32347 pound this is not a toll-free number and you may be subject to long distance charges according to your long distance plan when the chairperson opens the meeting for public comment please follow the below instructions if you wish to speak please di star five the moderator will unmute your line your turn to speak and notify you by announcing the last four digits of your telephone number please announce your name and address and you will be allowed to speak for 3 minutes any person wishing to address the board regarding an agenda item would be give it 3 minutes for time in time iner may only speak one time for each agenda item and I will say on that there's probably a few people that want to get up and speak tonight if you will everyone please just address the board not to address staff not to address other citizens that just come to the podium announce your name and address and please address the board um with that said um I'd like to request uh if you would if it's the pleasure of the board that we move agenda item number 17 to 12 a maybe a lot of are here for that particular item any objections to moving item 17 to to 12a all right well I request a motion to approve the agenda with that Amendment motion motion I say it to approve our agenda with item 17 moving to 12 a all in favor moving on to our consent items chance to go your consent items any questions discussion motion to approve motion to approve a second all in favor n a public request item number 11 Carol Marie marrow to to continue discussion of Scot SE Carol marrow 315 Northeast Second Street Ricky marrow same last meting we got no answer it was stated that you rejected our request for nobody said anything here tonight open back up unless i' like to get a guess or no answer as yall know what I've done last week I gave you all a pretty good visual of what we're up against here we're opening season too early it just is too early everybody knows it's too early we have a petition of 1,400 on it and grows every day um we need to put these dates back to where they were July to September the end of September a lot of the reason behind just they're too small why do we have to have sers we wouldn't even be having this conversation if the scholars were ready to go they're not ready to go we keep trying to make the resource get around the business that ain't the way it works the business has to get around the resource you can't make that resource just do what you wanted to do it just don't work that way they keep saying it's sustainable okay it's sustainable 2015 I was on the phone with Mr Chris W just the other day hour hour half 2 hours he's telling me I don't know why you know all your stakeholders ain't in on the same page you are R they you know I just don't they are be trying to protect it too because it's their money and I'm not trying to stop st season by no means we uh do good from Scot season too but we do realize that we want it back this September days it it Storms Come yeah we we get storms I mean that's that's just the way of life where we live at you know every Zone does why are we uh the only ones that open early because of the money that we get I get that I understand the money I understand that everybody needs the money but can't keep squeezing this Golden Goose and and it's depleting regardless of what anybody thinks all them boats out there we get all of it every year them first two weeks I mean it's a mad house and they all out there grinding them beds up this ain't just about the skulls this is about the grass beds out there too that that that's uh is home for all of our species that are getting completed and you know if You' done any research since I was up here looked at any of it I mean you can see everybody says the same thing it it's happening we've had good counts on our Scholars we have but that don't mean that we need to stay head in the curve I mean you know what what do we do we just sit here and wait till something happens and then we try to find an answer for it or do we stay ahead of the curve and we want to be the ones from Taylor County that says you know what them guys are right if I'm wrong then you know that's a good thing if I'm wrong it hurts everybody if I'm right bus everybody he County residents talking about that for a minute there's a lot of them on this petition y'all they want this they do they want it push back I tell you what the all of the uh feedback we're getting from this thread we've been running since January is that the Taylor County residents the main thing they tell us is we don't even go man in F that first month or so it's just too crazy and besides that the Scots are too small we wait till the end of the season we like to go into August and first of September cuz you know why they're from Taylor County they know that's when the Scots are good and that's when they're fat that's when they want to get them you don't need a sort don't need sort time to get that's that's pretty much you know where we're at with this and what I would like y'all seen my display of you know that little cup of Scholars and you know now the last couple since 20 when it went and they gave us in the first two weeks we never went at this this hard trying to get it changed back but we tried to roll with the flow roll the flow let's educate people we're on board with that we've been doing that for 14 years we've been doing that trying to educate people it ain't working and and and then sustainable to what you know we're tripled the amount of people that when we came up with this since then that are going out there in that bay triple at least and that's probably you know being light so what I'm asking here from y'all is it yes or no when I go before the FWC commission for a letter recommendation to switch the dates back in July the 1st to September 24th where they always were that is not going to probably fix the problem but it is one thing that we can do like I said before we can't help uh the the uh elements and and what happens to the uh water out there and the hurricane and stuff I something we have have no control over it but we do have control over this and we can say look we were you know we're we're trying at least help preserve it for everybody cuz if it goes away it won't be good for hat you and the surround there it won't be good at all any question yeah I got a questione I want to apologize to y'all for the lack of dialogue at the last me meeting when you were here um I I don't necessarily disagree with you but the problem that I have at this point in time is that people have already made reservations to come here and stay uh at uh hotels and condos and whatever else and they have their vacation plans they've already made plans they've probably already put money down I think it would be very unfair to these people and I think it would be unfair to the businesses right now to have to to change this at this time now if in and in addition to that our biologist he he disagrees with this data but I've heard the same arguments that you all present um but if this is something that that you want to pursue I would suggest that you come earlier before people have made plans but for right now I I I can't I I can't do this to people I'm sorry got got to hurry up and grow then right two weeks those SCS will be as big as we showed y'all we need those two weeks for them to grow I understand that I really do but I the other dates were changed what did they do those dayses through the years they Chang it from the uh 15th to July 1st if you'll look at it over 10 years you'll see where they did that and and that and they survived in May you can look around um I don't I know we had a hurricane but you know I don't know nobody's going under from these two weeks they're not I want to say the same thing the Pam said people's done got your took vac that they can't change and they got reservations they can't change and I'm I'm with them on that this is something FWC really needs to you need to talk to them about it when you go to the meeting with them that they need to come recommend the dates that they their biologist years ago said they needed to stop at a certain time and started at a certain time I remember them saying it in Cryer River meeting down there and that's what they said they had it figured out when they when they start leaving the hill going out to spawn there was a certain date there and they need to come and you need to explain to them they need to come and present something to the board where we can you know make a decision and U but I'm just it's for this year it's too late as far as I'm good so we have to discussed this topic at L and so understand about that um that's part of the reason I didn't have any questions for you guys previous meeting we had quite a number of discussions in response to where the seasons at and we have also discussed how the business owners were weeks away from the season and we we I think all understand that there are number of reservations and things that I that make but would you also be in support of if this board were to send a letter of request to ask FWC to look deeper into the data and the subject matter as far as going forward yes sir yeah I'm you know I'm open to compromise I am here dat the data is not wor but it's false data anyway so so the the bottom line for that would be to have a current data set that would give indication as to the current population and so I think our business owners the ones that I've spoken with will be in support of that even to looking into sizing enforcement limits and things of that magnitude so that we can see what those indications would have on the scol season as a whole was that it would be for me I'll just say you this this is a FWC jurisdiction they change these they change these dates 100% change they change these dates all the time on different species based on studies that they do that that species are in danger now FWC come to the board and said hey this is what we we need to do and this is what what our biologist is telling us then we would probably be in support of but I've not gotten that from that legac see and that's really that's their jurisdiction of what they do um it has been changed just by a phone call from person calling the uh govern office the governor's office and getting extra weekends posted in the paper anyway FWC has nothing to do with that we know I know that y'all W make that rule all I was asking was for support from y'all for your tayor County residents that who want this it ain't just me and her standing there wanting this and it's not you talking about a few stakeholders versus pretty much the county so I see how that works and we see what they bring in every June 15 was waste got anything else to say about the schol season Charlie danil y'all have anything to say about the scholar season I mean I know y'all made your phone calls so car WR move on to item number 12 uh Mr Scott plan to continue discussion of potential path forward for replacement see all all rights please so just start out with a quick review from the four March meeting that we had this is a what we're trying to do is place a blown out Timber seaw wall this is style seaw wall 4 in um gallon pipe driven down about 8 ft a piece down into the Rock so it's got um the panels are driven down adjacent to that the panels are driven down to the rock you can't get through the Rock and then there's additional 4in pipe that's driven down that will be driven down back um along the little seaw wall and then they're going to use 3/4 in all thread Rod as tiebacks for additional strength for that the big thing that this seaw wall has an advantage over Timber or rip wrap is there's a state of state-of-the-art drain system that's that we're putting in I've got a couple of pictures of that later on next slide please so this is the drain system the the panels are Everlast ESP Everlast and the drain system uses wheat PES are 2 in diameter holes placed along the uh the and I'm not sure if it's the high water mark or the midde mark in there these little things here go into those holes the Combs go back in to the dirt side and the square part with the little Tabs are out on the water side the nice thing about these is that it's got filter systems in there and you can actually take the little tabs and pull those out periodically over the years uh to make sure the filters are staying clean and I think that's the same system that they've got in the four rivers big um final panel Sewall that's on on the main Canal over there I'm not sure when that was put in I think 67 years ago something like that next slide this is a picture of the drain you can see the little filter this is just was sent to me just to clip off the internet there so that that would go down all the way across and these things keep they they equalize the hydrostatic pressure from the back side to the front side anytime water's going to get in someplace it's going to leave unless there's to get a perfectly sealed vessel which a seaw wall would never be so what this does is gives water P least resistance and allows that pressure drop which is what causes most seaw walls to fail is unequal pressure next so we got with the seawall I didn't get into this last time there's four main components to keep the sea wall from V panel Seawall from blowing out anyway the drain system that we talked about which probably just as critical as panels and poles and tiebacks and everything else that goes with these seaw walls the 4in schedule 40 pipe is driven down into the Rock and I didn't know this I got this from Salt Water Builders what they do when they drive those things down is the pable mushroom into the Rock and then that sort of acts like an anry just like when you thrill a hole concrete anchor in in your concrete when you're going to put carp up or something like that and then the panels are driven down to the Rocks so that'll prevent um any kind of scouring from underneath as well the conventional R vinyl pan seaw wall is driven down it has one it has a wher on the front and then the tie bags but what keeps the the bottom from Towing out is is into the mud this is actually into the Rock not into the Rock but onto the rock and they're going to add the additional tiebacks which I think is critical as well for Extra Strength just from my background is a pilot for 40 years 26 years in the Air Force shotty repairs kill people I understand that and I am not anything to do with anything shot that's the reason why we're trying to go with this this very very strong sea so this is the update I Mr Duff from DP finally called me back he apologized for taking so long to get back with me but he said on the phone he goes sorry about taking so long to call you back but I've been trying to do a little research on this I wasn't even sure this project requires seaw wall but having talked to Taylor County and to you because I sent him an email and not an email so fact this right now is a private Seawall on public property which means that it it does in fact get a permit then you followed up on an email and these are quotes from that email I think you guys have a copy of that uh that he said property ownership is the issue um with with Taylor County the issue of permit in its current location then he said if you do want to permit this wall we need to work it out I need to work it out with you to be able to continue and once that happens then I can begin the uh per um process at that point you actually simp the application form to start next so for the path forward and that's really what I'm here to talk about tonight again this DAV sea wall the way it's the way it's being built is a fort KNX seaw wall if it's not the strongest one on Katon Beach the will be the strong keep at least it's in the top one or two that will that will be there and I understand there's no seaw wall That's hurricane Pro but I believe this wall and the way saltwater Builders has has designed this wall will Everlast I think that this will be as hurricane res or storm resistant as you can ever get so if you compare this to the Four River seaw wall I don't know how many feets out there 400 ft maybe 350 ft that seaw wall does not have the it's not a nav sty wall it's conventional it's been there there's a rip WRA that's been required to go on the waterwood side and I think that and and someone Builders anyway says that this this seaw wall that we're trying to continue to build is stronger than the one across now so at this point I'm requesting that Tor County supports me with continuing this wall and its present position as long as I can get any permits that's required from the state uh Mr Duff told me that the um the easiest way for the state would be property ownership and then he said also that we cannot maybe get an easement from from Taylor County to move forward with that so that's my request Mr w we need do we know what the square footage is on this I not at the location of the new seaw wall so we would have actually if this is something the board wishes to do we would actually need a new survey because the survey that was done previously did not go so far out into the canal but it just went to the location of the present seaw wall but if you recall the new SE wall is out several more feet into the canal if you had that ownership the DP would be permit project DP said if I actually own the the uh the um property that it would be much easier for them and then he even talked about that's where we get back into probably see while my manmade body of water with just back fi behind it nothing in front may not require permit but we we'll have to work that we would still submit the I'd just say I'd be in support to see what that survey says and and I'm also being support supp property so the last meeting that that when we discussed this um I left here and everything was okay so could you explain to us then the sequence of events from the time we left that meeting where I thought everything was okay what happened sure I'll be glad so when we left the meeting the word property was used that that tayor County would support as long as it didn't go more waterward than the property on the east side across the bridge and that's where that old broken down seaw wall is no drain system as crooked as as all get out um so I was I'd already been over there several times the neighbors all been over there several times looking too and we were just looking from where the wall where the wall it was is was going to be I'm like well sh we got that you know was no-brainer since then I found out that uh you don't you can't count rip WP that doesn't count even though a vot won't FL up rip WP either rip WP doesn't count and then who told you that um Mr dudy apparently that's T County um not rule not law but convention I supp then the U the stakes were driven based on a cad drawing and I'm not sure about the date of the cad drawing I was not aware of that either so that's where the discrepancy happened and when we got back and saw that where the stakes had been driven I think it's I don't know 2T I heard 13 in I I don't know who told me that but so that's what happened and then um when I finally got in touch with Mr Duff I actually asked him if the state would permit no further out than where it is now just to give us Le to maybe discuss but as we talked about before I don't have any other options because I can't move the wall those P those hles cannot be pulled up because of the mushrooming they're going to have to be cut off with a torch I can't move them 13 in Back to the stakes I can't drive them down to the old wooden seaw wall and I can't go along my property line because then once the everything is pulled out I'll have exposed p it'll be back to worse than wood okay so uh just to be clear the state has told you that they will permit that the state said that with what we have provided them at this point he doesn't see a problem permitting it but the permit would still have to go through its process but that's what Mr D told me so I'm I'm in favor of letting this gentleman go ahead youve spent a ton of money um uh the last at the last meeting everything seemed okay then suddenly something pops up that's contrary to what we talked about um I'm glad that we finally have someone that's come in that's uh willing to spend this kind of money to fix this s wall because this has been a mess for a long time so as far as I'm concerned I'm willing to to let this gentleman go ahead with what he started and not have to uh he can't tear this down you have too much of an investment uh I don't think that it's um anything that would bother any of the neighbors it certainly doesn't bother me and and I'm going to suggest we goe in order to do that you would need the survey that property Surplus correct what's as far as I'm concerned what you've got down I've done been under there twice and looked at it I missed you that day if we were supposed to get together but I missed you but I looked at it twice and what he's doing is a good job for seaw wall Go I mean you're doing it above and beyond most everything that's been done down there and as far as the property line goes I have no problem with you being wor that because people put pilings and boat houses and float do all over the place on County property and they've done it for years and so you're not bother me a bit in world where I'm we you 100% on it um there's even houses in St has and ke Beach scking over property lines so I know I have any problem with it if you can get the blessing from D do it where it's at you got my blessing Mr chair can I address Mr mlan you you've had to help me help me understand this before but I think the additional issue or question about where the wall is cited now is was more about scour protection and any need for additional revetment can is that correct that's that brought up the con the wall that we've got now is the E best wall to prevent rip WRA from driv to go in front of it like so many of the others do which will they will all have problem problem once the ding starts so that I think was what the more of what the question was is that we just wanted to make sure that everyone understood the the seaw wall in its present location may require an additional inclusion into the canal in the future if there's a need for re so I talk to saltwater Builders about that and the nice thing about the tiebacks that they're putting in with the 50-year guarantee is they can come in and they can dig out to the tiebacks if that is if the wall starts blow it out that way right the way that it's set into the rock it will not tow out so but if it starts leaning which is very doubtful I mean 50 years maybe I don't know if a category five plus hurricane comes through that all bets are off at that point but I would not I am rip WP has its place this is not a place for rip WP if you have to start putting rip wrap in front of a seaw wall all you're doing is throwing more money and more money and more money you got to go in there and fix these things right that's for me being a pilot right so I would not put R Rip r is not going to do anything with the seaall but but that was really the concern more of the concern is that there could be potential like I said room taken up in the canal if there's a need for revetment I think that was the biggest that was a concern from staff cor I I don't know I know um I'm not sure what the concern was I just thought it was from the from the flag post that we put out on the cad drawing you told me that right but nobody else has but I can you know I don't I don't want to put rip WP that's that's not going to fix this seaw wall I mean if this seaw wall fails I would rather have somebody come in and redo it do something else besides just put rocks against it yes I read this article coming from uh it says something about ownership or EAS if we if we needed it to you is a ownership then there's nothing else we would have to do with it that's correct but if we let you have an easement in there 50e easement or whatever the easement might be then if you decide to leave or something happen to it we still have control because that's our right yes sir easement uh I'm not sure how that works um I'm not sure I think somebody mentioned whole Harless agreements I'm not sure exactly what that is to be honest with you I did speak with our insurance company link um about U liability insurance I don't know how that would work if somebody during the Scout season starts drinking a lot of beer trespasses across my property the county property and falls off to see while breaks their arm who's responsible for that my insurance C said they will not give me liability insurance on property that I don't have so Mr chair first and then the other concern that we talked about was if there's damage to the seaw wall and it's that even though the seaw wall belongs to you but it's on County property then you can not obtain assistance from FEMA that is correct right that's right the female I was actually here in September help my brother pulled his bottom walls out and dried and fix up after the hurric the FEMA guy actually came by and was talking to us and he remembered the previous owner uh before we bought the property and U I asked him about FEMA and he goes well I know that you don't own the sea wall so if you own the seaall you could apply for a grant but you can't now and I said Lord I was try I was still hopeful that I could figure out away was TR Pi the sea wall for me I didn't that's I dream now I understand but anyway um that is correct in order to really address the the suggestions by D and your limitations from FEMA or any kind of reimbursement you would need ownership of this sliver of square footage that's correct so do you need a motion to have that survey before you go down I like to say some sure I F in can you talking about um into the Well from the bridge it's it's in line for with the bridge it's not blocking the bridge any more than any of the other properties around uh as far as out the canal I'm not sure for my property line is that what you're talking about yeah 10 ft maybe I'm I'm not sure I I have not been able to get out so a boat coming down does a boat go up and down that Canal a boat on that can 10 ft off but they hit it they cannot they cannot get under the bridge along my seaw wall they can't because of the bridge has got you know you got your bridge and then you got your whatever bulkhead or whatever that's called so the bridge opening is 20 ft maybe and then I'm I'm way inside the bridge opening and you can't that Canal is so small you can't get you can't get two boats coming and going at the same time under the bridge anyway he's not interfering with it in any way he l Mr dudy with the upcoming Dr would any of this cause a foreseeable issue trying to be FL um will it cause a foreseeable issue potentially which is the whole reason that the question arose with respect to the potential for scour under this Mr mlan has stood up here and he's told you that did you come to the Pod yes ma'am absolutely so Mr mlan has stood up here and told you the the benefits of the structural aspects of the seaw wall I don't think anyone has From staff's perspective contested the structural adequacy of that sea wall uh relative to the method that they've done what we did question was relative to the placement of it and the placement of it as it pertains to the potential to address soil material from shifting and moving from underneath the seaw which is when we left the last time you thought everything was um all worked out yes we did too so I stood up here and I gave you staff's perspective with respect to where we were accepting of where the seaw wall would be relative to the one that was on the each side that is how we move forward so there was three options it was you put it no further than the existing seaw wall on the other side which is the concrete seaw wall which I clarified verbally to Mr mlan so that there wouldn't be any confusion you can put it on the where the existing sea wall is today which is consistent with our rules and D's rules or you can put it on your property and as we put it on your property when we come up to the dring project we would account for that material that is in front of it remove that and open up the conveyance so everything that we thought was worked out we moveed forward with that I did speak to Mr Duff um there was a synopsis or a summary of what was a receip from Mr mlan that was sent to him I followed it up with a clarification um we spoke to Mr mlan Excuse me Mr McDuff McDuff after that Mr excuse me and then subsequent to that he asked for some pictures so code enforcement went down there aligned himself on the East seaw wall and projected the stakes which is what you see in the pictures and it is the seawall location today because it's 30 more Ines beyond that so he made reference to the cad drawing the cad dra was the produced when the uh survey was acquired what Manda was referring to earlier I took that right away line turned a 90° to it moved that line to the furthest limit of that concrete seaw wall and projected it across it was 18 in at the Far West End from the existing seaw wall that is consistent with the's rules so if you put it in a line parallel to that Seawall you meet their rules our rules say one foot so we were willing to acquest to the D ep's position of it being up to 18 in so did something go wrong not from our perspective did anything go wrong was anything misleading no it was not everything we said was what we had reiterated in an open meeting the last time we were here I left a message with M Mr Duff with respect to the ownership there is a provision typically and I'm not sure why he didn't um make mention of it but it is usually as I mentioned before that we allow we can allow someone to act as the agent for that application that's fine so I'm hoping to reach out to him if it's necessary after this meeting to clarify what is going on with respect to that if that's not a provision or possibility if it's not I don't have a problem coming back and saying that this isn't going to work here are your rules if you want to try to move towards the variance from those rules here's the process so you guys tell me we followed the rules and every aspect of this and I will stand up here and defend I did it straight from that and I don't plan to today but we are telling you what our requirements are and our concerns and obviously you guys are in a position to digest all that and make your decision question yes why is it that D says 18 in and we somehow another came up with 12 in help me understand that differential so you have to remember the hierarchy of s I'm not sure where their methodology arrived at that well I I take that back I did I do understand um because he he did address it you can always be more restrictive than a higher authority so D could say 2 feet we can say one foot because we're a local jurisdiction but we can't say they say 2et and we say 3et but what his what 18 in is referenced to is that these interlock vinyl seaw walls are typically on the order of about 12 in deep and then you would typically have a whaler on the front side of it so 18 in gives you enough room to be able to position a new seaw wall right in front of an old seaw wall so that's how he gets to that that de but again and and I'm sorry but how did we and when did we come up with 12 in versus 18 I'm assuming it was put in the ldrs back in 1996 or whatever was they were adopted to me that we need to look at change in ours to match c yeah that I don't know that you you would have any opposition from us because it has it's rooted in the legitimacy of this is what takes physical states to put that new seaw wall in but you're willing to accept that six in VAR by what you projected yes sir so so there's no reason really for us to change anything you have to realize what where his where his framework is relative to where we gave the option to be is different it's 30 in at the closest point from 12 in to 18 in not 18 to 30 not not that not from what you projected but from what the allowance is because of what DP requires versus what count yes that being the jurisdiction we wouldn't have an issue accepting that 18in if the was willing to offer that permit so I guess basically if we were to table this until you could get more instructions to DP the game would be to understand what implications it might have for dring go back to what Mr McLean had mentioned that he talked about his insurance is not going protect him in any kind of way if he is not shown as showing ownership of this property no what we do if he's not showing ownership of the property the insurance is not going to cover it understood and you hat to bring up a lot of things but you have to remember there are numerous seat walls along County property along this Coastline there is not a seat wall in place on Dark Island that's on private property every one of those are on count property so is there a concern from us us being staff relative to that positioning I don't think and Conor me on this that I want to say maybe 10 15 years ago or so there was crafted like a structural easement where it at least on paper gives us that release of liability and demn ification Provisions with respect to us it doesn't necessarily offer the land owner any protection but at least attempts to insulate us from any issues of damage or um injury something like that so that's what I would suggest if you were wanting to allow him to excuse me this land Doner to install something the first thing that we had as an option was a RightWay use permit it's we're very familiar with it we know it has indemnification Provisions in it technically it's a piece of property versus right way but it has that and I suggested it so if I remember correctly Conrad said you know we could move forward with that that's what I would suggest him to do and just not necessarily put a time frame on it um maybe even perhaps Let It Go with the property versus the owner in case there's a change of ownership you know down the road something along those lines and let Conrad see it make sure that he agrees with the terminology and we can pitch that to D and ask them if that is adequate enough with respect to a company it with maybe the County administrator or the chairman signature on the application with respect to Mr mlan trying to be the agent and see if it works if it doesn't and we still feel the necessity to protect this area then at that time you've exhausted all measures and pursue the transfer ownership that's what I was going to say comrade wouldn't it be just easier just to transfer the property to to Mr mlan that's a clean is way yeah it seems like to me that's the easiest simplest thing to do we're out of it well obviously we can serve it and value it did you hear what I said well I didn't I just said transfer I didn't say whether we give it to it or sell it to him you know that would be the decision of the Ford well yeah surely and statutes for disposition of County property yeah being he's establishing a good seaw wall on that line that's going to protect that channel once they dredge it out I'm fine with it whatever it take to get it in his name to I'll make a motion to that for a survey to prove know what we're do do as far as I'm concerned I thought that's what staff and I guess my question would be if we need to go as far as an appraisal or just a seaw wall and I could request maybe the property appraiser to help us with a value well you could you could it's a very little small piece right so you under the statute you can say that it's nonv valuable um and that uh there's no County use for it right pursuant to the statute and with that you also would not have any um reason for maintenance and such for future clean you would then have to maintain your property isn't that correct that is correct but I have to maintain it anyway so but anyway yes that is correct yes sir but you're not able or you're not I guess qualified per FEA because of the technicality correct yes Ma so I guess I would just need um if that's the will of the board to instruct staff to move forward with the survey and then is the board going to absorb those costs I would say so yes ma'am what I want to add to that is what I want to add to that that is he is immensely improving that property that you know that no one else has done anything to so and this we would never um not all not while I'm here agree to put such a Sall up as what he's putting up so he the way I see it is he's he's helping the county and so with the amount of well with the value of that seaw wall uh I would say that um we did a survey and then and and little of you know just let him have that property because it's of no use to us we can't do anything with it um and like I said he's greatly improved it so I and and seeing that that's the direction that you're heading I would say in in Loop of us incurring additional associated with this use the original survey where the ground is not where he's trying to put it and you can use a legal description from that need a new Sur well that wouldn't be accurate right because yes it would it would be accurate for the land that's there okay but what about the the additional intrusion into the canal because the board is accepting of where it's going to be so the transfer of ownership is for land it's not for any any of the because if you recall the survey is only along the boundaries of the old seaw wall yes I have a cop right here help me I'm asking for for your help so any additional so the property where the seaw wall would go would that still be on County property there is not property there today so the sequence of timing would be if you're wanting to pursue transfer of ownership of this portion of County property to private land owner the legal description associated with that would be the way the land looks today not the way the land is hoping it's going to look I would not pay for another survey okay so Mr chair I I'll make a motion again that that we move forward and transfer this uh piece of property to Mr mlan and then he can move forward with your project that's that's that's my motion hold on hold on we already have because there is no County use for it that had that to your motion and and I add that to my motion absolutely is there not public hearing involved with this an advertisement uh yeah we're going to have to do that but her motion is contingent on us um following statut following the statute and we have to get a legal description and there's some steps we have to take it's contining on doing the the homework we have a motion in a second on the table all favor thank you move on to 12 a is our item 17 coming to 12a the board discuss Bas flood elevation for electrical services I'm going to ask Mr ketring to to help explain this issue to the board December 31st 2023 adopted a new flaing in that section R 3226 system equipment and components shall be located at or above the elevation required in section R2 if any replacement has substantial Improvement electrical system component shall meet requ of deception all right2 21 Coastal Z shall have lowest elevation to or above the Bas plug elevation ex so basically say build there would be Bas blood elevation plus one but electrical equipment heating ventilation air system would also use the same elevation this new building code you said this came out four months ago okay months ago came out in 2023 but they put it in a p on December 3 Mr chairperson if I may and the reason the reason this is Mr ketering feels like is relevant is as you recall a couple of weeks ago there was discussion of ordinance electrical service and I think St Mr Earl's concern is if there's any wish for the board to to include that um as far as anything you'd wish to set aside I he does not believe that Florida building code allows us to do that that probably more question for con you forgot to to give them the exception to this there is exceptions so electrical systems equipment heating ventilation air conditioning U what P you the first page the second parag the design accumulating res and stress incl effective during Curr of flood and require elevation of course so if you can build it sealed it can be put below the base PL elevation so there is availability for that because there are components you can buy that are sealed so that is available this would actually by elevating your electricity out of water in the event of a flood now a lot of times the utility company does turn the meters off or pull the meters but there's been a few times they have last one meters but if your main power going in is elevated and you have GFI protective breakers on your equipment if the stuff on the ground gets wet it will turn that off and therefore it would just it would reduce any chance of elocution greatly reduce it I just yeah I I'm I'm just baffled as to why TR County knows nothing about this um that's that's just amazing to me that the they know nothing and then I guess my other concern is that or my question is why are we deciding to do this and I'm assuming that it's for for new a new search when you've already got over half of the people down there has it the way it is now so what value is it to have a few new ones to to to do this when you've already got the majority of the people that's got it I really could not tell you what the value of changing the new ones versus old ones because yes there is but eventually in 20 years they would all be py about but again that was the Florida building came up with this is not anything I decid okay then maybe value is not the not the best word rationale then what is the rationale for it um I would say it's a safety issue going forward so apparently there must have been some issue somewhere else that they've come up with they seen this as a problem I don't know I just can't buy into it Mr chairperson and if I could answer commissioner fal's question about Tri County my understanding is that they they basically follow the recommendation of the county so they don't necessarily I hate to use the word concern themselves but they they have their own regulations of 4 feet um and I think that's above ground but but they they basically do they basically follow which each County recom requires well we can't we can't take this County to a place where it's a hardship on everybody it seems like we're making it so difficult to do anything at the coast anymore and we we need to stop that we're out of control and the way we've been operating has has been just fine let's don't make it hard on everybody let's let's don't do this this is not right this is this nothing to do with ordinance or Fe this this is in the Florida building I'm not sure exactly if there's any if Conrad has any comment on water building CO been been for a long long time not change really is I don't know whether this is this is a change or not but the building codee's been for a long time and the building code has been morphing as as time passes and changes you know and of course as I read this it appeared to me that the raising of of this Electrical uh equipment was because of floods also wind also take Inspire as I read it and that's why I said that I I want to read where everyone can hear because I don't think everybody heard the exception did everybody hear the exception so I'm going to read I talk louder than you exception locating electrical systems equipment and components heating ventilating air conditioning Plumbing appliances and plumbing fixures duct systems and other service equipment is permitted below elevation required in section R 322.212 point3 they're talking about the code provided that they are designed and installed to prevent water from entering or accumulating within the components and to risk to resist hydrostatic and hydr damic loads and stresses including the effects of buoyancy during the occurrence of flooding to the required elevation in accordance with ace24 to me that's the reason why they're doing it why they're why why you've got this exception uh to where the electrical components are placed now of course the building code of FL building code I don't know that they can come in and say that if you have it have it the way it's been that you have to change it I haven't seen anything like that but of course if your if your home is destroyed or your building is destroyed then you need to follow this pursuant to this um the part building Cod does that make sense that's what they're saying it would typically only affect new construction and replacement of damaged equipment so it would not be going down there and wholesale removing everybody's meters and putting up their grandfather again if they're already there in other words you'll be going by the building code from here on out with that on newer stuff that's coming this is new I went back till 2014 and you do see the verage change from year to year in that L section this one did get changed last this is how old four months it's one year and four months it's four months in place it's been one year to be I guess it's been available for four months able to scrutinize and actually write in for amendments it went into place December 31st then why are we all of a sudden bringing this up that somebody uh complain or something why is this why is this coming up now it would be just like any other thing that gets implemented the day gets implemented is when you change because again I don't see the rationale I don't see the value and making a few new people do it when you've got hundreds of people that already have it the way it is now if there is any exemption from this from the Florida building C I don't know do you know of anything Mr no but you know that's why that's why we read the exception you don't have to raise it that's what that says so you don't have to raise it if you do if you do what it says in what I read to you it's did you put it in yellow with all get everybody okay it's this y'all this right here right here and that's what I read to you just a few minutes ago when I said you know we got to give them the exception okay so another question so with this exception then is this up to um anybody's interpretation of what's going to make it uh um um to prevent water and this kind of stuff or is that something is that something we already have in the books the equipment is designed D locations is listed on the equipment say that again any equipment that is designed for wet or damp locations is listed on the equipment okay it will say that it's listed for wet what what I don't want to see is that people go and they do this and then someone comes along and says oh no that's not right I want it done this way after they've already spent money doing this be listed on equipment if it's designed for weed locations if it can be submerged it says only equipment and they can buy like said they can check with their vend when they buy it it's all avable just miss Fel and unless I just miss her the reference I gave you at the end which was asce e24 so that is for flood design um construction those three things that he made reference to would be your wind your water and then the buoyancy so they would have to all those apparatuses would have to be designed consistent with that and compliant with that in accordance with asce 24 it's not subjective it is based on that design guideline always heard building code they I've even been HED with building to you know they want stor Cs on your house and all this kind of stuff uh we going to go by the building code or we going to go by a county code or a fing code which one do we need to go by I don't think we have a county building I don't know if if it says we need to do this I think All Counties have to adopt the four that would be it's Incorporated in our we have to use it in know according to our ordinances okay are they doing this in Dy County yes so they have to put them they follow this and they they're actually doing that right now they do in D County they do in Swan County they do in Lafayette County I done there I couldn't tell you but he did say something about a knockout which you mean like a GFI yeah GFI and really as long as your main power coming in and I guess everybody has electricity you have the box of the meter is not protected it stays on all the time even when you don't pay your bill it's still on um so if that section goes to underwater then electrifies everything around it and you've got the power of the utility system there's really not much to turn it off um if you look at that doesn't get wet if you have components that are lower to the ground like your plugins if they're GFI protected with special Breakers that are they're not really special everybody has them in their house too yeah buy their house if they're protected with that as soon as they get damp they turn off no electricity they're damaged to any of your equipment they're damaged to you and that's relatively cost effective if I were building it and I was looking for cost that's probably the way I would get so what brought up for someone the way they've always build it they go down there and they boxes you wherever they want so to speak what's caused us to all of a sudden change that they got to go by this if they want to put it down at ground level that they got to go put go bu this special equipment submer equipment what's happened I guess I mean for me it's it's a citizen would like to go put his electrical equipment where he where he's always put it and it gets damaged by water or rain or whatever I mean high waters come in year over year do and and they they w't have to go replace it every year so be it again I did not write The Code by some else it's the new Florida building code that the changes because if you if I could speak Mr chairperson sorry say we're bound to the FL to the new Florida building code well I'm assuming we are I would say that this language is in the 2022 ordinance that's that's already been adopted by the board so when we were discussing you know possibly repealing that ordinance or a portion of it that's a question I have out to the state if that's even possible and what the ramifications of that would be but that this is in the 2022 ordinance I think the change it what the difference is is from what I understand our previous building official felt like that there was a possibility for an exception from this requirement for Standalone power Poes but we have not thus far been able to find an exception in the Florida building code so that's that's the reason we put it on the agenda even if the board wish to repeal a portion of that ordinance I don't know that we can that we don't have to follow the Florida building code but we may need to we may need to take a closer look at that I know Earl has reached out to dbtr um to see if we could get some guidance on that so that's that's a concern is that with the new this is in the new Florida building code that was effective January 1 which is about the time our previous building official left so I just think it's taken a little bit of time once we looked at the 2022 ordinance and realized that there may have you know that there may be a discrepancy so in an effort to say okay well what would happen if the board repealed that portion of the ordinance and we realized that even if that was your desire that we may still have to follow FL building code we know our intent was not to bound folks from doing property I know this board intent was not to bound anyone from doing as they always have on their property there saying we assume we we bound to then we need to find out I I absolutely we probably need to know how bound we are to it yes exactly well that's why we're bringing it to the board for some guidance and what I don't want is someone to be in in this you know this maybe a little bit of an unknown period to have different rules and then realize that maybe that you know that's not the case we don't want that obviously and I don't know if Conrad can answer that question as far as the building code my initial thinking is that we are bound by it but i' still like to make sure that we are section 55 3.80 enforcement subsection one it's comrade sure I appreciate it thank you sir just I'm G to read it out loud fla statute 5538 enforcement want can everybody hear me now yes except as provided in paragraphs a through G each local government and each legally constituted enforcement district with statutory Authority shall regulate building construction and where authorized in the state agencies enabling legislation each state agency shall enforce the Florida building code required by this part on all public and private buildings structures and Facilities unless such responsibility has been delegated to another unit of government under 55379 111 it's pretty clear isn't it so what would stop us from still talking to DPR and just just talk with someone well there's nothing there's no reason not to even go further than this to see what other folks are doing pursuant to this statute there's there's nothing wrong with that but this is a a starting spot which is the Florida Florida LA and the reason for this is more than anything is for protection of your constituents for fire for fire why get insurance on something if it's not a standalone pole stand I'm sorry a standalone pole is would that be part of the building if you building a home I get that for a standalone pole would which is how Danny interpreted it was okay like if I want to put a camper on my property and I need to stand on bat there it is I got a boat house and I need to Standalone Pole to get power I get power to my boat house it's from the Standalone pole that's what we're talking about right the building we're not going to arue the building build a house that put there make the meter there but I'm standing on pole on my property should I be able to have that and I don't need a meter to be 18t in a pole I got to get power back down here Mr chair that's that's what we're trying to get an answer to because I understand the way it was interpreted previously but that portion wasn't in the Florida building code from what I understand that was in our ordinance so that's that's the whole question is now that it's been added to the Florida building code polls have well it says electrical service so it doesn't I didn't we didn't see an exemption for polls but that's what we're searching for yes well let's read D on here building plans approved under 5537 73 and state approved manufactured buildings including buildings manufactured and assembled off site and not intended for habitation such as long storage buildings and storage sheds are exempt from local code enforcement agencies Plan reviews except for provisions of the code relating to erection assembly or construction at the s erection assembly and construction at the site are subject to local permitting and inspections long storage buildings and storage sheds bearing the Insignia of approval of the department are not subject to 553 842 such buildings that do not exceed 400 square ft may be delivered in the sty without the need of a contractors or specialty license you just got to keep reading on and reading on we seem to be doing a lot of shooting from the hip and they don't really have a lot of facts around what we're here talking about so uh I really think we we don't need to hinder citizens right now same as we did with these pole bars we don't need to stop citizens from being permitted that uh to to do jobs that they're trying to do now that sounds like we need to go figure out someone needs to go figure out maybe sta figure out what direction we need to go because I don't know that we even know that we're directing the citizens to even do right right or wrong can I make a comment okay I'm kind of in the middle of this I'm Judy Ferguson 2121 21211 you L Cedar Island I had a lot on Cedar Island had it it for years lived on Cedar Island 25 years my idea to retire was to sell the big house buy an RV put it on my lot at Cedar Island nice little shelter over and retire there that would be my sort of my retirement and that was my plan till I went to the building department building department I talked to the electric company company gave me a really nice picture of what everybody else has got on Cedar Island nice load area but the building department gives me this one it's up in the air and you got to build stairs to it it have to be 17t up 15t in my you have to build stairs for it my uncle called that when we built our house he called that an attractive new Nuance because if I'm leaving town and I have an RV lot and the RV is off because if I leave for any length of time during anywhere near storm season that RV is going off the block everything will be taken off so that'll be standing out there all by itself the Tower with my power and uh it's it's an attractive nuisance which I'm afraid we have some very creative kids on the island they got all got golf carts they run around if they climb those stairs and night nice platform there is no telling cuz I remember when I was young what I would try or something and I mean you could write you could write signs do not cross you could put tape around and everything that just makes it more exciting for a child and so I think it's a danger but number one I'm 84 thank you very much I to keep climbing those stairs to go plug in things and unplug them and they said you could run all these lines down my house has got a service and I see all those wires running down and running all over the house that's what they're saying I could do there put it up here and run all these lines down it's not going to have a building attached to it I'm not building a house if I was building a house this would be on the side of it and I have a house where it Services up and if there's a fire it's you know that's a problem this thing catches fire oh well too bad uh but if it's on the ground like I would like to put it and it catches fire we put the fire out we tear it down we build a new one put it just like it was get it inspected and start all over again that thing if it's if it if we had a daia come through that probably knock that one down on the ground in the water because wind would cat it and nobody's going to pay me FEMA is certainly not going to reimburse me for my electric power no matter where I have put it and so is this is this buil today I don't know you can ask the building no you're fine hold on I mean he gave it to me mean have you already built this no this is what you're being told you have to yeah this is L we're sitting here in one topic and we're telling people about pole bars about this kind of mess right here is what's messing up our beaches and and worried about insurance somebody wants to throw out insurance is going up he can show me a picture like this tell somebody build such as that no that's what they why we why are we given such as this to Citizens I believe to be compant with the Florida building were you were you aware that such as this was being given out I met with you on Thursday I think I had already I had I met with you on Thursday and I had already placed it on the agenda no my question was were you aware of on Thursday I saw this for the yes so before it was given out you didn't know it was happening I had not seen that picture okay we don't need to be doing this well well there's a whole list of things I had to do me they said it was weapons I had to go did the power company tell you you had to do power company gave me this one that's the one I was planning on doing and no problem comp equipment right yeah this one is is and I was going to put I tell you what I own a house next door to the lock and during herine her me's the most order we've had in 30 years I've been in the area 30 years so I know where the highest water her meain was the highest I had the lock the house next door and I had some damage on it and I went over and I measured where the water was on that house and I was going to put this 6 in higher than that and then put all the stuff on top electric company said we they need to have it sort of by level when they're working on their stuff and so I said and that would be fine this would be up higher than any water we've ever had in 30 years now not to say we couldn't have 17 ft of water but if we did nobody would have a house less power on the island how much is it going to cost you to get your power there that I've been trying to get an estimate on it from my cark as to how much it I mean that that t mAh staircase how much was it going to cost you to get your I mean that's got to be another 500 to maybe even A500 at least to that and then and then if it blows down or whatever I got to rebuild it every time now this one I've got post dors I could do this but I can't do this there goes my retirement I believe the question at this point and Conrad I need your help why don't you just ask me I'll tell you what you need to know if this is indeed a Florida building code requirement then then and we are according to what's in the Florida building code we must follow it that that's really the question is you know it's if we're bound to follow Florida building code and we cannot find any exemptions or exceptions for these folks then that's the concern one of the things that that I listen to the Earl said that he's checked with uh our neighboring counties okay let's find out for sure what they're doing because they strength in numbers okay but these questions should have been uh looked into an answer before tonight my concern and I apolog izee I I knew that it was an issue and the the intent was to bring it to the board's attention so you heard it from staff that there was there was a question because again this is in the 2022 ordinance now our previous building official felt like that because it was Standalone polls that was that provided an exception but we have not been able to find that in Florida building code and I I don't have the answers tonight obviously that's what we're trying to obtain but at the same time you know I did we wanted to alert the board that there was a question so you heard it from staff and the reason why and not from citizens who were frustrated and upset so I'm sure there's got to be citizens out there TR to get things at this moment and that's the concern as well yes that's why we're discing it why we figure this out that people back that's that's that's the question I need an answer to yeah how long is that going to take I think but just yeah we go go ahead what I was going to tell everyone is doing the foundations down there at beach they come in and give us an elevation point to start on that's where you get the height of your columns When You're Building or what you're doing that elevation Mark is your mean tide which is like around Katon Beach Dark Island and island is about 5 foot between 5 and 6t just kind of depends on where you are so that's already above the main tide level so and 90% of them is on the light B this far down foot off the ground so by the time you had that and your meter is supposed to be 5 1/2t dur 10t above what the mean height is people don't take that into account and the county knows this cuz that's how all the all the slabs and elevations are done on these new houses so you got to take that consideration too I don't know if anyone did at time but there is Al you know there's a mean tide level that's they shot all the time it's a not a random number the same number anywhere we go on one of them beaches we go to that on the pole surve come in put on there and we have to go from there to meet certain criteria certain height of where the house has got to be and most of the time it's 5.7 you know it kind of depends on elevation proper but just by everyone I've done we go 174 with most houses above that which put you at 22 ft above that being tight set by the elevation service by surveyors yeah everybody will have to get that survey done to know exactly where their meter B when you get well not really to where their meter pole goes they just take that consideration that that's a that 5T something whatever it is is that's to the dirt you know like a foot above the dirt so if pretty much what tell you you got to be five half foot where your meter is all right if that elevation Mark is a foot off the ground I'm at 9 foot and a half above mean TI that's what you're saying if they get the elevation shot from that nail they they know how far to go above yeah elevation everybody is different it'll be different just like majority of them all around the beach about they going have to get that they going have to get that survey done get that Mark to time when they if they buy a piece of property they go in and survey on I I know it's on the beach is if you're going to build a house you've got to have that that point to start your house saying elevation survey then is part of that LE would be a addition to the legal description once you make that purchase some people what he's saying is some people's meter box won't be 17t in air no some of them might be 6t some of them might be 7t if they get go from the elevation what he say like right now if you walk up house I done his house 2 years ago the elevation Mark might be 16 in off ground I I don't s that that's five that's plus 5T above mean tie so if I'm standing there at the meter you got to take that 5T and another 5 1/2t 10 1/2t above mean tide level basically you know that that'll give you some Assumption of you're not just 5 foot you got to add in you know the other five and that's how they create that height for the beach house I mean some of them might been 20 foot on by that elevation survey what's that it varies by where they put that nail for your elevation yes but the most well and I think your insurance company let you if you go a little bit higher they give you a little bit more break but standard is youve got to be at least 174 above that line which put you like 22 ft above that you I believe I'm not the elevations he's referencing are his real world elevations so if you look at the flood map you may see a V7 a v18 a B21 that is the elevation of your base flood yeah what he's making reference to is depending on where you're at and your land height it doesn't mean you'll be 17t above the dirt under your h on your property you may only be 5T you may be 20 ft depending on how it adjust the the BFE itself anyone can see this on our flood zones so and it does vary from one portion all the way down to steam Hatchy and there's even places down there that the properties are you know only two foot below the BFE but it may be the same elevation that you're seeing at key right so that's that's the real reference that you have to get to these these elevations that he's made reference to in the Florida building code that's what you have to be above Cedar island is typically around the 4 to 6t Elevation so compare that to a 17 that's what it's telling you would be the height and that's why you got some houses at Ste hatch that might not be but 12T 6t depending on how how their elevation is to start with but that that shot that that Mark we're talking about is a continuous Mark all through the county yeah the the the mean high tide only changes a little bit from all the way from oilla down to Ste that's what he's saying they reference it from it's about a foot and a half in in our area I just figured i' try to bring that to attention to the you know the half to the water ratio of the meter what are you saying makes sense to me I don't want to do is I don't want now to require people to have to pay for a survey just to see how how to put this thing I mean this is beginning to be ridiculous but if you don't do that you won't be following Florida building code and if you if you let one rule on Florida building code go by you might as well let them all go only even have building department over there just yall build what you want to if you going to break one room might as well put them all out s me I mean I mean that's break one you might as well break them off if bu what you want to in any elevation you want do we got to follow we got to follow a guideline somewhere and they're trying to tell us that building go is Florida building go what we you got but we got questions though that we need answers I think we need to do like Mr Bishop said there P numbers all the counties get together and tell part of building this is ridiculous that's right find out what they're doing commission one question just a couple of points along this um you're putting meter up there is the forward regulation also say that every single power source off that is a GFI if not you still got the same power issue 22t of power level up up if they're in the sky what about little bitty Lots like I've seen out on Katon Beach how do you get a Stairway to Heaven up there to the power pole and what real estate is that taking for that um totally understand going the building but and then one critical factor is you have to answer this but is it the county commissioner's job to set Florida building codes or say which building codes should be or is that just something when you step back away from it it just happens you see what I'm saying you have to find out what is the purpose of the County compared to the building commission building codes from Florida because you don't want to be constraining Beyond you know it connect can backl both ways in relation to the underwater and the flood and things like that I'm electrical engineer background and I understand you put water especially salt water and you put electrical components under there it doesn't like it okay understood but those exceptions um if you look around the old telephone wires had this box that was a upside down whatever shoved down on it and that kept the electronics of the telephone from getting flooded as long as those things stayed over there and were boled down good then everything in that was in a bubble that'd be difficult to do with power I'll just say it that way so to get a power box that would handle the code exception wise to put it down below ground you probably have to get some equipment that would go inside a submarine or something underwater totally designed and I don't know how practical that is so that exception might be difficult to actually pull up um and then what approval is required for that if you're going to allow the things to go the exception for water who's approving that what's the criteria because I'm finding it more and more difficult to do things because you have to have this approval and certified that and that approval certified that I think that's it just considerations thank sir um I just wanted to see if um in this time frame that we're looking at these issues about po bars is there possibility to get guidance that would speak to the requirement or variance from this I would think so I my biggest concern is that people who are attempting to to install electrical service now um because I I'm very concerned about what I'm hearing about what the what the building code reads and I mean I would think we would have an answer in a couple of weeks but I I think really what I'm looking for is if there's there is an exception for Standalone power poles for this service to be elevated is is that correct because that's what we're really talking about is D okay so there's really not a question about elevating in in a building or a residence this is really about Standalone power poles and that's what we're searching for okay so I would think that hopefully we could get an answer from dbpr fairly quickly right Earl yes where you okay fairly quickly on that I mean it feels like a simple enough question yeah okay and then we can we can react accordingly I don't want this to be hemmed up for us to wait for another meeting I I would think that we would just need to follow FL a building code is that correct if the if ddpr advises us that there is an exception for Standalone power poles I would think that we could accept that and that we would we would permit that accordingly sure okay so really I think that's the main question that we have and that's being the stand on the power poles with the meters such as that picture I just saw standing up yes yes I I think those are I mean I I don't I don't know why I mean I don't think there would be any any exception for residences in the Florida building code really the question is folks who are trying to you know this probably unfortunately the same folks who want to put in a pole barn and want electricity to go on those sites that's really what we're trying to resolve so if they were to be able to give you guidance then you could continue or you could write permits as they I don't see yeah absolutely well okay well hold on I would think so but I need the board to understand that this guidance is in this 2022 ordinance so correct Earl that's how the whole thing came about our ordinance yes our ordinance our ordinance let me know the intent of what was done there and not to all of a sudden pull the braks out on getting anything done so I would say go back to doing whatever we was doing 2022 to that okay so so I would so I I think what I'm hearing is if dbpr allows us to permit Standalone power poles as we've been doing and them not be elevated that while you're considering repealing a portion of this ordinance that is what you want us to do so you have con help me I mean they have the authority to set aside the provisions of their own ordinance but not what dbpr not what building requires you can always repeal it whether right I just want to make it clear that this is in the ordinance as well that's what started the whole discussion and and so while we were researching this then we realized that Florida building one of the ordinances that we were required to pass I know and I'm still lose sight of that I know and I'm still waiting for guidance from the state as far as any ramifications of repealing a portion of that ordinance which I have not received yet you know it remove if we don't follow the national flood insurance program we lose funding that's not what I'm saying listen in 2021 the guidance that we received from Department of Emergency Management the um mitigation Bureau portion was that the entire ordinance at that time was not mandatory the portion that was that I know was mandatory with elev the mobile homes the accessory structure portion of it was not mandatory at the time I don't know about the electrical part portion of it so that's what I'm trying to get guidance on now but no we don't want to endanger our um our standing within National flood insurance program and we also are you know we also need to know the impact on our community rating but I would think this is hopefully something that could be resolved sooner rather than later I'm just waiting for a response from the state wood just a quick question are we talking all flood areas are we pertaining to the coast CS I mean when you start looking at the flood when you start talking Coastal or flood in general there is a pile of flood planing in t County Mr how I think it which zones was it or was it V and V only or V of course is included in every type of flood and there's a and a is more string but it does include a but if you look in this on the second page if it's a o and you be it would be lower I think around 3 ft I think it said something like that the ice grade around it up to three ft so it would be lot of areas far low in County Madison County and it's low that's where that's where I used to live up there in ched gr and it was L I'm just curious because you know a lot of folks have to have flood insurance I'm just trying to differentiate you know what the difference is start talking flood floods flood oh I was kind my mind you know I keep hearing a lot about this National flood insurance you know I've heard that a lot and I just um you're talking about FEMA flood insurance and I just know that there's other places where you can get flood insurance it's not all dependent on FEMA plenty of places you can get flood insurance other than FEMA so we don't need to get hung up on oh FEMA we can't get insurance from FEMA cuz you can get it and besides that well I'm going to leave it at I'm going to leave that one at but there's other there's other options besides FEA now while we're talking about this I have a question for the County Administrator how many in the last three weeks how many uh applications have we received for po bars and how many permits have we given out in the last three weeks I don't believe any Earl how many applications have you received as of today for poor we're probably last I think we're probably in the 35 range and have we given any permanence yet we've gone through and we've uh reviewed them some of them had to get engineering change some of them the pole barers didn't actually match the setbacks so those people were contacted they've come and got theyve redoing theirs and we're still going through the other ones so all this this uh engineering plans where did that come from um that's pretty well standard I could probably maybe K would understand do we have something documented that says that you have to go and get an engineered CL I think there's only a few it I'm TR hear you she was I would like to see that hold on I don't know I hear you loud and clear but I really don't want to get us off track I know we're talking about electrical hup and we're going to have plenty of time to talk about these po I do have the same question when that comes around on having to have engineered plans on 250t okay then I I can ask it at the end of the meeting then when each one of us has anything to say okay then hold that to the end of the meeting I think work up so the direction I just need the direction from the board I guess are we going to hold any of these citizens up from getting things that they need electrical permit while we figure out I would say that we probably need at least a day or two to see if we can get a response from dbpr I know Earl sent several emails today asking for specific guidance and as soon as we can get guidance from dbpr then we will know what to do I'm inclined to let people move on until we find something different I don't have problem with that reason why we wouldn't do that I mean we did the same thing with these P bars well we did but that wasn't something that was in the in the Florida building code that's my only concern is that there is going to be an issue with mandating something or trying to change something that's in the Florida building code and Conrad I I need your guidance man I'm busy thinking about about the $5 million Grant then the assurances that we have to give pursuant to that Grant that's what I was looking up so the question is the board is is from what I understand the question is can the board overturned I don't know the right word the requirements of the Florida building code as far as issuing permits starting tomorrow for electrical you just talking about power poles that's talking about power poles terms can we issue any of these any citizens they permit to to uh go to to build their power Poes as they had planned to do from the get goes until the parking breake got pulled out I'd be afraid to do it but you want to do it well like I said I I I was saving that for Mayer talked about the Grant I have several things that I wanted to tell the board with regarded it's number 15 on your list on your list we've been staying on this one for a considerable period of time you might want to go ahead and do some other things then get to 15 fig this up before we get on so what the question is if this is if FEMA if Florida building code guidance is different my only question is if if there is any issue with the board instructing staff to not follow Florida building code I I'm only instructing folks to do as we've done since 2022 we've done it since 2022 apparently that I mean it okay from then than now so why would it not be okay from now because we because of the the Florida building code changed January 1 that's that's the only issue is that floring building code it was it was no longer just from what I understand just by County ordinance and something that the board has clear jurisdiction over so now that the the Florida building code has changed that's that's my question does the board and I hate to use the word Authority but does the board have the authority to instruct staff not to follow floor building code or do you just want to give us a couple of days and get some guidance from dbtr and hopefully clear all this up Mr I'd be inclined to take a few days not jeopardize I certainly don't want our folks to have to wait an instant longer than they have to but I also don't want to um make a decision that's going to jeopardize that kind of investment in our infrastructure is that million you talking about Dr what yes sir it all depends on what's most important I think we need to wait till we get that word to I mean that's not going to be with a few days to get you know if we have to have a special meeting in the midst of that all all means but I I don't want to jeopardize the potential for that funding a couple days I hope our res and I'm not sure how this how this correlates with the with the flood insurance program but I just I just want to make sure that we're on strong footing if there's an issue and that you know that we're not we're not taking a misstep I would hope I could get an answer fairly quickly um I I can't imagine it taking very long to get an answer from DPR especially since we've already asked the question how long has it been since y'all tried to get an answer it we started today because originally the thought was this was all governed by the 2022 ordinance and I was not made aware until I think last week then last week I think maybe at the end of last week or something like that right a probably that there there was a change in the Florida building code and of course no offices were open over the weekend so there was an attempt this morning to send emails to dvpr so we we we just found out we're saying last week that they was a change to the to the Florida building code yes we just found out last week and then well again this is in the 2022 ordinance okay right so as soon as I realized that there was an issue I put it on the agenda so we could discuss it and then realize that this is not only governed by the 2022 ordinance but also perhaps by Forida building code I think 2022 ordinance I mean I don't think they're the big concern of the board I think we all know we know our intent correct and it was not to be setting where we are right now I completely understand but we are for whatever reason and we only found out last week I just struggle holding people up I struggled in a week notice shut down I do too and that's why I brought it to the board I it is not it is not my intent to hold anybody up but I also understand that if they're if our employees feel like that they're not following the rules that they need to that we need to come to the board for guidance so when did we get notice of this change when when did notice come into the county this was into effect January the 1st right okay so when did it come to to us was it like in November sometime or is it just last week I that I cannot answer okay if you can't answer it who can I'm sure I can I can discuss that because my question is if they say something and we don't know about it okay and it's hard for me to believe and maybe it happened that this this is um a done deal as of January the 1st and for some reason we don't know anything about it I was not aware of it but I don't know it I don't I don't know what kind of notice was sent out so these people that have uh bought property and and and want to move forward until last week obviously we were um behaving in an illegal way since January the 1st right and what kind of repercussions are we having from that I don't know that we are yet see what I don't want to do is I don't want to um I don't want to lolly gag around for another extended period of time when we've got people waiting and I'd like to know why we did not know about it until last week so that's the two things that I I I would like to know Mike can clarify this but if I'm not mistaken you probably had the draft version of the building code that went into effect January 1 probably as much as a year before so it has been presented to this County since 2020 since January 2023 now whether it was implemented or self- interpreted or whatever the case may be during that time frame before it became effective once it became effective that apparently continued he has he being Earl has reviewed the current Flor to building code and his duty as a building official is to interpret those codes which is what he is doing and then I think that is the issue of where the county administrators brought it to to the board now because he seeing excuse me an obligation to follow that building code by his position and yet we see that maybe the common practice hasn't been consistent with that that's why it's here I would hope that we would afford the opportunity whether that be a day or three days to at least not put him in a position where he's being directed by this board to say okay I understand that you are the person who's supposed to interpret this and we're going to tell you that that's not what you think it is so let him have a chance to and the County Administrator flush it out till we can get this solidified and if it's an exemption great have at it if it's not then abide by it okay my concern is that I don't want this to drag on forever and then my other concern which is probably more than that is this interpretation thing as we already see tonight interpretation have been interpreted this way and interpret that way and interpret that way so how do we know what is Right clearly this lady brought a picture of a ladder or steps that goes up to something so I question the interpretation I understand and your this this guidelines for this state the laws and the rules associated with the state of Florida allow building official position to be in the driver seat when it comes to those interpretations that is his responsibility that can be challenged amen you you are more than welcome to challenge it but in the mean time he is charged in order to enforce and adhere to those rules Mr chair what I would suggest is this that that we we table this let them move forward as quickly as they can to get some answers about the power pole we can call a a special meeting um and then we can come back and see what's what's been presented to us but I do want to I can't say strongly enough that we don't want this to go on for a long time is that people waiting they're ready to move forward that is not the intent and and again I it was in the matter of notifying the board that there was a potential issue so there weren't any surprises or phone calls and that we could be transparent to the board and to the public we've identified a potential issue and we want to make you aware of it I'm going to put what I just said in a form of a motion motion theable do we have a second second all right cash staff items item 13 the board to consider approval of release authorization uh resolution for the purchase of um our last meeting the board approved to move forward with the 10e purchase of the ladder truck today we bring forward a resolution as required in the lease agreement and as well as the lease agreement itself for byle only motion to read a resolution by title only have second I got it right here resolution of the board of County commissioners of Tor County Florida to enter into a lease purchase agreement with leasing 2 in for the acquisition of a fire truck for Taylor County Florida motion to approve the resolution motion to approve the resolution we have second second second all favor motion to approve the um agement agreement motion to approve the agreement have a second second all in favor board consider approval agreement with the departmentation to fund project oversight Avenue in Ste Hatchy so if you remember back in September of 2022 I came before you asking for approval of a lap agreement which was for design of the um sidewalk that goes from the end of our reconstruction project right there at Riverside intersection and goes Westward towards the sunset condos the way the breaks these things up now they do a design phase agreement and then they come back later and do a construction phase agreement so that's what you're seeing before you now um once we approve this our responsibility would be to solicit and advertise and ultimately select the construction contractor do will include the CI over that aspect since it's Federal funding I have to do a lot of the administrative stuff which is why you'll see there's a reference to like $9,000 in there for some of our time uh this does have a resolution associated with it which authorizes the chairperson to sign on his behalf um I will say too that I have a hard copy in the signature folders for you guys but this is also another one of those docy signs where if we can coordinate it we'd like to construction phase First Avenue sidewalk lap project signature authorization motion approve the agreement second to approve the agreement all in favor resolution moot to approve resolution resolution excuse have motion resolution second by commissioner D all in favor she'll give you item 15 the board to consider approval of the Florida Department of Emergency Management Grant agreement in the amount of 550,000 for the dring of canal at Beach and The stey Boat Boat Ramp station and the design and Cedar by me Co rer hey everybody we are requesting approval of the grant agreement in the amount of $550,000 or the dring as the chairman just read there is no match due from the county so we are respectfully asking for your approval on that in addition I have contacted the golf Consortium because we have a pending application with them but they actually put on fold because we weren't ready to move forward yet we didn't have all the other funding to see how quick it would take to if we see we have a budget shortfall to get approval on that with the top three money and um Mr D indicated it would take approximately six months they could maybe move it along quicker because we have permit but we have I wanted to let you know we have checks that if we have a budget sportb how quickly we could be able to move along um to get this project done you have any issues Mo my eyes I do um this U it's called a state funded La gr uh Brant agreement on page one under uh Roman numeral six um a provision specifying that any funds in excess of the amount to which the recipient is entitled to under the terms and conditions of this agreement must be refunded to the division so if there's any money left over you got to refund it to the the U The Division I want you to make sure that all funds that of course this is a one-time Grant Subject to the availability of legislation appropriated funds just like they all are that's nothing new but all the funds that are shall be placed in an interest bearing account and the interest shall be returned to the division quarterly until the completion of all deliveries so be aware of that also this is one that your subs whoever the subs are they need to get a the agreement that we have with the subs has to have the same sort of language in it okay so when we do an agreement with a subcontractor need to be aware that we need to put a lot of this same language in that agreement the reason I'm being so specific with this is this is $5 million plus 50,000 of course Mr Conor can I ask you a question about that so you said um an agreement with a subcontractor if we if we solicit an award a contract to an entity typically I would refer to them as a prime contractor they may have Subs but we're not a part of the agreement between them in the subs right right but but the contractor needs to make sure that his agreement with his Subs has the same type of language in it okay it's in here it says that okay um also the recipiant shall provide the division with quarterly quarterly reports okay one of the one they had some really good language in in with regard to liability it's on page seven under B um I would say to miss leanda and Kenneth to read that one it's with regard to 76828 it's good language I like that language just read that yes sir okay um the division on page nine May terminate this agreement for convenience or when it determines in its sole discretion that continuing the agreement would not produce beneficial results be aware of that Soul discretion means Soul discretion um the subcontractor is bound by the terms of this agreement the subcontractor is bound by all applicable state and federal laws and regulations subcontractor shall hold the division and the recipient harmless against all claims whatever nature rising out of the subcontract performance of the work that's what I was talking about that's on page nine in the context of that agreement are we the subcontractor we're the contract we're the contractor contract in this agree this particular agreement so my prime contractor and from our terminology would be the subcontractor in that right right so I just need to make sure that the contract we have in place has the provisions that are discussed in that agreement with yeah whoever we hire to that's okay I do that okay all right all right um now of course venue is County govern laws of the State of Florida okay use of Grant funds for travel is not authorized the division reserves the right to unilaterally cancel this agreement if the recipient refuses to allow public access to all documents that means that we do that but the sub does that also yes sir we typically have a um a section within the contract language that all um documents have to remain subject to public availability for it's like three to five years I forget which something like that any balances of unobligated cash that have been Advanced or paid that are not authorized to be retained program cost in the subsequent period must be refunded to the state I was telling leanda this afternoon when I talked to her on the phone or was it it was Sunday I was talking on Easter lightning didn't strike either one of understand that um that what we talked about is that under this agreement any interest income that's made as a part of depositing this in an interest account guess who gets the money for the interest no we don't okay now a lot of the other the other thing that I wanted to to go over with you is attachment a which well that's the proposed budget and scope of work that's pretty s standard but then there's what they call a statement of assurances and this is generally when I when I do these I I don't go through all the attachments because it's not really my job but since this was 5 million $50,000 I thought it would a good idea to look at the statements of assurances that's uh yes of course B says in the statement of assurances this is Page 24 of the uh total package that you got it's government body has duly adopted and pass an official Act of resolution motion or similar action authorizing the execution of the hazard mitigation agreement okay also this is the star this is the star okay it's on page 25 I put not only a check mark But I put a star on this let me read this to you this is what you're assuring these folks with it will comply with the flood insurance purchase and other requirements of the flood disaster protection Act of 1973 as amended 42 us Code 42 through 4,17 including requirements regarding the purchase of flood insurance in communities where such insurance is available as a condition for the receipt of any federal financial assistant for construction or acquisition purposes or use in any area having special flood hazards the phras federal financial assistance includes any form of loan Grant guarantee insurance payment rebate subsidy Disaster Assistance loan or Grant or any other form of direct or indirect financial assistance you can see why I put a star by that okay on page 26 it says if the recip this recipient shall notify the division and FEMA as soon as practical of any changes in the approved scope for for the National Registry eligible of listed property in other words got to keep them informed and then there's a whole list of statues Federal statutes that we're supposed to to abide by so a warning that's all it is I felt it important for all of y'all to know about you know because this is so much foney but don't you raise your hand on have really good LA and I have really good discussions um but they made me lose my spot or was uh but the good thing about it guess what dring that this Bo has wanted for many many many years there nothing in here about the go about the Gophers I didn't find any goers I see Canal Mr cheer endangered species you can't yeah you're coming can I talk now yes ma'am sure you better talk to the cheer person not me so just as notice to the board we are going to ask for an advance of the $5 million and they'll and they are willing to do that so that will be better for us because we don't have to set the money aside and apply for reimbursement and from what I understand we don't have this funding would not be placed in an interest bearing account so we don't have to worry about paying the interest back to the state correct I mean all of our accounts are interest bearing um so we' have to set up a special account to do that but we have an interest allocation software that we plug it all the interest rate in and it tells us what the interest is on that money and then um the only other note is that this is another docu sign so I think it's already been sent to you but I haven't asked you to Doc you sign it because the board had not approved yet who can take care of the interest issue if there already question make a motion to approve agreement d551 second have a motion I second to approve this agreement all in favor thank you all and Mr chair ma since we have received this funding we will be required to make changes to our multi-year implementation plan with our c one money that's something we need to plan in the very near future um because that takes about a year to get approval and we only have about seven years to get this money spent so that's something we need to um start planning and thinking about um the board's required to have a couple of workshops on that then we have a 45 day advertising period before we submit it to treasury for approval so that's something we all need to be thinking about is what do we want to spend just money that we have Sav via this grant um with our treasury fund so everybody just needs to be thinking about that and we'll get something scheduled here in the very near future to get moving on that hey Melody this is that's for our that's for our part one F correct so so the only thing that we don't know immediately is exactly how much this drudging is going to cost so if it goes over the $5 million that's that's my only concern is it our top three money we have that pending to for that additional 1.2 million for dredging where we've already submitted that right now application and we can get that approved quicker than submitting a grand application for the top one to Treasury and I think that would probably be in our best interest to go that route to move this along quicker because the treasury application will take a minimum of the top one will take a minimum of a year to get a trid where our our Consortium we're looking at about 6 months four to six so staff just needs to really sit down and map out exactly how much of those funds those pop one funds that if any of the pop one funds will need to be set aside for dredging right Ken well correct right okay you're going to have some Gomes here at the initial part of it because we will take and solicit for bids on Stein Hatchy Boat Basin and the Keaton canals right so those will be fairly certain I've already asked for the task orders for the design and permitting for the other three locations those will be known in a month or so so we'll we'll have a good handle on dollars wise before we ever actually you know show up on site to start the job so you think maybe another two or three months and we'll have a better idea of the funding needed like I mentioned before you know we went through the very arduous process to get that bids solicitation to meet the US Treasury format now there's a different format that has to be accounted for I got to take that and somehow make all this move into that and then send it back to them I think for approval before we actually solicit I'm assuming demm has to approve it before we actually do it I don't know anything but it would probably be a quicker process than working with treasury but we know we don't want to begin dredging until after scol up season anyway I I mean it would be have a little bit of time it wouldn't be advis to move them in down there before September that's going coincide with your solicit process yes sir that would be the that would be the objective because we'll do the timing to where we know the advertising time frame we know about the time between a Ward and show up on site for notice proceed that gives us a window to easily achieve that as long as this effort here doesn't it isn't horrible and given weather patterns and other issues that you may come into contact with so you're getting outside of scul season we're not in the middle of having to move materials and such like so I mean it's just going to line line up with your time frame yeah ideally we wanted to avoid the congestion of the area kind of let that normalize back to day-to-day type stuff before we started putting a barge in the canals than thank you m item 16 the board will consider approval of community budget request to Congress Congressman dun office for the upcoming federal budget planning cycle ended by so the formality speaks on this um we did receive a visit from Congressman dun's office last week and we were encouraged to submit Community budget requests to his office for the upcoming federal budget funding cycle so after conversation and and that's the good news the bad news is these applications are due Friday so it is a very very quick turnaround so when I discussed this with Melody um our recommendation is that we um basically take the projects that were not funded or completely funed by the legislature and that we submit them to Congressman dun's office right Melody that's correct with the exception the only changes on the public safety um complex we were recommended to only submit for 5 million rather than the amount that we still need to um obtain right um concerning the the building that emergency manag um is there a portion of that that that if we got additional funding through this with what we were allocated through the legislature is there any way that we could start on that is are there phases I guess that's what I'm trying to say are their phases so yes we discussed faing it and we plan on submitting a second appropriation request to the state in you know the next upcoming six school year why don't we include that in this then just with the exception of that no no what she was what she was trying to say was that we did not submit the balance which would be almost $20 million it would only be 5 million because we were advised to phase that project so we could ask for funding every year now I know that from well I know that Emergency Management notified us today that they received a a grant contract for melody was it like $475,000 is is that the right number for design okay and then there's also funding pending that would have to be approved in the state budget of I believe $1.5 million or some somewhere around there so we know we have potential funding coming and then we would ask for an additional 5 million from Congress and dun's office for and then just try to I don't know how much we can accomplish it may just be that you know we do we have to phas it and we have to ask for money every year and it would take years now I would not expect that all of these projects would be funded um and it is a requirement number one and it is a requirement that we rank these projects we put them in the I think these are the ORD that they were previously um ranked by the board but that is something that we will have to submit along with the request I mean okay so um have prioritize we're going to still use the same that we did when we submitted it to the legislature I I just I did not want to assume anything okay then that seems reasonable to me same as same as we so tell us what that was um so first was sehy fire rescue station second Shady Grove fire rescue station third the Keaton Beach station um fourth was the public safety complex then the courthouse generator the Agriculture and Expo Center which we have we can show in that project a $200,000 match by the state and the courthouse air handler would be would be number what is that seven on the list f with and I just want to let Melody know how much I appreciate her jumping in on this we had some correspondence over the weekend and this is a very very quick turnaround and I appreciate her working so diligently on it it's a lot of work ability thank you all right thank you m moving on to County Administrator items jum to item 18 the board to consider approval of agreement with the newly appointed District 2 medical examiner sended by pton count administrator uh this agreement would be to continue our medical examiner services with Thomas coin MD PhD uh Dr thg Martin has been providing these services for us in the meantime I believe commissioner Fel was actually on that search committee and um it has this is the recommendation of the search committee and um I would just ask for board approval on the agreement motion to approve second motion second to approve agreement all in favor thank you 19 County Administrator to discuss informational items comments and current concerns from the public for non-agenda item comments and concerns from have something I would like to read from for myself from the last meeting that I attended my name is Patricia p and I live at 125 San P Road on Cedar Island I appeared at the county commissioner commission meeting on March 19 2024 to speak regarding the P bar permit item that was on the agenda when I was addressing the County Commissioners expressing my opinions and asking questions commissioner Pico attacked me Bally and ended by telling me that if I did not like it I should move I felt intimidated and bullied to the point I stopped speaking and return to my seat I understand that each commissioner must abide by the commissioner's code of conduct under this code for bullying tactics should have been stopped immediately and commissioner feo should have been told to oliz for her comment I hope that the future members of the public who choose to address this board are not subject to the same type of bullying treatment towards the very taxpayers who are paying their salaries I have a copy of the commissioner's quote of conduct that you're all supposed to follow maybe had a workshop you guys need to read it so that you can treat other people better than I was treated and I only have one thing to say to Pano you need to go home and read James 3 1-2 thank you thank you any from the all right out from the the 2020202 code or ordinance or whatever those adopted um I'm concerned that there are things in there that are interpreted in a way that is not what was the intent of when it was received and I think the board I'd like to see him really look at that code and the ramifications everything in it and the really I've heard other people I'm just going to represent others saying this that when it comes to just a few people setting rules that are going for thousands we have to understand the financial impact of adding rules because every single law creates a source of revenue for somebody uh whether it be um engineer Prince whether it be um Stairway to Heaven you know it varies but they're all going to cause every law is creating money for somebody so means the person that has to abide by it is paying extra funds so I just wanted to raise that 20222 and really analyze what's there and how many people use Insurance FEMA related um I've had some people that were heard mentioned that said they couldn't get insurance float Insurance because they weren't 22 ft up in the air so really when you're setting a law based on a FEMA for a few but it's applying all the rep repercussion to the many including down to like a very small building once you get close to the shore uh you need to really understand the impact than sir any I want to thank all five of y'all it's pretty obvious you guys are trying to make it where people can build at the beach the staff's doing a good job trying to find out the laws to keep you informed but it's obviously all 5 yard trying to help people it's really good thank you Pam thank you Mr Thomas Jamie thank you go thank you anyone else all right nothing else we'll move to board informational item commissioner figel yes I my question how many applications have we received and how many permits have been issued in the last 3 weeks or whenever it was we started this 45 day grace period 3 weeks or two weeks I think I think it's been it's been to but regardless we've received I haven't counted all the applications but there's probably been around 30 35 we reviewed several of them most of them we B through had some issue or something another far as the engineering not being correct or the actual size of the structure not fitting on the property so we we VIs how many perment we have issue none none the people have come back with the repairs okay is it am I correct in in my understanding that um there's a 30-day period that uh we have to either issue or not issue we have 30 days to plan and then 30 days for permitting so there's actually a planning of Vie there's 30 days statutorily and there's 30 days for permitting okay so out of all these applications there's been something wrong with all of them on I've seen there's been they've had either would not been on the property and a lot of times you sit there and explain it to the people and so you take to a map show them where their building is not in their setbacks and that takes time so like say I think um Jonathan Gilmer come by the other day he does a lot of people's Barns and I spent more than an hour and a half with him explaining how the bags work I know our our goal uh for my all of ours is to uh serve our citizens and to um and that's what we intend to do we have several other things that are permitted also that are still getting done we still like I say everything comes in in order comment on this the day after the rul and I went and started the process on the on the pole barn par a lot that I got at ke Beach uh I went there that day and I went to the the lady up there and I understood what size I could build can you speak up a little be glad to but anyway I found that out then I started contacting poar po Barn vendor gave them the specifications I wanted and actually today I signed a contract with one of them now it's going to take two weeks before they get the engineered drawing for me before they can ever get so it does take time to get the process done to get everything in order to get your permit the man that I signed a contract with he told me he had 47 I was number 47 the PO bars that he was fixing to come up here and get permit so it does take time I need on now that's okay that's okay I think we working I think we're working together trying to come up with a solution to satisfy our citizens and that's what we intend to do I have no problem trying to stop anybody from doing what they need to do but I think there's some things that's just necessary I'm telling you I could say my own insurance in my house 100% more than what it was like I haven't I've been living there since 1975 so I don't know what's the difference things do change but that being said I have nothing else yes Mr chair oh yes sir the day after the ruling about the uh the roll back and you got 45 days I went in to talk to Mr Earl he's been out that whole week um and would receive people the following Monday um in relation to how long things have been out there I pulled off the website pole bar and then said oh that hasn't been updated yet but it was a simple definition of what's needed for a pole bar like what bolts and what size and that type of simple architecture that hasn't been updated yet I do understand the need for standardization but like the power thing uh 2 3 weeks ago I pulled it off the web and I was handed the same piece of paper that you got to make The Stairway to Heaven in order to have power so there's been a consistent and I understand interpretation and that's why first time when I heard something I'm an rbtech and I went to Mr ER actually said okay what's going on this and this and this then I'm like okay let me get a different perspective and just different things so I'm like it is not a quick thing it is not just a couple weeks it has been going on for many months now that things have changed and I understand the need for rules I'm totally for that I'm an engineer so I like rules but when the pendulin swings so far one way that this way get you in trouble too we need to find that balance so it's not a new thing it's been there a while um I asked some simple questions of Mr and of the Building Commissioner a building official and that was can I build still based on your two week ago resolution of Grant the permiss can I build a PO bar without having a primary structure type of thing and I said here's the process I was never given an answer since then I've hired other answers and determined the answerers no so then some of the other people representing here are asking okay how big does the primary structure have to be do I put have to put a tiny house on there first before I can build a per two or is it four RVs because I was told went to I like no this exception applies so therefore you can't have four RVs you can only have two and I've not heard any exceptions in relation to those things being permitted yet either and last year engineering growing are not a requirement they are now I don't know what the code says it doesn't say that's not my call yet I haven't on the DU D but it's bigger issue than what we see I have those same concerns if I could just interject real quick now my understanding that engineer drawings have have always been required okay in the in the postal areas so that's not that's and I you know I double check that myself so I don't and I don't know where you live or where you're planning to build but that's that is not a new requirement I I don't mean to correct you in public I'm sorry but I I think you're mistaken W built three Bo houses in they W engineered drone Still Standing today I'm talking about tole barns not boat houses so I I asked boat house and a pole I well I asked specifically about pole barns so I don't know about boat houses I put my boat in I built three of them that didn't have to be engineered and they're still standing at Key beach today and it's possible that depending on who the Builder is I'm just saying you said they always had to be but well if you'll let me finish my understanding is that our previous building official had depending on who the Builder was he may have seen the same engine engineered plans over and over and over and over so he may not have that's that's the way it was explained to me so he may have already had those plans because I think they may be mass-produced depending on the type of whole Barn it is so yeah and I'm going to say too we talked a long time today but I keep coming from The Stance of everything's related to FEMA and our insurance and our rating but per FEMA definition a poarn is not an accessory structure and I and it said over and over and over you can I mean that definition is in there it doesn't have walls a a structure a a definition for accessory structure is a structure has walls and a roof so a pole barn is not an accessory structure their thema is talking about these storage buildings that they put by homes and when the water comes the home messes up your primary structure we live at the beach we have FEMA insurance we don't want to put a big storage building next our home because it's going to mess our pilings up it's going to mess our neighbor property up it's Common Sense FEA is not talking about a PO Barn that is the exact question that I sent to RPC writing I mean let's just make it simple and take themus definition of an accessory structure and go there and quit making things so difficult I understand I mean it's in writing it tells you what an accessory structure is I'm sorry I I want to thank members of the public came out I'm glad we can discuss this um um ongoing list of issues from Scot season to out buildings to our holes and um it'll be great when we get some guidance so we can um travel on down that path going forward so I do appreciate that glad the board is working together uh to see that to resolution just one thing with the rains that we've been getting in the warmer weather I would ask about mosquito counts and getting well I've been told about some of those and I've experienced some others so I would ask about that and we we'll see how this comes going forward thank you Mr I just went through the process so my poon got destroyed during the hurricane so I just built another one back and I asked the company that I got it from about engineered plan and they sent me a generic set of PL it wasn't you know it was just in and I said hey I need something to answer for an answer you know where get per it they said that's the way all po Bars were done they were done generic engineer you know and uh I bought a permit and I built the bar and history and I I got a new service I run luckily it wasn't in the flood zone so i r the underground service and got it h up you know but it kind of got away with me that they couldn't give me a line item engineer deal you know I said well whatever that generic and said that's what they give everybody to buy one a generic engineered plan so but usually what you'll see in those plans is they will have ranges for based on the size of the building that you have that if it's let's just say 20 X 30 it'll have use footing a footing B footing C so they they make a generic plan that's applicable to multiple sizes to where they can issue one set that covers a lot of different options it had the wind load and all that on it you know for work G and that's your engineered aspect of it is the main windforce resisting system and U I appreciate the people that come up here and stress what their issues are and their things I mean that's what we're here for try to get some answ for y'all and everybody that's signed up with r is what I'm understanding that started the PO Barn process they're in they're they're in the green light as far as doing something you know we just got to get all that straight out you know it worked out for everybody thank you the engineer plan that I got has got a stamp on I mean there but he's saying that something wrong with the foter No No Sir know what I was saying was he said he got a generic set of plans and they will have a stamp on it um it's required in the State of Florida but what you may see is that this is you know Pole Barn Company ABC they can issue a set of plans that cover covers multiple different sizes so if you are doing option A that may be a 20 by3 you use footer a if you're doing option b use foter B so they can cover a lot a lot more choices with a single set of plans of course it's still has the um the sign and seal of a of a licensed engineer that's that's all I would saying is he the generic but it's it covers a lot more different options but that's what we have and we were told we had to add more to it but we have a set of engineered plans that got denied to be redone didn't say redone there was just we this morning and you're get in contact with your engineer and have another statement put on it that is designed to be in a flood zone you are be where you're at which is the worst blood Zone that you can be again another reason they're not getting approved well in our hold up is because of where we are we're close to the coast this is a flood zone issue and that's where it started the flood zone flood plane it didn't have flood plane on it but um that's for accessory structur yes sir I I did want also follow up I I was just recalling the the U number of items and the revenues that you know we approve tonight so um thank you a special thank you to staff folks that are working Easter Sunday our attorney and U Mr Wanda discussing these agreements um it's it's certainly a maybe it's not a large amount of money to some County um but it's a large amount of money to phisically constrained pay Accounting in these conditions so I do understand some of the effort that goes into that and then you know reference to these potential Federal funding options um I would say we a very special thank you to our our state Partners in the ways that they have been able to fund us and then our federal partners that are continuing to reach out certainly in the uh time that we're going through we need all the good help we so thank you our R our land regulations have been um presented to us again and I just want to say Lea that that uh has not been um changed or altered in many years and I I my opinion is that that should be a document in the works at all times um so uh we need y'all need to start looking at that so we can update that and it just like I say it should be a working document if you're referring to ourl Dev development code it has had several amendments in it since I've been here and it's cified on on mut code right I mean it it should be up to date on on mut code is that your maybe I'm misunderstanding your question I know some of the things that I read had not been been anything done with it in a long time and I know somebody has sent us a copy of them and it does not coincide with with everything that's going on now do you know anything about it I know the vision 2060 hadn't been looked at in years years years want you talk the vision 2060 that um establish different planning areas within the county those are still part of our land uh land use classification map so they have specific allow allowable uses and requirements in those those are still valid today I I thought what she was inter was referring to was that in the various components of Our Land Development code there have been numerous times where Amendments have been proposed come before this board and ultimately got adopted and incorporated into that so we car on everything um the only thing I had and I think that's part of some of how this all started was that the 20222 had it made its way into the online version of the uni code doc document but I think I I heard that it was incorporated last week or something like that that's something we need to be looking at I'm still not clear what you wanted what is your direction it just should make sure that it's kept up to date with with that it's current with today so I think and Mar help me understand those ordinances are typically sent to munic code twice a year no they um I send the ordinances once they're approved um to munic code but I did miss that 2022 ordinance but then it's updated online immediately or is it twice a year um I think it's updated quarterly is it okay yeah okay it's updated quarterly um but it is also adverti or listed on our website so we have all of our ordinances and resolutions and everything on the website thank you all right I'll finish up with I'm all about following the rules those folks been building structures on there in this County for years and years and years and I would say most probably tend to try to follow the rules in the permitting process I'm sure some have just went off and built structures in this in this County without pering process but if we continue down the path that we're doing it just seems to being made hard to do business in this community and I mean people trying to follow the rul to build structures uh you put up electrical boxes and so forth the structures are still going to go up we're going to wake up one day and the structures are still going to go up the only thing that's going to be missing is the county is Miss going to miss out on the permit Fe when people trying to do it the right way the county is not going to have any say so and the way that structure goes up you're going to wake up one day and the structure is going to be there and guess what it's going to be a little bit of a fine that's going to be it so I say all that to say during this process uh these ordinances and this Florida building code that you know we need to look at it real hard even the Florida building code we need to look at it real hard and not just take whatever their answer is and take it as the gospel that I think it's okay to challenge these folks it's I mean we can change our own orces all day long but if we're being bound by a florid of building code then I think it's okay to challenge these codes because I'm just telling you people's going to build this stuff you're going to wake up one day and it's just going to be there I mean these people tried to build these 250t sheds sheds and being required to have engineered plans that's garbage yes but you know I'm just saying it's going to be a little bit of a fine and then we have no say so in the in the structural How structurally Sound this the these structures are and here we are so but I do want to say I appreciate all the citizens uh coming out speaking up you know always welcome to our meetings and thank you all for coming nothing else we obain a second all in favor