##VIDEO ID:ziMnD24mRSk## okay I'd like to call the meeting to or historical District's commission 3M 3M on January 9 Thursday May I please have a roll call J is here be here Julia St here Mary Jane here thank you let if the minutes we look at the minutes do you have a copy of the minutes like this would you would you like to see a copy of the minute for December 12 [Music] correct oh nice Julia um that's onethird of what we discussed very good but I couldn't do I couldn't do the bullets like uh Laura shepher suggested that was not something I could do but I did the best I could suiz so much better than 12 that's one3 that's nice I still got a page and a half yeah oh my yes um can I have a motion a motion to accept the December 12 2024 meeting I guess I have the second it thank you any discussion on these meetings at Miss minutes well then you can't come in can I second my own minutes I don't think so no clear second it want to take a minute please yeah take first dat please to this is be I believe that what's SP down here is you almost got it perfect Claire okay okay we're gonna close the discussion y may I have a vote then pleas is yes yes yes Mary Jane chur yes okay now now we're going to get to the knitting ready while we really it here partly okay I don't have any additions or deletions does anyone have any additions or deletions to this meeting the only thing I would like to add is I would like to start cleaning out those files upstairs okay all right Point all right let's I thought we talked a little bit about the warmer weather a little water oh maybe oh my God the windows would pull out yeah I didn't hear yeah cleaning out the files upstairs on third floor getting them organized clean them up there is there yeah lunch up there oh Oh I thought it was freezing up there oh it isn't okay so do you want to start like do you want to start after uh March or do you want yes after like say April set a DAT next time beginning VAP okay that sounds good I'll put that on the agenda for next week next meeting L why what do you have to put in on the agenda just so we can set a date oh so we can set a date for that time why don't we just wa until like what happens with March okay the date I would gladly volunteer oh thank you help with organiz excellent thank you very muches whatever you need help GL volunte oh thank you great yeah thanks very good okay now old business discussion and determination on two of the towns and historical societies are we have new vote I guess not okay see you later well on the town Historical Society stuff she's the president can we T can we table it no I can't I want to get rid of this uh this is the well we can't vote on it want me to call Susan and find out where she is yeah right I is the gis Mill imminent I can't wait till next month or are they working on it now oh I can be sure because I can table this until next month yeah because they're not going to work on this in the winter can they who knows oh who knows that's what they're doing all right then what let me just let me just call her and we'll see if I can super told not but super you told me she would be here I thought maybe Laura was still in this oh Laura thank you for coming oh good okay now we really have a COR well want me still call Susan just to make sure well okay check in see she's up here well just to bring you up to date what we've done we accepted the minutes okay we opened the meeting we accepted the minutes and now we don't have any deletions or additions except the Jerry wanted to remind us again that we have to clean the files out upstairs on the second floor and so we're getting ready to discuss an open discussion hi Susan this is Julia did you thinket our meeting or you not coming I'm sorry oh my gosh oh in California sorry I'm on my way right now okay well don't take your time we got a quum anyway so just take your time yeah we're just the um so her daughter-in-law just left all their things fire okay so did everyone have a copy of the G not application no oh did you you didn't give me one didn't give this the same one as last no new one this is new one if it's not the same then when you get around to it any copies of the one that you had last month okay okay so do you have one more okay yeah this one that's it yep what are these These are duplicates I just ran them again and again I thought I had this falling cage but or the cage but I guess I don't I guess he didn't give me the cage he just gave me you well is he coming in so what do you have I I oh here it is right here I well let me go Cofe okay but just well I can't take din Cofe at the same time well you know what let's discuss this one and then we can make copies because it'll be a discussion okay so can I have a motion to have discuss the application for the balding Gill at Tom South Street why do we have to we need to discuss no whatever we're do to approve and then have the discussion you can do that okay I'd like to do that yeah a motion has the original original been stamped in by the south FL yes okay do you not have a copy of the stamped no no oh oh well this the other one as it yeah I have I need to copy that for okay so this is a revisiting actually oh wait I need it um I'll make a motion to approve the application um discussion from yeah wait let me let me interject why do we have to approve an application we're going to review the application then approve if we agree on it or you know approve the actual action we don't need approval to a motion to just to Rie okay okay you can do it either way whatever let's get moving just give us that motion you don't need receiv an application we received an application for replacing of siding repair of Windows sashes and exterior work on the Gristmill submitted by the towns and Historical Society by Jack snake we did not act on it last time because we wanted to make sure that historic New England had approved the work he has gone back to Historic New England and I've attached their appr of the work to be done so it so he has to follow their rules rather than anything and I reviewed this and you're actually very welcome to review it but it it's very detailed into what he has to do and what he has to use see that it's more detailed than probably anything else we clarify so this is for the SI the windows and what else did you say stashes Stills stashes SS reglazing the windows well I just got under Windows paint the exterior um andl so you don't have to I don't have a copy of it oh don't look look on the second page of the top thing you have well no this is the this is the other one this is thank you yeah you shouldn't have to do that so so I think he has really um done his homework like we asked him to do it yeah and their letter covers everything and more like you said yeah and it and it's very DET well yeah detailed well spelled out well and this was actually approved by the historic doing before so what we're doing is just we're just doing it so that we can get it into the minutes am I correct that's what we have talking no what happened was in 2021 they asked for an appli issue they received it but the permit was never issued that's right so I wanted to make sure that everything was going to be the same or whatever was going to be was going to be approved by historic Noland right so he did it yeah so that's actually what we're doing so everything is pretty much the same except that now he has the permit well no he doesn't have the permit yet he has a letter from the historic New England which is what was asked and it's gone through the building department right not well it will go yeah we're first then the building okay so um I'd like to make a motion Madam chair yes that we approve the Spalding Gris meal application received to do repairs so that they can get a permit at two South Street I'll second I have V please yes Laur sh yes Jia St here yeah caining thank you are you yes or no I said yes okay you said here yeah you said here thank you good I'm good I understand okay now what I'm gonna do is pass this around and if you would please sign and just put either yes or no and c could you sign it you and just say up St all right just to make it official who second I didn't get yes pleas here's one in here okay so I only five two yep you all three D yes please okay and then while you're there doing that I'm going to skip ahead to shi's words for the Postcard that's fine as long as I get a copy of what that is or just the thank you so we getting anything on the cdge we are but got a copy we're gonna do that so while she's copying we're going to talk about war T and which was only you know from my perspective really I think from the realate point versus historic you'll say that Laura did work on it and an interesting take that she did she did it more of a positive take rather than what you can't do she did it as what you can do which I thought was a different take right it was very um I wanted to be more positive it was um and the only negative uh well not negative really was that there was no jurisdiction over the interior so that they knew that right away that we would not be imposing on their bathrooms and on on their inside their inside the so did you know your home is located in one of the three historic districts in town that's a really good opening because I the answer is no for 50% the commission does have the authority to review or comment on the following not I'm sorry does not have the authority to review or comment on the hi Susan hi morning sorry I'm late all right so question um I thought that when we did this postcard it was going to the um homeowners who lived in a district correct it's not going to the whole town no no no just to the homeowners in the district or it could be actually put on the website too whatever it could be yeah well that's a good idea and then anybody who's looking for information Department kind would be the same thing that okay it goes on the website because the agents are not going to get the postcard they're not look at you're right but if somebody's listing a historic home they may look at the um website for the historic Department to see what they could find out on the Townson website I'm saying I know they should they should yeah you know Laur why don't we have you here with that expertise can you just tell us what the Massachusetts Board of realter expects Realtors to understand know or question about historic districts in there okay so if you remember I think the first meeting I was at and you were talking about this I said as far as the board goes we do have CE classes okay continue education so when we hold classes one of the topics is architecture and N buler does that Flats oh okay so Niles always Incorporated historic was he was on the commission he was he was and he still he still does some of the classes so other than that there's no obligation on the board's part but they're always looking for things to make sure the agents know no right well I spoke to the girl in fburg Kathy La Kathy and she invited us to do a lunch some kind of a lunch learn lunch and learn she did invite us but we never got it together to do that but I would really like to do that this spring if we could I can bring that to her attention yeah she did ask me she wanted to get a couple of other of the historical commissions together to do it okay awes but she wasn't having any luck with the other town so in her area I know sounds I'll I'll talk to her about that and U maybe something could be put together they do usually do like a uh depending on who would be school well let me talk to her about it and see what can be arranged because what they would do is they probably do it like a 10 to 12 or 12 to one yeah and provide they may provide lunch sometimes they provide some snaks or whatever yeah and I think that that would put us at a at an ease because we want to make sure the real estate agents know that there there is number one you're not going to get them all no I understand that I understand that and I understand they're not all on the board of realtors too but if we can Outreach to at least a percentage sure I think I think it would would help yeah I think it's a good idea okay okay so that's I have to put that on my list and I have to remember to do it okay I'll remind you I'll you so if we could take a look at this and have an open discussion or if you want to just Mill it around and edit it maybe for the next meeting to give us your input this is the proposal for postcard right that was just my verbiage and again I don't have the experience that all of you have I looked at the website I trouble big time your name's here uh oh so Laur I think this is a very good jumping off spot because you always need an opening to create something and I think this is excellent I like the idea it's a positive approach rather than you can't you can't you can't because that's intimidating off that's a turn off so if I were to receive this because I am in historic district so I prob will receive it so so if I'm looking at this Le do you want to see it it starts off with did you know okay are they think I am stupid did I know what and then well did you know your no I'm reading it but I'm reading it like I am my new neighbor who I when I met them I I intered myself and talked about the historic district and she she was glad to know that it was not interior she you know she wanted to make changes in there but she brought house because it was historic um other people aren't too happy about it and all the you know and all these years we've been on it we know that um some people are mad that they're in the district even though they haven't made changes to the house they just don't like the idea that they can't because there's a negative aspect to you can't do something if you want to that's that's where starting starting this out I'm uncomfortable with the question oh I we haven't introduced ourselves and I think introducing ourselves is a better approach in the beginning because my neighbors are all new to towns and they're not Old townsites One's from peppol so you know they're local but the others have come from from out of town so how would you introduce yourself not myself introduce the historic commission and so saying here introducing um in fact the commission doesn't even say it's the historic district commission well it's entitled that I have it a historic commission oh that will be on front of the postcard probably we somewhere we identify but I think I think introducing ourselves is a better way a better approach okay because it's not like they're getting an invitation from someone they know I'm inviting you oh you need to identify what the historic commission is all about just the fact that it it doesn't it's did you know like okay did I know not know and now it's your home's located in one of the three historic districts in pwn that might come as a shop and they might not be happy about it and why didn't my realtor tell me that or I've lived here a long time and they didn't know it um and what does that mean I can't do because they know people in may gron they know it's strict and and and Conquer is strict so if they not that that it might set off the tone that it's a negative um and then we go on to say um what that we don't what we don't do we don't do interior correct um temporary things you walkway your storm door well yeah we don't say we don't do that but it's very it's a very confusing message I actually I should show this to my next door neighbor Terry she's selling her house it's being listed okay it's still in the coming mode okay um someone is interested it because they have they could use the garage which was for cars and it's got a lift and everything um it's got 5 Acres down the back that goes down to the river not buildable but it's there that's a great idea Susan but I think I I should ask her to look at this because this being in a historic district as much as we favor it and we're protective of it it's not it's not a good thing for a lot of people because it means restrictions well see that's the thing why we have to get to the real estate agents so that they can identify because people don't do caveat anymore and I don't think they're even going to tell them that it's an historic because it's not a selling point well they I know but I they should they should yeah but buy buyers shouldn't be saying oh I didn't know that there's a H there's public records I know I'm not a realtor so I I can't say I'm guilty of it so my new neighbor and and a house that's being sold in the district right and and and another thing is there's next door to me is a not an old house but they still had to come like the house across the dag across the street from the settle shop when they wanted to put Dormers and and raise the room for more room correct with CA McGrath had lived right and um so people are get their backup about it because it doesn't sound good it doesn't sound on when you said they didn't know and our job this year is to make sure that everybody in town knows that there is a historic district that it encompasses X properties and and we want to get the word out to the homeowner to the residents and to the real estate agents I think it would be better if we introduced ourselves well that's why we're going to work on this and work on the wording we website we are on the website by the way yeah but people are not using that either no no of course not no it's time so let's take this as jumping off very helpful I like the positive approach personally but I do have a question on it though color paint or the color material you used on the move that color paint or used on the roof only or because I thought we didn't deal with paint well that's the whole point the things that you can I took these points from the law Yeah Yeah from the restrictions ex they are I summarized um there's several points like two and a half pages but I I took only all of them figuring there'd be another postcard a year later and only took like a summary bullet which is what we talked about um of those sections so okay I guess didn't make the connection from where the interior changes in your home down there that it's you don't so that so that's so the point there is well that's just one point yeah okay by itself we we don't have authority to review or comment on the following yeah and so that's what that is so let's work on that and next um I think you did a good job yeah I'm happy with it know it's very hard to do that's why and now we're in it and have document to go great job and the website cuz I put the address on there you know I looked to see what information was on the website and what I could concisely put in a small 3x5 postcard exactly well maybe I'll P whatever 4 by7 maybe we haven't decided that yet but I really appreciate it LA and so we in the historic district if you were to get this how would you feel about this presentation well we never knew we were in it when you bought it yeah how did you find out uh we applied for a sign oh yeah well we want to change that that's our change for 2025 okay okay so everyone knows their homework okay very good now we're also we're gonna avoid the cage right now I'm sorry because we have a guest who's gonna make a presentation okay oh this is John bar I don't know if a presentation so much Mary Jane as Bill uh Ryo you need an introduction do I need to interu ladies ladies ladies um no gentlemen uh you want to take a long time no I don't minutes yeah and I have to get back for an appointment at four I kind of squeezed this in because Bill asked me to come to talk a little bit and try to get your feedback about the idea of a historic historical committee commission under uh generaliz chapter 40 SE 8 D so I'm going to cut you off right there yeah we already are y we're already when we were incorporated or when we voted back in 19758 it was included in the vote was it yes so and I have it right here because I know you're a lawy to see no I wasn't on fact I I remember that I don't even know if I was in high school back then uh that's but I was dating I was around no I used to go my dad would take me to the town meetings when they were up at Spalding but when when was this one adopted when 197 one five after the bicentennial it was God I was in college where you go you went around so I wasn't around I was remember if you were in college you yeah no I wasn't going to tames when I was in college um so but I think we could all work together well I think I think the problem is going to be if I can short oh I'm sorry Lisa Lisa Str hi hi Lisa you aair of the HDC yeah so that what you're looking at was when the very first district was established right and the hisor district commission was established right article 10 in section 7 where did so vote that there would be a historic commission as well yes and we've always operated as a what they call John is a combined commission commission and we and they are registered towns and is registered at the state level um as a combined commission okay okay so in big big towns down where they have say Province Town at any given time the district commission could have up to 20 applications in front of them like that and bigger cities have a a whole two separate groups yeah because there's so much work but in town which has 100 properties within its districts is it really that busy and has always during my tenure and and I'm sure if they could attest to it too it's ample time has always had ample time to fulfill anything needed under historic histor commission commission well combined the only question I I guess and maybe you have it Mary Jane but I think I did see this motion and it and it as I see it it's it adopted the historic district bylaw uh and it said if the town meeting so votes a commission established here under shall have the powers and duties of a historical commission as provided in section 8D and in this event the commission may be entitled a historical commission but I I don't I think that was a separate question was it but the town voted on the overall to accept see there's there's a disconnect there now but article seven is contained section s is contained within article 10 and they voted on the article yeah which is inclus all established here under I don't know I just I don't know it seems to me that that would require a second vote because the the vote the motion is that the town amend the bylaws adding article X as follows historic district bylaw so the town adopts that right now you have a historic district and and you adopt the historic districts but then a section of that bylaw says if the town meeting so votes a Comm commission established here under shall have the powers and duties I don't know if it's it's assumed within the vote to establish the historic district it seems like it's asking for a second state well I me if it's if it's registered then it's probably a moot point it's combined it would have to do all I'm saying is the way I would read that it would seem to me it would require a second vote of the town to say yes the historic district commission shall act as a historical commission as well you know the fact that it's kind of within the article now if the state has accepted it maybe that's sufficient that's curious as to why why they want that I mean what's the what's the ultimate well I I think the thing is I at least in my experience I'm not sure what the historical district commission has has done Visa other historical properties in town because that's what the historical commission can do is apply for Grants it can designate other properties outside of the historic district to be historic property just drove by one this morning at least I I haven't research it myself but I don't think it's in the har district is uh uh the Hamilton's house 1730 across from Joe shank's uh um a garage um and it looks like it's probably one of the first houses but uh the other one that's not in the historic district is would be the uh wood Farm uh on Worcester Road so yeah so John the way this works is and this is the legal procedure is if a property wants to be included into a historic district or a new District is to be established the owner of the property has to request that right yeah if you're establishing a historic district owner of a house so for instance during my tenure I had to put on the historical commission hat because I had a request for an owner of a house that said I'd like it to be in a historic district so when I sell it I can be sure that it won't be changed it'll stay in its historic yeah yeah so it went along the discussion went along that the owner of the property has to ask yeah so it was going to be the fean district let's just store did some work on it it could be that one property we entertain making it a district to include some of the other properties that would be a fidant district the other Butters no what nothing to do with that that right the owner the people who first requested to become in a district yeah then pulled out and said no we changed our mind okay and theyed their request request did they give me reason thought it would impede the sale of their home right right so it is so that's Chang owner of a property has to come forward and ask it's not the historic commission or the histor districts commission to if they wanted to put something in a district because like you said this building is very old but look the owner of that property has to agree to it and then the town has to approve it has to go the Town it has to go to town meeting right but that's not what we're talking about here yeah well well because he mentioned why you know that one's not in that's but but I think I think excuse me Alicia but I think there's a distinction here between a historic district commission and its main focus is preserving those historical districts which the town has determined and maybe adding to a historic district but I think the the provisions of of of 40D go a little bit beyond that in terms of historical preservation and I I'm not going to profess to be an expert on historical commissions or historic district you guys are the experts ask you what do you think preservation is Preservation is what we do I have it right here yeah I have it right here the historical commiss historical commission is responsible for identifying the historical and cultural resources of the Town oversees the preservation of those resources and certifies properties and artifacts throughout the town for which CPA funds are being requested for preservation or restoration as significant to the history and culture of the town the district commission is responsible for the preservation and protection of the buildings and places in those districts that have been created in our case districts 1 two and three it reviews and issue certificates of appropriateness for new construction and modification to the building so it seems that the district commission is responsible for keeping the architectural Integrity of the district right but the com historical commission is responsible for identifying those properties outside a district that may be significant and left out and then they have certain other duties they can certify a property right right so the big question I'm hearing John is according to the state we're we're combined I see where you're coming from on on that last paragraph and um if the vote weren't identified at the bottom of that page I what do you do I mean what's the argument well I I think and and quite frankly I had always thought that there was a distinction although I didn't you know wasn't in a position or I had the energy to try to suggest that we should have a historical Commission as well I think Bill in the in his bill WR out in the context of being on the Historical Society uh I think felt that there there is a separate entity here that would be it can be the same or it could be a different commission uh and the statute itself uh and that's why it says you know in that we were adopting a historic district commission under uh uh 8 8C 8D is a historical Commission and to just quote briefly from the statute um uhor sorry that um it um it seems like it it it can be the same so obviously the state has accepted Mass historical commission has accepted the historic district commission as a historical commission and several little towns are yeah com yeah so I mean I I guess maybe we just have to clarify that that that that's in fact the case and then I think though that I think not to dispute what you're saying about it has to be someone coming in I agree in terms of a historic district but I think the historical commission and your job as that body has expanded I wouldn't say Authority but expanded powers or duties because you can um conduct research search for place of historical or archeological value you can coordinate activities it's been happening a long has been happening yeah okay the other hat that's been worn all along okay several incidents in the very job description of a historic Commission in of these places is to work with the town Municipal boards planning for Bo all the town boards in okay in in presid ation planning to protect the architect architecture of our of historic places buildings such dur in my tenure I many times have been contacted by either um cemeterian Parks had a question blah blah blah so I was act you had to act as a historical commission yeah yes and as you'll see it says it's advisory it's an Advisory Board yeah sary to the district's commission can I ask a question what's the society what's the Historic Society the historical separate nonprofit organization to preserve history okay I think can I just jump the gist of this the reason why you're talking about is this CPA you're be getting funds from the state okay from the taxes of the people in towns that plus the state all right so what you're really interested in doing is how do we how do you deal with those funds as far as the CPA and as far as preservation goes you still have to come through us you still have to come before the district to make any changes to any the historic buildings so even if you get funds you still has to anything that's um that is going to go to a historic building to be done or to be reserved has to come before this board anyway so I think if if the historic district commission is the historical commission right and and maybe you guys have had it and it's just not generally known by the public but say for example I don't want to necess pick on the people that own the wood Farm but if they not to to become a historic district but if they were applying for a state Grant you know to renovate their because from what I understand that that building was built in 1716 yeah that's a um and they're trying to preserve it as a Farmstead of a colonial Massachusetts taking time um it would be just you're wearing the Hat of the historical commission fill out a very lengthy application form it's an inventory form it's very lengthy it has to the verbage has to support the historic significance what not what not it's it's an application they would make to gain approval as a historic property exactly okay and and I they have to initiate that okay it's not for the distri commission or the historical commission to do that the the owner of the property has to want to do that all right can I just yeah I just want to know all right so we have a difference of opinion here about whether it's been established or not that well well I I think I would concede if if the state says you're commission you're the email from on that by the way from who J at um Department of State okay historical commission yeah so I can shoot that to you sure yeah all right and I can explain that to Bill I think Bill was you know looking for that what is he looking for in the long run the I think just what does the board obviously now we know that the commission here uh views themselves as as being the historical commission right now and we already have bylaws and and you have that um so I'm not sure beyond that I think he was just proposing that we in the context of doing the um the CPA bylaw that we would do a historical commission bylaw to have that and whether it was this commission being the same body or a separate one remain to be decided but at least in his apprehension and mine too we didn't realize that you guys were the historical commission if you are then it's a it's a move point so you just have to refer to us in your CPA that anytime you have funds for that that youer it to us right right so so I I believe with the Historical Society there's a thought and a plan I think already in motion to do the historic walk and everything in the harbor right and so is he thinking of that being under the umbrella of something else other than the Historical Society or does he think it should come under no uh commission I already in yeah I know that but this is something that they're planning to do that that is under the orle right yeah that's a completely different Society to have its buildings and the neighborhood with within the district to be viewed as the harb old Harbor Village right so he's putting depts in order is that what you're telling I think so I think that's so the first thing he wants to do is is confirm that there is a historical Commission in the CPA it does talk about the historical commission has to certify the property right so that's what he's doing so he doesn't have like one building in mind that he wants to drag in no no I think it's just generally really realizing that the CPA is adopted and the bylaw is adopted when you go for the historic preservation grants I think the way he's reading it and probably the way I was is that you have to have a historical commission no you do you have to have a historic district commission that has been accepted as a historic Co commission and we actually just talked about that last so you guys have educated me you already are the CPA requirement for historical preservation has to be within a historic district be in the massachusett state registry or a local historic Commission of revie application that they bring in to justify that it is significant in archaeology architecture and some historic events or something that happened and then the historic in when you keep reading under so we have do you think we've satisfied those question uh I yeah I I think so um I'll just let him know you know I think he he basically want to be to discuss it and just get your feedback about you know whether we should have a article to adopt a historical commission this makes it technically easy for you because when you do your bylaws for the CBA you can just refer to the historical district commission and the historic commission at the same time as by us yeah yeah so you don't have to reinvent the wheel yeah all right thank you back with more um questions and we have by the way we are looking at doing a are you leaving a grant so okay anyway and we'll let you know what happens thank you John all right thank you sure nice to see you thank you John thank you John and I I you know I should have probably said something to you tonight this morning but I just felt uncomfortable you know telling you what I we knew about oh oh okay okay all right yeah that's all right but I felt you know saying it outside the yeah meeting the meeting yeah and what and even under the historic district byee all right I'll walk out with you got something else no it's okay years ago when there was money and you could apply for it and the Methodist Church could apply for it and and we were starting all the paperwork for it and then they also applied for the money to do that you were involved in with all the painting and everything upstairs years ago for the money from the state for what was a grant from from the for the hall you mean upstairs okay so I don't know who was on that commission But Ken and I did a lot of work to get money for the Methodist Church to do a lot of work at this church and when you did that and got the money nothing could ever change in that building it would always be a church oh they put the restriction on for you and that so if you were awarded the money nothing could change inside yeah I actually um I and so it was and actually the Methodist Church we in the meth mson do not own it it's owned by the conference so and the bishop so we couldn't do it so I did that's interesting I do have a copy so this building can never be anything but a town hall because of that of that money that was awarded and anything on the interior has to be reviewed right well um I have a copy of the historic New England I I mean the mass I'm going to give it to everybody because the Grist Mill and the cage both are under restrictions that you can trct so this is how their restriction reads and have they been awarded money oh it's in the de it's in the de the It came it came what happened was the gville and the cdge must have asked for money to do work when they did that money when they received that money when did they record this thing didn't say I don't know when this was the go back to go to the last page and no is 1981 okay when you get government money there's a lot of restrictions right so they took what's called they gave a quick claim de because it's kind of complicated it's almost like they gave them mortgage because they gave money they restricted the property so they put the Quick Claim Deed on to create their restriction and it's a 500 year Le yeah yeah 500 years and have to do it hope the last 500 years okay so so we we're now going to do we're now going to go down to five b okay and Julia did pass out yeah now this is I want to call this like a tandem request it's again from the town and historical society it's for the cage and it's the same situation they want to replace exterior plywood rotted wood Sills repair windows and thank you jock he attached the letter from the state yeah saying what they've approved now the only tricky thing about that is I am have a phone call out because I don't know who checks to see if the work is being done in compliance with the state I don't know if it's us or the state so I want to find out for sure yeah say that again like well they put the restrictions on he can only do whatever this letter says well I think that's up to us to make sure that he does well I want to make sure it's either us or them I don't know it's not our restriction they're making the Restriction so it's up to us to follow Eng yeah talk Mass yeah they put the restrictions on so we have to make sure that it's followed that's why we're the district all right am I correct do I well I think that I think I agree with that okay am I correct I would agree okay um and also it might be EV to ask uh historic New England if they have an inspection schedule for that's what I'm talking about that be at the end they they have schedule so let's just say they're going to do take off the boards okay and it's going to be done by February 1st so somebody periodically they be in expecting not at the end when it's done I think that's a good idea to find out but it should not impede no not at all not at all this our information to know where we stand in in in the pecking order of responsibility okay because there is um see oh okay this is one of the things I wanted to bring up in the meeting to memorialize it if you go to um page four which is paragraph seven is this this is something the yes it's in the quick pen do you have a you have oh good yep it's in the D it's on page four and it's it's paragraph seven and I just want to bring this up so that we point this out no sign shall be painted or AIX to the spaling cage or the Gris Mill or the grounds except for an attractive and suitable marker or historical sign approved in writing by mass histor we have to keep our eye on that because is that what Spina is well it used to be and now that used to be the society for the preservation of um natural new Eng and they've since merged and changed their name to become historic New England so this was back in the 80s so I think it's we have to keep our eye on on the sign business particularly because the historic the his a cult Society has a vision for how it's going to work and I think signage is going to be included so we're going to have to keep our eyes on that are they looking to do something different than what they've had yes they they're looking to create for signage well yeah I I haven't I don't know what it's going to be but they have this whole so they know they have to come to us let's hope well it's it's right in all the records of everything that signage is part of what they have to come before the historic commission for yes and that's why I'm saying this so that it be memorialized correct so everybody knows it doit has to come down yeah you know it doesn't fit it has to come down oh they can't put it up unless we say okay but if they put it up and it's wrong it has to come down well yes absolutely yeah thank but I think we can deal with that if the time comes instead of dealing with it right now well no I'm not saying we're dealing with it right now but what I'm saying is want to put it out there so that we don't have any I agree so that anybody's watching the meeting can hear everything that's going on no miscommunication okay very good that's a big time so I'm I'm ready to make a motion to accept the application for the Spalding Bridge 1 South Street to have the work done that's been approved by the historic New England can I have a second thank you jry we' discussed it I'd like to have a vote is yes La yes Susan G yes Julia St yes Mary Church yes so approved by V thank you very much and I think all signs have to go there they have to they have to go with a permit for size and everything but I think that the historic New England trumps any they would have to comply with do they go to plan I think ja do do you have to go to plan I think I think in this case it's historic doesn't we have to go not if it's because who yours I know does the building inspector give out the sign permit he go go okay so then he's the one that's going to say you have to go see historic yes yes ma'am yes that's how it's supposed to work 100% because when I had a sign a little shop in the barn and I had to come before the historic district commission when Ed West was chairman and I had to present the the the design and the size and I had to stay within with the town dictated for size and Mr D had to do the same thing oh Lisa sorry yeah you have the town of towns signed bylaws yep then you have historic district by so if you're in the historic district the sign requirements for approval of a sign are different a little different than right the town they can be but there's a whole different set of rules for within a historic distri go no bigger than 12 square feet letters painted on wood and it indirectly blah blah blah it's all in it's all in your okay here it goes you want to sign that and then the the next item this is a cloud all in nature um do you st who's our clerk has had to purchase supplies like ink and paper so she can do one minutes just in in and she would like to be reimbursed for her um do we have a budget we do have a budget I approve I so make the motion that she be reimbursed thank you for her expenditures doing her volunteer work I haven't been paid I I've used all of it most thank you any discussion thank you should be reimbursed does give Kathy yeah or k Katie Katie you know I never got the other one for the the pictures by the way well give us the did you have a receipt put in and they pay you why is that I don't know yeah we'll have to ask her yeah okay I told you not to worry about it but Jerry said we don't want to go that way want to make sure that yeah make sure can you I don't know where there she is I mean I don't did you give it to her yeah I had given it I thought you had given it to her I don't think so I don't think I had the receipt we talked about it but I don't think I had a receipt Julia we'll resubmit yeah did you vote on that before yeah the first one okay so just find it that was the pictures of the um enti Department well no the um little little building former El um store whatever it was down the harbor so have a vote on reimbursing like to oh I made the second vote please yes La yes Su yes Mary Jane Church yes thank you you can abstain since it's about you yeah I know yeah so what we're signing here it doesn't have any place to has a date right here so sh the meeting date yes okay I was going to fill it out before it's Gotta Be stamped I'm gonna borrow pen sorry so our next meeting will be scheduled for second Thursday in February um I should have actually have stained this no this is this is the coper let's see 13 this I need copies up to put with well actually that goes into the town clerk anyways right okay so I guess I don't need cies so that would be the 13th of February which is Thursday at 3 o' FR had a hard time is okay with you are and yeah because I'm yeah yeah 3 o' okay and Susan is that good for you at 3 o' yes yeah it's going to go on my calendar okay how about you I'm fine with that I like I like the second call Kathy before yeah and just find out right that would be great I mean if we could just get that off the plate that we've done what that well last year um I contacted the board of realtors and um actually she was really good she sent out I sent her notice that we were it did have historic districts and she said she was going to notify all the members of her board but towns did have it and that's when she called me back and asked if you'd be interested in doing a lunch and La okay so for the lunch and learn I if I may um so I went into the assessor's office and I asked for a list of all the historic properties I first asked for it by District she doesn't have it by district and this is relatively new I think garide might have uh referred to it the last time he was in here is that all the historic homes in the districts are now coded so and it's coded specifically for him to know okay and then he refers it back here right she so this list is not by District but it is all of them so my suggestion would be for this lunch and Lear that whatever communities are there that this be a handout okay for the agents that come there okay okay and then they can get the same kind of list in their own Community or they should be able to they should be able to S oh I'm sorry this is um we already created the detailed list the list by address with parcel ID and everything we have you you have it we created that when I was sitting did the yeah okay but there's also I can dig that out of my archives and S it you but we also we already have a full listing Janet was given that do this thank I'll check with Janet see if she yeah the only difference with this and this is also the same thing all of the map lot address owner's name okay which would be updated obviously um right present value is on here um or previous value and then current value and then the difference I did ask the question because in the assessors you get coded if you have wet PL or whatever in those things you actually get a uh credit on your uh tax bill if you're in Wetland you get a credit well I can get a credit for being in the histor dist find out about no you told I said well I said because some people think that that's a negative like Susan brought up Ear wetlands are negative okay so we give the deduction at this point in time no there is no deduction for being in the historic district but all the information is current information is here now so I think this is something that we might want to get from the assessors every year absolutely okay because they're are transfers but let's go back to that part about the negative so because you brought up the negative too so and you brought up the negative Lisa if I me so is there a perception of negativity with historic that would that we would be able to get a not we but we the historic district work I think that's something we could talk about approach yeah I can ask Vicki to see if any other communities do it okay because that would be the easiest way if other communities do it and you say well we think we should do it we could uh the we being the historic district commission could uh put in a request with the Assessor's board yes and then they would discuss it yes yes I mean that'd be worth pursuing at some point because it's a restriction it's a restriction yeah it is a restriction see I never realized it was such a Negative don't call conquered don't have Vicki call conquered coner probably not it's probably not a negative there of course it's going to be a negative and a restriction because they have to go through extra work and they have to go to all these other meetings to get approved so I mean it takes time for them so yeah so rather than being being proud of the fact of it it's a it's a negative yeah it's a negative for a lot of people they think oh how sit's gonna be old it's so got to be very strict I can't do this I can't do that yeah yeah but I think it has to do also with the demographics of the community you're in I can't see that happening in conquer I'm just talking about Townson oh Town yeah no oh I think Townson for sure yeah so starting out with did you know did I know what yeah and then did you know like are you're not a child you don't know your house is in the in the in the three one of the actually those words were brought up in the last meeting when I took the task on like did you know yeah you know it all depend on how you say it yeah it's not you can do that with anything you can read that paper and and I'll interpret it totally different and you'll like John just did with the vote yeah I was like okay where are we going with this because um I really thought they wanted something else I I wasn't sure what they oh they do do okay okay I'm gonna join the a couple things I want to address all right first of all um I know you're pretty proactive and Forward Thinking Mary Janes but sometimes we deal with things that may or may not happen in the future and I know you're trying to prepare us for that but I really want to be able to deal with the things we have to deal with like this today you know um and if it does come up I'm sure we're going to have time to able to deal with those things in the in the future oh oh I have I believe that my heart so but it just it just lengthens the meetings so that sometimes they become Comer so that was the only thing I'd like to suggest and I would like to thank Alicia for giving some information coming tonight that was very helpful thank you to see you sitting back in here with us was very helpful alici like knowledgeable experence knowledge is power so to change this and saying there's some negative things it's better to start somewhere oh yeah we needed to we need to start somewhere we'll never get started no obviously it's been this our second year talking about it and you have something that you can talk about now now we've got jump right now we've got a jumping off yeah all right any other discussions anyone want to bring anything up if not I would like to have a motion to adj I move we adjourn at 4099 49 thank you yes yes jul St yes thank you very much