##VIDEO ID:vGLz5BEQ6oM## I now call to order the regular session meeting of the Board of Commissioners of the City of Tarpon Springs on Tuesday, November 19th, 2024 at 6:30 p.m. City clerk roll call please. Mayor. Yes. Here. Vice mayor Culianu's here. Eisner. Here. Commissioner DiDonato. Here. Commissioner Banther. Here. Tonight's invocation will be given by Pastor Kerzner of Saint Timothy Lutheran Church, located here in Tarpon Springs. Please stand and remain standing for the Pledge of Allegiance. The Lord be with you. Heavenly father, we just thank you for the gift that you've given us of life, this city that you've given us to live in. Help us to be good stewards. We pray that you would be with us in this time. Following the hurricane to help one another and to heal. We ask that you would be with our leaders, that you would give them wisdom and patience, that you would help them to work together for the sake of the whole. Be with our residents. Help them to live well and protect us from the evil one. Lord, we lift our city. We lift this meeting up to you. We ask all of this in the name of the Most High. The father, the son, and the Holy Spirit. Amen. Pledge of allegiance to the fla. To the river which is one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. A few announcements on tonight's agenda. Item 14 approved or item four. Excuse me. Approve fDOT sub grant for Highway Traffic Safety Project CPG dash 2025. City of Tarpon Dash 00186. That has been deferred to December 3rd, 2024. BoCC Regular Session item 31 resolution 2024-54 ratifying election Results November 5th, 2024. There is an addendum and item 32, ordinance 202401 Land Development Code amendment amending article seven heritage preservation and providing for creation of Neighborhood Conservation overlay districts. Application 20 2-112 Legislative has been deferred to a date certain of December 17th, 2024. We will now go to Special Presentations. Item number one status update on hurricane Recovery. And we have fire Chief Scott Young to present. Good evening, Scott Young fire Chief, just a quick update of where we're at. I won't take that long. The city is still under a state of local emergency. We signed that again today. And you'll ratify those tonight. So, you know, the final day of debris pickup from our contractor was last Friday. The landfill will be going back to normal operations Thursday. Correct. For all residents and contractors. We are pretty much done picking up debris throughout the city. We've done a very good job getting it all done. But you'll still see the big piles out at the landfill. That's going to take probably up to about Christmas. There, we're guessing, to get rid of all that. So that's the next step in the big project. But I wanted to let you all know that since October, we've picked up about 126,000yd■!T of debris. That's mixed debris with the vegetative stuff and home debris. We're guessing about 160,000. When all is said and done. Permit fees are still waived for those that are doing work on their homes. So if you have anything you need to do at your home and you need permits, now's the time to come in and get it. Those are for the affected homes that are by the storm. You probably have seen or not. The building inspectors are out from Tetra Tech. They're out doing inspections. As of today, they've done about 300 inspections throughout the city and they're continually doing more. We'll be waiting to get all the data in. They have to put it through their programs to see what we have. As far as damage, substantial damage, mild damage, etcetera. We're hoping to get those in the next few days or by the beginning of next week, hopefully. And then we'll go for the next step. What we have to do from that point. We are taking names on a voluntary basis of those who may be interested in getting some grant money to do home stuff to their homes for mitigation. That's what take. Sending out letters of interest and they can fill it out and send it back to us and put their names on a list. So we want the money does come available to us. Which could take probably a year to two years before that grant money is available. So it's a long, long process. But we'll keep your name on file and we'll get Ahold of you when that process starts. Again, the city wide cleanup day was rescheduled to January 12th. That's pretty much where we're at. Right now, I don't know how many more weeks we'll go with the state of emergency. We checked with the county. They don't see it stopping right away. As long as we have resources in town working and doing recovery efforts for us, we'll keep the declaration. So we stay under the guidance for the money. So with that, I'll open it up to any type of questions you might have. Thank you chief. Are there any public comments on this special presentation? I t are there any zoom comments? If anyone would like to make a public comment on this item, please raise your hand and you'll be allowed into talk. And we do not have any raised hands at this time. Thank you. It staff or board and questions or comments for Chief Commissioner Banther. Yes. Thank you, chief. How many homes, if you know, have met that 50% threshold that we've been talking about? That's what we're waiting on for the data to come in from our contractor. They've been going through the homes. They they have a form they fill out. They put all the information into a program of theirs through FEMA, and that'll come out and tell them that this home, this home or this home. Once we have that, we'll, you know, get that information to you guys. So we just don't have it yet. No problem. Thank you. Any other questions from the board? Chief, I just want to thank the whole staff. Thank you. Tom. Mr. Duncan, everybody and everyone involved with this debris pickup. We, you know, we set a goal of the Saturday before Thanksgiving, and you all have beat that tremendously. And you guys have let it known for the rest of the county and the region that how great of a job you've done and setting up all these contracts in place and ahead of time. We took a lot of criticism to it at the same time, but we understand and I just can't thank you all enough. And then being ahead of this mitigation request with FEMA and stuff, doing a great thing for the residents. So we can't thank you enough. Thank you. Thank you sir. Team. Okay. It's a thank you. We are now going to go to public comments. Are there any public comments that will not be or any agenda items this evenin? It do we have any public comments? Anyone online would like to make a public comment on items not on the agenda. Please raise your hand and you'll be allowed into talk. And we do not have any raised hands at this time. Thank you. We will now go to the Consent Agenda Items item two is attorney fees and two a Dickman law firm. Invoices 5902 through 5916. Item two B Johnson Jackson p LLC. Invoice 13845. Item two C Eunice. Salesman. Jensen PA. Invoices 83942 and 83943. Item three. Special events three. A Light up the Bayou. Item three B Tarpon Springs Historical Society's pre-war motor show. Item four, which has been deferred. Item five, which is award file number 250037. Dash n a s single source purchase of hatch equipment and services. Item six increase file number 2240079. Dash n Dash a s single source purchase of Myers pumps, repairs and parts. Item seven Award file number 250038. Dash n Dash h. Single source purchase of fleet original equipment, manufacturer OEM parts and services. Item eight Award file number 2500399. Dash H single source purchase of Goodyear Auto Service. Tires and services. Item nine increase file number 190115. Dash C dash CCM equipment rental and related products and services through Omnia Partners. Contract number 201900318. Item ten. Award file number 250049. Dash C Dash a s fire protection system utilizing Sourcewell contract number 030421. Dash j h n. Item 11 increase file number. 230079-B-AS. Cartridge filters for reverse osmosis water treatment facility. Item 12 Award file number 250053. Dash c dash h. Purchase of city vehicles for fiscal year 2025 utilizing Sourcewell contract numbers 09152, 1-N, A, F and 032824 Dash Nayef. Item 13 increase file number 230155-C-H HVAC equipment installation service building control systems and related products and services utilizing National Cooperative Purchasing Alliance, now Omnia Partners contract number zero two. Dash 123. Item 14 Award file number 250023. Dash and Dash P h. Purchase of beverages for resale. Golf course. Snack bar. Item 15 increase file number 230022. Dash c dash j l utilizing City of Saint Petersburg IFB number 8435 lighting services holiday displays. Item 16 approved first amendment to extend File number 190130 dash. P dash. Jail, health benefits brokerage and consultant services. Item 17 Award file number 250054. Dash C Dash j l Global Standards Suction pump trailers through Florida Sheriff's Association Cooperative purchasing contract number. FSA 23-EQU210.0. Equipment and item 18 satisfaction release of leans. Commissioners. Are there any agenda items that you would like to pull? Commissioner Eisner? I don't know if I want to pull it. I do want to make comments on a couple, so I don't want to stall it. So I'll try to. The only one I really want to pull is 17. How's that? Sure. But I do want to make comments on a few of the others. Okay. Commissioner, is there any other agenda items? Okay. We will now go to public comments on consent agenda items two through three B and five through 16 and 18. Are there any public comments on those consent agenda items? I t. Are there any zoom comments? Anyone online has any comment on those items? Please raise your hand and you'll be allowed into talk. And we do not have any raised hands at this time. Okay. The chair will entertain a motion to approve consent agenda items two A through three B, five through 16, and item 18. So moved. Second. Okay. Now, Commissioner Eisner. Yes. Mr. Kiger. Quick question. Number six and number nine. Aren't those reimbursable through FEMA? Because it just shows that we're just spending the money, but they're all FEMA. Related. I couldn't speak to number nine. That's a public works item. But yes, number six is for pumps. Yeah. That's largely related to, you know, damages incurred to lift stations and things like that will be submitting for FEMA reimbursement. Right. So it's not that we're just spending the money that's what I wanted the public to know. This is more so what we had to do to satisfy, you know, the damage that was done. And we have to replace it. Correct. Yes. That's directly related to damaged equipment. Thank you. Appreciate that. I don't think I have anything else. You wouldn't be covering 17 also, would you? No. Nope nope nope no you're not. So then we go over to number nine. That would be. Mr. Duncan. Same question, different department head. On 17. Replacement of the pumps. Number nine. First on number nine. Yeah. Same thing. Same thing. We just. This is us laying out money, and FEMA will be reimbursing us. Okay. Hopefully. Well, I understand. I just want people to know that it's not a it's not an expense. 17. Yeah. Is that's a direct replacement on these pumps? Yes. Okay. The pumps these pumps are we've had for years. We're wearing down. We got to replace the pumps. Okay. That was it. Thank you. You're welcome. Good. Thank you. If there are no further comments, roll call please. Commissioner Banther. Yes. Commissioner DiDonato. Yes. Commissioner Eisner. Yes. Vice mayor Giuliani's. Yes. Mayor. Coolio's. Yes. We will now go to item 17, a World File Award. File number 250054. Dash c dash j l global standard suction pump trailers through Florida Sheriff's Association cooperative purchasing contract FSR two three Dash EC, EC U 21.0 equipment Commissioner Eisner. Yeah, he's already answered the question though, but thank you I appreciate that okay. The chair will entertain. Oh excuse me. Are there any public comments on item 17? It. Are there any zoom comments? And if anyone online has a comment on this item, please raise your hand and you'll be allowed into talk. And we do not have any raised hands at this time. Hearing none, the chair will entertain a motion to approve. Item 17 Award file number 250054. Dash c dash j l. So moved. Second. There are no further comments. Roll call please. Mr. Banther. Yes. Mr. DiDonato. Yes. Commissioner Eisner. Yes. Vice mayor Giuliani's. Yes. Mayor. Coolio's. Yes. We are now going to business items formerly known as Special Consent Agenda. We are on item 19. Approved contract for City Attorney services between Dickman Law firm and City of Tarpon Springs city attorney. Thank you. Mayor. The version of the agreement that's in the agenda, unfortunately, is not the final version. My office did not catch this. We reviewed the agenda when it comes out. I believe it came out on Friday. And this is not the version that should be in here. I did circulate it to you all this afternoon, but I believe that the public deserves a right to see it. And for that reason, I don't think that you should take action on this. And then some other issues have come up that we may I may have to address with the city manager and Mr. Saltzman. Okay. Board with any would anyone like to make a motion to defer this to another to a later date? Yes. I would make that motion to defer to a later date. Can I is there a second? Second. There are no further comments or discussion. Roll call please. Commissioner. Panther. Yes, Commissioner DiDonato. Yes. Commissioner. Eisner. Yes. Vice mayor Koulianos. Yes. Mayor. Kalia. Yes. We are now going to item 20. Appointment of public Art Committee. Miss Jacobs, can you take it from here? So currently there are three vacancies on the public art committee due to the resignation of Joan Jennings, Graham Jones and Nicholas Toth. Also, there's been a vacant position on alternate two, which we have no applications on file. We're recommending that the current alternate Katie Taylor, be moved up to fill one of those positions, and then it would be up to the commission to determine whether which term, which unexpired term she fills. This there will still be openings. So we're desperate in need of still an additional two board members if you do this this evening and then up to alternate members. So with that said, you know, this would provide them to have a quorum because their board is required to meet at least once quarterly. I'll be happy to answer any questions. Okay. Thank you. Are there any public comments on this item? It are there any zoom comments? Anyone online would like to make a public comment on this item? Please raise your hand and you'll be allowed into talk. And we do not have any raised hands at this time. Okay. Back to the board. I'm sorry sir. We did have a late raised hand. If you'd allow me to let them in. Yes. Please let them i. Okay. If you can state your name and address for the record, please. Juliana. Day 413 East Oakland Street, Tampa Springs, Florida. I'm looking forward to the Arts Committee getting back on board and working because I'm looking to do more art projects in the communities around Tarpon Springs. So I thank you all for addressing this issue. That's at hand. Thank you. Thank you. And we do not have any other raised hands. Okay. Back to the commission. The chair will entertain a motion. I'd like to make a motion that we move current alternate number one, Katie Taylor, to fill the unexpired term of Joan Jennings, which expires October 31st, 2026. Second. Second. Okay. If there are no further comments, I'm going to make one. I'm I'm going to support this. But as we talked about before and you know, as I you know, we do the board members do the work under the direction of the board of Commissioners. If I if I do see and as I talked about with Miss Taylor, if I see any agenda that's self driven and not in the best interest of the community or the mission statement of the community, I won't hesitate to bring up an agenda item to remove you from the public art committee. I want projects grouped together and certain projects have been done and completed and fulfilled and bringing them up again at some point is, you know, they've been tabled and they've moved forward with that. So that's all I'm going to say about the issue. There are no further comments or Commissioner Banther. I just have one question. As part of me being, well, not new, but new, new, new new for this term is why why were all these? Why did I think I have an assumption? But I don't want to assume all these people resigned. I mean, Joan Jennings is known. I don't know, Mr. Jones. Nicholas Toth is a is a significant person. And then we have no applicants. Is it is it because of the. I don't know how to say it politely, but the drama that happened. I mean, is it is or is this just the bigger picture as a whole that we're having trouble getting applicants for all boards? I mean, how can they meet? They have a quorum. Well, city clerk, can you answer that, please? Yes. So the reason why we really can't tell you. We don't know. As. And why they all resigned at around the same time. Again, we don't know. As far as the applications, we do put public notices out there. We post it online. We try to post it in every available spot. Homeowners associations, garden club chamber. We try to put it out there. So we are we are in need for some boards to get, you know, fill those positions. We're hoping we would get some Citizens Academy members now again. But as far as their the quorum, we have two. We had two until tonight we had two regular members and an alternate. And when in the absence of a quorum, it would go to the next applicant. And three is a quorum of their membership. Okay. And they're only required to meet quarterly, which they just recently met. And from my understanding, they won't be meeting again until after January, I believe, or after January. And this is this is this is Miss Taylor. Correct? That is correct. Okay. Thank you. Well, I don't believe it's for lack of advertising. I know that for a fact. So I'm getting the sense there's things reasons why not to be discussed today. Probably. Or or like tonight. So I'll talk to you offline, Irene. Okay. All right. Thank you. There are no further comments. Roll call please. Commissioner Banther. Yes. Commissioner DiDonato. Yes. Commissioner Eisner. Yes. Vice mayor. Yes, mayor. Yes. Yes. Item 21. Increase file number 240067. Dash C dash a s water meters and associated parts utilizing Hernando County contract. Number 23-TS00194-94. And we have Tommy Kiger, Public Services Director, to present the item. Thank you, Mayor Coleus. Members of the board. I'm Thomas Kiger, I'm the public service director, and we item for you today. This is a contract extension with Ferguson Waterworks. Their supplier for Neptune meters. We have been standardized on Neptune meters in the water utility for over ten years now. And they're the sole source supplier. So we're requesting an extension of $100,000 to this contract to continue to procure Neptune meters to for replacements and for our annual meter replacement program, as well as parts and repair services related to the meters that we have in the in the meter population. Currently. Thank you, Mr. Kiger. Are there any public comments on this ite? It are there any zoom comments? If anyone online would like to make a public comment on this item, please raise your hand and you'll be allowed into talk. And we do not have any raised hands at this time. Hearing none the chair will entertain a motion to approve agenda item 21. Increase file number 240067. Dash C dash a s move. Second. Commissioner Eisner comments. Yes. Thank you. Mayor. Is any of these are we expecting to have a larger amount of water meters breaking due to the fact that so many of them went under salt water? They're generally designed to be to be waterproof. You know, we have had a little bit of an increase that we've noticed an uptick in meter repairs, largely because of trees coming down and things like that. And roots pulling up meters and that sort of thing. But largely this is related to just us trying to focus on maintaining the health of the meter population and revenue recovery and maintaining the financial health of the utility. The only thing I would ask is if you can just, you know, lightly, just figure what we use last year versus this year as it comes about. So if it is something that we could turn over to FEMA to get reimbursed for as well, we should be looking at every avenue to get, you know, whatever is extra per se. That's all. Certainly. Thank you. Thank you. If there are no further comments, city clerk, roll call, please. Commissioner Banther. Yes. Commissioner DiDonato. Yes. Commissioner Eisner. Yes. Vice mayor Collins. Yes. Mayor. Yes. Yes. Item 22. Employee bonus. We have City Manager Charles Rudd to present. Thank you. Mayor. Well, we did confirm with our labor attorney that we cannot give a cash bonus or Christmas bonus. It's best just to not go there. If we don't already have a bonus policy in place. But we can give PTO. So we included a draft MoU. We would need a MoU approved by the unions for additional hours. And so you could either you have the option of just saying, you know, 16 hours for nonunion and the appropriate hours for two shifts for union and dispatchers. And that would sort of be a blanket cover if you didn't want to do specific date, which would if we had a specific date, it would close city Hall for another day. This way, the employees could just use those hours at their discretion. Would add to their bank. Okay. Okay. Are there any public comments on this item? Anita. Protest, 901 Bayshore Drive. Did I hear you right? The labor attorney said you. The city cannot give any type of a bonus or Christmas bonus to the employees. Well, we cannot give a bonus related to Hurricane work that's already done. Okay. And I said, what about just a we decided to give a Christmas bonus this year. And her advice was not to go there because we don't have a Christmas bonus policy in place. And it just be it'd be better if we just provide time off. Gentlemen, you need to get a bonus program in place for these employees because it's well deserved. Thank you, mayor Pro, because this can go many different ways. We're going to go into a discussion for a moment of Mr. Rockline. Go ahead sir. Sorry, sir. I guess it doesn't doesn't matter to me. Robert. Rockline, 755 North Lake Boulevard here in Tarpon. Mayor. Deputy. Mayor. Commissioners. Senior staff. As some of you may know, I was a municipal employee for just over 40 years in various capacities, mostly kind of middle management per se. I was hourly, I was salaried, I was everything, all of the above. I've worked in several major emergencies and I was saddened to hear that, that finding about the cash bonus, because a lot of people say time is money. It's really not it's not as tangible as a trade off. There's benefits to both. I was a union delegate for 12 years in the police department. If there's a way to repackage, repurpose something, whether it's after New Years and it's a spring bonus or an Easter bonus or epiphany bonus, or something of that nature, you have to remember that all these people gave and do give before they receive back. Most people only get paid after for what you worked before. All I can say is what I observed here in this city during this, and some previous storms, both with the emergency services, police and fire and public works and pretty much everybody I saw that had a Tarpon Spring truck or shirt or whatever was over. And above. And I know how wearing and tearing it gets on the body. I know that it takes away from their family and their own personal needs, especially during emergencies like this. So if there's any way and I'm happy to explore with you or sit down with any the labor attorney or anything else to give both, that was my original intent was saying here to give them both time and money, because they're equal in some ways, but unequal in others. So I just implore you, as someone who's sat on both sides of the coin, it's not impossible. In great likelihood. And, you know, something over and above should be done because something over and above was done by each of them, I'm sure. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Rockland. Are there any other public comments? It. Are there any zoom comments? If anyone online would like to make a public comment on this item, please raise your hand. You'll be allowed into talk. And we do not have any public comments at this time. Thank you. And back to the Commission for discussion. Oh, if I could just say one thing on the MOU on the backup. It has a date of having it done for the contract employees by January of 2025. That will be almost an impossibility for us. You're talking a couple eight weeks from now. We were just asking Fire Chief and I, in agreement with this, that you dated to January of 2026, to give us a year to fulfill that. Sure, sure. When we make a motion, someone can include that amendment in the motion. Back to discussion, Commissioner Banther. You were first. Yes. Thank you. And again, this is if this is all we can do. That's that that's that's that, that's that, that's that's acceptable. But this is going to set a standard. It's not going to be our last hurricane obviously. So I want to get this right. A city manager did the labor attorney opine that we aired in Irma. She didn't give an opinion on that. Why not? I don't want to quote her, but she said she doesn't know how it was done in 2017, but that the statute the way it reads, she interprets is we who's our who's our labor attorney. Aaron Jackson. Okay. Again, not an issue. I want to get too contentious on. But this doesn't smell right to me. Not that there's anything purposely going wrong. I think there might be some I don't know. I don't I don't want to say that. It's just if, if, if we erred in Irm, which is possible for humans, right? Then that's acceptable. We acknowledge that was a mistake. And this is how we have to do going, going, going forward. I just find it odd that that wasn't considered in this opinion. I'm not an attorney. I don't know labor law whatsoever, but that doesn't make any sense to me. So I'm I'm fine supporting this. It's better than nothing. But I would like something in writing to the commission from from the labor attorney. That gives her opinion on that, because this does set a standard. And I just again, I said two weeks ago, we get sued for like you know, for, for like for like, you know, looking looking the wrong the wrong, the wrong the wrong way. So I don't understand that what we did in 2017, all of a sudden now isn't allowed. We don't have is there is there a change in statute? Is there a change in case law? Is there reasoning. So I do expect from staff when we get opinions from from the city attorney or from the labor attorney, when we have been doing things a certain way, we need to know, have we erred in the past or is this just her opinion, or did she not want to research the issue? Or is this her safety default, which I know happens a lot in in legal cases? Regardless, I will support this tonight, but I would like for her to clarify her her her opinion as to why we can't do this. Okay. Understood. Thank you. Thank you. Commissioner Eisner. Thank you. Mayor. I agree with the first two speakers that came up in public. I agree with Commissioner Banther. What he just said I would like to take it one step further. I would like to know who made the decision back in 2017 to do that. And in addition, I would like to ask the labor attorney if there is a way to change if we don't have a policy to give bonuses, then I want to at this point put an agenda item in at the next meeting on us having a bonus procedure, if that's legal or not. Because as Commissioner Banther just said, this is not our last hurricane. This is bad. This is bad. Staff publicity. This is it hurts them. It hurts me to have to vote on something like this. I know they all gave their all. It's just wrong on every which way, shape and form. And if there's any way we can not break the law but still be able to fulfill. I don't care what we have to call it, whether it's a future bonus or a future. You know, maybe we can call it the end of the hurricane season. Christmas bonus I don't really care. But whatever it is, we should be doing it. And I would like to have a vote on that as an agenda item coming forward after the labor attorney says this is okay to do. I'm okay changing policy. Thank you Commissioner. Thank you Commissioner DiDonato. Yes, this is a perfect example of the meeting that I'm waiting to have. And that's on policies and procedures. We kind of tabled it. So that you could get on board and go forward. And this this could maybe be taken care of. Attorney wise, with a policy or procedure that we have that states such and gives us a little solid ground, but we're also maybe going to come up on a break here in a few minutes that we don't really need. And I want to see that change in policy and procedure as well. So if while we're going to bring something forward, I have no problem with doing that the next meeting. But let's have our policies, procedures meeting too, so that we can change some of these things that need to be looked a. Thank you. Commissioner DiDonato and mayor, I do have Paul is looking at all of the policies and procedures of all of our boards and committees and just kind of creating a spreadsheet so we can look comprehensively at they all have different enabling ordinances, and some have bylaws. And so we're going to look at comprehensively of this commission and all the boards and commissions of the city. So we're preparing that for you now. Thank you. No that'd be good to look at the departments and how they're structured individually. I appreciate it. Before there is a motion we have direction given to have the attorney opine on the situation. Back in 2017, as well as possibly create a bonus couple bonuses for the employees to have in their labor agreements and possibly presented at the next BoCC meeting. With that said, the chair will entertain a motion first and please include the amendment regarding the MoU for the fire and police Department. Motion. I'll go ahead and do it. Let's motion to approve. Well, I guess we got to state it out here. That will give. Let's see. Here it is nonunion employees get December 23rd. And are we doing December 23rd and December 31st? That's not either or right. Is that together or. No. You could just give 16 hours and then I can just say 16 hours for nonunion employees. The department heads will sort of manage the time off. Then I would motion to give nonunion employees 16 hours of PTO, as well as the MoU for the police and fire unions to be dated by January January 2026, if that motion makes sense. Does it? Thank you. Thank you. Okay, we have a motion. We have a second by Commissioner Eisner. There are no further comments. Roll call please. Commissioner Banther. Yes, Commissioner DiDonato. Yes, Commissioner Eisner. Yes. Vice mayor Koulianos. Yes, mayor. Julia. Yes. Item 23 discussion on Freebee transportation. Sustainable way to explore the city. Community driven and eco friendly, this item is presented by Commissioner Eisner. Thank you. Mayor. So when I was in Florida, League of Cities, I saw a presentation on Freebee. And we do have in the backup a presentation that Dunedin did. They asked if I wanted to do my own presentation. What I'm really looking to do is get feedback. If this is something the commission wants, the city manager to go ahead with and we could do this in as much or as little as we so see fit. So what Freebee is, it's like a little jitney and it'll you can have it either move people around just in town so we could have something where if you're at the sponge docks and you want to go to downtown Tarpon Ave, you can just give it a call and it'll come and move you over there. Vice versa, it can go the other way. It can also be made so that it goes on a on a direct route. You can make it where it's brings people to, let's say, somewhere in the downtown area. It's free to the people that use it. It has the costs that are involved, is supplemented by advertising on the side of the these little jitneys. It's a chauffeur driven vehicle. There is deals that you could have where you are allowed to tip, and that's usually a cheaper for the city. If tips are allowed. If there's no tipping allowed, it's more cost to the city. To pay this, you can have them certain hours, you can have them certain days. We could just try this on a trial basis just to see how it works out on the weekends. It would be excellent if people want to use this to go out and maybe have some drinks in town and don't want to have any sort of issue with our police force, driving home could be handled like that. So this is something that is it's just they're willing to work with us on anything that we want to come up with. Like, I said, I don't want to make that decision of what it is. But in speaking to it, I really didn't see any negatives to it. I did try to speak to some people at the sponge docks to see if that would be something that would be wanting to be done with their area, as well. Like, you know, we can have it where businesses could kick in some money if they want and to have it be where our residents have the ability to go to the sponge docks or go to downtown. And it's either supplemented by our funding or donations. So, you know, and actually one of the other things was possibly even to have it where we can utilize some of the CRA funds, I don't know, you know, again, these were just all brainstorms that I had. And I just think it's there's nothing better that would, you know, rejuvenate our downtown and our, you know, sponge docks. I know some of the issues that people complain about is that they don't want to. This is our residents now speaking. They don't want to pay to park at the sponge docks. That's for tourists. And, you know, and some of them say, look, I'd go there if I could find a spot or not have to pay. This could be that thing. So I'm just like I said, I'm willing to listen to what every everybody says. That's pretty much it. I mean, we could bring them in and they'll decide how many cars they'll give us. They could be electric cars, they could be gas cars. But it's really it's a it's a great program. Dunedin's using it. I know it's being used in a number of other places. It's the future. So let's see how we can, you know, greet it. And I also know that I think one of the commissioners also had seen it going somewhere. He was out eating and I noticed it that he had posted. It was something he was interested as well. Commissioner, vice mayor. So I'm sure you'd like to speak about it as well. And see, I just think it's a plus all the way around. And, you know, I've looked at it, they charge about 100 some odd thousand dollars a year and but they have, like I said, all kinds of deals, whether you, you know, we don't have to make any of the money on the advertising. We could, you know, rejuvenate all the money back into the, the vehicle. So I don't think it'll be that much. And I think everybody would really enjoy it. So we'll see where it goes. I appreciate you bringing this up for discussion. Next we'd have a Commissioner DiDonato. Yeah, I, I'm not sure which way I lean on this is an idea, but I need a lot more information and maybe we can bring it back in December or January. But I would want to know. My primary concern would just be how much money that's going to cost, because of the budget restraints that we are currently having. I just need more information, but I would be interested in hearing that. So thank you, Commissioner DiNardo. Commissioner Banther, Mr. Yeah, sorry. Thank you. Thank you, Commissioner Eisner, for bringing this up. It's I know we've talked about in theory in the past, but these things are becoming more readily available. I joke that I'm not sure I can even fit in this vehicle, but I realize the average person is smaller than me, so that's fine. So some of my main concerns not concerns, but things I would want when we when we discuss this, if the city manager could get the information from Dunedi, I'm, you know, assuming this is completely third party from a liability standpoint, it's not a city employee driver. That's my main concern. What's being done to protect the driver? I don't want to be drastic and, you know, say we got to put plexiglass up. But, you know, basically what has done Eden's experience been as far as liability goes, how have they mitigated that. And, you know, how has it worked for them? That's a bigger concern of mine, even even over cost. I just I just want to make sure if we consider this, that we know what our liability is. But I think it's worth it's worth, it's worth talking about. I have heard of the need of this. I just want to make sure that we're covered on this. And if we did it, we did it in the same way that that Dunedin did. Thank you. Thank you, Commissioner Banther. Vice Mayor Giuliani's. Thanks, Commissioner Eisner, for bringing this. It's yeah, it's coincidental that last week I was eating at Casa Tina's in Dunedin, and during the hour that I was with my wife in that restaurant, that thing came by about every ten minutes. It was always loaded with people. They were moving them all around Dunedin. I think they must have had multiple ones, because I don't think it could have gone by that many times. I think this is definitely worth handing off to the city manager to explore and find out all the details. So we can he can answer all these questions that the commissioners have have presented, and I think that it meets our strategic plan, it meets our sustainability plan. This is, you know, really what the kind of thing we need, whether it's exactly this project or something similar, you know, to be able to link our downtown with the sponge docks and even, you know, going out to the beaches, really, I think it's and it creates a, an ability for people to park a little bit outside, but yet be able to get around and, and to visit all of Tarpon Springs. So yeah, it was cool. And it would fit. Commissioner Banther it's bigger than than it looks. So we'll we'll, we'll that'll be our challenge. So all right anyways. But I think it's a great idea and I think it's something worth at least handing off to City manager to get us the details. We need to be able to consider it. So thank you. Thank you, vice mayor. Commissioner Eisner. Yes. Thank you I apologize. My computer was actually redoing something and I didn't have any of the backup to speak about. But just to give you some ideas, because I know some of the questions were brought up. Customer satisfaction is 99.6%. It's five star. They have three vehicles over in Dunedin, 33% of them are contacted through an app, 66% of them are flagged down. So people actually see it and just can, you know, contact them. The people are riding to downtown shopping, restaurants, bars, hotels, Marina. There's let me just see, there is 86% of the people recommend continuing this program. It was a trial program, 74% of them. Users believe that the route is convenient. They use a route system 84% support, allowing advertising on the vehicles. You could control how many hours these vehicles are out there. So if you only want it in a busy, you know, time, you can do that. 87% believe the drivers are professional and courteous. 85% would recommend this service to a friend, 84% feel the service is extremely comfortable and clean. Two thirds have used the service multiple times. So they're clean, they're nice, they're new. The price I saw here for a six months and it's let's see, it's it goes by the hours. So they will give you 2730 hours for $127,000 for six months. Now, mind you, I don't know if that is with the advertising or not. Annual. If it's a whole year, they're doing $255,000. But you know, I know that may even sound like a lot of money, but in the fact of people freeing up and being able to get out and utilize our town and spend money in our town, it will come back to us in spades. They have also you know, heavy duty usage where you have 8000 annual hours and that runs 325,000. Again, you know, we could supplement this with some of some money from the CRA. We could supplement it by people wanting to get involved in this and possibly having restaurants or stores saying, you know, I'm interested in this and I think it'll bring more business from people around town. So then the last one is 10,000 annual hours, and it's most of these prices I'm giving you is a 5050 split between the city and the freebie. So these are numbers that the city makes 50% of the advertising and freebie makes 50% of the advertising. Again, I would encourage us to not take the 50% advertising. I don't think we need it as a money driven thing. I think we should put it all back in. So to make it as cheap as it can be for the city and you know, cost recovery, there is grant opportunities, hotels might want to get involved with this. You know, and we could possibly even ask our public transportation, you know, to kick in because I know they wanted to do something for a while. I remember being when I first was a commissioner, we went to look at Dunedin for something and a unmanned freebie, which I wasn't really too fond of. It was a pretty jerky type of ride, so there's a phone number here. There's a managing partner I would encourage, you know, it's not a rush thing, but it would be great to have some sort of a, you know, an idea of what we would like to do and, and see about going forward with it. Thank you. Thank you, Commissioner Eisner, City attorney, your light is on. Yeah. Real quickly, you might also want to do some research with the folks at Saint Pete Beach. They've been partnering with Freebee for a number of years. Our firm did do the contract with Freebee, just some points of interest over the years that I that I was involved in. It was having to do with the advertisement tipping the app and how it's being used. Also, the power, the powering stations, where where are they and who pays for that. So, you know, it's all it's all the details are all in the contract. But they as well as Dunedin I encourage you to reach out to Saint Pete Beach and see what their experience has been with it. Thank you. Oh, and also that I know that they're trying to introduce the Tesla as part of their fleet as well. Thank you. City attorney Vice Mayor, your light is on. Okay, okay. I think it's great discussion. I think as a if this can be presented to us in a board with numbers with, as we see with seasonal or be open for discussion at some point. We've talked about the last budget being able to create maybe a purchase of a vehicle or two to shuttle people back and forth between the sponge docks and downtown. So it's all connected and trying to get everyone to enjoy two of the historic and tourist driven parts of town. So I definitely would like to bring this forward at least for discussion, to look at everything and maybe this might be a one year thing where we can at least test it out and see. But I think it's important to get people to connect between those areas as well and other parts of town. So city Manager, you have a direction and discussion to possibly bring this forward soon or look over everything the next couple of months or meetings. Thank you sir. Okay, that ends item 23. We have six minutes left before our ordinances and resolutions. We're going to take a recess for about six minutes. Is that okay? Board okay. Meeting in recess until 730. Meeting room resumes at 731. We are now going to the ordinances of resolutions. The public hearings begin at 7:30 p.m. Item 25 is resolution 2024-50. Budget resolution for fiscal year 2024. Mr. Herring, finance director, will be presenting the item. Good evening. Mayor, commissioners. Ryan hearing finance director, budget resolution 2024 dash 50 is being brought before you to budget for items that were not previously budgeted for in fiscal year 24. That's the previous fiscal year. It's a final resolution for fiscal year 2024. I put the major items to the budget resolution, and in the cover letter there, they consist of risk management funding, Hurricane Helene expenditures, which will get 100% reimbursement, and some city attorney fees where the major items. And then there was a bunch of smaller items in there. So any questions? I'd be happy to answer them. Thank you, Mr. Herring. Are there any public comments on this item? I t are there any zoom comments? Anyone online public comment on this item? Please raise your hand and you'll be allowed into talk. And we do not have any raised hands at this time. Hearing none. The chair will entertain a motion to approve resolution 2024. Dash five zero. So moved second. Okay, there are no further comments. Roll call please. Commissioner. Panther. Yes, Commissioner. DiNardo. Yes, Commissioner. Eisner. Yes. Vice mayor Giuliani's. Yes. Mayor. Coleus. Yes. We're now going to item 26, resolution 2024-51 Interfund loan for debris removal. And we have a finance director, Ron Herring, to present. Yes. Thanks, mayor. Yeah. We're asking for the board's approval for a resolution. 2024 Dash 51. The current estimate for debris removal is $5 million. The debris removal was 100% FEMA reimbursable. The city is we have filed for the expedited funding since we're over the 1 million threshold through FEMA. That means the city can get, you know, 50% of the 5 million, 2.5 million of the estimate. They say within 1 to 3 months. We've done all the paperwork. The sub grant was approved by the state. So they say the payment is in process. But I'm hoping to see it soon. The money, the 2.5 million. Like I say, resolution 20 2451 is asking the board's approval to borrow the money from the hospital. 20, 4170 fund to cover the balance. If we need it, till we get until we get reimbursed from FEMA as a FEMA reimbursement will come in, we would reimburse the fund that we borrowed the money from, and after that, I'll be happy to answer any questions. Thank you. Mr. Herring. Are there any public comments on this item? Mr. Mayor, if I could. Yes, madam clerk, do we need to read? We need to read these into the record. That's correct. We need to read the title. Right. So let me just read the title. A resolution of the Board of Commissioners of the City of Tarpon Springs authorizing an interfund loan for up to $3 million from the hospital lease 2041 Dash 2070 fund and up to $1 million from the Sidewalk Improvement Fund to the Sanitation Fund for debris removal from Hurricanes Helene and Milton, providing for scrivener's errors and an effective date. Thank you sir. Are there any public comments on this item? I t are there any zoom comments? If anyone online would like to make a public comment on this item, please raise your hand and you'll be allowed into talk. And we do not have any raised hands at this time. Thank you. Questions from board members to Mr. Herring. Commissioner banter. Yes. Thank you. I just want to first off say thank you, Ron, for how you've always guided us through all these things. And just to help reiterate your point, you know, I've been big on the reserve since probably 2011, 2010, and this is a great example how, you know, we're we're going to be spending $5 million and we didn't even get hit direct. Imagine if we had a direct hit. So in the future years when these hurricanes hopefully become in the back of our minds, hopefully it's not an annual event that we realize that it could have been much more, and it can be much more so it's very important that we keep our, our, our, our reserves healthy and when possible, above the charter requirement. Thank you. Thank you. Commissioner Banther, Vice Mayor. Ron, let me let me ask you, why aren't we using just going directly to our reserve funds? Are you are the 8 million that we have in reserves. Why aren't we going directly to. We could use that. We? It has been a lot of the overtime. Is being in charge to the reserve fund. You know we're talking debris category A, category B has been all the overtime. So we've already had a good 800 and some thousand, almost 800,000, you know, going against the general fund reserves. It could be used. Yes. It is there. The minimum fund balance is 20%, which is the minimum is about $7 million. Our unassigned fund balances at 9 million. So you do have a $2 million gap between the 9 million and the $7 million minimum. So you could use that. Well, how much time do we have if we use the if we just use reserve funds and didn't didn't do all this like shell games moving it from other other funds. The and I apologize for using that term but I you know I I'm hesitant in wanting to you know we have the reserve funds for the purpose of the things that happened. Right. We have it for the emergencies. And instead of using the reserves, we're going in and grabbing hospital money or we're going and grabbing, you know, sidewalk money instead of using the reserve, I, I don't, I, I like, I don't like the optics of, of having the reserve look like it's healthy. But we have all these liabilities now. I would prefer we use the reserve funds if we have to go do this, we do this. But you know it. It shows how vulnerable we are. You know, to have an $85 million General overall budget and having $8 million in reserves, which has slowly we've kept that 8 million. For how long is how long has it been in the $8 million range? Well, we've been at 8.6 8.7 million for the last 6 or 7 years, okay, six, seven years. And if you go back about eight years, we had a $55 million budget. Right. So the reserve fund was well above what was required. And we've just kept that reserve fund at 8 million. But the budgets keeps growing and growing, and we're getting very close to, to the minimum being the minimum. And then now we it's and I, I also like Commissioner Banther said I appreciate all you do for us to help us find money to do this and that. But I don't know, I'm just, I it just, it, it just doesn't sit on me. Well to leave the reserve, have the impression that we're healthy while we're going and borrowing money from funds that are totally unrelated to the storm and what we should be using them for. Now, let me ask you this. The of this money, we say 50% is going to come when the expedited portion they say between I'm guessing between one month to 2 or 3 months. Okay. And how about the other 50%? Well, that's what we're trying to cover. If we have the five the 5 million total, we get the expedited 2.5 million, but we still need to pay 2.5 million when we when do you think when do you think historically? How have how long have they taken? Because you were telling me that we're still waiting for money from two storms, two years. Irma took two years. Two years. Okay, so when you say we're going to pay back, so we're paying we're borrowing this money for you think a month or two. No, no, you're you're borrowing this money. Not this isn't the expedited. This is the money. Over, over and above the expedited. It's possible we don't pay the hospital fund back for two years. It could be. It could be a year or two years. And so again, the appearance of being, well funded. But yet we because we left our reserve fund looking like we're healthy, but we're going in taking money from other funds that now we could be two years before we pay them back. Yeah. And if you do, the hospital fund was never intended to be a piggy bank, to be used for this purpose. The hospital fund is. And correct me if I'm wrong, they prepaid some rent that is supposed to go towards the end of the of the term, and they discounted that number so that we could earn interest on that money between now and the time that we're actually going to be using those hospital funds. Right. Because we're going to have several years. We have no we'll have no rent, right? Correct. Okay. So we're taking this money out of the hospital fund. That is not. And now we're not getting interest. It could be two years to getting it back. Have you have you calculated how much we're losing in earnings that we could be putting back in the hospital fund? You could add interest on to the inner fund loan to have it paid back with interest if you wanted to. But I mean, we're paying the interest. We're not getting this interest from an outside party. Yeah okay. So it's not interest. We can pay interest. But that that's coming out of our out of our money. Yeah. Right now there's money sitting in that account earning interest. Yeah. The other concern is the debris removal is most likely going to get higher. It's going to get higher than 5 million. It might be 7 million, might be 8 million. And then you got hurricanes next year. So trying to find the money which pots of money to help do an inner fund loan. Or you could do a bank loan if you wanted to, to help cover the until we get the FEMA reimbursements. Anyway, I appreciate your you're always looking for ways to fund things. But in this case, I'm not in favor of taking money from the hospital. This is not what it was intended for. We should use our reserve. That should be a last resort. Going over there and borrowing money for a purpose. That's unrelated. And so I'm. Yeah, I'm, I'm. I think we should use our reserve funds. That's what they're there for. And if the reserve fund balances are low, then people need to know. Yeah. Just so you know, we need to replenish that because right now they they will not know that they'll think, oh, when we get our financials, it's going to show $8 million in the in in the reserve if we don't use that money. But we have all these liabilities to these other funds that we've you know, kind of moved the money around. Just so you're aware of, if we use 3 million out of the reserves, we're going down from 8.6 million to 5.6 million. You're under your minimum right there. And you have to we're allowed to bring that back up within two years under the minimum. For how long? Two fiscal years. Two fiscal years okay. And we but we are it's we're taking this money from other funds to, to show that we are healthy and our reserve. But we're not because we're, we we're borrowing our money. I'm good with it. If you want to do that, that's we can go to the 5.6 million one commissioners. I'm only one commissioner. That's my opinion. Yeah. Okay. Thank you. Okay, before I go to Commissioner Eisner or banter, we did have City Manager Rudd put his light on just moments ago, so I'd like for him to talk. I'm looking at just. Looking for authorization. In the event we need to borrow these funds. In the event. Yes. Not necessarily going to need to dip into those. I haven't received the invoices yet, but you know, the 5 million is probably coming due and the sanitation fund is going to go into a, you know, a cash deficit position. That's it. Okay. Commissioner Eisner, thank you, mayor. So these funds in the hospital and also these funds in the reserve, you have them invested, correct? Correct. And they're invested at different interest rates. Correct? Yeah, depending on the investment. Yes. Okay. So wouldn't it be wise to take the lowest interest rate returns and utilize those whichever they are, rather than losing a higher interest rate? I mean, if there's lower interest rate on the hospital fund. Yes. But I've got them all spread out in pools. So they're all basically earning. So it's all equal the same interest rate. Okay. So you're trying to keep things where you're not lowering the reserves too much by borrowing from, let's say, multiple sources. Right. Okay. Is that what you've always done? Well, we don't borrow too much from other funds. This is an emergency situation I know I was concerned about it. I got with attorney Dickman to say, can we do this? And he said, this is an emergency situation. We could do the interfund loan, but we've had hurricanes before. We've had debris removal and you've this is not your first rodeo. So my question is, have you done these kind of procedures before? We had more of a the hurricanes before it was just a vegetative debris removal. We only was only between one 1,000,001.2, I think no more than 1.5 million. So the sanitation fund could handle it. All right. So this was then the largest and which is why you've had to okay. Like I said, I mean, I it doesn't really matter where you're taking it from. I wouldn't want it to go down below our reserve amount that we have to keep as a minimum. Yeah, but you know, it's not like you're taking it and not going to reimburse it. So to me, I don't really have a difference of opinion. I don't care where you take it from. You know, I know we've borrowed from the Sidewalk Fund for fire trucks and then had, you know, so if FEMA if we if I knew that FEMA was going to reimburse us before September 30th of this year, before our audits done, I wouldn't even be here. Yeah, I hear you. Okay. That's all I wanted to say. Thank you. Thank you, Commissioner Eisner. Commissioner Banther. Yes. Thank you. I definitely hear what the vice mayor is saying. And, you know, my only concern is, you know, obviously, as Commissioner Eisner pointed out, I think I think others did, too, regardless of where it comes from. Well, if we do an interfund loan, we have to pay it back. If we use and pay it back with, obviously we're going to get FEMA money at least half up front in some in some soon fashion. Or if we take it from reserves, we got to do it the same way the issue. I see it, Ron, and correct me if I'm wrong, if we take it from reserves, we are forced by hand. I mean, we are forced by charter to replenish that fund to 20% in two years, correct? Two fiscal years? Yes. There's no ifs, ands or buts about that. That's what. Yes, that's what's in the policy. Whereas if we use if we do an interfund loan okay. And you know FEMA, they're going to take beyond two years. Let's, let's just be realistic here. Right. You know, we're not we're not forced to replenish those monies in the same way by charter. Correct? Correct. And that that's kind of the main, the main, the main difference here. Right. So if we use the reserve funds, which I fully see, the vice mayor's point, it is important for residents and people that review the financials to know what's going on and where money is moving. I'm just concerned that would put us in a very tight position where, you know, if things don't work out the right way or if we have a second crisis next year, we're in a tough spot and could be forced to borrow money at an unfavorable rate to replenish that or, God forbid, raise the military. I don't think we really could raise the millage rate that much to do that. That would not be politically or feasibly possible. So that's just, you know, I definitely want to make sure we, you know, we validate the vice mayor's concerns on this. I understand his approach. I just have hesitation because of it forcing our hand. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Commissioner Banther. Vice Mayor Giuliani's. Commissioner Banther the these this option to be able to pull money from these other funds will be available two years from now as well. I, I want you know, I'm I'm a big on fiscal responsibility. And if our if our goal is to replenish those funds in two years, then that should be our goal. It should be in our budget to be able to do that. I just think that for the first, I just don't think the first resort should be to go borrow money from funds that whose primary purpose aren't to handle these, these disasters. I think we use our money that are intended for that, which is a reserve. We always have this option. This option is available two years from now, 18 months from now or whenever we want to use this option. I just don't think it's the first option is to go raid the hospital fund to again give the appearance that we have funds that we don't have. I don't want you know, you know, we've had boards here for the last several terms that, in my opinion, have been drunk on funds. Right now. I'm not you know, we had, you know, $18 million come from Arpa money and, and all kinds of stuff. And this, you know, the this next term and maybe the next couple terms, we're not going to have all those luxuries. We have this issue that is going to really tighten us. And I just again, don't feel that the first resort should be to go raid other funds that are unrelated. We should use what we have. We always again, have this this resort as a last resort. We can always default to it if in fact we are forced to. Hopefully FEMA comes through before two years. We get our money back and we're, you know, we're whole. But again, we'll know a lot more things in May. So again, I'd rather use I personally would rather use the, the, the actual money that are intended for this for these purposes. And then we in May are going to know a lot because that's when our appraisals are going to come from the county, and we're going to know whether we're going to have a super tight budget for next year or whether we're not. I hope we're not. I hope everything comes through and we have, you know, an increase. But, you know, until we know that we need to be, you know, fiscally super conservative, it's just the way we have to be. So anyways, that's my opinion on it. Okay. Mr. Herring, I, I'm going to support it as it is tonight. The I understand the vice mayor's concerns with the reserves, the way the way I've been thinking about it and the way I've, I think I've been trained in a way with when I talk with staff and you know, you as reserves come absolutely last the very last situation possible to try to, you know, cover some of these expenses. And I'm sure with this state of emergency that we're in and the borrowing and the loans that we can, the process that we're going to go, go forward, I know you do your best to sit. You know, you're crunching numbers left and right. We sit here as policy people, you know, say yes or no to how things are going. But Ron Herring and his staff are constantly looking at everything, trying to balance the budget. As, you know, just things that we can't control have come in front of us as a community and as a region. And I just thank you a lot for everything you're doing and trying to make it all work for the budget. I appreciate vice Mayor's concerns moving forward. That may be a policy direction to be given in case of a state of emergency. And I know we're supposed to use those funds in that situation, but I'm thankful that it wasn't as could have been a lot worse. Even though it was bad for our community. And so with that said, the chair will entertain a motion to approve resolution 2024-51. So moved. Second, there are no further comments. City clerk roll call, please. Commissioner. Panther. Yes, Commissioner. Donato. Yes. Commissioner. Eisner. Yes. Vice mayor. Koulianos. No. Mayor. Julius. Yes. Item 27 application for annexation, land use and zoning for property located at 249251 Anclote Road. Application 24-51. This is a quasi judicial hearing. City attorney, can you please read the titles? Yes, mayor. Just before Renee gets started here, this is a these are a companion items. Three companion items. So it'll be one presentation. But there will have to be three votes on it. So I'm going to read all three titles. Bear with me. Ordinance 2020 4-08 An ordinance of the City of Tarpon Springs, Florida, annexing .36 acres more or less of real property located at 249 and 251 Anclote Road. Application 24 Dash 51 amending the future Land use map for property located at 249 and 251 Anclote Road from Pinellas County. Employment category E to the City of Tarpon Springs industrial general IG category amending the official Zoning atlas for property located at 28, 22, four, nine and 251 Anclote Road from the City of Tarpon, some from Pinellas County. C-2, which is general commercial and service district to Development District, providing for findings and providing for an effective date. Ordinance 24 Dash ten is an ordinance of the City of Tarpon Springs, Florida, amending the future land use map for 0.37 acres, more or less of real property located at 249 and 251 Anclote Road. Application 2451 from Pinellas County employment category E to the City of Tarpon Springs. Industrial General category G providing for findings and providing for an effective date. And finally 20 4-09 and an ordinance of the city of Tarpon Springs, Florida, amending the official zoning atlas for 0.37 acres, more or less of real property located at 249 and 251 Anclote Road from Pinellas County. C-2 general commercial and service district to the city of Tarpon Springs. WD two Waterfront Marine Industrial Development District, providing for findings and providing for effective date. Thank you, City Attorney. Can you explain that this is a quasi judicial process? Yes. So one of the so what's quasi judicial among this is really the zoning part. But since it's a companion item, it's one presentation. Whenever you amend your comprehensive plan you may recall it. That's that's actually a legislative item. But since you're annexing property from the county to the city, logically it has to marry up with your comprehensive plan and your zoning atlas. So that's what all these are doing. So my advice would be just to conduct the whole thing as a quasi judicial hearing, which has a heightened level of due process and what that requires is anyone who's going to testify, testify under oath. The commissioners up here would have to disclose any ex parte communications and go from there. Okay, so now we will swear everyone in that will be speaking on the agenda 27 A through C city attorney. Can you swear everyone in you swear to tell the truth? The whole truth and nothing but the truth. Alright, okay. And are there any ex parte communications from board members that they would wish to disclose? Now, Commissioner Eisner, yes. Thank you, mayor. I spoke with the applicant. Not per se with the annexing, but because that was part, I think that also got flooded and so there was quite a few people in town that I've spoken to that have been flooded. So that's what it pertained to. Thank you. Commissioner, any other ex parte communications? Okay. Thank you. Now to present we have city staff presentation planning director Rene Vincent. Good evening. Mayor, vice mayor, commissioners, this is application 24 dash 51, annexing approximately a third of an acre on the north side of the Anclote River into the city of Tarpon Springs. And then as city attorney indicated, applying the proper future land use map and zoning categories associated with that annexation. The property is located at 249 251 Anclote Road. Here's an aerial view showing the site. So this is Anclote Road North Pinellas Avenue. This property is actually another aerial view. You can see there's a house, you know, old house on the site, an outbuilding, and then boats are being stored on it in association with the Bell Harbor Marina. And again, just another aerial photograph. This property is it's actually qualifies as a type A enclave. So it's kind of completely surrounded by unincorporated by the city, the surrounding land use, you can see in the light gray is that's the city land use designation of industrial general, which is what the land use is proposed to be upon annexation. The site zoning in the area again in the city, the WD two, which is a waterfront industrial designation, is what the surrounding area mostly is, and that, again, that's what the applicant is seeking upon annexation for zoning designation. Just a aerial survey over top of the aerial under our. We have several criteria to look at for annexation. I'm not going to go into these in in depth. There's no code enforcement cases. You're not creating. You're reducing actually a type A enclave. There's no really no. In our research, nothing that would be flagged as, you know, being objectionable to annexation. The roadway access does come via an easement from Anclote Road. The future land use amendment being proposed is again goes to the industrial general future Land Use Map designation on the new 2045 Comprehensive Plan, that which actually just went into effect, that is now just industrial. And this is that's consistent with the place based area map for the working waterfront intensive. So everything is in compliance with the comprehensive plan. This is the place based area map. This is new in the comprehensive plan that identifies this entire area for working waterfront. And that's what's being proposed. The review criteria for zoning everything is supports rezoning this to WD two. That's consistent with the proposed land use. The staff recommendation. You know, we didn't make a formal recommendation, just kind of in keeping with past policy. But the, the staffing on it does support approving it. The planning and Zoning Board did recommend approval unanimously of ordinance 2020 408, which is the annexation Ordinance 24 Dash ten, The Future Land Use Map Amendment and 2020 4-09, the Zoning Atlas Amendment. So with that, I'll stop and answer any questions that you might have. Thank you, thank you. Are there any questions from the board for staff presentation? Is the applicant have any questions or cross examine city staff? I'm Merlin Seaman from 1161 Marina Drive. And I'll keep it real short here. Basically I just came in to staff a couple of months ago and said I'd, I'd like to get this all consistent with the rest of the Marina. So all we're really trying to do is just make the land use and zoning consistent and get the property into the city and out of the county. Thank you, Mr. Seaman. There are no further comments, Miss Vincent, are you willing to accept the presentation to the record? Yes. And the associated staff materials. Thank you. Now we're going to the applicant's presentation. Would you like to present anything, Mr. Seaman? Absolutely. No. That's fine. We're going. Any questions from the board for the applicant? Okay. We're now going to public comments on this application. Are there any public comments? It are there any zoom comments? If anyone online would like to make a public comment on this item, please raise your hand and you'll be allowed into talk. And we do not have any raised hands at this time. Hearing none, the BOC will go into deliberations and we will start with first ordinance A or ordinance 27 A. The chair will entertain a motion to approve ordinance 27 A202408 annexation move to approve second. Okay, there are no further comments or discussion. Roll call please. Commissioner. Panther. Yes. Commissioner. Donato. Yes. Commissioner. Eisner. Yes. Vice mayor Giuliani's. Yes. Mayor. Coolio's. Yes. Next, the chair will entertain a motion to approve item 27 B ordinance 2024 dash ten. Future land use map amendment. So moved. So moved. Second. Okay. There are no further comments. Roll call please. Commissioner. Panther. Yes, Commissioner DiDonato. Yes, Commissioner. Eisner. Yes. Vice mayor Giuliani's. Yes. Mayor. Coolio's. Yes. The chair will now entertain a motion to approve item 27 C, ordinance 202409. Rezoning. I moved second, there are no further comments. Roll call please. Commissioner. Panther. Yes, Commissioner DiDonato. Yes, Commissioner. Eisner. Yes. Vice mayor Koulianos. Yes. Mayor. Coleus. Yes. Item 28. Resolution 2024-52 ratification of Executive Orders 2024 14 and 2024. Dash 16 extending a declaration of state of emergency for Tarpon Springs due to Hurricane Helene. City attorney, can you please read the title? Yes, mayor. The next two resolutions that are on are ratifying the executive orders. I'll read the first one. It's 2452 Dash 52 resolution of the board of Commissioners of the City of Tarpon Springs, Florida, ratifying the executive Order 24 dash 14, extending the declaration of local state of emergency to November 19, 2024, and ratifying the Executive Order 24 Dash 16, extending the declaration of local state of emergency to November 26, 2024, and providing for an effective date hereof. Thank you city Attorney. Are there any public comments on this item? I t are there any zoom comments? If anyone online would like to make a public comment on this item, please raise your hand and you'll be allowed into talk. And we do not have any raised hands at this time. Thank you. Hearing none, the chair will entertain a motion to approve item 28, resolution 2024-52. So moved. Second, there are no further comments. Roll call please. Mr. Banther. Yes. Yes, Commissioner Eisner. Yes. Vice mayor. Colony. Yes. Yes, yes. Item 29, resolution 202453 ratification of Executive Orders 2024 dash 15 and 2024 dash 17 extending a declaration of state of emergency for Tarpon Springs due to Hurricane Milton. City attorney, can you please read the title, sir? Resolution 24 Dash 53 resolution of the Board of Commissioners of the City of Tarpon Springs, Florida. Ratifying Executive Order 24 dash 15, extending the declaration of local state of Emergency to November 1920, 2024, and ratifying Executive Order 24 Dash 17 extending declaration of local state of emergency to November 26th, 2024, and providing for an effective date hereof. Thank you sir. Are there any public comments on this item? I t are there any zoom comments? Anyone online would like to make a public comment? Please raise your hand and you'll be allowed into talk. And we do not have any raised hands at this time. Thank you. Hearing none, the chair will entertain a motion to approve agenda item 29, resolution 2024-53. So moved. Second, there are no further comments. Roll call please. Mr. Banther. Yes, Commissioner De Donato. Yes, Commissioner Eisner, vice Mayor giuliani's. Yes, mayor. Yes, yes, we have item 30, which is ordinance 2024-07 Charter Language. This is the first reading of City Clerk. Please read the title. Actually, the attorney will read the title and then I will. And then we'll I'll definitely need some help from the clerk on this one. After I read the title ordinance 2420 4-07 An ordinance of the Board of Commissioners of the City of Tarpon Springs, Florida, submitting the following proposed amendments to the city charter by the Charter Revision Commission to the electors of the city for approval. An amendment to section three. Limitations of power. An amendment to section eight Board of Commissioners compensation, composition and powers. An amendment to the section 11 terms of office. Qualifications. Date of annual election. An amendment to section 13 interference with administration. An amendment to section 14 internal auditor, an amendment to section 16 city manager, an amendment. Amendment to section 20 residency, an amendment to section 23 general, an amendment to section 26 Sidewalk Improvement Fund, an amendment to section 30, an initiative and referendum, an amendment to section 32 amendments, an amendment to section 33. City Hospital providing that the charter shall be amended to incorporate any proposed amendment. Receiving a majority vote of the electors of the city in favor of such an amendment, and providing for an effective date. Thank you. Are there any public comments on this item? I t are there any zoom comments? Anyone online would like to make a public comment? Please raise your hand and you'll be allowed into talk. And we do not have any raised hands at this time. Before we go to Commissioner DiDonato, we're going to have City Clerk talk over the item. Yes. So what you have before you this evening is the ordinance that the charter has done in final form, according to the charter, you have to adopt this verbatim. There'll be another item on the agenda where we could discuss those changes and the board's opportunity. But at this time, this is the first reading and final form, and I'll come back for a second reading at the December 3rd meeting. Okay. Thank you, Commissioner DiNardo, you had a comments. Well, what I stated last time when we went through this, I guess it it actually got to the committee because I while I wasn't mentioned by name, I was mentioned as one who felt that it was too long and I still feel that way. I'm trying to picture it. I don't disagree with what the Charter Review Committee was attempting to do. I want to make that real clear. There's no disagreement. Is just I'm I'm worried about the understanding of what we're asking our citizens to vote on. And I'm trying to picture what I counted 15 pages in our backup that have changes. How is that going to look on a ballot? It's hard to picture. It'll probably be a two card ballot. I believe I think because we split one of the questions. There's a total of 20 questions that are proposed by the charter. We don't know exactly how many pages that's going to be. It'll be a two card ballot. All right. And it's 75 words or less. Still, the title is 15 words limit. And the description, the question, the description is 75. And that will come back before you by resolution at the December 17th meeting. It will be interesting to see that with 15 pages of changes in 20 different items, I just ask our voters to, if you have any questions, please ask if I can help or if any of us can help. Please feel free to do that. But again, it's long. I still feel strongly that a lot of this is policies and procedures. Some of the stuff we're already doing, I just it's asking a lot and I hope that we're all prepared to help. Also, just for your information, a flier does go out to the public, but it could only state the facts of what it is currently. And you know what the change is and why the change was made. Thank you, Commissioner Banther. Yes. Thank you. I want to first thank all the members of the charter committee. I served on that when I left office back at back in back in 2019. And it's and it's a thankless job. I mean, you're meeting once a week in the dead of summer or you're meeting through summer. It's not the most fun thing in the world, but it's very needed and I appreciate their work. I do echo Commissioner. Commissioner Dinardo's concerns about the size of it. Not much we can do about that. Obviously, the committee is kind of independent of us because we appoint them. But I would ask the public, and this goes for anything, whether it's a land purchase charter, anything we put on the ballot or we authorize to go to the ballot, we don't necessarily put it on the ballot. Don't assume that that means the Commission wants an affirmative. Yes. And I think it's very important that that the public understands that. I do like that we put things on the ballot, because not everything should be by fiat up here. There's the voters have a right to decide things in the city. But please do your research. Don't just go off of what somebody tells you. Do your research on each item and vote for yourself. Yes or no. Okay. I just I think there's some times this, this theory that when we put stuff to the ballot, then it's, it has commission endorsement. I know back in my first tenure we, I put stuff on the ballot. I voted no against, but I believed it was rightfully so to go to the to go to the ballot. So I just ask that people keep that in mind when they when the when they vote, you know, I have a little bit of concerns with some of the items, but again, I you know, I'm not sure the relevancy of that being that this committee is kind of independent and it's going to go to the voters. So thank you. Thank you. Commissioner Banther. Commissioner Eisner, thank you, Mayor Irene, do you want us to go line by line on these what we agreed to and disagreed to right now, that would be at the next on the next item because this you cannot make any changes to it has to be adopted as the. So this this is just on what the charter Committee has brought before us. That's correct. And that's the ordinance. So I will then hold off until we get to that. Thank you. Commissioner Eisner. Vice Mayor. I want to thank the committee. Obviously, they wouldn't have had this many items if they hadn't done a lot of work. So it's kind of indicative indicative of a lot of work. I have the same concerns as Commissioner DiDonato. It's, you know, these ballots get exhaustive for citizens. You know, my I'm and I'm also hesitant to have alternate. Proposals from the commission. I think that even becomes even more confusing for the residents. I mean, the only thing I'm a little disappointed in is the this residency thing. I yeah, I don't I it's hard enough to find good people in this in this environment to, you know, be putting any kind of restrictive language on them, you know, ten miles. So some a really good candidate lives 10.1 miles. So you can't take them. But you can take the guy who lives 9.9 miles, you know, that really should be this man. Here's decision. He should be able to hire who he who he feels is competent. He should be able to sit down if he if he sees somebody lives in Lakeland, he thinks that's a little too far for them to be convenient to Tarpon. He says, no, that's that's not going to work. Some guy lives in Wesley Chapel, maybe 10.1 miles away. And he goes, yeah, that that works. So I again, anytime we take away like like Commissioner DiDonato said a lot of these are our own rules and, and procedures and things that we should have, especially this gentleman here who's going to have to run our city should have the, the, the option of, of picking who he thinks is good candidates to fill spots. But besides that, you know, again, I don't want alternate alternate language. I don't want to be, you know, battling publicly with our committee. You know, overall, I think they did a good job. So anyways, that's my only reservation. Thank you. Thank you, Commissioner DiDonato. Yeah, I just need to clarify. I had the privilege of being on that committee three different times. I was chairman twice, so I totally believe in the committee. I, I know how much work they went through. I observed most all of the meetings on online. I condone the committee. I want to make sure they understand. It's just I, I know from experience, I've asked frequently, you know, how should I vote on this referendum item? And I know sometimes in 75 words or less to describe it, it's a little difficult, Mr. Attorney. You can probably tell me that this is difficult to put some of these in 75 words or less. I would agree with Commissioner Giuliani's I the mileage thing. I think that really handicaps the city's ability to be able to hire. I understand why they did what they did. I watched that session. I just want to make it clear to the colleagues that served on that on the charter review that I, I truly appreciate their efforts. I'm just I have concern over some of the things because it's really, well, it's policy and procedures that we do and should have a right to control. And now it's going to be in the charter, which means you don't have that right anymore. So and understanding 20 some different items, you're, you're going to maybe some of you want help or want to talk about it. So I for 1 a.m. Offering and I'm sure my fellow commissioners would would do that as well. Commissioner Banther, yes, I want to really Mr. Dunn just made a very good point about something. And it's, you know, policy and procedure. I'm sorry. And it's and it's policy and procedure versus in the charter, we can't we can't change the charter. It goes in there. It's in there until the next review committee. And we don't have a lot of influence on that policy and procedures. We can change. So that is that that might be something for, for, for discussion that there's things that are good now but might not be good in two years. And that's that's a really, really big difference when it comes to the city. So I think we should be mindful of that. I think voters should be mindful of that when they're reviewing these items. Are are these things that in and of themselves should be corrected for the long term of Tarpon Springs, or at least the next what's it, what's it, five years, 4 or 5 years? Or is this something that's that, that, that that, that that could be a market condition and change over the course of 1 or 2 years. So I just I just want to make sure that point was echoed because that's that was a very important point. Thank you. Thank you to the board. The way I've been taught in regarding our charter, it's basically the Constitution or, you know, the Bible of our city. And it's a very delicate document document. So I appreciate all the hard work. The Charter Revision Commission did to put these questions together. But I do have my concerns as majority of this board, when we talked about some of the questions being policy driven as opposed to items that should be memorialized into the charter. So and as Commissioner DiNardo and the rest of the board said, keeping the citizens engaged and being able to read all the information and not not just going through and hitting yes on everything, and I'm sure maybe the charter Revision Committee would like that. But I just thought it's a very delicate document, and there was a lot of items that were brought to it. And so we just want to keep the residents engaged and have them answer all the questions. And so, City Attorney, I'd like to ask you, the Charter Revision Commission is a we didn't are we allowed privately, individually to say, hey, I oppose this charter item or, you know, or even if I go on social media, am I allowed to say something like that? Because it's something that the charter revision is presenting and not we as a board member putting on the referendum. But it's delicate. So I don't know if you could explain it a little bit. Yeah, I can explain it a little bit. I mean, you all have a provision that triggers a charter review, a charter review, a lot of cities, don't you go through that process. And right now the process is to bring it to you all to ultimately decide, you know, how you know, going on to the ballot. So individually. So there's you all as one as a board acting together on behalf of the city and then individually, you all are elected officials and you can and residents. You're right. You're voting. So you have you don't give up your, your First Amendment right to just because you're elected. The First Amendment right to express your own opinions privately. Not not here, of course. I mean, here's where you conduct the people's business, and that's what you're doing right now. But, you know, you shouldn't you should not use public funds to, you know, say to voice your your position on it. So I would, I would, I would not advise I would advise you not to put together fliers with your name and your title and city stuff and saying what you believe or not believe. But if you're at you're with some friends, or you're at a meeting and you just say, hey, this is here's my opinion on this, this is the way I'm voting. You're allowed to do that. Okay. Does that does that help you? Yeah, I think it's useful. Yeah. Or maybe if I go on social media and say as a private resident, I don't support this or do support this, right? Just be careful about whether that is, you know, we've talked about social media. I don't want to get too deep into it. Some, you know, some of it is your, your, your public official page versus your personal page. So make sure you're being very clear that you're you're speaking as a citizen, you know, in that capacity and not projecting the views of the city. Yes. No. Thank you, City Attorney, for clarifying that. Vice mayor. Yeah, mayor, that was a great question. So if we just reiterating, though, we can't change any of this, this is the charter has the authority to put these things on the ballot. We can't put something saying, oh, but the board doesn't like this item. So we go ahead. So that's a question. Can if the board let's say we did, let's say we voted that we don't like the mileage issue. So in the next in the next conversation we have, it would be the board's decision where they decide whether they want to put their own opposing question. What if there's no question? What if it's we just want to leave? You would have to do a question. I've never heard of saying not to change the item if we want to. It would be some type of question that would be proposed. And each question is going to say either it's proposed by the charter Revision Commission or it's proposed by the BOC. Okay. So and getting back to the mayor's question on social media, on our own private social media page, we you're saying we could say as a resident, here's how I plan to vote on these items. There's nothing wrong with that. No, your citizens, as long as you make it clear that you're distinguishing this is not that we're not speaking. I'm not speaking on behalf of the city. I'm not speaking on behalf of the Board of Commissioners. This is my opinion. And, you know, each all of you have your your constituents who voted for you, obviously. So you have the ability to communicate with them. But, you know, just be be mindful of the fact that, you know, you can't. You can state your opinion and how you're going to vote. And but don't form, you know, but it's important to qualify it, saying, yeah, I'm doing this as a private. This is my opinion. This is how I as a as a voter, here's how I plan to vote. I'm not I'm not talking as a commissioner or a mayor or, or else. Right. And you know, you've already you all have expressed opinions up here individually. You haven't taken any votes on it. You've, you've you've expressed your views, which, you know, people will see that and they watch that. I mean, that's perfectly fine. You're up here individually and collectively, but just be very careful of how you present it outside of this arena and in the media, the medium that you use. And like I said, I use examples of fliers and things like that, campaigning against something just just be very cautious about it. And you know, you can I know Attorney Saltzman was the attorney at the committee. You can if you have questions, you can talk to me or him about this before you act. So. Thank you. City attorney. Commissioner Banther. Yes, I would I mean that the city attorney is correct, obviously, but I would. We don't lose our First Amendment rights on this board, but we kind of do. I mean, I've told my family, too, that they lose their rights as well when I'm in office, and it's not like I said, we at first you can put on your Facebook or whatever Twitter, Instagram, whatever you want to. Y'all know I've made my opinions known in the past, but as I've grown in my previous position and this, you know, I just I'm more for verbally saying my opinion. Someone asked me, Hey David, should we buy that? Should we approve that amendment? Yes. No. Maybe so obviously that's fine. I there is very little good any more that comes to social media to post stuff. I mean, I don't know, it's a really cost benefit analysis because there's people in this town and every town in America that's there just waiting. So I would, I would caution the board to, to put yes, put support or not support certain things on social media only because what good is going to come, you know, I think it's a lot more influential to verbally and people because people are going to ask all of us, right where the, where, the where, the where, the where, the where, the five up here. Right. So just verbally say our thoughts and opinions. I just, you know, I don't see much good coming of it. If we put on there what we do and don't like. And first off mine would be so long. No no no no one's going to read that, you know what I mean? Like it's just not. And so as I understand it, Irene, for this next item, because we have to go back to that one item. Correct. For the charter questions our only we can't say yes or no. All we can do is, is do an opposing question. Right. That is correct. That's it. So I mean I'll stay here as late as you guys want, but but in my book there I mean there's things I'll be honest, there's things I disagree with in this. I'm not going to vote for all of it. Most of it's good. There's things I don't agree with. That's just my opinion. But nothing I see is to me is so dire. We should put an opposing question. My thoughts can be changed with y'all's opinions, but that's just my $0.02 on that. Okay. Thank you, Commissioner Banther. There are no further comments. The chair will entertain a motion to approve ordinance 2024-07 charter language. First reading. So moved. There are no further comments. Roll call please. Mr. Banther. Yes, Commissioner. DiNardo. Yes, Commissioner Eisner. Yes. Vice mayor Giuliani's. Yes, mayor. Cool. Yes, yes. We are now going to item 31, resolution 2024-54, ratifying election results from November 5th, 2024. And city attorney, can you please read the title? Yes, sir. Resolution of the Board of Commissioners of the City of Tarpon Springs, Florida, ratifying and confirming the results of the special referendum election held on November 5th, 2024, and providing for an effective date hereof. Thank you. Are there any public comments on this item? I t are there any zoom comments? If anyone online would like to make a public comment, please raise your hand and you'll be allowed into talk. And we do not have any raised hands at this time. Thank you. Hearing none, the chair will entertain a motion to approve resolution 202454 ratifying election results from November fifth, 2024. So moved second, there are no further comments. Roll call please. Commissioner. Panther. Yes, Commissioner DiDonato. Yes, Commissioner. Isai. Yes. Vice mayor. Giuliani's. Yes. Mayor. Cool. Yes. Yes. Item 32. Ordinance 2024-01 has been deferred to the date certain of December 17th, 2024. We are now going back to. Item 24 discussion of possible BOC charter questions. And we have a city clerk to go over this item. Yes. So the honorable Mayor and Board of Commissioners, just for the public's knowledge, section 32 of our charter states that the Board of Commissioners shall appoint a charter revision commission at least every five years to review the provisions and to make recommend any changes to the charter. The Charter Revision Commission presented the proposed charter amendments, and the Board of Commissioners made further comments. The Board of Commissioners then returned the proposed amendments to the Charter Revision Commission with their suggestions, and after review, the Charter Commission made their final report to the Board of Commissioners tonight, as we know, in final ordinance form, which has to be adopted verbatim, the Board of Commissioners in the same election may sponsor its own proposals. And the river, like I said earlier, the referendum questions will advise whether it's initiated by the charter revision Commission or if it's initiated by the Board of Commissioners in the event there's any conflict among proposals, the proposal receiving the greatest number of affirmative votes shall prevail to the extent of such conflict. I did want to let you all know that the CRC Charter Revision Commission wanted me to pass along to the Board of Commissioners, that they did hear your suggestions, and they did take them into consideration, even though the outcome might not be what you wanted. But they did have in-depth discussions on these suggestions at their last meeting. And it's a however, the board would like me to do it. I can review every question, or I could just review the items that were changed that they did take your suggestions on to me. I really would like just to discuss what we would like to if we if there's a BOC question we would like to add to the charter, maybe oppose one of the questions. I mean, possibly go over each and every one of them when we can't really do anything about changing them? Well, there are a couple changes that they did make that I should advise you on, that they did take your suggestion before you do that. Yes. So I'll just go over those items in section eight of the charter, which is the board of Commissioners. Composition, duties and responsibilities. And powers. We had the current charter had various sections, and then they were adding sections regarding different plans, such as the Comprehensive Plan, the strategic Plan and things like that. And they added the sustainability plan. They had. They had paragraphs I j and K and L. So the board, the board of Commissioners felt that some of those should be policy and some they were okay with. However, the charter revision did go back and they removed I j and L in its entirety and combined them with the current section K, which just lists the plans, not the rest of the paragraphs, which reads it's and it's going to be would be renumbered as I and it would read to review, update, retire, abandoned or deemed completed. All city master actions, sustainability comprehensive strategic plans every five years beginning October 1st, 2024. They just wanted to basically make sure that those plans get looked at at least every five years. So they did remove the rest on that one. The next change that was there was a section in the zoning powers, section 12 of the charter that talked about for special exceptions, and they were going to remove that. The BoCC felt that it wasn't really needed. So what the charter did, they agreed with your suggestion and they left, as it is currently written in the charter, and there will be no question for that section. Okay. As far as section 16, which is City Manager, acting City Manager and assistant city manager, the they added originally they added for assistant city manager position. However, the BoCC did not want the city manager position, especially with everything that has occurred and wanted that to be left up to the current city manager. So the CRC agreed and they removed that as a question. So they removed the assistant City Manager as a requirement. However, they just left it in the title of that section. So in case it ever happened, it would be covered okay. In that sectio. And the next change would be under the residency. So they did it in two parts. The first part they requested that the city manager assistant city manager, fire chief and police chief were required to reside within the city limits as defined in the planning area. The BOC was okay with that change. However, they wanted them to remove the Assistant City manager again. The CRC denied that suggestion because they wanted to leave it. If that position ever happened, that that would be a requirement of that position. So that was the one question of the residency. The second one on the residency. They are requiring that all department heads and directors who are not listed above in that paragraph I just read, would be required to live within ten miles of Tarpon Springs city Hall. Established city employees who are promoted to department heads or directors do not have to meet this residency requirement unless they are to change the residency during their employment. As a department head or director. If the department head or directors changed their residency, they must reside within ten miles of Tarpon Springs City Hall. The BoCC wanted that totally remove. The CRC denied that suggestion and they wanted it to leave it as proposed. However, they did add a sentence that is currently in the charter now that would give the authority to the board, and it reads the board of Commissioners may temporarily excuse the residency requirement for such time periods. No one time periods exceed one year as it deems appropriate in the best interest, and that were that was the changes that were made. If the you know, this is the only public forum, and with the storms and everything, we've been a little pushed back. So we are on a time crunch. If the Board of Commissioners wish to have any questions of their own, we would have to vote on what it is that you want the attorney to bring back and an ordinance would have to be written, which would go for a first reading on December 3rd, and then we would have to have a special session on December 10th to have a second reading on that. So I could bring back to you the questions, calling for the questions and calling for the election, along with the election contract on the 17th, to meet my election deadlines for the March election. So that is what you have before you tonight to decide. First, if you want to have any opposing questions and if you do what those are. So the city attorney and myself could start drafting an ordinance, publish it and make sure it meets the deadlines for you to have that question on the ballot. Thank you, City Clerk, for going over the changes. The CRC was considered, and now we'll go to Commissioner Eisner with comments. Thank you, Mayor, I what I did is I made copies of all the charter recommendations. So everything I don't speak about is a check mark. But section eight. And first, let me start off, I did watch every single one of the charter commission meetings. And I also want to thank I know they worked very, very hard, but you know, there's still I noticed a number of different opinions that were just on the committee. So I would expect to have different opinions up here as well. But one of the words that was used constantly was we don't want to make changes and make it into word salad. And yet we have all of this sitting in front of us and it comes back to being defined as word salad and some of what I'm reading. So charter eight, section eight. I still want it removed. And because I want it as a policy. So that was one thing. But it's not a hill I want to die on. Then we move over to section 11. And on this one I have my responses as no and no. I still do not want to have this at all. You know, I it says here BoCC wanted CRC to remove this and keep it as currently written in the code. They did not want that. They split it into two questions. I still think it should be a no, and I'm happy to discuss this at a later date of why internal auditor number section 14 a request was BoCC wanted this change removed because it was already added as a policy. I believe anything that's added as a policy we don't need to have redundancy and make it into a which Commissioner Banta said lock it in stone and it could change in two years. Three years, whatever. Number 16 same thing BoCC wanted this change removed because it was already a policy. They denied it. I disagree again, it's not a hill. I want you to die on. But you know what could I say? Residency was a big one with me. When I got up to speak, I spoke about residency. You know, I don't want to pick on age, but, you know, people that are my age, you know, we don't reach to our we take still business cards. We don't reach to our phone and make a copy of somebody's business card like the current younger people do. And I believe that having people living within the city limits doesn't make you love the city anymore, doesn't make you love the city any less. You, the EOC is overcrowded as it is, right now. They don't need more people to make ham sandwiches. It's been covered very well all along. I just don't think that we should have more and more people there. Too many, too many cooks spoil the broth. If somebody is needed for a question, if the fire chief needs to ask a question, he's got everybody's in their phone. He could text message, email. He could call and get a response. Just immediately you know, none of the storms that come here just like, blink out of nowhere, you know, we know they're coming. And you know, that's not the time that you go and take a, you know, visit to France. So, you know, any any one of his people that are under him know that they need to be at least have an ear by the phone so that he could ask or pick up, you know, pick their brain and say, what are we going to do with this? You could do with this same thing with the fire, with the police chief. So I I'm, I don't think we should have any sort of limitation except for what is reasonable to have within the area. We shouldn't have people in Lakeland or or somewhere where they're so far out of touch that they're not even in our county. So that goes for city manager and all department heads. I wouldn't even get into that at all. I think that should be removed. Then let's see. 23 I had no issue with go to 26 section sidewalk, be removed because this is already a policy. Same thing again, it's a policy. Why are we playing? You know again, they use words constantly and I heard it. I won't mention names, but I heard it word salad. We can't have word salad. And then they put these things in that adds to word salad. So I heard what Commissioner DiNardo said. I the our residents are going to get overwhelmed by this. You know, I just think we really need to go after, you know, I think if I remember the total when we went through this the first time, we had about eight items and they have about 20. And I just think that's excessive. You know, I know what all 20 are and everybody up here knows what all 20 are. But I don't think the residents know what all 20 is or are. And it's confusing. I don't want to have confusion. Let's see everything else. I was in agreement and I do want to thank them. They worked very hard. It was very lengthy. I definitely even enjoyed they they held off discussing the contract that we had with the hospital until they got the exact name of what was on the contract. So all in all, they did a great job. You know, I thought it was a great blend of different people with different ideas. They all brought in their thoughts and that's just where I'm at. I don't know what everybody else has gone through that they like or don't like. I just don't think it's a great idea to put 20 items on there. So even though we can't stop it, it's already on there. I know, but you know, we should at least be able to give a couple of different choices, that's all. Not a lot. I don't want to make it where it's 20 and now we're giving them 26 or 28 of them to think of. So that's it. Thank you, Commissioner Eisner. Commissioner Banther. Yes. Thank you. Two things I wanted to point out. The old system, the mics were always on. So I'm just getting used to that. I apologize, two things I want to point out the internal auditor, and this was obviously well in the last charter review, the one I was on, I disagreed with this. We had a we had a firm do it and the and the, the, the, the, the committee and that's the voters wanted to have a permanent position and thus so is it. So it says about the city attorney to review before being provided to as far as their their as far as their findings, I understand their approach to that because I believe the current internal auditor did have had some things that were of that that, that, that were concerning. But it's still supposed to be only reporting to, to the, to the commission. Correct. Like they don't work under you. Correct, Charles or anybody else. I mean, that's fine if that's if that's legal and appropriate. But it doesn't make a lot that doesn't make a lot of sense to me for that position to be like autonomous. But then still have to run things by the city attorney and the city manager first. But whatever. And I do echo my, my, my, my, my, my colleague's thoughts on the residency concerns. I don't so much mind it for the city manager, assistant city manager, Fire chief, and like police chief that okay, I get that. But all department heads and directors I just I worry that's going to hamstring us, you know, in the sense of especially how the world is today. It's not do or die for me. I'm not going to go buy a billboard and say like, you know, vote against this. But I do want to make that that known since, since, since my, my, my, my colleagues did it did as well that that's a that's definitely a concern to me. So thank you. Thank you. Commissioner Banther. Vice Mayor Giuliani's. Commissioner Banther that that internal auditor revision or that that adding that the city attorney review before being provided the reason I actually recommended that when I was at the that the board at that commission meeting, because what happens is if the internal auditor does a report and it's put given to the board of commissioners, then it becomes public record, I gotcha. Okay, so if in fact, the internal auditor puts something in there that has legally you know, is inappropriate, it could be inflammatory. The city attorney has a chance to opine with him, express his concerns, maybe help him change some words so that we don't get ourselves in a pickle and rather than because if it came to us, then it's public record. And if and again, if it's something sensitive and you know, you're obviously referring to something that, you know, happened and shouldn't have. So that's why that's in there. So I think that's actually a good I appreciate that clarity. I think it's a good positive thing to help us protect ourselves from any unnecessary litigation that could come from from something being inappropriately put in that report. You know, again, my concern is the residency thing. You know, this thing about living in the city and whether you love the city, don't love the city. People do their job because they're professionals. So, you know, Ron Herring, we can pick on Ron, but Ron is a consummate professional that cares about his job. If he was working for Largo, he would be just as professional as he is working for Tarpon Springs. He hasn't lived in this city. The entire time. I know he started back when my brother was mayor 37 years ago, and has never lived in the city and has worked tirelessly for the city. I hope he loves the city, but I don't, I don't care, he's a professional and that's what he does and no different than this gentleman right here. If he didn't get hired by us and he got hired by somebody else, he would do his job. Just like he's going to do it for us because he's a professional. So anytime we put these residency things to try to have some message of concern for the town or whatever, I think they're, they're almost they, they're silly. So I don't know how we if we were to have an alternate message, which I again, I don't like the alternate messages because again, I don't want to. It's confusing enough we got, you know, 20 items on this thing and then they're going to get to this spot. And now they're going to have two things to choose from. And they're going to probably be mentally exhausted by the time they get through all these cards. But if we were going to do something that contradicted that residency thing, I'm not sure how would we do that? City attorney? How how would we, if we say we do not want these restrictions, or do we if we say we want to just stay where we were, how do we how do we word something? It's almost like you'd have to flip it to the opposite and say, and again, the language you just have to flip it so that it's a, it's doing the opposite. So if the Board of commissioners does not, does not recommend this. Right. Something to that effect. Yeah. Does not recommend a residency requirement or whatever. Yeah I mean I'd like to hear from the other commissioners whether they have the stomach to want to do that. Again, I'm I I'll live with how this plays out. But if there is an interest in opposing this, you know, I'd go along with it. But I'd like to hear from the other commissioners on this item and thank you. Vice Mayor Commissioner DiDonato. Well, I pretty much stated how I felt. I believe that they did a great job. I've said that, and I just 20 items is a lot and that's why I offered up my help and I know that that you gentlemen will do the same thing. The biggest hangup I had was the residency, but as I read it, the way they wrote it, there's still no I mean, we can still excuse them if there are extenuating circumstances. That's how many times it says that you can't do it longer than a year. I can live with that rather than fight, because as commissioner just said, we've already got 20 items. I mean, adding adding another 5 or 6 kind of defeats our purpose. And they worked hard, diligently. And now I the way I read this residency thing, there is some some flax or flax that we can still accommodate established employee based on circumstances. So with that, I, I for one, unless the board feels strongly we'll go with what the charter review said. Okay. And before I go to Commissioner Eisner, I just want to say a couple comments. There was four of us when we were doing the review for each questions, and when we came to the policy ones, it was all four of us that collectively said we thought these were policy decisions and should have been in, but at the same time, the CRC said, we you know, we appreciate what you're saying, but we want it in the charter. So I know we're we're upset about that. I don't want Brazilian tree peppers and invasive species in the charter. You know, I don't want sidewalk improvements that we already have a priority list and they're already set year by year, and they change in the priority. You know, I understand it all, but the one thing I would I would put a billboard up for is the residency. And I think we should try to at least come up with a question to combat that a little bit. I don't know if it's 20 miles distance or no distance at all, but I don't want to have to worry about future boards. We're not this board, you know what they're going to do with the requirements from year to year? That's a big concern for me. And, you know, and how I spoke as a resident coming up here and, you know, I wanted everybody living in the city. But from what I know now and seeing how the city operates and where we're going, as you know, as city staff and, and looking out for the city, we got to have some versatility and we got to be able to bring people here and, and have some incentives for them to want to be around. So I would like to see just one question that the BoCC can present something along the lines with residency. And if it's no limit or if it's a limit of 20 miles or 25 miles, if we could come to an agreement on that and potentially get the city attorney to write that up and present, that would be great. But that's the only one I want to bring forward, because there are so many other questions out there that, you know, I just want to make sure we get the residents engaged. So those are my comments on everything. Commissioner Eisner, thank you, mayor, as I appreciate what Commissioner DiDonato said about having that loophole provided so that we could actually move the people for another year. It's almost like you're giving people a yearly review of whether they have a job or not. And for that matter, I just can't agree with that at all. You know, people that are devoted to do work here should be have the surety that they have a job and they shouldn't have to wait for a vote for us to extend their contract every year. It's like a yearly review. So thinking along those lines, I really don't want to do that. I know that I would be not feeling too comfortable having a yearly review of whether I have a job or not. I would like to know that I have a job unless I'm not doing the job properly. Not that you know that that is going to be a review because somebody doesn't like my breath mint. I mean, I just don't want that. So either they have the job or they don't. But I also wanted to clarify a comment for Commissioner Banthe. As far as the internal auditor, the internal auditor is just giving the city attorney to review before providing, but they still will report to the board. So it was just a as Commissioner, Cogliano said it was just one more step so that we didn't get ourselves into trouble. So we'd have, you know, it's like having a contract, anybody, any contract. We make, we would have the attorney review it before it goes to us. That makes sense. So yeah, it was it was a good idea. And pretty much like I said, I'm happy to discuss all of these. Any of the things that I brought up at a future meeting. And, you know, like I said, the residency is the biggest one for me as well. The others, you know, again, it becomes redundant. We have it in the policy and, you know, do we need it in a charter? No. Should we confuse the residents and give them an alternate to choose to not have it in the charter? That one we have to all decide as a board. So and again I thank them because like I said, I did watch every single meeting and they worked their tails off. So that's it. Thank you. Commissioner Eisner. We're going to go to Commissioner DiDonato. I don't like talking more than once on a on an item, but this this is a it's a perplexing idea. I, I for one, been I've been here pretty much my whole adult life and there was a time almost well, most of our employees lived in the city that is no longer true. And it's no longer true because they can't afford it. And that's just happened in about the last 20 years. Slowly, it's worse and worse. In fact, I, I bought a home a little over four years ago, and it's worth almost twice what I paid for that. So much property values have gone up now we may get some lower assessments in May, so it may not be almost twice as much, but there are certain circumstances. If someone is taking a promotion and they aren't quite ready to go and buy a new home and live in Tarpon Springs, that's a consideration. And that's why I don't believe the residency requirement should be as big as it is. I could support one issue on that to change. However, I will say this psychologically and for my history in this community, maybe I shouldn't say a lot, but I will. I think that if the two items oppose one another, that the citizens will support the ten year over a 20 year or a ten mile over a 20 mile, and I think they just do that logically. You want people to think they have to be close, not understanding the value of homes being almost double what they were in a very short time. So that's that's why I'm saying that. And again, a lot of these items are procedure items or policy items. And but you know, if it makes everybody feel better, I'll support that. But that's our dilemma. So I don't know. Tell me what you think about it. I, I just think it's almost a lose lose situation. I hate to say it that way, but thank you, Commissioner DiNardo. Vice mayor Koulianos. Yeah, I would be. Now that I hear from from you other members here, that having an opposing item on the residency would be smart. I any any miles you pick is going to be, you know, capricious and arbitrary no matter what you sa. 2018 again, this gentleman here needs to be able to hire who he feels would be a good employee for the city. He's he will make that decision about whether that person lives close enough for him to feel comfortable that they can come and do their job. I think this one period year by year thing usurps him because what happens is he's supposed to hire these department heads, not the commission, but if we have to ratify them. So again, I use Ron Herring, so they would have to have 37 votes on Ron Herring every single year. The guy's been here 37 years. That's ridiculous. And so if a board got up and said, I don't like Ron Herring, he doesn't, you know, genuflects enough. When I walk up to the second floor, then you've usurped his authority to hire who he wants. And you've got now the board of commissioners ratifying employees that they should not have any authority over. We are we are not the executives to run the city. He is. So again, I don't I know they tried to throw us a bone by throwing in that one year thing, but I think it actually is counterproductive. I think it again usurps his authority and I think it's inappropriate. So I definitely would, but I wouldn't have any miles let the man make a decision again. We can create policy for him. We can say as as a board, we can create policy and say, you know, we would like to recommend that you never hire anybody who lives more than 20 miles, but not in the charter. It's like like the mayor said, you know, this is the Constitution. You don't micromanage in the Constitution. It's the overall structure of how we're supposed to function. You don't these this is over micromanaging, and I don't I just don't I don't believe in it. So I would I would be happy with an alternative that had no miles and let the city manager hire who he wants. No thank you. Thank you. Before we go to Commissioner Banter, we have a city attorney. Yeah, just say a few words. Thank you. Just to add on to that, and again, I have not been part of these committees as Attorney Salzman. So I, I almost see this part as actually interfering with the administration, which is what it says. I mean, that's a that's a very common part of a charter, is that you all this is a you don't interfere with the administration. But to me, I would if you had to and we'd have to talk about this with Attorney Salzman as well. Is that you know, if you wanted to have it, say, the Board of commissioners, the board of commissioners may, upon the request of the city manager, waive this requirement period and not have it, as you said, like an annual, you know, an annual thing where someone's, you know, so the city manager may come across someone that says, this is a great department head, this is a great director. I'm going to take the initiative to speak with the city Commission and have asked for a waiver of that. I don't know if we could do it that way, but what concerns me about this part about is the one one time period not to exceed one year. I think you hit it on the head. It does it does put a lot of pressure on someone. And I think it almost interferes with the administration, to be honest with you. Thank you for appointing city attorney Commissioner Banther. Yes, there's some good points brought up. Obviously, I have come in on the latter part of this, so I really am in agreement with a lot of what I've heard here tonight, and I would be in support of all these things or these concerns, and the possible counter counter question. I do worry about the residents of their ability. They're plenty smart enough to. But again, like like we've been saying, it's a long ballot. You're going to have conflicting questions. They're not going to understand, like, okay, this is the Charter Review Committee's question. This is the City commission's, you know, we can we can we can work that out. I think this leads to a bigger discussion. And it's a mute point for this CRC, but for future ones, and I think we need to kind of frame how we are doing the CRC. What's the purpose of the CRC per the charter? It's like the Constitution, and I'm a pretty I don't want to say politically, but overall a very conservative person when it comes to old documents. Right? They were written for a reason. Now doesn't mean there's not things that have to change as we go on, but we need to be very, very careful in what we change. Because, you know, my opinion, the CRC is established to review the document to or to or to or to review the charter for, for not errors, but things that have to be updated and changed with the times or or or or situations have happened that call for a change. That's, that's different than saying, well, I think this should be done this way. I have lots of opinions, probably half of which no one agrees with. Right? And rightfully so. So I'm just I think we should help the next CRC. We though we sit and maybe the residents can use this to when they, when they vote on these items is was this a problem with the current charter. Did a problem come up to result in this recommendation, or is this recommendation from, you know, more of a policy standpoint where you know someone thinks as a commissioner, would this should be done this way, and that might affect how how you vote on that item. But I just wonder, was there this many errors and problems in the CRC? I mean, inside the charter, I don't know, maybe so, but it's definitely a concern I have with the, with the with the amount of recommendations we have in the sense of, you know, was there that many issues and problems we had with the charter or are these more policy things? And I think from me coming in here late and hearing you all tonight, you all did mention back and forth that there was a lot of these were were more, you know, policy driven. It's for the residents to choose. I don't think that's a bad thing, but I would recommend that when they look at these items to keep that in mind. Is this a policy thing or is this something that needs to be permanent in our Constitution? You know, you know, like in our charter, that was something that has to be maintained going forward or for at least five years, because I don't think we, we want to see as a city is this ping pong. Every five years we take things out, put things in, take things out, put things in. Because there's things in here I'm not going to go in tonight. But they were specifically put in here. Well, when I was on the CRC five years ago, there was things specifically put on there for political reasons. I think we all know what that is, right? And I'm not saying it's completely bad and wrong, but are those the motives that we want? So I would encourage all of us and the public as well when they vote to keep that in mind, when they're, when they're reviewing these, the, these, these, these decisions or these or these or the or these recommendations, but I do believe they're the biggest issue that have been brought up is the is the distance for directors to live. And for that annual review process or the possibility of that person not not having a job year to year. We can't. You're going to have a hard time retaining good employees that way. They they they need they need some more. They got you can't just be somewhere for a year. You got to know that you absent you making a mistake or the unforeseen happening. You have some longevity. There. So I have concerns about that as well. Thank you. Thank you Commissioner banter, city clerk. Would you like to say something? Yes, I just want for clarification. And the attorney can correct me if I'm wrong. So basically, if you want a question on the residency, what you would have to let us know tonight is so it's a two part if you're okay with the first part we it would stay as it is. There would not be an opposing question on the second part for all the department heads and directors. If you're if you want, you would just basically have to let us know. Do you just want to change the, you know, the mileage, the miles, or do you just don't want no policy for department heads and directors? You know, any restrictions? And then the city attorney and I would go through and write an ordinance that would be that would come back. And we could also bring back the question prior to the 17th, it would be, you know, for the December 3rd meeting that would would state that when we come up with some language and you would be able to as long as we don't change the title, which is very basic. If you didn't like what the ordinance said or you wanted to change or add language, you could do so as long as it's before the second reading. Okay, the attorney could correct me if that's how he no, the only I mean, one suggestion and again, this would be a suggestion is the opposite of this would be a question saying the all the all department heads and directors shall be hired at the discretion of the city manager, regardless of residency distance. I do have a question though, but would we have to? Because currently it states certain people. So that would clarify that as well. That would clear that up. And just the one question would so what actually would get put in the charter if it let's say one got one over the other. So by doing that, would we have to amend what's there currently and state that in the question as well. Could it say all other department heads. Yeah, you could do that. I mean if the I think, you know, I'd definitely like to talk to Attorney Salzman about this, but I mean, if the instruction is to develop an opposite question to consider by the public about the residency, the radius requirement, the ten mile, then that's the that's the instructions you give us. And we not try to wordsmith it too much here tonight. But if you want that to go away, then we would have to put our heads together and draft something that would be opposite of requiring directors and department heads to be within ten miles. So I was just thinking that it would be, you know, there's either no restriction or it's at the discretion of the city manager. Would. Okay. Good. I would like to suggest, because I've heard I think five people say that they don't particularly like the way this is. If I'm wrong, tell me I'm wrong. But to simplify it, let's come up with very similar to what our clerk said, an alternative that doesn't require the mileage scenario. And it whether or not we tie the city, the city manager's discretion or not, which I agree it should be his discretion. But just so that we might move along. And if the powers that be, the clerk and the attorneys can get together and agree, the language, I think I think you have an understanding of what we're trying to do. I think the clerk does, and I believe Mr. Saltzman does. So between that body, I would think we could come back on the third and take care of it on on the 10th. We would have to come back for a second reading, second reading. So I mean, that's that's what I would suggest. And but I don't know what the for want. So thank you, Commissioner Donato. I would just ask before I go back to Commissioner Eisner. We do this opposing question. It's either going to be what, 20 miles or no limits in the mileage. But I also ask, we talk about the verbiage. And can we as a board or in this verbiage write that, you know, the board considers maybe that, you know, the way work and lifestyle is that, you know, directors living outside. You know, can provide just as much and contribute to the community, like the verbiage wise and why we were supporting the opposing question or answer. So, yes, that also, to me, it's just like the voter is going to read this and then you want to if you if that's paragraph is something that you oppose as a commission, then we draft a second question that they're going to see right after that. And then the voter is going to be like, okay, clearly they're they're saying we're deciding whether this is up to the city manager and there's no distance requirements or they've got this distance requirements with a caveat in it. And then can we also explain that in our whereas is in the ordinance. Oh, for sure. In the ordinance will also have if you have a question then they will also be a separate flier. That would also go out stating the facts of the. But your ordinance basically says tells the story, the why and what you want done. And then the question is separate. The question will come back because that has to be condensed. Okay. So all right, now we'll go to Commissioner Eisner and after him I'd like to give a direction on what we're going to do or not do. So that way we can have a CRA meeting tonight and make sure we complete that. So, Commissioner Eisner, thank you. So as listening to all of the recommendations that went into the CRC, it always went to Attorney Salzman to write in all of what we're reading, any which way. So all we really need to do is relay to him what we as a board feel this should be. And I think it's best to allow him to construct something and come back with verbiage as you were saying earlier, that doesn't coincide with this, but kind of contradicts this according to the wording, how he thinks it should be put in, and then we just say yay or nay to it of course, but I don't think it should be something that we should try to come up with and that would solve it. But if that's the hill that we want to die on, so let's do that one. You know, the others are just, you know, just putting extra stuff in. We have the ruling. Most of what I spoke about was already policy and they just want to put it in the charter. I think it's going to be making it more confusing. But so be it. Yeah. No, no. Okay. Thank you, Commissioner Eisner. So with that, this was the discussion. How does this board collectively want to move with the BOC with the challenge question? Commissioner, I'll let you go first. Are you asking like 20 miles? No miles. Well, I number one, I think that both our attorney and our city clerk have said how we want to do it. Would just changing a few words in the second part of that. And that's what I think we should do, change as little as possible but open it up so that it's at the discretion of the city manager to hire and fire who he wants to hire and fire. Okay, that's vice mayor. Yeah. No, I'm in favor of no mileage restrictions and the city manager hires and who he wants. Okay, so how how that's worded legally is, you know, up to the attorneys, but that's it. No mileage up to the city manager. Commissioner Banther agreed. I agree to you have direction, sir. Perfect. Okay. That that is item 23. And now that was item 24. My apologies. Attorney Dickman, do we need a motion on that or is it just as a consensus? It's a discussion, so I wasn't sure because we'll be bringing back I think that's instruction to staff to do something. So this is going to be related to Attorney Salzman to draft something. I don't mind helping and jumping in, you know, more had someone, you know, it's that kind of thing. But yeah, thank you. Okay. This is the agenda that concludes the regular session. Agenda. We will now go to board and staff comments. Staff comments. Police Chief Jeff Young I just want to pass my condolences on to the family. Yesterday attended. Mrs. Zodiac is a long term longtime teacher out at Sunset Hills who retired, passed away. She was beloved by the community and those that knew her. Everybody called her Mrs. K and I think mayor, I think she was one of your teachers, wasn't she? She was, yes. Yeah. I remember being in the class back then, so. But she'll be missed and truly loved. Thank you. Chief City attorney. Yes, two things I'm taking a two week vacation. My number two here at the city and my firm is Sharon Linzner. She will be here on the second for the Heritage Board meeting, and we'll be sitting here on the third for with you all. She is very familiar with the city from an administrative point of view. She's been involved with all the various departments, so you'll be in good hands with that. Number two, with regard to this, the agreement for a city attorney assistance in talking with you all individually as your attorney and going over this, what should have been in here was an agreement that said I would be assistant city attorney and Mr. Saltzman would be the city attorney. So there's some there's been some really valid good points made to me in these conversations that I've been having. And I just want to emphasize that what I'm looking for is always a solution to a problem, because I think you have a really good opportunity here to have two really good law firms supporting the city. It's just working out that the process and the and how. And so I still want to continue those conversations with you all. I'll go back and talk to Mr. Saltzman about it and hopefully bring something back to you all. But I just want everyone to know that there's this the status quo can stay as it is, right now. You're not going to be in any jeopardy. It's fine. I just want to work something out so that it's clear it's clean and, you know, and it makes sense. But I want to thank you all for giving me your points of view on it. They're all very good, very valid, very, very smart. Thank you. Thank you. City attorney, city clerk, Miss Jacobs, I have no comments. Thank you. Thank you. City manager, Mr. Rudd. Thank you. Mayor. The only thing I want to offer because of the time and if you wanted to, I need at least an hour for the CRA meeting. If we could do it at 5:00 on the third and. And we know we'd have to drop dead. Stop time by 630. The challenge with the reason we tagged it on the end was just availability. So we wanted to have everyone here. But if you if your availability allows you to get here earlier, we could do it five and then be done by 630. But I, I think the presentation and possibly your questions may take us an hour or an hour and a half more. I'd move it. I'd move it. Yes. That's. You can't think this straight. I mean, it's not fair. I think to the CRA. I'd like to make sure everyone's. Yeah I agree. Okay. That could be the third. Would that work at 5:00 for everyone runner. No concerns with like with with like noticing that or that we establish it tonight. Right. Attorney. I mean I don't I don't think you have any problems with rescheduling this for, for what would you say, five. Would you say 535 an hour ahead or five, 5:00. Five and then take a little break and then start the other meeting, take a break? Yeah. You can. I think you can call the CRA the same way you can call the city commission like 24 hour notice, that kind of thing. That is correct. Do we need to open up that meeting and make a motion from the CRA at that time? Oh like here tonight? Yes. Open it up and have them continue it to that. That might be a smart way to do it so that it doesn't, you know, doesn't affect any re advertisement. And that'll take just a minute or two. That's all I have. Thank you city Manager. We're now going to board comments. Commissioner Banther yes, thank you. First off I it's been really nice to get to know this board as a whole. And there's I think today there was some very good discussions and it's helped me as well get me up to speed with what's going on. So I do appreciate the board explaining things. And you all you all have some very good input. Thank you. Charles, could you please have the internal auditor email me and of course copy the board. That's fine. I want to know what they're what they're what they're what they're what they're currently working on. Okay. And I assume you know that. And also how we and what's the appropriate way for me or any commissioner to, to give them stuff to do. How does that work. All right. Thank you. Oka. Commissioner DiDonato. I just would like to repeat I'm looking forward to our policies and procedures, time, whatever that is. Mr. City Manager. So I think we have several items to look at on that in it. We put it off for almost a year now. I want to get it done. Absolutely. That's all. Thank you. Commissioner Eisner, thank you, Mayor. So I did have a conversation with our assistant city attorney and what I brought up to him was the fact that in. And that's why you have this form in front of you of the charter is I asked Irene to put that out there because in our charter, we do not have any title of assistant attorney. So meaning he would now if we signed the contract as it's written, he would not be actually reporting to us because he wouldn't be a charter official. So he would be reporting to our city manager. So I saw this as confusing, confusing, and every question that I asked just started to get us even more confusing. He's complimenting me. Good question, but I don't have an answer to that. And I'm like, well, I need an answer to that. Otherwise, I'm going to give you more confusing questions because. So that's why this whole thing was brought up. You know, we need to know who's he's reporting to because literally either he's then going to report to the city manager or he's got to report to salesman, you know, and that's not how I thought this was going to come about. So that was the one thing that I we spoke about. The other thing I did want to make a second announcement. I did want to thank our mayor. I really appreciated how you handled yourself in the shade meeting. You did an excellent job. And, you know, I was very appreciative in your comments and your thoughts and your questions. And I think you did a really good job and you helped move the city forward. So I did want to make that a public announcement that I was very impressed with what you did. So thank you. Thank you, Commissioner Eisner. Thank you. And last but not least, not only did I turn 70 this past week, which I am now an old man. So if you see me stumble, they say, if I stumble and you laugh, I'm still a young guy. If you come running to my aid. That makes me an old person. So if I stumble, you better be laughing. Okay? That's one thing. Number two, this week I also had a granddaughter. My second granddaughter was born at 6 pounds 19oz and it was very emotional. My daughter had a tough birth on the first. This one was delightful and I am. My heart is just bursting with with just joy and love and you know, it was just it's probably one of the best feelings that you could possibly have. So I do want to wish my daughter, son in law and my two granddaughters the best and the healthy life. And I swore to my daughter I will not trip over my second granddaughter's highchair and break my other Achilles tendon like I did the first time. So I will walk wisely this time. So that's all I really want to share. And I, I just thank everybody, you know, contribution. I hope that the, the CRC didn't get offended by anything. We said. I know they did some great work. They all participated. I thought it was such a great blend of people. It was great ideas. I would like to see a few less things go on, but I accept it all and I just thank them all for their hard work. Thank you, Commissioner Eisner, Vice Mayor Collins. I am happy that our city attorneys are have worked out the little kinks. And because it's really nice having the representation we have and having two firms and all their resources is, is a really good thing. Yeah. I want to you know, wish to pass along condolences for Pam. Jackie's just a just a sweet lady. Always had a smile on her face and just a really important person in our community. Also Dan Chulu, we lost him last week and a longtime Rotarian and also a staple of our community as well. The it's nice having you, David. I enjoy seeing you down there. So welcome. I, I don't know if I said it the last time you were here, but and then just want to wish everybody a happy Thanksgiving. You know, we have gone through a lot. We need to take a break and enjoy ourselves and I'm glad the employees maybe all get a little an extra day off. They can unwind and enjoy the holidays as well. So that's it. Wish everybody a Happy Thanksgiving. I will be in New York City this year. I was there last year and I saw the tarpon Springs band. They won't be there this year, but so it won't be quite as eventful as it was last year. But I'll be looking watching the parade that everybody else will be watching on TV. So but you probably have a better view than I'll have, so. But thank you. Thank you. Just first I want to, as Commissioner DiDonato brought up about policies and procedures. I'm hoping that does come up soon in the future. And as I was going to the charter telling them, hey, I'd like to have once a year, you know, board gets together with projects that we could send out for earmarking for budget season for these, you know, our other state and local, federal officials. So I'm hoping we can get that memorialized in the policy for rules and procedures. That would be great. My condolences go out to the Zodiacus family thinking about the OPA, the Lee Terry Kiki, Stacy and Michael and the whole Zodiacus families. The Pam was a pillar in the community, a great teacher, you know, and so we're thinking about her as well as Rotarian Dan Chulu. He was great to the community too. And, you know, it's just wish him and his family the best and just thinking about them all. This board is yelling no matter what. I know we have our differences at times. I know you know, he came together and you know, unexpected way. But this board is gelling. We we're coming up with ideas, we're working together. And it's good to see. And I'd also. Police chief, I have to ask a favor. I'm getting a lot of requests from officers just to please consider. And I know he has no idea because I caught him off guard with this. The beards. You already know. So someone's coming to you and saying something. So just please consider it in the future for some of them. And you know, it's tough shaving your face every day. So just something to consider, sir. And this whole board, we wish everyone a happy Thanksgiving. Please enjoy it with your family, friends and loved ones. It's truly. This time of the year is all about coming together and appreciating everything we have. And you know, just being thankful for it all. So with that said, this concludes the regular session meeting. The meeting is I'm sorry, Commissioner Eisner, go. Yes, I did want to remind the board and our clerk that we also had to make a decision coming before forward Pinellas with that overpass that's coming up. It would have to be a vote for a referendum. Am I correct, or the city manager might want to speak additionally. But from my understanding that it is not doesn't have to be on this. Rene has gotten with the director, and it doesn't have to be on this election because they with the storms and all, they didn't do the town meetings and things that they were supposed to do for education. And they can start that. And it could go on if we did the November election next year, it would be a standalone election. But we would still have time, plenty of time to do it next March of 26. On that election. And then there would be no additional cost because we're having an election anyway to the city. And I don't know if the city manager wants to add anything from my understanding. Correct. That's it. We the storm threw off the schedule to make the March election, and since construction is not funded and so far out, they they they feel confident we can we can do a the November of next 25 or March of 26 with an item on the agenda because I have the I have the meeting, a meet and greet coming up in December. And then I know we have our first real forward Pinellas meeting in January, so I just wanted to I didn't want to go in there and, you know, not have a clue of what we're doing. So as long as there's a plan, I'm good with it. Awesome. Okay. That's it. Thank you. Okay. Commissioner Banther. Yes, that's a thank you for bringing that up about the overpass. I need to educate myself more on the process we're doing to help. I'm not sure if you could stop it, but whatever. But it does work. When we speak up to the county and officials, it was, I don't know, it was early in my first term in 2013. They wanted to put the county, wanted to put a fixed span bridge by by the yacht club that would involve eminent domain on both sides. And it was being slipped through like nothing you've ever seen. I blew the whistle on it. Some others did too. We forced the county commissioners to get out there and find tarpon Springs. They they met us at the yacht club and it got killed. Now the bridge still has to get replace, but it's getting replaced in a more respectable manner. So it does work, you know, not always what we want in the end, but we have to hold the county and state not accountable. They're doing their job, but let them know our opinions and thoughts. So I was glad to hear that. Thank you. Thank you Commissioner. Without us fighting, we wouldn't gain an extra seat on the board of Pinellas. So you know, Commissioner has been at every one of those meetings. So it's great to see what we can all together as a board do when we gel this concludes the regular session meeting. The meeting is adjourned at 9:35 p.m. Thank yo. Oh, yes. Now, please don't leave. We have to do the CRA special. Special session. It. Are you ready? Okay. I now call to order the special session agenda for the Community Redevelopment Agency meeting of the City of Tarpon Springs on Tuesday, November 19th, 2024 at 9:36 p.m. City Clerk roll call please. Chair coleus here. Vice chair Collins here. Commissioner Eisner here. Commissioner Donato here. Commissioner Banther here. Okay. There's only one agenda item, and that is to review and direction on updating redevelopment plan, downtown master plan and this chair will entertain a motion to defer the item to what was it December. The December 3rd, third at 5 p.m. So moved second. There are no further comments. Roll call please. Commissioner Banther. Yes, Commissioner DiDonato. Yes. Commissioner Eisner. Yes. Vice chair. Koulianos. Yes. Chair. Yes, yes. That concludes the special session agenda. We will. No, we will now go to board and staff comments. Police chief, just rest in peace. Dan July did city attorney. Nothing. City clerk I have none. Thank you. Thank you, city manager nothing. Thank you. Commissioner Banther. No, Commissioner DiDonato. No. Commissioner Eisner. No. Vice mayor. And I have I have no comments either. This concludes the special session. Meeting adjourned at 9:37 p.m. You want to?