we worked with IIs too for the Federal Highway tree program so we are familiar with them and we would probably reach out to them um should we move forward with code Amendment and for recommendations of trees and does the city do a five-year plan that they update regularly um about overall work that's done in the city I mean could this be part of that that when that gets updated we have a CIP that comes before us every year and it goes out you know more than five years actually it's 10 years right right so yeah it'll come it'll probably come before you sometime in August yeah yeah it's part of the budget yeah but we have the CRA plan too we also have the CRA plan I provide an update and Milton Milton Milton just a quick note well make a big note there so we can have you on tap to the mic please Milton leet Public Works director who work IAS uh yearly with them as far as uh all our trees go and do we do have our date Pals inoculated every so so often to keep the disease from attacking our date bombs so we do monitor our trees as far as that part goes okay all right Aaron do you have anything to add uh no nothing mark my only uh question or comment was uh if we if we do look to bring somebody in to do this kind of review first of all I don't think we need full-time staff you know subcontractor but it would be nice if we could find somebody who was not actively involved in current plans because you know that's you know all of those Landscape Architects generally are trying to manage these plans through the city and so be nice if we'd get somebody who's a little more independent uh and is not looking to make a living off of what they're doing right now but that's just my comment okay Andy oh anything else besides comments uh I think it's a I think what you want to do is makes perfect sense I don't have anything to add the only thing I did send you and it really doesn't apply to this I know but I sent it to you anyways was when we approve and give money for uh Landscaping this board we should make sure that all the Landscaping has an IR has irrigation connected to it and I don't know I don't think it goes into this code that's the burp program and we are bringing that uh to the board next month for discussions okay so I I just like you to remember that because yeah I too often we we spend thousands of dollars and then people don't really take care of the plants and again since we don't have anyone to go around 6 months from now we'll never know how those plants survived so I was just going to add we do like for PUD U approvals we do require a landscape maintenance plan and irrigation plan but again to your point it's nobody there to enforce it um so so um do we have anything else do you want add anything Lee on how this works from here um guess it would be worth noting that um obviously part of the duties and responsibilities for amending the landscape code fall under the um LPA um now y all's um your board here deals with the urban code amendments which does include and incorporate the Land Development code on landscaping and it provides extra exceptions and uh that would be in section three 0103 uh at the very end section g on Landscaping just to point that out that would probably be the only thing I I know we're having some recommendations but some of the stuff might still need to go through the LPA the more the mar right yeah so more more minds and uh discussion on it the better yeah the only thing I want to add is I don't when I I think when it comes to Landscaping we shouldn't get give the applicant too much leeway I think that's a mistake and I think we should should have our code AS up to dat as possible and then enforce it as much as possible that would be my only recommendation on something like that okay do you have any is there anything else that anyone wants to discuss I I did have um along the same lines here a little bit but just as a general note for us to maybe consider in the future is I still don't fully understand where the urban code designations that we've got I I understand how they work in a city like downtown but I don't really understand how an urban neighborhood works out six miles from downtown or outside the CR would be in the county it's a county well maybe not that was my joke maybe if you wound around and then went down this road you could get six six and a half but my point is you know we've got we've got code that's being implemented they're talking about implementing an urban code in what's a Suburban environment and I I don't understand exactly where those kind of where that works you know what I mean um so it's just a question I had I I don't understand it are you referring to Urban service boundary no we don't have one in the city no we don't have one I'm referring to we have in in downtown Stewart and in the CRA General we have Urban neighborhood urban center Urban us one or whatever Urban Waterfront and and in a city where you know you've got limited uh plants and planning capabilities limited uh other opportunities it makes sense but now we take that same thing out and we put it out at projects that we you know are looking at outside that are you know not anywhere close to the walkable downtown and we're using that code out there and I I don't see how that work no we don't use urban C we don't I I thought that was what C the SI boundary is actually larger than the urban district and we haven't updated the the extension of the CRA with the urban code district so the urban code is is just within a certain portion of our CRA there's Urban Highway urban center Urban General Urban neighborhood Urban Waterfront where the red sidewalks are where the pink sidewalks are right yeah um so it it's not the entire CRA so but but P what I was then I'm confused because I thought that one of the projects is being considered right now on us one is requesting a change to an urban neighborhood type of zoning and I thought that the project that went in next to Costco is under an urban code zoning are you talking about those those are plan units uh lee do you want to say anything Chris explain the difference what is somebody so if you're referring to aan Lea for instance which is in the CRA but it is z or has a future landus designation of special neighborhood special district which similarly works as a a small town if you will it has those development approvals built into it which require City commission approval um but I think our Land Development code for instance like the the urban code specifically has certain exceptions to the chapter six Land Development code which is universal throughout the city so certain Urban codes in East Stewart neighborhood zoning districts they have exceptions to our overall land uh landscape code but just in general so the project that that's up on us one the where the Eden multif family is that the one you're referring to yeah okay so that's a cpud commercial plan unit development but weren't they talking about or requesting and my question is can that type of project request an urban uh an urban code Type Z the urban the urban zoning designations are required under the downtown future land use so they require specific land use all right which is going to be restricted to pretty much downtown to the C even even less than the CRA right or is it less yeah less the there's a lot of properties even um East on East Ocean where the CR boundaries are still and they're Zone B2 they have straight zoning R2 R3 but by the hospital that's all straight zoning but it's yeah okay I just was asking and again I think zoning is different than what we're talking about today correct okay is anyone else have any other questions do you have anything Lee I have nothing Milton do you want to you know weigh in again you sure okay I just have a quick update at the last meeting the board asked um you know method to protect the murals and what we can incorporate as part of the requirement uh for the application so I've added um we have a budget worksheet that they have to submit as part part of the application and um they would have to provide a clear code with UV protection um as part of the budget worksheet so uh it would be something that they would be required to do uh before completing you know uh before submitting for uh reimbursement for the program um so this is one way to resolve that issue and how we can help protect the murals and and you know maintain them for a long longer period of time so this is something that will be added um I don't need a motion it's just a minor change we'll we'll just tweak the application a little bit and add that but we just I just want to make sure that the board feels comfortable with this amendment anyone not feel comfortable okay anything else panel that's all I have if there's nothing else by from anyone meeting ad journey I should just asked about that question m I just d e