##VIDEO ID:DxfBqc05Tx8## [Music] the notice requirements have been satisfied the meeting dates for the year are confirmed that the annual meeting are posted on the public B board in the lobby of the municipal center and published in the record within the first 10 Days of the New Year notice of this special meeting via the August 15 2024 Sunshine notice has been sent to the record suburbanite northern Valley Press and has been posted on Bon board B website uh the first item on Salute to the flag I pledge aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all Omar can you conduct a roll call please sure Corsair here C men here counc member here CC member Park Dan we don't we don't hear you Dan you're here but we can't hear you and council member Roy iron here oh okay the first item on the agenda is public comments audience members wishing to speak will have a three minute time limit to address the governing body large groups are asked to have a spokesperson represent them is there anyone here in the uh Chambers looking to speak doesn't appear to be hands how about online there any hands being waved looking to speak members of the public No Hands okay we're going to close public comment time um does anyone have any questions about the resolutions okay so could I get a motion to approve resolution r24 d366 and R 24- 369 move I have a second omark please call the r CC yes C yes counc member yeah here yes yes that's my report is what it is right if he's not answering he's not answering okay um the next item is the introduction of ordinance right yes do you excuse me do you have the resolution to amend the C to amend the cab resolution yes do the um the cancellation of General Capital [Music] fund 367 yes that was the on I just make 37 want to talk before we call it of course yeah yeah of course absolutely we have a question about a resolution that's not one that you voted on fine with your consent agenda yeah we like to get [Music] questions I don't have my computer but I thought it was clear so we're amending the C so it would be a it would be a resolution to amend the capital budget that was adopted on May 7 2024 to include the appropriation of three of an additional $300,000 for the old spr Club property which includes security cameras raise flower beds fening skate par so it's related to the ordinance right so do the move forward with the ordinance first then okay you want to move forward with the ordinance go ahead the resolution do you need first or thein well that's kind from Municipal open space so you could do the resolution that's already the one that I just yeah so you just need a motion we're talking about on your back end of your agenda um for three I mean 367 as the attach I had included this um spreadsheet but that's actually a separate resolution here let me give that explanation right so you have an ordinance to appropriate money hand inand with that is making sure that that appropriation is listed on your capital budget because it's the capital budget and the appropriation comes to the ordinance it's redundant but one needs a resolution one needs an ordinance so that's where the we're looking on on where everything is here difference between an ordinance and approval discuss these numbers what part is that that would be on the on the award of contract we get to that this is TR this is appropriating money from the open space fund to the capital Improvement okay so if we don't do it I'm not saying we won't but if we didn't do it then that money could be reversed back yes so this is not a one-way ticket this is a you need to load the Box before you discuss what you do with the Box yeah yeah you're just you're just setting the funding up right you're moving moving money to an account you're effectively appropriating money account whether that money gets used or restored later on is a different discussion yes because that account is done by resolution in an annual budget you have to amend your budget to in the money and Y everything has to match just tying it in what's on the agenda is uh moving the money from Municipal open space into C right okay whatever your next I would I believe we need to do this first the resolution to allow the acceptance because this is still true reading anyway yes so do the resolution first yes okay but before you can introduce the ordinance um David just verbalized because this resolution really is just on the actual budget itself so that's why there's whereas the local capital budget for year 2024 was adopted on the 7th of May 2024 and whereas it is designed to amend this adopted capital budget section now therefore be it resolved by the bur Council of the bur of tenly County of Bergen that the following amendments uh to the adopted capital budget section of the 2024 budget be made and that's where the Appropriations are um if somebody wants to make a motion okay what is the resolution number 243 370 I make I can make a motion all right so guys can I have a motion for r24 d370 please I have a second second okay Omar please call the RO yes yes yes R yes so I just wanted to ask a question about I mean so the resolutions we have uh in the packet were 366 uh 36 no it's 367 369 and we just approve 370 right so it's these three 36 368 39 I don't see the 368 that's why I'm asking so 366 367 36 was voted on and8 is the award of contract that would come after the ordinance oh got it okay okay got it out right so 368 has not been considered yet right okay good okay we ready to move on to the ordinance we are ready okay so what council wants an opportunity to discuss this a little bit so uh who has questions well I I want to start by saying that um David thank you for this due diligence of explaining that there are these areas that have been previously set aside and not fully uh expended Ed upon so it helps me you know organize my thinking um my understanding is the way you laid it out is we would be looking at a not to exceed price so that for this park it would be we're allowing them to go up to but you said expected a potential of a lower proposal expected yeah that did not materialize we gave them we gave them until 4:30 today and they Kinder they requested they need additional Time s so the original deadline was Friday we extended it to yesterday extended it today go so where is that yeah if you could explain that process let me tell to us as far as the deadlines or uh yeah yeah for them and what they're going to be doing and you know kendri would be doing the park part of it and then we're we're looking to so we do have um we do have J addit Builders LLC um with the price of 489 851 so they had bid on the project and so they reduced their costs from the 568 to the 489 in 51 oh okay um we uh received a bid from Dakota that came in at 800 plus, um I think then that was rejected yeah and so basically the way the law Works um you can you you can negotiate the contract if you bid it twice and you did not uh have successful biders uh but you can't award it for higher than the the bid that You' rejected so we couldn't award it higher than 568 even if we wanted to we would have to do a new bid so anything below 568 ratio so at this stage you said Kinder hadn't given you back or Revis well they never submitted anything yet yeah oh okay and what was the other one that was at 489 850 that's that's this J added Nots okay so we so if we passes today that's that's the one we're going forward with this we would award to J ad bus and what exper for 489 851 and if tomorrow the other guys come back in it's over yeah we would award the contract tonight um like I said they were given a deadline of Friday extended it um you know that's up to the council if you wanted to give additional time I we're in the negotiation process so you know that that they these are the parameters what is the current limit given the inability to the current bid as negotiated is $489 is that now the ceiling that's that do you would award for that exactly I understand that but is that the ceiling if these guys came in tomorrow at 520 we decided they were a more capable counter party could we use that bid or not you could because it's below 568 yes okay so 568 is the current yeah 568 you could not award above 568 without any totally so can we vote to move ourselves room between the 489 and the 568 and you mean what do you mean vote to leave ourselves wrong you do a vote that says if I close a business on Friday uh the bidder comes in at or below 568 and we can have a subsequent you know confirmation by email or otherwise I don't know if that's allowed that you know if these guys came in tomorrow and they said they were 5'10 and we know their work and we see their work and you know we think 510 is worth more than 489 or something that we don't know as well right could we have a preapproval that says so long as it's in these parameters that somebody where we have to reine as to what that you know approval is that's a question Wendy what do you no um I would say that if you feel that this is too high and you want David to continue to receive quotes from whoever it may be then you don't award a contract that's not what he's saying I understand but when you're wording a contract you're wording it to a contractor so it's Jay add just just to John's point we we did know kindan can you just import where's Jay added building Builder from I just oh okay they're in New Jersey then all right yes all right um and Kinder didn't didn't get it done um so I think in here you know from where I was coming from uh I was also you know I've been part of this process for at this point a number of years just so I understand timing this gets awarded then they have to finish this by the Cal end of the calendar year right to get that money from the county was there something about having to spend it we're getting 87,000 from the county yes do for the reimbursement Grant we would need to have the project completed by the okay and is there a failure consistency if they don't deliver until January 5th the DAT yeah we would be in the contract documents that we would uh we would uh offer to them there's a performance bond maintenance Bond and you could add liquidy damages that's what we wanted to know with this but I think that the performance bond would surprise let's say you let's say we approved this and you went back them tomorrow and said you have to complete it by December 31st or you ow $887,000 and they rejected that would be back to having another conversation you would be back to to negotiated do they know they have to get it done by the end of the year yes I've communicated that and writing to them them um well um I you know I personally am excited to get this off the ground uh and you know I I said the sooner the better and the other option cleaner is if you are not comfortable with this particular company is to table it if the funding in place have your second reading and award a contract on September 3rd right when correct the yes so you have those two options I mean you have this and this has been verif I they did respond to the bid so all their documentation is is in place and this is the negotiated number uh you received a a bid that was significantly higher that's rejected there was a fourth company that's in Andy's letter that did not respond at all and then we have the the non response from k k what you think I think we should agree in terms of what the I like to go through these right just frankly I don't fully understand them right articulate my understanding under where I'm my understanding is we set out for $400,000 you right and the bids have come in meaning fre high and so everybody has a vested interest in getting this done this is grossly overdue and needs to be executed on and firmly in that c you have two paths to go forward on right number one is you can say yes and understand that you know based on our time lag and inflation and other things that prices have moved away from us and therefore we need to accept the higher price and that's a reality of current economy right or you descope and you decide that there are things that can be removed right and you enjoyed out a conversation yesterday the key feature for me is that that which we do needs to be done in a manner that's ex right and so the question is do you descope for excellence are we concerned that the company that we're using is not going to provide Excellence across this Pro spectrum of projects and do you carve something out to ensure that either we con conform to our original budget or that we descope and have Excellence at the original budget number or have reason to go above it all right those are kind of the three paths to pursue here so I'm curious what how other people feel about that but my focus is on what we do needs to look we're not doing it twice right right so if we don't get everything we want but it looks perfect so at the bottom of of the ex F that I or the CDF that I sent you it basically talks about the global scenario with the open space fund so if you did appropriate the additional $300,000 to for get the original the the consens is scope done and it's my understanding that followed several iterations even for my tenure um we would get an excellent project now it becomes what do we know about J addit versus krian kenan's done work for us they're putting the signs up currently um J added does have some references not ason with their work and our engineer is not ason with their work they have a work they haven't worked with them on any particular project they've worked with K before um at the end of the day your your open space fund is going to be very healthy you even after this $300,000 supplemental appropriation um you're going to be at 214,000 or 244,000 and then $400,000 in tax revenue in November so you'll end the year at this particular stage at $2.8 million so your your open space fund is going to be very healthy and be able to ABS those matters are separate and distinct right that the the fact that we're cash rich in that environment is irrelevant to the cost of the overall proct it's a matter of two separate two separate issues cor they're separa and I think there's I think it it goes back to you know what the engineers's estimate was originally based on for the project and how that has changed in scope over time so was there scope creep that justifies the incremental spent just so we're going back in time two years now apologize it's not it's not it's not no apology necessary it's just give it a little history so this whole thing this whole park over there developed from the pool that was there when out of business people wanted a dog park it was like the planning Co the whole nine yards of everything going on and so we put a put a couple of fences up made a dog park protected the area then everybody sat back and said okay what do we want here and let's start talking to people the skateboard PE families came in with the kids uh people who were interested in the gardening came okay the dog people came in and so then it was um oh um then it was all about what's it going to cost to put a skate park in the original skate park that was designed for this the costs were astronomical and to your point to your comment before we descoped it to a much smaller thing realized for insurance purposes we had to use company certified the skate pars which is how we wind up there and so a fair amount of negotiating one on to determine um how do we serve the highest number of residents within the scope of this particular project and so it's really been driven by input from residents who have their particular interest there and what they want to see and what they're going to use and then of course negotiations amongst the Council of what goes where and how how does everyone you know kind of kind of get get get get uh the best project for the money and for the residents so that brought us to here I appreciate that given that we're in a cost overrun situation are we we went after a skap park that one would assume would have been excellent and now we put that down to something that is sufficient then the question becomes you spend that extra money for sufficient right as opposed like are we doing that and adding it in where it's going to be like okay and not really make people happy we did a skate park right and we spent more money right but you you could apply that to any of the particulars of this particular Park so our friends who want the dog park obviously want uh things to be built in that dog park which would rapidly increase the cost of it which we're not doing to the same reason that the skate park instead of being I don't remember what the number was 5 or 600 000 just for the skate part which we felt based on what we were doing over there right that it's too big was too big of a number that's the I'm aware of by 85% now the question is that 85% reduction is reasonable yeah but you can't compare you can't compare spending $500,000 and spending $100,000 does that mean it's a low equality not NE not not real not at all it means it's less of a skate park it's the diff right yeah actually if I can speak to that if I remember there and you're able to expand the skate park if there's a demand that's why I'm sorry that Dan's not so infrastructure start that's there's a few ramps and things and as yeah that was my understanding is that you can add more stuff so later that is correct ah he's here yeah so it's modular right Dan yep so the t-shaped skate park the original plan was for a 9 x 60 skate park uh the contractor came back gave us a plan for 30 by 60 so the concrete will be laid there'll be a flat section for kids to learn how to skate on a flat section and then the 30 by 60 will be the features so it's all expandable look I hear John's you know concerns we want to make sure I think J you would probably agree that what we end up giving the residents is good quality I have no reason to believe that neither of any of these bids wouldn't be good quality but I also understand that the engineer is more familiar with Kinder's work so it just I guess my question is as much to them but also to to Wendy and David and Mark if if we did it that other way where kindergan had a few more days and it was the awarding it on the third does that delay this further no there still 12:31 time you're basically in the next week you would be getting contract documents out of them so you would get them executed you're just delaying week so let me ask to Julie's question a different way but more pointedly if the council would approve this tonight can construction start before September 3rd unlikely well right I mean but because we have to have the second reading that's right yes no there you go so so does the second reading have to happen before we can actually physically I can put my do that on the same night as the second read but it can't happen before correct okay thank but if we change question if we change go just a quick question if we change the uh the amount um and the potential bidder will this uh first reading uh would we have to redo a first reading no you because the ordinance is setting the funding in place not not as per a contractor but just a followup for for uh John's question earlier um I would setly not to see that to 489 851 um there's really no reason to go above that and we have uh Andy HPP has been advised by kindergan that they would be lower oh than that but but I don't have anything in hand you kind of have a free op right we we we do to a very but just to be clear to a very limited degree because your organization hasn't actually done anything no we're just oh it's a free option that could expire but I I don't agree that we should set the not seed to at The Negotiator I would manage the vendor to that but if they came in and say list we really want to do this project and it's 5 10 and our engineers and our people that are managing the project have experienced history and more comfort with them I might be more inclined to spend that extra money Wendy can you speak to that issue bring that money away yeah we enough to to do that you know we should allocate to to the 568 ceiling right you're not you're not actually setting the contract limit until you award a contract okay right now this ordinance is moving money into you know it's appropriating money from the open space so that there's the pot available you don't have to use it all okay so do I get that right I'm getting confused what we've done let me say it back to you so we're on the same thing okay we moved money from a account a to account B count B is now funded right it's funded that money will be there and that money is sufficient to to cover no greater than 568 th000 or whatever is and we are not permitted to spend more than 568 given the death where we are correct unless entirely new process correct we still and we don't want to do that because we want to do this project right but we still retain the right between now and September 3rd to receive an incremental bid which may or may not ever materialize and so long as that bid is below 568 both bids onow 5 to be decided on September 3D for execution prior to 12:30 we lose no time so right and and just to reiterate in other words you are free to continue to look to negotiate a lesser amount yes yeah the money won't be in place until the second reading on September so the time that we're losing is potential negotiating of contract the delivery is not effective corre and even if you work tonight I believe the resolution is clear that money is not cont correct yeah we I thought we 68 67 60 6 was just table jul you're good yeah that's what like we're read this I read 366 and 369 okay so we're going to table 368 all right so okay guys let's focus for a second we can be done so what do we Wendy what are we doing here I'm going to table 368 it sounds like you're not going to get a motion to introduce to actually move forward on it I think probably because the motion was all in probably just have to s that motion do it well that's 368 we actually have a motion we voted on three we vot I voted we voted no skip you skipped that one during the the resolution that was that you had indicated skip okay fine say corrected so you just want to motion table you can either table it or you can just not make a motion to adopt it if you make a motion to adopt and nobody answers it doesn't move forward you can you can try again at the next meeting if you table it at the next meeting somebody has to make a motion to take it off the table introduced we need to introduce this ordinance so it's good for September 3rd right yes okay I I would like to if I use your okay so we're gonna make them we're GNA do this introduction now right yes do we need Jamie no we have we have okay um Julie would you like to make a motion on ordinance 24-22 please yes I move to introduce on first reading ordinance 24-22 and set the hearing for September 3rd 2024 at 8:00 p.m. or as soon there after I have a second please second second Mark could you please read the title of the ordinance and conduct the roll call sure ordinance number 24-22 an ordinance of the bur of tly in the county of berens New Jersey supplement ordinance 23-4 appropriated indal $300,000 for the sua security cameras race flower bed ing skate park and fountains ccil member Bennett yes CC member Dr yes pass member part yes yes okay can I get a motion to we going to adjourn now yeah you want to make one l oh so no no a motion to adjourn can I get a get a motion to ajour yes I have a second second all in favor good a h l my longed eyes