##VIDEO ID:3aKQKtFVc_0## e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e good afternoon everyone and welcome to the commission Workshop December 6th 2024 I'd like to call this meeting to order and the first thing that we need to do is to do the Pledge of Allegiance I pledge alance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all all right our first item is for City attorney and city manager reports do roll call oh I don't have a report today do we need to do I guess we do need to do a roll call yes please let's go back to the roll call commissioner Toth here commissioner crell here commissioner minning here vice mayor Dicky here and mayor doctor here all right so may I apologize I don't see that even on my agenda um for this meeting but I'm happy to entertain it I I don't have a report for this meeting oh okay ah I know why cuz this is the this is the document that if we were doing a full meeting going through the agenda and here and I just grabbed that sheet and it's the workshop notice for agenda so that's the reason it is all right then uh let's move on we're going to take public comment for non-agenda items at this point and that way the folks that uh that are here for those uh purposes can uh can then leave and then we can get into our uh our actual discussion item so let me uh the first would be uh Deb Garvin first Deb Toth I would love for you to speak into the microphone when we have a meeting because no one can hear a word you say please for the love of God you've been told multiple times cuz I'm going to scream into this microphone I have had it I've just did a Sunshine Law request because I want to see every single email and correspondant for the last year that has gone on between all of you this is a joke you're all up here smiling while we're out of our homes I can't get an update on permits I requested a meeting with you twice no return calls back I requested a meeting with yonan so I didn't have to stand up here and and yell so don't you dare sit up here with smiles on your faces while we're all out of our homes do you hear me at all do you hear your citizens stand up and get angry and get the job done I drove by here last night at 4:30 and it was dark I worked two jobs in my 40s to get where I'm at today and I'll be darned if I'm going to sit here and stay out of my home you actually asking people to break the law and who's at fault I want to know who's responsible for this mess I should be able to get a permit just to put my drywall up but I can't because I have to wait on all of you what is the process I want transparency I haven't seen an update on the email or on the Facebook page since the 3 it is now the 6th I have to call and check every day do I have a permit where's my letter substantial letter what was I mean when you started all of this was there ever an execution plan on how a city that lives on the water handles this situation I want to see execution before it's done I would have lost my job in Corporate America had I handled this situation the way that all of you are and yeah I'm putting the blame on every single one of you cuz I saw every single one of you up here with a smile on your face when we're all homeless and paying double mortgages do you find that funny Diana do you I don't how about you Deb I'm homeless yeah so are we all and you should be more angry about this than anybody it's kind of like the boat situation remember dad I never heard a word back from you and I had to live next door to to that next door so yeah I Blame You and I don't trust you good I don't because you never got back to me all of you except the new ones promised me even the City attorney was involved in this you promised to get back to me about new laws that you were going to implement so I didn't have to have commercial boats next to me and I haven't heard a word from you and that was a year ago because Amy Davis promised me and the chief of police that I had to have meetings with because of what was going on next store I have every right to be angry and I want every single email correspondence under that Sunshine Law so that we can see what's been going on you signed a contract with the city you had an execution out you got to move off the island and you got paid to move off the island is that correct we didn't have an out I'm on my sixth Airbnb since I was evacuated yeah and who's paying for that I am okay okay well I hope so cuz I'll find that out I want to see everything I have every right to be angry and I swear I think you should put yourselves in the shoes of your residents and figure this out and when we're getting this stuff and stop playing the blame or I'm working so hard you don't know what hard work is I've worked my butt off and I don't think either one any of you know what it's it's like to work from sun up to sun down to get where you're at today and deal with 3 months of being out of my home and paying a double mortgage you should all be ashamed of yourselves every single one of you and there's no answer like I said I've requested a meeting with you twice so I didn't have to come up here and yell and hold people accountable to get answers there's no transparency on the website hey we're working on it we're working on it pet yourself on the back that's all I get I'd like a little bit more than that period it do better and stop that smiling up there it's like a slap in the face to your community that you're not taking this seriously and yes I'm looking right at you good thank you all right non agenda Mark Hoy afternoon Mark Hoy 225 104th Avenue good afternoon um I'm going to just take a moment and read into the record a email i' had sent to Mayor and the Commissioners earlier following the Tuesday meeting so bear with me it won't be long I attended the workshop last night that would have been Tuesday night and appreciated your handling of the discussion in a open as possible Manner and I do appre appreciate that John it appeared that there was a 3-2 split between the commission regarding option two and option three both should have been brought forward for further consideration unfortunately City staff dug their heels in and claimed you already had enough information to select one and no further details were needed this is just wrong I can understand City's staff position in wanting to bring this matter to a conclusion however this is a major decision with ramifications for decades ahead the commission deserves the opportunity to fully vet both option two and option three City staff has no right to back you into a binary decision at this point who works for who there's a reason as the city staff stated in their work Workshop materials the number of times this program has been reviewed and formally discussed at public meetings is more than any other program in recent City history this program has a wide ranging impact upon the city its residents and businesses along with a massive unfunded mandate Commissioners and residents alike deserve the right to see the two options compared side by side and in detail before moving on please reconsider the commission decision made last night Tuesday night under duress from the city staff let's see all the details in a second Workshop thank you thank you Mark Brandy long I just have one request is there any way we can do like a town hall situation where those of us that are speaking actually have replies back instead of just stating opinions or stating this situations that we're going through and not getting a reply back is that a possibility I mean if you can answer this question in this forum is that a possibility that we can uh interact especially in a workshop so it it is um you know it's the it's up to you you you're running the meeting as far as if you want to go ahead and have that what I'll see a lot of times is when you're talking about an item that's before a workshop there may be a little bit more of that um interaction when you're talking about non-agenda items um different people handle it different ways some take notes and then get back to the person or wait until all the public comments done and then try to address it kind of all the concerns they here there could be multiple ways I feel like sometimes the City attorney is manipulating you guys and she's only giving you options of what she wants you to choose and so I feel like if it was a little bit more of a back and forth where the whole residents can actually see the answers to the questions that the residents are asking without anybody interfering that there might be more transparency to the process of what everybody is going through because you say we'll get back to you we don't know if you got back to that person that's asking the question because you may be doing it in email form you may not get back to them and then maybe rumors start to occur and I heard this or I heard that and I think it's really important that everybody is on the same page and you can just simply answer a question you guys live here too I ask a question and you answer it to the best of your ability if you don't know it then call in the person that does call in your permitting staff that has been doing all this hard work and let them answer what they can yep I know it it sounds easy and it's it's the feasibility of it though is where it would be so timec consuming that we wouldn't be able to get conduct I think the residents are more than willing to stay as long as possible so that you guys can actually answer the questions I think it's really really important the transparency is just it we're losing everything there's a potential to lose absolutely everything that we've worked hard for I I've I've I'm a very hard worker and I got here and I don't want to lose it and I think it's just been nonsense it's really disappointing and so if you can just please H let's schedule something soon before we have another holiday so that we can just have an honest Humane conversation what I've seen up here has been absolutely cruel people have came and they've spoke and they've poured their hearts out and it's just blank stares back at them and it is very very difficult sure so is there any possibility we can schedule that within the next week or so I less angry people like me that has been asking questions and trying to be I know it puts you on the spot but that is where we're at right now yes we are we are we we need answers and we need like transparency I mean do you do each one of you agree with that do you do you agree I'm I'm fine with having a town hall meeting where we can have questions and answers having said that having said that I've made myself available to anybody not just within my district but other districts to be able to answer their and that's appreciated but if you're just doing a one-on-one with a resident the other residents can't hear that information I understand all need that right now Diana are you agreeing with that would you be present for that well let me say this first I have already asked for us to become more transparent to the community okay and I do want an open forum the Commissioners if I get this correct on the sunshine laws we can't participate in a forum we can observe but we cannot be sitting like up here and giving any information it would have to be the city and the city staff answering your questions for you I sympathize with you guys I am out of a home also and that's not been really advertised so I understand where you guys are coming from right and I also have tried to identify a couple of of items that I see as problem areas that we have not really got into a hard discussion on and I have just this morning tried to get that turned over because we do need more transparency and there needs to be you you guys need need to see what what the flow is and what our and what the problems are the fact that we don't know that by now it's been over two months since hurricane Helen hit is really disheartening and I I believe you guys you have a City attorney on staff I'm sure she could draw up something that you guys could sign off for and say we are willing to participate in this against better judgment of the city or we will do this maybe she could write something up in some kind of legal ease to allow you guys to participate in this matter I mean I know that things like that can happen if you want it to happen Deb would you be willing to participate if you were given that opportunity I would I just have to work around my day job schedule because I do have a full-time day job okay good I'm I'm a full-time day job and I'm also homeless as well so I'm and I also think there's some issues with the Condominiums all of us are there we are so we understand I'm not a retiree so no I'm far from ask a question here of the attorney can we discuss when we're in a live meeting like this we can pretty much discuss anything correct correct uh so we wouldn't have any limitations that we'd have to do separately correct okay so yeah that's we can have a full discussion as long as we're in front of the audience and cameras do let's schedule within the week because we all have stuff going on let's just make this happen people will show up this has to be after work because like Deb said everybody's working not everybody's a retiree and can go let's try to schedule something at like a six o'clock hour where you can take people and the Overflow can be out there and they can write cards and we'll do it all night long We'll order pizza now one of the issues that I that I do see is that uh a lot of the questions that are being asked uh usually are very detailed and are to an individual that's maybe standing up at the the microphone and uh that we don't have a lot of time to get and have all the staff U we can do a second one or a third one or fourth one I I think that if you were to take a poll that every resident would say I want that information directly from the people that are responsible for doing and giving that information I think it's very important and you guys are voted in to be our voices and we've seen we've we've seen some crazy things on these videos that the residents all say one thing and you guys vote a separate way so we need to hear from every single person that's responsible to ask questions and get that answer to be held accountable in a public forum so that all the residents can see the answers that's transparency that is what we're looking for problem is the city manager wants the city not the mayor y please one at a time that's all I have to say I I would love please within the week and I don't think that that is a you know too soon before people go away for Christmas please can we please get together and allow the residents to ask questions and get them answered okay thank you visar good afternoon um mayor Commissioners uh visar hja at 32 Dolphin Drive uh came a couple days ago to ask for my um substantial damage estimator results uh since my home was uh estimated that it's been it was determined that it was substantial damaged uh thanks to you folks whoever um texted uh Jesse Miller um he came out that night and gave me the results well the results are disturbing they're bad every resident of Treasure Island should ask for these results and they'll see what the city is doing uh I came here yesterday too to talk to to Mr Jesse Miller and uh Mr uh Dicky uh he was here he he attended that uh five minute meeting I just wanted to know why uh they chose the another option instead of picking the uh what FEMA estimator tool was given and I'll explain so on the first page Mr dicki has a copy and and I can provide copies for all of you just my printer flooded so I can I need to buy a new one uh on the first page there's a damage summary if you guys haven't looked at these results I I will pass them to you just right now uh after I'm done uh there's a damage summary of this uh estimator uh substantial damage estimator which comes from as to my understanding it's coming from a tools that we borrowed from FEMA to come up with these results well on the damage summary my replacement cost of the home is $439,000 there's a dep depreciation for 24.2% which brings the actual cash value to $332,000 800 uh 332,500townhouse 1,556 80 and then it says repair reconstruction percentage at 36.5% 36.5% that means that this house is not substantially damaged this tool showed to whoever was doing this that my home is not substantially damaged right underneath which I've highlighted and you can take a look it says perfa publication 213 actual cash value may be used as market value so it's telling you that if you have an actual cash value which is 332,500townhouse there's another right underneath the damage uh summary there's an optional user entered data so you have to get this data enter it yourself the city was looking for another amount and they went on the County's uh property appraisal Mike Twitty it's probably 20 years old uh and that value is $172,000 for the structure of my home so now with $121,000 damages and a value of $172,000 that brings my home to 70% um to be correct 70.5% damaged and therefore my home got uh determined to be substantially damaged second page or actually it is I'm sorry uh page page four out of five it says it lists everything all the damages and then on page one damages say they're 121,000 on page 4 now my damages are 332,500townhouse so this this can't happen on accident cuz we know how computer works and we know how software works this is it will total and the total should have been 121 and it gives you a total replacement cost 439,000 and it should have been the damages to 121,000 which still brings my home back to 30 5 36.5% page four again there's a replacement cost there's a computed actual cash value there's a total estimated damages that was entered there by someone for $332,000 which is an error and it brings again my repair construction cost to 36% because they couldn't change that data over there so it stayed the same again uh there's another page that shows computed actual cash value how did this FEMA tool has this data cuz because Mr Jesse Miller said that we they couldn't trust that number interesting they couldn't trust what FEMA gave them that that number that data was that was for my house that is $332,000 Jesse Miller said they couldn't trust trust it because there's nothing to back it off with but they could trust the the pelis county aaer because it's there the page but they they do trust the estimator tool interesting you know the whole tool they they they trust it but they don't trust that number because that number would put me at 36.5% uh yeah so on that page it shows again that that one actually is pulled it says cost data reference panel County property appraisers office property appraisal office pinelis County it says on this document and Jesse Miller was directed to not go with this number but instead to go with a lower amount which what happens with a lower amount we're going to have a lot of substantial damage homes here take a look at this guys take a look at this and it's interesting enough how the city is choosing is choosing when to trust FEMA or when to follow FEMA rules and when it's in their ENT interest not to follow FEMA rules it shows again per FEMA publication please write this down cuz you guys probably need to look at it uh FEMA publication 213 yes that will be all for me and I'm going to be here every single day I'm going to quit my job and possibly try to get a job here CU I'm here almost every day now because there's something I know there's a lot of people I was here yesterday there's plenty people they're running around they're they're trying to help there's a lot of people in this building but nothing is moving forward and why is that we're not being efficient it doesn't matter how hard you work if you're not efficient in my world I'll fire you if you're not efficient I will fire you I let people go if you're not you can work 24 hours if you didn't bring results you're gone and that's how it's supposed to be around the city we need results we need people people here to start doing their job and now all these people are wasting their time right now there's Jesse Miller and bunch of other people are wasting time with these stupid substantial damage letters that we shouldn't even have them we shouldn't have these letters we went with option two we don't need the substantial damage letter and they're bogus please if you guys want to take a look at this or take pictures if you're interested if not you can throw it away I have problem thank thank you V sir thank you West Evans West Evans isop Pals uh I just wanted to get up and kind of second what one of my neighbors said about maybe having some kind of open Forum discussion I think uh obviously we're all frustrated very very frustrated and as the days go on we get even more frustrated and I'm starting to worry about like there's some like really people getting over the edge you know their toes are on the edge Y and uh we need to really start having uh I know we get up here and we ask questions and we can't get answers it by the design understand that but maybe in this open Forum uh way we can do that and of course we understand that you guys don't know the answers to everything and there's no shame in going you know what I just became mayor I don't know the answer to that let me ask the city staff City staff if you guys don't know the answer you don't have to flimflam it you can say we don't know let's look into that and we actually have a bunch of people in our community that uh do a lot of research and I'm not talking about reading through Facebook comments on stuff and calling that research you guys know the ones I'm talking about we have people who do this kind of stuff for a living outside of the city government work and uh they can give us I mean Mark alone comes with tons of information every meeting you know we rely on him for a lot of answers uh if we have this open Forum we can get a lot more information to the community maybe ease people a little bit uh and you know maybe one of the things we could do there is have someone from the permits come in and actually go okay here's why it takes Tak so long for a permit because you got to go through this step this step then this step then you got to go to the county and get this this and this I don't think it should take as long as it does I think there's probably a way to fast trck it a little more but of course I don't know I'd be willing to come down here I know Arden or Bob one of you guys said last meeting come down spend the day here you guys don't want me in that office every single permit will be out the door before the end to today trust me uh but seeing you know visar came up he was showing us his papers he got that show the numbers that we're depending on for these permits they're not even correct so we're wasting all this time going to the county to get these numbers that don't match up with the numbers that FEMA is using in their estimator tool that then the city says well we can't trust the number that FEMA use in their estimator tool to get this percentage and that percentage so what are we doing like if no if we can't trust the numbers from FEMA for this how can you trust them to give the anything like I said months ago I'm sorry that I don't trust a program to tell me if my house is substantially damaged created by people who want my house to be substantially damaged that's what it feels like I mean it's maybe if you know we had a more open discussion where we could ask questions and get more clear answers maybe people would be a little more calm maybe they'd be a little more understanding but like I you guys know I'm you know ringing the same Bell over and over and over when I come up here it feels like the citizens want one thing a few of the Commissioners are on the side of the citizens a few seem to be on the side of the staff and the staff sometimes comes off as adversarial to the citizens so something's got to change I mean obviously we know something's going to change come March because people aren't going to put up with this but it'd be nice if it changed by next week so we could live in our houses that's all I got to say thank you thank you West all right so uh I'm going to ask um how does the commission feel about having a town town meeting uh where we would interact and be able to answer what we know and as several of you have said there's a number of things we don't know the staff that's why staff is is out there is that they specialize in things but um so how does everybody feel I I'll start by saying I don't have a problem with it um and uh it it does take more time it'll take some energy and uh so we'll have to utilize some of our staff so we'll have to you know have a separate meeting you know and and and see how we can do that I think we deserve it as a community I mean we've all been through enough yeah great if if so okay um how is uh like I said I don't have a problem if it takes three four hours I don't have a problem doing it one day I can tell you though that I am committed to next week already but uh anything else so I think a town hall meeting concept if it can be worked uh uh legally I'm I I think it's a good idea and i' certainly would love to participate in it N I was just going to offer I can take a look at the schedules between the commission and staff and come up with a date I'd ask for an additional week you said you're already committed next week and I I know there's a couple of people who will be out but we can come up with enough time to advertise this see if there's the appropriate location because if there's a town hall I would anticipate that it would uh it would overflow here and into the other rooms we might need a a bigger location perhaps up on the fifth floor in addition to down here and then come up and make sure that we can advertise that out to the community okay B uh I too would be fully supportive um of a public meeting um having been through many of these before in my career uh they have a tendency to go Ary and they have a tendency to uh uh Endeavor the participants to become a bit rockus uh and the meetings have generally gone out of control and the person running the meetings has had to step in on numerous occasions and try to quell the disturbances and so while while we while we should have a meeting and I'm in favor of that the responsibility goes to those of you in the audience and just as we have a responsibility up here to conduct ourselves in a manner that represents the good smile by the way um we have h a responsibility you all have a responsibility too that's okay yeah thank you you're welcome I'm speaking you're welcome yep um and that's the kind of respon respon right there that we don't want to have disrupt a public session where everybody is entitled to the floor one at a time just as we are so if that's a bother to you then let's not do it but if you're all willing to to adopt that philosophy and participate in a public meeting I'm forward 150% I'm raising my hand can I talk now no we geez Diana I encourage the open Forum I would have to say for being on the commission we need staff the city staff to answer a lot of the questions we we're not in the everyday workflow process and I think it would be very important for the citizens to be able to hear what that complete what workflow is and what issues they have came up good and bad out of that workflow I think that would go a long distance for everybody understanding or at least better understanding of what some of the problems are and I I I truly encourage it and sooner than later thank you Deb yes I I concur with what Diana just said um I would like to see it more of also a learning process where we do um provide what's going on where the road the speed bumps are and where we're having problems with and why are we having problems with data where's the shortcomings of that so I think once we put that out there and I think we could put that on the website as well where people can look at a reference because you know we're getting to the holidays and and people are away and things for the holidays too so that way they have a reference when they get a letter they can scroll down um I was looking at the fema.gov site and it does go through how the damages are assessed but how do we do it differently and where does it all fit in I think a lot of Education needs to come out of this I'm fully for um having an open Forum but it does need to be controlled where it's respectfully done um being Target I am speak actually this is not the opportunity you've had your opportunity you guys get mad pleas sit down but then you're sitting up there bashing your own please sit down I didn't bash nobody see this is this is the reason that uh that all public meetings you know are the folks that are trying to help trying to give answers uh all we get is bombarded and and and that that's tough it really is to sit there for four hours I I get it but all we're saying is let's have some it's been let's let's have some decorum is all I'm saying you can you can speak to whatever please have terrible please that is Terri please would you be quiet terrible I think we need to take a recess sure let's go ahead and take a a five minute recess e e e e e e e okay I call this meeting back to [Music] order um I think that we had a little bit of sidebar that also said that uh that we are willing to do a town hall type meeting that we can use the facilities here and upstairs uh on overflow uh but the most important thing is truly it's the decorum we we can't have people you know screaming in the audience walking up just yelling out uh raising their hands no we we've got a format and we'll have the format that we'll use continually and um and so we we do appreciate that we do I mean I feel awkward sometimes when somebody asks a question that I know the answer but because of the way that we've always run the meetings uh I had to wait until after the meeting was over or give them a call the next day so I think that we're going to give this a shot and uh we're all willing to to take our time as as you're taking your time I mean nothing special about that but uh uh it probably will be uh longer than seven days to get that uh put together but we'll try to get it put together as soon as we can and uh and you know that we'll have it a a format and that that's what we'll be looking at but format is a lot of it'll be you know if you've got questions please submit them in advance uh but still you can come up and and ask your questions so um so we'll be working forward with that and with that being said I what I'd like to do is continue on with our meeting because we do have a presentation that uh that needs to be done today and um so I I'd like to do that so um with that being said let's card um no I've got all the cards yeah okay sorry yep with that uh we're going to have a staff presentation and this is on our ldrs with uh kimley kimley horn kimley horn good afternoon commission uh this Workshop is a presentation by kimley horn which is our consultant for our Land Development regulation update and so this project has been in process for a while um due to some state laws that affected our comp plan so in August of 2023 the city commission approved the contract with kimley horn to update the Land Development regulations uh this is a two-phase project the first phase is to bring the Land Development regulations into compliance with the comp plan so the comp plan was originally approved in June of 2023 by the state of Florida and then immediately uh uh new state law was passed saying that anything that could be considered more restrictive or burdensome um was ineffective back to the date of Ian so it effectively may have canceled our comp plan so we put the comp plan back through the whole process and got it reapproved in June of 2024 um so kimly horn has been working on this and they've got a presentation about where they are and where we're going uh to emphasize phase one is to bring it into compliance with the comp plan phase two is to talk about all of our dreams and Visions for the city about where we want to go and what we want to be and where we want to change so uh the first phase is is mainly bringing us into compliance but also doing a kind of a major overhaul to make it easier to use easier to understand easier for the public um to know what those rules and regulations are our comp plan our Our Land Development regulations have been put together over many many years and have carried through a lot of the things I look up I go back to their Genesis when we're writing an ordinance we want to know where it came from a lot of what we have predates 1995 and a lot of that is even older than 1995 so um this is an effort to bring our Land Development regulations into the current uh Century so kimley horn will present where they are and uh we'll go from there great thank you thank you good afternoon mayor Commissioners for the record Kelly ker with kimley horn with me is uh my Deputy project manager and good friend Miss Nicole gasso uh both of us live and reside in the greater ampa Bay Area Nicole's actually resident panel's County I'm I just happen to be one County down down in that Manatee and Parish um the first thing I'm going to say is we've had we as a community including those of us further south have had a heck of a year to say the least um there is a lot of of work that's been going on around this this greater Tampa Bay Region there's a lot of things still to be done uh but you know the the great thing about it is watching people come together agree to disagree come together uh as we talked about with some of our internal Partners opening up their their homes and their rooms uh to to Residents uh just shows how stronger of a community we are but what we want to do today uh as Katherine said we're here to present kind of an update on phase one now there's going to be a couple of things that you're going to hear and you're probably going to be start asking some questions as far as well are we looking at this so as Katherine said this is a two-pronged approach there's the phase one which is kind of that code approach much like you did with your comprehensive plan that says we're looking at x y and z we're trying to make sure we're being consistent with state law and in this case consistent with your adopted comprehensive plan that's the first phase of this so some of this is going to appear to be kind of the okay that's common sense more importantly what we're trying to do is at least do this initial step as Katherine said and this is nothing that is uh just unique to this city Land Development codes zoning codes zoning regulations engineering standards they all get updated at different times and what you end up having is a Band-Aid approach and unfortunately what happens is when something gets updated and I'll use for example we say signage it doesn't get translated to other sections so you start to have inent inconsistencies so what we did uh have started kind of working on towards is what is that first step what is let's let's get the form let's get the format let's get the bones back to where they need to be and then as part of phase two we can make it the more robust approach uh so we're going to go through a couple of things and I will be the first one to say the schedule has definitely unfortunately slipped uh between uh season versus and then more more importantly more critically you know Debbie Helen and Milton uh did us no favors whatsoever and there again you're not the only ones in this same situation with a lot of different codes comp plans and and policies that are being undertaken across the state to the contrary you're moving as fast as you can at this point given the resources and the time frames that we have uh we did have a much more aggressive schedule to say the least like I said the storms unfortunately have done that but we don't want to rush this uh we do have an end date of June of next year but they also want to make sure we're providing ample opportunities as is identified on this schedule uh coming up in the winter especially when we have residents in season and also to allow uh residents to start to get back in their homes uh to be able to come and understand exactly what we're talking about from the code perspective now there's going to be some things that you know may come up with respect to the FEMA or to other things those are separate and apart from what we're talking about with the Land Development regulations when you start looking at a city these regulations there's a number of things both from the local the state the regional perspective and more importantly there's also some things especially from a policy perspective that uh pelis County as far as P forward pellis that overarching Regional planning uh group also has some say in the matter they don't necessarily get into the code but they do when it comes to the comprehensive plan so there again what we're talking about today and this is kind of a critical uh item to kind of keep in the mind at this point as part of phase one is to actually look at the reorganization uh this is one of those things when we started meeting with staff and and talking with them it's like why is this here versus and start asking those questions uh unfortunately it's kind of like making meatloaf and saying we have components here here here and here um a lot of codes that we see that a lot of codes that we work on start to consolidate the Land Development regulations into one single chapter but in talking with several uh individuals including the City attorney and other attorneys across the state part of the especially with the phase one process is let's keep things where they are but let's make sure we've got an effective series of standards that have the correct language have the correct cross references and actually speak to each other instead of against each other part of this is also to standardize the language when you start kind of going through this code like we've done you start to see the same type of term defined three four different ways and that just leads to some of the potential confusion so part of our job has also been going through and looking at all of those key terms sorry to say okay this is the standard this is how we need to Define it and make sure that that language and those references are consistent across the board when we start thinking about certain things and I'll give you a simple one as far as some of the Landscaping Provisions where we have it in multiple sections of the the city's current Land Development regulations there's different definitions and different applications and that starts to cuse a a question and a concern from an interpretation standpoint which is more restrictive which one takes precedence so again working with staff working with our subject matter experts to there again to start to consolidate uh and ex and there again cons uh make this a little bit more user friendly Graphics this is something that Nicole's going to show you pictures worth a thousand words that's one of my old bad dad saying um when we can actually take a photo or an image that we've created and take it from over 400 words on a specific standard and get it down to 150 and it's very clear as far as where a building can be placed how tall setbacks and things like that and it's a it's an image it takes the interpretation out of it so you're going to see some of that as well and then more importantly when we start looking at a couple of these things where it says to clarify some of these are the big topics that we identified both through the conferen plan plus our own internal investigation and looking at the code from the Landscaping to signage to non-conforming situations also looking at the processes and procedures for certain types of of applications uh so that you are more consistent with some of the other jurisdictions and also there are certain things that uh you know are currently staffed that probably should go one way or vice versa we're not taking anybody's Authority or power away we're just making sure that we're being more consistent with how some of this is being applied so what we've done is we've identified uh a summary table of contents just like anything else if you start start to creete this meatloaf and you don't have that recipe how do you know what you're making at the end of the day so we took that initial step to say here's the table of contents here's how we're going to start formulating and inputting the information start with that and then there is a a clear road map of what's going in where and how is it going to be undertaken also making sure that it's very clear on a decision and appeals Matrix making sure that's very clear at what stage are certain things being reviewed who has that review Authority who has the final decision at that point right now there again is kind of scattered throughout your your regulations so there again creating some very simple graphics and we've got another one we'll show you as far as that that says here's who here's who reviews what at what stage and it goes from there and then more importantly if there is a disagreement or an appeal who does that go to at that point again trying to take that interpretation or the the inconsistency or just the unknown out of this uh looking at some of your what we call lot and bulk regulations how big how wide how far back uh and other types of standards that are fairly Universal in most codes there again it's scattered so consolidating those to where there is a single chapter that identifies those kind of core standards or what I'd like to generally refer to is those standards of General applicability the measurement the measurements and how how we going to approach certain things non-conforming situations uh this is something of course uh as Katherine said you know one looking at the more burdensome act there's also some additional or new case law that's out there with respect to the non-conforming situations you also have a and and I apology for having this there's language in your current code with respect to and specific to the hurricane Provisions a lot of coastal communities do not have that provision uh that is huge in our in our determination in working all across the State of Florida to have a safeguard in there so we're definitely not touching that but just wanted to call out that component so where we are at this point uh we are looking in of course chapters 72 and 73 so looking at the sign looking at those Provisions to make sure we're being consistent not only with the US Supreme Court cases for uh sometimes what people refer to as Reed which is interesting because I you know I've been looking at this federal court case for over 10 years now and then more importantly more recent one within the last couple of years with the city of Austin so there again making sure that we're being consistent from a regulatory standpoint and also consistent with the federal laws and interpretations uh what our landscape and environmental scientists are currently looking at the landscape Provisions the tree preservation the those kind of components and our environmental scientists are currently looking through as we speak with the environmental standards all of this is going to culminate under this uh like I said this newer type of section as part of phase one setting the stage also for what we've identified will be phase two and items where I like to kind of talk about and say this is the parking lot so there's items that we heard from you know the planning board we've heard through various things and other things are like okay this is beyond a cleanup we're putting it in this list so that we don't lose track of some of this uh when we were here back in July uh talking to the planning board uh kind of the three big things that they they provided us uh was look at the Common Sense from an architectural design standards component uh the board and I think uh commissioner you were at that meeting as well yes um so you know there's I say definitely some uh some knowledge kind of working back from that meeting to this but you start asking the questions about what does this architectural standard mean we actually ask a couple of our uh internal partners and I've actually have several friends that are Architects uh and no offense to the City attorney it's like putting you know a couple of attorneys in the same room you're going to get a different opinion we were getting different opinions on what does this actually mean from an architectural standpoint uh but also more importantly we started to realize that some of the standards can't actually be built or become so burdensome so onerous that it increases the cost on properties and projects so trying to that's where we say Common Sense approach we're not saying give you know not saying we throw the baby out with the bath water by any means but let's rightsize it and let's make sure that it can be applied uh especially for the residents and the businesses within the community uh so also starting to you C the other two comments were you know keep keep the small town charm uh as I like to say I kind of interpret that as keep Treasure Island Treasure Island you're not madira you're not Clearwater you're not St Pete Beach you're Treasure Island there is an image and an expectation for the community so again I've written codes for the past 32 years all across the southeast I could come in here with a code and go okay this will work perfect but is it the right size in the right context no that's where we're saying keep Treasure Island Treasure Island and then more importantly starting to come back and look at the focus on the downtown based off of that the downtown master plan so again taking the work that's been done putting it into a clear set of standards and regulations so that this body especially has a clear blueprint and road map for what we're doing how we do it and why Nicole do you want to go through a couple of the examples I think this point sure yeah and then we can come back to the slide hi commission once again my name is um Nicole gasso I'm actually going to stay seated so I can um continue to change the slides um thank you for having us here today I'm going to go through some of our work samples and examples of um the items that Kelly just spoke about that have been in progress so we have this proposed table of contents again as Kelly said this is simply to um kind of start to tease out what the reorganization of the ldrs might be um so we've had staff review that and we really just want to focus on having a um Common Sense flow to how the ldrs read today so you'll see that um you know currently there isn't an official introduction chapter U so you know we want to add that in and then just have the ldrs flow from there so you have your introduction and then your procedures that kind of form the blueprint for all of the rest of the the regulations to follow um but as Kelly mentioned we're not really touching the reorganization of the chapters that exist today we want to leave those as is so we don't lose any of the uh regulations that that we really want to keep in there um and then for the zoning District development standards currently you have some of your development standards for a particular zoning District scattered throughout the code so this is something that we um talked with staff about putting in the zoning districts themselves so that way if you own a property in a particular zoning District you only have to click on that one link and it brings you right to that zoning District district and it tells you everything that you need to know um in terms of you know what your density is your intensity your maximum impr prvious surface area your maximum and minimum building Heights your um setback so this is really just to improve um the the usability and the function of the code for uh Property Owners but also for staff it'll um help process applications and site plans a bit easier if everything's just in one place and so this is an example of the decision and appeals Matrix that Kelly mentioned this will go in that um procedures chapter that will come before any of the other regulations and again this is to improve the readability and user friendliness of the code so if you know you've figured out okay I need to submit this project for a site plan review you can go to this table you'll have a hot link to the section that that will have much more detail on that if you want to go further um but then also you can just very quickly look at it and see okay so first staff needs to review it I'm going to have to do a pre-application meeting then the decision maker is going to be the Planning and Zoning Board or the LPA and if you know maybe you need to go to appeals you know that you're going to be going to the city commission for appeals and public hearings will be required so this is really to give people just a snapshot of what that process might be but then we'll have you know more detail in the actual body of those various sections listed there and then here's some illustrative Graphics that Kelly mentioned um I do just want to note that these have all been developed for other municipalities this is just to show you an example of some of the types of Graphics we may produce uh as we go through the issue identification and review process of the ldrs we'll decide what's appropriate for Treasure Island and fits the context of what you all are trying to achieve but as Kelly said these images that can be placed within the code and also posted on the city's website really help to make um what's sometimes very technical legal type language accessible to anybody who's um who's looking at the code so um as I said we'll kind of go through with staff to figure out what makes sense to add in um at this phase versus phase two um and then finally we're also going to be looking at doing some flowcharts which again will kind of Simply explain what a you know process might be and then these can also be you know distributed to the public so when you have people asking okay you said that I you know need to apply for a land use Amendment but what does that mean and I don't want to go read paragraphs and paragraphs in munic code there's at least this simple you know graphic that can be distributed posted on the city website and so forth um so now I'm going to just go back to the next step slide and let Kelly finish it off so to kind of uh in today's when I say our portion of the presentation before we of course open it up for your questions and thoughts uh just kind of letting you know where we are you know we've done some of the Baseline assessments we are currently working with staff currently also looking at the uh the countywide regulations for consistency with that uh so we're going to continue to kind of fi finalize some of those standards to modernize simplify and the reorganization uh of course everything we're doing as is required for something like this is to do as a strike through an underline so it's very clear what is being recommended for deletion and what's being recommended for adoption so there again stat is showing hey here's the finished product what changed so at the end of the day you will have a clean document but in the interim those versions have those strike through an underlying components uh probably one of the biggest components of course is uh working with the the city on identifying a community Workshop uh this thing cannot be done in a vacuum we need to get to a certain point roll information out kind of solicit the feedback as well and the guidance and thoughts and there again consistent with the phase one and what we're proposing does it make sense refine it uh as as we see right there go back before the steering committee or you know and or the planning board and then ultimately back before you for formal review and adoption this is not anything that we do and go hey it's done it's adopted it is a public hearing process it is a legal process we go through the planning board and it has to come through here as part of a public hearing as well so all of this is going to be presented as part of phase one we will also be presenting our findings as far as what we recommend for phase two uh and then like I said with the input from the residents as part of the community workshops and of course this body what is going to be kind of coming out of that phase two approach and with that uh let's leave this slide up it's okay Nicole but let's if it's okay with you mayor just um protocols just open it up for any thoughts or questions you may have I guess I'll start the questioning out is my biggest concern I know we're on a deadline with this that we have to have this completed by within a year of the comprehensive plan being approved by the state so that would be June of this year uh we have the hurricane now that we're dealing with and a lot of the same people that uh City employees in particular that would be working with you on this would be otherwise working on getting permits out so what what kind of measures will be will we be taking to minimize the amount of time we we uh take from employees who are working on permits how are you going to manage through that I guess that's what I'm asking that that's a great question we're used to working with very limited staffs or staffs that wear multiple hats our approach and is our team is going through develop providing a series of recommendations instead of saying okay staff how do you want to deal with this it's these are our thoughts and recommendations with the justifications so that they can go yes no flesh it out keep moving so it is more of I'll say the sounding board the the common sense approach for staff realizing that storm recovery efforts have to take precedence no if Sands or butts uh we're still moving forward with things that we're doing so that as staff has you know what time that they have it's very simplified or very I'll say concise approach to what's being changed and why okay thank you and and just if I could vice mayor also we're trying to minimize you know when we have our check-ins it's not all of City staff it's one or two core people so it's a subject matter component so that others aren't having to sit there and listen through that if especially if it doesn't affect them okay thank you yes sir go ahead B uh one question you've been at this now a while and certainly throughout your career as you look over what you've put together so far and you project out into the future where do you see the roadblocks great question um I I probably shouldn't say this but uh you know what comes out of Tallahassee is probably one of the biggest challenges that uh we have to keep in consideration um you know some of the other jurisdictions we work in and they you know the legislature gets together every two years uh others it's almost like a fulltime but just being able to adapt to what comes out of Tallahassee you know we we unfortunately saw what happened with Ian and Adalia and the more burdensome act uh so we end up having to react to a lot of things that are coming out so I would think that's probably the biggest I'm not going to call it a hurdle but just being Nimble uh so that as we're going through this we get new legislation come through it's test it confirm it and then keep moving moving forward so we may have some pivot Points along the way have you heard anything in the uh wind uh probably the couple of biggest things that we have been tracking uh are with respect to some additional uh cleanup on the live local uh some of the issues as it relates to impact fees some of the affordable uh housing IND oror adus those are kind of the big four that we've been tracking at this point um just and also watching what was being presented last session as well okay thank you yes sir you know you you talked about some of this going back into the 90s and uh so when this all gets adopted and everything else uh are we going to have substantial changes that are going to take place within the city phase one will be more of the cleanup consolidation update so in there will be some pretty significant changes in core components but it'll be very clear what and why face two is where you would see more of the significant or substantial changes okay I have nothing at this point I don't either you know let me ask you a question you guys are re writing all of these regulations and everything else and this uh kind of goes back to the a meeting that took place on August 20th and uh it's it's about the field dirt we we talked about uh you know field dirt and what we all agreed to at that time was we need a simp fi dirt ordinance period uh is it possible I mean your organization's got to have all the resource possible to actually do a simple Fielder or ordinance if you were in central portions of the state yes Coastal not so clear sometimes okay that's the political answer and I'm not trying to dodge around it um it it's like I said being Coastal having the coastal High hazards having some of the adaptation uh considerations it adds an additional layer of concern and consideration to everything we do uh I would love to be able to say hey it's a one paragraph type of thing unfortunately it's not okay sorry can I follow up on that with that how deep does it go how deep do you have to go to to uh come up with this honestly there is a lot of testing there's a lot of let's try as by as I say it let's try test it test it on not just fake pieces of property but Redevelopment sites uh that we can identify throughout the community test it does it work no if not pivot come back and it's not just us sitting there going well we think this sounds good it's also working with our Engineers you know certified Professional Engineers with licenses on the line uh as well as what we're seeing in some of the other communities and asking them uh there's not probably go by goes by that Nicole and I aren't talking to a different Community how are you addressing this because ultimately the question is going to come up well who else is doing this why are they doing it how are they doing it so having those kind of case samples and examples you know and I'll be honest with it we've talked with the city of St Pete on a couple of these portions uh I'm saying hey how have you dealt with this and they say this and it's like well how does that work it doesn't well on the places that it has worked uh are you able to glean from those any approaches that's kind of goes back to the meatloaf approach yeah of finding what works to what level and bringing that piece over but then kind of like being making sure we don't do what's happened with a lot of codes is we bring this over this over this over and next thing you know we right back where we were and that's the reason there is a core team myself Nicole our project engineers and our Landscape Architects and and designers and utility Engineers it's the same team that started with this project for a reason so that there is that consistency and we talk uh at Le I going to say at least every week if not a regular schedule meeting internally every two weeks okay one final sure have you come across in your travels and in your workflow any solutions that do work regarding Phil uh before the storms kind of after the storms not really and and unfortunately what we're seeing more and more is what sounded good what was Sound Engineering isn't working because you know what was based off of either a 10y year or 25-year storm event we have exceeded those numbers um we've had a number of communities that we're working in you know they were designing to we'll say a 10in rainfall within the course of 24 hours you start looking at what we had had in the course of 24 hours we more than exceeded that um now how many times have we exceeded 10 in not a lot am here's and this is this is a very bad analogy uh because you know when we talk about flooding and storm water it's completely different than the analogy I'm want to use but it's like parking you don't design to the one time in the course of X that you're hitting you're trying to look at what is that common denominator and approach the majority of these standards it's like Transportation you know a lot of places will start to look at level of service and they go we want level of service B or C which is just you know how how much traffic can we get through a particular intersection at a given time and it s you know it's like oh level of service C sounds good that's average per School uh most of our communities we talk with are level of service D why because the cost become so prohibitive on trying to achieve and allow more traffic through it's not just oh restrict development it's more Lanes it's different turning movements it's a lot of other things that start to add those costs up go ahead okay I'm sorry to keep adding under have you dealt with any um Phil ordinances uh that deal specifically with Phil behind an elevated seaw wall uh one of our design Engineers Chris neadus he's also one of our resilience experts has um I didn't get a chance to talk to him before today but uh Nicole's making the notes so we will find that out for you thank you sir if we wanted to going back to the field dirt again if if we wanted to uh to do as we said on August 20th is just have a simple ordinance um is is it possible to I would keep hearing that that may take 8 12 months to get it through the the state and through everything are there ways to expedite this especially with the situation that we've had here with the hurricanes and you know we know that there's going to be some homes that are going to have to be knocked down and rebuilt and so is there anything that we could expedite or move quickly to to get uh something put in place I would need to confer with a couple of my partners on that before providing a a definitive or a thought on that one so my apologies okay will you do that yes sir thank you as say she's taking notes trust me all right is that all the questions sure okay uh now is the time for public comment on this issue do we have any nope okay uh I think that uh I I appreciate uh your time and efforts and the presentation that was very easy to understand and where we're going and how we're getting there uh does anybody have any other thoughts before we uh we adjourn all right we are now adjourned good job J